May 27, 2025 • 53 mins
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Have you been putting off "the talk" with your kids? That uncomfortable conversation about bodies, relationships, and sex that just feels too awkward to navigate? Take a deep breath – you're not alone, and this episode will completely transform how you approach these crucial conversations.
Dr. Mario Sacasa, licensed marriage and family therapist and father of four, brings refreshing wisdom to what many parents dread most. The breakthrough insight? It's not about having one perfect, scripted "talk" – it's about creating an ongoing dialogue that evolves as your child grows.
• Parents are the primary and perfect people to have these conversations with their children
• Starting age-appropriate conversations as young as 5-6 years old creates a foundation for healthy understanding
• Teaching kids the difference between lust (taking from others) and love (serving others)
• The ultimate goal is helping kids understand God's design for their bodies, relationships, and sexuality
For more resources on talking to your kids about sex, relationships, and faith, visit Dr. Mario Sacasa's website or listen to his podcast "Always Hope."
A children's book we recommend that teaches kids about how to navigate inappropriate pictures on the internet is Good Pictures, Bad Pictures by Kristen Jenson, MA.
To learn more about how to move well beyond "The Sex Talk", we recommend this thoroughly revised version of Beyond the Birds and the Bees, by Greg and Lisa Popcak. It offers a comprehensive guide to raising sexually whole and holy children.
The Thriving Family Accelerator provides an easy, 3-step process to lower stress, parent as a united team, and enjoy a true friendship with your spouse & relationship with your kids. Sign up now for this live parent coaching with proven methods for positively engaging your family and redistributing the mental load.
Give $20 to keep the mic on. We're a 501 c(3) non-profit and produce this show for parents around the globe.
Discover the secrets to building a connected + thriving family. All you'll need is a few minutes of your week—it's easy!
Looking for things to combat boredom and bolster growth in your kids? Check out our Tame the Tech Bundle and the Best Me I Can Be Journal!
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hey parents, let's face it, talking to our kids
about sex can feel awkward,stressful and like one of those
conversations that you just wantto put off.
But here's the truth you arethe perfect and chosen person to
(00:20):
have these conversations withyour kids, and if you don't feel
ready, we've got you.
We're here to equip andencourage you every step of the
way.
Today on our show, we'rewelcoming back Dr Mario Sacasa.
He is a Christian counselorthat you loved from episode
(00:41):
number 140 on acceptingdifferences in marriage, and
this time he's helping us tounderstand how to guide our kids
through the beauty of how Godcreated them body, mind and soul
and what that means forrelationships and sexuality.
(01:02):
And listen, parents, you don'thave to be perfect.
You don't need all the answers,but you do need a starting
point, and this episode is it.
I'm confident that afterlistening to this episode,
you'll feel relief, directionand have some practical ways to
begin these talks at any agewith your kids.
(01:25):
So stick with us.
It's time to take the pressureoff of this conversation and
step into it with confidence andgrace.
Dr Sacasa, welcome back to ourshow.
Speaker 2 (01:39):
Jordan, you are so kind to have me back on so
quickly.
Thank you so much.
I am excited to have thisconversation with you because it
is absolutely important.
Speaker 1 (01:49):
So, so important.
And, dr Scassa, you and yourwife Kristen have been married
for over 20 years.
You're raising four kids andyou're also a licensed marriage
and family therapist and havebeen in practice for 15 years,
and you're also the podcast hostof a show called Always Hope,
(02:09):
where you really providesolutions to life's challenges
that are grounded in faith andpsychology.
So you've got like the fullpackage here for our audience.
You're in the trenches with usas a husband and a father and
you've got the expertise to gowith it.
Speaker 2 (02:29):
Yeah, I didn't realize how helpful of a degree
it was going to be in terms ofmy own parenting, but it's
actually been phenomenal, sinceI'm like, oh, these
conversations pop up and like,okay, I think I'm a little bit
more prepared for this thanmaybe some of my peers are, by
virtue of the clinical trainingand the conversations I have
with my clients.
Speaker 1 (02:47):
Praise be to God.
We're glad that we have you.
Last time you were on the show,you and I touched on the idea
of dating and what this seasonof parenting is like, when your
kids start dating, and duringthat talk we promised the
audience that we would circleback on the mic and give some
practical tips of how to talk tokids about sex and dating and
(03:12):
all of that.
So look, here we are, we'reback, here we are.
Speaker 2 (03:15):
We are people of our word.
That's what we like to think.
Speaker 1 (03:18):
That's exactly right.
We do what we promise we'regoing to do.
Integrity.
Speaker 2 (03:21):
We're going to do it.
Integrity that's right that wedo what we promise.
We're going to do Integritywe're going to do it, integrity.
Speaker 1 (03:24):
That's right, that's right.
Well, where do you think weshould begin with this topic
today?
Speaker 2 (03:29):
Yeah, it's a great question, Absolutely great
question.
The place to begin is torecognize that it's not just a
talk.
Okay, first and foremost, Ithink we hear this in our
culture, in our society.
It's like oh, when did you havethe talk with your parents, or
when should you have the talkwith your kids?
And we have to break thatlanguage because it's not a
(03:51):
single talk.
It's a series of conversationsthat we're going to have with
our kids, from the time thatthey're little to the time that
they leave their house andbeyond, and what we're trying to
instill in them again is anunderstanding of God's plan for
their body, god's plan formarriage, god's plan for
sexuality, helping them tounderstand that from a little
age and using age-appropriatelanguage there to they're bigger
(04:13):
and using more age-appropriatelanguage at that front also.
And the reason that this isimportant is because what we're
trying to do is we're trying toset up our kids for success and
set up our kids to be able tonavigate the complexities of the
world that we live in, and wewant to be able to set the stage
for this conversation, and so Ithink it's important for
(04:33):
parents just to so we're gettingstarted here to take a deep
breath to recognize that, yes,we're going to feel awkward, yes
, it's uncomfortable, yes, thistopic brings up all sorts of
questions about our ownexperiences with this topic and
the conversations we've had.
And it's going to be okay.
It's going to be okay, allright, we're going to have a
great time today.
Speaker 1 (04:52):
That's right.
That's right.
Just shake it off parents.
Shake it off folks, that'sright, it's not just about one
talk.
I love how you said it.
It's a series of talks, it'sconversation and really using
age-appropriate language andeven starting as young as five
and six to talk to kids abouttheir bodies and relationships.
Speaker 2 (05:14):
Absolutely.
So.
Let me start with the story.
Okay, my oldest is 20, and thennumber three was six years
younger than him, right?
So when he was six, he had thequestion mom's pregnant?
And so he had the question youknow where, where do babies come
from?
And uh, and we said, all right,bud, you know well this is so
already thinking about thisbeforehand.
(05:35):
And I said, uh, storks, youknow storks is is where babies
come from.
And we just left it as that.
No, I'm just joking, obviously,make it super awkward on them
and just make up random lies,anyways, no, but what we told
them is we said, listen, big guy, um, uh, god loves mommies and
daddies so much that he's givenus a special hug.
(05:55):
And when mommies and daddiesshare this special hug, god
blesses it sometimes, and that'swhere babies come from.
All right, and so that's whatwe told them one night when we
were putting him to bed, andthat was all he needed to know
in that moment.
He's six, he doesn't even knowall the intricacies of his body,
how his body works, how awoman's body work.
He doesn't need all of thatjust yet, but what he does need
(06:16):
at a young age is anunderstanding that babies are
connected to something physical,there's a special hug that's
there and that God blesses itright there, right out of the
gates.
I want to enter into hisimagination that it's in the
covenant and the covenant of asacred relationship that there's
something happening here.
There's something unique,there's something special and
(06:37):
God blesses it.
All right.
That's the tone that I want himto know and that's theology of
the body, church teaching andsexuality, kind of at its 101,
most basic level.
Those are the things we wantedto tell our kids.
So I said, do you have anyquestions?
He said no.
And what I've learned over theyears is that often I'm the one
that's ready to like talk morethan they are, because they
(06:57):
don't know the topic and sowhatever we tell them is all
they need to know.
So he was satisfied with thatanswer.
No big deal Went to know.
So he was satisfied with thatanswer.
No big deal.
Went to bed the next morningI'm getting ready to go to work.
Gabriel pops his little head uparound the kitchen.
He sees Kristen and I giving alittle kiss and a hug right
before I leave for work, atwhich point Gabriel looks out
(07:19):
around the kitchen.
He goes are you guys doing thespecial hug?
Speaker 1 (07:24):
I love it.
It's that that right there, no,no, but that's, this, isn't it.
Speaker 2 (07:29):
This isn't it.
We're not.
No, get out of here.
We can't come back to your room.
Yeah, Kids are great.
Kids are great.
So, just like just tellingparents, I mean, that's, that's.
That's sometimes it, just aswe're beginning the conversation
when they're little, all theyneed to know is super simple
(07:49):
stuff, but at least we'rebeginning to set the stage for
what's going to come down thepike as they get older.
Speaker 1 (07:56):
Yes, and you made such a good point that often we
have this urge or thistemptation to share more, but
it's important to be mindfulthat the kids come to the table
with really not much informationat that age right.
Five or six.
They're just like wait, howdoes this happen?
(08:19):
And so asking them for like hey, do you have any other
questions?
Maybe they don't.
That's enough.
That's sufficient for now.
Speaker 2 (08:25):
Yeah, that's exactly right.
And even as they get older whenyou're talking about 10, 11,
when we start needing to haveconversations about puberty and
the changes that are going tohappen in their body, I view my
role as a dad is to help preparemy kids for the changes that
are going to happen, and so,being armed with the information
that I do have, I try to prepthem for it and saying, okay,
(08:45):
like these are some of thethings that are about to happen,
these are some of the changesthat are going to occur.
We can have that conversationin those preteen years and then
we can get into furtherdistinctions about, like, what
actually happens with thechanges and all of that.
But anytime that I introducedthis topic or had these
conversations with my kids, it'salmost always me expecting more
(09:06):
to come out of it from theirside.
But, as we've already indicated, they're little and they're
innocent, they don't really know, and so they're very receptive
to whatever it is that we tellthem.
And again, I think it'simportant for us to be proactive
as parents and to have theseconversations with our kids so
that they do understand what thechurch teaches, what the Bible
(09:27):
tells us about God's plan formarriage, what the Bible tells
us about God's plan for familylife, because we want that to be
the foundation.
So often, what happens in oursociety is that, unfortunately,
kids are just exposed topornography at such a young age
that that ends up being thefirst encounter with this
conversation and that thenbecomes the template upon which
(09:50):
everything else is compared to.
And that's not what I want.
I want our kids to be able tounderstand what God's plan is
and then from there, thatwhatever, whatever comes on the
other side of that will be um,will be compared to that All
right.
So so, gabriel, for example, ashe was getting older and we're
now we're having conversationsabout the changes that happen in
the body, we can get somespecifics about how to have that
(10:11):
discussion with your kids.
But he was reading, he wasreading the Bible, actually of
all things, and the word rapepopped up somewhere in the old
Testament, as it does, and andhe said you know, dad, what's
what's rape?
He didn't know what that meantbut we had context for for what
sex is in terms of love,relationships, family, um God
blessing it intimacy,vulnerability, and I was able to
(10:33):
explain what sexual violationis in the context of that, and
he got it, he understood, heunderstood it, he understood how
hurtful that action can be, um,and so there's so many points
that I can say that, like whenwe set, like, the foundation,
when we, when we determine whatthe language is going to be
around this, anything elsebecomes a comparison to that.
(10:55):
So, whether we're talking aboutsomething like sexual violation,
whether we're talking aboutquestions of sexual morality or
attraction, things that pop upin TV shows, now, how to be able
to tell your kids how tonavigate those distinctions as
well, when we set the foundation, when we set the language, the
definition, the terms, we don'thave to be afraid then, because
(11:16):
now we've equipped our kids tobe able to know what's going on
here, to be able to help themthen to see what's going on in
the world and how they candistinguish and decipher what
they're seeing compared, to beable to help them then to see
what's going on in the world andhow they can distinguish and
decipher what they're seeingcompared to what they're
experiencing at home.
Speaker 1 (11:31):
I read one time that the foundation for a child's
attitudes around relationshipsis actually already formed by
the age of five.
And you make such a great point.
If we are talking to our kidsat a young age about God's
design for marriage andsexuality and we start to say
(11:57):
that at a young age, then theyrealize that true love is about
serving others, not just servingourselves.
And you mentioned pornographyand people being exposed to that
, and that's the first timethey've, kind of you know, had a
conversation or a run in withtheir parents about sex and
sexuality and just how you know,viewing pornography,
(12:22):
participating in sexual actsthat serve only yourself is, is
just you know that that thatblows people's minds right.
It's just like whoa, whatthere's, this, and then there's
there's what I you know know isis good and and beautiful for me
to to serve another person.
Speaker 2 (12:42):
So that just came up in my mind when you were talking
.
Speaker 1 (12:46):
It's just like this idea that it's our role as
parents to help model healthyrelationships for our kids and
to understand that they alreadyhave kind of that foundation set
some way by the time thatthey're five.
Speaker 2 (13:01):
Yeah, that's right.
And so, like PDAs I don't knowhow comfortable you are like
kissing your husband in front ofyour kids or like telling
parents like it's okay to I mean, hold hands, snuggle, just sit,
just displaying healthy amountsof physical interaction is
absolutely important for us tomodel that for our kids so that
(13:23):
when we're having theseconversations there's some
context for it.
Right Again, like it's not, I'mnot trying to be explicit,
that's what I'm saying.
Obviously, keep the doorslocked and make sure the kids
are asleep.
When you're sharing intimacywith your spouse, but being able
to display healthy amounts ofphysical interaction and being
healthy physical display withthem as well, so that that model
(13:44):
is appropriately set, you know,as you've indicated.
Speaker 1 (13:50):
Mm-hmm, mm-hmm, just yeah.
And recognizing that you know,I think when you think about a
conversation with your kid abouttheir body and God's design for
their body, that conversationis actually so much easier than
this dreaded conversation thatwe all feel this pressure to
(14:10):
have with our kids when webecome parents, like, oh, when
they turn 13, we're going tohave to have this, have to have
this one singular talk thateverything else hinges on for
our kids, right?
Yeah, that's right, and thenalso I remember too, thinking
like well, I didn't get thattalk with my own parents.
(14:33):
Really I remember in religiouseducation going and it was like
we kind of like talked around it.
And so then thinking when youbecome a parent, if you haven't
had the talk or the series oftalks with your own parents,
then you're just like terrified,like I hope they pick this up
(14:54):
somewhere.
I hope you know somehow theyget the right message.
But going back to theintroduction, like we, the
parents, are the chosen ones tohave these conversations with
our kids right?
Speaker 2 (15:08):
Yes, yes, absolutely.
Parents are the primaryeducators of the faith.
I mean, like we are what, whatgives the foundation to, to our
children?
And listen, I didn't get thistalk from my parents I think my
sister, who is 10 years olderthan me, who's also a counselor
I remember it was like my I waslike a senior, I think, packing
up graduated, getting ready togo to college, and she steps
(15:29):
into the room and she was sweetand she goes.
You know, mario, you know, ifyou ever have any questions
about girls or sex, you know,happy to answer and she was so
sweet asking the question.
But in my 17 year old you knowkind of knowledge, I was like,
ah, I think you're a little latefor that conversation, but I
appreciate it, you know type ofthing you know.
But but that was like theextent that I got and so we've
(15:52):
taken the opposite approach withour kids.
As I said, six years old, wheredo babies come from?
I joked about the stork.
Don't give them, don't say thestork, you know, don't watch
boss, baby.
It's Find language that feelscomfortable for you as they then
get older 10, 11, and you starthaving to need to talk to them
(16:13):
about the changes that's goingto happen.
I only have boys, so maybe youcan explain this from your
perspective as a mom with women.
But for boys, it's good to beable to explain to them that
changes are going to happen, andexplaining it in a positive
sense.
You know, so often we approachthis topic with a sense of
awkwardness or discomfort, whichit absolutely is but helping
(16:34):
them to understand like why arethese changes happening within
our body?
Your body is transforming frombeing a child to becoming an
adult and the changes that needto happen are important for you
Like.
It's necessary for you and forthese changes to actually happen
.
And so what's going to happen?
Well, your voice is going tostart dropping, you're going to
start getting muscles, you'regoing to start getting hair and
(16:54):
funny places, you're going toget pimples.
Why is because the body isstarting to change.
But for boys, what happens in,like the first, I don't know
couple of years, from 11 to 13,when puberty kicks in, their
testosterone rate increases bysomething like 400%.
And so that's why you see theseboys like one day they wake up
(17:14):
and you're like where'd thosemuscles come from?
You're a man, like whathappened, and so you could joke
about it in a way that doesn'tshame them.
Because they're so sensitive atthis age, because so much is
happening, we want to becautious with our language.
As parents, we want to be ableto encourage and we want to make
jokes, but not in a way that isinciting shame.
(17:35):
We want to help them see that,yes, you feel uncomfortable, we
get it.
Your body's changing.
One leg's longer than the other, one arm is longer than the
other.
All of a sudden, you just grablike my boys grabbing drawers.
All of a sudden, the musclememory that they had when they
were 10, changes when they're 12and they're ripping the drawers
off because they're stronger.
Now you know the holes in thewalls, the whole bit, right.
(17:57):
You know all of that's normal,like it's all part of part of
what's happening, you know, intheir development, and so you
want to start by normalizing thechanges and helping them to see
that these changes serve areally important purpose.
As they get older this is whatI tell my boys the women in
their life are going to need thestrength that they're
(18:17):
developing.
They're going to need thecapacities that they're
developing right now, the skillsthat they're acquiring, the
things that are happening.
All of this is absolutelyimportant for them and I want
them to know that, not in a way,again, that produces too much
shame or produces too muchpressure, but just to help them
ease through this transitionthat we all went through at
their age.
Speaker 1 (18:38):
So important to acknowledge the changes that are
happening that we can recognizephysically in them their voice,
the hair on their bodies, theirsize, the growth spurt the
smells, know hair on theirbodies, their, you know size,
the growth, the smells, the funfun little smells, yes.
And for girls having theirmenstrual cycle and and feeling
extra sensitive around certaintimes of the month, it's so
(19:02):
important for us to address thisin a natural way with them,
Right?
I love your idea of just sayingyou know, hey, this is supposed
to happen.
This is actually God's design.
He is changing your body inpreparation of something bigger
than yourself.
This ability to join withanother man or woman and the two
(19:27):
become one and your body ishealthy and it's ready to
produce children Like this is agreat and beautiful thing.
Clunky, yes, awkward, yes,right, but it's all for the
greater good.
This is a good thing.
I read just something in this,this book beyond the birds and
the bees by.
(19:47):
Lisa and Greg Popchek.
Speaker 2 (19:50):
Popcheck, Popcheck.
Yes.
Speaker 1 (19:52):
And they were just talking about how important it
is for us to talk to our kids ata young age, when they're going
through those hormonal changes,about how culture will tell us,
when we get that feeling orthat tingly sensation inside our
bodies, that that is reallymeant for sex.
And that means like go after thegirl or go after the guy, and
(20:15):
you know it's sort of like this,go get a mentality like, like
that physical sensationindicates you ought to pursue
this person for the sexual act.
And what God tells us is thatthose little signs that our body
gives us, the tinglingsensation, that hyper-awareness
(20:39):
of the person of the oppositesex, is actually a signal to
tell us you ought to serve thisperson, Do something kind for
them, not necessarily go pursuethem for sex, but it means we
were made to serve others and soit's okay to be able to
appreciate the beauty in a womanor the you know the appearance
(21:03):
of a man and recognize thatfeeling.
But if we have that frame, thatframework that that feeling
indicates that we should servethem in some beautiful way, in a
friendship way or whatever,that's totally a different lens.
Speaker 2 (21:20):
Yep, absolutely.
John Paul II, in his Theologyof the Body, has some wonderful
language about being able todecipher within ourselves what
is lust and what is love, and herecognizes and articulates that
it's very complicated, eveninteriorly, even for adults.
Sometimes we can get confused,even within the context of
marriage.
Am I pursuing my wife right now?
(21:40):
Am I making an imitationbecause I desire her, goodness,
I want to serve her, or is itjust because I'm tired and I
want some type of emotionalrelease at this point and know
and wanted to be able to tonavigate that?
And so GP2 says it's it'simportant to recognize that
those variances and thosenuances can be confused, but
that it's important for us tostart doing that work of
(22:03):
reflecting and understanding.
Okay, what movement is leadingme towards to use the pop check
language service of another?
Or what movement is moving metowards wanting to take, go
conquest that person?
I think was kind of thelanguage that you were using.
Okay, want to be able to getsomething from them or want to
be able to give something fromthem?
That desire interiorly can bevery confusing, and so it's
(22:25):
important again, just to helpour kids understand that, as
these systems are turning online, that like those.
All that new feels are going tobe a little bit different.
I remember with each of the boyswhen they first started
noticing girls like I justremember and noticing the female
body.
It's like you just walk in andall of a sudden the head just
(22:46):
gets caught.
It's like, oh, what's he?
Oh, you need to look at that,birds.
It happens early.
It happens early.
You know it happens and you'relike, okay, well, what do you do
?
Do you just like, do you shamethem and say, don't, don't,
don't, do that.
No, you try to navigate and belike, okay, let's, let's just
(23:06):
kind of redirect, help themunderstand how to be able to be
respectful, how to be able toappreciate somebody's goodness
and their beauty without fallinginto lust.
With that I mean these thingsare complicated, complicated
feelings for adults, and so Ithink this is why it's so hard
for parents to step into thisconversation, because often I
think what parents feel is theshame of their own experiences
(23:29):
related to this topic.
Maybe people are listening tothis and had a conversion after
marriage or came back to Christafter marriage and are like I'm
the last person to give my kidsadvice because look at all the
things that I did before I gotmarried.
And so the problem is that yourkids don't know any of that
history and we come into thisconversation and think that we
(23:50):
don't have credibility becauseof what we've gone through in
life or the mistakes that we'vemade.
Um, or maybe we were Christianand we made mistakes along the
way Okay fine, but the problemis that we, our, our kids, do
not know or do not understandour history, do not understand
the shame.
That's fine, like, just checkthat aside and still do what's
(24:10):
necessary to help prepare yourkids so that they can make
better decisions than the onesthat you made.
And so anybody who's listeningjust want to encourage you and
recognize that I get it, I getit.
I get it.
Do the work that you need to doto come to peace and acceptance
about your story so that youcan embrace that as the journey
that God has put you on.
(24:30):
And you have an opportunityhere to be able to instill
something different for yourkids and be able to help them
navigate this in a way that youweren't able to.
And so just want to justgenuinely, genuinely, genuinely
encourage parents here to tocome to peace so that they can
be better prepared to equiptheir children.
Speaker 1 (24:52):
So good, so good for myself as well.
I mean you're navigating thingsin teen life and the pressures
of your friends, and if youdon't have a foundation for
these conversations, and safeconversations with your parents,
then you're talking to yourfriends about this and, like one
15 year old to another, is theblind leading the blind.
Speaker 2 (25:15):
You got it.
Yes, jordan.
Yes, with TikTok experts alongthe way, you know, telling them
what to do.
Speaker 1 (25:22):
Yes, oh yes, this is not the way we want our kids to
navigate sex and sexuality, andso I love how you genuinely give
parents permission to do theirown kind of healing around their
past and to give themselvesgrace with the information that
(25:45):
they had at the time and howthey chose to navigate those
relationships Because, like yousaid, our kids don't aren't
preloaded with all of ourshameful past, you know, and
they're like, oh, let's see whatkind of advice she's giving
Exactly.
Speaker 2 (26:02):
Yes, exactly, exactly , yes.
But we think that I mean that's, that's what we're waiting for.
We're waiting for thataccusation Exactly what you said
to be thrown back in her facebecause of what we went through
and they don't again.
They don't know, they don'tknow, and so we can share.
Just I don't briefly and saylike listen, this has been a
learning process for me too.
(26:23):
I don't think our kids need toknow all of our experiences.
We don't need to tell themeverything.
We probably don't even tellthem anything honestly but like
just helping them to see that,like it's okay and we're going
to get through this, and thatdisposition is what's going to
help them as they continue togrow and as they start dating
and as they start makingmistakes and as they start
(26:44):
getting exposed to things.
Like it's going to happen, lifeis going to intervene.
You can put yourself inwhatever Christian bubble that
you want and think that you'renot going to be exposed to it,
but it's going to happen, it'sgoing to happen.
And so, again, what we'retrying to do is give them the
knowledge that they need so thatthey can develop the best
choices that they can make, sothey can develop the best
(27:06):
virtues that they can developaround this area, and that's
what we're trying to do asparents.
Speaker 1 (27:12):
No, you mentioned the word virtue and just I think of
this conversation and chastitybeing the virtue that we need to
work on with our kids to helpthem love the right person at
the right time in the right ways.
That's truly what chastity is.
Do you use that word with yourboys?
(27:32):
I'm curious, because you hearthe word chastity and purity.
I actually don't think I usethe word.
Speaker 2 (27:40):
I actually don't think I use that word as often
as maybe I should, but I guess Idon't because the purity
culture has a bad taste in mymouth.
Uh, I read I kissed datinggoodbye when I was in, uh, like
a freshman in college, and Iguess I didn't have, as as as it
didn't shape me as much asmaybe it did some of my peers or
(28:01):
others.
But the purity culture, thattype of rigidity, um that that,
that that language to me, um,has a it's a very sour taste in
my mouth, and so I understandwhat the good that those books
and that movement was trying todo.
But we want to just take thegood and walk away from what's
bad and not create a systemwhere it's overly rigid.
(28:24):
Again we're trying to respectour children's freedoms.
We're trying to instill themvirtues.
We're trying to help shape themin a way that their consciences
are formed so that they'remaking right decisions, and not
just trying to impose a set ofstandards onto them that they
have to conform to or not.
Speaker 1 (28:42):
I like that because you're saying I'm not just
starting with a word and givingthem one word to carry with them
into teen life and college.
Like chastity, be chased yeahyeah, yeah, you know just but?
But the understanding ofrelationships, respecting
another in a relationship,respecting yourself, saving
yourself for marriage because ofthe goodness that you're going
(29:06):
to get out of it, not because ofthe shame that'll be put upon
you if you do the opposite.
Right, not because of the shamethat'll be put upon you if you
do the opposite right.
So you're leading with a, ifyou follow God's plan for your
life in this beautiful, naturalway, which is really really hard
, you're going to reap theseamazing benefits.
Speaker 2 (29:23):
Yes, that's right and so, but that is chastity Again,
what you just described ischastity, is purity, and so I do
use that word, but I try tojust massage it, I guess a
little bit differently.
So we actually get to the point, without all the cultural
buzzwords or hangups that may beassociated with it, which may
(29:43):
be my issue as well, and I'mwilling to be called out on that
, and that's fine.
But to each his own.
Speaker 1 (29:49):
That's right.
I think we need to meet ourkids where they are Right, and
so if, if they tend to be veryintellectual types that want to
know, like what is that called,what is that word, what?
What word must I use with otherpeople which still might not
work for them because theirpeers might be like what
chastity, what?
I don't even know what you'resaying.
(30:10):
You know, so I think we know ourkids best and that's the
message that you and I aretrying to send to people right
now is that you are the primaryeducator of faith and morals in
your family, whether you feelprepared or not, and you know
the words best to use with them.
Yep, absolutely when to jointhem in this conversation and
when.
Speaker 2 (30:30):
Yeah, and we live in a day and age where information
is available to us, so you don'thave to go into this alone.
You mentioned the Pop Checksbook, which is one certainly
great resource to recommend.
I'd also recommend Dr JuliaSadusky's work.
She has a book on talking toyour kids about sex that also
kind of speaks it from aChristian, Catholic perspective,
(30:51):
which is also great.
If you're itty bitty kids andyou want to be able to talk to
them about pornography, the goodpictures bad pictures book is a
great resource to be able tohave that conversation with your
children.
And then, as far as usingchastity talks, I mean there's
abundance.
I mean of course we have theJason Everett's and the Matt
Frad's of the world and theChristopher West's and Brian
(31:13):
Butler and folks like that whohave dedicated their lives to
speaking on this topic.
That us, as parents, we don'thave to make it all up.
We just have to avail ourselvesto the information that's there
and be able to read thoseresources, get the information
that we can and then know how tobe able to cur information
that's there and be able to readthose resources, get the
information that we can and thenknow how to be able to curtail
(31:35):
that in a way that meets theneeds of your specific children.
Speaker 1 (31:40):
Yes, Always being students right, Always trying to
learn along with our kids.
I think I read one time too.
We only have to be a chapterahead of our kids.
Speaker 2 (31:52):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's right.
Yeah, yeah, that's right.
It's like students.
You only have to be a chapterahead.
Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 1 (31:57):
That's right.
So find the resources and talkto your friends about what kind
of conversations they're havingwith their children as well.
I think that's a wonderful wayto kind of bring this topic to
light in your social circles,and so, again, other people
don't feel like, oh gosh, thisis just something we should talk
(32:17):
about behind closed doors.
And no, let's see what otherpeople are saying.
Speaker 2 (32:22):
Yeah, that's right.
When we were in New Orleans,the Archdiocese used to offer a
father-son, mother-daughterprogram that was geared to 10
and 11-year-olds, or 10 to 13,something like that, and that
was a great program because theyhad the director of family life
would come in and he'd give atalk about just an intro
(32:42):
theology of the bodypresentation.
Here's the beauty of God's plan.
Here's men, here's women.
This is why God creates usdifferently but creates us to be
the same.
Where are the differences andwhat's the importance in all of
that?
And then they would have adoctor give a presentation on
all the changes that happen, youknow, with slides and really
explaining here's the femaleanatomy, here's the male anatomy
(33:04):
, here's the changes that happen.
And and then leaving it to theparents to be able to talk about
what sex itself is.
So everything.
He described everything rightup to to that line and then
leaving it to the parents to beable to talk about what sex
itself is.
So everything.
He described everything rightup to that line and let it for
parents to be able to then havethat conversation.
But like, oh, you saw thethings that we just talked about
.
Well, funny how all those thingsactually fit together, you know
(33:25):
, or having that discussion withour kids.
So that was a great resourcethat I am forever grateful for,
because we were able to havethese conversations about
chastity, about the church'steachings, all of that.
But the medical side, or thebiological side of it, that's
where I felt like we werelacking in some resources and I
(33:46):
was really grateful that theArchdiocese provided that and
that I can go with my son andwe'd watch this and then we'd go
out afterwards and we wouldhave like an hour, two hour long
conversation afterwards.
Speaker 1 (33:58):
So good, and I think when you understand the biology
behind all of this, it becomesto me the pressure just like
just shakes off because it'slike this is science, this is
nature, this is going to happento every one of us in our bodies
.
These changes and so it makesthe conversation easier to say
(34:20):
like, oh, we are all goingthrough this.
Isn't it awesome to understandwhy our bodies go through this
change?
And then it, like you said, hedidn't need to explain the
sexual act.
Speaker 2 (34:32):
It was like right up to the point of the marital
embrace, that special hug thatcreates a baby, a human.
You know, it's so awesome.
Yeah, remember that special hugwe were talking about six years
ago.
That that's it.
You know, like.
Speaker 1 (34:45):
That's right, that's right.
It comes full circle andthey're like oh.
Speaker 2 (34:49):
Yeah, and I think that's part of life that things
are unfolding, mysteries arebeing revealed bit by bit.
It's okay.
We don't have to give them allthe information at one time.
Let's let things graduallyunfold.
That is okay.
That's how life works.
That's how divine pedagogy is.
We don't know it all in oneinstance, and that's fine.
(35:12):
Let things unfold and be readyfor them.
Now it does require someintentionality.
This conversation isn't justgoing to come up.
You have to introduce it.
Part of setting a foundationfor your kids is saying we're
going to talk about this.
Even though it's awkward, eventhough you may feel
uncomfortable, it's importantenough for us to have this
conversation.
And what you're telling them isthat you're a safe place for
(35:35):
them to be able to bring updiscussions after the fact.
So when they do see something,when they may cross a line with
a boyfriend, girlfriend, whenthey may whatever the case might
be you want them to know thatyou're a place where we can
continue this conversation.
Speaker 1 (35:53):
So so important to set that foundation of safety
and trust between you and yourchild.
So, like you said, when theyfall, when they make the mistake
, when they cross the line,Because they're going to.
Speaker 2 (36:04):
They're going to you did too, you did too.
Exactly, that's exactly it.
Speaker 1 (36:08):
Yeah, yeah, that's right At some point they'll come
back and have a safe place toland the plane and have the
conversation right.
Yes, yes.
Yes, it's so good.
All on all on the table.
The other thing I'm thinking ofis just the importance of like
carving out some one-on-one timewith your kiddos.
You know, in those years the 11through 13, 15, 18, you know
(36:32):
just that you get outside of thehouse, you go on a hike, a walk
, a trip to get ice cream orsomething and to just sort of
ask some of those questions,open-ended questions, in the
midst of doing something thatyour child likes, to find out
where they are with all of thisand to kind of offer a place to
(36:52):
ask any questions that may becirculating in their mind.
Speaker 2 (36:57):
Since the last time you had an intentional
conversation about this, yeah, Itry with my kids to do a dad's
night out, I mean.
So we have four kids and it'sbusy with them.
They're very active in theiractivities.
I'm very active with myventures as well, and sometimes
we can feel like we're justships passing in the night.
And so trying to maybe twice ayear, I would say, if possible
(37:21):
it's been a little bit sinceI've done this because of the
move and different things butbut trying to at least have one
day where it's like all right,what do you want to do?
Let's go out, let's go havesome fun, let's go get a meal,
and so we know that it's a timethat we're going to have a good
time together.
Whether we go to a ball game orwatch a movie or go to an
escape room or whatever it isthat they want to do, we go do
(37:42):
the activity and then afterwardswe go get a bite to eat, and
when we're sitting and eating iswhen we start having some of
these um meteor conversations.
Check in you know, how are youdoing?
How are things when?
Where are we checking in onthat stuff and then trying to
introduce some of this um aswell?
So it's, it can done, folks, itcan be done.
Speaker 1 (38:00):
It can.
And again, you don't have tohave all the answers, it doesn't
have to be a perfect plan, youdon't have to put this in your
calendar on a special day, whenthey turn 13,.
You have to do this one thingright If you've passed these
milestones it's never too lateto go back and say hey, I know
we never talked about this andI'm unsure of where you are with
(38:21):
your own sexuality, your ownrelationships, but I just want
to let you know that I'mavailable and open to start a
conversation, wherever it is youfeel comfortable talking to me,
about this real liferelationship stuff and sex stuff
.
Speaker 2 (38:37):
And.
Speaker 1 (38:38):
I bet your kids would be.
Oh, immediately their guardwill come down a bit and go oh,
you're available.
It'd be better to do that thanjust to say, well, I've missed
the boat and it's too late, andnever even mention it to them,
right?
Speaker 2 (38:54):
Yes, absolutely Absolutely.
Now we do have coming in eyeson the computer and the phones
and devices.
So when things pop up, you know, we, we take a look at it and
that's a point of that, becomesa point of conversation also,
again not out of shame, but justan intervention where you can
be like, hey, you know, I saw acouple of things kind of get
flagged.
Would you tell me what, what,what happened there, what was
(39:14):
going on there?
Again, trying to get them toreflect and to think, as we said
earlier, about the differencesbetween that lust and that love
and helping them to be able toreflect interiorly about what
was happening, thoseconversations we can have with
them also just to help shapethem a little bit.
Speaker 1 (39:33):
And you mentioned that software that you can put
on your computers and yourphones called Covenant Eyes
Covenant Eyes.
Speaker 2 (39:40):
Covenant Eyes.
Yep, that's right.
And so that is a web filter aswell as a web tracker, and you
get an accountability reportdaily if you want that weekly,
depending on what frequency youwant those emails to come into
you.
And what it does, is it daytrack what websites they've been
looking at, and some websitesare fine, some are not.
They have kind of like a greenit.
They track what websitesthey've been looking at, and
(40:00):
some websites are fine, some arenot.
They have kind of like a green,yellow, red, uh type of
indication and some things willget they'll block.
We'll get blocked automaticallyand anything gets blocked
automatically.
You know we'll, we'll pop up Um, so it.
It helps.
You can set kind of thestringency of it Um and uh, and
how hard you want it to befiltering or how light you want
it to be filtering.
(40:25):
And I know sometimes parentsmight feel uncomfortable about
that, but I will say it's animportant tool to help parents
understand what their child'sinternet behaviors are and it
helps to bring up some reallygreat conversations, even if
they're just on Amazon searchingfor Lego toys, whatever you can
be like.
Oh, I saw you were looking upthis Lego toy.
Is that one that you'rethinking about for your birthday
that's coming up or whatever.
You know.
You kind of can see some ofthat, but it also does.
(40:47):
It helps them to break awayfrom this notion that everything
they do online is justanonymous, that there's no
accountability online.
There is accountability online,and it just helps to bring
again some of thoseconversations up to the fore.
Speaker 1 (41:01):
Well, and I want to underscore what you said is, the
purpose of using these is notto just bust your kids and dish
out a quick consequence.
Give me your phone, you're donewith that?
Yeah, exactly Because thatcommunicates shame and that
whatever you did or werethinking about is awful and
terrible and so bad that you gotyour computer in your pocket
(41:21):
removed.
You know.
But instead you're saying itcould serve as a.
Hey, I noticed you were lookingthis up, Can we?
Speaker 2 (41:28):
talk about that.
Speaker 1 (41:29):
A platform to bring up the conversation in a calm
way not freak out.
Speaker 2 (41:35):
And if you've already been having the conversation,
so bring this full circle.
If you've been having theseconversations.
When things like that pop up,it's not going to be weird, it's
going to be understood, as thisis part of the dynamics of our
relationship.
So it is okay for us to be ableto talk about these things.
Speaker 1 (41:54):
Totally.
Oh yes, Just starting theseconversations early.
And again, if you're listeningand you feel, you know, you feel
like you've missed the boat.
You've never missed the boat.
Speaker 2 (42:05):
Circle back to the boat as soon as possible.
Also in parenting, to just go.
Oh, I got this so wrong Like Ididn't realize.
Speaker 1 (42:12):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
I should have been the one totalk to you about this long ago,
but now.
I'm realizing it.
Can we join this conversationup now?
Speaker 2 (42:29):
and just touch base, and that's the gift of having
multiple children.
Is that, like you get it rightby number four?
Probably right.
Speaker 1 (42:37):
You just apologize to the first several?
Speaker 2 (42:40):
Yeah, exactly.
Oh phew, at least I had numberfour, probably right, you just
apologized to the first several.
Yeah, exactly, I'm sorry,another chance.
We're always apologizing to ourfirst born and our second.
Speaker 1 (42:49):
Yeah, who is almost six years behind our first like
yours yeah is like well, that'snot how you did it with parker,
and I'm like boy we made a lotof mistakes with your brother.
Speaker 2 (43:00):
That's right.
Speaker 1 (43:01):
That's not how he did it, and we have the prudence to
know and to change because ofour own mistakes.
Speaker 2 (43:09):
Yep, yep.
Or sometimes we get theopposite, with, like, the oldest
being like hey, that's not fair, he didn't get, I didn't get to
watch that.
I was like, yeah, it's not, butit's what it is.
I'm sorry.
That's right.
We can make different choices.
Speaker 1 (43:21):
That's the beauty of life and parenting.
You learn as you go and youadjust as new information comes
in, and I think that's thespirit of all of this is, if
you're hearing this for thefirst time or you're hearing
something new in today's episode, you know, um, give yourself
permission to make a change, todo something different, to start
(43:41):
the conversation with yourspouse.
That might be where you startfirst is just sharing this
episode with your spouse andsaying, hey, can we sit down and
and have a chat about this andand some of the insights that
were gained from this, thistopic.
Speaker 2 (43:55):
That's right, that's right.
And to listen to a podcasttogether, this is a great one.
I have many episodes on my showthat that tackle this topic as
well.
But then also there's like withpornography specifically,
something like fight the newdrug.
They have a three-partdocumentary series called brain
heart world that goes into theintricacies of how pornography
affects the brain, how itaffects relationships and its
(44:18):
impact that it's having on youknow, on our, on our, society.
You can watch those are like 30minutes with your teens and
then have a conversation withthem afterwards about what you
agreed with and what you didn'tagree with, what worked, what
didn't work, and so thishumility stance that you spoke
about, you can enter into thiseducation together with your
teens and to not feel likeyou're just behind or you have
(44:39):
to read all this and then youhave to spit it all back out to
them.
You can do this stuff togetheras you're learning, and that
becomes a shared venture.
That, I think, would make it alittle bit easier as well.
Speaker 1 (44:53):
So cool.
And what if your kid said heydad, have you ever thought of
such and such?
Or hey mom, this made me thinkof this.
And then you learn somethingnew from them.
That's a beautiful thing.
Speaker 2 (45:05):
Yeah, absolutely yes To journey alongside with them.
Speaker 1 (45:08):
Like you said, it could be something that you
pursue together, that you'relearning about this side by side
.
Speaker 2 (45:14):
Yeah, absolutely yes, yes, we can do it.
Parents Again, we can do it, wecan do it.
That's right.
Speaker 1 (45:21):
We've got what it takes and if we don't, we can
learn alongside them as they arefive and 10 and 13 and 15 and
20.
It's a beautiful thing and Ithink, honestly, the generation
of parents before us, ourparents, really didn't feel the
freedom and the permission tolearn along with us.
(45:43):
They thought, well, we're theparents, you're the kids, we got
to figure things out and impartknowledge on you.
And then that which isuncomfortable we kind of hope
that the school will tackle that, or the churches and then we
got to just march forward andour generation, I feel like, is
different in the generationafter us, where it's this
(46:03):
co-learning, it's thisjourneying alongside, not as
friend, as in I don't have anyrules and I don't have any
consequences and I'm notelevated to any place of
authority, but as friend, aslike someone who is saying I'm
never going to have it allfigured out, you can teach me
something and I can teach yousomething and we can journey
(46:24):
along this together, becausethis is what God wants for us is
to learn the truth and thebeautiful and know how to be
healthy in relationships and dohis will.
Speaker 2 (46:35):
Yeah, and in defense of our parents, they just didn't
have access to the informationthat we have today.
I mean you just happened towatch that one episode of 60
Minutes that maybe talked aboutthe one researcher who was
talking, that wrote a book onthis, that got that interview.
But that could have been inApril and you're tuning in in
(46:55):
May and it's gone.
There's no.
YouTube there's no internet thatyou can rewatch, that.
You can't go on some list whereyou go to podcasts and say what
are the titles that seem ofinterest and are pertinent to me
right now.
That stuff didn't exist in the80s and 90s.
It wasn't there, and so maybeyour friends talked about a book
(47:16):
that might've been available orsomething I don't know, but how
you even got information wasjust so restricted compared to
what it is today.
Speaker 1 (47:26):
I needed to hear that for myself, just because I
think I take for granted theinternet at our fingertips and
just how you could Google and intwo seconds come up with 100
top parenting books about sexand faith like get that
distilled in the filtering Right.
But back then, before theinternet, you'd be relying on
(47:50):
your parents.
You'd be, relying on theirfriends to tell them if they ran
into a book and then it was howdo you get it?
Speaker 2 (47:57):
Yeah, exactly how do you get the book you gotta?
Speaker 1 (48:00):
hope your library has it Well.
I grew up in a rural, tiny townof 1,200.
Speaker 2 (48:04):
Like they had books from 30 years you know yeah,
yeah, yeah, yeah, that's right,that's right.
What do you do?
Go to Barnes and Noble andactually buy it.
Speaker 1 (48:14):
I know.
Speaker 2 (48:15):
Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (48:20):
That's good to remember that the information
age is a real thing.
And now we have stuff at ourfingertips, all the stuff at our
fingertips Yep For good or forill?
Speaker 2 (48:25):
right For good or for ill.
Speaker 1 (48:27):
That's right.
That's right and so, yes, alsojust doing your own kind of
healing and looking back andmaybe grieving some of that
right.
I think that's important tosort of just acknowledge.
Like they didn't have theinformation, that's why I didn't
know things that I know now inmy 40s, when I was 16 or
(48:50):
whatever, and that just toremind yourselves that, just
like your parents, you're doingthe best that you have with the
resources available to you inthis moment.
Speaker 2 (49:00):
Amen, amen, yeah, amen to you in this moment.
Amen, amen, yeah, amen, jordan,so good, yeah Amen.
Speaker 1 (49:04):
Mario, what an incredible conversation.
Parents, if you've been waitingfor the perfect moment to talk
to your kids about sex, considerthis your green light.
Okay, you don't need a scriptor a degree in counseling.
You just need a willing heart,open ears and trust that God
will guide you.
And please remember, theseconversations aren't just about
(49:28):
facts.
They're about helping your kidsunderstand the beauty of how
God designed them and the valueof their bodies and the deep
purpose of relationships rootedin love and truth.
So don't go it alone.
Seek out resources that alignwith your faith and keep coming
(49:49):
back to the truth of God's lovefor your kids and for you.
And a huge thank you to DrMario Sacasa for sharing his
wisdom and making this feeldoable.
Let's keep the conversationgoing and let's do it with
intention, love and grace.
So, mario, thank you so muchfor coming back on our show.
(50:12):
Tell our listeners how to findyou.
Please restate the name of yourpodcast and your website.
Speaker 2 (50:18):
Thanks, jordan, again , such a gift to be with podcast
and your website.
Thanks, jordan, again, such agift to be with you and your
listeners.
The podcast is called AlwaysHope and you can find that on
YouTube, spotify, apple, and youcan just look up Always Hope
and it should pop up.
Or my website isdrmariacicasacom, and there
you'll find all the resourcesthat I have available, whether
it's the podcast, the YouTubechannel, the dating series,
(50:38):
anxiety series all the thingsthat I have going on.
Please check outdrmarisacasacom.
Speaker 1 (50:43):
Awesome.
You can find the link to theseresources in our show notes.
Even the books that we talkedabout, the works of Julia
Sadesky, good pictures, badpictures, books for young kids
All of that is linked here inour show notes.
So just scroll down below thisepisode and you can find links
to all those resources.
(51:03):
Until next time, parents, keepleading your family with courage
and confidence.
We'll catch you on anotherepisode of our show real soon,
Take care.
Hey parents, let's face it, talking to our kids
about sex can feel awkward,stressful and like one of those
conversations that you just wantto put off.
But here's the truth you arethe perfect and chosen person to
(00:20):
have these conversations withyour kids, and if you don't feel
ready, we've got you.
We're here to equip andencourage you every step of the
way.
Today on our show, we'rewelcoming back Dr Mario Sacasa.
He is a Christian counselorthat you loved from episode
(00:41):
number 140 on acceptingdifferences in marriage, and
this time he's helping us tounderstand how to guide our kids
through the beauty of how Godcreated them body, mind and soul
and what that means forrelationships and sexuality.
(01:02):
And listen, parents, you don'thave to be perfect.
You don't need all the answers,but you do need a starting
point, and this episode is it.
I'm confident that afterlistening to this episode,
you'll feel relief, directionand have some practical ways to
begin these talks at any agewith your kids.
(01:25):
So stick with us.
It's time to take the pressureoff of this conversation and
step into it with confidence andgrace.
Dr Sacasa, welcome back to ourshow.
Speaker 2 (01:39):
Jordan, you are so kind to have me back on so
quickly.
Thank you so much.
I am excited to have thisconversation with you because it
is absolutely important.
Speaker 1 (01:49):
So, so important.
And, dr Scassa, you and yourwife Kristen have been married
for over 20 years.
You're raising four kids andyou're also a licensed marriage
and family therapist and havebeen in practice for 15 years,
and you're also the podcast hostof a show called Always Hope,
(02:09):
where you really providesolutions to life's challenges
that are grounded in faith andpsychology.
So you've got like the fullpackage here for our audience.
You're in the trenches with usas a husband and a father and
you've got the expertise to gowith it.
Speaker 2 (02:29):
Yeah, I didn't realize how helpful of a degree
it was going to be in terms ofmy own parenting, but it's
actually been phenomenal, sinceI'm like, oh, these
conversations pop up and like,okay, I think I'm a little bit
more prepared for this thanmaybe some of my peers are, by
virtue of the clinical trainingand the conversations I have
with my clients.
Speaker 1 (02:47):
Praise be to God.
We're glad that we have you.
Last time you were on the show,you and I touched on the idea
of dating and what this seasonof parenting is like, when your
kids start dating, and duringthat talk we promised the
audience that we would circleback on the mic and give some
practical tips of how to talk tokids about sex and dating and
(03:12):
all of that.
So look, here we are, we'reback, here we are.
Speaker 2 (03:15):
We are people of our word.
That's what we like to think.
Speaker 1 (03:18):
That's exactly right.
We do what we promise we'regoing to do.
Integrity.
Speaker 2 (03:21):
We're going to do it.
Integrity that's right that wedo what we promise.
We're going to do Integritywe're going to do it, integrity.
Speaker 1 (03:24):
That's right, that's right.
Well, where do you think weshould begin with this topic
today?
Speaker 2 (03:29):
Yeah, it's a great question, Absolutely great
question.
The place to begin is torecognize that it's not just a
talk.
Okay, first and foremost, Ithink we hear this in our
culture, in our society.
It's like oh, when did you havethe talk with your parents, or
when should you have the talkwith your kids?
And we have to break thatlanguage because it's not a
(03:51):
single talk.
It's a series of conversationsthat we're going to have with
our kids, from the time thatthey're little to the time that
they leave their house andbeyond, and what we're trying to
instill in them again is anunderstanding of God's plan for
their body, god's plan formarriage, god's plan for
sexuality, helping them tounderstand that from a little
age and using age-appropriatelanguage there to they're bigger
(04:13):
and using more age-appropriatelanguage at that front also.
And the reason that this isimportant is because what we're
trying to do is we're trying toset up our kids for success and
set up our kids to be able tonavigate the complexities of the
world that we live in, and wewant to be able to set the stage
for this conversation, and so Ithink it's important for
(04:33):
parents just to so we're gettingstarted here to take a deep
breath to recognize that, yes,we're going to feel awkward, yes
, it's uncomfortable, yes, thistopic brings up all sorts of
questions about our ownexperiences with this topic and
the conversations we've had.
And it's going to be okay.
It's going to be okay, allright, we're going to have a
great time today.
Speaker 1 (04:52):
That's right.
That's right.
Just shake it off parents.
Shake it off folks, that'sright, it's not just about one
talk.
I love how you said it.
It's a series of talks, it'sconversation and really using
age-appropriate language andeven starting as young as five
and six to talk to kids abouttheir bodies and relationships.
Speaker 2 (05:14):
Absolutely.
So.
Let me start with the story.
Okay, my oldest is 20, and thennumber three was six years
younger than him, right?
So when he was six, he had thequestion mom's pregnant?
And so he had the question youknow where, where do babies come
from?
And uh, and we said, all right,bud, you know well this is so
already thinking about thisbeforehand.
(05:35):
And I said, uh, storks, youknow storks is is where babies
come from.
And we just left it as that.
No, I'm just joking, obviously,make it super awkward on them
and just make up random lies,anyways, no, but what we told
them is we said, listen, big guy, um, uh, god loves mommies and
daddies so much that he's givenus a special hug.
(05:55):
And when mommies and daddiesshare this special hug, god
blesses it sometimes, and that'swhere babies come from.
All right, and so that's whatwe told them one night when we
were putting him to bed, andthat was all he needed to know
in that moment.
He's six, he doesn't even knowall the intricacies of his body,
how his body works, how awoman's body work.
He doesn't need all of thatjust yet, but what he does need
(06:16):
at a young age is anunderstanding that babies are
connected to something physical,there's a special hug that's
there and that God blesses itright there, right out of the
gates.
I want to enter into hisimagination that it's in the
covenant and the covenant of asacred relationship that there's
something happening here.
There's something unique,there's something special and
(06:37):
God blesses it.
All right.
That's the tone that I want himto know and that's theology of
the body, church teaching andsexuality, kind of at its 101,
most basic level.
Those are the things we wantedto tell our kids.
So I said, do you have anyquestions?
He said no.
And what I've learned over theyears is that often I'm the one
that's ready to like talk morethan they are, because they
(06:57):
don't know the topic and sowhatever we tell them is all
they need to know.
So he was satisfied with thatanswer.
No big deal Went to know.
So he was satisfied with thatanswer.
No big deal.
Went to bed the next morningI'm getting ready to go to work.
Gabriel pops his little head uparound the kitchen.
He sees Kristen and I giving alittle kiss and a hug right
before I leave for work, atwhich point Gabriel looks out
(07:19):
around the kitchen.
He goes are you guys doing thespecial hug?
Speaker 1 (07:24):
I love it.
It's that that right there, no,no, but that's, this, isn't it.
Speaker 2 (07:29):
This isn't it.
We're not.
No, get out of here.
We can't come back to your room.
Yeah, Kids are great.
Kids are great.
So, just like just tellingparents, I mean, that's, that's.
That's sometimes it, just aswe're beginning the conversation
when they're little, all theyneed to know is super simple
(07:49):
stuff, but at least we'rebeginning to set the stage for
what's going to come down thepike as they get older.
Speaker 1 (07:56):
Yes, and you made such a good point that often we
have this urge or thistemptation to share more, but
it's important to be mindfulthat the kids come to the table
with really not much informationat that age right.
Five or six.
They're just like wait, howdoes this happen?
(08:19):
And so asking them for like hey, do you have any other
questions?
Maybe they don't.
That's enough.
That's sufficient for now.
Speaker 2 (08:25):
Yeah, that's exactly right.
And even as they get older whenyou're talking about 10, 11,
when we start needing to haveconversations about puberty and
the changes that are going tohappen in their body, I view my
role as a dad is to help preparemy kids for the changes that
are going to happen, and so,being armed with the information
that I do have, I try to prepthem for it and saying, okay,
(08:45):
like these are some of thethings that are about to happen,
these are some of the changesthat are going to occur.
We can have that conversationin those preteen years and then
we can get into furtherdistinctions about, like, what
actually happens with thechanges and all of that.
But anytime that I introducedthis topic or had these
conversations with my kids, it'salmost always me expecting more
(09:06):
to come out of it from theirside.
But, as we've already indicated, they're little and they're
innocent, they don't really know, and so they're very receptive
to whatever it is that we tellthem.
And again, I think it'simportant for us to be proactive
as parents and to have theseconversations with our kids so
that they do understand what thechurch teaches, what the Bible
(09:27):
tells us about God's plan formarriage, what the Bible tells
us about God's plan for familylife, because we want that to be
the foundation.
So often, what happens in oursociety is that, unfortunately,
kids are just exposed topornography at such a young age
that that ends up being thefirst encounter with this
conversation and that thenbecomes the template upon which
(09:50):
everything else is compared to.
And that's not what I want.
I want our kids to be able tounderstand what God's plan is
and then from there, thatwhatever, whatever comes on the
other side of that will be um,will be compared to that All
right.
So so, gabriel, for example, ashe was getting older and we're
now we're having conversationsabout the changes that happen in
the body, we can get somespecifics about how to have that
(10:11):
discussion with your kids.
But he was reading, he wasreading the Bible, actually of
all things, and the word rapepopped up somewhere in the old
Testament, as it does, and andhe said you know, dad, what's
what's rape?
He didn't know what that meantbut we had context for for what
sex is in terms of love,relationships, family, um God
blessing it intimacy,vulnerability, and I was able to
(10:33):
explain what sexual violationis in the context of that, and
he got it, he understood, heunderstood it, he understood how
hurtful that action can be, um,and so there's so many points
that I can say that, like whenwe set, like, the foundation,
when we, when we determine whatthe language is going to be
around this, anything elsebecomes a comparison to that.
(10:55):
So, whether we're talking aboutsomething like sexual violation,
whether we're talking aboutquestions of sexual morality or
attraction, things that pop upin TV shows, now, how to be able
to tell your kids how tonavigate those distinctions as
well, when we set the foundation, when we set the language, the
definition, the terms, we don'thave to be afraid then, because
(11:16):
now we've equipped our kids tobe able to know what's going on
here, to be able to help themthen to see what's going on in
the world and how they candistinguish and decipher what
they're seeing compared, to beable to help them then to see
what's going on in the world andhow they can distinguish and
decipher what they're seeingcompared to what they're
experiencing at home.
Speaker 1 (11:31):
I read one time that the foundation for a child's
attitudes around relationshipsis actually already formed by
the age of five.
And you make such a great point.
If we are talking to our kidsat a young age about God's
design for marriage andsexuality and we start to say
(11:57):
that at a young age, then theyrealize that true love is about
serving others, not just servingourselves.
And you mentioned pornographyand people being exposed to that
, and that's the first timethey've, kind of you know, had a
conversation or a run in withtheir parents about sex and
sexuality and just how you know,viewing pornography,
(12:22):
participating in sexual actsthat serve only yourself is, is
just you know that that thatblows people's minds right.
It's just like whoa, whatthere's, this, and then there's
there's what I you know know isis good and and beautiful for me
to to serve another person.
Speaker 2 (12:42):
So that just came up in my mind when you were talking
.
Speaker 1 (12:46):
It's just like this idea that it's our role as
parents to help model healthyrelationships for our kids and
to understand that they alreadyhave kind of that foundation set
some way by the time thatthey're five.
Speaker 2 (13:01):
Yeah, that's right.
And so, like PDAs I don't knowhow comfortable you are like
kissing your husband in front ofyour kids or like telling
parents like it's okay to I mean, hold hands, snuggle, just sit,
just displaying healthy amountsof physical interaction is
absolutely important for us tomodel that for our kids so that
(13:23):
when we're having theseconversations there's some
context for it.
Right Again, like it's not, I'mnot trying to be explicit,
that's what I'm saying.
Obviously, keep the doorslocked and make sure the kids
are asleep.
When you're sharing intimacywith your spouse, but being able
to display healthy amounts ofphysical interaction and being
healthy physical display withthem as well, so that that model
(13:44):
is appropriately set, you know,as you've indicated.
Speaker 1 (13:50):
Mm-hmm, mm-hmm, just yeah.
And recognizing that you know,I think when you think about a
conversation with your kid abouttheir body and God's design for
their body, that conversationis actually so much easier than
this dreaded conversation thatwe all feel this pressure to
(14:10):
have with our kids when webecome parents, like, oh, when
they turn 13, we're going tohave to have this, have to have
this one singular talk thateverything else hinges on for
our kids, right?
Yeah, that's right, and thenalso I remember too, thinking
like well, I didn't get thattalk with my own parents.
(14:33):
Really I remember in religiouseducation going and it was like
we kind of like talked around it.
And so then thinking when youbecome a parent, if you haven't
had the talk or the series oftalks with your own parents,
then you're just like terrified,like I hope they pick this up
(14:54):
somewhere.
I hope you know somehow theyget the right message.
But going back to theintroduction, like we, the
parents, are the chosen ones tohave these conversations with
our kids right?
Speaker 2 (15:08):
Yes, yes, absolutely.
Parents are the primaryeducators of the faith.
I mean, like we are what, whatgives the foundation to, to our
children?
And listen, I didn't get thistalk from my parents I think my
sister, who is 10 years olderthan me, who's also a counselor
I remember it was like my I waslike a senior, I think, packing
up graduated, getting ready togo to college, and she steps
(15:29):
into the room and she was sweetand she goes.
You know, mario, you know, ifyou ever have any questions
about girls or sex, you know,happy to answer and she was so
sweet asking the question.
But in my 17 year old you knowkind of knowledge, I was like,
ah, I think you're a little latefor that conversation, but I
appreciate it, you know type ofthing you know.
But but that was like theextent that I got and so we've
(15:52):
taken the opposite approach withour kids.
As I said, six years old, wheredo babies come from?
I joked about the stork.
Don't give them, don't say thestork, you know, don't watch
boss, baby.
It's Find language that feelscomfortable for you as they then
get older 10, 11, and you starthaving to need to talk to them
(16:13):
about the changes that's goingto happen.
I only have boys, so maybe youcan explain this from your
perspective as a mom with women.
But for boys, it's good to beable to explain to them that
changes are going to happen, andexplaining it in a positive
sense.
You know, so often we approachthis topic with a sense of
awkwardness or discomfort, whichit absolutely is but helping
(16:34):
them to understand like why arethese changes happening within
our body?
Your body is transforming frombeing a child to becoming an
adult and the changes that needto happen are important for you
Like.
It's necessary for you and forthese changes to actually happen
.
And so what's going to happen?
Well, your voice is going tostart dropping, you're going to
start getting muscles, you'regoing to start getting hair and
(16:54):
funny places, you're going toget pimples.
Why is because the body isstarting to change.
But for boys, what happens in,like the first, I don't know
couple of years, from 11 to 13,when puberty kicks in, their
testosterone rate increases bysomething like 400%.
And so that's why you see theseboys like one day they wake up
(17:14):
and you're like where'd thosemuscles come from?
You're a man, like whathappened, and so you could joke
about it in a way that doesn'tshame them.
Because they're so sensitive atthis age, because so much is
happening, we want to becautious with our language.
As parents, we want to be ableto encourage and we want to make
jokes, but not in a way that isinciting shame.
(17:35):
We want to help them see that,yes, you feel uncomfortable, we
get it.
Your body's changing.
One leg's longer than the other, one arm is longer than the
other.
All of a sudden, you just grablike my boys grabbing drawers.
All of a sudden, the musclememory that they had when they
were 10, changes when they're 12and they're ripping the drawers
off because they're stronger.
Now you know the holes in thewalls, the whole bit, right.
(17:57):
You know all of that's normal,like it's all part of part of
what's happening, you know, intheir development, and so you
want to start by normalizing thechanges and helping them to see
that these changes serve areally important purpose.
As they get older this is whatI tell my boys the women in
their life are going to need thestrength that they're
(18:17):
developing.
They're going to need thecapacities that they're
developing right now, the skillsthat they're acquiring, the
things that are happening.
All of this is absolutelyimportant for them and I want
them to know that, not in a way,again, that produces too much
shame or produces too muchpressure, but just to help them
ease through this transitionthat we all went through at
their age.
Speaker 1 (18:38):
So important to acknowledge the changes that are
happening that we can recognizephysically in them their voice,
the hair on their bodies, theirsize, the growth spurt the
smells, know hair on theirbodies, their, you know size,
the growth, the smells, the funfun little smells, yes.
And for girls having theirmenstrual cycle and and feeling
extra sensitive around certaintimes of the month, it's so
(19:02):
important for us to address thisin a natural way with them,
Right?
I love your idea of just sayingyou know, hey, this is supposed
to happen.
This is actually God's design.
He is changing your body inpreparation of something bigger
than yourself.
This ability to join withanother man or woman and the two
(19:27):
become one and your body ishealthy and it's ready to
produce children Like this is agreat and beautiful thing.
Clunky, yes, awkward, yes,right, but it's all for the
greater good.
This is a good thing.
I read just something in this,this book beyond the birds and
the bees by.
(19:47):
Lisa and Greg Popchek.
Speaker 2 (19:50):
Popcheck, Popcheck.
Yes.
Speaker 1 (19:52):
And they were just talking about how important it
is for us to talk to our kids ata young age, when they're going
through those hormonal changes,about how culture will tell us,
when we get that feeling orthat tingly sensation inside our
bodies, that that is reallymeant for sex.
And that means like go after thegirl or go after the guy, and
(20:15):
you know it's sort of like this,go get a mentality like, like
that physical sensationindicates you ought to pursue
this person for the sexual act.
And what God tells us is thatthose little signs that our body
gives us, the tinglingsensation, that hyper-awareness
(20:39):
of the person of the oppositesex, is actually a signal to
tell us you ought to serve thisperson, Do something kind for
them, not necessarily go pursuethem for sex, but it means we
were made to serve others and soit's okay to be able to
appreciate the beauty in a womanor the you know the appearance
(21:03):
of a man and recognize thatfeeling.
But if we have that frame, thatframework that that feeling
indicates that we should servethem in some beautiful way, in a
friendship way or whatever,that's totally a different lens.
Speaker 2 (21:20):
Yep, absolutely.
John Paul II, in his Theologyof the Body, has some wonderful
language about being able todecipher within ourselves what
is lust and what is love, and herecognizes and articulates that
it's very complicated, eveninteriorly, even for adults.
Sometimes we can get confused,even within the context of
marriage.
Am I pursuing my wife right now?
(21:40):
Am I making an imitationbecause I desire her, goodness,
I want to serve her, or is itjust because I'm tired and I
want some type of emotionalrelease at this point and know
and wanted to be able to tonavigate that?
And so GP2 says it's it'simportant to recognize that
those variances and thosenuances can be confused, but
that it's important for us tostart doing that work of
(22:03):
reflecting and understanding.
Okay, what movement is leadingme towards to use the pop check
language service of another?
Or what movement is moving metowards wanting to take, go
conquest that person?
I think was kind of thelanguage that you were using.
Okay, want to be able to getsomething from them or want to
be able to give something fromthem?
That desire interiorly can bevery confusing, and so it's
(22:25):
important again, just to helpour kids understand that, as
these systems are turning online, that like those.
All that new feels are going tobe a little bit different.
I remember with each of the boyswhen they first started
noticing girls like I justremember and noticing the female
body.
It's like you just walk in andall of a sudden the head just
(22:46):
gets caught.
It's like, oh, what's he?
Oh, you need to look at that,birds.
It happens early.
It happens early.
You know it happens and you'relike, okay, well, what do you do
?
Do you just like, do you shamethem and say, don't, don't,
don't, do that.
No, you try to navigate and belike, okay, let's, let's just
(23:06):
kind of redirect, help themunderstand how to be able to be
respectful, how to be able toappreciate somebody's goodness
and their beauty without fallinginto lust.
With that I mean these thingsare complicated, complicated
feelings for adults, and so Ithink this is why it's so hard
for parents to step into thisconversation, because often I
think what parents feel is theshame of their own experiences
(23:29):
related to this topic.
Maybe people are listening tothis and had a conversion after
marriage or came back to Christafter marriage and are like I'm
the last person to give my kidsadvice because look at all the
things that I did before I gotmarried.
And so the problem is that yourkids don't know any of that
history and we come into thisconversation and think that we
(23:50):
don't have credibility becauseof what we've gone through in
life or the mistakes that we'vemade.
Um, or maybe we were Christianand we made mistakes along the
way Okay fine, but the problemis that we, our, our kids, do
not know or do not understandour history, do not understand
the shame.
That's fine, like, just checkthat aside and still do what's
(24:10):
necessary to help prepare yourkids so that they can make
better decisions than the onesthat you made.
And so anybody who's listeningjust want to encourage you and
recognize that I get it, I getit.
I get it.
Do the work that you need to doto come to peace and acceptance
about your story so that youcan embrace that as the journey
that God has put you on.
(24:30):
And you have an opportunityhere to be able to instill
something different for yourkids and be able to help them
navigate this in a way that youweren't able to.
And so just want to justgenuinely, genuinely, genuinely
encourage parents here to tocome to peace so that they can
be better prepared to equiptheir children.
Speaker 1 (24:52):
So good, so good for myself as well.
I mean you're navigating thingsin teen life and the pressures
of your friends, and if youdon't have a foundation for
these conversations, and safeconversations with your parents,
then you're talking to yourfriends about this and, like one
15 year old to another, is theblind leading the blind.
Speaker 2 (25:15):
You got it.
Yes, jordan.
Yes, with TikTok experts alongthe way, you know, telling them
what to do.
Speaker 1 (25:22):
Yes, oh yes, this is not the way we want our kids to
navigate sex and sexuality, andso I love how you genuinely give
parents permission to do theirown kind of healing around their
past and to give themselvesgrace with the information that
(25:45):
they had at the time and howthey chose to navigate those
relationships Because, like yousaid, our kids don't aren't
preloaded with all of ourshameful past, you know, and
they're like, oh, let's see whatkind of advice she's giving
Exactly.
Speaker 2 (26:02):
Yes, exactly, exactly , yes.
But we think that I mean that's, that's what we're waiting for.
We're waiting for thataccusation Exactly what you said
to be thrown back in her facebecause of what we went through
and they don't again.
They don't know, they don'tknow, and so we can share.
Just I don't briefly and saylike listen, this has been a
learning process for me too.
(26:23):
I don't think our kids need toknow all of our experiences.
We don't need to tell themeverything.
We probably don't even tellthem anything honestly but like
just helping them to see that,like it's okay and we're going
to get through this, and thatdisposition is what's going to
help them as they continue togrow and as they start dating
and as they start makingmistakes and as they start
(26:44):
getting exposed to things.
Like it's going to happen, lifeis going to intervene.
You can put yourself inwhatever Christian bubble that
you want and think that you'renot going to be exposed to it,
but it's going to happen, it'sgoing to happen.
And so, again, what we'retrying to do is give them the
knowledge that they need so thatthey can develop the best
choices that they can make, sothey can develop the best
(27:06):
virtues that they can developaround this area, and that's
what we're trying to do asparents.
Speaker 1 (27:12):
No, you mentioned the word virtue and just I think of
this conversation and chastitybeing the virtue that we need to
work on with our kids to helpthem love the right person at
the right time in the right ways.
That's truly what chastity is.
Do you use that word with yourboys?
(27:32):
I'm curious, because you hearthe word chastity and purity.
I actually don't think I usethe word.
Speaker 2 (27:40):
I actually don't think I use that word as often
as maybe I should, but I guess Idon't because the purity
culture has a bad taste in mymouth.
Uh, I read I kissed datinggoodbye when I was in, uh, like
a freshman in college, and Iguess I didn't have, as as as it
didn't shape me as much asmaybe it did some of my peers or
(28:01):
others.
But the purity culture, thattype of rigidity, um that that,
that that language to me, um,has a it's a very sour taste in
my mouth, and so I understandwhat the good that those books
and that movement was trying todo.
But we want to just take thegood and walk away from what's
bad and not create a systemwhere it's overly rigid.
(28:24):
Again we're trying to respectour children's freedoms.
We're trying to instill themvirtues.
We're trying to help shape themin a way that their consciences
are formed so that they'remaking right decisions, and not
just trying to impose a set ofstandards onto them that they
have to conform to or not.
Speaker 1 (28:42):
I like that because you're saying I'm not just
starting with a word and givingthem one word to carry with them
into teen life and college.
Like chastity, be chased yeahyeah, yeah, you know just but?
But the understanding ofrelationships, respecting
another in a relationship,respecting yourself, saving
yourself for marriage because ofthe goodness that you're going
(29:06):
to get out of it, not because ofthe shame that'll be put upon
you if you do the opposite.
Right, not because of the shamethat'll be put upon you if you
do the opposite right.
So you're leading with a, ifyou follow God's plan for your
life in this beautiful, naturalway, which is really really hard
, you're going to reap theseamazing benefits.
Speaker 2 (29:23):
Yes, that's right and so, but that is chastity Again,
what you just described ischastity, is purity, and so I do
use that word, but I try tojust massage it, I guess a
little bit differently.
So we actually get to the point, without all the cultural
buzzwords or hangups that may beassociated with it, which may
(29:43):
be my issue as well, and I'mwilling to be called out on that
, and that's fine.
But to each his own.
Speaker 1 (29:49):
That's right.
I think we need to meet ourkids where they are Right, and
so if, if they tend to be veryintellectual types that want to
know, like what is that called,what is that word, what?
What word must I use with otherpeople which still might not
work for them because theirpeers might be like what
chastity, what?
I don't even know what you'resaying.
(30:10):
You know, so I think we know ourkids best and that's the
message that you and I aretrying to send to people right
now is that you are the primaryeducator of faith and morals in
your family, whether you feelprepared or not, and you know
the words best to use with them.
Yep, absolutely when to jointhem in this conversation and
when.
Speaker 2 (30:30):
Yeah, and we live in a day and age where information
is available to us, so you don'thave to go into this alone.
You mentioned the Pop Checksbook, which is one certainly
great resource to recommend.
I'd also recommend Dr JuliaSadusky's work.
She has a book on talking toyour kids about sex that also
kind of speaks it from aChristian, Catholic perspective,
(30:51):
which is also great.
If you're itty bitty kids andyou want to be able to talk to
them about pornography, the goodpictures bad pictures book is a
great resource to be able tohave that conversation with your
children.
And then, as far as usingchastity talks, I mean there's
abundance.
I mean of course we have theJason Everett's and the Matt
Frad's of the world and theChristopher West's and Brian
(31:13):
Butler and folks like that whohave dedicated their lives to
speaking on this topic.
That us, as parents, we don'thave to make it all up.
We just have to avail ourselvesto the information that's there
and be able to read thoseresources, get the information
that we can and then know how tobe able to cur information
that's there and be able to readthose resources, get the
information that we can and thenknow how to be able to curtail
(31:35):
that in a way that meets theneeds of your specific children.
Speaker 1 (31:40):
Yes, Always being students right, Always trying to
learn along with our kids.
I think I read one time too.
We only have to be a chapterahead of our kids.
Speaker 2 (31:52):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's right.
Yeah, yeah, that's right.
It's like students.
You only have to be a chapterahead.
Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 1 (31:57):
That's right.
So find the resources and talkto your friends about what kind
of conversations they're havingwith their children as well.
I think that's a wonderful wayto kind of bring this topic to
light in your social circles,and so, again, other people
don't feel like, oh gosh, thisis just something we should talk
(32:17):
about behind closed doors.
And no, let's see what otherpeople are saying.
Speaker 2 (32:22):
Yeah, that's right.
When we were in New Orleans,the Archdiocese used to offer a
father-son, mother-daughterprogram that was geared to 10
and 11-year-olds, or 10 to 13,something like that, and that
was a great program because theyhad the director of family life
would come in and he'd give atalk about just an intro
(32:42):
theology of the bodypresentation.
Here's the beauty of God's plan.
Here's men, here's women.
This is why God creates usdifferently but creates us to be
the same.
Where are the differences andwhat's the importance in all of
that?
And then they would have adoctor give a presentation on
all the changes that happen, youknow, with slides and really
explaining here's the femaleanatomy, here's the male anatomy
(33:04):
, here's the changes that happen.
And and then leaving it to theparents to be able to talk about
what sex itself is.
So everything.
He described everything rightup to to that line and then
leaving it to the parents to beable to talk about what sex
itself is.
So everything.
He described everything rightup to that line and let it for
parents to be able to then havethat conversation.
But like, oh, you saw thethings that we just talked about
.
Well, funny how all those thingsactually fit together, you know
(33:25):
, or having that discussion withour kids.
So that was a great resourcethat I am forever grateful for,
because we were able to havethese conversations about
chastity, about the church'steachings, all of that.
But the medical side, or thebiological side of it, that's
where I felt like we werelacking in some resources and I
(33:46):
was really grateful that theArchdiocese provided that and
that I can go with my son andwe'd watch this and then we'd go
out afterwards and we wouldhave like an hour, two hour long
conversation afterwards.
Speaker 1 (33:58):
So good, and I think when you understand the biology
behind all of this, it becomesto me the pressure just like
just shakes off because it'slike this is science, this is
nature, this is going to happento every one of us in our bodies
.
These changes and so it makesthe conversation easier to say
(34:20):
like, oh, we are all goingthrough this.
Isn't it awesome to understandwhy our bodies go through this
change?
And then it, like you said, hedidn't need to explain the
sexual act.
Speaker 2 (34:32):
It was like right up to the point of the marital
embrace, that special hug thatcreates a baby, a human.
You know, it's so awesome.
Yeah, remember that special hugwe were talking about six years
ago.
That that's it.
You know, like.
Speaker 1 (34:45):
That's right, that's right.
It comes full circle andthey're like oh.
Speaker 2 (34:49):
Yeah, and I think that's part of life that things
are unfolding, mysteries arebeing revealed bit by bit.
It's okay.
We don't have to give them allthe information at one time.
Let's let things graduallyunfold.
That is okay.
That's how life works.
That's how divine pedagogy is.
We don't know it all in oneinstance, and that's fine.
(35:12):
Let things unfold and be readyfor them.
Now it does require someintentionality.
This conversation isn't justgoing to come up.
You have to introduce it.
Part of setting a foundationfor your kids is saying we're
going to talk about this.
Even though it's awkward, eventhough you may feel
uncomfortable, it's importantenough for us to have this
conversation.
And what you're telling them isthat you're a safe place for
(35:35):
them to be able to bring updiscussions after the fact.
So when they do see something,when they may cross a line with
a boyfriend, girlfriend, whenthey may whatever the case might
be you want them to know thatyou're a place where we can
continue this conversation.
Speaker 1 (35:53):
So so important to set that foundation of safety
and trust between you and yourchild.
So, like you said, when theyfall, when they make the mistake
, when they cross the line,Because they're going to.
Speaker 2 (36:04):
They're going to you did too, you did too.
Exactly, that's exactly it.
Speaker 1 (36:08):
Yeah, yeah, that's right At some point they'll come
back and have a safe place toland the plane and have the
conversation right.
Yes, yes.
Yes, it's so good.
All on all on the table.
The other thing I'm thinking ofis just the importance of like
carving out some one-on-one timewith your kiddos.
You know, in those years the 11through 13, 15, 18, you know
(36:32):
just that you get outside of thehouse, you go on a hike, a walk
, a trip to get ice cream orsomething and to just sort of
ask some of those questions,open-ended questions, in the
midst of doing something thatyour child likes, to find out
where they are with all of thisand to kind of offer a place to
(36:52):
ask any questions that may becirculating in their mind.
Speaker 2 (36:57):
Since the last time you had an intentional
conversation about this, yeah, Itry with my kids to do a dad's
night out, I mean.
So we have four kids and it'sbusy with them.
They're very active in theiractivities.
I'm very active with myventures as well, and sometimes
we can feel like we're justships passing in the night.
And so trying to maybe twice ayear, I would say, if possible
(37:21):
it's been a little bit sinceI've done this because of the
move and different things butbut trying to at least have one
day where it's like all right,what do you want to do?
Let's go out, let's go havesome fun, let's go get a meal,
and so we know that it's a timethat we're going to have a good
time together.
Whether we go to a ball game orwatch a movie or go to an
escape room or whatever it isthat they want to do, we go do
(37:42):
the activity and then afterwardswe go get a bite to eat, and
when we're sitting and eating iswhen we start having some of
these um meteor conversations.
Check in you know, how are youdoing?
How are things when?
Where are we checking in onthat stuff and then trying to
introduce some of this um aswell?
So it's, it can done, folks, itcan be done.
Speaker 1 (38:00):
It can.
And again, you don't have tohave all the answers, it doesn't
have to be a perfect plan, youdon't have to put this in your
calendar on a special day, whenthey turn 13,.
You have to do this one thingright If you've passed these
milestones it's never too lateto go back and say hey, I know
we never talked about this andI'm unsure of where you are with
(38:21):
your own sexuality, your ownrelationships, but I just want
to let you know that I'mavailable and open to start a
conversation, wherever it is youfeel comfortable talking to me,
about this real liferelationship stuff and sex stuff
.
Speaker 2 (38:37):
And.
Speaker 1 (38:38):
I bet your kids would be.
Oh, immediately their guardwill come down a bit and go oh,
you're available.
It'd be better to do that thanjust to say, well, I've missed
the boat and it's too late, andnever even mention it to them,
right?
Speaker 2 (38:54):
Yes, absolutely Absolutely.
Now we do have coming in eyeson the computer and the phones
and devices.
So when things pop up, you know, we, we take a look at it and
that's a point of that, becomesa point of conversation also,
again not out of shame, but justan intervention where you can
be like, hey, you know, I saw acouple of things kind of get
flagged.
Would you tell me what, what,what happened there, what was
(39:14):
going on there?
Again, trying to get them toreflect and to think, as we said
earlier, about the differencesbetween that lust and that love
and helping them to be able toreflect interiorly about what
was happening, thoseconversations we can have with
them also just to help shapethem a little bit.
Speaker 1 (39:33):
And you mentioned that software that you can put
on your computers and yourphones called Covenant Eyes
Covenant Eyes.
Speaker 2 (39:40):
Covenant Eyes.
Yep, that's right.
And so that is a web filter aswell as a web tracker, and you
get an accountability reportdaily if you want that weekly,
depending on what frequency youwant those emails to come into
you.
And what it does, is it daytrack what websites they've been
looking at, and some websitesare fine, some are not.
They have kind of like a greenit.
They track what websitesthey've been looking at, and
(40:00):
some websites are fine, some arenot.
They have kind of like a green,yellow, red, uh type of
indication and some things willget they'll block.
We'll get blocked automaticallyand anything gets blocked
automatically.
You know we'll, we'll pop up Um, so it.
It helps.
You can set kind of thestringency of it Um and uh, and
how hard you want it to befiltering or how light you want
it to be filtering.
(40:25):
And I know sometimes parentsmight feel uncomfortable about
that, but I will say it's animportant tool to help parents
understand what their child'sinternet behaviors are and it
helps to bring up some reallygreat conversations, even if
they're just on Amazon searchingfor Lego toys, whatever you can
be like.
Oh, I saw you were looking upthis Lego toy.
Is that one that you'rethinking about for your birthday
that's coming up or whatever.
You know.
You kind of can see some ofthat, but it also does.
(40:47):
It helps them to break awayfrom this notion that everything
they do online is justanonymous, that there's no
accountability online.
There is accountability online,and it just helps to bring
again some of thoseconversations up to the fore.
Speaker 1 (41:01):
Well, and I want to underscore what you said is, the
purpose of using these is notto just bust your kids and dish
out a quick consequence.
Give me your phone, you're donewith that?
Yeah, exactly Because thatcommunicates shame and that
whatever you did or werethinking about is awful and
terrible and so bad that you gotyour computer in your pocket
(41:21):
removed.
You know.
But instead you're saying itcould serve as a.
Hey, I noticed you were lookingthis up, Can we?
Speaker 2 (41:28):
talk about that.
Speaker 1 (41:29):
A platform to bring up the conversation in a calm
way not freak out.
Speaker 2 (41:35):
And if you've already been having the conversation,
so bring this full circle.
If you've been having theseconversations.
When things like that pop up,it's not going to be weird, it's
going to be understood, as thisis part of the dynamics of our
relationship.
So it is okay for us to be ableto talk about these things.
Speaker 1 (41:54):
Totally.
Oh yes, Just starting theseconversations early.
And again, if you're listeningand you feel, you know, you feel
like you've missed the boat.
You've never missed the boat.
Speaker 2 (42:05):
Circle back to the boat as soon as possible.
Also in parenting, to just go.
Oh, I got this so wrong Like Ididn't realize.
Speaker 1 (42:12):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
I should have been the one totalk to you about this long ago,
but now.
I'm realizing it.
Can we join this conversationup now?
Speaker 2 (42:29):
and just touch base, and that's the gift of having
multiple children.
Is that, like you get it rightby number four?
Probably right.
Speaker 1 (42:37):
You just apologize to the first several?
Speaker 2 (42:40):
Yeah, exactly.
Oh phew, at least I had numberfour, probably right, you just
apologized to the first several.
Yeah, exactly, I'm sorry,another chance.
We're always apologizing to ourfirst born and our second.
Speaker 1 (42:49):
Yeah, who is almost six years behind our first like
yours yeah is like well, that'snot how you did it with parker,
and I'm like boy we made a lotof mistakes with your brother.
Speaker 2 (43:00):
That's right.
Speaker 1 (43:01):
That's not how he did it, and we have the prudence to
know and to change because ofour own mistakes.
Speaker 2 (43:09):
Yep, yep.
Or sometimes we get theopposite, with, like, the oldest
being like hey, that's not fair, he didn't get, I didn't get to
watch that.
I was like, yeah, it's not, butit's what it is.
I'm sorry.
That's right.
We can make different choices.
Speaker 1 (43:21):
That's the beauty of life and parenting.
You learn as you go and youadjust as new information comes
in, and I think that's thespirit of all of this is, if
you're hearing this for thefirst time or you're hearing
something new in today's episode, you know, um, give yourself
permission to make a change, todo something different, to start
(43:41):
the conversation with yourspouse.
That might be where you startfirst is just sharing this
episode with your spouse andsaying, hey, can we sit down and
and have a chat about this andand some of the insights that
were gained from this, thistopic.
Speaker 2 (43:55):
That's right, that's right.
And to listen to a podcasttogether, this is a great one.
I have many episodes on my showthat that tackle this topic as
well.
But then also there's like withpornography specifically,
something like fight the newdrug.
They have a three-partdocumentary series called brain
heart world that goes into theintricacies of how pornography
affects the brain, how itaffects relationships and its
(44:18):
impact that it's having on youknow, on our, on our, society.
You can watch those are like 30minutes with your teens and
then have a conversation withthem afterwards about what you
agreed with and what you didn'tagree with, what worked, what
didn't work, and so thishumility stance that you spoke
about, you can enter into thiseducation together with your
teens and to not feel likeyou're just behind or you have
(44:39):
to read all this and then youhave to spit it all back out to
them.
You can do this stuff togetheras you're learning, and that
becomes a shared venture.
That, I think, would make it alittle bit easier as well.
Speaker 1 (44:53):
So cool.
And what if your kid said heydad, have you ever thought of
such and such?
Or hey mom, this made me thinkof this.
And then you learn somethingnew from them.
That's a beautiful thing.
Speaker 2 (45:05):
Yeah, absolutely yes To journey alongside with them.
Speaker 1 (45:08):
Like you said, it could be something that you
pursue together, that you'relearning about this side by side
.
Speaker 2 (45:14):
Yeah, absolutely yes, yes, we can do it.
Parents Again, we can do it, wecan do it.
That's right.
Speaker 1 (45:21):
We've got what it takes and if we don't, we can
learn alongside them as they arefive and 10 and 13 and 15 and
20.
It's a beautiful thing and Ithink, honestly, the generation
of parents before us, ourparents, really didn't feel the
freedom and the permission tolearn along with us.
(45:43):
They thought, well, we're theparents, you're the kids, we got
to figure things out and impartknowledge on you.
And then that which isuncomfortable we kind of hope
that the school will tackle that, or the churches and then we
got to just march forward andour generation, I feel like, is
different in the generationafter us, where it's this
(46:03):
co-learning, it's thisjourneying alongside, not as
friend, as in I don't have anyrules and I don't have any
consequences and I'm notelevated to any place of
authority, but as friend, aslike someone who is saying I'm
never going to have it allfigured out, you can teach me
something and I can teach yousomething and we can journey
(46:24):
along this together, becausethis is what God wants for us is
to learn the truth and thebeautiful and know how to be
healthy in relationships and dohis will.
Speaker 2 (46:35):
Yeah, and in defense of our parents, they just didn't
have access to the informationthat we have today.
I mean you just happened towatch that one episode of 60
Minutes that maybe talked aboutthe one researcher who was
talking, that wrote a book onthis, that got that interview.
But that could have been inApril and you're tuning in in
(46:55):
May and it's gone.
There's no.
YouTube there's no internet thatyou can rewatch, that.
You can't go on some list whereyou go to podcasts and say what
are the titles that seem ofinterest and are pertinent to me
right now.
That stuff didn't exist in the80s and 90s.
It wasn't there, and so maybeyour friends talked about a book
(47:16):
that might've been available orsomething I don't know, but how
you even got information wasjust so restricted compared to
what it is today.
Speaker 1 (47:26):
I needed to hear that for myself, just because I
think I take for granted theinternet at our fingertips and
just how you could Google and intwo seconds come up with 100
top parenting books about sexand faith like get that
distilled in the filtering Right.
But back then, before theinternet, you'd be relying on
(47:50):
your parents.
You'd be, relying on theirfriends to tell them if they ran
into a book and then it was howdo you get it?
Speaker 2 (47:57):
Yeah, exactly how do you get the book you gotta?
Speaker 1 (48:00):
hope your library has it Well.
I grew up in a rural, tiny townof 1,200.
Speaker 2 (48:04):
Like they had books from 30 years you know yeah,
yeah, yeah, yeah, that's right,that's right.
What do you do?
Go to Barnes and Noble andactually buy it.
Speaker 1 (48:14):
I know.
Speaker 2 (48:15):
Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (48:20):
That's good to remember that the information
age is a real thing.
And now we have stuff at ourfingertips, all the stuff at our
fingertips Yep For good or forill?
Speaker 2 (48:25):
right For good or for ill.
Speaker 1 (48:27):
That's right.
That's right and so, yes, alsojust doing your own kind of
healing and looking back andmaybe grieving some of that
right.
I think that's important tosort of just acknowledge.
Like they didn't have theinformation, that's why I didn't
know things that I know now inmy 40s, when I was 16 or
(48:50):
whatever, and that just toremind yourselves that, just
like your parents, you're doingthe best that you have with the
resources available to you inthis moment.
Speaker 2 (49:00):
Amen, amen, yeah, amen to you in this moment.
Amen, amen, yeah, amen, jordan,so good, yeah Amen.
Speaker 1 (49:04):
Mario, what an incredible conversation.
Parents, if you've been waitingfor the perfect moment to talk
to your kids about sex, considerthis your green light.
Okay, you don't need a scriptor a degree in counseling.
You just need a willing heart,open ears and trust that God
will guide you.
And please remember, theseconversations aren't just about
(49:28):
facts.
They're about helping your kidsunderstand the beauty of how
God designed them and the valueof their bodies and the deep
purpose of relationships rootedin love and truth.
So don't go it alone.
Seek out resources that alignwith your faith and keep coming
(49:49):
back to the truth of God's lovefor your kids and for you.
And a huge thank you to DrMario Sacasa for sharing his
wisdom and making this feeldoable.
Let's keep the conversationgoing and let's do it with
intention, love and grace.
So, mario, thank you so muchfor coming back on our show.
(50:12):
Tell our listeners how to findyou.
Please restate the name of yourpodcast and your website.
Speaker 2 (50:18):
Thanks, jordan, again , such a gift to be with podcast
and your website.
Thanks, jordan, again, such agift to be with you and your
listeners.
The podcast is called AlwaysHope and you can find that on
YouTube, spotify, apple, and youcan just look up Always Hope
and it should pop up.
Or my website isdrmariacicasacom, and there
you'll find all the resourcesthat I have available, whether
it's the podcast, the YouTubechannel, the dating series,
(50:38):
anxiety series all the thingsthat I have going on.
Please check outdrmarisacasacom.
Speaker 1 (50:43):
Awesome.
You can find the link to theseresources in our show notes.
Even the books that we talkedabout, the works of Julia
Sadesky, good pictures, badpictures, books for young kids
All of that is linked here inour show notes.
So just scroll down below thisepisode and you can find links
to all those resources.
(51:03):
Until next time, parents, keepleading your family with courage
and confidence.
We'll catch you on anotherepisode of our show real soon,
Take care.
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