Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:04):
There's more to great travel stories than picture perfect views.
Sometimes the real gems are the awkward bus rides, the misturns,
and the people you meet along the way. In this episode,
we're diving into the heart of travel with someone who's
made those stories her specialty. Episode two six starts right now.
(00:24):
Welcome to the Family Vacationer with Robin.
Speaker 2 (00:27):
Tracy, your go to podcast for families on the moon.
Speaker 1 (00:32):
Welcome back, friends to the Family Vacationer. This is episode
two o six and I'm your host, Rob. This podcast
is here to help families create more meaningful and memorable
travel experiences together. Now, if you've ever had a travel
moment that was messy, unpredictable, and somehow became the highlight
of your trip, you're gonna love Today's guest, Melissa Roadway
(00:54):
is a Canadian writer and a podcast host who's backpacked
through more than fifty countries The Beautiful, Chaos and Those
Adventures and her best selling book The People You Meet.
Melissa writes with humor, heart and honesty, celebrating the real
side of travel that rarely makes it into postcards or
Instagram posts. She's also the creator of the podcast Fly,
(01:17):
where she brings out stories that are raw, funny and
deeply human. Melissa, Welcome to the show.
Speaker 3 (01:23):
Thank you so great to be here, Rob, I appreciate it.
Speaker 1 (01:26):
Glad to have you here. Your book, The People You
Meet celebrates kind of the unpredictable, hilarious side of travel.
For listeners who may have not read it yet, how
would you describe what the book's about.
Speaker 3 (01:38):
Uh Ah, that's a great question.
Speaker 2 (01:40):
The book is basically a journey through Thailand, Lao, Cambodia, Vietnam,
and China. And I was with a partner at the
time who was researching luxury travel, so he had the
opportunity to sort of do some business development we'll say,
hotels and tour operators, things like that. So for me,
(02:04):
I was the tag along who wouldn't want to do that.
I quit my job. I was thirty five, and off
we went. But I got a little bit restless, and
that was where I discovered I needed a bit more
of a purpose if I was doing long travel. And
so this book is basically about the stories. It's about
the people, the places, the geography, the history of those
(02:27):
countries Tyler and Lao, Kambodia, Vietnam and China.
Speaker 3 (02:30):
But it's not a like do this do that kind
of story.
Speaker 2 (02:34):
These are emails that I sent home at the time,
and I turned them into this book. So back in
twenty ten, I mean, we didn't have cell phones really,
so I was going to internet cafes, to any hotel
that had a computer in the lobby, and I was
crafting these stories that I had been writing in my
head on long buses and train rides, and then once
(02:56):
a week I would send them home. So this happened
twenty ten. It's just came out this year, this book.
So fifteen years later I put them together and here
we are. I would say it's a really fun, honest
account of traveling.
Speaker 3 (03:12):
It's also very vulnerable for me.
Speaker 2 (03:14):
I'm very honest abou where I'm at in my life,
in my relationship, in my journey at that point. It's
going to inspire you to do whatever kind of adventure
that you want.
Speaker 3 (03:26):
It doesn't have to look like mine.
Speaker 2 (03:28):
It could be anything, but I think more than anything, Yeah,
it's just a really fun armchair adventure.
Speaker 3 (03:34):
Whether you travel or not.
Speaker 2 (03:35):
It's a really good entertaining time and if you read it,
you'll be happy that I did a lot of these
things for you. Because some parts of travel are not
pleasant and are a little messy, So you're welcome. I
did it for you, and much cheaper as well. So yeah,
that's basically it. It's a fun, fast, easy read and
(03:56):
takes you on a big adventure.
Speaker 1 (03:59):
It sounds amazing. So you've backpacked through more than fifty countries.
I can imagine that's a lot of stories, a lot
of people. After those fifteen years, what makes you decide
that now was the time to put those experiences together
and write a book?
Speaker 3 (04:15):
So, I mean, this book kind of wrote itself.
Speaker 2 (04:19):
The emails I was sending home in twenty ten were massive,
they were like Novella's, and I had kind of gone
in and out of deciding if I would do anything
with them, and then about a year and a half ago,
I finally just went for it. And if I hadn't,
I think it would have been something that was always
kind of eating away at me because the response to
(04:41):
them had been so good when I had sent them
out in twenty ten, people were sending them off to
their friends and family and wanting more and more and more,
so I knew there was something there and I just
felt like it was a story that I had to
tell even though it was fifteen years ago. I was like, no,
this is still a timeless story. It's a good story.
(05:01):
And yeah, it was just something I knew that I
had to do. It was something that had been sort
of hanging around me. And it's another adventure, right, I
mean adventures come in all shapes, sizes forms. I mean
there's the obvious ones getting on a plane, the train
of us, but also exercising some creativity and taking some risks,
and those are adventures as well as much, if not more.
(05:24):
I've done a few things in that department, so I think, yeah,
your body tells you what you need to do, and
you got to do it sometimes.
Speaker 1 (05:32):
You know. I think you and I agree that the
best travel isn't polished. I mean, as long as travel
involves people, it's going to be messy, right, That's just
that's just how it is. So what's one story from
the people you meet that really captures that spirit?
Speaker 3 (05:51):
Oh of the messiness?
Speaker 2 (05:52):
I mean, so, even though my partner was researching luxury travel,
I would say that ninety percent of this trip is back,
so the ten percent was very welcome of luxury, but
that wasn't really the common situation for us. I have
very many messy stories, but the best one that everybody
(06:12):
loves is about a It was either three or four
days of a jungle trek that we did in Northern Lao.
So we had been traveling for probably six weeks at
that point, and I'm a pretty active person, and I
was getting a little bit, you know, restless, because buses
and trains you're sitting a lot of hours every day,
(06:35):
all day constantly. So I knew I needed to do
something active, So off we went to Northern Lao. We
signed up for this jungle trek and when we signed up,
we had had a couple of beers, I'm not going
to lie to you, and the tour operator kind of
looked at us. They're English wasn't great, and they just said,
you know, there's gonna be some leeches, there might be
(06:58):
a few bees, but it won't be that bad. And
that was in very very broken English, and we were like, yeah, yeah, whatever, how.
Speaker 3 (07:04):
Bad can it be? Well it was very very bad.
Speaker 2 (07:08):
So we went on this trip and there were a
few other travelers that we met on this trip, but.
Speaker 3 (07:14):
In summary, it was hell on Earth.
Speaker 2 (07:17):
It was very hot, like excruciatingly hot, and they had
told us they would provide enough water for us. They
did not, so we were fairly dehydrated. And then the
leeches just started, I think on day two. They were
everywhere and literally crawling up your legs, up your pant legs,
(07:37):
dropping on your hands, crawling up your walking sticks. You
could not get away from them. And the terrain was miserable,
so thank goodness, it didn't rain, but it was dry,
and it was just all of it was horrible. And
then we would stay in accommodations that night it would
(07:58):
just be like one big been hut and there would
be holes in the.
Speaker 3 (08:02):
Ceiling, holes in the floor.
Speaker 2 (08:05):
You were in the open air, which was fine, but
we were surrounded by mosquito nets, and in the morning
there would be like thousands of bees that would circle
around your tent like it was just all of it
was hell. And then you would try to cool off
at times during the hike and there would be leeches
in the creek like it was if there were leeches,
(08:26):
there were bees, there were flies, like it was hell.
And then there was nothing, like nothing beautiful to look at,
Like I've gone on some hikes where it's worth the agony.
There was nothing that was There was nothing worth any
of this. So that's a very messy travel story. No
one will ever want to do that.
Speaker 3 (08:44):
So you can read.
Speaker 2 (08:45):
All about that one and yeah, I mean a lot
of things don't go to plan. You know, in your
head do you think it's going to be great? And
it's not always great.
Speaker 3 (08:55):
So but that's where you get the good stories.
Speaker 2 (08:57):
And you know, we had a lot of laughs. We
met some eight people and we're thrilled that we all
came out of it in one piece. No broken bones.
I mean, no one's in the hospital. So there you go,
glass half full.
Speaker 1 (09:11):
Well. The book spent weeks on Amazon's bestseller list in Canada,
which is awesome. Congratulations for that. Why do you think
the stories resonated so strongly? Were the readers?
Speaker 3 (09:21):
I think it's really funny. I'm not gonna lie.
Speaker 2 (09:23):
I have a very good sense of humor, and I
think the humor appeals to people. I think the honesty,
the vulnerability. I think I'm a very normal person. So
I think sometimes in the travel world we feel like
we see these people on Instagram that are untouchable and
they're made of something magical that we do not have,
(09:47):
and I'm not that person, right, So I'm kind of
your everyday person who loves adventures, and I don't do
them perfectly. I make like tons of mistakes. I'm still learning.
I've been doing this a long time. I really don't
know what I'm doing half the time. And I think that, yeah,
there's some people are quite intimidated by people who go out.
Speaker 3 (10:06):
There and do these things.
Speaker 2 (10:07):
And I'm just here to tell you that I'm a
very normal person who has had great opportunities to have
some amazing adventures. But anyone can go and have an adventure.
So I think there's a bit of that. I think
it inspires people a little bit to push the envelope
a little bit and to dig deep and know that
there's maybe more in there for them. So I think
(10:29):
there's a lot of things in this book.
Speaker 3 (10:30):
But you're right, I.
Speaker 2 (10:31):
Mean, you never know what's going to grab people, but
they just seem to find it very entertaining. I mean
everyone says they fly through it in a couple of
days because they can't put it down. So there must
be something in there that's, you know, alluring.
Speaker 1 (10:46):
Yeah, well you mentioned you mentioned writing with humor, but
how do you balance storytelling that's funny and relatable with
moments that are more leech where they're all reflective. Do
you how do you balance that?
Speaker 3 (10:59):
Yeah, I think it's important to do both.
Speaker 2 (11:02):
And often if you have a sense of humor, you
also have a sad side to you as well. That's
how it goes. I'm pretty perceptive and intuitive. I've always
been built that way with people. So in this book
you will find as much humor as sadness as you know,
questioning things. And I think that's important because traveling is
(11:26):
not all laughter and good times and fun.
Speaker 3 (11:29):
It's really hard and it's a privilege.
Speaker 2 (11:31):
So we're lucky to be out there to do that,
but that doesn't mean that it doesn't come with challenges.
And I think that when you're away, you're still with yourself.
So a lot of people think that when you go
away you transform into a different world and you have
no problems and everything solved, and that couldn't be further
from the truth. You maybe are, you know, in an
(11:54):
environment where you're presented with different problems, and there is
some escape, certainly in travel, but you're still you.
Speaker 3 (12:03):
You're still going there with.
Speaker 2 (12:04):
All your insecurities and you know, weirdness and this, that
and the other. So I think for me, it's always
been important to share both to share the fun and
to share the hard moments and the honest moments.
Speaker 3 (12:19):
And I do that even on Instagram.
Speaker 2 (12:21):
I was traveling two years ago, and I was in
South America for five weeks, and at the fourth week,
I had hit the wall quite badly.
Speaker 3 (12:30):
I had probably done too much.
Speaker 2 (12:32):
And I was really tired, and I was really ready
to come home. And there were ten days left of
my trip, and I came very close to bailing early.
Speaker 3 (12:41):
But I pushed through it.
Speaker 2 (12:43):
But I wrote about it on Instagram, just saying like
this happens, this exists because a lot of people don't
want to talk about these things. They don't talk about
the hard stuff. So it's very important to me to
share all of it. And I think I have always
found a way to balance both. And I think that's
called being a human. You know, I don't think we
should hide from that.
Speaker 1 (13:03):
Right Well, the title itself, the People You Meet, says
a lot. Why do you think it's the human connections
more than the destinations that define our travel memories.
Speaker 2 (13:14):
I think that you can always love a place. There's
certain places that I love much more than others. But
a lot of the reason that we love these places
is because of the people we met along the way.
Speaker 3 (13:28):
It could be local people, it could be.
Speaker 2 (13:32):
Someone you have a very small interaction with, even just
like at a restaurant or buying something on the street.
You just you never know, and those interactions are certainly
very fun.
Speaker 3 (13:42):
But it's also fellow travelers.
Speaker 2 (13:44):
You are meeting people from all over the world, and
they shape what's going to happen to you and how
you're going to experience it and what you invest in
those people and sometimes what you choose.
Speaker 3 (13:58):
Not to invest in them.
Speaker 2 (13:59):
And traveling is a really interesting social experiment because you
are in touch with the types of people that you
probably wouldn't hang out with in regular, everyday life. The
walls kind of come down, the judgments come down, and
you hang out with some weird and wonderful people. You
have connections with them that you may not normally have
(14:22):
in regular life because you're having unique experiences. You're on
a different playing field with them, you have kind of
different conversations because you're with like minded people. So I
find that that is huge for me with travel. It
doesn't mean you like everyone that comes along, right, but
it's important those connections.
Speaker 1 (14:43):
Well, you've traveled solo, you've traveled with friends for work.
How is your approach to travel changed over the years,
and what stayed the same.
Speaker 2 (14:54):
I will always love just the adventures for adventure's sake.
I call that sort of travel classic backpacking. But now
my priorities have changed, so I'm much more into active travel,
So hiking trips, cycling trips, that.
Speaker 3 (15:11):
Is my go to at this point.
Speaker 2 (15:15):
Certainly I would love hanging around a town or a
villager city for a few days and doing what you do,
but the main part of it must be active or
I'm also leaning towards and I haven't done this yet,
but this is something that I'm starting to inquire about.
Is going to work on a farm or volunteering at
(15:35):
an inn, or just some sort of local experience, because
I think for me, I'm fifty now, and I mean
you can travel at any age, and I certainly have
backpacked with like seventy three year olds and eighty five
year olds and twenty five year olds, so the world
is your oyster in terms of age and travel. But
(15:55):
I think every individual changes as they get older. Out
there on the road, and what speaks to them now
may not be what spoke to you like ten, fifteen,
twenty years ago, but I think, yeah, there's still that,
you know, I love having a beer with a stranger
or someone you're traveling with at the end of the day.
Speaker 3 (16:14):
I've always loved that.
Speaker 2 (16:16):
I love those like crazy random conversations, and I don't know,
there's just a magical connection that you can have with people.
I've met a lot of really good friends on the
road and I will never stop loving that part. That's
really fun and just yeah, just I love being on
the bus. Like a lot of people hate bus journeys,
(16:38):
I love them. I think it's more fun than watching TV.
So that has stayed the same for me. I can
look out the window for hours. I don't care what
the scenery is. It can be very boring for some people.
For me, I think it's fascinating anything from people putting
up their laundry to hurting animals, to talking to their kids,
(16:59):
to whatever it is. That's part of the journey too,
you know, seeing things. And I look around off and
on buses and people are knee deep in like texting
and Netflix and sleeping or talking you know whoever, and
it doesn't matter. Everyone's different. I don't really care. I'm
not going to judge you on that, but I just
think that, like for me, that has been a constant
(17:20):
this my whole time, I am glued to the window
on a bus.
Speaker 3 (17:24):
Yeah, that's that's pretty cool. I love that.
Speaker 1 (17:28):
Do you have one of those? It's awful. It was
awful then, but it's hilarious now. Stories I don't think
the Leech story qualifies because it seems like it would
be awful then and now.
Speaker 3 (17:37):
But well, the Leech Story has certainly given me some mileage.
Speaker 2 (17:42):
But I would say that I even though it was awful,
that there were parts of it that I liked because
I'm a bit of a sucker for punishment, and so
there were elements of it that weren't terrible. But if
you asked anyone else that was there, they would say
it was terrible.
Speaker 3 (17:59):
There's lots. The whole book is full of that stuff.
Speaker 2 (18:02):
There was a night that we stayed in rural China
and what is called a tulu that means a round house.
And these are old, old, old buildings. They're very uncomfortable.
They've the one that we stayed in I think could
fit up to six hundred or eight hundred people. So
you have the Hakka community, which is an ethnic minority
(18:23):
Chinese community. They live in these places, they have been
for centuries, and they basically all live together so that
they can you know, farm and cook and eat and
raise their kids and whatever it is they need to do.
Where they all live in these tiny rooms in these
circular houses. So we stayed in one of those. That
(18:47):
was very uncomfortable and a little bit frightening. But in hindsight,
I wouldn't do that again either. That's probably up there
with the leeches. But it makes you appreciate, you know,
these temporary moments, and it was kind of funny at
the time. You know, these are the things that you
get yourself into. But I think maybe as I get
(19:08):
older too, like I do less things like that. You know,
I'm a little bit more leaning towards the comfort and predictability,
but not always.
Speaker 3 (19:18):
I still continue to do some silly things.
Speaker 1 (19:21):
Yeah, try, I try to lean into things that make
me uncomfortable with these days, just to see what happens.
Speaker 2 (19:26):
Right. Well, Yeah, And the thing is often these things
are temporary.
Speaker 3 (19:32):
You know, it's a night or two or a week
or whatever. We'll live. You know you'll get through it,
so it's worth it.
Speaker 1 (19:38):
I think I agree. Well, obviously we have a family
slant on the family vacationer. What do you hope families
can take away from your stories about connection and curiosity
even when things maybe especially when things don't go perfectly.
Speaker 3 (19:55):
I think I've traveled with some families.
Speaker 2 (19:57):
I don't have a family of my own, so my
travel would be just with a partner.
Speaker 3 (20:03):
We can call that family travel.
Speaker 2 (20:05):
But I have been on some very interesting trips, like
group trips with families. I did a cycling trip in
Croatia with a family who the kids were older I
would say teenagers and the parents and it was really awesome,
to be honest, because you saw how throughout the week
they how much they bonded and came together as a family.
Speaker 3 (20:29):
And I think they were initially close as it was.
Speaker 2 (20:32):
But travel is hard, and it's beautiful and wonderful and magical,
but there are some really tough moments. And when you
do sort of watch a family who's kind of in
it together and you watch them come out to the
other side a week or two weeks later, it's pretty cool.
Like you can just feel how much closer they are,
how much more they know each other, who's helped who out,
(20:57):
you know, when there's a bike that's broke down, or
they don't want to cycle up this horrible ten kilometer
hill in forty degree celsius heat.
Speaker 3 (21:08):
But it's also what I find.
Speaker 2 (21:09):
Interesting with families is when you're in a group trip
and there's other people, so it's that family, and then
there's other people around, how they interact.
Speaker 3 (21:20):
With other people is also very interesting.
Speaker 2 (21:23):
So it's like, does the family just stay with each
other or are they comfortable to like branch out and
get to know other people in the group, or and
how do they within that family react to like family
members sort of making friends that are outside of this group.
I find that super interesting, and sometimes it works and
sometimes it doesn't. You can see that sometimes like the
(21:45):
people that come with their families are like, we are
going to stay together this whole time, no one will
penetrate us. And then other people just have a blast
sort of like exploring these tentacles of new people while
I still kind of have the comfort of this like
core nuclear family.
Speaker 3 (22:04):
So I think it's actually really cool.
Speaker 2 (22:05):
I think it's a really interesting thing to do as
a family. It's certainly very very bonding and what cool
memories and experiences to have with each other you know
that you'll always have together when you know, down the road,
and to talk about and laugh about and think about it.
Speaker 3 (22:23):
I think it's pretty awesome.
Speaker 1 (22:24):
Actually, yeah, well, let's talk about your podcast, which is
called Fly for listeners who might not know it. What's
the show about.
Speaker 2 (22:33):
So, yes, this is a show called Fly Travel Radio.
It is on hiatus at the moment. I started this
show in twenty sixteen, I think twenty fifteen, twenty sixteen.
So after I had gone away in twenty ten, I
came home and I obviously had zero money and I
couldn't travel for several years.
Speaker 3 (22:53):
So I started a.
Speaker 2 (22:55):
Radio show and it was at the community radio station
at the University of Toronto.
Speaker 3 (23:00):
And it was awesome.
Speaker 2 (23:00):
I was meeting people from around the world and it
was my way of traveling without traveling, and I had
some really fascinating guests, like I had a guess who
walked the length of Africa. I think I believe it
was the length or the width. I don't know one
or the other. For like two and a half years,
I had a guess who cycled from China to Canada
(23:21):
over a couple of years, and they weren't always that extreme,
but I did look for pretty like unique people that
are out in the world adventuring, and certainly there are
a ton. But it was just great and I was
very lucky, very lucky I built this awesome community. And
then actually, two years ago, I went on a hiking
trip in Turkey with one of my guests. I'd never
(23:43):
met her in real life, but we got along through
the show and we kept in touch, so off we
went on on a trip together that was pretty interesting.
Speaker 3 (23:51):
So yeah, I really really loved it.
Speaker 2 (23:53):
And then I had to put it on a hiatus
because two years ago I went traveling and then I
decided to write this book, and you can all do everything.
Speaker 3 (24:01):
But it's still there in those one hundred.
Speaker 2 (24:04):
And eighty episodes, and it's possible that I might fire
it up again in twenty twenty six, so we'll wait
and see on that.
Speaker 3 (24:12):
But it was really fun.
Speaker 2 (24:15):
I loved it, as I'm sure you're enjoying your podcast
as well. It's like a whole new world of meeting people.
Speaker 1 (24:22):
Yeah, and you never know where the podcast is going
to take yet times it seems like, yep, Well, you
mentioned a couple of people that you've interviewed through your
conversations and talking to adventures from all walks of life.
What's one story or conversation that really stuck with you.
Speaker 2 (24:41):
The story that I've been talking abouit lately, and I
don't want to keep repeating myself, but I think that
it's a really interesting thing that happened to me which
has changed my travel experience. So when I was away
in twenty ten in this in Southeast Asia, I met
a woman who was probably in her fifties at the time.
Speaker 3 (25:02):
I was thirty five. I think she was in her fifties.
Speaker 2 (25:05):
Fascinating person, had lived a million lives, done more than
anyone I'd ever met, and to this day probably still has.
And we were in Northern Loo. It seems like everything
happens in Lao in my life. But she stopped talking
to me for a minute and was really zoning in
(25:25):
or like honing in on these two young girls that
were in their twenties backpackers, and she was like kind
of studying them and listening to them. And then she
looked at me and she said, these two girls need
to go home, they're done, and I had no idea
what she was talking about. So then we had this
amazing conversation about travel, burnout and knowing when it's time
(25:47):
to go home. And thank goodness we'd had that conversation
because it happened to me on the same trip. So
four months and my partner was going indefinitely. But I
always knew I would listen to myself when it was
time to leave, and four months in, I'd had it.
I had had enough. I wasn't enjoying it. It became
(26:09):
a job. I was a little bit homesick. I was
tired of just being with the same person all the time,
because traveling with a partner can be isolating.
Speaker 3 (26:20):
Nothing was interesting. I'd like it. Just it was over
and I needed to go home, and I did, and
that has changed everything for me.
Speaker 2 (26:29):
It was understanding that it's okay to have had enough,
because there's a lot of ego on the road when
you are traveling and you're meeting people that are doing
this for months, years, whatever it is, so you'll meet
people that'll be like, oh, I've been on the road
for two years, or I've been on the road for
eighteen months, and that can be it can get competitive
(26:53):
in a really weird and stupid way, or I have
how many countries have you been to?
Speaker 3 (26:58):
Or oh my story is this blah blah blah.
Speaker 2 (27:01):
So I think I was the right age to get
that message at thirty five, to know, hey, like it's
as important to know when to go home as it
is to know when to travel.
Speaker 3 (27:11):
And so now I have changed everything.
Speaker 2 (27:14):
So last year when I went, I had a year
off and all my trips, the longest trip I did
was two months. I would go anywhere from three weeks
to eight weeks and then kind of come home and regroup.
And I was lucky that I had the finances to
do that, because not everybody does. But I knew that
I needed to like reset and process what I'd done
(27:36):
and get like proper sleep and then go out again.
And so she's probably the person who has been the
most pivotal into understanding like travel burnout and ego and
mindset and looking after yourself and how that has shaped
my life after that. That was a pretty interesting thing
(27:57):
to have happened to me on that trip. I would
say an important person.
Speaker 1 (28:02):
Well, and you've met people from all over the globe.
Speaker 2 (28:05):
You will see that they are the happiest people, the
most generous people, and the kindest people. So that's a
huge lesson and I think that everybody needs to see that.
That would help us all out in the world. I think,
so that's an important thing to take home always.
Speaker 3 (28:26):
But I think it's also.
Speaker 2 (28:29):
You know, just what I was saying earlier is when
you meet different people, you know, when we're in our
own lives and our silos, and especially in North America.
Speaker 3 (28:37):
Where we leave very or so I live very.
Speaker 2 (28:42):
Often independent lives, you can kind of get trapped into
what you know and who you know, and we judge,
you know, what we do. We're human, and I think
that when you go away, something happens with all of
that and you it just it doesn't entirely disappear, because
you have to still be safe and have your radar
(29:04):
about you. But I do really think that we're more
open to like different kinds of people and what they
have to offer, and you just never know who you're
going to meet, you know, and what kind of stories
they have to tell you. And I think that there's
a lot of that, like just not judging a book
by its cover. But I think that traveling, you end
(29:26):
up with a real pack of like strange people that
you would never ever in your life think that would
work together, and it does, and you become a family often,
and you look out for each other, and there's a
real sort of pack mentality that no one gets left behind.
And that can be with people you're only hanging out
(29:46):
with for a day or for three days, or I
don't know, if something happens to you right where you're
kind of looking out for each other. So I think
that those are really important things to learn about.
Speaker 3 (29:56):
When you travel.
Speaker 2 (29:57):
It does kind of like change how you see people,
and hopefully we bring that back home when when we
you know, life always goes back to normal, but hopefully
we can keep some of that with us, where we're
open to learning about people and treating people well. I mean,
I have a regular nine to five job. I've been
very lucky to like work travel around that. But I
(30:19):
see people who don't always speak the nicest or most
respectfully to custodians and caretakers and people working the security desks,
and I hate that because.
Speaker 3 (30:32):
You don't know their story.
Speaker 2 (30:34):
So I always go out of my way to be
kind to those people and to talk to them and
to find out what they're all about. And I've learned
fascinating things from them, and I think that comes from travel.
Speaker 3 (30:45):
I think I was also raised that way.
Speaker 2 (30:47):
But I think the more exposure you have to different
types of people, the more curious you are and you know,
questioning you are. And like, everyone has the same needs.
You know, they want to be treated with respect, they
want to eat, they want to sleep, they want to
have a roof over their head, they want to be safe,
they want to be loved. Like we are all the same,
(31:09):
and that's what you get from traveling.
Speaker 1 (31:12):
I agree, Well, you know, we live in an Instagram society,
But what advice would you give travelers who want to
collect more stories and fewer selfies.
Speaker 2 (31:23):
You know, I have had some interesting encounters with proper influencers,
and I'm not a huge fan.
Speaker 3 (31:30):
I'm going to be very honest about that.
Speaker 2 (31:33):
And I wouldn't say that I am one of those people.
I'm just a normal person who just likes to share stories.
I think that you don't need to have a predetermined
idea of what something is. I see a lot of
influencers that are like, I'm going here and this is
the picture and this is the story and whatever.
Speaker 3 (31:56):
I don't work like that.
Speaker 2 (31:57):
I mean, I'm not getting paid any money to be
an influencer, so maybe I'm doing something wrong here. But
for me, I have zero expectations going into things, and
I just feel if I feel like this is something
I need to share in terms of like something through
my lens which becomes my story, then I do that.
(32:20):
And the other thing for me is that I don't often.
I mean, my Instagram is full of travel stuff, but
a lot of it happens weeks, if not months, after
a trip because I'm still processing it right. And I
feel like influencers are like, it's in the moment they're posting.
They need the clicks, they need this, they need that,
(32:41):
and that's great. Good for them, that's their career. But
that's not me. And so my storytelling comes from a
lot of time of like letting it sink in, seeing
how I feel all of that stuff.
Speaker 3 (32:55):
So that's how I roll.
Speaker 2 (32:56):
I don't know if that's for everybody, but you have
to add why you're doing it.
Speaker 3 (33:01):
Is it is it for your audience or is it
for you?
Speaker 2 (33:04):
And for me, the things that are for me is
what the most people respond to.
Speaker 3 (33:09):
Because it's authentic. It's me. I'm not like pretending.
Speaker 2 (33:14):
I'm being pretty honest about what's happening, what the moment is,
and people relate to that. You know, there's like there
has to be a humanness to what we're sharing. Otherwise
it's pretty obvious what people are, you know, they're just
wanting the immediate reaction and like praise of where they are.
Speaker 3 (33:32):
I'm just not.
Speaker 2 (33:32):
Into that, right and I often, I mean I had
I had spent days with two like really annoying influencers
in Bolivia, and they're not really in the moment. They
are constantly like plotting and scheming actually a little bit,
and it's really it's really kind of sad, to be honest.
(33:54):
I mean, I get it, and it's changed the landscape
and you know, but it's just I don't know, I
think it's kind of sid I think it's changed travel
for the not the best in some ways.
Speaker 1 (34:05):
I'll never forget. I went my brother lived in Key West,
and so I went to see him and I drove,
you know, I'm just hitting the tourist spots and I
went to that southernmost point. I forget what it's what
it's called exactly, but you know there's somebody, there's a
family that was in front of it, and then there's
this huge line of people waiting to take a picture,
(34:25):
and I'm just like, that's you know, you're missing so
much about Key West just trying to get that one.
I mean, think if you spend an hour or two hours,
they're waiting to get a picture of that because you
feel like you need that to prove that you were there.
I don't know, I just don't feel I feel like
you're missing a whole lot doing that.
Speaker 2 (34:46):
And then they're saying, how you know people who are
doing that are wrecking cities and towns and wildlife and
all of.
Speaker 3 (34:54):
It, just to like block to these places. It's really
really sad.
Speaker 1 (34:59):
Yeah, it is. Well, so what's what's next for you?
You mentioned maybe starting the podcast back up. Are you
going to write another book? Is there a new adventure
on the horizon?
Speaker 3 (35:10):
There's a book percolating. I'm just trying to find the time.
But yes. In twenty twenty three, I was in.
Speaker 2 (35:16):
I lived in Quebec City for five weeks, and I
was in South America for a couple of months or
for five weeks, and I was in Europe for a
couple of months, and I feel there's some stories there,
so yes, I'm working on that. I did some stand
up comedy last year, so contemplating giving that another go.
Speaker 3 (35:38):
But yeah, these are the these are the projects. But
always travel.
Speaker 2 (35:43):
I actually, though, have no plans for twenty twenty six,
which is not like me. I'm kind of in a
phase where I'm letting sort of the universe decide for
me where I'm supposed to go. So that's kind of
fun sometimes and we'll see something will happen. I just
don't know where yet.
Speaker 1 (36:00):
But yeah, you mentioned stand up comedy. That has to
be and being vulnerable, that has to be the most
vulnerable person can be standing on stage trying to get
a laugh from an audience. I can't even imagine.
Speaker 3 (36:12):
Yeah, it's stressful. I took a class.
Speaker 2 (36:15):
I was supposed to take this project management class, and
after ten minutes I was.
Speaker 3 (36:22):
Like, I cannot do this.
Speaker 2 (36:24):
This is like being in Charlie Brown with a Charlie
Brown you know that teacher? Oh yes, And then I
started googling like comedy classes and public speaking classes, so
I landed in this course.
Speaker 3 (36:36):
I very quickly dropped out of this project.
Speaker 2 (36:38):
Management course and I ended up in this eight week
course called public Speaking through stand up Comedy, So they
kind of taught you, i mean, the things that you
needed to know and how to create like an eight
minute set and yeah, it's terrifying, but if you can
write and you're funny and you can tell a story, you.
Speaker 3 (37:00):
Can do it. But the key there is to be prepared.
Speaker 2 (37:04):
So once you have this thing like chopped down, because
I'm very wordy, you can probably tell by this interview.
Speaker 3 (37:10):
So I really had to learn how to like.
Speaker 2 (37:12):
Get very concise and just chop, chop chop, and and
then I just rehearse it over and over and over
again for like three weeks walking around Toronto and my
talking out loud to myself so that when you get
on stage, you it's it's locked in.
Speaker 3 (37:29):
And you can still have fun and be in the moment.
But it is absolutely.
Speaker 2 (37:32):
Terrifying, but when they laugh, it's pretty spectacular, honest.
Speaker 1 (37:37):
Bat Well, finally, where can our listeners follow you? Find
your content? Where can they follow you?
Speaker 2 (37:44):
Yes, Instagram's probably the best. It's fly underscore travel underscore Media,
so that's a good one. And then fly roadway dot
com is my website and then all my podcasts are
on sound Cloud and that's under fly Travel Radio, So
those are probably the best places, but you can also
(38:06):
find all of that on my website at fly roadway
dot com.
Speaker 1 (38:09):
Awesome, and the book, again is The People You Meet.
So Melissa, thank you so much for coming on and
talking with me. I appreciate it.
Speaker 3 (38:17):
Thank you. I had a great time. I appreciate it too.
It is a good time.
Speaker 1 (38:22):
Those stories are a great reminder that travel doesn't have
to be perfect, and it rarely is. It just has
to be real. Sometimes the best souvenir is a story
that makes you laugh years later. For our listeners, if
you haven't picked up The People You Meet, I highly
recommend it. It's full of moments that are funny, relatable,
and surprisingly moving. You'll find yourself nodding along, laughing, maybe
(38:47):
even reflecting a bit on your own travel memories. And also,
if you're looking for more ways to make your own
trips more meaningful, you can check out my book, The
Family Vacationer Appearance Guide to Meaningful Travel. It's packed with
practical ideas for bringing more connection into every adventure, whether
you're heading across the world or across your own state
until next down. Folks, remember, keep your passports and your
(39:09):
heart's open. Safe travels everyone.
Speaker 4 (39:19):
I've got it fool on all the beach places and
the hotel spaceis amusement, bark rides and water slides, mountain
ranges and seasonal changes.
Speaker 5 (39:35):
I'm leading to serve on the fairly vacation.
Speaker 4 (39:42):
I've got in food on other beach praaces and hotel spaces,
amusement bark rides and water slides, mountain ranges and seasonal changes.
I'm lead to serve.
Speaker 5 (39:58):
I'm the family vaca, your family vacation, your family vacation.
Speaker 4 (40:12):
Now, I've got to let me want to see a frame.
Speaker 3 (40:19):
It's this a mesta.
Speaker 4 (40:21):
Don't go loss it pass
There's more to great travel stories than picture perfect views.
Sometimes the real gems are the awkward bus rides, the misturns,
and the people you meet along the way. In this episode,
we're diving into the heart of travel with someone who's
made those stories her specialty. Episode two six starts right now.
(00:24):
Welcome to the Family Vacationer with Robin.
Speaker 2 (00:27):
Tracy, your go to podcast for families on the moon.
Speaker 1 (00:32):
Welcome back, friends to the Family Vacationer. This is episode
two o six and I'm your host, Rob. This podcast
is here to help families create more meaningful and memorable
travel experiences together. Now, if you've ever had a travel
moment that was messy, unpredictable, and somehow became the highlight
of your trip, you're gonna love Today's guest, Melissa Roadway
(00:54):
is a Canadian writer and a podcast host who's backpacked
through more than fifty countries The Beautiful, Chaos and Those
Adventures and her best selling book The People You Meet.
Melissa writes with humor, heart and honesty, celebrating the real
side of travel that rarely makes it into postcards or
Instagram posts. She's also the creator of the podcast Fly,
(01:17):
where she brings out stories that are raw, funny and
deeply human. Melissa, Welcome to the show.
Speaker 3 (01:23):
Thank you so great to be here, Rob, I appreciate it.
Speaker 1 (01:26):
Glad to have you here. Your book, The People You
Meet celebrates kind of the unpredictable, hilarious side of travel.
For listeners who may have not read it yet, how
would you describe what the book's about.
Speaker 3 (01:38):
Uh Ah, that's a great question.
Speaker 2 (01:40):
The book is basically a journey through Thailand, Lao, Cambodia, Vietnam,
and China. And I was with a partner at the
time who was researching luxury travel, so he had the
opportunity to sort of do some business development we'll say,
hotels and tour operators, things like that. So for me,
(02:04):
I was the tag along who wouldn't want to do that.
I quit my job. I was thirty five, and off
we went. But I got a little bit restless, and
that was where I discovered I needed a bit more
of a purpose if I was doing long travel. And
so this book is basically about the stories. It's about
the people, the places, the geography, the history of those
(02:27):
countries Tyler and Lao, Kambodia, Vietnam and China.
Speaker 3 (02:30):
But it's not a like do this do that kind
of story.
Speaker 2 (02:34):
These are emails that I sent home at the time,
and I turned them into this book. So back in
twenty ten, I mean, we didn't have cell phones really,
so I was going to internet cafes, to any hotel
that had a computer in the lobby, and I was
crafting these stories that I had been writing in my
head on long buses and train rides, and then once
(02:56):
a week I would send them home. So this happened
twenty ten. It's just came out this year, this book.
So fifteen years later I put them together and here
we are. I would say it's a really fun, honest
account of traveling.
Speaker 3 (03:12):
It's also very vulnerable for me.
Speaker 2 (03:14):
I'm very honest abou where I'm at in my life,
in my relationship, in my journey at that point. It's
going to inspire you to do whatever kind of adventure
that you want.
Speaker 3 (03:26):
It doesn't have to look like mine.
Speaker 2 (03:28):
It could be anything, but I think more than anything, Yeah,
it's just a really fun armchair adventure.
Speaker 3 (03:34):
Whether you travel or not.
Speaker 2 (03:35):
It's a really good entertaining time and if you read it,
you'll be happy that I did a lot of these
things for you. Because some parts of travel are not
pleasant and are a little messy, So you're welcome. I
did it for you, and much cheaper as well. So yeah,
that's basically it. It's a fun, fast, easy read and
(03:56):
takes you on a big adventure.
Speaker 1 (03:59):
It sounds amazing. So you've backpacked through more than fifty countries.
I can imagine that's a lot of stories, a lot
of people. After those fifteen years, what makes you decide
that now was the time to put those experiences together
and write a book?
Speaker 3 (04:15):
So, I mean, this book kind of wrote itself.
Speaker 2 (04:19):
The emails I was sending home in twenty ten were massive,
they were like Novella's, and I had kind of gone
in and out of deciding if I would do anything
with them, and then about a year and a half ago,
I finally just went for it. And if I hadn't,
I think it would have been something that was always
kind of eating away at me because the response to
(04:41):
them had been so good when I had sent them
out in twenty ten, people were sending them off to
their friends and family and wanting more and more and more,
so I knew there was something there and I just
felt like it was a story that I had to
tell even though it was fifteen years ago. I was like, no,
this is still a timeless story. It's a good story.
(05:01):
And yeah, it was just something I knew that I
had to do. It was something that had been sort
of hanging around me. And it's another adventure, right, I
mean adventures come in all shapes, sizes forms. I mean
there's the obvious ones getting on a plane, the train
of us, but also exercising some creativity and taking some risks,
and those are adventures as well as much, if not more.
(05:24):
I've done a few things in that department, so I think, yeah,
your body tells you what you need to do, and
you got to do it sometimes.
Speaker 1 (05:32):
You know. I think you and I agree that the
best travel isn't polished. I mean, as long as travel
involves people, it's going to be messy, right, That's just
that's just how it is. So what's one story from
the people you meet that really captures that spirit?
Speaker 3 (05:51):
Oh of the messiness?
Speaker 2 (05:52):
I mean, so, even though my partner was researching luxury travel,
I would say that ninety percent of this trip is back,
so the ten percent was very welcome of luxury, but
that wasn't really the common situation for us. I have
very many messy stories, but the best one that everybody
(06:12):
loves is about a It was either three or four
days of a jungle trek that we did in Northern Lao.
So we had been traveling for probably six weeks at
that point, and I'm a pretty active person, and I
was getting a little bit, you know, restless, because buses
and trains you're sitting a lot of hours every day,
(06:35):
all day constantly. So I knew I needed to do
something active, So off we went to Northern Lao. We
signed up for this jungle trek and when we signed up,
we had had a couple of beers, I'm not going
to lie to you, and the tour operator kind of
looked at us. They're English wasn't great, and they just said,
you know, there's gonna be some leeches, there might be
(06:58):
a few bees, but it won't be that bad. And
that was in very very broken English, and we were like, yeah, yeah, whatever, how.
Speaker 3 (07:04):
Bad can it be? Well it was very very bad.
Speaker 2 (07:08):
So we went on this trip and there were a
few other travelers that we met on this trip, but.
Speaker 3 (07:14):
In summary, it was hell on Earth.
Speaker 2 (07:17):
It was very hot, like excruciatingly hot, and they had
told us they would provide enough water for us. They
did not, so we were fairly dehydrated. And then the
leeches just started, I think on day two. They were
everywhere and literally crawling up your legs, up your pant legs,
(07:37):
dropping on your hands, crawling up your walking sticks. You
could not get away from them. And the terrain was miserable,
so thank goodness, it didn't rain, but it was dry,
and it was just all of it was horrible. And
then we would stay in accommodations that night it would
(07:58):
just be like one big been hut and there would
be holes in the.
Speaker 3 (08:02):
Ceiling, holes in the floor.
Speaker 2 (08:05):
You were in the open air, which was fine, but
we were surrounded by mosquito nets, and in the morning
there would be like thousands of bees that would circle
around your tent like it was just all of it
was hell. And then you would try to cool off
at times during the hike and there would be leeches
in the creek like it was if there were leeches,
(08:26):
there were bees, there were flies, like it was hell.
And then there was nothing, like nothing beautiful to look at,
Like I've gone on some hikes where it's worth the agony.
There was nothing that was There was nothing worth any
of this. So that's a very messy travel story. No
one will ever want to do that.
Speaker 3 (08:44):
So you can read.
Speaker 2 (08:45):
All about that one and yeah, I mean a lot
of things don't go to plan. You know, in your
head do you think it's going to be great? And
it's not always great.
Speaker 3 (08:55):
So but that's where you get the good stories.
Speaker 2 (08:57):
And you know, we had a lot of laughs. We
met some eight people and we're thrilled that we all
came out of it in one piece. No broken bones.
I mean, no one's in the hospital. So there you go,
glass half full.
Speaker 1 (09:11):
Well. The book spent weeks on Amazon's bestseller list in Canada,
which is awesome. Congratulations for that. Why do you think
the stories resonated so strongly? Were the readers?
Speaker 3 (09:21):
I think it's really funny. I'm not gonna lie.
Speaker 2 (09:23):
I have a very good sense of humor, and I
think the humor appeals to people. I think the honesty,
the vulnerability. I think I'm a very normal person. So
I think sometimes in the travel world we feel like
we see these people on Instagram that are untouchable and
they're made of something magical that we do not have,
(09:47):
and I'm not that person, right, So I'm kind of
your everyday person who loves adventures, and I don't do
them perfectly. I make like tons of mistakes. I'm still learning.
I've been doing this a long time. I really don't
know what I'm doing half the time. And I think that, yeah,
there's some people are quite intimidated by people who go out.
Speaker 3 (10:06):
There and do these things.
Speaker 2 (10:07):
And I'm just here to tell you that I'm a
very normal person who has had great opportunities to have
some amazing adventures. But anyone can go and have an adventure.
So I think there's a bit of that. I think
it inspires people a little bit to push the envelope
a little bit and to dig deep and know that
there's maybe more in there for them. So I think
(10:29):
there's a lot of things in this book.
Speaker 3 (10:30):
But you're right, I.
Speaker 2 (10:31):
Mean, you never know what's going to grab people, but
they just seem to find it very entertaining. I mean
everyone says they fly through it in a couple of
days because they can't put it down. So there must
be something in there that's, you know, alluring.
Speaker 1 (10:46):
Yeah, well you mentioned you mentioned writing with humor, but
how do you balance storytelling that's funny and relatable with
moments that are more leech where they're all reflective. Do
you how do you balance that?
Speaker 3 (10:59):
Yeah, I think it's important to do both.
Speaker 2 (11:02):
And often if you have a sense of humor, you
also have a sad side to you as well. That's
how it goes. I'm pretty perceptive and intuitive. I've always
been built that way with people. So in this book
you will find as much humor as sadness as you know,
questioning things. And I think that's important because traveling is
(11:26):
not all laughter and good times and fun.
Speaker 3 (11:29):
It's really hard and it's a privilege.
Speaker 2 (11:31):
So we're lucky to be out there to do that,
but that doesn't mean that it doesn't come with challenges.
And I think that when you're away, you're still with yourself.
So a lot of people think that when you go
away you transform into a different world and you have
no problems and everything solved, and that couldn't be further
from the truth. You maybe are, you know, in an
(11:54):
environment where you're presented with different problems, and there is
some escape, certainly in travel, but you're still you.
Speaker 3 (12:03):
You're still going there with.
Speaker 2 (12:04):
All your insecurities and you know, weirdness and this, that
and the other. So I think for me, it's always
been important to share both to share the fun and
to share the hard moments and the honest moments.
Speaker 3 (12:19):
And I do that even on Instagram.
Speaker 2 (12:21):
I was traveling two years ago, and I was in
South America for five weeks, and at the fourth week,
I had hit the wall quite badly.
Speaker 3 (12:30):
I had probably done too much.
Speaker 2 (12:32):
And I was really tired, and I was really ready
to come home. And there were ten days left of
my trip, and I came very close to bailing early.
Speaker 3 (12:41):
But I pushed through it.
Speaker 2 (12:43):
But I wrote about it on Instagram, just saying like
this happens, this exists because a lot of people don't
want to talk about these things. They don't talk about
the hard stuff. So it's very important to me to
share all of it. And I think I have always
found a way to balance both. And I think that's
called being a human. You know, I don't think we
should hide from that.
Speaker 1 (13:03):
Right Well, the title itself, the People You Meet, says
a lot. Why do you think it's the human connections
more than the destinations that define our travel memories.
Speaker 2 (13:14):
I think that you can always love a place. There's
certain places that I love much more than others. But
a lot of the reason that we love these places
is because of the people we met along the way.
Speaker 3 (13:28):
It could be local people, it could be.
Speaker 2 (13:32):
Someone you have a very small interaction with, even just
like at a restaurant or buying something on the street.
You just you never know, and those interactions are certainly
very fun.
Speaker 3 (13:42):
But it's also fellow travelers.
Speaker 2 (13:44):
You are meeting people from all over the world, and
they shape what's going to happen to you and how
you're going to experience it and what you invest in
those people and sometimes what you choose.
Speaker 3 (13:58):
Not to invest in them.
Speaker 2 (13:59):
And traveling is a really interesting social experiment because you
are in touch with the types of people that you
probably wouldn't hang out with in regular, everyday life. The
walls kind of come down, the judgments come down, and
you hang out with some weird and wonderful people. You
have connections with them that you may not normally have
(14:22):
in regular life because you're having unique experiences. You're on
a different playing field with them, you have kind of
different conversations because you're with like minded people. So I
find that that is huge for me with travel. It
doesn't mean you like everyone that comes along, right, but
it's important those connections.
Speaker 1 (14:43):
Well, you've traveled solo, you've traveled with friends for work.
How is your approach to travel changed over the years,
and what stayed the same.
Speaker 2 (14:54):
I will always love just the adventures for adventure's sake.
I call that sort of travel classic backpacking. But now
my priorities have changed, so I'm much more into active travel,
So hiking trips, cycling trips, that.
Speaker 3 (15:11):
Is my go to at this point.
Speaker 2 (15:15):
Certainly I would love hanging around a town or a
villager city for a few days and doing what you do,
but the main part of it must be active or
I'm also leaning towards and I haven't done this yet,
but this is something that I'm starting to inquire about.
Is going to work on a farm or volunteering at
(15:35):
an inn, or just some sort of local experience, because
I think for me, I'm fifty now, and I mean
you can travel at any age, and I certainly have
backpacked with like seventy three year olds and eighty five
year olds and twenty five year olds, so the world
is your oyster in terms of age and travel. But
(15:55):
I think every individual changes as they get older. Out
there on the road, and what speaks to them now
may not be what spoke to you like ten, fifteen,
twenty years ago, but I think, yeah, there's still that,
you know, I love having a beer with a stranger
or someone you're traveling with at the end of the day.
Speaker 3 (16:14):
I've always loved that.
Speaker 2 (16:16):
I love those like crazy random conversations, and I don't know,
there's just a magical connection that you can have with people.
I've met a lot of really good friends on the
road and I will never stop loving that part. That's
really fun and just yeah, just I love being on
the bus. Like a lot of people hate bus journeys,
(16:38):
I love them. I think it's more fun than watching TV.
So that has stayed the same for me. I can
look out the window for hours. I don't care what
the scenery is. It can be very boring for some people.
For me, I think it's fascinating anything from people putting
up their laundry to hurting animals, to talking to their kids,
(16:59):
to whatever it is. That's part of the journey too,
you know, seeing things. And I look around off and
on buses and people are knee deep in like texting
and Netflix and sleeping or talking you know whoever, and
it doesn't matter. Everyone's different. I don't really care. I'm
not going to judge you on that, but I just
think that, like for me, that has been a constant
(17:20):
this my whole time, I am glued to the window
on a bus.
Speaker 3 (17:24):
Yeah, that's that's pretty cool. I love that.
Speaker 1 (17:28):
Do you have one of those? It's awful. It was
awful then, but it's hilarious now. Stories I don't think
the Leech story qualifies because it seems like it would
be awful then and now.
Speaker 3 (17:37):
But well, the Leech Story has certainly given me some mileage.
Speaker 2 (17:42):
But I would say that I even though it was awful,
that there were parts of it that I liked because
I'm a bit of a sucker for punishment, and so
there were elements of it that weren't terrible. But if
you asked anyone else that was there, they would say
it was terrible.
Speaker 3 (17:59):
There's lots. The whole book is full of that stuff.
Speaker 2 (18:02):
There was a night that we stayed in rural China
and what is called a tulu that means a round house.
And these are old, old, old buildings. They're very uncomfortable.
They've the one that we stayed in I think could
fit up to six hundred or eight hundred people. So
you have the Hakka community, which is an ethnic minority
(18:23):
Chinese community. They live in these places, they have been
for centuries, and they basically all live together so that
they can you know, farm and cook and eat and
raise their kids and whatever it is they need to do.
Where they all live in these tiny rooms in these
circular houses. So we stayed in one of those. That
(18:47):
was very uncomfortable and a little bit frightening. But in hindsight,
I wouldn't do that again either. That's probably up there
with the leeches. But it makes you appreciate, you know,
these temporary moments, and it was kind of funny at
the time. You know, these are the things that you
get yourself into. But I think maybe as I get
(19:08):
older too, like I do less things like that. You know,
I'm a little bit more leaning towards the comfort and predictability,
but not always.
Speaker 3 (19:18):
I still continue to do some silly things.
Speaker 1 (19:21):
Yeah, try, I try to lean into things that make
me uncomfortable with these days, just to see what happens.
Speaker 2 (19:26):
Right. Well, Yeah, And the thing is often these things
are temporary.
Speaker 3 (19:32):
You know, it's a night or two or a week
or whatever. We'll live. You know you'll get through it,
so it's worth it.
Speaker 1 (19:38):
I think I agree. Well, obviously we have a family
slant on the family vacationer. What do you hope families
can take away from your stories about connection and curiosity
even when things maybe especially when things don't go perfectly.
Speaker 3 (19:55):
I think I've traveled with some families.
Speaker 2 (19:57):
I don't have a family of my own, so my
travel would be just with a partner.
Speaker 3 (20:03):
We can call that family travel.
Speaker 2 (20:05):
But I have been on some very interesting trips, like
group trips with families. I did a cycling trip in
Croatia with a family who the kids were older I
would say teenagers and the parents and it was really awesome,
to be honest, because you saw how throughout the week
they how much they bonded and came together as a family.
Speaker 3 (20:29):
And I think they were initially close as it was.
Speaker 2 (20:32):
But travel is hard, and it's beautiful and wonderful and magical,
but there are some really tough moments. And when you
do sort of watch a family who's kind of in
it together and you watch them come out to the
other side a week or two weeks later, it's pretty cool.
Like you can just feel how much closer they are,
how much more they know each other, who's helped who out,
(20:57):
you know, when there's a bike that's broke down, or
they don't want to cycle up this horrible ten kilometer
hill in forty degree celsius heat.
Speaker 3 (21:08):
But it's also what I find.
Speaker 2 (21:09):
Interesting with families is when you're in a group trip
and there's other people, so it's that family, and then
there's other people around, how they interact.
Speaker 3 (21:20):
With other people is also very interesting.
Speaker 2 (21:23):
So it's like, does the family just stay with each
other or are they comfortable to like branch out and
get to know other people in the group, or and
how do they within that family react to like family
members sort of making friends that are outside of this group.
I find that super interesting, and sometimes it works and
sometimes it doesn't. You can see that sometimes like the
(21:45):
people that come with their families are like, we are
going to stay together this whole time, no one will
penetrate us. And then other people just have a blast
sort of like exploring these tentacles of new people while
I still kind of have the comfort of this like
core nuclear family.
Speaker 3 (22:04):
So I think it's actually really cool.
Speaker 2 (22:05):
I think it's a really interesting thing to do as
a family. It's certainly very very bonding and what cool
memories and experiences to have with each other you know
that you'll always have together when you know, down the road,
and to talk about and laugh about and think about it.
Speaker 3 (22:23):
I think it's pretty awesome.
Speaker 1 (22:24):
Actually, yeah, well, let's talk about your podcast, which is
called Fly for listeners who might not know it. What's
the show about.
Speaker 2 (22:33):
So, yes, this is a show called Fly Travel Radio.
It is on hiatus at the moment. I started this
show in twenty sixteen, I think twenty fifteen, twenty sixteen.
So after I had gone away in twenty ten, I
came home and I obviously had zero money and I
couldn't travel for several years.
Speaker 3 (22:53):
So I started a.
Speaker 2 (22:55):
Radio show and it was at the community radio station
at the University of Toronto.
Speaker 3 (23:00):
And it was awesome.
Speaker 2 (23:00):
I was meeting people from around the world and it
was my way of traveling without traveling, and I had
some really fascinating guests, like I had a guess who
walked the length of Africa. I think I believe it
was the length or the width. I don't know one
or the other. For like two and a half years,
I had a guess who cycled from China to Canada
(23:21):
over a couple of years, and they weren't always that extreme,
but I did look for pretty like unique people that
are out in the world adventuring, and certainly there are
a ton. But it was just great and I was
very lucky, very lucky I built this awesome community. And
then actually, two years ago, I went on a hiking
trip in Turkey with one of my guests. I'd never
(23:43):
met her in real life, but we got along through
the show and we kept in touch, so off we
went on on a trip together that was pretty interesting.
Speaker 3 (23:51):
So yeah, I really really loved it.
Speaker 2 (23:53):
And then I had to put it on a hiatus
because two years ago I went traveling and then I
decided to write this book, and you can all do everything.
Speaker 3 (24:01):
But it's still there in those one hundred.
Speaker 2 (24:04):
And eighty episodes, and it's possible that I might fire
it up again in twenty twenty six, so we'll wait
and see on that.
Speaker 3 (24:12):
But it was really fun.
Speaker 2 (24:15):
I loved it, as I'm sure you're enjoying your podcast
as well. It's like a whole new world of meeting people.
Speaker 1 (24:22):
Yeah, and you never know where the podcast is going
to take yet times it seems like, yep, Well, you
mentioned a couple of people that you've interviewed through your
conversations and talking to adventures from all walks of life.
What's one story or conversation that really stuck with you.
Speaker 2 (24:41):
The story that I've been talking abouit lately, and I
don't want to keep repeating myself, but I think that
it's a really interesting thing that happened to me which
has changed my travel experience. So when I was away
in twenty ten in this in Southeast Asia, I met
a woman who was probably in her fifties at the time.
Speaker 3 (25:02):
I was thirty five. I think she was in her fifties.
Speaker 2 (25:05):
Fascinating person, had lived a million lives, done more than
anyone I'd ever met, and to this day probably still has.
And we were in Northern Loo. It seems like everything
happens in Lao in my life. But she stopped talking
to me for a minute and was really zoning in
(25:25):
or like honing in on these two young girls that
were in their twenties backpackers, and she was like kind
of studying them and listening to them. And then she
looked at me and she said, these two girls need
to go home, they're done, and I had no idea
what she was talking about. So then we had this
amazing conversation about travel, burnout and knowing when it's time
(25:47):
to go home. And thank goodness we'd had that conversation
because it happened to me on the same trip. So
four months and my partner was going indefinitely. But I
always knew I would listen to myself when it was
time to leave, and four months in, I'd had it.
I had had enough. I wasn't enjoying it. It became
(26:09):
a job. I was a little bit homesick. I was
tired of just being with the same person all the time,
because traveling with a partner can be isolating.
Speaker 3 (26:20):
Nothing was interesting. I'd like it. Just it was over
and I needed to go home, and I did, and
that has changed everything for me.
Speaker 2 (26:29):
It was understanding that it's okay to have had enough,
because there's a lot of ego on the road when
you are traveling and you're meeting people that are doing
this for months, years, whatever it is, so you'll meet
people that'll be like, oh, I've been on the road
for two years, or I've been on the road for
eighteen months, and that can be it can get competitive
(26:53):
in a really weird and stupid way, or I have
how many countries have you been to?
Speaker 3 (26:58):
Or oh my story is this blah blah blah.
Speaker 2 (27:01):
So I think I was the right age to get
that message at thirty five, to know, hey, like it's
as important to know when to go home as it
is to know when to travel.
Speaker 3 (27:11):
And so now I have changed everything.
Speaker 2 (27:14):
So last year when I went, I had a year
off and all my trips, the longest trip I did
was two months. I would go anywhere from three weeks
to eight weeks and then kind of come home and regroup.
And I was lucky that I had the finances to
do that, because not everybody does. But I knew that
I needed to like reset and process what I'd done
(27:36):
and get like proper sleep and then go out again.
And so she's probably the person who has been the
most pivotal into understanding like travel burnout and ego and
mindset and looking after yourself and how that has shaped
my life after that. That was a pretty interesting thing
(27:57):
to have happened to me on that trip. I would
say an important person.
Speaker 1 (28:02):
Well, and you've met people from all over the globe.
Speaker 2 (28:05):
You will see that they are the happiest people, the
most generous people, and the kindest people. So that's a
huge lesson and I think that everybody needs to see that.
That would help us all out in the world. I think,
so that's an important thing to take home always.
Speaker 3 (28:26):
But I think it's also.
Speaker 2 (28:29):
You know, just what I was saying earlier is when
you meet different people, you know, when we're in our
own lives and our silos, and especially in North America.
Speaker 3 (28:37):
Where we leave very or so I live very.
Speaker 2 (28:42):
Often independent lives, you can kind of get trapped into
what you know and who you know, and we judge,
you know, what we do. We're human, and I think
that when you go away, something happens with all of
that and you it just it doesn't entirely disappear, because
you have to still be safe and have your radar
(29:04):
about you. But I do really think that we're more
open to like different kinds of people and what they
have to offer, and you just never know who you're
going to meet, you know, and what kind of stories
they have to tell you. And I think that there's
a lot of that, like just not judging a book
by its cover. But I think that traveling, you end
(29:26):
up with a real pack of like strange people that
you would never ever in your life think that would
work together, and it does, and you become a family often,
and you look out for each other, and there's a
real sort of pack mentality that no one gets left behind.
And that can be with people you're only hanging out
(29:46):
with for a day or for three days, or I
don't know, if something happens to you right where you're
kind of looking out for each other. So I think
that those are really important things to learn about.
Speaker 3 (29:56):
When you travel.
Speaker 2 (29:57):
It does kind of like change how you see people,
and hopefully we bring that back home when when we
you know, life always goes back to normal, but hopefully
we can keep some of that with us, where we're
open to learning about people and treating people well. I mean,
I have a regular nine to five job. I've been
very lucky to like work travel around that. But I
(30:19):
see people who don't always speak the nicest or most
respectfully to custodians and caretakers and people working the security desks,
and I hate that because.
Speaker 3 (30:32):
You don't know their story.
Speaker 2 (30:34):
So I always go out of my way to be
kind to those people and to talk to them and
to find out what they're all about. And I've learned
fascinating things from them, and I think that comes from travel.
Speaker 3 (30:45):
I think I was also raised that way.
Speaker 2 (30:47):
But I think the more exposure you have to different
types of people, the more curious you are and you know,
questioning you are. And like, everyone has the same needs.
You know, they want to be treated with respect, they
want to eat, they want to sleep, they want to
have a roof over their head, they want to be safe,
they want to be loved. Like we are all the same,
(31:09):
and that's what you get from traveling.
Speaker 1 (31:12):
I agree, Well, you know, we live in an Instagram society,
But what advice would you give travelers who want to
collect more stories and fewer selfies.
Speaker 2 (31:23):
You know, I have had some interesting encounters with proper influencers,
and I'm not a huge fan.
Speaker 3 (31:30):
I'm going to be very honest about that.
Speaker 2 (31:33):
And I wouldn't say that I am one of those people.
I'm just a normal person who just likes to share stories.
I think that you don't need to have a predetermined
idea of what something is. I see a lot of
influencers that are like, I'm going here and this is
the picture and this is the story and whatever.
Speaker 3 (31:56):
I don't work like that.
Speaker 2 (31:57):
I mean, I'm not getting paid any money to be
an influencer, so maybe I'm doing something wrong here. But
for me, I have zero expectations going into things, and
I just feel if I feel like this is something
I need to share in terms of like something through
my lens which becomes my story, then I do that.
(32:20):
And the other thing for me is that I don't often.
I mean, my Instagram is full of travel stuff, but
a lot of it happens weeks, if not months, after
a trip because I'm still processing it right. And I
feel like influencers are like, it's in the moment they're posting.
They need the clicks, they need this, they need that,
(32:41):
and that's great. Good for them, that's their career. But
that's not me. And so my storytelling comes from a
lot of time of like letting it sink in, seeing
how I feel all of that stuff.
Speaker 3 (32:55):
So that's how I roll.
Speaker 2 (32:56):
I don't know if that's for everybody, but you have
to add why you're doing it.
Speaker 3 (33:01):
Is it is it for your audience or is it
for you?
Speaker 2 (33:04):
And for me, the things that are for me is
what the most people respond to.
Speaker 3 (33:09):
Because it's authentic. It's me. I'm not like pretending.
Speaker 2 (33:14):
I'm being pretty honest about what's happening, what the moment is,
and people relate to that. You know, there's like there
has to be a humanness to what we're sharing. Otherwise
it's pretty obvious what people are, you know, they're just
wanting the immediate reaction and like praise of where they are.
Speaker 3 (33:32):
I'm just not.
Speaker 2 (33:32):
Into that, right and I often, I mean I had
I had spent days with two like really annoying influencers
in Bolivia, and they're not really in the moment. They
are constantly like plotting and scheming actually a little bit,
and it's really it's really kind of sad, to be honest.
(33:54):
I mean, I get it, and it's changed the landscape
and you know, but it's just I don't know, I
think it's kind of sid I think it's changed travel
for the not the best in some ways.
Speaker 1 (34:05):
I'll never forget. I went my brother lived in Key West,
and so I went to see him and I drove,
you know, I'm just hitting the tourist spots and I
went to that southernmost point. I forget what it's what
it's called exactly, but you know there's somebody, there's a
family that was in front of it, and then there's
this huge line of people waiting to take a picture,
(34:25):
and I'm just like, that's you know, you're missing so
much about Key West just trying to get that one.
I mean, think if you spend an hour or two hours,
they're waiting to get a picture of that because you
feel like you need that to prove that you were there.
I don't know, I just don't feel I feel like
you're missing a whole lot doing that.
Speaker 2 (34:46):
And then they're saying, how you know people who are
doing that are wrecking cities and towns and wildlife and
all of.
Speaker 3 (34:54):
It, just to like block to these places. It's really
really sad.
Speaker 1 (34:59):
Yeah, it is. Well, so what's what's next for you?
You mentioned maybe starting the podcast back up. Are you
going to write another book? Is there a new adventure
on the horizon?
Speaker 3 (35:10):
There's a book percolating. I'm just trying to find the time.
But yes. In twenty twenty three, I was in.
Speaker 2 (35:16):
I lived in Quebec City for five weeks, and I
was in South America for a couple of months or
for five weeks, and I was in Europe for a
couple of months, and I feel there's some stories there,
so yes, I'm working on that. I did some stand
up comedy last year, so contemplating giving that another go.
Speaker 3 (35:38):
But yeah, these are the these are the projects. But
always travel.
Speaker 2 (35:43):
I actually, though, have no plans for twenty twenty six,
which is not like me. I'm kind of in a
phase where I'm letting sort of the universe decide for
me where I'm supposed to go. So that's kind of
fun sometimes and we'll see something will happen. I just
don't know where yet.
Speaker 1 (36:00):
But yeah, you mentioned stand up comedy. That has to
be and being vulnerable, that has to be the most
vulnerable person can be standing on stage trying to get
a laugh from an audience. I can't even imagine.
Speaker 3 (36:12):
Yeah, it's stressful. I took a class.
Speaker 2 (36:15):
I was supposed to take this project management class, and
after ten minutes I was.
Speaker 3 (36:22):
Like, I cannot do this.
Speaker 2 (36:24):
This is like being in Charlie Brown with a Charlie
Brown you know that teacher? Oh yes, And then I
started googling like comedy classes and public speaking classes, so
I landed in this course.
Speaker 3 (36:36):
I very quickly dropped out of this project.
Speaker 2 (36:38):
Management course and I ended up in this eight week
course called public Speaking through stand up Comedy, So they
kind of taught you, i mean, the things that you
needed to know and how to create like an eight
minute set and yeah, it's terrifying, but if you can
write and you're funny and you can tell a story, you.
Speaker 3 (37:00):
Can do it. But the key there is to be prepared.
Speaker 2 (37:04):
So once you have this thing like chopped down, because
I'm very wordy, you can probably tell by this interview.
Speaker 3 (37:10):
So I really had to learn how to like.
Speaker 2 (37:12):
Get very concise and just chop, chop chop, and and
then I just rehearse it over and over and over
again for like three weeks walking around Toronto and my
talking out loud to myself so that when you get
on stage, you it's it's locked in.
Speaker 3 (37:29):
And you can still have fun and be in the moment.
But it is absolutely.
Speaker 2 (37:32):
Terrifying, but when they laugh, it's pretty spectacular, honest.
Speaker 1 (37:37):
Bat Well, finally, where can our listeners follow you? Find
your content? Where can they follow you?
Speaker 2 (37:44):
Yes, Instagram's probably the best. It's fly underscore travel underscore Media,
so that's a good one. And then fly roadway dot
com is my website and then all my podcasts are
on sound Cloud and that's under fly Travel Radio, So
those are probably the best places, but you can also
(38:06):
find all of that on my website at fly roadway
dot com.
Speaker 1 (38:09):
Awesome, and the book, again is The People You Meet.
So Melissa, thank you so much for coming on and
talking with me. I appreciate it.
Speaker 3 (38:17):
Thank you. I had a great time. I appreciate it too.
It is a good time.
Speaker 1 (38:22):
Those stories are a great reminder that travel doesn't have
to be perfect, and it rarely is. It just has
to be real. Sometimes the best souvenir is a story
that makes you laugh years later. For our listeners, if
you haven't picked up The People You Meet, I highly
recommend it. It's full of moments that are funny, relatable,
and surprisingly moving. You'll find yourself nodding along, laughing, maybe
(38:47):
even reflecting a bit on your own travel memories. And also,
if you're looking for more ways to make your own
trips more meaningful, you can check out my book, The
Family Vacationer Appearance Guide to Meaningful Travel. It's packed with
practical ideas for bringing more connection into every adventure, whether
you're heading across the world or across your own state
until next down. Folks, remember, keep your passports and your
(39:09):
heart's open. Safe travels everyone.
Speaker 4 (39:19):
I've got it fool on all the beach places and
the hotel spaceis amusement, bark rides and water slides, mountain
ranges and seasonal changes.
Speaker 5 (39:35):
I'm leading to serve on the fairly vacation.
Speaker 4 (39:42):
I've got in food on other beach praaces and hotel spaces,
amusement bark rides and water slides, mountain ranges and seasonal changes.
I'm lead to serve.
Speaker 5 (39:58):
I'm the family vaca, your family vacation, your family vacation.
Speaker 4 (40:12):
Now, I've got to let me want to see a frame.
Speaker 3 (40:19):
It's this a mesta.
Speaker 4 (40:21):
Don't go loss it pass
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