September 11, 2024 • 22 mins
Ever wondered what it takes to be a successful real estate agent in 2024? We are thrilled to have Karem back with us to shatter the stereotypes and unveil the true essence of a modern-day agent. Forget the outdated image of fancy suits and luxury cars; today’s agents are multifaceted professionals mastering roles in negotiation, marketing, content creation, and even psychology. Karem shares how balancing vendor and buyer expectations leads to fair outcomes and immense job satisfaction, providing a realistic look at the dedication and hard work behind each successful deal.
Harnessing the power of social media is no longer optional but essential in the real estate industry. Karem and the boys break down how authenticity and strategic content creation can significantly impact your business. We cover everything from conceptualization to the execution of diverse forms of content, including behind-the-scenes footage. These efforts not only increase engagement but also help in building a robust personal brand that keeps you prominently in the minds of potential clients.
Trust is the cornerstone of any successful real estate business. Karim underscores this by discussing how authentic marketing and referrals have driven his success, illustrated by a recent listing that broke viewership records in New South Wales. Karem also shares insights on the dynamics of running a real estate business, emphasizing the value of a robust rent roll and the collaboration between rental and sales departments for sustained success.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:05):
Welcome to the Finance Show with Joe.
He's Joe, I'm Jess Lomshmo andwe've got our very special guest
Karim back again and we're allin t-shirts because it's a
midwinter heat wave, it's hot.
Speaker 2 (00:15):
Sun's out guns out baby.
Not for me, though.
Speaker 3 (00:21):
I'm just trying to hold my gut in everyone so we
gotta keep it nice and tight.
Speaker 2 (00:24):
So, if anyone doesn't know, karim's been on a
worldwide tour Dubai, lebanon,china.
Speaker 3 (00:29):
Yugoslavia oh, here we go.
Speaker 2 (00:31):
People are going to think I don't work.
Trust me, all I do is work.
He's back in Australia.
He's back on the podcast for asecond time.
We're so excited to have you.
So thank you so much, Kar.
Really do appreciate you takingthe time, because we know how
busy you are and genuinely youprovide such good insight on the
property market, the realestate market, the effects
(00:52):
interest rates are even having.
You're not a mortgage broker,but you know the ins and outs of
it as well.
And that kind of leads me to myquestion.
Today's topics are around theevolving role of the real estate
agent and how that has changedso much in the last five years.
So would you be able to give ussome insight on what the modern
real estate agent needs to bedoing in 2024?
Speaker 3 (01:14):
Jeez, where do I start?
Honestly?
So I'm just going to like nipit in the butt.
Right now there's thismisconception that agents just
wear fancy suits, drive nicecars, put a property on
realestatecom, kick back, waitfor the sale.
When they're done, collecttheir commission and go home.
Speaker 2 (01:29):
Clearly not.
You're in a T-shirt today.
Speaker 3 (01:30):
Well, yeah, I very rarely wear suits.
That's number one about me, butthat's just my personal style.
It is what it is.
But, yeah, has it changed?
I mean, like I've only been inthe we discussed, but for those
that haven't seen it since,realistically 2016, start of
2016, so what's that?
You know we're eight years inand in that eight years, I can
tell you from where I started towhere we are right now.
(01:51):
It is day and night, yeah,literally day and night.
A good real estate agent thesedays is wears about 30 different
hats.
Real estate agency is numberone.
You've got to be real estate.
You've got to be a masternegotiator.
You've got to be a marketinggenius.
You've got to be a contentcreator.
You've got to be a social mediainfluencer.
You've got to be a stylist.
You've got to be uh, anarchitect.
(02:12):
You've got to be a conveyancer.
You've got to be a solicitor.
You've got to be a psychologist.
You've got to be a mediator.
There are so many things thatgo into selling a property these
days.
I wouldn't know where to startor begin, but we wear so many
hats and I'm not trying to like,beat our chest, trying to make
it.
We've got the hardest job inthe world.
Every job is hard.
Everything you do in life thatis rewarding is hard.
Speaker 2 (02:32):
That's why I think it's easy work that is that I'm
going to like take that snippetand I'm just going to replay it
every day in my head and I'mgoing to replay it to my kids,
because I hear this work-lifebalance and all this kind of
stuff and I want to be able todo this and socialize and stuff
People like I'm telling you now,the most rewarding thing in
(02:53):
life is when you work hard, okay, and you are rewarded for those
efforts.
It is just the most amazingthing.
I want to touch on one thingthat you really stuck out to me,
because we haven't spoken atall about it on the show the
role of the negotiator.
So explain the role of thenegotiator as a real estate
agent.
Speaker 3 (03:11):
Look, it's hard to like kind of quantify into a
conversation, but I feel likethe art of negotiation.
I mean, I've read a ton ofbooks in my lifetime self-help
books, negotiation books becauseI like this kind of stuff
anyway but honestly it justcomes down to understanding the
person you're speaking with,understanding who they are, what
they want.
I'm not trying to squeeze everysingle drop of blood from a
(03:34):
person.
There's got to be a commonground, there's got to be a fair
deal for a vendor and for abuyer, but usually that common
ground results in a really goodresult for everyone.
So my Right, so like my job, Ifeel like is to find out my
vendor's wants and needs, mybuyer's wants and needs,
correlate them together and thenfind a happy place for both
parties.
Speaker 2 (03:53):
Because you have to negotiate first of all with the
vendor.
The vendor might think thattheir house is worth $5 million
when it's really worth $3million.
I don't take the listing on.
You won't take it.
Speaker 3 (04:06):
I've made a decision to myself.
If I don't believe I canachieve that result for him, I'm
not going to pull.
As I said to you, I wear 30hats during the campaign.
You know like I put my blood,sweat and tears into every
seller, whether I'm selling atwo-bedroom unit in Wiley Park
or a $5 million luxury home inKingsgrove or whatever the case
may be.
It's the same energy that goesinto every transaction and you
(04:31):
can't believe I can deliver thatto him.
Why am I going to pour all myenergy, all my effort into it,
just to end up in saying youcouldn't do the job and I knew
it wasn't there.
I'd much rather be the secondagent.
He calls and he gets me shit.
Karim, you're right.
Can you come and help me?
I want to get the resort withthe current agent, whatever the
case may be, and that's happenednumerous times.
Speaker 2 (04:51):
I'm always assisting the buyer in achieving finance.
But dealing with a vendor,that's the hard job.
It's a very hard job, yeah,especially because they just
sometimes they have theunrealistic expectations.
Speaker 3 (05:02):
Well, everyone believes their house is worth a
certain amount of dollars.
Yeah, you know I'll go intomany listing appraisers.
It's funny.
I'll.
Any list in appraisals is funny.
I walk around, I look at it andthen I say, out of curiosity,
do you have any expectations?
Oh, I've got no idea.
I don't know.
You're the professional.
I give them a number.
Oh, no way, it's worth morethan that.
I'm like brother.
You told me five minutes agoyou have no idea.
So clearly you have an idea,you just want to know what I'm
(05:22):
thinking first right.
Speaker 2 (05:26):
Your area is.
Everyone is property savvy.
Speaker 3 (05:28):
Now Let me take that back a bit.
It's not my area, joe.
It is.
Everyone is property savvyperiod.
There is this misconceptionthat back in the day, you could
like go knock on an olderperson's home and try to
convince them to sell their homeor whatever this, that, and
they wouldn't know.
We're in the digital age.
Everyone knows what theirproperty is worth and they want
10% to 20% more than that,understandably so, like it's
(05:54):
your biggest asset that you'reever going to move.
We're not selling flat screentvs yeah.
We're selling million dollarhomes here, yeah.
So I understand why theexpectations are that way, but
everyone knows what the propertyis worth these days, because
all you got to do is punch itinto google and there are like
10 different ways and sites thatcan tell you where your
property is priced another thingthat you just mentioned.
Speaker 2 (06:06):
You said million dollar homes.
To be able to sell thesemillion-dollar properties, you
can't just market them and putup four pictures, or even do you
remember the old real estatewindows with the just the like?
It was like a little16-centimetre square for sale
and it used to be, like you know, $500,000.
You can't do that anymore.
It needs to be visible.
(06:26):
People need to be able toimagine what it's like living
there 100%.
Speaker 3 (06:31):
We don't have anything on our windows.
We don't have any TVs on ourwindows.
We have nothing.
The only way you know where areal estate office is the big
LED that says Mayfair RealEstate.
Other than that, there's notone picture of a property in my
office, because where are all mybuyers coming from this device
right here?
They're all being driven fromthat device right there.
Instagram TikTok YouTubeInstagram, tiktok, youtube
(06:52):
Obviously the big players realestate or common domain that's
where you generate majority ofyour leads.
But in saying that my firstever sale in Mayfair was from
social media, on Instagram,really, I literally put a
picture up of a house that I hadoff market.
One of my followers asked meabout it.
A week and a half later theybought the house.
Speaker 2 (07:11):
It's documented.
Did that make you realise thepower of social media?
Speaker 3 (07:15):
I knew then what it could potentially do, but that
solidified it for me.
I've really focused in on usingsocial media to the greatest
advantage that I possibly canfor real estate.
And it's funny, I walk intolisting pitches and I talk about
social media and the vendorwill say to me, oh, and I talk
about social media.
And the vendor will say to me,oh yeah, the other agent said
they do social media as well.
I go, do they really they go?
What do you mean I go, what doyou understand about social
(07:35):
media?
Oh, I don't know, I don'treally use it.
I go.
Are they doing targeted ads?
Are they boosting their posts?
Are they zeroing in on certainpeople?
Yeah, yeah, I go.
Like social media is not justputting up a picture and saying
I do social media marketing.
That's not social mediamarketing.
You have to understand thealgorithm, you have to know what
(07:58):
engages with who you'rereaching, who your buyers are,
and I like to think I'm nottrying to beat my chest, but I
think that's where wedifferentiate ourselves in the
marketplace and the resultsspeak for themselves the
record-breaking results we'vegenerated and the viewership you
can just look on my socials andsee numbers don't lie.
Speaker 2 (08:17):
It's just a better way to tap into the market and
to really engage your audience.
Everybody needs a house.
Everyone needs somewhere tolive.
No one wants to live with theirparents for the rest of their
life, and if they do, we've gotto have a conversation with them
okay.
Speaker 3 (08:27):
Good luck to them.
Speaker 2 (08:29):
You know my thing.
I put up a video the other daywhy it's more like how difficult
it's going to be to live inrent for the rest of your life.
So people need to be able tobuy property and they need to be
able to do that.
And the best way to reallyengage a customer especially
anyone that's under the age of25, is social media 100%.
They're scrolling TikTok allthe time.
(08:50):
They're scrolling InstagramReels.
Speaker 3 (08:52):
I swear by it Honestly.
I can't speak highly enough ofit.
It's like the bread and butterof our business these days, and
if you're not doing it, you'reso far behind.
Speaker 2 (09:02):
I have to ask you something, because I saw it on
your Instagram story the otherday and you have to share us
this picture.
Speaker 3 (09:12):
We saw a picture of you, Chantel, and the.
Speaker 2 (09:13):
KRooz brothers yes, oh that's.
I can't really talk about thatat the moment.
This episode's releasing at theend of August, I mean end of
September.
Speaker 3 (09:17):
It doesn't also directly correlate to real
estate.
So there's a couple of otherthings we're doing, but they're
great guys and what they'redoing is a testament to the
power of social media.
Look what they've generated,how they've built for themselves
Great guys and they've usedsocial media to a T.
They've started this wholebusiness around themselves and
who they are just by being whothey are.
(09:38):
And that's the other thing.
It's being genuine on socialmedia.
Some people can do it and maybethey're not comfortable in
front of the camera or they tryto be someone they're not.
You'll get fanned out.
Speaker 1 (09:46):
Oh yeah, everyone knows straight away.
Yeah, you can pick it from amile away.
Speaker 3 (09:50):
You've just got to be who you are and give that to
the public.
Speaker 2 (09:53):
Did you ever get anxiety around posting a video
or anything like that?
Speaker 3 (09:57):
Look, I did drama in school, so I was always
comfortable.
Speaker 1 (10:01):
I was comfortable in front of the camera.
Speaker 3 (10:02):
I was comfortable on stage.
Somewhere inside of me there'sa budding probably actor slash
director.
I love theatre.
I love movies.
At the start you do get a bitself-conscious about the content
you're putting out and how it'sgoing to, but then what I
learned was a long time ago isyou've just got to really not
give a shit.
Put it out there and excuse thelanguage.
Give zero fucks about how it'staken.
(10:23):
As long as I'm not hurtinganyone or saying anything wrong,
I'm going for gold, yeah.
Speaker 2 (10:31):
And it going for gold ?
Yeah, and it's worked wondersfor me.
Yeah, I have to agree with you.
Yeah, um, my business is builton social media.
Yeah, uh, you know, we get alot of referral partnerships and
we get like, like yourself, forexample, and we get a lot of
accountants that you know.
Call us up, hey, can you assistsomeone.
But the way we stay top of mindand this is what I always try
to explain people it's not aboutone post generating a lead that
that post keeps you top of mind, whether it's real estate,
(10:53):
hairdressing, being a broker,any sort of thing, whatever
industry.
Yeah, whatever industry, it'ssuch a massively powerful tool
and especially with this newTikTok 15 seconds, you have to
be able to grab people'sattention very quickly.
Speaker 3 (11:06):
Very quickly and like there's lots of things, and you
would know this because you'rea pro of watching your videos.
I quickly and like there's lotsof things, and you would know
this because you're a prowatching your videos.
I've always admired them, likeit's the captions, it's uh, what
image are you using as yourlead image for your reel?
You know, like you gotta,there's there's such a science
to it and I think people don'trealize the science that's
involved in it and it's allstrategy and it's all knowing
how to do it and do it correctly.
Speaker 2 (11:25):
So like it's really, really important so how do you
use social media now?
Don't reveal all your secrets.
So how do you use social mediaNow?
Don't reveal all your secrets,but how do you?
Good enough imitators out there, often imitated, never
duplicated.
Speaker 1 (11:37):
Greatest form of flattery.
Speaker 3 (11:39):
Yeah, that's it 100%.
Speaker 2 (11:41):
How do you really capture someone's imagination
when, let's say, you're filminga video for a new listing that
you've got?
Speaker 3 (11:49):
So look, first and foremost, what I do is I like to
shoot multiple videos for alisting, so we'll have the
traditional video that we uploadon YouTube, which then goes to
realestatecom.
Now I'm still very hands-onwith that project.
I'll be there with the videoeditor.
I'll actually tell him how Iwant the video shot, in terms of
what theme I want.
Do I want it fast-paced?
Do I want it slow?
Do I want it more editorial?
Do I want to focus on certainparts of the house?
(12:11):
I'm very hands-on.
I'll pick the music.
If I don't like the edit, I'llsend it back.
I'll be like no, I need you tochop this, I need you to add
this.
I need you to do that.
It can be a pain in the ass forthe editors and I know they
(12:32):
sometimes don't.
Number one and I've got aresponsibility to my vendor to
showcase their property in itsbest light.
Then we'll do different videos.
I'll do behind the scenesvideos.
So those behind the scenesvideos that I've been doing are
going absolutely bonkers.
On my socials.
The viewership is to the roofBecause people don't just want
to see a normal video of thesame thing bedroom, kitchen,
living, pool, whatever.
They want to see a little bit ofinteraction.
I kind of walk them throughunofficially.
I'll interact with people aswe're filming.
Photographers might be there,stylists might be there, my team
(12:53):
might be there, whatever thecase may be.
It's a lot.
It's condensed.
I always keep it to a minute 30because that way we can sponsor
the videos.
You know there's a little tradesecret.
I might reveal that too much.
I just try to engage indifferent ways to different
audiences, because you don'twant to see the same thing all
the time.
You want to keep it fresh, youwant to keep it engaging and you
want to keep people alwaysguessing and reaching out to me,
(13:13):
and I can't tell you how manytimes people drop into my DMs.
I get phone calls.
I had a phone call from abuilder.
I sold a property for him aboutthree months ago now and he
called me up.
He saw a BTS that I did.
He's like man, yes, that's whatI want, like that's, you know.
Like you know, I'm not here forthe pats on the back, but that
(13:35):
positive feedback you get frompeople, it's just nice man, it's
great, like honestly, it feelsgood.
Speaker 2 (13:42):
I've noticed a little bit of a change in certain
culture where people actually goout of their way to give you a
compliment now if you're reallygood at what you do.
There have been so many hatersin this world and there's so
many people in the comments that, whoever that builder is, give
me his number.
I'm going to call him and tellhim.
I'm going to leave him atestimonial on his page as well,
just because when you go out ofyour way and you do that, you
make someone's day.
You probably make their yearwhen something like that happens
(14:02):
.
Speaker 3 (14:03):
It doesn't take much to be kind.
Yeah, that's the end of the andthat small act of kindness.
You don't know how that canchange someone's world.
Speaker 2 (14:12):
It also triggers something in your brain.
You've probably because you'rein a better mood or you hear
that or something, you'veprobably become more creative.
Speaker 3 (14:19):
100% inspires you to do better.
Yeah, and it's the most naturalform of dopamine you can get.
Yeah, like you know, gettingthat in and like hearing
positive affirmations comingfrom someone that's got no
reason to give it to you anddoesn't want anything from you,
like fuck man, that's a good.
Speaker 1 (14:33):
The fact that he even called you and didn't just
leave a comment.
Honestly, honestly, like yeah,that's it.
Speaker 3 (14:38):
It was great, you know.
So, again, it just inspires meto keep doing what I'm doing,
keep elevating the game.
I always want to be changing.
I never want to be stale.
Yeah, as I said, I'll dosomething and then I'll notice.
I've got lots of agents thatfollow me and I'll notice.
I'll see a video and I'm like,hmm, like I literally like I did
a video very recently.
I'm not going to talk which one, but I saw another agent post
(15:01):
the same video four days later,like 100% exactly the same.
Oh, like shot for shot, shot forshot, and I was like wow.
And I was like, okay, well it,it is what it is like.
You know, these things aregoing to happen.
I don't get all my ideasorganically.
I sometimes see things and thenI'll change them around and try
to make them my own yeah,that's the difference, though.
Speaker 1 (15:16):
Yeah, it's trying to make you see an idea.
You're inspired and you're likeI'll do it a little bit like
that, but you've got to, you'vegot to make it your own me and
my business partner stories andit'd be like epic, but we'll do
that when we're retired one day.
Speaker 2 (15:30):
So call people out.
I always wanted to do.
This was like a marketing ideaI had, but I had.
But what I wanted to do wascreate seasons of it's simple
finance and every three monthswe would reshoot a classic intro
of a sitcom.
So like one day we would bedoing the office and like you
know, like the theme song, andthen like it would have you know
(15:52):
jose song, and then like itwould have you know Joseph, and
then this person, then thisperson, and then I thought, oh,
why don't we go to a fountainand then jump around in a
fountain and do the Friends oneyou know, and then that way,
like it's just engaging theaudience and getting them to
laugh and be like, oh, what doyou guys do?
here, but yeah, that was way tooleft of field and I'm pretty
sure it would cost like $50,000a video.
It costs so much.
We'll scrap that idea.
(16:13):
All of a sudden, JenniferAniston is at the fountain.
Joey, who paid for this?
Speaker 3 (16:18):
Let me know if she shows up.
Yeah, I will.
Speaker 2 (16:20):
I just said.
Speaker 3 (16:20):
But look just to kind of cap it off in terms of the
role of a real estate agentTaking the wedding ring off for
that one.
No, we're doing guys.
Yeah, like it's very, it's allencompassing, that's all I can
say.
It's not what it is and it'sfull on and we work very hard
for what we do.
Yeah, like, believe me, we workvery hard for what we do.
Speaker 1 (16:40):
Do you get like different kinds of?
What kind of clients do youusually get through social media
, like values of the houses,like are these big clients with
like big bank accounts and stuff, or just sort of everyday
people or lower end?
Speaker 3 (16:53):
Man, it's a mixture of everything.
Everything, honestly, it is.
I've got young people in theirearly 20s that reach out to me
looking to either maybe buytheir first investment property
or just want some advice.
Yeah, I get the middle-agednewlyweds.
I get vendors looking to sellor asking me you've sold that
property.
It's very similar to mine.
Can you come out and see myproperty?
(17:13):
I've had people reach out to mefrom Wollongong recently, two
of them from Wollongong becauseI sold one.
We listed a house two weeks ago.
It's now the number one mostviewed house in New South Wales
and the number two in the entirecountry.
Wow, according to realestatecom.
Wow, yeah.
And I had an influx of peoplereaching out saying your
marketing is insane, what you do, how you market.
(17:33):
And again, like that reallymade me feel really good about
myself because it showed like myvendor loved hearing that, like
he loves the fact that hishouse is the number two property
in the entire country.
Like that's a pretty big start,man, you've got over 160,000
listings on realestatecom andwe're two, yeah, you know.
And we've got over 60,000listings on realestatecom and
we're two, yeah, you know.
And we've got over 60,000listings in Sydney, in New South
(17:54):
Wales, and we're one Likethat's pretty kick-ass and
that's going to attract a lotmore vendors.
100%, because they'll now seethe way we market and they'll
see that effort that I put intomy marketing.
And it's not cheap.
Marketing is not cheap.
No, it works 100%.
Speaker 2 (18:07):
So, with the vendors, with attracting these people,
how do you develop thatreputation of trust, how do you
develop the inclination ofpeople wanting to go with you to
either sell or buy a propertyfrom?
Speaker 3 (18:21):
Yeah, great question, because I get asked that a lot
about how you generate leads orwhatever the case may be.
I find the most authentic andgenuine way is obviously
referrals.
Because if you're looking tosell, joe, and you're speaking
to someone that you trust reallywell, a family member, a good
friend you're like, oh, I'mthinking of selling, and they
say to you, hey, man, reach outto Karim for Mayfair.
I work with him, mate.
(18:42):
What an experience Genuine,down the line, whatever,
whatever there's like, you'renot it's not me telling you that
, it's someone else that youtrust telling you that.
So automatically there's alevel of trust there and I get
so many phone calls like that.
Obviously, results are a bigthing.
You break a record in the area.
People are going to see it,they're going to call you up and
say, wow, I've got somethingsimilar to that.
(19:02):
And that's how we've kind ofdoubled up and tripled up on all
these results that we'regetting, because we've broken
records in Kingsgrove, inRoselands, in Belmore, in
Belfield, and they just compileon top of each other.
So I would say referrals isprobably the biggest thing in
our business in terms of it'sorganic, it's natural, it comes
to you.
Obviously you've got your oldschool ways of prospecting.
(19:24):
Your door knocks, your letterdrops all that old school stuff,
phone calls.
You wouldn't shy away from itbecause that's always going to
be true and tested.
Speaker 2 (19:32):
I had a letterbox dropped the other day.
Somebody was like I've got abuyer for your house right now.
I just kind of saw it.
I can't even remember who putit in there, I can't remember
who signed off, but I know for afact if it was one of the
trusted agents in the area, Imight have picked up the phone
and I might have been like, hey,what's it worth?
Yeah, okay, what do they wantto buy?
(19:53):
Because I'm thinking to myself,like my wife and I were
thinking about selling.
We've been thinking aboutselling or, you know, doing
something because we don't wantto live in our area for the rest
of our lives Property, realestate.
(20:15):
There's a chance I would havepicked up the phone, and that's
just a very big thing.
You need to be able to hold,maintain and grow your
reputation.
It's like I always say how youdo anything is how you do
everything.
100%.
Speaker 3 (20:28):
How many times would you go into a house and see a
calendar magnet on a fridge fora real estate agency?
Right, and I sometimes stillsee them.
But what are 90% of peopledoing at 7.30 at night on a
weekday?
They're on TikTok.
They're doing this, they'rescrolling man, yeah, that, or
Tinder, one of the two they'rescrolling.
So the more times you can be infront of their face, the more
(20:51):
times they're going to see me.
They're going to see my name,my brand.
They're going to start thinkingKareem, mayfair, kareem,
mayfair, kareem.
It's just going to correlatewith that might go in the mail.
You get one of those things,you tear them up, it goes in the
mail, Sorry bin, so you get inthe records.
Speaker 2 (21:08):
You've built such a trusted brand.
Have you started thinking toyourself I need to look into a
new market?
You mentioned Wollongong twomoments ago, or is that
something that's still in theback burner?
So?
Speaker 3 (21:18):
we're very blessed.
We've got a really goodbusiness.
We've got a really big officein a really thriving community
and it's a great business thatwe've built.
We built from nothing, westarted.
So I'm not sure most peopleknow, but real estate businesses
are valued from your rent roll,not from your sales.
That's just the way it's valuedin terms of a financial
(21:39):
perspective.
So we started with zeroproperties when we started the
business in our rent roll.
I'm not going to tell you howmany we have now, but it's
fairly significant and you know,off the back of her hard work,
she runs the rental department.
So I've got to give her all thekudos.
She runs that side and I runthe sales side.
We obviously cross between eachother and you know I bring in
clients, she brings in clientsfor sales, I bring in.
Whatever the case may be, butsometimes it's good to have
(22:03):
something one really good thing,rather than than two or three
okay things.
Yeah, you know, and I thinkthat's where my mind's taken me
Both of us we're like reallyhappy with having one really
really good business.
Yeah, and thank God we havethat rather than maybe like, do
you expand and you lose a littlefrom here, you don't you know?
Keep your eye on that.
Yeah, got a good thing going,we've got a good thing going,
you know.
No-transcript.
Welcome to the Finance Show with Joe.
He's Joe, I'm Jess Lomshmo andwe've got our very special guest
Karim back again and we're allin t-shirts because it's a
midwinter heat wave, it's hot.
Speaker 2 (00:15):
Sun's out guns out baby.
Not for me, though.
Speaker 3 (00:21):
I'm just trying to hold my gut in everyone so we
gotta keep it nice and tight.
Speaker 2 (00:24):
So, if anyone doesn't know, karim's been on a
worldwide tour Dubai, lebanon,china.
Speaker 3 (00:29):
Yugoslavia oh, here we go.
Speaker 2 (00:31):
People are going to think I don't work.
Trust me, all I do is work.
He's back in Australia.
He's back on the podcast for asecond time.
We're so excited to have you.
So thank you so much, Kar.
Really do appreciate you takingthe time, because we know how
busy you are and genuinely youprovide such good insight on the
property market, the realestate market, the effects
(00:52):
interest rates are even having.
You're not a mortgage broker,but you know the ins and outs of
it as well.
And that kind of leads me to myquestion.
Today's topics are around theevolving role of the real estate
agent and how that has changedso much in the last five years.
So would you be able to give ussome insight on what the modern
real estate agent needs to bedoing in 2024?
Speaker 3 (01:14):
Jeez, where do I start?
Honestly?
So I'm just going to like nipit in the butt.
Right now there's thismisconception that agents just
wear fancy suits, drive nicecars, put a property on
realestatecom, kick back, waitfor the sale.
When they're done, collecttheir commission and go home.
Speaker 2 (01:29):
Clearly not.
You're in a T-shirt today.
Speaker 3 (01:30):
Well, yeah, I very rarely wear suits.
That's number one about me, butthat's just my personal style.
It is what it is.
But, yeah, has it changed?
I mean, like I've only been inthe we discussed, but for those
that haven't seen it since,realistically 2016, start of
2016, so what's that?
You know we're eight years inand in that eight years, I can
tell you from where I started towhere we are right now.
(01:51):
It is day and night, yeah,literally day and night.
A good real estate agent thesedays is wears about 30 different
hats.
Real estate agency is numberone.
You've got to be real estate.
You've got to be a masternegotiator.
You've got to be a marketinggenius.
You've got to be a contentcreator.
You've got to be a social mediainfluencer.
You've got to be a stylist.
You've got to be uh, anarchitect.
(02:12):
You've got to be a conveyancer.
You've got to be a solicitor.
You've got to be a psychologist.
You've got to be a mediator.
There are so many things thatgo into selling a property these
days.
I wouldn't know where to startor begin, but we wear so many
hats and I'm not trying to like,beat our chest, trying to make
it.
We've got the hardest job inthe world.
Every job is hard.
Everything you do in life thatis rewarding is hard.
Speaker 2 (02:32):
That's why I think it's easy work that is that I'm
going to like take that snippetand I'm just going to replay it
every day in my head and I'mgoing to replay it to my kids,
because I hear this work-lifebalance and all this kind of
stuff and I want to be able todo this and socialize and stuff
People like I'm telling you now,the most rewarding thing in
(02:53):
life is when you work hard, okay, and you are rewarded for those
efforts.
It is just the most amazingthing.
I want to touch on one thingthat you really stuck out to me,
because we haven't spoken atall about it on the show the
role of the negotiator.
So explain the role of thenegotiator as a real estate
agent.
Speaker 3 (03:11):
Look, it's hard to like kind of quantify into a
conversation, but I feel likethe art of negotiation.
I mean, I've read a ton ofbooks in my lifetime self-help
books, negotiation books becauseI like this kind of stuff
anyway but honestly it justcomes down to understanding the
person you're speaking with,understanding who they are, what
they want.
I'm not trying to squeeze everysingle drop of blood from a
(03:34):
person.
There's got to be a commonground, there's got to be a fair
deal for a vendor and for abuyer, but usually that common
ground results in a really goodresult for everyone.
So my Right, so like my job, Ifeel like is to find out my
vendor's wants and needs, mybuyer's wants and needs,
correlate them together and thenfind a happy place for both
parties.
Speaker 2 (03:53):
Because you have to negotiate first of all with the
vendor.
The vendor might think thattheir house is worth $5 million
when it's really worth $3million.
I don't take the listing on.
You won't take it.
Speaker 3 (04:06):
I've made a decision to myself.
If I don't believe I canachieve that result for him, I'm
not going to pull.
As I said to you, I wear 30hats during the campaign.
You know like I put my blood,sweat and tears into every
seller, whether I'm selling atwo-bedroom unit in Wiley Park
or a $5 million luxury home inKingsgrove or whatever the case
may be.
It's the same energy that goesinto every transaction and you
(04:31):
can't believe I can deliver thatto him.
Why am I going to pour all myenergy, all my effort into it,
just to end up in saying youcouldn't do the job and I knew
it wasn't there.
I'd much rather be the secondagent.
He calls and he gets me shit.
Karim, you're right.
Can you come and help me?
I want to get the resort withthe current agent, whatever the
case may be, and that's happenednumerous times.
Speaker 2 (04:51):
I'm always assisting the buyer in achieving finance.
But dealing with a vendor,that's the hard job.
It's a very hard job, yeah,especially because they just
sometimes they have theunrealistic expectations.
Speaker 3 (05:02):
Well, everyone believes their house is worth a
certain amount of dollars.
Yeah, you know I'll go intomany listing appraisers.
It's funny.
I'll.
Any list in appraisals is funny.
I walk around, I look at it andthen I say, out of curiosity,
do you have any expectations?
Oh, I've got no idea.
I don't know.
You're the professional.
I give them a number.
Oh, no way, it's worth morethan that.
I'm like brother.
You told me five minutes agoyou have no idea.
So clearly you have an idea,you just want to know what I'm
(05:22):
thinking first right.
Speaker 2 (05:26):
Your area is.
Everyone is property savvy.
Speaker 3 (05:28):
Now Let me take that back a bit.
It's not my area, joe.
It is.
Everyone is property savvyperiod.
There is this misconceptionthat back in the day, you could
like go knock on an olderperson's home and try to
convince them to sell their homeor whatever this, that, and
they wouldn't know.
We're in the digital age.
Everyone knows what theirproperty is worth and they want
10% to 20% more than that,understandably so, like it's
(05:54):
your biggest asset that you'reever going to move.
We're not selling flat screentvs yeah.
We're selling million dollarhomes here, yeah.
So I understand why theexpectations are that way, but
everyone knows what the propertyis worth these days, because
all you got to do is punch itinto google and there are like
10 different ways and sites thatcan tell you where your
property is priced another thingthat you just mentioned.
Speaker 2 (06:06):
You said million dollar homes.
To be able to sell thesemillion-dollar properties, you
can't just market them and putup four pictures, or even do you
remember the old real estatewindows with the just the like?
It was like a little16-centimetre square for sale
and it used to be, like you know, $500,000.
You can't do that anymore.
It needs to be visible.
(06:26):
People need to be able toimagine what it's like living
there 100%.
Speaker 3 (06:31):
We don't have anything on our windows.
We don't have any TVs on ourwindows.
We have nothing.
The only way you know where areal estate office is the big
LED that says Mayfair RealEstate.
Other than that, there's notone picture of a property in my
office, because where are all mybuyers coming from this device
right here?
They're all being driven fromthat device right there.
Instagram TikTok YouTubeInstagram, tiktok, youtube
(06:52):
Obviously the big players realestate or common domain that's
where you generate majority ofyour leads.
But in saying that my firstever sale in Mayfair was from
social media, on Instagram,really, I literally put a
picture up of a house that I hadoff market.
One of my followers asked meabout it.
A week and a half later theybought the house.
Speaker 2 (07:11):
It's documented.
Did that make you realise thepower of social media?
Speaker 3 (07:15):
I knew then what it could potentially do, but that
solidified it for me.
I've really focused in on usingsocial media to the greatest
advantage that I possibly canfor real estate.
And it's funny, I walk intolisting pitches and I talk about
social media and the vendorwill say to me, oh, and I talk
about social media.
And the vendor will say to me,oh yeah, the other agent said
they do social media as well.
I go, do they really they go?
What do you mean I go, what doyou understand about social
(07:35):
media?
Oh, I don't know, I don'treally use it.
I go.
Are they doing targeted ads?
Are they boosting their posts?
Are they zeroing in on certainpeople?
Yeah, yeah, I go.
Like social media is not justputting up a picture and saying
I do social media marketing.
That's not social mediamarketing.
You have to understand thealgorithm, you have to know what
(07:58):
engages with who you'rereaching, who your buyers are,
and I like to think I'm nottrying to beat my chest, but I
think that's where wedifferentiate ourselves in the
marketplace and the resultsspeak for themselves the
record-breaking results we'vegenerated and the viewership you
can just look on my socials andsee numbers don't lie.
Speaker 2 (08:17):
It's just a better way to tap into the market and
to really engage your audience.
Everybody needs a house.
Everyone needs somewhere tolive.
No one wants to live with theirparents for the rest of their
life, and if they do, we've gotto have a conversation with them
okay.
Speaker 3 (08:27):
Good luck to them.
Speaker 2 (08:29):
You know my thing.
I put up a video the other daywhy it's more like how difficult
it's going to be to live inrent for the rest of your life.
So people need to be able tobuy property and they need to be
able to do that.
And the best way to reallyengage a customer especially
anyone that's under the age of25, is social media 100%.
They're scrolling TikTok allthe time.
(08:50):
They're scrolling InstagramReels.
Speaker 3 (08:52):
I swear by it Honestly.
I can't speak highly enough ofit.
It's like the bread and butterof our business these days, and
if you're not doing it, you'reso far behind.
Speaker 2 (09:02):
I have to ask you something, because I saw it on
your Instagram story the otherday and you have to share us
this picture.
Speaker 3 (09:12):
We saw a picture of you, Chantel, and the.
Speaker 2 (09:13):
KRooz brothers yes, oh that's.
I can't really talk about thatat the moment.
This episode's releasing at theend of August, I mean end of
September.
Speaker 3 (09:17):
It doesn't also directly correlate to real
estate.
So there's a couple of otherthings we're doing, but they're
great guys and what they'redoing is a testament to the
power of social media.
Look what they've generated,how they've built for themselves
Great guys and they've usedsocial media to a T.
They've started this wholebusiness around themselves and
who they are just by being whothey are.
(09:38):
And that's the other thing.
It's being genuine on socialmedia.
Some people can do it and maybethey're not comfortable in
front of the camera or they tryto be someone they're not.
You'll get fanned out.
Speaker 1 (09:46):
Oh yeah, everyone knows straight away.
Yeah, you can pick it from amile away.
Speaker 3 (09:50):
You've just got to be who you are and give that to
the public.
Speaker 2 (09:53):
Did you ever get anxiety around posting a video
or anything like that?
Speaker 3 (09:57):
Look, I did drama in school, so I was always
comfortable.
Speaker 1 (10:01):
I was comfortable in front of the camera.
Speaker 3 (10:02):
I was comfortable on stage.
Somewhere inside of me there'sa budding probably actor slash
director.
I love theatre.
I love movies.
At the start you do get a bitself-conscious about the content
you're putting out and how it'sgoing to, but then what I
learned was a long time ago isyou've just got to really not
give a shit.
Put it out there and excuse thelanguage.
Give zero fucks about how it'staken.
(10:23):
As long as I'm not hurtinganyone or saying anything wrong,
I'm going for gold, yeah.
Speaker 2 (10:31):
And it going for gold ?
Yeah, and it's worked wondersfor me.
Yeah, I have to agree with you.
Yeah, um, my business is builton social media.
Yeah, uh, you know, we get alot of referral partnerships and
we get like, like yourself, forexample, and we get a lot of
accountants that you know.
Call us up, hey, can you assistsomeone.
But the way we stay top of mindand this is what I always try
to explain people it's not aboutone post generating a lead that
that post keeps you top of mind, whether it's real estate,
(10:53):
hairdressing, being a broker,any sort of thing, whatever
industry.
Yeah, whatever industry, it'ssuch a massively powerful tool
and especially with this newTikTok 15 seconds, you have to
be able to grab people'sattention very quickly.
Speaker 3 (11:06):
Very quickly and like there's lots of things, and you
would know this because you'rea pro of watching your videos.
I quickly and like there's lotsof things, and you would know
this because you're a prowatching your videos.
I've always admired them, likeit's the captions, it's uh, what
image are you using as yourlead image for your reel?
You know, like you gotta,there's there's such a science
to it and I think people don'trealize the science that's
involved in it and it's allstrategy and it's all knowing
how to do it and do it correctly.
Speaker 2 (11:25):
So like it's really, really important so how do you
use social media now?
Don't reveal all your secrets.
So how do you use social mediaNow?
Don't reveal all your secrets,but how do you?
Good enough imitators out there, often imitated, never
duplicated.
Speaker 1 (11:37):
Greatest form of flattery.
Speaker 3 (11:39):
Yeah, that's it 100%.
Speaker 2 (11:41):
How do you really capture someone's imagination
when, let's say, you're filminga video for a new listing that
you've got?
Speaker 3 (11:49):
So look, first and foremost, what I do is I like to
shoot multiple videos for alisting, so we'll have the
traditional video that we uploadon YouTube, which then goes to
realestatecom.
Now I'm still very hands-onwith that project.
I'll be there with the videoeditor.
I'll actually tell him how Iwant the video shot, in terms of
what theme I want.
Do I want it fast-paced?
Do I want it slow?
Do I want it more editorial?
Do I want to focus on certainparts of the house?
(12:11):
I'm very hands-on.
I'll pick the music.
If I don't like the edit, I'llsend it back.
I'll be like no, I need you tochop this, I need you to add
this.
I need you to do that.
It can be a pain in the ass forthe editors and I know they
(12:32):
sometimes don't.
Number one and I've got aresponsibility to my vendor to
showcase their property in itsbest light.
Then we'll do different videos.
I'll do behind the scenesvideos.
So those behind the scenesvideos that I've been doing are
going absolutely bonkers.
On my socials.
The viewership is to the roofBecause people don't just want
to see a normal video of thesame thing bedroom, kitchen,
living, pool, whatever.
They want to see a little bit ofinteraction.
I kind of walk them throughunofficially.
I'll interact with people aswe're filming.
Photographers might be there,stylists might be there, my team
(12:53):
might be there, whatever thecase may be.
It's a lot.
It's condensed.
I always keep it to a minute 30because that way we can sponsor
the videos.
You know there's a little tradesecret.
I might reveal that too much.
I just try to engage indifferent ways to different
audiences, because you don'twant to see the same thing all
the time.
You want to keep it fresh, youwant to keep it engaging and you
want to keep people alwaysguessing and reaching out to me,
(13:13):
and I can't tell you how manytimes people drop into my DMs.
I get phone calls.
I had a phone call from abuilder.
I sold a property for him aboutthree months ago now and he
called me up.
He saw a BTS that I did.
He's like man, yes, that's whatI want, like that's, you know.
Like you know, I'm not here forthe pats on the back, but that
(13:35):
positive feedback you get frompeople, it's just nice man, it's
great, like honestly, it feelsgood.
Speaker 2 (13:42):
I've noticed a little bit of a change in certain
culture where people actually goout of their way to give you a
compliment now if you're reallygood at what you do.
There have been so many hatersin this world and there's so
many people in the comments that, whoever that builder is, give
me his number.
I'm going to call him and tellhim.
I'm going to leave him atestimonial on his page as well,
just because when you go out ofyour way and you do that, you
make someone's day.
You probably make their yearwhen something like that happens
(14:02):
.
Speaker 3 (14:03):
It doesn't take much to be kind.
Yeah, that's the end of the andthat small act of kindness.
You don't know how that canchange someone's world.
Speaker 2 (14:12):
It also triggers something in your brain.
You've probably because you'rein a better mood or you hear
that or something, you'veprobably become more creative.
Speaker 3 (14:19):
100% inspires you to do better.
Yeah, and it's the most naturalform of dopamine you can get.
Yeah, like you know, gettingthat in and like hearing
positive affirmations comingfrom someone that's got no
reason to give it to you anddoesn't want anything from you,
like fuck man, that's a good.
Speaker 1 (14:33):
The fact that he even called you and didn't just
leave a comment.
Honestly, honestly, like yeah,that's it.
Speaker 3 (14:38):
It was great, you know.
So, again, it just inspires meto keep doing what I'm doing,
keep elevating the game.
I always want to be changing.
I never want to be stale.
Yeah, as I said, I'll dosomething and then I'll notice.
I've got lots of agents thatfollow me and I'll notice.
I'll see a video and I'm like,hmm, like I literally like I did
a video very recently.
I'm not going to talk which one, but I saw another agent post
(15:01):
the same video four days later,like 100% exactly the same.
Oh, like shot for shot, shot forshot, and I was like wow.
And I was like, okay, well it,it is what it is like.
You know, these things aregoing to happen.
I don't get all my ideasorganically.
I sometimes see things and thenI'll change them around and try
to make them my own yeah,that's the difference, though.
Speaker 1 (15:16):
Yeah, it's trying to make you see an idea.
You're inspired and you're likeI'll do it a little bit like
that, but you've got to, you'vegot to make it your own me and
my business partner stories andit'd be like epic, but we'll do
that when we're retired one day.
Speaker 2 (15:30):
So call people out.
I always wanted to do.
This was like a marketing ideaI had, but I had.
But what I wanted to do wascreate seasons of it's simple
finance and every three monthswe would reshoot a classic intro
of a sitcom.
So like one day we would bedoing the office and like you
know, like the theme song, andthen like it would have you know
(15:52):
jose song, and then like itwould have you know Joseph, and
then this person, then thisperson, and then I thought, oh,
why don't we go to a fountainand then jump around in a
fountain and do the Friends oneyou know, and then that way,
like it's just engaging theaudience and getting them to
laugh and be like, oh, what doyou guys do?
here, but yeah, that was way tooleft of field and I'm pretty
sure it would cost like $50,000a video.
It costs so much.
We'll scrap that idea.
(16:13):
All of a sudden, JenniferAniston is at the fountain.
Joey, who paid for this?
Speaker 3 (16:18):
Let me know if she shows up.
Yeah, I will.
Speaker 2 (16:20):
I just said.
Speaker 3 (16:20):
But look just to kind of cap it off in terms of the
role of a real estate agentTaking the wedding ring off for
that one.
No, we're doing guys.
Yeah, like it's very, it's allencompassing, that's all I can
say.
It's not what it is and it'sfull on and we work very hard
for what we do.
Yeah, like, believe me, we workvery hard for what we do.
Speaker 1 (16:40):
Do you get like different kinds of?
What kind of clients do youusually get through social media
, like values of the houses,like are these big clients with
like big bank accounts and stuff, or just sort of everyday
people or lower end?
Speaker 3 (16:53):
Man, it's a mixture of everything.
Everything, honestly, it is.
I've got young people in theirearly 20s that reach out to me
looking to either maybe buytheir first investment property
or just want some advice.
Yeah, I get the middle-agednewlyweds.
I get vendors looking to sellor asking me you've sold that
property.
It's very similar to mine.
Can you come out and see myproperty?
(17:13):
I've had people reach out to mefrom Wollongong recently, two
of them from Wollongong becauseI sold one.
We listed a house two weeks ago.
It's now the number one mostviewed house in New South Wales
and the number two in the entirecountry.
Wow, according to realestatecom.
Wow, yeah.
And I had an influx of peoplereaching out saying your
marketing is insane, what you do, how you market.
(17:33):
And again, like that reallymade me feel really good about
myself because it showed like myvendor loved hearing that, like
he loves the fact that hishouse is the number two property
in the entire country.
Like that's a pretty big start,man, you've got over 160,000
listings on realestatecom andwe're two, yeah, you know.
And we've got over 60,000listings on realestatecom and
we're two, yeah, you know.
And we've got over 60,000listings in Sydney, in New South
(17:54):
Wales, and we're one Likethat's pretty kick-ass and
that's going to attract a lotmore vendors.
100%, because they'll now seethe way we market and they'll
see that effort that I put intomy marketing.
And it's not cheap.
Marketing is not cheap.
No, it works 100%.
Speaker 2 (18:07):
So, with the vendors, with attracting these people,
how do you develop thatreputation of trust, how do you
develop the inclination ofpeople wanting to go with you to
either sell or buy a propertyfrom?
Speaker 3 (18:21):
Yeah, great question, because I get asked that a lot
about how you generate leads orwhatever the case may be.
I find the most authentic andgenuine way is obviously
referrals.
Because if you're looking tosell, joe, and you're speaking
to someone that you trust reallywell, a family member, a good
friend you're like, oh, I'mthinking of selling, and they
say to you, hey, man, reach outto Karim for Mayfair.
I work with him, mate.
(18:42):
What an experience Genuine,down the line, whatever,
whatever there's like, you'renot it's not me telling you that
, it's someone else that youtrust telling you that.
So automatically there's alevel of trust there and I get
so many phone calls like that.
Obviously, results are a bigthing.
You break a record in the area.
People are going to see it,they're going to call you up and
say, wow, I've got somethingsimilar to that.
(19:02):
And that's how we've kind ofdoubled up and tripled up on all
these results that we'regetting, because we've broken
records in Kingsgrove, inRoselands, in Belmore, in
Belfield, and they just compileon top of each other.
So I would say referrals isprobably the biggest thing in
our business in terms of it'sorganic, it's natural, it comes
to you.
Obviously you've got your oldschool ways of prospecting.
(19:24):
Your door knocks, your letterdrops all that old school stuff,
phone calls.
You wouldn't shy away from itbecause that's always going to
be true and tested.
Speaker 2 (19:32):
I had a letterbox dropped the other day.
Somebody was like I've got abuyer for your house right now.
I just kind of saw it.
I can't even remember who putit in there, I can't remember
who signed off, but I know for afact if it was one of the
trusted agents in the area, Imight have picked up the phone
and I might have been like, hey,what's it worth?
Yeah, okay, what do they wantto buy?
(19:53):
Because I'm thinking to myself,like my wife and I were
thinking about selling.
We've been thinking aboutselling or, you know, doing
something because we don't wantto live in our area for the rest
of our lives Property, realestate.
(20:15):
There's a chance I would havepicked up the phone, and that's
just a very big thing.
You need to be able to hold,maintain and grow your
reputation.
It's like I always say how youdo anything is how you do
everything.
100%.
Speaker 3 (20:28):
How many times would you go into a house and see a
calendar magnet on a fridge fora real estate agency?
Right, and I sometimes stillsee them.
But what are 90% of peopledoing at 7.30 at night on a
weekday?
They're on TikTok.
They're doing this, they'rescrolling man, yeah, that, or
Tinder, one of the two they'rescrolling.
So the more times you can be infront of their face, the more
(20:51):
times they're going to see me.
They're going to see my name,my brand.
They're going to start thinkingKareem, mayfair, kareem,
mayfair, kareem.
It's just going to correlatewith that might go in the mail.
You get one of those things,you tear them up, it goes in the
mail, Sorry bin, so you get inthe records.
Speaker 2 (21:08):
You've built such a trusted brand.
Have you started thinking toyourself I need to look into a
new market?
You mentioned Wollongong twomoments ago, or is that
something that's still in theback burner?
So?
Speaker 3 (21:18):
we're very blessed.
We've got a really goodbusiness.
We've got a really big officein a really thriving community
and it's a great business thatwe've built.
We built from nothing, westarted.
So I'm not sure most peopleknow, but real estate businesses
are valued from your rent roll,not from your sales.
That's just the way it's valuedin terms of a financial
(21:39):
perspective.
So we started with zeroproperties when we started the
business in our rent roll.
I'm not going to tell you howmany we have now, but it's
fairly significant and you know,off the back of her hard work,
she runs the rental department.
So I've got to give her all thekudos.
She runs that side and I runthe sales side.
We obviously cross between eachother and you know I bring in
clients, she brings in clientsfor sales, I bring in.
Whatever the case may be, butsometimes it's good to have
(22:03):
something one really good thing,rather than than two or three
okay things.
Yeah, you know, and I thinkthat's where my mind's taken me
Both of us we're like reallyhappy with having one really
really good business.
Yeah, and thank God we havethat rather than maybe like, do
you expand and you lose a littlefrom here, you don't you know?
Keep your eye on that.
Yeah, got a good thing going,we've got a good thing going,
you know.
No-transcript.
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