March 4, 2025 • 19 mins
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
Welcome to the Fiscal Physical Podcast.
Join us each week as we sitdown with the founder of Alchemy
Wealth Management and author ofyour Fiscal Physical, Ryan
Nelson.
Tune in to gain valuableinsights and practical tips as
we simplify complex financialconcepts into digestible lessons
(00:22):
.
From budgeting to retirementplanning, this podcast is your
go-to resource for masteringfinancial literacy.
Aaron Hoisington (00:33):
Welcome everybody to this week's episode
of the Fiscal Physical Podcast.
My name is Aaron.
I'm joined by Ryan, the sage,wise financial connoisseur, guru
whatever you want to call himfounder of Alchemy Wealth
Management.
How are you today, ryan?
I'm doing well.
How are you doing?
I'm doing well.
How'd you like those titles?
I like sage, Sage yeah, that'sa good word.
(00:54):
You throw out sage.
You're like cool.
Ryan Nelson (00:57):
I don't even know exactly what it means, but I
like it.
Aaron Hoisington (00:59):
I don't know, but people burn it too.
So it's like a plant, and Iguess it's an adjective if you
want to say too.
So anyway, we're going to talktoday about something that is
pretty prevalent, I would say,in the United States.
Specifically, we're going totalk about student loans today.
So if you guys have studentloans, you're listening to this
(01:23):
podcast, maybe you're thinkingabout going back to school,
going to school for the firsttime.
Potentially this could beinsightful for you, just to kind
of gain some literacy or someknowledge based on student loans
overall.
But, Ryan, I'll go ahead andkind of turn it over to you to
think just how you want toapproach this.
Talk about how they might, whatthey are, two different types
and all that good stuff here.
Ryan Nelson (01:41):
So real quick.
The definition of sage is aprofoundly wise man, especially
one who features in ancienthistory or legend.
Aaron Hoisington (01:50):
Oh, I was 50-50 on that.
I like it.
I like it, that's pretty good.
Ryan Nelson (01:55):
Yeah, student loans so yeah, they're super
prevalent, right.
Whenever we talk about debtwith clients, I always say
there's five main types of loansthere's mortgages, there's car
payments, there's credit carddebt, there's medical debt and
that fifth one is student loans.
So they're very, very prevalent.
Lots of people have studentloans, Some of them seemingly
(02:15):
crippling amounts, right.
And some not too big of a dealand so, yeah, I think there's
certainly some actions to taketo make sure that you can maybe
still have your student loans,or maybe not have any student
loans, and plan for anappropriate retirement.
So a couple of things I wouldsay is to plan ahead.
So if you're the parents of achild that you want to encourage
(02:37):
to go to school, start thinkingabout it ahead of time.
Is there an opportunity tostart saving for your kid's
education, either in a brokerageaccount or a 529 account, or do
prepaid tuition or somethinglike that?
And planning ahead can really.
You know one of the I use anexample in the book.
It's about two differentindividuals one planned ahead
(02:59):
for retirement or for educationcosts and one financed the
education costs.
And, if you think about it, theperson who's planning ahead so
let's say they start saving forthis example, they start saving
five years before the kid goesto college.
Well, they get to takeadvantage of interest, so they
collect interest over those fiveyears, right?
So they again take advantage ofinterest.
(03:19):
They are the beneficiary ofinterest over those five years.
If, instead, you take the loanand you pay it off over the next
five years, you're now payinginterest into the bank?
Right, it's detrimental.
So in either case, interest iscoming into play.
One, you're benefiting from itand it's growing the amount you
have to spend on something.
One, it's a detriment andyou're having to pay more for
(03:41):
the same thing.
Right, and that can be a bigdeal, I know.
For the example I used in thebook, the cost ended up being
effectively double right.
So, buying something ahead oftime, or the example I used in
the book, it might've beenbuying a car, I can't remember
now off the top of my head, buteither way, the theory is the
same.
And saving for this big, largepurchase five, 10, 15 years in
(04:03):
advance and then buying it andtaking advantage of the compound
, means that you might've put,you know, half as much capital
towards it as if you make thepurchase and then pay, you know,
with the negative effects ofinterest moving forward.
So just planning ahead is avery useful tool.
Aaron Hoisington (04:18):
Yeah, well, I think that Bruce applies to a
lot of honestly in life ingeneral planning ahead, ahead
and especially when it comes tofinancial stuff in the, you know
, retirement overall.
You think, if you and whenyou're making a big purchase
like this or potentially goingto be taking out a big loan or
doing something that's reallyexpensive, if you can plan for
it, because there's going to bethings that come up and you have
(04:39):
to adjust and such too but ifyou have a good plan at least of
how you're going to attack it,versus kind of just doing it,
you're much more likely to beable to.
You know, be able to it doesn'tcripple your life if you will.
Ryan Nelson (04:50):
Yep, the other thing I would say is, yeah, what
if?
Like, this is sort of thinkingahead as well.
But you know and this is hardright For like an 18-year-old
kid who's going into college, Imean, it's hard to know what you
want to do, right?
I know I didn't, and I've now.
You know, I got my undergrad inmechanical engineering.
I'm not practicing engineering.
I didn't know exactly what Iwanted to do at that stage in my
(05:11):
life, and so this is hard right.
But the cost of schools variesdrastically, very drastically.
We're talking being able tograduate, you know, with, say,
say, say that some of thecheapest schools are, you know,
15 grand.
Some of the most expensiveschools are, like 400 grand,
right?
Um, that's a really, reallyreally big difference.
(05:34):
Um, and even if we justcompared, say, 40 grand to 400
grand, is the $400,000 school?
It's 10 times the cost.
Is it 10 times the education?
Like, is your earning potential10 times higher?
Is it 10 times more fun?
Is it 10?
Like, what are you trying tosolve from this experience?
Are you trying to like, youknow, mature?
Are you trying to have fun?
Are you trying to increaseearning potential?
(05:55):
You know, what are you tryingto solve?
And is the cost of that schoolactually worth it?
Right, um and again, this ishard for an 18 year old, but
obviously, hopefully theirparents would be able to help
walk them through this.
And another thing would be, youknow, do you?
do you need to go straight tothe private?
You know university, or couldyou benefit from a community,
either graduating completelyfrom a community college or
(06:17):
starting and doing two years ata community college if you don't
know what you want to do, right, um?
Or a tech tech, uh, technical,a tech school or a trade school,
or even just your local stateschool compared to a private
school, right?
And so, again, those costs varyvery drastically and I would be
(06:38):
very hard pressed to say thatan education that costs 10 times
as much is going to leave youwith 10 times as much earning
potential.
I think most of us realize thatafter you kind of get that first
job and second job and thirdjob, like your experience and
stuff is much more meaningfulthan um, you know what the
diploma says from your educationa decade or two decades ago?
(06:58):
Absolutely, and most people aregoing to reach their peak
earning years in their fiftiesands, and so you think, when
somebody's hiring a 60-year-oldfor a new role, do they care so
much about where they went toschool 45 years ago, or do they
care more about what their lastrole was and what their most
recent expertise is.
(07:18):
So that'd be something to thinkabout.
And one of the examples I liketo use is so I think an example
a lot of people can relate to isbuying a car.
(07:39):
Whether or not they do this ornot, everybody sort of knows in
the back of their head.
Buying a new car is to get youfrom your house to work, from
you know work, to the grocerystore, from the grocery store to
the gym and back to the house.
Right, and the used car can getyou paying a 10X premium just
to have a flashy name.
Are you accomplishing the samething as maybe your local state
(08:11):
university or a communitycollege and you're paying 10
times the cost or more just tohave that flashy name on your
diploma?
And then again, is that worthit?
And I guess it depends on whatyou're trying to solve for.
But I do think too many peoplejust sort of blindly both push
their kids and the kids thentherefore just kind of blindly
follow and just end up incollege with, no, there was no
(08:32):
real true meaning or thoughts orplanning around it.
It's just like you just happenedto land in college.
You're just kind of goingthrough the motions and then you
graduate Kids don't even knowwhat $400,000 of loan means.
And then they graduate, theyget a job, maybe even a good job
, paying them $100,000 a year,but still that's a burden.
That's an entire mortgage,right, basically, that they have
(08:54):
to still pay back.
And then if they want to buy ahouse now they have two
mortgages.
So I think, yeah, just puttingsome like intentional thought
around what you're trying toachieve and the costs associated
with these differentuniversities probably is,
honestly, like the mostmeaningful.
And again, depending on whatyou're trying to accomplish and
what degree you're doing, maybethe university that's 10 times
(09:16):
as expensive does make sense foryou.
But as long as you put thatintentional thought in ahead of
time, I think it could make moresense there.
Aaron Hoisington (09:24):
Oh, no doubt, man, intentional thought in
ahead of time.
I think it could make moresense there.
Oh, no doubt, man.
And I think that you hit righton the idea of, like, at 18
years old, what do you want todo, and can you do that
somewhere that's maybe cheaperthan maybe, an Ivy League school
.
Now, if you get into an IvyLeague school, maybe you have
some financial help behind you.
Whatever it is, I think thatthere's opportunity, and there's
(09:44):
only a small handful of peoplewho can say they went to
Stanford, yeah, yeah, likethat's great.
But you know, like you said,like 15 years later, no one
cares that I went to theUniversity of Idaho versus Penn,
it's like all right, cool, butmaybe you build those
connections, something like that.
There's always pros and conswith everything too, but I think
you put it incrediblyeloquently of like what do you
(10:07):
want to do at 18?
Sure, I don't think a lot ofpeople at 18 are still doing
what they are doing 17 yearslater even for example.
Ryan Nelson (10:16):
Another interesting thought experiment would be
like, if you go think about allthe professionals in your life
that you work with, how many ofthem like you know just a
professional it's not that yourpersonal friends or anything but
like the professionals you knowyour doctor, whatever, your
attorney how many of them do youactually know what school they
even went to?
Aaron Hoisington (10:34):
Very few.
Ryan Nelson (10:39):
So it's clearly not .
It's clearly not meaningful inyour evaluation on whether or
not to hire that person.
So then, yeah, so it's justsomething to think about.
The other thing I would say isworking through school, or
extending your school, maybe nottaking the traditional
four-year path and spending sixyears to graduate school and
working full-time throughout theprocess, or whatever.
Obviously, that can help avoidstudent loans.
(11:00):
Again, whether or not that'sthe experience you want for
yourself or your children,that's another question.
But again, if simply ourquestion is how to reduce
student loans, that wouldcertainly be a tool.
And then if we are going to getstudent loans, there's both
federal student loans andprivate student loans, and it
would be worth evaluating thedifferences between the two.
There's certainly some pros andcons, and you might have heard
some things in the news over thelast few years about, maybe
(11:24):
loans getting forgiven or peoplenot having to pay on their
loans.
That's primarily federalstudent loans.
If you borrowed money from meto go to school, I'm going to
expect to be paid back.
Aaron Hoisington (11:36):
Yeah, come hell or high water, ryan's
getting paid back.
Ryan Nelson (11:40):
But so there's definitely some difference
between private and federalstudent loans and you might want
to again just do some duediligence, looking into all the
different pros and cons of thedifferent types of loans as well
.
Aaron Hoisington (11:50):
Yeah, definitely.
And I think it's a good pieceto know what the difference
between those federal and theprivate ones are, because I know
if you've ever filed I thinkit's FAFSA, the Free Application
for Federal Student Aid.
It gives you the federaloptions and also says, hey, you
can explore private loans aswell too.
(12:11):
And and I, one of my friends,uh, actually, you know Bobby,
his name is Bobby, yeah, he, uh,he's from Maine originally and
he did a.
He did a like a five and a halfyear program with uh, with
school.
Um, didn't really work full timeeither, he just pretty much
went to school and uh, he Iremember him telling me about,
just like the, you know, hisfirst semester coming out of
college or high school.
(12:32):
He had some scholarships andstuff.
He really didn't have to pay,had some savings, didn't have to
pay very much.
Then he got to the end of hisfirst semester.
He's like wait, how do I payfor the second one?
And I think it's just thatknowledge or lack of knowledge.
And before you know it, he didfive and a half years at this
university and he ended up with$100,000 in student loans for a
political science and a minor inSpanish.
And you're like for a politicalscience and a minor in Spanish,
(12:53):
sure, and you're like, oh my God, like that is on paper.
That's just incredibly, makes mesweat thinking about that about
like having to pay these thingsback, but just and he has some
private ones, some federal onesand such too but just knowing
the difference between the twoand knowing what works best for
you and how you're gonna paythese things back, like it's
(13:16):
something you might not thinkabout it, you know, 20 years old
, but when it comes time, it'slike you know those things are
going to be due.
Yeah, absolutely Awesome.
That's great.
Anything else you want to touchon here?
Ryan, do you feel like wecovered it pretty well?
Ryan Nelson (13:29):
No, I think it sounds good to me Okay.
Aaron Hoisington (13:31):
Awesome.
Well, I'll just leave you guyswith this.
We've said it a couple timesJust make sure you do your due
diligence.
There's a lot of resources outthere right now that you can
take advantage of that maybeweren't around 15, 17 years ago.
Make sure, if you're going todo these things, it might be
right for you.
We're not going to say one wayor the other, but just make sure
you're aware of what you'regetting into for sure, and make
sure it jives with what you'relooking to do in your future,
(13:53):
for sure.
So awesome.
Well, everybody, hang tight,we'll be right back.
Speaker 1 (14:02):
And now to put the personal in personal finance.
Aaron Hoisington (14:09):
Welcome back to this side of the physical
physical podcast.
I am still here with Ryan and,ryan, I got another question for
you here.
I'm going to pose it to ourlisteners too, to kind of think
about this but what's a qualityin others that you really admire
but maybe might find hard tocultivate in yourself?
Ryan Nelson (14:23):
Yeah, I think humility is often, you know, I
think like somebody who's likehumbly confident, you know, and
you know if you're having like aconversation, you know if
you're in a group or somethingand you're having a conversation
and you know, maybe you know ifyou're having like a
conversation, you know if you'rein a group or something and
you're having a conversation andyou know, maybe you know
they're like a subject matterexpert on something or something
and somebody else just somesomething wrong, and it's like
(14:45):
they're just confident enoughand humble enough just to say,
no worries, like I don't need tocorrect that person, you know.
I mean there's, you know, attimes they can correct them if
it's something important thatneeds correcting, but also, at
the same time, it's just fine,confident enough in themselves
that they can just let it go anddon't need to prove anything to
anybody.
And sure, I think that's a acool uh quality, that lots not
(15:07):
maybe not lots, but that somepeople have Some people.
Aaron Hoisington (15:10):
That's an excellent.
When you, when you saidhumility, I was like because in
my mind, like at least in maybeI have a jaded point of view,
but I find you pretty humble,like just in general.
Like about like, if you asklike, oh, how's it going, or
whatever, like I feel like a lotof times you like to ask
questions to other people, likeyou like like turn it back, no,
I'm doing well, how are you?
Like it kind of gets back tothe other person pretty quickly.
It kind of gets back to theother person pretty quickly and
(15:34):
maybe with like successes orfailures or whatever, it's like
being able to like talk aboutthose things equally, I feel
like is like a big piece of likewhat I respect, about people
too, and so.
But I would say like just thatI don't know the definition of
humility, but I think the wayyou put it of like I have that
exact same thing.
If somebody says something,that's just I'm like ah no, I
(15:57):
know that's not right.
Speaker 1 (15:57):
It's very hard.
I kind of start twitching.
Aaron Hoisington (15:59):
But at the same as I've gotten older and
maybe gotten more patience orwhatever, I'm just like, ah, is
this really important for me toput in here?
And like I don't know, like letthis, but when it gets to be
egregious I'm like, all right, Igot to leave, but it's an
(16:19):
interesting one that you putthere and um, I'm gonna go a
different direction with thistoo.
I find like people who areartistically creative sure are
incredibly like intriguing to me.
Yeah, I think it's so awesomepeople who can just like sit
down and draw a picture ofsomething and have it be like
legible or whatever, like I canbarely write my own name, like
(16:40):
my handwriting is so terrible,and I mean somebody was like,
hey, do you draw a picture of awatermelon?
I'm like I don't know, Icouldn't do that.
Ryan Nelson (16:50):
Right, yeah, or somebody with like perfect pitch
or something.
It's incredible.
Yeah, you know, I've seen somevideos of people who, yeah, like
I mean they can match a pitchperfectly and then you know they
can think about how like a songwould sound in a different
pitch without even having tohear it.
They just have that abilitywhich you know.
I don't know if it's a learnedability, an innate ability, but
either way, I haven't eitherlearned it or didn't get it.
Aaron Hoisington (17:12):
It's not innate and I haven't learned it.
Ryan Nelson (17:15):
But yeah, definitely, I think a lot of
that stuff is really cool.
Aaron Hoisington (17:18):
Yeah, I think the creativity piece of it,
especially artistically andwhatever you want to call what
an artistic thing is.
But it's something that I don'thave, but I think it's really
cool when people do, I'm likethat's awesome.
You guys don't know how coolthat is because that's something
I practice penmanship but Inever really got any better.
Sure, awesome.
(17:39):
Well, thanks, ryan, as always.
Appreciate it, appreciate allthe listeners out there.
We'll be back next week.
These podcasts drop everyTuesday morning, so set your
calendar to that and weappreciate the listeners and
Ryan, go ahead and play us outhere as always stay the
listeners and Ryan go ahead andplay us out here, as always.
Ryan Nelson (17:56):
Stay the course.
Speaker 1 (17:57):
Thank you for joining us for the Fiscal Physical
Podcast.
Until next time, happylistening and, as always, stay
the course.
If you have a question or topicsuggestions, please email us at
podcast at alchemywealthcom.
If you enjoyed today'sdiscussion, subscribe to the
podcast to ensure you never missan episode and consider leaving
(18:20):
us a rating and review on yourfavorite platform.
This helps other listeners likeyou find the show.
For more resources, you canvisit Alchemy Wealth
Management's website atwwwalchemywealthcom or find your
fiscal physical the book onAmazon.
We'd be remiss if we didn'tmention that personal finance is
just that personal.
(18:40):
Please don't take anything wesay as advice.
The preceding content is forinformational and entertainment
purposes only.
It's not an offer or asolicitation, nor should it be
construed or relied upon for tax, legal or investment advice.
It doesn't consider yourpersonal financial situation or
objectives and may not besuitable for you.
Welcome to the Fiscal Physical Podcast.
Join us each week as we sitdown with the founder of Alchemy
Wealth Management and author ofyour Fiscal Physical, Ryan
Nelson.
Tune in to gain valuableinsights and practical tips as
we simplify complex financialconcepts into digestible lessons
(00:22):
.
From budgeting to retirementplanning, this podcast is your
go-to resource for masteringfinancial literacy.
Aaron Hoisington (00:33):
Welcome everybody to this week's episode
of the Fiscal Physical Podcast.
My name is Aaron.
I'm joined by Ryan, the sage,wise financial connoisseur, guru
whatever you want to call himfounder of Alchemy Wealth
Management.
How are you today, ryan?
I'm doing well.
How are you doing?
I'm doing well.
How'd you like those titles?
I like sage, Sage yeah, that'sa good word.
(00:54):
You throw out sage.
You're like cool.
Ryan Nelson (00:57):
I don't even know exactly what it means, but I
like it.
Aaron Hoisington (00:59):
I don't know, but people burn it too.
So it's like a plant, and Iguess it's an adjective if you
want to say too.
So anyway, we're going to talktoday about something that is
pretty prevalent, I would say,in the United States.
Specifically, we're going totalk about student loans today.
So if you guys have studentloans, you're listening to this
(01:23):
podcast, maybe you're thinkingabout going back to school,
going to school for the firsttime.
Potentially this could beinsightful for you, just to kind
of gain some literacy or someknowledge based on student loans
overall.
But, Ryan, I'll go ahead andkind of turn it over to you to
think just how you want toapproach this.
Talk about how they might, whatthey are, two different types
and all that good stuff here.
Ryan Nelson (01:41):
So real quick.
The definition of sage is aprofoundly wise man, especially
one who features in ancienthistory or legend.
Aaron Hoisington (01:50):
Oh, I was 50-50 on that.
I like it.
I like it, that's pretty good.
Ryan Nelson (01:55):
Yeah, student loans so yeah, they're super
prevalent, right.
Whenever we talk about debtwith clients, I always say
there's five main types of loansthere's mortgages, there's car
payments, there's credit carddebt, there's medical debt and
that fifth one is student loans.
So they're very, very prevalent.
Lots of people have studentloans, Some of them seemingly
(02:15):
crippling amounts, right.
And some not too big of a dealand so, yeah, I think there's
certainly some actions to taketo make sure that you can maybe
still have your student loans,or maybe not have any student
loans, and plan for anappropriate retirement.
So a couple of things I wouldsay is to plan ahead.
So if you're the parents of achild that you want to encourage
(02:37):
to go to school, start thinkingabout it ahead of time.
Is there an opportunity tostart saving for your kid's
education, either in a brokerageaccount or a 529 account, or do
prepaid tuition or somethinglike that?
And planning ahead can really.
You know one of the I use anexample in the book.
It's about two differentindividuals one planned ahead
(02:59):
for retirement or for educationcosts and one financed the
education costs.
And, if you think about it, theperson who's planning ahead so
let's say they start saving forthis example, they start saving
five years before the kid goesto college.
Well, they get to takeadvantage of interest, so they
collect interest over those fiveyears, right?
So they again take advantage ofinterest.
(03:19):
They are the beneficiary ofinterest over those five years.
If, instead, you take the loanand you pay it off over the next
five years, you're now payinginterest into the bank?
Right, it's detrimental.
So in either case, interest iscoming into play.
One, you're benefiting from itand it's growing the amount you
have to spend on something.
One, it's a detriment andyou're having to pay more for
(03:41):
the same thing.
Right, and that can be a bigdeal, I know.
For the example I used in thebook, the cost ended up being
effectively double right.
So, buying something ahead oftime, or the example I used in
the book, it might've beenbuying a car, I can't remember
now off the top of my head, buteither way, the theory is the
same.
And saving for this big, largepurchase five, 10, 15 years in
(04:03):
advance and then buying it andtaking advantage of the compound
, means that you might've put,you know, half as much capital
towards it as if you make thepurchase and then pay, you know,
with the negative effects ofinterest moving forward.
So just planning ahead is avery useful tool.
Aaron Hoisington (04:18):
Yeah, well, I think that Bruce applies to a
lot of honestly in life ingeneral planning ahead, ahead
and especially when it comes tofinancial stuff in the, you know
, retirement overall.
You think, if you and whenyou're making a big purchase
like this or potentially goingto be taking out a big loan or
doing something that's reallyexpensive, if you can plan for
it, because there's going to bethings that come up and you have
(04:39):
to adjust and such too but ifyou have a good plan at least of
how you're going to attack it,versus kind of just doing it,
you're much more likely to beable to.
You know, be able to it doesn'tcripple your life if you will.
Ryan Nelson (04:50):
Yep, the other thing I would say is, yeah, what
if?
Like, this is sort of thinkingahead as well.
But you know and this is hardright For like an 18-year-old
kid who's going into college, Imean, it's hard to know what you
want to do, right?
I know I didn't, and I've now.
You know, I got my undergrad inmechanical engineering.
I'm not practicing engineering.
I didn't know exactly what Iwanted to do at that stage in my
(05:11):
life, and so this is hard right.
But the cost of schools variesdrastically, very drastically.
We're talking being able tograduate, you know, with, say,
say, say that some of thecheapest schools are, you know,
15 grand.
Some of the most expensiveschools are, like 400 grand,
right?
Um, that's a really, reallyreally big difference.
(05:34):
Um, and even if we justcompared, say, 40 grand to 400
grand, is the $400,000 school?
It's 10 times the cost.
Is it 10 times the education?
Like, is your earning potential10 times higher?
Is it 10 times more fun?
Is it 10?
Like, what are you trying tosolve from this experience?
Are you trying to like, youknow, mature?
Are you trying to have fun?
Are you trying to increaseearning potential?
(05:55):
You know, what are you tryingto solve?
And is the cost of that schoolactually worth it?
Right, um and again, this ishard for an 18 year old, but
obviously, hopefully theirparents would be able to help
walk them through this.
And another thing would be, youknow, do you?
do you need to go straight tothe private?
You know university, or couldyou benefit from a community,
either graduating completelyfrom a community college or
(06:17):
starting and doing two years ata community college if you don't
know what you want to do, right, um?
Or a tech tech, uh, technical,a tech school or a trade school,
or even just your local stateschool compared to a private
school, right?
And so, again, those costs varyvery drastically and I would be
(06:38):
very hard pressed to say thatan education that costs 10 times
as much is going to leave youwith 10 times as much earning
potential.
I think most of us realize thatafter you kind of get that first
job and second job and thirdjob, like your experience and
stuff is much more meaningfulthan um, you know what the
diploma says from your educationa decade or two decades ago?
(06:58):
Absolutely, and most people aregoing to reach their peak
earning years in their fiftiesands, and so you think, when
somebody's hiring a 60-year-oldfor a new role, do they care so
much about where they went toschool 45 years ago, or do they
care more about what their lastrole was and what their most
recent expertise is.
(07:18):
So that'd be something to thinkabout.
And one of the examples I liketo use is so I think an example
a lot of people can relate to isbuying a car.
(07:39):
Whether or not they do this ornot, everybody sort of knows in
the back of their head.
Buying a new car is to get youfrom your house to work, from
you know work, to the grocerystore, from the grocery store to
the gym and back to the house.
Right, and the used car can getyou paying a 10X premium just
to have a flashy name.
Are you accomplishing the samething as maybe your local state
(08:11):
university or a communitycollege and you're paying 10
times the cost or more just tohave that flashy name on your
diploma?
And then again, is that worthit?
And I guess it depends on whatyou're trying to solve for.
But I do think too many peoplejust sort of blindly both push
their kids and the kids thentherefore just kind of blindly
follow and just end up incollege with, no, there was no
(08:32):
real true meaning or thoughts orplanning around it.
It's just like you just happenedto land in college.
You're just kind of goingthrough the motions and then you
graduate Kids don't even knowwhat $400,000 of loan means.
And then they graduate, theyget a job, maybe even a good job
, paying them $100,000 a year,but still that's a burden.
That's an entire mortgage,right, basically, that they have
(08:54):
to still pay back.
And then if they want to buy ahouse now they have two
mortgages.
So I think, yeah, just puttingsome like intentional thought
around what you're trying toachieve and the costs associated
with these differentuniversities probably is,
honestly, like the mostmeaningful.
And again, depending on whatyou're trying to accomplish and
what degree you're doing, maybethe university that's 10 times
(09:16):
as expensive does make sense foryou.
But as long as you put thatintentional thought in ahead of
time, I think it could make moresense there.
Aaron Hoisington (09:24):
Oh, no doubt, man, intentional thought in
ahead of time.
I think it could make moresense there.
Oh, no doubt, man.
And I think that you hit righton the idea of, like, at 18
years old, what do you want todo, and can you do that
somewhere that's maybe cheaperthan maybe, an Ivy League school
.
Now, if you get into an IvyLeague school, maybe you have
some financial help behind you.
Whatever it is, I think thatthere's opportunity, and there's
(09:44):
only a small handful of peoplewho can say they went to
Stanford, yeah, yeah, likethat's great.
But you know, like you said,like 15 years later, no one
cares that I went to theUniversity of Idaho versus Penn,
it's like all right, cool, butmaybe you build those
connections, something like that.
There's always pros and conswith everything too, but I think
you put it incrediblyeloquently of like what do you
(10:07):
want to do at 18?
Sure, I don't think a lot ofpeople at 18 are still doing
what they are doing 17 yearslater even for example.
Ryan Nelson (10:16):
Another interesting thought experiment would be
like, if you go think about allthe professionals in your life
that you work with, how many ofthem like you know just a
professional it's not that yourpersonal friends or anything but
like the professionals you knowyour doctor, whatever, your
attorney how many of them do youactually know what school they
even went to?
Aaron Hoisington (10:34):
Very few.
Ryan Nelson (10:39):
So it's clearly not .
It's clearly not meaningful inyour evaluation on whether or
not to hire that person.
So then, yeah, so it's justsomething to think about.
The other thing I would say isworking through school, or
extending your school, maybe nottaking the traditional
four-year path and spending sixyears to graduate school and
working full-time throughout theprocess, or whatever.
Obviously, that can help avoidstudent loans.
(11:00):
Again, whether or not that'sthe experience you want for
yourself or your children,that's another question.
But again, if simply ourquestion is how to reduce
student loans, that wouldcertainly be a tool.
And then if we are going to getstudent loans, there's both
federal student loans andprivate student loans, and it
would be worth evaluating thedifferences between the two.
There's certainly some pros andcons, and you might have heard
some things in the news over thelast few years about, maybe
(11:24):
loans getting forgiven or peoplenot having to pay on their
loans.
That's primarily federalstudent loans.
If you borrowed money from meto go to school, I'm going to
expect to be paid back.
Aaron Hoisington (11:36):
Yeah, come hell or high water, ryan's
getting paid back.
Ryan Nelson (11:40):
But so there's definitely some difference
between private and federalstudent loans and you might want
to again just do some duediligence, looking into all the
different pros and cons of thedifferent types of loans as well
.
Aaron Hoisington (11:50):
Yeah, definitely.
And I think it's a good pieceto know what the difference
between those federal and theprivate ones are, because I know
if you've ever filed I thinkit's FAFSA, the Free Application
for Federal Student Aid.
It gives you the federaloptions and also says, hey, you
can explore private loans aswell too.
(12:11):
And and I, one of my friends,uh, actually, you know Bobby,
his name is Bobby, yeah, he, uh,he's from Maine originally and
he did a.
He did a like a five and a halfyear program with uh, with
school.
Um, didn't really work full timeeither, he just pretty much
went to school and uh, he Iremember him telling me about,
just like the, you know, hisfirst semester coming out of
college or high school.
(12:32):
He had some scholarships andstuff.
He really didn't have to pay,had some savings, didn't have to
pay very much.
Then he got to the end of hisfirst semester.
He's like wait, how do I payfor the second one?
And I think it's just thatknowledge or lack of knowledge.
And before you know it, he didfive and a half years at this
university and he ended up with$100,000 in student loans for a
political science and a minor inSpanish.
And you're like for a politicalscience and a minor in Spanish,
(12:53):
sure, and you're like, oh my God, like that is on paper.
That's just incredibly, makes mesweat thinking about that about
like having to pay these thingsback, but just and he has some
private ones, some federal onesand such too but just knowing
the difference between the twoand knowing what works best for
you and how you're gonna paythese things back, like it's
(13:16):
something you might not thinkabout it, you know, 20 years old
, but when it comes time, it'slike you know those things are
going to be due.
Yeah, absolutely Awesome.
That's great.
Anything else you want to touchon here?
Ryan, do you feel like wecovered it pretty well?
Ryan Nelson (13:29):
No, I think it sounds good to me Okay.
Aaron Hoisington (13:31):
Awesome.
Well, I'll just leave you guyswith this.
We've said it a couple timesJust make sure you do your due
diligence.
There's a lot of resources outthere right now that you can
take advantage of that maybeweren't around 15, 17 years ago.
Make sure, if you're going todo these things, it might be
right for you.
We're not going to say one wayor the other, but just make sure
you're aware of what you'regetting into for sure, and make
sure it jives with what you'relooking to do in your future,
(13:53):
for sure.
So awesome.
Well, everybody, hang tight,we'll be right back.
Speaker 1 (14:02):
And now to put the personal in personal finance.
Aaron Hoisington (14:09):
Welcome back to this side of the physical
physical podcast.
I am still here with Ryan and,ryan, I got another question for
you here.
I'm going to pose it to ourlisteners too, to kind of think
about this but what's a qualityin others that you really admire
but maybe might find hard tocultivate in yourself?
Ryan Nelson (14:23):
Yeah, I think humility is often, you know, I
think like somebody who's likehumbly confident, you know, and
you know if you're having like aconversation, you know if
you're in a group or somethingand you're having a conversation
and you know, maybe you know ifyou're having like a
conversation, you know if you'rein a group or something and
you're having a conversation andyou know, maybe you know
they're like a subject matterexpert on something or something
and somebody else just somesomething wrong, and it's like
(14:45):
they're just confident enoughand humble enough just to say,
no worries, like I don't need tocorrect that person, you know.
I mean there's, you know, attimes they can correct them if
it's something important thatneeds correcting, but also, at
the same time, it's just fine,confident enough in themselves
that they can just let it go anddon't need to prove anything to
anybody.
And sure, I think that's a acool uh quality, that lots not
(15:07):
maybe not lots, but that somepeople have Some people.
Aaron Hoisington (15:10):
That's an excellent.
When you, when you saidhumility, I was like because in
my mind, like at least in maybeI have a jaded point of view,
but I find you pretty humble,like just in general.
Like about like, if you asklike, oh, how's it going, or
whatever, like I feel like a lotof times you like to ask
questions to other people, likeyou like like turn it back, no,
I'm doing well, how are you?
Like it kind of gets back tothe other person pretty quickly.
It kind of gets back to theother person pretty quickly and
(15:34):
maybe with like successes orfailures or whatever, it's like
being able to like talk aboutthose things equally, I feel
like is like a big piece of likewhat I respect, about people
too, and so.
But I would say like just thatI don't know the definition of
humility, but I think the wayyou put it of like I have that
exact same thing.
If somebody says something,that's just I'm like ah no, I
(15:57):
know that's not right.
Speaker 1 (15:57):
It's very hard.
I kind of start twitching.
Aaron Hoisington (15:59):
But at the same as I've gotten older and
maybe gotten more patience orwhatever, I'm just like, ah, is
this really important for me toput in here?
And like I don't know, like letthis, but when it gets to be
egregious I'm like, all right, Igot to leave, but it's an
(16:19):
interesting one that you putthere and um, I'm gonna go a
different direction with thistoo.
I find like people who areartistically creative sure are
incredibly like intriguing to me.
Yeah, I think it's so awesomepeople who can just like sit
down and draw a picture ofsomething and have it be like
legible or whatever, like I canbarely write my own name, like
(16:40):
my handwriting is so terrible,and I mean somebody was like,
hey, do you draw a picture of awatermelon?
I'm like I don't know, Icouldn't do that.
Ryan Nelson (16:50):
Right, yeah, or somebody with like perfect pitch
or something.
It's incredible.
Yeah, you know, I've seen somevideos of people who, yeah, like
I mean they can match a pitchperfectly and then you know they
can think about how like a songwould sound in a different
pitch without even having tohear it.
They just have that abilitywhich you know.
I don't know if it's a learnedability, an innate ability, but
either way, I haven't eitherlearned it or didn't get it.
Aaron Hoisington (17:12):
It's not innate and I haven't learned it.
Ryan Nelson (17:15):
But yeah, definitely, I think a lot of
that stuff is really cool.
Aaron Hoisington (17:18):
Yeah, I think the creativity piece of it,
especially artistically andwhatever you want to call what
an artistic thing is.
But it's something that I don'thave, but I think it's really
cool when people do, I'm likethat's awesome.
You guys don't know how coolthat is because that's something
I practice penmanship but Inever really got any better.
Sure, awesome.
(17:39):
Well, thanks, ryan, as always.
Appreciate it, appreciate allthe listeners out there.
We'll be back next week.
These podcasts drop everyTuesday morning, so set your
calendar to that and weappreciate the listeners and
Ryan, go ahead and play us outhere as always stay the
listeners and Ryan go ahead andplay us out here, as always.
Ryan Nelson (17:56):
Stay the course.
Speaker 1 (17:57):
Thank you for joining us for the Fiscal Physical
Podcast.
Until next time, happylistening and, as always, stay
the course.
If you have a question or topicsuggestions, please email us at
podcast at alchemywealthcom.
If you enjoyed today'sdiscussion, subscribe to the
podcast to ensure you never missan episode and consider leaving
(18:20):
us a rating and review on yourfavorite platform.
This helps other listeners likeyou find the show.
For more resources, you canvisit Alchemy Wealth
Management's website atwwwalchemywealthcom or find your
fiscal physical the book onAmazon.
We'd be remiss if we didn'tmention that personal finance is
just that personal.
(18:40):
Please don't take anything wesay as advice.
The preceding content is forinformational and entertainment
purposes only.
It's not an offer or asolicitation, nor should it be
construed or relied upon for tax, legal or investment advice.
It doesn't consider yourpersonal financial situation or
objectives and may not besuitable for you.
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