November 25, 2024 • 47 mins
Dr. Justin Moody, a leading figure in implant dentistry, joins us to share his journey and the impact of his visionary educational platform, Pathway. From my own beginnings with an Implant Pathway scholarship in 2018 to the vibrant evolution of dental training, we explore the myriad opportunities Pathway presents. Dr. Moody's passion for inspiring new dentists and his personal pursuits, such as acquiring a Napa property, highlight the importance of passion projects beyond a professional career.
The triangular challenges of dentistry—art, business, and patient relationships—are central to our discussion, as we explore how dentists can transform their roles from problem-solvers to healers. Specialization in areas like full arch dentistry allows practitioners to focus on solutions, creating a more rewarding practice for both dentists and their patients. By honing listening skills and understanding patient needs, we emphasize building stronger, more fulfilling patient relationships, turning them into enthusiastic advocates.
Through personal stories of overcoming limitations and seizing bold career moves, we delve into the essence of persistence and innovation in the dental field. My journey from a Nebraska farm to implant dentistry illustrates the power of passion and growth when pursuing one's true calling. Additionally, we recount the expansion of a surgical practice amid the COVID-19 pandemic, showcasing the resilience and dedication of our Pathway community. Join us for an inspiring conversation that promises to leave you feeling motivated and ready to embrace new possibilities in your professional journey.
The triangular challenges of dentistry—art, business, and patient relationships—are central to our discussion, as we explore how dentists can transform their roles from problem-solvers to healers. Specialization in areas like full arch dentistry allows practitioners to focus on solutions, creating a more rewarding practice for both dentists and their patients. By honing listening skills and understanding patient needs, we emphasize building stronger, more fulfilling patient relationships, turning them into enthusiastic advocates.
Through personal stories of overcoming limitations and seizing bold career moves, we delve into the essence of persistence and innovation in the dental field. My journey from a Nebraska farm to implant dentistry illustrates the power of passion and growth when pursuing one's true calling. Additionally, we recount the expansion of a surgical practice amid the COVID-19 pandemic, showcasing the resilience and dedication of our Pathway community. Join us for an inspiring conversation that promises to leave you feeling motivated and ready to embrace new possibilities in your professional journey.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
My name is Dr Tyler Tolbert and I'm Dr Soren Poppy,
and you're listening to the FixPodcast, your source for all
things implant dentistry.
Hello and welcome back to theFix Podcast.
We have a celebrity on with ustoday, dr Justin Moody.
I wanted to welcome him to theshow.
Justin, thank you so much forcoming on today.
This is a huge full circlemoment for me.
(00:23):
You actually kind of startedoff my whole implant journey.
You maybe probably don't evenremember, of course, but this
was back in, must have been.
I think this was probably thesummer of 2018.
I got a scholarship of sorts togo through Implant Pathway, so
I was a D2 and did the onlinepart and part one that came out
(00:45):
for parts two and three inSeattle.
I'm now in the PNW again whichis an amazing thing and now
you're on my implant podcast andit's just been really
incredible to see all that comefull circle.
You really, you know, gave methe implant bug and I was never
able to look past it.
So, you know, here we are and Ican't thank you enough for
coming on.
Speaker 3 (01:07):
Oh, of course, I've always enjoyed everybody that
comes through the, you know,through the place and uh,
there's, you know to be, to behonest, you know, there's uh not
that many that take thatjourney.
You know, like starting in uh,uh dental school and yeah, you
know, we don't know what, wedon't know right, and I mean I
just remember dental school is alittle different today than it
(01:27):
was.
Well, hell, it was different in18 than it is today.
You know, in the 90s, when Iwas in dental school, like God,
I don't know if there was enoughpizza and beer to get me to
attend some kind of functionthat had to do with learning
outside of dental school.
So, you know, hats off to youand anyone that does that.
Speaker 1 (01:50):
Sure, sure, no, I appreciate it.
So, for anyone who doesn't know, I guess you've been living
under a rock if you don't.
So Dr Justin Moody, among hismany accomplishments, is
infamous for starting theImplant Pathway, which is now
known as pathway.
Is it, is it?
Just everyone knows what it is.
So this is really the premierimplant education continuum that
(02:11):
has sprawled out.
It started off with just, youknow, getting doctors into
placing implants, I guess justwith your simple, abundant bone.
You know, single implant.
And now, you know, dr Moodyjust sat down with us and was
like, yeah, we had all kinds ofstuff going on.
We got remote Anchorage with DrDan Holtzclaw he's been on the
show before.
Um, we had, uh, you guys got aCEREC course going on.
(02:32):
You've got a fast track goingon all at the same time.
And just, I can't wait to kindof get into the full story of it
.
And you know where it's been,where it's come, where it's
going, things like that Cool.
Speaker 2 (02:49):
I want to thank you too.
I just got back from Napa abouta month ago and I don't
remember if I reached out forsome recommendations.
So I got to.
I hit Brasswood, I had thepulled mozzarella did ghost
block I did.
I did all the wrecks and man itwas, it was delicious.
Speaker 3 (03:07):
you nailed all of them and we had a great time
there well, I didn't know and I,I guess I didn't realize you uh
, uh, I'd already been therebefore this.
So, uh, yeah, like, um, youknow, like I think everybody
should have like this passionproject right Like I, there's
there's no doubt.
You know that I am uh continueto be passionate about, uh, you
(03:30):
know, implant dentistry and uh,I think my niche, you know kind
of, is settled out into.
You know, my job is to excitepeople in the implant industry.
You know, when Bethway firststarted, you know I taught I
(03:50):
mean literally, I mean I taughtall the courses.
You know I taught fast track.
You know I taught the full archcourse that we did and the
scientist course and thecomplications course.
And you know, as we've grown,you know so as our, you know, as
we've grown, you know so hasour, you know, faculty and
mentor base has grown, uh, withus.
And uh, you know I've settledinto, I just need to excite
(04:15):
doctors into getting intoimplant dentistry.
And you know, get out there andnail some ones and twos and
some up under bone and uh, youknow, I'll ruin a, I'll ruin a
good chair of dentists.
And to, you know, never wanting, you know, philips krauts and
hygiene check yeah don't followthe way you guys.
You know I did the full arch andand I couldn't be, you know,
more proud of that.
But you know I'm also superproud of the.
(04:36):
You know the the doctors havegone through and they drop.
You know they drop singles thatare that are dead center
parallel to the contact points,but a screw-retain crowd at the
access hole, dead center.
Those are all great things.
Speaker 1 (04:53):
That's harder, by the way.
That's harder than anything wedo in Full Arch.
Speaker 3 (05:00):
Listen Monday at a fast track.
I start out with telling them Idon't want you to start with
number eight as a matter of fact, like if I finished my if.
I finished my dental career andI didn't do another eight or
nine in my career like.
Speaker 1 (05:17):
I'm good Like.
Speaker 3 (05:19):
I, that's some hard ass implant dentistry, right?
You know, over these years I'mgoing to circle back.
Oh yeah, it is.
You know, over these years I'mgoing to circle back to the Napa
thing.
You know, sometimesopportunities show up and I had
the opportunity to buy adistressed property from a buyer
, you know, back in 2020 in Napa.
And you know, today we've got a.
You know, we got a winery underconstruction and the goal of
(05:44):
that is to create an environmentwhere, you know, obviously
we'll probably cater to dentists.
You, know, yeah, a thousandpeople have taken pathway and
you know probably more than that.
You know that.
You know, know where we are andyou know dentists we tend to be
.
You know we didn't.
We, you know we tend to likewine and uh, you know many of
the uh.
(06:04):
You know it is as a dentist.
Like, you do have a good wageand you can, we tend to like
wine.
As a dentist, you do have agood wage and you can afford to
scale up on the wine.
It's one of my passions as well.
I'm super passionate about it.
I'm glad you had a greatexperience because that's what's
going, that's what's going outthere is supposed to be, and you
(06:26):
know those places.
You know, like there's thislittle, this brasswood uh
restaurant.
They also have a winery thereand they have an off the menu
thing called the, the pulledmozzarella, and they come and
they, they cut it and they pullit, literally pull it, and then
they set it on this uh, uh,toasted, almost baguette type
thing and like oh, you wouldhave liked it.
(06:49):
If I'm out there by myself, likeI, I may just have that and a
glass of wine for dinner andthat's like, yeah, there you go,
yeah, no, we had a an excellenttime.
Speaker 2 (06:57):
unfortunately, it did end with a couple cases of wine
coming to my house and I had toget a wine fridge.
So now i'm'm a, I'm a full onboard, I'm like it was.
It was so good.
You know what they do, is they?
They get you to have four orfive tastings and then, before
you know it, you know you got acase coming to your door.
Uh, but we had, man, such agood time.
Helena was great, and then wewent to I don't know if it's
(07:25):
called the Cook too.
That was really good.
Speaker 3 (07:33):
So Cook is the locals' restaurant.
So imagine Napa having allthese millions of tourists a
year.
Catering to the tourists.
Cook restaurant in downtown StHelena isn't open on friday and
saturday night.
Yeah, like, imagine, like.
Imagine a high-end, like chefinspired restaurant that is not
(07:54):
open on friday and saturdaynight in this environment.
And it is because the therestaurant is for the locals.
Speaker 2 (08:03):
Yeah, that's what he said.
He said that that he doesn'twant to serve on weekends, so he
just does weekdays.
He doesn't care about having ahuge crowd in there and he just
serves good quality Italianpasta.
It was delicious.
Speaker 3 (08:17):
But think about that as it correlates to the jobs
that we do.
I don't want to work onweekends either, right, but you
know, you think about it Like.
You know.
What he's done is he's createdan environment and a job in
which it works for him.
Speaker 1 (08:34):
It's a lifestyle restaurant.
Speaker 3 (08:36):
Right right.
Like it's true, look likebalanced restaurant.
You know like I'm not going toblow away Friday and Saturday
night every day for the rest ofmy life.
You know, like, like I'm notgonna play you, I'm not gonna
blow my friday and saturdaynight every day for the rest of
my life.
You know serving other people,so that's my night to have date
night.
Yeah, you know why can't I havedate night on friday night or
saturday night or go travel onweekend or whatever?
(08:57):
So, uh, I think it's.
I think there's always likegreat correlations between you
know, like what we perceive tobe what we perceive to be the
norm and what is possible foranyone to go create.
Yeah, you know, he created a.
He went and created arestaurant that he get, that he
(09:19):
has his weekend spree.
Speaker 2 (09:21):
What an amazing job right and you know it's.
It's funny because that's kindof what I mean just just saying
like a correlation, like thereason that I got into one of
the reasons I got into dentistryin the first place was because
I was looking for a work lifebalance.
And then I got into dentistryand I was like I don't know if,
if the like fillings thing isfor me, I really like surgery.
So you know it's what's niceabout dentistry is you can kind
(09:44):
of tailor yourself into whateveravenue you want, like and you
can have a really nice work lifebalance off that.
If you love to do root canals,you can start a practice, do an
endo every day.
You know, maybe you only wantto work three days a week.
It's an option for you.
And that's a really cool thingthat I think we're able to do as
dentists is you can find yourniche.
You don't have to work six daysa week.
(10:06):
You can kind of tailor it basedon what kind of income you want
and you could still be verysuccessful.
I mean, I know dentists thatwork two days a week and they
still do absolutely fine andit's pretty cool that we're able
to do that.
And very similar to the chef atCook.
He wanted this for hisrestaurant, made it happen.
He figured out how to make itsuccessful by tailoring to the
(10:29):
the local crowd instead ofinstead of the tourist is that
like?
Could his restaurant be moresuccessful if he wanted to
expand a bit?
Probably.
But he's not interested in thatand that's okay too.
Speaker 3 (10:39):
He's probably much, much happier just doing monday
through thursday is it that youknow, like you think about, like
the correlations to.
You know what we do because youknow dentistry I don't care if
you're doing what we call breadand butter dentistry or if we're
doing implant dentistry orwhatever it is uh, you know that
(11:00):
the job is tough and it getstough when you, when you cycle
the hamster wheel.
And you know junior point right, like you know, he could
probably make a tremendousamount more money by being open
Friday and Saturday and cateringto the tourists and then
working with the car servicesand all the other things, but
(11:21):
it's not what he, it's not whathe chooses to do and to do, and
and it keeps him sane.
You know because you know Ithink that, um, I think about
this all the time and you knowwhat inspires me to uh.
Uh, you know the, the, thetasting room, and you know the,
the winery aspect is.
You know, when you woke up inNapa, were, you mad?
Speaker 2 (11:48):
No, I wasn't mad.
Speaker 3 (11:52):
No, what I'm getting at is like now.
Think about your patient that'sgoing to wake up tomorrow
morning for a dual arch.
Are they happy?
Speaker 2 (12:04):
Probably anxious but maybe excited to get on the
other end, but scared.
Speaker 3 (12:09):
For sure, right, right, but like, let me ask you
this like when they came to youroffice, like, did they be like,
hey, doc, like, uh, like, howare you?
Like, like, what makes you tick?
Like how'd you, how'd you buildthis office?
Like, how'd you get here, how'dyou go to dental school?
Like, like all the things?
No, but think about you goinginto a winery in napa, like
(12:30):
those are like all the thingsthat you want from them.
Right, you just like tell me,you know like what's?
You know what's your story?
You know, like, like, where thegrapes come from, how they get
here, who owns it?
Like all these, all thesethings, because the the mindset
is I want the story, yeah, and Iand I and I want, you know, I
(12:52):
want the experience in.
I was telling the class onmonday that fast track classes.
You know john coice, uh, youknow, is one of my you know dear
friends and mentors and, likehe, for 20 years now, you know
maybe more, but, like you know,since I took the thing um dating
me, uh, you know he's, hetalked about dentistry.
(13:16):
We're like the hit man.
You know, like, we go in there,we tell the doc, you know, we
tell the patient, all the thingsthat are wrong, and you know
it's going to cost money andit's going to cost time and it's
going to cause pain and allthese things.
So they get this upset in thisright, yeah, it's almost like
you know.
You know.
It's like hey, you know, doc,you know no offense, but you
know I hate the debts yeah,great right like, like maybe I
(13:41):
want to go out as a dentist, begoing like, hey, like, the first
time someone, next time someonetells me that I'll be like like
hey, patient, like I don't likepatients, yeah Right, just drop
them.
You know, drop the drill andwalk out.
You know, like, but you knowthere's a, there's a that it, it
, it, it, it, it, it, it.
Go back to that's.
(14:02):
What makes this job tough isthat you've got the business
side of dentistry right, likeyou're.
You know you got to makepayroll and you got to like
provide for your family andservice, your loans and things
like that.
You know it's kind of like thistriangle right, like you've got
the act of being a dentist atthe top.
You know like having a skillsetof doing like the amazing
(14:24):
quality dentist and helpingpatients.
But then you've got like thebase of the triangle that holds
that up and that and the base isbusiness.
You know like, like, like whichare separate.
You know, like you do enough ofthis up here, like it should
see the business business.
But you know we're scientists bynature and we, you know we
don't, we're not always the bestbusiness people.
(14:45):
You know.
So, like we learn on the flyand got to be conscious of that.
And then I think the otherpiece that holds us up is the
being in us, like the ability tocommunicate with that patient
and have a relationship withthem that allows them to be
(15:08):
served, you know, by you andallows you, you know, do the
work that they need to have doneand like, if you think about,
if you don't have three goodcorners of that, that triangle,
like you're, you're not gettingwhere you want to be, you know
you're not, you're not going tolike, you're not going to be as
successful as you could be, andwe're all born with all of those
(15:30):
and those are things that we, Iknow we got on a little bit of
a tangent Business and business,but then, at the end of the day
, we're still in our customerservice business, absolutely,
and it's what makes dentistrytough.
Speaker 2 (15:44):
It is.
Yeah, I agree 100%.
One thing I've talked about onthe podcast before that I enjoy
about at least full archdentistry tough it is.
Yeah, I, I agree 100.
You know one thing I've talkedabout on the podcast before that
I enjoy about, um, at leastfull arch dentistry, you know
this in this, in this podcast,is full arch dentistry kind of
focused and um, and I would saysomething that I've enjoyed a
lot, that kind of transitionedme into full arch dentistry, was
(16:04):
I kind of got sick of ofwhenever I told a patient that
something was wrong.
They, you know, it's like I'mlike, hey, you're doing an oral
exam and and they have a tooththat that needs a filling.
They're just like, oh, like man, this is.
This is why I hate the dentistis because you gave that.
Speaker 1 (16:23):
you gave them yeah.
Speaker 2 (16:28):
I gave you, gave them , yeah, I gave them a problem,
and there's nothing.
Yeah, there's nothing morefulfilling, though, about having
an office where the patientsseek me out because they want a
solution to a problem that theyalready know of.
Um, and I think it probably isthe same thing with with like, I
don't do cosmetic dentistry,but like cosmetic dentistry
where, where there's like, yeah,right, but you're talking about
.
Speaker 3 (16:47):
You're talking about Kois.
Speaker 2 (16:48):
And if you're able to find a niche that you like, you
can service yourself in a waythat when patients come to your
door, they know their problemalready You're the solution.
So instead of me telling themall these issues they have, I'm
telling them how I can fix alltheir issues, and for me that's
(17:08):
really rewarding and it takesaway a little bit of that hitman
aspect where and that makes itso much more enjoyable for me
and it allows me to see myselfin this career for a long period
of time, because I enjoy it,instead of going to work every
day.
The patient's telling me man, Ihate you, the dentist sucks and
(17:29):
now I have to get four crownsand a filling.
I thought I came in herescot-free and you know what the
dentist across the street said Iwas fine.
They said I didn't have any andit was totally good.
So I do like the aspect of fullarch focus dentistry, where they
come to me and they're like doc, I need all my teeth out.
How, how can you help me?
(17:49):
And I'm like perfect.
I'll tell you exactly what Iwould do.
You know, these are the, theseare the options you have and we
can go from there.
Um, so that's something thatyou know, I I really, really
enjoy about that.
Speaker 3 (18:03):
Well, don't stop talking about that.
Like, like, uh, uh, you know,don't stop talking about that.
Like, you know, don't stoptelling other dentists, you know
that there's a way to, like,become the healer, because
that's what Don Coyce talksabout.
You know, at the end of the day, we want to try to change the
narrative of a dentist goingfrom the hitman to being a
(18:26):
healer, and that's really whatyou describe is exactly what
that is is.
You know, we didn't cause yourproblem and I'm not here to
berate you about how we gotthere or to, you know, shame you
.
You know, for you know, havingyour teeth the way it is, like
I'm, you know I'm here to helpyou and you know, and it starts
(18:47):
by just what you said.
It starts by how may I help you?
What do you desire?
Because sometimes and I seethis a little in Full Arch
sometimes our desires to do acertain procedure will drive the
case and we, we will misssometimes the patient's desire
(19:11):
for maybe something else.
Yeah, and, and I, and I willtell you I have, uh, a lot of.
It starts by by prejudgingpeople and like it's the hardest
thing not to do in dentistryand if, when you learn not to.
It's the hardest thing not todo in dentistry.
And when you learn not to, itopens the doors.
And what I'm talking about isyou know we all thin slice
(19:34):
everybody that walks in thedoors in nanoseconds by, like
you know some people call ityour fight or flight, but like
we thin slice them in like, oh,you know they look dirty, they
talk funny.
You know they don't have anymoney.
You know they drove a piece ofshit car.
Know they look dirty, they talkfunny.
You know they like they don'thave any money.
You know they drove a piece ofshit car.
You know, like, whatever it is.
And all of a sudden you're likegod, do it?
Am I gonna go into my wholefull arch fixed?
(19:56):
you know, thing you know, orlike I think they're.
I think they'd be a better, Ithink they'd be better over
denture, canada, yeah, and earlyin my career, like the hard
thing about the hard thing aboutit for me was I was in a town
of 1,000 people.
I knew most of the people and myperception was that person
can't afford this so I wouldjust go straight to the
(20:18):
overdenture and hope that Icould get that.
But the reality is, if you do agood job of showing them value
in what you're doing, thehealing portion of it because we
all want to be healed, right.
So when you show them thehealed portion, they may not be
(20:39):
able to afford it, but you knowwhat their dad, their mom, their
brother, their aunt, theirsister, they may borrow the
money, they may go to Prusik,they can do all these things,
but they don't know that theycan do those because we didn't
show them, because we shut downwhen we saw them drive up in the
rusted out Corolla.
Yeah, and dentistry is hard inthat aspect because we do
(21:06):
prejudge people.
But we can open our minds tojust talking to every single
patient about what like, what ispossible for them, and then let
them.
Speaker 2 (21:18):
Let them decide absolutely the first thing that
I ask in a consult is what isyour goal here?
You know, why do you?
Every patient first thing I sayis what is your goal?
And you know why do you?
Every patient first thing I sayis what is your goal?
And then you know, like yousaid, maybe they don't have
enough money to to afford theprocedure.
But if their goal is to getinto fixed a fixed, you know
they don't want their dentureanymore, they're sick of it.
(21:39):
Or they come in with, you know,bombed out teeth and they're not
interested in a denture andthey just want to get something
that's fixed in a place.
Well, I'll at least go throughmy whole console with them and
I'll work with them as much as Ican to get to get them there,
or at least give them some ideas, so that way when they're ready
for it, I'm here for them.
Or you know, if their goal isjust they just want to smile and
(22:00):
they don't care about if it'sfixed in a place, they just want
something to replace theirteeth, well then of course I'm
not going to go into the wholefixed spiel.
So I think it's important, likeyou say, to get an idea of what
they're there for and what youknow, and once you know that you
can tailor your presentationtowards that and you are going
to get so much more success withone you know, closing the cases
(22:22):
, and two with at least you knowthey're going to think that
you're listening to them, sothey're going to appreciate that
and whenever they are ready toget whatever they need done,
you're there for them andthey're not going to go to
anybody else because you werethe one that was actually there
listening to them.
Speaker 3 (22:38):
Right, you know, one of the most basic desires of the
human is to be heard.
Basic desires of the human isto be heard and we sometimes
don't give them the opportunityto speak the way they do.
And I think you are exactlycorrect.
(22:58):
Like, I feel it's reallyimportant to you know, like ask
them those questions right, andthen shut up and listen or let
them talk and I know we're ontimeframes and things but, like
you know, when you, when you'retalking about a dual arch in the
money and stuff, like like they, they deserve to be heard and
you know, maybe being heard islike telling you that they
(23:21):
didn't, like you know where theywere at is in their deluge or
they may be.
Being heard is like my, you know, I made it 20 more years than
my parents, you know, beforethey lost their teens.
Or my grandparents, you know,whatever it is right, but like
they, they want to get it offtheir chest and they want to
talk to you about it.
And then, when they've beenheard, the conversation is over
(23:43):
and now you can.
Now you can go to work andfixing, you know, fixing them,
and they will feel like they cango forward with treatment
because, by God, that doctor.
He listened to me.
He listened to me and he laidout a green plan that I
understood and found a way forme to afford to be able to do
(24:07):
that.
And that person is what you'retrying to create and that's a.
That's a raving fan Like you're.
You're trying to go, you'retrying to create raving fans,
and here's someone else andyou'll you'll create a lot more
of them.
Speaker 1 (24:25):
Yeah, yeah, and I think that really is the key to
flipping that wholeproblem-solution dynamic you
were talking about, Because ifthey lead with the reason that
they're there and all the thingsthat their conditions have
taken from them, then you'representing a solution at the end
.
But if you just lead withtrying to fit this person into a
box, then you've created aproblem for them and they're
trying to run away from it.
It's not like they've kind ofled themselves to water.
(24:47):
You know they're they're tryingto run away from it.
You know it's not like they'vekind of led themselves to water.
You're trying to distract themto it and that, and that's just
not going to create a fan.
Speaker 3 (24:53):
Like you said, if you , if you, if you take that, you
know, like that, if you, if youoperate in that domain and your
practice, like you know you'llhave, you know you'll, you'll
have an abundance of patience,but then you know, you take that
out into the, into the rest ofyour life, and that is like you
know, something like, though,you know, most people just need
(25:14):
to get out of their own way.
Yeah, you know, and I know youhear that sometimes you're like,
oh, that's kind of corny, butlike, the reality is like the,
the only self-limiter you havein life is yourself.
You know, and like you want to.
Yeah, I mean, you guys know it.
Like you know, like in 2010, Ileft my, you know my, my
(25:34):
hometown of a thousand peoplewhere I built this big dodge
model to myself for a practice,and that I decided you know what
I, you know I was doing.
It was not a bright thing.
I was.
I was doing 300, 320 implants ayear pretty consistently, one
season, two seasons and thensome overdentures, but not real
big fixed work like that and Idecided that's what I want to do
(26:01):
.
So I talked to my family and Isaid, listen, we're going to
move two hours north to RapidCity, south Dakota, and we're
going to.
I'm going to open animplant-only practice from
scratch.
I'm going to rent twooperatories from an oral surgeon
who doesn't place implants andI'm going to make my business
(26:24):
completely referral-based fromthe other dentist.
Like no outside marketing, nodirect to consumer or anything
like that.
And I, you can imagine, likemost people in 20, it's a
different environment thanTuesday Like yeah, that guy's
crazy.
Speaker 1 (26:37):
Yeah, you know what I mean.
Speaker 3 (26:40):
You know you can't do that and I was like, okay, well
, I mean, maybe it proves outthat I can't.
I said, but would you let meinto your office?
Could I buy your office lunchand talk to your team about what
it would be like to implementgood implants into your practice
and have restorable implantsfor you?
(27:01):
If you could see yourself doingthat, I think that I could show
you a way to serve yourpatients and, you know, you know
even be more profitable at it.
And you know I did lunch andlearns in every damn office that
would let me in and I boughtlunches and cookies and bagels
and, like you, the fastest wayto a dentist's office is through
(27:23):
the stomach of the front deskand I would like I would serve
that, that through the stomachof the front desk, and I would
like I would serve that, thatthat community.
And you know when I, uh, when Ileft, uh, when I moved to
scottsdale, you know to to youknow the second, the second
epiphany you know that I did waslike you know what I'd done
this implant thing like that.
(27:45):
And you know my next, and I gotdivorced so I didn't have to
convince my family to move againbut, uh, my kids were grown,
but, um, I was like you knowwhat I want?
To go, I'm going to go make myliving giving back and teaching
people like, ah, nobody doesthat, you know, make their
living, you know, in education.
(28:05):
And I was like, well, whycouldn't I?
I said like, like I can only doso many and so many implants
with my hands.
Yeah, but training people to godo that.
I mean like, like, think aboutthe people that I can serve, you
know, by secondary intent,right, like like you know, uh,
(28:28):
as it goes out there andexponential impact yeah, you
know, and that's what I, that'swhat I set out to, that's what I
sent out to create.
And, you know, I didn't knowlike where I'm at today, like I
had no idea that's what I would,you know, I would be doing.
Speaker 1 (28:42):
But like I knew I, you know, I knew what I wanted
to do yeah and it just kind ofmorphed in along the way and I
was I'm super happy to be thatspace have you ever sat down and
kind of done the calculus onyou know how many doctors have
come through pathway maybe anaverage amount of their placing
per year and just try to kind ofget an idea of how many
(29:03):
implants have sort of beenplaced as a secondary result of
you starting pathway?
Speaker 3 (29:09):
You know I thought about doing that before I asked.
You know, asked by our licenseone time.
I'm just like, hey, let's likeyou know, like there's myself.
And then there's like you knowthe accounts that you know.
You know that may have beencreated from, you know, pathway,
and I'm just like like do youhave a number?
And they were just like thatmay have been created from
(29:30):
Pathway.
And I'm just like, do you havea number?
Speaker 1 (29:34):
And they were just like it's got to be a lot, and
that's what I thought I meanthat's great, but what's the
number?
Speaker 3 (29:39):
And they're just like , yeah, we don't know.
Do you really want to know?
And I was like, no, I'm notabout numbers, I don't even like
to say how many plans I didwhen I was back in my little
hotel, but, like, like thereality was I, I set out to in
my little hometown, like I setout to, uh, I had a motto that
(30:04):
we had on the top of awhiteboard in our break room and
it was no dentures, partials orbridges.
That was, that was, that was mymotto.
And there's almost exceptions,right, like like money and bad
bone and bad humans and stuff,but like, like, uh, like there's
always but, but our, our, Icall it an implant focused
(30:32):
practice.
And that is like we're going toprovide true truth replacement
solutions for our patients.
And I, I, I told like kind ofjust goes back to like, I try to
put these life experiences in.
You know that day one of uh,you know fast track, and I, I
tell them all, I said, no,you're all going to be in a
little bit of an ethical dilemmawhen you leave Pathway.
But they all kind of look at melike, what does that mean?
(30:53):
I said, well, all of you arejust in general dentistry right
now and you're going to go homeand I guarantee you by the end
of the month you're all up downa bridge.
And I said the ethical dilemmafor me and maybe I'm not putting
you said, you know, like theethical dilemma for me and maybe
I'm not putting you in one, butlike the ethical dilemma for me
was I couldn't in good faithtell my patients to have a
(31:19):
procedure done that I would havenever had done to myself for
yourself.
You know right, like, like, if,if I had the ability to have an
implant in a missing tooth site,you know, regardless of the
conditions on the other teeth,because, like that doesn't
matter, like it's not somethingthat I would have done to myself
and I can't do it to someoneelse, and it's not a, it's not
(31:42):
an elitist standpoint, it's justlike I don't want to do that.
Uh, and it car it, it causesyou to sometimes turn a patient
away.
You know it's usually the onethat's like, well, my insurance
patient, the branch is like,well, like, listen, like, like
you know, if you're, if youbroke your arm and your
insurance only paid for anamputation, like you'd probably
(32:04):
pull.
You'd probably pull out a pot,like keep your arm.
And you know, my assistants arealways like oh, that's such a
terrible analogy and I said, Iknow, but like, like, your teeth
are fucking important.
Yeah, like, like, stop.
Yeah, it's the same.
Speaker 2 (32:20):
It is no 100.
That is I actually.
I I like that analogy it.
Speaker 1 (32:26):
It's not bad.
Speaker 3 (32:26):
It's good, I might have to use that.
Speaker 1 (32:30):
It's not bad, I think I learned from someone else.
Speaker 2 (32:33):
Okay.
So just going back a little bit, just so I get a full scope,
because I don't really know yourwhole story.
It sounds like you went to, youlive in a small town and then
you moved, did your own implantoffice and then you went and
started Pathways.
Is there some stuff I'm missingin there?
We'd love to kind of listen tothe whole journey to where
Pathway is now and then evengoing into maybe how Pathway
(32:57):
started, what you first startedoffering and then what Pathway
has to offer now how it grew asan operation.
Speaker 1 (33:02):
Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3 (33:07):
Yeah, man, I'm from a small uh, I'm the fifth
generation to grow on my, on myfamily's cow ranch and uh farm
as well, and uh, um, you know, Idon't know anything other than
cows and wheat.
You know, like my dad's afourth generation, you know my
brother still works out there.
Like I don't, like, uh, Ididn't have dentistry in my
blood.
Nor, you know, when I went tothe university of Nebraska, you
(33:28):
know, in 1989, like it was to uh, uh, drink beer, watch college
football, I'm going to get an agdegree and go back home and do
the same thing that.
You know, the five generationsbefore me, you know the you know
the four generations for me didit themselves and I got into
implant dentistry.
Or I got into dentistry from amentor who actually turned out
to be my uh implant uh mentor.
(33:50):
Uh, roger Pluster in Lincoln,nebraska.
He was also from my hometown.
Uh, there's only two ABOI.
There's only two ABOI diplomatsuh, in the entire state of
Nebraska and they're uh, they'reboth from my hometown of a
thousand people in westernNebraska.
It's kind of uh anyway uh, youknow, I ended up going to dental
(34:11):
school in Oklahoma and I hadsome, met some great people and
got a great education.
And I went home and uhpracticed and then ultimately
bought out my childhood dentist,uh and um, you know, along the
way I should have in uh 80 or in98 uh, I'd made a trip to napa
(34:33):
uh when I was in dental school.
That presented as the paperthey got as the meeting and san
fran went to napa valley and upeven to spring mountain and uh
got the bug.
So went home back to the ranchand I planted a vineyard.
Uh planted five acres of winegrapes in nebraska and then in
2000 uh started the.
(34:54):
Uh started the third bondedwinery in the state of nebraska.
Uh, then uh, in 2006 I I soldit to my winemaker and I sold it
because, you know, the, thedentistry and the implant
dentistry in my practice wastaking off and the money I could
(35:14):
make and support my family.
There was just so muchdifferent than agriculture so I
moved.
That was my firstentrepreneurial activity was
planting a vineyard, selling it,building it up and selling it
and then I'd gone.
Obviously, in the early 2000sI'd gone to Mish.
(35:35):
That was the only place youcould go.
I went to learn from Carlhimself out in Detroit, went
there nine times to learn andcame home and I implemented it.
You know, to learn and camehome and I implemented it.
And you know the people onWestern Nebraska, like you know,
like rural, rural farmers andranchers, like you know, they
have money but they they don'tspend it unless they they see a
(35:59):
value or like they're very like,they're kind of a tough sell
because they don't like if theydon't see the value that they're
not going to write a check for.
And uh, so, uh, I was able, I'mable to talk their language
because I'm from that, you know,and business took off and
implants and I, I found, likeyou guys, like, like, implants
(36:21):
is all I want to do, you know,like it's the gratification of
the, the, the, the jobsatisfaction that I got from and
I didn't get from anything elsein dentistry and I think that
had I not got into implants, youknow, hey, we wouldn't be
talking that be, uh, uh.
I think I don't know if I wouldhave stayed in denver.
I think I would have probablyended up just ranching and
farming with my dad because,like that, that was a more, that
(36:44):
was more passionate than I wasfor general industry and I think
I would have went thatdirection.
So in around 2009, I started.
It was tough economic time butI really wanted to do more
implants and I was like you know, the only way I can I'm maxed
out on like my airhead.
You know they were alreadystarting to drive hundreds of
(37:05):
miles to see me because therewas no one else out in this part
of the country placing implants.
I was like I need more people.
I moved two hours up to SouthDakota, naurupt City.
I went from a town of 1,000people to some more zeros, to
almost 100,000.
I started marketing myself.
(37:25):
I went from general dentistryto an implant-only shop I ran
that from.
I was there from 2010 tomid-2017.
Then I moved down here.
I'll come back to that in asecond.
I moved down here at youprobably know Chris Barrett we
(37:48):
just had him on.
Speaker 2 (37:48):
We just had him on.
Speaker 3 (37:51):
Yeah, I don't know if he said that or not.
Speaker 2 (37:52):
He did.
Speaker 3 (37:53):
Chris went from general dentistry to implants to
.
He moved to Rapid City and wasmy associate in there during A
the years during my divorce.
But when I went off to go, uh,get a implant, uh, pathway, and
what came about by really, youknow, you know bio horizons and
(38:17):
and icad and some of the imagingplaces like they would they
started asking me if I wouldspeak to, like the study clubs
and like I just remember, likethe, the like today I would
never actually do what I didthat day and it's because they.
The first gig I had was uh, uhin albany, new york, at the
albany county study club andactually it was the albany
(38:39):
county world surgeons study cluband I was to go up there and
talk about restorations onimplants.
And uh, from rapid city, southdakota, I flew from rapid to
denver, denver to newark, newarkto albany all day long so I had
to leave on wednesday to do athursday night presentation, and
(38:59):
then you can't leave that night, so then it was all day friday
to come back and I and Iliterally did it for my travel
and expenses, and you know.
So you took three days off andI fucking loved it, like it was
like, and you know, and you gotgood reviews and they started
asking you to do it more andmore.
And then I had the conversationwith you know it was Steve
(39:22):
Bogan, who's the CEO ofBioHorizons, who would be an
amazing guest for you on this,by the way.
Speaker 2 (39:29):
Definitely.
Speaker 3 (39:32):
These guys.
There are a couple ofbiomechanical engineers that
started BioHorizons inBirmingham and Alabama and it's
now the third largest implantcompany in the world.
They did it in 30 years.
Anyway, at the same time aroundthis time, you know, uh, coral
mish got sick with aglioblastoma and uh, uh, steve
(39:54):
was like like there's gonna be avoid, justin, and he goes like
there isn't anybody out there.
That's got, you know, the thekind of passion that you do and
he kind of encouraged me to, youknow, do some more courses.
Wasn't like necessarily, hey,go create this like big thing.
You know, like like you shouldstep into that.
And he goes because you're just, you know, you're one of, I was
(40:17):
one of two of carl's firstmasterships that he gave.
So, like it was, it was theright time for me personally as
well.
So went down there and leasedout this eight chair old clinic
and put some chairs in there andsome computers and convinced
Acteon to drop a CVCT in there,cause now I didn't have money to
(40:40):
like like build this Dodge mallor anything.
And that's how it.
That's how it got started.
And you know, chris Barrett wasworking my office back in rapid
and uh, uh, you know he wasflying down, you know, basically
every other week, you know, tomentor the courses and you know
and teach with me.
And I just remember, one day,you know, chris said yeah,
(41:02):
because I don't think I reallywant to live in Rapid anymore.
Speaker 1 (41:05):
And.
I was like I don't like goingto shit.
Speaker 3 (41:08):
Then I was like you know, justin, you don't either.
Speaker 1 (41:12):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (41:12):
And I was like, yeah, you're right, man.
So I said, well, what do youwant to do?
And he's just like I don't know.
He's like I love Scottsdale andI love there all the time and I
said you know what I said let'spack up everything and wrap it.
Let's find a space inScottsdale and let's drop it in
(41:34):
and let's go.
And that's how his office andultimately was the Brightly
thing Ultimately.
That's how it got started.
Instead of just pulling theplug and plug and wrapping, I'm
just like shit.
We got a whole office full ofstuff like we don't need
anything.
Just let's, let's find adifferent place.
We moved out and, uh, you knowthat part's.
(41:55):
You know, chris is, you know, adear, dear friend of mine and
one of the most gifted surgeonsthat I know, amazing, and if I
was to say something about him,I would tell you that you'll be
hard pressed to find someonethat is as clean of a surgeon as
(42:16):
him, like his incisions arealways on point, they're always
full thickness, reflected, theAlvy is like he put a planer on
it, you know, and lately you runit through a damn.
Uh, you know a table saw, youknow, like it's perfect and and
(42:40):
it, he's a and he's good, yeah,which checks a lot of boxes for
me.
So, uh, you know, we, whichchecks a lot of boxes for me.
So we went through, we grewPathway, you know, through the
years of 2020 came around, covidcame around and there was a.
We really needed to expand theclinic, we needed more chairs
(43:02):
for the surgeries and, you know,in March you know, march was
kind of funny because we'releasing this new space so we
signed this lease for this newspace and then Proven hits and
then I'd hired Steve Vorholt andliterally he moved to Arizona
(43:23):
six days before we closed, theworld closed, and I was just
like sorry, buddy, but at theend of the day we spent all the
lockdown redoing lectures andpaperwork and fine-tuning the
machine and doing the thingsthat he did.
(43:44):
And I took a gamble on myselfand I was like you know what,
this is going to wreck a lot ofpeople, but when we come out of
this, people are going to neededucation and so we put the
hammer down on building out thatspace and shit.
We did our first live surgery.
(44:05):
We closed the 20th of March andwe did the first, uh, live
surgery.
We did our.
We closed the 20th of march andwe did, uh, the first fast
track.
I think that second or third ofmay.
Oh, wow, we were.
We were like, and you know,arizona was open and so many of
these things.
You know how washington wasclosed for almost six months.
You know.
So like, uh, all these peoplecame there because they, their
(44:26):
practices were still slow or notopen and they, they you know I
had some covet money and that,uh, we just started like and
that's what just really likeramped us because we kind of had
center stage without anyoneelse, like in that parameter,
and the people that are involvedwith pathway, the, the mentors,
(44:47):
like I've only as good aspeople that I have around me,
I'm like like there's some OGmentors that are the best of
class and they, they give ittheir time and and we put out.
I think we put out a.
You know, I think we put out agood product and I know that I
know this from all the docs outthere that do do a good job and
(45:11):
like, uh, that's what I'm mostproud of.
You know, like I'm I'm, youknow I'm proud of my boys.
Uh, you know, proud of my twoboys.
Like you know, that wouldalways be number one for me, uh,
but you know, second off wouldbe, you know, uh, I'm proud of
the, the, the environment ofthat, and the family that we've
created with pathway, causethat's uh, uh, yeah, like that
(45:32):
is my family.
My name is Dr Tyler Tolbert and I'm Dr Soren Poppy,
and you're listening to the FixPodcast, your source for all
things implant dentistry.
Hello and welcome back to theFix Podcast.
We have a celebrity on with ustoday, dr Justin Moody.
I wanted to welcome him to theshow.
Justin, thank you so much forcoming on today.
This is a huge full circlemoment for me.
(00:23):
You actually kind of startedoff my whole implant journey.
You maybe probably don't evenremember, of course, but this
was back in, must have been.
I think this was probably thesummer of 2018.
I got a scholarship of sorts togo through Implant Pathway, so
I was a D2 and did the onlinepart and part one that came out
(00:45):
for parts two and three inSeattle.
I'm now in the PNW again whichis an amazing thing and now
you're on my implant podcast andit's just been really
incredible to see all that comefull circle.
You really, you know, gave methe implant bug and I was never
able to look past it.
So, you know, here we are and Ican't thank you enough for
coming on.
Speaker 3 (01:07):
Oh, of course, I've always enjoyed everybody that
comes through the, you know,through the place and uh,
there's, you know to be, to behonest, you know, there's uh not
that many that take thatjourney.
You know, like starting in uh,uh dental school and yeah, you
know, we don't know what, wedon't know right, and I mean I
just remember dental school is alittle different today than it
(01:27):
was.
Well, hell, it was different in18 than it is today.
You know, in the 90s, when Iwas in dental school, like God,
I don't know if there was enoughpizza and beer to get me to
attend some kind of functionthat had to do with learning
outside of dental school.
So, you know, hats off to youand anyone that does that.
Speaker 1 (01:50):
Sure, sure, no, I appreciate it.
So, for anyone who doesn't know, I guess you've been living
under a rock if you don't.
So Dr Justin Moody, among hismany accomplishments, is
infamous for starting theImplant Pathway, which is now
known as pathway.
Is it, is it?
Just everyone knows what it is.
So this is really the premierimplant education continuum that
(02:11):
has sprawled out.
It started off with just, youknow, getting doctors into
placing implants, I guess justwith your simple, abundant bone.
You know, single implant.
And now, you know, dr Moodyjust sat down with us and was
like, yeah, we had all kinds ofstuff going on.
We got remote Anchorage with DrDan Holtzclaw he's been on the
show before.
Um, we had, uh, you guys got aCEREC course going on.
(02:32):
You've got a fast track goingon all at the same time.
And just, I can't wait to kindof get into the full story of it
.
And you know where it's been,where it's come, where it's
going, things like that Cool.
Speaker 2 (02:49):
I want to thank you too.
I just got back from Napa abouta month ago and I don't
remember if I reached out forsome recommendations.
So I got to.
I hit Brasswood, I had thepulled mozzarella did ghost
block I did.
I did all the wrecks and man itwas, it was delicious.
Speaker 3 (03:07):
you nailed all of them and we had a great time
there well, I didn't know and I,I guess I didn't realize you uh
, uh, I'd already been therebefore this.
So, uh, yeah, like, um, youknow, like I think everybody
should have like this passionproject right Like I, there's
there's no doubt.
You know that I am uh continueto be passionate about, uh, you
(03:30):
know, implant dentistry and uh,I think my niche, you know kind
of, is settled out into.
You know, my job is to excitepeople in the implant industry.
You know, when Bethway firststarted, you know I taught I
(03:50):
mean literally, I mean I taughtall the courses.
You know I taught fast track.
You know I taught the full archcourse that we did and the
scientist course and thecomplications course.
And you know, as we've grown,you know so as our, you know, as
we've grown, you know so hasour, you know, faculty and
mentor base has grown, uh, withus.
And uh, you know I've settledinto, I just need to excite
(04:15):
doctors into getting intoimplant dentistry.
And you know, get out there andnail some ones and twos and
some up under bone and uh, youknow, I'll ruin a, I'll ruin a
good chair of dentists.
And to, you know, never wanting, you know, philips krauts and
hygiene check yeah don't followthe way you guys.
You know I did the full arch andand I couldn't be, you know,
more proud of that.
But you know I'm also superproud of the.
(04:36):
You know the the doctors havegone through and they drop.
You know they drop singles thatare that are dead center
parallel to the contact points,but a screw-retain crowd at the
access hole, dead center.
Those are all great things.
Speaker 1 (04:53):
That's harder, by the way.
That's harder than anything wedo in Full Arch.
Speaker 3 (05:00):
Listen Monday at a fast track.
I start out with telling them Idon't want you to start with
number eight as a matter of fact, like if I finished my if.
I finished my dental career andI didn't do another eight or
nine in my career like.
Speaker 1 (05:17):
I'm good Like.
Speaker 3 (05:19):
I, that's some hard ass implant dentistry, right?
You know, over these years I'mgoing to circle back.
Oh yeah, it is.
You know, over these years I'mgoing to circle back to the Napa
thing.
You know, sometimesopportunities show up and I had
the opportunity to buy adistressed property from a buyer
, you know, back in 2020 in Napa.
And you know, today we've got a.
You know, we got a winery underconstruction and the goal of
(05:44):
that is to create an environmentwhere, you know, obviously
we'll probably cater to dentists.
You, know, yeah, a thousandpeople have taken pathway and
you know probably more than that.
You know that.
You know, know where we are andyou know dentists we tend to be
.
You know we didn't.
We, you know we tend to likewine and uh, you know many of
the uh.
(06:04):
You know it is as a dentist.
Like, you do have a good wageand you can, we tend to like
wine.
As a dentist, you do have agood wage and you can afford to
scale up on the wine.
It's one of my passions as well.
I'm super passionate about it.
I'm glad you had a greatexperience because that's what's
going, that's what's going outthere is supposed to be, and you
(06:26):
know those places.
You know, like there's thislittle, this brasswood uh
restaurant.
They also have a winery thereand they have an off the menu
thing called the, the pulledmozzarella, and they come and
they, they cut it and they pullit, literally pull it, and then
they set it on this uh, uh,toasted, almost baguette type
thing and like oh, you wouldhave liked it.
(06:49):
If I'm out there by myself, likeI, I may just have that and a
glass of wine for dinner andthat's like, yeah, there you go,
yeah, no, we had a an excellenttime.
Speaker 2 (06:57):
unfortunately, it did end with a couple cases of wine
coming to my house and I had toget a wine fridge.
So now i'm'm a, I'm a full onboard, I'm like it was.
It was so good.
You know what they do, is they?
They get you to have four orfive tastings and then, before
you know it, you know you got acase coming to your door.
Uh, but we had, man, such agood time.
Helena was great, and then wewent to I don't know if it's
(07:25):
called the Cook too.
That was really good.
Speaker 3 (07:33):
So Cook is the locals' restaurant.
So imagine Napa having allthese millions of tourists a
year.
Catering to the tourists.
Cook restaurant in downtown StHelena isn't open on friday and
saturday night.
Yeah, like, imagine, like.
Imagine a high-end, like chefinspired restaurant that is not
(07:54):
open on friday and saturdaynight in this environment.
And it is because the therestaurant is for the locals.
Speaker 2 (08:03):
Yeah, that's what he said.
He said that that he doesn'twant to serve on weekends, so he
just does weekdays.
He doesn't care about having ahuge crowd in there and he just
serves good quality Italianpasta.
It was delicious.
Speaker 3 (08:17):
But think about that as it correlates to the jobs
that we do.
I don't want to work onweekends either, right, but you
know, you think about it Like.
You know.
What he's done is he's createdan environment and a job in
which it works for him.
Speaker 1 (08:34):
It's a lifestyle restaurant.
Speaker 3 (08:36):
Right right.
Like it's true, look likebalanced restaurant.
You know like I'm not going toblow away Friday and Saturday
night every day for the rest ofmy life.
You know, like, like I'm notgonna play you, I'm not gonna
blow my friday and saturdaynight every day for the rest of
my life.
You know serving other people,so that's my night to have date
night.
Yeah, you know why can't I havedate night on friday night or
saturday night or go travel onweekend or whatever?
(08:57):
So, uh, I think it's.
I think there's always likegreat correlations between you
know, like what we perceive tobe what we perceive to be the
norm and what is possible foranyone to go create.
Yeah, you know, he created a.
He went and created arestaurant that he get, that he
(09:19):
has his weekend spree.
Speaker 2 (09:21):
What an amazing job right and you know it's.
It's funny because that's kindof what I mean just just saying
like a correlation, like thereason that I got into one of
the reasons I got into dentistryin the first place was because
I was looking for a work lifebalance.
And then I got into dentistryand I was like I don't know if,
if the like fillings thing isfor me, I really like surgery.
So you know it's what's niceabout dentistry is you can kind
(09:44):
of tailor yourself into whateveravenue you want, like and you
can have a really nice work lifebalance off that.
If you love to do root canals,you can start a practice, do an
endo every day.
You know, maybe you only wantto work three days a week.
It's an option for you.
And that's a really cool thingthat I think we're able to do as
dentists is you can find yourniche.
You don't have to work six daysa week.
(10:06):
You can kind of tailor it basedon what kind of income you want
and you could still be verysuccessful.
I mean, I know dentists thatwork two days a week and they
still do absolutely fine andit's pretty cool that we're able
to do that.
And very similar to the chef atCook.
He wanted this for hisrestaurant, made it happen.
He figured out how to make itsuccessful by tailoring to the
(10:29):
the local crowd instead ofinstead of the tourist is that
like?
Could his restaurant be moresuccessful if he wanted to
expand a bit?
Probably.
But he's not interested in thatand that's okay too.
Speaker 3 (10:39):
He's probably much, much happier just doing monday
through thursday is it that youknow, like you think about, like
the correlations to.
You know what we do because youknow dentistry I don't care if
you're doing what we call breadand butter dentistry or if we're
doing implant dentistry orwhatever it is uh, you know that
(11:00):
the job is tough and it getstough when you, when you cycle
the hamster wheel.
And you know junior point right, like you know, he could
probably make a tremendousamount more money by being open
Friday and Saturday and cateringto the tourists and then
working with the car servicesand all the other things, but
(11:21):
it's not what he, it's not whathe chooses to do and to do, and
and it keeps him sane.
You know because you know Ithink that, um, I think about
this all the time and you knowwhat inspires me to uh.
Uh, you know the, the, thetasting room, and you know the,
the winery aspect is.
You know, when you woke up inNapa, were, you mad?
Speaker 2 (11:48):
No, I wasn't mad.
Speaker 3 (11:52):
No, what I'm getting at is like now.
Think about your patient that'sgoing to wake up tomorrow
morning for a dual arch.
Are they happy?
Speaker 2 (12:04):
Probably anxious but maybe excited to get on the
other end, but scared.
Speaker 3 (12:09):
For sure, right, right, but like, let me ask you
this like when they came to youroffice, like, did they be like,
hey, doc, like, uh, like, howare you?
Like, like, what makes you tick?
Like how'd you, how'd you buildthis office?
Like, how'd you get here, how'dyou go to dental school?
Like, like all the things?
No, but think about you goinginto a winery in napa, like
(12:30):
those are like all the thingsthat you want from them.
Right, you just like tell me,you know like what's?
You know what's your story?
You know, like, like, where thegrapes come from, how they get
here, who owns it?
Like all these, all thesethings, because the the mindset
is I want the story, yeah, and Iand I and I want, you know, I
(12:52):
want the experience in.
I was telling the class onmonday that fast track classes.
You know john coice, uh, youknow, is one of my you know dear
friends and mentors and, likehe, for 20 years now, you know
maybe more, but, like you know,since I took the thing um dating
me, uh, you know he's, hetalked about dentistry.
(13:16):
We're like the hit man.
You know, like, we go in there,we tell the doc, you know, we
tell the patient, all the thingsthat are wrong, and you know
it's going to cost money andit's going to cost time and it's
going to cause pain and allthese things.
So they get this upset in thisright, yeah, it's almost like
you know.
You know.
It's like hey, you know, doc,you know no offense, but you
know I hate the debts yeah,great right like, like maybe I
(13:41):
want to go out as a dentist, begoing like, hey, like, the first
time someone, next time someonetells me that I'll be like like
hey, patient, like I don't likepatients, yeah Right, just drop
them.
You know, drop the drill andwalk out.
You know, like, but you knowthere's a, there's a that it, it
, it, it, it, it, it, it.
Go back to that's.
(14:02):
What makes this job tough isthat you've got the business
side of dentistry right, likeyou're.
You know you got to makepayroll and you got to like
provide for your family andservice, your loans and things
like that.
You know it's kind of like thistriangle right, like you've got
the act of being a dentist atthe top.
You know like having a skillsetof doing like the amazing
(14:24):
quality dentist and helpingpatients.
But then you've got like thebase of the triangle that holds
that up and that and the base isbusiness.
You know like, like, like whichare separate.
You know, like you do enough ofthis up here, like it should
see the business business.
But you know we're scientists bynature and we, you know we
don't, we're not always the bestbusiness people.
(14:45):
You know.
So, like we learn on the flyand got to be conscious of that.
And then I think the otherpiece that holds us up is the
being in us, like the ability tocommunicate with that patient
and have a relationship withthem that allows them to be
(15:08):
served, you know, by you andallows you, you know, do the
work that they need to have doneand like, if you think about,
if you don't have three goodcorners of that, that triangle,
like you're, you're not gettingwhere you want to be, you know
you're not, you're not going tolike, you're not going to be as
successful as you could be, andwe're all born with all of those
(15:30):
and those are things that we, Iknow we got on a little bit of
a tangent Business and business,but then, at the end of the day
, we're still in our customerservice business, absolutely,
and it's what makes dentistrytough.
Speaker 2 (15:44):
It is.
Yeah, I agree 100%.
One thing I've talked about onthe podcast before that I enjoy
about at least full archdentistry tough it is.
Yeah, I, I agree 100.
You know one thing I've talkedabout on the podcast before that
I enjoy about, um, at leastfull arch dentistry, you know
this in this, in this podcast,is full arch dentistry kind of
focused and um, and I would saysomething that I've enjoyed a
lot, that kind of transitionedme into full arch dentistry, was
(16:04):
I kind of got sick of ofwhenever I told a patient that
something was wrong.
They, you know, it's like I'mlike, hey, you're doing an oral
exam and and they have a tooththat that needs a filling.
They're just like, oh, like man, this is.
This is why I hate the dentistis because you gave that.
Speaker 1 (16:23):
you gave them yeah.
Speaker 2 (16:28):
I gave you, gave them , yeah, I gave them a problem,
and there's nothing.
Yeah, there's nothing morefulfilling, though, about having
an office where the patientsseek me out because they want a
solution to a problem that theyalready know of.
Um, and I think it probably isthe same thing with with like, I
don't do cosmetic dentistry,but like cosmetic dentistry
where, where there's like, yeah,right, but you're talking about
.
Speaker 3 (16:47):
You're talking about Kois.
Speaker 2 (16:48):
And if you're able to find a niche that you like, you
can service yourself in a waythat when patients come to your
door, they know their problemalready You're the solution.
So instead of me telling themall these issues they have, I'm
telling them how I can fix alltheir issues, and for me that's
(17:08):
really rewarding and it takesaway a little bit of that hitman
aspect where and that makes itso much more enjoyable for me
and it allows me to see myselfin this career for a long period
of time, because I enjoy it,instead of going to work every
day.
The patient's telling me man, Ihate you, the dentist sucks and
(17:29):
now I have to get four crownsand a filling.
I thought I came in herescot-free and you know what the
dentist across the street said Iwas fine.
They said I didn't have any andit was totally good.
So I do like the aspect of fullarch focus dentistry, where they
come to me and they're like doc, I need all my teeth out.
How, how can you help me?
(17:49):
And I'm like perfect.
I'll tell you exactly what Iwould do.
You know, these are the, theseare the options you have and we
can go from there.
Um, so that's something thatyou know, I I really, really
enjoy about that.
Speaker 3 (18:03):
Well, don't stop talking about that.
Like, like, uh, uh, you know,don't stop talking about that.
Like, you know, don't stoptelling other dentists, you know
that there's a way to, like,become the healer, because
that's what Don Coyce talksabout.
You know, at the end of the day, we want to try to change the
narrative of a dentist goingfrom the hitman to being a
(18:26):
healer, and that's really whatyou describe is exactly what
that is is.
You know, we didn't cause yourproblem and I'm not here to
berate you about how we gotthere or to, you know, shame you
.
You know, for you know, havingyour teeth the way it is, like
I'm, you know I'm here to helpyou and you know, and it starts
(18:47):
by just what you said.
It starts by how may I help you?
What do you desire?
Because sometimes and I seethis a little in Full Arch
sometimes our desires to do acertain procedure will drive the
case and we, we will misssometimes the patient's desire
(19:11):
for maybe something else.
Yeah, and, and I, and I willtell you I have, uh, a lot of.
It starts by by prejudgingpeople and like it's the hardest
thing not to do in dentistryand if, when you learn not to.
It's the hardest thing not todo in dentistry.
And when you learn not to, itopens the doors.
And what I'm talking about isyou know we all thin slice
(19:34):
everybody that walks in thedoors in nanoseconds by, like
you know some people call ityour fight or flight, but like
we thin slice them in like, oh,you know they look dirty, they
talk funny.
You know they don't have anymoney.
You know they drove a piece ofshit car.
Know they look dirty, they talkfunny.
You know they like they don'thave any money.
You know they drove a piece ofshit car.
You know, like, whatever it is.
And all of a sudden you're likegod, do it?
Am I gonna go into my wholefull arch fixed?
(19:56):
you know, thing you know, orlike I think they're.
I think they'd be a better, Ithink they'd be better over
denture, canada, yeah, and earlyin my career, like the hard
thing about the hard thing aboutit for me was I was in a town
of 1,000 people.
I knew most of the people and myperception was that person
can't afford this so I wouldjust go straight to the
(20:18):
overdenture and hope that Icould get that.
But the reality is, if you do agood job of showing them value
in what you're doing, thehealing portion of it because we
all want to be healed, right.
So when you show them thehealed portion, they may not be
(20:39):
able to afford it, but you knowwhat their dad, their mom, their
brother, their aunt, theirsister, they may borrow the
money, they may go to Prusik,they can do all these things,
but they don't know that theycan do those because we didn't
show them, because we shut downwhen we saw them drive up in the
rusted out Corolla.
Yeah, and dentistry is hard inthat aspect because we do
(21:06):
prejudge people.
But we can open our minds tojust talking to every single
patient about what like, what ispossible for them, and then let
them.
Speaker 2 (21:18):
Let them decide absolutely the first thing that
I ask in a consult is what isyour goal here?
You know, why do you?
Every patient first thing I sayis what is your goal?
And you know why do you?
Every patient first thing I sayis what is your goal?
And then you know, like yousaid, maybe they don't have
enough money to to afford theprocedure.
But if their goal is to getinto fixed a fixed, you know
they don't want their dentureanymore, they're sick of it.
(21:39):
Or they come in with, you know,bombed out teeth and they're not
interested in a denture andthey just want to get something
that's fixed in a place.
Well, I'll at least go throughmy whole console with them and
I'll work with them as much as Ican to get to get them there,
or at least give them some ideas, so that way when they're ready
for it, I'm here for them.
Or you know, if their goal isjust they just want to smile and
(22:00):
they don't care about if it'sfixed in a place, they just want
something to replace theirteeth, well then of course I'm
not going to go into the wholefixed spiel.
So I think it's important, likeyou say, to get an idea of what
they're there for and what youknow, and once you know that you
can tailor your presentationtowards that and you are going
to get so much more success withone you know, closing the cases
(22:22):
, and two with at least you knowthey're going to think that
you're listening to them, sothey're going to appreciate that
and whenever they are ready toget whatever they need done,
you're there for them andthey're not going to go to
anybody else because you werethe one that was actually there
listening to them.
Speaker 3 (22:38):
Right, you know, one of the most basic desires of the
human is to be heard.
Basic desires of the human isto be heard and we sometimes
don't give them the opportunityto speak the way they do.
And I think you are exactlycorrect.
(22:58):
Like, I feel it's reallyimportant to you know, like ask
them those questions right, andthen shut up and listen or let
them talk and I know we're ontimeframes and things but, like
you know, when you, when you'retalking about a dual arch in the
money and stuff, like like they, they deserve to be heard and
you know, maybe being heard islike telling you that they
(23:21):
didn't, like you know where theywere at is in their deluge or
they may be.
Being heard is like my, you know, I made it 20 more years than
my parents, you know, beforethey lost their teens.
Or my grandparents, you know,whatever it is right, but like
they, they want to get it offtheir chest and they want to
talk to you about it.
And then, when they've beenheard, the conversation is over
(23:43):
and now you can.
Now you can go to work andfixing, you know, fixing them,
and they will feel like they cango forward with treatment
because, by God, that doctor.
He listened to me.
He listened to me and he laidout a green plan that I
understood and found a way forme to afford to be able to do
(24:07):
that.
And that person is what you'retrying to create and that's a.
That's a raving fan Like you're.
You're trying to go, you'retrying to create raving fans,
and here's someone else andyou'll you'll create a lot more
of them.
Speaker 1 (24:25):
Yeah, yeah, and I think that really is the key to
flipping that wholeproblem-solution dynamic you
were talking about, Because ifthey lead with the reason that
they're there and all the thingsthat their conditions have
taken from them, then you'representing a solution at the end
.
But if you just lead withtrying to fit this person into a
box, then you've created aproblem for them and they're
trying to run away from it.
It's not like they've kind ofled themselves to water.
(24:47):
You know they're they're tryingto run away from it.
You know it's not like they'vekind of led themselves to water.
You're trying to distract themto it and that, and that's just
not going to create a fan.
Speaker 3 (24:53):
Like you said, if you , if you, if you take that, you
know, like that, if you, if youoperate in that domain and your
practice, like you know you'llhave, you know you'll, you'll
have an abundance of patience,but then you know, you take that
out into the, into the rest ofyour life, and that is like you
know, something like, though,you know, most people just need
(25:14):
to get out of their own way.
Yeah, you know, and I know youhear that sometimes you're like,
oh, that's kind of corny, butlike, the reality is like the,
the only self-limiter you havein life is yourself.
You know, and like you want to.
Yeah, I mean, you guys know it.
Like you know, like in 2010, Ileft my, you know my, my
(25:34):
hometown of a thousand peoplewhere I built this big dodge
model to myself for a practice,and that I decided you know what
I, you know I was doing.
It was not a bright thing.
I was.
I was doing 300, 320 implants ayear pretty consistently, one
season, two seasons and thensome overdentures, but not real
big fixed work like that and Idecided that's what I want to do
(26:01):
.
So I talked to my family and Isaid, listen, we're going to
move two hours north to RapidCity, south Dakota, and we're
going to.
I'm going to open animplant-only practice from
scratch.
I'm going to rent twooperatories from an oral surgeon
who doesn't place implants andI'm going to make my business
(26:24):
completely referral-based fromthe other dentist.
Like no outside marketing, nodirect to consumer or anything
like that.
And I, you can imagine, likemost people in 20, it's a
different environment thanTuesday Like yeah, that guy's
crazy.
Speaker 1 (26:37):
Yeah, you know what I mean.
Speaker 3 (26:40):
You know you can't do that and I was like, okay, well
, I mean, maybe it proves outthat I can't.
I said, but would you let meinto your office?
Could I buy your office lunchand talk to your team about what
it would be like to implementgood implants into your practice
and have restorable implantsfor you?
(27:01):
If you could see yourself doingthat, I think that I could show
you a way to serve yourpatients and, you know, you know
even be more profitable at it.
And you know I did lunch andlearns in every damn office that
would let me in and I boughtlunches and cookies and bagels
and, like you, the fastest wayto a dentist's office is through
(27:23):
the stomach of the front deskand I would like I would serve
that, that through the stomachof the front desk, and I would
like I would serve that, thatthat community.
And you know when I, uh, when Ileft, uh, when I moved to
scottsdale, you know to to youknow the second, the second
epiphany you know that I did waslike you know what I'd done
this implant thing like that.
(27:45):
And you know my next, and I gotdivorced so I didn't have to
convince my family to move againbut, uh, my kids were grown,
but, um, I was like you knowwhat I want?
To go, I'm going to go make myliving giving back and teaching
people like, ah, nobody doesthat, you know, make their
living, you know, in education.
(28:05):
And I was like, well, whycouldn't I?
I said like, like I can only doso many and so many implants
with my hands.
Yeah, but training people to godo that.
I mean like, like, think aboutthe people that I can serve, you
know, by secondary intent,right, like like you know, uh,
(28:28):
as it goes out there andexponential impact yeah, you
know, and that's what I, that'swhat I set out to, that's what I
sent out to create.
And, you know, I didn't knowlike where I'm at today, like I
had no idea that's what I would,you know, I would be doing.
Speaker 1 (28:42):
But like I knew I, you know, I knew what I wanted
to do yeah and it just kind ofmorphed in along the way and I
was I'm super happy to be thatspace have you ever sat down and
kind of done the calculus onyou know how many doctors have
come through pathway maybe anaverage amount of their placing
per year and just try to kind ofget an idea of how many
(29:03):
implants have sort of beenplaced as a secondary result of
you starting pathway?
Speaker 3 (29:09):
You know I thought about doing that before I asked.
You know, asked by our licenseone time.
I'm just like, hey, let's likeyou know, like there's myself.
And then there's like you knowthe accounts that you know.
You know that may have beencreated from, you know, pathway,
and I'm just like like do youhave a number?
And they were just like thatmay have been created from
(29:30):
Pathway.
And I'm just like, do you havea number?
Speaker 1 (29:34):
And they were just like it's got to be a lot, and
that's what I thought I meanthat's great, but what's the
number?
Speaker 3 (29:39):
And they're just like , yeah, we don't know.
Do you really want to know?
And I was like, no, I'm notabout numbers, I don't even like
to say how many plans I didwhen I was back in my little
hotel, but, like, like thereality was I, I set out to in
my little hometown, like I setout to, uh, I had a motto that
(30:04):
we had on the top of awhiteboard in our break room and
it was no dentures, partials orbridges.
That was, that was, that was mymotto.
And there's almost exceptions,right, like like money and bad
bone and bad humans and stuff,but like, like, uh, like there's
always but, but our, our, Icall it an implant focused
(30:32):
practice.
And that is like we're going toprovide true truth replacement
solutions for our patients.
And I, I, I told like kind ofjust goes back to like, I try to
put these life experiences in.
You know that day one of uh,you know fast track, and I, I
tell them all, I said, no,you're all going to be in a
little bit of an ethical dilemmawhen you leave Pathway.
But they all kind of look at melike, what does that mean?
(30:53):
I said, well, all of you arejust in general dentistry right
now and you're going to go homeand I guarantee you by the end
of the month you're all up downa bridge.
And I said the ethical dilemmafor me and maybe I'm not putting
you said, you know, like theethical dilemma for me and maybe
I'm not putting you in one, butlike the ethical dilemma for me
was I couldn't in good faithtell my patients to have a
(31:19):
procedure done that I would havenever had done to myself for
yourself.
You know right, like, like, if,if I had the ability to have an
implant in a missing tooth site,you know, regardless of the
conditions on the other teeth,because, like that doesn't
matter, like it's not somethingthat I would have done to myself
and I can't do it to someoneelse, and it's not a, it's not
(31:42):
an elitist standpoint, it's justlike I don't want to do that.
Uh, and it car it, it causesyou to sometimes turn a patient
away.
You know it's usually the onethat's like, well, my insurance
patient, the branch is like,well, like, listen, like, like
you know, if you're, if youbroke your arm and your
insurance only paid for anamputation, like you'd probably
(32:04):
pull.
You'd probably pull out a pot,like keep your arm.
And you know, my assistants arealways like oh, that's such a
terrible analogy and I said, Iknow, but like, like, your teeth
are fucking important.
Yeah, like, like, stop.
Yeah, it's the same.
Speaker 2 (32:20):
It is no 100.
That is I actually.
I I like that analogy it.
Speaker 1 (32:26):
It's not bad.
Speaker 3 (32:26):
It's good, I might have to use that.
Speaker 1 (32:30):
It's not bad, I think I learned from someone else.
Speaker 2 (32:33):
Okay.
So just going back a little bit, just so I get a full scope,
because I don't really know yourwhole story.
It sounds like you went to, youlive in a small town and then
you moved, did your own implantoffice and then you went and
started Pathways.
Is there some stuff I'm missingin there?
We'd love to kind of listen tothe whole journey to where
Pathway is now and then evengoing into maybe how Pathway
(32:57):
started, what you first startedoffering and then what Pathway
has to offer now how it grew asan operation.
Speaker 1 (33:02):
Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3 (33:07):
Yeah, man, I'm from a small uh, I'm the fifth
generation to grow on my, on myfamily's cow ranch and uh farm
as well, and uh, um, you know, Idon't know anything other than
cows and wheat.
You know, like my dad's afourth generation, you know my
brother still works out there.
Like I don't, like, uh, Ididn't have dentistry in my
blood.
Nor, you know, when I went tothe university of Nebraska, you
(33:28):
know, in 1989, like it was to uh, uh, drink beer, watch college
football, I'm going to get an agdegree and go back home and do
the same thing that.
You know, the five generationsbefore me, you know the you know
the four generations for me didit themselves and I got into
implant dentistry.
Or I got into dentistry from amentor who actually turned out
to be my uh implant uh mentor.
(33:50):
Uh, roger Pluster in Lincoln,nebraska.
He was also from my hometown.
Uh, there's only two ABOI.
There's only two ABOI diplomatsuh, in the entire state of
Nebraska and they're uh, they'reboth from my hometown of a
thousand people in westernNebraska.
It's kind of uh anyway uh, youknow, I ended up going to dental
(34:11):
school in Oklahoma and I hadsome, met some great people and
got a great education.
And I went home and uhpracticed and then ultimately
bought out my childhood dentist,uh and um, you know, along the
way I should have in uh 80 or in98 uh, I'd made a trip to napa
(34:33):
uh when I was in dental school.
That presented as the paperthey got as the meeting and san
fran went to napa valley and upeven to spring mountain and uh
got the bug.
So went home back to the ranchand I planted a vineyard.
Uh planted five acres of winegrapes in nebraska and then in
2000 uh started the.
(34:54):
Uh started the third bondedwinery in the state of nebraska.
Uh, then uh, in 2006 I I soldit to my winemaker and I sold it
because, you know, the, thedentistry and the implant
dentistry in my practice wastaking off and the money I could
(35:14):
make and support my family.
There was just so muchdifferent than agriculture so I
moved.
That was my firstentrepreneurial activity was
planting a vineyard, selling it,building it up and selling it
and then I'd gone.
Obviously, in the early 2000sI'd gone to Mish.
(35:35):
That was the only place youcould go.
I went to learn from Carlhimself out in Detroit, went
there nine times to learn andcame home and I implemented it.
You know, to learn and camehome and I implemented it.
And you know the people onWestern Nebraska, like you know,
like rural, rural farmers andranchers, like you know, they
have money but they they don'tspend it unless they they see a
(35:59):
value or like they're very like,they're kind of a tough sell
because they don't like if theydon't see the value that they're
not going to write a check for.
And uh, so, uh, I was able, I'mable to talk their language
because I'm from that, you know,and business took off and
implants and I, I found, likeyou guys, like, like, implants
(36:21):
is all I want to do, you know,like it's the gratification of
the, the, the, the jobsatisfaction that I got from and
I didn't get from anything elsein dentistry and I think that
had I not got into implants, youknow, hey, we wouldn't be
talking that be, uh, uh.
I think I don't know if I wouldhave stayed in denver.
I think I would have probablyended up just ranching and
farming with my dad because,like that, that was a more, that
(36:44):
was more passionate than I wasfor general industry and I think
I would have went thatdirection.
So in around 2009, I started.
It was tough economic time butI really wanted to do more
implants and I was like you know, the only way I can I'm maxed
out on like my airhead.
You know they were alreadystarting to drive hundreds of
(37:05):
miles to see me because therewas no one else out in this part
of the country placing implants.
I was like I need more people.
I moved two hours up to SouthDakota, naurupt City.
I went from a town of 1,000people to some more zeros, to
almost 100,000.
I started marketing myself.
(37:25):
I went from general dentistryto an implant-only shop I ran
that from.
I was there from 2010 tomid-2017.
Then I moved down here.
I'll come back to that in asecond.
I moved down here at youprobably know Chris Barrett we
(37:48):
just had him on.
Speaker 2 (37:48):
We just had him on.
Speaker 3 (37:51):
Yeah, I don't know if he said that or not.
Speaker 2 (37:52):
He did.
Speaker 3 (37:53):
Chris went from general dentistry to implants to
.
He moved to Rapid City and wasmy associate in there during A
the years during my divorce.
But when I went off to go, uh,get a implant, uh, pathway, and
what came about by really, youknow, you know bio horizons and
(38:17):
and icad and some of the imagingplaces like they would they
started asking me if I wouldspeak to, like the study clubs
and like I just remember, likethe, the like today I would
never actually do what I didthat day and it's because they.
The first gig I had was uh, uhin albany, new york, at the
albany county study club andactually it was the albany
(38:39):
county world surgeons study cluband I was to go up there and
talk about restorations onimplants.
And uh, from rapid city, southdakota, I flew from rapid to
denver, denver to newark, newarkto albany all day long so I had
to leave on wednesday to do athursday night presentation, and
(38:59):
then you can't leave that night, so then it was all day friday
to come back and I and Iliterally did it for my travel
and expenses, and you know.
So you took three days off andI fucking loved it, like it was
like, and you know, and you gotgood reviews and they started
asking you to do it more andmore.
And then I had the conversationwith you know it was Steve
(39:22):
Bogan, who's the CEO ofBioHorizons, who would be an
amazing guest for you on this,by the way.
Speaker 2 (39:29):
Definitely.
Speaker 3 (39:32):
These guys.
There are a couple ofbiomechanical engineers that
started BioHorizons inBirmingham and Alabama and it's
now the third largest implantcompany in the world.
They did it in 30 years.
Anyway, at the same time aroundthis time, you know, uh, coral
mish got sick with aglioblastoma and uh, uh, steve
(39:54):
was like like there's gonna be avoid, justin, and he goes like
there isn't anybody out there.
That's got, you know, the thekind of passion that you do and
he kind of encouraged me to, youknow, do some more courses.
Wasn't like necessarily, hey,go create this like big thing.
You know, like like you shouldstep into that.
And he goes because you're just, you know, you're one of, I was
(40:17):
one of two of carl's firstmasterships that he gave.
So, like it was, it was theright time for me personally as
well.
So went down there and leasedout this eight chair old clinic
and put some chairs in there andsome computers and convinced
Acteon to drop a CVCT in there,cause now I didn't have money to
(40:40):
like like build this Dodge mallor anything.
And that's how it.
That's how it got started.
And you know, chris Barrett wasworking my office back in rapid
and uh, uh, you know he wasflying down, you know, basically
every other week, you know, tomentor the courses and you know
and teach with me.
And I just remember, one day,you know, chris said yeah,
(41:02):
because I don't think I reallywant to live in Rapid anymore.
Speaker 1 (41:05):
And.
I was like I don't like goingto shit.
Speaker 3 (41:08):
Then I was like you know, justin, you don't either.
Speaker 1 (41:12):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (41:12):
And I was like, yeah, you're right, man.
So I said, well, what do youwant to do?
And he's just like I don't know.
He's like I love Scottsdale andI love there all the time and I
said you know what I said let'spack up everything and wrap it.
Let's find a space inScottsdale and let's drop it in
(41:34):
and let's go.
And that's how his office andultimately was the Brightly
thing Ultimately.
That's how it got started.
Instead of just pulling theplug and plug and wrapping, I'm
just like shit.
We got a whole office full ofstuff like we don't need
anything.
Just let's, let's find adifferent place.
We moved out and, uh, you knowthat part's.
(41:55):
You know, chris is, you know, adear, dear friend of mine and
one of the most gifted surgeonsthat I know, amazing, and if I
was to say something about him,I would tell you that you'll be
hard pressed to find someonethat is as clean of a surgeon as
(42:16):
him, like his incisions arealways on point, they're always
full thickness, reflected, theAlvy is like he put a planer on
it, you know, and lately you runit through a damn.
Uh, you know a table saw, youknow, like it's perfect and and
(42:40):
it, he's a and he's good, yeah,which checks a lot of boxes for
me.
So, uh, you know, we, whichchecks a lot of boxes for me.
So we went through, we grewPathway, you know, through the
years of 2020 came around, covidcame around and there was a.
We really needed to expand theclinic, we needed more chairs
(43:02):
for the surgeries and, you know,in March you know, march was
kind of funny because we'releasing this new space so we
signed this lease for this newspace and then Proven hits and
then I'd hired Steve Vorholt andliterally he moved to Arizona
(43:23):
six days before we closed, theworld closed, and I was just
like sorry, buddy, but at theend of the day we spent all the
lockdown redoing lectures andpaperwork and fine-tuning the
machine and doing the thingsthat he did.
(43:44):
And I took a gamble on myselfand I was like you know what,
this is going to wreck a lot ofpeople, but when we come out of
this, people are going to neededucation and so we put the
hammer down on building out thatspace and shit.
We did our first live surgery.
(44:05):
We closed the 20th of March andwe did the first, uh, live
surgery.
We did our.
We closed the 20th of march andwe did, uh, the first fast
track.
I think that second or third ofmay.
Oh, wow, we were.
We were like, and you know,arizona was open and so many of
these things.
You know how washington wasclosed for almost six months.
You know.
So like, uh, all these peoplecame there because they, their
(44:26):
practices were still slow or notopen and they, they you know I
had some covet money and that,uh, we just started like and
that's what just really likeramped us because we kind of had
center stage without anyoneelse, like in that parameter,
and the people that are involvedwith pathway, the, the mentors,
(44:47):
like I've only as good aspeople that I have around me,
I'm like like there's some OGmentors that are the best of
class and they, they give ittheir time and and we put out.
I think we put out a.
You know, I think we put out agood product and I know that I
know this from all the docs outthere that do do a good job and
(45:11):
like, uh, that's what I'm mostproud of.
You know, like I'm I'm, youknow I'm proud of my boys.
Uh, you know, proud of my twoboys.
Like you know, that wouldalways be number one for me, uh,
but you know, second off wouldbe, you know, uh, I'm proud of
the, the, the environment ofthat, and the family that we've
created with pathway, causethat's uh, uh, yeah, like that
(45:32):
is my family.
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