June 6, 2025 • 34 mins
Mandi McKay, Chief Sustainability and Social Impact Officer at Sierra Nevada, shares how the company is raising the bar for sustainable brewing. 🌿🍺
Learn more about Sierra Nevada:
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Steven (00:01):
Welcome to the Four Worlds Podcast from Tomorrow's
World Today.
We're diving into the latest intech, science, and
sustainability, from nature'smysteries and the world of
inspiration, to the hands-oncrafts of creation, the bold
breakthroughs of innovation, andthe scaled-up wonders of
production.
This is your ticket to thestories shaping tomorrow.
(00:23):
Welcome into the show,everyone.
Today, we're focusing onsustainability.
And bringing in that, we're sohappy to have the Chief
Sustainability Officer withSierra Nevada Brewing, Mandi
McKay.
She joins us today.
Mandy, how are you?
Thank you so much for joiningus.
Mandi (00:40):
Hi, good.
Thank you, Stephen.
It's a pleasure to be here.
Steven (00:43):
Yeah, it's a pleasure to have you and jumping right into
it, sustainability in the beermaking process, I guess is what
we're going to be talking about.
So let's just go back to SierraNevada's goals and their
missions with sustainability.
Give people a little bit ofbackground, how important
sustainability really is to yourprocess.
Mandi (01:03):
Yeah, so sustainability, the word itself literally is one
of our core values.
So it was truly built in to thecompany's founding, our e How
we think about our operationsand how we do business.
And it's been that way sinceday one.
So, you know, we were foundedin 1980 by Ken Grossman in
Chico, California.
(01:24):
And we now have two breweriesspanning the country and about
1100 employees.
And so, as I said, it's trulyembedded in the fabric of who we
are and how we operate.
I've been with the company justabout 17 years now.
helping lead and grow oursustainability program.
So I've seen it evolve, butwhat I can say is it's truly,
(01:45):
it's why I've stayed.
It's why we have a lot ofemployees come to work for us.
It's because we do it right andwe embed it in everything that
we do from day-to-day operationsto our products and how we
think about our communities andour employees.
Steven (01:59):
Yeah, and take me to the two locations.
There's one in North Carolinaand there's one in California.
How are they similar and howare they different when it comes
to sustainability and kind ofimplementing sustainability in
the beer making process at thesetwo locations?
Mandi (02:18):
Yeah.
So again, we were founded inChico, California.
So our headquarter brewery andkind of our home base is
Northern California.
So Chico is about an hour and ahalf north of Sacramento.
So we've been here for almost40 years, 45 years.
And when we opened our NorthCarolina brewery about 10 years
(02:39):
ago.
Obviously, we took a lot oflearnings from everything we did
in Chico and got to put that inplace and think differently and
with much more forethought andplanning when we opened Mills
River.
So let me start with, so we dothe same core philosophies and
thinking around closing loopsand zero waste and energy and
water efficiency all We'reapproaching those things.
(03:01):
We're doing the same work, butthe approaches are different.
So with Chico, it's an olderfacility.
We've added on over thedecades.
So it's less efficient justinherently because we've had to
literally add buildings ontothat facility over time.
Whereas when we opened MillsRiver, we can design in a lot of
efficiencies, also a lot ofguest experience, and people can
(03:22):
actually see the process andsee all the cool work that we're
doing around sustainability.
The other difference that Iwould say is in Chico, you know,
We grew up in this community,so people know who we are.
They know our commitment tothis work.
They know how we operate.
So when we opened Mills River,that's a new community that
people didn't know us as well.
So when we went there, it wasintentional to literally show in
(03:45):
the building itself.
how much we are committed tosustainability and sustainable
operations.
So we knew during the designprocess, we want to be LEED
certified.
So LEED is leadership in energyand environmental design, and
it's a building certificationthat you can achieve for natural
lighting, water efficiency,energy efficiency, the building
(04:07):
materials that you use if yourecycle and capture rainwater.
So we knew very early on, hey,we're going into new community.
It's really important for thatcommunity to know, who we are as
a brand and as a company.
So lead certification wassomething we chose to
specifically do.
And when we started buildingthat brewery, we thought, well,
let's just make sure we're leadcertified, which is like the
lowest level of certificationthat you can get.
(04:28):
But then you can go up tosilver, you can go up to gold,
you can go up to platinum.
So as we started building, youknow, we couldn't help
ourselves.
And we thought, well, what doesit take to get to gold?
What does it take to get toplatinum?
And what's really excitingabout what we were able to
achieve out there and how we gotthat platinum level
certification was what we did inthe brew house around
sustainability and efficiency.
(04:49):
So again, we took everything welearned for the past 40 years
in Chico and basically built oneof the most efficient brew
houses that you can in thatNorth Carolina brewery.
That energy modeling that wedid to as part of the LEED
certification, that is what gotus to that platinum
certification.
So it's all the heat and steamthat we are recovering and
(05:12):
recycling, all the energyefficiency processes that we put
in place to that brew house,that's what kind of got us to
that final platinumcertification.
And so...
The other thing I'll touch onis the difference approach with
water.
So obviously we're thinkingabout water a lot as a brewery
because it's something we use alot of.
But in California, you thinkabout water very differently
than you do in North Carolina.
(05:33):
So in Chico, we do a lot moredrought tolerant landscaping and
removing lawns and things likethat.
And then still, of course, allthe efficiency work inside the
brew house.
In North Carolina, where itrains most of the year, we can
actually do rainwater capture.
So we installed rainwatersystems.
And an underground cistern andwe can capture all that water
(05:54):
and use it for non potable needslike toilet flushing or
irrigation.
So we wouldn't do that in Chicobecause it just it doesn't rain
enough doesn't make any senseto have rain water at that scale
in Chico.
So those are just a coupleexamples of how we're working on
the same things but approachingthem very differently at the
two facilities.
Steven (06:12):
And you know, the one in North Carolina, I used to live
in Greenville, South Carolina,and there was a few trips up to
Asheville where it wasn't a tripwithout stopping.
to sierra nevada and and and iwant to touch on that you know
just at that location just froma personal experience it goes
beyond the beer i mean the fooda lot of it is grown on site in
(06:35):
a true kind of farm to tableaspect so maybe someone thinks
of sierra nevada most peoplemight think of it just beer but
explain how even the food oneit's delicious and two it's
right there for you
Mandi (06:47):
yeah you make a really good point and it's something i
often share is that yes we arebrewery, but we do a lot more
than just make beer, right?
Like the beer is amazing.
That's who we are.
That's what we do.
But we also run amazingrestaurants and tap rooms.
And then to your point, both ofour restaurants do utilize our
onsite garden.
And so we have teams at bothbreweries that that is what they
(07:08):
do.
And they farm and grow producefor the restaurants.
We do it organically and wehave a whole team dedicated to
that work.
And so we're growing fruits,vegetables, herbs that go
directly into the restaurant,obviously the most local
sustainable food you could get.
I mean, we're, we still have topurchase, you know, quite a bit
of food and we're not doingeverything, but for the things
(07:30):
that make a lot of sense for youto grow yourself, we are doing.
And so we're, we're farmers,you know, we're brewers, we're
farmers.
We do all kinds of things.
Especially in North Carolina.
We also, we have sheep andchickens and a couple of
donkeys.
And so, yeah, we do, wedefinitely have more than just
beer.
So when you come to that sitein particular, you you get a
(07:51):
much bigger experience on top ofour beer.
Steven (07:54):
Yeah.
And I think that's reallyimportant to mention because
Sierra Nevada, it really is,it's more than just beer, but
really what brought us to thisinterview was of course beer.
There's two beers coming outthis summer exclusively for this
summer.
Let's jump into that becauseit's the summer of
sustainability and sustainablebrewing with the Summerfest and
(08:15):
the Pale Ale.
Just kind of go over theprocesses with these two beers
coming out this summer.
and, you know, how you fitsustainability in that brewing
process.
Mandi (08:24):
So I'll talk about pale for first.
So pale ale for...
listeners that don't know, youknow, it's our, it's our
flagship beer.
It's how we're known.
People only know us by Sierrapale ale.
And that's great because itliterally is a pioneer brew.
It's helped, it helped launchthe American craft beer industry
and it's, it is the standardand the go-to for so many
(08:46):
people.
And there's a reason for thatbecause it's iconic and it's
really good.
And so what I would say to thatis one thing that's really
exciting this year that we aredoing with pale is our
partnership with the nationalpark foundation.
And so what, What's unique, butalso really exciting and
something we've never donebefore is take something like
our flagship, which normally youdon't touch a flagship.
Steven (09:09):
Hands off.
Mandi (09:10):
Exactly.
It's a flagship for a reason.
It's an icon for a reason.
It stands on its own.
We've never done anything likethis, but when you think
about...
what Sierra Nevada stands for.
We have this very deepconnection to the natural world
that comes from our founder andour owner, Ken Grossman, that
has been carried with us for allthese decades.
When you take another icon likethe national parks that we all
(09:33):
know and love that are trulyiconic places, you can actually
bring the two icons together andit makes a lot of sense.
And so you're kind ofcelebrating the two icons and
they help each other.
So we're really excited aboutthat partnership.
It launched about a month agoand you'll see some limited pale
ale packaging coming out thissummer.
So we're highlighting sixdifferent, um, national parks
(09:54):
and, um, literally on thepackaging, you will see these
landscapes, excuse me, I thinkit's four national parks, um,
you'll see these beautifullandscapes that kind of take the
pale ale imagery, but show offa national park.
We're also donating to theNational Park Foundation as part
of this partnership to makesure they can keep doing their
work around landscape andwildlife conservation, things
(10:15):
that we care a lot about.
For pale ale, I'm reallyexcited about that campaign and
that partnership, and we'll seewhere it goes, but they're kind
of collector's items, at least Ihope they will be.
I hope it gets people excitedabout pale ale and reignites
their love of pale
Steven (10:30):
ale.
Mandi (10:30):
Put them to a national And like collect those
packagings.
Steven (10:34):
Yeah.
Yeah.
And I have the national parks.
It's Yosemite, Yellowstone, BigBend and Great Smoky Mountains
National Park.
And I've looked at the pack.
I mean, just it's really,really cool packaging.
I was looking on the website,just looking at the design of
the cans in the in the packagingitself.
And that kind of piques ourinterest because we are the four
(10:57):
worlds podcast.
It goes inspiration, creation,innovation, and production.
Creation and inspiration arereally coming together.
The natural world, just likeyou said, and the creative world
with these designs on thepackaging.
So I just wanted to throw thatin there.
Just such a cool aspect and areally neat idea.
And of course, it all goes to agood cause in the national
(11:18):
parks.
Mandi (11:18):
Yes, agreed.
Again, we're super excitedabout it.
And it's the first time we'veever done something like this.
like it.
So pale ale, again, it speaksfor itself, but also this
partnership is just reallyexciting.
And on Summerfest, it's anotheralmost iconic in its own way,
seasonal that we've had out formany, many years.
People look forward to it, justlike all of our seasonals.
(11:39):
But Summerfest in particular,for the last couple of years,
we've been putting in somesustainably grown barley that we
have a partnership with out ofOregon.
So we are doing a lot more.
We're thinking a lot more aboutour supply chain.
So we've always had this strongconnection with our barley
farmers and our hop growers.
But as we move forward intosome of the work that my team is
(12:02):
doing around our hop forwardambitions The supply chain is
coming in a lot more, and we'regoing to be thinking and talking
more with our suppliers aboutfarming practices or recycled
content when it comes topackaging materials.
So I'm really excited about thebarley that is in Summerfest,
and you can learn more aboutthat.
So we're doing a lot more ofthinking about the ingredients
(12:23):
and showcasing them in some ofthese iconic products that we do
offer.
Steven (12:26):
Right.
And it's something you don't–it's important, but it's
something you don't think aboutwhen you're cracking open a
beer.
And it really is– It's good toshed light on that actual
process because some people justdon't understand what it takes
to go through that.
And then when you're doing itin a sustainable way, it's
really important to shed lighton that.
(12:57):
Right.
So
Mandi (13:05):
I've used a definition, the same definition for decades
now on what I thinksustainability means.
It really is kind of a textbookdefinition and there's two sort
of parts to it.
One is just a philosophicalidea around it, which for me,
the one I share most often isthat it really is this idea of
meeting the needs of the presentwithout jeopardizing future
(13:26):
generations' ability to do thesame.
So at a very big macro level,That's what sustainability means
to me is we should be doingthings today that aren't going
to negatively impact the futureand future generations to also
live the way we do.
Right.
So that's kind of very big,high level.
There's also when you break itdown, what you're really saying,
what sustainability reallymeans is sustaining a system.
(13:49):
In this case, we're a business.
It's a brewery.
So we're trying to sustain ourbusiness.
And that starts all the waywith our supply chain to our
operations and then ourconsumers down the line.
There's usually a three partdefinition also where in most
systems, whether you're abusiness or a city or a county
or a state or a household, youare trying to balance the
(14:11):
environmental, the social andthe economic needs of that
system.
So a lot of times people equatesustainability all with the
environmental piece.
which is, that's fair.
And that makes a lot of sensebecause usually that is where
the work is being done.
Again, for us, it's energyefficiency in our brew house or
water efficiency or zero waste.
But you also need to thinkabout the social piece and the
(14:33):
economic piece.
So for a business, yeah, it'ssustainability is quarter our
values.
It's who we are, but we arealso a business.
So at the end of the day, we dohave to be financially viable,
right?
And that we have money toreinvest and do more work and
take care of our employees anddo more initiatives and
projects.
And then, of course, on thesocial side, for us, it's our
(14:53):
employees.
It's our consumers.
It's the communities in whichwe work and live.
So...
That's how I think that's howI've always thought about
sustainability.
That's how I try to communicateit and share it is a lot of
environmental work, but it'salso much broader than that.
And they all support eachother.
So often the work that we doaround efficiency or zero waste
(15:14):
does positively impact thebottom line.
So they're not mutuallyexclusive, right?
Things that you're doing toreduce emissions or reduce waste
or save water often do havefinancial benefits as well.
So they all have interplayingwith each other and support.
on each other.
Steven (15:30):
Right.
Yeah.
Again, I mean, you said itbest, you know, when it comes
down to it, you are a businessand, and keeping that business
afloat, you have to keep itsustainable.
You have to sustain, you know,you have to sustain those
operations, you know, and goingin, going into that through the
brewing process, of course,through your side of work, you
(15:50):
know, what are some of those,let's say cutting edge
technologies or practices thatSierra Nevada has implemented in
the process that are innovativeto the industry?
Mandi (16:00):
Yeah.
A couple of things that I wouldsay there's still...
They were innovative, and I'mnot sure if they're still
cutting edge.
Steven (16:09):
Maybe at one point they were cutting
Mandi (16:12):
edge.
At one point they were, and itis still hard to do, so I will
talk about them because we dothem really well.
So a couple things that SierraNevada does within the brewing
process specifically, I alreadykind of mentioned it, but a lot
of heat and steam recovery.
That's what makes somethingsuper efficient.
And so what we do really well,and I'll explain that.
I'll give a couple examples.
Steven (16:30):
Yeah, please.
Mandi (16:31):
we think about anything that's leaving a process.
So like a waste stream or abyproduct, we are really good at
thinking about how to reusethat and bring it back in as a
resource, either for the sameprocess or a different process.
So let me give an example.
So brewing is very heatintensive, right?
You're doing a lot of boilingand using steam.
So off of our kettles oranytime we've got a situation
(16:54):
where we are boiling a liquid,you're obviously going to
release heat and steam as partof that process.
So you can install things likeheat recovery, vapor condensers,
steam recovers, steam recoverycondensers.
You bring all that, youcondense steam back into water.
Now you've got hot water thatcan go back into the next batch
of beer, right?
Or same with steam and heat.
If you can collect heat, youcan now use that heat to warm up
(17:18):
cold water.
Sometimes you need to do that.
We need hot water for thebrewing process.
So if we can get heat from thecurrent boiling process, use
that heat to heat up the waterfor the next batch of beer,
that's another process we do.
We do a lot of that, both inthe brew house, but also in a
couple other systems that wehave to make electricity and
energy where we're covering heatoff those as well.
(17:39):
So almost any time we've gotheat leaving a system, we're
capturing that and reusing it insome way.
Again, it's not superinnovative.
It's just literally thinkingabout hey, this is a waste
stream that we could probablyreuse and make ourselves more
efficient.
So we do that really, reallywell.
And that's part of what led usto that LEED Platinum
certification.
(17:59):
A couple other examples.
So same thing, you've got heator steam leaving a system.
Oftentimes we need to cool downThe wort, so this is the liquid
that is eventually going tobecome beer, is called wort
before it becomes beer.
That wort has to get cooleddown before it goes into
fermentation.
You can't add yeast into hotliquid, otherwise you kill your
(18:22):
yeast, and the yeast is what isgoing to make your alcohol for
you.
So when we have a boilingliquid that we need to cool down
very quickly to send it tofiltration, you can use a heat
exchange process.
So you've got this hot liquid,you need to cool it down, you
run it past Very simple, butagain, kind of innovative and
(18:51):
really smart ways to think aboutheat transfer and heat
recovery.
Those are the best examplesthat I have for efficiency in
the brewing process.
And then I would just say, wethink a lot about what our R&D
team and our brewing teams aredoing now is how do you like,
how do we get really detailedand efficient with like our
(19:12):
boiling times?
Do we really need to boil foran hour and a half?
Could we boil for an hour?
Can we reduce that temperaturejust a little bit?
And what impact does that haveon the beer or not?
So now we're getting into like,we've done a lot of the low
hanging fruit.
Now it's the next step ofreally dialing in timing,
temperatures, differentingredients or different ways.
(19:32):
Is there a different barleythat doesn't have to boil as
long?
So there's all kinds of thingsthat we're thinking about in our
R&D side to continue kind ofthat efficiency journey.
Steven (19:42):
Yeah.
And really, you took the wordsright out of my mouth because I
was going to ask, what are thosebehind the scenes?
What does that look like whenit comes down to thinking of new
ways to, maybe not new ways,but just ways to kind of stay
ahead of the curve and justcontinue to innovate and build
on what's what you already haveas a foundation.
Mandi (20:03):
Another good example of kind of that behind the scenes,
and it's hard to explain and itfeels really nuanced, but water,
on the water side, Most of thewater consumption and the water
usage in a brewery is forcleaning because you have to
keep everything clean.
There's multiple stages ofcleaning and it's very important
for beer quality andmicrobiology and all those
things.
(20:23):
A couple things we've done isthe cleaning processes that you
do have to use to clean outtanks once beer is smoothed out
or the pipes.
They're called CIP processesand we've spent a lot of time
thinking about can you reusesome of that cleaning water or
cleaning chemical?
Can you recover it and use itagain instead of building up a
whole new batch.
We've done a lot of work onthat and significantly reduced
(20:46):
water and cleaning chemical,which again goes back to that,
like it saves water, but it alsosaves money on chemicals.
So they kind of go hand inhand.
There's lots of ways to kind ofthink through and how much
water do you actually need?
is the spray nozzle coveringthe entire tank or is it only
hitting one side of the tank sonow you're having to use more
water to get the rest of thetank so there's like there's a
(21:07):
lot of very like details andvariables that go into like how
much more efficient can we getwith our water and our chemicals
especially in those in thosecleaning processes because
that's where most of the wateris being used
Steven (21:18):
yeah and i just want people to to when they listen to
this realize all of the littleintricacies that go into that
can of sierra nevada or thedraft of Sierra Nevada that
you're drinking because itreally is.
And I could see it in you justgoing through each and every
little detail that you, theproduction staff, everyone at
(21:41):
Sierra Nevada really, trulycares about the product and
always continuing to be better.
Mandi (21:46):
You know, I really appreciate that because we do
take it very seriously.
And there is a lot of work thatdoes go into every can or
bottle of beer.
And, you know, you don't seeit.
And I wouldn't expect peopleto, you know, you don't really,
Steven (21:59):
we
Mandi (21:59):
all buy beverages and you don't necessarily think about
all that.
But there's a lot.
And we think and hope that youcan really taste that, right?
That comes through.
It's very high quality.
We think we put a lot of timeand effort into the innovation
and the quality and thesustainability of our products.
Hopefully you can taste that aswell.
Steven (22:18):
I personally, from a personal effect, you can, you
can, you can, you can taste,let's say like you can taste the
love that you guys put that youguys put into the brewing
process.
Now let's talk, you have the,you have the Chico, California
and you have the North Carolinafacility.
Take me through a distributionwhere, you know, where's it go?
Is it all over the country?
(22:38):
Give someone, you know, give mean idea of, of how much you're
actually distributing from thesetwo locations.
Mandi (22:44):
Yeah, that's a great question.
So we're currently, we're thethird largest craft brewer in
the country.
And again, we have our twobrewing facilities, California
and North Carolina, but we dodistribute to all 50 states.
So you can find our products inall 50 states.
You're not going to find everyone of our products in all those
states.
Our, you know, we're certainlylargest markets are in
(23:04):
California and North Carolinaand kind of on the coasts.
But again, we do distribute allover.
So we're a pretty large brewerwhen it comes to craft, but
we're still pretty small when itcomes to just sort of brewing
more broadly.
We're actually still kind of amedium, small size business
overall, but large in craft beerbecause most of craft breweries
(23:27):
are very small, right?
So we're large in terms ofcraft.
We make about a little over amillion barrels of beer a year.
That is big for craft, butsmall for kind of domestic beer
and breweries overall.
Steven (23:40):
And just talking about that brings up another
interesting point.
What kind of challenges do youface?
Just thinking about, in thegrand scheme of things, being
kind of a smaller craft brewery,what are some of those
challenges that you face tocontinue to produce as much as
you do in a sustainable way?
Mandi (23:59):
Yeah.
From a sustainabilityperspective, there are some
challenges because if we werelarger, some of those things
would make even more financialsense or be easier to do.
So we are kind of in a weirdmiddle space where we're not
small, but we're not big.
Sometimes that's a benefit.
Other times it's a barrier anda challenge where it has made
sense, especially fromsustainability.
(24:21):
So things like recovering ourCO2.
or treating our wastewater, ourown wastewater on site, those
things you do kind of have toreach a certain threshold to
where they make sense to do.
So much smaller breweries,Right.
Right.
Recovering our CO2 means allthe CO2 that's coming off of our
(25:01):
fermentation tanks.
We capture all that CO2.
We could just release it.
And that's what most breweriesdo.
It just goes, vents to theatmosphere.
Steven (25:08):
We
Mandi (25:09):
capture all of that.
We compress it down.
We reuse it.
So again, closing a loop andusing a waste product as a
resource.
We use all of that collectedCO2 to purge tanks, to move beer
from process to process.
We use it for some of our draftsystems.
So if you come on site andyou're getting a beer poured on
drafts, you are likely gettingit.
(25:30):
It's being pushed with recycledCO2.
So once you get to a certainsize, things like that makes
sense.
Similar with wastewatertreatment, you reach a certain
size and it makes a lot moresense for you to pre-treat your
brewing wastewater before yousend it to the municipal
treatment plant for furthertreatment.
So both of our breweries, wehave these really, really
(25:50):
amazing, great examples ofclosing the loop, wastewater
treatment plants.
And what those are doing,they're anaerobic digesters.
So we're taking all the brewingwater that's used to make beer.
So no sewer water, no sinks, nokitchens, no bathrooms, but all
the water that's used in thebrewing process.
Goes down the drain, it goes toour onsite wastewater treatment
plant, goes through anaerobicdigestion.
(26:12):
So it's basically a littlebacteria, little anaerobes.
They're eating all the leftoverorganic matter in that water.
They generate a biogas as abyproduct of that process.
They are treating the water.
That water then goes to thecity for further treatment.
That biogas that we're able tocapture from the wastewater
treatment plant, we use thatbiogas to then make electricity
(26:34):
for the brewery.
We do that by sending thatbiogas through microturbines.
Microturbines use a gas to thenmake electricity.
So super cool cool onsiteclosed loop example of literally
going from brewing wastewaterto electricity for the site.
So again, when you are largeenough, you get to do fun things
(26:54):
like that.
But where we're not largeenough is sometimes, you know,
it's, we're kind of like certainsize of equipment.
So like for one example, we'relooking for a new alternative
for some of our small productruns where we need a certain
kind of carrier.
So like a six pack carrier.
Steven (27:13):
Yeah.
Mandi (27:13):
We are too big for the small machine.
We are not big enough for thebig machine.
And so we're kind of trying tofind this perfect.
We've got to find somebody thathas this midsize machine so
that we can, we want to move tothis different six pack carrier.
So that's, that's one example Ican think of where it just like
we're right in the middle.
Yeah.
Perfect sometimes, butchallenging.
(27:35):
It
Steven (27:36):
sounds like you're in the market to commercialize the
midsize yourselves.
Yeah.
There, a new project for you.
Mandi (27:44):
Yep.
We can lead the way.
And we often do.
We've often been kind of aleader or a guinea pig on some
technologies and things, whichis part of the innovation that
we do.
Steven (27:54):
Yeah.
And how do you stay ahead ofthat, trying to be, let's say, a
model for others?
Mandi (28:03):
A
Steven (28:04):
loaded question.
A loaded question, right?
Mandi (28:07):
We are lucky in that Again, we are founded by
somebody who has always thoughtabout, so he's driven by
efficiency.
He's also driven by, hey, I'lltake a risk and be the first
person to use hydrogen fuelcells, for example.
We were like the first breweryto ever use hydrogen fuel cells
to make electricity.
And we are still the first andonly brewery that has an onsite
(28:32):
hot rock composting system.
So we've taken risks.
We've thought about thingsdifferently.
We are often a pilot for, fordifferent technology.
So I think that's part of it isthat you have that spirit and
interest and curiosity to liketry things.
I think that's what helps keepsus, you know, doing that.
And as a leader, you know,we're proud of being a leader
and we do think about being aleader for the rest of the craft
(28:55):
brewing industry.
I mean, if you, if we can helplead it, then everyone wins and
everyone, you know, the wholeindustry kind of benefits from
anything that we or otherbreweries our size do.
So I think we, we know that weknow we have a responsibility
and a pride in the leader thatwe have.
So we want to make sure we'redoing our part for the industry
and beyond.
Steven (29:13):
Yeah, absolutely.
And from the top down, there's,I'm sure, a lot of hands that
go into the brewing process andeverything in between.
How do these teams, whetherit's, again, from the top down,
how do they ensure that thesesystems stay efficient, that are
effective and are scalableacross all your facilities?
Mandi (29:34):
It is 100% a team effort.
And we are getting, I thinkevery business probably
struggles a little bit with, youknow, collaboration and
cross-functional work is socritical.
And I think we've inherentlyalways done a good job, but
everyone has ways to improve.
And so we are, it's a constant,you have to constantly remind
yourself and your teams aroundyou to bring people in.
(29:56):
We're all on the same team.
We're all working on thistogether.
And, you know, but we're reallylucky that that has always kind
of been inherent to who we are.
And I think it goes back to Kenand our founder, who's his
impact.
You see it still today.
Right.
So it's how we operate.
But we do have so I will say myteam, we have two people
dedicated solely tosustainability at each brewery.
(30:18):
So one one person in Chico, oneperson in Mills River.
That's their whole job is tomake sure the programs that we
have in place for zero waste,for efficiency, for greenhouse
gas reduction.
Those programs are maintained.
They're top of mind.
So that person is, you know,managing and keeping everyone
kind of connected on that work.
But it does take all teams.
And I would say in the same waythat it takes everyone
(30:38):
committed to quality.
or to safety.
Sustainability is the same.
So everyone's job in some wayis a sustainability job or a
safety job or a quality job.
So that's how, but it is, ittakes intention and action and
reminding, you know, that's,it's everyone's job and we're
all, we're all kind of like partof it.
So we do have people dedicatedto it, but it's definitely
(31:00):
embedded into everyone's role.
Steven (31:02):
Absolutely.
I mean, again, you said itbest.
It's, it's a team effort whenit comes down to.
Let's get into the, you know,two beers that we, you know,
talked about with the in theSummerfest, especially the Pale,
those exclusive packaging.
Who can find those?
Where will those bedistributed?
Just so people can keep an eyeout.
Mandi (31:21):
You should be able to find them anywhere that you
normally find pale ale.
What I know is going to bechallenging and we weren't able
to really figure out is like,you know, if you live near Great
Smoky or Yosemite orYellowstone, you may not be able
to find that particularpackage.
So, you know, you may find oneof the other packagings, but you
should, it really is a wholesummer long campaign.
(31:44):
So anywhere that you normallyare used to seeing pale ale, you
should start seeing thosespecialty packagings.
And so you'll, I I forgetexactly how long the campaign is
going, but all summer long, youshould be able to find it.
And we're already talkingabout, you know, is this, do we
continue this?
Do we expand it?
Do we do something different?
So it's again, very excitedabout it.
It's a first time for us, sowe'll see how it goes, but I'm
(32:07):
really hoping people are excitedby it.
I
Steven (32:09):
know I'm excited too.
You have a lot of nationalparks to pick from.
That's true.
To keep it going.
It's a sustainable thing yougot going with the national
parks.
Yeah.
So as we wrap this up, how canpeople stay connected with
Sierra Nevada?
How can they learn more?
The floor is yours.
Mandi (32:28):
Well, what I'd love to share with people that we
launched at the end of April onEarth Day was our new hop
forward commitments andambitions.
So as we've talked about SierraNevada, this work is core to
who we are.
We've always done it.
We're really proud ofeverything we've already
invested in sustainability andoperations in our communities.
But what we've never done isformalize that externally and
(32:51):
really really set future facing,you know, targets and goals and
ambitions.
So we just launched kind oflike our first ever five year
roadmap and strategy aroundsustainability and social
impact.
It's called hop forward.
Um, you can find that on ourwebsite.
Uh, you can see all the goalsthat we're going to be working
on for the next five yearsacross five different pillars.
(33:11):
So that's what I'm most excitedabout and what my team's going
to be doing.
And then you can, you know,please go to the website cause
there you can also findinteractive maps.
Um, So you can look at each oneof our sites and you can
literally hover over and kind ofdo a virtual tour of all the
processes, programs, initiativesthat we've done around
sustainability.
And it gives you, it's justkind of a fun, interactive way
(33:33):
to like tour the sustainabilityefforts at each of our
breweries.
You'll find more about HopForward there.
You know, we have a newsletterwhere you can keep up on the new
products that we're coming outwith and, We usually share a lot
of fun updates in there as wellabout, you know, we just got
three new electric vehicles thatI'm super excited to talk
about.
So, you know, you can learnabout different things like that
way too.
But I really appreciate, youknow, being able to share our
(33:56):
story and talk more about it.
So thank you so much for havingme.
Steven (34:00):
No, it's been a pleasure.
Thank you, Mandy.
You know, it has been greatjust learning through the
process and how muchsustainability matters in this
process.
Thank you so much.
Yeah.
All right.
Well, thank you again, Mandy.
Thank you to Sierra Nevada.
Until next time, everyone,we'll see you soon.
Thanks for listening to thisepisode of the Four Worlds
Podcast.
Until next time, you can catchup on the latest innovations
(34:23):
shaping our world atTomorrowsWorldToday.com.
Follow us on Facebook andInstagram, and be sure to
subscribe to our YouTubechannel.
Welcome to the Four Worlds Podcast from Tomorrow's
World Today.
We're diving into the latest intech, science, and
sustainability, from nature'smysteries and the world of
inspiration, to the hands-oncrafts of creation, the bold
breakthroughs of innovation, andthe scaled-up wonders of
production.
This is your ticket to thestories shaping tomorrow.
(00:23):
Welcome into the show,everyone.
Today, we're focusing onsustainability.
And bringing in that, we're sohappy to have the Chief
Sustainability Officer withSierra Nevada Brewing, Mandi
McKay.
She joins us today.
Mandy, how are you?
Thank you so much for joiningus.
Mandi (00:40):
Hi, good.
Thank you, Stephen.
It's a pleasure to be here.
Steven (00:43):
Yeah, it's a pleasure to have you and jumping right into
it, sustainability in the beermaking process, I guess is what
we're going to be talking about.
So let's just go back to SierraNevada's goals and their
missions with sustainability.
Give people a little bit ofbackground, how important
sustainability really is to yourprocess.
Mandi (01:03):
Yeah, so sustainability, the word itself literally is one
of our core values.
So it was truly built in to thecompany's founding, our e How
we think about our operationsand how we do business.
And it's been that way sinceday one.
So, you know, we were foundedin 1980 by Ken Grossman in
Chico, California.
(01:24):
And we now have two breweriesspanning the country and about
1100 employees.
And so, as I said, it's trulyembedded in the fabric of who we
are and how we operate.
I've been with the company justabout 17 years now.
helping lead and grow oursustainability program.
So I've seen it evolve, butwhat I can say is it's truly,
(01:45):
it's why I've stayed.
It's why we have a lot ofemployees come to work for us.
It's because we do it right andwe embed it in everything that
we do from day-to-day operationsto our products and how we
think about our communities andour employees.
Steven (01:59):
Yeah, and take me to the two locations.
There's one in North Carolinaand there's one in California.
How are they similar and howare they different when it comes
to sustainability and kind ofimplementing sustainability in
the beer making process at thesetwo locations?
Mandi (02:18):
Yeah.
So again, we were founded inChico, California.
So our headquarter brewery andkind of our home base is
Northern California.
So Chico is about an hour and ahalf north of Sacramento.
So we've been here for almost40 years, 45 years.
And when we opened our NorthCarolina brewery about 10 years
(02:39):
ago.
Obviously, we took a lot oflearnings from everything we did
in Chico and got to put that inplace and think differently and
with much more forethought andplanning when we opened Mills
River.
So let me start with, so we dothe same core philosophies and
thinking around closing loopsand zero waste and energy and
water efficiency all We'reapproaching those things.
(03:01):
We're doing the same work, butthe approaches are different.
So with Chico, it's an olderfacility.
We've added on over thedecades.
So it's less efficient justinherently because we've had to
literally add buildings ontothat facility over time.
Whereas when we opened MillsRiver, we can design in a lot of
efficiencies, also a lot ofguest experience, and people can
(03:22):
actually see the process andsee all the cool work that we're
doing around sustainability.
The other difference that Iwould say is in Chico, you know,
We grew up in this community,so people know who we are.
They know our commitment tothis work.
They know how we operate.
So when we opened Mills River,that's a new community that
people didn't know us as well.
So when we went there, it wasintentional to literally show in
(03:45):
the building itself.
how much we are committed tosustainability and sustainable
operations.
So we knew during the designprocess, we want to be LEED
certified.
So LEED is leadership in energyand environmental design, and
it's a building certificationthat you can achieve for natural
lighting, water efficiency,energy efficiency, the building
(04:07):
materials that you use if yourecycle and capture rainwater.
So we knew very early on, hey,we're going into new community.
It's really important for thatcommunity to know, who we are as
a brand and as a company.
So lead certification wassomething we chose to
specifically do.
And when we started buildingthat brewery, we thought, well,
let's just make sure we're leadcertified, which is like the
lowest level of certificationthat you can get.
(04:28):
But then you can go up tosilver, you can go up to gold,
you can go up to platinum.
So as we started building, youknow, we couldn't help
ourselves.
And we thought, well, what doesit take to get to gold?
What does it take to get toplatinum?
And what's really excitingabout what we were able to
achieve out there and how we gotthat platinum level
certification was what we did inthe brew house around
sustainability and efficiency.
(04:49):
So again, we took everything welearned for the past 40 years
in Chico and basically built oneof the most efficient brew
houses that you can in thatNorth Carolina brewery.
That energy modeling that wedid to as part of the LEED
certification, that is what gotus to that platinum
certification.
So it's all the heat and steamthat we are recovering and
(05:12):
recycling, all the energyefficiency processes that we put
in place to that brew house,that's what kind of got us to
that final platinumcertification.
And so...
The other thing I'll touch onis the difference approach with
water.
So obviously we're thinkingabout water a lot as a brewery
because it's something we use alot of.
But in California, you thinkabout water very differently
than you do in North Carolina.
(05:33):
So in Chico, we do a lot moredrought tolerant landscaping and
removing lawns and things likethat.
And then still, of course, allthe efficiency work inside the
brew house.
In North Carolina, where itrains most of the year, we can
actually do rainwater capture.
So we installed rainwatersystems.
And an underground cistern andwe can capture all that water
(05:54):
and use it for non potable needslike toilet flushing or
irrigation.
So we wouldn't do that in Chicobecause it just it doesn't rain
enough doesn't make any senseto have rain water at that scale
in Chico.
So those are just a coupleexamples of how we're working on
the same things but approachingthem very differently at the
two facilities.
Steven (06:12):
And you know, the one in North Carolina, I used to live
in Greenville, South Carolina,and there was a few trips up to
Asheville where it wasn't a tripwithout stopping.
to sierra nevada and and and iwant to touch on that you know
just at that location just froma personal experience it goes
beyond the beer i mean the fooda lot of it is grown on site in
(06:35):
a true kind of farm to tableaspect so maybe someone thinks
of sierra nevada most peoplemight think of it just beer but
explain how even the food oneit's delicious and two it's
right there for you
Mandi (06:47):
yeah you make a really good point and it's something i
often share is that yes we arebrewery, but we do a lot more
than just make beer, right?
Like the beer is amazing.
That's who we are.
That's what we do.
But we also run amazingrestaurants and tap rooms.
And then to your point, both ofour restaurants do utilize our
onsite garden.
And so we have teams at bothbreweries that that is what they
(07:08):
do.
And they farm and grow producefor the restaurants.
We do it organically and wehave a whole team dedicated to
that work.
And so we're growing fruits,vegetables, herbs that go
directly into the restaurant,obviously the most local
sustainable food you could get.
I mean, we're, we still have topurchase, you know, quite a bit
of food and we're not doingeverything, but for the things
(07:30):
that make a lot of sense for youto grow yourself, we are doing.
And so we're, we're farmers,you know, we're brewers, we're
farmers.
We do all kinds of things.
Especially in North Carolina.
We also, we have sheep andchickens and a couple of
donkeys.
And so, yeah, we do, wedefinitely have more than just
beer.
So when you come to that sitein particular, you you get a
(07:51):
much bigger experience on top ofour beer.
Steven (07:54):
Yeah.
And I think that's reallyimportant to mention because
Sierra Nevada, it really is,it's more than just beer, but
really what brought us to thisinterview was of course beer.
There's two beers coming outthis summer exclusively for this
summer.
Let's jump into that becauseit's the summer of
sustainability and sustainablebrewing with the Summerfest and
(08:15):
the Pale Ale.
Just kind of go over theprocesses with these two beers
coming out this summer.
and, you know, how you fitsustainability in that brewing
process.
Mandi (08:24):
So I'll talk about pale for first.
So pale ale for...
listeners that don't know, youknow, it's our, it's our
flagship beer.
It's how we're known.
People only know us by Sierrapale ale.
And that's great because itliterally is a pioneer brew.
It's helped, it helped launchthe American craft beer industry
and it's, it is the standardand the go-to for so many
(08:46):
people.
And there's a reason for thatbecause it's iconic and it's
really good.
And so what I would say to thatis one thing that's really
exciting this year that we aredoing with pale is our
partnership with the nationalpark foundation.
And so what, What's unique, butalso really exciting and
something we've never donebefore is take something like
our flagship, which normally youdon't touch a flagship.
Steven (09:09):
Hands off.
Mandi (09:10):
Exactly.
It's a flagship for a reason.
It's an icon for a reason.
It stands on its own.
We've never done anything likethis, but when you think
about...
what Sierra Nevada stands for.
We have this very deepconnection to the natural world
that comes from our founder andour owner, Ken Grossman, that
has been carried with us for allthese decades.
When you take another icon likethe national parks that we all
(09:33):
know and love that are trulyiconic places, you can actually
bring the two icons together andit makes a lot of sense.
And so you're kind ofcelebrating the two icons and
they help each other.
So we're really excited aboutthat partnership.
It launched about a month agoand you'll see some limited pale
ale packaging coming out thissummer.
So we're highlighting sixdifferent, um, national parks
(09:54):
and, um, literally on thepackaging, you will see these
landscapes, excuse me, I thinkit's four national parks, um,
you'll see these beautifullandscapes that kind of take the
pale ale imagery, but show offa national park.
We're also donating to theNational Park Foundation as part
of this partnership to makesure they can keep doing their
work around landscape andwildlife conservation, things
(10:15):
that we care a lot about.
For pale ale, I'm reallyexcited about that campaign and
that partnership, and we'll seewhere it goes, but they're kind
of collector's items, at least Ihope they will be.
I hope it gets people excitedabout pale ale and reignites
their love of pale
Steven (10:30):
ale.
Mandi (10:30):
Put them to a national And like collect those
packagings.
Steven (10:34):
Yeah.
Yeah.
And I have the national parks.
It's Yosemite, Yellowstone, BigBend and Great Smoky Mountains
National Park.
And I've looked at the pack.
I mean, just it's really,really cool packaging.
I was looking on the website,just looking at the design of
the cans in the in the packagingitself.
And that kind of piques ourinterest because we are the four
(10:57):
worlds podcast.
It goes inspiration, creation,innovation, and production.
Creation and inspiration arereally coming together.
The natural world, just likeyou said, and the creative world
with these designs on thepackaging.
So I just wanted to throw thatin there.
Just such a cool aspect and areally neat idea.
And of course, it all goes to agood cause in the national
(11:18):
parks.
Mandi (11:18):
Yes, agreed.
Again, we're super excitedabout it.
And it's the first time we'veever done something like this.
like it.
So pale ale, again, it speaksfor itself, but also this
partnership is just reallyexciting.
And on Summerfest, it's anotheralmost iconic in its own way,
seasonal that we've had out formany, many years.
People look forward to it, justlike all of our seasonals.
(11:39):
But Summerfest in particular,for the last couple of years,
we've been putting in somesustainably grown barley that we
have a partnership with out ofOregon.
So we are doing a lot more.
We're thinking a lot more aboutour supply chain.
So we've always had this strongconnection with our barley
farmers and our hop growers.
But as we move forward intosome of the work that my team is
(12:02):
doing around our hop forwardambitions The supply chain is
coming in a lot more, and we'regoing to be thinking and talking
more with our suppliers aboutfarming practices or recycled
content when it comes topackaging materials.
So I'm really excited about thebarley that is in Summerfest,
and you can learn more aboutthat.
So we're doing a lot more ofthinking about the ingredients
(12:23):
and showcasing them in some ofthese iconic products that we do
offer.
Steven (12:26):
Right.
And it's something you don't–it's important, but it's
something you don't think aboutwhen you're cracking open a
beer.
And it really is– It's good toshed light on that actual
process because some people justdon't understand what it takes
to go through that.
And then when you're doing itin a sustainable way, it's
really important to shed lighton that.
(12:57):
Right.
So
Mandi (13:05):
I've used a definition, the same definition for decades
now on what I thinksustainability means.
It really is kind of a textbookdefinition and there's two sort
of parts to it.
One is just a philosophicalidea around it, which for me,
the one I share most often isthat it really is this idea of
meeting the needs of the presentwithout jeopardizing future
(13:26):
generations' ability to do thesame.
So at a very big macro level,That's what sustainability means
to me is we should be doingthings today that aren't going
to negatively impact the futureand future generations to also
live the way we do.
Right.
So that's kind of very big,high level.
There's also when you break itdown, what you're really saying,
what sustainability reallymeans is sustaining a system.
(13:49):
In this case, we're a business.
It's a brewery.
So we're trying to sustain ourbusiness.
And that starts all the waywith our supply chain to our
operations and then ourconsumers down the line.
There's usually a three partdefinition also where in most
systems, whether you're abusiness or a city or a county
or a state or a household, youare trying to balance the
(14:11):
environmental, the social andthe economic needs of that
system.
So a lot of times people equatesustainability all with the
environmental piece.
which is, that's fair.
And that makes a lot of sensebecause usually that is where
the work is being done.
Again, for us, it's energyefficiency in our brew house or
water efficiency or zero waste.
But you also need to thinkabout the social piece and the
(14:33):
economic piece.
So for a business, yeah, it'ssustainability is quarter our
values.
It's who we are, but we arealso a business.
So at the end of the day, we dohave to be financially viable,
right?
And that we have money toreinvest and do more work and
take care of our employees anddo more initiatives and
projects.
And then, of course, on thesocial side, for us, it's our
(14:53):
employees.
It's our consumers.
It's the communities in whichwe work and live.
So...
That's how I think that's howI've always thought about
sustainability.
That's how I try to communicateit and share it is a lot of
environmental work, but it'salso much broader than that.
And they all support eachother.
So often the work that we doaround efficiency or zero waste
(15:14):
does positively impact thebottom line.
So they're not mutuallyexclusive, right?
Things that you're doing toreduce emissions or reduce waste
or save water often do havefinancial benefits as well.
So they all have interplayingwith each other and support.
on each other.
Steven (15:30):
Right.
Yeah.
Again, I mean, you said itbest, you know, when it comes
down to it, you are a businessand, and keeping that business
afloat, you have to keep itsustainable.
You have to sustain, you know,you have to sustain those
operations, you know, and goingin, going into that through the
brewing process, of course,through your side of work, you
(15:50):
know, what are some of those,let's say cutting edge
technologies or practices thatSierra Nevada has implemented in
the process that are innovativeto the industry?
Mandi (16:00):
Yeah.
A couple of things that I wouldsay there's still...
They were innovative, and I'mnot sure if they're still
cutting edge.
Steven (16:09):
Maybe at one point they were cutting
Mandi (16:12):
edge.
At one point they were, and itis still hard to do, so I will
talk about them because we dothem really well.
So a couple things that SierraNevada does within the brewing
process specifically, I alreadykind of mentioned it, but a lot
of heat and steam recovery.
That's what makes somethingsuper efficient.
And so what we do really well,and I'll explain that.
I'll give a couple examples.
Steven (16:30):
Yeah, please.
Mandi (16:31):
we think about anything that's leaving a process.
So like a waste stream or abyproduct, we are really good at
thinking about how to reusethat and bring it back in as a
resource, either for the sameprocess or a different process.
So let me give an example.
So brewing is very heatintensive, right?
You're doing a lot of boilingand using steam.
So off of our kettles oranytime we've got a situation
(16:54):
where we are boiling a liquid,you're obviously going to
release heat and steam as partof that process.
So you can install things likeheat recovery, vapor condensers,
steam recovers, steam recoverycondensers.
You bring all that, youcondense steam back into water.
Now you've got hot water thatcan go back into the next batch
of beer, right?
Or same with steam and heat.
If you can collect heat, youcan now use that heat to warm up
(17:18):
cold water.
Sometimes you need to do that.
We need hot water for thebrewing process.
So if we can get heat from thecurrent boiling process, use
that heat to heat up the waterfor the next batch of beer,
that's another process we do.
We do a lot of that, both inthe brew house, but also in a
couple other systems that wehave to make electricity and
energy where we're covering heatoff those as well.
(17:39):
So almost any time we've gotheat leaving a system, we're
capturing that and reusing it insome way.
Again, it's not superinnovative.
It's just literally thinkingabout hey, this is a waste
stream that we could probablyreuse and make ourselves more
efficient.
So we do that really, reallywell.
And that's part of what led usto that LEED Platinum
certification.
(17:59):
A couple other examples.
So same thing, you've got heator steam leaving a system.
Oftentimes we need to cool downThe wort, so this is the liquid
that is eventually going tobecome beer, is called wort
before it becomes beer.
That wort has to get cooleddown before it goes into
fermentation.
You can't add yeast into hotliquid, otherwise you kill your
(18:22):
yeast, and the yeast is what isgoing to make your alcohol for
you.
So when we have a boilingliquid that we need to cool down
very quickly to send it tofiltration, you can use a heat
exchange process.
So you've got this hot liquid,you need to cool it down, you
run it past Very simple, butagain, kind of innovative and
(18:51):
really smart ways to think aboutheat transfer and heat
recovery.
Those are the best examplesthat I have for efficiency in
the brewing process.
And then I would just say, wethink a lot about what our R&D
team and our brewing teams aredoing now is how do you like,
how do we get really detailedand efficient with like our
(19:12):
boiling times?
Do we really need to boil foran hour and a half?
Could we boil for an hour?
Can we reduce that temperaturejust a little bit?
And what impact does that haveon the beer or not?
So now we're getting into like,we've done a lot of the low
hanging fruit.
Now it's the next step ofreally dialing in timing,
temperatures, differentingredients or different ways.
(19:32):
Is there a different barleythat doesn't have to boil as
long?
So there's all kinds of thingsthat we're thinking about in our
R&D side to continue kind ofthat efficiency journey.
Steven (19:42):
Yeah.
And really, you took the wordsright out of my mouth because I
was going to ask, what are thosebehind the scenes?
What does that look like whenit comes down to thinking of new
ways to, maybe not new ways,but just ways to kind of stay
ahead of the curve and justcontinue to innovate and build
on what's what you already haveas a foundation.
Mandi (20:03):
Another good example of kind of that behind the scenes,
and it's hard to explain and itfeels really nuanced, but water,
on the water side, Most of thewater consumption and the water
usage in a brewery is forcleaning because you have to
keep everything clean.
There's multiple stages ofcleaning and it's very important
for beer quality andmicrobiology and all those
things.
(20:23):
A couple things we've done isthe cleaning processes that you
do have to use to clean outtanks once beer is smoothed out
or the pipes.
They're called CIP processesand we've spent a lot of time
thinking about can you reusesome of that cleaning water or
cleaning chemical?
Can you recover it and use itagain instead of building up a
whole new batch.
We've done a lot of work onthat and significantly reduced
(20:46):
water and cleaning chemical,which again goes back to that,
like it saves water, but it alsosaves money on chemicals.
So they kind of go hand inhand.
There's lots of ways to kind ofthink through and how much
water do you actually need?
is the spray nozzle coveringthe entire tank or is it only
hitting one side of the tank sonow you're having to use more
water to get the rest of thetank so there's like there's a
(21:07):
lot of very like details andvariables that go into like how
much more efficient can we getwith our water and our chemicals
especially in those in thosecleaning processes because
that's where most of the wateris being used
Steven (21:18):
yeah and i just want people to to when they listen to
this realize all of the littleintricacies that go into that
can of sierra nevada or thedraft of Sierra Nevada that
you're drinking because itreally is.
And I could see it in you justgoing through each and every
little detail that you, theproduction staff, everyone at
(21:41):
Sierra Nevada really, trulycares about the product and
always continuing to be better.
Mandi (21:46):
You know, I really appreciate that because we do
take it very seriously.
And there is a lot of work thatdoes go into every can or
bottle of beer.
And, you know, you don't seeit.
And I wouldn't expect peopleto, you know, you don't really,
Steven (21:59):
we
Mandi (21:59):
all buy beverages and you don't necessarily think about
all that.
But there's a lot.
And we think and hope that youcan really taste that, right?
That comes through.
It's very high quality.
We think we put a lot of timeand effort into the innovation
and the quality and thesustainability of our products.
Hopefully you can taste that aswell.
Steven (22:18):
I personally, from a personal effect, you can, you
can, you can, you can taste,let's say like you can taste the
love that you guys put that youguys put into the brewing
process.
Now let's talk, you have the,you have the Chico, California
and you have the North Carolinafacility.
Take me through a distributionwhere, you know, where's it go?
Is it all over the country?
(22:38):
Give someone, you know, give mean idea of, of how much you're
actually distributing from thesetwo locations.
Mandi (22:44):
Yeah, that's a great question.
So we're currently, we're thethird largest craft brewer in
the country.
And again, we have our twobrewing facilities, California
and North Carolina, but we dodistribute to all 50 states.
So you can find our products inall 50 states.
You're not going to find everyone of our products in all those
states.
Our, you know, we're certainlylargest markets are in
(23:04):
California and North Carolinaand kind of on the coasts.
But again, we do distribute allover.
So we're a pretty large brewerwhen it comes to craft, but
we're still pretty small when itcomes to just sort of brewing
more broadly.
We're actually still kind of amedium, small size business
overall, but large in craft beerbecause most of craft breweries
(23:27):
are very small, right?
So we're large in terms ofcraft.
We make about a little over amillion barrels of beer a year.
That is big for craft, butsmall for kind of domestic beer
and breweries overall.
Steven (23:40):
And just talking about that brings up another
interesting point.
What kind of challenges do youface?
Just thinking about, in thegrand scheme of things, being
kind of a smaller craft brewery,what are some of those
challenges that you face tocontinue to produce as much as
you do in a sustainable way?
Mandi (23:59):
Yeah.
From a sustainabilityperspective, there are some
challenges because if we werelarger, some of those things
would make even more financialsense or be easier to do.
So we are kind of in a weirdmiddle space where we're not
small, but we're not big.
Sometimes that's a benefit.
Other times it's a barrier anda challenge where it has made
sense, especially fromsustainability.
(24:21):
So things like recovering ourCO2.
or treating our wastewater, ourown wastewater on site, those
things you do kind of have toreach a certain threshold to
where they make sense to do.
So much smaller breweries,Right.
Right.
Recovering our CO2 means allthe CO2 that's coming off of our
(25:01):
fermentation tanks.
We capture all that CO2.
We could just release it.
And that's what most breweriesdo.
It just goes, vents to theatmosphere.
Steven (25:08):
We
Mandi (25:09):
capture all of that.
We compress it down.
We reuse it.
So again, closing a loop andusing a waste product as a
resource.
We use all of that collectedCO2 to purge tanks, to move beer
from process to process.
We use it for some of our draftsystems.
So if you come on site andyou're getting a beer poured on
drafts, you are likely gettingit.
(25:30):
It's being pushed with recycledCO2.
So once you get to a certainsize, things like that makes
sense.
Similar with wastewatertreatment, you reach a certain
size and it makes a lot moresense for you to pre-treat your
brewing wastewater before yousend it to the municipal
treatment plant for furthertreatment.
So both of our breweries, wehave these really, really
(25:50):
amazing, great examples ofclosing the loop, wastewater
treatment plants.
And what those are doing,they're anaerobic digesters.
So we're taking all the brewingwater that's used to make beer.
So no sewer water, no sinks, nokitchens, no bathrooms, but all
the water that's used in thebrewing process.
Goes down the drain, it goes toour onsite wastewater treatment
plant, goes through anaerobicdigestion.
(26:12):
So it's basically a littlebacteria, little anaerobes.
They're eating all the leftoverorganic matter in that water.
They generate a biogas as abyproduct of that process.
They are treating the water.
That water then goes to thecity for further treatment.
That biogas that we're able tocapture from the wastewater
treatment plant, we use thatbiogas to then make electricity
(26:34):
for the brewery.
We do that by sending thatbiogas through microturbines.
Microturbines use a gas to thenmake electricity.
So super cool cool onsiteclosed loop example of literally
going from brewing wastewaterto electricity for the site.
So again, when you are largeenough, you get to do fun things
(26:54):
like that.
But where we're not largeenough is sometimes, you know,
it's, we're kind of like certainsize of equipment.
So like for one example, we'relooking for a new alternative
for some of our small productruns where we need a certain
kind of carrier.
So like a six pack carrier.
Steven (27:13):
Yeah.
Mandi (27:13):
We are too big for the small machine.
We are not big enough for thebig machine.
And so we're kind of trying tofind this perfect.
We've got to find somebody thathas this midsize machine so
that we can, we want to move tothis different six pack carrier.
So that's, that's one example Ican think of where it just like
we're right in the middle.
Yeah.
Perfect sometimes, butchallenging.
(27:35):
It
Steven (27:36):
sounds like you're in the market to commercialize the
midsize yourselves.
Yeah.
There, a new project for you.
Mandi (27:44):
Yep.
We can lead the way.
And we often do.
We've often been kind of aleader or a guinea pig on some
technologies and things, whichis part of the innovation that
we do.
Steven (27:54):
Yeah.
And how do you stay ahead ofthat, trying to be, let's say, a
model for others?
Mandi (28:03):
A
Steven (28:04):
loaded question.
A loaded question, right?
Mandi (28:07):
We are lucky in that Again, we are founded by
somebody who has always thoughtabout, so he's driven by
efficiency.
He's also driven by, hey, I'lltake a risk and be the first
person to use hydrogen fuelcells, for example.
We were like the first breweryto ever use hydrogen fuel cells
to make electricity.
And we are still the first andonly brewery that has an onsite
(28:32):
hot rock composting system.
So we've taken risks.
We've thought about thingsdifferently.
We are often a pilot for, fordifferent technology.
So I think that's part of it isthat you have that spirit and
interest and curiosity to liketry things.
I think that's what helps keepsus, you know, doing that.
And as a leader, you know,we're proud of being a leader
and we do think about being aleader for the rest of the craft
(28:55):
brewing industry.
I mean, if you, if we can helplead it, then everyone wins and
everyone, you know, the wholeindustry kind of benefits from
anything that we or otherbreweries our size do.
So I think we, we know that weknow we have a responsibility
and a pride in the leader thatwe have.
So we want to make sure we'redoing our part for the industry
and beyond.
Steven (29:13):
Yeah, absolutely.
And from the top down, there's,I'm sure, a lot of hands that
go into the brewing process andeverything in between.
How do these teams, whetherit's, again, from the top down,
how do they ensure that thesesystems stay efficient, that are
effective and are scalableacross all your facilities?
Mandi (29:34):
It is 100% a team effort.
And we are getting, I thinkevery business probably
struggles a little bit with, youknow, collaboration and
cross-functional work is socritical.
And I think we've inherentlyalways done a good job, but
everyone has ways to improve.
And so we are, it's a constant,you have to constantly remind
yourself and your teams aroundyou to bring people in.
(29:56):
We're all on the same team.
We're all working on thistogether.
And, you know, but we're reallylucky that that has always kind
of been inherent to who we are.
And I think it goes back to Kenand our founder, who's his
impact.
You see it still today.
Right.
So it's how we operate.
But we do have so I will say myteam, we have two people
dedicated solely tosustainability at each brewery.
(30:18):
So one one person in Chico, oneperson in Mills River.
That's their whole job is tomake sure the programs that we
have in place for zero waste,for efficiency, for greenhouse
gas reduction.
Those programs are maintained.
They're top of mind.
So that person is, you know,managing and keeping everyone
kind of connected on that work.
But it does take all teams.
And I would say in the same waythat it takes everyone
(30:38):
committed to quality.
or to safety.
Sustainability is the same.
So everyone's job in some wayis a sustainability job or a
safety job or a quality job.
So that's how, but it is, ittakes intention and action and
reminding, you know, that's,it's everyone's job and we're
all, we're all kind of like partof it.
So we do have people dedicatedto it, but it's definitely
(31:00):
embedded into everyone's role.
Steven (31:02):
Absolutely.
I mean, again, you said itbest.
It's, it's a team effort whenit comes down to.
Let's get into the, you know,two beers that we, you know,
talked about with the in theSummerfest, especially the Pale,
those exclusive packaging.
Who can find those?
Where will those bedistributed?
Just so people can keep an eyeout.
Mandi (31:21):
You should be able to find them anywhere that you
normally find pale ale.
What I know is going to bechallenging and we weren't able
to really figure out is like,you know, if you live near Great
Smoky or Yosemite orYellowstone, you may not be able
to find that particularpackage.
So, you know, you may find oneof the other packagings, but you
should, it really is a wholesummer long campaign.
(31:44):
So anywhere that you normallyare used to seeing pale ale, you
should start seeing thosespecialty packagings.
And so you'll, I I forgetexactly how long the campaign is
going, but all summer long, youshould be able to find it.
And we're already talkingabout, you know, is this, do we
continue this?
Do we expand it?
Do we do something different?
So it's again, very excitedabout it.
It's a first time for us, sowe'll see how it goes, but I'm
(32:07):
really hoping people are excitedby it.
I
Steven (32:09):
know I'm excited too.
You have a lot of nationalparks to pick from.
That's true.
To keep it going.
It's a sustainable thing yougot going with the national
parks.
Yeah.
So as we wrap this up, how canpeople stay connected with
Sierra Nevada?
How can they learn more?
The floor is yours.
Mandi (32:28):
Well, what I'd love to share with people that we
launched at the end of April onEarth Day was our new hop
forward commitments andambitions.
So as we've talked about SierraNevada, this work is core to
who we are.
We've always done it.
We're really proud ofeverything we've already
invested in sustainability andoperations in our communities.
But what we've never done isformalize that externally and
(32:51):
really really set future facing,you know, targets and goals and
ambitions.
So we just launched kind oflike our first ever five year
roadmap and strategy aroundsustainability and social
impact.
It's called hop forward.
Um, you can find that on ourwebsite.
Uh, you can see all the goalsthat we're going to be working
on for the next five yearsacross five different pillars.
(33:11):
So that's what I'm most excitedabout and what my team's going
to be doing.
And then you can, you know,please go to the website cause
there you can also findinteractive maps.
Um, So you can look at each oneof our sites and you can
literally hover over and kind ofdo a virtual tour of all the
processes, programs, initiativesthat we've done around
sustainability.
And it gives you, it's justkind of a fun, interactive way
(33:33):
to like tour the sustainabilityefforts at each of our
breweries.
You'll find more about HopForward there.
You know, we have a newsletterwhere you can keep up on the new
products that we're coming outwith and, We usually share a lot
of fun updates in there as wellabout, you know, we just got
three new electric vehicles thatI'm super excited to talk
about.
So, you know, you can learnabout different things like that
way too.
But I really appreciate, youknow, being able to share our
(33:56):
story and talk more about it.
So thank you so much for havingme.
Steven (34:00):
No, it's been a pleasure.
Thank you, Mandy.
You know, it has been greatjust learning through the
process and how muchsustainability matters in this
process.
Thank you so much.
Yeah.
All right.
Well, thank you again, Mandy.
Thank you to Sierra Nevada.
Until next time, everyone,we'll see you soon.
Thanks for listening to thisepisode of the Four Worlds
Podcast.
Until next time, you can catchup on the latest innovations
(34:23):
shaping our world atTomorrowsWorldToday.com.
Follow us on Facebook andInstagram, and be sure to
subscribe to our YouTubechannel.
Popular Podcasts
On Purpose with Jay Shetty
I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!
The Breakfast Club
The World's Most Dangerous Morning Show, The Breakfast Club, With DJ Envy And Charlamagne Tha God!
The Joe Rogan Experience
The official podcast of comedian Joe Rogan.