This one scene from Christoper Nolan's The Dark Knight Rises inspired this topic. On this episode Matt and Drew talk about making the jump without the rope. The big idea is if you're playing it safe, you are limiting your future. The safety you seek is holding you back.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:13):
Drew, we're back at it.
We're here, we're doing it.
Your tan jacket is made inappearance again.
Speaker 2 (00:18):
Well, you have to call out.
I've only got like two jacketsthat I want You're.
You've got a great blazer game.
I think that's part of my nextstep in leadership.
We're gonna do a whole episodeon the importance of blazers and
leadership for blazers.
You're not wearing your blazertoday.
Speaker 1 (00:33):
They retired for the season of Fraction X podcast.
Speaker 2 (00:36):
Okay, yeah, we'll bring it back next season.
Why are you gonna mark my tanjacket?
No, I'm so into it, that's allyou like it.
Speaker 1 (00:42):
It's fantastic, you look.
You look amazing.
Speaking of amazing.
Speaker 2 (00:47):
Nice segue.
What a pro that's right.
Speaker 1 (00:50):
I get so much inspiration from movies.
And I think like the uncannyability for art, you know, to
imitate life and vice versa, andso we were talking about a
movie that we both love and thisone specific scene.
So, yeah, I'm just gonna pitchit to you.
Talk about Christopher Nolan'sthe Dark Knight.
Speaker 2 (01:07):
I love Christopher Nolan, first of all, my favorite
director.
Like anything he does, I'mgonna watch.
I love the way he tells storiesand you know I and I love that.
I love storytelling, goodstorytelling, good
cinematography, all that kind ofstuff.
And you mentioned this moviethis morning and we never talked
about it before.
But I'm like dude, that's myproblem.
My favorite movie.
Speaker 1 (01:24):
I didn't know you liked that movie.
Speaker 2 (01:25):
The whole Batman trilogy, the Dark Knight, that
whole thing, and you actuallywere able to extract some great
truth out of probably one of myfavorite scenes in any of those
movies and it always moved meand I didn't really have like
the why behind it.
But I do love all like you knowhow.
You know in those movies youknow Batman is the idea that
(01:48):
he's being what Gotham needs atthe time.
Whatever that is, he's willingto be that, even if he's willing
to be the bad guy.
And I just love although Ididn't love how they just
swapped out I forget the actress.
Speaker 1 (01:59):
Oh yeah, she was better in the first movie.
I didn't like the second one.
Speaker 2 (02:02):
Yeah, they just swapped her out like we weren't
going to notice.
Speaker 1 (02:04):
But we saw her.
It's a different human.
Speaker 2 (02:06):
That's not the same person.
Anyways, we'll let that oneslide.
But there's this one scene inthe movie that is so profound.
Yeah, and do you want me totell?
Speaker 1 (02:14):
it, or do you want to tell it?
Speaker 2 (02:15):
No, well, it's the scene where he's trying to get
out of the cave.
He's trying to get out of thewhole lot of the prison yeah,
right, and he's jumping with therope.
Yeah, and he's jumping.
He's basically breaking hisback every time he does it and
he's having to, like, train forit all over again.
Yeah, no one only, but oneperson had ever made it out of
again, and it wasn't until hejumped without the rope that he
(02:37):
actually made it.
And I love the fact that theydon't talk, they don't like go
into the philosophical stuff,they just show that.
But everyone knows like, hey,there's something too, when you
have everything to lose, whenthe safety net is gone.
That is a time that it'sspoiler alert if you haven't
seen the movie.
He makes it without the rope,but when you watch that scene,
(02:59):
something kind of came up foryou and you're like, hey, this,
this is a great metaphor forleadership.
Speaker 1 (03:07):
Yeah, there's just so much fear and a lot of
decisions we make.
It's unfortunate because we'vetalked about this in the past.
Like you know, when it comes toleaders that we have they have,
you know, influence over ourcareers.
They have influence of oursalary and our job and stuff,
but we also have a lot ofautonomy as leaders, especially
if you own your own company orif you're, you know, leading
hide in an organization.
(03:27):
There are consequences to thedecisions we make, yeah, and
sometimes it just gets real easyto play it safe, and so really,
that scene for me is about fearand safety.
Yep, and that guy you knowBatman, that guy, he could make
that jump a lot because the ropewould always save him if he
missed it.
Yep, yeah, and the consequenceof taking the rope off, making
(03:49):
the jump and missing it.
He's done the movies over right, so there to see things where
we can make a decision, and ifwe miss it, if we get the
decision wrong, it could bedevastating.
And so I was actually coaching aclient and when this movie came
up, and so we've done somestrategic planning with this
client and we've identifiedParts of his business that he's
(04:09):
using the past to grow.
He has to retire that type ofbusiness.
That's smaller clients, smallerprojects.
Where his you know futurereally lives is with bigger
projects, bigger clients.
And so I was asking him howthings were going, yeah, what
his bid process was like andhe's, like management, really
tied up in the bid processbecause I'm bidding these jobs
(04:31):
For, you know, smaller clientsand I pulled up our strategic
like planning PDF and I showedhim the map.
I was like, bro, yeah, we sat inthe room and said this type of
project is not the future ofyour company.
Yeah, we've got to go afterthis type of client and this
type of business.
And he was like, yeah, yeah,you're right.
I was like but you, you wantthe, you need the revenue.
Sure, you got to keep the light, sure, on.
(04:52):
You've got payroll, you've gotexpenses, and so these small
jobs are keeping the lightsturned on absolutely and at the
same time, they're killing thepossibility of a future man I
read, I resonate with that sodeeply and I feel that even in
my own business now.
Speaker 2 (05:06):
And so let's just do, let's do a live coaching
session here, let's go coach,coach me on my business, because
what I was writing down,actually, as you were talking a
minute ago, is you have to getto the place where the fear of
staying the same or Goingbackwards is greater than the
fear of taking that, that riskright.
(05:28):
Like you get sort of like hey,I'm actually I'm more afraid,
like in the movie, I'm moreafraid of Actually having to
stay here the same or having todo this again.
I would rather just die.
Yeah then it's, it was actuallygreater than the fear of missing
the jump right.
And so I think in a lot ofpeople's lives, whether it's in
(05:48):
their personal health, mentalhealth, emotional health,
business, whatever you get theirplace where it's like I'm
actually more afraid of stayingthe same than I am of what it's
gonna take to get me to where Iwant to be in life, right, yeah,
so if you're, if you'recoaching, consulting me, because
I feel that there's things,there's goals I have in my
business I Don't want to get to,but there's things that I have
(06:08):
got going on currently thatmight be the driver of my time,
my energy, my revenue, all thosekind of things.
And it's just, it's scary ashell to go from what's kind of
keeping you alive to when I wantto be, but I can't get to where
I want to be because what'skind of keeping me alive is
dominant in my time.
If you're coaching me on that,help me with next steps, because
(06:32):
that is a big leap right.
Like this, like even Batman hadhis, had his sage Mentor that
was helping him see, like, yeah,this is, this is gonna be a
problem if you miss it, right.
So help me with this man,because how do you get from
point a to even point B?
Forget point Z.
Speaker 1 (06:49):
Yeah, well, we've we've used this word before on
the show but perspective.
So you have to pull away fromyour business that you're
running to see it for what itreally is.
Yeah, you know.
So if you're in the middle ofinvoicing or doing the work that
you're doing, talking toclients you can't stop in that
moment, be like, oh, there's adifferent future that I want.
You have to take serious time,like, and I think people should
(07:12):
build a work on it calendar fortheir year.
So I would propose, hey, once ayear you need a three-day
off-site when you and yoursenior leaders, or you and your
mentor, get away and you look atthe business that you have, you
get on top of the mountain andtry to see the whole picture and
then, quarterly, you'rereviewing Okay, we're gonna take
eight hours a quarter, a wholeday, and say, okay, are we doing
(07:37):
what we said we're gonna dofrom a strategy, execution and
vision standpoint for thecompany, and then, once a month,
you've got to be reviewingthose as well.
So, first of all, the firststep is perspective.
Where am I really and where doI want to go?
Speaker 2 (07:49):
Yeah, dude, that's so good.
Yeah, I want to dive more intothat work on it calendar,
because that is that's reallysmart.
Yeah, I wonder how manyorganizations or leaders
Actually actually do this onthis three-day off-site.
Right, talk a little bit aboutand this is a little off topic,
so I don't spend too much timehere but what are the kind of
things you're doing on athree-day off-site like that
(08:11):
step?
Speaker 1 (08:12):
ones disconnect.
Yeah, I'm not gonna check myteam emails.
I'm not gonna put out any fires.
I'm not gonna manage crisis.
I'm not gonna look at theproblems of my organization yeah
, so I'm turning my face awayfrom the immediate and I'm
turning my face towards A littlebreathing room.
Right, it's right, you're gonnaget a cabin.
You're gonna air B&B yeah,somewhere where there's nature,
(08:32):
a lake, yeah, pond, ocean,something where you can just be
totally focused on the futureand not the present.
So that's the first step is getaway.
Yeah, that's really good.
And the exercises you I mean youcan do a hundred different
things.
You can do a four helpful listand we're gonna look at what's
right, what's wrong, what'smissing, what's confused.
You can do SWAT on the wholebusiness, where our strengths,
(08:54):
weaknesses, opportunities,threats.
Something I like to do is aturning points, like an events
Calendar of the company hey,what happened in the beginning,
and then what happened?
And then, at this phase, phaseof the business, what happened
next?
And talk about the story of thebusiness and try to learn from
hey, when we pivoted orreiterated or we had a crisis,
(09:15):
what happened financially,strategically?
Yeah, what happened to ourproduct?
What happened to our people?
And every time you look at aturning point event in your
company's history, you get tolearn something.
So again, you're just trying todo something that distracts
from clients calling, yeah,staff calling HR issues.
You're like no, let's, let's,let's look at holistically.
Yeah you're just gonna runthrough a series of exercises
that look at where are we soperspective before planning and
(09:38):
then.
Then you need dreamers on yourteam, like you need people that
don't always just grind right.
You know.
You need people that are gonnabe around you.
They're like man.
What if you start asking thosebig questions?
Like man, If there wasn'tobstacles, if we knew we
couldn't fail, what would we bereally doing right now?
You ask those big questions andyou fill in the fill in the
piece of paper like dude.
We would do this like if therewas no way we'd fail.
(10:00):
We'd do this.
Speaker 2 (10:01):
Yeah, yeah, I love that.
Well, it's also a great time toto Work with each other, like
to learn each other.
Yeah, so like relational is ahuge part of it, man, because I
know, yeah, I sat in on one ofyour off-sites that you led not
too long ago and you did somestrength finder stuff you did
and you got people talking aboutlike recognizing, hey, what do
you bring to the table and whatconversation Should I bring you
(10:23):
into, and all that kind of stuff, and so, anyways, not to get
too distracted on that, but wewould encourage people to do
this, to have a work on itcalendar, bring some
intentionality and strategy toit.
I'm going back to kind of thefear thing, though I want you to
speak a little bit to scarcity.
Yeah right, because I thinkthis is a mindset that a lot of
us have in business, especiallywhen you start to have a little
(10:45):
bit of success.
Then that scarcity and thatcontrol the things that even,
like I know, for me my mentalityis different now than it was
when I first started, like Ijust you get to where it's like,
okay, now I want to holdtightly to what I have, yeah,
and I stopped doing the thingsthat I was doing in the
beginning to build to where Iwas at today.
Right, so talk to me as abusiness leader, the other
(11:06):
business leaders that arelistening, entrepreneurs around
this scarcity mindset, how thatholds us back and how do we
overcome that to actuallyachieve the goals that we want
to get to yeah, I Thinkquestions are one of the best
ways to move someone forward,and it's some of those like
really eternal questions likewhen am I?
Speaker 1 (11:23):
Yeah really right, where do I want to go?
Really?
I'm not talking about scarcity,digging into those like
existential not like I've goteight hours today.
How do I best divvy that up formy business priorities, like no
, we're not talking about thatkind of stuff.
If you've got a break a habitof Scarcity and it is a habit
(11:44):
like you you you disciplineyourself towards scarcity, just
the way you discipline yourselfout of scarcity right.
Interesting.
Yeah, so we, we build theseneural pathways.
Every time we make a decisionthat leads towards scarcity.
Okay, I'm not gonna think aboutthe future of my business.
I need to go get one of theselittle small clients again.
That's gonna help me makepayroll for the next week.
Well, so you start to automatesome of those ways of thinking,
(12:07):
you start to automate some ofthose practices and all before
you know it, you're justbuilding habits towards scarcity
leadership and I think you gotto go.
Okay, no, I'm gonna stop that.
I'm gonna be intentional aboutokay, I've said in one of my
off-sides, or I've said to mymentor or my business coach I
want to do X, what's a habitualthing?
What's a discipline?
What's the thing I can do rightnow?
(12:28):
That puts me on the pathtowards doing that?
And it's gonna feel scarybecause Typically with scarcity,
you're going there are finiteresources, time is a finite
resource, my energy is a finiteresource, my budget's finite.
I can't do everything all atonce.
I'm just gonna do what I know Ican control Mm-hmm, and I know
I can get my head in my mindaround right, and you go after
(12:50):
that.
But abundance is saying thereare more resources than I have
Consciously acknowledged yeah,I'm smarter than I think I am
right.
I've got more relationshipsthan I think I do.
There's more strategy out therethan I've tapped into.
There's more I can learn.
There's more I can be developed.
(13:11):
There's more I can stretch andgrow.
Yeah, and that will lead tomore opportunity.
More opportunity leads tobuilding a bigger budget and
it's just putting yourself on apathway towards those things and
abundance.
Speaker 2 (13:22):
Yeah, man, that's such good advice.
I, for me, I know I have tosurround myself and we've talked
about this a lot on thispodcast but I have to get around
other people who help me withthat mindset and that, you know,
help me get out of thatscarcity mindset, help me dream
again, help speak truth.
You know, I'm the type ofleader that I can be very
scattered, not focused.
I mean people with me.
That's also saying hey, that'sa great idea, just not yet.
(13:45):
Or that's a bad idea or likeyou know.
So, depending on yourpersonality, having people
around you that are helping youUnderstand like, hey, this is a
good risk to take, you know.
And the last thing I wanted toask you because I think this is
also helpful is Around the ideaof like in the in the movie with
Batman, like if he misses thatjump, like he's gonna physically
(14:05):
die, right.
The good news is, like we'renot living in the movie.
So, like if you take a leap offaith.
I think a lot of people think,hey, if I do this, I'm gonna die
, right.
It does feel that way.
It could feel scary.
The truth is, you know, thedifference between entrepreneurs
or even just leaders that makeit are the ones that just get up
and keep trying, like they failforward, right, that whole like
(14:27):
thing.
I was just talking to a leadernot too long ago who is wanting
to make a big jump, who'swanting to make, and there's
just so much anxiety and fearbecause it's leaving what's
known and going to the unknown,right.
So I'd love for you just totalk to that leader that's out
there.
That's like Matt man, you don'tunderstand.
I've got a family to providefor.
I got, like, what do I do toget from point B to point A?
(14:49):
And the reason I'm asking thisis because you're a very
practical thinker.
I'm more the type of like just,you know, jump without a
parachute, see what happens.
You know, like, but how do youhelp us kind of to bridge that
gap into where we want to be inlife?
Speaker 1 (15:02):
Well, I think most of us vastly overestimate the
consequences of failure andvastly underestimate what safety
is really doing.
I just don't think we weremeant to live safe lives.
I'm not saying to be a wildperson, I'm not saying it's the
Wild West and just live yourdreams and go for everything,
(15:23):
but I'm saying like, greatstories and so we'll go back to
the movies for a second Involverisk, right, they involve the
unknown and all that stuff andyou may think you're in
something that's safe andpredictable.
What you don't understand isyou're giving away pieces of
your heart, like you're givingaway things that you don't know
(15:44):
you're giving to achieve thatsafety.
Safety has a cost.
You pay the price every singleday.
Now it's small, maybeincremental.
It doesn't feel like failingdoes, and failing publicly is
like a huge fear for most people.
But, man, I would trade apublic failure over like a small
, quiet death in a place whereI'm just like it's safe.
I'm staying here because it'ssafe Totally.
Speaker 2 (16:07):
One and, like you said, most people, when you take
that leap, even if you do fail,the key of getting back up and
trying again and going.
Those are the people, like thefriends of mine that are the
most successful, have failed themost.
That's right, but they justdon't have that mentality of
like well, I'm going to quit.
It's like well, I just keepgoing, I'm going to chalk it up,
and they end up figuring it out.
So, matt, this was great.
(16:28):
This is actually an episodethat I need because, like fear,
anxiety that can really takeover in my life is really
helpful.
I just want to give you kind ofjust the final word, even if
you just want to encapsulatekind of the big idea behind this
.
Speaker 1 (16:40):
Yeah, I don't think I'd wrap specifically, trying to
put it all on a bow.
I would say, look, none of thisstuff is easy.
If it was easy, everybody wouldbe doing it, and they're not.
And so my thing is look forinspiration.
Right, there are books, there'spodcasts, there's relationships
, all that stuff.
But you need someone in yourcorner Like it is very difficult
to do or talking about, unlessyou've got the right kind of
(17:02):
systems in place that supportyou.
And I'm more talking likeemotionally, like hey, have
somebody who's rooting for you.
Yes, we need to take that risk.
We've got to go try this.
We can't stay safe anymore.
And if you're surrounded bypeople who make safe decisions,
like you're probably going tocontinue to make safe decisions.
And if you get around peoplewho are comfortable with failure
and say, look, it was neverfinal when I screwed that up, it
(17:23):
didn't hold me back forever.
When I hit the concrete facefirst, I got back up and people
supported me and I was able todo something different.
So I think it's all aboutfinding someone who's going to
encourage you on that journey.
Yeah, so give me.
Thanks, matt Yep.
Drew, we're back at it.
We're here, we're doing it.
Your tan jacket is made inappearance again.
Speaker 2 (00:18):
Well, you have to call out.
I've only got like two jacketsthat I want You're.
You've got a great blazer game.
I think that's part of my nextstep in leadership.
We're gonna do a whole episodeon the importance of blazers and
leadership for blazers.
You're not wearing your blazertoday.
Speaker 1 (00:33):
They retired for the season of Fraction X podcast.
Speaker 2 (00:36):
Okay, yeah, we'll bring it back next season.
Why are you gonna mark my tanjacket?
No, I'm so into it, that's allyou like it.
Speaker 1 (00:42):
It's fantastic, you look.
You look amazing.
Speaking of amazing.
Speaker 2 (00:47):
Nice segue.
What a pro that's right.
Speaker 1 (00:50):
I get so much inspiration from movies.
And I think like the uncannyability for art, you know, to
imitate life and vice versa, andso we were talking about a
movie that we both love and thisone specific scene.
So, yeah, I'm just gonna pitchit to you.
Talk about Christopher Nolan'sthe Dark Knight.
Speaker 2 (01:07):
I love Christopher Nolan, first of all, my favorite
director.
Like anything he does, I'mgonna watch.
I love the way he tells storiesand you know I and I love that.
I love storytelling, goodstorytelling, good
cinematography, all that kind ofstuff.
And you mentioned this moviethis morning and we never talked
about it before.
But I'm like dude, that's myproblem.
My favorite movie.
Speaker 1 (01:24):
I didn't know you liked that movie.
Speaker 2 (01:25):
The whole Batman trilogy, the Dark Knight, that
whole thing, and you actuallywere able to extract some great
truth out of probably one of myfavorite scenes in any of those
movies and it always moved meand I didn't really have like
the why behind it.
But I do love all like you knowhow.
You know in those movies youknow Batman is the idea that
(01:48):
he's being what Gotham needs atthe time.
Whatever that is, he's willingto be that, even if he's willing
to be the bad guy.
And I just love although Ididn't love how they just
swapped out I forget the actress.
Speaker 1 (01:59):
Oh yeah, she was better in the first movie.
I didn't like the second one.
Speaker 2 (02:02):
Yeah, they just swapped her out like we weren't
going to notice.
Speaker 1 (02:04):
But we saw her.
It's a different human.
Speaker 2 (02:06):
That's not the same person.
Anyways, we'll let that oneslide.
But there's this one scene inthe movie that is so profound.
Yeah, and do you want me totell?
Speaker 1 (02:14):
it, or do you want to tell it?
Speaker 2 (02:15):
No, well, it's the scene where he's trying to get
out of the cave.
He's trying to get out of thewhole lot of the prison yeah,
right, and he's jumping with therope.
Yeah, and he's jumping.
He's basically breaking hisback every time he does it and
he's having to, like, train forit all over again.
Yeah, no one only, but oneperson had ever made it out of
again, and it wasn't until hejumped without the rope that he
(02:37):
actually made it.
And I love the fact that theydon't talk, they don't like go
into the philosophical stuff,they just show that.
But everyone knows like, hey,there's something too, when you
have everything to lose, whenthe safety net is gone.
That is a time that it'sspoiler alert if you haven't
seen the movie.
He makes it without the rope,but when you watch that scene,
(02:59):
something kind of came up foryou and you're like, hey, this,
this is a great metaphor forleadership.
Speaker 1 (03:07):
Yeah, there's just so much fear and a lot of
decisions we make.
It's unfortunate because we'vetalked about this in the past.
Like you know, when it comes toleaders that we have they have,
you know, influence over ourcareers.
They have influence of oursalary and our job and stuff,
but we also have a lot ofautonomy as leaders, especially
if you own your own company orif you're, you know, leading
hide in an organization.
(03:27):
There are consequences to thedecisions we make, yeah, and
sometimes it just gets real easyto play it safe, and so really,
that scene for me is about fearand safety.
Yep, and that guy you knowBatman, that guy, he could make
that jump a lot because the ropewould always save him if he
missed it.
Yep, yeah, and the consequenceof taking the rope off, making
(03:49):
the jump and missing it.
He's done the movies over right, so there to see things where
we can make a decision, and ifwe miss it, if we get the
decision wrong, it could bedevastating.
And so I was actually coaching aclient and when this movie came
up, and so we've done somestrategic planning with this
client and we've identifiedParts of his business that he's
(04:09):
using the past to grow.
He has to retire that type ofbusiness.
That's smaller clients, smallerprojects.
Where his you know futurereally lives is with bigger
projects, bigger clients.
And so I was asking him howthings were going, yeah, what
his bid process was like andhe's, like management, really
tied up in the bid processbecause I'm bidding these jobs
(04:31):
For, you know, smaller clientsand I pulled up our strategic
like planning PDF and I showedhim the map.
I was like, bro, yeah, we sat inthe room and said this type of
project is not the future ofyour company.
Yeah, we've got to go afterthis type of client and this
type of business.
And he was like, yeah, yeah,you're right.
I was like but you, you wantthe, you need the revenue.
Sure, you got to keep the light, sure, on.
(04:52):
You've got payroll, you've gotexpenses, and so these small
jobs are keeping the lightsturned on absolutely and at the
same time, they're killing thepossibility of a future man I
read, I resonate with that sodeeply and I feel that even in
my own business now.
Speaker 2 (05:06):
And so let's just do, let's do a live coaching
session here, let's go coach,coach me on my business, because
what I was writing down,actually, as you were talking a
minute ago, is you have to getto the place where the fear of
staying the same or Goingbackwards is greater than the
fear of taking that, that riskright.
(05:28):
Like you get sort of like hey,I'm actually I'm more afraid,
like in the movie, I'm moreafraid of Actually having to
stay here the same or having todo this again.
I would rather just die.
Yeah then it's, it was actuallygreater than the fear of missing
the jump right.
And so I think in a lot ofpeople's lives, whether it's in
(05:48):
their personal health, mentalhealth, emotional health,
business, whatever you get theirplace where it's like I'm
actually more afraid of stayingthe same than I am of what it's
gonna take to get me to where Iwant to be in life, right, yeah,
so if you're, if you'recoaching, consulting me, because
I feel that there's things,there's goals I have in my
business I Don't want to get to,but there's things that I have
(06:08):
got going on currently thatmight be the driver of my time,
my energy, my revenue, all thosekind of things.
And it's just, it's scary ashell to go from what's kind of
keeping you alive to when I wantto be, but I can't get to where
I want to be because what'skind of keeping me alive is
dominant in my time.
If you're coaching me on that,help me with next steps, because
(06:32):
that is a big leap right.
Like this, like even Batman hadhis, had his sage Mentor that
was helping him see, like, yeah,this is, this is gonna be a
problem if you miss it, right.
So help me with this man,because how do you get from
point a to even point B?
Forget point Z.
Speaker 1 (06:49):
Yeah, well, we've we've used this word before on
the show but perspective.
So you have to pull away fromyour business that you're
running to see it for what itreally is.
Yeah, you know.
So if you're in the middle ofinvoicing or doing the work that
you're doing, talking toclients you can't stop in that
moment, be like, oh, there's adifferent future that I want.
You have to take serious time,like, and I think people should
(07:12):
build a work on it calendar fortheir year.
So I would propose, hey, once ayear you need a three-day
off-site when you and yoursenior leaders, or you and your
mentor, get away and you look atthe business that you have, you
get on top of the mountain andtry to see the whole picture and
then, quarterly, you'rereviewing Okay, we're gonna take
eight hours a quarter, a wholeday, and say, okay, are we doing
(07:37):
what we said we're gonna dofrom a strategy, execution and
vision standpoint for thecompany, and then, once a month,
you've got to be reviewingthose as well.
So, first of all, the firststep is perspective.
Where am I really and where doI want to go?
Speaker 2 (07:49):
Yeah, dude, that's so good.
Yeah, I want to dive more intothat work on it calendar,
because that is that's reallysmart.
Yeah, I wonder how manyorganizations or leaders
Actually actually do this onthis three-day off-site.
Right, talk a little bit aboutand this is a little off topic,
so I don't spend too much timehere but what are the kind of
things you're doing on athree-day off-site like that
(08:11):
step?
Speaker 1 (08:12):
ones disconnect.
Yeah, I'm not gonna check myteam emails.
I'm not gonna put out any fires.
I'm not gonna manage crisis.
I'm not gonna look at theproblems of my organization yeah
, so I'm turning my face awayfrom the immediate and I'm
turning my face towards A littlebreathing room.
Right, it's right, you're gonnaget a cabin.
You're gonna air B&B yeah,somewhere where there's nature,
(08:32):
a lake, yeah, pond, ocean,something where you can just be
totally focused on the futureand not the present.
So that's the first step is getaway.
Yeah, that's really good.
And the exercises you I mean youcan do a hundred different
things.
You can do a four helpful listand we're gonna look at what's
right, what's wrong, what'smissing, what's confused.
You can do SWAT on the wholebusiness, where our strengths,
(08:54):
weaknesses, opportunities,threats.
Something I like to do is aturning points, like an events
Calendar of the company hey,what happened in the beginning,
and then what happened?
And then, at this phase, phaseof the business, what happened
next?
And talk about the story of thebusiness and try to learn from
hey, when we pivoted orreiterated or we had a crisis,
(09:15):
what happened financially,strategically?
Yeah, what happened to ourproduct?
What happened to our people?
And every time you look at aturning point event in your
company's history, you get tolearn something.
So again, you're just trying todo something that distracts
from clients calling, yeah,staff calling HR issues.
You're like no, let's, let's,let's look at holistically.
Yeah you're just gonna runthrough a series of exercises
that look at where are we soperspective before planning and
(09:38):
then.
Then you need dreamers on yourteam, like you need people that
don't always just grind right.
You know.
You need people that are gonnabe around you.
They're like man.
What if you start asking thosebig questions?
Like man, If there wasn'tobstacles, if we knew we
couldn't fail, what would we bereally doing right now?
You ask those big questions andyou fill in the fill in the
piece of paper like dude.
We would do this like if therewas no way we'd fail.
(10:00):
We'd do this.
Speaker 2 (10:01):
Yeah, yeah, I love that.
Well, it's also a great time toto Work with each other, like
to learn each other.
Yeah, so like relational is ahuge part of it, man, because I
know, yeah, I sat in on one ofyour off-sites that you led not
too long ago and you did somestrength finder stuff you did
and you got people talking aboutlike recognizing, hey, what do
you bring to the table and whatconversation Should I bring you
(10:23):
into, and all that kind of stuff, and so, anyways, not to get
too distracted on that, but wewould encourage people to do
this, to have a work on itcalendar, bring some
intentionality and strategy toit.
I'm going back to kind of thefear thing, though I want you to
speak a little bit to scarcity.
Yeah right, because I thinkthis is a mindset that a lot of
us have in business, especiallywhen you start to have a little
(10:45):
bit of success.
Then that scarcity and thatcontrol the things that even,
like I know, for me my mentalityis different now than it was
when I first started, like Ijust you get to where it's like,
okay, now I want to holdtightly to what I have, yeah,
and I stopped doing the thingsthat I was doing in the
beginning to build to where Iwas at today.
Right, so talk to me as abusiness leader, the other
(11:06):
business leaders that arelistening, entrepreneurs around
this scarcity mindset, how thatholds us back and how do we
overcome that to actuallyachieve the goals that we want
to get to yeah, I Thinkquestions are one of the best
ways to move someone forward,and it's some of those like
really eternal questions likewhen am I?
Speaker 1 (11:23):
Yeah really right, where do I want to go?
Really?
I'm not talking about scarcity,digging into those like
existential not like I've goteight hours today.
How do I best divvy that up formy business priorities, like no
, we're not talking about thatkind of stuff.
If you've got a break a habitof Scarcity and it is a habit
(11:44):
like you you you disciplineyourself towards scarcity, just
the way you discipline yourselfout of scarcity right.
Interesting.
Yeah, so we, we build theseneural pathways.
Every time we make a decisionthat leads towards scarcity.
Okay, I'm not gonna think aboutthe future of my business.
I need to go get one of theselittle small clients again.
That's gonna help me makepayroll for the next week.
Well, so you start to automatesome of those ways of thinking,
(12:07):
you start to automate some ofthose practices and all before
you know it, you're justbuilding habits towards scarcity
leadership and I think you gotto go.
Okay, no, I'm gonna stop that.
I'm gonna be intentional aboutokay, I've said in one of my
off-sides, or I've said to mymentor or my business coach I
want to do X, what's a habitualthing?
What's a discipline?
What's the thing I can do rightnow?
(12:28):
That puts me on the pathtowards doing that?
And it's gonna feel scarybecause Typically with scarcity,
you're going there are finiteresources, time is a finite
resource, my energy is a finiteresource, my budget's finite.
I can't do everything all atonce.
I'm just gonna do what I know Ican control Mm-hmm, and I know
I can get my head in my mindaround right, and you go after
(12:50):
that.
But abundance is saying thereare more resources than I have
Consciously acknowledged yeah,I'm smarter than I think I am
right.
I've got more relationshipsthan I think I do.
There's more strategy out therethan I've tapped into.
There's more I can learn.
There's more I can be developed.
(13:11):
There's more I can stretch andgrow.
Yeah, and that will lead tomore opportunity.
More opportunity leads tobuilding a bigger budget and
it's just putting yourself on apathway towards those things and
abundance.
Speaker 2 (13:22):
Yeah, man, that's such good advice.
I, for me, I know I have tosurround myself and we've talked
about this a lot on thispodcast but I have to get around
other people who help me withthat mindset and that, you know,
help me get out of thatscarcity mindset, help me dream
again, help speak truth.
You know, I'm the type ofleader that I can be very
scattered, not focused.
I mean people with me.
That's also saying hey, that'sa great idea, just not yet.
(13:45):
Or that's a bad idea or likeyou know.
So, depending on yourpersonality, having people
around you that are helping youUnderstand like, hey, this is a
good risk to take, you know.
And the last thing I wanted toask you because I think this is
also helpful is Around the ideaof like in the in the movie with
Batman, like if he misses thatjump, like he's gonna physically
(14:05):
die, right.
The good news is, like we'renot living in the movie.
So, like if you take a leap offaith.
I think a lot of people think,hey, if I do this, I'm gonna die
, right.
It does feel that way.
It could feel scary.
The truth is, you know, thedifference between entrepreneurs
or even just leaders that makeit are the ones that just get up
and keep trying, like they failforward, right, that whole like
(14:27):
thing.
I was just talking to a leadernot too long ago who is wanting
to make a big jump, who'swanting to make, and there's
just so much anxiety and fearbecause it's leaving what's
known and going to the unknown,right.
So I'd love for you just totalk to that leader that's out
there.
That's like Matt man, you don'tunderstand.
I've got a family to providefor.
I got, like, what do I do toget from point B to point A?
(14:49):
And the reason I'm asking thisis because you're a very
practical thinker.
I'm more the type of like just,you know, jump without a
parachute, see what happens.
You know, like, but how do youhelp us kind of to bridge that
gap into where we want to be inlife?
Speaker 1 (15:02):
Well, I think most of us vastly overestimate the
consequences of failure andvastly underestimate what safety
is really doing.
I just don't think we weremeant to live safe lives.
I'm not saying to be a wildperson, I'm not saying it's the
Wild West and just live yourdreams and go for everything,
(15:23):
but I'm saying like, greatstories and so we'll go back to
the movies for a second Involverisk, right, they involve the
unknown and all that stuff andyou may think you're in
something that's safe andpredictable.
What you don't understand isyou're giving away pieces of
your heart, like you're givingaway things that you don't know
(15:44):
you're giving to achieve thatsafety.
Safety has a cost.
You pay the price every singleday.
Now it's small, maybeincremental.
It doesn't feel like failingdoes, and failing publicly is
like a huge fear for most people.
But, man, I would trade apublic failure over like a small
, quiet death in a place whereI'm just like it's safe.
I'm staying here because it'ssafe Totally.
Speaker 2 (16:07):
One and, like you said, most people, when you take
that leap, even if you do fail,the key of getting back up and
trying again and going.
Those are the people, like thefriends of mine that are the
most successful, have failed themost.
That's right, but they justdon't have that mentality of
like well, I'm going to quit.
It's like well, I just keepgoing, I'm going to chalk it up,
and they end up figuring it out.
So, matt, this was great.
(16:28):
This is actually an episodethat I need because, like fear,
anxiety that can really takeover in my life is really
helpful.
I just want to give you kind ofjust the final word, even if
you just want to encapsulatekind of the big idea behind this
.
Speaker 1 (16:40):
Yeah, I don't think I'd wrap specifically, trying to
put it all on a bow.
I would say, look, none of thisstuff is easy.
If it was easy, everybody wouldbe doing it, and they're not.
And so my thing is look forinspiration.
Right, there are books, there'spodcasts, there's relationships
, all that stuff.
But you need someone in yourcorner Like it is very difficult
to do or talking about, unlessyou've got the right kind of
(17:02):
systems in place that supportyou.
And I'm more talking likeemotionally, like hey, have
somebody who's rooting for you.
Yes, we need to take that risk.
We've got to go try this.
We can't stay safe anymore.
And if you're surrounded bypeople who make safe decisions,
like you're probably going tocontinue to make safe decisions.
And if you get around peoplewho are comfortable with failure
and say, look, it was neverfinal when I screwed that up, it
(17:23):
didn't hold me back forever.
When I hit the concrete facefirst, I got back up and people
supported me and I was able todo something different.
So I think it's all aboutfinding someone who's going to
encourage you on that journey.
Yeah, so give me.
Thanks, matt Yep.
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