Understanding Trauma and Finding Peace With Laurel Wiers

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What if the key to your inner peace lies in understanding the latent pain you carry? Join us as we promise a transformative exploration into the depths of trauma with expert Laurel Wiers. Laurel redefines trauma, emphasizing its lasting impact on our psyche and emotions rather than the event itself. She shares invaluable insights from her work with first responders, highlighting why early intervention is crucial to prevent long-term effects. Through this episode, you'll gain a deeper understanding of how trauma can lie dormant for years, only to resurface at moments of vulnerability, and how our bodies manage this latent pain.

Discover the complexities of trauma triggers and the therapeutic techniques designed to neutralize them. Laurel introduces groundbreaking methods such as EMDR, ART, and critical memory integration, offering a roadmap to emotional release and healing. By connecting negative memories to more positive associations, these therapies help alleviate the pain of triggers that can arise from simple interactions. With compelling personal stories, including the emotional aftermath of a loved one's suicide, this episode provides listeners with powerful tools and hope for navigating their own healing journeys.

Experience the revolutionary approach of Rapid Trauma Resolution Therapy, which offers substantial relief without the need to recount traumatic experiences in detail. Laurel's discussion about the benefits of this method, particularly for first responders and survivors of sexual abuse, underscores the importance of properly integrating traumatic memories. In our final conversation, we uncover the profound ways self-love and trauma integration can lead to a sense of inner peace and stability. Reconnect with your past self and learn to embrace your traumas as we guide you through this path to healing and emotional well-being.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:15):
Hello and thank you for joining me on this episode
of the Fuzzy Mike.
You know the feedback of thepast two episodes.
It's been overwhelming and sopositive.
So thank you for those kindcomments and for the several
congratulatory messages on our100th episode last week.
This week we start our trek to200.

(00:37):
And, having the benefit ofrecording these in advance, I
can tell you that theconversation you're about to
hear well, it was life-changingfor me and I fully believe that
if you are dealing with a pasttrauma, it could be just as
life-altering for you.
My guest this week is LaurelWeers.
Laurel is somebody I found on apodcast that I listen to

(00:58):
regularly and it's hosted by afuture Fuzzy Mike guest.
Her name is Jen Drummond.
While I was listening to Laurelon Jen's podcast, I appreciated
her ability to articulate thedynamics of trauma in a way that
wasn't clinical.
I appreciated her empathy andher passion for healing those
who hurt.

(01:20):
I wanted to have her on theFuzzy Mike because I know some
of you who listen and openlytalk with me about your
post-traumatic events.
I know you can greatly benefitfrom Laurel and her methods, and
my goal with the fuzzy mic it'salways been to provide you
information, instruction andinspiration to help you navigate
through your own mentalstruggles struggles Whether you

(01:47):
know me personally or justthrough this podcast or my days
when I was on the radio.
You know that I am open aboutmy own mental health diagnoses,
but I try very hard not to makemy own mental dilemmas a focus
of this podcast.
The question I always askmyself is how will this impact a
listener?
Never.
How will this impact me?
So I do feel quite sheepishthat this conversation did take

(02:11):
a bit of a personal tone, but Irationalize that by telling
myself that I'm just an exampleof how Laurel and her methods
can benefit you.
I'm excited to bring you thisamazing episode.

Speaker 2 (02:26):
Hello Laurel Weers.
Good morning, how are you?

Speaker 1 (02:29):
I'm fantastic, so excited to be speaking with you.

Speaker 2 (02:32):
Oh well, thank you, Same here.
Thanks for asking me to be on.

Speaker 1 (02:35):
Your voice and the way that you talk, just it seems
empowering.

Speaker 2 (02:40):
Oh well, that's my hope.
Right's what I hope witheveryone I sit with yeah.

Speaker 1 (02:46):
And so let's just jump in and say, ask the
question what is trauma?

Speaker 2 (02:52):
oh, you know, it's actually a word that, as you've
heard me say, I kind of shy awayfrom.
Um, trauma is really any event.
That's really big.
And the way I look at itpersonally is it changes your
whole trajectory.
There's a pre-trauma version ofyou and then there's a
post-trauma version of you and Ithink what we call trauma in

(03:13):
between that varies anywherefrom a car accident to being
bullied when we were little.
I don't think that we have tomake it a certain thing right,
the DSM.
Everyone has certaindefinitions of what trauma is,
but there's so many people thattalk about it, like Gabor Mate.
He's very big in the traumafield and he says trauma isn't

(03:34):
the event that happened, butit's basically the mark that it
leaves upon you, the imprintupon your psyche, who you are,
your emotions.
So to me that's trauma, it'swhat's left over.
It's really not the event, somuch.

Speaker 1 (03:50):
So how does or why does trauma lay dormant in our
minds for so long and then allof a sudden, for no apparent
reason, it just shows up?

Speaker 2 (04:02):
This is such a good question, truly, because my
clients will come to me and saythis and in a sense it fools
people because they think it'snot trauma or they think the
event has been taken care of orthey've processed it or that
they're just fine.
And then they come into myoffice and they say I don't know
why, suddenly right, and it'snot.

(04:24):
Suddenly I'm being triggered bysomething, and really it's just
that they've done a really goodjob or their body sometimes not
even intentionally has done agreat job at managing.
And I feel like what happens inlife and I see this all the
time is that we all have thiscapacity to be resilient and we
all have this ability toovercome and to function.

(04:46):
We are made to function in theface of horrible things.
But over time I feel likethere's a chipping away that
starts to happen and then wenever know for everybody it's
different when we're going tohit that point that we become
almost fragile in a sense.
So a great example of this ismy first responders.

(05:07):
Typically, I have two ends ofthe spectrum with them.
I either have the first group,which are the brand new first
responders.
They've gone to their, you know, they're in their first six
months they've gone to thesehorrible calls and they're
having nightmares or they can'tdrive down the street where they
went to the call and somebodydidn't make it.
And so they're very aware thatthis is consuming them in their

(05:31):
mind because they haven't quite,maybe, mastered the ability yet
to function through that.
So I love it.
I love it when they come to mebecause I feel like it's a gift
I can give them to say let meclean that up for you, so your
brain doesn't have to show it toyou anymore, so you can drive
down that street and not betriggered anymore.
And I feel like when they cango out at the beginning of their

(05:54):
career and know that they havea Laurel to call or anybody to
call, to say I keep seeing thisand it's long past the event,
that's a win for me.
So I either get them in thebeginning or I get the end,
which this is where it ties backto kind of this chipping away.
So I'll get my guys thatthey've been in the field for 25
, 30 years and they have seen somuch stuff and they have

(06:17):
functioned perfectly fine.
Now they'll come and tell me ohyes, I've been triggered for
years.
Or oh yes, I've had nightmares,that type of a thing, but it
hasn't impeded their ability toget the job done.
But then all of a sudden theyhit this one accident and
they're like Laurel ever sincethat accident.
I cannot hear the own sirensfrom my truck, the police sirens

(06:40):
.
I can't go out there withoutgetting into fight or flight.
So what they are actuallyrecognizing is that their
nervous system has kind of hitits max on what it can manage.
And now, all of a sudden, thisthing.
They think it's this case, butit's not this case, it's just
that their system can't manageit anymore.
So then they come into me andwhat I say is it wasn't really

(07:02):
this case, this was just are-traumatization of probably a
couple other calls that you wentto, and then we will, you know,
clean that out and then they'regood to go again.
So yeah, I think that ourbodies can hold so much, and for
everyone it's different whensuddenly we can't hold it
anymore.

Speaker 1 (07:18):
So a lot to dissect in that answer right there and I
love it.
It's so beautiful dissectingthat answer right there and I
love it.
It's so beautiful.
So it can.
I know we don't like to use theword trauma, but is it just one
event that can cause the damageor is it multiple events?

Speaker 2 (07:36):
that have to accumulate.
One event can do it Really.
Or it can be multiple.
Oh, totally Like well, think,for example, I can have somebody
who's fine their whole life.
They get in one car accidentand they suddenly can knock it
in their car without a panicattack.
One event.
Or they have some one eventhappen with a dog.
Right, it doesn't take a wholelot.
The thing is we never know.

(07:57):
Now there's been research thatshows you know the ACEs study
that if we've had past negativelife events you know abuse,
domestic violence, parents withmental health yes, there is a
propensity for us to be morelikely to experience trauma or
have PTSD because of ourbackground.
But you can have plenty ofpeople who don't have any of

(08:18):
that and they just have oneevent and that's all that it
takes, and then they have traumafrom it.

Speaker 1 (08:24):
So I'm 13 years old.
My dad tells me I'll neveramount to anything.
I brush it off at the time, butI used it as motivation to
become as successful as I wantedto become or could become.
To spite him.
It didn't feel bad at the time,but then, as I got older, it

(08:49):
felt horrible.
Yes, how does that happen?
Why do we seemingly notinternalize that?
And then, bam, it just shows up.

Speaker 2 (09:01):
Exactly Kind of that same thing, right, we don't know
when it suddenly becomes aproblem and typically what
happens is you're right, and Ithink this is what's so good is
there's strength that can befound in some of these negative
things, and I love that peoplecan look back and say I had the
capacity to take somethingreally negative right and turn
it into a positive.
But then something will happenthat triggers that same sense of

(09:24):
someone doesn't believe in me,someone doubts me, someone's
judging me, someone thinks I'mincompetent, right In their
normal daily life, 20 yearslater or whatnot, and all of a
sudden they don't actually mostof the time tie it back to that
13 year old event.
So when you talk about that,that's a great insight and
self-awareness, because many ofmy people that is not the stage

(09:45):
that they're coming into me at.
They're coming into me andthey're saying Laurel, I'm going
into these meetings or I'mgoing into this new job and I
don't know what is coming overme, but I suddenly am at a loss
for words or I suddenly don'tfeel like I can do it, and what
I will say to them is justnotice what you're feeling in
that moment, notice how thatfeels in your body and our

(10:09):
bodies are so good at telling usthe true story.
And when I will do that, theywill say, oh, that feels
familiar.
And then I'll say, okay, let'sfollow this, let's pull this
thread, let's go back in timeand find out, when else did you
feel that?
And usually they will have theresponse oh, I just saw this
moment, but it was so long ago.

(10:29):
That can't be it.
And I'm like, no, no, no, no,yes, that actually is it.
Whenever you tell me, no, thatcan't be it, I'm like, oh, we're
into something good becausethat is definitely going to be
it.
And so, yeah, we'll go back andthey'll say I was 13 years old,
this is what my dad told me,and that, right is a trauma
response.
It's your body always havingthat in the front of your brain

(10:51):
and it's the filter throughwhich every other life event
comes through and it taints it.
So if we can go back andneutralize that, and then your
body no longer is thinking aboutit and holding it, you're still
your resilient self that youlearned to be, but without the
baggage of that statement, youwon't amount to anything.

Speaker 1 (11:11):
You just clarified something for me that years of
therapy has been unable to do,and I've done EMDR before.
I mean that was a long processand it's not as good, it's not
as rapid as ART, which we'regoing to talk about.
That's your specialty, but yeah, it was like two and a half

(11:32):
months at $160 a pop every week.
It's just crazy.

Speaker 2 (11:36):
Oh, I'm so sorry.

Speaker 1 (11:38):
No, but that's where I learned that the 13 year old
trauma happened.
Okay, but what you just said tome explains everything about
why a boss will come to me andsay hey, and that's all it does.
That's all they have to say.
They might say something goodafter that, but I hear hey, and
all of a sudden I go intodefensive mode.

Speaker 2 (11:59):
Yes, yes, and so the EMDR didn't fix that.

Speaker 1 (12:04):
It didn't fix it.
It just identified where theproblem came from.

Speaker 2 (12:07):
Yeah, okay.
So guess what?
There's hope you can actuallyneutralize that.

Speaker 1 (12:12):
Well, you know, you say there's hope, and that's one
of the things that I take awayfrom researching.
You know, when you hear trauma,we automatically at least I do
think blunt force trauma.
You know, boom, somebody's,somebody's been hit, A bruise
shows up.
Well, guess what?
The bruise goes away eventually.
So maybe the hope is that theseholding back thoughts can go

(12:34):
away too.

Speaker 2 (12:36):
Right, and that's how a lot of people operate and for
the most part, that actually do.
They go away, no, but continueto be a problem.
No, most people can move alongquite fine, but usually it's
right.
In that moment when it becomesa problem, oh, it's all you can
see once it's revealed to you,and that's where people are
stuck because they're like well,I did two years of therapy,

(12:56):
laurel, I've talked about this,they'll come to me.
Oh, I process this and I'm likeokay, then how come you're
tearful right now?
Because if you really processthis, like you would probably
not be emoting on a certainlevel with it, when something
has been integrated into yourmemory the way that it needs to
be, to no longer be triggering,and yeah, how do we move that
thought from the front of ourmind into the back of our mind,

(13:19):
where it lays dormant anddoesn't ever appear?
it lays dormant and doesn't everappear.
So that would be through any ofthe methods.
So EMDR sometimes can do that,art sometimes can do that, and
also critical memory integrationcan do that, and that's a new
emerging therapeutic model thatcame out this last year that I
had the pleasure of being acollaborator on.
So basically, what you have todo is you have to calm your body

(13:43):
as it's reacting to thoseimages, to those moments, to
those things that were spokenover you.
But the beauty is it's not justdesensitizing yourself to it,
but you actually have to processit and almost in a sense
connect it to something morepositive.
So in accelerated resolutiontherapy, what you do, one of our
processes, is we actuallycreate positization is what the

(14:04):
developer calls it to a memory.
So once we process the negative,you can ask questions like well
, how do you wish it had been?
And in that moment, when youcan take a memory that was
really traumatic and you canmake it unstable, your brain has
the ability to actually changeit.
You're not changing the memorythe people always remember the
facts but you can change theimages and the sensations, which

(14:26):
are really the troubling part.
Anyways, nobody gets upset whenyou say, oh, my father was
negative towards me.
But when you sit in that momentand you see your father and you
hear those words and your bodycalls it up, that's what becomes
the problem.
So if we can take that and wecan process out again, the body
holds it and there's ways that Ican calm people's body as
they're remembering the memory.
But once you process it out,it's almost like this drain

(14:50):
where your body's like okay,thank you.
Like I always say to my clients, sit in that moment and feel
that and acknowledge thatfeeling.
Do not gloss over it, becausewhen you say hi, thank you,
thank you for being there, I seewhat's happening, I honor what
I went through in those earlieryears.
It's like your body goes ah,now that you heard us, we can

(15:11):
leave you, and it will.
It will process out theemotional piece of it and then
we can make sense of okay, whatwould have been a better way to
have resolved this situation.
And it's crazy when the memoryis unstable, it will latch onto
that new image and that newsensation.
And by the end of a session,when I say to a client, like if
it were you, I would say fatherat 13, what do you see right now

(15:35):
they will see the new memory orthe new image sorry, not the
new memory the new image that weassociated with it, which is so
cool because that's positive.
And then they leave with thatfeeling.
They can recite to me whathappened at 13, but they no
longer see the bad.
And then they're no longertriggered because their nervous
system has been calmed down.

Speaker 1 (15:53):
Yeah, it's so interesting because for 30 years
actually it was 27 years I was.
There was never any negativeyears I was.
There was never any negativefailure or anything on my part
and I felt like I was winning,okay.
And then, but my dad, he's.
He's long gone, 18, 19 yearsago.

(16:14):
He killed himself.

Speaker 2 (16:15):
But uh, I'm so sorry.

Speaker 1 (16:18):
Oh, no, don't be, don't be, no, not at all.
Uh, I, I people say that allthe time, oh, I'm so sorry, and
I look at it like you know.
Yeah, he committed suicide andit sucks for the family, but the
thing that the the act itselfdoesn't bother me.
What bothers me is, I don'tknow, his demeanor going down
those stairs to hang himself.

(16:38):
Was he mad?
Was he sad?
Was he just fed up?
You know that that's whatbothers me, Cause you never left
a note.
It does.
The act itself doesn't botherme at all.

Speaker 2 (16:46):
You know, it really doesn't.

Speaker 1 (16:48):
So, but my point was that for 27 years I was, oh God,
I was winning, I was winning.
The spite was, it was real andman, I took it.
I took that power away from himand then the biggest failure of
my life happened and I'm stilldealing with it because I can't
change it.
You know, that's where the 13year old thing came up and it's

(17:11):
like, man, he was right.

Speaker 2 (17:13):
Oh damn, oh, we have to fix that for you, kevin, yeah
, yeah.

Speaker 1 (17:23):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2 (17:23):
Because think what would it be like if you didn't
have that.
Continue to creep back in andcontinue to like poke at that
self-doubt.

Speaker 1 (17:30):
Well, I'd probably still have a job.
I would probably be, you know,like I was before this event
happened, and I mean world bythe tail.
But now I self-doubt.
Now I'm.
I seriously.
I retired shortly after thisevent.
In the event was, I was tryingto do something that had never
been done before and I failed.

(17:52):
I didn't do it and so yeah, butso I quit my job, I retired
quote, retired.
I was on the radio for 30 yearsand I felt after this failure,
I felt, well, you're like afraud, you can't be in the
public eye if you can't succeed.

Speaker 2 (18:11):
So yeah, I know Right , and it's.
It's crazy though, isn't itthat?

Speaker 1 (18:16):
that one memory from uh.
You know what?
I was 13 years old at uh, earlyeighties.
Yeah, right, and it is.
And people will say it's onememory, but but it really is 13
years old, early 80s.

Speaker 2 (18:26):
Yeah, yes, right, and it is, and people will say it's
one memory, but it really is,because in a sense, like we
talked about how we started this, it altered who you were Before
your father spoke those wordsover you.
You could take on the worldRight After he spoke those words
over you.
Even though you pushed againstit, it was planted and then
there was always this reactivityto it.
And then, when you talk aboutthe event that happened that you

(18:49):
know led to this shift in you,that, in a sense, is a
re-traumatization of 13-year-oldyou right, it feels the same in
your body, I would dare to say,and they connect on the same
feelings because really, thatwas the original, but this was
like oh, here we are again.
So, yeah, you need to clearthose.

Speaker 1 (19:06):
Oh, he doubled down when I was 22,.
Because then I told him, hey, Ijust took a job in radio and
I'm making $13,100 a year and hegoes.
He told you no life, no future.
And I just, yeah, he doubleddown.
Man, he you know.

Speaker 2 (19:20):
Seriously, yeah, those are what we call critical
memories.
Right, these memories thatagain they screw with us.
So if you were my client, wewould pull both of those, we
would pull 13 and we would pull22 and we would neutralize them,
so they were no longer part ofthe way that you react to things
.

Speaker 1 (19:37):
But it was such a motivating factor for me though
you know, and had I not.
So what I was trying to do wasI was trying to be the first
person in recorded history torun from the Arctic Circle sign
to the Arctic Ocean in winter.

Speaker 2 (19:49):
Oh, my goodness.

Speaker 1 (19:50):
Minus 40 degrees and it's 304 miles and I only ran
264 before my body gave out, youknow.

Speaker 2 (19:56):
That is quite an accomplishment.
264, Kevin.
Oh, my word.

Speaker 1 (20:00):
It was yeah, it was a marathon a day for nine
straight days Super impressive,but it's super impressive.
But here's the thing, though Iwas doing it for childhood
cancer awareness, and so you,the world's watching you, and,
yes, you blow up, and so myfirst thought was he was right.
Damn it and I know it'sirrational, and I know it's

(20:23):
subconscious, and but you knowit's there.
You know it's irrational and Iknow it's subconscious, and but
you know it's there, you knowit's there.

Speaker 2 (20:30):
Absolutely, absolutely.
And you know you made a veryinteresting comment a moment ago
that I want to highlightbecause it's a comment I hear
often.
So when people have thesenegative events, sometimes they
will come to me and they'll say,laurel, I know this is a
problem, but I don't want to getrid of it, because it is the
reason I am a success, it's thereason that I've been able to do

(20:50):
what I do, and so if you dosomething with this, I won't be
that person anymore.
Very, very common misconception, to which I say it is like when
it's alarm bells, but they'regoing off all the time, right?
So you want a fire alarm thatworks when there is a fire.
You don't want a fire alarmthat goes off all the time over

(21:12):
the slightest thing, becausethat's annoying and then we
don't function well, right, itcreates a sense.
We want to be in a vigilantstate, not in a hypervigilant
state.
And so when people come to meand they say that, I say you're
not going to lose who you are,your tenacity, your drive, your
ability, but what we're going todo is take away those parts of
you that do too much of that, ina sense, because you're trying

(21:33):
to cover up your insecurities.
That's the exhausting, tiringpiece of you that you just don't
need.
It's costing you something in anegative fashion.
So if we can clear that up, youcan still have all that other
stuff, but it's not going totake away who you have developed
yourself to be through allthese other things.
It just takes away the superhypervigilant alarm bells, if
that makes sense.

Speaker 1 (21:53):
Absolutely, Because one of the things I read is and
this is from, I believe, yourwebsite trauma saps your energy.

Speaker 2 (22:02):
It does.
Concentration, creativity,focus, you know, just makes you
just tired, it makes you anxious, as your nervous system is
jacked up all the time and again.
We can do that for a season,but we can't do it forever.
It shouldn't be a lifestyle.

Speaker 1 (22:18):
So I mentioned that I was EMDR.
I said it took me two months,two and a half months EMDR.
I said it took me two months,two and a half months ART would
shorten that by at least half.

Speaker 2 (22:28):
Oh yeah, Like well, like, everything you just talked
about would literally be onesession.
Seriously Seriously seriouslyone session.

Speaker 1 (22:36):
How do you make money ?

Speaker 2 (22:43):
Someone said that to me the other day.
They were like you are sodifferent because I hear you
saying that you want people toget well and to be done with you
, and they said the same thing,like that's not a really good
model, and I'm like, well, Ireally just believe there's
enough pain in the world that Iprobably am okay.

Speaker 1 (23:00):
Well, there is actually.
Yeah, you're right.

Speaker 2 (23:02):
Yeah, totally.
And obviously I don't takeinsurance, so people pay well to
have this done.
But I mean, who doesn't want tobe done?
I think that's a great deal tobe done in one session.
To three sessions when you havethese things.
I mean typically when it'ssomething like you just said.
That to me is one session toptwo, but I can hear what you're

(23:23):
saying right now.
I can look at the memory sets.
That's one.
But when I have people that havea couple of things, well,
they'll come in and hang outwith me for a half day or a full
day and we just go through alltheir stuff and just pick off
their critical memories one byone and then they leave and they
are tired as all get get out.
Don't get me wrong, it isemotionally exhausting.
We've taken years of therapyand put it into a day, but it
just clears them right out andthey leave and after three days

(23:44):
later, when they're like whew,they come to life again.
They're like, oh my gosh, theclarity is unbelievable because
you don't have that baggageweighing on you anymore.
But yeah, art was an outgrowthof EMDR.
So they work on the same thing,which is memory reconsolidation
and adaptive informationprocessing, which is taking your
memory networks and reallyintegrating them properly.

(24:06):
When we have big life eventshappen, we're not integrating
right.
It's almost like your brain'slike this is too big, we're just
going to leave it hanging outhere for a little while, and
that's what screws things up.
So both of those modalitiescome in and they say let's
finish that memory network,let's integrate it and let's
calm the nervous system and getyou to move on and make sense of
it, because it's a naturalthing your brain does it anyways

(24:28):
.
It's just that we need tomanually do it when there's big
traumas.
But the difference is EMDR andI'm trained in EMDR also it is
free, associative and ART ismuch more formulaic and it's a
protocol and it's quicker and itkind of dives in, gets to it,
pulls it out, neutralizes it.
I can do it anywhere from 45minutes to an hour and a half

(24:49):
max two hour session to docertain memory sets.
Whereas EMDR, because it's morefree, associative, it takes a
little bit longer.

Speaker 1 (25:03):
Okay, so for somebody who needs this and I'm thinking
of somebody in particular, andit's not me, it's one of my
regular listeners and shelistens religiously and she's
had some serious trauma in herlife Okay, so for somebody who
needs this, doesn't know aboutit, explain what EMDR means.

Speaker 2 (25:17):
Okay, it's eye movement, desensitization and
reprocessing.
Okay, so that's the EMDR andwith that, basically, what
you're doing is you're lookingat the memories, you're looking
at how they changed your lifeand you're processing it,
meaning that you're finallymaking sense of it and you're
integrating it.
So when we have memories thatare not processed, they're
called ready state memories.
These are memories that, in asense, they're the ones that

(25:38):
come up when you're triggered.
So your brain, they're out hereand your brain is always going
hello, hello, hello.
We have this memory here andit's not integrated and
therefore it's screwing thingsup.
It's reminding us and it'sdoing a service, though it's
protecting us.
What it's saying is we never,ever want to experience that
again or feel that way again.
So it's out there.
It thinks, making you a betterperson and making your life

(26:00):
better by reminding you of don'tlet this happen again.
That's a problem.
So when you go in and youprocess these memories, you put
it back and say thank you again.
Yes, but this is old.
See, triggers are often whenyour past is creeping into your
present.
It's making you think that thisis a current threat, when
really it was a past threat.
So both EMDR and ART tell yourbrain.

(26:23):
Oh, it's over.
And now that it's over, we cango forward with what we learned,
like I talked about with youbefore these people that are
hypervigilant let's just go backto vigilance.
Let's go back to learning andbeing rational and being more
calculated and conscious andaware and present, whereas when
we're hypervigilance, let's goback to learning and being
rational and being morecalculated and conscious and
aware and present, whereas whenwe're hypervigilant, we're in

(26:44):
the past and we're not seeingthat this is over.

Speaker 1 (26:48):
So one of the ways that we did this in EMDR and I
think you do it also on ART isthe eye movement thing, where my
therapist had something on alittle multicolored ball on the
end of a stick and I had tofollow it with my eyes.
What does that do?

Speaker 2 (27:07):
So that is bilateral stimulation.
So you can do it either withyour eyes, you can do it with
sound, you can do it withtapping.
So I used to do eye movementsforever.
That's all I did.
But then I started to usetappers, because I would have
people that couldn't do the eyemovements for whatever reason,
whether they just had difficultymoving their eyes, or people

(27:27):
with ADHD often have difficultyholding onto the thought and
moving their eyes sometimes.
So then I would go to I usethese buzzers that people put in
their hand.
But it's any way that youcreate bilateral stimulation and
what it does is two things.
One is it's a very calmingresponse.
So when people get upset itdoes calm, but also it distracts
the brain.
And as you're distracting thebrain with bilateral stimulation

(27:50):
, it just allows you to moreeasily access what's going on
and to make sense of thememories that are coming forward
.
So that's really it's kind ofgot a twofold process in it.

Speaker 1 (28:01):
So you said free association with EMDR.
Yeah, it seemed like there wasnothing congruent about it.
It's like how do you feel now?
How do you feel now?
And I'm just you know?
So how does ART differ?
Because we're getting fasterresults.

Speaker 2 (28:17):
Well, because we're not doing.
How do you feel now?
How do you feel now, go with it, go with it, go with it.
That's exactly what we weredoing.
Yeah, and again, I use EMDRparts of it in the work that I
do, but I don't do it the waythat a session is typically done
with that, because I know I canget results quicker with ART,

(28:39):
so that being, the difference isthat when somebody's doing EMDR
, yes, they're having a thoughtand as a therapist, you're
saying, okay, what do you feelnow?
What do you see now?
What are you noticing now?
Let's go with it.
The person you know does the eyemovements again and then the
brain is processing, itabsolutely is doing something,
and then you're like, okay, whatare you noticing now?
Right, you can see that thiscould go on for session after
session, after session aftersession, and it does for a lot

(29:00):
of people.
And, yes, they are integratingand they are making sense of it.
But it's taking a lot longer todo that process because you're
just allowing the person to gowherever and sometimes they can
get a little bit off, right,sometimes they were supposed to
be going this way, but then thisother memory set comes up and
that's important information,but then they're going over here

(29:23):
with it.
So you're processing that WithART.
What's happening is I know thememory set we're working on and
we don't do go with it, go withit, go with it.
That is, we are literally justprocessing that memory set and
then we are adding positiveassociation with it.
Obviously there's other stepsthat happen in between, but
because of that I know everystep of the way what I'm looking
for.
I know if it's working.
If it's not working, I know ifwe've hit the right memory based
on what's happening in theperson's body, or if actually

(29:45):
that memory was a representationof an earlier memory and that's
the one that we need to process.
And if I see that, then I say,oh, this isn't it, there's
something else.
And then in that session wewill hit that.
And then in that session wewill hit that, and then we start

(30:06):
over with that memory set andgo through it, and so, anyways,
it's just a very more directiveprocess that doesn't allow for
the weaving and diving andbobbing and moving that EMDR
does with the same results.

Speaker 1 (30:11):
Talking to Laura Wears you can see Laura Wears on
laurawhearscom or you can go.
You started LighthouseCounseling.

Speaker 2 (30:18):
Yes, yep, so I have Lighthouse Counseling, that's my
counseling business, and thenOptimal Outcome is my coaching
and consulting business.

Speaker 1 (30:26):
And here's something interesting that I heard you say
Trauma was not your first Love.
It was not where you found, itwas not where you thought you
would be.

Speaker 2 (30:37):
Oh no, it was not my jam at all.
Like I did not like it.
It scared me, truth be told,because I knew I couldn't help
you for the first 17 years.
I knew that I could becomforting and I could journey
alongside of you and I could bea support, but I knew that there
wasn't transformation and justthe nature of who I've always

(30:59):
been as a person which obviouslygets translated into my therapy
is I'm very solution focused,I'm very action oriented and I
want you to be better as soon aspossible.
I want you to live your life.
So what happened is my trauma.
People would come in and wewould talk, but they weren't
getting better.
We were just talking about thesame thing over and over again.

(31:19):
And even that sometimes isworse, because if you're not
processing and integrating atrauma, you are literally just
being re-traumatized by theretelling of that traumatic
event.
So, if anything, you may feelworse, or I'm opening things up
for you and you're going homeand you're dreaming about them.
Now you're having nightmaresagain.
Well, of course you're going toneed me next week because
you've been feeling like garbageever since our session last

(31:41):
week, because I opened you upand I didn't actually do
anything for your trauma.
So I realized very early on, ifI even smelled PTSD I'd be like,
oh no, no, no, no, no.
I got to go send them to one ofthose EMDR people.
I don't know what they do, butthey say they can do PTSD, so
you'll go over there.
So that's what I did for 17years.
And then I had a couple clientsthat my heart really went out

(32:05):
for and I did take them on andthey didn't want to go anywhere
else or they were waiting to getEMDR, so I would let them stay
with me.
And then that's when I happenedupon hearing about this new
form of therapy and got trainedin it and they were still like
within the holds of my practice.
So I was like, well, let's justtry this and see if it works.
And I did it.

(32:25):
And it blew my mind, it blewtheir mind, it surpassed
anything I'd ever been taughtabout therapy.
Right, when you get trained asa talk therapist which I'm a
proponent of, like, I do it, butI know when it works and when
it doesn't.
And so to have this therapywhere we're not talking and that
is the beautiful piece of it isthat you just have to be able
to see in your mind's eye thesemoments, which is so safe for my

(32:49):
first responders for sexualabuse people, anything like that
, because they don't have torecount the details of that mess
all over to me again, which alot of people love.
So, anyways, I saw thishappening and I saw that we
could do something by movingsomeone's eyes and just changing
the way that their brain lookedat these images and sensations
and the way that it stored it,and it brought this immense

(33:10):
relief.
And then they didn't even needto come back to me sometimes
because we had solved theirproblem and they'll come back
the next week.
You're like so what's going on?
They're like I'm good, and thenthey'll come back a month later
, I'm good.
So, yeah, once I realized that,I was like, oh, bring it on,

(33:30):
Anybody that I heard that hadstuck points in their life or
had traumas.
I wanted to help them because Iknew the other misconception was
that I could do it quickly,because everyone thinks, right,
it's going to take months oryears, like you said, two and a
half months, and all this likegrueling therapy, and I was like
, no, like we can do this, andin an hour and a half you are
going to feel such a lift andsuch relief from that memory set

(33:52):
and, yeah, so that just changedeverything for me To the point
that now that's really all thatI do besides my coaching changed
everything for me and to thepoint that now that's really all
that I do besides my coaching.
After I do this work withpeople.
I just love to do intensivesand I love to do our work online
with a lot of people justone-offs, you know, for certain
memory sets and things thathappen.

Speaker 1 (34:08):
So you can do it online.

Speaker 2 (34:10):
Yes, I can do it online.
I do so.
It's so cool.
There's all these ways that youcan get a ball that moves
online and people can watch it.
Or I had these tappers that Ihave people buy and I can
remotely manage your buzzers soI can get the bilateral
stimulation.
The only time that I get alittle more nervous online is
when people come to me is ifthey have more than two to three

(34:32):
memory sets that I know need tobe processed, because that can
become laborious doing a sessiona week for like three, four,
five weeks and you don't feelthe lift quite as much sometimes
when you have to processthrough like three to five
memory sets.
So I'll say you know what?
Just come in, spend a half daywith me, spend a day with me and
we'll get through it that way.
And if I think that they mighthave some dissociative

(34:54):
tendencies, then I just feel alot more comfortable having
people be there with me in thepresent.
If I know that that's apossibility, I will work with
people online that have that.
But I feel a lot better if it'scomplex, trauma and there's a
lot going on.
I just think being together inperson is just such a better
deal for that.

Speaker 1 (35:12):
You said something earlier about your clients.
Will see you once, maybe twice.
They come back.
Problem solved Is there aproblem that can't be solved?

Speaker 2 (35:22):
I'm sure there are right, because there's no one
therapy that is perfect foreverything in this world and I
am always learning, alwayslearning things that I said,
like seven years ago, oh I canknock that out.
Now I'm learning.
80% of the time I can knock aphobia out, but 20% of the time,

(35:43):
if you have generalized anxietydisorder and your phobia is a
presentation of your anxiety, oh, I can't knock that out in one
session.
So I would be so careful toever say is there anything that
it can't address?
Just because I think that wealways need to learn and be open
.

Speaker 1 (35:57):
Yeah Well, I don't know what the statistics are,
but I know that it's a very,very minuscule part of our brain
that we actually know andunderstand.
You know, the brain is sofascinating, I mean, it's like
the ocean, it's so untapped, youknow.

Speaker 2 (36:13):
Yes, totally, and just all the connections that
our brain has and where it goesto and all the things that it
wants to show us and teach usand resolve.

Speaker 1 (36:21):
Yeah, Well, here's an interesting thing, because you
and I have had this scheduledfor a week and yesterday, when I
started doing my intense prepfor this conversation, I woke up
and I don't know where it camefrom, but I started singing and
I don't know if you know thesong or not.
It's called Lucky man by theVerve.
It's from the 90s Okay, they'rea British band.

(36:43):
Anyway, I started singing thissong in my head.
I haven't sang it in years, butthere's a line in the song and
it hit me this morning.
There's a line in the song thatsays all the love I have is in
my mind.
So talking about, you know,self-love, you know it's talking

(37:05):
about acceptance of who we areand that's all we need.
And when I was listening to itagain this morning, prepping,
doing my last minute prep, I'mlike holy shit.
That's why I'm singing thissong, because Laurel's going to
help me find the inner peace,going to help me find the love
for myself that has been missing.
So isn't that weird, isn't thatcrazy?

Speaker 2 (37:24):
I love that you said that, because that taps into one
of the big things that I dowith people, which is the
critical memory integration andso much of that work.
Honestly, before I even startjumping into the memory sets
with people, I go into the spaceof seeing that version of you
that was harmed and reallytrying to get in touch with that

(37:47):
compassion and that empathy andwhat that person did not have,
that they needed, and thenoffering that to them.
And when you do that and you'reable to get in touch with that
and bring that person in and ina sense, like integrate them
with who you are now, you'reright, that self-love, it is so
powerful and it just grows andit brings just a stability and a

(38:11):
clarity and a sense of oh, thisis who I am, that's not me,
this is who I am.
That people are.
Just they're limitless whenthey can get in touch with that.

Speaker 1 (38:20):
Can we heal ourselves ?

Speaker 2 (38:23):
Yes.

Speaker 1 (38:24):
Really.

Speaker 2 (38:26):
Can we heal ourselves , meaning that?
Can we go back and grab likethose versions of ourselves and
offer that love and give whatthat little person didn't have?
Yes, I see it all the time inmy sessions, that just that
acknowledgement of the pain thatthe earlier version of us went
through.
And sometimes, kevin, it is assimple as that.
It is as simple as a personsaying I see that six-year-old

(38:48):
me, I see how scared they werein that moment.
I'm going to just hug themright now because that's what
they need and in your mind youcan do that.
And you wouldn't believe what Isee in my sessions Something
that takes literally threeminutes.
You will see this lift on theirface and they're like they're
safe now.

Speaker 1 (39:08):
You literally see the weight off of their shoulders.

Speaker 2 (39:18):
Yes, yes.
So when we say can we healourselves, To me that's a
beautiful example of how we dothat whole process.
I believe there's a lot thatcomes from above.
I believe there's a lot ofguidance and healing as well,
you know, from places that areoutside of us.

Speaker 1 (39:29):
But as far as being a conduit to let that be
expressed, yes, yeah, that'skind of what I thought when I
woke up this morning and Ifinally figured out what the
song was meaning and why it was.
You know.
Now I thought, wow, theuniverse is telling me something
really really strange, you know, because I too believe in a
higher power, you know thatguides us.

(39:49):
So I thought I thought that tooimmediately.
The brain is a muscle.
By working out your muscles,you condition them and get them
stronger.
The way that we train our brain, is it just using mantras?

Speaker 2 (40:03):
Just using mantras.
No, I think there's so muchmore than using a mantra to
strengthen our brain.
No, I think that so.
To me, that reminds me of whenI talked to a lot of people
about cognitive behavioraltherapy, which is very helpful,
but where it meets its end isthere's so much that we can do
just by saying think differently, behave differently, respond

(40:23):
differently, look at thingsdifferently, like tell yourself,
like I have this saying do youhave power over something?
If it's a no, let it go right,like that's a mantra.
I will do that in therapy withpeople Check and ask yourself
when you're feeling anxious is,if it's a no, let it go.
But that has limits, becausethere are certain situations
when your nervous system is soinvolved in something that no

(40:44):
amount of recitation of anymantra is really going to get
you to behave yourself or to dosomething that you need to do if
you have a block, because it'sthe way that some memory or some
event in your life has beenwired into you.
So I think that really it'stwofold.
We have to also train ourbrains to learn new things.
There are muscles that we haveto grow and new skills we have

(41:05):
to adapt.
But we also have to be awarewhen there's been hindrances,
bruises, scars that need to behealed, so therefore we can grow
even more.

Speaker 1 (41:16):
You're fascinating.
You really are, and you know,the first responders that you
work with are definitely heroes,but I think you are too,
because you're helping peopleovercome debilitating situations
.
You know, and thank you fordoing that.
Thank you for taking on thiswork and thank you for being
open to working with trauma.

Speaker 2 (41:38):
Well, thank you.
I don't think I could doanything but this to me.
I feel like God has given me agift and he has given me an
ability that it is our duty tojust release that into the world
.

Speaker 1 (41:53):
Isn't it rewarding when somebody makes that
breakthrough right in front ofyou.

Speaker 2 (41:57):
Oh, oh, my gosh, that's what keeps me going.
If you were to meet my husbandand ask him and say what is the
thing that Laurel's the mostpassionate about, he will tell
you.
Oh, you get her talking abouther trauma.
People, I light up.
There's nothing better thanjust being like.
I just helped that person finda way to live life differently

(42:17):
and they're so fulfilled andthey're so free and they can now
be who God designed them to be.
That's what matters to me.
Don't be anything less than whoyou were called to be on this
earth, and if I can help youclear that so you can go into
your destiny, then like that'ssuch a win.

Speaker 1 (42:32):
Yeah, it's a win for you, it's a win for them, it's a
win for humanity, you know weall win because of you.
How do people get in touch withyou, Laurel?

Speaker 2 (42:43):
So one of the easiest ways is to go to my website,
laurelwearscom, and then it hasa contact me button and then I
can get in touch with them andwe can talk about.
I do free 20 minuteconsultations for people can
explore if we're a good fit andif this is something I can help

(43:04):
them with.
Or I'm hanging out on LinkedIn.
That's kind of my social mediaoutlet of choice because it's
you know, it's just nice andclean and it's businesslike.
So that's where I am most ofthe times.
They can find me on LinkedIn aswell.

Speaker 1 (43:13):
Awesome, and you have a book that deals with marriage
, right.

Speaker 2 (43:17):
Yes, it's called Betrayed, Not Broken, and I
wrote that about 10, 11 yearsago and it has to deal with the
trauma of infidelity.
So it's a guide for men andwomen.
It's written more towards thefemale languaging, but it's
useful for partners and it's todecide do you want to stay, Do
you want to go?
Is this relationshipsalvageable?

(43:39):
And how did we end up here andjust to cleanly be able to walk
away knowing like, okay, Ilooked at that, I thought
everything through and if Ichoose to go, I'm at peace.
But also that 70% of marriagescan survive it.
So let's figure this out so wecan make our marriage better.
So it's really just a guide toget people to where they need to
be.

Speaker 1 (43:57):
Yeah, you put yourself in some situations that
I would run from at the firstsign of conflict.
I'm gone.
I am gone, whether it's my ownor whether it's somebody else's,
and you sit there and youlisten to couples.
Oh my God, how do you do that?

Speaker 2 (44:12):
Oh that I can tell you I was pretty intense with
that for probably five yearsafter my book and I'm not going
to lie, it was tiring becauseyou know, inherently in
infidelity is lying Right.
So just because you're in myoffice doesn't Because you know,
inherently in infidelity islying right.
So just because you're in myoffice doesn't mean you're going
to stop lying.
And so it is very difficult Imean I'm human too to sit there

(44:34):
and be like this woman or thisdude is totally lying here, like
none of this is stringingtogether.
It's hard, but that's where youjust have to kind of be like
okay, back to the basics, andyou just dive in, and really a
good therapist is not going to,personally, I believe let you
sit in there and scream and yellat each other, because you can
do that for free at home.

(44:54):
So we don't need to be doingthat in my office and that's
what I tell people.
I'm like just go home, don'tpay me if that's what you want
to do.
But we're going to do it reallydifferently in here and to
really just calm people and belike we're going towards the
same place here.
But let's just calm down and goforward.

(45:14):
But no, you feel like a refereesometimes and there's plenty of
that that goes on when you'redoing infidelity work.
It is grueling, there is a lotto it, but it is beautiful to
see people get out on the otherside and have actually a better
marriage, and those are the onesthat I love the most.
And not everyone gets there.
Some people infidelity is justtoo much for someone and
everyone's different, and thisis what I tell everybody.
You have to decide where youfit in with this.
Some people can forgive andmove on, and that's great.

(45:37):
But you're no less of a human ifyou're like you know what that
mark was.
Just too much, and I can't lookat you without seeing that
every day of my life.
And I can't look at you withoutseeing that every day of my
life and you have to move on.
But when I have the two peoplethat can sit there and say let's
both own our pieces as to whyneeds went unmet and you see
them two years later posting allover Facebook on these dates

(45:59):
and how much in love they are,I'm like man think where that
could have gone had they not putthe time in.
So those are the ones that Ijust celebrate because their
marriage is always better whenyou make it through something
like that, because everything isout and you have nothing to
lose, so you can really workthrough some gunk.

Speaker 1 (46:16):
Saving lives, saving marriages.
You're like the coming ofChrist.
You're super special.
Thank you so much for joiningme and continued success to you.
You're real cool.
Thank you so much for joiningme and, uh, continued success to
you.
You're, you're, you're realcool.

Speaker 2 (46:30):
Thank you very much.
I so appreciate you giving methis time.
Honestly, this is beautiful.

Speaker 1 (46:35):
You know I I don't know if you're watching the U S
open on, uh, saturday.
Uh, coco golf, are you familiarwith tennis?
Okay, top five players in theworld.
She's the best American playerthat we have and she committed
19 double faults in one set.
One, one one.
You know one, one set, and itreminded me of what you do.

(46:58):
It just it kept compoundingitself.
She had that first one, thenshe has a second one, and it
just kept compounding and shecouldn't get out of her own head
Then she has a second one andit just kept compounding and she
couldn't get out of her ownhead and I was like Laurel needs
to reach out to her.

Speaker 2 (47:13):
I can fix you.
I love that.
You can see all the people youcan connect me with.
That would be just lovely, butyou're not wrong about that.
I work with athletes on thatexact type of thing.
I worked with plenty ofathletes who have gotten injured
or have made a mistake and theycannot go back without being
haunted like that.
You work with people like that.
Yes, yeah, it's so fun to do.

(47:54):
I love that work because it'sone session, you know, and
they're done.
It's literally being yelled atfalling off, getting injured.
Injuries are a big thingbecause rightfully so our body
is like no, no, no, no, no.
So basketball players, when youtwist an ankle, when you're
stuck in traffic underneath thatnet, your tenacity is
challenged.
When you have to go back there,or when you've headed the ball
and something's gone wrong rightand you've gotten injured.

(48:15):
In soccer, it is so amazing theway that you just can you have
that slightest bit of hesitancyright when you go back in, and
how it does impact your abilityto perform the way that you did
beforehand.
So those are some of my easiestcases.
It's like 45 minutes and you'redone and they process that and
they go back on the field andI've had coaches go back to

(48:37):
parents or text me and be like Idon't know what you did, but
they're back and thank you somuch.

Speaker 1 (48:42):
Well, not only just working through that and
becoming a better player on thefield and not letting that, but
if somebody is really injuredprofessional athletes and
they're put on the injuredreserve list for a month, two
months, three months, I meanthat that's a whole nother issue
with the psyche, oh yes.

Speaker 2 (49:01):
Oh, my goodness, yes, that self-doubt and who am I?
Really?
I went through this with,actually, my daughter last year,
who's a volleyball player andhad surgery.
It's an identity crisis at thatpoint for many of them which is
, without this gift and when I'mnot exercising it, who am I?
And that there's a little talk,therapy involved in that work,

(49:22):
but sometimes we just have tolift that injury and lift some
of these moments of that.
I have a guy I'm working withright now same thing.
He's having issues in hismarriage and what they tie back
to are his years when he was 20playing soccer and again that
self-doubt when he didn't makefirst team but made second team.

(49:42):
So these are people look at itand they're like, oh, it's just
sports.
No, it's you.
You are a human.
In every place you show up andit doesn't matter whether we
value it or not, but it changeswho you are and how you see
things and you have to wrestlethrough some of that.

Speaker 1 (49:58):
Why is our job or our hobby?
Why does that become ouridentity?

Speaker 2 (50:03):
I think often when we don't know how to root it in
things that are greater in vigor, it's just easily accessible,
right?
We very easily get complimentsfor those things that others see
and people don't go around andsay, wow, you showed such
integrity today when you didn'tlie when your boss asked you a
question.
There's just not as much likehoorah over the other things

(50:26):
that really do make up ouridentity so much so.
So I just think that those areeasier things, that we get quick
validation, yeah.

Speaker 1 (50:34):
Well, as somebody who can't take a compliment, I
would much rather just, you know, not even be complimented at
all.
So for you to say, oh my gosh,the way that you handled that
comment from the boss, you know,I don't know, I don't know
where I was going with that.

Speaker 2 (50:51):
Oh, but that fascinates me.
You got to be careful when youopen up things like that with me
, because I'm like, ooh, Iwonder what that's about.
Where should we have aconversation about that?

Speaker 1 (51:00):
Yeah, well, we can have a conversation at
laurelweiriscom.
I'll book a slot and we'll gofrom there.
Congratulations on all yoursuccess.

Speaker 2 (51:10):
And I just, I wish you nothing but the best.

Speaker 1 (51:12):
Thank you so much.
Pretty cool, right?
Yeah, I thought so too, andeven though we kind of wrapped
the conversation there, I keptrecording, because I usually do,
and we somehow got to talkingabout my endurance running and
my failed attempt at solorunning Alaska's Dalton Highway
from the Arctic Circle to theArctic Ocean.
I tried it in November of 2019.

(51:34):
I share this piece with youbecause it's very raw and you
might like to hear like a voyeur, you know, but it also
perfectly illustrates howcompassionate and caring Laurel
is, and those are traits thatyou want to find in a therapist.

Speaker 2 (51:51):
Would you ever try it again?
How do you feel after that,after obviously you feel like
you fell short in not completingit.
Would you try it again?

Speaker 1 (52:03):
I don't know.
You know people ask me that allthe time.
Would you try it again?
I don't know.
You know.
People ask me that all the time.
Would you try it again?
There's a part of me that wantsto go back and try and do it
but there's a bigger part of methat doesn't want to train for
18 months.
Yeah, that must be grueling.
Yeah well, my wife gave up herspot in the garage, her parking

(52:23):
spot in the garage, and we put a20 by 20 walk-in freezer and I
set it to minus 20 and we go runon a treadmill in there for two
, three hours at a time to getmy body acclimated to that
temperature.

Speaker 2 (52:33):
Oh my gosh, that is impressive, and that is such
dedication.
I love it.
Oh my Wow, so you are superspecial too, then.
I mean, that is not somethingthat your average person does.

Speaker 1 (52:47):
But think about it, okay, it's a form of
self-torture, it's a form ofself-harm because you're putting
yourself in this very, veryuncomfortable position and
you're enjoying it, you know.
So there's yeah.
So I don't know, I don't knowif you know much about I'm
clinically depressed and chronicsuicidal ideation.

Speaker 2 (53:08):
So I'm all kinds of effed up.
Oh wow, I read a little bitabout that, but I didn't know if
that's still something that youoh, yeah, that's.

Speaker 1 (53:20):
It's the whole reason I do the fuzzy mic.
Okay, because I know I'm notalone and you would not believe
well, you would believe becauseyou're in the industry.
But the amount of people whorespond to these episodes and
say, my God, you helped me somuch, and that's what this is
about.
You know, it serves twopurposes for me.
It's the conversation.
I get to meet interestingpeople and I get to learn more
about myself.
But the bigger reason isbecause there's people out there

(53:42):
that need this.

Speaker 2 (53:44):
Oh, totally.
Yes, Of course you know there'sso much I'd love to dive in
with that, but I won't do thatto you.

Speaker 1 (53:49):
But oh no, feel free, we're still recording.

Speaker 2 (53:55):
So when did your depression start?

Speaker 1 (53:58):
I realized it when I was about 15, 14 or 15, you know
, after my dad said that to me,and he said it because I told
him I didn't want to playbaseball anymore and he's like
well, welcome to a life with nofuture.
So his identity was wrapped upin our baseball success and so
that's where that came from, youknow.
And then when I was 22 and Idid quit baseball because I

(54:19):
wasn't going to be pro, and Igot a job in radio for $13,100.
He goes see, I told you nothing.
Him $100.
He goes see, I told you nothing.
And so, but I knew, I knew whenI was 15, 15, 14, 15, 16, that
I didn't want to have kids and I, because I didn't want to pass
this depressed gene on.
You know, he's the fifth personin his family, his side of the

(54:40):
family, to kill himself.

Speaker 2 (54:42):
Oh my gosh, that's so heavy, that's so heavy.

Speaker 1 (54:46):
Yeah, wow yeah.

Speaker 2 (54:48):
So oh yeah.

Speaker 1 (54:54):
So how does that impact you, knowing that there's
been so many people that havedone that?

Speaker 2 (55:00):
Well, I pretty much know that the next person is
either going to be myself or mybrother.
Oh my goodness, that's justheavy too right Like just that
thought.

Speaker 1 (55:07):
Oh, without my wife we wouldn't be having this
conversation.
Yeah, she's the greatestmedicine.
She's the greatest.
I hate to say the word thing,but she is.
She's the greatest aspect of mylife.

Speaker 2 (55:17):
Yes, so it's so interesting that you talk about
and that's what I always like toask people is when did it start
?
Because, as you know, there'smore and more people coming out
and saying we are not created tobe this way.
Right, but it's the impact oflife.
And, yes, I do believe thatthere's genetic propensity,

(55:38):
predisposition sorry, that feedsinto that but I also believe
that there's these switchesright that get turned on when we
have that predisposition.
So when I hear you talk and nowtwice you've mentioned the same
memories and I'm so glad youwent to EMDR for it, but it
sounds like it hasn't quitecompletely integrated it the way
it needed to I hear that andyou just fit with everything

(56:01):
that I know to be true, which iswhen people come to me for
certain things, even if it'strauma, and then I start to
figure out they have anxiety anddepression, and I always go
back and say like, where didthis start?
They will.
I get this more often than notand I'm like, well, hallelujah
Cause, you know what, we candeal with that and that's gonna
change everything for you goingforward.
So I love that you can pinpointit and say, yeah, my whole

(56:24):
sense of self completely changedon that day and that one thing
has completely rewired andyou've been fighting it since
then and then it just kind ofgot doubled down on when you
were 22.

Speaker 1 (56:37):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (56:39):
Oh, we've got to heal that for you.

Speaker 1 (56:43):
Well, I'll reach out and we'll set up an appointment
for sure.

Speaker 2 (56:46):
Yeah, and I'm not trying.
I am not trying to ruck up work, but I cannot even stand when I
know that is a minimum.
Let's just lift it and see whatlife is like, because you are,
this is who my people are.
They're these lovely people andit's these things that we think
like no, but they're a littlebit big and that so easily we

(57:07):
can just neutralize that and seehow your whole lens changes.
Oh, I would love that for you.

Speaker 1 (57:13):
Well, you said you didn't want to ruck up business.
Truth be told, I figured afterwe conversed I was going to be a
client.
I knew going into this.
I did.
I'm like, if we, if we don'tresolve it in the conversation,
I will be signing up.
So yeah, it is something Iwould like to shed because you

(57:34):
know it's it.
I mean, still to this day, Istill try and do stuff too, and
he's dead.
He's dead, he can't even youknow.

Speaker 2 (57:43):
Yeah, oh, and there's stuff we can do around that too
, or if we can throw that in andlike there's things you can do
that just even bring like relieffrom that.
But it's not uncommon that manyof my podcast hosts turn into
my clients oh yeah, conversationthat you realize.

(58:03):
Oh, my gosh, there's actuallyhope and there's something out
there that we haven't done.
And that's my whole goal in theworld right now is I just want
people to know this is not hardand there are things that you
could do to bring relief andlike let's do it, you know,
cause nobody knows.
They just don't believe thatit's.
And of course everyone sayswell, laurel, it sounds too good
to be true.
And I say I know, but you knowwhat?

Speaker 1 (58:33):
I'll just hold that faith for you till you get to
the other side, and then I'llgive it back to you.
That's so cool.
Yeah, it's, it's.
It's amazing that we've comethis far.
Number one, that there arepeople now who are open about it
, you know, open about their ownbattles, their own depression,
their own psychosis.
But then people like you who gooh, this is an easy fix.
It's an easy fix.
You know, it's like the work,the work that my wife and I do
with pediatric cancer patients.
You know, when I was born in1969, any cancer had a 10%

(58:57):
chance of survival.
Now kids go into the hospitaland they say you have ALL.
It's a good cancer to have ifyou have to have one, because
it's a 95% cure rate.
Awesome, you know.

Speaker 2 (59:08):
Yes, totally Right, we have.
We've come so far and again,we're not negating the import
right of these things, but justsaying that there are solutions
that are, you know, easy, easierthan once thought so.

Speaker 1 (59:23):
Well, the solutions can be found at laurelweerscom.
That's where I'll be goingright after we conclude this.
And now again, thank you somuch for being on with me, and
you live in a beautiful stateand you're just a delight.
Thank you so much.

Speaker 2 (59:37):
Thank you.
To be continued, and she'sright.

Speaker 1 (59:40):
The conversation will continue because I have my
initial consult with Laurel intwo days.
I can't promise because Ihaven't asked Laurel yet, but my
session with Laurel may verywell be the next episode.
If you're curious how a sessionworks and want to see if it's
right for you or hell, maybe youjust want to voyeur, be a fly

(01:00:01):
on the wall into my mess of amind, well then, the next
episode of the Fuzzy Mike couldjust be for you.
Now.
If laughter is right for you,then check out the Tuttle Clime
podcast every Wednesday on thisvery platform that you're
listening to.
The Fuzzy Mike right now.
It's the show where my radiopartner of 25 years, tim Tuttle,
and I we just talk like twobuddies at the end of the bar,

(01:00:25):
solving world problems throughlaughter.
Now here's my weekly requestPlease help me grow the Fuzzy
Mike audience.
You can do this simply bytelling your friends, family,
heck, even tell your enemiesabout the show.
Please like, follow, comment,email me at
thefuzzymikeatgmailcom and givethe podcast a rating.

(01:00:45):
I sure would appreciate it.
My thanks to Laurel Wears forjoining me.
My thanks to you, as always,for listening.
The Fuzzy Mike is hosted andproduced by Kevin Kline.
Podcast.
Professional voice guy is ZachSheesh from the Radio Farm.
Social media director is TrishKline.
See you next week and thank youagain for spending your time
with me.
I'm grateful.

(01:01:06):
That's it for the Fuzzy Mike.
Thank you, the Fuzzy Mike withKevin Kline.