Field Notes 14: Frank smokes 2 more

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What if reconnecting with primitive hunting values could enhance your modern hunting skills? Join us as we explore this thought-provoking idea, kicking off with Frank's impressive November success and Steve's transformative Midwest journey. From filming at deer camp to nearly encountering a shooter buck in New Jersey, Steve's experiences provide a wealth of knowledge. As we move into December, you'll hear about Zach's remarkable double kill and Steve's strategies for overcoming increased hunting pressure. We reflect on the camaraderie and early mornings of our PA rifle hunt, where we navigated freezing conditions and unexpected encounters, making memories that will last a lifetime. 

Our hunting season is filled with excitement as we discover new challenges and equipment, comparing the rugged mountains of Pennsylvania to the flatlands of New Jersey. The allure of traditional hunting gear like muzzleloaders and flintlocks leads us into discussions about venturing into primitive hunting seasons, embracing the historical skill involved in this approach. This episode is more than just stories of successful hunts; it's an appreciation for the sport, the challenge, and the personal satisfaction it brings, all while contemplating the importance of ethical hunting practices and bowhunting skills.

As we celebrate our milestones, including our upcoming 200th episode and reaching 4 million followers, we're thrilled to share exciting giveaways and details about forthcoming events. Look forward to fantastic prizes and join us at the Empire State Show and the Great American Outdoor Show, where we'll immerse ourselves further in the hunting community. This week's journey is packed with strategies, personal stories, and a shared love for the great outdoors, promising to inspire both novice and seasoned hunters alike.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
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Hunting just got tactical.
Welcome back to the GardenState Outdoors and Podcast
presented by Boondock Hunting.

Speaker 2 (00:42):
That's why your tagline JCL known perfect.
You don't know what that man isgoing to do.
You don't know what that man isgoing to do.

Speaker 1 (00:52):
I accidentally drifted my canoe between a sow
and a cub and she charged andhit the back of the canoe.

Speaker 3 (00:59):
But his head hit the ground before his ass did.

Speaker 2 (01:04):
Begging and crying to go with my grandfather, go with
my father on these deer drives.

Speaker 4 (01:09):
You know the last trip over I shot a great Cape
Buffalo with my bow, chargingthrough the grass and then the
whooping.

Speaker 1 (01:16):
And then you hear a body drop Boys.
It is field notes number 14,and there is a lot to catch up
on.
Steve is back.
It's great to see him feelslike we.
We have.
It's been what at least over amonth, I think, maybe even maybe
more than that, since we we'velast seen you yeah, it's been

(01:38):
about a month.

Speaker 4 (01:38):
It's great to be back , guys.

Speaker 1 (01:40):
Sorry for the long hiatus, but here we are frank
has continued with his absolutehot street hot streak and making
us look bad because he has beenthe, the number one hunter and
uh, the boondocks hunting crew.
But you know it keeps onpouring on with the success.

(02:01):
Um, the squash has beengrinding and continues to grind
and soon I we know that a bunchof deer are going to start
hitting the the ground for forthe squash.
And um peyton, out in uhmaryland, got it done in in his
home state of maryland, andethan and I headed up to pa for

(02:26):
our first ever uh rifle hunt andwe had a absolute blast.
And the new guy, uh zach, gotit done tonight, doubled up with
the buck and a doe tonight andhopefully we'll be getting him
on soon, uh to to give you guyshis introduction and everything
like that.
But I mean we rolled into a verysuccessful november and the

(02:49):
streak is continuing.
It's currently what?
December 2nd today and I mean,I think, I think we're, we're
hot, as hot as ever, justputting deer down and um, it's
been great.
But um, steve, what can youshare?

Speaker 4 (03:08):
well I can.
I can definitely say that uhwas fortunate to have an
absolute, absolutely amazingexperience with a great group of
guys out in the midwest was outthere for 10 days.
Uh was asked to come out andhelp film a deer camp, a hunt
camp basically, and we spent 10days out there at an Airbnb.

(03:32):
Actually, a good portion of uswere actually camping in tents.
The weather wasn't phenomenalthe first couple of days but
finally that broke.
By Wednesday Guys startedgetting on deer and just had a
really absolutely incredibleexperience.
I wish I could share more.

(03:52):
It's kind of top secret for thecompany that I was working with,
but extremely blessed to havespent time with so many great
guys, learned, learned amountain.
Uh just absorbed hopefullyretained, but absorbed a
mountain of of knowledge in ashort period of time.
And the cool thing about thatis, as I was able to come back

(04:17):
home the week after was a weekor two after I got back, I had
the good fortune to be able toget out three different days.
I think it was not last week,it was the week before last,
before Thanksgiving, and I hadsome micro hunts.
I mean micro, like get in thewoods at 5am and get out of the

(04:38):
woods at like 745 to get to workand I had three days like that
that saw deer every single day,had a really close encounter.
I almost took one of theshooter bucks that I've had on
camera in one of the pieces ofpublic I've been hunting this
year, had him pass at 40 yards,actually rattled him in.

(04:59):
And he passed at 40 yards,grunted, he stopped, kept moving
, snort, wheezed, came backabout five feet but couldn't
close the gap on it.
But just an it, just anincredible uh experience to be
able to put what I had justlearned into practice playing
the wind, picking out features,uh, terrain, the right tree um,

(05:25):
would have been the right tree.
I honestly the width, the placewhere this buck moved.
I was not expecting himwhatsoever to move right out in
the open.
I was at where he should havewalked through.
In fact, when I set up in thedark and when I got down there
was a fresh grape right,literally right under the tree
that I was in, about two feetaway.
So I think that's it was.

(05:47):
The biggest takeaway at thispoint has been being able to
quickly put those things that Ilearned and absorbed into
practice right away and to beable to see uh reaping the
dividends of that and hopefullyit's going to pay off if I'm
able to get some more time toget in the woods in the coming
weeks.
It's going to be more difficultnow, not as much activity.

(06:10):
We're also have the orange armycoming out next week, so that's
going to upset, upset theentire apple cart, especially
for down in our areas.
Our public gets decimated.
So you know there are a fewareas that are sanctuaries that
the safety zone is not adequatefor uh driving deer and for
using shotguns.
So I'll probably be relying onthose areas and moving into

(06:34):
those as I do historically.
So, um, yeah, that's that'skind of been.
I haven't had a ton of time toget in the woods in jersey this
year, but but it's okay, causethat Midwest trip definitely
made up for it and it's great tobe back.

Speaker 1 (06:49):
Yeah, no, it's yeah, the orange army is almost here,
so but it is.
You know that.
That's that one thing that withus here.
You know we all have spotswhere it's like all right, we
know that the orange armyhopefully legally cannot get
into uh, get into some of theseareas and everything like that,

(07:10):
and that's what we're gonna haveto to rely on.
But I mean the fact that you'reable to come back and you know
you you're right where you leftoff and you know you had some
great encounters and you knowwe're able to to get right into
the saddle again and, you know,have a couple of great hunts
back to back.
I know the weather the upcomingweather for December is just

(07:34):
phenomenal.
So we hope you're able to getout All of us are able to get
out and and things like that.
But you know it is great tohave you back and you know um
can't wait till in a year whereyou can fully release.
You know the details and andeverything like that.
We're we're very excited um tofor, for all that and everything

(07:56):
like that.

Speaker 4 (07:56):
But, um, yeah, it's cool, like even even coming back
now just scout even my scoutingapproach to different things is
different Was able to get onsome fresh sign even just in
this past week, some really,really killer bucks that I've

(08:17):
had on camera.

Speaker 1 (08:19):
And obviously and a question is one of them, hobs,
Do you think you know?

Speaker 4 (08:24):
that's a great question.
I don't know in fact I'm evenquestioning the, the deer that I
had sent you guys back inAugust.
I I'm not really sure thatthat's Hobbs and I don't know
that that deer is alive and Ihaven't seen him out of velvet.
So it's really hard to tell.
One of the bucks that I sentyou guys I think there's a
possibility that might be Hobbsand I actually he was actually

(08:48):
came through one of the areas Iwas that I'm hunting right now.
He came through Saturdaymorning and about an hour and 20
minutes before I was going intothe woods.
That was the one hunt thatdidn't go so well.
I barely broke the woods andyou know the the woods line and

(09:10):
uh, I was taking a chance goingin because my wind wasn't great,
but it's literally my onlyaccess point and um, and I got
blown right away.
So I just turned around, wentback home and and it was
probably a good thing, becausethis is a really busy week for
my wife, for her, her business,and it was better for me to be
home anyway.
So, but, um, but yeah, there'sa strong possibility earning

(09:32):
those points.
Uh, you know, gotta keep herhappy hey, whatever gets me more
time in the woods, I'll dowhatever it takes.

Speaker 1 (09:39):
So it's all good um, you know, know, and then we're
gonna before we get to Frank,because you know the deer killer
of the group this year, I'lltell my story because it's not
nearly as exciting as Frank'sand because I honestly have lost
track of how many deer Frankhas killed since we last

(10:01):
recorded last week, and it'sonly been a week.
I remember the season he goesto, he goes, yeah, you know, not
a bad day.
You know, saw some deer, hegoes.
Yeah, I saw 11 does and I waslike that's a, that's a great
hunt, like that's man I wish Isaw last time I saw 11 does was

(10:22):
in the summer.
All in one place if he reallywanted to, he could uh crept out
.
What took a shot with the withthe.
Well, can you take does rightnow with the, with the
muzzleloaders or bucks only?

Speaker 3 (10:34):
yeah, yeah, no, no, you could shoot those if you
want.
Okay, but uh, I was like yeahoh, you're, you're full.

Speaker 1 (10:41):
I mean your, your freezer's full.
So I mean I, I completely getwhy you are.
You've taken what three bucks,three bucks, three does.
You're not going to get anypoints with the muzzleloader for
our competition.

Speaker 4 (10:55):
You might as well just wait, so was that fall.
So fall bow, permit, bow andmuzzleloader.

Speaker 3 (11:03):
No, so I shot.
Well, actually I hit that 10pointer during the fall bow I
didn't get.
But then I went to new yorkstate for their opener.
I shot, uh, I shot my buck upthere and then, um, I shot
another buck up there during theuh, the rifle season, and then,

(11:24):
permit bow, I shot another onein jersey oh, that's awesome so
guys been on a rampage just beengetting lucky man, that's all
no, you're putting the time init's putting the time

Speaker 1 (11:38):
you know, all of us have had a very good success, I
think.
Um, I just counted, recounted.
I think we're at now with zach.
I think that's good.
I don't know if zach killed any.
I think he killed some does,and in the beginning year, but I
haven't gotten that, thatnumber yet.
But I think we're at like Ithink, 19 or 20.

(11:59):
I think ethan and frank bothhave five, so that's 10 right
there.
Um, yeah, I uh peyton has four,so we're at 14, then you two
are 16, then I have two 17, 18,so so 20, 20.

(12:22):
Deer down, one mule, deer doe,one elk, one bear and so far
that that's what we got so farwith the season.
So you know, I would say allthe guys have been.
You know the work that we haveall put in and the time and
effort is has really been payingoff and we still got to the end
of February, basically to wellfor us to here in jersey.

(12:45):
We have done in february.
I know squatches season, youknow, ends a little bit for us,
but still plenty of time.
Squatch, like I said lastepisode's going to be getting
out for for the predator hunt,some ice fishing and things like
that.
So like, still plenty of time.
And for me, waterfowl is coming.
You know we're about to startthe wild waterfowl grind and
everything like that.
So plenty more to meet, to beput into the freezer, upcoming.

(13:06):
But, um, guys, I'll tell you, parifle, it was a blast.
It was a blast, you know.
We hope that you guys can makeit next year.
I know we already got the uh,the yes from from frank.
But, um, I'll tell you, ethanand I, early start, early start
to our day.
Ethan, I think, got up at like2 am and drove to me, got here

(13:29):
at 3 30 we headed up to, uh, topa, 16 degrees snow on the
ground, freezing, right.
But man, we, we've noe-scouting before, like we, we
just kind of looked at, like,all right, this is where we're
going.
Um, ethan will kind of filleveryone in, you know, next time

(13:50):
he's on more of the details andeverything like that.
But so we waited for just theright light so we could start
walking in, because we didn'tjust want to start walking
blindly or anything like that.
Uh, with the snow on the ground, we wanted to find tracks and
man, we were everywhere.
We looked the tracks, tracks,runs, we, we found bed.

(14:13):
We, like we were in the perv asalready from where our hunt
started we were successful offthe jump, like with just going
into a brand new area noknowledge, not even e-scouting,
nothing.
The amount of sign I think thatwe saw was probably almost

(14:38):
out-competed everything thatwe've seen this year throughout
our season here in Jersey andDelaware and everything like
that.
So we were extremely happy onwhat we did and we covered just
under six miles.
Boots on the ground, justgetting after and everywhere we
went was really deer sign.
You know we.

(14:59):
And where we got, where it gotcrazy.
We got to a point where we gotto clearing and you know there's
.
You could tell like, all right,this looks like a good spot.
But we stopped real quick and Ihad to call bianca because I
wasn't sure if this girl woke upto go to work.
So I was like, oh, let me, letme give bianca a ring real quick

(15:19):
.
I called her.
I'm like, hey, you know, did I'mmaking sure.
We're like, all right, we'regonna.
Looks like there's a cutoutright there.
So we're gonna, you know, I'mmaking sure we're like, all
right, we're going to.
Looks like there's a cutoutright there.
So we're going to, you know,start going over there and we
take two steps and a big buckjust jumps up from his bed.
I was like, oh, I got to go,bianca, I got to go.
She hangs up the phone, right.
The deer doesn't, just gets up,walks a little bit and stops.

(15:43):
I lift up the 30 odd six, butthe sun is blaring right in my
freaking so I can't see, like oh, I can't see.
I can't see.
We think he's at 100.
Ethan raises his gun, boom meof course, like oh, I think you
hit it.
The deer did not move at all,it did not move so he sends a
number boom.

(16:05):
Next thing, you know, he, hestarts running.
All of a sudden, a bunch ofdoes just get up and they just
start running too.
There's deer just running allin the back and everything like
that.
I'm like all right, all right,this is what we're gonna do.
You're gonna go check, makesure you know you didn't.
You didn't hit him, you know.
See if there's blood.
I'm gonna go to where I think Isaw him run.
No, we're getting over there andI think I hear him run up the

(16:29):
ridge and I was like, all right,deer don't usually run up there
, you know, run up when they gethit or something like that.
So I, we really didn't think wehit him.
We turns out it was like 150,160 yard shot.
So we definitely completelymissed, you know.
And I mean that right there andyet again, that was just
another win right there we werefired up.

(16:49):
We're, we're laughing like man,this is, it's so much fun.
I mean we're having a blast andeverything like that.
I mean it's freezing my beard,because every time I'd breathe
it would just freeze.

Speaker 2 (17:01):
Yeah so, like you, just like have some videos of me
and it's literally like.

Speaker 1 (17:04):
It looks like my.
I have gray hair.
Kind of looks like what we'lllook.
Look at Frank right now.
Everything was everything wasfrozen and everything like that,
a phenomenal hunt.
I couldn't have.
Besides, you know, couldn'thave asked for a picture perfect
hunt to go well, where the onlything we, you know would have

(17:26):
made it better if we would havekilled something, you know.
And but besides that, I mean wetalked to, like everyone we
talked to I mean one person shotone doe that day and everyone
else nothing.
But we were also what werealized no one else did what we
did.
No one else was going far.
You know, everyone was prettyclose when we came back, like we

(17:48):
were bumping into people, butthat was close to the road.
We ran into a ground, blind,that was maybe I don't know 150,
200 and something yards off theroad and we were far, far in.
So like that gave us we learneda lot of knowledge from this
hunt and we're like, okay, man,this is something that one we

(18:09):
can keep doing through the,through the upcoming seasons and
get out and everything likethat.
And then also, why not bow huntit?
Like we highly doubt thatpeople and everyone knows pa
like yeah, they bow hunt, butlike the orange army there is a
whole different animal, you knowso and I we don't think people
are getting would be going backas far as, as far as we would,

(18:32):
you know.
So there is a lot of potentialin this area and what we
probably only hit one percent,not even, not even one percent
of the land.
I mean, you know, everyone knowsPA is huge.
You know the big woods are are.
It's a completely differentballgame.
So the tracks that we werefinding, I mean there's got to
be some absolute giants.

(18:53):
We found turkey tracks.
The cool thing about PA is whatwe didn't know is we have
turkey tags.
Now you know it came with ourtag.
We have fall and spring, so wemight as well just head up there
and do some spring, springturkey hunting.
Uh, we found some bear tracksthat were just like you know,

(19:13):
gotta be big bears over thereand everything like that.
So, like it was, it was a blast.
I mean, besides waking up atthree o'clock in the morning,
everything else was.
It was great, we had, we had alot of fun and definitely it's,
it's going to be something thatwe bow hunt and then also
continue to rifle hunt in thefuture, because I mean, it's a

(19:35):
different style and you knowit's something cool and you know
, say if all our whole crew goesout and everything like that.
It's just like we were walking.
We were told we, we, there wasno pressure on us, we weren't
like.
You know, we all know how it isbow hunting and that's what I
always say about.
That's why I want to do six day.
We have so much pressure on usto to bow hunt but it is such a

(19:58):
super serious thing where it'slike you're diving into beddings
.
We're constantly moving around.
We're running cameras all thetime.
Like you know, to me, yeah,we're having fun, but I'm not
laughing, smiling and googlegagaing while I'm going into a
hunt.
This over here, we're like youknow, we're just having
conversations, walking, talking,hunting.

(20:19):
You know it was, um, it's likeduck, hunting like duck hunting
like duck hunting, except foryou know, you know your gun can
probably reach two miles out, ifyou really want to.

(20:43):
It's not anywhere close to thesame, you know.
But boys, I mean, yeah, I andwe might go back up.
Ethan was like, hey, if we havetime and we get a date, let's
go back up, and why not go do it, you know?
And so it's something thatwe're definitely looking forward
to.
And you know, I texted Frankimmediately on the side.
He goes yeah, I haven't had apiano in a while.
And I was like, okay, I look atEthan, I go, we already got one

(21:03):
guy that's in.
I was like, okay, yeah, I, I, I, Ethan, I go, we already got
one guy that's in.
I go, you know, the rest willprobably, you know still there

(21:30):
squatch I'm here, yeah, I'm heretoo okay, so it's just mike.

Speaker 4 (21:35):
It's just mike, all right, because you, I was
waiting for somebody to move.

Speaker 3 (21:38):
I'm looking my bad voice too frank yeah, there you
go.

Speaker 1 (21:42):
The wi-fi for some reason just went for on my
laptop, just literally went awayand I was like whoa, that's
never happened, like it wasactually searching, but it was
fine on my phone, so I don'tknow what the hell happened
there.
Um, so I don't, I don't knowwhat was picked up or anything
like that, so let's just hope.

(22:03):
Uh, let's just hope it waspicked out because, yeah, the
wi-fi just literally took a crapon me, so I don't know what you
guys heard last or what it waseven recorded.
But, um, yeah, just great,great hunt.
Um, definitely looking forwardto it.
And you know, at the lodge Isent you guys the picture.
I mean, yeah, there were somestuds killed in PA yesterday.

(22:23):
Yeah, there was so definitely.
Man.
Don't we just love hunting LikeI'm so happy that this is what
we do?
I couldn't imagine doinganything else.

Speaker 4 (22:38):
Yeah, no it's incredible too, and I've been
following some of my buddies whois actually one guy that I work
with, who he's from pa and herifle hunts uh, two guys
actually that rifle hunt.
And then I got a buddy down invirginia that rifle hunts and
I'm you know they're sending mephotos.
There's just something thatseems really badass about

(23:01):
walking the ridges in themountains with a rifle, you know
, going after deer, which isseems for lack of a better,
better term seems really sexycompared to walking flat land,
you know, with a shotgun in inin Jersey.
Um, definitely seems moreappealing.
So I definitely consider it andI think I told myself last year

(23:22):
when I was at the great Americanoutdoor show, I walked by CVA's
booth and was checking out alltheir different models and
muzzleloaders and I was like man, like that's really cool, Like
if I was going to get into likerifle hunting or whatever
obviously muzzleloaders areclosest thing we have in Jersey
and I was like, yeah, I thinkmaybe next year, Cause the

(23:43):
prices were really good too,Like the sales that they have
during the great Americanoutdoor show, and I was like,
yeah, I think, I think I mighthave to get a muzzleloader next
year and get it and give this acrack, so be pretty cool.

Speaker 2 (23:59):
I was thinking about doing the Flintlock muzzleloader
, getting into that because Ihave a CVA.
I've had that for a bunch ofyears now and not taken away
from anything that anybody does,because I do it too.
I use a modern day muzzleloaderthat uses a 209 breech plug
primer like a shotgun andbesides the fact that you get

(24:22):
one shot at a time with it,that's fine, it's a muzzleloader
, you're loading down the barrel.
But I've killed a lot of deerwith the muzzleloader to prim
the.
You know the modern daymuzzleloader.
But I was watching some stuff.
There was a guy on one of thehunting channels and he was
doing flintlock and I was likedamn, that's kind of like when I

(24:43):
took out the recurve and Ikilled my buck with the recurve.
Maybe I should, maybe I shouldget a flintlock and start trying
to kill deer with a flintlock.

Speaker 1 (24:52):
That'd be pretty cool so do you guys have what?
Do you guys have a specific?
I mean because I know pa haslike a they do, they do, we
don't.

Speaker 2 (25:00):
We don't I mean muzzleloader just justifies
using something that you loaddown the barrel for our season
okay, so it's.

Speaker 1 (25:06):
It would still be like you'd still yeah pa has
what they call their primitive.

Speaker 2 (25:11):
They call it primitive season, so they're
using, they have to use aflintlock.
Later on I think I've seen nota hunting public guys doing it
too one time.
But this fellow was out west hewas going after, uh, mule deer
and he went after, I think, elkand stuff too with it.
But man, I'll tell you what guywas on a 10-day hunt with a

(25:33):
flintlock going after mule deerand it was like he came down to
the wire.
I mean he got one, it was aspike but a flintlock and he
made like about a hundred andprobably 10 yard shot with it.
Wow, and that's, that'sincredible.
That's pretty damn impressiveiron sights.
You know, I, I don't know, I, Ithink I don't know.

(25:55):
I kind of like always like thatchallenge of just doing
something else.
And uh, some of the guys withthe other podcast, dave there,
that I'm on, he's a, he's a avidshooter with the bow, and we
were talking, cause I still havemy super mag 48, that uh, I put
them up to a challenge.
This year I'm going to take aTurkey with the recurve.
So and I said I challenge youcause I know you got a recurve

(26:18):
too, and he said, okay, I'm down.
And I said well, we better getour butts out there and start
practicing, because May's goingto be here before you know it
and I can shoot the recurvefairly decent.
I just have to practice with it.
You know, it's like everythingelse, but I would love to take.
I have a good-sized blind thatI can use.
I can't wait.
I want to try to get one withthe recurve this year.

Speaker 4 (26:44):
I was going to say in a blind situation, whether it's
a compound or a recurve, you,you know, the advantage is yours
, obviously, running and gunningwith a, with a bow, and then
even a recurve, forget it.
I mean I shouldn't say forgetit, I know there's guys that do
it, but that's really that'scrazy too, talking about the
flintlock, because you'retalking about carrying around
what maybe eight and a half,nine pound, you know like a
flintlock rifle.

Speaker 3 (27:05):
It's not light.
It's not light, hopefully notlight.

Speaker 2 (27:10):
But I don't know.
It's just, I mean to each istheir own.
It's just like I looked at thecompound bow and I killed, you
know the big guy over there withthe compound bow in 2001.
And I was like, nah, I, I gottado the recurve thing.
So I went out and I shot a goodbuck with the recurve and then
hunted with it for anothercouple years and then I don't

(27:32):
know, I'm just like crazy.
I just switch around stuff.
I get bored.
But when I saw that flintlock Iwas like I'm going to spark
something.
Man, maybe I'm gonna, maybeI'll try to look into that.
They're not cheap either, man.
They're like six, seven hundredbucks for, for a decent one,
you know.
So it's like, yeah, it's aninvestment, but they got ones

(27:52):
that you can like, finish onyour own, you know, sand down
stain on the kit, like a kit,yeah, so I was like yeah, maybe,
maybe I'll go that route.
that'd be, that'd be pretty cool, like, and then can say you
know, at least I killedsomething when I made yeah.

Speaker 4 (28:07):
Sounds like a great off-season project.

Speaker 2 (28:10):
Food for thought man.

Speaker 1 (28:13):
Oh well, looks like we're going to be expecting
something out of Squatch nextyear, which I think is.
You know, it's the same with alot of us.
I I mean, I imagine most of usare probably going to pick up a
recurve at at some point as aswell.
You know, I know that's on theon the bucket list and
everything like that.
Um, you know to to get there.

(28:36):
Um, you know, and I thinkthat's something like for you.
You, like you said you've doneit so many times with the, with
the modern day muzzleloader,like, yeah, what's the next step
for me to challenge myself as ahunter?
Um, you know, and, and thatwould be it could you imagine
real quick you're you're talkingabout old style.
Can you imagine really shooting, going back in the day and how

(28:58):
they did it with the old musketsbut that had the circular balls
that had like no accuracywhatsoever, like killed stuff
with that.
Or, even better, like you lookat some of the primitive bows
and stuff like that, where howthey would make their their,
their broad heads and everythingtheir their arrow heads, uh,

(29:21):
out of that ride.
But it's so cool, like, andit's a no matter what.
I I see where technology hasgone, but that is just the
definition of any way necessary.
You, we can get it done.
You know, almost any weaponthat we have out there, whether
it's modern or just old orwhatever the case is, is lethal.

(29:45):
And you know, just like thosedays.
You know I've talked on, Ithink, a podcast before, not on
ours but I think on somebodyelse's.
You know, I've never beensomeone I don't look down on any
way, like if you bait, if youuse dogs or whatever, because
you know, at the end of the day,if you want to really get down
to the nitty gritty, theyliterally chase Buffalo till

(30:11):
they ran off the cliff.
You know that is a big part ofhistory and you know that
wouldn't be ethical nowadays.
But listen when, when you'retrying to get your food and
stuff like that, like yeah, yeahyeah yeah, oh sorry, you know
it shouldn't matter can you seethat?

Speaker 2 (30:26):
that's, that's yeah.
Yeah, that was the buck withthe recurve.
And then where I'm pointing isthe perfect shot.
I hit him at 20 yards with therecurve.

Speaker 4 (30:34):
That's great.

Speaker 2 (30:35):
There you go it was so let me tell you something,
not to interrupt your story.
But when you do that and you'vegot no sights and you're just a
stick and a string and that,that, that deer saw me.
I wasn't even in a high stand,he was looking at me when I
released the arrow and he went75 yards, man, and I'm like I
just killed the deer, like myIndian blood did years ago.

Speaker 4 (31:00):
And I'm like I can't believe.

Speaker 2 (31:01):
I just did that and I'm telling you guys.
I mean, it's tough, it's noteasy.
You got to get them close.
You know you got to get a goodshot, but if you get the
opportunity and you practice andyou feel efficient with it, do
it for yourself.

Speaker 4 (31:15):
It's really, it's really cool every time we move
forward into another and anotherfacet of hunting, yeah, and you
get more intimate with theanimal.
There's a, there's a veryclimatic, emotional moment every
time you up the ante more.

(31:36):
I mean it's, it's an incrediblefeeling and it it's something
that I don't think the generalpublic, the unexperienced
general public, can identifywith.
Like, there are very fewexperiences.
We talk about this all the time, but there's very few
experiences that you can evenput in the same arena as hunting

(31:57):
and having that kind ofexperience.
It's also interesting.
So on the trip that I was on, Iactually met joshua moreland.
I don't know if that name'sfamiliar or not, but he's one of
two people, I believe, inarkansas right now that has
taken a buck with a spear ahandmade I was literally about
to bring that up, okay I met him.

(32:18):
He was he was on this trip, hewas one of the guys that was out
there.
Incredible guy, really, reallyamazing.
But I mean you want to talkabout you want to talk about
taking it primitive.
I mean here's a guy in a treewith a, with a hand handmade
welded spear.
Yeah, you know killing deerwith that.
Uh, I think arkansas is one oftwo or three states where it's

(32:41):
legal to do so.
But I mean, yeah, how far doyou want to take it?
You know it's funny.
On the group text earlier wewere talking about talking about
rob.

Speaker 2 (32:50):
You know you said squash, gotta stop using your
hands to kill these deer well,that's definitely well busted up
and if you've seen the size ofrob, it looked like he made like
a manled that deer, oh yeahit's, it's phenomenal.

Speaker 1 (33:07):
You know, I literally today I watched, I was going to
bring it up, you know the spearwhere the guy literally and it
could have been him, I'm notsure who, who it was, I wasn't
really paying attention to that,but like the deer was just
right under and you know, yougotta do your, you know, make
sure it's going to be on andthen you drop it.
I mean, a deer went nowhere,literally nowhere, just did you

(33:27):
see the one with the hogs?

Speaker 2 (33:29):
when he does the one with the, hog.

Speaker 1 (33:30):
Yeah, I've seen.

Speaker 2 (33:31):
I've seen the hog ones um, and then the alligator
he does an alligator too.

Speaker 1 (33:35):
I saw that one too, which was that was ridiculous as
well.
But like, listen, I mean, ohman, I think that's the cool
thing about hunting is, and it'sjust how we're going to just
challenge ourselves as well.
And you know, having I thinkthe cool thing and it's
something I've been into, isjust Ethan and I were talking
about it is like we've justgotten so comfortable as humans.

(33:58):
You know we're so civilized,we're so civilized and we lose
that you know we're not supposedto be.
If you really look at it, andjust how we're built.
We're supposed to be livingoutside, sleeping outside.
We're supposed to be walkingbarefoot, we're supposed to be

(34:20):
navigating without you know tojust do all these things.
Where I think hunting like themore primitive you go like, just
the better you are for yourselftoo, where you're really like
set yourself in the nature andyou're more, I think, at one
with nature as well.
Because, listen, at the end ofthe day, I don't care what

(34:41):
weapon you're using, you don'twant animals to suffer.
So I think you know the moreprimitive you go, the more like
precise your, your hunting stylemust be.
You know you talk about a spearnow you're, you're really going
like all right, I really can'tmess this up, like you know,
especially on like a hog or analley, or especially an

(35:03):
alligator, like you need to makethis drop of of the spear be
absolutely lethal, you know.
So I think it challenges us notonly just to be a better hunter
, but just to be like a more atone with ourselves in nature.
Um, you know it's, we could godown this rabbit hole, all of us

(35:27):
, and you know, I think everyhunter basically out there could
, could definitely go down this,and I think you know everyone
would agree.
Like I think I'd much rather beat camp all day, every day,
living outside and farming andhiking and hunting and fishing,
than sitting here, watching tv,going to work.

(35:48):
Like you know, I want that typeof lifestyle, you know, I think
a lot of us all all do, and it'sit's something that I think is
missing, and just not only justour country, but I think just in
in humanity itself as well.
You know, obviously there arecountries that you know like I
could talk about, like africa orsomething like that.
Like I've seen videos likelisten, this is what they do.

(36:10):
Like I watched literally just aguy, just whatever they caught
and just ripped it up with hismouth and listen, you got.
That's, that's survival of thefittest.
Like there is no, oh my god,that's brutal, nasty, like.
How could you do that?
Like it's it's either you eator you you don't.
You starve and you die, and youknow there is something magical

(36:32):
about that at the same time aswell.

Speaker 4 (36:35):
We're disconnected.
That's why we're disconnectedwith that, with the very basic
act of taking a life to preserveour own.
We're very disconnected withthat as a society and you know
it's to our detriment.
And I don't want to soundungrateful at the risk of
sounding ungrateful here.
You know we go to work everyday, we have jobs that we've, we

(36:57):
trade our skills for the moneyto take in animals, products
that we eat.
You know that we wouldotherwise procure by ourself.
And it's strange when you getto a point I'll just speak for
myself it's strange when I'vegotten to a point where I think
that my time, even though I'm aspecialized each one of us

(37:20):
specialized in our own trade, inour own skill, my time as a
hunter in the field, procuringmeat for my family, I feel like
that is more valuable than thetime that I'm spending at my job
.
And I feel like again the riskof sounding ungrateful I feel
like I have so much wasted time.

Speaker 2 (37:37):
I agree, and that's a hard thing to say, you know.

Speaker 1 (37:42):
Yep I agree, yep and that's a hard thing to say.
You know, yep, I agree.
Yeah, you know it's.
Yeah, it's just one of thosethings.
But I agree with you where,yeah, it's not us being
ungrateful, but yeah, like I'msorry, but I think it takes a
lot more for for us to to go outthere and get the food or fish
or or farm you know farm andstuff like that where, where

(38:02):
you're going to provide for yourfamily then because, listen, at
the end of the day, ifeverything goes to shit, what
are you going to?
Really?
That money is not, that's notgoing to be important.
You know, your job is.
You know, and you never knowwhat's going to happen.
I mean, look at what goes on inother countries and stuff like
that.
You know.
You look at history and youjust never know what what's

(38:24):
going to go on.
We can't predict what's goingto happen, but one thing's for
sure like if things do go wrong,not only do we have the
capabilities of protecting ourfamily, but just providing for
for our family or on our lovedones and things like that, it's,
you know it's it's definitelylost.
I mean, look at trapping, look,you know, the fur trade and

(38:44):
everything like.
Look at, look where that went.
That used to be one of the mostimportant things back back back
in the in the time.
That's how people really, youknow, survive was trapping,
hunting and things like that.
People forget that's whatthat's human basic instincts.
That's that's one of the thingsthat we are created to do and

(39:05):
how we survive, you know.
And people are just so lost inthat of just going to the
grocery store and you know, Itell people that I go.
Well, why do you?
Because I started fasting.
I do like 12 to 16 to 22 to 24hour fast, fast, almost try to
do it almost every day.
Two to 24 hour fast, fast,almost try to do it almost every

(39:29):
day.
Um, and you know, people, I'mlike we're not meant to be
eating every single day three,three plus meals a day, like, if
you really look at it, we'renot.
You know we're.
We're wasting so much, we haveso much stored in us.
It's actually, if you look atit, it's not good.
And all the scientific stuffthat's coming out about how good
fasting actually is.
Because you know what, back inthe day, our ancestors, they

(39:51):
would starve until they theykilled something, you know, and
it's our human body is made tosurvive, it is made to go
periods of time with withouteating, and then all are stored
up.
That's where it's supposed toget used.
Just like you know, I watched avideo on a bear was um

(40:11):
hibernation.
That's why it stores up allthat food.
So then, boom, it can gothrough through hibernation and
everything like that and be itsfull, full potential.

Speaker 4 (40:20):
So you know not to go down the rabbit hole which
we're going now the industrialfood complex has done a great
job producing propaganda tochange the american psyche, move
us towards, uh, what they wantus to do.

Speaker 1 (40:36):
You we all saw what, um, what peyton put in the chat
about uh pita, it's isn, isn'tit?
It's a, it's a, it's a on theFBI or whatever database, as
being a like a it's an extremistorganization organization,
which is how many peopleactually know that out there,
Like that's what they'reactually classified as as under,
and you just don't get put onthat list because you do stuff

(40:59):
that's innocent.
Let's be honest.

Speaker 4 (41:01):
I think I think anyone that has ever promoted
any violent tendencies, and Iguess violence could be as
simple as you know, putting painon fur or something.
I think they could make it ontothat list.
I mean, I don't personally knowwhat it takes, but I think
there's probably more people inthere than people realize.

Speaker 1 (41:21):
Probably, probably.
You know people realizeprobably, probably you know um,
but you know, I, I, I don'tdisagree when it comes to um.
I don't think we should beusing animals as testing and and
there's certain things that Iespecially like listen, I'm a
huge animal lover.
I like that makes me sick rightthere, you know.

(41:42):
So I, I'm full on board for youknow, for things like that.
But to take away our rights, orjust anyone's rights, where,
where you don't believe in, likewe're not doing anything, cruel
, you know, I think it's more ofa shame to for zoos and stuff
Like I, I do believe in, listen,I'm okay with the zoo and

(42:03):
everything, as long as theanimals are treated right and,
you know, are done correctly,like I, I, that's how much I
just I just love it.
I wish I could have my own damnzoo.
That's how much I love.
I love animals and stuff likethat.

Speaker 3 (42:14):
So, um, but, frankie, yes, sir, the hot hand right
there, yeah, definitely uh like,like I said, I I feel like I
feel like I'm more lucky thangood at times because you know

(42:35):
most of it, I think has to dowith this one particular piece
of property.
Mike and steve know, or, um,mike Squatch know what I'm
talking about.
So you know my one buddy'sproperty that he let me hunt
this year.
It's actually amazing, man.
I mean there's a lot of deer onit.

(42:57):
It's not pressured.
That's why I've been focusingmost of my time on it, like I
still got some cameras on therefuge and some of my spots and
stuff, but I mean it's, mycamera's really been dead over
there, so I've been just kind offocused on this one spot.
And man, it's that farm'sincredible man, you know.

(43:22):
So you know'll guess I'll diveright into it.
So I, I, um, I went out on real, real quick.

Speaker 1 (43:31):
So, okay, I can't like, I like I legit cannot
remember the last time we talked, I think you had killed a buck,
correct?

Speaker 3 (43:40):
in in new york.

Speaker 1 (43:41):
Yeah, with the rifle, okay, yeah so then, since then,
you killed a doe and a I killeda doe.
Yeah, okay, so I wasn't sure ifthe doe was.
Was the last episode, or so?
You've killed two, two deerokay two deer.

Speaker 3 (43:57):
I was like it's hard to keep up right now yeah, yeah,
even listen, I'm losing track.
I almost forgot about the dough, even though we were just
talking about it earlier.
What a problem to have, but yeahyeah so, um, yeah, so I guess
I'll start with the dough realquick.

(44:17):
So, um, I went out.
Actually, when I got back homefrom New York, I decided to go
out and I kind of knew that Iwas going to.
If I saw a nice size doe, I wasgoing to take it.
So I went to, you know, prettymuch one of my honey hole spots
over there.
I always see tons of doesclimbed up in the tree.

(44:41):
I mean I saw tons of deer, tonsof them climbed up in the tree.
I mean I saw tons of deer, tonsof them and for some reason,
like I went in there with themindset shoot one, and I, just,
I, just I didn't do it.
It was like group after groupafter group and I didn't do it.
And then all of a sudden it waslike around, I think it was
around like 8 30, I had one, onenice size doe.

(45:03):
She walked right under me,provided me you know the shot
and it was.
But this particular day was sofreaking windy, in the saddle,
and actually I think I wastelling I was telling squatch,
yeah, as many times as Ipracticed during the, during the
off season, like getting readyto hunt out of a saddle I wasn't

(45:25):
prepared for.
When it's that windy andeverything's moving and I come
to full draw, she was only likeI can't remember I think she was
only like Maybe 16 yards at thetime and I was swaying so much
that I almost Didn't even takethe shot.

(45:46):
If she wasn't standingbroadside like I wouldn't have
shot her.
And I decided to take the shotand I ended up hitting her.
I caught Actually I caught partof her lung, but the arrow must
have deflected or something,because it came out her gut.
But the arrow must havedeflected or something because

(46:10):
it came out her gut.
And I watched her run off andshe basically went about 40
yards and stopped and then Iwatched her lay down and then I
think I was on the phone withsquash, told him I shot you, I
shot one, and I was kind ofrunning the scenario through
through him and she's like, allof a sudden, as I'm talking to

(46:30):
him, she gets up and she goeslike another 10 yards and I'm
trying to see where the shot wasbecause I wanted to be sure.
And boom she.
She lays down again.
I'm like, ok, like maybe thisis going to be it.
Then I'm thinking how long am Iactually going to be up here
Because the way where shedecided to lay down she's

(46:53):
looking right at me.
So if I wanted to get off thetree, like I couldn't, so I'm
sitting there, I'm waiting andwaiting.
I'm like all right, likeanother I think.
Half hour goes by, 40 minutes.
She stands up, she walksanother five feet and beds down
again and I was like all right,like it's going to be a while.

(47:13):
I'm just going to leave mystuff up here.
Let's see how, how quick, like,how good I really am.
Let me let me just kind ofsneak down, got all my stuff, I
snuck all the way down.
I could see her through mybinoculars.
She's looking right at me and Ijust slowly back out.

(47:34):
I think I gave her until.
I think I went in there likefour o'clock in the afternoon.
Yeah, and she must have, and it.
It literally wasn't long beforelike that like she expired
because she was still likereally warm.
So I was telling the guys thatI made the right call on that

(47:56):
one, so, but that that that wasa crazy story.
But um, now I'll fast forwardto the Buckeye shot.
So now we get to Thanksgiving.
I went out in the morning and itwas.
It was same thing.
I had a little action, butnothing crazy.
So, you know, at home I had agood Thanksgiving with the

(48:23):
family.
I'm like, all right, like wegot to get home because I'm
planning on going out tomorrowmorning, go out there and as
soon as I get up, around 430,get in the woods.
You know I drive there.
I'm there by, like walking in,like before 5 o'clock, getting
my tree.
All of a sudden, as soon as itgets light, I have like probably

(48:47):
six to eight of those justsnorting at me.
They came from behind me, mywind's right in their face, and
they, like I wasn't I didn'tthink that they were going to
come from that side, obviouslyand they're just snorting and
snorting.

(49:07):
I'm like, oh, I'm like, well,I'm already up here, so I here,
so I'm just gonna wait it out,you know, and see what else
comes.
So they take off and then I seelike a small, like a smaller six
point.
He's walking.
He's actually walking away fromme, he's about 80 yards out.
He's walking back to like thisum, there's actually like a
little swamp and there's like ahorse farm over there, he.

(49:27):
So he's walking back that way.
So as I'm watching him.
I look and I see I see anotherdeer coming and I see a doe.
She walks out and then I see aspike.
They walk by me.
No, no problem.
Then, all of a all of a sudden,I see one of our nice
eight-pointers I haven't seen inprobably three and a half weeks

(49:51):
, only got like one picture ofhim.
He steps out, he's 50 yards andhe comes out and I thought he
was facing me so I thought hewas going to come right for me.
What does he do?
He turns and I'm.
He was facing me so I thoughthe was going to come right for
me.
What does he do?
He turns and I'm grunting athim, I'm snort, wheezing at him.
Nothing.

(50:12):
And Squatch is like you know,he's like you got your rattling
horns, you know do like a lightrattle.
I'm like, well, I don't havethem, they're in the truck.
I was like so I guess I'm going.
I guess I'm like I'm just, Iguess I'm just gonna leave them

(50:33):
squats, like you know, live tofight another day.
So I, so I get out of the woodsabout 1030, go home, get a quick
bite to eat.
Believe it or not, I took likea half hour nap.
I get up, because I knew thatthe snow, that there was going
to be like a little snow in theforecast.

(50:54):
I get in there and I think Igot up about like 130.
I was in the tree by two, like130.
I was in the tree by two everactually.
I actually moved my setup towhere I saw that eight pointer
go, because that's where I'vebeen seeing, you know, most of
the buck movement.
So I picked a different tree,got set up.

(51:17):
It's I'm not even in the treefive, ten minutes.
Here come two, two yearlingsand I'm like, okay, this is here
we go, this is gonna be nice.
So, uh, they were there forprobably about 10-15 minutes,
they leave and then nothing.
Then all of a sudden it startssnowing and all of a sudden I

(51:39):
hear now, right in front of me,there's like there's like this
little hilltop that it dropsdown into a swamp and there's
actually like a horse farm onthe top of it and right across
the ridge I see a doe come.
She's I mean she's hauling ass.
She's running right across thatridge and I just see, I could

(52:01):
just hear him coming and I waslike I guarantee that's a buck
chasing her.
And here he comes.
You know this beautiful eightpoint.
He comes out, he's chasing her,she goes into the swamp.
She's coming right for me, justlike I planned, and all of a
sudden she actually veers offand stayed in the swamp, which I

(52:22):
thought he was going to followher, but he ends up coming right
to me.
He's about, I think, like 18 or19 yards, but he's on my weak
side, right.
So I guess I didn't practiceenough, my weak side, because he

(52:43):
.
I mean thank God he stayedthere Because it felt like
freaking 10 minutes.
I'm sitting there trying tofigure out.
I'm moving my bow over, I'mgetting the camera, I'm trying
to like zoom in and I'm like howthe hell am I going to pull
this off?
So I'm like I'm trying to getsituated.
I finally come to full draw.
As I'm coming to full draw, Iactually bump my camera.

(53:07):
It makes a noise.
He never even looks up Nothing.
The full draw.

Speaker 1 (53:11):
I actually bumped my camera.
It makes a noise.
He never even looks up nothing.
His head's down the whole timein the uh in the video and I was
like how the hell is this deeris just not paying attention at
all he never moved.

Speaker 3 (53:22):
Thank god he never moved.
So, yeah, he just, he nevermoved.
So I was like all right.
So I just, you know, I put it,I put it dead on him and I I
just let it fly with, you know,those several hybrids.
And I could tell the shot wasgreat because he went as soon as
I hit him.
He went maybe 20 yards and Icould see his back legs already

(53:46):
starting to give out and he mustmust.
He went another 20, 25 yardsand I could watch him drop from
the tree.
That's the greatest feeling Iwas like in the snow.
I finally got it done.
You know, like I'm over therecelebrating.
I'm calling Squatch, I'mcalling Mike, I'm texting you
guys.
I'm like, holy shit, I can'tbelieve it.
You know, I can't believe itactually happened.

(54:07):
It was a good day, man, it wascrazy Friday.

Speaker 1 (54:12):
Thursday it was Thanksgiving with Bianca's
family down the shore.
Then I drove home to doThanksgiving on Friday with mine
.
It was right before everyonegot there.
I think it was me, my mom, mysister.
All of a sudden I stepped awayfrom my phone but on my watch
call frank.
I go oh, this is an importantcall, hold on answer.

(54:35):
I go you killed something,didn't you?
Yeah, why did you kill squadstoo?
I?

Speaker 2 (54:42):
said the same thing to him what'd you kill?

Speaker 1 (54:47):
at this point, when frank calls you, you kind of
just know that like all right,something's dead.
Um, but, frank, quick question,because I've noticed, like you
know, I have all, the, all thevideos that you've sent over.
Do you run lighted knocks?
You do, don't you?
I do, yep, I can never see your.

(55:09):
You can't see them, which whichI I can't believe because, like
me, I use I mean, I was usingnocturnals and now I'm using
just a, a honestly off brand,one off of amazon, that have
been absolutely amazing for me.
Uh, why spend all that damnmoney on nocturnals where I can
get?
You know, I think we're talkingabout this in the group with uh

(55:29):
steve and everything like thatearlier in the year.
You know, I've always been ableto see my, my arrow in in a
video and for some reason, withyours I can.

Speaker 3 (55:38):
Just, I can never see him and it's funny you say that
because remember, when I shotthat 10 pointer you could see
the lighted knock right.
Yes, on that one you'reactually they're.
Actually I ran two lightedknocks so I was running the
warheads right, so me shootingthem, they got smacked up, they

(56:01):
got banged up.
That he was.
He was out of stock so I bought, just like the cheap ones off
amazon well, not cheap, but youknow decent ones, I guess, off
amazon and I cannot see them tosave my life.
It's interesting, I, I just Idon't get it, but like I could
see the arrow when it's on thefloor, but other than that, like

(56:23):
I cannot see it when it'sflying, nothing that's weird.

Speaker 4 (56:27):
I've been using the key ups and the deep powers and
they're both.
They've been great.
I just had my first one and II've mixed them.
They're kind of mixed andmatched now, so I don't know
which, but I just now had myfirst one start to dim after
shooting them, you know, weeklyfor the past, but probably two
months.
So I mean you can't be, can'tbeat the price.

(56:49):
Six, six knocks for what?
18 bucks, you know, as comparedto three for 40 oh yeah 40
as long as they don't fall apart.
You just got to shoot them all.
Got to shoot them all and makesure they don't break yep, what
I love about these.

Speaker 1 (57:04):
I mean I, I think yours are kind of the same way,
um, steve, but I like how youcan.
I no longer need a tool,because with the nocturnals you
need a tool.

Speaker 2 (57:13):
So if they by, mistake.

Speaker 1 (57:14):
Go on, you have to like.
If you don't bring the tool, Iwould always have to use a knife
or something like that.

Speaker 4 (57:19):
The new ones that they came out with have a switch
, but they're more expensive, ofcourse, I mean I can't see the
reality.

Speaker 3 (57:27):
The reality is they all come from the same place,
absolutely absolutely one morething I didn't share with you
guys and Mike knows this, maybeSquatch knows it I shot.
I shot the doe and the buckwith the same severed bra head.
I was telling Mike, I was likeand I usually never do that, but

(57:53):
I was like, it's in good shape,it's not bent, it's still sharp
as hell.

Speaker 1 (57:59):
It's like I'm gonna reuse it and two deer with the
same broad I, I will give, um,I've never, I've never done it
as well, but these, thesesevered broadheads have held up
absolutely incredible, wherethey kind of besides, you know,
having some blood and fur andstuff like that on it.

(58:27):
It really looks like they haveeven been shot, you know,
through a deer and everythinglike that.
Um, you know, I think you know,with the, with the 2.0, I love
those, but I don't, I don'tthink I would shoot those again.
But just the way that thishybrid is, is made, I think it's
just, you know, it just holdsup so well that feral is just,
it's phenomenal, you know, justjust the way it was made and
everything like that.
So I, I am definitelyespecially after frank told me

(58:50):
he he did with his like, I mean,I know I'm buying more severs
anyway, the hybrids anyway, butlike, why not, you know, or just
easily, if you don't, if youdon't want to, and what?
What's pretty cool about that?
If you don't want to use your,your already used ones, you can
use those as practice heads andyou know, instead of instead of.

(59:12):
Because I usually, whenever Ibuy a brand new pack, I usually
take one and I designate thatthe the practice one.
But I have all these old, oldheads all over the place and I'm
like, wait, why haven't I neverused the old ones as my
practice ones, instead of alwaystaking one new one out of the
three, four, five or how many Iend up getting like?

Speaker 4 (59:33):
what an idiot they're on, they're on sale, I think
the rest of the night too.
Um, they're like three or fourdollars off a pack, uh, or a
piece.
Sorry, a piece, a piece, yeah,um, right now, until the end of
the night.
So I bought a bunch.
Actually I bought a bunch oftheir match grade, uh, 125 grain
field points because I lovethem.

(59:53):
They're they're the best thatI've I've come across, so I had
to get a bunch more.

Speaker 1 (59:57):
They're like $1.50, I think I'm going 125 next year I
think that's going to be nextyear's uh um is to go 125.
I'm shooting 100 grain thisyear but I I think I'm gonna
step toe to the 120 and you knowit's just a small difference.
You know I've already seen thehow my arrows have handled this
year and going to the heavierweight which you know I've I've

(01:00:18):
talked about for years now andfinally did, and you know the
mamba arrows that I have, I meanI mean when I like we talked
about already but when I shotthat deer, I mean that thing
blew right through that buckwhere he Steve, he had no idea
what hit him, he and then hewalked off and died and it was.
It was absolutely phenomenal tosee.

(01:00:38):
And you know as much as listen,I was a huge Eastern guy and I
don't get me wrong I do love myEastern arrows, but I don't
think I'm ever going back myEaston Arrows, but I don't think
I'm ever going back.
I love these.
As long as Mamba stays inbusiness, I'll probably be
shooting Mamba, probably for therest of the time.

Speaker 4 (01:00:58):
It's amazing too.

Speaker 1 (01:01:00):
Hit us up, Mamba, if you're listening.

Speaker 4 (01:01:04):
It's amazing too when you make the switch, because
when anybody I should say a lotof people when they talk about
the heavier arrows or if youwant to coin the frames, adult
arrows or you know, depending onhow negative you want to get,
you know it doesn't.
You can go heavier, but you canstill stay with mechanicals.

(01:01:26):
I mean the amount of videosthat I watch and people are
shooting they're shooting deerwith a 400 total arrow weight,
you know, arrow or even 450 orwhatever.
Like if you're mechanics, yourFOC is set up and you don't need
some crazy FOC.
You don't need 20 FOC or 20plus or whatever, but you get a

(01:01:47):
good 15% FOC on an arrow and youget the weight to the right
place and then you really workon your mechanics, tune it out.
There's no reason why youshouldn't be able to.
You know.
There's no reason why youshouldn't be able to have a full
pass through.
I'm not talking about hittingthe shoulder, but I mean if
you're hitting through the ribcage.
I mean unless you're hitting adirect rib, but even in that

(01:02:11):
case it's going to deflect andgo through nine times out of 10,
even more than that.
Something I didn't share withyou guys is actually very
interesting.
Actually, I did share with thegroup but I had a deer that I
had on camera from July thatcame past one of my trail cams
in one of the areas of publicthat I hunt and he was limping

(01:02:34):
and when I zoomed in he had beenshot in the shoulder and the
arrow the guy couldn't havegotten more than four inches of
penetration.
I mean, and I get that, it'sthe shoulder, but if your arrow,
if your setup is good, I'vepunched through the both
shoulder blades with a singlebevel and I've done it with.

(01:02:58):
I've done it with mechanicaltoo, like if you, if you can get
the mechanics set up, there'sno reason why you shouldn't be
able to be lethal and just aboutany you just about any
relatively vital area that youhit an animal.

Speaker 1 (01:03:15):
Yeah, perfectly said, I think it's.
Yeah, you hear the arrows and Idon't think anyone needs.
You see, people at 600 grainair, not for whitetail, like
that is that's crazy, you know.
But even I think, as long asyou have the right setup, I

(01:03:41):
think you know, if tunedcorrectly, there's so many
things that factor into into bowhunting and to archery, you
know know, and there's just somuch that you can do and I think
every bow hunter arrow andtheir setup and their it's going
to be different from from eachother.
You know, um, and that's thecool thing, the, the

(01:04:04):
customization from for archeryjust alone, of just like at the
end of the day, you know, allfour of us right here, what
works for for me doesn't meanit's always going to work for
for you guys.
Everyone's setup is different.
Our bows are are different.
At the end, all of our four ofour bows are are completely
different.
You know our, our wingspan isis different.

(01:04:26):
You know how we, you know howwe shoot.
Our bows are are going to bedifferent you know, it's a game
of every single detail matterswith with archery, and it's
going to be the same thing.
Listen, you, I don't fear thatshoulder anymore, you know.
I mean, I'm I'm prettyconfident that I'm punching

(01:04:48):
through that, that shoulder, atleast one of them where it's
still going to be a lethal shot,you know, but it's, if you're
fearing that shoulder, thenmaybe look at your.
You know, and that's what I did.
I looked at my setup and I waslike all right, what, what needs
to change here?
You know, what do I need to do,just in case if I do hit that
shoulder?

(01:05:10):
If I do hit that shoulder, youknow, I I mean with the easons,
I've still quartering away gotthrough and it, you know, broke
off into to the other shoulder,killed that deer, barely went
anywhere.
But you know it's what's goingto happen.
If you're somebody and youshoot, and maybe four inches of
penetration, it's like, uh, yeah, right, what, something needs
to change.
You know, when I hit that deerlast year and just the angle,
that just made me like all right, that right, there was enough.

(01:05:32):
Like okay, we need to come upwith a different.
You know, I don't want thatever happen again and that could
have not been.
Um, I just caught a.
Uh, just caught a.
Just caught a moth trying tofly to my, my dear over there.
God damn it um but, um, you knowit's just.

(01:05:54):
You know it's just one of thosethings that we can tinker with
our whole entire lives.
But you know, once you get thatformula down, you're not
fearing that shoulder anymore.
You know it.
Whether you're using like yousaid it I love how you said it
you've done it with fix andyou've done it with mechanical,
and you know it.
Whether you're using, like yousaid I love how you said it
you've done it with fix andyou've done it with mechanical,
and you know what either one youuse it's, you're gonna get it

(01:06:15):
done yeah, absolutely,especially now you look at you,
look at the flagship lineup thisyear.

Speaker 4 (01:06:21):
You could go with matthews or hoyt or you know any
of the major brands, and almostevery single one of them is now
offering the ability to shoot80 pounds.
My goodness, I mean it's almostto the detriment because, you
know, going from 70 to 80 pounds, your tunes really got to be on
when you're pulling 80 poundsbut you're also getting kinetic

(01:06:45):
energy out the wazoo if yourspine and everything else and
your whole, you know your, yoursetup is built correctly.
I mean there's just, there'sjust no reason to to see an
arrow hanging out of a deeranymore running away now.
And I'm not arguing that it'snot lethal, I'm just saying I
don't see why I saw a picture ina group, I don't know what.

Speaker 1 (01:07:09):
I don't know if any of you guys saw it, but a buck
had a arrow through its head.
Um, and I mean, I know the thebuck was, honestly, it was, he
was completely fine, you know.
Um, as bad as it and, yes, itlooks extremely bad and it's a
very bad.
Look on on hunters and, and Iwill, that's not.

(01:07:30):
There's no excuse for that.
There, there, there is nonewhatsoever, you know, but it
just sucks because people whodon't know what these animals go
through and how they surviveand you know the most horrific
things happen to them and theyjust it's another day to them.

(01:07:50):
You know they're, they didn't.
That deer is not looking at itall for me, like I have an arrow
through my head.
It's like, okay, somethinghappened, you know what, but I'm
still fine, I'm still eating.
He's probably chasing doesright now.
You know what I mean Like it's,it's, it's not the same, but it

(01:08:11):
gives the fuel to, to thenon-hunting world.
Like this is disgusting.
Do you see what these peopleare doing?
Um, and there's no excuse forthat, just like you know they,
it's none and you know if you're, if you're someone, maybe, I
don't know, maybe hanging up.
Then at that point, you know, II don't see in what world how
do you hit a buck in the head.

(01:08:33):
I mean, it's something crazyhas got to got to happen there.
I mean, unless it's amalfunction of you know, you're
pulling back and somethingbreaks.
Yeah, okay, but what are theodds?
You know what I mean?
What, what are?
what are the honest odds ofsomething like that happening?
You know what I mean.
What?
What are, what are the honestodds of of something like that
happening, you know?
So it's something that ourequipment is just so deadly

(01:08:55):
right now.
Steven, you, you hit it on thehead Like there's no reason why
yeah and arrow should be onlygoing for you know what I mean?
Our everything now that we haveis just deadly.
And 80 pounds.
If I ever get a bow and I'm setto 80, you best believe I'm
gonna have a backup bow.

Speaker 4 (01:09:14):
That's set to like 50 pounds.
Absolutely no, I mean and don'tI'm not taking away from the
youth hunters, or you know, mydad's a good example.
My dad just bought a brand newbear adapter last year and I
think he's pulling 40 pounds.
You know, it's basically alittle bit above the legal
minimum.
But you know what?
I also built him a 510 grainarrow which has 200 grains up

(01:09:38):
front and even though he's onlypulling 40 pounds, I mean it's
basically like a trad bow.
You look at the trad bow guys,the trad bow, recurve longbow,
whatever it is they, they have200.
Most of those guys have atleast 200 grains up front and
they're and they might not begetting a full pass through, but
they're not worried aboutpenetration, you know, and

(01:10:00):
that's with a 40 to 50 pound,you know recurve my super mag 48
60.

Speaker 2 (01:10:07):
It's a 60-pound, 48-inch recurve.
I shot the traditional carbonarrows with a Magnus two-blade
broadhead on it.
When I hit that buck I wentright through, right through at
20 yards.
I mean no issues.

Speaker 4 (01:10:23):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:10:24):
Plenty of power in that thing, man.
I mean, it's a heavy arrow andit had the kinetic energy it
needed.
And a recurve's kinetic energybelieve it or not is actually a
little bit different through howa compound's measured, just due
to the fact that the way itunloads the arrow out of it it's

(01:10:46):
a different kind of power.
I don't know how to exactlyexplain it, so it makes sense,
but the torque, yeah, basically,yes, yes, you hit it right on
the head yeah so uh, but yeah, Ican tell you from from doing it
, don't be afraid, I mean thatthat 60 pound, you know is, is
something, and I learned how tosnap shoot that I'm not really

(01:11:07):
one of those guys that like hangback on a recurve and you know
you draw back to, you hit youranchor point and then you
release.
But it's all one movement andI'm telling you it worked great.
I had no issues.
But I also stayed inside of mymeans.
You know nothing outside of 20yards and, believe me, I had.

(01:11:27):
That's why I went back to thecompound, because I was seeing
some bigger bucks at 30 and I'mlike, oh, if I had the compound
but.

Speaker 4 (01:11:38):
I refused.

Speaker 2 (01:11:39):
I just refused to take a crap shot with the, with
the recurve if I had it it hadto be.
It had to be a shot.

Speaker 1 (01:11:46):
That was what that was meant to do, so all about
being ethical hunter right there, but uh guys, I think that's
gonna it's gonna be our longest,um feel no episode.
It was great to to have steveback.
Uh, you know the the episodereally flowed a little more with
steve's.
Uh, steve here.
It's nicer when you got fourpeople here, because there's

(01:12:10):
there's just more to to talkabout with with four of us.
Uh, but it was.
It was great getting the boysback on.
It is that holiday time.
Holy crap, it's almostChristmas.
It's absolutely unbelievable.
It's almost Christmas, um.
So we're going to be gettinginto a lot of things here.
I'm probably going to, tomorrow, be starting our fan voted top

(01:12:34):
episodes of 2024.
A lot of episodes this year, Ithink.
I not officially know yet, butI think this is going to be the
all time episodes in a year.
I think last year I did 42episodes in one year and I'm
pretty sure we knocked it outthe park.
Uh, this year, um, so it's been, it's been great, um, and yeah,

(01:13:00):
we're getting to that christmastime.
Once we get a little closer to 4000, we'll be doing our 200th
episode plus 4 000000 followerepisode giveaway soon.
A lot of broadheads that aregoing to be given away.
So people keep out, keep alookout for that.
So, yet again, trying to naildown the game dinner and then,

(01:13:25):
like I said, we'll be at theEmpire State Show February 28th
to March 2nd and then also wewill be at the Great American
Outdoor Show February 1st.
I believe Bianca and I aregoing to February 5th.
She extended that day.
She was like, oh, we'll justput down to the 5th.
I was like, ok, whatever you,whatever you say, looking

(01:13:48):
forward to all these greatevents and guys, great week.
Let's get another good week inthe books here.