The 30-Year-Old Rookie: How Joe Arabia Became a Jersey Rut Warrior

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
Welcome back to the Garden State Outdoorsman Podcast
.
I'm your host, frank Bustica,I'm your co-host, mike Nitre,
and today we have a very specialguest, mr Joe Arabia from
Northern Jersey Outdoors.
Joe, welcome to the show bud.

Speaker 3 (00:19):
Hey guys, thanks for having me on, I appreciate it.

Speaker 1 (00:22):
No, appreciate you coming on, man, as we were just
talking having a little funbefore the podcast.
But uh, joe, for the people whodon't know you, why don't you
just give everybody like alittle background on yourself?

Speaker 3 (00:34):
Sure, uh, well, I guess, like my Instagram handle
says, I uh, I live in NorthernNew Jersey where I uh, I uh hunt
as well.
Um, I guess my, my story iskind of a little different than
most people, I feel like, whohunt.
I just started hunting when Iwas 30.
I'm currently 36.
So I've only been hunting forlike six years.

(00:56):
My cousin was the one who reallygot me into it.
My cousin and my two uncles, sohis father and then our uncle.
They hunted their whole livesand growing up they were like oh
, you should come, you shouldcome, you should come, you know,
and I just I never, I never did.
I played sports and stuff likethat, but I never, I never went

(01:19):
with them.
And then it was kind of funny.
We had my now wife.
She was my girlfriend then, butmy now wife had a surprise 30th
birthday party for me and mycousin got me a card and in the
card were permits because theapprenticeship had just started,

(01:41):
so they had implemented theapprenticeship, so he was able
to buy, you know, permits for meand uh, and he, you know, he
decided to be, you know, it waslike I'll, I'll be, you know,
the, your, your guide, you knowyou have these apprentice
permits.
Um, why don't you just come outwith me?
You know we'll, we'll, we'llhave fun.
So I was like, okay, you know.
And uh, boy, I think it wasshotgun season and my first deer

(02:04):
was a big old doe.
She came in and it was likejust lightly snowing I'll never
forget it and my heart was justbeating out of my chest.
I didn't know whether I wasgoing to be able to hold on to
the gun or not.
My chest was beating so hard,my adrenaline was going so fast.
And you know, he talked methrough it, calmed me down and

(02:25):
uh, pulled the trigger and shejust fell right there.
Man and I, I've been hooked eversince with deer on.
I just been obsessed, obsessedwith deer hunting.
Um, you know, there's nothing,there's just nothing else like
it.
You know I uh, I mean I, I got,I got some other hobbies.
You know I like to bodybuildand you know work out and stuff,

(02:48):
but there's just somethingprimal.
You know it opens up To me.
I feel like it just opened up adifferent part of my brain
where it's just like I can'tpicture living without it
anymore, to be able to go huntand chase.
And when people ask me why I,you know, I feel like I, uh,
it's because, like, you get outof it what you put into it.

(03:10):
You know.
So if you want you know, if youdon't want to scout and and you
don't want to do anything, youjust want to go sit in the woods
and and enjoy being out, uh,outdoors and in nature, all the
more power to you, you know,like it, that alone is is, to me
, is great with, you know, theuh technology age now, like
everybody's just kind of sittingindoors.

(03:32):
I'm also a, uh, a nurse.
I work in the emergencydepartment, uh, so, you know, I,
I see that all the time, likepeople just, you know, decaying
away but um, uh, yeah, so, uh,and now I don't know, yeah, so,

(03:52):
um, uh, what was I, what was Isaying right before that?
Oh my God.

Speaker 1 (03:58):
No, you were.
You were talking about like howyou were nursed and how you saw
everybody like like start, oh,so you get everybody like like
start, yeah, so, oh, so you getout what you put in right, so
but if you put in the time.

Speaker 3 (04:10):
If you put in the time, I really feel like you
know, you know, and if your goalis to get more mature, older
deer and stuff like that, if youput in the time, scouting and
and and doing the work and theresearch, like you know, you get
out of it what you put in andyou are able to put down mature
bucks.
But I also I like the fact thatyou can grow in hunting too,

(04:33):
right.
So, like I think, at first,like I said, my first deer was a
doe.
I was so happy with it.
That memory will always be withme, you know, and that's what I
love about it.
So, yeah, that's just that's alittle bit about, about me.

Speaker 2 (04:47):
No, that's hey, that's a heck of a story, but
like yeah, really especially sixyears real quick Frank the six
years, like I would have neverhave guessed, like you know,
when I first started followingyou on Instagram.
And like I would have neverhave guessed like six years is
still a very short time.
I mean, I know we're talkingbefore the show about turkey

(05:07):
hunting, and you know how it'sso and don't be wrong.
I think turkey huntingdefinitely, I think, is
something that's going to takepeople a little longer to get
their first bird and everythinglike that.
But I think the hardest thingabout deer hunting is really not
deer hunting itself, but wheredo you go like?
What are all the?
Rules and everything like that.

(05:28):
Like you know where do I bring,you know the butcher like how
do I?
How?

Speaker 3 (05:32):
do I cut the.

Speaker 2 (05:32):
If you didn't grow up do it.
How do?
How do I cut this thing?
Where do I take it to thebutcher?
Like I think a lot of whatmakes deer hunting so hard and
why people have a tough timegetting into it is kind of the
the stuff before you actually goon your your first hunt and
everything like that, and thenthe whole scouting thing and all
these different things.
Like I I think there's there'sjust so much that you need to

(05:55):
know before you actually go deerhunting that if you didn't grow
up in it or you know you havesomebody close to you and
everything like that that makesmakes it extremely hard to get
into.

Speaker 3 (06:07):
Yeah, I definitely agree with you and that's why I
say like I was definitelyblessed, or am blessed, with my
cousin.
You know we're really goodfriends and we're close and he
really, you know the first Iwould say two years like held me
by the hand basically andwalked me through the woods and
was like you know, this is adeer rub, this is a deer scrape.

(06:27):
You know these are droppings.
You know, um, basically, youknow you name it, like he, he
taught it to me, uh, my uncletoo and uh, you know where to go
, what's public land, what youknow what permits you need to
get for which uh area.
You know, by me, there's a lotof Newark watershed, you know,
so, getting that permit andwhere you can go to hunt and set

(06:51):
up trees.
He taught me how to set up treestands and stuff like that.
So, as a, as an older guy,getting into getting into
hunting, I think you know that'sthat's key really is trying to
find somebody that's that'swilling to do that.
I don't and I don't know ifthat's really easy or not.
I don't.
I probably it's probably not,you know, but I know there's a
lot of programs out there, um,but so I do suggest anybody who

(07:14):
you know is is a little olderand not that you know, being in
your thirties, is old, but youknow, for hunting, usually
people start hunting whenthey're 10, you know.

Speaker 1 (07:22):
Yeah, yeah, I think I was going when I was like five.

Speaker 3 (07:26):
Right, exactly.
So you know, sometimes I feellike maybe I missed out on that.
But then sometimes I think likeI don't know if I'd be that
passionate about it now if I hadstarted when I was like five or
eight, you know like I probablywould have been, would be right
.

Speaker 2 (07:42):
But, like I, don't know, I probably would have been
would be right.

Speaker 1 (07:44):
But like who knows, Over the years, it only burns,
it only grows.

Speaker 2 (07:49):
I think what I've heard from a lot of people,
especially you know, doing thispodcast, you know both podcasts
now for so many years is thatyou know, correct me especially
for you, frank, you're, you'resomeone that's been doing it for
I imagine Squatch or somethinglike you go through these dips,
especially like when you becomea teenager and you know when you
, you know, hit that a youngadult and everything like that

(08:11):
and you're trying to now balance.
You know school, social life,like everything like that, and
then you go to go to college.
I usually hear a lot of peoplesay that they get into it.
You know they have a lot of fun, but then other things take
over, as as a kid and everythinglike that.
And honestly, I think huntingespecially in in, you know,

(08:32):
takes a lot of effort and ittakes a lot of time, especially
once you really get dialed anddedicated into it.
You know then it's like, oh,this is a full, it's a full, oh
this is a full time job.

Speaker 1 (08:44):
It really is.

Speaker 2 (08:44):
It really is so this is the only thing that we're you
know.
This is what we're thinkingabout.
This is everything that's goinginto it.
So you see, those hunters thatstarted at five, they go, they
hunt and then they take a hugedip.
And then I've talked to a lotof people that they'll take a
couple years off, especiallyaround college time and
everything like that.

Speaker 3 (09:10):
And then they get really back into it and then
they really hit it hard likeokay, like now I'm obsessed,
like we're also out of collegenow and everything starts
burning hot again, yeah yeah, Idon't think I ever lost a man.

Speaker 1 (09:18):
I lost a lot of girlfriends for that really hell
yeah, man, like I was, I wasalways on the go man, I always I
just wanted to be out there,especially in high school.
Forget about it.
Like I was, you know I waschasing girls.
But then, you know, come deerseason, I was like, oh, gotta go
.

Speaker 2 (09:36):
You know, like that's it, oh yeah, I think for me,
honestly, like I don't know,like and you know all the
listeners and you know that no,and joe, for you, like I was a
big time hockey player, likethat's what I did, like I big,
big time hockey player, likefriends playing the nhl and
everything like that, like so itwas full-time job.

(09:57):
I honestly could say in a bigpart why I've fallen on and I
still love hockey and I stillwatch it, but I don't care about
playing really anymore.
And what has also helped myretirement from hockey was
hunting and like I honestly,like people are like, oh well,
do you wish you were in the NHL?
like yes, just so I can havemoney, so I can go it's not

(10:22):
necessarily because I want tolike and yeah, cool, it'd be
pretty damn cool to play in theNHL.
Don't get me right.
It's not necessarily because Iwant to like and yeah, cool,
it'd be pretty pretty damn coolto play in the NHL, don't get me
wrong.
But it's not like I would beable to go to Alaska, like I
would be able to go to theMidwest, I'd have my own
properties and everything Like.
I kind of think of it now aslike, all right, how is that
going to help me?
Like I'll have all the money Ineed, like I can get a new pro
every year and everything likethat.

(10:43):
You know, and the people like,oh, you know, you want your kids
to play hockey.
I'm like, yeah, I do, but likeand like, I'm really like I
really want them to hunt, but Iwant them to play hockey and
stuff like, but I really like, Iwant to show my kids, you know,
and I want them to be asobsessed about hunting as as
much as I am, especially, youknow, hopefully I can pass a lot

(11:03):
of this stuff down to to them.
And maybe you know this companywith the podcast and whatever
the future holds and everythinglike that.
You know, it's, it's crazy, butyou know, I frank, I completely
get you.
Like I, I can only imagine whatgirls would have been.

Speaker 1 (11:19):
They would have been like, yeah, no yeah, they're
like no, we can't you're, you'regoing again.

Speaker 3 (11:23):
No, that's it, you know I like, I like how you said
you want, you know, you want topass it down to your kids and I
can see the the passion in youreyes, uh, about that, because I
I think about the same thingwith my two-year-old.
You know he's only two, but Ikeep saying to my wife I'm like
man, I really hope he wants tohunt you know, like man, I
really hope he wants to come outyou.

Speaker 1 (11:41):
You don't want to force them, but you're like,
please want to do it Right,right, cause I feel like if you
force things on on kids likeyou're right, I don't, they
don't ever want to do it, right.

Speaker 3 (11:50):
So I keep saying, man , I hope, I hope he does, and I,
I tag him along, I mean to pickhim up, but he doesn't want to
be picked up, you know.
So instead of a you know halfhour thing, it's taken like you
know, but uh, I get him out.
I just get him out there and uh,and I hope the same thing.

(12:13):
I think that's another thing,that right, that, and I keep
this is how I I think about itto myself.
I'm like that's another aspectof hunting that will soon be
unlocked for me right like now Ican pass what I've learned from
my cousin, my uncles.
Now I can pass that down to tomy son, hopefully, and I think
that's one of the the the greatthings about it, you know, so I

(12:37):
I get what you're saying yeah,no, absolutely.

Speaker 1 (12:39):
Because, like even with me, like every chance I get
I take my, my four-year-old son, out with me.
He's always wants to takepictures there.
We, you know if we got a trackone scouting like he's, that's
one thing.
He's always with me, alwayswants to go, that's awesome.
I mean that's.
I'm looking forward like Ican't wait until he can actually
go out with me.
Believe it or not, me and oneof my buddies were actually

(13:03):
talking about trying to bringhim out this year.
Like set up just a ground blind.
See how he does, like I don'tcare if he spooks.
I'm like put the ground blindsomewhere.
We're like I really don't careabout knowing where we're going
to see those, at least you know,entertain.

Speaker 3 (13:19):
You want him to be yeah.

Speaker 1 (13:21):
Yeah, and just see how you know, see how he is Like
, see if he can, you know, learnto be climbing, because at the
end of the day, he's a kid, youknow Right.

Speaker 3 (13:29):
So that was going to be my next question.
Do you think at four, like he's?

Speaker 1 (13:35):
old enough to stay quiet.
I don't, no, I think he needslike another year or two.
But you know, I I kind of wantto start him like sooner than
later.
So I kind of want to just getout there and like at least take
him for like one sit this yearor whatever.
See, see how he does.
If he does good, then like I'llkeep bringing him.

(13:56):
You know, like yeah and you know, I'm sure he he's gonna love it
.
I'm sure he'll get bored, butlike, that's what you got snacks
for and everything like.
It should all work.

Speaker 3 (14:04):
Sometimes I get bored but like that's what you got
snacks for and everything Like.
It should all work.
I get bored sitting up in thetree too.
Yeah Right, it happens.

Speaker 1 (14:10):
It happens, listen.
I took my daughter out.
I mean she's, she's turning 16now.
I took her when she was, Ithink, like eight or nine and
she was fine until, like, allher snacks were gone, and then
she was like all right, daddy,we're done make sure you always
have more snacks than youactually need.
Just the right yeah, yeah, Ilearned the hard way but I, you

(14:32):
know, I've listened to.

Speaker 2 (14:33):
You know I don't have kids and everything like that.
I work with kids and and thingslike that.
So, but you know, always thekey is kind of like, yeah, you
don't want to force it, you wantto and take him out that one
time just to see how he does,and you know what, even if he
does have, like you know he had,he's Perfect.
You know what I mean, which Idon't really believe in anything
being, but Say he does just aphenomenal job.

(14:56):
You know, if he Just keepsasking and you want him to Keep
asking, asking, asking, so thenRight, when you bring them
another time, it's like allright, this is something that I
look forward to and you knowit's one.
It's creating memories, butit's also now him pushing that
he wants to go, especially onceit gets a little bit, a little
taste of it and everything likethat.
Hopefully, and as much ashopefully there's deer and

(15:19):
everything like that, because weall know, how hunting can go
like it gets boring and it'saction.
It does get tough and I alwaysdeer hunting is hard to get
people into like.
If you're getting people intohunting like man waterfowl
hunting is like one of myfavorite things to do yeah,
that's something I've never done, but I heard it's fun.

Speaker 3 (15:40):
I heard it's fun and it's the interaction.
It's because of the interaction.

Speaker 2 (15:44):
It's because you get to talk and you communicate,
you're, you're laughing, you'rehaving a good time, you're not
really worrying about anythinguntil the birds are coming in.

Speaker 3 (15:52):
Right, right you know what I mean.

Speaker 2 (15:53):
So it's completely different with deer hunting.
You know and, like you said,you want to take them to a spot
that you don't have to worryabout which you don't, because
at the end day, like we know howthese bucks are, you know, we
know how, like the mid minute,something is off or they hear

(16:14):
something or smell something orwhatever you're not going to see
a deer and and you know anyonewho takes their cat out there,
they may not have the funbecause they want to see animals
no, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1 (16:25):
Or the reverse side is that, as you can go to a spot
where, where you don't think heis, all of a sudden he shows up
and you're please be quiet youknow, any given, any given day,
right, like they, they can showup and, yeah, it's that's.

Speaker 3 (16:40):
That's that's the one of the tough things about
hunting, for myself too, because, like I said, I'm always,
always trying to be better.
But, like like we all said,right, you know, there are those
boring times and trying to stayfocused during those boring
times is hard, because that'swhen you get caught literally
with you.
You know, your pants downbasically, yeah, because the big
buck all of a sudden startsrunning in and you're just not

(17:02):
ready.
You know know the phone's inyour hand or something stupid on
your hand, you're trying to getyour feet situated, you're
trying to pick up the bow, youknow, without them seeing you,
and and it just.
And then you know, even if youdo get everything right and you
draw back, like everything nowis, instead of being smooth,
everything's rough.
Yeah, and like, I'm one ofthose people where it's like

(17:31):
when it feels good, it feelsgood, but when it's like off,
it's off.
You know what I mean.
I think everybody you know cankind of kind of relate to that.
And it's like, uh, you know,this year that happened, that
actually happened to me.
Um, you know, it was November,november 3rd, yeah, it was
November 3rd, and it was cold onNovember 3rd.
Man, I remember it was a cold,cold morning and I didn't see

(17:51):
anything and I told myself I wasgoing to stay till 10 o'clock,
I was going to get down, my momwas watching my son for me, so I
was like I'll get down, I'llcome back and we'll eat lunch,
I'll eat lunch with them andthen, like she said, she could
watch them again in theafternoon, you know.
So it was like, uh, 9, 50 andI'm like you know what that's,

(18:12):
you know that, that's, that'sbasically it.
And all of a sudden, I look overto my left and there's a buck,
you know, and I don't have mybow in my hand.
My phone is in my hand, rightlike, which is like you know,
because I'm I'm scrollinginstead of focusing and uh, so I
put my phone, you know, in mypocket.
I grabbed my bow.
Luckily he was like on an anglewhere he couldn't see me and

(18:33):
I'm trying to stop, I'm tryingto stop him, but again, like
everything just just felt wrong,you know, and I pulled back on
him and I was able to settle thepin and, um, I got him right,
right in the right in theshoulder blade.
So I was like to settle the pinand I got him right, right in
the right in the shoulder blade.
So I was like, oh man, I don'tknow, I don't think that was a
deep mouth penetration, and sohe, he had run off out of my

(18:56):
sight and I I gave it some timeand you know it, like I said, it
looked that the placementlooked like it was like right on
the shoulder and you know.
So I walked about, saw blood,and I walked about like a
hundred yards and I found thearrow and then that that was it.
The arrow didn't even like justthe head of it had broken off,

(19:16):
didn't look like I got any goodpenetration.
I searched and searched for himthat day but never found him and
he wound up being on a trailcam picture of mine actually a
few, a few weeks later in adifferent, different spot.
But, um, you know, contrary tothe next day, actually, with the
, the buck, I got in November,like everything, you know,
everything felt right, you know,everything felt right and the

(19:37):
shot was, was, was, was perfect,and and you know, I was
actually.
That's actually a pretty,pretty cool story too, with,
with that buck, I had that.
That same afternoon that I,that I had put the bad shot on
the on the deer, I went andchecked my trail camera on the,

(19:57):
on the same ridge but a littlefurther down, and, um, that buck

(20:23):
that I, that I shot November,november 4th it's this big eight
point um was on the trail, wason the camera the day before, so
he was on November 2nd, he wason November 2nd, it was November
3rd, and I'm like yo, I, youknow, this afternoon I'm going
to stay where I am, but liketomorrow morning, I'm, I'm, I'm
moving down this, this ridge,here and um.
So the next morning I moved I II just started saddle hunting,
like two years ago, so I I use asaddle now that was literally
my next question for you.
That's perfect yeah, yeah, whatkind of saddle you got before
you get into the story what typeof saddle yeah uh, I have a.
I use XOP sticks.

(20:45):
I have XOP sticks and I wasusing for starting out, I was
using an XOP saddle as well, theone that's got like the harness
and everything Like it's like Iforget what it's called, to be
honest which I think like forlike bang for your buck, is a
great setup.
I don't know if they sell itanymore, though.

(21:06):
I think they, I think theyrevamped it and it looks.
It looks a little different now, but now I use the trophy line,
trophy line Nexus, the, the,the Nexus, which is, which is
pretty comfortable, and theplatform I use actually is like
a platform off Amazon.

Speaker 2 (21:27):
I had the.

Speaker 3 (21:27):
XOP yeah, I had the XOP one, but it was a little
heavy.
You know, like I said, it waslike a beginner's package one.

Speaker 1 (21:35):
Yeah, I've heard they're heavy.

Speaker 3 (21:37):
Yeah, so the sticks are super light.
I got the new sticks andthey're really light.
I love them.
The grip on them is is amazing,um, and I use, uh, daisy chains
with those.
I use daisy chains with thoseto lighten it up a little bit,
because the buckles they comewith are like it's crazy, by the
time you you put it alltogether they're so heavy.

(21:58):
It's like, yeah, why even takethe weight out of the sticks?
You know, yes, they make theymake a lot of noise.
You know.
So the daisy chains, they Ithink they work great.
I don't know, uh, that was thatwas a new thing I tried this
year.
Um, I do like it.
I mean they kind of they.
I know some people complainbecause they kind of get like
caught up in things and stufflike that you're trying to get

(22:19):
them around, but, um, I haven'thad, I haven't had too many
issues but I like that.
But the actual platform is, likeyou know, I think it's like a
12 by 12, three pound platform.
I got off Amazon.
It's not really anything towrite home about, but it's super

(22:40):
light and the actual it comesout a little further than it is,
than it is wide, which I, whichI, I like, cause, like you can
turn sideways on it a littleeasier, and stuff like that.
Um so, really really basic,basic stuff, you know not, not
anything crazy, um so yeah.

(23:01):
So I the next morning I uh, Iuh, went, went to that spot on
the ridge but I had forgotten totake off my uh, my uh cabinet,
the uh, the, the rope, basicallyyou know, the, the rope on the

(23:22):
on the other set the day before.
So like I get there in themorning and I'm setting up and
I'm like shit man.

Speaker 2 (23:29):
I don't have anything to hang from.
I don't have my rope here.

Speaker 3 (23:32):
It's like hanging 20 feet in a tree up the ridge.
I had forgotten to take it downthat day.

Speaker 1 (23:42):
So I'm like what am I going to do?
That's the worst.
I said that's the worst theword.

Speaker 3 (23:47):
It was the worst, right, and I like I just figured
this out, like when I basicallyset every everything up.
You know, I'm like about topull it out of my bag and it's
it's not in my bag and uh, I'mlike, luckily it was a small
tree, the, the right.
What I felt was like the righttree was a tree.
That's basically.
You know, basically I don'tknow, maybe it was 12.

(24:07):
I don't know, it was like itwas like this wide, basically.
So it was it was a very thintree, but I felt like it was in
the right spot.
So what I did was I took the,the, the belt, basically, and
where where you would latch, youknow, your, your your rope too,

(24:28):
and I just secured myself to tothe tree and I stood basically,
uh, the whole time.
Thank God I didn't have to standfor a for a long time uh
because at first light, you know, there was some laurels to my
right and about 80 yards, I seeI hear a deer moving pretty fast
and I'm like I think that's a,I think that's a buck.

(24:48):
You know, like the it soundedlike it was by itself and it was
moving fast.
And sure enough, I see I seeabout 80 yards like some, some
antlers.
So I'm like you know what?
He wasn't heading my direction,he was perpendicular parallel
to me.
He was heading parallel to me.
So I said it's November, I'mgoing to try to just clash some
antlers together and see whathappens, you know.
So nothing crazy.
You know, like I just kind oflike hit them together and then

(25:16):
made like a small little gruntafterwards and just touched him
again and I hear him stop and Ican't see him at this point.
And then I hear the walk.
Now he's walking, but he'swalking towards me.
I can tell he's walking towardsme.
So like now I'm jacked, youknow, because I've never called
a deer in that way, you knowwhat I mean.
But I was like I'm going to tryit and I had never actually
seen what the deer looked like.

(25:36):
And he's coming, he's coming,he's coming.
So I got my bow and, you know, Igot the shakes going on.
I'm like, oh my God, like thisis, this is sweet.
And I finally see him and he'sa uh, I would say probably a
two-year-old, eight pointer,nice, a nice deer man, and I,
like, the thought in my head was, like you know, cause we I

(25:58):
think we were saying it beforelike you know, I work, I had the
, the, the, the baby at the time.
You know, I'm like I might notget another opportunity, like
this November for deer.
Like you know, maybe I shouldshoot this deer.
You know, and it's a cool story, you know, I call, I call the
man and I said you know what,nah, man, like you promised
yourself, like you know there'sa big deer in the area.

(26:20):
You promised yourself it was,it was him or nothing Like.
And you're not going to be ableto get the big deer unless you
sacrifice, you know, maybe maybeeating a tag, you know.
So, um, you know, I put the bowback down and, like you know, he
uh, he walked across about 15yards and uh he got my, you know
my scent from from where Iwalked in and instead of you

(26:42):
know how young bucks kind of actcrazy during the rut.
Instead of getting spooked,he's like trying to find me,
he's like walking around likelooking all over the place, you
know, kind of like a doe mightdo you know what.
I mean, but like, not like amature buck at all, because he's
only probably two years old,but he's stomping around, making

(27:03):
like all this noise and I'mlike man, this is kind of crazy,
but I'm just watching it.
Actually I was.
I was filming it with my phoneand all of a sudden I hear this
like ruckus to you know, I wasturned around on the tree.
He was, cause he was behind me,so it was to my left, um, and I
look up and there is just thebiggest deer I personally have
ever seen, coming coming downthe ridge and he's pissed, like,

(27:28):
just like you could tell by thebody language, like he's coming
down like yo, what are youdoing on my block?
You know, and that deer sees him, that young eight pointer sees
him and takes off, Doesn't wantanything to do with him.
You know, and I'm like holyshit, Like I grabbed my bow

(27:48):
again and he's coming like likea like on a string.
He's coming like on a string toto my, to my stand, and I'm
like he never even checked thewind.
He was so pissed he never evenstopped to check the wind.
He stopped at 20 yards, atabout 30 yards.
He was walking behind, he wasin the Laurel.
So I pulled my bow back and hestopped about 20 yards and of

(28:10):
course was his.
His vitals were in a tree, wasblocking his vitals, Of course
you know, it felt like foreverand I'm like thinking I'm like,
should I just shoot them?
Like you know, I'm just like,should I just shoot?
Should I just shoot?
Like, like you know, I'm justlike, should I just shoot?
Should I just shoot?
Like I think it would have beena little forward.
Though you know what I mean Inmy head.
I'm like, logically, I'm likeit's going to be four.
I'm like just calm down andjust wait.

(28:32):
I'm like he's coming, he'salready come this far, like he's
going 30 seconds.
But it felt like an eternity.
But he finally gave me two moresteps, uh, basically broadside
at 20 yards, and I and I let itfly and, uh, I doubled long.

(28:53):
I mean he went.
I saw him drop it around 60yards, 50 yards, 60 yards.
So but, um, it was pretty,pretty sweet, pretty sweet story
I thought it was.
It was kind of of kind of coolhunting experience you must have
been celebrating in that tree,huh I had to wait to get down
because I was so, like I said,it was a thin tree.

(29:13):
The whole tree was shaking fromme shaking like afterwards love
it called my cousin I called myuncles and, uh, you know my
brother, and uh, you know, Itook my, took my time because I
was thinking like I'm, likeyou're going to, if you don't
calm down, you are going to fallout of this tree and it's kind
of funny, like I, like you know,I have a tree stand and and

(29:38):
saddle, but I hate heights.
I actually I hate heights.
So every time I get up in atree it takes me about five to
ten minutes to settle down.
But actually I wound up gettingthat buck officially scored and
it went 133 net.

Speaker 1 (29:58):
Yeah, I did see that on your Instagram.
That buck was gorgeous man.

Speaker 3 (30:02):
Yeah, thanks, man.
I was really pumped about thatand you know I had done some.
I did some digging after thatand I realized that I had.
I actually had a few picturesof this deer previous years in
the same spot and one in adifferent spot and I didn't

(30:23):
realize it was the same deer.
So I'm pretty sure the deer wasprobably around six years old.
You know, I pulled this anothercrazy story.
I pulled his teeth to get himaged, you know.

Speaker 1 (30:36):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (30:36):
And I left them in my garage and mice stole them.
No.

Speaker 2 (30:42):
Yeah, I swear to God, so I put them on God.

Speaker 3 (30:45):
I have.
I have a butchering table and Iput the teeth on the on the
table and and two days later thekit comes and I go to the table
and the teeth aren't there.
So I asked my wife.
I said, listen, I don't thinkyou touched them, but like, did
you see where the teeth went?
They're on the butchering table.
And she was like no, I have noidea.
And I was like man, what Like?

(31:07):
The only thing that could popin my head was that, like, maybe
an animal stole them.

Speaker 1 (31:22):
So I set out a couple mouse traps and of course you
know, I got about four mice inaround three days.
So yeah, I wasn't even gonnamage you should take that you
want to steal my teeth?

Speaker 2 (31:27):
I got you what a, what a story.
Though like on all honesty,like that is just say that got
me fighting my heart rate, Ithink.
Got up like that for season,like that, that was great it was
.

Speaker 3 (31:42):
The story is like it was like half of what what I
love about it was like the, thelike.
You know that perfect rut hunt,you know what I mean that that
you want, like you know, I guessthere's like two scenarios,
right, like a buck chasing a doe, or a buck fighting off another
buck and it was just like itwas.
Uh, it was crazy.
I'd never seen a deer act soaggressive before in my in my,

(32:05):
like I said, I've only beenhunting for for six years but
I've never seen he was just sodominant and, like, like I said,
never even checked the wind,like he knew he was the baddest
dude there and he was and he wascoming to to kick him out of,
out of his uh, head of spot.

Speaker 2 (32:19):
So it was uh, it was definitely really cool yeah, and
, and for, and, for the rat andeveryone.
I'll tell you it is always.
My dream too is to hit thoserattled together antlers and get
a deer coming in.
And I've, I've kind of, youknow, I've talked to a bunch of
people on the east coast, youknow, and things like that, and

(32:39):
yeah, you can do it, but Ialways feel like you, you see it
, on these, these midwest showsand they make it seem so easy
and I do think right yep, I dothink the vocalization in out
the mid Midwest is a littledifferent than here.
Also, you got to remember,especially like northern Jersey
and everything like that,everything's thick and you could

(33:02):
rattle in a buck and just neverknow where.
A lot of these places where yousee it happening, it's a lot of
ag, so it's a lot of openfields and everything like that.
So I think it's a littledifferent of open fields and
everything like that.
So I I think it's it's a littledifferent, um, and but it's
always a frustrating thingbecause it is so cool when you
watch it and whatever showyou're watching, and they hit
that antler scale, they get thegrunty and you get a buck that

(33:25):
comes in.
That's just all jacked up andeverything like that.
Like that's what everybodywants I know it's, it's crazy.

Speaker 3 (33:33):
I think I think another reason why it's not so
effective here because I I'vetried it, I've tried it before
is that, like you know, thedough to buck ratio here I I
think it's very skewed.
It's very skewed and if youdon't have a truly aggressive
buck, they're like listen, man,there's plenty of fish in the
sea.
Yeah, I'll go, I'll go on tothe next one, you know, and it's

(33:54):
like uh, so I think that'sthat's one of the reasons, one
of the reasons too, because theyjust they just don't need to,
you know, they just don't needto like it's not life or or
death, or like there's a,there's another broad around the
, around the, around the bend, abend for them you know.

Speaker 2 (34:08):
So, yeah, and that's a great point, that's a
phenomenal point because of justus being in New Jersey, our,
our deer number is just so muchdifferent than everywhere else.
And you know, I've I alwaystell people like, at least in in
the areas I hunt, our rut isn'tlike a normal rut, because I
think a big part of it isbecause, like you said, like

(34:30):
they don't have to get fired up,like they, they don't have to
get fired up, they don't have tofight, they don't have to do
this.
They are going to, and if theydo get kicked out of an area by
a big mature buck, they're justgoing to go right over to the
next area and go breed some doesover there while he's breeding
the does in his domain.

(34:50):
So it's this thing where you doget a lot of bucks that do
travel, but I agree, I don'tthink they're fighting and, yeah
, they may scrap here and there,but right, yeah, they're not.

Speaker 3 (35:03):
I don't.
I've seen like on trail cams.

Speaker 2 (35:04):
I got some videos like they'll scrap a little bit.
You know what I mean?
Yeah, nothing.
I've never seen anything crazy.
I want to write something, yeahyou never seen one.

Speaker 1 (35:12):
Really go at it.

Speaker 3 (35:13):
Right, I've never seen two bucks really go at it
on camera in the middle of thenight or in person, like you're
saying, out in the Midwest whereyou see them, they're really,
really going at it.
You know what.

Speaker 1 (35:25):
I mean.

Speaker 3 (35:26):
I just don't see that here.
And the vocalization you'retalking about.
You said too I agree with thattoo Like I don't hear deer, like
I was able to go out toIllinois I guess it was three
years ago now, three years agonow and I swear the deer out
there, like even the does, likethey're all grunting.

(35:47):
They're all grunting andtalking, you know, basically
talking, you know to each other,and I was like really, really
amazed by that Like as they're,you know, 20 yards away you can
hear them like grunting to eachother and talking.
And I remember sitting therethinking like I don't hear this
ever in New Jersey.
They're a lot less vocal, Ifeel like.

Speaker 2 (36:10):
Two things before I forget One also.
You got to Midwest.
You get a lot of deer that arefour, five and six.
You get a lot more of thoseMature bucks in the Midwest
versus New Jersey.
You will get a four year Oldevery once in a while.
Five, you know.
I mean you'll get it, but Idon't think also the age class
and the Dominant bucks like youhave in the Midwest it's not the

(36:33):
same too as Well, because atthe end day your buck that you
killed.
If there was another buck inthat same class as him, they
would be probably a little more.
There might be a better, biggerchance of them fighting I agree,
you know what I mean over thereyou're midwest, you get like

(36:56):
one property can have a bunch offreaking four-year-olds, you
know, I mean, or five-year-oldsand six-year-olds, that, and all
really big deer, where that bigguy, yeah, he doesn't like, he
doesn't have to worry because heknows he's the biggest, baddest
thing.
You know.
The other little bucks, likelike that eight ran, just ran
away because you know where youyou might not get that you know,
um, and then also I wonder ifand I know the midwest has a lot

(37:21):
of coyotes, but right nowjersey has a ridiculous amount
of coyotes and also at the endday and I know I've seen bears
interact with deer and on thecamera honestly and eat together
.
It's, it's absolutely wild,yeah, but at the end of the day
I wonder how much really nottrying to be vocal because of

(37:43):
bears, because of coyotes,because maybe even the Bobcat
population is is on a rise in inNorthern.

Speaker 1 (37:49):
New Jersey, you know, versus and.

Speaker 2 (37:52):
I know people are like oh well, yeah, they have
some of that in the Midwest.
Which 100 percent they do.
I still think you look at howtightly close everything is here
in New Jersey, because we're asmall state.
Every little thing matters andif you're too vocal you could
get a pack on you real quick.

Speaker 3 (38:15):
Yeah, no, I definitely agree with that.
And you know you're talkingabout the coyote situation.
Like I think even in the shorttime that I've been hunting,
like it's gotten.
It's gotten a lot worse.
Like I used to hear some, someyips, you know, when I was out
there.
Now I got I hear whole packsjust howling away while I'm out
there and I'm like that's a lotof coyotes, you know, like they
like one, two, three, four,that's like five, six, seven,

(38:39):
eight.
You know what.
I mean Like running, running asa pack.
You know, I was actually ableto shoot one with my bow this
this past.
I guess it was October, it wasin October.
It was like a, so I was, I washappy about that.
It was my first one.
So, yeah, it was like a, so Iwas, I was happy about that was
my first one, so yeah it waslike last light, I could barely
see my pin, you know, and uh, soI was like I'm just gonna let

(39:02):
it ride and see.
But you know, the problem iswith the coyotes and you, you
guys know this too is like.
You know, shooting one is likedoesn't, doesn't do anything.
There's, there's so many ofthem and they, they populate so
so fast that it's uh, it's tough.
And and going back to um, youknow the skewed deer numbers in
new jersey.
You know it's funny.
Like I, I two, two thoughts onthat too is like.

(39:25):
You know, people who don't huntare funny, right, they're like,
oh, come to my backyard.
Like there's 20 deer in mybackyard every night yeah, I get
that all right, you get thatall the time as a hunter,
especially new jersey, right,but I think it it tells us
something, though.
Right, like all the deer are inthe wrong places in new jersey,
because you can sit you know,you can sit on, you know, the
mountaintop or or whatever, andand, like we were saying, not

(39:47):
see a deer, like bring somebodyout there and not see deer deer
one, two, three days, you knowwhat I mean whereas all the deer
are living in these suburbs, uhand and you can't, you can't
hunt them, you know, becauseeverything's so, so close
together, so the deer numbersare really skewed and, um, I
think that's going to probablystay that way.
Unless you know they, theystart trying to take it serious

(40:11):
and I don't know.
Me personally, I feel like weshould go to a two buck state
yeah, you know, I think yeah, Ithink it should be one bow, one
gun, like like a lot of otherstates like two bow or whatever
too right or two yeah, two bucks, basically two bucks, state.
I know some guys like me, likeyou know, some guys like to
shoot guns, some guys like to dobow only some guys like to do

(40:33):
bow only, some guys like to doboth.
You know, I feel like you shouldbe able to pick and um and like
.
For most places you couldprobably still do unlimited
dough.
I mean, there's so many doughsaround, uh, it's crazy.
But if not unlimited, then thena higher number of those, and
that will actually change.
You know, like you're saying,it'll change the hierarchy,

(40:53):
right, because now if I can onlytake two deer, right, two bucks
, I'm saying, then there's achance for these young bucks to
get, to get some age on them, tosmarten up, get off that corn
pile and and and get some someage on them.
And if we bring the doepopulation down, the, the bucks

(41:14):
are more willing to, to, to,like we said, to fight, to rut,
to run around and and and try tofind those, try to find those
does.
So I don't, you know, I don't,I don't know if they're actually
ever going to change that Cause.
I think I don't know.

Speaker 2 (41:29):
It's an insurance thing from from what I always
hear is it's a lot for theinsurance companies because in
these residential areas there'sall there's people always
hitting deer.
So, and and I I understand to avery small degree, right, and
obviously, like us being hunters, we actually see like, yeah,

(41:53):
I've seen such a declineactually in population with with
deer, um and and when I say adecline, that's not saying we
still don't have a freakishlyamount like big amount of deer.
But compared to, you know,public land that I'm allowed to

(42:13):
hunt versus across even like afive minute drive into a
residential area, it is a nightand day difference.
But also, the bucks know thatas well, and I've experienced a
lot too.
Not only do they know that like, oh, they don't really have to
fight over it, they will leavepublic land and they will go
into those private.

(42:35):
So you also have to use that toyour advantage, and I tried
doing that two years ago, usingit to my advantage of, I think,
how to be somewhere on that linewhere they're going to be
coming from public land andgoing across to meet on private.
That's smart yeah.
And then and then coming backand vice versa.

(42:56):
You'll have.
Does that come from the private?
Because they don't knowboundaries like that?
But they'll come from theprivate and they'll come into
state land and you got to kindof cut them off.
As much as I sometimes don'tlike hunting that close and
everything like that, Sometimesthat's what you got to do,
especially during that rut time,if the doe number isn't high on

(43:18):
your public land, you have tofind those bordering areas of
private where there's a roadright there, where they're just
going to be going right acrossthe road, where there is going
to be a high number of does onon private, because that's where
they're going to want to be.
They know where.
They know where the deer are.
I've seen it with my own eyes.
The buck that I killed thisyear.

(43:38):
I'm pretty sure he was fightingone of the other big boys
across the road, because I canhear fighting early in the
morning.
I think it was a death type offight that we're talking about.

Speaker 3 (43:58):
You can hear it though.

Speaker 2 (44:00):
It was a spar.
When he came in, it wasn't likehe was.
He didn't look injured, nothingwas hair wasn't gone, nothing
like that.
No cuts, no, nothing like that.
But you can hear the spar.
But it wasn't yeah, it's, andI'm pretty sure if he came
across in private.
If not, it was somewhere closeto private where he was able to

(44:23):
just come where I was and gaveme a great shot.
But New Jersey, unfortunately.
Look what they just did.
We were going to be at sevendeer, I know, yeah, I really
thought they were going to gothe opposite way.

Speaker 1 (44:35):
I was hoping did.

Speaker 3 (44:35):
We were going to be at seven deer, I know, yeah, I
really thought they were goingto go the opposite way.
I was hoping and praying it wasgoing to be the opposite thing
and I was like, oh, now there'sfour, I think.

Speaker 2 (44:43):
Unfortunately and I really don't want to say it's, I
don't really think it's the bowhunters.
I think like there was a goodamount of people that said that
it should either stay the sameor drop down, and I think that
was a lot of bow hunters and Idon't want people to get upset
and everything like that, but Ithink a lot of gun hunters.

(45:06):
They really don't care,obviously when you're going out
for 6 day Listen when you go outfor 6 day.
There's only one thing on yourmind Kill 2 bucks.
It doesn't matter what, becauseyou have the, you have the buck
tags.
Like I, I get it where ourstate allows it.
They allow this to happen.
I don't blame people who like,oh listen, I'm just going out to
kill a buck.

(45:26):
I don't blame you because ourstate this is what our state
allows, so you're going tolisten?
Shit, I'll do it.
And I've been in that position.
I'm like damn you know what,let me go have fun for six days.
I'll walk around with a gun andwhatever comes out, I'm not
looking for a big buck.

Speaker 3 (45:42):
Right and like you said it's all about what you
want to do, right, and I saidthat before, I feel like
personally, like if it gets you,if it gets your heart racing

(46:02):
and it's what you want, it makesyou happy, I say, go for it.
And, like you said, as long asyou're within your legal right
to to, to harvest that buck, uh,like I'm, I'm all about it, me,
just me personally, like, likewe said, like, or I was saying
before, I like to, to kind oflike, grow into it, right, me
personally, like yeah it justdoesn't.
It just doesn't do it for meanymore.
You know so, and I think, if weever, I think think you know
what drives me crazy and mycousin and I, we talk about this
all the time is that, like, thegenetic potential is here to
have very big deer, to have very, very big deer.

(46:25):
We have.
You know they call Jersey thegarden state, right, like we
have fertile soil, you knowthere's, there's an abundance of
food here, even in themountains, like egg corns.
You know, browse, there's,there's, there's, there's an
abundance of food here, even inthe mountains, like eggorns.
You know, browse, there's,there's, there's an abundance of
food.
They just need to get the yearson them.
And I think, like we've beensaying, it's just, it's just
tough if, if you get to takeseven bucks.

Speaker 1 (46:48):
Yeah, and I think a lot of people like going back to
, like the gun season.
I think a lot of people'smentality, mentality too, is
that that, like I've talked toor experienced in the past, it's
they go in there and they say,if I don't shoot this buck, the
other guy will next to me, right, so that's another.
You know another thing that'salways on the table and back of

(47:10):
people hey, it's happened to me.

Speaker 3 (47:12):
It's, it's happened to me.

Speaker 1 (47:14):
It's happened to me yeah it happened to me too.

Speaker 2 (47:17):
I don't know if you were a part of the team yet,
frank, but I think a coupleyears ago, yeah, a couple years
ago.
I'm out hunting and I'm afterthese two big, a 10 and an 8
pointer, and this little, youknow little 6 pointer comes in,
probably a 2-year old deer,really small guy.
I'm sitting there and I'mfilming him, whatever.

(47:39):
He's giving me a show and I'mI'm happy, and then all of a
sudden he heads up the ridge.
I'm watching him, I guess he hegoes and he finds a corn pile
which I I didn't see.
This was like my first time,like first or second time being
in the spot and all of a suddenyou hear a whop and the deer

(48:01):
just runs off and I'm just like.
I was just like, oh my god,like I passed him.
Obviously that didn't get megoing, but like he's gonna be a
good, he's gonna be a good deerin like a couple years.
You know what I mean, this isgonna be a good buck, you know.
So I was like know what I mean,this is going to be a good buck
.
So I was like, all right, myhunt's done, whatever I get down
, and I go meet the guy.

(48:22):
And I told him straight upcongratulations.
Like hey, listen, I'm not goingto say anything Like that's
what guy.
And he said it, he goes.
My heart started pumping and hegoes.
I shot it.
That's what guy.
And he said he goes.
He goes.

Speaker 3 (48:35):
My heart started pumping and he goes.

Speaker 2 (48:36):
I shot it and I go I go there, you go, I go, then
that's all that matters and I gocongratulations, you know, we
talked, whatever and everythinglike that, and I was like you
know that that's, that's funny.
You know, I've never had thathappen literally sit there
watching a buck pass him and hegoes up and literally gets shot
and then, like the next week ortwo it happened to um, I think
it, it happened to American Mike, where he was watching a deer
passed it and then somebody elsejust shot it.

Speaker 3 (48:58):
See, that's crazy.
That's crazy.
It happens, man.
I, you know it's funny I got adeer on my in my sights for next
year and he's a six and, likeyou know, he's nothing, nothing
crazy, but he's got like thesetall G1s now and for two years
now he's broken off one of thesides of his antlers.

(49:19):
So I feel like it's saved himbecause they, you know, each
year he's broken off the sides.
So people, if they do see them,you know probably going to pass
him, and so I'll be excited tosee what he, what he, what he
does.
This year.
I'm hoping that he'll be.
I think he'll be four, you know, for my trail camera, you know

(49:40):
data, so I'm thinking he mightmake a big jump, even if he
stays at six.
You know what I mean A big sixsomething about a big six.

Speaker 2 (49:47):
I love big, everyone loves big sixes, absolutely.

Speaker 1 (49:51):
I got a few on my wall Now.
Um, where you hunt, is that?
Is that private land or is itstate land?
Like, how's the huntingpressure over there?

Speaker 3 (49:58):
So there it's like a mix.
So around by where my parentslive there's, uh, they have a
little bit of private land, um,it's about 15 acres, um, so it's
really it's not bad.
During the rut there's somefamily of does that beds, that
lives basically kind of stays onthe property.

(50:19):
Obviously they don't stay thereall the time, but they do bed
in that property a lot.
And well, some mature bucks,usually around the first week of
November and the very last weekof November they seem to run to
run through there.
Now there's only there's notreally a lot of cover, it's not.
It's like old forest, you knowwhat I mean.

(50:41):
So it's uh kind of the.
The understory is very open,you know.
So, um, there's it's very hardto get bucks to go through there
during the day, unless it'slike the, you know, unless the
rut is like on Um.
It's like the, you know, unlessthe rut is like on Um.
But this deer I got, uh, thisyear was actually on, on, on on
public land, so, but thepressure wasn't too too bad.

(51:01):
So, um, I think there was.
There was another guy whoactually messaged me afterwards
saying that he had, you know, hehad had trail cameras of him,
um, for the past two years.
And you know, at first he waslike, oh, is this the deer?
And I was like, I don't, Idon't think that's him.
And then he showed me anotherpicture and I was like, oh man,
I'm sorry that's, that'sdefinitely you know I, because

(51:24):
that you know, that's happenedto me before too like I, uh, uh.
Two years ago I think it wasabout two years ago I was on a
nice 10 man.

Speaker 2 (51:33):
I was like no-transcript like we know damn

(52:06):
it.
We just know, yeah, there's nottoo many deer walking around
this area looking like that.
All right, that that's yeah, Iknow that's the deer, but that
was a heartbreaker man.

Speaker 3 (52:15):
You know that was, that was a heartbreaker.
It sucks, you know.
I was happy for the guy, but uh, I'd be lying to say it didn't.
It sucked, you know yeah,that's.

Speaker 1 (52:24):
Let me ask some.
Did you, uh, did you send thefood back?

Speaker 3 (52:31):
I ate it, man.
I was.
Uh, that was a.
That was a miserable dinner,though I'll tell you that.
That was the first time that hadhappened to me, you know, and
my cousin you know, he alwaystold me he's like listen, man,
he's like, if you have a pictureof a deer in New Jersey,
somebody else has a picture ofthat deer too, you know.

(52:52):
And he's like, and I was like,no, I don't you know.
And he's like, and I was like,no, I don't, you know, I don't
think so, you know, I don'tthink I, I think I would have
heard about this theory, youknow.
And he's like trust me, man,somebody else has got a picture
of that deer I have found thatto be true.
I have definitely found that tobe true.
Um, you know, you don't think alot of people are are hunting.
I mean, you know, I could onlysay, say from where I am up in

(53:14):
North Jersey, you don't?
I mean I see people hunting,don't get me wrong, but you
don't feel like there's somebodyaround every corner.
But there is there is there is?

Speaker 1 (53:25):
Yeah, because I learned that this past season
too, I end up shooting like oneof the big nines we had on our
place on my buddy's farm and Iend up shooting them during six
days, like the last morning, andI'm sitting there, I'm taking
pictures with them and I onlyhad, like myself, I only had

(53:46):
like two or three trail campictures of this deer, that's it
, and I put and you know, afterI do all the posts, I I same
thing.
I get a message from a guy.
He goes hey, I know that deer,I know exactly what road that
that deer was on.

Speaker 3 (54:02):
I was like yeah, there it is yeah okay, yeah it's
, it's funny, but you know, itdoes show you too, like, how
much these deer travel to I.
You know, I in New Jersey, Ifeel like again, I'm talking
about Northern New Jersey, it'skind of like PA and and I've
seen you're talking aboutupstate New York.
You know, they're definitely alittle bit more nomadic.

(54:24):
They're a little bit more, andwhen I mean nomadic I don't mean
that they stay, they they're.
They're more of a spread outLike.
So the bucks that I usually geton camera, um, they're almost
like on a two-week cycle.
You know what I mean two-weekcycle where, like or or a week
week cycle where, like you know,I'll get a picture of them and
then it'll be a week, maybe eventwo weeks, then I'll get

(54:44):
another picture of them.
You know, and it's like they'renot, you know, and for a long
for, and I've been trying tofigure out buck betting in in
hill country for a long time,and I think the Midwest is
different right and I keep, youknow, I was thinking like, all
right, there's one bed, rightthat this buck is at, because in

(55:07):
the Midwest that's kind of whathappens, because everything's
either ag land or this littlelot of woods.
You know what I mean, but whereI'm hunting that's not the case
.
They have several beds, theyhave several areas spread out
across a couple of miles wherethey feel comfortable, you know.
And uh, to me, me, I, and Ifeel like you know, it's kind of

(55:29):
, I mean, you might get luckyand find out where they're
betting, but it's tough.
I think it's tough, like mygeneral go-to, which has worked
the past two seasons, is usingrut funnels, is using funnels,
using finding terrain.

(55:50):
I use Onyx and I find terrainwhere, more than where, where
more than one or, you know, morethan two or three trails are
coming.
They have to come together.
So this spot where, where Ishot the deer out of, I shot the
deer this year and last year atbasically the same spot, not
the same exact tree, but within20 yards of each other, and it's

(56:13):
where, like you know, theridgeline goes like this, so
across, and then there's, Iguess, like you would call it, a
little creek that kind of goesdown down the mountain, like
there's not always water on it,but during the winter, when the
leaves are down, it's a, it's asmall stream right, so across.
So it almost makes like this,this, this cross between those
two, two, two landscapes, andit's where four different trails

(56:37):
, game trails, can converge.
So you know, your odds are aremuch higher to to see game
because of just the way the, theland is laid out and um, and
bucks are, they got to travel.
They got to travel throughthere eventually.
I'm not saying you're going tobe there on the right day, but
there's going to be a day duringthe rut where bucks are or

(56:57):
traveling through through thatarea, you know so.

Speaker 2 (57:01):
I think that's what makes New Jersey so great and
why.
I don't know how people don't.
I mean I get why, but why therehas to be a little more respect
on New Jersey.
You know name and is because wehave that.
You look at North and SouthJersey.
You can't compare the two, youcannot.

(57:22):
Everything is just so different.
The behavior of the deer are sodifferent.
You know what I mean Both ofthem and I hunt both.
I hunt both north jersey and Ihunt a little more south.
They're both like, yeah, northjersey it's tough but it's fun,
like I love it they're.

(57:43):
They're the different challengeto it, you know.
And then you go to south jerseywhere I think it's a little it's
easier to get on big bucks butit's hard to kill big bucks just
because you're in those agfields, right, and at the end of
the day they have so much spaceright you know what I mean and
it's you have these smallerplots of wood and if you have

(58:07):
another hunter there, it's notenough room, like it is up in
north jersey like listen you canand I'll give you know, like
blairstown, for example, becauseI hunt.
I hunt blairstown.
You know I've done it so manytimes and you know I have a
property like I didn't have toreally worry about other because

(58:28):
you know what.
I could just keep going right,look at all the land.
Look at the delaware gap.
You're right by the del Gap,like up there.
You can keep going.
There's so much land in NorthJersey that you could just keep
going.

Speaker 3 (58:43):
The trick, I think yeah, I totally agree.
But the trick is, I think, ishaving faith in your spot and
sitting it out.
You know, and sometimes that'stough because, like we were
talking about, like you know,you don't see a deer all day and
you're like I don't, I don'tget what's going on you know, I
don't get what's going on Likethis is the spot, this should be
the spot.

(59:03):
You know, and even if you'vebeen doing this for for a long
time, you know when you go, ohfor for nothing, for mean, maybe
I should move, and I thinkthat's something that you know
takes definitely takes some time, like I I always uh and
questioning myself with that and, uh, you know, I got, I got.

(59:25):
I feel like I got lucky because, like I said, I looked at that
trail, can I decided to go takea look at that trail camera and
he was literally in the area theday before.
So it's like you know, I had alot of faith that he was
probably still in the area, youknow, cause there's more than
one doe there, and usually doefamilies come in to breed around
the same time, so I figured hewas probably going to be in this

(59:45):
area for a few days.

Speaker 1 (59:48):
So when you get a little sliver of information
like that to give you a littlebit of faith in your spot,
really it really helps yeah, no,I agree because and that's
actually a good point because,um, one of the big nine pointers
that I killed on the wall, samething.
I had him patterned all summerlong.
I knew exactly what he wasdoing, so I got my doe out of

(01:00:10):
the way and the spot he shouldbe in that.
I always watched him come outall the time to this one alfalfa
field.
I hunted it.
I'm like no bullshit.
A week straight before I shothim and I'm like there you go.
And literally it was like everyday.
I'm like like where the helldid he go?

(01:00:30):
Oh, this is textbook.
Like now he's gone.
Like he disappeared, he'ssomewhere else.
Now I gotta start all overAgain.
And then it was just One day Ijust happened to go.
I still remember it was like Ithink it was, uh, september 19th
and it was like, uh, I think itwas like 15 or 20 minutes
before dark, I watched this bigSix jump a fence and, believe it

(01:00:55):
or not, I was contemplating onShooting him.
He was only like he was like 15.
This big six jump offense and,believe it or not, I was
contemplating on shooting him.
He was only like he was like 15yards and I was like, oh man.
And all of a sudden I justhappened to look and here he
comes, he jumps, he jumps thefence, just like that, just like
that six did.
So I was like, all right, likehe's coming.
So I was, I was, I got allready and I could hear him

(01:01:16):
coming through the hedgerow.
I can't remember.
He's taking his time.
I see his head coming, myheart's pumping, I'm shaking.
I go to draw back.
As soon as he hits the field,he like starts sprinting.
He sprinted to like 30 yards inlike two seconds oh geez and
I'm like nervous.
I 30 yards in like two secondsoh geez and I'm like nervous.

Speaker 3 (01:01:40):
I'm like that that you know trying doing everything
, I tend to stop them stop.

Speaker 1 (01:01:42):
Yeah, and he finally stopped and I ended up, you know
, put, you know, getting anarrow through him.
But I mean it just goes to showyou, I mean having faith in
your spot, like I, I do believein it because I, like I had that
feeling.
I was like if I stop hunting it, he's going to show up right
right so I'm like I I gotta atleast try for the week, even

(01:02:02):
though it's tough, but it'sdefinitely not easy.

Speaker 3 (01:02:06):
It's definitely not easy.
But I've moved around beforeand you wind up just chasing
your tail.
You know you wind up, you'reyou're like one step behind them
or one step in front of them,which both are bad.
It's not the right day.
It's not the right day.
So do you guys get a lot ofyour bucks early season or
during the raw or late season?

(01:02:27):
What do you guys usually or isit kind of a mix?

Speaker 1 (01:02:31):
I'll let you go first Frank.
Yeah, usually for me it'susually towards the later part
of the season.
I mean, I have gotten luckyduring early season, like when I
shot that big nine and stuff,but most of the time it's
usually like either late octoberlike until like mid, like
mid-november usually like thattime frame is usually when I
usually have more success okay,I would, for for me it depends

(01:02:55):
where, where I'm hunting um, youknow, I've I've had success
early up in northern new jersey.

Speaker 2 (01:03:01):
I've had success later into into the rut.
But I will definitely say, likewe're talking about earlier,
with the rut there it's reallywishy-washy, you know, because
of the doe number um, and itjust feels like once the doughs
start really getting in heat youcan't really find the bucks, or
they're on private Yep Down inwhere I was, southern Jersey,

(01:03:26):
first of all, the big, bigmonsters are all there from the
summer until like October and IFrank knows this like Halloween
was the last time I saw one ofmy giants like, and then it was
nothing until I killed my buck,november.

(01:03:46):
When the hell did I kill thisyear?
november 19th remember yeah,november 19th, yeah, and really
wasn't seeing much for buck withlike only small bucks.
And the day before where himand another big eight or ten
pointer came into the camera andthey're chasing does and that's
like I got.

(01:04:07):
I got.
It was like put in the workcameras, boom right, saddle spot
, jumped right in there rightafter like an hour after that
that trail camera, because I wasin a completely different spot
like I was like 600.
I was like 600 yards in theopposite direction and I worked
myself completely around.
But um, yeah, it's I.

(01:04:30):
That's the focus for southjersey this year and where I am
is going to be early, early inthe year, yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:04:38):
I'm trying to get better at the early season, for
sure.
I think it's again like I havesome trouble with trying to,
like everyone's like, get on thefood sources right.
Food sources food sources, butwhen you're in big woods, the
food sources are everywhere.

Speaker 2 (01:04:53):
Every ridge is an oak ridge.

Speaker 1 (01:04:55):
There's acorns everywhere, I literally live in
Oak Ridge.

Speaker 3 (01:04:59):

Speaker 1 (01:05:00):
All right, I live up the Wantage, so I'm not too far
from you, yeah yeah, so everyridge is an oak ridge.

Speaker 3 (01:05:06):
You know what I?

Speaker 1 (01:05:06):
mean.

Speaker 3 (01:05:06):
There's oaks everywhere.
In my experience I've baitedbefore and I still will in some
areas, but I just don't, I justdon't get mature bucks coming
there during the day and Ithat's just been my experience,
like through the rut it'll,it'll, it'll happen randomly.
I think they're just going thereto check to see if those those

(01:05:28):
are there really, but most ofthe time, if, if, uh, it's a
bait pile, from my experience,it's just you're getting them in
the middle of the night yeah,no, I agree because, like I mean
, last year was the first year,like I got, you know, a private
property and I was baiting lastyear.

Speaker 1 (01:05:44):
Last year was the first time and, believe it or
not, I had bucks in thereconstantly and like mature bucks
, like mike knows this.
So one day I was at work andthis big 10 pointer that I was
watching showed up.
I think it was like at likeseven or eight o'clock in the
morning and I told Mike, Itexted him and I said I'm
leaving work now because I knowthat that buck's going to be

(01:06:06):
back tonight, a hundred percent.
I got in there early, left work, got up in there.
Sure, shit enough, here hecomes, he's coming, and actually
he, he caught me off guardbecause I was in the saddle and
expecting him to come from, uh,my right, and all of a sudden I
hear something.

(01:06:26):
I hear like, um, I think whatthat was.
Oh, it was a squirrel.
I heard a squirrel run and Iheard like a deer jump and I
look over and he's standing likeprobably like 15 yards from me,
to my left.
So I'm like, oh shit.
So like I go and I like mybow's hanging up, so like I grab

(01:06:50):
it, he, he actually does acomplete circle and when he does
the complete circle he's comingback.
And he didn't.
He didn't see me, but I drewback on him and I'm waiting for
him to actually turn broadside,because he was quartering to me
a little bit and he just, hejust stood there like me and him

(01:07:12):
locked eyes for, like it seemedlike an hour that's the worst
I'm trying not to look them inthe eyes, you know, I'm like I'm
sitting there, I'm like justjust please turn, please turn.
And what I thought was he.
I thought he turned.
What happened is because, likeum, mike saw the video and
actually I'll send it to youafter this podcast.

(01:07:34):
Okay, he just moves his head,like his upper body, his, his
chest, and everything stays thesame.
He just moves his head in hisneck to look like the other
direction.
I don't know if he heardsomething, but in my peripherals
, like I thought he had and Ireleased, and it was like the
same same thing to your story Ihit him smack dead in the

(01:07:56):
shoulder.
He does, he does a back flip,he flips over, he's on the
ground that he gets up and hetakes off and the arrow sticking
out of him, and it was.
It was like you said.
I think it was like I didn'tget him back on camera for like
a month and a half probablyafter I shot them.

Speaker 2 (01:08:15):
But I think, like depends where you're hunting.
I think one of the big thingsis learning your bucks and their
behavior and what they like andand I get it.
We're in it.
We're in a state where everyonebaits, almost everybody baits,
yeah, like I.
I read like I've.
It's something that I've alwaystried to get away from and this

(01:08:37):
year I did a really phenomenaljob like getting away from it.
I didn't.
Yeah, I did two last yearsingle animal over bait this
year.
Now do I use it and do I use itstill?
Yeah, like I'll use, especiallyfor for trail cam right trail
cameras everything like that andeverything like that.
I shot my doe and um with agiant right on giant acorn tree,

(01:09:01):
just like dropping.
I had a big nine and a big tenthere the first day that I that
I found them, they, they cameright in and was it white oaks?

Speaker 3 (01:09:10):
or was it white oaks that were dropped?

Speaker 2 (01:09:11):
no, it wasn't white.
Um, no, it wasn't white.
Um, I can't remember what, andI just said I can never.
Every time I find a tree, it'snever freaking white oak yeah
they're a little rare aroundhere, yeah yeah um, so you know
it, it was, it was a highway andthey were just, they were, they

(01:09:32):
were hitting it.
And then you know, fast forward.
I killed buck during, during arut and everything like that.
But you know you, sometimes youjust have to do it because, at
the end of the day, you can doeverything in your power not to,
but almost every other hunteris going to?
I mean one of the guys thatkilled that 10 pointer that I

(01:09:52):
saw.
He I think he was told that the10 pointer over bait and was
dropping, like I think, two bagsof of corn at a like at a time.
So, like you're, you arecompeting with people that
aren't, that are beating.
So, listen, sometimes, likewhat are you going to just shoot

(01:10:13):
yourself in the foot, andthat's what you know.
If I find acorns like that,listen, I'm just going to just
shoot yourself in the foot andthat's what you know.
If I find acorns like that,listen, I'm just going to stick
to the acorns and I don't even,you know, I'm not going to even
bring you know anything likethat.
You know hunting cornfields, youknow ag fields, like everything
like that, like that's.
I love doing it, you know.
But you have to know your deer.
You have to know how they'renot going to hit that corn pile

(01:10:36):
or they're only going to hitthat corn pile at night, or the
deer which you talk to, a lot ofjersey hunters it's like the
minute they see corn, they juststart looking up in the tree.
Yeah, it's smart yeah, yeah it's, it's crazy that like, but it's
, it's a thing, that it's areality, that anyone coming here
to hunt has to understand.

(01:10:57):
Like that's what you're goingto be competing with, especially
if you're hunting on public oreven the most experienced people
.
I see guys all the time thatcomplain oh here's another corn
pie.
I'm like, well, it's legal inNew Jersey, so listen.
It doesn't matter.

Speaker 3 (01:11:13):
To me.
I look at it like if you wantto shoot a small buck, if it
makes you happy, it makes youhappy.
If you like hunting over baitand it makes you happy, then
then then go for it.
And, like I said, I'm notagainst it.
I've done it.
I still do do it.
Um, you know, I, I'm gettingmore and more away from it
because it's just like I feelmore.
It feels more rewarding to mewhen I'm like putting in the

(01:11:35):
work and, um, you know, I'm like, you know I find a trail, game
trail, it looks, it looks good.
You know, like I know I'msaying, okay, well they're,
they're probably betting up hereand I think they're feeding
down here.
If I come here and intersectthem and like, and when it a lot
of times it doesn't work outRight, but when it does work out
, you're like, damn, I'm, I amactually a hunter.

Speaker 1 (01:11:57):
You're like damn, I'm good.

Speaker 3 (01:12:01):
You know most of the time it doesn't work out, but
when it does work out, you knowit's great, but but like you
said, um, I think it's stillgreat for for Intel.
Like I was saying, that a smallprivate property that, um, that
my parents uh own, um, that's,that's basically what I use it
for.
I I just use it for Intel.

(01:12:21):
Like, I know the bucks aren'tgoing to be there during the day
, but I'll know what bucks arein the area.
Uh, based on, you know, acouple of months worth of trail
cameras for for being in thecorner, or mineral blocks.
I go back and forth.
There's so many goddamn bearsthat uh one is like 13 a bag,
now, you know.
So it's just like I.
You know it's expensive.

(01:12:43):
I mean, if you're dropping twobags at a time, you know, and
it's just like it's lasting aweek, you know like it's, you're
spending a lot of money, youknow you're spending a lot of
money.
So I I for me where, where I'mat, I noticed the bears kind of
mess with the mineral blocksless and yeah, you get less
pictures but they still comearound.
You know what I mean like.

Speaker 2 (01:13:02):
So such a such a northern new jersey problem is
bear.
Listen, I'll tell you, goingdown hunting now, an area that I
don't like.
You don't have to worry aboutthat, like I've yet to see a
bear, it's more Southern, solike there really is, there's
like it is nice, like.

(01:13:22):
I will actually say like and thedeer behavior definitely is
different than it is in North umNorthern Jersey and the coyote
pressure isn't.
There isn't as many coyoteslike up being up and hunting in
Northern Jersey anywhere fromanywhere.
The zones that I hunt inNorthern Jersey, like you hear
coyotes like, like you'retalking about before, like six,

(01:13:44):
seven, eight, like.
From the minute the sun startsto go down, they just start
going crazy.
The whole woods erupt, erupts.

Speaker 1 (01:13:52):
I didn't hear that one down in.
It shows up.
Yeah, absolutely, especiallywhen you're walking in the dark
and they start it up.

Speaker 3 (01:14:03):
You know, my thinking is right.
If there's one or two like I'mprobably going to be fine, but
if there's?

Speaker 1 (01:14:06):
like eight.

Speaker 3 (01:14:07):
You know what I mean that might be an issue, you know
, yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:14:09):
I had guys tell me that like hey, like, hey, man,
like I was walking in you, hey,man, like I was walking in you.
Know, I heard all of them.
I turned around, went rightback to my truck, like if I hear
that many, I'm not going.

Speaker 3 (01:14:21):
You know, the reason the bears drive me crazy is
because they don't just come tothe pile and eat and be on their
way.
They sit there and lay down.
They'll be there all day andall night.

Speaker 2 (01:14:34):
Yeah, it's easy to eat it.

Speaker 3 (01:14:36):
Yeah, it just drives you nuts.
So I'm I'm at the point whereit's just like I usually, just
like right now, like at thatspot, like I just got a mineral
block, like they come and go,you know yeah, because I know
once, once a mama font withtheir cubs comes, you know soon
soon, you know, like that'll,that'll be the end of it, you
know so yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:14:55):
now I want to ask you real quick, joe.
So how was your transitionCause you said you start saddle
hunting this year.
How was your cause?
Me too, this was actually myfirst year too.
How did you, how was thetransition from that, from going
to a regular tree stand, to thesaddle?

Speaker 3 (01:15:10):
You know I was.
I was a little, I was a littleworried at first and then more
and more people like I'mlistening to podcasts, like
everybody does now, and more andmore people are like you got to
try the saddle.
You got to try the saddle and Ijust wanted to be more mobile,
right, which is what everybodysays and it's the truth Because

(01:15:38):
I had stands hang on stands, butthey weren't what I would call
like micro light hang on standsbecause, like I said, I really
don't like heights and thosemicro, small stands like they.
They freak me out.
Man like I, I hate them.
I feel like I'm about to fallout of the tree, like at any
moment, you know.
So the the hang on stands I waslugging around were were pretty
big and, and, to be, I was notvery mobile with them.

(01:15:59):
So instead of, like you know,putting them up and taking them
down, I was putting one up,putting another one up.
And you know, and like you,just you know, if I, if I was
doing that, I would have neverkilled that deer this November,
because, you know, I wouldn'thave been able to move my setup
the way I did.
It's funny, and I don't know ifyou feel this way too, but

(01:16:21):
actually in the saddle I feelmore secure.
I actually feel more securebecause I have that constant
pressure on me.

Speaker 1 (01:16:29):
Yep.

Speaker 3 (01:16:30):
Yeah, having that constant pressure on me is, I
guess, subconsciously reassuringthat, like something has me you
know, so it's like funny Causemost people are like, oh, you're
afraid of heights, but yourather be hanging off a saddle
and I'm like I know it soundsweird, but it actually does feel
feel better, you know.
So, like you said, I uh.
So, like you asked, Itransitioned by using that.

(01:16:52):
Um, that combo that, uh, xopwas was selling because it
wasn't too expensive, because,like with anything in hunting,
you know, like you, you canspend a fortune, you know, you
can spend a fortune.
I didn't know whether I wasgoing to like it or not, um, but
I wound up.
I wound up really liking it.
Like I said, I feel more securein it.
You can move around the tree alot easier, you're?

(01:17:14):
I feel like you're able to makemore shots if you practice, you
know.
But I guess it's the same withthe hang on stand too, like one
of the things I tell myself,because you know you forget, or
whatever is.
You know, practice pulling backyour bow at every angle on the
tree.
Like some people, sometimes Iget in there and I'm like, yeah,

(01:17:36):
I pull it back once and I'mlike, oh, it's good, you know.
But like you know, they're,they, you might have the right
tree but, like you know, veryrarely do you have the right
tree and the right angle thatthe deer is coming in on, you
know, you know.
So you're going to have toprobably shoot at, at, at a
weird direction uh, more or adirection differently than what

(01:17:57):
you're thinking about and, uh, Ithink, with with the saddle,
it's definitely, uh, definitely,a little easier.
So, yeah, I'm glad I made thetransition.
I think I'm gonna, I'm gonnastick with that.
I I do have, you know, somestands still set up that have
been set up um.
But you know, I think for forfor mobile hunting, I mean it
just, it doesn't really get muchbetter.
But but how did mobile hunting?
I mean it just, it just didn'treally get much better.

(01:18:17):
But but how did, how did you doit?

Speaker 1 (01:18:20):
so it was basically the same thing.
So, like I always mainly uselock-ons, like I would have
ladders every now and then for,like, gun season or something,
but other than that I was alwayslike a lock-on guy.
So I actually I got in thesaddle from listening and
talking to mike before I was amember I used to listen to talk

(01:18:40):
I was like man, like everybody'stalking about the saddle, like
I want to try it.
So, you know, I think my wifeended up messaging Mike and
cause she was going to buy me asaddle for um for Christmas.
So she got me the trophy linelike covert pro, okay, me the
the trophy line like covert pro,okay, and I still have that.
And then, um, I went up to theum, the great american outdoors
show and I bought, uh, thearsenal platform with the sticks

(01:19:04):
, which you know wasn't thatcheap, you know.
But uh, you know that's whatI've been running and like I
love that I was practicing inthe backyard, I like as much as
I could, trying to trying tolearn how to shoot, like on my
weak side, on this side, youknow so, but I'll never go back,
but it was almost like, likeyou said, like I remember I use

(01:19:26):
a saddle for most, like 98% ofthe time.
I was in the saddle last year.

Speaker 3 (01:19:32):
Right, me too yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:19:33):
I went, I think, one time.
Uh, I got out of work and I waslike I like I don't feel like
climbing the tree, like I'lljust go to my lock on, because I
had a lock on over there and I,I think I remember telling mike
it was like the mostuncomfortable feeling I've ever
been and I used to live in thosethings.
Right, I got up there.
I felt when I would get up Iwould feel like dizzy from

(01:19:55):
sitting down because I felt likeI was gonna fall and I would
always like catch myself and Iwas like I'm like if a deer
comes, I don't know how I'mgonna pull this off I feel the
exact same way.

Speaker 3 (01:20:07):
I think I.
I just to me it was definitely,uh, just just funny, because I
thought it was gonna be theopposite.
I thought it was yeah, for sure, and uh, but it definitely
feels better actually, yeah,absolutely it's the way to go.

Speaker 2 (01:20:21):
It's by far.
The I'm not gonna say like it'snot perfect, like that does
have its issues, but they'reeverything.

Speaker 3 (01:20:30):
It has has something that you could say negative, I
mean I won't say it's the mostcomfortable thing, always right,
like you know it's always andthat depends on the tree and how
you set it up, how high.
But I just adjust, like you knowwhat I mean.
So like, if I'm starting to getuncomfortable, I'll lower my
set a little bit.
If I'm getting uncomfortablewith that, I'll raise the set a

(01:20:50):
little bit.
You know I'll try differentthings.
You know my feet get tiredafter a while, so I kind of
switch back and forth on whichfoot I'm leaning on.

Speaker 2 (01:21:10):
So it's definitely I won't say like, oh, you're
definitely going to be the mostcomfortable in a saddle over
like a nice big stand.
I will say it really depends onyour actual saddle.
I will say it really depends onyour actual saddle, Like in
Frank I moved to the hell.
Did I move to Frank?

Speaker 1 (01:21:23):
What you moved to Arsenal right.

Speaker 2 (01:21:24):
Arsenal.
Yeah, I got Arsenal saddle Lastyear, the years.
Every other year I've had awild edge saddle, Not this is
nothing bad about wild edge.
Like I, I do love this, thissaddle.
It was actually like a perfectbeginner saddle for me to get
introduced, but it's not.
It wasn't as comfortable,especially around like my hips,

(01:21:47):
your hips, yeah yeah yeah, pinchthe hip yeah, yeah yeah, so now
with this, the what I have nowwith this, it is great.
It is so comfortable, it's solight and it adjusts on the back
so you can actually pull it uphigher.

Speaker 3 (01:22:04):
So is it like a two-panel, or is it just one
that folds out?
I think?

Speaker 2 (01:22:09):
it folds up.
It's not a two-panel, but Ithink it folds up.
And then also, what theycreated also was like for your,
for your legs, and you actuallyclip it on to the saddle and it
now gives you a chance where youcan rest your knees, instead of
using knee pads.
You can rest your knees andit's kind of like you're fully

(01:22:29):
sitting and you can actually youcan basically actually work
your whole entire way around andhow does it?

Speaker 3 (01:22:36):
how are you able to sit?
What is it?

Speaker 2 (01:22:39):
I, I would have to, I'll.
I'll show you when I am it's toexplain it basically like it's
out of, when I get all my saddleequipment and everything like
that out of the thing, I willsend you a uh, a video of it, um
, or, if I have, if I'll gothrough my stuff.

Speaker 1 (01:22:55):
I probably do have one, but it's super, super
comfortable you know, nice, yeah, but uh, all right, mike, we're
getting to that.
That mark um.
Let me do a few, um rapidquestions, mike, and then we'll
start wrapping up.
So all right, joe, you readyfor this?
Sure?
All right, what's your favoritegame meal?

Speaker 3 (01:23:19):
Favorite game meal.
Yeah, my wife makes an awesomevenison enchilada man, we make
venison enchiladas and they'regreat Wow.

Speaker 1 (01:23:33):
I didn't see that one coming man.
That sounds great.

Speaker 2 (01:23:37):
That's cool, that sounds great.

Speaker 1 (01:23:39):
We gotta get him to the game dinner.
Yeah, definitely.
Alright, now the next one.
Would you rather forget yourammo or your boots?

Speaker 3 (01:23:51):
Man, I guess my boots , because If I don't have any
ammo and something comes along,I can't shoot it.

Speaker 1 (01:23:58):
Me and Mike were talking because actually that
happened.
Something similar happened toMike Dorn, turkey.

Speaker 2 (01:24:04):
Really.

Speaker 1 (01:24:06):
In a way.

Speaker 2 (01:24:08):
I grabbed the wrong boots.
It was my big insulated ones.
It was rubbing so bad.
I think I put six miles in thatday and by like mile three both
blisters on both of my feet soI said screw this.
I took them on and I walkedbarefoot the rest of the like.

(01:24:29):
I think I did like a like twomiles or so barefoot.

Speaker 3 (01:24:33):
Did you really yeah?
Then when I got back to thetruck.

Speaker 2 (01:24:36):
So barefoot Did you really?
Yeah, and then when I got backto the truck, put on sneakers
and I went to another spot and Ihunted the rest of the day in
sneakers.

Speaker 1 (01:24:43):
Oh, that's a good one .
So for the next question what'sscarier being charged by a bear
or your wife calling mid hunt?

Speaker 3 (01:24:53):
I'm going to.
I'm going to say wife callingmid hunt man, that's mine,
Something's wrong thenunt man,that's mine too.

Speaker 2 (01:25:01):
Yeah, something's wrong, then yeah, right, yeah, I
don't want to go home at thatpoint.

Speaker 3 (01:25:04):
Exactly If she knows I'm hunting and she's calling me
, something's up.

Speaker 1 (01:25:09):
Something's up.
Trust me, I've gotten the callwhere your son did.
I'm like, oh shit.
So are you a fixed head ormechanicals guy?

Speaker 3 (01:25:22):
Mechanical actually.
Actually, you know what I like.
I like those schwackers man, Ilike the regular schwackers.
I haven't had any issues withthem.
I know they're not anythingcrazy, but they always seem to
put a devastating hole for meinto them.
So I can't complain.
Yeah, I can't complain, but Iwill say I always try to

(01:25:48):
obviously put.
I wouldn't try to do a frontalshot on them or anything like
that.
I try to keep it broadside andstuff like that you should try
Sever, me and Mike, we're bigSever guys.
That's why, like that, I try tokeep it broadside and stuff
like that.

Speaker 1 (01:25:58):
You should try Sever Me and Mike.
We're big Sever guys, that'swhy Sever, yeah, Big Sever guys.
What's your go-to snack?
Oh yeah, what's your?

Speaker 3 (01:26:12):
go-to snack I'm going to have to say PB&J man, that's
a good one PB&J with you.

Speaker 1 (01:26:18):
We're going to go with those crustables, you know
those crustables yeah.
Sounds good to me.
Now what's another one?
I got one more.
Would you rather miss a deer at10 yards or spook one at 60?

Speaker 3 (01:26:35):
I think I'd rather spook one at 60, because if I
miss one at 10, I'm just goingto be.

Speaker 1 (01:26:40):
You're confidently shot.

Speaker 2 (01:26:43):
That's pretty true.
I think 60 would be.
If I miss at 30, I'm going tobe having some serious questions
.
I'm going to be at the bowrange like what the hell is
going on.

Speaker 1 (01:26:55):
Maybe I should be a gun hunter.

Speaker 3 (01:26:59):
Yeah, if I miss that close man I'm gonna be really
upset with myself.
I'll be the next week I'll bejust shooting every every day,
you know.
So at least if I spook one at60, I'm like well, it's 60 yards
away, I wouldn't be able toshoot him anyway.

Speaker 1 (01:27:12):
You know what I mean yeah, exactly, all right, I got
one more and then we'll wrap up.
Um, is there any gear that youbought that you ever regretted?

Speaker 3 (01:27:22):
any gear that I've bought that I've ever regretted
hmm, uh, I don't, I don't really, I don't really think so.
Oh, you know what I guess?
Maybe, uh, a bino harness, likea bino harness.
You know, thought I liked theidea of a bino harness, but I
actually just like the strapsbetter, you know what I mean,

(01:27:44):
because I'm constantly taking itin and out, in and out.
Maybe I just need a differentone, Maybe I should try a
different one, but when I justhad the straps like it was just
easy pickup, easy pickup youknow what I mean.
So so maybe that.
But to tell you the truth, I'mnot like a crazy gear guy, Like
I'm not, I don't, I don't gonuts Like I don't need a new bow

(01:28:07):
every, every year and stufflike that, and I try to keep it
logical.
It's as much, as much as youcan.
You know.
I know, like me, anywhere I getthe itch.
You want to get something newand and and nice, but I try to.
I try to keep it reasonable,yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:28:23):
OK, no, I hear you, but all right.
Well, I got, I got one more.

Speaker 2 (01:28:28):
I got one more for.

Speaker 1 (01:28:30):
Mike.

Speaker 2 (01:28:30):
I got the typical, my favorite question of them all
what's your two weeks anywhere?
Money's not an option.
What's your dream?
Hunt and where.

Speaker 3 (01:28:43):
Oh man, I think that's tough Because I got a
couple of different dream hunts.
I want to do the typical, youknow.
I want to really do an elk huntreally bad, and you know so.

(01:29:05):
And I hear Montana is gorgeous.
I hear Montana is gorgeous andthe hunting is great there.
So I'm going to have to say Iprobably would love to go out to
Montana and chase elk andwhitetail, you know.

Speaker 1 (01:29:16):
Awesome, awesome, but all right.

Speaker 2 (01:29:19):
Joe, I respect it.

Speaker 1 (01:29:22):
Me too, Absolutely Listen.
Elk's definitely on my list oneday.

Speaker 3 (01:29:27):
Yeah, hopefully one day, but like you said, you said
money's not an option, becauseit's money's, not an option.

Speaker 2 (01:29:34):
Yeah, I think elk is on there.
I think elk, elk, like I havethe itch for it, but not, he's a
moose guy I am a moose guy yeah, big big, yeah, big moose guy.
Um, but I could see myselfhunting elk in the next five
years, did you?

Speaker 3 (01:29:54):
did you guys see that that trail cam pic of the day
yeah, yeah, yeah yeah yeah, I'veI've heard of it before that
that happening before.

Speaker 2 (01:30:03):
I'm also pretty sure I saw mountain lion two years
ago and really, I listen, Ibelieve it.

Speaker 3 (01:30:08):
I believe it because they they travel, man, I believe
they do they do travel.

Speaker 2 (01:30:13):
Um, I know one was killed, I think, in connecticut
one day, like on, it got hit bya car.
So, like the thing is with withmountain lion and almost any
animal like, they do travel,like it's, you know, especially
males or young, young males thatget pushed out or or whatever
the case is.
So I, I don't know where theclosest area to us.

Speaker 3 (01:30:37):
Well, pa, pa nevermind PA does, so I mean
yeah, they have a season andeverything like that.

Speaker 2 (01:30:44):
So like that's not a huge stretch, like that's right
there, swim across the Delaware.

Speaker 1 (01:30:50):
Yeah, so I mean it's pretty cool.

Speaker 2 (01:30:54):
I mean, I would love to see one.
I don't know what I would do ifI saw one.
I'd call Fish and Wild and belike hey can.

Speaker 3 (01:31:05):
I shoot technically.

Speaker 2 (01:31:08):
I'm definitely trying to make my case Technically
there's no rules on it.

Speaker 3 (01:31:15):
There's no rules in the game.
Yes, yeah, I pop this thing.

Speaker 2 (01:31:19):
I want to make sure that you guys are going to take
it from me and I'm not losing mylicense.

Speaker 1 (01:31:24):
Yeah, I'll be like.
I knew you guys lied to me.
I'm looking right at them.

Speaker 3 (01:31:30):
So what?
Uh, I'm just curious what areyour guys' dreams hunts?

Speaker 1 (01:31:34):
You want to go first, Mike?

Speaker 2 (01:31:36):
Everyone damn knows mine on their show yeah mine's a
two-week alaskan float for um,for moose, for moose.
But I was on just on the bluehen podcast and he said any,
like it could be multiple andlike I'd probably want to do
that combo because you're goingto like, if I'm going to alaska
I'm already probably spending,yeah, fifty thousand dollars

(01:31:56):
already.
So like I would add now, like,think I'd add, like a brown bear
hunt or like maybe a caribou ora wolf or like see what other
tags I can, I can grab,especially if I'm going to be
there two weeks floating, like Idon't want to like and if I
don't kill a moose, like thereare other things, like there's

(01:32:17):
so many animals there, like I'llbring, bring my fishing pole
and you know fish and everythinglike that.
Like that's, that's the, that'sthe dream.
That may not, really may nothappen.
That's why I always tell elklike you know, I've already
turned down an elk hunt so like,for me that's definitely more
achievable.

(01:32:37):
And then maybe also I candabble in now.
Africa has started to pique myinterest and it never has before
, up until my buddies startedhunting in Africa and I've
gotten close with some of theAfrican guides and seen more
about it and talked to people onthe podcast, I mean like that
Africa is starting to definitelypique pique my interest.

Speaker 1 (01:32:59):
Yeah I'm with you on that one, but for mine it's
definitely, uh, it's definitelyan oak 100.
I've always wanted to do it.
I just want to hear them bugleand everything you know.
Um, it's for me it doesn'tmatter, I'll go anywhere
Colorado, montana, it doesn'tmatter.
I just want to get after oneOne day yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:33:22):
Yeah, me too, man.
Me too, Of course, likeanywhere where there's huge
whitetails is fun too right.

Speaker 1 (01:33:29):
Yep, yep, a hundred percent.
But hey, joe, it was a pleasurehaving you on the show.
We got to get you back onDefinitely.

Speaker 2 (01:33:37):
We didn't even cover that much.
We didn't even cover that much.

Speaker 3 (01:33:40):
That was a great conversation.
Yeah, man, I appreciate youguys having me on.
I love just bullshit andtalking hunting.
It's funny.

Speaker 1 (01:33:53):
Anybody who knows me is like oh don't even talk about
it, because you'll just getthem going.
You've been imperfect with us.
Listen, you're more welcome tocome on anytime.
Just hit me up and all right,we'll definitely make it happen.
But, um, for the people whodon't know you like, where would
they find your content?

Speaker 3 (01:34:08):
uh, so you can find my instagram is uh northern, uh,
nj.
Northern northern nj.
Outdoorsman.
Um, anything I post I posthunting-related is on there, so
feel free to reach out anybodywho wants to.
Like I said, I love talking,hunting and always looking for
new ideas and strategies andstuff like that.

Speaker 1 (01:34:30):
So yeah, Definitely I'll message you after this.
I'll give you my number, so ifyou ever need anything, just
feel free to reach out.
You know we could swap picturesand all that too.
So uh definitely be a good time.
Mike, you, you got anything youwant to say, or you're good.

Speaker 2 (01:34:47):
No, I mean it was, it was a play.
I mean I had a lot of fun.

Speaker 3 (01:34:50):
now that one fast and we were trying to keep our
episodes lately down to to anhour, now that we got two shows
and everything like that, andlike time flew and we're at 30,
like that.

Speaker 2 (01:35:02):
I had a good time that was that wasn't.
You know, I've been doing thisfor quite some time and I think
this episode has definitely goneinto like one of my top, uh
favorite recordings.
Sorry, everyone else out thereum but this one is.
It's probably definitely in inmy top five, just because like
it just feels like we've flownyou so many times, but like this

(01:35:26):
wasn't your first time on theshow and everything like that.
Like it feels like you'reyou're a regular, that we've
known you now for a while.
We're just sitting here justjust bullshitting and great
storytelling too, like thatthose stories were were great.
I appreciate that, yeah we'lldefinitely have to get you and
your wife to our game dinnerbecause I need you to try the

(01:35:47):
that like.

Speaker 1 (01:35:48):
That is phenomenal and if you can make our archery
shoot, we'll we'll be settingthat up soon.
So if you can make our archeryshoot, we'll be setting that up
soon.
So if you can make it, we'dlove to have you out and that
way we can all meet in personand you know, we can all shoot
the shit Some more and hang out.

Speaker 2 (01:36:04):
We'll be there all night.
I think everyone and this isfor everyone out there I think
we're going to do it now inAugust and do like a Pre-shoot
before the season and just haveFun and chill with the guys.
We're going to New York in July.
So it's just been a crazy timenow for us and we're getting

(01:36:27):
these shows and we're doingthese events and everything like
that.
So you know, doing one inAugust I've always wanted to do.
So I think we're just going topush this one to August because
it's normally in june.

Speaker 1 (01:36:37):
so and we're already in june.
It's like it's the month 30here.
Yeah, we literally had thisconversation the other day.
Mike's like, yeah, that's nothappening.
But uh, joe, it was a pleasure,go ahead.
What were you gonna say, mike?

Speaker 2 (01:36:52):
no, I was gonna say we we're never going to end this
show.

Speaker 1 (01:36:58):
But listen, Joe, it was a pleasure having you on man
, Definitely going to get you onagain.
Like I said, just keep in touch, All right will do, Thanks guys
.
All right, appreciate itEverybody.
We hope you enjoyed thisamazing episode and we'll see
you all next time.

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