Tradition and Self-Reliance: Randy Kyrk on Hunting, Family, and Finding Balance

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
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Hunting just got tactical.
Welcome back to the GardenState Outdoors and Podcast

(01:02):
presented by Boondocks Hunting.
I'm your host, mike Nitrang,and today we have Randy Kirk.
Welcome to the Garden StateOutdoors and Podcast presented
by Boondocks Hunting.
I'm your host, mike Nitrang,and today we have Randy Kirk.

Speaker 2 (01:08):
Welcome to the show Randy hey, thanks for having me,
mike.

Speaker 1 (01:12):
No problem, it's a pleasure of mine to get you on.
You know, I've been followingalong a little bit with you for
the past couple of years.
We met each other, I think, Ithink, like two different
occasions.
We did the Empire, not theEmpire, that one Sussex show,
and then you were at the EmpireState Show as well, you know.

(01:34):
But it's finally a greatpleasure of mine to get you on
and, you know, excited to forour conversation.
But real quick, why don't yougive a quick backstory for all
the listeners out there?

Speaker 2 (01:47):
all right.
Well, I'm, uh, I'm a retired,uh, new york city detective.
I grew up in upstate new york.
Um, my grandfather was, uh, mymain staple, um, my main moral
direction, my code, and he's theguy that kind of instilled
everything in me.
He took me hunting from thetime I could barely walk.
We were in the woods, you know,just living that life, he

(02:10):
taught me a lot, of, a lot oflessons, important growing up
lessons and you know, and that'ssomething that stuck with me my
whole life and then, when I hadmy own kids, it was something
that I just felt was important,that had to be taught, almost
the same way my grandfathertaught me, and something that
had to be passed on.
And that's basically, I wouldsay, our community, the hunting

(02:32):
community.
I wouldn't be surprised ifmaybe 80, 90 percent of us kind
of fit that mold and just livedthe way that we were raised and
passing on lived the way that wewere raised and passing on.

Speaker 1 (02:47):
Yeah, no, definitely.
And you know you, you talkabout your grandfather and he,
he was the one that really gotyou in what you know what was
some of your earliest memoriesLike what was the you know your
first hunt?
Like like what back then, youknow where was it gun hunting?
You know, I know upstate NewYork it's.

Speaker 2 (03:01):
You know, you know it's all different with the
rules and everything like that,but was a lot more just gun
hunting back then and everythinglike that.
Yeah, predominantly mygrandfather was.
He's one of the ones that fitthe mold.
He came home from World War II.
He was able to purchase a landand build a home with the, with

(03:25):
the grants that were for thesoldiers from World War Two and,
very much like a lot of the menfrom that generation, they took
to hunting and a lot of itbeing, you know, post postwar,
you know today, I know they gotall kinds of different names and
post-traumatic and everythingelse.
But that lifestyle is what helived and living up there in a

(03:59):
rural area we had quite a bit ofacreage for me to roam as a
child and that's what we did.
We took care of, you know, wehad the garden for the fruits
and vegetables and we had thehunting for the meat and
self-sufficiency of living thatway and it was kind of I can't
remember an exact first, I meanthere's just so many memories

(04:26):
rabbits, you know flushing outrabbits and taking shots at them
and you know clearingwoodchucks out and hunting foxes
and coyotes.
And he was a big avid sportsmanwith Turkey.
So he got involved with theNational Wild Turkey Federation
in the early 80s, when it wasjust blossoming in the early

(04:47):
eighties, when it was justblossoming and he ended up, uh,
I don't remember if he was oneof the, the the starters of the
Catskill uh chapter in New Yorkor if he was just a president.
I know he was a president forum some time in the early
eighties but uh, we were always,you know, releasing pheasants,
releasing turkeys, deer hunting,you know just basically
everything, the whole gamut ofwhat a back, you know not, not

(05:10):
back country, not the Westernhunting that we see, that's
really predominant in the in themedia today, but that, you know
, walk out your back door andhunt what you have kind of
lifestyle.
He, you know, we never.
You know, thanksgiving washunting and then food at noon,
you know, so it was.
Everybody would get together,go hunting at noon and come in

(05:32):
and eat after, after everybodywas done hunting and and that
was, you know, that's most ofthe memories of just being out
in the woods.
Um, the most common memory Ihave is him waking me up before
school to go turkey hunting,dragging me out in the woods and
me and him both falling asleepat a tree and then waking up
like yo, you gotta go to school.
So that's uh, that's the mostcommon memory oh, I love that.

Speaker 1 (05:58):
You know and and that sounds like I mean I want to
say, every hunter's dream, youknow they really want I feel
like maybe not every, butmajority of the hunters, like I
think you want to be asself-sufficient as you possibly
can, especially the way that ourworld is going.
And, yes, you know, you knowfarming, get, you know having

(06:19):
your own vegetables andeverything like that, your own
crop, and then being able to goout in your back door and, you
know, hunt every game speciesthat you're legally allowed to
hunt.
I mean, who would it, who wouldit want that?
That?
That like just picturing that,like just in my head it's like
that's the childhood you know,that's, that's one that, like, I

(06:39):
want my kids to have, andeverything like that I imagine
that you're going to.

Speaker 2 (06:42):
You know you're teaching absolutely everything
like that and I imagine thatyou're going to you know you're
teaching kids and everythinglike that as well.

Speaker 1 (06:45):
I'm passing down the traditions and everything like
that, but you know, it's justit's sad to see where our you
know, we'll just keep it on ourcountry, you know and how
everything is just so focused oneverything else besides.
You know nature and theoutdoors and and hunting and
fishing and even farming, youknow you, you could definitely

(07:07):
talk about that Like farming toois another one that there it's
really being cut down and youdon't see people getting dirty
with with their hands.
You know, and that's like that'sthe tough thing but, those
memories right there lastforever and you know it must be
a great experience now for youto to teach your children as
well.

Speaker 2 (07:28):
Yeah, and it's also.
It's one of those.
It's a reality check at thesame time, because it's one of
those things that you grow up in.
And you know my childhood was,you know there were plenty of
things that weren't great aboutit and there was plenty of
things that were great.
And it's when you sit down andyou reflect now, you know, being
45 years old and havingchildren, and it's, you know, I

(07:48):
look back and you know I'mtelling you these stories and
it's like man, I didn'tappreciate that enough when I
was a child and I really didn'tknow what I had.
And I think that's part of beinga father is kind of putting,
trying to open the eyes of yourchildren to say, hey, look, this
is what we have, let's enjoythis.

(08:10):
And because you never know ifyou're going to have it or
you're not.
And you know my story is Iended up moving away from the
country, living in the city,working in the city, and you
know I live now in the suburbsand it's very much an empty
feeling for me to not have whatI took for granted when I was a

(08:31):
kid.
And it's like man, I wish Icould just, you know, just
really open the eyes of mychildren and be like look, you
don't know how lucky you are toenjoy what you have now.
You know, because there's goingto come a time when you get
older and it's you may not havethese things.
You may not have the sameexperience, you may live in a
totally different part of thecountry, you might not have the

(08:53):
same opportunities.
Especially you know what we'retalking about with the way the
country is going.
They're just trying to take awayso many things that we were
raised on and you know, like youtouch on the farming, uh,
what's going on in colorado withall the you know, ballot, bat,
ballot box conservation issuesthat they're coming up with, and

(09:14):
it's like we didn't have thatissue as a kid and it was never
even thought of as uh, oh, youknow.
Uh, you know, what do you meanI can't do this?
What do you mean I can't go outand hunt in my backyard?
Or you know, and it was just it.
Do you mean I can't do this?
What do you mean?
I can't go out and hunt in mybackyard, or you know, and it
was just, it's those things, andit's like we just really want
to open up the kids and not evenopening up the kids.
But for us too, as the adults,it's come to, it's been handed

(09:39):
down to us, and we're going tobe the generation that decides.
If we teach this way of life,it'll stay here, at least for
now.
But if we don't and we don'tfight for it we're going to be
the generation that loses it.

Speaker 1 (09:55):
Yeah, oh man, yeah, that's, that's 100 percent
correct right there.
And you know, you knowsomething.
I want to just what yourexperience was.
You know, when you made thattransition to the city.
You know, and you know anyonesee the city from.
I go up on my roof and I cansee the city like we've been so

(10:26):
accustomed now to this, the citylife.
You know, when you're comingfrom such a different area and
background, what was theadjustments for for you?

Speaker 2 (10:41):
well, it was funny because, like every I don't want
to say every kid, that's kindof like lost.
You know, it's like I wanted togo to the sea, I wanted to get
out of the country.
It reminds me of that oldwailing song where the corn
don't grow, you know, and it'slike you want.
I was attracted to the city.
I wanted to go to the citybecause it was something that I

(11:02):
didn't know, it was somethingnew, it was something exciting
and part of me really justwanted to go and make my own
life.
And I did.
You know, I kind of lefteverything behind, I went, I
struggled, I made it happen andyou know, it was like, you know,
listening to that song as a kid, as you know, like if you can
make it here, you can make itanywhere, like you know, like

(11:24):
Frank Sinatra said and I wouldsay the big difference was back
then those opportunities werestill viable and real.
Today, I don't know how much ofit might be the opposite
direction.
You know, like you're going togo to New York City, but what
are you really going to get outof it?
Are you going to make a career?
Are you going to make?
I mean, granted, the civilservice jobs are still second to

(11:46):
none.
The health benefits, theretirement, you know that is a
staple of the city and veryproviding for a lot of people,
but people that have theopportunity.
Now you start, you see thetrend is going the other way.
Back in the nineties the trendwas let's go to the city,
everything's possible in thecity.
Now the trend is let's get awayfrom the city, let's do, you

(12:07):
know, homesteading, let's do thefarming, let's do small
community, let's do all thesethings.
So it's a very much differenttime from when I was a kid,
because I went into itwholeheartedly, with nothing.
I was like one of those kidsthat showed up and I was staying
at a friend's house, I wasliving here.
I was living there, you know,and I got a job as a waiter and
I was waiting tables and my tipscould pay the rent.

(12:30):
I mean, I think my first rentin New York City Back in the
late 90s was only like threehundred and fifty dollars.
You know, it was like so I canmake my rent.
You know, now it's like I don'tknow how kids come to the city

(12:53):
and they're like oh yeah, therent's like two thousand dollars
it's.

Speaker 1 (12:54):
It's very much different time different
opportunities for, for young, uh, young people these days.
Yeah, it's you're.
You're seeing it all over theplace like everyone is not
everyone, but a lot of peopleare leaving the city and you
touched on that, like thehomestead lifestyle, like that's
kind of what's it right now andwhat's in, because I think, you
know, a lot of things have beenexposed.
You know, we can, you know,with just COVID in general, I

(13:15):
think people kind of started tosee like hey, we kind of need to
start to have a healthierlifestyle.
You know, we don't want to beconfined to such a small area
with millions and millions ofpeople.
You know I'll never forget this,you know when I was in maine,

(13:35):
you know, the first year ofcovid, like they're like, yeah,
what we're all we're so spreadout, like we don't.
They didn't really payattention to that, like out out
in the sticks, like in themiddle of nowhere, like life
just kept going on.
But you know, back in the cityeveryone was on lockdown.
You couldn't do this, couldn'tdo that, you know, and I think
it just opened a lot of people'seyes.
And then, you know, eatinghealthier you're looking at all

(13:58):
the bad processed food andAmerica and everything like that
.
So people just trust it.
Trust it If they grow itthemselves, if they hunted
themselves, they fish themselves.
I mean, I know, for hunting westill have a long way to go
because we're always going to beattacked by, you know, by
others.
But I think the clean lifestylehas gotten way more popular of

(14:22):
homesteading and everything likethat as well, and it, yet again
hunting has to go hand in handwith that.
You know you can't have, can'tsay, oh well, I want to just
grow fruits and vegetables butgo to the store and get chicken
and beef that are coming from,you know, a factory and
everything like that.
So at the end it has to go handin hand.

Speaker 2 (14:42):
Absolutely, absolutely.
And as in everything, I kind ofalways I try to remember and
always try to tell myselfeverything comes in waves.
You know and it's something Iwas taught as a kid you're going
to have good times, you'regoing to have bad times, it's
going to go up and it's going togo down, and every issue kind

(15:02):
of tends to have the samereaction.
Being a detective in the city,you kind of you get more of a
feel of that, because you see somuch of the bad you start to
forget the good and you start toreally get blinded to things.
But then if you tell yourself,well, you know, well, you know,

(15:24):
like, hey, we're over here andthis situation is really bad,
you know, somebody living twodoors down is having the exact
opposite, um experience thanwhat's happening over here.
They don't even know about it.
My first eye awakeningexperience was becoming a cop
and walking the street seeingeverything that would happen in
that day, in that week, and thenbeing like why isn't this on

(15:48):
the news?
Like this is huge, and you know.
And then you really start tosee that there's two lives,
there's two.
There's two distinct realities.
There's the, the reality ofwhat's going on and the reality
of what people, um, don't knowis going on and how they live
their lives in.
You know I don't want to say ina bubble or you know, not to

(16:11):
put anybody down, but it's a lotof people if it's not fed to
them on the media, or that theywouldn't know, how would they
know?
You know what's going on unlessthey're told so it it becomes a
really distinct differencebetween you know the reality of
being in it and seeing all thesedifferent things that law

(16:32):
enforcement provided, and thenthe reality of the people that
live it but never see what'sgoing on, and that fluctuates
back and forth.
And I think people sometimes gofrom their you know, their,
their blinders, kind of havingtheir blinders on and what makes
their life work.
And I mean and I'm not puttingthem down either you have to

(16:53):
have a certain amount ofblinders to survive and actually
live.
Because if you, if you take offthe blinders and you see what's
going on around you, you know ahundred percent of the time and
you can't afford to pick up andmove, you can't afford to
change your lifestyle.
Or you know you're just barelymaking it by.
You do kind of have to, youknow, put it on and go in the

(17:15):
survival mode, and that's what alot of people live in is their
survival mode.
So, you know, having thoseexperiences of going and this is
what I'm talking about the upsand downs is that you kind of
make your reality and you'llhave the up, where you can kind
of control it, and then you'llhave the down parts where you
have to have a.
You know, it's not, it's notsustainable for us to be healthy

(17:37):
, you know, and mentally healthy, physically healthy, you know,

(17:57):
from a food standpoint healthy,you know, just across the board.
You know, just across the board.
I think people are starting to,and COVID, like you said,
absolutely opened up everythingwhere they can see, like you
know, wait a minute, this is notgood.
Why do we have all thesechemicals in our food?
Why don't they want us havingfarms anymore?
You know?
Why are they getting rid offarmland?

(18:18):
Why do we have all ourvegetables and fruits coming
from China and meat shippedoverseas, when we can do it here
?
And it's not, you know, andpeople are starting to realize,
well, it's not climate change.
You know that that argument isstarting to really take a dive.
Um, you know, because that wasthe big excuse.
Oh, we can't have all thesefarms because it's terrible for

(18:39):
the climate.
But at the same time, what'sbetter?
China, you know it has likezero emission control, you know
zero um you know uh the wordcare for the planet.
So it's, it's yeah like I said,it's all cyclical and I believe
the more, yeah, and when morepeople open up and you know, and

(19:00):
the information flows and likeyou know the podcast, what you
do, and you know what I try toput out on my channel, and
people start to really see like,hey, you know, there's a
simpler life that we can control.
You know, and it's like I,where I live now in the suburbs
it's I got chickens last yearand people like, oh, my god,

(19:22):
I've never seen a chicken.
You're like you've never seen achicken.
Come on, you know, and it'slike you know I got three
chickens and that gives me threeeggs a day.
That really it cuts down on thetrip to the supermarket.
I still, you know, but at thesame time you're you're
supplementing.
You don't need to.
You know they go into thatlockdown again and everybody's

(19:42):
panicking and clearing out the.
You know it's like at least Igot something for myself.
And you know, and as we do, youknow if we make a, a kill in
september or november to feedour family, at least, you know,
depending on how, how much weeat, you know, through a quarter
of the year yep, yeah, no, andit's.

Speaker 1 (20:01):
You know, talking just about that.
Like, first of all, our townwon't let us have chickens.
You know it's ridiculous.
We want them eventually.
You know I'm hoping that wewill.
But I want, I want everythinglike I want, you know, chickens.
I want sheep.
I want my fiance wants a horse.
You know I pigs.
I'm a huge bacon person, like Ilove having bacon, so you know

(20:23):
I would.
I just want, all around, beable to just hunt fish, provide
for my whole entire family andyou know what you have to.
It's so hard to go to thegrocery store right now because
I'm spending.
It seems like we're spendinglike five hundred dollars one
trip and we really even get that, get that much.

(20:44):
It's absolutely terrible.
I'm hoping it's going to besomething that changes, but it's
really going to take for, likeyou said, all of us to just keep
pushing what we're doing,showing everyone and teaching
them what really us outdoorsthink those men are about.

Speaker 2 (21:06):
You know right, yeah, and there's, and there's so
many, as bad as it is, there areso many light, um, you know,
like I say, like beacons of hope, but there are are so many
things going on that arestarting to turn and there's

(21:27):
these little signs of thingschanging that really just give
me a lot of hope for the future.
And you know, there's a bigpush in religion, religion's
making a huge comeback, which isis, you know, I think it's
something vital to our community.

(21:48):
It's always been like, you know, I go out, I say, you know, a
little prayer.
I always feel like I'm closerto jesus.
When I'm out hunting, the worldquiets down.
You can kind of hear, you knowthe plan of nature, what's there
for you?
And then you know, and it'salmost, it's our culture, you
know, we think we thank God forwhat he has given us.

(22:10):
I mean, that's literally thefood that he meant that to be
provided for us and for us totake.
So it's like we have that goingon.
Then we have all these thefights going on across the
country and it's like there arechanges being made everywhere

(22:36):
that kind of seem to seem likeit's starting to tip in our way.
And I'm being optimistic.
I took my son shooting and Iposted up about him shooting,
zeroing his rifle, and I gavehim, you know, my .22 rifle that
was given to me by my father.
Now my father etched hisinitials in it when I was a kid.
I mean when he was a kid whenhe gave it to me.

(22:58):
I etched my initials in it whenI was a kid and now I give it
to him and he etched hisinitials in it.
I mean, this is a rifle that'sbeen in our family for three
generations now and he'slearning to shoot on that rifle
just the way I did and I made apost about it and I made a
couple videos and of course itgets flagged for content.

(23:19):
It gets flagged for, you know,whatever they um violence, it
got flagged for um consumergoods and whatever they're you
know yeah, yeah whatever thething is, and I I appealed it,
thinking that you know, you knowwhat I'm never gonna get.
You know, I'll just appeal it,I'm gonna fight the system, I'll
put it up, I pinned it to myboard and, sure enough, um, I

(23:43):
was fortunate enough that I I'vebeen for the last two or three
months now.
I got a call from Meta forcreators and they're like, going
over my you know my platform,how I use it, they're giving me
tips and tricks and you knowkind of telling me, hey, you
know this is what you should do.
Utilize this, utilize that.

(24:04):
And I brought it up when sheshe called for a follow-up and I
said, you know, I was like Iwas flagged for this and you
know I was like I appealed it.
She's like, well, I can't seethe process.
She was like, but if we go intoit now, because at the time my
whole account had got, uh, whereit could not be seen by
non-followers, so my wholeInstagram account was only for

(24:26):
my followers and it wouldn't beshared with non-followers, so
she goes, you appealed it.
And I was like, yeah, Iappealed it.
She goes, go into the last reelthat you put up and check the
reach and see if it's gotten tonon-followers.
And sure enough, I posted Ithink it was with the new field
and stream issue and I think itwas with the new field and

(24:47):
stream issue and I think I gotlike 80% non-followers viewed
that.
So there she was, like yeah,you won your appeal, You're good
.
So it's like to me it's likewhat?
I won the appeal.
I was like no way they're goingto let you know a kid with a
rifle win on appeal.
And you know they've opened itup.
But you know we'll see how itgoes.
And you know it's, it's a partof our culture, it's part of our
life.
You know, teaching kids gunresponsibility, gun ownership

(25:28):
and how to actually shoot arifle is nothing but an actual
win for um, for our society,because you're teaching young
men and women how to properlytreat these things that we have
constitutional rights for.
And like anything else,education is always going to be
paramount to.
You know, banning or gettingrid of some like let's just
educate people on what we haveand why we do it, and you know.
And then we raise the nextgeneration to have the same
respect.
You know, to understand, youknow what this um it actually is

(25:54):
and I'll go and say that thisis a tool that we use, no
different than a craftsman usesa hammer or a saw or a nail and
drills.
It's a tool for our trade andit's a tool for, um, you know,
providing for your family.
It's a tool for the sport.
It's a tool for um, evencognitive um.

(26:16):
You know, like I was justtalking to um a random person
about archery and I was like no,I was like it's the, it's the
mental part of the sport that isthe most beneficial to you as a
person, that concentration.
I was like it's all mental,clearing your head, processing
what you're going to do and thendoing it and then getting the

(26:37):
outcome that you want it.
That sport is more beneficialthan going out and playing.
You know that sport is morebeneficial than going out and

(26:57):
playing, you know, an hour offootball, because you're
actually exercising control overyour body, your brain, to come
up with a you know what you wantto accomplish and hitting that
bullseye.
So I was like it's just so manythings that rifles archery,
conservation, you know, ourcommunity, that provide.
You know, and there's noargument that can be made in my
mind.
I'm sure there's a lot ofpeople who will argue with me
but what would you rather have akid doing?
Would you rather have a kidoutside learning about nature,

(27:19):
learning about trees, learningabout leaves, learning about
habitat, learning about leaves,learning about habitat, learning
about food supplies for animals, practicing shooting a bow and
arrow or shooting a rifle,becoming proficient at something
?
Or would you rather have themsitting in on a tablet playing a
stupid video game for eighthours a day or all summer?

(27:43):
Some of these kids I actuallyfeel really bad there's probably
the majority of the kids whereI live probably never even go
outside for the entire summerand it's like what kind of life
is that for a young, for a youngboy or girl?

Speaker 1 (27:57):
yeah, no, it's.
It's not the life that that we,as humans should be having at
the end of the day.
If you look at the human body,we are supposed to be outside,
we're supposed to be in.
You know the different climatechanges and battling the the
weather, and you know, honestly,I don't wear shoes as much

(28:20):
anymore because you know, at theend, technically, you're
supposed to be walking, you know, barefoot.
I'm trying to get back intoright.
When I wake up, I go outsideand I get sunlight and you know
I just go right into thesunlight.
You know, get fresh air, drinksome water and I just sit there
and I I kind of like meditatenow, you know, and just relax my

(28:41):
body, just get back at beingoutside more and listen, I'm out
, we're outside as much as wecan.
You know as outdoorsmen you are, you know when you have to work
, you got to be.
You know that's a time whenyou're usually cooped up or
something like that, but youknow it starts with early in the
morning.
You know getting up, going out.
You know Taking advantage ofeverything that we have,

(29:07):
whether's raining, hot, snowy,it doesn't matter.
Just get outside.
You know you will definitely,definitely, you know, reap the
benefits, without a doubt.
Just you know, do that for acouple weeks and you will start
to see a difference.
Um, you know, off of just thatwhole topic as well, when you,

(29:28):
when you move to, you know newyork for the first, or the city
for the first time, you know,and you is that.
Did you know you're going tobecome a cop right away?
Or is that the purpose of youmoving there, or you just want?
to move there, and that cameafter yeah, no, I um.

Speaker 2 (29:49):
So my, my grandfather , my life kind of took a drastic
turn.
My grandfather died when I was14 I think, and him being the
predominant uh role in my life,I went from a life that was
completely outdoors, hunting,fishing, all the time with him

(30:11):
and then, when he passed, thatkind of dried up for me and I
had this bad habit and I stilldo it today If something causes
me pain or something hurts me, Icompletely shut it out and I
mean I turn it off.
So I think a part of me was toohurt by him passing to go

(30:36):
continue hunting and beingoutside and being part of the
outdoors.
And I turned to sports and Iplayed football and I wanted to
play football and I wanted to be, as you know, as good as I put
everything into that and Icompletely ignored, um, the
outdoors.
And you know, I wanted to playfor college and I got a chance.
I got to go down to Mississippistate, um, where I eventually

(31:01):
dropped out.
I dropped out of college downthere.
Then I went back home and I waslike I don't want to be here, I
want to be in the city.
I went to community college downin Nassau County out in Long
Island, didn't work out.
I dropped out of college there,you know, and then it was like
I was like all right, college isnot for me and I got to go to

(31:22):
work.
So I moved, I stayed with afriend in Washington Heights, I
got a job, waiting tables, andthen I spent like the next three
years, uh, waiting tables, kindof just living, you know.
Uh, I don't want to say runningaway, but just living the
opposite of the way I was.
I grew up and it was, it was,it was good, it was fun.

(31:48):
I had, um, the experience ofmaking it on my own, um pulling
myself up, you know, takingwhatever job I could, um, and
then finally, after a couple ofyears of not going anywhere,
just waiting tables, realizingmy life's not going anywhere, I
have to do something.

(32:09):
And a couple more series ofevents and miscues and
adventures that I tried, thatdidn't work out and I finally
said I was like I got to takethe test Because at the time I
didn't want to go back to school.
I was like I'm going to takethe test to become a cop and
I'll see if I can get on.
I was originally.
I'm going to take the test tobecome a cop and I'll see if I
can get on.
I was originally going to go toget.
At the time you needed 60credits to become a cop, so I

(32:30):
applied again now for the thirdtime to go to college and they
wouldn't take me anywhere to goto college.
But I got lucky.
There was a program that saidif you had been out of school
for I can't remember how manyyears it was and you didn't have
the grades and you know,basically I wasn't getting
accepted on admissions.
They say you know, you get afresh start with the uh, with

(32:53):
the CUNY, the city university ofNew York, we'll give you a
fresh start.
You can start over.
Um, I went to John Jay college,um, and I took to it for the
first time and I mean now I'mlike, uh, must've been by now 26
, 27 years old.
And, um, I took to it and I waslike wow, I was like this isn't

(33:15):
bad, I'm doing pretty good, andI ended up sticking through it
and I went around.
I went to school year round.
I went at night, I went a day,I went during the little, you
know, the summer breaks, I wentduring the winter break and I
ended up getting my master'sdegree and graduating with my
master's in three years um, attop of my class.

(33:37):
So, uh, it was a big change inmy life there, a big wake up
that you know what?
I better do something with mylife.
I went back to school, I got itdone.
I like banged it out, I crushedit.
I worked with the US MarshalService while I was in college.
I was supposed to go with themto continue my career and at the

(33:59):
last minute NYPD called me.
I had a couple of people that Ilooked up to at the time that
were like you know, listen, man,don't go into the martial
service, be a real cop here.
And you know, in the city,experience the city actually say
you know help people.
And I did.
And uh, it turned out to be agreat 15 year career that I've

(34:20):
pushed through.
I ended up getting hurt in a?
Um I was working when I retired.
I was a detective with thewarrant squad, with the violent
felony squad we went after ifyou shot or killed somebody in
the Bronx, it was my team thatwas going to apprehend you if
you were on the run.
So in other words, we werehunting people that were on the

(34:40):
run for murder and shootingpeople in the Bronx and one of
the cases I ended up gettinghurt in a fight pulling the guy
out of the car.
My spine not that the discslipped, but if this is my
vertebrae on top of the othervertebrae, the one vertebrae

(35:01):
slipped backwards and became outof line and put pressure on the
nerves, made my arm go numb andthey had to end up
straightening it back out, uh,putting a box and a plate and
four screws into my spine tostabilize it.
And uh, at that point they werelike you can't be a cop anymore

(35:22):
and retired me.
So you know, it's just funnyhow the how life works out.
It's just.
You know.
Now I'm here with my kidsgiving them.
You know pretty much what mygrandfather was giving me when I
was a kid yeah, no, it's wow.

Speaker 1 (35:39):
What, first of all, you know thank you for, for
everything that you've done andeverything like that.
I mean I know I work um with um, I work with with kids thank
you and psych and everythinglike that.
So I I understand with a certainlike degree I work in the psych
field.
Now I I go with you knowanywhere from kids that have

(36:01):
autism and stuff like that toyou know skits to then I just
have just violent gang membersin in my, on my unit and you
know it's.
It's an unfortunate thing, butI know, like doing it in the
bronx we actually had one, wehad one kid from the bronx and
he was, he was a tough, tough,he was, he was very serious and

(36:24):
it was very about that, thattype of lifestyle and everything
like that.
So you know, just off the smallsample of what I've seen, you
know, I can only imagine.
You know how it was for you andeverything like that.
But, um, were you, were youhunting at all during this time
or you were just full-on, justworking?

Speaker 2 (36:44):
um, I had.
I was full on working most ofthe time, um, and then when I
got, when I got oldersignificantly older, um,
probably when I hit 30, my,probably around 30, um, when my

(37:05):
life started to calm down againmore, you know like so, going
through you know, all thesurvival, trying to figure out
what I'm gonna do as a career.
You know doing what, what am Igonna be, where am I gonna live?
You know, kind of like goingthrough all that and really
finding myself as a person.

(37:25):
I didn't hunt.
When I became more secure in whoI was and more established, it
kicked in like, I mean, out ofnowhere in the back of my head,
was like a clock and it was likeokay, time to get back to the
person you were, the way youwere raised.

(37:48):
You know enough of everythingyou just went through, enough of
the life of trying to figureout life, of trying to do it on
your own.
You're missing this part ofyour life and you need to get
back to it.
And and then I did, and I wentback and you know it would start
out with like, hey, you know afriend, you know a co-worker,
lived upstate, had a coupleacres.

(38:09):
Hey, can I go, uh, you know, sitand you know, do some hunting
in your backyard, and it reallywent back to a more natural life
where it was like, all right,get all this nonsense out of
your system now, go, sit downand you get back to it.
Get back to what you wereraised, doing, get back to, um,

(38:32):
what gave you your, yourbeginning.
Now that you're older, maybeyou can understand it more, and
I did.
And you know, um, there was acouple of seasons there when I
first got back to it, I didn't,I didn't get anything, I didn't
see anything.
I just kind of sat therereflecting on, you know, the
last 30 years and it was like,yeah, no, I need more of this in

(38:53):
my life mentally.

Speaker 1 (38:57):
What did that do for you?
Because you know, yet again, Iwork in psych, so a lot of it's
mental and I take hunting as aas a.
It's a lot of it's mental andit's the best therapy session
you're going to get that.
You don't have to.
I mean, we do.
Yeah absolutely.
But in a different way.
So what?

Speaker 2 (39:14):
did it do for you mentally, right?
Mentally, it cleared up a lotof nonsense.
It cleared up a lot of stress.
It cleared up, you know, wewere getting to a point where
there was some things thatworked that I just couldn't

(39:35):
control.
And you know, and coming from apsychology background and I
didn't get to tell you when I,when I graduated from John Jay I
ended up graduating with mymaster's in forensic psychology
I did a couple of internships atum.
I did an internship at Kirbyforensicnsic.
I worked in Elmhurst Hospitalin Queens for a little while on
a juvenile, on an adolescent andjuvenile award, and so I know

(39:58):
exactly what you're talkingabout when you say you know on
your unit some of the thingsthat you see, and you know that
that you take on.
Whenever you're in a field andyou work with people, and
especially when you work withpeople with psychological
problems and issues, so much ofthat you take upon yourself and

(40:19):
law enforcement too.
You see things that people gothrough and you take it on
yourself.
You don't process the stressand you don't know how to
adequately deal with it or fileit away or, you know,
compartmentalize it or makesense of it.
It's something that can messyou up mentally and it's

(40:39):
something that you that canstart showing its effects on you
and the way you are at home.
So when it really got to apoint of being a little bit more
than I could handle, it becameokay, you're stressed out,
you're, you're not acting likeyourself, put everything down

(40:59):
and go go hunt them.
And I would, I would take a dayoff, I would do.
You know, if I had a day off,or, uh, on the weekend, I would
just like all right, I'm gettingup in the morning, I'm taking
my rifle or my bow and I'm goingout and I'm going out in the
woods and that quietness, thattherapy that you talked about,

(41:22):
it really helps you process andget away from.
You know, especially the stuffthat you see every day and you
get a.
You know especially the stuffthat you see every day and you
get a chance to say this isn'tlife, this isn't a complete
picture of life, this isn't allthat there is in this world.
There's so much more.
Here's a little taste of it Offin the woods by yourself.

(41:45):
You know, just showing you whatnature can give you, and I
don't think a lot of peopleunderstand that.
And you know, just showing youwhat nature can give you.
And I don't think a lot ofpeople understand that and you
know our community definitelydoes but a lot of people that if
they would, you know, if theyhave issues and they lived in
the city their whole life andthey have all these stresses
that they deal with.
You know, even to go hiking orjust go, you know, get on a

(42:06):
train and go to some public land, you'd be surprised at what a
few minutes in the woods coulddo for for your mental health.
And it definitely played a bigpart in me processing a lot of
stress and, you know, beingcomfortable with the stuff that
was going on in my life.

Speaker 1 (42:26):
Yeah, wow, um, and then another thing that I'm just
really curious about.
You know, so, when you tookyour your time to basically
figure out who you were and andto grow as a person and you know
deal with everything that wasgoing on and you stopped hunting
.
So when you got back into it,what was the biggest difference
from from then?

(42:46):
Like, what was the biggestchange in the just the hunting
world, like, when you came in,were the guns or bows a little
different, lighter, what?
What was the type of equipmentthat you were first dealing with
to to then what you ended upusing when you got back in?

Speaker 2 (43:05):
Well, when I was a kid, when I was probably 12, 10
to 12, I got into archery.
My mother worked at an archeryshop, so it would be a place
that I went and hung out a lotand you know, I first learned to

(43:27):
shoot a compound bow and then,a couple of years, years into it
, I got into to traditionalarchery and I mean I really took
the traditional archery andit's all I did.
I have, um, I still have mylongbow to this day.
And, um, I got into competitionshooting, um, you know, with
the recurve Um, and then so allthat being in my childhood,

(43:52):
having that um success at anearly age of being able to shoot
those um bows, um, it wassomething that I picked up right
away.
I was like, oh, I got to get abow.
I found somebody who wasselling a bow, used that, picked
up a bow and I started shootingagain.
And, um, you know, I went outwith uh, I still have some, you
know, family rifles that I wentout with just to get out.

(44:14):
You know, like all right now Icould say I'm going hunting
because I got a rifle in my hand, even though I was so more just
escaping than I was doinghunting.
I was literally going to, youknow, a friend's backyard,
walking into the woods behindhis house and sitting down.
You know, no, no, no, scouting.
You know, didn't know what wasthere and it was really just, it

(44:36):
was, uh, those beginning stepsof, uh, of uh, you know not I
don't want to say a call forhelp, but of me telling myself,
listen, this is where you got togo, just do whatever you got to
do to get back into it.
You know, find some.

(44:58):
I bought some used camo onlineand I just sat out there.
And I sat out there until I waslike all right, let me see
what's around here, let me starttracking, let me see what, what
signs, what animals, and thenyou know, and then it evolved
back into actually being more ofa of a active hunter.
All right, now we know what'shere, let's find out what's here
.
Let's find out what's here,let's track these animals to see

(45:18):
these footprints, let's findout what's coming in and then
being.
You know, and then you know.
All that leads to the success ofactually, you know, harvesting
an animal again and thenprocessing again.
You know, harvesting an animalagain and then processing again.
You know doing all that stuff.
So it was very much a let mejust get back out with what I
can and get my mind into it.
And then, when I got my mindback into it, archery, you know,

(45:43):
and then the therapeutic ofarchery, of shooting a bow.
You know of that physicalstress, that mental
concentration and that releaseand that instant gratification
of you know hitting a bullseyeor grouping or doing what you
set out to accomplish and itreally just it all builds on
itself as a mental exercise in.

(46:05):
You know, like you said, intherapy.

Speaker 1 (46:08):
Yeah, no, it's the best therapeutic, I love
shooting.
I think, even if you know, likeyou said in therapy, yeah, no,
it's the best therapeutic, Ilove shooting.
I think, even if you know, goshforbid I was to not ever go
hunting ever again, I think Iwould stick with archery.
I think, regardless, for therest of my life and that, let's
be honest, I don't think that'sever happening.
I will find every possible wayto hunt.
Ever happening, I will findevery possible way to hunt.

(46:33):
But I think, when you, when youjust go out and shoot and you
make that perfect shot, you know, and even at your rate, you,
you get pumped up.
It's just like all right, likeyou feel good about yourself,
it's a win.
You know you could be havingthe lousiest day at work and you
, just you go out real quickjust to send a few arrows yeah,
it's true, it flips your daysover I lost you in that last

(47:04):
part.

Speaker 2 (47:04):
You broke up a little bit, I'm sorry okay, no worries
um I don't know what.
No, you came in broken up onthat question okay, um.

Speaker 1 (47:12):
So I basically said you know you could be having the
the worst day and you know youhead out to the range and you
you send a couple arrows downrange and it flips your day
completely over and you'refeeling good about yourself
again.
You know you get to end yourday on a on a positive note
because it mentally it justclears your your head and that

(47:34):
gets you into a positive stateof mind absolutely, absolutely.

Speaker 2 (47:42):
There's um, um from a psychological standpoint, um,
shooting, um, both, you know,rifle and archery.
I would say a little bit morearchery psychologically because
it it takes a, a physical act,so you get the stress of pulling

(48:03):
back a heavy, you know poundage, physically performing an act.
Then you go into step two ofmentally clearing your brain to
concentrate on your alignment.
Your release everything, puremental sport.
At this point, after you havethat your anchor, you clear your

(48:24):
head, you take that shot and ifyou do everything right, you
have instant gratification whichdrives your success.
Your endorphins start going offand you're like hey, I just did
a physical act, a mental act,and I got exactly what I wanted

(48:46):
out of it.
And it's that repetition andit's, it's a positive thing
because your mind really feedsoff of that.
The instant gratification of oh, I got that group, I hit right
where I wanted to hit, and it's,it's um, it builds up your
self-esteem, it builds up yourclarity, it builds up, you know,

(49:07):
just so many mental aspects ofdoing a task and instantly
knowing a reward for that task.
And it's it just.
It builds on so many otherthings and it really is like you
said, it's like you can have aterrible day If you can control
your mind enough to say let meget out there, let me do a

(49:29):
little physical exertion, get itout that stress, that emotional
stress, let me clear my brainto get that mental clarity and
then boom, instant gratificationI completed the task, let's do
it again, boom, do it again,boom, do it again.
And then you build off of thatand it's, you know, like I was

(49:50):
just saying, I had thatconversation with a guy at one
of the stores I was in and hewas like archery.
He's like that sounds cool and Iwas like it's one of the best
things for you.
And I wish here, where I live,we don't have the archery range.
That's closed, we don't haveone, that's, you know.
You know, the youth alone, Ithink, would serve just from

(50:11):
having a legit archery rangehere with like 10, 15 lanes
where kids could go and they canlearn that confidence and they
can learn the shoot and they canlearn, you know, a little
physical stress, little mentalcontrol and a little
gratification and it could dowonders for children.
I mean, it did a lot for mewhen I was young and I'm sure

(50:32):
it's done a lot for a lot ofpeople.

Speaker 1 (50:36):
Now quick question Did you, did you have it in
school?
Cause I know you know there wasa time period where Archie was
taught in school.
Was that something you wereable to do in school?

Speaker 2 (50:46):
I know that's something I wish they would
bring back and I've I have heardhad bringing it back yeah, yeah
, and when I was doing um, whenI was doing, uh, the the hunter
business, we suspended it fornow, but, uh, one of the
organizations that we weresupporting was the, uh, the

(51:07):
national field um archeryassociation, and they are, they
have a big push of gettingarchery back in the school.
That we were supporting was theNational Field Archery
Association and they have a bigpush of getting archery back in
the school and it's a reallygood cause to get behind and get
in for those kids to learn thatdiscipline and I think it is
something that should absolutelymarksmanship itself should be
in schools and teaching kids howto shoot and teaching them how

(51:31):
to shoot rifles and how to shootbows and and all of that stuff.
I mean it is an important thingfor children to process, you
know, because it's one thing andyou can see a difference you
may have seen this yourself um,and being in the two different

(51:51):
worlds and being in an urbanworld and being in a rural world
.
There is, you know, some ofthese kids in in uh, urban
settings.
They see guns in movies, in tvevery day.
They see them in every day lifeand you know, but they don't
see them in person and they it.
It's a you know.

(52:12):
To them it's this magical thingthat's on tv that hits the mark
every time and somebody justpulls it out as fast as they can
and shoots and it the bulletalways goes where it's supposed
to and it always does.
They grow up with this, eitherfear of guns or an unhealthy

(52:36):
attraction to them because theydon't know what they can do.
And in rural life you have kidsthat grew up like with me.
I had a shotgun in my room whenI was like 10 years old and you
just kind of you knew how tohandle it, you know how to
respect it, you knew what it wascapable of and it was not a
mystery.
And with my own children, I satdown with my son when he was, I

(52:58):
don't know, probably four yearsold and I distinctly taught him
the difference between I wasstill working at the time and I
said this is, you know, this ismy pistol for work.
This is the time.
And I said this is, you know,this is my, my, my pistol for
work.
This is your toy and one, youknow, one is for playing and one
is, you know, daddy's tool andone is very dangerous and one is
a toy and I started to gothrough the safe handling of the

(53:25):
firearm at a very young agewith him and I said this is how
you handle the firearm.
This is when you can touch thefirearm at a very young age with
him.
And I said this is how youhandle the firearm, this is when
you can touch the firearm.
This is when you can't touchthe firearm.
You know and I took away thatmystical power that it holds
over some kids like, oh yeah,this is so cool.
Look, there's john wick thing.

(53:45):
And you know, this is what thiscan do.
And I took that away by showinghim this is the real thing.
There's no, there's no magicbehind it.
There's no crazy amount ofthings that's going to happen.
There's no, it can't performmiracles.
It is no different than thisknife in the kitchen drawer and

(54:06):
you have to know how to use itand you have to know how to
handle it and you have to knowhow to respect it.
And we would go through the, the, the laws, the rules of firearm
safety every night and he neverhad an inclination.
I have safes all over my house,everything gets locked up, but
he does not have.

(54:26):
I could put out a rifle.
I could put out a rifle, Icould put out a gun, he won't
grab it, he won't touch it, hewon't even go.
There's times I told him hey,you want to go shoot, we can go
shoot.
He was like, no, I'd ratherjust play with my cap gun today,
and he knows that difference.
Hey, if, if he gets a hold ofthis, what's he gonna do?

(54:53):
Because he's demonstrated howto handle it properly.
Um, he just got his first um bbgun and he's walking around
with it like I've never seensomebody.
So like I gotta make sure Idon't point at anybody or
anything that you know I'm notable.
You know like tense, to thepoint where he's literally
paying attention to what, whatit actually is that he has in
his hand and it's, and for thatI'm grateful.
You know, and that's the way Ithink you know, firearm safety

(55:20):
should be handled for a lot ofkids, and you know.
And then there's other kidsthat you know if they see a
rifle, they're going to pick itup and start pointing it all
over the room and not know what.
And that's not their fault,they just they watch tv.
They don't have anybody toteach them what it is yeah, no,
and you know I love the factthat.

Speaker 1 (55:40):
That's how I was taught too as well.
And it's crazy, still to thisday I'm, you know, 30 years old.
I'm about to turn 31, you know,in the beginning of august.
Even if I have a nerf gun, I'venever put my finger on on the
trigger.
Like it's just trained into mybrain that when I have my hand
on a gun, the finger goesnowhere, even close to the

(56:02):
finger.
It stays in the same position.
I always until you are ready toactually point that weapon down
range into to fire.
You know, and you know when youare pointing that weapon down
range, you better know whatyou're firing at.
You know you don't just pointthe gun oh you know, I'm very
like even I take people out andI and I teach them and

(56:24):
But you know, even when, whenI'm cleaning guns after I'm
shooting, like I'm just so likeit's this routine that you just
get in your head that it's likeOK, I got to make sure
everything is clean, you'regoing to make sure there's gosh
forbid.
There's no round to do this.
Fingers never on the trigger,never pointing it down, like,
and I taught my fiance like that.
Everyone in my family on mymom's side of family, as little

(56:48):
kids, they're taught the sameexact way.
I knew where the keys were tomy grandfather's safe growing up
all throughout my life, just incase if I was home alone and
somebody came into the house butguess what?
I actually was never, because Iwas so used to it I didn't have
that curiosity.
He's not home.
Let me go open up the gun safe,take the gun out and start

(57:10):
playing with it, like it, likeit's an actual toy.
You know, because I knew whatthis thing was.
This was not a toy, you know.
This is like you said it's atool.
This is what it's meant for.
I'm not curious about it,nothing like that.
So you know that's how it needsto be.
I think if they started doingthat, you know, I think we would

(57:32):
be able to get out of this suchnegative and you know space
where we are with guns.

Speaker 2 (57:44):
Absolutely yeah, and unfortunately, yeah, I agree,
agree, I agree 100.
And unfortunately there's somany things that you know that
aren't the argument against umfirearms and you know the

(58:06):
reasoning that they come up withthis stuff and it's, it's not
honest and it's not.
You know, it would be one thingif you know they were really.
Oh, you know it's not safe, andthis and that.
And you know, oh, you know,because of the school shootings
and everything else, and we wantto get rid of this and, to a

(58:27):
point, those arguments aren'thonest.
They're not honest.
And you know, taking guns awayfrom criminals, you know, and or
, I'm sorry, the other wayaround, taking guns away from
law abiding citizens and notcriminals.
You're just not being honest.
So it's like we try to fight alot of these fights on on, uh,

(58:50):
on the background.
Like you know, this is wherewe're coming from and we're
going to tell you no, you know,we know we train our kids and we
train our family members and weknow this is the way, this is
what is going to happen, this ishow people are going to act,
you know, and they turn aroundand you know the counter culture
to it and the people who, youknow, absolutely just don't want

(59:11):
guns, don't like guns.
And you know the main, they maythink oh, it's because of this,
these terrible things, theviolence, guns are so violent
and in reality they're beingused by a government who really
just wants to take away thatright so that the people can't

(59:33):
be free, you know, and can't,you know, stand up to the
government.
You know, as long as we havethe second amendment and the
first amendment, the governmentis really limited what they can
do to us.
Once we get rid of those twothings either one of those two
things then the government'sgoing to be a lot more free to
exert their control.
And I'm telling you as a memberof law enforcement, just a few

(59:57):
years ago in COVID was my bigawakening when, you know I was,
I had just gotten injured at thebeginning, right before COVID
hit is when I had my injury withmy spine.
At the beginning, right beforeCOVID hit is when I had my
injury with my spine and I wasout when it really got bad and
they locked down.
I was home already rehabbing,waiting for surgery and fast

(01:00:26):
forward through that to the endwhen they came up with the
vaccine.
And you know, oh, you know, newYork City.
We're going to mandate.
You got to do this, you got todo that.
And in my head I'm like who'sgoing to?
I was like who's going toenforce that?
And then I saw in my own eyespeople in my own unit taking
that side and being like, oh no,you have to do this.

(01:00:47):
And I'm like, wait a minute,that's not constitutionally
correct.
And being like, oh no, you haveto do this.
And I'm like, wait a minute,that's not constitutionally
correct.
You can't force me to do that.
And then seeing people that haveauthority and power go into
this tyrannical mode of you haveto do this because we're saying
that you have to do it, and itwas really eye-opening to me and

(01:01:08):
I was already on my way out atthe time and I was like this is
not.
I was like you know what myfear is now?
Or cause.
I was like, oh no, you know, wehave good law enforcement,
everybody's going to do this andwe're going to stick up and
we're going to do the rightthing.
And it turns out you can'talways depend on people in
authority to do the right thingbecause they're going to do
what's best for them.

(01:01:29):
And it was a scary moment for mebeing on the outside.
Now you're threatening, youknow, now my job is being
threatened, my livelihood'sbeing threatened, all by the
same people that just a fewmonths ago I was kicking in the
door, the first one through thedoor, you know, with the shield.
You know protecting them orworking with them to protect

(01:01:50):
them.
Now they're telling me oh, Ican't, even, because of this, I
can't do my job anymore.
It's like, well, wait a minute,now we're getting in scary
territory here.
So there is, and there is agood reason to fear your
government to a point where youcan't just be all ideological
and be like, oh no, thegovernment's always going to

(01:02:11):
look out for us, always going totake care of us.
We clearly see that that is notthe case and you know you have
to be reliant, you have to beself-sufficient and you have to
be skeptical of a lot of thingsthat people you know and that
they push on you.
And for what reasons?
Why are they pushing thesethings on us?
Why and it's like and anothermoment to talk about clarity was

(01:02:37):
the Uvalde shooting in Texas,and I remember specifically,
being a member of lawenforcement.
I couldn't believe that it evenhappened, being a member of law
enforcement, I couldn't believethat it even happened.
I was like I literally I waslike this is not right, cause I
know that every department inthe United States get the same
training on active shooters.

(01:02:59):
We all get the same training.
It's federally mandated.
Everybody has to take it.
They put us through you knowthese situations and they teach
you basically what the Tennesseeshooting reaction, what the
reaction of the police officersin Tennessee were.
This is how they train you.
They train you to go in andconfront the threat as soon as
possible and the number onepriority is to stop the killing.

(01:03:21):
And that doesn't mean waitingfor backup.
It doesn't mean waiting on theback, another side of the door.
It means you're going in.
There are young children indanger.
You're there.
You have a responsibility totry to protect and save them and
they drilled that in us and wewould run through this school.

(01:03:41):
You know they would be like allright, you're in your car.
You get the call All right,jump out, run into the room.
This is how you clear this room.
This is how you keep moving.
And they taught us how totactically clear and move.
Clear and move as fast as wecould.
And the number one time you'rerunning towards those gunshots.
You're running towards thosegunshots and when Yuvalde
happened and they were like, oh,they just sat on the other side

(01:04:03):
of the door and I was just, Iwas in disbelief and I was, I
was emotional to the point whereit was, it was bothering me
because I was like I know thisis not the way we're trained, I
know this is not the way we'resupposed to respond.
Why did this happen?
And it it really bothered me,um, to a point that we had

(01:04:24):
gotten to that point where therewas people that would be like,
oh no, we didn't get the okay orwe didn't, we're waiting for
this.
We were like in my head, I'mlike you're waiting for what
you're trained you, you have,you know, shooting, you have
scenarios, you have reactionsthat you've been trained to do
and I get it.

(01:04:45):
It's a scary thing.
But at the same time, you know,like I was getting emotional
just being around my kids whenthat happened, because I'm like
there is no way in the world andI told my son.
I told my son, I said listen,if something happens like that,
and I'm, you know, at the time Iwas working and I said I want
you to understand something.
And I told my wife and I toldmy son my daughter wasn't born

(01:05:06):
yet and I said, if God forbidthat happens here and I'm there.
I was like you will.
You will either bury me, a hero, or because there's no way that
you will live with me as acoward.
And I told him specifically.

(01:05:27):
I said I will die before I haveto live a life where I'm going
to regret that children diedbecause of my inaction.
I was like it's just, that'sthe way I am.
I was like I will not have youlive with that person as your
father.
If you, if something went offlike that and I didn't take

(01:05:49):
action and I didn't save and anumber, a huge number of kids
died because I was too afraid togo forward, I was like I'd
rather have you bury me, knowingthat I tried, than to live with
me knowing that I didn't.
And and I told them and I madethat very clear to them in the
beginning, and I said that'sjust the way I am.
I was like if something happensand you guys are around, I was

(01:06:12):
like I'm going to tell you youknow, stick close to your mom,
get down, take cover, go to theget out of the area, I was like,
but 90 times, 90% of the time,I was like I will not be there
with you.
I will be trying to do what Ihave to do and I don't, I don't.
I don't want to say that tosound tough, I don't want to say
I don't want to say it to belike, oh you know, this guy's

(01:06:32):
just talking, he's being machoor not.
But these, these instances andI have my own little forms of
PTSD that I deal with fromdifferent events but these
instances that happen as asociety, and what we've gotten
away from too is also I have toteach, teach my, my son, that at

(01:06:53):
the end of the day, he's a man,he is there to protect his
mother and his sister and hisfamily, and he needs to know
that when he grows up someday,when he's a man, he's going to
have to protect his children.
It's not going to be, oh, youknow, oh God, we're in trouble,
call the cops and let's wait forthe cops.
No, we can't live in a societylike that.

(01:07:15):
You have to protect your familyand you know, you know.
I'm sorry to go off on a rantlike that, but you know, it's
just one of those things.
That is eye opening, yeah, it'slike.
It's like I can't believe someof the stuff that is going on in
this world is happening andpeople are allowing it to happen
.
And you know, and it goes backto you know, teaching our kids

(01:07:41):
these things and how to live andhow to be you know a man, how
to be a woman, what is expectedof you.
You know, and it's like youknow, and it's like you know
you've all the was was one ofthose things that just they
really hurt to see that people,my own profession, that I would
stick up for 99 times out of youknow a hundred, just be like,

(01:08:04):
wait what you were waiting for,a key, you know, and it's just.
It really anyway, it's just,it's one of those things, the
point being that is like we haveto be able to take care of
ourselves.
We have to be able to protect.
We have to be able to be self,you know, reliant.

(01:08:26):
We have to be able to have ourown food.
We have to be able to be self,you know, reliant.
We have to be able to have ourown food.
We have to be able to hunt.
We have to be able to, because,at the end of the day.
I think in the last 20 years,the institutions have proven
that they cannot take care of usand they will not take care of
us when they, when we need it.

Speaker 1 (01:08:47):
Yeah, no, listen, I love that, you know I, when I'm,
when we're doing a podcast, Ilove it when people go, excuse
me, go on rants and everythinglike that.
Like that is what.
This is what you're passionateabout, you.
This is the insight, this ishow you feel, and I and I agree
with you.
You know what it's.

(01:09:07):
It's one of those cases you seenow, lately in this world, like
every day, it's like, oh my God,I can't believe this happened.
I can't believe you know thisis going on and things like that
.
And you know another one thatI'm very curious to for, to hear
your, your thoughts about,which you know the most recent.
You know, everyone now is goingto remember where they were
when they, when they heard about, you know, the assassination

(01:09:31):
attempt on on Trump's life.
You know, I was sitting in abar and I couldn't.
I couldn't believe it, and thenit was all over the news.
So you know what?
What was the first thing thatthat ran through your mind,
especially as a law enforcementand a, you know, a detective,
and everything like that?
Like, what is the first thingthat ran through your mind
during this, this whole entiresituation?

Speaker 2 (01:09:54):
sadly, I would say.
The first thing that wentthrough my mind was I wasn't,
you know, I wasn't surprisedthat it happened.
I think, kind of, if you'vebeen paying attention to, you
know what's going on politicallyand you know the kind of state
of affairs that we've been inrecently, um, I think it's been

(01:10:16):
building towards something likethis.
I'm not surprised that it didhappen.
I um, um, my immediateafterthought of when it happened
and that he was still alive wasthat God had intervened and you
know, is showing, you know, Imean that's, you know, I talk

(01:10:40):
about Jesus and God quite a bitbecause there's been quite a bit
of experiences in my careerwhere I know what just happened
wasn't possible without hisintervention.
Like I can say, I tell my wifeand I tell my children I have
seen God and I've seen, I haveseen Jesus walk next to me and

(01:11:03):
for whatever reason, and notphysically see him, but to know
that he was there with me insituations that I got out of or
that went smoothly, by no otherreason than by the grace of God,
and to know, you know, like Itold him I said, there's a point
of humility that you have toreach and I think when you do a

(01:11:26):
job like law enforcement or youdo something that's inherently
dangerous and you, you have areal fight between good and evil
.
And I tell my son I was likeyou know, I was like this is the
old stuff you know, grandmawill tell you.
You know, there is truly afight between good and evil
raging in this world and italways has been, and there's a

(01:11:53):
sense of humility where I'vealways said I'm not that good,
there was no way I should havewalked out of there the way I
did.
I'm not that good as adetective, I'm not that good as
tactically, I'm not that goodthat we just made it through
that incident the way we did,even when I got hurt.

(01:12:17):
It was the most random thing.
We were in a car pursuit.
I jumped out of the car.
I tried to break the window outof the driver.
I hitting the driver, uh, thedriver's window, with, uh, my
ass.
I'm hitting with my gun.
I'm trying to break the windowto get him out where.
It's a crazy pursuit.
He ends up taking off.

(01:12:37):
My hands are bloody, broken,blood coming out from the
pressure.
I was hitting the window.
My team continues on thepursuit, leaves me, uh, on foot.
Now, by all accounts, I'm outof the, I'm out of the chase.
I run back to the main street.
I flag down the first cop car Ican find.

(01:12:59):
I get in that car.
We start circling trying tofind them.
We, you know.
Now I don't know where my teamis.
Now I'm like I got to get to myteam, I got to get to my team,
can't find them.
The driver of that car Can'tfind them.
The driver of that car is likelet's just pull over here, let's
calm down.
Everything's going crazy.
It was over the radio.
They had all kinds of thingsgoing on.
I was like no, I'm not calmingdown.
I run into the next police car Isee driving around.

(01:13:21):
I drive into that police car.
I get into that.
Backseat of that car they'recircling around.
Backseat of that car they'recircling around.
By the grace of God.
I see the car up ahead on thehighway where traffic had built
up.
I get out of the car and Istarted running.
This time I know I was like Igot to break that window.
I get my ass out and I hit thatwindow as hard as I could.

(01:13:43):
This is my second chance.
Why was I given a second chance?
How did I end up getting leftbehind by my team, getting into
another car, not getting out ofthat car, getting into a second
car, finding the guy that wewere looking for, being able to
get that second chance to breakthat window and pull him out of
that car and apprehend him, andI'm like I'm not that good.

(01:14:05):
Jesus was walking beside metelling me to listen, to pay
attention to the signs he was hewas showing at me.
And and that's just one case,there's many cases I've been on
where I can been like no way Ishould have found this person,
no way that this should havewent down as smoothly as it did.
And you know and I always tellmy son I was like you got to be

(01:14:28):
humble.
You have to know that noteverything is due to your
greatness or your skill.
There is a divine interventionthat's always going around
around us and I think you haveto be open and I think that's
something our community, thehunting community, has always
been more attuned to is what'sgoing on around us, because

(01:14:48):
that's what our community isbased on.
It's based on being in, innature and listening to what's
going on.
And you know, and it's like theassassination attempt same thing
, there was more at play thanyou know.
That millisecond that he turnshis head, that makes the

(01:15:09):
difference between, you know,was that god just like?
Hey, let me look over here, forwhatever reason, turn my head
that it clears my whole back ofmy skull from being, you know,
shot to just my ear being nicked?
I mean and this is one of thethings I read the other day is
that God is showing himself tothe world again.

(01:15:30):
And these acts and these thingsthat happen, and you know, and
I think it's true, I thinkpeople are turning to Jesus and
they're turning to God andthey're turning to an actual
realization that there's moregoing on in this world right now
than just our own.
You know, whatever man madeproblems that we've made for

(01:15:53):
ourselves perfectly said.

Speaker 1 (01:15:56):
Yeah, I, I agree, and you know it's the more you look
at it.
Yeah, I, I will like I went.
I went to catholic school.
I've, you know, like you said,you know I always go out before
I go hunter, when I'm up in thestand and everything, I always
say a prayer and everything likethat.
I'm not the most, definitelynot the most religious person
out there, but I definitely dobelieve in in that, like there,

(01:16:19):
there is a god and everythinglike that.
And you know things happen fora reason and you know he, he, by
his good gracious, you knowthese things happen.
You know, and there's no otherway like you could really
explain it, like what are always, what are the odds, what are
the chances of that happening?
You know, I mean yeah,absolutely it's like you know.

Speaker 2 (01:16:38):
And then, yeah, and, and the difference that
millisecond you know made inwhat's going on in our world is.
It's insane that that secondyou know is going to be a

(01:17:00):
defining second of where youknow reality could have went
this way or reality could gothis way, and I mean we'll see
where it goes.
But you know, and then you knowit from a law enforcement point
of view, that whole situationis very frustrating because I
know I have a good friend, youknow that I have a good friend
and I know you know too, that's.

(01:17:22):
You know we have active snipersin the NYPD and you know, just
from a situational awareness, toknow, looking at the map, that
is your only elevated threat isthat location.
That's.
You know.
You know I don't want to.
You know second guess anythingthat's going on, or you know

(01:17:43):
people's abilities or anything.
But if you know that's yourprimary um, you know that's your
primary uh, what do you?
You know that's your weakestlink in your protection, where
you could be attacked, you know.
Then you know, and to get offeight shots before combating,

(01:18:04):
that is just.
You know it's, it's not goodand you know.
You know things happen the waythey do for a reason and you
know I don't want to bad mouthanybody or anything, but you
know it it was a failure and itshould be classified and
reviewed as a failure.
And that's the only way you'regoing to learn to go through

(01:18:25):
these things and to say you know, we failed here, what can we do
?
That's different, you know, andthat's another important aspect
of life is admitting when youfailed and when you messed up.
You know if you're going to goon and say, you know, oh, we're
not going to do anythingdifferent, this is you know that
that that strategy we had.

(01:18:46):
You know it's like playing afootball game you got, you got
destroyed.
You know 30 to nothing.
And you're going to go into thenext game saying, oh, no, no, no
, I'm going to have the sameexact game plan I did in the
last one.
That's game.
Saying oh, no, no, no, I'mgonna have the same exact game
plan I did in the last one.
That's not, that's not realityand that's not um, you know
that's not the way it should beand nobody should think like

(01:19:07):
that.
You know, as a hunter, you'rein the field, you blow a hunt.
You're gonna say, all right,I'm just gonna do the same damn
thing again.
No, I'm gonna change my tacticand I'm gonna learn from the
mistakes I did last time and you, you know, god, you know.
This is all I got to say isthank God, the mistake didn't.
You know, unfortunately, youknow, one person lost his life

(01:19:27):
and you know very sad story withhim and you know his family.
You know and that should beremembered and that should be
something that is talked about.
Um with the, you know, withthat day and you know he should
not be forgotten either.
You know, you know, civilservant firefighter protecting

(01:19:48):
his wife and his daughter.
Um, you know, is no longer withus because, you know, security
fail.

Speaker 1 (01:19:58):
Yeah, no, I, I agree with you on that as well.
You know, randy, we're gonna.
I got a few more quickquestions for you.
I mean, first of all, this hasbeen one of the most interesting
episodes we've done in a while.
I mean, we, we really only hitlike one topic and and that's
about it.
And you know, I, actually I, Iabsolutely loved it.

(01:20:20):
You know, this was this wasdefinitely something different,
and I definitely appreciate it.
That definitely means thatthere does have to be a part two
coming in in the future,without a doubt, since we have
still so much more to get into.
But you know, the biggestquestion for every new person
that joins this podcast is whatis your dream hunt?

(01:20:44):
If you could go on your dreamhunt for two weeks, what animal
would it be and where would itbe?

Speaker 2 (01:20:54):
All right.
Well, I'm going to start offwith before I give you my answer
, because it's a little complexanswer, and I'll give you the
general dream.
Let's just throw it out there.
I would love to hunt a red stagin either New Zealand or

(01:21:16):
Scotland or Argentina, in eitherNew Zealand or Scotland and or
Argentina.
But the reality of that dreamI'm gonna give you my.
You know, that's the, the dreamdream answer.
The reality of my dream is whatI would really like be.
A dream that I think isobtainable is that when my son
gets older, I would like to takehim out to Idaho, to Idaho to

(01:21:41):
like the, uh, the Sawtoothmountains and do a bear hunt
with him.
Uh, like, you know, backpackingfor like a week or two and, uh,
do a hunt with him.
That is my, my dream, that's mygoal when he gets older as a
teenager is to accomplish that.
But you know, like, when yousay dream hunt and you go right
off, you know like, oh,something that's never going to

(01:22:01):
happen, yeah, sure you know, letme do a red stag in Scotland or
Argentina.
The likelihood of ever havingof of that happening is very
thin.
But um, my, uh, my goal anddream that I'm working at is
taking him to do an Idaho bearhunt.

Speaker 1 (01:22:23):
Love that, love, love that one.

Speaker 2 (01:22:29):
Non-typical or typical white town.

Speaker 1 (01:22:37):
Non-typical.

Speaker 2 (01:22:43):
Are you a?
Are you a big snack guy in thewoods?
Uh, not really, but I alwayshave my peanut butter and jelly
sandwich all right.

Speaker 1 (01:22:49):
So the question was what?
What is your go-to snack in thewoods?
I'll just put pb and j down foryou.
Um, pb and j in a cup of coffee.
Um, if you could, you know,hunt one week out of the year.
What would you?
What dates would you pick?

Speaker 2 (01:23:13):
oh, that's a good one .
Um, I'm a little torn man.
The rut is always amazing, butI love getting in that early
season, real early October um,when everything is still calm

(01:23:33):
and patternable.
Uh, I would definitely say thefirst or second week of October
um is one of my favorites,gotcha.

Speaker 1 (01:23:43):
Yeah, no, it's tough.
That one's always a tough one.
I think I change my answerevery single time I have a new
guest on, when they saysomething that I didn't think of
before and everything like that.
So my answers are alwayschanging.
I hope no one, if I ever go onyou know, when I go on on
people's podcasts, I hope theydon't ask me that question,
because I would never know.

(01:24:03):
Um, if you could get sponsoredby one company, what would it be
?

Speaker 2 (01:24:12):
um well, I'm fortunate enough, um that I have
uh been sponsored by Cryptekand I'm proud to be a part of
their legion and their story ontheir company Butch Whiting's
story as a helicopter pilot andhow he came up with the pattern

(01:24:33):
and how he tested in thebattlefield from a range, from
actually putting camo to usefrom an elevated position in a
helicopter, what you can see onthe ground and how well that
camo pattern disperses, and thefact that they're probably the

(01:24:54):
largest family-owned camouflagecompany probably in the world.
I know, in america theydefinitely are, um, you know,
and being an american company,being a family company, they are
uh really awesome.
I get to speak to uh kyliewhiting, uh his daughter, um

(01:25:14):
every once in a while throughemail on different stuff that
they have going on and they arethey're just an amazing company
and they really have uh greatvalues and I'm just I'm really
happy to be be affiliated withthem and and what they produce
and the products they put outand and what they stand for am

(01:25:37):
for Gotcha.

Speaker 1 (01:25:38):
Um, if you can move to any state to hunt, what state
are you picking?

Speaker 2 (01:25:47):
Oh man, you know this is something that always goes
through my mind.
Um, you know because you thinkabout where we live over here on
the East coast and it's likeNew York's hunting season is
very especially for a bow isvery generous.
I mean, you're hunting almostfrom the beginning of September

(01:26:09):
to, if you go to long Island, tothe end of January.

Speaker 1 (01:26:13):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:26:14):
And it's, it's.
It's pretty staggering amountof time that you have to hunt
and I start, you know, and thenyou know I talked to these other
.
It's like, yeah, I'd love to goto Idaho, and they're talking
about well, you gotta get in alottery to get this tag and that
tag.
And you know, in New York it'slike I just get my, I get my
deer tags, I get my, my doemanagement, you know my deer
management tags for the does.

(01:26:35):
I get black bear tag, I getturkey tags, I get everything
right there's.
You know, there's no lottery.
And and this year actually, I'mdoing my first new jersey bear
hunt, um, which I'm excitedabout, um, so I'll be crossing
over the border to, uh,hopefully get some success going
on over there oh man, thatthat's gonna.

Speaker 1 (01:26:56):
I can't wait to see that.
I mean, I love black bearhunting.
It's one of my favorite thingsto do.
Um, and over here we got tonsand tons of black bear that
you're gonna, that you're gonnarun into.
Um, yeah, I agree with you onthat.
Like, uh, you know I don't wantto keep it too long with with
this, but I'm going to agree.

Speaker 2 (01:27:13):
Like, being on the East coast, we're blessed, you
know you, we're blessed, youknow you, um, we get very long,
especially for bowhungers, andmaybe not be the same.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
And I think, like what we'vetouched on the whole, the whole
conversation, there's such anelement like, yeah, you know,

(01:27:35):
it's colorado, montana, it'sbeautiful, it's so.
You know, idaho.
I want to go, I want to dothese things.
But from what we've beentalking about and I would say
probably a theme of thisconversation we've had is the,
the, the therapy, the mentalaspect of being able to get out
in the woods and go and clearyour mind and and enjoy hunting.

(01:27:57):
What they offer us here isreally, you know, it's a lot.
I mean, we have all of made forTurkey.
We have, you know, early bearin September.
We have early.
I mean, if they give us aspring bear season over here,
that would just be, you know,icing on the cake.

Speaker 1 (01:28:18):
That'd be amazing.
That that would.
That would be amazing.
I think I'll be where I'mactually scouting upstate New
York with with Frank on FridayCause I think we're going to get
on on that early season.
No idea what area, no idea.
It's somewhere close to like 10minutes from his house.

(01:28:38):
I think he lives on that, thatborder, so I'm not 100 sure.
Uh, when I let, when I find out, I'll definitely let you know.
Um, but um, I got, I got one,two more for you, um, you know
one is is probably likeeveryone's favorite one to to
talk about, um, you know.
So I always give a scenario ifyou could hunt with with one

(01:29:01):
person, now I do a family member, um, and then I also do like
somebody who's famous, orsomething like that, and it
doesn't matter what time framethey're from, or anything like
that.
Um, you know, whether alive,dead, what, what I know, you
know what are you picking it.
You know, for your family I'llactually give you two, because I
imagine one would be one'sgoing to be your son, like you

(01:29:24):
said, uh, idaho, but I'd imaginealso your grandfather too, if
you, if you could yes, yep, youhit it right on the right, on
the head, yep cool, cool yeah Ifigured that I.
I definitely figured that whatwould be um what would be I?

Speaker 2 (01:29:41):
guess your famous person my famous person would be
um remy warren ah, okay, yeah,yeah, good one definitely yeah,
we've got him a few times umfew people, but you know like,
but you know, like, if you coulddo, yeah, I listened to him

(01:30:01):
quite a bit.
Uh, his podcast, uh, cool story, uh with with Remy Warren.
And something I'll never forgetand I'm sure my son I'll never
forget, was a couple of yearsback.
Um, I was putting my son to bed.
We were reading, like thoselittle hunting Um, I don't know
if you've seen them, like thelittle hunting books, where it's
like you know they're made forlike three, four year olds and

(01:30:24):
you know, talking about going ona hunt or going fishing.
And I was putting him to bed andI had my phone on, I was
listening.
We were listening to, um, apodcast, uh, about hunting.
We were listening to the toremy warren's podcast and, um,
we went over to his instagramreal quick and I'm like, look,

(01:30:44):
you know, look at he, he shot,you know, he got this beautiful,
uh, elk or whatever it was, andI'm showing him.
He's like that's super cool andand I was like why don't you
leave a comment or send him amessage?
I was like you could just putit right on here on instagram
and he goes um, and I'll neverforget it was um, it was a post
or a reel about getting ready togo on his next hunt, that he

(01:31:08):
was going on and I think it wasmule deer and my son left a
voice comment saying you know,hey, good luck on your hunt, I
hope you get a big one.
And within like 15 minutes myson got a response from Remy
Warren, a voice message sayingthanks, buddy, I'll try my best.

(01:31:28):
And it was just like that wasawesome.
I was like that's, that was socool.
Thank you for doing that.
My son loved it and you knowthat's something that we'll
always, we'll always remember.
Loved it, and you know that'ssomething that we'll always
we'll always remember.

Speaker 1 (01:31:39):
Now that that's amazing.
You know that.
That that's definitely that'skind of what, like you know, not
saying if, if I was ever to getsomewhere like I just want to
be someone who who answersInstagrams or stuff like that,
cause you'll, you'll, you'll DMor email or what whatever these
guys and they just don't answer.

(01:32:01):
They have that automated answerand everything like that.
Like I think it's especiallywhen you're looking for for the
younger generation, everythinglike that it means a lot like
that could really there be.
The all man like that couldreally set a kid where it's like
that's my, my idol, that'ssomeone who I really want to
look and change somebody's lifearound right and what better you

(01:32:27):
know and what better role modelyou know then you have.

Speaker 2 (01:32:31):
You know, like you have pop culture and you have so
many role models that arereally you know I'm not saying
that they're false role models,but they might not be the best
role model to look up to and youget somebody like that.
And you know, ever since then,my son it's funny I, you know,
we live in the suburbs here inWestchester and he goes to

(01:32:53):
school and his school projectshave always been.
You know, he wrote a book onhow to go hunting, he wrote a
book on how to go fishing andit's like, you know, to a point
I almost feel, um, you know, Ialmost feel bad for him in a way
, that he's so alone in hisclass because none of his

(01:33:14):
classmates have any experiencewith any of this and that he
kind of shares this on his own.
But at the same time, I alsofeel happy for him that he gets
to be this different kid thaneverybody else and he gets to
have something that's unique tohim and to cherish.
And you know, and it's that,it's that father role where you

(01:33:35):
want the best for your kids andyou want them to fit in and you
want you know, you kind of wantthe best of both worlds for them
and you want to give themeverything.
But you know, and it definitelyoutweighs the fact that he's
getting this experience and he'sgetting to talk to people, you
know, like that message, and hegets to relate and go oh, you
know, you know, my dad hunts andI go hunting with him and all

(01:33:56):
his classmates are like wow,hunting with him, and all his
classmates are like wow, youknow, what is that?
Like, you know, and it'ssomething you know, it's
something that's unique to himand I I'm glad he gets that
experience yeah, no, I.

Speaker 1 (01:34:13):
I would definitely say, like when you're, when
you're not surrounded by peoplewho do what we do, they just
gravitate to that.
They're so interested becauseit's so.
They only see it really inmovies.
And it's so fake in movies, Imean, it's so unrealistic, you
know, and it's the way that theyportray hunters and stuff like
that in movies and shows.

(01:34:34):
It's ridiculous, right where,like same thing at work.
I'm like, yeah, no, it'snothing like that at all.
But the kids are so invested inmy stories that, like they want
to go, like, hey, can we is, howdo we do this?
I go listen, this is how you doit.
You know it's tough because Ihave this patient.
Like you know, I can't justgive them my information like,

(01:34:57):
hey, you know you could text meor or whatever outside of here
and I could take you hunting.
I can't do that because youknow you're my patient.
So I have to be like listen,this is how you do it.
You know, if you look up therule, you know you got to do
this, do that.
Look at it, you know, and like,hey, listen, I say, if you do
find me right, I do have guysthat can take you, that can take

(01:35:21):
you out, that can show you theropes.
You know, I I actually have towait for, like my patients to be
, I think, like 21 or somethinglike that, like until I can
actually like would be able toactually like take one of them
out hunting, because of justlike the whole, like it's a huge
mess that I don't want to getinto.
So you, you know I don't wantto, you know, deal with any of

(01:35:42):
that BS or anything like that.
So, like, I tell them, listen,I wish I could, but you know, if
you do find the company page orsomething, I got people that
would gladly show you the ropesof, of how to get into hunting
and everything like that.
Um, randy, I I gotta say thiswas absolutely incredible.
Um, you know any any last wordsfrom you?

(01:36:03):
Uh, we are definitely hittingwith the part, part two, without
a doubt, and we're gonna divedeeper into you know, all all
these other things absolutely.

Speaker 2 (01:36:17):
Um, it was a pleasure , man.
Thank you for having me.
It was a great conversation.
Um, yeah, we got so much morethat we could talk about.
Um, I don't know, man, youmight have just thrown out there
an idea for a not-for-profitthat might be.
You know pretty good here innew york man, your background in
psychology, my background inpsychology and law enforcement.

(01:36:39):
Maybe we could help some kids,maybe we can get something put
together.

Speaker 1 (01:36:42):
Yeah, no, definitely.

Speaker 2 (01:36:43):
Maybe that's something we can explore.
I've been wanting to explorehow we can actually bring you
know, archery and hunting moreinto you know this suburban
world that we're in, because Ithink I honestly think that
there are there's a need for it.
I think there's a even a wantfor it, for you know even

(01:37:06):
archery, um, what it can do forkids after school, summer
programs.
You know something to get intothat's.
You know more healthy, morestimulating, more mental control
, um, you know there's just Ireally think that there's a
place for it in our community,in our society, and you know

(01:37:27):
where it's lacking and you know,I think people like you, you
know that are putting out theright message and putting out
you know the positive spin, thislifestyle that we live, and you
know not just the weekendwarriors, but you know an spin,
this lifestyle that we live, andyou know not just the, the
weekend warriors, but you knowan actual lifestyle where you
know you can live a life and youcan live a happy life and you

(01:37:48):
can be in control, and you know,and you could do all these
things and be successful and, um, you know, I think that's, I
think that's where we're neededand I think that's where a lot
of this is going to go.
I think the food aspect to itis going to be, you know, I mean

(01:38:09):
, that's already been proven tobe a big part of it.
You know, when Meat Eater cameout, it was the mixing of the
food with the hunting to showthe, you know, the access to our
food, what kind of food we'reeating.
You know, and I think that wasthe big draw and it brought in a
lot of non-hunters to that showand to that, you know, into

(01:38:30):
this community and I think it'sgoing to continue.
I think we're going to see morepeople get into this lifestyle,
and you know, and for peoplethat want to get into this
lifestyle and you know, and andfor people that want to get into
this lifestyle, I would justsay, you know, it's not, it
doesn't have to be that you wereraised or you had somebody take
you.
There is so many opportunitiesout there to go and to hunt and

(01:38:52):
to learn and, you know, and tonot be afraid of it.
It's just something new.
You know, when I was a kid, Ihad a family friend that lived
in Harlem.
That came, they, you know, theycame to my grandfather's
property and they hunted everyyear and you know they were like
family to me and it was justthat they went, they met, you

(01:39:16):
know, I don't know how they metmy grandfather and him, I don't
know how they became friends,but it was just that he went and
they became friends and thenhim and his son hunted, you know
, the same property that me andmy grandfather hunted for years,
and there's opportunities forpeople in urban areas just to
get out, not to be afraid.
I mean, I've heard otherpodcasts where they talk about,

(01:39:37):
oh, you know, I thought of this.
I've heard other podcasts wherethey talk about, oh, you know,

(01:40:03):
I've thought of this.
And, you know, like going toknock on random people's doors
and, you know, cultureating andwelcoming to you Especially, you
know, and I witnessed it in the80s and 90s where, you know
people would come up from thecity and just didn't know and
they were like, yeah, no, comeon, We'll definitely.
And it's a respect thing too.
You come respectful and peopleare going to show you.
You know, I told my son I waslike you, give the most amount
of respect to everybody that youmeet, because nobody wants to

(01:40:25):
teach somebody that thinks theyknow it all.
They want to teach kids thatare learning to, that are
willing to learn and arerespectful and humble.
And that's when you're going toget the most out of people,
because they're going to want toteach you.
When they see that respect,that humility, that humbleness,
they're going to want to giveyou more than the person.
That goes.
All right, you know how to dothis.

Speaker 1 (01:40:45):
Okay, go ahead, go do it yeah, we listen perfectly,
said we will definitely talk,because that's something I've
been very interested in, tryingto figure out how I can do
something like this as well,because yet again know it is
something that's extremelyimportant and there's kids that
are just so much less fortunatethan you know that I was and

(01:41:05):
that the rest of us and I wouldlove to get yet again as many,
and doesn't matter thebackground.
You know, hunting is forliterally everyone black, white,
spanish, male, female, whateveryou are.
This is, this is what we allhave, all have to do and have to
connect.
You know this is not just awhite person's thing, this isn't
just a.
You know, some people say, oh,you know, you know, yet to be

(01:41:28):
white and from the south orsomething like no, that's,
that's not, that's not.
It like it's, it's for everyone, all over the place.
And you look at the rest of theworld, most of the rest of the
countries, they hunt for aliving, they eat what they.
You know what they can you know, they grow their crops,
So, um, we'll, we'll definitelytalk um some more about this and
you know we'll definitely goback and forth and come up with

(01:41:51):
with something for sure.
But, um, you know, yet again, II just want to say thank you so
much for for coming on andeveryone you know, make sure if
you're not following him already, make sure you go follow him.
The links are going to be downin the description below.
You know, check it out.
They're doing some great thingsover there.
I know.
You know, when you get back onthe nonprofits and everything

(01:42:13):
like that, you know, definitelylet us know right away so we can
let everyone out there know andwe can contribute every way
that we possibly can andeveryone.
I hope you guys enjoyed thisepisode and we'll see you guys
next time.

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