February 2, 2025 • 35 mins
What happens when two Armenian refugees transform adversity into a powerful journey of justice and empowerment? Join us, Ilona and Mila, as we recount our transformative experiences from fleeing Baku, Azerbaijan, to building successful legal careers in America. Each story we share highlights the resilience needed to overcome cultural and economic hurdles and the strength drawn from family support and a positive mindset. We invite you to listen as we explore the trials of adapting to a new life, facing the challenges of fitting in, and nurturing the passion that eventually led us to law.
Ever wondered how a twist of fate or a psychic encounter could pivot your entire career path? Our journeys into the legal profession, marked by unexpected turns and immigrant dreams, is filled with surprising stories, including the inspiration Mila took from TV justice shows and the tough decision for Ilona to start her own law firm. Through personal anecdotes, we unravel the unpredictable yet rewarding nature of the legal field, from handling complex cases to leveraging our linguistic and cultural backgrounds to serve our community. Our narrative is a testament to ambition and the pursuit of dreams against the odds.
Balancing motherhood with a demanding legal career poses its own set of unique challenges, and we’re here to share how we navigate this delicate act. We highlight the importance of finding passion in our work while also savoring the joys and challenges of being working parents. By sharing our experiences, we hope to inspire others to seek personal fulfillment in both career and family life, embracing every step with style and tenacity.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Ilona (00:00):
My grandma taught me.
She said to me in Russian, I'llsay it in English.
What she said to me was alwaysstand up for yourself.
Welcome to the Glamorous Grindwhere ambition meets allure.
Mila (00:10):
Where Ilona and Mila, longtime lawyers, friends and
your guides to the wild andsometimes downright outrageous
world of law.
Ilona (00:19):
Every week we're diving into our juiciest past cases,
breaking down drama and dishingon how we keep it classy in the
chaos of careers, family and bigdreams.
Mila (00:29):
Whether you're a powerhouse attorney balancing
your own grind or just here forthe jaw-dropping stories, grab
your coffee or your cocktail,because we are bringing the heat
with style and tenacity.
It's law it's life.
Ilona (00:43):
It's a glamorous grind.
This week it's all aboutpulling back the curtain.
Mila (00:56):
We're introducing you to us our journey, our hustle and
why you want to tune in everysingle week.
We'll share how we started asimmigrants, what sparked our
love for the law, the highs andlows of our careers and, of
course, how we managed to keepour personal lives thriving and
fabulous.
Ilona (01:14):
And stick around, because later we're giving you an
exclusive sneak peek at theexciting segments, incredible
stories and glam-filledconversations coming your way on
The Glamorous Grind.
Mila (01:27):
We've been friends for a while and we're colleagues.
You're my boss.
What are the chances out of allthe places in the world?
Both of our families come fromthe same city in the fallen
Soviet Union.
How old were you when you cameto America?
Ilona (01:41):
I was 12 years old and we were both from Baku, azerbaijan
, but we're Armenians and weboth became refugees because of
the ethnic cleansing ofArmenians between 1980 to 1990,
to be given an opportunity tomake the American dream happen.
Mila (01:58):
My family came also after the Baku pogroms occurred, my
family initially moved from Bakuto Ukraine because that's where
they could afford to live.
We got like this small houseand like 30 of us lived there
together because my grandparentshad five kids and everyone lost
their homes.
And growing up I remember itwas really fun for me because
(02:21):
there were so many people alwayseverywhere.
You know, if it was hot wedidn't have AC.
So we like got our "skladushki", which were our like little
beds, and we all slept outside.
So as a kid it was like so fun.
But now I realize like thepoverty that we lived in.
Ilona (02:39):
When we became refugees.
You know, the conflict startedwhen I was starting second grade
.
I remember going to school andwhen my mom and I were taking
the elevator up to go home,there was a letter next to the
elevator saying Armenians, getout of our city, we're going to
kill you.
I remember my mom ripped thatoff and she got scared and
eventually we just went onvacation so that the political
(03:02):
situation and conflict wouldcalm down, because Azerbaijan
and Armenia were fighting overNagorno-Karabakh, the land
that's between them, becauseNagorno-Karabakh wanted to join
Armenia.
While we're on vacation, livingwith my aunt in Uzbekistan for
a few months, we're hopingthings will settle so we can
come back to our home.
We didn't think we're nevergoing to return home.
We received a letter sayingthat our home was invaded in the
(03:28):
middle of the night, that ourneighbors got burned, thrown
down, balconies rolled incarpets and that we're lucky we
weren't home.
And our neighbor, who wasRussian, so she wasn't kicked
out of the city she said thatwhen she walked into our home
the only thing that was left wasour photographs all over the
house.
We were left with nothing.
We ended up going to Armenia andI didn't speak Armenian
(03:52):
language.
I spoke Russian, because inAzerbaijan you know on the way I
worked in former Soviet Unionevery single former republic
spoke Russian, which was theuniversal language.
But then everybody had theirown ethnic language and since I
was Armenian living inAzerbaijan, I didn't speak
Azerbaijani.
I came to Armenia, I didn'tspeak Armenian, so it wasn't
accepted as their own and Iremember they changed all the
(04:15):
schools from Russian language toArmenian to make sure that they
don't lose a vernacular, myentire life I've never felt like
I fit in anywhere.
Mila (04:24):
I've always felt like I've always been this like outcast,
like I was born in Ukraine butI'm not Ukrainian.
I speak Russian but I'm notRussian.
You know, I'm Armenian but Idon't speak Armenian and like
really Armenians didn't reallyaccept us back then because we
were from Azerbaijan and then wecame to America Like I'm not
American but I'm here.
You are American.
(04:44):
Well, now I.
And then we came to Americalike I'm not American, but I'm
here, you are American.
But back then I was just likenever like fit into any box and
always have felt like this, likecrazy outcast, that you know, I
was always like where do I fitin?
Ilona (04:57):
I definitely feel like I fit in America and I'm American
and I'm so grateful for that.
But obviously when I became arefugee moving from Azerbaijan
to Armenia, I wasn't accepted astheir own, although these are
my people.
They said I got bullied.
I had to fight in school everyday pretty much.
(05:18):
Did you physically fight?
Oh yeah, I mean, I used to lovewatching Bruce Lee movies.
There was a movie theater nextto our house and I thought Bruce
Lee was my God.
I used to pray to Bruce Leejust so that I could go and kick
some butt.
When I'm at school to defendmyself and I use his moves.
I was actually defending otherkids because I was getting.
I got along with people, but Ididn't like it when I saw
(05:40):
injustice.
So if I saw somebody gettingbullied just because they're a
refugee or they didn't have niceclothes or something else, I
would stand up for them.
And I remember there was onegirl in my class in Armenia that
they would just come and smackher in the face and she wouldn't
do anything.
And I didn't like it.
So, anyways, I made enemieswith them, so it was like a
(06:01):
daily thing.
Mila (06:02):
You were a lawyer before you were a lawyer.
Um, you were an advocate.
Ilona (06:06):
Yeah, I think it was of my heart, um but yeah, I
remember one time I got jumpedby a lot of people after school
and trying to protect, you know,my friends over there.
So I remember I had a heavybookcase with a lot of books and
I took the bookcase because Icouldn't and I just started
spinning like so I could likeget everybody away from me.
I was like spinning with it tokeep everybody away from me, and
(06:26):
then you know doing the karatemoves which don't work, because
I was not that good at it.
You know doing this and this andthis.
Mila (06:33):
You're also very little.
You're petite.
I can't imagine.
Ilona (06:37):
I'm I'm" petite, but you know I can .
fight I can fight, I'm a goodfighter.
mean I went and then I come toAmerica and I had to fight a lot
, because physically,.
Because then I start school Idon't speak English.
Girls got, you know, fifthgraders got jealous, pulled my
hair on the bus, pushed me.
My grandma taught me.
She said to me in Russian, I'llsay it in English what she said
(07:00):
to me was always stand up foryourself, and that has been
imprinted in my mind Alwaysstand up for yourself, and that
has been imprinted in my mindAlways stand up for yourself.
So if somebody pushed me,treated me unfairly, I gave it
back to them.
I think, whichever way you are,your soul is the same.
When you're a kid to now, Ifyou were a mean kid, you're
probably going to be like thatwhen you grow up, unless life
(07:21):
taught you some lessons and youbecame self-aware.
Mila (07:23):
Foundationally, I don't think we change.
Ilona (07:25):
No.
Mila (07:26):
As people.
Ilona (07:26):
I think we just have different responsibilities.
Mila (07:28):
We get wiser and learn our lessons, and then we have to
use tact, because we can't justfight people when they piss us
off anymore, unfortunately, butno, I mean, it's interesting I
also struggled with assimilatinginto the culture.
Like now I definitely feelAmerican and like as an adult, I
see the melting pot and I seethat everyone is different.
(07:49):
But we came to America and youknow, everyone was Mexican
because we were in San Diego andI was the only one who spoke
Russian and they put me in theESL classes with all the Spanish
speakers and I had no idea howto learn English because
everyone else spoke Spanish.
And you know, we went from nothaving any food, like just being
extremely poor, to now.
(08:09):
You know, my mom got like acheck for $300 for welfare, so
she would like go to Albertsonsand buy like all the frozen
pizzas and all the bonbons.
So we just all exploded andgained so much weight so quickly
.
I was like 170 pounds by thetime I was 11.
So now I'm like poor, I'mforeign, I'm overweight and I
(08:30):
had a mustache on top of all ofthat.
Okay, so like everyone bulliedme too, and then I like wanted
to take off my mustache, but mymom wouldn't let me take it off
because she said it would growback thicker.
Oh, I know, this is like allthe Soviet girl problems, this
is real.
So then she's like I'll fix it.
So she goes and buys me bleach.
(08:53):
So now I'm this like overweightbrown girl with a blonde
mustache, and on top of that mygrandma like was so excited that
they had velour in the store,you know.
So she like went and bought allthis like velour material and
made me a bunch of pants so Iwould wear these like ugly
(09:16):
velour pants every day.
I'm laughing now, but it wasn'tfunny.
But, like you know and yeah,I'm laughing now but it wasn't
funny, oh yeah, but like youknow, and yeah, I was bullied
and I felt like I always kind oflike stood out.
But you know, ultimately at theend of the day, going back to
(09:36):
like being in America, all youhave to do is work really hard
and you can literally accomplishanything.
Ilona (09:42):
And stay positive
Mila (09:43):
And stay positive.
That's a huge thing, becauseyour mind is powerful.
Ilona (09:46):
Yeah, because a lot of people are held back by their
past and I think rewiring yourbrain and thinking positive and
especially just like beinggrateful for what you have your
health, your five senses,anything small things every day
matter to be grateful for.
Because you know here I thinkwe forget everything that we
have, that we didn't have acertain time in our lives.
(10:07):
My father always said we camehere, we came here for you, it's
all on you, and I was always agood student, so I felt the
pressure.
Now it's just wired in me thatI have not reached my potential.
I have so much more toaccomplish in my life and I know
I can.
It's like I just know my gutthat I'm going to do bigger
things than I've done so far.
I'm going to do bigger thingsthan I've done so far and I
(10:28):
really want to make a differencein the world Perspective is
everything I mean.
Mila (10:39):
I feel like I was even lucky because, even though I
also was very greatly affectedby the pogroms, I was not born
yet, so, like I ended up beingborn in Ukraine because my mom
was pregnant with me when theyfled, so I didn't have the
comparison of like living anormal life until I was, you
know, 11, like you, or my sisterwho was 12 years older than me,
and then going to, like youknow, poverty.
I was born into poverty.
Ilona (10:59):
Oh, I didn't know, I didn't realize you were not born
there.
Mila (11:02):
Yeah, I was born in 1990.
So like right as soon as youknow, they settled in Ukraine,
my mom had me, so I don't evenhave that comparison, but I do
have the comparison of likegrowing up in Ukraine, because
we grew up in Ukraine, and, youknow, after the Bolshevik
Revolution, like Ukraine wasnever its own country, so I grew
(11:26):
up like there was no law andorder.
My neighbors were all, like youknow, crazy.
Everyone was hungry, everyonewas alcoholics.
They would drink percovka,which is like vodka with pepper,
because, like it's basicallyrubbing alcohol, I think they
put the pepper in to, like youknow, make it taste decent.
I wonder how it compares toabsolute papar which I liked in
(11:47):
my Bloody Marys back in the daysI haven't tried it, but like
that's kind of what I grew up inand you know, every time I have
like a hard day, now hard dayof like all my kids are sick and
I have to be up all night.
I'm like I've had harder daysand I'm sure you're the same way
.
But I think you have to be inthat mindset because both you
and I could have been like we'revictims.
(12:09):
This sucks Like why are we sopoor?
Why are we in America and wedon't have rich parents and
we're not privileged?
And I mean I felt like that.
Ilona (12:17):
When I came to America I was like why the hell was I born
?
Why did you bring me here?
Because I had to.
When I had to go to school inAmerica, I didn bullied so much
that there were days when I justlike wish I was dead, like I
really hated my life so much andI felt like my parents couldn't
speak English, they couldn'tlike stand up for me or do
anything, being poor or not orrich.
(12:38):
What matters and what matteredto me and matters in my family
still is how close my family is,how much love and support we
give to each other, and thatincludes, you know, my mom, my
dad, my aunts, my cousins, mygrandparents.
They were just always so lovingand so supporting that I didn't
like I personally don't reallyfeel like I missed out on
(12:58):
anything during my childhood.
I guess I couldn't do someextracurricular activities that
I wanted to because they didn'thave the money.
And what I really hated is whenwe would go to the market.
I'd be like mom, I want a gum,because you know they had these
American gums.
Maybe you don't know, but backin former Soviet Union they used
(13:20):
to sell Turbo gum and likeMcDonald's gum, mcdonald's, you
didn't have it, mcdonald's gum,and it was so good, but it was
like a dollar, Russian ruble andI'd be like mom, can I have gum
?
She'll be like portuga", whichmeans we have no money, and I
hated it.
I hated when a ruble would gosomewhere and I'd say, want
something.
She probably could say , and Ijust was so ashamed of that and
I was like, okay, I'm going togrow up and I'm just going to
have a lot of money and I'mgoing to make it happen.
(13:42):
I can buy anything I want andfortunately I worked hard to be
where I am, so that's not aproblem anymore.
Mila (13:49):
I know I remember like every time you know now they,
for whatever reason in schoolsthey like, give the stuff to the
kids in the school every year.
But when we were kids theywould give us a list at the
beginning of each school year of, like, all the things you need
to buy.
And I remember like every timethat list would come in I had
(14:14):
like this dread of like we haveno money, like where's my mom
going to find money to, like buyme a calculator and markers,
you know, and I remember likegrowing up and being like I will
never be poor again.
This will never be an issue.
My children will never wonderwhere their calculator is coming
from.
So now, when people are like,how do you have the motivation
to work so hard?
I'm like this is not hard.
Being poor is hard, beinghungry is hard.
(14:36):
Not knowing where your rent iscoming from is hard, working
hard and having all of theopportunities in the world to
build grow and develop is ablessing.
Why don't you tell us a littlebit about how you decided to
become a lawyer?
Ilona (14:51):
In high school I asked my dad.
Well, I told my dad that I wantto go to the moon, I want to be
an astronaut.
And he told me because he stillhad the fresh off the boat
mentality is that you're a woman, you're not going to end up
going to the moon, you're goingto be sitting behind the desk
somewhere.
But I was really good at math.
So then I said I want to be anactress Because when I was a kid
(15:12):
my grandma made sure that whenI would walk on the street I
would sing really loud so itwould be discovered.
And I used to do that.
I would like scream my butt offscreen like singing on the
street as a little kid.
But that didn't happen informer Soviet Union, never got
discovered.
So then I went to a psychic tofigure out what the hell am I
gonna be.
First I went to her when I was16 with one of my boyfriends I
(15:34):
mean the boyfriend.
At a time I remember she toldme that I was gonna have nine
children and that she gave him areading and said he was gonna
not have nine children whenyou're on your way, I don't know
about him.
I'm fine now and I have somefrozen embryos.
But you know, we broke up liketwo months later.
(15:55):
So your reading was a lie.
So a couple of years later, Itake my other boyfriend to a
psychic.
While he's getting a readingand I refuse to spend any more
money on that lady.
Mila (16:05):
So same psychic?
Ilona (16:06):
Same psychic, but I wasn't going to participate.
So while I'm in a waiting room
Mila (16:15):
Why would you not find a new psychic?
Ilona (16:16):
Because she was like the main one there on the radio all
the time.
So then I.
So I'm sitting in the hallwayand then her daughter is there.
She's like okay, why don't Igive you a reading for, like
free?
So she looked at my hand and Isaid well, I really don't know
what I'm going to like.
What am I going to be when I'mgoing to grow up?
And she says I see a lot ofpapers around you.
I remember being in the showerthat night and I was thinking a
(16:36):
lot of papers, I guess I couldbe someone's secretary or I
could have secretaries.
And then my dad, I remember,mentioned to me before that only
lawyers or doctors make it toAmerica, because that's what
every immigrant thinks.
Okay, I'll be a lawyer andthat's it.
That's when I made a commitment.
I was in a shower shortly aftera psychic reading, and that's
(16:58):
how it got started.
Mila (16:59):
So my story is much simpler.
We came to America and my momwas like, okay, mila, like we
brought you here.
I don't speak the language,this is not my country.
Like you better make it worthit.
So then she said you can be alawyer, a doctor or a failure,
take your pick.
So I really thought about itand I was like, well, I don't
(17:22):
like blood, so I guess I'll be alawyer because I don't want to
be a failure.
And then I really like fell inlove with Law Order and I
watched Law Order religiously.
So I like really liked whatthey were doing and I always I
like became just so enthralledwith the fact that, like the
justice system worked sosmoothly here, because growing
(17:43):
up, like in the Soviet Union,there was no justice system.
In the Soviet Union there wasno justice system.
I remember like my uncle'sfriend got his head chopped off
for 300 bucks and no one evenlike knew who did it, what did
it.
Like people would disappear allthe time, like no one knew here
, like everything wasinvestigated.
I was like wow, and I was likeso amazed by the constitution
and the two-party system.
(18:03):
I was like this is genius, Ilike like super nerdy, but I was
just like really, reallypassionate about like the
American legal system.
And then I like for surethought I would be a prosecutor
and I would watch like the cuteblonde lady in Law and Order who
would like be eating Chinesefood in the high rise at two in
the morning like solving cases.
(18:23):
I was like that's going to beme.
But then when I like became anadult, I was like I need to make
money and like not, you know,deal with murder all day.
So yeah, here.
Ilona (18:34):
I remember when I was a kid and I was watching some
black and white Russian movie, Iwas impressed with the part
where there was a girl who wasshe was a prostitute but she got
arrested.
And then I remember this momentwhere she's like reciting these
code sections to the cop andthen they let her go and I was
(18:55):
like that's so cool, like sheknows code sections.
So, as a litigator, like I knowmy code sections really well.
But I didn't know I was goingto be a lawyer back then.
Mila (19:00):
How did you end up choosing being a family attorney
?
Ilona (19:04):
I think it chose me because I opened up my law firm
straight out of law school.
I remember I worked for acriminal law attorney during law
school because I had zeroconnections and I wanted to have
something on my resume and hewould accept every case that
would walk through a door andgive it to me and I did the work
and it would get filed andeverything was fine.
(19:25):
So then that gave me confidencethat you know, maybe I can do
this myself.
So when it came time to talkabout salary, after I pass the
bar exam, he calls me.
He says I can't afford to payyou salary, but how about I open
up a office, like in anapartment building in North Park
somewhere, and we'll doeverything 50-50.
(19:46):
So all he would do is at leastpay rent and then I would give
him 50% of profits.
Which gave me an idea.
And I was 20, I just turned 25.
I'm like I wonder what would be, what would it cost to just
have my own office, to rent anoffice and do it myself?
Because I speak fluent Russian,I speak fluent Spanish, and
during that time I went downtownand started looking, walking
(20:07):
around and called the phonenumbers I saw for rent and just
inquired what it would cost torent my own office and I ended
up just signing the lease intothe first place.
I walked actually in Sparklesbuilding, I remember that
building.
Yeah, I mean it was.
I signed a lease withoutapplying for a job anywhere and
(20:30):
then put an ad into Russiannewspaper, mexican newspaper and
Yellow Pages.
At the time Russians andHispanics started using my
services.
So I took every case that wouldwalk through the door and
prepared hard and learned andwent all the way with it.
So well, from family law Iended up getting a criminal case
(20:53):
that was a lewd act with aminor because I helped my client
get 50-50 custody of his kid.
The mother got mad so accused,worked up her teenage daughter
to accuse a stepdad of touchingher breast.
That turned into criminalcharges lewd act with a minor
which he was facing eight yearsin prison or jail.
(21:13):
I learned that people use familycourt to manipulate the system
to get advantage and that got memore interested in family law
and I started getting morefamily law cases and eventually,
after like second year into mypractice, 50% of my practice was
, I would say, family law andthe other 50% was personal
(21:35):
injury and civil litigation.
I did breach of contract cases.
I did some jury trials and Isaid, okay, I'm just going to do
family law exclusively, but wehave recently added personal
injury back to our practice asof January 2025.
We're going to be serving theRussian community, hispanic
community and everybody else outthere to help them with
personal injury
Mila (21:56):
And employment.
I did totally opposite of you.
I went the firm route.
So initially I started mypractice I mean, I didn't know
anybody, I didn't know anyattorneys and I ultimately ended
up doing personal injurydefense work and I really liked
litigation and I liked the trialpractice, but I didn't love
(22:17):
being on the defense and Ididn't, and it wasn't.
You know, I used to think therewas like good guys and bad guys
, but now I realize everyone isokay, like everyone's doing
their job.
There's a lot of gray areas inthe law, but I still didn't love
defending.
You know, personal injury cases,especially looking at people
who were injured, and you know,watching videos of people in the
(22:39):
hospital like screaming in pain.
We're going to do that inplaintiffs.
On the plaintiff side, though,it's different.
It's different because I feellike I'm on the right side.
You're helping people, yes, andlike, what really like kind of
switched me from PI toemployment, was one case.
It was a 3-year-old who fellout of a 14-story building and
(23:01):
was one case it was athree-year-old who fell out of a
14th story building and he fellbecause he was like climbing on
this air conditioning unit,that like, and there was no
screen in the window.
So they were suing.
Did he survive?
He survived because a treebroke his fall.
But he was very badly injured.
Basically had you know, defecthealth, defects for life, like
lost all his teeth, had wasgoing to have a limp for his
(23:23):
whole life.
And at that time Daniel, myoldest, was, I think, two or
three and so watching the videosof this like child, like fully
in a full body cast, like crying, like it, just I couldn't do it
.
I just could not do it.
I was like PI defense not forme.
I was like employment it's likesalacious, it's sexy, like no
(23:47):
one's hurt.
I mean there's a lot of traumathat comes with it, like
emotional trauma.
I can handle that, but I can'tsee injured kids anymore Like I
was, just like I can't, unlessI'm like helping them get money
and like fighting for theirrights.
I don't want to defend caseslike that.
So I started doing employmentand I went to big law.
I started working at JacksonLewis.
There was like a thousandattorneys.
It was super.
I mean you have to hustle, butagain, I'm not scared of hard
(24:09):
work, but it was good.
I really liked employment, itwas fun.
And then I got an opportunityto start an employment
plaintiff's practice andinitially I was like I'm not
really a plaintiff's lawyer.
I've always been on the defenseside.
But I always say don't miss anyopportunities.
I'm a yes girl.
So I was like you know what,I'll do it.
(24:29):
So I started an employmentpractice and it was great and I
love fighting for people and Ialways say you have to find
passion in what you do, becausethat's what gives you motivation
.
I can't imagine waking up andnot wanting to go to work.
I can't imagine waking up andbeing like oh, I have to go to
work again.
This is terrible.
(24:50):
Like what kind of life is that?
Because we spend so much timeat work, we should enjoy it, you
know.
Ilona (24:54):
I'm happy when I go to work.
It's definitely quiet, I getthings done, I feel productive.
But I would really love to havemore time with my children
because I barely see them.
Like I go to work at, you know,I'll drop off my daughter at
school at 830 in the morning andthen I'll come home at 630.
I'll have 30 minutes with themby Monday through Friday.
Then I have to work out at 730three times a week, half the.
(25:21):
If I'm stuck at work then Imiss it.
Like I love working, I lovegetting things done.
Like before I had children, Iused to work six to seven days a
week.
My car was always the last oneon the parking lot, three, four
in the morning, and obviously Ihad court in the morning or tons
of clients to handle.
And I did that from 2005 to, Iwould say, till 2019, when I had
Ella.
Then I, you know I didn't worktill three four in the morning
(25:43):
anymore, but I still worked alot until I had children in 2023
four in the same year.
I now take my weekends offbecause that's my only time I
really get to spend quality timewith them and that's not even
enough.
there's no time for yourself butyou know how it is for yourself
like I feel guilty getting mynails done because it's an hour
and a half wasting time, youjust have to do it.
Mila (26:04):
That's why I work out at four in the morning, because
everyone's asleep.
If it's like six and I know thekids are about to wake up, I
feel guilty being in the gym.
I'm like I have to go homethey're going to wake
You know, if it's the weekend, Iwork out, even on the weekends,
at five in the morning, five tosix, because otherwise I can't.
I can't because I have aninfant sleeping in my bed in my
room, so I have to take care ofhim at night and he wakes up two
(26:25):
to three times at night.
And then I have Ella sleepingwith me because you know, she's
my little baby and I don't mindat all.
I would love anyways.
Of course my boyfriend doesn'tlike it, but I want to sleep
with Ella forever.
Yeah, I have no kids in my bedroom.
Kids are not allowed to evencome close to my bed.
Ilona (26:42):
How did you decide to
Mila (26:45):
So there was never any other plan.
I met my husband.
We got married after threemonths of knowing each other and
then as soon as I finished lawschool, I finished law school at
24, got pregnant like -finished in or passed the bar in
November, was pregnant byJanuary and had a baby like year
one of law school.
(27:05):
And then I had another babythree years later, and another
baby three years later and now Ihave three kids.
I've been married 12 years andthat was that.
Ilona (27:13):
Yeah, I think - I'm 44.
And your kids are older thanmine because you got started
earlier than me.
I waited till later in lifebecause I wasn't as lucky to
just like meet somebody.
Of course, I heard from myfamily and felt pressured ever
since my 20s, that I'm becomingan old maid and like all your
cousins and everybody's married.
And you know I was sent topsychics a couple of times to
(27:33):
get readings as to why this isnot happening for me.
I was told I've been cursed,that I've jinxed on me, you name
it.
But in reality, like I dated alot, to the point where my young
grandmother was like you know,look at you, what's going on?
Like I'm a grandma, I'm makingit up for all of you guys,
because you didn't date, myother grandma didn't date, my
(27:55):
mom didn't date, so I'm makingit up for all the women in my
married heritage, so say thankyou.
So of course you know we laughedabout it.
But she didn't like you knowshe didn't think it was as funny
, but that's the reality.
I had no choice.
I want you know.
I was like, okay, I'm going toprobably get married and have
(28:21):
kids and I'm 25.
Nope, didn't happen.
Thought it might happen by 30.
Didn't happen.
That might happen by 35, didn'thappen.
So then I said, screw it, I'mjust going to like freeze my
eggs until you know I find theright guy.
Because, as being a divorceattorney, the one mistake you
make that will make your lifemiserable is have children with
the wrong person.
Because for the next 18 yearsyou'll be in court over custody,
over child support.
For the next 18 years you'll bein court over custody over
child support and a whole bunchof other problems.
So I didn't want that and Iwaited.
(28:43):
I was hopeful until I was 39,that you know some prince will
come and sweep me off my feetand everything will be good and
I'll have a family with him.
Didn't happen.
When I was 38, I met myboyfriend and when I met him I
said, hey, I, hey, I decided Iwant to have kids before I'm 40.
So I'm going to have my own kidthis year.
(29:04):
You can hang around with me oryou don't, but I'm doing it.
So he stayed with me.
The first time I did my IVFtransfer, it didn't work.
And then, you know, we stillcontinued dating and I tried
again in April of 2019.
And you know, I now have mybeautiful daughter, ella, and
(29:26):
she's five years old, so andthen I obviously have more
frozen embryos.
I waited and when I was 42, Isaid, okay, not getting any
younger might as well get it outof the way.
So I decided that I'll carryone child and I was going to
hire a surrogate to have anotherchild for me.
(29:48):
But what happened is thateverything doubled.
It went to my ultrasound andthey're like you have twins.
I'm like what?
Well, okay, fine, like I justadapt, like this.
My great blessing, all good.
My boyfriend almost had a heartattack.
I gave birth to twins in Julyof 2023.
And then, as soon as Irecovered from my C-section, the
(30:10):
surrogate's water broke and Ihad to fly to Northern
California to pick up my otherset of twins.
And yeah, I have a funny video.
I I had all the babies at home.
Like I don't need help, I cando this myself, I want to take
care of all the babies myselftonight.
So I had I bought these doublebeds for for the infants, where
(30:31):
they're laying, and and then Ialso had ella sleep with me, so
I had five children.
I thought I'm gonna be able totake care of everybody myself
that night.
Mila (30:39):
I'm getting anxiety listening to this because I had
one newborn and two toddlers andI thought I was going to die.
But go ahead.
Ilona (30:46):
WelI wasn't able to do it .
I definitely needed, you know,my boyfriend's help and I had to
.
I don't remember how that nightwent, but I remember I took
videos because everybody wasscreaming.
I was screaming, I was like, ah, this person wants a boob, not
person my kid.
They get a bottle here and theywake up Ella.
It was a disaster.
So now what we do is, you know,I rotate my babies.
(31:10):
I take a different child everynight into the crib in my room
and Ella sleeps with me, andthen that's a story, but it's
very manageable.
Now that I have five, it's easy, like it's actually way easier.
Mila (31:21):
I feel like humans are just so adaptable, like at first
everything sounds difficult andthen, once you get it, it's
just like meh.
Ilona (31:27):
I got this.
Yeah, like now I'm thinking,you know, although it might be
crazy, but what I mean?
I have two more.
I would have seven kids if Iever did that again.
I would have to hire asurrogate if I ever did that.
Of course, you know, I don'tknow if anybody will agree to it
, but I actually don't needconsent.
So we'll see what happens inlife.
If everything goes to plan andI accomplish my dreams and make
(31:48):
big things happen, then why not?
Mila (31:50):
You know what I love about you more than anything probably
is that like you are reallygood at being positive.
I always say, you know, tellmyself this because I feel like
so often I get into the nittygritty of the hard parts and I'm
like don't let your blessingsbe burdens.
And I feel like you're so goodat that innately, and so like,
keep up the good work.
Ilona (32:11):
I mean, I think life is up and down.
All of us, you know, have ourhighs and have lows and you know
, once you hit the bottom it'sonly going to go up.
So just know that time willheal and I think that when I I
remember a moment when Irealized that it will only get
better.
I had an ingrown nail on my toeand I was like 16.
And I had to go to a doctor tohelp me and I remember he had
(32:37):
this huge syringe and he had toput this.
He had to give me a numbing shotinto my toe like where there's
bone, but you know I had totolerate it.
All I was thinking is timeheals, time heals.
This will be like in the past,like think of the future, like
and that works, and that workand now, like I always think
(33:04):
back of that, I'm like it washurting so much.
Yeah, well, I mean, I think ofmy mindset at the time, not of
my ingrown nail.
I was just thinking this momentwill be the past.
So just get through it, yeah,and then it won't hurt anymore.
well, I hope that everyone feelslike they know you me a little
(33:25):
bit better.
We hope we can share with youwhat it's really like going
through the courts, as well astell you some of the wild
stories.
Mila (33:31):
We will be interviewing past clients, so you don't have
to take our word for it.
You can hear their storiesdirectly from them.
Ilona (33:38):
Now for a taste of what's to come.
Each episode, Mila and I willbring you into our world through
three exciting segments.
Mila (33:44):
First off, we have Hot Off the Headlines, where we dive
into the latest lawsuits andlegal stories making waves in
the news, From shocking twiststo high stakes drama.
We will break it all down foryou with wit and wisdom.
Ilona (33:59):
Then we'll revisit some of our own crime and punishment
and past cases and present drama.
We'll relive our most startlingcases, proving that the stories
of yesterday still pack a punchtoday.
We'll even be inviting specialguests during these segments who
were actually involved in thecases.
Mila (34:15):
And, last but not least, you can look forward to what we
are calling the balancing act.
This is the part where we shareour secrets to juggling
demanding careers, family lifeand personal passions, all while
staying sparkling Tips, tricksand a little glam on the side.
And that's a wrap for today'sepisode of the Glamorous Grind.
Ilona (34:37):
We hope you loved getting to know us, our stories, our
passion for the law and whatmakes this grind just a little
bit more glamorous.
Mila (34:44):
And next week we've got a special guest who turned their
legal battle into alife-changing story.
Ilona (34:51):
You won't want to miss this.
We'll be dropping episodesevery Tuesday, so make sure you
stay tuned.
Mila (34:57):
Don't forget to subscribe, rate and review wherever you
listen to your podcasts.
Ilona (35:01):
And be sure to follow us on social media for
behind-the-scenes contentupdates and even a sneak peek at
future episodes.
Mila (35:09):
Until next time, remember, success isn't about choosing
between ambition and eleganceyou can have both.
Ilona (35:15):
Stay fabulous, stay fierce, and we'll see you on the
next episode of the GlamorousGrind.
My grandma taught me.
She said to me in Russian, I'llsay it in English.
What she said to me was alwaysstand up for yourself.
Welcome to the Glamorous Grindwhere ambition meets allure.
Mila (00:10):
Where Ilona and Mila, longtime lawyers, friends and
your guides to the wild andsometimes downright outrageous
world of law.
Ilona (00:19):
Every week we're diving into our juiciest past cases,
breaking down drama and dishingon how we keep it classy in the
chaos of careers, family and bigdreams.
Mila (00:29):
Whether you're a powerhouse attorney balancing
your own grind or just here forthe jaw-dropping stories, grab
your coffee or your cocktail,because we are bringing the heat
with style and tenacity.
It's law it's life.
Ilona (00:43):
It's a glamorous grind.
This week it's all aboutpulling back the curtain.
Mila (00:56):
We're introducing you to us our journey, our hustle and
why you want to tune in everysingle week.
We'll share how we started asimmigrants, what sparked our
love for the law, the highs andlows of our careers and, of
course, how we managed to keepour personal lives thriving and
fabulous.
Ilona (01:14):
And stick around, because later we're giving you an
exclusive sneak peek at theexciting segments, incredible
stories and glam-filledconversations coming your way on
The Glamorous Grind.
Mila (01:27):
We've been friends for a while and we're colleagues.
You're my boss.
What are the chances out of allthe places in the world?
Both of our families come fromthe same city in the fallen
Soviet Union.
How old were you when you cameto America?
Ilona (01:41):
I was 12 years old and we were both from Baku, azerbaijan
, but we're Armenians and weboth became refugees because of
the ethnic cleansing ofArmenians between 1980 to 1990,
to be given an opportunity tomake the American dream happen.
Mila (01:58):
My family came also after the Baku pogroms occurred, my
family initially moved from Bakuto Ukraine because that's where
they could afford to live.
We got like this small houseand like 30 of us lived there
together because my grandparentshad five kids and everyone lost
their homes.
And growing up I remember itwas really fun for me because
(02:21):
there were so many people alwayseverywhere.
You know, if it was hot wedidn't have AC.
So we like got our "skladushki", which were our like little
beds, and we all slept outside.
So as a kid it was like so fun.
But now I realize like thepoverty that we lived in.
Ilona (02:39):
When we became refugees.
You know, the conflict startedwhen I was starting second grade
.
I remember going to school andwhen my mom and I were taking
the elevator up to go home,there was a letter next to the
elevator saying Armenians, getout of our city, we're going to
kill you.
I remember my mom ripped thatoff and she got scared and
eventually we just went onvacation so that the political
(03:02):
situation and conflict wouldcalm down, because Azerbaijan
and Armenia were fighting overNagorno-Karabakh, the land
that's between them, becauseNagorno-Karabakh wanted to join
Armenia.
While we're on vacation, livingwith my aunt in Uzbekistan for
a few months, we're hopingthings will settle so we can
come back to our home.
We didn't think we're nevergoing to return home.
We received a letter sayingthat our home was invaded in the
(03:28):
middle of the night, that ourneighbors got burned, thrown
down, balconies rolled incarpets and that we're lucky we
weren't home.
And our neighbor, who wasRussian, so she wasn't kicked
out of the city she said thatwhen she walked into our home
the only thing that was left wasour photographs all over the
house.
We were left with nothing.
We ended up going to Armenia andI didn't speak Armenian
(03:52):
language.
I spoke Russian, because inAzerbaijan you know on the way I
worked in former Soviet Unionevery single former republic
spoke Russian, which was theuniversal language.
But then everybody had theirown ethnic language and since I
was Armenian living inAzerbaijan, I didn't speak
Azerbaijani.
I came to Armenia, I didn'tspeak Armenian, so it wasn't
accepted as their own and Iremember they changed all the
(04:15):
schools from Russian language toArmenian to make sure that they
don't lose a vernacular, myentire life I've never felt like
I fit in anywhere.
Mila (04:24):
I've always felt like I've always been this like outcast,
like I was born in Ukraine butI'm not Ukrainian.
I speak Russian but I'm notRussian.
You know, I'm Armenian but Idon't speak Armenian and like
really Armenians didn't reallyaccept us back then because we
were from Azerbaijan and then wecame to America Like I'm not
American but I'm here.
You are American.
(04:44):
Well, now I.
And then we came to Americalike I'm not American, but I'm
here, you are American.
But back then I was just likenever like fit into any box and
always have felt like this, likecrazy outcast, that you know, I
was always like where do I fitin?
Ilona (04:57):
I definitely feel like I fit in America and I'm American
and I'm so grateful for that.
But obviously when I became arefugee moving from Azerbaijan
to Armenia, I wasn't accepted astheir own, although these are
my people.
They said I got bullied.
I had to fight in school everyday pretty much.
(05:18):
Did you physically fight?
Oh yeah, I mean, I used to lovewatching Bruce Lee movies.
There was a movie theater nextto our house and I thought Bruce
Lee was my God.
I used to pray to Bruce Leejust so that I could go and kick
some butt.
When I'm at school to defendmyself and I use his moves.
I was actually defending otherkids because I was getting.
I got along with people, but Ididn't like it when I saw
(05:40):
injustice.
So if I saw somebody gettingbullied just because they're a
refugee or they didn't have niceclothes or something else, I
would stand up for them.
And I remember there was onegirl in my class in Armenia that
they would just come and smackher in the face and she wouldn't
do anything.
And I didn't like it.
So, anyways, I made enemieswith them, so it was like a
(06:01):
daily thing.
Mila (06:02):
You were a lawyer before you were a lawyer.
Um, you were an advocate.
Ilona (06:06):
Yeah, I think it was of my heart, um but yeah, I
remember one time I got jumpedby a lot of people after school
and trying to protect, you know,my friends over there.
So I remember I had a heavybookcase with a lot of books and
I took the bookcase because Icouldn't and I just started
spinning like so I could likeget everybody away from me.
I was like spinning with it tokeep everybody away from me, and
(06:26):
then you know doing the karatemoves which don't work, because
I was not that good at it.
You know doing this and this andthis.
Mila (06:33):
You're also very little.
You're petite.
I can't imagine.
Ilona (06:37):
I'm I'm" petite, but you know I can .
fight I can fight, I'm a goodfighter.
mean I went and then I come toAmerica and I had to fight a lot
, because physically,.
Because then I start school Idon't speak English.
Girls got, you know, fifthgraders got jealous, pulled my
hair on the bus, pushed me.
My grandma taught me.
She said to me in Russian, I'llsay it in English what she said
(07:00):
to me was always stand up foryourself, and that has been
imprinted in my mind Alwaysstand up for yourself, and that
has been imprinted in my mindAlways stand up for yourself.
So if somebody pushed me,treated me unfairly, I gave it
back to them.
I think, whichever way you are,your soul is the same.
When you're a kid to now, Ifyou were a mean kid, you're
probably going to be like thatwhen you grow up, unless life
(07:21):
taught you some lessons and youbecame self-aware.
Mila (07:23):
Foundationally, I don't think we change.
Ilona (07:25):
No.
Mila (07:26):
As people.
Ilona (07:26):
I think we just have different responsibilities.
Mila (07:28):
We get wiser and learn our lessons, and then we have to
use tact, because we can't justfight people when they piss us
off anymore, unfortunately, butno, I mean, it's interesting I
also struggled with assimilatinginto the culture.
Like now I definitely feelAmerican and like as an adult, I
see the melting pot and I seethat everyone is different.
(07:49):
But we came to America and youknow, everyone was Mexican
because we were in San Diego andI was the only one who spoke
Russian and they put me in theESL classes with all the Spanish
speakers and I had no idea howto learn English because
everyone else spoke Spanish.
And you know, we went from nothaving any food, like just being
extremely poor, to now.
(08:09):
You know, my mom got like acheck for $300 for welfare, so
she would like go to Albertsonsand buy like all the frozen
pizzas and all the bonbons.
So we just all exploded andgained so much weight so quickly
.
I was like 170 pounds by thetime I was 11.
So now I'm like poor, I'mforeign, I'm overweight and I
(08:30):
had a mustache on top of all ofthat.
Okay, so like everyone bulliedme too, and then I like wanted
to take off my mustache, but mymom wouldn't let me take it off
because she said it would growback thicker.
Oh, I know, this is like allthe Soviet girl problems, this
is real.
So then she's like I'll fix it.
So she goes and buys me bleach.
(08:53):
So now I'm this like overweightbrown girl with a blonde
mustache, and on top of that mygrandma like was so excited that
they had velour in the store,you know.
So she like went and bought allthis like velour material and
made me a bunch of pants so Iwould wear these like ugly
(09:16):
velour pants every day.
I'm laughing now, but it wasn'tfunny.
But, like you know and yeah,I'm laughing now but it wasn't
funny, oh yeah, but like youknow, and yeah, I was bullied
and I felt like I always kind oflike stood out.
But you know, ultimately at theend of the day, going back to
(09:36):
like being in America, all youhave to do is work really hard
and you can literally accomplishanything.
Ilona (09:42):
And stay positive
Mila (09:43):
And stay positive.
That's a huge thing, becauseyour mind is powerful.
Ilona (09:46):
Yeah, because a lot of people are held back by their
past and I think rewiring yourbrain and thinking positive and
especially just like beinggrateful for what you have your
health, your five senses,anything small things every day
matter to be grateful for.
Because you know here I thinkwe forget everything that we
have, that we didn't have acertain time in our lives.
(10:07):
My father always said we camehere, we came here for you, it's
all on you, and I was always agood student, so I felt the
pressure.
Now it's just wired in me thatI have not reached my potential.
I have so much more toaccomplish in my life and I know
I can.
It's like I just know my gutthat I'm going to do bigger
things than I've done so far.
I'm going to do bigger thingsthan I've done so far and I
(10:28):
really want to make a differencein the world Perspective is
everything I mean.
Mila (10:39):
I feel like I was even lucky because, even though I
also was very greatly affectedby the pogroms, I was not born
yet, so, like I ended up beingborn in Ukraine because my mom
was pregnant with me when theyfled, so I didn't have the
comparison of like living anormal life until I was, you
know, 11, like you, or my sisterwho was 12 years older than me,
and then going to, like youknow, poverty.
I was born into poverty.
Ilona (10:59):
Oh, I didn't know, I didn't realize you were not born
there.
Mila (11:02):
Yeah, I was born in 1990.
So like right as soon as youknow, they settled in Ukraine,
my mom had me, so I don't evenhave that comparison, but I do
have the comparison of likegrowing up in Ukraine, because
we grew up in Ukraine, and, youknow, after the Bolshevik
Revolution, like Ukraine wasnever its own country, so I grew
(11:26):
up like there was no law andorder.
My neighbors were all, like youknow, crazy.
Everyone was hungry, everyonewas alcoholics.
They would drink percovka,which is like vodka with pepper,
because, like it's basicallyrubbing alcohol, I think they
put the pepper in to, like youknow, make it taste decent.
I wonder how it compares toabsolute papar which I liked in
(11:47):
my Bloody Marys back in the daysI haven't tried it, but like
that's kind of what I grew up inand you know, every time I have
like a hard day, now hard dayof like all my kids are sick and
I have to be up all night.
I'm like I've had harder daysand I'm sure you're the same way
.
But I think you have to be inthat mindset because both you
and I could have been like we'revictims.
(12:09):
This sucks Like why are we sopoor?
Why are we in America and wedon't have rich parents and
we're not privileged?
And I mean I felt like that.
Ilona (12:17):
When I came to America I was like why the hell was I born
?
Why did you bring me here?
Because I had to.
When I had to go to school inAmerica, I didn bullied so much
that there were days when I justlike wish I was dead, like I
really hated my life so much andI felt like my parents couldn't
speak English, they couldn'tlike stand up for me or do
anything, being poor or not orrich.
(12:38):
What matters and what matteredto me and matters in my family
still is how close my family is,how much love and support we
give to each other, and thatincludes, you know, my mom, my
dad, my aunts, my cousins, mygrandparents.
They were just always so lovingand so supporting that I didn't
like I personally don't reallyfeel like I missed out on
(12:58):
anything during my childhood.
I guess I couldn't do someextracurricular activities that
I wanted to because they didn'thave the money.
And what I really hated is whenwe would go to the market.
I'd be like mom, I want a gum,because you know they had these
American gums.
Maybe you don't know, but backin former Soviet Union they used
(13:20):
to sell Turbo gum and likeMcDonald's gum, mcdonald's, you
didn't have it, mcdonald's gum,and it was so good, but it was
like a dollar, Russian ruble andI'd be like mom, can I have gum
?
She'll be like portuga", whichmeans we have no money, and I
hated it.
I hated when a ruble would gosomewhere and I'd say, want
something.
She probably could say , and Ijust was so ashamed of that and
I was like, okay, I'm going togrow up and I'm just going to
have a lot of money and I'mgoing to make it happen.
(13:42):
I can buy anything I want andfortunately I worked hard to be
where I am, so that's not aproblem anymore.
Mila (13:49):
I know I remember like every time you know now they,
for whatever reason in schoolsthey like, give the stuff to the
kids in the school every year.
But when we were kids theywould give us a list at the
beginning of each school year of, like, all the things you need
to buy.
And I remember like every timethat list would come in I had
(14:14):
like this dread of like we haveno money, like where's my mom
going to find money to, like buyme a calculator and markers,
you know, and I remember likegrowing up and being like I will
never be poor again.
This will never be an issue.
My children will never wonderwhere their calculator is coming
from.
So now, when people are like,how do you have the motivation
to work so hard?
I'm like this is not hard.
Being poor is hard, beinghungry is hard.
(14:36):
Not knowing where your rent iscoming from is hard, working
hard and having all of theopportunities in the world to
build grow and develop is ablessing.
Why don't you tell us a littlebit about how you decided to
become a lawyer?
Ilona (14:51):
In high school I asked my dad.
Well, I told my dad that I wantto go to the moon, I want to be
an astronaut.
And he told me because he stillhad the fresh off the boat
mentality is that you're a woman, you're not going to end up
going to the moon, you're goingto be sitting behind the desk
somewhere.
But I was really good at math.
So then I said I want to be anactress Because when I was a kid
(15:12):
my grandma made sure that whenI would walk on the street I
would sing really loud so itwould be discovered.
And I used to do that.
I would like scream my butt offscreen like singing on the
street as a little kid.
But that didn't happen informer Soviet Union, never got
discovered.
So then I went to a psychic tofigure out what the hell am I
gonna be.
First I went to her when I was16 with one of my boyfriends I
(15:34):
mean the boyfriend.
At a time I remember she toldme that I was gonna have nine
children and that she gave him areading and said he was gonna
not have nine children whenyou're on your way, I don't know
about him.
I'm fine now and I have somefrozen embryos.
But you know, we broke up liketwo months later.
(15:55):
So your reading was a lie.
So a couple of years later, Itake my other boyfriend to a
psychic.
While he's getting a readingand I refuse to spend any more
money on that lady.
Mila (16:05):
So same psychic?
Ilona (16:06):
Same psychic, but I wasn't going to participate.
So while I'm in a waiting room
Mila (16:15):
Why would you not find a new psychic?
Ilona (16:16):
Because she was like the main one there on the radio all
the time.
So then I.
So I'm sitting in the hallwayand then her daughter is there.
She's like okay, why don't Igive you a reading for, like
free?
So she looked at my hand and Isaid well, I really don't know
what I'm going to like.
What am I going to be when I'mgoing to grow up?
And she says I see a lot ofpapers around you.
I remember being in the showerthat night and I was thinking a
(16:36):
lot of papers, I guess I couldbe someone's secretary or I
could have secretaries.
And then my dad, I remember,mentioned to me before that only
lawyers or doctors make it toAmerica, because that's what
every immigrant thinks.
Okay, I'll be a lawyer andthat's it.
That's when I made a commitment.
I was in a shower shortly aftera psychic reading, and that's
(16:58):
how it got started.
Mila (16:59):
So my story is much simpler.
We came to America and my momwas like, okay, mila, like we
brought you here.
I don't speak the language,this is not my country.
Like you better make it worthit.
So then she said you can be alawyer, a doctor or a failure,
take your pick.
So I really thought about itand I was like, well, I don't
(17:22):
like blood, so I guess I'll be alawyer because I don't want to
be a failure.
And then I really like fell inlove with Law Order and I
watched Law Order religiously.
So I like really liked whatthey were doing and I always I
like became just so enthralledwith the fact that, like the
justice system worked sosmoothly here, because growing
(17:43):
up, like in the Soviet Union,there was no justice system.
In the Soviet Union there wasno justice system.
I remember like my uncle'sfriend got his head chopped off
for 300 bucks and no one evenlike knew who did it, what did
it.
Like people would disappear allthe time, like no one knew here
, like everything wasinvestigated.
I was like wow, and I was likeso amazed by the constitution
and the two-party system.
(18:03):
I was like this is genius, Ilike like super nerdy, but I was
just like really, reallypassionate about like the
American legal system.
And then I like for surethought I would be a prosecutor
and I would watch like the cuteblonde lady in Law and Order who
would like be eating Chinesefood in the high rise at two in
the morning like solving cases.
(18:23):
I was like that's going to beme.
But then when I like became anadult, I was like I need to make
money and like not, you know,deal with murder all day.
So yeah, here.
Ilona (18:34):
I remember when I was a kid and I was watching some
black and white Russian movie, Iwas impressed with the part
where there was a girl who wasshe was a prostitute but she got
arrested.
And then I remember this momentwhere she's like reciting these
code sections to the cop andthen they let her go and I was
(18:55):
like that's so cool, like sheknows code sections.
So, as a litigator, like I knowmy code sections really well.
But I didn't know I was goingto be a lawyer back then.
Mila (19:00):
How did you end up choosing being a family attorney
?
Ilona (19:04):
I think it chose me because I opened up my law firm
straight out of law school.
I remember I worked for acriminal law attorney during law
school because I had zeroconnections and I wanted to have
something on my resume and hewould accept every case that
would walk through a door andgive it to me and I did the work
and it would get filed andeverything was fine.
(19:25):
So then that gave me confidencethat you know, maybe I can do
this myself.
So when it came time to talkabout salary, after I pass the
bar exam, he calls me.
He says I can't afford to payyou salary, but how about I open
up a office, like in anapartment building in North Park
somewhere, and we'll doeverything 50-50.
(19:46):
So all he would do is at leastpay rent and then I would give
him 50% of profits.
Which gave me an idea.
And I was 20, I just turned 25.
I'm like I wonder what would be, what would it cost to just
have my own office, to rent anoffice and do it myself?
Because I speak fluent Russian,I speak fluent Spanish, and
during that time I went downtownand started looking, walking
(20:07):
around and called the phonenumbers I saw for rent and just
inquired what it would cost torent my own office and I ended
up just signing the lease intothe first place.
I walked actually in Sparklesbuilding, I remember that
building.
Yeah, I mean it was.
I signed a lease withoutapplying for a job anywhere and
(20:30):
then put an ad into Russiannewspaper, mexican newspaper and
Yellow Pages.
At the time Russians andHispanics started using my
services.
So I took every case that wouldwalk through the door and
prepared hard and learned andwent all the way with it.
So well, from family law Iended up getting a criminal case
(20:53):
that was a lewd act with aminor because I helped my client
get 50-50 custody of his kid.
The mother got mad so accused,worked up her teenage daughter
to accuse a stepdad of touchingher breast.
That turned into criminalcharges lewd act with a minor
which he was facing eight yearsin prison or jail.
(21:13):
I learned that people use familycourt to manipulate the system
to get advantage and that got memore interested in family law
and I started getting morefamily law cases and eventually,
after like second year into mypractice, 50% of my practice was
, I would say, family law andthe other 50% was personal
(21:35):
injury and civil litigation.
I did breach of contract cases.
I did some jury trials and Isaid, okay, I'm just going to do
family law exclusively, but wehave recently added personal
injury back to our practice asof January 2025.
We're going to be serving theRussian community, hispanic
community and everybody else outthere to help them with
personal injury
Mila (21:56):
And employment.
I did totally opposite of you.
I went the firm route.
So initially I started mypractice I mean, I didn't know
anybody, I didn't know anyattorneys and I ultimately ended
up doing personal injurydefense work and I really liked
litigation and I liked the trialpractice, but I didn't love
(22:17):
being on the defense and Ididn't, and it wasn't.
You know, I used to think therewas like good guys and bad guys
, but now I realize everyone isokay, like everyone's doing
their job.
There's a lot of gray areas inthe law, but I still didn't love
defending.
You know, personal injury cases,especially looking at people
who were injured, and you know,watching videos of people in the
(22:39):
hospital like screaming in pain.
We're going to do that inplaintiffs.
On the plaintiff side, though,it's different.
It's different because I feellike I'm on the right side.
You're helping people, yes, andlike, what really like kind of
switched me from PI toemployment, was one case.
It was a 3-year-old who fellout of a 14-story building and
(23:01):
was one case it was athree-year-old who fell out of a
14th story building and he fellbecause he was like climbing on
this air conditioning unit,that like, and there was no
screen in the window.
So they were suing.
Did he survive?
He survived because a treebroke his fall.
But he was very badly injured.
Basically had you know, defecthealth, defects for life, like
lost all his teeth, had wasgoing to have a limp for his
(23:23):
whole life.
And at that time Daniel, myoldest, was, I think, two or
three and so watching the videosof this like child, like fully
in a full body cast, like crying, like it, just I couldn't do it
.
I just could not do it.
I was like PI defense not forme.
I was like employment it's likesalacious, it's sexy, like no
(23:47):
one's hurt.
I mean there's a lot of traumathat comes with it, like
emotional trauma.
I can handle that, but I can'tsee injured kids anymore Like I
was, just like I can't, unlessI'm like helping them get money
and like fighting for theirrights.
I don't want to defend caseslike that.
So I started doing employmentand I went to big law.
I started working at JacksonLewis.
There was like a thousandattorneys.
It was super.
I mean you have to hustle, butagain, I'm not scared of hard
(24:09):
work, but it was good.
I really liked employment, itwas fun.
And then I got an opportunityto start an employment
plaintiff's practice andinitially I was like I'm not
really a plaintiff's lawyer.
I've always been on the defenseside.
But I always say don't miss anyopportunities.
I'm a yes girl.
So I was like you know what,I'll do it.
(24:29):
So I started an employmentpractice and it was great and I
love fighting for people and Ialways say you have to find
passion in what you do, becausethat's what gives you motivation
.
I can't imagine waking up andnot wanting to go to work.
I can't imagine waking up andbeing like oh, I have to go to
work again.
This is terrible.
(24:50):
Like what kind of life is that?
Because we spend so much timeat work, we should enjoy it, you
know.
Ilona (24:54):
I'm happy when I go to work.
It's definitely quiet, I getthings done, I feel productive.
But I would really love to havemore time with my children
because I barely see them.
Like I go to work at, you know,I'll drop off my daughter at
school at 830 in the morning andthen I'll come home at 630.
I'll have 30 minutes with themby Monday through Friday.
Then I have to work out at 730three times a week, half the.
(25:21):
If I'm stuck at work then Imiss it.
Like I love working, I lovegetting things done.
Like before I had children, Iused to work six to seven days a
week.
My car was always the last oneon the parking lot, three, four
in the morning, and obviously Ihad court in the morning or tons
of clients to handle.
And I did that from 2005 to, Iwould say, till 2019, when I had
Ella.
Then I, you know I didn't worktill three four in the morning
(25:43):
anymore, but I still worked alot until I had children in 2023
four in the same year.
I now take my weekends offbecause that's my only time I
really get to spend quality timewith them and that's not even
enough.
there's no time for yourself butyou know how it is for yourself
like I feel guilty getting mynails done because it's an hour
and a half wasting time, youjust have to do it.
Mila (26:04):
That's why I work out at four in the morning, because
everyone's asleep.
If it's like six and I know thekids are about to wake up, I
feel guilty being in the gym.
I'm like I have to go homethey're going to wake
You know, if it's the weekend, Iwork out, even on the weekends,
at five in the morning, five tosix, because otherwise I can't.
I can't because I have aninfant sleeping in my bed in my
room, so I have to take care ofhim at night and he wakes up two
(26:25):
to three times at night.
And then I have Ella sleepingwith me because you know, she's
my little baby and I don't mindat all.
I would love anyways.
Of course my boyfriend doesn'tlike it, but I want to sleep
with Ella forever.
Yeah, I have no kids in my bedroom.
Kids are not allowed to evencome close to my bed.
Ilona (26:42):
How did you decide to
Mila (26:45):
So there was never any other plan.
I met my husband.
We got married after threemonths of knowing each other and
then as soon as I finished lawschool, I finished law school at
24, got pregnant like -finished in or passed the bar in
November, was pregnant byJanuary and had a baby like year
one of law school.
(27:05):
And then I had another babythree years later, and another
baby three years later and now Ihave three kids.
I've been married 12 years andthat was that.
Ilona (27:13):
Yeah, I think - I'm 44.
And your kids are older thanmine because you got started
earlier than me.
I waited till later in lifebecause I wasn't as lucky to
just like meet somebody.
Of course, I heard from myfamily and felt pressured ever
since my 20s, that I'm becomingan old maid and like all your
cousins and everybody's married.
And you know I was sent topsychics a couple of times to
(27:33):
get readings as to why this isnot happening for me.
I was told I've been cursed,that I've jinxed on me, you name
it.
But in reality, like I dated alot, to the point where my young
grandmother was like you know,look at you, what's going on?
Like I'm a grandma, I'm makingit up for all of you guys,
because you didn't date, myother grandma didn't date, my
(27:55):
mom didn't date, so I'm makingit up for all the women in my
married heritage, so say thankyou.
So of course you know we laughedabout it.
But she didn't like you knowshe didn't think it was as funny
, but that's the reality.
I had no choice.
I want you know.
I was like, okay, I'm going toprobably get married and have
(28:21):
kids and I'm 25.
Nope, didn't happen.
Thought it might happen by 30.
Didn't happen.
That might happen by 35, didn'thappen.
So then I said, screw it, I'mjust going to like freeze my
eggs until you know I find theright guy.
Because, as being a divorceattorney, the one mistake you
make that will make your lifemiserable is have children with
the wrong person.
Because for the next 18 yearsyou'll be in court over custody,
over child support.
For the next 18 years you'll bein court over custody over
child support and a whole bunchof other problems.
So I didn't want that and Iwaited.
(28:43):
I was hopeful until I was 39,that you know some prince will
come and sweep me off my feetand everything will be good and
I'll have a family with him.
Didn't happen.
When I was 38, I met myboyfriend and when I met him I
said, hey, I, hey, I decided Iwant to have kids before I'm 40.
So I'm going to have my own kidthis year.
(29:04):
You can hang around with me oryou don't, but I'm doing it.
So he stayed with me.
The first time I did my IVFtransfer, it didn't work.
And then, you know, we stillcontinued dating and I tried
again in April of 2019.
And you know, I now have mybeautiful daughter, ella, and
(29:26):
she's five years old, so andthen I obviously have more
frozen embryos.
I waited and when I was 42, Isaid, okay, not getting any
younger might as well get it outof the way.
So I decided that I'll carryone child and I was going to
hire a surrogate to have anotherchild for me.
(29:48):
But what happened is thateverything doubled.
It went to my ultrasound andthey're like you have twins.
I'm like what?
Well, okay, fine, like I justadapt, like this.
My great blessing, all good.
My boyfriend almost had a heartattack.
I gave birth to twins in Julyof 2023.
And then, as soon as Irecovered from my C-section, the
(30:10):
surrogate's water broke and Ihad to fly to Northern
California to pick up my otherset of twins.
And yeah, I have a funny video.
I I had all the babies at home.
Like I don't need help, I cando this myself, I want to take
care of all the babies myselftonight.
So I had I bought these doublebeds for for the infants, where
(30:31):
they're laying, and and then Ialso had ella sleep with me, so
I had five children.
I thought I'm gonna be able totake care of everybody myself
that night.
Mila (30:39):
I'm getting anxiety listening to this because I had
one newborn and two toddlers andI thought I was going to die.
But go ahead.
Ilona (30:46):
WelI wasn't able to do it .
I definitely needed, you know,my boyfriend's help and I had to
.
I don't remember how that nightwent, but I remember I took
videos because everybody wasscreaming.
I was screaming, I was like, ah, this person wants a boob, not
person my kid.
They get a bottle here and theywake up Ella.
It was a disaster.
So now what we do is, you know,I rotate my babies.
(31:10):
I take a different child everynight into the crib in my room
and Ella sleeps with me, andthen that's a story, but it's
very manageable.
Now that I have five, it's easy, like it's actually way easier.
Mila (31:21):
I feel like humans are just so adaptable, like at first
everything sounds difficult andthen, once you get it, it's
just like meh.
Ilona (31:27):
I got this.
Yeah, like now I'm thinking,you know, although it might be
crazy, but what I mean?
I have two more.
I would have seven kids if Iever did that again.
I would have to hire asurrogate if I ever did that.
Of course, you know, I don'tknow if anybody will agree to it
, but I actually don't needconsent.
So we'll see what happens inlife.
If everything goes to plan andI accomplish my dreams and make
(31:48):
big things happen, then why not?
Mila (31:50):
You know what I love about you more than anything probably
is that like you are reallygood at being positive.
I always say, you know, tellmyself this because I feel like
so often I get into the nittygritty of the hard parts and I'm
like don't let your blessingsbe burdens.
And I feel like you're so goodat that innately, and so like,
keep up the good work.
Ilona (32:11):
I mean, I think life is up and down.
All of us, you know, have ourhighs and have lows and you know
, once you hit the bottom it'sonly going to go up.
So just know that time willheal and I think that when I I
remember a moment when Irealized that it will only get
better.
I had an ingrown nail on my toeand I was like 16.
And I had to go to a doctor tohelp me and I remember he had
(32:37):
this huge syringe and he had toput this.
He had to give me a numbing shotinto my toe like where there's
bone, but you know I had totolerate it.
All I was thinking is timeheals, time heals.
This will be like in the past,like think of the future, like
and that works, and that workand now, like I always think
(33:04):
back of that, I'm like it washurting so much.
Yeah, well, I mean, I think ofmy mindset at the time, not of
my ingrown nail.
I was just thinking this momentwill be the past.
So just get through it, yeah,and then it won't hurt anymore.
well, I hope that everyone feelslike they know you me a little
(33:25):
bit better.
We hope we can share with youwhat it's really like going
through the courts, as well astell you some of the wild
stories.
Mila (33:31):
We will be interviewing past clients, so you don't have
to take our word for it.
You can hear their storiesdirectly from them.
Ilona (33:38):
Now for a taste of what's to come.
Each episode, Mila and I willbring you into our world through
three exciting segments.
Mila (33:44):
First off, we have Hot Off the Headlines, where we dive
into the latest lawsuits andlegal stories making waves in
the news, From shocking twiststo high stakes drama.
We will break it all down foryou with wit and wisdom.
Ilona (33:59):
Then we'll revisit some of our own crime and punishment
and past cases and present drama.
We'll relive our most startlingcases, proving that the stories
of yesterday still pack a punchtoday.
We'll even be inviting specialguests during these segments who
were actually involved in thecases.
Mila (34:15):
And, last but not least, you can look forward to what we
are calling the balancing act.
This is the part where we shareour secrets to juggling
demanding careers, family lifeand personal passions, all while
staying sparkling Tips, tricksand a little glam on the side.
And that's a wrap for today'sepisode of the Glamorous Grind.
Ilona (34:37):
We hope you loved getting to know us, our stories, our
passion for the law and whatmakes this grind just a little
bit more glamorous.
Mila (34:44):
And next week we've got a special guest who turned their
legal battle into alife-changing story.
Ilona (34:51):
You won't want to miss this.
We'll be dropping episodesevery Tuesday, so make sure you
stay tuned.
Mila (34:57):
Don't forget to subscribe, rate and review wherever you
listen to your podcasts.
Ilona (35:01):
And be sure to follow us on social media for
behind-the-scenes contentupdates and even a sneak peek at
future episodes.
Mila (35:09):
Until next time, remember, success isn't about choosing
between ambition and eleganceyou can have both.
Ilona (35:15):
Stay fabulous, stay fierce, and we'll see you on the
next episode of the GlamorousGrind.
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