August 8, 2025 • 37 mins
Jim Keyes, bestselling author of “Education is Freedom” and former CEO of Blockbuster and 7-Eleven, is a living example of how access to knowledge can transform a life. Jim’s journey began in a tumultuous, disrupted household, where independence was forced on him at an early age.
Rather than letting these disadvantages define him, Jim embraced education—not to climb the professional ladder, but as the ultimate pathway to freedom: freedom of choice, freedom to chart his own course, and freedom from obligation to anyone or anything.
Key Takeaways
- Education = Freedom: Learning isn’t just for jobs or money; it provides the ultimate freedom to choose your own path and live adventurously.
- Turning Disadvantage into Agency: Growing up in a disrupted home gave Jim a unique drive for independence, realized through continual self-education.
- Self-Reliance through Knowledge: The more you learn, the less you depend on others’ approval or authority, especially in uncertain times.
- Resilience Over Resentment: Facing public criticism and hardship (even at the Fortune 500 level) is easier with a mindset focused on learning and adaptability.
- The Power of Curiosity: The single “secret code” to success is staying curious and committed to personal growth at every stage of life.
Jim credits his resilience and self-reliance to his pursuit of learning. He explains that education allowed him to sustain his independence, providing the flexibility to navigate both personal and professional obstacles. Jim’s perspective reframes adversity as a kind of advantage: growing up with less meant greater agency, drive, and the realization that knowledge—and not just money or titles—enables a truly adventurous and autonomous life.
About James Keyes
James W. Keyes is known internationally as a business and social change agent. Currently spearheading several initiatives in the tech, art, and education space, his career has included serving as Chief Executive Officer of two Fortune 500 companies, 7-Eleven, Inc. and Blockbuster, Inc., and serving on numerous civic boards. Now, a best-selling author, Keyes has written Education is Freedom: The Future is In Your Hands.
Coming from humble beginnings in the small town of Grafton, Massachusetts, Jim’s father taught him “the absolute key to freedom is to learn as much as you can, every day of your life”. Keyes majored in political science at College of the Holy Cross, and graduated cum laude and Phi Beta Kappa. He earned a MBA degree from Columbia University in New York, and went on to establish himself in corporate America.
On his quest of lifelong learning, and passionate about aerospace and aviation, Keyes has been a pilot for over 40 years. He is “single-pilot” certified in Textron C525 series Citation Jets, and is also certified to fly helicopters and floatplanes. He is a skilled sculptor, painter, musician, and composer.
A "glow up" signifies a positive transformation, reflecting the journey of becoming a better, more successful version of oneself.
At The Tech Glow Up, we humanize the startup and innovation landscape by focusing on the essential aspects of the entrepreneurial journey. Groundbreaking ideas are often ahead of their time, making resilience and perseverance vital for founders and product leaders.
In our podcast, we engage with innovators to discuss their transformative ideas, the challenges they face, and how they create value for future success.
If you're a founder or product leader seeking your own glow up, or a seasoned entrepreneur with stories to share, we invite you to join our guest list via this link.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Nathan C (00:00):
Hello and welcome to The Glow Up.
I'm Nathan C, and today I'mtalking with Jim Keyes
bestselling author of"Educationis Freedom" and former CEO of
brands like Blockbuster and7-Eleven.
James Keyes (00:14):
Thanks.
Great to be with you!
Nathan C (00:15):
Where did your journey in innovation start?
James Keyes (00:18):
This is my story.
I am the poster child, theliving, breathing example of the
transformative power ofeducation.
Not to give me big jobs or letme make a lot of money.
That's a byproduct, but the realdrive in using education to
transform my life was a passionfor freedom.
(00:43):
Freedom to do what I want to do,be with whom I want to be with,
where I wanna be, anywhere inthe world to explore, to live a
life of adventure, and to haveno boundaries whatsoever.
And it comes from education.
The more I learn, the more I cando.
(01:04):
It's pretty simple.
It's a very simple formula.
Nathan C (01:06):
When did this idea of freedom, education and freedom
start for you?
James Keyes (01:11):
I didn't intentionally set out to say,
I've got an idea, I'm going touse education as a tool! No, it
was quite the opposite.
I grew up really in a highlyunderprivileged, let's say,
literally no running water in alittle three room shack when we
grew up.
And, the irony is that I had noearthly idea that I was in any
(01:35):
way worse off than kids whohappen to have bigger houses and
fancy game rooms and beautifulcars and things like that.
I, it just didn't matter.
Interestingly, at a very youngage, what I realized that I had,
that many of my peers did nothave, I had freedom.
(01:55):
Now that came from having atotally disrupted household and,
mom bailing and dad in thehospital and pretty much having
to take care of myself, but Ihad freedom and that freedom I
realized me very independent,but it was only as good as my
ability to sustain it bylearning enough to take care of
(02:20):
myself.
So education turned into my pathto stay free.
I didn't have to be obligated toanyone.
Whether it's a job.
Whether it's an authorityfigure, it didn't matter because
the more I learned and the moreI could do, the more free I
became.
I had the advantage, let's say,of growing up disadvantaged.
Nathan C (02:44):
In retrospect to be able to look back at, you know,
a disjointed, a little bit of achaotic situation growing up and
seeing how 1.) You still hadthat peace and that happiness,
regardless of the monetaryaspects of it.
And that it very early installedthis kind of focus on agency.
(03:08):
And it seems like a really clearidea of like, what are my goals
and how do I go make themhappen?
And I feel like for today'sworkforce, for the younger
generations that are coming upfor this exact moment, hearing
this story it feels like this isthe moment.
There is a bit of chaos.
(03:29):
There is a bit of confusionabout what is the path forward.
But it seems like you found thatin education.
I'm curious, if at such a youngage you understood that like
learning and knowledge and yourdrive were differentiators, what
was the first business that youstarted?
Or like, what was the first sortof entrepreneurial idea that you
(03:52):
had?
And about how old were you whenthat came about?
James Keyes (03:55):
The first entrepreneurial idea was
actually I must have been 7, 8years old.
I wanted to be a rocketscientist.
I was a child of the, Apollo eraand Gemini, and a guy named
Robert Goddard was the father ofmodern rocketry.
He grew up and did hisexperiments in the adjoining
(04:15):
town, Auburn, Massachusetts,Worcester, Massachusetts, where
I grew up.
So I just had this exposure tospace, to rockets, et cetera.
And yet, my friends could affordEstes Rockets.
Those things that you buy andassemble and you build the, they
were kind of expensive, so Icould never afford them.
So I set out to build my own! IfRobert Goddard can do it, I can
(04:36):
do it.
Now, I wasn't really at sevenyears old, sophisticated enough
to come up with very effectivepropulsion systems.
So I was using a flashlightbody, putting fins and a nose
cone on it, with glue and thentrying to fashion a propulsion
system out of a baggie, sometwisties from the grocery store
bread bags and a couple of otherthings I had.
(04:58):
Nearly blew myself up and burneddown the neighborhood in the
process! My firstentrepreneurial venture, was not
exactly a success.
But I learned a lot from it.
Nathan C (05:09):
Amazing! You've had a very unique position,
potentially like in the world onworking with some household,
global brands.
Iconic! Right?
And you've been the one who wasresponsible for setting a vision
for not just the company, butyou've also kind of owned how
(05:31):
those companies think aboutbringing in technology, bringing
in innovation.
And some of the times, you'vehad wild successes and other
times you were maybe ahead ofthe curve.
Can you talk a little bit to theskills that you learned building
this career, that helped youdrive ideas, help other people
(05:51):
learn about innovation andtechnology in that more
traditional, sort of businesssetting?
James Keyes (05:57):
Yeah, you want the secret code?
All right, here it is! When Iset out to write this book, my
first three words in the book"Education is Freedom" doesn't
sound like on the surface it'san entrepreneurial book or a
business book, but it is.
It's about learning andleadership is basically about
learning.
My first three words in the bookwere the secret code.
(06:19):
Total secret code to being anentrepreneur.
Ready?
Change equals opportunity.
Think of that acronym, CEO.
I didn't realize that until Iwrote those three words down.
I stepped back and I went,"Oh,check that out!" Change equals
opportunity.
I'm gonna own this! It is therole, the very essence of the
(06:41):
role of a CEO or an entrepreneurto recognize that all commerce
from the beginning of timebegins and ends with change.
Something changes.
Someone responds to it.
They're compensated for it.
Then what happens?
They get big, they getsuccessful.
(07:02):
They then are afraid to change,And then they resist change, and
then inertia steps in, and thenwhat happens?
They decline and sometimes theygo away.
Nathan C (07:13):
Change equals opportunity! I love how you were
diving into there! Foundersstart in change, right?
Like there's a disruptive idea,there is a pain, there is a gap.
Often as a founder, as a leader,you are charged with
systematizing, formalizing,packaging, normalizing
everything that you do.
And what you're saying is thatlike, that model is inherently
(07:36):
broken.
Because there's always going tobe change happening.
The person buys your service andbecomes wildly successful, or
they buy your service and itbankrupts them.
You're always in a sea of changeand opportunity at the same
time.
It's easy to write those thingsin a book.
How do you spread that kind ofunderstanding across thousands
(08:01):
of stores across continents?
James Keyes (08:04):
Well, there are three elements to change to
being able to manage throughchange that I have captured in
the book.
I call it the what to learn, inorder to be able to manage
through any times.
Those three things are first,embracing change.
That's the underlying premise.
The second is confidence,because it's fear.
(08:26):
It's the lack of confidence thatcreeps in, that inhibits change.
Why do companies like IBM growso big and they're massive and
they own the computer space andthen they can't adapt and some
startup like Dell comes in andkicks their butt?
Because IBM gets so big thatthey're resistant to change.
(08:46):
I saw it at 7-Eleven.
I saw it at Blockbuster.
Successfully tackled it at7-Eleven.
Not so successfully tried totackle it, made some great
progress, but didn't get therewith Blockbuster.
But the fundamentals are thesame.
Change, confidence, and thenhere's the third piece.
And this is, if I left anythingon the table with Blockbuster,
(09:09):
it was and if I wanted to do itagain, it would be this:
Clarity.
Because you see, you can havethe best strategy in the world,
which I believed we had atBlockbuster.
Something called total access,making convenient access to
media, entertainment, availableto anyone, anywhere, anytime,
whether it's in store, in akiosk, by mail, or even
(09:31):
streaming.
Yes, we did.
But, when the investmentcommunity collapsed in 2008 and
we had a billion dollars ofdebt, the clarity of that
message and simplicity of thatmessage to keep not just my
investors happy, but myshareholders had to be happy, my
customers had to be happy, andunderstand the opportunity.
(09:56):
But my suppliers too had to behappy.
And really what happened toBlockbuster is the suppliers
gave into their fears.
Suppliers being the studios.
We only had six big providers ofcontent.
And when one took our creditterms from 90 days, so in other
words, we'd buy a movie wedidn't have to pay for 90 days.
(10:16):
That was a huge advantage.
When they got scared and said,we're gonna put you on cash
terms, and then the othersfollowed immediately because no
one wanted to be the last manstanding, that pulled 300
million in liquidity out of thecompany almost overnight.
And we were forced into arestructuring that was not
(10:38):
really planned, nor was itreally necessary unless a change
like that occurred.
Now, could I have done a betterjob of communicating the
strategy, the liquidity that wehad to those suppliers, the
importance of them staying onboard where we're heading in the
future?
Yes.
Perhaps I could have done abetter job with that.
(11:00):
But that clarity is soimportant.
Simplicity.
The ability to communicateeffectively, all of that rolled
into a package that I callclarity.
So those three things.
Change, have the confidence todo something about it, and the
clarity or simplicity to be ableto not only lay out a vision for
(11:21):
where you're going, how are yougonna navigate through the
storm, but the direction you'regoing in.
Because if you can't explain it,then your team can't follow it
and your stakeholders can't stayon board.
Nathan C (11:32):
I feel like, especially early entrepreneurs
and I talk with a lot ofinnovation products.
What you're doing in the mostprecise development or
technological terms is oftenwhat we think about, in those
terms of clarity.
And I love that you called out,I had so many different kinds of
customers that I needed to becommunicating with, that I
(11:56):
needed to be managing, that Ineeded to have that clarity
with.
And it's not just the studios,it's not just the shareholders,
it's not just the board but it'salso the consumers.
Those are so many differentlayers to be playing on.
And if you are just focused onone of them as a global leader
(12:17):
you're falling short.
And sometimes, at no real faultof your own, right?
Nobody planned on losing 300million in liquidity.
Going back to confidence andchange, what is your approach as
like, not just a leader, but asa person for receiving such a
horrible piece of news, thatcould be personalized into
(12:40):
critique of your own acumen.
Where do you find the confidenceto move forward and to know that
you have another at bat, youhave another play, another day
to work?
James Keyes (12:49):
Well first of all, I'll give you an example of what
happened to me.
This is such a critical elementof leadership and people you
know, you get all theseleadership lessons and classes
and all this stuff, and peopledon't really see the impact of a
leader with confidence.
And here's the criteria.
It's not personal.
(13:11):
It is not personal.
Lemme repeat that.
It is not personal.
It is business.
And when you do the best thatyou can with the best
information that you have atyour fingertips, and you don't
win the game, you can't thentake it personally.
You have to get back at bat anddo it again and learn from the
(13:34):
things that happened last time.
And as long as you're learningalong the way, the mistakes are
never really mistakes.
They're learning opportunities,they're tuition.
And this is something that a lotof people forget.
Here's what happens when youtake it personally.
When all of that startshappening.
The press turns, you know,they're very quick.
(13:55):
All of a sudden I, my pictureshows up in the New York Post
with the Pinocchio nose, that'snot fun, and it hurts.
Now two ways I can respond tothat.
I can either say it ain't aboutme.
I understand why they did it.
Maybe somebody even leaked thatinformation'cause they've got a
different motive.
They're trying to make somequick money trying to crush us,
(14:18):
push us into bankruptcy.
It isn't about me, it'sbusiness.
As long as I think that way,then I'm not going to react as
the victim because the victimsays, oh, woe is me.
They're picking on me.
They're bad.
Blame this person.
Blame that person.
I'm the victim now.
And victimhood is notleadership.
(14:41):
Victimhood is never ever goingto be leadership.
Now it happens all the time.
You see people, I won't namenames, but it happens.
A leader has to be able towithstand the arrows that are
gonna come from all kinds ofdirections and recognize it's
not about me.
My ego is not going to bebruised by all of these negative
(15:03):
things people are saying.
If I'm doing the best I can.
With the best information I haveand trusting in my team to be
with me on this boat, trying tosteer it through this storm.
It sounds good.
I can say that oh, I don't takeit personally no.
I was fine, you know.
No! It hurt and I did.
(15:24):
I was vulnerable to thatinsecurity that comes from being
besmirched in the press,attacked and accused of lying
and things like that.
And you go wait, wait.
We did not have a liquiditycrisis until those studios
bolted on me.
So here's what happened.
I was at an event at Bill Gates'House.
Called The CEO Summit.
(15:45):
When you're leading a bigFortune 500 company, you get to
do some pretty cool stuff andit's a pretty small community
ultimately.
So here I am at Gates' house andI'm looking around.
I'm a little starstruck'cause Iwas pretty young compared to a
lot of the other leaders at thetime.
And you know, Bezos was there,Meg Whitman and, you know, lot
of Fortune 500 CEOs and I'mlooking around saying, this is
(16:08):
pretty cool.
And I go over to get somedinner, at the little line, you
know, picking up some shrimp orsomething like that, and who's
next to me but Warren Buffet.
And Warren said, so Jim, how areyou doing?
Good to see you again.
What are you doing now?
You know, he had followed mysuccess at 7-Eleven and I had
some correspondence with him inthe past.
I became apologetic.
(16:30):
I was like, oh yeah, I'm atBlockbuster.
You know, Warren, I'm gettingthe crap beat outta me.
The press is all over me.
I was in the New York Post witha Pinocchio nose.
This really sucks.
I'm just not sure.
You know, I don't know.
I'm not sure what to do now.
Maybe I don't know if I'm gonnastay or not.
And he looked at me and here'sthe turning point we all need
(16:51):
sometimes that muse.
And Warren looked at me andsaid, Would you rather be on the
bench watching somebody else upthere doing that?" And I was
like,"Well, no! Of course not!""I wanna be in the game!" He was
like, well, dust yourself off.
Get back at the plate and takeanother swing.
You'll be fine as long as you'redoing the best you can.
And it was exactly what I neededat exactly the right time
(17:14):
because we're human beings.
We're naturally going to bevulnerable to our own
insecurities and our own egothat says, oh, they're picking
on me.
And I began to drift down thatpath of victimhood and become a
quitter.
And I thank God I didn't go downthat path.
(17:36):
I don't think I ultimately wouldhave, but I was, I was slumping
a little.
And when he said that I did dustmyself off, I stayed in the
game.
I saw it through, we hadstrategic deals.
I got Dish to the table.
I almost had to deal withGoogle.
I was this close to it andultimately was able to
successfully restructure thecompany, get a sale to Dish
(17:58):
Network, and then Dish gave it achance to see another day.
Nathan C (18:02):
Wow! Thank you, for sharing that.
That's so amazing! In the spanof just a few moments, you know,
my heart sunk as I was posingthe question about how do you
deal with that sort of changeand then, you know, back up to
the skies imagining, you know, Ioften talk about how important
(18:23):
just having one person believein you can be for like a founder
or a creator, somebody with abig idea.
Just like one person saying,"Ithink you could do it!" It can
be so transformational and tohave of all people, Warren
Buffet.
Right?
Like, how do you not haveconfidence if Warren Buffet's
(18:43):
like, yeah, so what?
200 million?
James Keyes (18:45):
Yeah, we all need friends around us that can pull
us up off the ground and tell usto dust ourselves off.
I'm a big believer and in fact,one of the things that I've been
talking about a lot is thatknowledge is the antidote to
fear.
Clearly, the more understandingyou have, the more knowledge you
have, the less you have to fear.
(19:06):
But there's always that elementof unknown.
There's always something thatyou don't know.
And you won't get the answer to.
No matter how much you dig.
Then what?
Now here's where I invoke Yoda,because when Yoda was teaching
Luke how to be a Jedi.
(19:27):
He taught him the skillsnecessary.
He had to have the knowledgenecessary to be a Jedi.
But then there was this otherelement.
What about those things youdon't know?
What about those things youcan't control?
That's when you must have theForce be with you.
And I like to use that in my owncase.
Everybody can interpret ithowever they want, but I
(19:48):
interpret it as my faith.
And it can be a universal faith,it can be a faith in God, it can
be a faith in a religion, it canbe a faith in the universe.
It can be a faith in yourself.
But it's that balance betweenwhat we know and our faith that
it will work out.
(20:09):
And so you collect the bestknowledge you can, the most
knowledge you have, and then youproceed with faith in yourself.
That you'll be able toaccomplish it.
If you don't have the either orboth, you'll fly around in
circles.
Nathan C (20:26):
I gotta give that space.
You really got me.
There's so often, right?
Like founders are described ashaving it's not quite
predestination, right?
But it is like this force thatis driving them regardless and,
to put a name to it, to havethat be part of the strength
that you bring, to your work asa leader and as somebody trying
(20:47):
to do really hard things.
it fits right into your threeCs.
James Keyes (20:51):
Well think about it, do you know any successful
person that isn't a believer?
Nathan C (20:56):
In the mission, in the people?
James Keyes (20:59):
Something.
Yes! Now, a religious person cansay, well a believer is a person
of faith.
Sure, okay.
Well, a believer in themselvesis a person of faith.
They have faith in themselves,you know.
But you've got to have a beliefin something.
It's such an important elementof confidence that, yes, I can
do this! Maybe it's calling on ahigher power to help you do
(21:21):
this.
Maybe it's a belief that, evenif I don't have all of the
knowledge to accomplish this,the universe will conspire to
make it happen.
Nathan C (21:29):
Ooh! So I wanna tag on this because you have a glow up
that you're working on.
It seems like, write this book,this mission of sharing this
idea that education is freedom.
What's the glow up that you'reworking on now and what are you
hoping to see in the next sixmonths?
James Keyes (21:47):
Okay, so, my glow up, if you will, is a belief
that education and learningenhanced by technology, this is
an important element, isliterally the key the future of
humanity and peace on earth.
Which has always been elusivefor humanity.
(22:10):
Let me unwind that a little.
Think of all the problems in theworld that we've had throughout
history, what causes it?
Fear, somebody's afraid ofsomething.
Maybe a little greed in there,but greed causes fear.
Think about it in the simplestterms.
Remember I said clarity, right?
So think of the simplest terms.
When you're afraid and you're akid, one of the first things
you're afraid of is the monsterin the room.
(22:30):
What do you do?
You call for mom and she turnson the light and she goes, oh,
look at that.
Look under the bed! There's nomonster.
Now I have nothing to be afraidof because I have knowledge that
there really isn't a monster inthe room.
And if you think about knowledgeand education throughout
history, the more advancedhumanity is, the less we have to
(22:51):
fear.
We don't have natural predatorsanymore.
The less we need the old fightor flight, and yet it still
shows up on the battlefield.
It shows up in the boardroom.
It shows up in the classroom.
You know, somebody's mad at you,they're ready to beat you up.
It's like, why?
Come on.
What are you afraid of?
It's ultimately rooted in fear.
(23:14):
Someone's gonna make you lookbad, show them up, take
something from you, take theirgirlfriend, et cetera.
But it's all fear related.
If this is the case, most of theissues with humanity are rooted
in misunderstanding.
Your culture's different frommine.
That scares me.
Your beliefs are different frommine.
(23:34):
That scares me.
I'm not sure that reflects myvalues, you know, et cetera, et
cetera.
Right?
So what do you do?
Well, you use knowledge toovercome that fear.
Well, technology today, and Ilook at this from a scale
perspective.
I use technology to be able totransform 7-Eleven.
We had no scale.
(23:54):
We had plenty of stores, but wehad no buying power because we
didn't know how to leverage thatbuying power.
We couldn't manage each store totailor its assortment to each
individual neighborhood.
We had to have one assortmentfor every store.
And so what we did is we broughtin technology on a centralized
basis.
(24:14):
That made us more decentralized.
It kind of defies logic, but thecentralization of data and
capture of data allowed us to bemore effective at store level.
Now, take that same model andapply it to the way we teach and
learn.
Today it's very decentralized,but there are some fabulous
educational tools.
(24:35):
Khan Academy is off the chartsin its ability as a tutorial
device to help kids learn mathoutside of the classroom.
Why not bring those same toolsinside of the classroom?
We worry about kids being bored,not engaged, et cetera, because
they're living on their device.
Why not bring that device in theform of LED screens into every
(24:57):
classroom and light up thatlearning experience so it's fun
and engaging for young people.
This is all possible with thepower of technology.
I'm not an educator.
I'm not a technologist, but Iknow scale.
And we have 55 million kids inthis country.
So here's my objective.
My objective is to build theinternet of education
(25:18):
technology, deploy it on anational basis so that every
classroom, every kid has accessto the best tools.
Set out a goal that thepresident would launch and say a
JFK moment.
JFK in 1962 said, we're gonnaput a man on the moon in this
decade.
Not because it's easy, butbecause it's hard.
(25:40):
I want a leader in this country,ideally the president, to stand
up and say, we're gonna have100% literacy by the third grade
in this country.
Talk about transformative act.
If every American kid by thethird grade is fully literate.
And then we're gonna be in thetop three of developed countries
(26:02):
in math and science and readingin this decade.
Possible with the use of scaleand technology.
I'm calling this the mega idea.
Make education great again! I'vegotta put it in terms that this
administration will understand.
It takes national leadership tobe able to say America will be
(26:25):
the best.
Education has always been theenabler for America to succeed,
both in national security.
You think the future of warfare,it's gonna be cyber.
It's gonna be data, not gonna betanks and trench warfare like we
had in the past.
We have to have scientists inschool today, learning math and
science and engineering, we haveto have the best education
(26:48):
system in the world for Americato compete on the global scale.
This is what I wanna try tobring my leadership to the
table, to inspire others to saywe're not gonna sit aside and
let America any longer be middleof the pack when it comes to
education.
We should be the best and let'suse technology to get us there.
Nathan C (27:07):
Mic drop moment.
Oh my goodness! There's like sixthings that I'm struck with.
First on the terms of clarityand vision, you shared this like
outrageously huge vision, right?
An internet of educationtechnology accessible to
everybody that's gonna like,make us literate a hundred
percent literate by the thirdgrade.
(27:29):
That's some like outrageoustransformation.
You've got the confidence andwhat I love is in the moment
where a lot of people areworried about how to maintain
the status quo of education,where they're concerned about
where funding and resources andvision are coming from, your
(27:52):
vision is incredibly aware ofthe challenges and the working
modes for the moment, and you'renot skirting around any of those
challenges.
But like accepting them as, youknow, the stakes to play the
game and running straight towardit.
James Keyes (28:11):
Yeah.
Nathan C (28:12):
I did not expect, like I'm gonna engage the president
to transform education, was oneof the things I would hear in
the podcast today.
So, thank you for challenging mypreconceived notions on how this
happens.
James Keyes (28:25):
Since when are we sitting around clutching our
pearls and saying, oh, what arethey teaching my children?
And, you know, there's nothingwe can do.
The teacher's unions arecontrolling us.
I'm gonna pull my kid outtaschool and homeschool'em.
And it's like, whoa, wait aminute and think about it this
way.
If we leverage the power of thebest technology available and
(28:46):
amortize it across 55 millionkids, there's no public school
in the country with a hundredkids that could ever afford have
the quality of tools that wewere able to provide by making
them available across 55 millionstudents, right?
So there's no homeschool thatcould ever afford the
(29:08):
sophistication of thetechnology.
If you can go to send your childto the classroom and have them
watch on an LED screen, anoperation at Sloan Medical
School or UT Southwestern,that's a learning experience you
could never replicate at homewith your iPad.
So why not leverage the scale ofour national system to give kids
(29:32):
the best education tools thatare available anywhere in the
world.
And then imagine, I I mean wetalk about peace on earth,
right?
If America builds this forAmerican students and we build
the best education system in theworld, why wouldn't we then
share that with the world?
Instead of having to provide aidto different countries, let's
(29:52):
provide them access to the besteducation tools so they can all
help themselves.
Because those children in remotecorners of the planet will now,
even if all they have is accessvia phone, they will have access
to the best literacy tools, mathtools, science tools, anywhere
in the world.
(30:13):
And if you believe that theultimate antidote to fear is
knowledge and the ultimatesolution for things like
terrorism, crime, abuse,poverty, why wouldn't we educate
the world and help people helpthemselves?
Kind of compelling, isn't it?
Nathan C (30:32):
It is! Jim you got me thinking on so many levels and
I'm like super excited for thisvision.
I'm on board in so many ways,but I have to ask just because I
can't not.
You know, that ability to beflexible to ride the wave, to
(30:52):
have confidence in such a momentof disruption feels like it's
easy for people who look likeyou and me to say on a podcast,
but maybe isn't as accessible toeveryone out in the world.
And like similarly, the globalsouth is typically last in
(31:14):
innovation last in access.
Often when you know technologyis going to save the world, the
technology happens and the saveof the world thing sometimes
comes out.
How do you approach, you knowsome of these real concerns
about technology as a savior forthe moment, or innovation, I'm
(31:37):
curious to know your thoughts onhow do you look at the other
side?
James Keyes (31:39):
You're absolutely right.
And you started with the word"but." I am not gonna accept any
buts.
Because the buts are what killus! It's the, but what about the
teacher's unions?
They're gonna block this.
But what about the cost?
It's gonna be expensive.
Yep.
But what about the difficulty?
It's gonna be hard?
But what about, you know, thistool may indoctrinate may be
(32:02):
used by evil people toindoctrinate children.
Yep.
All those"buts" are there.
And this is what I encounteredat 7-Eleven.
I encountered at the AmericanRed Cross.
We did the same thing for theAmerican Red Cross.
Very decentralized organization.
A lot of"buts." Oh, we can'thave centralized systems.
We're local.
We have to be nimble at the, andwhen we build it, and then all
(32:25):
of a sudden they see what'spossible, the"buts" go away.
All the naysayers go away.
The excuses go away because it'ssuch a powerful tool.
It's so transformative.
It's just like, you know, noneof us 20 years ago, sitting
around in a bar drinking beerswould've said, Hey, you know
what I'm gonna do?
I'm gonna get on my phone, I'mgonna call a stranger, and
(32:45):
they're gonna come pick me up intheir car and drive me on the
other side of town.
And you'd be like, that is thedumbest thing I have ever heard.
I would never get in astranger's car! Remember the
days I grew up in the days ofhitchhiking and then it went
away because no one would get ina stranger's car.
Technology enabled a sense ofsafety in doing the unthinkable,
(33:07):
jumping in a total stranger'svehicle and going on the other
side of town at two in themorning, right?
But we do it every single day.
This is the power of technology.
When we build this, they willcome, the"buts" will go away and
the opportunity will be there.
Now there's one other thing indoing this, that, as you said,
(33:29):
some people not only can't wraptheir head around it, they're
afraid they aren't gonna be ableto afford it.
Perhaps they don't have thevision.
Perhaps they'd be afraid of it,et cetera, et cetera.
This is where I see ourresponsibility.
The subtitle of my book,"TheFuture Is In Your Hands." I mean
that as each of us individuallyand those of us who have been
privileged enough to haveenjoyed some success in life, I
(33:52):
think have an obligation to takewhat got us here, which was big
vision.
I didn't get to run 7-Eleven'cause I thought small.
I had to think big.
And what I wanna do is sharethat big thinking and take a
leadership role.
So that others who would neverthink this is possible can be
(34:14):
inspired by it, and I can createa grassroots support'cause even
if the president doesn't havetime, and maybe he doesn't for
this initiative, I'll go afterit on a state level.
I'll try to take Texas andtransform it.
If I can't make it happen inTexas, if I have to wait for the
next administration, I'll do it.
(34:34):
But I am committed to help sharethis vision because I know it is
possible.
It is doable.
This isn't, gee, would thiswork?
The tools exist.
All I'm doing is showing a way apath to scale this in a way that
we can accelerate thetransformation of education in
(34:56):
America and the acceleration ofeducation across this globe.
It'll happen organically overthe next 50, 60, a hundred
years.
Why not let's happen now.
Let's do it! Let's just get itdone.
Nathan C (35:08):
Let's just do it.
I love it! On each episode ofThe Glow Up, we do make time for
a community spotlight.
I'm curious, is there anorganization that you think is
doing great work that could usea little bit of extra attention?
James Keyes (35:20):
Well, there is a foundation by the same name
called Educationist Freedom.
It is primarily in theDallas-Fort Worth area and now,
helping in schools providingcounselors in public schools
trying to help kids understandthat the, opportunity is there
and that the future is in theirhands.
The mission of the EducationistFreedom Foundation is to
(35:42):
convince young people thatcollege may not be for everyone,
but opportunity is, and the pathto unlimited opportunity is to
keep learning as much as youpossibly can.
Nathan C (35:54):
Is there anything based on where you're at now,
with the foundation or the book,that you're looking for, do you
have a call to action for us andhow can people learn more and
connect with you online?
James Keyes (36:06):
Yeah, a couple things.
One, I hope they can find atjameswkeyes.com.
I've got a website, K-E-Y-E-S.
And, I do have a request.
I hope that, people will enjoythe book, but I don't want you
just to buy the book.
What I hope people will get thisbook, but give it away because I
want help in spreading the wordthat the answer to us
(36:31):
individually, collectively isfor us all to take
responsibility for our ownknowledge and critical thinking.
So much we can do to improve ourworld collectively if we all do
that and I hope you'll find thatmessage is loud and clear in the
book and you'll share it withothers.
Nathan C (36:47):
Oh my goodness! What a fantastic place to wrap it up
for us today.
James Keyes, bestselling authorof"Education is Freedom," former
CEO of just some small brandslike 7-Eleven and Blockbuster,
lifelong learner.
James, it was so great to chatwith you today.
Thank you for joining me on TheGlow Up.
James Keyes (37:09):
Appreciate the opportunity and thank you to
everybody, all of yourlisteners, really appreciate it!
Hello and welcome to The Glow Up.
I'm Nathan C, and today I'mtalking with Jim Keyes
bestselling author of"Educationis Freedom" and former CEO of
brands like Blockbuster and7-Eleven.
James Keyes (00:14):
Thanks.
Great to be with you!
Nathan C (00:15):
Where did your journey in innovation start?
James Keyes (00:18):
This is my story.
I am the poster child, theliving, breathing example of the
transformative power ofeducation.
Not to give me big jobs or letme make a lot of money.
That's a byproduct, but the realdrive in using education to
transform my life was a passionfor freedom.
(00:43):
Freedom to do what I want to do,be with whom I want to be with,
where I wanna be, anywhere inthe world to explore, to live a
life of adventure, and to haveno boundaries whatsoever.
And it comes from education.
The more I learn, the more I cando.
(01:04):
It's pretty simple.
It's a very simple formula.
Nathan C (01:06):
When did this idea of freedom, education and freedom
start for you?
James Keyes (01:11):
I didn't intentionally set out to say,
I've got an idea, I'm going touse education as a tool! No, it
was quite the opposite.
I grew up really in a highlyunderprivileged, let's say,
literally no running water in alittle three room shack when we
grew up.
And, the irony is that I had noearthly idea that I was in any
(01:35):
way worse off than kids whohappen to have bigger houses and
fancy game rooms and beautifulcars and things like that.
I, it just didn't matter.
Interestingly, at a very youngage, what I realized that I had,
that many of my peers did nothave, I had freedom.
(01:55):
Now that came from having atotally disrupted household and,
mom bailing and dad in thehospital and pretty much having
to take care of myself, but Ihad freedom and that freedom I
realized me very independent,but it was only as good as my
ability to sustain it bylearning enough to take care of
(02:20):
myself.
So education turned into my pathto stay free.
I didn't have to be obligated toanyone.
Whether it's a job.
Whether it's an authorityfigure, it didn't matter because
the more I learned and the moreI could do, the more free I
became.
I had the advantage, let's say,of growing up disadvantaged.
Nathan C (02:44):
In retrospect to be able to look back at, you know,
a disjointed, a little bit of achaotic situation growing up and
seeing how 1.) You still hadthat peace and that happiness,
regardless of the monetaryaspects of it.
And that it very early installedthis kind of focus on agency.
(03:08):
And it seems like a really clearidea of like, what are my goals
and how do I go make themhappen?
And I feel like for today'sworkforce, for the younger
generations that are coming upfor this exact moment, hearing
this story it feels like this isthe moment.
There is a bit of chaos.
(03:29):
There is a bit of confusionabout what is the path forward.
But it seems like you found thatin education.
I'm curious, if at such a youngage you understood that like
learning and knowledge and yourdrive were differentiators, what
was the first business that youstarted?
Or like, what was the first sortof entrepreneurial idea that you
(03:52):
had?
And about how old were you whenthat came about?
James Keyes (03:55):
The first entrepreneurial idea was
actually I must have been 7, 8years old.
I wanted to be a rocketscientist.
I was a child of the, Apollo eraand Gemini, and a guy named
Robert Goddard was the father ofmodern rocketry.
He grew up and did hisexperiments in the adjoining
(04:15):
town, Auburn, Massachusetts,Worcester, Massachusetts, where
I grew up.
So I just had this exposure tospace, to rockets, et cetera.
And yet, my friends could affordEstes Rockets.
Those things that you buy andassemble and you build the, they
were kind of expensive, so Icould never afford them.
So I set out to build my own! IfRobert Goddard can do it, I can
(04:36):
do it.
Now, I wasn't really at sevenyears old, sophisticated enough
to come up with very effectivepropulsion systems.
So I was using a flashlightbody, putting fins and a nose
cone on it, with glue and thentrying to fashion a propulsion
system out of a baggie, sometwisties from the grocery store
bread bags and a couple of otherthings I had.
(04:58):
Nearly blew myself up and burneddown the neighborhood in the
process! My firstentrepreneurial venture, was not
exactly a success.
But I learned a lot from it.
Nathan C (05:09):
Amazing! You've had a very unique position,
potentially like in the world onworking with some household,
global brands.
Iconic! Right?
And you've been the one who wasresponsible for setting a vision
for not just the company, butyou've also kind of owned how
(05:31):
those companies think aboutbringing in technology, bringing
in innovation.
And some of the times, you'vehad wild successes and other
times you were maybe ahead ofthe curve.
Can you talk a little bit to theskills that you learned building
this career, that helped youdrive ideas, help other people
(05:51):
learn about innovation andtechnology in that more
traditional, sort of businesssetting?
James Keyes (05:57):
Yeah, you want the secret code?
All right, here it is! When Iset out to write this book, my
first three words in the book"Education is Freedom" doesn't
sound like on the surface it'san entrepreneurial book or a
business book, but it is.
It's about learning andleadership is basically about
learning.
My first three words in the bookwere the secret code.
(06:19):
Total secret code to being anentrepreneur.
Ready?
Change equals opportunity.
Think of that acronym, CEO.
I didn't realize that until Iwrote those three words down.
I stepped back and I went,"Oh,check that out!" Change equals
opportunity.
I'm gonna own this! It is therole, the very essence of the
(06:41):
role of a CEO or an entrepreneurto recognize that all commerce
from the beginning of timebegins and ends with change.
Something changes.
Someone responds to it.
They're compensated for it.
Then what happens?
They get big, they getsuccessful.
(07:02):
They then are afraid to change,And then they resist change, and
then inertia steps in, and thenwhat happens?
They decline and sometimes theygo away.
Nathan C (07:13):
Change equals opportunity! I love how you were
diving into there! Foundersstart in change, right?
Like there's a disruptive idea,there is a pain, there is a gap.
Often as a founder, as a leader,you are charged with
systematizing, formalizing,packaging, normalizing
everything that you do.
And what you're saying is thatlike, that model is inherently
(07:36):
broken.
Because there's always going tobe change happening.
The person buys your service andbecomes wildly successful, or
they buy your service and itbankrupts them.
You're always in a sea of changeand opportunity at the same
time.
It's easy to write those thingsin a book.
How do you spread that kind ofunderstanding across thousands
(08:01):
of stores across continents?
James Keyes (08:04):
Well, there are three elements to change to
being able to manage throughchange that I have captured in
the book.
I call it the what to learn, inorder to be able to manage
through any times.
Those three things are first,embracing change.
That's the underlying premise.
The second is confidence,because it's fear.
(08:26):
It's the lack of confidence thatcreeps in, that inhibits change.
Why do companies like IBM growso big and they're massive and
they own the computer space andthen they can't adapt and some
startup like Dell comes in andkicks their butt?
Because IBM gets so big thatthey're resistant to change.
(08:46):
I saw it at 7-Eleven.
I saw it at Blockbuster.
Successfully tackled it at7-Eleven.
Not so successfully tried totackle it, made some great
progress, but didn't get therewith Blockbuster.
But the fundamentals are thesame.
Change, confidence, and thenhere's the third piece.
And this is, if I left anythingon the table with Blockbuster,
(09:09):
it was and if I wanted to do itagain, it would be this:
Clarity.
Because you see, you can havethe best strategy in the world,
which I believed we had atBlockbuster.
Something called total access,making convenient access to
media, entertainment, availableto anyone, anywhere, anytime,
whether it's in store, in akiosk, by mail, or even
(09:31):
streaming.
Yes, we did.
But, when the investmentcommunity collapsed in 2008 and
we had a billion dollars ofdebt, the clarity of that
message and simplicity of thatmessage to keep not just my
investors happy, but myshareholders had to be happy, my
customers had to be happy, andunderstand the opportunity.
(09:56):
But my suppliers too had to behappy.
And really what happened toBlockbuster is the suppliers
gave into their fears.
Suppliers being the studios.
We only had six big providers ofcontent.
And when one took our creditterms from 90 days, so in other
words, we'd buy a movie wedidn't have to pay for 90 days.
(10:16):
That was a huge advantage.
When they got scared and said,we're gonna put you on cash
terms, and then the othersfollowed immediately because no
one wanted to be the last manstanding, that pulled 300
million in liquidity out of thecompany almost overnight.
And we were forced into arestructuring that was not
(10:38):
really planned, nor was itreally necessary unless a change
like that occurred.
Now, could I have done a betterjob of communicating the
strategy, the liquidity that wehad to those suppliers, the
importance of them staying onboard where we're heading in the
future?
Yes.
Perhaps I could have done abetter job with that.
(11:00):
But that clarity is soimportant.
Simplicity.
The ability to communicateeffectively, all of that rolled
into a package that I callclarity.
So those three things.
Change, have the confidence todo something about it, and the
clarity or simplicity to be ableto not only lay out a vision for
(11:21):
where you're going, how are yougonna navigate through the
storm, but the direction you'regoing in.
Because if you can't explain it,then your team can't follow it
and your stakeholders can't stayon board.
Nathan C (11:32):
I feel like, especially early entrepreneurs
and I talk with a lot ofinnovation products.
What you're doing in the mostprecise development or
technological terms is oftenwhat we think about, in those
terms of clarity.
And I love that you called out,I had so many different kinds of
customers that I needed to becommunicating with, that I
(11:56):
needed to be managing, that Ineeded to have that clarity
with.
And it's not just the studios,it's not just the shareholders,
it's not just the board but it'salso the consumers.
Those are so many differentlayers to be playing on.
And if you are just focused onone of them as a global leader
(12:17):
you're falling short.
And sometimes, at no real faultof your own, right?
Nobody planned on losing 300million in liquidity.
Going back to confidence andchange, what is your approach as
like, not just a leader, but asa person for receiving such a
horrible piece of news, thatcould be personalized into
(12:40):
critique of your own acumen.
Where do you find the confidenceto move forward and to know that
you have another at bat, youhave another play, another day
to work?
James Keyes (12:49):
Well first of all, I'll give you an example of what
happened to me.
This is such a critical elementof leadership and people you
know, you get all theseleadership lessons and classes
and all this stuff, and peopledon't really see the impact of a
leader with confidence.
And here's the criteria.
It's not personal.
(13:11):
It is not personal.
Lemme repeat that.
It is not personal.
It is business.
And when you do the best thatyou can with the best
information that you have atyour fingertips, and you don't
win the game, you can't thentake it personally.
You have to get back at bat anddo it again and learn from the
(13:34):
things that happened last time.
And as long as you're learningalong the way, the mistakes are
never really mistakes.
They're learning opportunities,they're tuition.
And this is something that a lotof people forget.
Here's what happens when youtake it personally.
When all of that startshappening.
The press turns, you know,they're very quick.
(13:55):
All of a sudden I, my pictureshows up in the New York Post
with the Pinocchio nose, that'snot fun, and it hurts.
Now two ways I can respond tothat.
I can either say it ain't aboutme.
I understand why they did it.
Maybe somebody even leaked thatinformation'cause they've got a
different motive.
They're trying to make somequick money trying to crush us,
(14:18):
push us into bankruptcy.
It isn't about me, it'sbusiness.
As long as I think that way,then I'm not going to react as
the victim because the victimsays, oh, woe is me.
They're picking on me.
They're bad.
Blame this person.
Blame that person.
I'm the victim now.
And victimhood is notleadership.
(14:41):
Victimhood is never ever goingto be leadership.
Now it happens all the time.
You see people, I won't namenames, but it happens.
A leader has to be able towithstand the arrows that are
gonna come from all kinds ofdirections and recognize it's
not about me.
My ego is not going to bebruised by all of these negative
(15:03):
things people are saying.
If I'm doing the best I can.
With the best information I haveand trusting in my team to be
with me on this boat, trying tosteer it through this storm.
It sounds good.
I can say that oh, I don't takeit personally no.
I was fine, you know.
No! It hurt and I did.
(15:24):
I was vulnerable to thatinsecurity that comes from being
besmirched in the press,attacked and accused of lying
and things like that.
And you go wait, wait.
We did not have a liquiditycrisis until those studios
bolted on me.
So here's what happened.
I was at an event at Bill Gates'House.
Called The CEO Summit.
(15:45):
When you're leading a bigFortune 500 company, you get to
do some pretty cool stuff andit's a pretty small community
ultimately.
So here I am at Gates' house andI'm looking around.
I'm a little starstruck'cause Iwas pretty young compared to a
lot of the other leaders at thetime.
And you know, Bezos was there,Meg Whitman and, you know, lot
of Fortune 500 CEOs and I'mlooking around saying, this is
(16:08):
pretty cool.
And I go over to get somedinner, at the little line, you
know, picking up some shrimp orsomething like that, and who's
next to me but Warren Buffet.
And Warren said, so Jim, how areyou doing?
Good to see you again.
What are you doing now?
You know, he had followed mysuccess at 7-Eleven and I had
some correspondence with him inthe past.
I became apologetic.
(16:30):
I was like, oh yeah, I'm atBlockbuster.
You know, Warren, I'm gettingthe crap beat outta me.
The press is all over me.
I was in the New York Post witha Pinocchio nose.
This really sucks.
I'm just not sure.
You know, I don't know.
I'm not sure what to do now.
Maybe I don't know if I'm gonnastay or not.
And he looked at me and here'sthe turning point we all need
(16:51):
sometimes that muse.
And Warren looked at me andsaid, Would you rather be on the
bench watching somebody else upthere doing that?" And I was
like,"Well, no! Of course not!""I wanna be in the game!" He was
like, well, dust yourself off.
Get back at the plate and takeanother swing.
You'll be fine as long as you'redoing the best you can.
And it was exactly what I neededat exactly the right time
(17:14):
because we're human beings.
We're naturally going to bevulnerable to our own
insecurities and our own egothat says, oh, they're picking
on me.
And I began to drift down thatpath of victimhood and become a
quitter.
And I thank God I didn't go downthat path.
(17:36):
I don't think I ultimately wouldhave, but I was, I was slumping
a little.
And when he said that I did dustmyself off, I stayed in the
game.
I saw it through, we hadstrategic deals.
I got Dish to the table.
I almost had to deal withGoogle.
I was this close to it andultimately was able to
successfully restructure thecompany, get a sale to Dish
(17:58):
Network, and then Dish gave it achance to see another day.
Nathan C (18:02):
Wow! Thank you, for sharing that.
That's so amazing! In the spanof just a few moments, you know,
my heart sunk as I was posingthe question about how do you
deal with that sort of changeand then, you know, back up to
the skies imagining, you know, Ioften talk about how important
(18:23):
just having one person believein you can be for like a founder
or a creator, somebody with abig idea.
Just like one person saying,"Ithink you could do it!" It can
be so transformational and tohave of all people, Warren
Buffet.
Right?
Like, how do you not haveconfidence if Warren Buffet's
(18:43):
like, yeah, so what?
200 million?
James Keyes (18:45):
Yeah, we all need friends around us that can pull
us up off the ground and tell usto dust ourselves off.
I'm a big believer and in fact,one of the things that I've been
talking about a lot is thatknowledge is the antidote to
fear.
Clearly, the more understandingyou have, the more knowledge you
have, the less you have to fear.
(19:06):
But there's always that elementof unknown.
There's always something thatyou don't know.
And you won't get the answer to.
No matter how much you dig.
Then what?
Now here's where I invoke Yoda,because when Yoda was teaching
Luke how to be a Jedi.
(19:27):
He taught him the skillsnecessary.
He had to have the knowledgenecessary to be a Jedi.
But then there was this otherelement.
What about those things youdon't know?
What about those things youcan't control?
That's when you must have theForce be with you.
And I like to use that in my owncase.
Everybody can interpret ithowever they want, but I
(19:48):
interpret it as my faith.
And it can be a universal faith,it can be a faith in God, it can
be a faith in a religion, it canbe a faith in the universe.
It can be a faith in yourself.
But it's that balance betweenwhat we know and our faith that
it will work out.
(20:09):
And so you collect the bestknowledge you can, the most
knowledge you have, and then youproceed with faith in yourself.
That you'll be able toaccomplish it.
If you don't have the either orboth, you'll fly around in
circles.
Nathan C (20:26):
I gotta give that space.
You really got me.
There's so often, right?
Like founders are described ashaving it's not quite
predestination, right?
But it is like this force thatis driving them regardless and,
to put a name to it, to havethat be part of the strength
that you bring, to your work asa leader and as somebody trying
(20:47):
to do really hard things.
it fits right into your threeCs.
James Keyes (20:51):
Well think about it, do you know any successful
person that isn't a believer?
Nathan C (20:56):
In the mission, in the people?
James Keyes (20:59):
Something.
Yes! Now, a religious person cansay, well a believer is a person
of faith.
Sure, okay.
Well, a believer in themselvesis a person of faith.
They have faith in themselves,you know.
But you've got to have a beliefin something.
It's such an important elementof confidence that, yes, I can
do this! Maybe it's calling on ahigher power to help you do
(21:21):
this.
Maybe it's a belief that, evenif I don't have all of the
knowledge to accomplish this,the universe will conspire to
make it happen.
Nathan C (21:29):
Ooh! So I wanna tag on this because you have a glow up
that you're working on.
It seems like, write this book,this mission of sharing this
idea that education is freedom.
What's the glow up that you'reworking on now and what are you
hoping to see in the next sixmonths?
James Keyes (21:47):
Okay, so, my glow up, if you will, is a belief
that education and learningenhanced by technology, this is
an important element, isliterally the key the future of
humanity and peace on earth.
Which has always been elusivefor humanity.
(22:10):
Let me unwind that a little.
Think of all the problems in theworld that we've had throughout
history, what causes it?
Fear, somebody's afraid ofsomething.
Maybe a little greed in there,but greed causes fear.
Think about it in the simplestterms.
Remember I said clarity, right?
So think of the simplest terms.
When you're afraid and you're akid, one of the first things
you're afraid of is the monsterin the room.
(22:30):
What do you do?
You call for mom and she turnson the light and she goes, oh,
look at that.
Look under the bed! There's nomonster.
Now I have nothing to be afraidof because I have knowledge that
there really isn't a monster inthe room.
And if you think about knowledgeand education throughout
history, the more advancedhumanity is, the less we have to
(22:51):
fear.
We don't have natural predatorsanymore.
The less we need the old fightor flight, and yet it still
shows up on the battlefield.
It shows up in the boardroom.
It shows up in the classroom.
You know, somebody's mad at you,they're ready to beat you up.
It's like, why?
Come on.
What are you afraid of?
It's ultimately rooted in fear.
(23:14):
Someone's gonna make you lookbad, show them up, take
something from you, take theirgirlfriend, et cetera.
But it's all fear related.
If this is the case, most of theissues with humanity are rooted
in misunderstanding.
Your culture's different frommine.
That scares me.
Your beliefs are different frommine.
(23:34):
That scares me.
I'm not sure that reflects myvalues, you know, et cetera, et
cetera.
Right?
So what do you do?
Well, you use knowledge toovercome that fear.
Well, technology today, and Ilook at this from a scale
perspective.
I use technology to be able totransform 7-Eleven.
We had no scale.
(23:54):
We had plenty of stores, but wehad no buying power because we
didn't know how to leverage thatbuying power.
We couldn't manage each store totailor its assortment to each
individual neighborhood.
We had to have one assortmentfor every store.
And so what we did is we broughtin technology on a centralized
basis.
(24:14):
That made us more decentralized.
It kind of defies logic, but thecentralization of data and
capture of data allowed us to bemore effective at store level.
Now, take that same model andapply it to the way we teach and
learn.
Today it's very decentralized,but there are some fabulous
educational tools.
(24:35):
Khan Academy is off the chartsin its ability as a tutorial
device to help kids learn mathoutside of the classroom.
Why not bring those same toolsinside of the classroom?
We worry about kids being bored,not engaged, et cetera, because
they're living on their device.
Why not bring that device in theform of LED screens into every
(24:57):
classroom and light up thatlearning experience so it's fun
and engaging for young people.
This is all possible with thepower of technology.
I'm not an educator.
I'm not a technologist, but Iknow scale.
And we have 55 million kids inthis country.
So here's my objective.
My objective is to build theinternet of education
(25:18):
technology, deploy it on anational basis so that every
classroom, every kid has accessto the best tools.
Set out a goal that thepresident would launch and say a
JFK moment.
JFK in 1962 said, we're gonnaput a man on the moon in this
decade.
Not because it's easy, butbecause it's hard.
(25:40):
I want a leader in this country,ideally the president, to stand
up and say, we're gonna have100% literacy by the third grade
in this country.
Talk about transformative act.
If every American kid by thethird grade is fully literate.
And then we're gonna be in thetop three of developed countries
(26:02):
in math and science and readingin this decade.
Possible with the use of scaleand technology.
I'm calling this the mega idea.
Make education great again! I'vegotta put it in terms that this
administration will understand.
It takes national leadership tobe able to say America will be
(26:25):
the best.
Education has always been theenabler for America to succeed,
both in national security.
You think the future of warfare,it's gonna be cyber.
It's gonna be data, not gonna betanks and trench warfare like we
had in the past.
We have to have scientists inschool today, learning math and
science and engineering, we haveto have the best education
(26:48):
system in the world for Americato compete on the global scale.
This is what I wanna try tobring my leadership to the
table, to inspire others to saywe're not gonna sit aside and
let America any longer be middleof the pack when it comes to
education.
We should be the best and let'suse technology to get us there.
Nathan C (27:07):
Mic drop moment.
Oh my goodness! There's like sixthings that I'm struck with.
First on the terms of clarityand vision, you shared this like
outrageously huge vision, right?
An internet of educationtechnology accessible to
everybody that's gonna like,make us literate a hundred
percent literate by the thirdgrade.
(27:29):
That's some like outrageoustransformation.
You've got the confidence andwhat I love is in the moment
where a lot of people areworried about how to maintain
the status quo of education,where they're concerned about
where funding and resources andvision are coming from, your
(27:52):
vision is incredibly aware ofthe challenges and the working
modes for the moment, and you'renot skirting around any of those
challenges.
But like accepting them as, youknow, the stakes to play the
game and running straight towardit.
James Keyes (28:11):
Yeah.
Nathan C (28:12):
I did not expect, like I'm gonna engage the president
to transform education, was oneof the things I would hear in
the podcast today.
So, thank you for challenging mypreconceived notions on how this
happens.
James Keyes (28:25):
Since when are we sitting around clutching our
pearls and saying, oh, what arethey teaching my children?
And, you know, there's nothingwe can do.
The teacher's unions arecontrolling us.
I'm gonna pull my kid outtaschool and homeschool'em.
And it's like, whoa, wait aminute and think about it this
way.
If we leverage the power of thebest technology available and
(28:46):
amortize it across 55 millionkids, there's no public school
in the country with a hundredkids that could ever afford have
the quality of tools that wewere able to provide by making
them available across 55 millionstudents, right?
So there's no homeschool thatcould ever afford the
(29:08):
sophistication of thetechnology.
If you can go to send your childto the classroom and have them
watch on an LED screen, anoperation at Sloan Medical
School or UT Southwestern,that's a learning experience you
could never replicate at homewith your iPad.
So why not leverage the scale ofour national system to give kids
(29:32):
the best education tools thatare available anywhere in the
world.
And then imagine, I I mean wetalk about peace on earth,
right?
If America builds this forAmerican students and we build
the best education system in theworld, why wouldn't we then
share that with the world?
Instead of having to provide aidto different countries, let's
(29:52):
provide them access to the besteducation tools so they can all
help themselves.
Because those children in remotecorners of the planet will now,
even if all they have is accessvia phone, they will have access
to the best literacy tools, mathtools, science tools, anywhere
in the world.
(30:13):
And if you believe that theultimate antidote to fear is
knowledge and the ultimatesolution for things like
terrorism, crime, abuse,poverty, why wouldn't we educate
the world and help people helpthemselves?
Kind of compelling, isn't it?
Nathan C (30:32):
It is! Jim you got me thinking on so many levels and
I'm like super excited for thisvision.
I'm on board in so many ways,but I have to ask just because I
can't not.
You know, that ability to beflexible to ride the wave, to
(30:52):
have confidence in such a momentof disruption feels like it's
easy for people who look likeyou and me to say on a podcast,
but maybe isn't as accessible toeveryone out in the world.
And like similarly, the globalsouth is typically last in
(31:14):
innovation last in access.
Often when you know technologyis going to save the world, the
technology happens and the saveof the world thing sometimes
comes out.
How do you approach, you knowsome of these real concerns
about technology as a savior forthe moment, or innovation, I'm
(31:37):
curious to know your thoughts onhow do you look at the other
side?
James Keyes (31:39):
You're absolutely right.
And you started with the word"but." I am not gonna accept any
buts.
Because the buts are what killus! It's the, but what about the
teacher's unions?
They're gonna block this.
But what about the cost?
It's gonna be expensive.
Yep.
But what about the difficulty?
It's gonna be hard?
But what about, you know, thistool may indoctrinate may be
(32:02):
used by evil people toindoctrinate children.
Yep.
All those"buts" are there.
And this is what I encounteredat 7-Eleven.
I encountered at the AmericanRed Cross.
We did the same thing for theAmerican Red Cross.
Very decentralized organization.
A lot of"buts." Oh, we can'thave centralized systems.
We're local.
We have to be nimble at the, andwhen we build it, and then all
(32:25):
of a sudden they see what'spossible, the"buts" go away.
All the naysayers go away.
The excuses go away because it'ssuch a powerful tool.
It's so transformative.
It's just like, you know, noneof us 20 years ago, sitting
around in a bar drinking beerswould've said, Hey, you know
what I'm gonna do?
I'm gonna get on my phone, I'mgonna call a stranger, and
(32:45):
they're gonna come pick me up intheir car and drive me on the
other side of town.
And you'd be like, that is thedumbest thing I have ever heard.
I would never get in astranger's car! Remember the
days I grew up in the days ofhitchhiking and then it went
away because no one would get ina stranger's car.
Technology enabled a sense ofsafety in doing the unthinkable,
(33:07):
jumping in a total stranger'svehicle and going on the other
side of town at two in themorning, right?
But we do it every single day.
This is the power of technology.
When we build this, they willcome, the"buts" will go away and
the opportunity will be there.
Now there's one other thing indoing this, that, as you said,
(33:29):
some people not only can't wraptheir head around it, they're
afraid they aren't gonna be ableto afford it.
Perhaps they don't have thevision.
Perhaps they'd be afraid of it,et cetera, et cetera.
This is where I see ourresponsibility.
The subtitle of my book,"TheFuture Is In Your Hands." I mean
that as each of us individuallyand those of us who have been
privileged enough to haveenjoyed some success in life, I
(33:52):
think have an obligation to takewhat got us here, which was big
vision.
I didn't get to run 7-Eleven'cause I thought small.
I had to think big.
And what I wanna do is sharethat big thinking and take a
leadership role.
So that others who would neverthink this is possible can be
(34:14):
inspired by it, and I can createa grassroots support'cause even
if the president doesn't havetime, and maybe he doesn't for
this initiative, I'll go afterit on a state level.
I'll try to take Texas andtransform it.
If I can't make it happen inTexas, if I have to wait for the
next administration, I'll do it.
(34:34):
But I am committed to help sharethis vision because I know it is
possible.
It is doable.
This isn't, gee, would thiswork?
The tools exist.
All I'm doing is showing a way apath to scale this in a way that
we can accelerate thetransformation of education in
(34:56):
America and the acceleration ofeducation across this globe.
It'll happen organically overthe next 50, 60, a hundred
years.
Why not let's happen now.
Let's do it! Let's just get itdone.
Nathan C (35:08):
Let's just do it.
I love it! On each episode ofThe Glow Up, we do make time for
a community spotlight.
I'm curious, is there anorganization that you think is
doing great work that could usea little bit of extra attention?
James Keyes (35:20):
Well, there is a foundation by the same name
called Educationist Freedom.
It is primarily in theDallas-Fort Worth area and now,
helping in schools providingcounselors in public schools
trying to help kids understandthat the, opportunity is there
and that the future is in theirhands.
The mission of the EducationistFreedom Foundation is to
(35:42):
convince young people thatcollege may not be for everyone,
but opportunity is, and the pathto unlimited opportunity is to
keep learning as much as youpossibly can.
Nathan C (35:54):
Is there anything based on where you're at now,
with the foundation or the book,that you're looking for, do you
have a call to action for us andhow can people learn more and
connect with you online?
James Keyes (36:06):
Yeah, a couple things.
One, I hope they can find atjameswkeyes.com.
I've got a website, K-E-Y-E-S.
And, I do have a request.
I hope that, people will enjoythe book, but I don't want you
just to buy the book.
What I hope people will get thisbook, but give it away because I
want help in spreading the wordthat the answer to us
(36:31):
individually, collectively isfor us all to take
responsibility for our ownknowledge and critical thinking.
So much we can do to improve ourworld collectively if we all do
that and I hope you'll find thatmessage is loud and clear in the
book and you'll share it withothers.
Nathan C (36:47):
Oh my goodness! What a fantastic place to wrap it up
for us today.
James Keyes, bestselling authorof"Education is Freedom," former
CEO of just some small brandslike 7-Eleven and Blockbuster,
lifelong learner.
James, it was so great to chatwith you today.
Thank you for joining me on TheGlow Up.
James Keyes (37:09):
Appreciate the opportunity and thank you to
everybody, all of yourlisteners, really appreciate it!
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