October 17, 2025 • 21 mins
The market floor in Indy buzzed, but the real energy came from a simple idea: winning sales teams keep score and remove friction. Sitting with Eric Knox, Director of LBM Sales, we pull back the curtain on how a regional structure, clear metrics, and a new mindset around “no” transformed a team from scattered effort to compounding momentum. Eric’s story, from hauling bag goods to leading a hungry, data-driven crew, shows how clarity turns competition into culture, and how early stumbles can become the foundation for hockey-stick growth when you keep iterating.
We dig into the nuts and bolts of selling in the built world when big-box and mega-pro dealers loom large. The advantage for independents isn’t pretending to be bigger; it’s becoming easier. That means deploying tools like TOOLBX to streamline quotes and payments, giving dealers more time with contractors, and aligning field roles to support entire businesses, not just isolated categories. It also means modern outreach: we unpack how LinkedIn stops being a resume graveyard and starts working like a warm-intro engine.
Topics covered:
• Eric’s path from hardware retail to LBM leadership
• Drive, resilience, and the hockey-stick model of growth
• Publishing metrics and keeping score to focus the team
• Rolling out a regional structure for accountability and speed
• Using LinkedIn to replace cold starts with warm intros
• Training and tools that remove friction for contractors
• Merchandising small-footprint, high-ROI products
• Developing next-gen talent and gamifying performance
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Eric Knox (00:00):
I'm very metric driven, data oriented.
That's one of the biggestthings you can do as a sales
leader is basically tell a teamthis is how we're keeping score.
There's winners and losers.
There's ultimately gonna bethat winner.
You really got to have thatdrive to go out and make it
happen, right?
If you want to be successful atsales, you can't report the
news.
You gotta go out and make thenews.
(00:21):
You gotta pretty quickly learnthat no just means not today.
And if you you run away at thefirst no, it's gonna be a really
long climb to get where youwant to be.
Stefanie Couch (00:30):
But then that moment where it starts to turn
is always my favorite part.
I call it the hockey stickmomentum.
You go down sometimes to go wayback up exponentially.
Eric Knox (00:39):
I'm just so excited for the momentum we're building,
the leads that we're generatingto help our members grow their
business has just been awesome.
Stefanie Couch (00:46):
Welcome to the Grit Blueprint Podcast, the
playbook for buildingunmistakable brands that grow,
lead, and last in the builtworld.
I'm Stephanie Couch, thefounder of Grit Blueprint, and
I'm a lifelong building industryinsider.
I was raised here, built mycareer here, and now my team and
(01:08):
I help others win here.
The truth is, you can be thebest option in your space and
still lose to someone else whosimply shows up better and more
consistent.
Each week on the GritBlueprint, I'm going to show you
how to stand out, earn trust,and turn your brand into a
competitive advantage thatlasts.
(01:30):
If you're ready to be seen,known, chosen, and become
unmistakable, you're in theright place.
Let's get started.
Welcome to the Grit BlueprintPodcast.
I'm your host, Stephanie Couch,and today I'm here in Indy with
Eric Knox, the director of LBMSales, right on the market
floor.
Welcome to the show, Eric.
Eric Knox (01:50):
Thanks, Stephanie.
Excited to be here.
Stefanie Couch (01:51):
We have been here all weekend.
We've been doing a lot of coolstuff.
We've had booth activity,unlike any other show I've ever
been to with you guys.
Eric Knox (02:00):
It's been a lot of fun seeing the members come in
and interact in the booth and uhjust seeing the team interact
with our new alignment andeverything.
It's been awesome.
Stefanie Couch (02:08):
It's been a fun show.
What actually got you intosales?
Because I know we're bothfiercely competitive people.
We figured that out prettyquickly when we started talking.
But what actually made you getinto sales and then hardware or
lumber sales?
Eric Knox (02:20):
You know, I started at a very young age in a
hardware store.
And one of the things that Ilatched on to pretty early is
when that customer or thatcontractor came in and said, I
need this.
And it was something we didn'thave.
And even better when they said,I need this, and I need a
thousand of them.
Stefanie Couch (02:37):
Yeah.
Eric Knox (02:37):
Right.
So now that hunt started.
How do I find this?
How do I get it?
You know, how much, how muchmoney can I make on selling
this?
And uh, I got that exposureworking in the store, which was
great, but then hadopportunities throughout my
career to evolve really moreinto that outside sales role and
then really ultimately intosales leadership.
Stefanie Couch (02:53):
Well, what's your very first role?
And where was the store?
Eric Knox (02:56):
I got my start uh lugging bag goods outside uh as
a summer job, and it just itevolved from there.
Uh the lawn and gardendepartment closed for the the
the fall and winter, and Imigrated into the the hardware
hardware portion of the storeand sporting goods.
And before you knew it, I wasrunning hardware stores in my
(03:16):
early 20s and uh you knowevolved into outside sales in my
early 30s and finally evolvedand moved into the LBM business
here uh uh over the last yearand a half.
Stefanie Couch (03:27):
It has been a a twisty turny ride for you for
sure, going from hardware andretail more traditionally to the
LBM.
Tell me a little bit about thattransition and what's the last
year been like for you?
Eric Knox (03:38):
The last year has been a whirlwind for many
different reasons.
Um, one, the the transition toLBM.
Uh it wasn't that long ago.
We were at the Houston market,and I came back from that and I
got offered the opportunity tomove over to LBM.
And I'm like, I'm a hardwareguy.
What am I gonna do over there?
And uh, you know, really one ofthe things that Nick Talerico
(03:59):
talked with me about.
He's like, he's like, Eric,you're a builder.
He's like, we've evolved thesales team, we've done all this.
You're you're you're close,you're almost there.
That last 10% is gonna be thehardest part to get, and it's
not nearly as fun as the first90%.
You can come over to the LBMteam and really start that
building process.
And you know what?
A year and a half later, I lookback at it and Nick was right.
(04:21):
It's been it's been a reallyfun ride.
Stefanie Couch (04:23):
That's amazing.
And we've actually been workingtogether for really the last
year since you moved overpretty, pretty closely.
And uh we may be a dynamic duo.
I don't know.
Eric Knox (04:32):
We are.
I mean, we similar fashionstyle, um, not so much there,
but our competitive spirit, uh,passion for sales, absolutely.
Stefanie Couch (04:41):
What do you think if you were talking to
someone younger that wants toget into our business or maybe
wants to get into sales, isn'tsure, what does it take to be a
successful salesperson in anyindustry, but you can
specifically talk about thisindustry if you want?
Eric Knox (04:56):
You really gotta have that drive to go out and make
it happen, right?
It it really, if you want to besuccessful at sales, you can't
report the news.
You got to go out and make thenews.
And um, you know, the otherthing that has to happen is you
you gotta pretty quickly learnthat no just means not today,
right?
And and if you you run away atthe first no, it's gonna be a
(05:17):
really long climb to get whereyou want to be.
Stefanie Couch (05:20):
Yeah, and you're gonna try stuff that's gonna be
a miserable failure.
I mean, you're gonna try tosell some product lines that
people don't want.
You might go out to market andjust, you know, pretty much get
no's everywhere you go for alittle while, but then that
moment where it starts to turnis always my favorite part, is
like when you feel I call it thehockey stick momentum, but you
know, you go down sometimes togo way back up exponentially.
(05:42):
I feel like that's where youguys are right now with the
changes you've made in yoursales team.
So talk a little bit about thatbecause you've expanded a lot
since you come here.
You put in a regionalstructure.
Tell me about how that'sworking for the team.
Eric Knox (05:54):
Yeah, I think it's it really comes down to a couple
of different things.
You know, I'm I'm very metricdriven, data-oriented.
And when I came over uh to theLBM side, we had sales numbers
and all that, but it was not themain focus.
It took me way too long tofigure out what a sales sale
was, how to report it.
(06:15):
Uh, but ultimately we built outuh a plan, got that in front of
the team, explained why it wasimportant, and then we published
those metrics.
To me, that's one of thebiggest things uh you can do as
a sales leader is basically tella team this is how we're
keeping score, and there'sthere's winners and losers, and
we're gonna track this.
(06:35):
And you know, there's nothingbetter than everybody on the
team can technically win, right?
And it's just some there'sultimately gonna be that winner,
right?
And and I want that team thathas that passion and drive and
they're competing.
And and we've been able tostart making that happen, right?
We're very early in the stages,we've been under a regional
(06:55):
structure really since um sinceearly March uh with the start of
the fiscal year.
It's really kind of solidified,and we're now in that execution
stage, right?
It's no longer, I'm no longerselling a vision and trying to
instill this culture.
We're now out there doing it.
And that's kind of for me, it'sbeen one of the best parts of
market is actually sitting backand watching this strategy play
(07:17):
out, seeing the team worktogether with members and
looking at the entirety of theirbusiness as opposed to talking
about one category at a time.
Stefanie Couch (07:25):
Absolutely.
And trying new things, like yousaid, you know, you're going to
you have a lot of new membersthat have lumber and true value.
That acquisition obviouslychanged the face of the company.
And you have these new teammembers that are out there way
more often.
They're doing things likeLinkedIn.
So let's talk a little bitabout that.
LinkedIn is something thatwe've been partnering together
on as a team to try to get morepeople to do that in your
(07:48):
organization.
How has that worked?
And what do you think aboutLinkedIn so far?
Eric Knox (07:52):
Well, I've learned it's really important that you
should probably have a pictureon your LinkedIn profile.
Uh, I went a long time withoutone, but uh I've finally got
that out there.
Stefanie Couch (08:01):
A man of mystery, Eric Knox.
Eric Knox (08:03):
Yeah, but uh, you know, credit to you, right?
I I've never been a big fan ofsocial media.
I I've been, you know,resistant to it.
But what I've realized isLinkedIn is really a great
selling tool where I'd alwayskind of viewed it as hey, this
is somewhere you go and you getconnected with people you work
with, and it's it's how you findyour next job.
(08:25):
But I've really spent a lot oftime, you know, over the last
few months building out myprofile, connecting with people
that I haven't worked with.
And I now here at Market, youknow, with with some of your
assistants, I'm seeing thechange in who is viewing my
profile, who's commenting on it,who's liking it, which now
allows me to follow up and dothis.
(08:45):
And I've actually seenrelationships grow, personal
relationships via LinkedIn thatI would have never had before.
People that would havetypically been strangers walking
up to you in the booth.
There's now this rapport andrelationship you have, which to
me, not being a fan of socialmedia is strange, but I hate to
tell you, it it works, and we'reseeing other successes on the
team with it.
Stefanie Couch (09:04):
Yeah.
You thought that it was justall BS from a lady in a pink hat
until you started hearing it,right?
Eric Knox (09:11):
Yeah, I probably shouldn't really say what I
thought about LinkedIn andsocial media when you first
started pushing it, but uh, I amI am a believer at this point,
that's for sure.
Stefanie Couch (09:20):
Yes.
Is that is that kind of as a Wfor me?
Eric Knox (09:23):
As long as it's a W for me too.
It's a W for both of us forsure.
As long as it's not an L for meand you won because there's
always a winner and loser,right?
I just want to make sure that'sit.
Stefanie Couch (09:31):
We're on the same team, so we're both
winning.
I love that.
Eric Knox (09:33):
No, it's definitely been a win.
Stefanie Couch (09:34):
A few things about LinkedIn that I'll just
say a lot of the things I dohere, you you covered it.
First of all, it's a resumeplatform.
It's when you want a new job.
Totally wrong.
Second of all, you should beconnected with everybody at your
company and not your customersor your vendors or other people
that could be customers, totallywrong.
Third thing is that you canjust post, you know, reshare
your company things, never postanything else, never comment,
(09:55):
never like.
I call it the silent lurkers.
So people that scroll onLinkedIn, they spend hours
sometimes on LinkedIn, but theynever do anything with it.
Eric Knox (10:03):
Well, that was me six months ago.
I I was a lurker.
Occasionally I might like, butthat was it.
Stefanie Couch (10:10):
Yeah, and that's really how you drive
communication through it andbuild partnerships and build
friendships.
I mean, I have I've had so manypeople that don't ever like my
stuff, don't comment, don't doanything, come up to me at shows
like this and say, I've beenfollowing your content for
years.
I love your content.
Um, thank you for posting this.
They'll reference specificposts.
And I just think that's amazingthat you can have just a
(10:32):
different avenue with LinkedInto reach out to people.
It doesn't mean you do awaywith word of mouth or your sales
team or any of that.
Eric Knox (10:38):
No, all that stuff still has to happen.
I mean, you cannot replace theface-to-face contact, but it
makes that face-to-face contactso much easier.
I mean, the the the days of ofcold calling should be over,
right?
We should, we should walk intoany prospect call, you know,
having already established thatrelationship online and and have
some familiarity there, and itjust makes that face-to-face
(11:00):
contact so much easier.
Stefanie Couch (11:01):
Yeah.
And also another little knownsecret about LinkedIn is that
because it's such a big website,it actually is great for
searches on either Google orother AI platforms.
So if someone went in and putin Eric Knox and you've been
posting original content, it'sgonna come up just like a blog
post would, or just likesomething that, you know, you
wrote in a magazine or any ofthat.
It's actually gonna come upunder your name.
(11:23):
So people will know you'relegit.
And that's really a coolopportunity for them to know
what you're all about.
And like you said, there's nocold calling because they
already know who you are.
Eric Knox (11:32):
Well, and I think one of the other cool things is
it's this market.
Well, yeah, it's three dayslong.
It might feel like it's twoweeks long, but um this market.
What day is today?
Stefanie Couch (11:43):
I don't know.
Eric Knox (11:44):
I have no idea.
This market's gonna live on forweeks, yeah.
Uh, if not longer.
I mean, especially with youknow, a lot of the great
podcasts you've been recording.
So we can just make it go onand on and on.
And before you know it, we'regonna start releasing content on
what's gonna happen in Denver.
Stefanie Couch (11:59):
I agree.
It's exciting to think about.
And that's what I love aboutthe LBM team, you and Russ and
the rest of the team and thecommunications team have given
an opportunity to try some newthings.
Some of it's worked reallywell, some of it hasn't.
Some of it is working betternow than the first time we tried
it.
That's the spirit of I thinkindependent business with what
(12:19):
your dealers are seeing too, isthey need to be able to have
room for margin to grow and haveerrors and keep trying new
things.
Eric Knox (12:26):
Yeah, no, for sure.
I mean, when I first jumpedinto this role, uh, there were
things that we tried right awayand we failed on a couple
things.
And it's just we weren't, weweren't ready.
It's not that the idea was bad,it's just we weren't capable
and ready to execute.
And we're just we're in thisposition today where I'm I'm
just so excited for the momentumwe're building and that's gonna
build here for market and andreally move on.
(12:47):
The fact that we now have fourpeople out in the field working
directly with members, thefeedback from that has been
super positive.
The leads that we're generatingto help our members grow their
business has just been awesome.
Stefanie Couch (12:58):
Yeah, it's been an incredible 12 months.
It feels like a lot longer thanthat.
Eric Knox (13:02):
I know it does.
Stefanie Couch (13:04):
This episode of the Grit Blueprint Podcast was
sponsored by Do It Best Group.
Do It Best Group is the largestco-op in the world, and they
help independent hardware andlumber yards all over North
America win.
Do It Best offers services,products, and people that can
help you win long term.
They are the champion ofindependence.
(13:25):
It looks like we actually havesome special visitors in the
podcast booth.
Eric Knox (13:32):
We are gonna have some special guests.
Stefanie Couch (13:34):
Uh you like fuzzy baby chicks?
Eric Knox (13:36):
You know me.
I I love I love animals.
Stefanie Couch (13:40):
Oh, hi, sweet baby.
Um, this is actually MetzgersFarms, which is one of your hard
line dealers that sells babychicks.
And I am also wearing burnapparel because I wanted to make
sure I wasn't cold today.
This baby chick is very active.
She is very loud.
Eric Knox (13:59):
My baby chick has like brown and dark colors.
Stefanie Couch (14:03):
It's almost like we planned this.
Come right here, Katie, so wecan see you in the camera.
Just stay right here.
This is Katie.
She is actually here with oneof the other vendors.
So thank you for coming in.
I'm gonna give you my mic.
Tell me just a little bit aboutyour business and what you do
here.
Katie from Metzer Farms (14:18):
My name is Katie.
Um, we are a third-generationfamily-run hatchery with
locations in Memphis, Tennessee,and Gonzales, California.
We hatch ducks, geese, chicks,um, guineas, and heritage
turkeys.
And so we hatch the birds atour hatchery and ship them to
your stores.
This is a white layer ducklingthat's really good for eggs.
(14:42):
And this one's a ruinedduckling.
Stefanie Couch (14:44):
Did you give me the loudest one to match me in
spirit?
It feels like we're meant foreach other.
I hope my husband's reallyexcited about hearing this all
the way back to Georgia.
We do have a bathtub that wecould use for this bad boy.
Hi, sweet baby.
Well, Katie, thank you forcoming in and bringing these
sweet babies.
And like Eric said, we arematched here.
(15:05):
He's got one that has somedarker, muted tones, just like
him.
And then I've got the brightyellow baby that won't shut up.
So it's perfect for us.
Thank you so much.
I love it.
All right, I'm gonna give thisback begrudgingly.
And if you're interested inamazing chickens and ducks, you
need to come see Katie or talkto her about how you can sell
these in your store.
(15:26):
Thank you so much, Katie.
Man, isn't that awesome?
That was awesome, like totallyawesome.
Eric Knox (15:32):
Highlight of my market.
Stefanie Couch (15:34):
Well, now that we've got baby ducks out of the
way, that was a really coolmoment.
You have to admit, that'syou're never gonna forget.
Don't tease me with a goodtime, Eric.
I do love puppies, and they arehere on the market floor.
Eric Knox (15:47):
I know they are.
Stefanie Couch (15:47):
It's incredible.
Eric Knox (15:48):
You've already seen them, haven't you?
Stefanie Couch (15:49):
I have seen them.
I walked by earlier.
I did not touch any of them,which seems like an absolute
crime.
I do want to talk a little bitabout this jacket that I got
because it's pretty cool.
It's in my pink color.
So this is burn apparel.
And this is actually a productthat I don't think a lot of
lumber yards might not think,hey, we could sell this.
We talked recently about thisis a great item to put by your
(16:09):
counter.
You've got a lot ofmerchandising experience.
Tell me how you think thiscould work for lumber dealers.
Eric Knox (16:14):
Yeah, I think you start looking at the the inside
of uh of a store and just thethe space that's available.
Uh, the burn rack, it sits onabout, you know, four square
feet and uh holds all kinds ofproduct.
Uh, it's all available directlyout of our warehouse, one piece
at a time.
You don't get stuck with abunch of excess inventory.
(16:35):
Really a great program.
And and they've got all kindsof programs to help you get
started, you know, rolling intothe cooler months.
What do we need?
They've got racks that are allbuilt out, ready to go, and get
you set up, but really maximizethat space inside of your store.
So whether it's a burn apparelrack or some type of a flooring
rack, just to find ways toreally maximize that space to
(16:55):
drive as many sales as you can.
Stefanie Couch (16:56):
Absolutely.
And it is getting a littlechilly.
That's why I'm wearing thisbecause it's actually really
cold in here.
And this has really done thetrick.
So thank you.
It is.
Thank you to the guy, Josh, whogave it to me at the burn
apparel booth.
I love that.
Well, let's get back to LBMsales.
We've got a lot of excitingthings happening.
We're on the podcast boothfloor here doing live events.
This feels like a reallyincredible time to be a
(17:18):
do-it-best independent member,but there is a lot going on in
the macro outside with big box.
There are huge pro dealers likeBFS and other people.
How does the independent winand thrive in this next few
years?
Eric Knox (17:35):
Well, I think it's how do you make it easy for your
contractor?
And it's one of the thingswe're focused on is how do we
make it easier for the member todo business with us?
And then really, how do we makeit easier for our dealers to
work directly with theircontractors?
So we've tried to focus onthings like we brought toolbox
in here at this market to reallyuh help make it easier for
contractors to pay their bills,get quotes.
(17:56):
We've done a lot of trainingand education.
Anybody can kind of sourceproducts, but how can we support
our dealers with programs andservices that really free them
up to spend more time sellingand working with their
contractors and customers?
Stefanie Couch (18:11):
Yeah, reducing friction, increasing margins,
all those things that we can dofor dealers.
There's been a lot of trainingat this market.
And I think that's a big pointof how you grow in the future is
making sure that your nextgeneration, I like to call them
the ambitious next generation,are out there knowing the
products, knowing what'savailable, and you're helping
with technology like Toolbox tobe able to help them sell and
(18:31):
get paid easier.
Eric Knox (18:33):
Yeah, I mean, that next generation is really
important in this industry.
And I think that's one of thethings that I'm probably most
excited about with our salesteam here is we really started
um five, six, seven years agobringing in that younger
generation into roles where theycan kind of learn the industry
and then they migrate into atrader role.
(18:54):
And the cool thing is when werolled out into this regional
format, we tapped into that andand all of our candidates came
internally.
They're that youngergeneration, and the best thing
is they're gonna be here for along time and grow this
business.
And then on these teams, we nowhave these folks that have just
rolled into that trader role.
And yeah, there's some youththere, but they're learning
(19:16):
quickly, they're sharp.
They're and what I love themost is they're hungry.
And oh, by the way, when Istarted keeping score and
posting leaderboards, man, thoseguys were all over it.
Stefanie Couch (19:28):
Nothing like some gamification to bring out
the inner warrior.
Eric Knox (19:31):
Yeah, well, I I knew instantly.
I'm like, yeah, these guys gotit, right?
That we're keeping score andthey want their name at the top.
Stefanie Couch (19:38):
Even if you're not keeping score, there's
always a score.
You know, if we walk down thehallway, I'm gonna try to walk
faster than you.
Eric Knox (19:45):
Yeah, kind of like keeping score or number of
attendees that sign up for yoursession, right?
Stefanie Couch (19:49):
That does happen once or twice at market, but we
won't name names.
We'll just say if you know, youknow.
Eric Knox (19:56):
Yeah, that's right.
Scoreboard.
Stefanie Couch (19:58):
Well, thank you for joining me on the Grit
Blueprint podcast.
And thank you for everythingyou've done to support this
effort and uh embracing thingsthat you know were a little bit
edgy and a little bit different,maybe a little bit pinker than
normal.
Eric Knox (20:11):
And a lot pinker than normal.
Stefanie Couch (20:13):
And I will make sure that next episode you have
a pink hat and a pink shirt, andmaybe another baby duck.
Eric Knox (20:18):
You keep threatening.
Stefanie Couch (20:19):
I am threatening, but I feel like I
can do more than threaten thistime.
I can make it happen.
And so my handy assistant, RussCatherine, has now made all of
your back.
Yeah, tag goes in the back.
All of your pink cat dreamshave now come true.
How's that feel?
Eric Knox (20:34):
Oh, awesome.
Stefanie Couch (20:36):
Do you feel the power surging through that
thing?
Eric Knox (20:38):
No, not at all.
Stefanie Couch (20:40):
Let's take a picture.
Eric Knox (20:42):
Do you have anything in black or gray?
Stefanie Couch (20:44):
I do not wear black.
I'm a true spring, a lightspring color palette, and I'm
not actually allowed to putblack on my body.
Eric Knox (20:49):
No, it's not gonna be spring.
Stefanie Couch (20:51):
I am always a light spring.
Eric Knox (20:53):
Got it.
Got it.
Stefanie Couch (20:54):
Things you didn't know you needed to know
on the Grit Blueprint podcast.
Well, thank you for joining me,Eric, and thank you for being a
good sport.
And I think you might have wornit better than me, so you might
be winning this one.
Eric Knox (21:05):
Well, thank you.
Appreciate it.
It's been a fun ride and reallylooking forward to where we go
over the next 12 months.
Stefanie Couch (21:10):
Amazing.
Thank you for listening to theGrit Blueprint Podcast.
If this episode helped youthink a little differently about
how to show up, share it withsomeone in your building world
who needs it.
If you're ready to turnvisibility into growth, then
head to gritblueprint.com tolearn more and book a call to
talk to us about your growthstrategy.
(21:32):
Until next time, stayunmistakable.
I'm very metric driven, data oriented.
That's one of the biggestthings you can do as a sales
leader is basically tell a teamthis is how we're keeping score.
There's winners and losers.
There's ultimately gonna bethat winner.
You really got to have thatdrive to go out and make it
happen, right?
If you want to be successful atsales, you can't report the
news.
You gotta go out and make thenews.
(00:21):
You gotta pretty quickly learnthat no just means not today.
And if you you run away at thefirst no, it's gonna be a really
long climb to get where youwant to be.
Stefanie Couch (00:30):
But then that moment where it starts to turn
is always my favorite part.
I call it the hockey stickmomentum.
You go down sometimes to go wayback up exponentially.
Eric Knox (00:39):
I'm just so excited for the momentum we're building,
the leads that we're generatingto help our members grow their
business has just been awesome.
Stefanie Couch (00:46):
Welcome to the Grit Blueprint Podcast, the
playbook for buildingunmistakable brands that grow,
lead, and last in the builtworld.
I'm Stephanie Couch, thefounder of Grit Blueprint, and
I'm a lifelong building industryinsider.
I was raised here, built mycareer here, and now my team and
(01:08):
I help others win here.
The truth is, you can be thebest option in your space and
still lose to someone else whosimply shows up better and more
consistent.
Each week on the GritBlueprint, I'm going to show you
how to stand out, earn trust,and turn your brand into a
competitive advantage thatlasts.
(01:30):
If you're ready to be seen,known, chosen, and become
unmistakable, you're in theright place.
Let's get started.
Welcome to the Grit BlueprintPodcast.
I'm your host, Stephanie Couch,and today I'm here in Indy with
Eric Knox, the director of LBMSales, right on the market
floor.
Welcome to the show, Eric.
Eric Knox (01:50):
Thanks, Stephanie.
Excited to be here.
Stefanie Couch (01:51):
We have been here all weekend.
We've been doing a lot of coolstuff.
We've had booth activity,unlike any other show I've ever
been to with you guys.
Eric Knox (02:00):
It's been a lot of fun seeing the members come in
and interact in the booth and uhjust seeing the team interact
with our new alignment andeverything.
It's been awesome.
Stefanie Couch (02:08):
It's been a fun show.
What actually got you intosales?
Because I know we're bothfiercely competitive people.
We figured that out prettyquickly when we started talking.
But what actually made you getinto sales and then hardware or
lumber sales?
Eric Knox (02:20):
You know, I started at a very young age in a
hardware store.
And one of the things that Ilatched on to pretty early is
when that customer or thatcontractor came in and said, I
need this.
And it was something we didn'thave.
And even better when they said,I need this, and I need a
thousand of them.
Stefanie Couch (02:37):
Yeah.
Eric Knox (02:37):
Right.
So now that hunt started.
How do I find this?
How do I get it?
You know, how much, how muchmoney can I make on selling
this?
And uh, I got that exposureworking in the store, which was
great, but then hadopportunities throughout my
career to evolve really moreinto that outside sales role and
then really ultimately intosales leadership.
Stefanie Couch (02:53):
Well, what's your very first role?
And where was the store?
Eric Knox (02:56):
I got my start uh lugging bag goods outside uh as
a summer job, and it just itevolved from there.
Uh the lawn and gardendepartment closed for the the
the fall and winter, and Imigrated into the the hardware
hardware portion of the storeand sporting goods.
And before you knew it, I wasrunning hardware stores in my
(03:16):
early 20s and uh you knowevolved into outside sales in my
early 30s and finally evolvedand moved into the LBM business
here uh uh over the last yearand a half.
Stefanie Couch (03:27):
It has been a a twisty turny ride for you for
sure, going from hardware andretail more traditionally to the
LBM.
Tell me a little bit about thattransition and what's the last
year been like for you?
Eric Knox (03:38):
The last year has been a whirlwind for many
different reasons.
Um, one, the the transition toLBM.
Uh it wasn't that long ago.
We were at the Houston market,and I came back from that and I
got offered the opportunity tomove over to LBM.
And I'm like, I'm a hardwareguy.
What am I gonna do over there?
And uh, you know, really one ofthe things that Nick Talerico
(03:59):
talked with me about.
He's like, he's like, Eric,you're a builder.
He's like, we've evolved thesales team, we've done all this.
You're you're you're close,you're almost there.
That last 10% is gonna be thehardest part to get, and it's
not nearly as fun as the first90%.
You can come over to the LBMteam and really start that
building process.
And you know what?
A year and a half later, I lookback at it and Nick was right.
(04:21):
It's been it's been a reallyfun ride.
Stefanie Couch (04:23):
That's amazing.
And we've actually been workingtogether for really the last
year since you moved overpretty, pretty closely.
And uh we may be a dynamic duo.
I don't know.
Eric Knox (04:32):
We are.
I mean, we similar fashionstyle, um, not so much there,
but our competitive spirit, uh,passion for sales, absolutely.
Stefanie Couch (04:41):
What do you think if you were talking to
someone younger that wants toget into our business or maybe
wants to get into sales, isn'tsure, what does it take to be a
successful salesperson in anyindustry, but you can
specifically talk about thisindustry if you want?
Eric Knox (04:56):
You really gotta have that drive to go out and make
it happen, right?
It it really, if you want to besuccessful at sales, you can't
report the news.
You got to go out and make thenews.
And um, you know, the otherthing that has to happen is you
you gotta pretty quickly learnthat no just means not today,
right?
And and if you you run away atthe first no, it's gonna be a
(05:17):
really long climb to get whereyou want to be.
Stefanie Couch (05:20):
Yeah, and you're gonna try stuff that's gonna be
a miserable failure.
I mean, you're gonna try tosell some product lines that
people don't want.
You might go out to market andjust, you know, pretty much get
no's everywhere you go for alittle while, but then that
moment where it starts to turnis always my favorite part, is
like when you feel I call it thehockey stick momentum, but you
know, you go down sometimes togo way back up exponentially.
(05:42):
I feel like that's where youguys are right now with the
changes you've made in yoursales team.
So talk a little bit about thatbecause you've expanded a lot
since you come here.
You put in a regionalstructure.
Tell me about how that'sworking for the team.
Eric Knox (05:54):
Yeah, I think it's it really comes down to a couple
of different things.
You know, I'm I'm very metricdriven, data-oriented.
And when I came over uh to theLBM side, we had sales numbers
and all that, but it was not themain focus.
It took me way too long tofigure out what a sales sale
was, how to report it.
(06:15):
Uh, but ultimately we built outuh a plan, got that in front of
the team, explained why it wasimportant, and then we published
those metrics.
To me, that's one of thebiggest things uh you can do as
a sales leader is basically tella team this is how we're
keeping score, and there'sthere's winners and losers, and
we're gonna track this.
(06:35):
And you know, there's nothingbetter than everybody on the
team can technically win, right?
And it's just some there'sultimately gonna be that winner,
right?
And and I want that team thathas that passion and drive and
they're competing.
And and we've been able tostart making that happen, right?
We're very early in the stages,we've been under a regional
(06:55):
structure really since um sinceearly March uh with the start of
the fiscal year.
It's really kind of solidified,and we're now in that execution
stage, right?
It's no longer, I'm no longerselling a vision and trying to
instill this culture.
We're now out there doing it.
And that's kind of for me, it'sbeen one of the best parts of
market is actually sitting backand watching this strategy play
(07:17):
out, seeing the team worktogether with members and
looking at the entirety of theirbusiness as opposed to talking
about one category at a time.
Stefanie Couch (07:25):
Absolutely.
And trying new things, like yousaid, you know, you're going to
you have a lot of new membersthat have lumber and true value.
That acquisition obviouslychanged the face of the company.
And you have these new teammembers that are out there way
more often.
They're doing things likeLinkedIn.
So let's talk a little bitabout that.
LinkedIn is something thatwe've been partnering together
on as a team to try to get morepeople to do that in your
(07:48):
organization.
How has that worked?
And what do you think aboutLinkedIn so far?
Eric Knox (07:52):
Well, I've learned it's really important that you
should probably have a pictureon your LinkedIn profile.
Uh, I went a long time withoutone, but uh I've finally got
that out there.
Stefanie Couch (08:01):
A man of mystery, Eric Knox.
Eric Knox (08:03):
Yeah, but uh, you know, credit to you, right?
I I've never been a big fan ofsocial media.
I I've been, you know,resistant to it.
But what I've realized isLinkedIn is really a great
selling tool where I'd alwayskind of viewed it as hey, this
is somewhere you go and you getconnected with people you work
with, and it's it's how you findyour next job.
(08:25):
But I've really spent a lot oftime, you know, over the last
few months building out myprofile, connecting with people
that I haven't worked with.
And I now here at Market, youknow, with with some of your
assistants, I'm seeing thechange in who is viewing my
profile, who's commenting on it,who's liking it, which now
allows me to follow up and dothis.
(08:45):
And I've actually seenrelationships grow, personal
relationships via LinkedIn thatI would have never had before.
People that would havetypically been strangers walking
up to you in the booth.
There's now this rapport andrelationship you have, which to
me, not being a fan of socialmedia is strange, but I hate to
tell you, it it works, and we'reseeing other successes on the
team with it.
Stefanie Couch (09:04):
Yeah.
You thought that it was justall BS from a lady in a pink hat
until you started hearing it,right?
Eric Knox (09:11):
Yeah, I probably shouldn't really say what I
thought about LinkedIn andsocial media when you first
started pushing it, but uh, I amI am a believer at this point,
that's for sure.
Stefanie Couch (09:20):
Yes.
Is that is that kind of as a Wfor me?
Eric Knox (09:23):
As long as it's a W for me too.
It's a W for both of us forsure.
As long as it's not an L for meand you won because there's
always a winner and loser,right?
I just want to make sure that'sit.
Stefanie Couch (09:31):
We're on the same team, so we're both
winning.
I love that.
Eric Knox (09:33):
No, it's definitely been a win.
Stefanie Couch (09:34):
A few things about LinkedIn that I'll just
say a lot of the things I dohere, you you covered it.
First of all, it's a resumeplatform.
It's when you want a new job.
Totally wrong.
Second of all, you should beconnected with everybody at your
company and not your customersor your vendors or other people
that could be customers, totallywrong.
Third thing is that you canjust post, you know, reshare
your company things, never postanything else, never comment,
(09:55):
never like.
I call it the silent lurkers.
So people that scroll onLinkedIn, they spend hours
sometimes on LinkedIn, but theynever do anything with it.
Eric Knox (10:03):
Well, that was me six months ago.
I I was a lurker.
Occasionally I might like, butthat was it.
Stefanie Couch (10:10):
Yeah, and that's really how you drive
communication through it andbuild partnerships and build
friendships.
I mean, I have I've had so manypeople that don't ever like my
stuff, don't comment, don't doanything, come up to me at shows
like this and say, I've beenfollowing your content for
years.
I love your content.
Um, thank you for posting this.
They'll reference specificposts.
And I just think that's amazingthat you can have just a
(10:32):
different avenue with LinkedInto reach out to people.
It doesn't mean you do awaywith word of mouth or your sales
team or any of that.
Eric Knox (10:38):
No, all that stuff still has to happen.
I mean, you cannot replace theface-to-face contact, but it
makes that face-to-face contactso much easier.
I mean, the the the days of ofcold calling should be over,
right?
We should, we should walk intoany prospect call, you know,
having already established thatrelationship online and and have
some familiarity there, and itjust makes that face-to-face
(11:00):
contact so much easier.
Stefanie Couch (11:01):
Yeah.
And also another little knownsecret about LinkedIn is that
because it's such a big website,it actually is great for
searches on either Google orother AI platforms.
So if someone went in and putin Eric Knox and you've been
posting original content, it'sgonna come up just like a blog
post would, or just likesomething that, you know, you
wrote in a magazine or any ofthat.
It's actually gonna come upunder your name.
(11:23):
So people will know you'relegit.
And that's really a coolopportunity for them to know
what you're all about.
And like you said, there's nocold calling because they
already know who you are.
Eric Knox (11:32):
Well, and I think one of the other cool things is
it's this market.
Well, yeah, it's three dayslong.
It might feel like it's twoweeks long, but um this market.
What day is today?
Stefanie Couch (11:43):
I don't know.
Eric Knox (11:44):
I have no idea.
This market's gonna live on forweeks, yeah.
Uh, if not longer.
I mean, especially with youknow, a lot of the great
podcasts you've been recording.
So we can just make it go onand on and on.
And before you know it, we'regonna start releasing content on
what's gonna happen in Denver.
Stefanie Couch (11:59):
I agree.
It's exciting to think about.
And that's what I love aboutthe LBM team, you and Russ and
the rest of the team and thecommunications team have given
an opportunity to try some newthings.
Some of it's worked reallywell, some of it hasn't.
Some of it is working betternow than the first time we tried
it.
That's the spirit of I thinkindependent business with what
(12:19):
your dealers are seeing too, isthey need to be able to have
room for margin to grow and haveerrors and keep trying new
things.
Eric Knox (12:26):
Yeah, no, for sure.
I mean, when I first jumpedinto this role, uh, there were
things that we tried right awayand we failed on a couple
things.
And it's just we weren't, weweren't ready.
It's not that the idea was bad,it's just we weren't capable
and ready to execute.
And we're just we're in thisposition today where I'm I'm
just so excited for the momentumwe're building and that's gonna
build here for market and andreally move on.
(12:47):
The fact that we now have fourpeople out in the field working
directly with members, thefeedback from that has been
super positive.
The leads that we're generatingto help our members grow their
business has just been awesome.
Stefanie Couch (12:58):
Yeah, it's been an incredible 12 months.
It feels like a lot longer thanthat.
Eric Knox (13:02):
I know it does.
Stefanie Couch (13:04):
This episode of the Grit Blueprint Podcast was
sponsored by Do It Best Group.
Do It Best Group is the largestco-op in the world, and they
help independent hardware andlumber yards all over North
America win.
Do It Best offers services,products, and people that can
help you win long term.
They are the champion ofindependence.
(13:25):
It looks like we actually havesome special visitors in the
podcast booth.
Eric Knox (13:32):
We are gonna have some special guests.
Stefanie Couch (13:34):
Uh you like fuzzy baby chicks?
Eric Knox (13:36):
You know me.
I I love I love animals.
Stefanie Couch (13:40):
Oh, hi, sweet baby.
Um, this is actually MetzgersFarms, which is one of your hard
line dealers that sells babychicks.
And I am also wearing burnapparel because I wanted to make
sure I wasn't cold today.
This baby chick is very active.
She is very loud.
Eric Knox (13:59):
My baby chick has like brown and dark colors.
Stefanie Couch (14:03):
It's almost like we planned this.
Come right here, Katie, so wecan see you in the camera.
Just stay right here.
This is Katie.
She is actually here with oneof the other vendors.
So thank you for coming in.
I'm gonna give you my mic.
Tell me just a little bit aboutyour business and what you do
here.
Katie from Metzer Farms (14:18):
My name is Katie.
Um, we are a third-generationfamily-run hatchery with
locations in Memphis, Tennessee,and Gonzales, California.
We hatch ducks, geese, chicks,um, guineas, and heritage
turkeys.
And so we hatch the birds atour hatchery and ship them to
your stores.
This is a white layer ducklingthat's really good for eggs.
(14:42):
And this one's a ruinedduckling.
Stefanie Couch (14:44):
Did you give me the loudest one to match me in
spirit?
It feels like we're meant foreach other.
I hope my husband's reallyexcited about hearing this all
the way back to Georgia.
We do have a bathtub that wecould use for this bad boy.
Hi, sweet baby.
Well, Katie, thank you forcoming in and bringing these
sweet babies.
And like Eric said, we arematched here.
(15:05):
He's got one that has somedarker, muted tones, just like
him.
And then I've got the brightyellow baby that won't shut up.
So it's perfect for us.
Thank you so much.
I love it.
All right, I'm gonna give thisback begrudgingly.
And if you're interested inamazing chickens and ducks, you
need to come see Katie or talkto her about how you can sell
these in your store.
(15:26):
Thank you so much, Katie.
Man, isn't that awesome?
That was awesome, like totallyawesome.
Eric Knox (15:32):
Highlight of my market.
Stefanie Couch (15:34):
Well, now that we've got baby ducks out of the
way, that was a really coolmoment.
You have to admit, that'syou're never gonna forget.
Don't tease me with a goodtime, Eric.
I do love puppies, and they arehere on the market floor.
Eric Knox (15:47):
I know they are.
Stefanie Couch (15:47):
It's incredible.
Eric Knox (15:48):
You've already seen them, haven't you?
Stefanie Couch (15:49):
I have seen them.
I walked by earlier.
I did not touch any of them,which seems like an absolute
crime.
I do want to talk a little bitabout this jacket that I got
because it's pretty cool.
It's in my pink color.
So this is burn apparel.
And this is actually a productthat I don't think a lot of
lumber yards might not think,hey, we could sell this.
We talked recently about thisis a great item to put by your
(16:09):
counter.
You've got a lot ofmerchandising experience.
Tell me how you think thiscould work for lumber dealers.
Eric Knox (16:14):
Yeah, I think you start looking at the the inside
of uh of a store and just thethe space that's available.
Uh, the burn rack, it sits onabout, you know, four square
feet and uh holds all kinds ofproduct.
Uh, it's all available directlyout of our warehouse, one piece
at a time.
You don't get stuck with abunch of excess inventory.
(16:35):
Really a great program.
And and they've got all kindsof programs to help you get
started, you know, rolling intothe cooler months.
What do we need?
They've got racks that are allbuilt out, ready to go, and get
you set up, but really maximizethat space inside of your store.
So whether it's a burn apparelrack or some type of a flooring
rack, just to find ways toreally maximize that space to
(16:55):
drive as many sales as you can.
Stefanie Couch (16:56):
Absolutely.
And it is getting a littlechilly.
That's why I'm wearing thisbecause it's actually really
cold in here.
And this has really done thetrick.
So thank you.
It is.
Thank you to the guy, Josh, whogave it to me at the burn
apparel booth.
I love that.
Well, let's get back to LBMsales.
We've got a lot of excitingthings happening.
We're on the podcast boothfloor here doing live events.
This feels like a reallyincredible time to be a
(17:18):
do-it-best independent member,but there is a lot going on in
the macro outside with big box.
There are huge pro dealers likeBFS and other people.
How does the independent winand thrive in this next few
years?
Eric Knox (17:35):
Well, I think it's how do you make it easy for your
contractor?
And it's one of the thingswe're focused on is how do we
make it easier for the member todo business with us?
And then really, how do we makeit easier for our dealers to
work directly with theircontractors?
So we've tried to focus onthings like we brought toolbox
in here at this market to reallyuh help make it easier for
contractors to pay their bills,get quotes.
(17:56):
We've done a lot of trainingand education.
Anybody can kind of sourceproducts, but how can we support
our dealers with programs andservices that really free them
up to spend more time sellingand working with their
contractors and customers?
Stefanie Couch (18:11):
Yeah, reducing friction, increasing margins,
all those things that we can dofor dealers.
There's been a lot of trainingat this market.
And I think that's a big pointof how you grow in the future is
making sure that your nextgeneration, I like to call them
the ambitious next generation,are out there knowing the
products, knowing what'savailable, and you're helping
with technology like Toolbox tobe able to help them sell and
(18:31):
get paid easier.
Eric Knox (18:33):
Yeah, I mean, that next generation is really
important in this industry.
And I think that's one of thethings that I'm probably most
excited about with our salesteam here is we really started
um five, six, seven years agobringing in that younger
generation into roles where theycan kind of learn the industry
and then they migrate into atrader role.
(18:54):
And the cool thing is when werolled out into this regional
format, we tapped into that andand all of our candidates came
internally.
They're that youngergeneration, and the best thing
is they're gonna be here for along time and grow this
business.
And then on these teams, we nowhave these folks that have just
rolled into that trader role.
And yeah, there's some youththere, but they're learning
(19:16):
quickly, they're sharp.
They're and what I love themost is they're hungry.
And oh, by the way, when Istarted keeping score and
posting leaderboards, man, thoseguys were all over it.
Stefanie Couch (19:28):
Nothing like some gamification to bring out
the inner warrior.
Eric Knox (19:31):
Yeah, well, I I knew instantly.
I'm like, yeah, these guys gotit, right?
That we're keeping score andthey want their name at the top.
Stefanie Couch (19:38):
Even if you're not keeping score, there's
always a score.
You know, if we walk down thehallway, I'm gonna try to walk
faster than you.
Eric Knox (19:45):
Yeah, kind of like keeping score or number of
attendees that sign up for yoursession, right?
Stefanie Couch (19:49):
That does happen once or twice at market, but we
won't name names.
We'll just say if you know, youknow.
Eric Knox (19:56):
Yeah, that's right.
Scoreboard.
Stefanie Couch (19:58):
Well, thank you for joining me on the Grit
Blueprint podcast.
And thank you for everythingyou've done to support this
effort and uh embracing thingsthat you know were a little bit
edgy and a little bit different,maybe a little bit pinker than
normal.
Eric Knox (20:11):
And a lot pinker than normal.
Stefanie Couch (20:13):
And I will make sure that next episode you have
a pink hat and a pink shirt, andmaybe another baby duck.
Eric Knox (20:18):
You keep threatening.
Stefanie Couch (20:19):
I am threatening, but I feel like I
can do more than threaten thistime.
I can make it happen.
And so my handy assistant, RussCatherine, has now made all of
your back.
Yeah, tag goes in the back.
All of your pink cat dreamshave now come true.
How's that feel?
Eric Knox (20:34):
Oh, awesome.
Stefanie Couch (20:36):
Do you feel the power surging through that
thing?
Eric Knox (20:38):
No, not at all.
Stefanie Couch (20:40):
Let's take a picture.
Eric Knox (20:42):
Do you have anything in black or gray?
Stefanie Couch (20:44):
I do not wear black.
I'm a true spring, a lightspring color palette, and I'm
not actually allowed to putblack on my body.
Eric Knox (20:49):
No, it's not gonna be spring.
Stefanie Couch (20:51):
I am always a light spring.
Eric Knox (20:53):
Got it.
Got it.
Stefanie Couch (20:54):
Things you didn't know you needed to know
on the Grit Blueprint podcast.
Well, thank you for joining me,Eric, and thank you for being a
good sport.
And I think you might have wornit better than me, so you might
be winning this one.
Eric Knox (21:05):
Well, thank you.
Appreciate it.
It's been a fun ride and reallylooking forward to where we go
over the next 12 months.
Stefanie Couch (21:10):
Amazing.
Thank you for listening to theGrit Blueprint Podcast.
If this episode helped youthink a little differently about
how to show up, share it withsomeone in your building world
who needs it.
If you're ready to turnvisibility into growth, then
head to gritblueprint.com tolearn more and book a call to
talk to us about your growthstrategy.
(21:32):
Until next time, stayunmistakable.
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If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
CrimeLess: Hillbilly Heist
It’s 1996 in rural North Carolina, and an oddball crew makes history when they pull off America’s third largest cash heist. But it’s all downhill from there. Join host Johnny Knoxville as he unspools a wild and woolly tale about a group of regular ‘ol folks who risked it all for a chance at a better life. CrimeLess: Hillbilly Heist answers the question: what would you do with 17.3 million dollars? The answer includes diamond rings, mansions, velvet Elvis paintings, plus a run for the border, murder-for-hire-plots, and FBI busts.