May 7, 2025 • 38 mins
Bob Vetter, a cultural anthropologist, healer, and spiritual mentor with over 30 years of experience, shares his journey of creating a unique healing modality that blends indigenous wisdom with personal authenticity. Through powerful stories and practical insights, he illustrates how healers can honor traditions while developing their distinctive approach.
• Explains the difference between respectful integration and cultural appropriation and teaches healers to identify their core wound as key to discovering their medicine
• Structures healing sessions with a clear beginning, middle, and end while allowing intuitive flexibility
• Identifies three levels of healing: universal principles, cultural contexts, and individual expressions
Join Bob's next Soul Medicine Journey cohort starting September 2025. Visit www.bobvetter.com for info.
Bob will also be serving as a guide at the upcoming Healers Retreat at Menla May 16-18, 2025—an immersive experience for those seeking deeper embodiment of their healing path within community. Visit Menla.org to register.
Check out Heallist.com for digital tools created just for holistic healers.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Yuli (00:04):
Welcome to the Healist Podcast, where we inspire and
guide healers through businessexpansion.
We give voice to incrediblyabundant healers to share their
stories.
We dive into the quantum fieldto unlock the energies of
conscious creation.
We also develop digital toolsto help you grow, which you can
(00:25):
find on HealLesscom.
I'm your host, Yuli, and I'mgrateful you chose to join this
space.
Now let's go deep.
Hello, dear friends, Welcome tothe HealLess podcast.
So so thrilled about today'sguest.
It is Bob Vetter, a culturalanthropologist, healer and
(00:47):
spiritual mentor with over 30years of experience alongside
indigenous elders andtraditional healers.
His mission is simple yetprofound Healing is about
remembering who you are andliving in alignment with our
deeper purpose.
And, as the creator of soulmedicine journey from calling to
(01:08):
practice.
He mentors the next generationof healers to walk the path with
integrity, authenticity andheart.
And I'm really, really excitedabout the topic we're going to
be uncovering today, and it'sthe topic of creating your own
way of healing, your own uniquemodality, your way just to bring
(01:34):
your gifts to the world.
And we just chatted before westarted recording and we got
into this fascinatingconversation and I said, Bob,
stop, stop, let's save it forthe podcast, because it was just
so profound already.
So I cannot wait to dive deeperinto it.
And my intention for thisepisode, as I'd like to set for
each, is to inspire some of youto find your own unique gifts.
(02:01):
Even if you have many differentcertificates or modalities that
you explored, how can you blendthem together in a way that is
not just more beneficial for theseekers, the people that come
to you but also allows you thisreally full and pure form of
(02:22):
creation and sharing your giftsin the world.
So, Bob, welcome to thisfascinating conversation.
Bob (02:29):
Thank you, yuli, it's a pleasure to be here.
Yuli (02:31):
So where should we start?
I think we should just diveright in.
We started this conversation,like I said before, and I paused
you because it was just sofascinating where you were
sharing, because I do think itresonates with a lot of healers,
right, I see so many peoplejust on our platform, on the
Heal Us platform, averagepractitioner has multiple
modalities.
Some of them have as many as 20to their name, right?
(02:54):
So at one point you blend thosetogether in a way that you kind
of the lines are blurred andthen you're not even sure if
you're doing like Reiki anymoreor hypnosis, or what is it that?
You kind of the lines areblurred and then you're not even
sure if you're doing like Reikianymore or hypnosis, or what is
it that you're doing, andsomething else kind of emerges.
Bob (03:11):
So maybe I could share a quick story with you to tell you
where that landed for me.
So this was decades ago.
I was sitting up in anall-night medicine ceremony and
what I brought to it that nightin addition to, of course,
(03:31):
focusing my prayers on who wasthere was my own personal
question what do I do with thedecades of work that I've done,
of work that I've done?
You know, I've been aroundnative North American healers
and studied with them, studiedcuranderismo, the indigenous
healing practices of Mesoamerica.
(03:52):
You know a whole bunch ofmodalities as well that I
studied Medical qigong, energyhealing, sound healing I mean,
you know long list as well ashypnotherapy, NLP.
What do I do with this?
So that was the kind of thecritical moment in my life of
saying what of all of this is me?
(04:15):
That's what I brought to it,and I was in deep prayer all
night.
I was staring at the fire and Iheard an answer.
Now, the words that I heard wereway less important than the
feeling that went along with it.
The words were specific to someof the modalities that I was
(04:38):
told to use, but there was apermission in that moment to
create something that was uniqueto me in my experience and in a
flash of insight, I just hadthis moment where all of those
things came together into onesystem.
That would be my way of healingin the world, and that's what I
(05:02):
try to bring to other people ishow to have that moment of
insight, how to pull it alltogether so that my system is
mine alone and yours is yoursalone.
And if you and I studied withthe same teachers for the same
amount of time, but you broughtin your experience and I brought
(05:23):
in mine, If we were reallyreally in touch with our soul in
design, you would end up with acompletely different healing
system than I do, Because it'syour soul mission, it's your
soul walk, your soul journeythat comes in with these
(05:45):
techniques.
Yuli (05:46):
Now that's incredible.
So it seems like for you it wasgoing through your own quest
right for this answer.
How do you see other peoplefinding this answer?
Because I think it's somethinga lot of people kind of like
struggle with and yes, they willgo into deep meditation and
they will try to come up andthey still.
(06:07):
The clarity doesn't always comeas easy as just an answer you
receive.
I wish everything in life wasas easy.
Bob (06:17):
It's just decades that lead up, led up to that simple
moment.
You know I was a culturalanthropologist my whole life.
I did my graduate work at theUniversity of Oklahoma and did
my field work among traditionalhealers.
You know, I wanted to look atthat intersection of where
healing and spirituality meet incultures all over the planet.
(06:40):
So that was my original missionin an academic sense, but it
would be years and years beforeI got to actually engage it in
the work, the boots on theground, the what do you do with
this?
We consider the healingmodality that the person has
(07:04):
already learned and all of thetechniques, the things that that
person has done, theirspiritual orientation, which is
incredibly important in all ofthis, and then create a safe
container for the work.
In other words, I considerhealing to be and this is maybe
(07:25):
a controversial point, but Iconsider healing to be a
performance and as a performanceit has a beginning, a middle
and an end.
And I may end up doingsomething completely different
in a one-on-one healing sessionwith you compared with someone
else, but I have a standard wayof beginning it, ending it and
(07:51):
sequencing our way through thedifferent parts of that healing
ceremony that we do together.
So it's like a template in mymind that is operating in the
background so that I always havesomething to fall back on, and
I'm going to share one morelittle tiny story with you that,
(08:12):
I think, illustrates this point.
The template, if you want tocall it that, that I use comes
out of Corrinderismo, thetraditional healing art of
Mesoamerica, and I was sittingin a cafe in Manhattan with a
dear friend of mine.
She went through.
My first apprenticeship inCorrenderismo was with Alina
(08:35):
Avila, who wrote a book calledWoman who Glows in the Dark,
which I strongly recommend toyou and all of the listeners,
and this friend of mine.
She had been through theyear-long apprenticeship with
Elena Avila, with me, and youknow we had been around a number
of other teachers together andI said something about healing
(08:57):
being a performance and shecompletely disagreed with me.
I mean, she's kind of like mylittle obnoxious sister that I
never had, who loves to fightwith me and argue with me.
So I was trying to come up withan analogy that would make
sense in terms of understandinghow all of this works.
And we were sitting at thisoutdoor cafe in Manhattan and I
(09:18):
was trying to think how can Iexplain this?
What is the metaphor that I canuse?
And I looked down at the tableand it hit me in that moment and
I said you know, when I firstcame to these healing arts, what
I thought was healing was theknife, the fork, the napkin and
(09:38):
the cup and the glass.
Now that I've been through thisas long as I have, I think that
it is the table that holds allof those items up.
And what I mean by that is byhaving a sense of your own
spirituality, an orientationthat comes out of your
(09:59):
understanding of your soul'smission being here and why being
a healer is the most importantjob there is on the entire
planet.
It's having that as anorientation.
The table becomes the containerfor the various items and the
items can be pulled from varioussystems as that moment calls
(10:23):
for systems as that moment callsfor.
So it's an intuitive grasp inthe moment of what that client
needs and having enough toolsthat either come out of one
system or a variety of systemsto have the intuition to know
with clarity which one to pullout.
Because you know there'sanother saying if the only tool
(10:44):
that you have is a hammer,everything looks like a nail.
Yuli (10:48):
Yes, I love that.
And do you feel like clientsneed some level of performance
to be able to transform?
Bob (10:59):
I do, I do, and you know.
Let me go to another story.
If you don't mind, I'm going toillustrate.
I love your stories.
I think it makes the point verywell.
So over the course of the yearsthat I lived in Oklahoma I was
a graduate student at theUniversity of Oklahoma An old
man named Oliver Pataponi wasthe last medicine man of his
(11:20):
tribe but he adopted me into hisfamily.
He made me his grandson and oneday we were talking about the
healers that he remembered whenhe was a little boy.
Now let me give you an idea ofhow far back we're talking.
We don't know exactly when hewas born, because they didn't
really keep records like that,but he was probably born around
(11:42):
1898.
Wow, like that, but he wasprobably born around 1898.
Wow.
So I met him in 1980 when Istarted graduate school, and he
was talking about when he was alittle boy.
So we're talking about the very, very early 1900s and he was
telling me about these medicinemen who were old men at that
(12:03):
time.
Medicine men who were old menat that time.
So now you know we're back,probably early 1800s.
These guys were born and theywere from a completely different
era with completely differentsensibilities than we have today
.
Now, in the literature that Iwas reading about the
ethnographic texts that talkedabout healers among the
(12:24):
Comanches, they talked aboutthese medicine men who would
have.
It was almost like a contest,you know, to see whose powers
were greater than somebodyelse's.
At least that was the way thatsome of these anthropologists
couched it.
But that wasn't the impressionthat I got from my grandpa chief
(12:44):
, and it certainly is not theimpression that I have now when
I look back on it.
Now I'll tell you what I make ofit.
The performative aspect is whatchanges something in the mind
of the viewer, because when youwatch something happen that is
maybe incongruous, beyond thescope of what my normal life is
(13:09):
like, it makes me embrace adifferent understanding, that
maybe I am not trapped by all ofthe things that I thought I was
trapped by, and the conditionthat a person enters into when
they come to see a healer ismaybe, instead of understanding
(13:30):
something that is going on withthem in their personal life or
in their health challenges,whatever the reason is mental,
spiritual, emotional,psychological, whatever it is
that they come to a session forwhat starts as something that is
a temporary condition.
As soon as I take on thisbelief, this understanding.
(13:52):
This is part of my identity.
This is now who I am.
Now it's fixed, now it's notsubject to change.
But when I see somethingapparently miraculous happen, I
see something that is outsidethe realm of my normal
experience.
It expands my understandingthat maybe, just maybe, whatever
(14:17):
it is that I came here for outof desperation can move.
That's something that seemed tobe a permanent part of my
condition.
Maybe there's a glimmer of hopethat something can change.
Yuli (14:30):
I love that so much.
I can totally see it and I'mwith you.
It's like you are making theman observer and but taking them
also out of the ordinary world.
Right, you're putting them inanother world and now they're
observer, and suddenly the rulesare changing, the reality is
shifting.
So just the act of that I'm notsure if you're.
Bob (14:53):
Are you familiar with the word liminality?
Yes, so it's.
Yeah, you enter liminality inthat moment where everything
gets reversed.
Everything is different in thatmoment.
Yuli (15:05):
I love that so much.
Well, as you were speaking, Iwas trying to imagine the fire
ceremony that you're going to beleading us in our Menla Healers
Retreat in just a couple ofweeks, and it's yeah.
I love shamanic ceremonies andI think they're just so powerful
, and this ability of takingpeople out of the ordinary
(15:29):
worlds into other dimensions isjust so incredible in this
tradition and I can't wait toexperience it myself.
I was just mesmerized justlistening to you.
But how do you teach peoplethose some of those skills?
Bob (15:46):
Yeah, so that's a good question.
So in the program that I teachthat you mentioned, I'm in the
middle of one cohort right now.
There are four separate modulesthat have to do with this
experience, and in the first one, the first section, we look at
personal transformation, how thehealer is healed, and that goes
(16:09):
for anybody, you know.
I like to say that the job, theprocess of healing, is never
finished, that we are alwaysmoving from a place of
fragmentation to a place ofwholeness.
That's the reason for our beingon this earth walk in the first
place.
So there's no such thing asbeing done.
(16:32):
We're always working on that,regardless of where we begin and
what our entry point is.
So the first section is we lookat that personal transformation
, personal healing and growth.
In the second section we go intospecific techniques that I
consider to be the core, thecore items that I use, and it's
(16:57):
really a handful of things, butit's enough to give you a
beginning, middle and an end,and it's enough of a container
to be able to drop things in,you know.
So another analogy that I cameup with one of the things that I
lead is Temazcal, which is thetraditional Mesoamerican version
(17:21):
of the sweat lodge and when Iwas learning Temazcal, this was
many years after I'd beenleading North American sweat
lodges.
But in the Temazcal there'smuch more flexibility in terms
of what you do, and what it mademe think of was a bento box in
a Japanese restaurant and you'vegot four separate sections that
(17:43):
are the four rounds of theceremony and you drop whatever
items into each of those boxesthat you need in that moment.
And that's the way that I thinkyou can think of this process
of soul medicine that I'm ableto provide you with the bento
box that you can then draw fromyour own experiences and your
(18:03):
own background and other healingmodalities.
So we explore how to createthat safe container, how to do a
beginning, a middle and an endand then a core of maybe five
different techniques that youmay or may not use, but you drop
them in as the situation callsfor.
(18:25):
In the next section of thecourse we look at, we explore
how your personal experiencefits into this and then, in the
final and fourth session, welook at how to put everything
together and create this uniquehealing system that is yours and
(18:46):
yours alone.
And the clue is finding in thefirst section of the course what
is my core wound?
What is it that is unique, thatbrought me to wanting to be
healed in the first place, andhow do I plug that back into who
(19:06):
it is that I'm destined to workwith, so that the medicine lies
next to the wound, as we say?
Yuli (19:15):
That sounds like an incredible system and I can see
it working together sobeautifully.
And you know, I'm also one ofthose people who I actually love
the blending of teachingsbecause, as someone on a healing
journey, I rarely use just onetool, right, I use different
(19:38):
modalities.
I love seeing differentpractitioners.
Each of them uncovers differentparts of me, my journey for me.
But also I met on this journeya lot of people who are actually
extremely protective of certainmodalities and they're very.
(19:59):
They have a big likeapprehension when people either
mix modalities or stray awayfrom the proper way of doing
something or the tradition right.
There's a lot of like peoplethat just think tradition
keeping as their their callingright, and they become so
(20:21):
protective that it's almost like.
On one hand, I can see why,right, I do think it's important
to protect a lot of beautiful,different ancient traditions
that are around, but I'm alsowitnessing this new kind of like
emergence of all of thosedifferent modern modalities that
are just again they're comingout of a blend right, and how
(20:44):
beneficial those are.
So I'm curious about and I knowyour point of view that we're
pretty much alike in this vision.
But how do you justify topeople that have that resistance
of straying away, that havethat resistance of straying away
.
Bob (21:01):
Well, so far I've only given you one side of my
experience.
Now let me go into the otherside of it, because I'm involved
in traditional collectiveNative American ceremonies from
a number of tribes.
You know I was adopted into anumber of different families and
(21:23):
a number of different tribesand there are annual ceremonies
that I go to, where I help outor I have a variety of different
ways of being a part of.
I don't bring any of that intothe work that I do and the
reason that I don't is becauseit doesn't fit with that
(21:46):
tradition.
So I would not violate thetrust that was placed in me.
I will occasionally tellstories about it.
I will draw strength from it.
I will even consider the waythat my one-on-one work goes to
be based on a way of being, away that I see in ceremony that
(22:10):
people bring to the interaction,the compassion, the one-on-one
ability to listen withconcentrated awareness.
Now, all of those things arecompletely separate than taking
something from there that theydon't want taken.
So I'm very clear aboutcultural boundaries that I don't
(22:36):
violate because they do notgive permission.
Now my experience inCorrenderismo is completely
different, because all of myteachers encouraged me to take
it and bring it out into theworld.
So that's why I'm very carefulabout what I do and do not move
(22:56):
from one side to another.
And you know, we also liveduring a time that people are
very concerned and maybe rightlyso about cultural appropriation
.
So what constitutes culturalappropriation?
Now, if I share something withyou openly and I tell you, yuli,
(23:17):
I want you to go out and I wantyou to use this in the world, I
want you to help to eliminatethe suffering in the world.
So take this with you, with myblessing, and go do the work.
That's very different than if aperson shows up.
(23:37):
They spend a very little bit oftime somewhere.
They pull something from onecontext and take it out and go
away with it and neveracknowledge, never give back to
the community.
You know all those are allthings that make it cultural
appropriation.
(23:58):
So you know the things that I doto make sure that I'm not doing
cultural appropriation is.
I make sure that I havepermission.
I make sure that I maintaincontact with the people who have
shared with me.
I name my teachers.
I can tell you where everysingle technique that I use came
from.
(24:18):
So I'm very careful to avoidwhat I believe is the danger of
cultural appropriation.
But there are people in theworld who think that that's not
enough, who think that anythingin what that, that we should
stay in our own lane and weshould never step into that
other lane, because I wasn'tborn into it.
(24:40):
So I have my own beliefs aboutthis and I think each one of us
has to come to it with anunderstanding of how we can be
honoring and respectful of otherpeople and other traditions.
Does that answer?
Yuli (24:55):
Yeah, Listen, it's such a.
It's such a, you know, delicateline to walk and I've seen it
from so many different sides.
And you know, while I respectand absolutely agree that the
traditions are precious and theyneed to be kept, but I've also
met people, like often, otherpeople, who were told we want
(25:18):
these traditions to come to theWest.
Right, it's time to.
This is the only thing that'sgoing to save this planet if
some of those traditions arefinally being introduced.
And I think, like when you dothat, when you open a door,
there's always a danger ofdelusion, right, of some of
those things.
(25:39):
And then I've also seen peoplethat are so like on the other
side, right in the Western world, that would say I would never
attend, like, a fire ceremonyled by a white woman.
It's just not right, right, andno matter how much time she
spent with the elders and whatcertification she would have.
(26:02):
So I think we're seeing now,this beautiful time, that a lot
of those things are coming intoour life and there are still not
many rules or regulations,right, how?
Bob (26:18):
to operate.
Yuli (26:20):
Right, it's a wild west literally.
But, and someone like yourselfwho has done it for years and
you definitely have a strongethical values, right, it makes
sense that you will respect.
But I think a lot of peoplemaybe some of the newer
generation that comes to thosetraditions I don't think they
(26:40):
intentionally want to bedisrespectful.
I think they're just actingbecause there's no rules and
regulations, right, they takesomething beautiful, it works
for them, it changed their life.
I try to believe that mostpeople have good intentions,
right, that's always myassumption until you're proving
me wrong.
So I do think they come withgood intentions to spread those
(27:02):
teachings.
But how do we help them do itin a way that is not
compromising?
Bob (27:09):
And that's where mentoring comes in.
You know, whether it's you, meor somebody else, a lot of times
it's the job of a mentor.
You know, I had mentors alongthe way native elders who, when
I came to a crisis in my life,when I had a question, I would
go to them.
I mean, I'm not saying that Inecessarily do everything that
(27:33):
they recommended, but I went tothem in moments of uncertainty
and I think it is helpful tohave a mentor or a number of
mentors.
Yuli (27:44):
Absolutely Such a good point.
So let's kind of circle back alittle bit.
So we talked about thisblending of techniques and
traditions.
Then we talked about the kindof the more of a boundaries
right around preserving some ofthem.
So how does one kind of come upwith their own technique that
(28:05):
is not compromising all thedifferent modalities and
traditions that they are drawingfrom?
Bob (28:12):
well, are you asking me in general or do you want to know
how I specifically do it?
I work with let's dospecifically.
Yuli (28:20):
Yeah, okay, sure so in.
Bob (28:20):
In the case of work, the people I work with, let's do
specifically yeah, okay, sure.
So in the case of the peoplewho work with me, I am their
mentor and we have not only theclass sessions, but when they
sign up with me, we have aseries of one-on-one sessions as
well as well, and they have achance to practice the things
(28:47):
that they learn, and I only usetechniques in it that I know are
okay to share.
So there's no need for worry inthat sense, and the people that
I've gotten to know have hadtheir own experiences with and
figure out a way.
Well, let me just give you anexample.
Okay, let's say that we'redoing a soul retrieval.
(29:10):
Okay, so the idea behind soulretrieval is something called
susto, that a person experiencessoul loss, that when we
experience a susto which I'm notgoing to define it as trauma,
but let's just say that it is atleast partially analogous to
(29:32):
trauma that a splinter of thesoul gets left behind at the
time and the place of theincident, and that is a
temporary fix.
You could say so in the samesense that, let's say, you get
in a car accident, you don'tfeel the pain right away because
(29:52):
your body went into shock.
In the same way, at the momentof a trauma, a little piece
leaves to save the integrity ofthe rest of your sense of self.
Now that works short term, butin the long term there is an
energy loss associated with that.
(30:14):
So in soul retrieval we'retrying to find and bring back
the pieces of the soul that left, and there are specific
techniques that we do during asoul retrieval.
But then there are other thingsthat we do during a soul
retrieval.
But then there are other thingsthat we can bring in.
So, for example, you know I'lluse contemporary sound healing
(30:37):
practices to bring in during it.
There are techniques that I'velearned in other systems of
healing that I may drop induring one of these soul
retrievals, even though it's notexactly the way that I was
taught soul retrieval, so thatwe have a here's my favorite
(30:59):
analogy it's like a jazzcomposition.
There is the basic structure tothe song and then there is the
place for improvisation.
So when I want to dropsomething in, I ask the question
would I be able to say to theperson who I learned this from
I'm using this in this context.
(31:21):
Would they be okay with medoing what I'm doing?
That's the way that I wouldpose the question.
I mean, if you're learning itfrom me, I'm teaching it to you
in a way that I can tell youwith certainty is with integrity
, because I was given permissionto do the things that I'm
teaching you.
But if you want to addsomething to it, you want to do
(31:42):
it in your own way, and you'vebeen, maybe you've traveled
around the entire planet.
Well, I would ask you thatquestion Could you tell me who
taught it to you?
Could you tell me that you havetheir permission?
Can you tell me that you have acontinued relationship with
them, so that you have thatconnection to the tradition and
(32:05):
it's not merely a weekend thing?
Yuli (32:08):
Yeah, no, that is so beautiful and thank you for
taking us on this journey kindof behind the scenes of the
healer's mind.
I always I love, I learned somuch and I'm naturally curious
about the way that healers workand why do they choose to use
different techniques or how dothey do that.
(32:29):
So I think that's extremelyhelpful for healers and not just
healers, right, people thatwork just to understand where
those things are coming from.
Because I think one of thechallenges of the entire
holistic healing space and Ithink especially some of the
more less kind of defined waysof healing, like energy healing
(32:52):
or shamanism right, it's soundefined and undescribed and
it's pure energy work, right,that is really hard for people
sometimes to understand it andtrust it, right.
So I think and this is part ofthe mission of this podcast like
, the more we talk about thosethings, the more we kind of lift
(33:13):
the veil and actually provethere is a science behind and
there's a system in place, right, there's traditions that go
back thousands of years, andthen there's the healer who is
the master of the jazz orchestra, right.
So I love that.
I think a lot of people arelearning a lot right now.
(33:35):
So thank you for that.
Bob (33:37):
Yeah.
So to just kind of sum that up,kind of wrap it up, I like to
think that there are threelevels of understanding this
healing process.
So there is an aspect ofhealing that is universal,
meaning that there areprinciples that we find all over
the planet that everybodyshares in common, including
(33:59):
modern holistic practices.
So that would be the universallevel of healing.
There's also a cultural levelof healing, and by that I mean
that, for example, you know, wecan look at even illnesses as
being culture specific, that theway that people heal in a
(34:21):
particular culture is unique tothem because of the holistic
nature of the culture itself.
And then there's the individuallevel, and it's the individual
level where I am different.
I am unique from everybody elseboth in terms of how my healing
unfolds for me and in terms ofhow I put together my own system
(34:44):
and my own way of being in theworld as a healer.
Yuli (34:48):
I love this.
Well, you are just a wealth ofknowledge and inspiration, and I
feel like we could talk forhours, and I have so many more
questions.
You might have to come for parttwo, but I wanted to ask if
there was anything else that youwant to share with our
listeners as a part of theconversation.
Bob (35:08):
Yeah, my parting message is that healing is not something
that we do only because of oursymptoms, and rather I would say
it is an unfolding process ofthe evolution of the soul, and
symptoms are what bring us to itin the first place, which is
(35:32):
why it's so important to infusemeaning into the inevitable
suffering that each one of uswill go through at some point or
we have in the past, andhealing is the way we make
meaning out of this life'sjourney that at times is
difficult and sometimes it'seasy, sometimes it's sad,
(35:56):
sometimes it's joyful.
Healing is this process of usmoving from fragmentation to
wholeness, and so it can becomeour whole reason for being.
Yuli (36:08):
Well, this episode was very healing for me.
Already I love to talk topeople like you who just raise
the vibration just by being inthe room or on my Zoom screen,
and I really want to thank youfor that and anyone who's
interested in your beautifulcourse and to find their own
unique modality.
We'll put it in the show notes,but do you want to share a
(36:30):
little bit more quickly aboutthe course and the next cohort
that's coming?
Bob (36:34):
up?
Yeah, sure.
So the next cohort is coming upin September 2025.
And there are all kinds offreebies that you can find on my
website, wwwbobvettercom.
So, b-o-b-v-e-t-t-e-rcom,there's a quiz that you can take
(36:58):
Should I be a healer?
There is a free healingcommunity that people can sign
on to.
There's all kinds of podcastsand blogs and videos and all
kinds of things.
So, even if you don't buysomething, just go, because
there's all kinds of fun stuffthere.
Yuli (37:15):
Amazing.
I love this so much, bob, and Icannot wait for your fire
ceremony in just a couple ofweeks, and hopefully more
healers will join us there andhave a chance to work with you
in person.
So thank you.
Can I give a quick plug to thatevent?
Yes, yes.
Bob (37:32):
So what is the name of the event?
Healers Retreat, healersRetreat.
So let me say why I signed on.
Because, as you know, yuli, yousent me an invitation which I
never even saw.
You sent me an invitation whichI never even saw, and then I
found out about this and Iwanted to come because I love
the inspiration of being aroundother people who do what they do
(37:54):
, and this whole idea that wecan be in one place at one time
that is dedicated to us sharingshoulder to shoulder.
So I look forward to sharing alittle bit of what I know during
that nighttime healing ceremonyand getting to know what other
people in the community who I'venever met before.
I want to know what they do aswell.
Yuli (38:14):
Amazing.
I love this Community is ourmedicine.
That's what I like to say.
And this is the right communityto belong, with all people that
want to grow, want to help,want to make the world a better
place, and thank you for beingpart of it and thank you for
joining us today.
Bob (38:30):
Thank you so much, yuli, and thanks everybody for
listening.
Welcome to the Healist Podcast, where we inspire and
guide healers through businessexpansion.
We give voice to incrediblyabundant healers to share their
stories.
We dive into the quantum fieldto unlock the energies of
conscious creation.
We also develop digital toolsto help you grow, which you can
(00:25):
find on HealLesscom.
I'm your host, Yuli, and I'mgrateful you chose to join this
space.
Now let's go deep.
Hello, dear friends, Welcome tothe HealLess podcast.
So so thrilled about today'sguest.
It is Bob Vetter, a culturalanthropologist, healer and
(00:47):
spiritual mentor with over 30years of experience alongside
indigenous elders andtraditional healers.
His mission is simple yetprofound Healing is about
remembering who you are andliving in alignment with our
deeper purpose.
And, as the creator of soulmedicine journey from calling to
(01:08):
practice.
He mentors the next generationof healers to walk the path with
integrity, authenticity andheart.
And I'm really, really excitedabout the topic we're going to
be uncovering today, and it'sthe topic of creating your own
way of healing, your own uniquemodality, your way just to bring
(01:34):
your gifts to the world.
And we just chatted before westarted recording and we got
into this fascinatingconversation and I said, Bob,
stop, stop, let's save it forthe podcast, because it was just
so profound already.
So I cannot wait to dive deeperinto it.
And my intention for thisepisode, as I'd like to set for
each, is to inspire some of youto find your own unique gifts.
(02:01):
Even if you have many differentcertificates or modalities that
you explored, how can you blendthem together in a way that is
not just more beneficial for theseekers, the people that come
to you but also allows you thisreally full and pure form of
(02:22):
creation and sharing your giftsin the world.
So, Bob, welcome to thisfascinating conversation.
Bob (02:29):
Thank you, yuli, it's a pleasure to be here.
Yuli (02:31):
So where should we start?
I think we should just diveright in.
We started this conversation,like I said before, and I paused
you because it was just sofascinating where you were
sharing, because I do think itresonates with a lot of healers,
right, I see so many peoplejust on our platform, on the
Heal Us platform, averagepractitioner has multiple
modalities.
Some of them have as many as 20to their name, right?
(02:54):
So at one point you blend thosetogether in a way that you kind
of the lines are blurred andthen you're not even sure if
you're doing like Reiki anymoreor hypnosis, or what is it that?
You kind of the lines areblurred and then you're not even
sure if you're doing like Reikianymore or hypnosis, or what is
it that you're doing, andsomething else kind of emerges.
Bob (03:11):
So maybe I could share a quick story with you to tell you
where that landed for me.
So this was decades ago.
I was sitting up in anall-night medicine ceremony and
what I brought to it that nightin addition to, of course,
(03:31):
focusing my prayers on who wasthere was my own personal
question what do I do with thedecades of work that I've done,
of work that I've done?
You know, I've been aroundnative North American healers
and studied with them, studiedcuranderismo, the indigenous
healing practices of Mesoamerica.
(03:52):
You know a whole bunch ofmodalities as well that I
studied Medical qigong, energyhealing, sound healing I mean,
you know long list as well ashypnotherapy, NLP.
What do I do with this?
So that was the kind of thecritical moment in my life of
saying what of all of this is me?
(04:15):
That's what I brought to it,and I was in deep prayer all
night.
I was staring at the fire and Iheard an answer.
Now, the words that I heard wereway less important than the
feeling that went along with it.
The words were specific to someof the modalities that I was
(04:38):
told to use, but there was apermission in that moment to
create something that was uniqueto me in my experience and in a
flash of insight, I just hadthis moment where all of those
things came together into onesystem.
That would be my way of healingin the world, and that's what I
(05:02):
try to bring to other people ishow to have that moment of
insight, how to pull it alltogether so that my system is
mine alone and yours is yoursalone.
And if you and I studied withthe same teachers for the same
amount of time, but you broughtin your experience and I brought
(05:23):
in mine, If we were reallyreally in touch with our soul in
design, you would end up with acompletely different healing
system than I do, Because it'syour soul mission, it's your
soul walk, your soul journeythat comes in with these
(05:45):
techniques.
Yuli (05:46):
Now that's incredible.
So it seems like for you it wasgoing through your own quest
right for this answer.
How do you see other peoplefinding this answer?
Because I think it's somethinga lot of people kind of like
struggle with and yes, they willgo into deep meditation and
they will try to come up andthey still.
(06:07):
The clarity doesn't always comeas easy as just an answer you
receive.
I wish everything in life wasas easy.
Bob (06:17):
It's just decades that lead up, led up to that simple
moment.
You know I was a culturalanthropologist my whole life.
I did my graduate work at theUniversity of Oklahoma and did
my field work among traditionalhealers.
You know, I wanted to look atthat intersection of where
healing and spirituality meet incultures all over the planet.
(06:40):
So that was my original missionin an academic sense, but it
would be years and years beforeI got to actually engage it in
the work, the boots on theground, the what do you do with
this?
We consider the healingmodality that the person has
(07:04):
already learned and all of thetechniques, the things that that
person has done, theirspiritual orientation, which is
incredibly important in all ofthis, and then create a safe
container for the work.
In other words, I considerhealing to be and this is maybe
(07:25):
a controversial point, but Iconsider healing to be a
performance and as a performanceit has a beginning, a middle
and an end.
And I may end up doingsomething completely different
in a one-on-one healing sessionwith you compared with someone
else, but I have a standard wayof beginning it, ending it and
(07:51):
sequencing our way through thedifferent parts of that healing
ceremony that we do together.
So it's like a template in mymind that is operating in the
background so that I always havesomething to fall back on, and
I'm going to share one morelittle tiny story with you that,
(08:12):
I think, illustrates this point.
The template, if you want tocall it that, that I use comes
out of Corrinderismo, thetraditional healing art of
Mesoamerica, and I was sittingin a cafe in Manhattan with a
dear friend of mine.
She went through.
My first apprenticeship inCorrenderismo was with Alina
(08:35):
Avila, who wrote a book calledWoman who Glows in the Dark,
which I strongly recommend toyou and all of the listeners,
and this friend of mine.
She had been through theyear-long apprenticeship with
Elena Avila, with me, and youknow we had been around a number
of other teachers together andI said something about healing
(08:57):
being a performance and shecompletely disagreed with me.
I mean, she's kind of like mylittle obnoxious sister that I
never had, who loves to fightwith me and argue with me.
So I was trying to come up withan analogy that would make
sense in terms of understandinghow all of this works.
And we were sitting at thisoutdoor cafe in Manhattan and I
(09:18):
was trying to think how can Iexplain this?
What is the metaphor that I canuse?
And I looked down at the tableand it hit me in that moment and
I said you know, when I firstcame to these healing arts, what
I thought was healing was theknife, the fork, the napkin and
(09:38):
the cup and the glass.
Now that I've been through thisas long as I have, I think that
it is the table that holds allof those items up.
And what I mean by that is byhaving a sense of your own
spirituality, an orientationthat comes out of your
(09:59):
understanding of your soul'smission being here and why being
a healer is the most importantjob there is on the entire
planet.
It's having that as anorientation.
The table becomes the containerfor the various items and the
items can be pulled from varioussystems as that moment calls
(10:23):
for systems as that moment callsfor.
So it's an intuitive grasp inthe moment of what that client
needs and having enough toolsthat either come out of one
system or a variety of systemsto have the intuition to know
with clarity which one to pullout.
Because you know there'sanother saying if the only tool
(10:44):
that you have is a hammer,everything looks like a nail.
Yuli (10:48):
Yes, I love that.
And do you feel like clientsneed some level of performance
to be able to transform?
Bob (10:59):
I do, I do, and you know.
Let me go to another story.
If you don't mind, I'm going toillustrate.
I love your stories.
I think it makes the point verywell.
So over the course of the yearsthat I lived in Oklahoma I was
a graduate student at theUniversity of Oklahoma An old
man named Oliver Pataponi wasthe last medicine man of his
(11:20):
tribe but he adopted me into hisfamily.
He made me his grandson and oneday we were talking about the
healers that he remembered whenhe was a little boy.
Now let me give you an idea ofhow far back we're talking.
We don't know exactly when hewas born, because they didn't
really keep records like that,but he was probably born around
(11:42):
1898.
Wow, like that, but he wasprobably born around 1898.
Wow.
So I met him in 1980 when Istarted graduate school, and he
was talking about when he was alittle boy.
So we're talking about the very, very early 1900s and he was
telling me about these medicinemen who were old men at that
(12:03):
time.
Medicine men who were old menat that time.
So now you know we're back,probably early 1800s.
These guys were born and theywere from a completely different
era with completely differentsensibilities than we have today
.
Now, in the literature that Iwas reading about the
ethnographic texts that talkedabout healers among the
(12:24):
Comanches, they talked aboutthese medicine men who would
have.
It was almost like a contest,you know, to see whose powers
were greater than somebodyelse's.
At least that was the way thatsome of these anthropologists
couched it.
But that wasn't the impressionthat I got from my grandpa chief
(12:44):
, and it certainly is not theimpression that I have now when
I look back on it.
Now I'll tell you what I make ofit.
The performative aspect is whatchanges something in the mind
of the viewer, because when youwatch something happen that is
maybe incongruous, beyond thescope of what my normal life is
(13:09):
like, it makes me embrace adifferent understanding, that
maybe I am not trapped by all ofthe things that I thought I was
trapped by, and the conditionthat a person enters into when
they come to see a healer ismaybe, instead of understanding
(13:30):
something that is going on withthem in their personal life or
in their health challenges,whatever the reason is mental,
spiritual, emotional,psychological, whatever it is
that they come to a session forwhat starts as something that is
a temporary condition.
As soon as I take on thisbelief, this understanding.
(13:52):
This is part of my identity.
This is now who I am.
Now it's fixed, now it's notsubject to change.
But when I see somethingapparently miraculous happen, I
see something that is outsidethe realm of my normal
experience.
It expands my understandingthat maybe, just maybe, whatever
(14:17):
it is that I came here for outof desperation can move.
That's something that seemed tobe a permanent part of my
condition.
Maybe there's a glimmer of hopethat something can change.
Yuli (14:30):
I love that so much.
I can totally see it and I'mwith you.
It's like you are making theman observer and but taking them
also out of the ordinary world.
Right, you're putting them inanother world and now they're
observer, and suddenly the rulesare changing, the reality is
shifting.
So just the act of that I'm notsure if you're.
Bob (14:53):
Are you familiar with the word liminality?
Yes, so it's.
Yeah, you enter liminality inthat moment where everything
gets reversed.
Everything is different in thatmoment.
Yuli (15:05):
I love that so much.
Well, as you were speaking, Iwas trying to imagine the fire
ceremony that you're going to beleading us in our Menla Healers
Retreat in just a couple ofweeks, and it's yeah.
I love shamanic ceremonies andI think they're just so powerful
, and this ability of takingpeople out of the ordinary
(15:29):
worlds into other dimensions isjust so incredible in this
tradition and I can't wait toexperience it myself.
I was just mesmerized justlistening to you.
But how do you teach peoplethose some of those skills?
Bob (15:46):
Yeah, so that's a good question.
So in the program that I teachthat you mentioned, I'm in the
middle of one cohort right now.
There are four separate modulesthat have to do with this
experience, and in the first one, the first section, we look at
personal transformation, how thehealer is healed, and that goes
(16:09):
for anybody, you know.
I like to say that the job, theprocess of healing, is never
finished, that we are alwaysmoving from a place of
fragmentation to a place ofwholeness.
That's the reason for our beingon this earth walk in the first
place.
So there's no such thing asbeing done.
(16:32):
We're always working on that,regardless of where we begin and
what our entry point is.
So the first section is we lookat that personal transformation
, personal healing and growth.
In the second section we go intospecific techniques that I
consider to be the core, thecore items that I use, and it's
(16:57):
really a handful of things, butit's enough to give you a
beginning, middle and an end,and it's enough of a container
to be able to drop things in,you know.
So another analogy that I cameup with one of the things that I
lead is Temazcal, which is thetraditional Mesoamerican version
(17:21):
of the sweat lodge and when Iwas learning Temazcal, this was
many years after I'd beenleading North American sweat
lodges.
But in the Temazcal there'smuch more flexibility in terms
of what you do, and what it mademe think of was a bento box in
a Japanese restaurant and you'vegot four separate sections that
(17:43):
are the four rounds of theceremony and you drop whatever
items into each of those boxesthat you need in that moment.
And that's the way that I thinkyou can think of this process
of soul medicine that I'm ableto provide you with the bento
box that you can then draw fromyour own experiences and your
(18:03):
own background and other healingmodalities.
So we explore how to createthat safe container, how to do a
beginning, a middle and an endand then a core of maybe five
different techniques that youmay or may not use, but you drop
them in as the situation callsfor.
(18:25):
In the next section of thecourse we look at, we explore
how your personal experiencefits into this and then, in the
final and fourth session, welook at how to put everything
together and create this uniquehealing system that is yours and
(18:46):
yours alone.
And the clue is finding in thefirst section of the course what
is my core wound?
What is it that is unique, thatbrought me to wanting to be
healed in the first place, andhow do I plug that back into who
(19:06):
it is that I'm destined to workwith, so that the medicine lies
next to the wound, as we say?
Yuli (19:15):
That sounds like an incredible system and I can see
it working together sobeautifully.
And you know, I'm also one ofthose people who I actually love
the blending of teachingsbecause, as someone on a healing
journey, I rarely use just onetool, right, I use different
(19:38):
modalities.
I love seeing differentpractitioners.
Each of them uncovers differentparts of me, my journey for me.
But also I met on this journeya lot of people who are actually
extremely protective of certainmodalities and they're very.
(19:59):
They have a big likeapprehension when people either
mix modalities or stray awayfrom the proper way of doing
something or the tradition right.
There's a lot of like peoplethat just think tradition
keeping as their their callingright, and they become so
(20:21):
protective that it's almost like.
On one hand, I can see why,right, I do think it's important
to protect a lot of beautiful,different ancient traditions
that are around, but I'm alsowitnessing this new kind of like
emergence of all of thosedifferent modern modalities that
are just again they're comingout of a blend right, and how
(20:44):
beneficial those are.
So I'm curious about and I knowyour point of view that we're
pretty much alike in this vision.
But how do you justify topeople that have that resistance
of straying away, that havethat resistance of straying away
.
Bob (21:01):
Well, so far I've only given you one side of my
experience.
Now let me go into the otherside of it, because I'm involved
in traditional collectiveNative American ceremonies from
a number of tribes.
You know I was adopted into anumber of different families and
(21:23):
a number of different tribesand there are annual ceremonies
that I go to, where I help outor I have a variety of different
ways of being a part of.
I don't bring any of that intothe work that I do and the
reason that I don't is becauseit doesn't fit with that
(21:46):
tradition.
So I would not violate thetrust that was placed in me.
I will occasionally tellstories about it.
I will draw strength from it.
I will even consider the waythat my one-on-one work goes to
be based on a way of being, away that I see in ceremony that
(22:10):
people bring to the interaction,the compassion, the one-on-one
ability to listen withconcentrated awareness.
Now, all of those things arecompletely separate than taking
something from there that theydon't want taken.
So I'm very clear aboutcultural boundaries that I don't
(22:36):
violate because they do notgive permission.
Now my experience inCorrenderismo is completely
different, because all of myteachers encouraged me to take
it and bring it out into theworld.
So that's why I'm very carefulabout what I do and do not move
(22:56):
from one side to another.
And you know, we also liveduring a time that people are
very concerned and maybe rightlyso about cultural appropriation
.
So what constitutes culturalappropriation?
Now, if I share something withyou openly and I tell you, yuli,
(23:17):
I want you to go out and I wantyou to use this in the world, I
want you to help to eliminatethe suffering in the world.
So take this with you, with myblessing, and go do the work.
That's very different than if aperson shows up.
(23:37):
They spend a very little bit oftime somewhere.
They pull something from onecontext and take it out and go
away with it and neveracknowledge, never give back to
the community.
You know all those are allthings that make it cultural
appropriation.
(23:58):
So you know the things that I doto make sure that I'm not doing
cultural appropriation is.
I make sure that I havepermission.
I make sure that I maintaincontact with the people who have
shared with me.
I name my teachers.
I can tell you where everysingle technique that I use came
from.
(24:18):
So I'm very careful to avoidwhat I believe is the danger of
cultural appropriation.
But there are people in theworld who think that that's not
enough, who think that anythingin what that, that we should
stay in our own lane and weshould never step into that
other lane, because I wasn'tborn into it.
(24:40):
So I have my own beliefs aboutthis and I think each one of us
has to come to it with anunderstanding of how we can be
honoring and respectful of otherpeople and other traditions.
Does that answer?
Yuli (24:55):
Yeah, Listen, it's such a.
It's such a, you know, delicateline to walk and I've seen it
from so many different sides.
And you know, while I respectand absolutely agree that the
traditions are precious and theyneed to be kept, but I've also
met people, like often, otherpeople, who were told we want
(25:18):
these traditions to come to theWest.
Right, it's time to.
This is the only thing that'sgoing to save this planet if
some of those traditions arefinally being introduced.
And I think, like when you dothat, when you open a door,
there's always a danger ofdelusion, right, of some of
those things.
(25:39):
And then I've also seen peoplethat are so like on the other
side, right in the Western world, that would say I would never
attend, like, a fire ceremonyled by a white woman.
It's just not right, right, andno matter how much time she
spent with the elders and whatcertification she would have.
(26:02):
So I think we're seeing now,this beautiful time, that a lot
of those things are coming intoour life and there are still not
many rules or regulations,right, how?
Bob (26:18):
to operate.
Yuli (26:20):
Right, it's a wild west literally.
But, and someone like yourselfwho has done it for years and
you definitely have a strongethical values, right, it makes
sense that you will respect.
But I think a lot of peoplemaybe some of the newer
generation that comes to thosetraditions I don't think they
(26:40):
intentionally want to bedisrespectful.
I think they're just actingbecause there's no rules and
regulations, right, they takesomething beautiful, it works
for them, it changed their life.
I try to believe that mostpeople have good intentions,
right, that's always myassumption until you're proving
me wrong.
So I do think they come withgood intentions to spread those
(27:02):
teachings.
But how do we help them do itin a way that is not
compromising?
Bob (27:09):
And that's where mentoring comes in.
You know, whether it's you, meor somebody else, a lot of times
it's the job of a mentor.
You know, I had mentors alongthe way native elders who, when
I came to a crisis in my life,when I had a question, I would
go to them.
I mean, I'm not saying that Inecessarily do everything that
(27:33):
they recommended, but I went tothem in moments of uncertainty
and I think it is helpful tohave a mentor or a number of
mentors.
Yuli (27:44):
Absolutely Such a good point.
So let's kind of circle back alittle bit.
So we talked about thisblending of techniques and
traditions.
Then we talked about the kindof the more of a boundaries
right around preserving some ofthem.
So how does one kind of come upwith their own technique that
(28:05):
is not compromising all thedifferent modalities and
traditions that they are drawingfrom?
Bob (28:12):
well, are you asking me in general or do you want to know
how I specifically do it?
I work with let's dospecifically.
Yuli (28:20):
Yeah, okay, sure so in.
Bob (28:20):
In the case of work, the people I work with, let's do
specifically yeah, okay, sure.
So in the case of the peoplewho work with me, I am their
mentor and we have not only theclass sessions, but when they
sign up with me, we have aseries of one-on-one sessions as
well as well, and they have achance to practice the things
(28:47):
that they learn, and I only usetechniques in it that I know are
okay to share.
So there's no need for worry inthat sense, and the people that
I've gotten to know have hadtheir own experiences with and
figure out a way.
Well, let me just give you anexample.
Okay, let's say that we'redoing a soul retrieval.
(29:10):
Okay, so the idea behind soulretrieval is something called
susto, that a person experiencessoul loss, that when we
experience a susto which I'm notgoing to define it as trauma,
but let's just say that it is atleast partially analogous to
(29:32):
trauma that a splinter of thesoul gets left behind at the
time and the place of theincident, and that is a
temporary fix.
You could say so in the samesense that, let's say, you get
in a car accident, you don'tfeel the pain right away because
(29:52):
your body went into shock.
In the same way, at the momentof a trauma, a little piece
leaves to save the integrity ofthe rest of your sense of self.
Now that works short term, butin the long term there is an
energy loss associated with that.
(30:14):
So in soul retrieval we'retrying to find and bring back
the pieces of the soul that left, and there are specific
techniques that we do during asoul retrieval.
But then there are other thingsthat we do during a soul
retrieval.
But then there are other thingsthat we can bring in.
So, for example, you know I'lluse contemporary sound healing
(30:37):
practices to bring in during it.
There are techniques that I'velearned in other systems of
healing that I may drop induring one of these soul
retrievals, even though it's notexactly the way that I was
taught soul retrieval, so thatwe have a here's my favorite
(30:59):
analogy it's like a jazzcomposition.
There is the basic structure tothe song and then there is the
place for improvisation.
So when I want to dropsomething in, I ask the question
would I be able to say to theperson who I learned this from
I'm using this in this context.
(31:21):
Would they be okay with medoing what I'm doing?
That's the way that I wouldpose the question.
I mean, if you're learning itfrom me, I'm teaching it to you
in a way that I can tell youwith certainty is with integrity
, because I was given permissionto do the things that I'm
teaching you.
But if you want to addsomething to it, you want to do
(31:42):
it in your own way, and you'vebeen, maybe you've traveled
around the entire planet.
Well, I would ask you thatquestion Could you tell me who
taught it to you?
Could you tell me that you havetheir permission?
Can you tell me that you have acontinued relationship with
them, so that you have thatconnection to the tradition and
(32:05):
it's not merely a weekend thing?
Yuli (32:08):
Yeah, no, that is so beautiful and thank you for
taking us on this journey kindof behind the scenes of the
healer's mind.
I always I love, I learned somuch and I'm naturally curious
about the way that healers workand why do they choose to use
different techniques or how dothey do that.
(32:29):
So I think that's extremelyhelpful for healers and not just
healers, right, people thatwork just to understand where
those things are coming from.
Because I think one of thechallenges of the entire
holistic healing space and Ithink especially some of the
more less kind of defined waysof healing, like energy healing
(32:52):
or shamanism right, it's soundefined and undescribed and
it's pure energy work, right,that is really hard for people
sometimes to understand it andtrust it, right.
So I think and this is part ofthe mission of this podcast like
, the more we talk about thosethings, the more we kind of lift
(33:13):
the veil and actually provethere is a science behind and
there's a system in place, right, there's traditions that go
back thousands of years, andthen there's the healer who is
the master of the jazz orchestra, right.
So I love that.
I think a lot of people arelearning a lot right now.
(33:35):
So thank you for that.
Bob (33:37):
Yeah.
So to just kind of sum that up,kind of wrap it up, I like to
think that there are threelevels of understanding this
healing process.
So there is an aspect ofhealing that is universal,
meaning that there areprinciples that we find all over
the planet that everybodyshares in common, including
(33:59):
modern holistic practices.
So that would be the universallevel of healing.
There's also a cultural levelof healing, and by that I mean
that, for example, you know, wecan look at even illnesses as
being culture specific, that theway that people heal in a
(34:21):
particular culture is unique tothem because of the holistic
nature of the culture itself.
And then there's the individuallevel, and it's the individual
level where I am different.
I am unique from everybody elseboth in terms of how my healing
unfolds for me and in terms ofhow I put together my own system
(34:44):
and my own way of being in theworld as a healer.
Yuli (34:48):
I love this.
Well, you are just a wealth ofknowledge and inspiration, and I
feel like we could talk forhours, and I have so many more
questions.
You might have to come for parttwo, but I wanted to ask if
there was anything else that youwant to share with our
listeners as a part of theconversation.
Bob (35:08):
Yeah, my parting message is that healing is not something
that we do only because of oursymptoms, and rather I would say
it is an unfolding process ofthe evolution of the soul, and
symptoms are what bring us to itin the first place, which is
(35:32):
why it's so important to infusemeaning into the inevitable
suffering that each one of uswill go through at some point or
we have in the past, andhealing is the way we make
meaning out of this life'sjourney that at times is
difficult and sometimes it'seasy, sometimes it's sad,
(35:56):
sometimes it's joyful.
Healing is this process of usmoving from fragmentation to
wholeness, and so it can becomeour whole reason for being.
Yuli (36:08):
Well, this episode was very healing for me.
Already I love to talk topeople like you who just raise
the vibration just by being inthe room or on my Zoom screen,
and I really want to thank youfor that and anyone who's
interested in your beautifulcourse and to find their own
unique modality.
We'll put it in the show notes,but do you want to share a
(36:30):
little bit more quickly aboutthe course and the next cohort
that's coming?
Bob (36:34):
up?
Yeah, sure.
So the next cohort is coming upin September 2025.
And there are all kinds offreebies that you can find on my
website, wwwbobvettercom.
So, b-o-b-v-e-t-t-e-rcom,there's a quiz that you can take
(36:58):
Should I be a healer?
There is a free healingcommunity that people can sign
on to.
There's all kinds of podcastsand blogs and videos and all
kinds of things.
So, even if you don't buysomething, just go, because
there's all kinds of fun stuffthere.
Yuli (37:15):
Amazing.
I love this so much, bob, and Icannot wait for your fire
ceremony in just a couple ofweeks, and hopefully more
healers will join us there andhave a chance to work with you
in person.
So thank you.
Can I give a quick plug to thatevent?
Yes, yes.
Bob (37:32):
So what is the name of the event?
Healers Retreat, healersRetreat.
So let me say why I signed on.
Because, as you know, yuli, yousent me an invitation which I
never even saw.
You sent me an invitation whichI never even saw, and then I
found out about this and Iwanted to come because I love
the inspiration of being aroundother people who do what they do
(37:54):
, and this whole idea that wecan be in one place at one time
that is dedicated to us sharingshoulder to shoulder.
So I look forward to sharing alittle bit of what I know during
that nighttime healing ceremonyand getting to know what other
people in the community who I'venever met before.
I want to know what they do aswell.
Yuli (38:14):
Amazing.
I love this Community is ourmedicine.
That's what I like to say.
And this is the right communityto belong, with all people that
want to grow, want to help,want to make the world a better
place, and thank you for beingpart of it and thank you for
joining us today.
Bob (38:30):
Thank you so much, yuli, and thanks everybody for
listening.
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