November 14, 2025 • 35 mins
What does it really take to walk away from a marquee role and build a brand that feels personal, principled, and wildly creative? We sit down with David Bowd, co-founder and CEO of Salt Hotels, to unpack the decision to leave the world of iconic properties and start small with a 20-room inn in Provincetown, Massachusetts —and how that leap reset his definition of success. From St. Martin’s Lane and Gramercy Park to a boutique collection rooted in design and community, David shares the choices, mistakes, and moments that shaped Salt’s identity.
We get candid about the “no assholes” rule and why culture fit is a strategy, not a slogan. David tells the story of firing misaligned clients, the immediate lift across the team, and how ditching the numbers race brought better work and happier guests. We go deep on leadership—fairness over fear, debate over yes-people, and the habit of listening to the people closest to the work. When a housekeeping team suggests a smarter process, he says yes, and the operation gets sharper overnight. That respect-based approach shows up in Salt School, an eight-weekend, community-rooted talent program that turns skeptics into believers and dramatically lowers employee turnover.
There’s hard truth here too: COVID was brutal. Yet when doors reopened, demand roared back, proving the human urge to travel beats the headlines. David offers clear advice to rising hoteliers on accessing capital—network beyond your comfort zone, especially with finance partners—and opens up about building a company with his spouse, the designer Kevin O’Shea, by staying in lanes and keeping work at the office. We finish with the rituals that sustain him: early walks, SoulCycle, and non-negotiable boundaries that protect focus and kindness in a 24/7 business.
If you care about hospitality with heart—talent development, design that serves community, and leadership that scales without losing its soul—press play. Subscribe, share this episode with a hotel geek or entrepreneur you love, and leave a review to help more people find the show.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_01 (00:05):
Welcome to Hotel Daddy.
I'm your host, Blake Danner.
On today's episode, I speak withone of our industry's best, the
co-founder and chief executiveof Salt Hotels, David Bow.
And by the way, a dear friend.
We're going to just dive rightin and get to know David,
exploring his unique journey andthe stories that have helped
shape his career andhospitality.
(00:26):
Now, knowing David, I think wecan expect some candid
conversations, a few honestreflections, and if we're lucky,
maybe a couple of secrets frombehind the scenes.
Whether you're an industryinsider or you just love a good
story, you're in the rightplace.
So grab your favorite drink,settle in, and enjoy the ride as
we open the doors to HotelDaddy.
(00:49):
David Bowde is the co-founderand chief executive of Salt
Hotels, a collection ofaward-winning boutique
properties known for design,culture, and community.
With over four decades ofhospitality experience, David
has built his career from theground up in the UK with brands
like Hilton, Marriott, ThistleHotels, and then as senior
(01:09):
leaders with industry icons likeIan Trager and Andre Balage.
Along the way, he helped shapesome of the world's most
talked-about and buzzy hotels,from St.
Martin's Lane and Sanderson inLondon to Gramercy Park and The
Mercer in New York to one of myfavorites, Chateau Marmont in
LA.
In 2014, David launched SaltHotels with his partner Kevin
(01:31):
O'Shea, creating a brand thathas earned global recognition
from Condi Nas Traveler, Traveland Leisure, USA Today, and
others.
Committed to nurturing futuretalent, he also founded SALT
School, a visionary educationalprogram dedicated to developing
the next generation of ourhospitality leaders.
Beyond hospitality, he's apassionate advocate for equality
(01:54):
and the arts, serving on boardsincluding Garden State Equality
and the Boutique LifestyleLeaders Association.
Originally from the Englishvillage of Salt, David now
divides his time between NewYork City and his beloved
Provincetown, Massachusetts,still driven by the same
philosophy that launched hiscareer that hotels should be as
(02:15):
inspiring and stylish andwelcoming as the people who stay
in them.
Welcome to Hotel Daddy, myfriend, industry leader, David
Bowd.
SPEAKER_00 (02:24):
David, welcome.
Thank you, Blake.
That's an incredibleintroduction.
I feel very humbled, but greatto be here.
SPEAKER_01 (02:30):
Thank you.
Well, look, I'm excited to haveyou.
One of the things that I'mloving about doing this pod is
we're bringing together somereally talented industry
leaders.
But you know, a few of you guysare also dear friends of mine,
and that makes it that much morerewarding, and I hope makes for
some better conversation.
All right.
Not everybody knows you like Ido.
So we like to start everyepisode around here with
(02:53):
something I called who's in thelobby.
You ready?
Yeah.
I'm gonna throw some rapid offire questions at you.
Just give me the first thingthat comes to mind.
Here we go.
What's your name?
David Bowd.
What's your zodiac sign?
I'm Leo.
Coffee or tea?
Now it's coffee.
That surprises me.
I didn't see that one coming.
Morning person or night owl?
(03:15):
Now I'm the morning person.
Go-to comfort food.
SPEAKER_00 (03:19):
Ooh, Chinese food.
All right.
Dream travel vacation.
SPEAKER_01 (03:25):
Australia on Amber's Airlines.
Ooh, very specific.
Love it.
I think I know though, somebodygotta ask.
Dogs or cats?
SPEAKER_00 (03:34):
That's a hard one, but now I have to say dogs
because I have my baby dog afterall these years.
SPEAKER_01 (03:41):
And gorgeous he is.
He is.
Beach or mountains?
Beach.
Book or podcast?
Podcast.
One word friends use to describeyou.
Fun.
Final question.
Watch your guilty pleasure TVshow.
SPEAKER_00 (03:57):
Well, that's hard because I don't watch TV.
So I'm gonna have to say Shit'sCreek and reruns of Shit's
Creek.
SPEAKER_01 (04:07):
Okay.
So look, normally I start at thevery beginning of your career.
But if you don't mind, I want tojump right in the middle.
You've had this great career.
You work your way up, you cometo the States, you find yourself
running all operations for inTraeger hotels.
Then you go on to operate AndreBalage hotels.
(04:27):
I mean, these are industryicons.
From the outside looking in,people are thinking, David Bowd
has made it.
And you have.
But you make a decision to stepaway, buy a 20-room inn in
Provincetown, Massachusetts, afixer-upper, I might add, and
start your own business.
Tell me about that leap offaith.
SPEAKER_00 (04:46):
By the time I had done that, which was 2014, I'd
actually been in the industryfor quite a long time.
Working for Ian and working forAndre, who are two icons, as you
say, and two incrediblehoteliers.
You know them both, and a lot ofyour listeners will know them.
(05:08):
They have created some of thebest hotels in the world, in my
opinion.
And I was a little bit like,where do I go from here?
What do I do next?
When Kevin and I were talkingabout that, my thought was
actually to take a bit of abreak, to do nothing.
I left school when I was 15years old and I started work
(05:29):
when I was 15 years old.
I have never taken a break.
And so it was time to take abreak.
The idea was to buy this littleinn in Provincetown, get a dog,
retire, walk on the beach everyday, and have this lovely life.
That was sort of the motivationbehind it was to regroup,
(05:54):
really, and to take some timefor myself and to take some time
back into thinking about why Ilove this industry and what I
want to do next in thisindustry.
That was how we formed SaltHotels, really.
SPEAKER_01 (06:09):
And how much of it in your mind was moving away
from something, and how much wasI just want to go to something
else?
I was drawn to something new.
SPEAKER_00 (06:17):
It was all drawn to something new.
I had just finished opening theChiltern Firehouse in London,
which is was sadly the mostbeautiful hotel I think anyone
could ever open.
The opening events for thathotel, when you have the royal
family coming in, when you haveall of the members of parliament
(06:40):
coming into that hotel,presidents coming in to the
hotel.
It's never gonna get much betterthan that.
So I thought, what's next forme?
I wanted to do something very,very different.
And I was always lookingforward.
I always am looking forward.
I very rarely look back.
To me, it was time to change andtime to mix it all up and do
(07:01):
something different.
And that's what happened withSalt House.
SPEAKER_01 (07:04):
So if you look at Salt Hotels today and you think
back to the beginning, howdifferent has that path actually
been than how you saw it whenyou very first started with
Kevin?
SPEAKER_00 (07:15):
It's funny.
It's a that's a great questionbecause the path was very
different.
But where we are now is exactlywhere I wanted us to be.
And we got lost along the way.
We got a little confused, Ithink, along the way, as a lot
of people do as they're startingout and they're figuring out
what they're going to do.
(07:35):
I think we grew very, very fast,very, very quickly.
We had one rule when we startedSALT Hotels, and that was no
assholes.
SPEAKER_01 (07:46):
Did I take that rule with me?
SPEAKER_00 (07:49):
Yes, it's a great rule.
And the thought process was thatwe just didn't need to work with
people that were assholes.
We'd done enough of that in ourcareers over the years.
It was time to just work withgood people.
What happened was hotels startedto become very successful.
I got caught up in thedevelopment side of the business
(08:12):
and signing deals.
No.
The numbers game.
SPEAKER_01 (08:16):
More, more, more, back on the train.
Gotta get it.
Yeah.
So it's so funny.
One of the things I love aboutentrepreneurs like yourself is
you usually end up where youthink you're going, but it's
that in-between path that gets alittle crazy.
We get on the train and itstarts being successful, and
success breeds success, and nowyou're like more, more, more.
And I'd love to understand atwhat point did you say, that's
(08:36):
actually not what I was doingthis for?
SPEAKER_00 (08:38):
I did an interview for travel and leisure.
One of their questions was, Howmany miles did you travel last
year?
I had to go through my calendarand work out how many flights I
had been on and how many milesI'd traveled.
It was horrendous.
It was so many thousands ofmiles.
(08:58):
I was platinum status with everysingle airline.
This is crazy.
This is not a badge of honor.
This is crazy.
This doesn't mean that I've madeit.
This means actually that Ihaven't made it and that this
isn't what I wanted to do.
And that was the realization andthe moment of I need to take a
step back and I need to thinkabout what do we want SART
(09:21):
hotels to be?
Do we still want it to be thesame?
And if we do, and we did, thenwe need to make some decisions.
Unfortunately for us, that cameat the same time as COVID came
and the two things couldactually help us and help each
other.
SPEAKER_01 (09:38):
I want to go back to this no assholes.
How many clients have you had tofire in your career?
How many times were you able tojust go?
Yeah, no, this doesn't work forme.
No names, but how many times?
In the last few years, probablyhalf a dozen.
See, that's the beauty of beingan entrepreneur, right?
When you're working in corporateAmerica, it's so hard.
But when you own the company,when you're making the
decisions, when you and yourpartner Kevin are saying, this
(10:00):
is what we want, you have thegreat ability to say, this
doesn't meet what we're lookingfor.
We don't need that.
How difficult is it to fire aclient?
SPEAKER_00 (10:11):
The first one was difficult.
The first one, I don't think Islept the night before.
And I stressed a lot about it.
And I kept worrying about have Imade the right decision?
And am I making an emotionaldecision?
Is this what a businessman does?
And I remember thinking thatquestion a lot.
I kept thinking I was making anemotional decision.
(10:32):
When I did it, the relief andthe happiness that came through
my team felt so good.
And everybody was so muchhappier.
This was a no-brainer.
We should have done this before.
And then we moved on and wecarried on and we made smart
decisions together.
SPEAKER_01 (10:53):
So let me ask this question.
So much of your brand, for folksthat know Salt Hotels, they know
this, and we have a lot of hotelgeeks that are listening.
You are so known for creativity,design, your commitment to
community.
How much better did that getwhen you took this burden away
from you and your team ofdealing with, as you call them,
assholes?
SPEAKER_00 (11:12):
The ceiling was lifted.
It literally went overnight.
It's like when you have a bademployee in a department.
How much that employee bringsthe department down.
It's exactly the same with a badpartner.
They bring everything down, theybring you down, and your
(11:33):
creativity starts to get put ina corner and you start to
question yourself and doubtyourself.
You're not as creative anymore.
What it did for us is it justopened everything up and took
away the ceiling, and suddenlyhere we were again, creating and
doing some great things again.
SPEAKER_01 (11:51):
So, look, I think that is the most important part
of making sure that you'rehaving fun every day is
especially when your brand isabout creativity, especially
when your brand is aboutout-of-the-box thinking.
Sometimes we put ourselves inthese boxes because we're
unhappy, we're not being fueled.
And that takes me to the nextquestion.
What's your style as a leader?
How do you inspire your teamsbecause you are on the bleeding
(12:15):
edge of creativity, of design inyour space?
What's your leadership style?
How do you make that happen?
SPEAKER_00 (12:20):
I like to keep everybody involved.
I've worked for many people whotend to shout, who are not as
kind as other people.
And I think when you work forpeople like that, you learn that
isn't a great leadership trait,and you learn not to be like
(12:40):
that.
For me, I learned from the badleaders just as much as I learnt
from the good leaders.
It's communication, it's workingtogether as a team.
I like being creative as a team.
I don't think I know all theanswers.
I hate yes people.
I love a good fight in a roomwhere we're creating something
(13:02):
and somebody's like, I don'tthink that's right.
I disagree with that.
And it's like, why?
And we end up pushing somethingbecause we're debating it.
I love that.
Our entire team has a voice.
And I think everybody has avoice in an organization.
Last week, I was in Miami and itwas housekeeping appreciation
(13:24):
week.
We were with all the team inMiami.
They were talking about a coupleof things that would make their
life much easier in thehousekeeping department.
We had set it up.
What do we know?
They know much more than we knowabout their department.
Subject matter experts.
Exactly.
And it's they're like, yes, wecan change that in a heartbeat.
(13:47):
And that's where it's soimportant to give everybody that
voice and let everybody speakbecause the whole business can
be so much better.
SPEAKER_01 (13:56):
Has your leadership style changed running your own
business versus working in, youknow, what was kind of some big
corporate America institutionalinvestor type brands?
SPEAKER_00 (14:07):
It has to have changed.
And I think it changes naturallyas you get older and you get
wiser, and you've done itbefore.
So, or you've seen mostsituations before.
My dad was chief of police, andhe always taught me when I was
growing up, he said, the mostimportant thing in your life is
(14:31):
to be fair.
That was something that stuckwith me from when I left school.
That's something that I'vecarried on throughout my career.
I've always thought whether it'sa we've got to do the same thing
regardless of the position thatwe're doing it for.
And so I think I've always triedto be incredibly fair.
I'm probably more patient nowthan I was when I was working in
(14:55):
corporate America because Idon't have the deadlines on me
any longer than I used to have.
SPEAKER_01 (15:02):
And does that cause you to be, I don't want to say
more forgiving, but moreunderstanding of the multiple
priorities that a lot of yourteam members have?
SPEAKER_00 (15:09):
It does.
But I think the other side of itis I have to make sure we make
the money.
I have to make sure there ismoney in the bank to pay
everybody's wages now.
And so I'm less forgiving inthat way because I've got to
make sure that that happens.
And so there's a little bit ofgive and take.
Some things I'm probably alittle bit more lenient on, and
(15:31):
some things I'm probably alittle tougher on.
SPEAKER_01 (15:34):
So in your bio, and for folks that know you and know
SALT, we mentioned SALT School.
Would you, for those that don'tknow, describe what SALT School
is?
Because it's something, as youknow, I am so fond of.
SPEAKER_00 (15:46):
Yes.
And I appreciate that so muchbecause it is my baby.
Salt School started in 2016.
I was in a meeting and I wastold that we were opening a
hotel in Asbury Park, NewJersey, and somebody told me,
we'll never get good staff.
For anybody that knows me andknows that if they tell me we'll
never do something, then that'sit.
(16:08):
I'll prove you wrong.
And so that evening we weretalking in a different meeting
about what makes a community.
And one of the things that makesa community is school.
I call it my working girl momentbecause elevated moment of
Melanie Griffith saying how shethought of the idea of the radio
buyout.
That's how it came together.
(16:29):
So then, with the wonderfulJenny Lockman, who is the
greatest person putting thissort of thing together, we put
the school together.
And the school is aboutintroducing people to
hospitality.
We've honed it over the years tobe eight weekends where we cover
(16:51):
all different aspects ofhospitality from housekeeping,
food and beverage, sales andmarketing, revenue management,
creative, and then some of thesort of more back of house areas
to accounting.
We have open applications we gothrough every weekend, and we
have different people from theindustry.
(17:12):
Some are now, some are saltemployees, but a lot come from
different areas of the industry.
Some come from, we tend to dofood and beverage away from
hotels because it's moreinteresting and to get
restaurateurs and barspecialists to come in because
it's much more fun.
And they talk about what happensin those specific departments.
(17:33):
We do a lot of role playing, alot of guest experience
role-playing and those sorts ofthings to give candidates a real
opportunity to see what happensin hotels because I think a lot
of people quite like the idea ofhospitality, but don't know what
it's about.
I love this industry.
I want to attract as much talentas possible to this industry.
(17:54):
And I don't think we do a verygood job as an industry
attracting talent.
Salt School is there to breakdown some of the barriers.
It's proven incrediblysuccessful.
And some of the things that wedidn't expect from Salt School
are such a massive reduction inturnover.
People join Salt School and thenthey come and work with us and
(18:16):
then they set, we've got nannymanagers.
Actually, our manager here inProvincetown, she was at the
very first Salt School back in2016.
She now does the summers inProvincetown and the winters in
Miami.
She has a great, uh, a greatlife and works.
Give me some of that about it.
Yeah, right.
I think she never has anydowntime.
(18:39):
That's the uh the disadvantage.
But it gives people the chanceto to see our industry and to
stay in our industry and to bepromoted.
So you and I speak on a lot ofpanels.
SPEAKER_01 (18:50):
Yeah.
And every panel I've been on inthe last two years, staffing
comes up, retention, attraction.
And one of the things that I sopersonally loved about SALT
School was not only was it aconnection to the community, but
it also was just a supercreative way, as you said, to
attract good talent when peoplesaid you couldn't, and to deal
with what is clearly one of thebiggest issues our industry
(19:12):
faces right now, which issourcing talent.
I want to share with mylisteners what a gracious
industry colleague you are.
I've watched you from afar.
We've been friends for a longtime.
And as salt was coming out ofthe ground, I followed you and I
followed Salt School.
And I was bowled over with thesuccess you were having.
So I picked up the phone one dayand I called you and I said,
(19:35):
David Bowd, I love what you'redoing with Salt School.
Can I knock it off?
I was just opening the freehandbrand at that time.
And you know, I think a lot ofpeople in our industry would
have said, that's my ideal, stayaway.
But to your point about beingpassionate about this industry,
you actually said, Oh my gosh,Blake, I'm flattered.
Of course you can knock it off.
Not a lot of people would dothat, David.
SPEAKER_00 (19:55):
Yeah, and I would give anybody, and I have done
since, and I love the fact thatyou asked for it, and I love the
fact that you took it, adoptedit, adapted it, made it your
own, and made it something thatworked for you.
And I think that that's whatanybody can do.
And like you say, it does openthe doors to get great talent in
(20:17):
the community, to be part of acommunity.
And I still do not get why moreand more people aren't doing
community-driven, educationallydriven programs to attract
people into our industry.
And it is work and it's hardwork, but it's so beneficial.
SPEAKER_01 (20:34):
Love it.
I just think it shows yourpassion for the industry and
your high tide raises all ships'attitude.
I've always been appreciativeand I've thanked you many times,
but here today on Hotel Daddy, Iwant the world to know thank you
for letting me rip it off.
We did it in our own style, anduh you are a gracious gentleman
about it.
And I love that support.
Thank you.
SPEAKER_00 (20:52):
You had a better name for it, Blake.
You had a great name for it.
SPEAKER_01 (20:56):
Okay, so well, in fairness, I was opening, you
called it Salt School.
I was opening the Freehandbrand, and and so we decided
that Freehand University soundedgood.
So we just called it FU.
Hey, you had to have a littlebit of wink and nod there.
So, final question on kind ofthe salt journey.
What's been your greatestdisappointment in the salt
hotel's run?
SPEAKER_00 (21:15):
Wow.
I think COVID was the hardshipof COVID and what it did to us
as a company.
It helped us in so many ways,but it was so difficult.
I had to let some people go.
That really hurt me.
We had to close all of ourproperties, which was awful, as
(21:37):
every hotel did.
I remember the day.
We had some amazing partnersthat allowed us to keep going
when, and we did keep going,which was phenomenal, but it was
a really, really difficult time.
I would never want to go throughthat again.
SPEAKER_01 (21:55):
Amen.
What did the rebound of businessafter COVID teach you about
travel?
SPEAKER_00 (22:03):
I think don't believe anything you read.
I mean, right?
Like at all this.
The human spirit wants totravel, and as soon as they can,
they will.
Exactly.
It was crazy.
The minute we opened thosedoors, everyone was back.
And everyone, like you say,everybody wanted those
experiences.
SPEAKER_01 (22:21):
And you happen to operate in some key domestic
leisure destinations.
Yeah.
So that traveler that wanted totravel that couldn't go
international, you were booming.
Yeah.
So I happen to know a lot offolks that are gonna listen to
this.
And I know a lot of folks arelistening right now, and some of
them are young, they're smart asa whip, they're creative, they
(22:42):
are making their way in thisindustry.
They share the passion that youand I have for this industry.
They want to open their own inn,they want to open their own
small little hotel, they want toopen their own restaurant.
And what is usually a gatingissue for them is accessing
capital.
Now, you're a guy that went outand started on his own.
If you had any advice to theseyoung, wannabe entrepreneurs,
(23:04):
they want to follow a pathsimilar to yours, they might not
do it with all the experiencethat you had when you did it.
Any advice on how to handle thecapital issue?
How do you get out there?
How do you find capital?
SPEAKER_00 (23:16):
I do speak to a lot of people every week that are
going through that and havingthat struggle.
And I always say, you know, itthis industry is so much about
the people that you know and thepeople that you meet along the
way.
Experience counts for a lot whenpeople are thinking about going
out on their own.
(23:37):
They will use the time now whileyou're in your full-time job to
meet as many people in thefinance world as you possibly
can.
Um go to every single networkingevent that you possibly can.
You've got to be out there,you've got to put yourself out
there.
These people are out there,they're looking for young
(23:59):
entrepreneurs that are doing thenext interesting thing.
And I think it's being ballsyand and being out there and and
not taking no for an answer,having the attitude of it's all
about attitude.
I think our industry is entirelyabout attitude.
And if you've got a can-doattitude, then it'll work, it'll
(24:22):
take some time and you've got tokeep plugging at it.
But get out there and keepmeeting these people.
And one will introduce you tosomebody at some point who's
gonna be able to open a door foryou.
SPEAKER_01 (24:34):
I want to summarize what I think I just heard you
say because it's such goodadvice that I haven't given
before, and I'm gonna steal itfrom you as well, which is they
think nothing about networkingin the creative circles.
They think nothing aboutnetworking in kind of the people
they're comfortable with.
But if you're seriously aboutwanting to do something, you
need capital, you gotta networkwith the finance folks.
You gotta put yourself outthere.
And for a lot of these young,hungry entrepreneurs, that might
(24:56):
not be as comfortable for them,right?
I love that advice.
So you founded SALT with yourpartner, the adorable Kevin
O'Shea, who I just am a big fanof.
What's it like working with yourspouse?
SPEAKER_00 (25:08):
For us, it's great.
We met, as you will know,because we worked with you at
the time.
I know the whole story.
Yes.
We met working together.
We met opening the MondrianScottsdale many, many years ago.
By the way, you were both so DLabout it, just for the records.
SPEAKER_01 (25:24):
I need everyone to know that.
SPEAKER_00 (25:25):
Absolutely.
We were.
We work very, very welltogether.
We have our own disciplines.
We do have a lot of fun withthose disciplines.
They obviously cross over a lot.
We sort of stay in our ownlittle lanes.
We consult each other oneverything.
You know, I'm sitting in theoffice right now, we have an
office table in the middle, weface each other.
(25:47):
But we sort of come into theoffice and it's work.
We don't talk about work whenwe're out of the office, unless
it's something that we need totalk about.
You know, it's work and thenthere's the rest of our lives,
which is, I think, the way itshould be.
We look at it like it has to befun and it has to be enjoyable.
Look, don't get me wrong, Imean, there's been moments where
(26:08):
it's been like, oh, get me outof here now.
I'm gonna go, I'm gonna I'mgonna take the dog for a walk.
Do tell, do tell.
If the dog could talk, then Ithink there'd be a few problems.
But we're very fortunate.
We've always worked very, verywell together.
And we're very fortunate thatwe're both have the same
mindset.
We're both very hard workers.
We sort of appreciate that ineach other as well.
SPEAKER_01 (26:30):
How important do you think it is that both of you
came into SALT having alreadykind of made your mark in the
industry?
I mean, you both, you both hadalready had great success.
So, how important do you thinkit is that when you founded SALT
together, you both came in witha lot of credibility, like both
of you on your own?
SPEAKER_00 (26:49):
I think that helped a lot.
It wasn't David's show orKevin's show, and I think
everybody had respect for usboth, but I think that
definitely makes it a lot, loteasier for sure.
SPEAKER_01 (27:01):
You are both proud, out, successful business
leaders.
What's that journey been likespecifically for you?
SPEAKER_00 (27:07):
It's been hard.
I remember when I was a generalmanager in London in my early
30s.
I think I was actually just 30.
There was a general managersconference.
The company that I worked for atthat time had about 50, 60
hotels.
There were three gay generalmanagers.
We were very quiet and we werenot out and proud, and it was
(27:33):
not talked about.
SPEAKER_01 (27:34):
It was a different time.
You are about the same age, youknow.
I I remind these young guys andgirls, and it was a different
time.
SPEAKER_00 (27:41):
Totally.
And it was part, it wasn'tcomfortable.
I really focused on the LGBTQIAteam members that worked for me,
making sure they never felt likethat.
So I sort of took my strugglesand focused it much more on sort
of the team people that I workedwith giving it back because it
(28:03):
wasn't comfortable until I thinkuntil honestly, I worked for an
American company.
SPEAKER_01 (28:10):
Oh wow, interesting.
SPEAKER_00 (28:12):
Which was the Intrager hotels, which was then
it's more open, it's it's lesspeople care.
And I think it has, like yousay, it has changed so much now.
And thank goodness, because itwas it was appalling, especially
in an industry where it is madeup.
We claim to be so accepted.
Exactly.
I'm really glad now that thingshave changed significantly.
(28:35):
But I also, very, very lucky, Ihad some incredible mentors
throughout my career that werevery good to me and knew that I
was gay and helped me through,particularly my early, you know,
when I was a very junior memberof staff going through, you
know, coming out and all of thatsort of thing.
(28:57):
They were great.
It was tough, but I was veryfortunate that I had great
mentors as well.
How important is it for peoplelike you and I right now to
represent?
I think it's incrediblyimportant.
I don't think there's been amore important time than today
and and than now.
And I think that it's soincredibly important that
(29:18):
there's a voice out there.
SPEAKER_01 (29:20):
I appreciate you so much for that.
I I do, I agree with you.
It is important that we bevisible right now.
That's all.
I don't need to lead with it.
But I need to be visible.
I need to be visible with mylife, and I I love you for that.
Thank you.
You know I'm passionate aboutfitness.
So you and I had hadn't seeneach other in a couple of years,
and I'd heard that you'd reallyjumped on the fitness bandwagon.
You were doing soul cycles,exercising, and I'm in LA and I
(29:42):
go to Soul Cycle and you comewalking out of the studio.
And my friend, you are lean andmean and fit.
And I remember saying, Wow,David bowed.
And this is when you werestarting a company, and I
thought, how does he do it all?
So, in the remaining fewminutes, we have.
Tell me how you balance fitnessin this really aggressive
(30:04):
schedule you have.
And how important is it?
SPEAKER_00 (30:06):
It's vital and it's critical.
I know that now.
I never found a good fitnessregime in my early life and uh
early career.
I didn't like the gym, and itwas never my sort of thing, and
I couldn't find anything that Ireally liked.
And and I think that's part ofit.
You have to find something thatyou you really buy into and you
(30:29):
really, really enjoy.
And I was very fortunate that Ifound Soul Cycle from day one.
I was terrible at it, but Iabsolutely loved it.
I mean, it's like going to a gaydiscount.
Oh, that's I buy that, but okay,it's your story.
It's uh like 45 minutes in a gaydisco at 6 a.m.
It's uh like, okay, this is thisis fun.
I can do that.
It's funny, you know.
I I get up now at 5 a.m.
(30:52):
every day.
I walk the dog for an hour and ahalf, and then at 6:30, I do a
at-home soul cycle class everyday.
And then if I'm in New York orsomewhere that has soul cycle,
I'll go and do an in-personclass.
I'll have it in my schedule.
It's part of my routine that Iwill not compromise about.
(31:14):
And I book hotel rooms aroundwhere SoulCycle is, I book
travel around what time classesare, because I think that it's
my 45 minutes of my time whereI've not got a phone, no one's
going to interrupt me.
In the old days, that a lot ofpeople listening to this will
(31:36):
sort of be laughing at now.
We didn't have phones, weweren't contactable 24 hours a
day.
We had a life that's missingright now, and I think we're too
accessible.
And I think that 45 minutes justgives me a little touch back to
the 80s and 90s where we weren'talways accessible.
(31:56):
And I truly love it.
And of course, I I love itbecause I'm so far ahead of you,
Blake, on Soul Cycle Classes.
SPEAKER_01 (32:02):
So uh oh, come on, I'm pulling out my app.
You want to compare?
I'm pulling it out right now.
Uh-uh.
And just in like 1250, like1250.
So, dude, I'm only at like 901or something.
I actually didn't think you werethat far ahead of me.
I gotta pick it up.
You just said something that Iwant to double down on because
it's something I'm hearing fromall of the really successful
(32:24):
leaders I talked to, which yousaid, I book hotels around, I
put travel around, I make surethat I plan my fitness.
All the young managers out therewho are listening to us right
now don't apologize for makingfitness important and frankly
protecting time in your day forit will make you more
productive, more creative, itwill make you a better manager,
(32:47):
leader, employee, whatever youare at this point in your
career.
SPEAKER_00 (32:50):
Can I just add that as well?
Because it your thing might notbe fitness.
It could be wellness in adifferent way, it could be
meditation, it could be whateveryour thing is.
Make sure you take time for youbecause our industry is one of
the hardest industries you canjoin.
It is a lot of pressure.
(33:12):
There are a lot of peoplelooking at you, there are a lot
of people wanting things fromyou, there's a lot of
expectations on you.
It's very easy to burn out.
And so you need to take care ofyourself.
To take care of yourself, youneed to give yourself some you
time.
SPEAKER_01 (33:30):
Thank you for that.
So true.
It's fitness for us.
It might be playing ball withyour kids, it might be playing
dominoes, but make time for it.
All right.
I'm so embarrassed.
I literally have like 15questions we didn't even get to.
And here we are at the closingmark.
David, thank you.
Thank you so much for spendingtime with me and enjoying and
sharing your passion with ourlisteners.
(33:51):
As we close out today, you aresuch a great mentor.
Any final advice?
There are a lot of folkslistening who I know that are up
and coming in our industry.
They look at guys like you whohave had great success.
What's that piece of advice youmight give them as we close out
today?
SPEAKER_00 (34:07):
You meet incredible people in this industry along
the way.
Some of my best friends, many ofmy best friends, my oldest and
best friend was a front deskagent with me back in the late
80s.
We've worked together a fewtimes over the years.
We're still in contact.
You meet incredible people inthis industry and you stay in
(34:29):
touch with them.
I think that that is one of thebeauties of our industry and one
of the real advantages of ourindustry.
And it's don't lose touch withthose incredibly talented people
that you work with in your earlycareer.
And so if you've lost touch withsomebody, pick up the phone
today and give them a call andget back in touch with them.
I have no notes on that answer.
SPEAKER_01 (34:52):
Wow.
Okay, kids, this has been HotelDaddy.
We spent the day with DavidBowd, co founder and chief
executive of SALT Hotels.
David, my friend, thank you.
Thank you, Blake.
Thanks for listening to HotelDaddy with your host, Blake
Danner.
Be sure to like and subscribewherever you get your podcasts.
Welcome to Hotel Daddy.
I'm your host, Blake Danner.
On today's episode, I speak withone of our industry's best, the
co-founder and chief executiveof Salt Hotels, David Bow.
And by the way, a dear friend.
We're going to just dive rightin and get to know David,
exploring his unique journey andthe stories that have helped
shape his career andhospitality.
(00:26):
Now, knowing David, I think wecan expect some candid
conversations, a few honestreflections, and if we're lucky,
maybe a couple of secrets frombehind the scenes.
Whether you're an industryinsider or you just love a good
story, you're in the rightplace.
So grab your favorite drink,settle in, and enjoy the ride as
we open the doors to HotelDaddy.
(00:49):
David Bowde is the co-founderand chief executive of Salt
Hotels, a collection ofaward-winning boutique
properties known for design,culture, and community.
With over four decades ofhospitality experience, David
has built his career from theground up in the UK with brands
like Hilton, Marriott, ThistleHotels, and then as senior
(01:09):
leaders with industry icons likeIan Trager and Andre Balage.
Along the way, he helped shapesome of the world's most
talked-about and buzzy hotels,from St.
Martin's Lane and Sanderson inLondon to Gramercy Park and The
Mercer in New York to one of myfavorites, Chateau Marmont in
LA.
In 2014, David launched SaltHotels with his partner Kevin
(01:31):
O'Shea, creating a brand thathas earned global recognition
from Condi Nas Traveler, Traveland Leisure, USA Today, and
others.
Committed to nurturing futuretalent, he also founded SALT
School, a visionary educationalprogram dedicated to developing
the next generation of ourhospitality leaders.
Beyond hospitality, he's apassionate advocate for equality
(01:54):
and the arts, serving on boardsincluding Garden State Equality
and the Boutique LifestyleLeaders Association.
Originally from the Englishvillage of Salt, David now
divides his time between NewYork City and his beloved
Provincetown, Massachusetts,still driven by the same
philosophy that launched hiscareer that hotels should be as
(02:15):
inspiring and stylish andwelcoming as the people who stay
in them.
Welcome to Hotel Daddy, myfriend, industry leader, David
Bowd.
SPEAKER_00 (02:24):
David, welcome.
Thank you, Blake.
That's an incredibleintroduction.
I feel very humbled, but greatto be here.
SPEAKER_01 (02:30):
Thank you.
Well, look, I'm excited to haveyou.
One of the things that I'mloving about doing this pod is
we're bringing together somereally talented industry
leaders.
But you know, a few of you guysare also dear friends of mine,
and that makes it that much morerewarding, and I hope makes for
some better conversation.
All right.
Not everybody knows you like Ido.
So we like to start everyepisode around here with
(02:53):
something I called who's in thelobby.
You ready?
Yeah.
I'm gonna throw some rapid offire questions at you.
Just give me the first thingthat comes to mind.
Here we go.
What's your name?
David Bowd.
What's your zodiac sign?
I'm Leo.
Coffee or tea?
Now it's coffee.
That surprises me.
I didn't see that one coming.
Morning person or night owl?
(03:15):
Now I'm the morning person.
Go-to comfort food.
SPEAKER_00 (03:19):
Ooh, Chinese food.
All right.
Dream travel vacation.
SPEAKER_01 (03:25):
Australia on Amber's Airlines.
Ooh, very specific.
Love it.
I think I know though, somebodygotta ask.
Dogs or cats?
SPEAKER_00 (03:34):
That's a hard one, but now I have to say dogs
because I have my baby dog afterall these years.
SPEAKER_01 (03:41):
And gorgeous he is.
He is.
Beach or mountains?
Beach.
Book or podcast?
Podcast.
One word friends use to describeyou.
Fun.
Final question.
Watch your guilty pleasure TVshow.
SPEAKER_00 (03:57):
Well, that's hard because I don't watch TV.
So I'm gonna have to say Shit'sCreek and reruns of Shit's
Creek.
SPEAKER_01 (04:07):
Okay.
So look, normally I start at thevery beginning of your career.
But if you don't mind, I want tojump right in the middle.
You've had this great career.
You work your way up, you cometo the States, you find yourself
running all operations for inTraeger hotels.
Then you go on to operate AndreBalage hotels.
(04:27):
I mean, these are industryicons.
From the outside looking in,people are thinking, David Bowd
has made it.
And you have.
But you make a decision to stepaway, buy a 20-room inn in
Provincetown, Massachusetts, afixer-upper, I might add, and
start your own business.
Tell me about that leap offaith.
SPEAKER_00 (04:46):
By the time I had done that, which was 2014, I'd
actually been in the industryfor quite a long time.
Working for Ian and working forAndre, who are two icons, as you
say, and two incrediblehoteliers.
You know them both, and a lot ofyour listeners will know them.
(05:08):
They have created some of thebest hotels in the world, in my
opinion.
And I was a little bit like,where do I go from here?
What do I do next?
When Kevin and I were talkingabout that, my thought was
actually to take a bit of abreak, to do nothing.
I left school when I was 15years old and I started work
(05:29):
when I was 15 years old.
I have never taken a break.
And so it was time to take abreak.
The idea was to buy this littleinn in Provincetown, get a dog,
retire, walk on the beach everyday, and have this lovely life.
That was sort of the motivationbehind it was to regroup,
(05:54):
really, and to take some timefor myself and to take some time
back into thinking about why Ilove this industry and what I
want to do next in thisindustry.
That was how we formed SaltHotels, really.
SPEAKER_01 (06:09):
And how much of it in your mind was moving away
from something, and how much wasI just want to go to something
else?
I was drawn to something new.
SPEAKER_00 (06:17):
It was all drawn to something new.
I had just finished opening theChiltern Firehouse in London,
which is was sadly the mostbeautiful hotel I think anyone
could ever open.
The opening events for thathotel, when you have the royal
family coming in, when you haveall of the members of parliament
(06:40):
coming into that hotel,presidents coming in to the
hotel.
It's never gonna get much betterthan that.
So I thought, what's next forme?
I wanted to do something very,very different.
And I was always lookingforward.
I always am looking forward.
I very rarely look back.
To me, it was time to change andtime to mix it all up and do
(07:01):
something different.
And that's what happened withSalt House.
SPEAKER_01 (07:04):
So if you look at Salt Hotels today and you think
back to the beginning, howdifferent has that path actually
been than how you saw it whenyou very first started with
Kevin?
SPEAKER_00 (07:15):
It's funny.
It's a that's a great questionbecause the path was very
different.
But where we are now is exactlywhere I wanted us to be.
And we got lost along the way.
We got a little confused, Ithink, along the way, as a lot
of people do as they're startingout and they're figuring out
what they're going to do.
(07:35):
I think we grew very, very fast,very, very quickly.
We had one rule when we startedSALT Hotels, and that was no
assholes.
SPEAKER_01 (07:46):
Did I take that rule with me?
SPEAKER_00 (07:49):
Yes, it's a great rule.
And the thought process was thatwe just didn't need to work with
people that were assholes.
We'd done enough of that in ourcareers over the years.
It was time to just work withgood people.
What happened was hotels startedto become very successful.
I got caught up in thedevelopment side of the business
(08:12):
and signing deals.
No.
The numbers game.
SPEAKER_01 (08:16):
More, more, more, back on the train.
Gotta get it.
Yeah.
So it's so funny.
One of the things I love aboutentrepreneurs like yourself is
you usually end up where youthink you're going, but it's
that in-between path that gets alittle crazy.
We get on the train and itstarts being successful, and
success breeds success, and nowyou're like more, more, more.
And I'd love to understand atwhat point did you say, that's
(08:36):
actually not what I was doingthis for?
SPEAKER_00 (08:38):
I did an interview for travel and leisure.
One of their questions was, Howmany miles did you travel last
year?
I had to go through my calendarand work out how many flights I
had been on and how many milesI'd traveled.
It was horrendous.
It was so many thousands ofmiles.
(08:58):
I was platinum status with everysingle airline.
This is crazy.
This is not a badge of honor.
This is crazy.
This doesn't mean that I've madeit.
This means actually that Ihaven't made it and that this
isn't what I wanted to do.
And that was the realization andthe moment of I need to take a
step back and I need to thinkabout what do we want SART
(09:21):
hotels to be?
Do we still want it to be thesame?
And if we do, and we did, thenwe need to make some decisions.
Unfortunately for us, that cameat the same time as COVID came
and the two things couldactually help us and help each
other.
SPEAKER_01 (09:38):
I want to go back to this no assholes.
How many clients have you had tofire in your career?
How many times were you able tojust go?
Yeah, no, this doesn't work forme.
No names, but how many times?
In the last few years, probablyhalf a dozen.
See, that's the beauty of beingan entrepreneur, right?
When you're working in corporateAmerica, it's so hard.
But when you own the company,when you're making the
decisions, when you and yourpartner Kevin are saying, this
(10:00):
is what we want, you have thegreat ability to say, this
doesn't meet what we're lookingfor.
We don't need that.
How difficult is it to fire aclient?
SPEAKER_00 (10:11):
The first one was difficult.
The first one, I don't think Islept the night before.
And I stressed a lot about it.
And I kept worrying about have Imade the right decision?
And am I making an emotionaldecision?
Is this what a businessman does?
And I remember thinking thatquestion a lot.
I kept thinking I was making anemotional decision.
(10:32):
When I did it, the relief andthe happiness that came through
my team felt so good.
And everybody was so muchhappier.
This was a no-brainer.
We should have done this before.
And then we moved on and wecarried on and we made smart
decisions together.
SPEAKER_01 (10:53):
So let me ask this question.
So much of your brand, for folksthat know Salt Hotels, they know
this, and we have a lot of hotelgeeks that are listening.
You are so known for creativity,design, your commitment to
community.
How much better did that getwhen you took this burden away
from you and your team ofdealing with, as you call them,
assholes?
SPEAKER_00 (11:12):
The ceiling was lifted.
It literally went overnight.
It's like when you have a bademployee in a department.
How much that employee bringsthe department down.
It's exactly the same with a badpartner.
They bring everything down, theybring you down, and your
(11:33):
creativity starts to get put ina corner and you start to
question yourself and doubtyourself.
You're not as creative anymore.
What it did for us is it justopened everything up and took
away the ceiling, and suddenlyhere we were again, creating and
doing some great things again.
SPEAKER_01 (11:51):
So, look, I think that is the most important part
of making sure that you'rehaving fun every day is
especially when your brand isabout creativity, especially
when your brand is aboutout-of-the-box thinking.
Sometimes we put ourselves inthese boxes because we're
unhappy, we're not being fueled.
And that takes me to the nextquestion.
What's your style as a leader?
How do you inspire your teamsbecause you are on the bleeding
(12:15):
edge of creativity, of design inyour space?
What's your leadership style?
How do you make that happen?
SPEAKER_00 (12:20):
I like to keep everybody involved.
I've worked for many people whotend to shout, who are not as
kind as other people.
And I think when you work forpeople like that, you learn that
isn't a great leadership trait,and you learn not to be like
(12:40):
that.
For me, I learned from the badleaders just as much as I learnt
from the good leaders.
It's communication, it's workingtogether as a team.
I like being creative as a team.
I don't think I know all theanswers.
I hate yes people.
I love a good fight in a roomwhere we're creating something
(13:02):
and somebody's like, I don'tthink that's right.
I disagree with that.
And it's like, why?
And we end up pushing somethingbecause we're debating it.
I love that.
Our entire team has a voice.
And I think everybody has avoice in an organization.
Last week, I was in Miami and itwas housekeeping appreciation
(13:24):
week.
We were with all the team inMiami.
They were talking about a coupleof things that would make their
life much easier in thehousekeeping department.
We had set it up.
What do we know?
They know much more than we knowabout their department.
Subject matter experts.
Exactly.
And it's they're like, yes, wecan change that in a heartbeat.
(13:47):
And that's where it's soimportant to give everybody that
voice and let everybody speakbecause the whole business can
be so much better.
SPEAKER_01 (13:56):
Has your leadership style changed running your own
business versus working in, youknow, what was kind of some big
corporate America institutionalinvestor type brands?
SPEAKER_00 (14:07):
It has to have changed.
And I think it changes naturallyas you get older and you get
wiser, and you've done itbefore.
So, or you've seen mostsituations before.
My dad was chief of police, andhe always taught me when I was
growing up, he said, the mostimportant thing in your life is
(14:31):
to be fair.
That was something that stuckwith me from when I left school.
That's something that I'vecarried on throughout my career.
I've always thought whether it'sa we've got to do the same thing
regardless of the position thatwe're doing it for.
And so I think I've always triedto be incredibly fair.
I'm probably more patient nowthan I was when I was working in
(14:55):
corporate America because Idon't have the deadlines on me
any longer than I used to have.
SPEAKER_01 (15:02):
And does that cause you to be, I don't want to say
more forgiving, but moreunderstanding of the multiple
priorities that a lot of yourteam members have?
SPEAKER_00 (15:09):
It does.
But I think the other side of itis I have to make sure we make
the money.
I have to make sure there ismoney in the bank to pay
everybody's wages now.
And so I'm less forgiving inthat way because I've got to
make sure that that happens.
And so there's a little bit ofgive and take.
Some things I'm probably alittle bit more lenient on, and
(15:31):
some things I'm probably alittle tougher on.
SPEAKER_01 (15:34):
So in your bio, and for folks that know you and know
SALT, we mentioned SALT School.
Would you, for those that don'tknow, describe what SALT School
is?
Because it's something, as youknow, I am so fond of.
SPEAKER_00 (15:46):
Yes.
And I appreciate that so muchbecause it is my baby.
Salt School started in 2016.
I was in a meeting and I wastold that we were opening a
hotel in Asbury Park, NewJersey, and somebody told me,
we'll never get good staff.
For anybody that knows me andknows that if they tell me we'll
never do something, then that'sit.
(16:08):
I'll prove you wrong.
And so that evening we weretalking in a different meeting
about what makes a community.
And one of the things that makesa community is school.
I call it my working girl momentbecause elevated moment of
Melanie Griffith saying how shethought of the idea of the radio
buyout.
That's how it came together.
(16:29):
So then, with the wonderfulJenny Lockman, who is the
greatest person putting thissort of thing together, we put
the school together.
And the school is aboutintroducing people to
hospitality.
We've honed it over the years tobe eight weekends where we cover
(16:51):
all different aspects ofhospitality from housekeeping,
food and beverage, sales andmarketing, revenue management,
creative, and then some of thesort of more back of house areas
to accounting.
We have open applications we gothrough every weekend, and we
have different people from theindustry.
(17:12):
Some are now, some are saltemployees, but a lot come from
different areas of the industry.
Some come from, we tend to dofood and beverage away from
hotels because it's moreinteresting and to get
restaurateurs and barspecialists to come in because
it's much more fun.
And they talk about what happensin those specific departments.
(17:33):
We do a lot of role playing, alot of guest experience
role-playing and those sorts ofthings to give candidates a real
opportunity to see what happensin hotels because I think a lot
of people quite like the idea ofhospitality, but don't know what
it's about.
I love this industry.
I want to attract as much talentas possible to this industry.
(17:54):
And I don't think we do a verygood job as an industry
attracting talent.
Salt School is there to breakdown some of the barriers.
It's proven incrediblysuccessful.
And some of the things that wedidn't expect from Salt School
are such a massive reduction inturnover.
People join Salt School and thenthey come and work with us and
(18:16):
then they set, we've got nannymanagers.
Actually, our manager here inProvincetown, she was at the
very first Salt School back in2016.
She now does the summers inProvincetown and the winters in
Miami.
She has a great, uh, a greatlife and works.
Give me some of that about it.
Yeah, right.
I think she never has anydowntime.
(18:39):
That's the uh the disadvantage.
But it gives people the chanceto to see our industry and to
stay in our industry and to bepromoted.
So you and I speak on a lot ofpanels.
SPEAKER_01 (18:50):
Yeah.
And every panel I've been on inthe last two years, staffing
comes up, retention, attraction.
And one of the things that I sopersonally loved about SALT
School was not only was it aconnection to the community, but
it also was just a supercreative way, as you said, to
attract good talent when peoplesaid you couldn't, and to deal
with what is clearly one of thebiggest issues our industry
(19:12):
faces right now, which issourcing talent.
I want to share with mylisteners what a gracious
industry colleague you are.
I've watched you from afar.
We've been friends for a longtime.
And as salt was coming out ofthe ground, I followed you and I
followed Salt School.
And I was bowled over with thesuccess you were having.
So I picked up the phone one dayand I called you and I said,
(19:35):
David Bowd, I love what you'redoing with Salt School.
Can I knock it off?
I was just opening the freehandbrand at that time.
And you know, I think a lot ofpeople in our industry would
have said, that's my ideal, stayaway.
But to your point about beingpassionate about this industry,
you actually said, Oh my gosh,Blake, I'm flattered.
Of course you can knock it off.
Not a lot of people would dothat, David.
SPEAKER_00 (19:55):
Yeah, and I would give anybody, and I have done
since, and I love the fact thatyou asked for it, and I love the
fact that you took it, adoptedit, adapted it, made it your
own, and made it something thatworked for you.
And I think that that's whatanybody can do.
And like you say, it does openthe doors to get great talent in
(20:17):
the community, to be part of acommunity.
And I still do not get why moreand more people aren't doing
community-driven, educationallydriven programs to attract
people into our industry.
And it is work and it's hardwork, but it's so beneficial.
SPEAKER_01 (20:34):
Love it.
I just think it shows yourpassion for the industry and
your high tide raises all ships'attitude.
I've always been appreciativeand I've thanked you many times,
but here today on Hotel Daddy, Iwant the world to know thank you
for letting me rip it off.
We did it in our own style, anduh you are a gracious gentleman
about it.
And I love that support.
Thank you.
SPEAKER_00 (20:52):
You had a better name for it, Blake.
You had a great name for it.
SPEAKER_01 (20:56):
Okay, so well, in fairness, I was opening, you
called it Salt School.
I was opening the Freehandbrand, and and so we decided
that Freehand University soundedgood.
So we just called it FU.
Hey, you had to have a littlebit of wink and nod there.
So, final question on kind ofthe salt journey.
What's been your greatestdisappointment in the salt
hotel's run?
SPEAKER_00 (21:15):
Wow.
I think COVID was the hardshipof COVID and what it did to us
as a company.
It helped us in so many ways,but it was so difficult.
I had to let some people go.
That really hurt me.
We had to close all of ourproperties, which was awful, as
(21:37):
every hotel did.
I remember the day.
We had some amazing partnersthat allowed us to keep going
when, and we did keep going,which was phenomenal, but it was
a really, really difficult time.
I would never want to go throughthat again.
SPEAKER_01 (21:55):
Amen.
What did the rebound of businessafter COVID teach you about
travel?
SPEAKER_00 (22:03):
I think don't believe anything you read.
I mean, right?
Like at all this.
The human spirit wants totravel, and as soon as they can,
they will.
Exactly.
It was crazy.
The minute we opened thosedoors, everyone was back.
And everyone, like you say,everybody wanted those
experiences.
SPEAKER_01 (22:21):
And you happen to operate in some key domestic
leisure destinations.
Yeah.
So that traveler that wanted totravel that couldn't go
international, you were booming.
Yeah.
So I happen to know a lot offolks that are gonna listen to
this.
And I know a lot of folks arelistening right now, and some of
them are young, they're smart asa whip, they're creative, they
(22:42):
are making their way in thisindustry.
They share the passion that youand I have for this industry.
They want to open their own inn,they want to open their own
small little hotel, they want toopen their own restaurant.
And what is usually a gatingissue for them is accessing
capital.
Now, you're a guy that went outand started on his own.
If you had any advice to theseyoung, wannabe entrepreneurs,
(23:04):
they want to follow a pathsimilar to yours, they might not
do it with all the experiencethat you had when you did it.
Any advice on how to handle thecapital issue?
How do you get out there?
How do you find capital?
SPEAKER_00 (23:16):
I do speak to a lot of people every week that are
going through that and havingthat struggle.
And I always say, you know, itthis industry is so much about
the people that you know and thepeople that you meet along the
way.
Experience counts for a lot whenpeople are thinking about going
out on their own.
(23:37):
They will use the time now whileyou're in your full-time job to
meet as many people in thefinance world as you possibly
can.
Um go to every single networkingevent that you possibly can.
You've got to be out there,you've got to put yourself out
there.
These people are out there,they're looking for young
(23:59):
entrepreneurs that are doing thenext interesting thing.
And I think it's being ballsyand and being out there and and
not taking no for an answer,having the attitude of it's all
about attitude.
I think our industry is entirelyabout attitude.
And if you've got a can-doattitude, then it'll work, it'll
(24:22):
take some time and you've got tokeep plugging at it.
But get out there and keepmeeting these people.
And one will introduce you tosomebody at some point who's
gonna be able to open a door foryou.
SPEAKER_01 (24:34):
I want to summarize what I think I just heard you
say because it's such goodadvice that I haven't given
before, and I'm gonna steal itfrom you as well, which is they
think nothing about networkingin the creative circles.
They think nothing aboutnetworking in kind of the people
they're comfortable with.
But if you're seriously aboutwanting to do something, you
need capital, you gotta networkwith the finance folks.
You gotta put yourself outthere.
And for a lot of these young,hungry entrepreneurs, that might
(24:56):
not be as comfortable for them,right?
I love that advice.
So you founded SALT with yourpartner, the adorable Kevin
O'Shea, who I just am a big fanof.
What's it like working with yourspouse?
SPEAKER_00 (25:08):
For us, it's great.
We met, as you will know,because we worked with you at
the time.
I know the whole story.
Yes.
We met working together.
We met opening the MondrianScottsdale many, many years ago.
By the way, you were both so DLabout it, just for the records.
SPEAKER_01 (25:24):
I need everyone to know that.
SPEAKER_00 (25:25):
Absolutely.
We were.
We work very, very welltogether.
We have our own disciplines.
We do have a lot of fun withthose disciplines.
They obviously cross over a lot.
We sort of stay in our ownlittle lanes.
We consult each other oneverything.
You know, I'm sitting in theoffice right now, we have an
office table in the middle, weface each other.
(25:47):
But we sort of come into theoffice and it's work.
We don't talk about work whenwe're out of the office, unless
it's something that we need totalk about.
You know, it's work and thenthere's the rest of our lives,
which is, I think, the way itshould be.
We look at it like it has to befun and it has to be enjoyable.
Look, don't get me wrong, Imean, there's been moments where
(26:08):
it's been like, oh, get me outof here now.
I'm gonna go, I'm gonna I'mgonna take the dog for a walk.
Do tell, do tell.
If the dog could talk, then Ithink there'd be a few problems.
But we're very fortunate.
We've always worked very, verywell together.
And we're very fortunate thatwe're both have the same
mindset.
We're both very hard workers.
We sort of appreciate that ineach other as well.
SPEAKER_01 (26:30):
How important do you think it is that both of you
came into SALT having alreadykind of made your mark in the
industry?
I mean, you both, you both hadalready had great success.
So, how important do you thinkit is that when you founded SALT
together, you both came in witha lot of credibility, like both
of you on your own?
SPEAKER_00 (26:49):
I think that helped a lot.
It wasn't David's show orKevin's show, and I think
everybody had respect for usboth, but I think that
definitely makes it a lot, loteasier for sure.
SPEAKER_01 (27:01):
You are both proud, out, successful business
leaders.
What's that journey been likespecifically for you?
SPEAKER_00 (27:07):
It's been hard.
I remember when I was a generalmanager in London in my early
30s.
I think I was actually just 30.
There was a general managersconference.
The company that I worked for atthat time had about 50, 60
hotels.
There were three gay generalmanagers.
We were very quiet and we werenot out and proud, and it was
(27:33):
not talked about.
SPEAKER_01 (27:34):
It was a different time.
You are about the same age, youknow.
I I remind these young guys andgirls, and it was a different
time.
SPEAKER_00 (27:41):
Totally.
And it was part, it wasn'tcomfortable.
I really focused on the LGBTQIAteam members that worked for me,
making sure they never felt likethat.
So I sort of took my strugglesand focused it much more on sort
of the team people that I workedwith giving it back because it
(28:03):
wasn't comfortable until I thinkuntil honestly, I worked for an
American company.
SPEAKER_01 (28:10):
Oh wow, interesting.
SPEAKER_00 (28:12):
Which was the Intrager hotels, which was then
it's more open, it's it's lesspeople care.
And I think it has, like yousay, it has changed so much now.
And thank goodness, because itwas it was appalling, especially
in an industry where it is madeup.
We claim to be so accepted.
Exactly.
I'm really glad now that thingshave changed significantly.
(28:35):
But I also, very, very lucky, Ihad some incredible mentors
throughout my career that werevery good to me and knew that I
was gay and helped me through,particularly my early, you know,
when I was a very junior memberof staff going through, you
know, coming out and all of thatsort of thing.
(28:57):
They were great.
It was tough, but I was veryfortunate that I had great
mentors as well.
How important is it for peoplelike you and I right now to
represent?
I think it's incrediblyimportant.
I don't think there's been amore important time than today
and and than now.
And I think that it's soincredibly important that
(29:18):
there's a voice out there.
SPEAKER_01 (29:20):
I appreciate you so much for that.
I I do, I agree with you.
It is important that we bevisible right now.
That's all.
I don't need to lead with it.
But I need to be visible.
I need to be visible with mylife, and I I love you for that.
Thank you.
You know I'm passionate aboutfitness.
So you and I had hadn't seeneach other in a couple of years,
and I'd heard that you'd reallyjumped on the fitness bandwagon.
You were doing soul cycles,exercising, and I'm in LA and I
(29:42):
go to Soul Cycle and you comewalking out of the studio.
And my friend, you are lean andmean and fit.
And I remember saying, Wow,David bowed.
And this is when you werestarting a company, and I
thought, how does he do it all?
So, in the remaining fewminutes, we have.
Tell me how you balance fitnessin this really aggressive
(30:04):
schedule you have.
And how important is it?
SPEAKER_00 (30:06):
It's vital and it's critical.
I know that now.
I never found a good fitnessregime in my early life and uh
early career.
I didn't like the gym, and itwas never my sort of thing, and
I couldn't find anything that Ireally liked.
And and I think that's part ofit.
You have to find something thatyou you really buy into and you
(30:29):
really, really enjoy.
And I was very fortunate that Ifound Soul Cycle from day one.
I was terrible at it, but Iabsolutely loved it.
I mean, it's like going to a gaydiscount.
Oh, that's I buy that, but okay,it's your story.
It's uh like 45 minutes in a gaydisco at 6 a.m.
It's uh like, okay, this is thisis fun.
I can do that.
It's funny, you know.
I I get up now at 5 a.m.
(30:52):
every day.
I walk the dog for an hour and ahalf, and then at 6:30, I do a
at-home soul cycle class everyday.
And then if I'm in New York orsomewhere that has soul cycle,
I'll go and do an in-personclass.
I'll have it in my schedule.
It's part of my routine that Iwill not compromise about.
(31:14):
And I book hotel rooms aroundwhere SoulCycle is, I book
travel around what time classesare, because I think that it's
my 45 minutes of my time whereI've not got a phone, no one's
going to interrupt me.
In the old days, that a lot ofpeople listening to this will
(31:36):
sort of be laughing at now.
We didn't have phones, weweren't contactable 24 hours a
day.
We had a life that's missingright now, and I think we're too
accessible.
And I think that 45 minutes justgives me a little touch back to
the 80s and 90s where we weren'talways accessible.
(31:56):
And I truly love it.
And of course, I I love itbecause I'm so far ahead of you,
Blake, on Soul Cycle Classes.
SPEAKER_01 (32:02):
So uh oh, come on, I'm pulling out my app.
You want to compare?
I'm pulling it out right now.
Uh-uh.
And just in like 1250, like1250.
So, dude, I'm only at like 901or something.
I actually didn't think you werethat far ahead of me.
I gotta pick it up.
You just said something that Iwant to double down on because
it's something I'm hearing fromall of the really successful
(32:24):
leaders I talked to, which yousaid, I book hotels around, I
put travel around, I make surethat I plan my fitness.
All the young managers out therewho are listening to us right
now don't apologize for makingfitness important and frankly
protecting time in your day forit will make you more
productive, more creative, itwill make you a better manager,
(32:47):
leader, employee, whatever youare at this point in your
career.
SPEAKER_00 (32:50):
Can I just add that as well?
Because it your thing might notbe fitness.
It could be wellness in adifferent way, it could be
meditation, it could be whateveryour thing is.
Make sure you take time for youbecause our industry is one of
the hardest industries you canjoin.
It is a lot of pressure.
(33:12):
There are a lot of peoplelooking at you, there are a lot
of people wanting things fromyou, there's a lot of
expectations on you.
It's very easy to burn out.
And so you need to take care ofyourself.
To take care of yourself, youneed to give yourself some you
time.
SPEAKER_01 (33:30):
Thank you for that.
So true.
It's fitness for us.
It might be playing ball withyour kids, it might be playing
dominoes, but make time for it.
All right.
I'm so embarrassed.
I literally have like 15questions we didn't even get to.
And here we are at the closingmark.
David, thank you.
Thank you so much for spendingtime with me and enjoying and
sharing your passion with ourlisteners.
(33:51):
As we close out today, you aresuch a great mentor.
Any final advice?
There are a lot of folkslistening who I know that are up
and coming in our industry.
They look at guys like you whohave had great success.
What's that piece of advice youmight give them as we close out
today?
SPEAKER_00 (34:07):
You meet incredible people in this industry along
the way.
Some of my best friends, many ofmy best friends, my oldest and
best friend was a front deskagent with me back in the late
80s.
We've worked together a fewtimes over the years.
We're still in contact.
You meet incredible people inthis industry and you stay in
(34:29):
touch with them.
I think that that is one of thebeauties of our industry and one
of the real advantages of ourindustry.
And it's don't lose touch withthose incredibly talented people
that you work with in your earlycareer.
And so if you've lost touch withsomebody, pick up the phone
today and give them a call andget back in touch with them.
I have no notes on that answer.
SPEAKER_01 (34:52):
Wow.
Okay, kids, this has been HotelDaddy.
We spent the day with DavidBowd, co founder and chief
executive of SALT Hotels.
David, my friend, thank you.
Thank you, Blake.
Thanks for listening to HotelDaddy with your host, Blake
Danner.
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