January 14, 2025 • 31 mins
Navigating the Intersection of Humanity and Technology: A Deep Dive with Derek Lundsten
In this episode of The Human Code, host Don Finley interviews Derek Lundsten, President and Chief Culture Officer of LifeGuides. Derek shares his journey of combining spiritual exploration with technological innovation, emphasizing the importance of human connections in a digital world. The conversation explores the foundation and mission of Life Guides, a platform that matches individuals with mentors to provide empathetic support through life's challenges. They discuss the impact of technology on mental health, the importance of balancing digital and real-world interactions, and the future of technology and humanity. This episode offers insights into leveraging technology to enhance human experience while maintaining meaningful connections.
Visit LifeGuides here
00:00 Introduction to The Human Code
00:49 Meet Derek Lundsten: A Transformative Leader
01:16 Derek's Journey: Spirituality and Technology
03:27 The Birth of Life Guides
07:54 The Role of Technology in Human Connection
11:36 Balancing Technology and Humanity
18:42 The Future Vision of Life Guides
22:06 Navigating Technology's Impact on Mental Health
30:06 Conclusion and Final Thoughts
Sponsored by FINdustries
Hosted by Don Finley
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Don Finley (00:00):
Welcome to The Human Code, the podcast where
technology meets humanity, andthe future is shaped by the
leaders and innovators of today.
I'm your host, Don Finley,inviting you on a journey
through the fascinating world oftech, leadership, and personal
growth.
Here, we delve into the storiesof visionary minds, Who are not
only driving technologicaladvancement, but also embodying
(00:23):
the personal journeys andinsights that inspire us all.
Each episode, we explore theintersections where human
ingenuity meets the cutting edgeof technology, unpacking the
experiences, challenges, andtriumphs that define our era.
So, whether you are a techenthusiast, an inspiring
entrepreneur, or simply curiousabout the human narratives
(00:44):
behind the digital revolution,you're in the right place.
Welcome to The Human Code.
Today, we're joined by DerekLundsten.
A transformative leader,passionate about the
intersection of humanity andtechnology.
As the president and chiefculture officer at life guides,
Derek is redefining howtechnology connects people
through mentorship and sharedhuman experiences.
(01:06):
His career spans innovativeventures, including his
leadership of scrimmage andadvisory roles in healthcare
technology, startups, where hefocuses on empowering
individuals and teams to thrive.
In this episode, Derek shareshis journey of combining
spiritual exploration withtechnological innovation.
We'll dive into the founding oflife guides and its mission to
(01:26):
harness technologies, to matchindividuals with mentors,
providing empathetic supportduring life's challenges.
Derek also explores the delicatebalance of leveraging technology
while maintaining meaningfulhuman connections in a rapidly
digitalizing world.
Join us for an inspiringconversation about the future of
technology, the enduringimportance of human connection
(01:47):
and how we can navigate a worldincreasingly shaped by AI and
innovation.
I'm here with Derek Lundsten andDerek and I have just had a nice
little pre show conversation.
I'm really digging what we'regoing to talk about today, but
Derek, first question for you.
What got you interested in theintersection of humanity and
Derek Lundsten (02:06):
Well, thanks for having me on, Don, and the topic
is very relevant.
So I think on a simple level,I've always been more interested
in humanity and what drivespeople as at the core, and the
technology piece, I think,happened.
Circumstantially, just in manyways, based on the time that we
live in.
but from a young age, I've been,interested in pursuing what
(02:27):
drives people, their purpose,their interests, and why we're
here.
And that's something that I'vepersonally explored.
and then spending a considerableamount of time in my education,
studying that from aphilosophical and a
psychological perspective,really what makes people tick
and like I said, as I, Enteredthe workforce, following
studying in university.
(02:47):
I ended up working in consultingand technology businesses that
were focusing specifically thetime in the healthcare space.
And so that lent itself to anatural convergence of where
humanity and technology cometogether.
And over the last couple ofdecades, That's only really
accelerated, As we've seen thead, the renaissance of
technology as I'm going to referto it and what we're seeing now,
(03:09):
on the topic of artificialintelligence and
personalization, it's justgetting more and more
accelerated from that point ofview.
So I think we're at a reallyfascinating moment of the
convergence of humanity andtechnology.
and I've had the privilege overthe last couple of decades of
building businesses and startingcompanies.
that have been in that space.
And even the one that I'mworking in now, which on my
shirt, life guides, which we'lltalk a bit about, but at the
(03:31):
core, the entire essence of thatbusiness is about the
intersection of humanity andtechnology using technology
specifically for the purposes ofconnecting people to other
people who can be mentors orguides, in navigating life
experiences, life events, andlife challenges.
Helping people to be at theirbest or in moments of challenge
(03:51):
or struggle to be there and besupportive and empathetic
resources and driveefficiencies.
of accessing those resources toimprove their life
circumstances.
That's what we do.
and that's really core to what Iam doing in my life's work.
so yeah, great question, Don.
Don Finley (04:05):
And I love this and I feel if I ask you questions
about your personal journey,we're going to end up hitting on
life guide as well.
And like in both sides of it,but when you spoke about
people's drive, their purpose,and like what are their
interests, how does that processlook for you?
Or what was the most insightfulthing that you got from that
Derek Lundsten (04:23):
I'll just share a little story.
So I added at the age, and I'veshared this on a few other
podcasts, the age of seven, forwhatever reason, I was already
asking myself, the question thatmany people ask at some point in
their life or persistently intheir life.
Why am I here?
And that was the, and I rememberit vividly just being in my
childhood bedroom and having,for lack of a better term a
(04:44):
conversation with myself or withGod or whatever saying what am I
here for?
What am I here to do?
What am I here to learn?
And that question has driven mefor my entire life in terms of,
Things that I've pursued orstudied or just been interested
in.
And similar to this idea ofconnecting with guides, the
idea, I can't imagine, or, Iknow for certain that I'm not
(05:07):
the only person that experiencedthat question or experiences
that question either, like Isaid, consistently, or at some
moment in their life where theyhave an awakening and they're
like, what are we doing here?
What am I doing here?
And yeah, I've just always beenfascinated by.
That question in other people'slives as well.
Like, why do people do what theydo?
why are they interested in whatthey're interested in?
(05:28):
Why are we connected in thecertain ways that we are?
And as I said, I studied as aspiritual seeker for most of my,
early teens and early twenties.
That question, from a spirituallens, studying philosophy, and I
was particularly interested inexistentialism and eastern
philosophy.
I've gone on a whole faithjourney, that's brought me back
to a true personal relationshipand where I look at that from my
(05:50):
intersection with God.
but at the end of the day, it's,we're here in this temporal
realm of the world.
Connections and relationshipsand lots of possibilities and
things to explore.
And so I have always beenfascinated by people and by that
aspect and how that layersthrough generations and through
our kind of existence as aspecies about what makes people
(06:12):
tick and technology has been anaccelerator of information.
of knowledge, of the ability toapply that knowledge and
reorganize how power structuresand organizational structures
are formed.
And there's been many instancesalong that journey, Don, that
have been important for me.
but I also think that I get thatquestion to your point, I was in
(06:33):
an entrepreneur's group, thatwas specifically focusing on
this idea of, okay, we live in aworld of exponential
technologies.
Think, Genomics.
Think artificial intelligence.
Think robotics.
Think longevity.
This was 10 years ago.
And the question was, okay, ifthose technologies are going to
influence the trajectory ofhuman innovation and
potentiality, the question thatmyself and my business partners
(06:55):
that we met through that groupwere asking is, what does not
change?
What makes people?
What makes humanity?
What is unique to us in terms ofthat spiritual, that emotional,
that desire for love, thatdesire for purpose, that sharing
of empathy, that sharing of lifeexperience, that sharing of
wisdom, that sharing ofstruggle, that's what makes
humanity.
And we said that those thingsare not going to transition.
(07:16):
And so with that as thefoundation, what business, what
we build that would still bethere, regardless of how we
change from a technologicalstandpoint.
So if we develop.
revolutionary technologiesrelated to how we can feed
people or to manage our, thecrises that we never really face
or that we could heal diseasesor that we can reverse aging or
that we can travel intointerplanetary realities.
(07:38):
Like what's still going to makehumanity.
And that was part of the drivingquestion of this particular
group.
and more specifically for thebusiness partners that I met and
we created with.
And that's really whereLifeguides was birthed was
through that network.
Don Finley (07:51):
now coming back to life guides because you like
guides, you briefly mentionedit's basically using technology
in order to match people basedon like their needs.
And so how does that look foryou?
Derek Lundsten (08:02):
yeah, so I'll share in the context of that
group that it was, there wasactually a specific topic.
So my business partner andanother one of our partners,
they were sharing theirexperience that they had both
become caregivers for theirparents who had dementia.
And these at the time, theseare, mid fifties, late fifties
year old or early fifties, midfifties, general gentlemen.
So That had experiencedfinancial success.
(08:25):
They were well educated.
They were well networked.
They experienced the world.
And even with all thoseprivileges and even with all
that opportunity, there wasstill this acknowledgement that
it's really hard to be acaregiver, because of their
demands on your emotions, onyour identity, on seeing your
parent go through that evolutionin their life, their eventual,
degradation of their quality oflife and transitioning of their
(08:46):
life.
And Let alone the emotional,there's also the financial and
the practical considerationsthat you have in a caregiving
relationship.
And so they had this question ofacknowledgement.
So imagine, for us, it's thischallenging.
How much harder is it for peoplethat don't have the means, the
education, the financialresources, the connections that
we've been blessed to have?
(09:07):
What if we could build and, oneof those partners actually was a
founder of match.
com.
What if we could build a match.
com like experience, not fordating, but for caregivers to
find their person who'd beenthrough that so they could pick
their brain, not throughsearching on Google for hours
and hours on end, but talk tosomeone and get real world
firsthand experience and counselfrom someone who'd been through
(09:29):
that.
And I had, secondhand seen this.
I was not a caregiver directlyfor my grandparents, but I'd
seen my dad and my stepmom bethat for my grandparents.
And so I had a lens removed ofsaying, okay, I can empathize.
I can relate to what thesegentlemen are going through.
Having been caregivers, I'veseen it secondhand.
So I understand it.
And what I saw as well was thatsame model applies not just for
(09:50):
caregiving, but for any lifeexperience, whether it be,
becoming a parent for the firsttime, Going through a
relationship transition or adivorce or relocating across the
country for a promotion ortransitioning from active duty
military to civilian life.
These are all examples ofhundreds of unique experiences
that people go through every daywhere they may or may not have
(10:13):
the resources, the knowledge,the network or the experience to
figure it out.
And so it's invaluable to beable to talk with someone or
some people about who knowpersonally and have been through
it and successfully been throughit.
These are the things that I wishI had known at the time.
These are the things that youshould be aware of.
Here's things, there's resourcesand places that you can go and
access information to improvethe efficiency or the taxing of
(10:36):
the emotions or mental taxationthat happens in that way.
And so that's really whatLifeguides is doing.
And the cool part about it isbecause we are all human beings
and we all are experiencingthese challenges and these
moments of struggle and triumph.
All of us has a story orexperiences or attributes that
we are able to then share.
And so we're tapping into thisunrealized potential of human
(10:58):
wisdom and insight to becommunicated in real time in a
moment of someone's need oropportunity for growth where
they've chosen that and they'vesought that.
And think back to where we werein tribal natures, Where you'd
go seek your elders, you wouldseek your Those in the village
who'd been through thesituation.
We now have an internet like youand I are talking across the
country right now, as if we'resitting in the same room and
(11:21):
same thing.
You could talk to someone on theother side of the world.
Who had been a caregiver, whohad been through a certain
situation that might have aknowledge or experience, and you
can learn from them in a veryrare and unique way that is now
becoming more and moreaccessible because of this
technology innovation,
Don Finley (11:36):
I love what you're talking about.
And when you were speaking, oneof the things that came to me is
I have a spiritual teacher whosays, your experience is unique.
Your story And basically whathe's getting at is There's other
people out there who have been afather.
There's other people who havebeen entrepreneurs, Your
experience though is 100 percentunique and valuable in that
(11:57):
space, but there are people whohave gone through this in the
past.
And it sounds like Lifeguides isreally helping to align with the
community that goes there.
And another human trait thatwe've talked about is the
tribalism and, feelingbelongingness.
and knowing that there'ssomebody else out there who has
gone through and been acaregiver successfully and being
able to pull that informationout or to rely on, that, that
(12:20):
voice to be able to help you.
It sounds like Lifeguide'sreally staged to help a lot
Derek Lundsten (12:25):
That's it.
So that's a very profoundstatement that you and your
teacher made, and that's exactlywhat we're doing.
That there are many people whohave similar stories and yet all
of us has our own experiencesand.
Values and limitations andbeliefs and just uniqueness that
makes that slightly different.
And that provides that, thatnuance that provides that sense
(12:46):
of personalization, thatprovides that deeper level of
connection when you start tounravel some of those threads
that are special to you, butalso are transferable, frankly,
to other people that are goingto help on their experience and
how they reflect in that sharedstory, And there's power in
that.
And that's also, to your point,We believe, and we see this
firsthand, that when you gothrough something challenging or
(13:08):
even traumatic, the, that thereason for that, the purpose of
that is one to help you, butalso to help others to be
shared, to be transformed andtransmuted in service so that it
is recycled and repurposed andreused.
To help other people on theirway.
And I believe that at a corelevel, that's what we're doing.
(13:30):
And so it is an exciting time.
And we can only do it right nowbecause of the technological
advances that have happened inhow people, are now comfortable
in the sharing economy, if youwill.
They're more comfortable inconnecting and being more open
in this kind of format that youand I are speaking in right now,
or virtual tools.
They're more comfortable in, inconfronting.
(13:52):
Mental health or what werehistorically stigmatized topics
that people didn't go there, butnow we see that and social media
and the way we're doing this arenormalizing and bringing
awareness to that way that weall are experiencing life.
And there, there are certainly,shadow and challenging sides of
that as well, but there's also amassive gift and opportunity
(14:12):
that we see that we'recapitalizing on or sharing on.
Don Finley (14:15):
That's fantastic.
And I love that you brought upthe shadow side of this because
there's The shadow that we know,or the shadow is never anything
that we know, but there's thegood shadow and then the shadow
that harms us, on an individuallevel.
But I'd like to go to thetechnology side of this.
your mission is powerful,there's direct benefit that
millions of people can see fromthe work that you're doing.
(14:38):
not just the people that workwith you, but additionally the
people that they interact withas well.
Where do you see technology ishindering?
Like our mental health and thenadditionally, where's technology
helping to align us with our own
Derek Lundsten (14:52):
Yeah.
so back to social media for asecond, I'll comment on that and
also talk to hardware, So whatsocial media has done, that is
both a blessing and a curse, ifI can put it that way, is that
it's accelerated everyone'sinformation access and awareness
of other people in real time.
it's also created, What I'llcall more people are much more
surface level.
like you hear about this conceptall the time.
We're more connected and morelonely than ever.
(15:14):
The reason for that is becauseeveryone is like a mile wide and
an inch deep.
and you see the highlights andyou see what's people, the story
that people construct, for thatplatform.
And it's not necessarilyrepresentative of reality in the
day to day mundane things thatwe all do as people.
That's part of being human.
It's just that moment by moment.
(15:35):
Reality of living and it doesnot capture that well.
And so that's one aspect ofwhere I think it's social media
has done a disservice and partlywhere we're trying to
counterbalance that by saying,go deeper in an interaction with
a person or people.
In a way that you may nottypically have done with someone
you didn't know that well, or aquote unquote stranger in the
(15:55):
sense of a guide, you build arelationship.
So that's one aspect of it.
And then secondarily, to back totechnology, because we have
access to cell phones anddevices round the clock, again,
back to the beauty ofinformation and access and
everything can be, consumed atthe matter of a click or two,
and everybody, we now have thisconditioning for instant
(16:15):
gratification.
And we're constantly on ourphones, distracting ourselves
from being present.
And I think that's anotherelement and that's causing,
frankly, that looping, franklybetter term of people's presence
or lack of presence.
And they're living in a way thatis not helping them and they're,
and they are, frankly, addictingthemselves mentally to these
devices and, not necessarilyaware of that fully.
(16:37):
and if you're not careful, Ifyou run in, if you allow the
software to run you, quoteunquote, you will surround
yourself into echo chambers andit's easy to go into places that
are, not conducive to people'sbest selves or past potential
coming through.
And so those are, we can have awhole conversation around just
this topic, frankly, and I've, Iam passionate about this, but I
(16:59):
think that's a key driver of,mental health.
And then in addition, gettinginto the real world, we.
Beyond numbing ourselves, it is,people are not as physically
active.
They are not as, interactivewith one another in real life.
That's also undermining them.
our diets and how we consume,not just digital information,
but all sorts of information,food and otherwise are not
(17:21):
helping, that.
And I just think there's a lotof contributing factors in
society, but this is an elementof it.
And Yeah, that's a symbol ofwhat we are trying to do with
lifeguides.
Again, is bring people back tousing this to connect, to talk
with someone, to refine anddefine healthier habits and
usage of technology, andhopefully go back into the real
(17:42):
world and apply that in theirday to day lives to have
healthier relationships, havehealthier mindsets and to make
better decisions.
In the type of content and thetype of, contents that we
consume in every aspect of ourlife.
Don Finley (17:56):
And we're definitely going to dive deeper into that
because the one thing I justwant to touch on is while you
were speaking about the aspectsof where technology has led us
down a path that isn't in ourbest interest and no fault of
technology, but really it comesdown to everything you are, what
you eat and everything is food.
(18:17):
And today I'm literally walkingaround with junk food in my
pocket or like the easiestaccessible, but I could also
have it, it could be carrots.
It could be, something else thatactually helps to serve it.
And the vision that you'veoutlined here is how do we
actually bring ourselves tousing technology to bring us
closer to other people or toconnect us to the people that we
(18:40):
can, relate with as well?
in the ideal state, let's see,even 20 years down the line, go
total Jetsons on us.
how does Lifeguides fit into,your daily life?
And my daily life as well as a
Derek Lundsten (18:53):
to your point, I think that, everybody, so just
to comment, everyone's going tohave a unique experience of how
they, live their life.
and, But I believe that in anideal situation, you are going
on using lifeguides on aregular, if not daily, basis to
have a session.
To get some insight andperspective on something that
(19:13):
you're doing in your life thatyou want to improve upon, And it
could be everything from yourcareer to your relationships, to
your mindset, to your parenting,to your struggles.
there's the idea that you can goon and you can, much how people
use Google today to search onsomething, you can go on and you
can access the collective wisdomand insight of the crowd and
work will be better and betterat doing that.
(19:33):
and to your point, there is noreason that anyone should.
have to be suffering in silence,if you will, knowing that
there's someone out there thatthey can access almost
instantaneously to talk withthem and get some perspective on
this.
And so I think that, but I thinkat the same time there is this,
you can call it dystopian orutopian environment where you
meant, in our pre call we'retalking about artificial or
(19:55):
augmented reality and virtualreality.
If you like.
Where is that intersectionbetween the temporal world and
the digital world?
And what is the right balance ofthat?
And, it's a really challengingspot to be in because I, for,
from our perspective, we have,we do have young children.
We give them very limitedtechnology access, like very
limited.
people would probably say it'son the extreme, And that's
(20:16):
intentional considering that I'min, the technology business.
And I have other peers that are,their kids are literally with,
wrapping headsets around andthey're gaming multiple hours a
day.
And, that there's an, there's ause case that says that's part
of the reality that we're movingtowards.
And so there's a lot of researchon both sides and I, there's no
clear answer.
Although my gut says that Forthe mental health and long term,
(20:39):
best of what makes human beingshuman, you need to give a
healthy dose of nature, ofgenuine human connection and,
non digital interventions, tothen be supplemented with the
best of technology, access tospeed of information, and to be
doing it in a way that, you arein discernment and I'm not going
to use control, but you arecalling the shots on how
(21:01):
technology.
is playing a role and asupportive role and a tool as
opposed to you are the, you areat the control of the technology
and the information itself.
Don Finley (21:12):
I, I love this conversation for a couple of
reasons.
One, it's going to be reallyimpactful for the people that
are listening.
knowing that you have to be ableto walk away from it, get
nature, get exercise, haveconnection with people because
we're both sitting down here inoffices and there's a lot of
connection that you can do inthis space, but there's
(21:33):
something to be said about thatin person, that like direct
human to human contact that wecan go.
And I know for myself, like Ihave an AI that I've trained as
Carl Young.
so I can do lightweight therapywith Carl Young.
And at the same time, like itcan be really insightful for
what I can share.
(21:53):
and also it's not a human, Likeit's not that level of empathy,
compassion, connection that youcan go.
it's still grounded
Derek Lundsten (22:01):
Yes.
Don Finley (22:03):
what are some of the warning signs that people can be
aware of?
if the technology is drivingthem, like how do you wake up
from that
Derek Lundsten (22:10):
so that's a whole, let me share something
that kind, that supports whatyou just said.
Then I'll answer your question.
So there's some research thatshows right now.
with like chatbots or AI therapytype of interventions, that the
initial experience of chattingwith a bot, for example, or,
with even an avatar of, CarlJung, for instance, which is
super cool, by the way, that wecan do that.
(22:32):
While your initial experience ofthat will generate positive
outcomes that drops and dipsquickly.
so whereas with a humanintervention, you're going to
receive a consistency andpotentially a gradual upswing.
What you're going to see withdigital is this up and then
down.
that's what they're seeing rightnow.
And specifically related tomental health, for example, that
(22:55):
there's an acute moment whereit's helpful in the moment, but
it does not provide sustainedrelational support because we
know on a core level that it'snot humanity.
At the same time, I read anarticle the other day and it was
talking about sadly, this teamthat had literally built a
relationship for another termwith an AI woman and was like,
I'm going to leave and committedsuicide because he felt that he
(23:18):
was going to connect with thisdigital woman that he had built
a relationship with.
like that's the level of extremethat we have at risk of how this
technology when not, I don'twant to say what not being fully
aware of how it can be utilizedfor young impressionable minds
in particular can be distortedand, misplaced.
And there's risk of that inevery aspect of life.
(23:39):
But that's a particularlyprofound example, And I think
that to your point, we, thereare ways even in a device that
notifies you of when you'veexceeded your intended
interaction with a device, likeyou can, I'm highly, encouraging
of using time setting and limitson certain apps.
especially when it comes tosocial media or other pieces, I
(24:00):
think it's important to stepaway and examine your thoughts,
so I do this a lot.
even in debating politics, forexample, taking a step back,
what is this really about?
asking a lot of that deeperlevel of why is this important?
What's driving this?
Is this value?
Is this serving thisrelationship?
Is it serving my interests?
Is it serving that other person?
it requires another level ofjust awareness of the interface
(24:24):
between you as a person, yourthoughts.
You're in outward expressionwith that technology as well as
how that affects yourrelationship with others.
And I don't know, in fact, I'mquite certain that we've not
done an effective job yet ofhelping to teach the next
generation how to do that.
And in fact, we hear oftentimesfrom this generation, this
emerging generation of youththat they feel more comfortable
(24:44):
talking with their devices thanthey do talking to real people.
And how alarming is that,
Don Finley (24:48):
Oh, it's scary, Like just to think that your kids are
growing up in a world where thisis their comfort and there's so
much beauty out there thatthey're missing.
and also at the same time, thinkyou and I are probably around
the same age.
We grew up without cell phones.
We grew up pre internet actuallymy internet was hitting us right
around high school, likecomparison, So we had touched
(25:10):
grass, Like we were out there,we were in nature, we were lost
for hours.
There was like no connectivity.
And at the same time that gaveus some grounding and there's no
way to walk away from that.
And in fact, from like 2006 toprobably 2015, every vacation I
chose to go on was a place wheremy cell phone wouldn't work.
(25:32):
I no longer
Derek Lundsten (25:33):
Yeah.
Don Finley (25:34):
that's basically, like the cell phone works.
I have one more vacation that Ican do that, but I have to go
into the Amazon three day trip.
And I'm starting to think thatthey're probably a year or two
away of actually being fullyconnected.
Derek Lundsten (25:47):
which then means you have to take responsibility
to turn it off,
Don Finley (25:50):
exactly.
Derek Lundsten (25:51):
and that's where the shift is going back to is
the individual has to takeresponsibility to disconnect,
not because you can no longer.
Just circumstantially disconnectat that point.
I remember back to your comment.
So yes, I think it'sfascinating.
I believe our generation thatmoment like in time of the pre
post actually has a reallyimportant role to play in this
time because it's almost likethe transition of a new an old
(26:14):
age and a new age, the pre andthe post of technology playing
the role of ubiquitous access.
Don Finley (26:20):
And you know what?
AI has that same sort oftransition point.
I think it's even more importantfor what you're doing at
Lifeguides now, to take thoselessons that we've learned from
the last 20, 30 years of this,into this new space of now you
have a technology that's soadvanced that if its goals
aren't aligned with yours, Youhave to recognize that because
(26:42):
it will manipulate you intogetting its
Derek Lundsten (26:45):
there's certainly a risk of that.
Don Finley (26:47):
even social media, We've seen this with social
media, like optimizing forattention.
It figured out that fear andanger are great ways to get you
engaged, but living in thosestates isn't healthy for you and
I.
And we're talking abouttechnology that's probably going
to be a hundred times, athousand times more
sophisticated.
(27:07):
So how would you recommend thatpeople connect to themselves, in
this space?
And additionally, how do yousign up for life
Derek Lundsten (27:15):
So, that former question, so one, I'm not big on
giving advice.
That's right.
just to be clear, that's evenpart of the guide's model, We
don't tell you what to do.
We ask questions to help youfigure out what is important to
you and to help mirrorInformation that would be useful
in that.
And also to share, from myexperience or from that person
(27:37):
experience, what might behelpful to know, For instance.
to that point, I have personallyexperienced a lot of, value in
being very intentional withCreate Windows, where I am
disconnected from technologythat I am present with my
children, with my wife, with myfamily, that I am.
Prioritizing physical exerciseand, prioritizing my dietary
(28:01):
choices and how I show up in the3D world independent of
technology and that, I am seekout opportunities to be around
people and to be around, bothtrusted relationships and new
relationships and to learn aboutthat and to put myself in
(28:21):
environments that Might evenmake me uncomfortable with the
intention to work that muscle,if you will.
And then to be able to use thatand apply that in the lens of
technology.
And so in some ways it is simpleto, to understand it, but it's
not easy to do.
And that is something that Ihave made it a practice and I
track it.
I hold myself accountable tothese things, right?
(28:43):
on a day by day basis.
I see we're both wearing aurarings and that's just one
example, but It's got to thepoint where even all those other
things outside of technology arebeing tracked.
And that's my suggestion.
and if, and seek counsel.
Not advice, but seek otherpeople who have a perspective on
this, and get their point ofview on it.
Particularly if you'rechallenged or believe there's
(29:03):
something that, that there's,that you don't know.
let's do it.
And and then to your questionabout life guides, at the
present moment, we only offerlife guides through employers.
So at some point in the future,we will offer this as a consumer
product, but right now, andthere's a whole of a reason why
we've done it this way, which isa whole other conversation.
We offer it through employers.
and if you want it, talk to yourmanager or talk to your team and
(29:27):
say, can we buy life guides forsome subset of our population or
the whole company.
So that you can have access toit.
and the reason why we do this,cause we believe that the
intersection of work and life isa really important fulcrum point
and that's because we spendconsiderable time in our work.
that's a place where that startsto, outside into both spheres of
influence of people's lives.
(29:48):
And yeah, seek, go tolifeguides.
com.
put in a demo request, ask for asubscription, Get your boss to
buy it and you'll get access tothis network of lifeguides.
yeah.
Don Finley (30:06):
We've been running FINdustries for 12 years now and
in 2018 I had a little bit of amidlife crisis myself in which
Derek Lundsten (30:13):
Yeah.
Don Finley (30:21):
But at the same time, I'm missing out on
connections with friends andfamily.
And so what we ended up doing isafter, the story's longer, but
really the end result of it waswe're only going to work with
friends.
And so that means changing howwe interacted with each other.
It changed half of our clients.
We ended up having to end somerelationships, in a peaceful
(30:44):
manner.
But at the same time, we changedit that way.
And so your angle of goingthrough the employer employee
relationship in that is a reallyimpactful spot in people's
lives.
So really awesome.
Lifeguides.
com is the website.
And Derek, thank you so much for
Derek Lundsten (31:02):
you for having me, Don.
It's been a pleasure, and Iappreciate your curiosity and
your enthusiasm for this topic.
Don Finley (31:07):
Thank you for tuning into The Human Code, sponsored
by FINdustries, where we harnessAI to elevate your business.
By improving operationalefficiency and accelerating
growth, we turn opportunitiesinto reality.
Let FINdustries be your guide toAI mastery, making success
inevitable.
Explore how at FINdustries.
(31:29):
co.
Welcome to The Human Code, the podcast where
technology meets humanity, andthe future is shaped by the
leaders and innovators of today.
I'm your host, Don Finley,inviting you on a journey
through the fascinating world oftech, leadership, and personal
growth.
Here, we delve into the storiesof visionary minds, Who are not
only driving technologicaladvancement, but also embodying
(00:23):
the personal journeys andinsights that inspire us all.
Each episode, we explore theintersections where human
ingenuity meets the cutting edgeof technology, unpacking the
experiences, challenges, andtriumphs that define our era.
So, whether you are a techenthusiast, an inspiring
entrepreneur, or simply curiousabout the human narratives
(00:44):
behind the digital revolution,you're in the right place.
Welcome to The Human Code.
Today, we're joined by DerekLundsten.
A transformative leader,passionate about the
intersection of humanity andtechnology.
As the president and chiefculture officer at life guides,
Derek is redefining howtechnology connects people
through mentorship and sharedhuman experiences.
(01:06):
His career spans innovativeventures, including his
leadership of scrimmage andadvisory roles in healthcare
technology, startups, where hefocuses on empowering
individuals and teams to thrive.
In this episode, Derek shareshis journey of combining
spiritual exploration withtechnological innovation.
We'll dive into the founding oflife guides and its mission to
(01:26):
harness technologies, to matchindividuals with mentors,
providing empathetic supportduring life's challenges.
Derek also explores the delicatebalance of leveraging technology
while maintaining meaningfulhuman connections in a rapidly
digitalizing world.
Join us for an inspiringconversation about the future of
technology, the enduringimportance of human connection
(01:47):
and how we can navigate a worldincreasingly shaped by AI and
innovation.
I'm here with Derek Lundsten andDerek and I have just had a nice
little pre show conversation.
I'm really digging what we'regoing to talk about today, but
Derek, first question for you.
What got you interested in theintersection of humanity and
Derek Lundsten (02:06):
Well, thanks for having me on, Don, and the topic
is very relevant.
So I think on a simple level,I've always been more interested
in humanity and what drivespeople as at the core, and the
technology piece, I think,happened.
Circumstantially, just in manyways, based on the time that we
live in.
but from a young age, I've been,interested in pursuing what
(02:27):
drives people, their purpose,their interests, and why we're
here.
And that's something that I'vepersonally explored.
and then spending a considerableamount of time in my education,
studying that from aphilosophical and a
psychological perspective,really what makes people tick
and like I said, as I, Enteredthe workforce, following
studying in university.
(02:47):
I ended up working in consultingand technology businesses that
were focusing specifically thetime in the healthcare space.
And so that lent itself to anatural convergence of where
humanity and technology cometogether.
And over the last couple ofdecades, That's only really
accelerated, As we've seen thead, the renaissance of
technology as I'm going to referto it and what we're seeing now,
(03:09):
on the topic of artificialintelligence and
personalization, it's justgetting more and more
accelerated from that point ofview.
So I think we're at a reallyfascinating moment of the
convergence of humanity andtechnology.
and I've had the privilege overthe last couple of decades of
building businesses and startingcompanies.
that have been in that space.
And even the one that I'mworking in now, which on my
shirt, life guides, which we'lltalk a bit about, but at the
(03:31):
core, the entire essence of thatbusiness is about the
intersection of humanity andtechnology using technology
specifically for the purposes ofconnecting people to other
people who can be mentors orguides, in navigating life
experiences, life events, andlife challenges.
Helping people to be at theirbest or in moments of challenge
(03:51):
or struggle to be there and besupportive and empathetic
resources and driveefficiencies.
of accessing those resources toimprove their life
circumstances.
That's what we do.
and that's really core to what Iam doing in my life's work.
so yeah, great question, Don.
Don Finley (04:05):
And I love this and I feel if I ask you questions
about your personal journey,we're going to end up hitting on
life guide as well.
And like in both sides of it,but when you spoke about
people's drive, their purpose,and like what are their
interests, how does that processlook for you?
Or what was the most insightfulthing that you got from that
Derek Lundsten (04:23):
I'll just share a little story.
So I added at the age, and I'veshared this on a few other
podcasts, the age of seven, forwhatever reason, I was already
asking myself, the question thatmany people ask at some point in
their life or persistently intheir life.
Why am I here?
And that was the, and I rememberit vividly just being in my
childhood bedroom and having,for lack of a better term a
(04:44):
conversation with myself or withGod or whatever saying what am I
here for?
What am I here to do?
What am I here to learn?
And that question has driven mefor my entire life in terms of,
Things that I've pursued orstudied or just been interested
in.
And similar to this idea ofconnecting with guides, the
idea, I can't imagine, or, Iknow for certain that I'm not
(05:07):
the only person that experiencedthat question or experiences
that question either, like Isaid, consistently, or at some
moment in their life where theyhave an awakening and they're
like, what are we doing here?
What am I doing here?
And yeah, I've just always beenfascinated by.
That question in other people'slives as well.
Like, why do people do what theydo?
why are they interested in whatthey're interested in?
(05:28):
Why are we connected in thecertain ways that we are?
And as I said, I studied as aspiritual seeker for most of my,
early teens and early twenties.
That question, from a spirituallens, studying philosophy, and I
was particularly interested inexistentialism and eastern
philosophy.
I've gone on a whole faithjourney, that's brought me back
to a true personal relationshipand where I look at that from my
(05:50):
intersection with God.
but at the end of the day, it's,we're here in this temporal
realm of the world.
Connections and relationshipsand lots of possibilities and
things to explore.
And so I have always beenfascinated by people and by that
aspect and how that layersthrough generations and through
our kind of existence as aspecies about what makes people
(06:12):
tick and technology has been anaccelerator of information.
of knowledge, of the ability toapply that knowledge and
reorganize how power structuresand organizational structures
are formed.
And there's been many instancesalong that journey, Don, that
have been important for me.
but I also think that I get thatquestion to your point, I was in
(06:33):
an entrepreneur's group, thatwas specifically focusing on
this idea of, okay, we live in aworld of exponential
technologies.
Think, Genomics.
Think artificial intelligence.
Think robotics.
Think longevity.
This was 10 years ago.
And the question was, okay, ifthose technologies are going to
influence the trajectory ofhuman innovation and
potentiality, the question thatmyself and my business partners
(06:55):
that we met through that groupwere asking is, what does not
change?
What makes people?
What makes humanity?
What is unique to us in terms ofthat spiritual, that emotional,
that desire for love, thatdesire for purpose, that sharing
of empathy, that sharing of lifeexperience, that sharing of
wisdom, that sharing ofstruggle, that's what makes
humanity.
And we said that those thingsare not going to transition.
(07:16):
And so with that as thefoundation, what business, what
we build that would still bethere, regardless of how we
change from a technologicalstandpoint.
So if we develop.
revolutionary technologiesrelated to how we can feed
people or to manage our, thecrises that we never really face
or that we could heal diseasesor that we can reverse aging or
that we can travel intointerplanetary realities.
(07:38):
Like what's still going to makehumanity.
And that was part of the drivingquestion of this particular
group.
and more specifically for thebusiness partners that I met and
we created with.
And that's really whereLifeguides was birthed was
through that network.
Don Finley (07:51):
now coming back to life guides because you like
guides, you briefly mentionedit's basically using technology
in order to match people basedon like their needs.
And so how does that look foryou?
Derek Lundsten (08:02):
yeah, so I'll share in the context of that
group that it was, there wasactually a specific topic.
So my business partner andanother one of our partners,
they were sharing theirexperience that they had both
become caregivers for theirparents who had dementia.
And these at the time, theseare, mid fifties, late fifties
year old or early fifties, midfifties, general gentlemen.
So That had experiencedfinancial success.
(08:25):
They were well educated.
They were well networked.
They experienced the world.
And even with all thoseprivileges and even with all
that opportunity, there wasstill this acknowledgement that
it's really hard to be acaregiver, because of their
demands on your emotions, onyour identity, on seeing your
parent go through that evolutionin their life, their eventual,
degradation of their quality oflife and transitioning of their
(08:46):
life.
And Let alone the emotional,there's also the financial and
the practical considerationsthat you have in a caregiving
relationship.
And so they had this question ofacknowledgement.
So imagine, for us, it's thischallenging.
How much harder is it for peoplethat don't have the means, the
education, the financialresources, the connections that
we've been blessed to have?
(09:07):
What if we could build and, oneof those partners actually was a
founder of match.
com.
What if we could build a match.
com like experience, not fordating, but for caregivers to
find their person who'd beenthrough that so they could pick
their brain, not throughsearching on Google for hours
and hours on end, but talk tosomeone and get real world
firsthand experience and counselfrom someone who'd been through
(09:29):
that.
And I had, secondhand seen this.
I was not a caregiver directlyfor my grandparents, but I'd
seen my dad and my stepmom bethat for my grandparents.
And so I had a lens removed ofsaying, okay, I can empathize.
I can relate to what thesegentlemen are going through.
Having been caregivers, I'veseen it secondhand.
So I understand it.
And what I saw as well was thatsame model applies not just for
(09:50):
caregiving, but for any lifeexperience, whether it be,
becoming a parent for the firsttime, Going through a
relationship transition or adivorce or relocating across the
country for a promotion ortransitioning from active duty
military to civilian life.
These are all examples ofhundreds of unique experiences
that people go through every daywhere they may or may not have
(10:13):
the resources, the knowledge,the network or the experience to
figure it out.
And so it's invaluable to beable to talk with someone or
some people about who knowpersonally and have been through
it and successfully been throughit.
These are the things that I wishI had known at the time.
These are the things that youshould be aware of.
Here's things, there's resourcesand places that you can go and
access information to improvethe efficiency or the taxing of
(10:36):
the emotions or mental taxationthat happens in that way.
And so that's really whatLifeguides is doing.
And the cool part about it isbecause we are all human beings
and we all are experiencingthese challenges and these
moments of struggle and triumph.
All of us has a story orexperiences or attributes that
we are able to then share.
And so we're tapping into thisunrealized potential of human
(10:58):
wisdom and insight to becommunicated in real time in a
moment of someone's need oropportunity for growth where
they've chosen that and they'vesought that.
And think back to where we werein tribal natures, Where you'd
go seek your elders, you wouldseek your Those in the village
who'd been through thesituation.
We now have an internet like youand I are talking across the
country right now, as if we'resitting in the same room and
(11:21):
same thing.
You could talk to someone on theother side of the world.
Who had been a caregiver, whohad been through a certain
situation that might have aknowledge or experience, and you
can learn from them in a veryrare and unique way that is now
becoming more and moreaccessible because of this
technology innovation,
Don Finley (11:36):
I love what you're talking about.
And when you were speaking, oneof the things that came to me is
I have a spiritual teacher whosays, your experience is unique.
Your story And basically whathe's getting at is There's other
people out there who have been afather.
There's other people who havebeen entrepreneurs, Your
experience though is 100 percentunique and valuable in that
(11:57):
space, but there are people whohave gone through this in the
past.
And it sounds like Lifeguides isreally helping to align with the
community that goes there.
And another human trait thatwe've talked about is the
tribalism and, feelingbelongingness.
and knowing that there'ssomebody else out there who has
gone through and been acaregiver successfully and being
able to pull that informationout or to rely on, that, that
(12:20):
voice to be able to help you.
It sounds like Lifeguide'sreally staged to help a lot
Derek Lundsten (12:25):
That's it.
So that's a very profoundstatement that you and your
teacher made, and that's exactlywhat we're doing.
That there are many people whohave similar stories and yet all
of us has our own experiencesand.
Values and limitations andbeliefs and just uniqueness that
makes that slightly different.
And that provides that, thatnuance that provides that sense
(12:46):
of personalization, thatprovides that deeper level of
connection when you start tounravel some of those threads
that are special to you, butalso are transferable, frankly,
to other people that are goingto help on their experience and
how they reflect in that sharedstory, And there's power in
that.
And that's also, to your point,We believe, and we see this
firsthand, that when you gothrough something challenging or
(13:08):
even traumatic, the, that thereason for that, the purpose of
that is one to help you, butalso to help others to be
shared, to be transformed andtransmuted in service so that it
is recycled and repurposed andreused.
To help other people on theirway.
And I believe that at a corelevel, that's what we're doing.
(13:30):
And so it is an exciting time.
And we can only do it right nowbecause of the technological
advances that have happened inhow people, are now comfortable
in the sharing economy, if youwill.
They're more comfortable inconnecting and being more open
in this kind of format that youand I are speaking in right now,
or virtual tools.
They're more comfortable in, inconfronting.
(13:52):
Mental health or what werehistorically stigmatized topics
that people didn't go there, butnow we see that and social media
and the way we're doing this arenormalizing and bringing
awareness to that way that weall are experiencing life.
And there, there are certainly,shadow and challenging sides of
that as well, but there's also amassive gift and opportunity
(14:12):
that we see that we'recapitalizing on or sharing on.
Don Finley (14:15):
That's fantastic.
And I love that you brought upthe shadow side of this because
there's The shadow that we know,or the shadow is never anything
that we know, but there's thegood shadow and then the shadow
that harms us, on an individuallevel.
But I'd like to go to thetechnology side of this.
your mission is powerful,there's direct benefit that
millions of people can see fromthe work that you're doing.
(14:38):
not just the people that workwith you, but additionally the
people that they interact withas well.
Where do you see technology ishindering?
Like our mental health and thenadditionally, where's technology
helping to align us with our own
Derek Lundsten (14:52):
Yeah.
so back to social media for asecond, I'll comment on that and
also talk to hardware, So whatsocial media has done, that is
both a blessing and a curse, ifI can put it that way, is that
it's accelerated everyone'sinformation access and awareness
of other people in real time.
it's also created, What I'llcall more people are much more
surface level.
like you hear about this conceptall the time.
We're more connected and morelonely than ever.
(15:14):
The reason for that is becauseeveryone is like a mile wide and
an inch deep.
and you see the highlights andyou see what's people, the story
that people construct, for thatplatform.
And it's not necessarilyrepresentative of reality in the
day to day mundane things thatwe all do as people.
That's part of being human.
It's just that moment by moment.
(15:35):
Reality of living and it doesnot capture that well.
And so that's one aspect ofwhere I think it's social media
has done a disservice and partlywhere we're trying to
counterbalance that by saying,go deeper in an interaction with
a person or people.
In a way that you may nottypically have done with someone
you didn't know that well, or aquote unquote stranger in the
(15:55):
sense of a guide, you build arelationship.
So that's one aspect of it.
And then secondarily, to back totechnology, because we have
access to cell phones anddevices round the clock, again,
back to the beauty ofinformation and access and
everything can be, consumed atthe matter of a click or two,
and everybody, we now have thisconditioning for instant
(16:15):
gratification.
And we're constantly on ourphones, distracting ourselves
from being present.
And I think that's anotherelement and that's causing,
frankly, that looping, franklybetter term of people's presence
or lack of presence.
And they're living in a way thatis not helping them and they're,
and they are, frankly, addictingthemselves mentally to these
devices and, not necessarilyaware of that fully.
(16:37):
and if you're not careful, Ifyou run in, if you allow the
software to run you, quoteunquote, you will surround
yourself into echo chambers andit's easy to go into places that
are, not conducive to people'sbest selves or past potential
coming through.
And so those are, we can have awhole conversation around just
this topic, frankly, and I've, Iam passionate about this, but I
(16:59):
think that's a key driver of,mental health.
And then in addition, gettinginto the real world, we.
Beyond numbing ourselves, it is,people are not as physically
active.
They are not as, interactivewith one another in real life.
That's also undermining them.
our diets and how we consume,not just digital information,
but all sorts of information,food and otherwise are not
(17:21):
helping, that.
And I just think there's a lotof contributing factors in
society, but this is an elementof it.
And Yeah, that's a symbol ofwhat we are trying to do with
lifeguides.
Again, is bring people back tousing this to connect, to talk
with someone, to refine anddefine healthier habits and
usage of technology, andhopefully go back into the real
(17:42):
world and apply that in theirday to day lives to have
healthier relationships, havehealthier mindsets and to make
better decisions.
In the type of content and thetype of, contents that we
consume in every aspect of ourlife.
Don Finley (17:56):
And we're definitely going to dive deeper into that
because the one thing I justwant to touch on is while you
were speaking about the aspectsof where technology has led us
down a path that isn't in ourbest interest and no fault of
technology, but really it comesdown to everything you are, what
you eat and everything is food.
(18:17):
And today I'm literally walkingaround with junk food in my
pocket or like the easiestaccessible, but I could also
have it, it could be carrots.
It could be, something else thatactually helps to serve it.
And the vision that you'veoutlined here is how do we
actually bring ourselves tousing technology to bring us
closer to other people or toconnect us to the people that we
(18:40):
can, relate with as well?
in the ideal state, let's see,even 20 years down the line, go
total Jetsons on us.
how does Lifeguides fit into,your daily life?
And my daily life as well as a
Derek Lundsten (18:53):
to your point, I think that, everybody, so just
to comment, everyone's going tohave a unique experience of how
they, live their life.
and, But I believe that in anideal situation, you are going
on using lifeguides on aregular, if not daily, basis to
have a session.
To get some insight andperspective on something that
(19:13):
you're doing in your life thatyou want to improve upon, And it
could be everything from yourcareer to your relationships, to
your mindset, to your parenting,to your struggles.
there's the idea that you can goon and you can, much how people
use Google today to search onsomething, you can go on and you
can access the collective wisdomand insight of the crowd and
work will be better and betterat doing that.
(19:33):
and to your point, there is noreason that anyone should.
have to be suffering in silence,if you will, knowing that
there's someone out there thatthey can access almost
instantaneously to talk withthem and get some perspective on
this.
And so I think that, but I thinkat the same time there is this,
you can call it dystopian orutopian environment where you
meant, in our pre call we'retalking about artificial or
(19:55):
augmented reality and virtualreality.
If you like.
Where is that intersectionbetween the temporal world and
the digital world?
And what is the right balance ofthat?
And, it's a really challengingspot to be in because I, for,
from our perspective, we have,we do have young children.
We give them very limitedtechnology access, like very
limited.
people would probably say it'son the extreme, And that's
(20:16):
intentional considering that I'min, the technology business.
And I have other peers that are,their kids are literally with,
wrapping headsets around andthey're gaming multiple hours a
day.
And, that there's an, there's ause case that says that's part
of the reality that we're movingtowards.
And so there's a lot of researchon both sides and I, there's no
clear answer.
Although my gut says that Forthe mental health and long term,
(20:39):
best of what makes human beingshuman, you need to give a
healthy dose of nature, ofgenuine human connection and,
non digital interventions, tothen be supplemented with the
best of technology, access tospeed of information, and to be
doing it in a way that, you arein discernment and I'm not going
to use control, but you arecalling the shots on how
(21:01):
technology.
is playing a role and asupportive role and a tool as
opposed to you are the, you areat the control of the technology
and the information itself.
Don Finley (21:12):
I, I love this conversation for a couple of
reasons.
One, it's going to be reallyimpactful for the people that
are listening.
knowing that you have to be ableto walk away from it, get
nature, get exercise, haveconnection with people because
we're both sitting down here inoffices and there's a lot of
connection that you can do inthis space, but there's
(21:33):
something to be said about thatin person, that like direct
human to human contact that wecan go.
And I know for myself, like Ihave an AI that I've trained as
Carl Young.
so I can do lightweight therapywith Carl Young.
And at the same time, like itcan be really insightful for
what I can share.
(21:53):
and also it's not a human, Likeit's not that level of empathy,
compassion, connection that youcan go.
it's still grounded
Derek Lundsten (22:01):
Yes.
Don Finley (22:03):
what are some of the warning signs that people can be
aware of?
if the technology is drivingthem, like how do you wake up
from that
Derek Lundsten (22:10):
so that's a whole, let me share something
that kind, that supports whatyou just said.
Then I'll answer your question.
So there's some research thatshows right now.
with like chatbots or AI therapytype of interventions, that the
initial experience of chattingwith a bot, for example, or,
with even an avatar of, CarlJung, for instance, which is
super cool, by the way, that wecan do that.
(22:32):
While your initial experience ofthat will generate positive
outcomes that drops and dipsquickly.
so whereas with a humanintervention, you're going to
receive a consistency andpotentially a gradual upswing.
What you're going to see withdigital is this up and then
down.
that's what they're seeing rightnow.
And specifically related tomental health, for example, that
(22:55):
there's an acute moment whereit's helpful in the moment, but
it does not provide sustainedrelational support because we
know on a core level that it'snot humanity.
At the same time, I read anarticle the other day and it was
talking about sadly, this teamthat had literally built a
relationship for another termwith an AI woman and was like,
I'm going to leave and committedsuicide because he felt that he
(23:18):
was going to connect with thisdigital woman that he had built
a relationship with.
like that's the level of extremethat we have at risk of how this
technology when not, I don'twant to say what not being fully
aware of how it can be utilizedfor young impressionable minds
in particular can be distortedand, misplaced.
And there's risk of that inevery aspect of life.
(23:39):
But that's a particularlyprofound example, And I think
that to your point, we, thereare ways even in a device that
notifies you of when you'veexceeded your intended
interaction with a device, likeyou can, I'm highly, encouraging
of using time setting and limitson certain apps.
especially when it comes tosocial media or other pieces, I
(24:00):
think it's important to stepaway and examine your thoughts,
so I do this a lot.
even in debating politics, forexample, taking a step back,
what is this really about?
asking a lot of that deeperlevel of why is this important?
What's driving this?
Is this value?
Is this serving thisrelationship?
Is it serving my interests?
Is it serving that other person?
it requires another level ofjust awareness of the interface
(24:24):
between you as a person, yourthoughts.
You're in outward expressionwith that technology as well as
how that affects yourrelationship with others.
And I don't know, in fact, I'mquite certain that we've not
done an effective job yet ofhelping to teach the next
generation how to do that.
And in fact, we hear oftentimesfrom this generation, this
emerging generation of youththat they feel more comfortable
(24:44):
talking with their devices thanthey do talking to real people.
And how alarming is that,
Don Finley (24:48):
Oh, it's scary, Like just to think that your kids are
growing up in a world where thisis their comfort and there's so
much beauty out there thatthey're missing.
and also at the same time, thinkyou and I are probably around
the same age.
We grew up without cell phones.
We grew up pre internet actuallymy internet was hitting us right
around high school, likecomparison, So we had touched
(25:10):
grass, Like we were out there,we were in nature, we were lost
for hours.
There was like no connectivity.
And at the same time that gaveus some grounding and there's no
way to walk away from that.
And in fact, from like 2006 toprobably 2015, every vacation I
chose to go on was a place wheremy cell phone wouldn't work.
(25:32):
I no longer
Derek Lundsten (25:33):
Yeah.
Don Finley (25:34):
that's basically, like the cell phone works.
I have one more vacation that Ican do that, but I have to go
into the Amazon three day trip.
And I'm starting to think thatthey're probably a year or two
away of actually being fullyconnected.
Derek Lundsten (25:47):
which then means you have to take responsibility
to turn it off,
Don Finley (25:50):
exactly.
Derek Lundsten (25:51):
and that's where the shift is going back to is
the individual has to takeresponsibility to disconnect,
not because you can no longer.
Just circumstantially disconnectat that point.
I remember back to your comment.
So yes, I think it'sfascinating.
I believe our generation thatmoment like in time of the pre
post actually has a reallyimportant role to play in this
time because it's almost likethe transition of a new an old
(26:14):
age and a new age, the pre andthe post of technology playing
the role of ubiquitous access.
Don Finley (26:20):
And you know what?
AI has that same sort oftransition point.
I think it's even more importantfor what you're doing at
Lifeguides now, to take thoselessons that we've learned from
the last 20, 30 years of this,into this new space of now you
have a technology that's soadvanced that if its goals
aren't aligned with yours, Youhave to recognize that because
(26:42):
it will manipulate you intogetting its
Derek Lundsten (26:45):
there's certainly a risk of that.
Don Finley (26:47):
even social media, We've seen this with social
media, like optimizing forattention.
It figured out that fear andanger are great ways to get you
engaged, but living in thosestates isn't healthy for you and
I.
And we're talking abouttechnology that's probably going
to be a hundred times, athousand times more
sophisticated.
(27:07):
So how would you recommend thatpeople connect to themselves, in
this space?
And additionally, how do yousign up for life
Derek Lundsten (27:15):
So, that former question, so one, I'm not big on
giving advice.
That's right.
just to be clear, that's evenpart of the guide's model, We
don't tell you what to do.
We ask questions to help youfigure out what is important to
you and to help mirrorInformation that would be useful
in that.
And also to share, from myexperience or from that person
(27:37):
experience, what might behelpful to know, For instance.
to that point, I have personallyexperienced a lot of, value in
being very intentional withCreate Windows, where I am
disconnected from technologythat I am present with my
children, with my wife, with myfamily, that I am.
Prioritizing physical exerciseand, prioritizing my dietary
(28:01):
choices and how I show up in the3D world independent of
technology and that, I am seekout opportunities to be around
people and to be around, bothtrusted relationships and new
relationships and to learn aboutthat and to put myself in
(28:21):
environments that Might evenmake me uncomfortable with the
intention to work that muscle,if you will.
And then to be able to use thatand apply that in the lens of
technology.
And so in some ways it is simpleto, to understand it, but it's
not easy to do.
And that is something that Ihave made it a practice and I
track it.
I hold myself accountable tothese things, right?
(28:43):
on a day by day basis.
I see we're both wearing aurarings and that's just one
example, but It's got to thepoint where even all those other
things outside of technology arebeing tracked.
And that's my suggestion.
and if, and seek counsel.
Not advice, but seek otherpeople who have a perspective on
this, and get their point ofview on it.
Particularly if you'rechallenged or believe there's
(29:03):
something that, that there's,that you don't know.
let's do it.
And and then to your questionabout life guides, at the
present moment, we only offerlife guides through employers.
So at some point in the future,we will offer this as a consumer
product, but right now, andthere's a whole of a reason why
we've done it this way, which isa whole other conversation.
We offer it through employers.
and if you want it, talk to yourmanager or talk to your team and
(29:27):
say, can we buy life guides forsome subset of our population or
the whole company.
So that you can have access toit.
and the reason why we do this,cause we believe that the
intersection of work and life isa really important fulcrum point
and that's because we spendconsiderable time in our work.
that's a place where that startsto, outside into both spheres of
influence of people's lives.
(29:48):
And yeah, seek, go tolifeguides.
com.
put in a demo request, ask for asubscription, Get your boss to
buy it and you'll get access tothis network of lifeguides.
yeah.
Don Finley (30:06):
We've been running FINdustries for 12 years now and
in 2018 I had a little bit of amidlife crisis myself in which
Derek Lundsten (30:13):
Yeah.
Don Finley (30:21):
But at the same time, I'm missing out on
connections with friends andfamily.
And so what we ended up doing isafter, the story's longer, but
really the end result of it waswe're only going to work with
friends.
And so that means changing howwe interacted with each other.
It changed half of our clients.
We ended up having to end somerelationships, in a peaceful
(30:44):
manner.
But at the same time, we changedit that way.
And so your angle of goingthrough the employer employee
relationship in that is a reallyimpactful spot in people's
lives.
So really awesome.
Lifeguides.
com is the website.
And Derek, thank you so much for
Derek Lundsten (31:02):
you for having me, Don.
It's been a pleasure, and Iappreciate your curiosity and
your enthusiasm for this topic.
Don Finley (31:07):
Thank you for tuning into The Human Code, sponsored
by FINdustries, where we harnessAI to elevate your business.
By improving operationalefficiency and accelerating
growth, we turn opportunitiesinto reality.
Let FINdustries be your guide toAI mastery, making success
inevitable.
Explore how at FINdustries.
(31:29):
co.
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