September 10, 2025 • 25 mins
The epitome of leadership is the ability to share your leadership story and leave a legacy. I discuss how to do that with my guest, Shelley Goldstein.
Shelley Goldstein is a leadership development coach specializing in communications affectionately known by clients as "The Coach Whisperer". The moniker stems from her intuitive ability to pinpoint untapped potential in leaders and cultivate it into speaking mastery with remarkable ease and speed.
As the architect of Remarkable Speaking, Shelley has created a proprietary framework that has evolved into a global leadership development platform. Rooted in 30-plus years of experience in leadership, entrepreneurship, marketing, and design, her expertise allows her to creatively integrate time-saving drills, persuasive storytelling, and behavioral psychology, driving significant real-world impact.
Your Leadership Story
Your leadership story begins with the origins of why and how we do things. It can go back to your youth when you’re joining a music program or getting involved in sports. It's a study of behaviors involved with those activities. It's those stories that build one on top of the other that become your legacy, who you are today, and why you lead the way you do when situations call or leadership.
Shelley’s Leadership Story: Back to the Beginning
Shelley says her story goes back to when she was eight or nine years old and her and a group her friends put together a neighborhood newspaper. The three of them were about the same age. They included hosted a beauty pageant and had articles and recipes that they got from their neighbors. Being able to organize that at such a young age and publish it month after month had a profound impact on leadership in Shelley’s adult life.
Looking back, she learned a lot about leadership skills and taking the initiative at a very young age. Some of the things she carries forward with her today is the idea of sharing that responsibility and delegating to other people. Whether she was aware of it or not, it just naturally happened. And Shelley believes that's what helps her be a better leader today; that sharing of ideas and giving people autonomy to create some of the most innovative, creative ideas of their childhoods.
Leadership Showing Up
Shelley remembers her earlier career as a costume designer. She had the responsibility of creating a look, making sure the costumes could be perceived from the audience. That meant meaning when that curtain goes up, she can't be up there with the assistants hemming and sewing. It was showtime. Shelley believes that whole idea of “it's showtime” was an early leadership development experience in her adult life. She realized that she can't do everything.
She had to prioritize and realized you can’t sweat the small stuff. To lead through that and make sure her team understood that the work that they were doing as individuals contributed to their combined success; and that bigger vision of what things need to happen.
The Beginning of Leadership in Your Adult Life
It's so hard to say where it actually begins.
If you have an idea, let's start with the incubating. You have a great idea. How you strategize that, how you move forward with that, that's an innate leadership skill. I'm going to have a marketing strategy. I'm going to have a sales strategy. I'm going to develop my brand this way. Those are all leadership skills because you're making important decisions. Those stories of how you eventually do that, that becomes the legacy. That becomes your competitive advantage and unique story to only you.
The stories are so important because that's where the money flows. Money is how people respond to the stories. That's what people buy into. That's the journey.
The Structure of a Great Leadership Story
A great leadership story is the journey, the mistakes, the decisions you made when you were building your business. You know what? I'm going to go with my marketing strategy and h...
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
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(00:00):
Welcome to the Idea Climbing podcast. The epitome
of leadership is the ability to share your
leadership story and leave a legacy.
I discuss how to do that with my
guest, Shelly Goldstein.
Shelly equips visionary leaders with the tools to
communicate boldly,
especially under pressure, having coached over 1,000 executives
(00:22):
and entrepreneurs across five continents.
Her competitive advantage is speed and effectiveness,
delivering a time saving framework for action driven
leaders who can't afford to lose opportunities in
high stakes situations.
As the architect of the remarkable framework and
number one international best selling author, Shelley transforms
how leaders communicate at the neurological level, helping
(00:43):
them secure deals, command boardrooms, and build lasting
legacies through authentic executive presence. We dive into
topics such as why it's important to create
and share your genesis or origin story with
the world, the importance of creating and following
a vision for your business and how to
do it, The one thing above all else
you need to do to share your leadership
story and leave a legacy and other golden
(01:04):
nuggets of advice.
You're gonna love this show.
Shelley, thank you for making the time to
be on the Idea Climbing podcast. I appreciate
you.
Oh, I appreciate you. Great to be here
today, Mark. And I'm looking I've gotta read
this. I gotta get this right. We're gonna
(01:25):
be talking about how to share your leadership
story and leave a legacy.
But before we get into, you know, the
tips, the tricks, the strategies, everything like that,
when it comes to creating your leadership story,
we'll look at legacy in a minute, but
creating your leadership story, why is that important?
I mean, where did your leadership story begin?
What's your story with that?
(01:46):
You know, the leadership story begins
with all of our origins
of how we do things, And it can
go back to our youth when we're joining,
maybe an orchestra or we're involved in sports.
It's those behavioral studies. It's those stories that
(02:06):
lead and build one on top of the
other that become your legacy, who you are
today and why you lead the way you
do.
So where did you get started? What do
you consider to be your earliest leadership experiences?
Oh, wow. I would have to say
when
I'm not kidding. It goes back to probably
(02:27):
when I was eight or nine years old,
and a group of us put together
a
we put together a neighborhood
newspaper.
Three of us did, three little friends about
the same age, and we included we hosted
a beauty pageant, and we had articles and
recipes that we got from the different neighbors.
And being able to organize that at such
(02:48):
a young age
and actually publish it month after month,
Looking back, I learned a lot about leadership
skills and taking the initiative.
Some of the things I carry forward with
me to today is the idea of
sharing that responsibility and delegating with other people,
whether I was aware of it or not,
(03:09):
or it just naturally happened.
I think that's what made the whole thing
work then, and I think that's what makes
or helps me be a better leader today
is that sharing of ideas and giving people
autonomy to create some of the most innovative
creative ideas.
As an adult, let's say maybe college or
later, what are your first memories of leadership
where you were consciously aware of, okay, I
(03:31):
have a responsibility
as a leader. What did that look like
for you? When did you discover
being consciously aware that, okay. I I am
a leader now. What did that look like?
Probably
in my earlier
career as a costume designer,
the responsibility
of
(03:52):
creating a look,
making sure
the
the costumes, if you will, were at a
place where they could be perceived from the
audience, meaning when that curtain goes up and
this is a very important lesson I learned
early on when that curtain goes up, I
can't be up there and the assistants can't
be up there hemming and sewing.
(04:13):
It's showtime.
And I think that whole idea of it's
showtime
was an early leadership development,
probably turning point for me to realize
I can't do everything. I have to prioritize,
Can't sweat the small stuff.
And lead through that and make sure the
team understands that the work that they're doing
(04:34):
contributes
to that success, to that vision of what
things need to be and that they're not
necessarily failing because they don't get everything done
checked off on the task list.
So as far as let's say newer newer
entrepreneurs,
as far as I'll say stepping into a
leadership role, where does leadership begin
(04:54):
in the business world, especially entrepreneurship?
It's so hard to say where it actually
begins.
If you have an idea
let let's start with the the the, you
know, incubating. You have a great idea
how you strategize
that, how you move forward with that.
(05:16):
That's an innate leadership skill.
I'm going to have a marketing strategy. I'm
going to have a sales strategy. I'm going
to develop my brand this way. Those are
all leadership skills because you're making
really important decisions.
And those stories of how you do that,
that becomes the legacy.
That becomes your your competitive advantage and unique
(05:37):
story to only you.
And the stories are so important because that's
where the money flows. And I'm taking that
from Don Valentine, who of Sequoia
Ventures.
Money
is how it responds to the stories.
That's what people buy into.
That's the journey.
(05:59):
That's I'd love you to dive a little
bit deeper. What what are some components or
a structure? What what makes a great leadership
story? What what should people be sharing
with the world?
The journey,
the mistakes,
those decisions you made. You know what? I'm
going to go with my marketing strategy and
and hire this this team and go forward
(06:20):
with them. And let's say it's a it's
a bomb. Nothing happened. Six months, you spent
thousands of dollars. That's a learning moment. So
what do you do
to compensate for that, to switch gears and
become the success you are today?
So
it's the little things that
sometimes we think are so unimportant.
(06:41):
For example,
I coached a young a young guy who
was,
a very very successful entrepreneur. I mean he
made it to like well over $100,000,000
in his twenties. He was a college dropout
and he created a watch company.
And through social media, which he knew really,
really well, he built this whole company and
(07:02):
sold the organization for
millions and millions of dollars.
After the sale of that company, he came
to me and he said,
I have nothing to talk about. The company
sold. That was my identity.
I don't know what to talk about and
show up now. Who am I? I'm nothing
without that organization.
(07:24):
So what we unpacked together
was the fact that
that journey, whether
it's in the past
or it's current, is part of that story,
is part of that
legacy,
and
identifying with that as an entrepreneur and focusing
in on the little moments,
(07:44):
the pivotal moments, the early days where you
had no followers, let's say,
to the time where you had millions of
followers, to the time where you couldn't
fulfill your first order for your product, to
the time where
you sold hundreds of millions of units.
All those details
are every bit of who you are today
(08:04):
and where you're going tomorrow.
And changing that story and be able to
express that story changed everything for this young
entrepreneur. He's now
running a lot of other businesses based on
that
experience because that's what people want to know.
Tell me more about that. When what kind
of when you say based on that experience,
(08:26):
he was sharing the stories of his trials
and tribulations, then he attracted other business owners.
How did he end up running not not
necessarily running the entire company, of course. I'm
assuming it would be a founder. But how
did he get into that role of being
of doing work with other companies? Was it
because of his story, or did he start
from scratch and start writing a new story
with new companies?
(08:47):
It's the story. How did you do it?
How did Apple happen? We all want to
know the genesis of Steve Jobs. We all
want to know how Nike came to be,
how star some of the biggest brands in
the world. How did Oprah get to be
Oprah?
Not that you're a success today. So it
was the same for this young entrepreneur.
They wanted to know those stories,
(09:10):
the failures, the successes,
the nuanced
moments
where you thought it was over.
And that's what inspires people to go forward
and say, Okay, well, can we try this
here? Or how would we approach this scenario
using some of those ideas and examples? What
would you do right? What would you avoid?
(09:31):
What would you
continue to experiment with?
Right? If we all had a crystal ball,
hey, it would be a hell of a
lot easier. But
that journey is what fascinates people. I mean,
think of a superhero.
Think of any superhero in the Marvel comics.
It's their weaknesses, it's their vulnerabilities,
it's their origin story of how they got
(09:52):
to where they are is what fascinates us,
and why every single movie includes that
in the fact that this person can save
lives and
fly with a cape. It comes from deep,
deep within.
That is
how you embody your voice and your vision
to create that legacy.
(10:14):
That is awesome. And you mentioned trials and
tribulations.
Whether it's yourself, people you know, clients,
what advice do you have when that are
in that growth mode? For lack of a
better term, I'll say, how do you how
do you mentally
keep on keeping on during the dark times?
Because it's one thing to look back and
say, wow. You know, I had these rough
times, but I sold my company for 10,000,000.
(10:36):
That's a different level. When you're in the
trenches, what advice do you have to keep
on keeping on to be a good leader?
I'm going to be honest with you, and
I face this myself.
It's hard to keep the pompoms up every
day all day, and I don't think that's
realistic.
I think
we need to acknowledge some of those difficult
(10:56):
challenges.
But
as a visionary,
keep your eye on that ball. Recognize, Okay,
this isn't working out 100%. It doesn't feel
good.
Accept that. Sit in that.
And honestly,
the vision is what's going to take me
there. That's not gonna hold me back, so
(11:16):
I've acknowledged it. I'm now trudging forward and
keeping my eye
on that goal,
that idea of what it's going to be
because the bigger vision is how you're going
to help people, not sitting in that
sullen moment where you've messed up.
The idea is to accept it, bring make
a part of your story.
(11:37):
You know, they say go out and walk
in nature. I do that a
lot. Just to clear the air, move forward,
and get back on that
road to that
vision.
How do you know when you're on that
road and things get tough and maybe a
couple failures happen, not failures, but learn I'll
say lessons happen.
How do you know when to keep going
down the road and when to shift gears
(11:59):
and say, I don't wanna say giving up.
I'll say shift gears to another project or
something different. How do you determine, you know,
I gotta just keep on and I'll get
to that vision as opposed to, okay, this
is not working. I need a new vision.
How do you tell the difference between those
two?
You know, I don't know that there's a
magic wand for that, but something I work
with my clients that when they're using the
(12:20):
framework
that I work with them on, on being
able to communicate that story, being able to
step into their power and lead with gravitas
and assuredness,
they'll say, this feels weird. This is this
is something strange. And I'll say, yes,
Exactly.
Because if you keep doing the same thing
you're doing over and over again and the
(12:42):
results are the same, well, we all know
that famous quote is the definition of insanity.
You can't change.
So you've got nothing to lose because you
already know what the end result is, just
staying in that path.
And when
that repetition
and the movement
stays flat,
that's when you say I gotta do that's
(13:02):
what I say. Try something new. I I
got nothing to lose. Worst case scenario, it
stays right where it is,
but you can try something new to propel
yourself forward, and that is usually where the
growth and change happens. And it's recognizing that
giving it one, two, three shots after that,
If it's still if you're stagnant,
that's a sign to do something different.
(13:25):
Well, once you get through to switching gears
or staying the staying the course, you you
you're very close to or realizing your vision.
Is legacy something that you look back on
and say, wow. This is my you it's
is it retrospective where you're looking, oh, I
was here. I did this. Or is the
legacy something you're actively building while you're living,
building the legacy? Or like I said, is
(13:47):
it something that you look back on and
create a story in hindsight or a little
bit of both?
It's not creating a story. It's just retelling
something you've experienced.
It's there.
Life is a story. Every day you do
something is a new idea, a new story,
a new experience, a new case study,
a new
(14:08):
data point,
a new white paper.
Those are the ideas that it's important to,
yes, reflect on them and bring them back
into the life going forward. But it's not
a manufactured
thing. It's a truth.
It's a truth that you're
happy to share
to move people forward.
(14:31):
Oh, I like that. Okay. The truth that
you're happy to share and then to move
people forward, is it ins inspiring people or
what when you say people, what are what
people are you referring to? Is it their
employees, their network at large? Again, a little
bit of both. What people are you moving
forward as a leader with your legacy? Yeah.
It's your audience. It could be your client
base. It could be your board of directors.
(14:51):
It could be your employees. It could be
your constituents. I mean, again, I'm going to
go back to some of the greats like
like Steve Jobs. We we're motivated by that
vision.
Many of us went out and bought Apple
products. It was more expensive than the PC
at the time, but we went out because
we wanted that vision. We wanted
(15:12):
to be part of that journey, that bigger
idea.
It wasn't a dollar exchange so much, and
that's
absolutely it. By sharing your legacy,
people are motivated by how you overcame your
obstacles,
how you manage things,
what different things you did that changed the
(15:33):
world for you.
And it's absolutely motivating and encouraging people.
These stories, I mentioned Don Valentine,
you want people to invest in you? You
want people to put their money and time
into your
idea and vision?
Stories are what's going to make that happen,
(15:54):
that legacy,
how you did it,
not necessarily
a bland fact sheet or a feature and
benefit. You can read that on the box
top. Anybody could own that.
But again, as Don Valentine says, and I
think it's so brilliant,
that's how the money works. The money flows
as a function of the story.
(16:16):
And you mentioned motivating people, and Steve Jobs,
obviously, a phenomenal on every level that I
understand, at least through interviews, a great motivator.
Yeah. In order to motivate people,
I'd imagine tell me if I'm on point.
First, you have to get them
I'll say bought in. Or you have to
get them in want get them to want
to be involved with your legacy.
(16:38):
And once they're involved, then, you motivate them.
What do you do to get people involved?
Maybe in the early days because then, you
can motivate them once they're, you know, the
herd is there but how do you build
the herd? How do you get people to
buy into your legacy and your vision in
the first place?
To buy in is sharing those moments.
Sharing those moments
of success, of failure, of trial and error.
(16:59):
It's honest, it's truth. I mentioned that earlier,
and that's what people buy into, that honesty
and truth.
Nothing else.
Absolutely. It's because you build business on trust.
I trust you because you're honest and you're
truthful.
And if you think of every
successful
brand, including individuals
(17:19):
I mean, Martha Stewart, there's a great documentary
out about her journey and her story.
It's incredible how she went up and down.
The woman went to prison
and came out
another success story because of her honesty and
truth.
And that's why people
ramped up and followed her again.
(17:41):
We we
love
that journey,
and that's really important to continually
remind yourself as well as others why am
I doing this. It keeps I believe it
keeps us humble.
I could I could be reading into this,
but I I gotta bring it up.
It sounds like you're saying vulnerability
(18:02):
is part of leadership and so many people
think a leader has to be, you know,
the
the big statue in in the town square,
and they're amazing. And, oh my god, if
I can just get employed by him or
her, it's great. Are you saying that leaders
need to be vulnerable to be effective?
That that ugly word vulnerability that scares people,
I'm rephrasing it as truth and honest and
(18:25):
being humble, so maybe that's a little less
intimidating.
But even at the end of Martha Stewart's
documentary,
she says
she can't be perfect. And her whole vision,
her whole mission in her first
the businesses that got her to Walmart as
a billion dollar industry was perfection.
And she came all this way to realize
(18:46):
it isn't that.
You can't always be perfect.
I mean, that's quite a statement for somebody
who built a brand on perfection. So absolutely,
it is those vulnerable moments, those honest, truthful
moments.
And when and how often should you share
your legacy? Again, is it sharing it
all along the entire journey? Here's where I've
(19:06):
been, you know, being honest and truthful.
Is it once you hit a certain level
of success and you use it to motivate
people, when do you start or when should
how often are you sharing your legacy itself?
Is it once I've made it big and
I sold my company for 10,000,000, now I
have a story to tell? Are you sharing
a story as the story is actually building
itself?
(19:27):
I think as you're building a business, I
mean, I have teams that I work with.
I'm sure you do too, outsource teams, people
that are on salary.
And I share
the learning curve with them in small doses.
And I think we have to be, you
know, discretionary about what we share and to
what capacity.
But if you know your audience and you
(19:48):
know they're ready to hear it.
And you're
onboarding people, you're trying to persuade them with
a new idea,
bringing those moments in
throughout that journey is going to help bring
them on. And it also
you're opening
the door to conversation.
(20:08):
You're letting your people,
your audience,
your board of directors, whoever you're dealing with
know
that this is an open door. We can
have a conversation.
And I want to hear what you have
to say as much as
here's what I want to share with you.
That is really important because at the end
(20:28):
of the day, all of us
just want to be heard.
Oh, that is awesome. It's people in leadership
roles, especially once there's a certain level of
a certain I'll say, like, a number of
people on the team. It's not just like
you and a virtual assistant or something like
that.
To encourage I'll say create.
How do you create
open conversations with people who could be like,
(20:51):
I can't you know, I'll use the v
word, vulnerable.
I'm not sure what I'm doing. I don't
know if I'm gonna hit my goal, whatever
it might be. How do you create an
environment is the word I was looking for.
How do you create an environment
for open and honest conversations when people could
just as easily be fearful of I don't
wanna look back?
One thing I tell my clients to do,
(21:12):
start a meeting
with your story.
Start a meeting with a moment in your
life that changed everything for better or worse.
A personal private moment about your business
as it relates to the business.
I could talk about some of my early
days of coaching,
(21:32):
how
I wasn't sure that the client was getting
what I was delivering. I was probably more
nervous than that client was coming there to
learn confidence
and how to speak up.
And I was shaking, and I was shaking.
And I
really
(21:52):
tried to
focus on the client, but I spent more
time worrying about my own fears,
and I failed that I failed that client.
I did not give them the very best.
I did not serve them in the way
I could.
And by sharing that moment with you,
perhaps
you're saying, Oh, yeah, I've had something like
(22:14):
that,
and here's how I've overcome it.
I'm sharing
a special time
that was a learning moment
that brings you to say,
Shelley's not perfect.
I connect with that.
She's creating a safe space for me to
share as well.
That's how you do it.
(22:35):
That is awesome. And I know there's a
there's a I'm not gonna think of the
exact phrase, but when you become a leader,
a lot of people say, I believe in
it too. A good great
great leaders
develop
other great leaders. When it comes to being
a leader and helping others, how do you
get other people below you
or tangential to you and your network to
(22:56):
as an inspiration?
How do you get them how can you
get them to embrace their legacy and start
sharing their legacy? What does that look like?
Well, it's really important to, again, start those
conversations to let people it's okay. And actually
ask them, how do you feel about this?
What's your defining moment? And let people know
(23:18):
in those meetings, especially when they're when you're
getting status reports and updates about where things
are, for better or worse, and let the
team know. Listen,
let's figure out where the holes were. I
know you're doing a great job, Mark. You've
been holding the fort, but we had a
little downfall over here. We had a setback.
(23:38):
We lost
client A, B, C and D because the
shipment got tangled up. How can we let's
review that and see how I can help
you and how others.
What do you need
to make this a success?
So when you invite those types of conversations,
it's not like you're wrong, you're out of
here and you're fired.
It's
we had a setback.
(23:58):
How do we overcome it? And starting it
that way, building those opportunities, especially in one
on ones and especially in group meetings, acknowledging
the better of the person.
The team did great,
but here's what the challenge is. How can
we overcome this together?
You're building a team. You're building
a group that everybody's trying to rally on
(24:21):
and reach the end goal.
This has been awesome.
And if people are watching or listening, there's
a lot of a lot of nuggets in
there as far as advice. When it comes
to sharing your leadership story and leaving a
legacy,
whether it's reinforcing
something you already said or maybe something you
haven't touched on yet, for viewers, listeners, if
(24:41):
you were to say, look it, when it
comes to sharing your leadership story, like I
said, leaving your legacy.
If you're gonna do at least one thing,
if you wanna do it right, at least
do this one thing, what would you tell
people that one thing would be?
Open your meetings. Start your conversations
with a moment in your journey.
(25:06):
That is beautiful.
Thank you so much. And if people wanna
find you online, where's the best place or
places to go?
Oh, you can find coach Shelly at Remarkable
Speaking on YouTube.
I'm also on LinkedIn, and of course, Remarkable
Speaking website.
This has been excellent. I appreciate you. Thank
you so much for the time.
(25:26):
Thank you, Mark. This has been really a
good conversation.
And
scene.
Thank you for joining us today. I hope
you enjoyed the episode. I also hope that
you'll subscribe to the Idea Climbing podcast and
rate us on iTunes.
Visit ideaclimbing.com
to learn more about Idea Climbing and hear
(25:47):
more episodes about mentoring,
marketing, and big ideas.
Welcome to the Idea Climbing podcast. The epitome
of leadership is the ability to share your
leadership story and leave a legacy.
I discuss how to do that with my
guest, Shelly Goldstein.
Shelly equips visionary leaders with the tools to
communicate boldly,
especially under pressure, having coached over 1,000 executives
(00:22):
and entrepreneurs across five continents.
Her competitive advantage is speed and effectiveness,
delivering a time saving framework for action driven
leaders who can't afford to lose opportunities in
high stakes situations.
As the architect of the remarkable framework and
number one international best selling author, Shelley transforms
how leaders communicate at the neurological level, helping
(00:43):
them secure deals, command boardrooms, and build lasting
legacies through authentic executive presence. We dive into
topics such as why it's important to create
and share your genesis or origin story with
the world, the importance of creating and following
a vision for your business and how to
do it, The one thing above all else
you need to do to share your leadership
story and leave a legacy and other golden
(01:04):
nuggets of advice.
You're gonna love this show.
Shelley, thank you for making the time to
be on the Idea Climbing podcast. I appreciate
you.
Oh, I appreciate you. Great to be here
today, Mark. And I'm looking I've gotta read
this. I gotta get this right. We're gonna
(01:25):
be talking about how to share your leadership
story and leave a legacy.
But before we get into, you know, the
tips, the tricks, the strategies, everything like that,
when it comes to creating your leadership story,
we'll look at legacy in a minute, but
creating your leadership story, why is that important?
I mean, where did your leadership story begin?
What's your story with that?
(01:46):
You know, the leadership story begins
with all of our origins
of how we do things, And it can
go back to our youth when we're joining,
maybe an orchestra or we're involved in sports.
It's those behavioral studies. It's those stories that
(02:06):
lead and build one on top of the
other that become your legacy, who you are
today and why you lead the way you
do.
So where did you get started? What do
you consider to be your earliest leadership experiences?
Oh, wow. I would have to say
when
I'm not kidding. It goes back to probably
(02:27):
when I was eight or nine years old,
and a group of us put together
a
we put together a neighborhood
newspaper.
Three of us did, three little friends about
the same age, and we included we hosted
a beauty pageant, and we had articles and
recipes that we got from the different neighbors.
And being able to organize that at such
(02:48):
a young age
and actually publish it month after month,
Looking back, I learned a lot about leadership
skills and taking the initiative.
Some of the things I carry forward with
me to today is the idea of
sharing that responsibility and delegating with other people,
whether I was aware of it or not,
(03:09):
or it just naturally happened.
I think that's what made the whole thing
work then, and I think that's what makes
or helps me be a better leader today
is that sharing of ideas and giving people
autonomy to create some of the most innovative
creative ideas.
As an adult, let's say maybe college or
later, what are your first memories of leadership
where you were consciously aware of, okay, I
(03:31):
have a responsibility
as a leader. What did that look like
for you? When did you discover
being consciously aware that, okay. I I am
a leader now. What did that look like?
Probably
in my earlier
career as a costume designer,
the responsibility
of
(03:52):
creating a look,
making sure
the
the costumes, if you will, were at a
place where they could be perceived from the
audience, meaning when that curtain goes up and
this is a very important lesson I learned
early on when that curtain goes up, I
can't be up there and the assistants can't
be up there hemming and sewing.
(04:13):
It's showtime.
And I think that whole idea of it's
showtime
was an early leadership development,
probably turning point for me to realize
I can't do everything. I have to prioritize,
Can't sweat the small stuff.
And lead through that and make sure the
team understands that the work that they're doing
(04:34):
contributes
to that success, to that vision of what
things need to be and that they're not
necessarily failing because they don't get everything done
checked off on the task list.
So as far as let's say newer newer
entrepreneurs,
as far as I'll say stepping into a
leadership role, where does leadership begin
(04:54):
in the business world, especially entrepreneurship?
It's so hard to say where it actually
begins.
If you have an idea
let let's start with the the the, you
know, incubating. You have a great idea
how you strategize
that, how you move forward with that.
(05:16):
That's an innate leadership skill.
I'm going to have a marketing strategy. I'm
going to have a sales strategy. I'm going
to develop my brand this way. Those are
all leadership skills because you're making
really important decisions.
And those stories of how you do that,
that becomes the legacy.
That becomes your your competitive advantage and unique
(05:37):
story to only you.
And the stories are so important because that's
where the money flows. And I'm taking that
from Don Valentine, who of Sequoia
Ventures.
Money
is how it responds to the stories.
That's what people buy into.
That's the journey.
(05:59):
That's I'd love you to dive a little
bit deeper. What what are some components or
a structure? What what makes a great leadership
story? What what should people be sharing
with the world?
The journey,
the mistakes,
those decisions you made. You know what? I'm
going to go with my marketing strategy and
and hire this this team and go forward
(06:20):
with them. And let's say it's a it's
a bomb. Nothing happened. Six months, you spent
thousands of dollars. That's a learning moment. So
what do you do
to compensate for that, to switch gears and
become the success you are today?
So
it's the little things that
sometimes we think are so unimportant.
(06:41):
For example,
I coached a young a young guy who
was,
a very very successful entrepreneur. I mean he
made it to like well over $100,000,000
in his twenties. He was a college dropout
and he created a watch company.
And through social media, which he knew really,
really well, he built this whole company and
(07:02):
sold the organization for
millions and millions of dollars.
After the sale of that company, he came
to me and he said,
I have nothing to talk about. The company
sold. That was my identity.
I don't know what to talk about and
show up now. Who am I? I'm nothing
without that organization.
(07:24):
So what we unpacked together
was the fact that
that journey, whether
it's in the past
or it's current, is part of that story,
is part of that
legacy,
and
identifying with that as an entrepreneur and focusing
in on the little moments,
(07:44):
the pivotal moments, the early days where you
had no followers, let's say,
to the time where you had millions of
followers, to the time where you couldn't
fulfill your first order for your product, to
the time where
you sold hundreds of millions of units.
All those details
are every bit of who you are today
(08:04):
and where you're going tomorrow.
And changing that story and be able to
express that story changed everything for this young
entrepreneur. He's now
running a lot of other businesses based on
that
experience because that's what people want to know.
Tell me more about that. When what kind
of when you say based on that experience,
(08:26):
he was sharing the stories of his trials
and tribulations, then he attracted other business owners.
How did he end up running not not
necessarily running the entire company, of course. I'm
assuming it would be a founder. But how
did he get into that role of being
of doing work with other companies? Was it
because of his story, or did he start
from scratch and start writing a new story
with new companies?
(08:47):
It's the story. How did you do it?
How did Apple happen? We all want to
know the genesis of Steve Jobs. We all
want to know how Nike came to be,
how star some of the biggest brands in
the world. How did Oprah get to be
Oprah?
Not that you're a success today. So it
was the same for this young entrepreneur.
They wanted to know those stories,
(09:10):
the failures, the successes,
the nuanced
moments
where you thought it was over.
And that's what inspires people to go forward
and say, Okay, well, can we try this
here? Or how would we approach this scenario
using some of those ideas and examples? What
would you do right? What would you avoid?
(09:31):
What would you
continue to experiment with?
Right? If we all had a crystal ball,
hey, it would be a hell of a
lot easier. But
that journey is what fascinates people. I mean,
think of a superhero.
Think of any superhero in the Marvel comics.
It's their weaknesses, it's their vulnerabilities,
it's their origin story of how they got
(09:52):
to where they are is what fascinates us,
and why every single movie includes that
in the fact that this person can save
lives and
fly with a cape. It comes from deep,
deep within.
That is
how you embody your voice and your vision
to create that legacy.
(10:14):
That is awesome. And you mentioned trials and
tribulations.
Whether it's yourself, people you know, clients,
what advice do you have when that are
in that growth mode? For lack of a
better term, I'll say, how do you how
do you mentally
keep on keeping on during the dark times?
Because it's one thing to look back and
say, wow. You know, I had these rough
times, but I sold my company for 10,000,000.
(10:36):
That's a different level. When you're in the
trenches, what advice do you have to keep
on keeping on to be a good leader?
I'm going to be honest with you, and
I face this myself.
It's hard to keep the pompoms up every
day all day, and I don't think that's
realistic.
I think
we need to acknowledge some of those difficult
(10:56):
challenges.
But
as a visionary,
keep your eye on that ball. Recognize, Okay,
this isn't working out 100%. It doesn't feel
good.
Accept that. Sit in that.
And honestly,
the vision is what's going to take me
there. That's not gonna hold me back, so
(11:16):
I've acknowledged it. I'm now trudging forward and
keeping my eye
on that goal,
that idea of what it's going to be
because the bigger vision is how you're going
to help people, not sitting in that
sullen moment where you've messed up.
The idea is to accept it, bring make
a part of your story.
(11:37):
You know, they say go out and walk
in nature. I do that a
lot. Just to clear the air, move forward,
and get back on that
road to that
vision.
How do you know when you're on that
road and things get tough and maybe a
couple failures happen, not failures, but learn I'll
say lessons happen.
How do you know when to keep going
down the road and when to shift gears
(11:59):
and say, I don't wanna say giving up.
I'll say shift gears to another project or
something different. How do you determine, you know,
I gotta just keep on and I'll get
to that vision as opposed to, okay, this
is not working. I need a new vision.
How do you tell the difference between those
two?
You know, I don't know that there's a
magic wand for that, but something I work
with my clients that when they're using the
(12:20):
framework
that I work with them on, on being
able to communicate that story, being able to
step into their power and lead with gravitas
and assuredness,
they'll say, this feels weird. This is this
is something strange. And I'll say, yes,
Exactly.
Because if you keep doing the same thing
you're doing over and over again and the
(12:42):
results are the same, well, we all know
that famous quote is the definition of insanity.
You can't change.
So you've got nothing to lose because you
already know what the end result is, just
staying in that path.
And when
that repetition
and the movement
stays flat,
that's when you say I gotta do that's
(13:02):
what I say. Try something new. I I
got nothing to lose. Worst case scenario, it
stays right where it is,
but you can try something new to propel
yourself forward, and that is usually where the
growth and change happens. And it's recognizing that
giving it one, two, three shots after that,
If it's still if you're stagnant,
that's a sign to do something different.
(13:25):
Well, once you get through to switching gears
or staying the staying the course, you you
you're very close to or realizing your vision.
Is legacy something that you look back on
and say, wow. This is my you it's
is it retrospective where you're looking, oh, I
was here. I did this. Or is the
legacy something you're actively building while you're living,
building the legacy? Or like I said, is
(13:47):
it something that you look back on and
create a story in hindsight or a little
bit of both?
It's not creating a story. It's just retelling
something you've experienced.
It's there.
Life is a story. Every day you do
something is a new idea, a new story,
a new experience, a new case study,
a new
(14:08):
data point,
a new white paper.
Those are the ideas that it's important to,
yes, reflect on them and bring them back
into the life going forward. But it's not
a manufactured
thing. It's a truth.
It's a truth that you're
happy to share
to move people forward.
(14:31):
Oh, I like that. Okay. The truth that
you're happy to share and then to move
people forward, is it ins inspiring people or
what when you say people, what are what
people are you referring to? Is it their
employees, their network at large? Again, a little
bit of both. What people are you moving
forward as a leader with your legacy? Yeah.
It's your audience. It could be your client
base. It could be your board of directors.
(14:51):
It could be your employees. It could be
your constituents. I mean, again, I'm going to
go back to some of the greats like
like Steve Jobs. We we're motivated by that
vision.
Many of us went out and bought Apple
products. It was more expensive than the PC
at the time, but we went out because
we wanted that vision. We wanted
(15:12):
to be part of that journey, that bigger
idea.
It wasn't a dollar exchange so much, and
that's
absolutely it. By sharing your legacy,
people are motivated by how you overcame your
obstacles,
how you manage things,
what different things you did that changed the
(15:33):
world for you.
And it's absolutely motivating and encouraging people.
These stories, I mentioned Don Valentine,
you want people to invest in you? You
want people to put their money and time
into your
idea and vision?
Stories are what's going to make that happen,
(15:54):
that legacy,
how you did it,
not necessarily
a bland fact sheet or a feature and
benefit. You can read that on the box
top. Anybody could own that.
But again, as Don Valentine says, and I
think it's so brilliant,
that's how the money works. The money flows
as a function of the story.
(16:16):
And you mentioned motivating people, and Steve Jobs,
obviously, a phenomenal on every level that I
understand, at least through interviews, a great motivator.
Yeah. In order to motivate people,
I'd imagine tell me if I'm on point.
First, you have to get them
I'll say bought in. Or you have to
get them in want get them to want
to be involved with your legacy.
(16:38):
And once they're involved, then, you motivate them.
What do you do to get people involved?
Maybe in the early days because then, you
can motivate them once they're, you know, the
herd is there but how do you build
the herd? How do you get people to
buy into your legacy and your vision in
the first place?
To buy in is sharing those moments.
Sharing those moments
of success, of failure, of trial and error.
(16:59):
It's honest, it's truth. I mentioned that earlier,
and that's what people buy into, that honesty
and truth.
Nothing else.
Absolutely. It's because you build business on trust.
I trust you because you're honest and you're
truthful.
And if you think of every
successful
brand, including individuals
(17:19):
I mean, Martha Stewart, there's a great documentary
out about her journey and her story.
It's incredible how she went up and down.
The woman went to prison
and came out
another success story because of her honesty and
truth.
And that's why people
ramped up and followed her again.
(17:41):
We we
love
that journey,
and that's really important to continually
remind yourself as well as others why am
I doing this. It keeps I believe it
keeps us humble.
I could I could be reading into this,
but I I gotta bring it up.
It sounds like you're saying vulnerability
(18:02):
is part of leadership and so many people
think a leader has to be, you know,
the
the big statue in in the town square,
and they're amazing. And, oh my god, if
I can just get employed by him or
her, it's great. Are you saying that leaders
need to be vulnerable to be effective?
That that ugly word vulnerability that scares people,
I'm rephrasing it as truth and honest and
(18:25):
being humble, so maybe that's a little less
intimidating.
But even at the end of Martha Stewart's
documentary,
she says
she can't be perfect. And her whole vision,
her whole mission in her first
the businesses that got her to Walmart as
a billion dollar industry was perfection.
And she came all this way to realize
(18:46):
it isn't that.
You can't always be perfect.
I mean, that's quite a statement for somebody
who built a brand on perfection. So absolutely,
it is those vulnerable moments, those honest, truthful
moments.
And when and how often should you share
your legacy? Again, is it sharing it
all along the entire journey? Here's where I've
(19:06):
been, you know, being honest and truthful.
Is it once you hit a certain level
of success and you use it to motivate
people, when do you start or when should
how often are you sharing your legacy itself?
Is it once I've made it big and
I sold my company for 10,000,000, now I
have a story to tell? Are you sharing
a story as the story is actually building
itself?
(19:27):
I think as you're building a business, I
mean, I have teams that I work with.
I'm sure you do too, outsource teams, people
that are on salary.
And I share
the learning curve with them in small doses.
And I think we have to be, you
know, discretionary about what we share and to
what capacity.
But if you know your audience and you
(19:48):
know they're ready to hear it.
And you're
onboarding people, you're trying to persuade them with
a new idea,
bringing those moments in
throughout that journey is going to help bring
them on. And it also
you're opening
the door to conversation.
(20:08):
You're letting your people,
your audience,
your board of directors, whoever you're dealing with
know
that this is an open door. We can
have a conversation.
And I want to hear what you have
to say as much as
here's what I want to share with you.
That is really important because at the end
(20:28):
of the day, all of us
just want to be heard.
Oh, that is awesome. It's people in leadership
roles, especially once there's a certain level of
a certain I'll say, like, a number of
people on the team. It's not just like
you and a virtual assistant or something like
that.
To encourage I'll say create.
How do you create
open conversations with people who could be like,
(20:51):
I can't you know, I'll use the v
word, vulnerable.
I'm not sure what I'm doing. I don't
know if I'm gonna hit my goal, whatever
it might be. How do you create an
environment is the word I was looking for.
How do you create an environment
for open and honest conversations when people could
just as easily be fearful of I don't
wanna look back?
One thing I tell my clients to do,
(21:12):
start a meeting
with your story.
Start a meeting with a moment in your
life that changed everything for better or worse.
A personal private moment about your business
as it relates to the business.
I could talk about some of my early
days of coaching,
(21:32):
how
I wasn't sure that the client was getting
what I was delivering. I was probably more
nervous than that client was coming there to
learn confidence
and how to speak up.
And I was shaking, and I was shaking.
And I
really
(21:52):
tried to
focus on the client, but I spent more
time worrying about my own fears,
and I failed that I failed that client.
I did not give them the very best.
I did not serve them in the way
I could.
And by sharing that moment with you,
perhaps
you're saying, Oh, yeah, I've had something like
(22:14):
that,
and here's how I've overcome it.
I'm sharing
a special time
that was a learning moment
that brings you to say,
Shelley's not perfect.
I connect with that.
She's creating a safe space for me to
share as well.
That's how you do it.
(22:35):
That is awesome. And I know there's a
there's a I'm not gonna think of the
exact phrase, but when you become a leader,
a lot of people say, I believe in
it too. A good great
great leaders
develop
other great leaders. When it comes to being
a leader and helping others, how do you
get other people below you
or tangential to you and your network to
(22:56):
as an inspiration?
How do you get them how can you
get them to embrace their legacy and start
sharing their legacy? What does that look like?
Well, it's really important to, again, start those
conversations to let people it's okay. And actually
ask them, how do you feel about this?
What's your defining moment? And let people know
(23:18):
in those meetings, especially when they're when you're
getting status reports and updates about where things
are, for better or worse, and let the
team know. Listen,
let's figure out where the holes were. I
know you're doing a great job, Mark. You've
been holding the fort, but we had a
little downfall over here. We had a setback.
(23:38):
We lost
client A, B, C and D because the
shipment got tangled up. How can we let's
review that and see how I can help
you and how others.
What do you need
to make this a success?
So when you invite those types of conversations,
it's not like you're wrong, you're out of
here and you're fired.
It's
we had a setback.
(23:58):
How do we overcome it? And starting it
that way, building those opportunities, especially in one
on ones and especially in group meetings, acknowledging
the better of the person.
The team did great,
but here's what the challenge is. How can
we overcome this together?
You're building a team. You're building
a group that everybody's trying to rally on
(24:21):
and reach the end goal.
This has been awesome.
And if people are watching or listening, there's
a lot of a lot of nuggets in
there as far as advice. When it comes
to sharing your leadership story and leaving a
legacy,
whether it's reinforcing
something you already said or maybe something you
haven't touched on yet, for viewers, listeners, if
(24:41):
you were to say, look it, when it
comes to sharing your leadership story, like I
said, leaving your legacy.
If you're gonna do at least one thing,
if you wanna do it right, at least
do this one thing, what would you tell
people that one thing would be?
Open your meetings. Start your conversations
with a moment in your journey.
(25:06):
That is beautiful.
Thank you so much. And if people wanna
find you online, where's the best place or
places to go?
Oh, you can find coach Shelly at Remarkable
Speaking on YouTube.
I'm also on LinkedIn, and of course, Remarkable
Speaking website.
This has been excellent. I appreciate you. Thank
you so much for the time.
(25:26):
Thank you, Mark. This has been really a
good conversation.
And
scene.
Thank you for joining us today. I hope
you enjoyed the episode. I also hope that
you'll subscribe to the Idea Climbing podcast and
rate us on iTunes.
Visit ideaclimbing.com
to learn more about Idea Climbing and hear
(25:47):
more episodes about mentoring,
marketing, and big ideas.
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