March 2, 2023 • 50 mins
Peter Rork is a retired orthopedic surgeon and co-founder and pilot for Dog is My CoPilot. In this episode, Peter shares his inspiring journey of finding purpose in his life after his wife passed away.
In 2012, he teamed up with Judy Zimet, a Scottsdale real estate attorney and animal lover, to start Dog Is My CoPilot. Over the past decade, Dog is My CoPilot has grown from flying 20-30 pets at a time to now rescuing 1,000 dogs and cats a month all across the country.
Peter and Stephan talk about the dedication of the volunteers at the animal shelters and the hard work and logistics that goes into transporting hundreds of animals at a time. In 2023, their volunteer pilot team has grown, and they now have ten pilots helping to fly their rescue missions.
Dog is My CoPilot works collaboratively with city shelters, local animal welfare organizations, and individuals to save the lives of pets abandoned in animal shelters. They reduce animal euthanasia in overcrowded shelters by ensuring that each pet has the chance to find a safe and loving home.
Find out more about Peter and Dog is My CoPilot at dogcopilot.org
This week's episode is supported in part by Teton County Solid Waste and Recycling, reminding businesses of Teton County’s “Curb to Compost” Program for food waste collection; an important next step in your restaurant’s recycling program. More at TetonCountyWY.gov or at @RoadToZeroWaste.JH on Instagram.
Support also comes from Compass Real Estate, the region's largest and most dynamic real estate company in the valley. For more information and to view current listings visit COMPASS.com or at @compassjacksonhole
Want to be a guest on The Jackson Hole Connection? Email us at connect@thejacksonholeconnection.com. Marketing and editing support by Michael Moeri (michaelmoeri.com)
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
You are tuned into the Jackson hole,connection, sharing, fascinating stories
of people connected to Jackson Hole.
I am truly grateful for each ofyou for tuning in today and support
for this podcast comes from:
Today I'm gonna beginthe episode with a quote.
This one is not an original by melike I've done the past few weeks.
(00:22):
Here we go.
What lies behind us and whatlies before us are tiny matters
compared to what lies within us.
That's from Oliver Wendell Holmes.
I pulled that quote from the book,seven Habits of Highly Effective People,
which we've probably all read, but.
if you haven't read it or peruse throughit recently, I recommend picking up that
(00:45):
book, once a year and or a few timesa year just to reference some of the
information that Stephen Covey has inthere can always help us and remind us
of what our purpose is and, why we doand how to accomplish what we want to.
And today you are listeningto episode number 231.
(01:06):
My guest today is Dr.
Peter Rourke and Dr.
Rourke.
is one of the foundersof Dog is my co-pilot.
After tragedy struck Peter.
He found himself in a really dark,place in life, and a good friend of his
suggested that Peter find a purpose.
And I would say that Peter certainlyfound a purpose that he certainly found.
(01:29):
And which is to savedogs from kill shelters.
It took some time to figure itout, but he, he did figure it out.
And dog is, my co-pilot hassaved thousands of dogs now.
They fly cats as well.
And they started off with onelittle plane, which Peter's gonna
talk about the growth of dog as myco-pilot, the nonprofit, growth of
(01:51):
one plane based in one community.
To now two planes based in twodifferent cities around the country.
And guess what?
They're getting ready to addanother plane and another community
which they serve, in this country.
So they're gonna be covering quite a bitof the country, by the end of this year.
as Peter shares with ustoday, be a part of the.
(02:13):
And that can be applied toany problem you may find.
Peter shares how you can be part of thesolution and why having some faith and
great partners will build success withtime determination and lots of hard work.
Peter thank you for joining me heretoday at the Jackson Hole Connection
I'm delighted to find you on the groundand be able to have some of your time
(02:36):
Well, thank you for having me.
S.
You're very welcome And Peter Ilove learning people's history
and
background and I'd love for you to startoff by sharing where is it that you were
raised and are you a native of JacksonAnd if not where how did you land here
Uh, my children are natives,but I am anything but I was born
(03:01):
and raised in, uh, Northern NewJersey in a New York City suburb.
, it's a community where peoplewere either on their way up
or down the economic ladder.
Ladder.
So we had a broad cross section of things.
My father was an only childand wanted a big family.
Uh, so I was one of seven.
So, uh, and he liked to take abig family vacation every year.
(03:23):
So when I was about 10 years old, weall piled up a piled into the Rambler
Ambassador Station wagon with the bass.
And, uh, he says, gonna go check outsome of these, uh, parks in the West.
So we went to Estees, Rocky MountainNational Park, grand Teton, Yellowstone.
(03:43):
Drove up to Glacier, up to BanCanada, and it changed my world.
I mean, I, I couldn't figure outwhy anybody would wanna, anywhere
but in the Rocky Mountains and, uh,I mean, I was completely smitten.
So at that point I started plottingmy escape and, being the youngest
of the four boys in the family, myfather had gone to Rutgers College,
(04:07):
which was a men's school, and somy three older brothers did not.
So it fell upon me to, to go.
So I, I did my undergradat Rutgers College.
I'd had enough in New Jersey atthat time, so I moved all the way to
Baltimore to go to medical school.
not that far away, but you know,
Mm-hmm
say it's, uh, it's like an outhouse.
(04:27):
You want it close enough for theconvenience, but far enough away
that you don't get the smell.
So . So, um, after I finishedmedical school, I matched to
the University of New Mexico inAlbuquerque and, did my internship
in residency in, uh, orthopedic.
. I then followed that with a hand surgeryfellowship at the Good Sam Hospital
(04:50):
in Phoenix, and then a knee surgeryfellowship in South Lake Tahoe with,
uh, Richard Sedman, who passed away.
Russ in peace.
got a job offer to practice in SunValley, Idaho, and I just was absolutely.
moved to Sun Valley, had mountains,aspen trees, the ski area, everything
(05:11):
I was looking for, and I just figureout what was wrong with the place.
And it, it took me a couple years andit, uh, sun Valley is, it's really an
LA suburb it's a, it's a ski resortthat built a small mountain town.
And
Hmm
After four years, I waslooking for my escape.
(05:34):
So moved over to, Jackson when patientsfrom Jackson started seeing me in Sun
Valley because the three orthopedicsurgeons who were practicing in
Jackson all left at the same time.
Some political, you know, confrontationwith the hospital administrator.
And honestly, I, I have yet to.
on an airplane flight when they,the stewards rings a button, excuse
(05:57):
me, we have a medical emergency.
Is there a hospitaladministrator on board?
You know, that just, thatjust doesn't happen anyway.
So they always look at us as thesource of the problems, and yet
we're the, we're the solution.
So I moved to Jacksonin the spring of 1990.
moved there with my wife, SQUI.
. And then, uh, we had two children,born, and they were born and raised.
(06:19):
One in the old hospital,one in the new hospital.
Uh, started building my practice and,um, just really, really loved it.
I felt I was at home.
I was at home and, so worked really hard.
I, worked hard for thecommunity and the community.
exceptionally good to I mean,it was, uh, a good relationship.
(06:42):
And one of the things they teachyou, what they never teach you in
medical school is how to say no.
So, you know, you get a call, you're inthe ER to go see your patient, uh, even
if you're not on call, I mean, that's,that's just, that's kind of old school.
You don't see a lot of that now.
. But, uh, that's, that's how I practice.
So I practice until, unfortunatelysquirrel and I went our, kind of
(07:06):
our separate ways, remained greatfriends, two children to raise and
we raised them together very well.
and then, uh, remarried.
And, two months later, my wifepassed away of a cardiac arrest and
ohh
It was brutal.
Yeah.
That it absolutely crushed me.
And that was in May of 2012 and,I just walked out of the office.
(07:28):
That was it.
I, I quit medicine and I retreatedto my lake house up in Montana.
And I mean, there were mornings Iwould make a pot of coffee, down and,
uh, with the coffee mug in my hand,and look up in the sun is setting.
I'm going, what the hell just happened?
I mean, That grief can be soconsuming and if, and hopefully
(07:50):
you'll never experience it.
But sadly, we all do andeveryone handles it differently.
But, uh, I mean, I had, youknow, it just, it destroyed me.
we had a mutual friend, my wife and I, whocalled me after a couple months and said,
, you know, Meg would want you to be happy.
She wants you to be happy, soyou need to knock that shit off.
(08:10):
I thought, okay, been a number ofmonths, um, you never really get over it.
You know, I'm still, she's still inthe back of my head mourning her and,
but, , I, been a pilot before I wentto medical school and worked my way
through medical school, teaching,flying, and doing, charter work.
(08:30):
I'd seen tours over the ChesapeakeBay, the, so I was familiar with
aviation, had my own aircraft.
I had done a couple rescue flights,uh, with my wife Meg, and it was kind
of a one dog, one location, one time.
and then you move on to the next flight.
There's an organizationcalled Pilots and Paws.
And really these are a bunch ofpilots who are using the dog as
(08:52):
an excuse to go fly the airplane.
but you know, honestly, for that, forthat dog, I mean, it's a game changer.
It changes their world.
So, you know, how can youargue against that except that
it not very cost effective.
So, I started with that model andthen Animal Adoption center in
Jackson wanted to start flyingdogs in from San Francisco.
Marty Watts runs San Francisco asPCA a and they wanted me to fly
(09:16):
them in and I thought, perfect.
All right, I'll do that.
So we, we can do a flight everyother week or however you want to.
So I flew out to San Francisco, met MartyWatts, and Marty had nice lunch out for
us and we chit chatted and Gibber javery.
And then she was sittingthere just kind of studying.
. And then after lunch he pulledme aside and said, I have a big,
(09:38):
uh, a bigger mission for you.
said, uh, these folks inJackson, yeah, that's great,
but they don't need your help.
The way this woman needs your help.
Her name is Sharon Lowman.
She's in Merced, California, which isin the Central Valley of California.
I would love for you togo down and meet her.
So I flew down the nextday and, met Sharon at the.
(09:59):
She walked me throughthe municipal shelter.
Now Sharon runs a, a private organizationcalled New Beginnings, these folks
are, were desperate to save animals.
They would go into the municipal shelter,they would find the most readily adoptable
animals, and they would put 'em in acrate, put 'em in a van, and drive 'em
to Seattle, Missoula, Boise, Spokane,salt Lake City, Denver, you name.
(10:22):
and these are like 16 hour trips andthey're taking 20, 25 dogs at a time.
And for any of you who have everbeen involved in animal transport,
you know that dog gets in the crateand the dog gets out of the crate
when it gets to its destination.
You don't stop every threehours and let 'em out and pee.
So it's brutal.
really
tough on everybody and there'san incredible sense of urgency
(10:45):
on the part of the drivers.
, they can't stop.
They, they don't, they can't stop andrest and check into a hotel overnight
or whatever, and then they get thereand turn around and drive back.
and the municipal shelter atthat time was euthanizing.
94% of all the animals that cameinto the shelter completely overrun.
(11:08):
And they didn't have an outlet.
, I mean, the dogs are comingin, people aren't going to the
shelter to, to adopt the dog.
Uh, a lot of owner surrendersmostly picked up as strays.
uh, I said, I can do that flightfor you in about four hours.
All right, let me take over for you.
So I was flying a, a small sixseater aircraft at the time,
(11:30):
Sessna 2 0 6, a capable air.
. but the size is, is rather limited.
And I could put in 20 or 25 smallcrates, you know, like chihuahuas
or min pens or cats or whatever.
And sadly, the, the big dogs were beingleft behind because if I put two of
the larger crates in, I would bulk out.
And now there's no more room.
(11:52):
Now it wasn't, it wasn't a weight issue,it was the size of the crate issue,
Mm-hmm
I struggled with that.
a couple of years, and then Iabsolutely knew I had to scale up.
So, the aircraft that I hadin mind was a Cessna caravan.
It's, it's what the FedExuses for hauling the freight.
You've seen 'em, the singleengine, high wing aircraft with a
(12:13):
turbine engine on the front, and.
I, I went looking for one, and Imean, they cost $3 million a copy.
And, you know, we didn'thave that kind of money and I
didn't have that kind of money.
so I hired a broker.
looked and looked and lookedand looked, uh, all the aircraft
that were in our price range,like got seven figures a million.
(12:34):
had either been, you know, crashed intoa lake and repaired, or, I mean, they,
they had terrible histories with thesethings so he found one up in Canada and a
mining company that was shutting down itsflight operations and they would fly it
in and out of the old backcountry strips.
And when I saw it, I mean, the paint'schipping off of it, mean, got dents all
(12:56):
over it from the rocks on the runway, theinterior, the ceiling is falling down.
The ceiling and yourgrandfather's Oldsmobile.
I mean, it was just,
in terrible shape.
But in Canada, they are very specificabout their maintenance on the aircraft.
So we went through the maintenance log.
mechanical condition, complete eyesore.
(13:18):
I said perfect
The
The dogs don't care.
, I don't care.
The only thing I care about iswhat's forward of that firewall,
you know, keep that turbinespinning and keeping me in the air.
So the, the next thing I, I hadto come up with the money and so I
mortgaged my house, gave the milliondollars to the nonprofit as a loan
(13:39):
any plan on how to get it back.
But I didn't care.
I figured this is the right next step.
So Suddenly we're, we're going fromflying from 20 animals at a time
to up to 200 animals at a time.
. And that in that created levels ofnew ways to make mistakes . And so
(14:00):
no one group can take 200 animals.
So you either have four or fivegroups, or four or five destinations,
or a combination of both.
So now I'm leaving the rightdog at the wrong airport, the
wrong dog at the right airport.
It's really,
Oh
God
it figured out now we have it, we haveit, uh, we have it, um, all ironed out.
(14:20):
know, it was interesting.
The other thing that I found was thatwhen you're loading up the airplane
and you close the door, have like150 or 200 panting dogs in there.
A lot of hot breath.
All the windows fog upand all the instruments.
I mean, think the backseat ofthe Toyota, uh, the Volkswagen
Bug high school prom night.
(14:40):
All right.
You know, I'm talking about Sowe had to carry handkerchiefs and
towels to wipe everything down and.
. But once we get up to altitude, youknow, things cool off and that's
no longer a problem cuz it startsfreezing on the windows and such.
I did that for a couple yearsand then, um, we get a phone call
from, uh, the Petco Corporation,their, their foundation arm.
(15:03):
And, uh, they said, oh, been,we've been watching you.
I said, great.
And they kept asking endlessquestions, endless que and I
didn't even know where it was.
. And, uh, so finally at the end, thegal says, well, uh, no more questions.
And, and I was really cheeky at thatpoint, and I said, are you sure?
Not even one more question?
And she
(15:23):
Yes
I'm good.
I said, oh, so what can we do for you?
She says, well, we're gonna give you theLove and Action Award for Petco, and we're
gonna grant you a quarter million dollars.
And my jaw just.
Kara Pollard, who is theexecutive director who, who
is, uh, do you know Kara?
Do you know where Kara and Mark Mark runs?
(15:44):
O s m in, uh, Jackson.
In anything?
I might know them Yeah.
Kara, it's just a sweetheart.
She, she's everything that I'm not,you know, I'm Imre, I'm rude, I'm short
with people and she's just the opposite.
So, she started crying andI thought, wow, this is.
. So now that allowed me, and up tothis point I'm flying five or six
(16:08):
days a week myself doing all therescue flights, I'm getting a little
burned out to, to be quite honest.
And I wanted to be home with my dogs.
So, it allowed me to go out andbring on a couple new pilots.
And these are all volunteer pilots, butit costs about 10,000 bucks per pilot.
To train them every year andthrough recurrent training
(16:31):
the insurance requirements.
the caravan is a simple airplane to fly.
I mean, it, it's big, it's slow, andit's noth nothing happens really quickly.
It's got a turbine enginewater power, a lot.
It's very roomy comparedto the other aircraft.
And so the, the pilots, uh,were more than happy to fly it.
So did that for a couple years.
Then I started thinking, Wecan't keep up with the demand.
(16:54):
So I'm thinking we have to, wehave to get another airplane.
So we started
Hmm
looking and started looking and my,my board, and we had just recently,
it took seven years to pay off aloan . So we had, board in their infant
wisdom said, okay, no more loans.
We're gonna pay cash for this next.
Now cost of everything goes up.
(17:15):
And so we finally found anaircraft for, close to 2 million.
And uh, Kara went out there andreally beat the bushes and she and
I worked hard raising the money andwe were able to raise the funds.
now we have two caravans and wehave, a dozen volunteer pilots
flying for the organization.
We fly from March until, . because duringthe winter, I mean, when you, when you
(17:39):
think about it, you're flying a singleengine engine airplane during the winter
over the Rocky Mountains, could go wrong?
. know, it's just,
How much
Exactly.
so now, you look at our map and itlooks like a map of Southwest Airlines.
I mean, we're, we're national and.
. Oh
We, we still kind of struggledfinancially and then, I mean, the greatest
(18:03):
thing in the world happened to us.
I got a call from Connor Knightonwho from CBS Sunday morning, and
he says, I wanna do a piece on you.
And I said, are you kidding me?
I mean, I grew up watching Charles Caral.
I mean, I would just, I wouldlove to be on that program.
And it took him a couple years to getpast his, uh, board back in New York.
But we finally shot the.
(18:24):
and it put us on the nationalmap and allowed e expanded our
fundraising because, we're a 5 01 and we never charge, we never
charge our senders or the receivers.
we offer these, these gifts for free.
I mean, it's not a gift.
I mean, we're in transportation.
and honestly, uh, people say,wow, that's really great.
(18:45):
You're a hero.
I'm going, no, I'm not.
You know, I'm a bus driver.
You know, the real heroes are the oneswho walk into those shelters every
single day and deal with those animals,cleaning out the stalls, changing
the water, exercising them, groomingthem, teaching them leash training.
Uh, simple voice commands, tryingto get them ready for adoption
(19:07):
because that's really the onlyoption a lot of these places have.
So now we have about a hundred partners.
We fly basically from the south tothe north the farther south you go in
the United States, the worse it is.
The farther north yougo, the better it is.
Jackson dog.
, Portland, Seattle, Spokane.
(19:30):
Boise.
I mean, these are all placeswhere the, and we fly the dogs in.
They're gone in a couple days.
So we're constantlyflying the same routes.
And basically we have the samerepeating flight schedule.
and it repeats over a, atwo or three week period.
And I'll give you an exampleof, of what, what I would do.
jump in the airplane.
(19:50):
I fly down to Hobbs, New Mexico.
spend the night load up at four30 in the morning, when it's
nice and cool for the dogs.
And, wheels up by about 5, 5 30.
First stop would be Denver.
second stop would.
Fort Collins.
Third stop would be Rock Springs.
(20:10):
Fourth stop would be Salt Lake City.
And then boom down to El Paso.
Spend the night, repeat.
Get up.
Start loading at four 30 in the morning.
Fly the dogs to Troutdaleor Portland, Oregon.
to Seattle to Spokane Walla Wall.
Boise, Missoula and then back.
(20:32):
And so it's a, that's a three day trip.
A lot of flying, about10 or 12 hours a day.
Sometimes weather cansometimes be an issue.
But we're all, air at tpairline transport pilot, rated.
So, uh, we can handle the weather.
It's just how much you wanna whiteknuckle it, you know, when you're
flying it's, it's supposed to be fun,you know, and this is what I tell
(20:54):
these guys, so, this and gals, cuzwe have women who fly with us too.
Uh, so I use that genericallyin a neutral sense.
This is a want to, it'snot a have to all right?
We wanna go out and we wanna do this, wewanna save, we wanna transport these dogs.
We're not saving the dogs, we're gettingthe golden ticket to get them to the
(21:14):
organizations that will get them adopted.
And so never charge thesenders or the receiv.
We only fly kill to no-kill.
So if, if they're, if we get a callfrom a no-kill shelter, we go, well,
your dog's already taken care of.
You don't need us.
There are a lot of otherpeople who need us.
So, that's kind of where we are.
(21:35):
We, I, when I first started, I thought,well, I'll do this for 10 years, or, or
10,000 animals, whichever comes first.
And when I was fine, thesmall plane, mean, I was fine.
About a thousand animals.
And, I mean, I've reallyfelt good about that.
Now, suddenly we're flying5,000 animals a year, and
Wow
we blew, I blew through that 10,000number and then, uh, last year we
(21:58):
broke through 20,000, no, 25,000.
And, uh, we're gonna hit 35,000 this year.
We have two aircraft,pilots, a nationwide map.
I'm not done.
Even.
It's, it's like one of those ads.
But wait, there's more.
So order now, and Peter Rourkewill get a third Cessna caravan
(22:22):
and he's gonna base it in Atlanta.
Because we have one inDRGs, one in Dallas.
And the Southeast, as you know,is also very rough for dogs.
very high, incidents.
Euthanasia and their shelters.
You know, 80% is not uncommon.
Probably 60% is more than norm.
(22:44):
But think about that.
You know, six out of 10 of all thenoses that go in never come out.
I mean, that's just, I'm a dogperson, you know, I, I like dogs
better than most people I know.
I mean, that's just the way it is.
I mean, I've, and I've gotmy two rescues right here.
I had four until, and I lost.
, that was a bad month.
occupational hazard, I suppose,because, you know, you see these
(23:08):
dogs and you, don't choose them.
They chose me.
So it's and the rescueis my favorite breed.
So, and I would get calls all these timeabout, oh, find a French bulldog for me.
I go French.
Forget that.
Why?
You can go to petfinder.com, putin French Bulldog and they'll
give you a list of 50 rescue.
(23:29):
that specialize in French bulldogs.
I said, my next dog's gonna be a pit bull.
Why?
Because people think they're,they're inherently dangerous.
My experience, they're the mostlovable, and affectionate dogs
out there all tongue and tail.
Because remember, the animalbehavior and this dog population
problem is not a dog problem.
(23:51):
, it's a people problem.
And so if all we have to do iseducate the people, the problem?
What can we do to fix it?
And so really, you're eitheryou're part of the solution
or you're part of the problem.
All right, And there, here are thefour ways that they can choose.
You can go adopt ananimal, adopt don't shop.
All right?
And better yet, adopt two.
(24:12):
They keep each other companyand they say, well, you know,
I don't have time for the dog.
Oh yeah, you're right.
They're be much better line ona cement floor you know, with
five other dogs crammed in there,way waiting, be euthanized.
They don't mind waiting foryou when you're at home.
and if you can't adopt, then foster a dog.
get it outta the shelter, let itknow that it has an opportunity.
(24:36):
You can see their behavior changes.
It takes about three weeks and it's,uh, they can really come around.
And if you can't adopt any,you can't foster, then go by
your local shelter and volunt.
Sweep out those stalls, change thewater, exercise the dogs, help groom 'em.
They all could, all could use some help.
(24:57):
And if you can't do that, then donate.
And you say, well, I don'twant to give 'em money.
I don't want, I don't know what they'redoing with Drop off some old blankets,
some leashes, a bag of dog food.
I mean, there's so manydifferent ways that you can help
and be part of the solution.
I mean, it's people,they're all black and white.
I mean, this whole thing is gray and.
(25:17):
We need to get more people out there.
We need to educate them and,make this problem go away.
That is a load right thereand I so appreciate it
and
I I'm not quick at math I wouldsay in the number of years that
you've been flying that what closeto half a million animals have been
(25:41):
saved
not by me.
No.
Remember I was flying a athousand animals a year.
Oh a year Okay So like I said I'm not very
quick with my math
we're, we're with the two aircraft.
We're flying a thousand a month, and
Uhhuh
passed 25,000 dogs.
, I would love to see them all in one room.
(26:01):
. A loud
room You gonna need like the super
dumb to do that
that's right.
It brings up an interesting pointbecause people always ask me, well, it
must be really noisy on those flights.
It's not.
you know, once that they're makingnoise, when we're loading the aircraft,
they're seeing the other dogs andworking and talking and, gibber jabbing.
But once that turbine spins and thenoise starts in the air, they haven't
(26:22):
heard that noise before and they'reprobably wondering is it gonna hurt?
I mean they, these dogs have had likethe worst life you can imagine and they
don't realize they're on the aircraft.
They have a golden ticket.
They're gonna go live in the northernRockies with a family that knows
how to take care of their, their.
We fly cats too, about 10%
(26:43):
. Uh
So just, just, but we put themway in the back of the aircraft.
not only because of weight andbalance, but they're noisy.
I mean, they, theyalmost never settle down.
cats The that meowing
Um so Peter we're gonna take a quick breakto get a word from one of our sponsors
and then come back I have uh a load of
questions for you
(27:04):
I'll be here.
Peter welcome back remarkable results hereyou said this year you guys will break
35,000 animals So you said you're basedyou're soon to be based in Atlanta You're
based in Dallas And where's the other you
guys are based Drakes Okay Just
on the other side of the pass
Driggs takes care of theWest, the 14 Western states.
(27:27):
Dallas
Hmm
care of the central part of the country.
And also going to the east coast,
Mm-hmm
probably not this year, but nextyear we'll get our third caravan
base in Atlanta and that will takecare of all the East Coast issues.
And basically it's movingthe dogs from south to north.
Okay And you said this is apeople issue Tell me how People
(27:52):
can be better to help solve
this issue
uh, it's hip to snip.
All right, so spay andneuter is the way to go.
say, well, you know, I,I want them to have this.
First litter or whatever, or they, theywanna buy it from a breeder or, and I
have no problem if you wanna buy it frombreeder, there should be a tax on that.
(28:13):
You know, it's interesting that you,you go in to get your hair cut and they
have to have a, license to do that.
They have a ha have tohave a license to do nails.
why don't they have to havea license to breed dogs?
Generate a revenue stream.
Create a situation where we can policeand make sure it's being done humanely.
(28:36):
the spay and neuter clinics, I mean, alot of 'em, you know, they, they give
away these coupons so it's free and, anda lot of the people who are economically
challenged may maybe don't have the timeor the ability to get to these locations.
And so now they're doingMobilePay neuter clinic.
That, that's, that's really the key.
It's the spay and neuteris, is the answer.
(28:58):
So people are
breeding
dogs and then they sell 'em and then those
dogs are not
backyard
spayed And
do they do when they don't sell them?
They dump 'em at the pound.
Oh
so, and you've seen these guys atWalmart holding up a little chihuahua,
you know, dog for sale or whatever,you know, it just, . Honestly, I
(29:18):
don't think they're bad people.
I just
don't
think they're
they're part of the solution.
Yeah And why in the south is it such anissue Is it their climate It's just more
happening there
it's a lot warmer.
The dogs are out, running around.
They're, they're not really house dogs.
(29:38):
mean, my dogs sleep on my bed with me.
All right.
In
. Mine does
too Yeah
you go.
Yeah
in the south they just kind of run wildand, and it's also a cultural thing.
They like to keep their dogs intact,you know, maybe a more of a macho thing.
I don't know.
but it certainly seems to fit and itjust, so they're out there breeding
(30:00):
like crazy the puppies get pregnant.
The, these dogs get pregnant.
The owner.
either kill the puppies or theydump the puppies at the pound.
you know, puppies actually gopretty quickly in the pound.
Everybody wants a littlepuppy until they figure out.
And a lot of 'em are returned becausethese, they don't know what the breed is.
(30:20):
And then suddenly this puppyis like 90 pound mask or
something like that, , massive
Hmm
And you know, they don'thave room for that.
And I go, well, I haveroom for it, but Yeah.
It's, it's an educational issue.
And if, uh, they shouldstart teaching it in schools.
I mean, it's, it's just toteach the kids how to be good.
(30:40):
And there's, is it,that brings up a point.
We used to do, um, a critter camp with,uh, Merced and Missoula, and once a
month I would fly an aircraft full.
Of animals up, and they would have aday camp for these kids the week, and
they would sign and assign the animalto this one child, and the child would
(31:02):
learn how to groom it, how to, youknow, how feed it and how to walk in
voice commands and stuff like that.
How to foster the animal.
And of course, , you know, thedeep, dark secret is that we
want this to be a failed foster.
Where , where the parents say, okay,well it's time to take the dog back and
, and the child is gonna go, you can't
So maybe, maybe that's manipulatinga little bit, but who cares?
(31:25):
If it gets a job done?
It gets a job done.
We're not harming.
Sure And with all these dogs that youall have saved just remarkable remarkable
numbers There are there any otherorganizations that are doing this as well
There are a lot there are alot of transport organizations,
but they're ground transport.
(31:46):
Mm-hmm
there's one other, but they're, they'rerunning into a little difficulty right
now with some personality issues.
They're based out of la and ofcourse there's the pilots and PAW
organization where you can fly theone dog the one time and and stuff.
when, when I was flying the dogsin the 2 0 6, we, uh, it costs us
(32:07):
about $75 per animal per transport.
And you go, well, that's not so, Andthen we get the caravan and it costs
us 750 bucks an hour to run this thing.
But through economies of scale.
Now the cost is about $50 per animalper transport, and that's about the
same cost as a, um, a spay neuter fee.
(32:30):
Actually, the vets maybe evencharge a little bit more.
so it's, it's cost effective.
And I mean, I, I say the more themerrier, you know, if, if you have an
airplane, and you want to put a dog init and fly it somewhere, that's great.
The, the problem is itends up costing them about.
A thousand bucks to transport thisone animal, and we're doing it for 50.
(32:51):
but they're, they like to flyand as I said earlier, they're
using the animal as an excuse.
By the way, a shout out to Dr.
Brent Blue, who lives in Jackson.
He's one of our volunteer pilots andhas just got back from flight safety
doing his annual, recurrent training.
He's looking forward.
about 12 or 15 rescuemissions for us this year.
(33:15):
We ask each of our pilots to flyabout between 10 and 15, depending
on what their, their schedule allows.
And right now we're, we already have ourschedule and it, we'll, we're gonna be
flying hundred and over a hundred rescueflights that we have on the calendar now.
We leave some blanks in there forthings that come We're, we're
(33:36):
frequently asked if we go and respondto, say, a hurricane situation or a
flood situation, and go rescue thosedogs, well we did that when they had
floods down in New Orleans so, we did.
They had the floods in New Orleans.
The shelters are killing up.
(33:57):
fly the caravan down there, fly the.
up to Seattle and, andWyoming and all over the west.
And then about a week later, the ownersare coming in looking for their dogs.
. What
So we don't do it that way anymore,
huh
if, if we have enough heads up andthere's a storm coming, we'll fly down
(34:19):
and empty the shelters so that thedogs that are recovered can stay in the
shelters till their owners come to them.
Do you follow?
. Yeah.
that makes sense
we, we did it perfectly backward.
Just yet.
Another mistake that, that wemade, no, no one was harmed.
And you know, they say, well, we wantyou to go and bring that dog back.
(34:40):
I go, no, I
Hm Well we all there's as we grow in anybusiness in in life we we make mistakes
but it doesn't mean it's an intentional
harmful mistake but you learn from itand you figure out okay how can we still
accomplish our goal but just make theeffort better so we don't have the same
(35:00):
mistake
we, I have a lot of people helpingwe've got it pretty much wired now.
We know, we tag all the animals, reverseload them according to destination.
And, um, and all the health certificatesthat go into an envelope, we have how
many crates are getting out, not howmany animals, cuz we count the crates
and sometimes there are, there are twoanimals in a, in a much larger crate.
(35:25):
know, a nursing mother with four or fiveof her pups, you know, will be in one
Hmm
So that that's,
Remarkable work Peter
Remarkable work
and
I, I'm really proud of, of, andbelieve me, I have a lot of help.
and, um, just as when I waspracticing orthopedics in
Jackson, I had a lot of help too.
(35:46):
A lot of great people there.
And, uh, and a shout out toTeun Outpatient services.
The, the, uh, outpatient surgical clinicthat I started back in the late nineties
or whatever, put me in, in a bad way withthe hospital, but the patients loved.
And when you so do you guys havea a network of shelters where
(36:09):
you guys are running these routes
with
All
do.
And that's we, I have two, KaraPollard, who's our executive director
and primary fundraiser is also ourChief Rescue flight coordinator.
got to be too much for her as wekept scaling up and expanding.
(36:29):
So we now have two full-time rescueflight coordinators and they'll make
sure that, that numbers of animalsthat they want to put on the plane
is realistic in both directions.
We're not gonna fly downand, and fly five dogs out.
That just doesn't make senseus economically when we can go
Mm
(36:50):
and fill the aircraft so they know
Sure
aircraft every time.
what we don't want to happen ishave to leave five or 10 animals
the tarmac cuz there's no room.
they learn of the crate, theylearn the number of the crates.
The rescue flight coordinators,uh, Du and Kara Pollard There's,
(37:12):
there's a group in El Paso, Kayla,she's just an absolute sweetheart.
and she was featured on the c v s Sundaymorning piece that Connor Knighton
did, uh, with us a couple years ago.
And they actually built amockup of the interior of the
aircraft and practiced loading.
it's the only
place
I go
go to where I just stand there at four30 in the morning and drink my coffee.
(37:34):
And these gals are in there justputting those crates in like a Tetris
master, I mean, and no space left.
And they know exact, and we've beenfully flown so many flights for them.
And it, it's such a pleasurewhen you're working with the
same group over and over again.
They become such great friends.
And so this is, I've, I've startedtaking the rescue flight coordinators,
(37:58):
Kara and Lynette along on these flights.
I said, you know, you'venever really met these.
need me to meet these people?
You're on the phone with them all thetime and, uh, you know, I know their face.
And so they actually just last week gotback from a 10 day, road trip around
Texas with all of our Texas partners.
And rarely we're, we're sourcing about90% of all our animals out of Texas.
(38:19):
Now it, it's, it's a mess and
Hmm
I, I think that.
Care, or maybe they can't afford it.
I, I don't know.
But you go into the sheltersdown in Edinburgh or down in
Laredo on these border towns,
mm-hmm
break your heart.
It'll, it'll
Hmm
break your heart.
And you think, it smellsbad in the airplane.
(38:41):
You go into those sheltersand it, it just, it's brutal.
And got the, the volunteerswho go in there and work.
They're the heroes in my book, not, not
mm-hmm
receiving group.
They're great too, but the sending groups,they're making do with absolutely nothing.
It's just a absolutely a labor of love,
(39:03):
What a big win for them to see allthose dogs um leave that kill shelter
as well
real
Mm-hmm
It's just, and this is whatI love about these folks.
They are emotionally involved.
They, and they, we could, we couldfly for the same group every week.
(39:23):
Every week, but there are othergroups in that same situation.
So I let the gals, I, I paint withbroad strokes where we're gonna do the
flights, how we're gonna do it, howwe're gonna coordinate it so we don't.
Send a pilot, A down and back, they'reout there for three or four or five
days sometimes stringing together alot of these trips to save, having
(39:46):
come back to the home base and theadditional expense of flying the aircraft
empty and we almost never fly, empty.
Uh, and so for an example,mentioned I get in the plane, I
fly down to Hobbs, New Mexico.
Well, what I do on the way down,I'll stop in Rock Springs in Salt
Lake City and I'll pick up the crate.
That I left off with the animals.
(40:07):
Ah
so then I return the empty crates,um, to the sending group because then,
Uhhuh
are used over and over and over again,they, they get, there's a lot of wear
and tear and once a month we havea dog that breaks out of its crate.
And it's, uh, you know,the first time you noticed.
they work their way up through the front.
(40:28):
And then you have this hotbreath on your neck, , and you
go and, and there's this dog.
And you wonder, well,I hope it's friendly.
Well, of course it's friendly becausethe sending group not going to send a
dog with behavioral issues to a receiving
Hmm
because that's the last time thereceiving group will ever work with them.
(40:50):
So the, the receiving groups will.
cherry pick the animals thatare most likely to be adopted.
Because remember, this is they'regoing to non kelp, and those,
Mm-hmm
if they, it doesn't work out, notflying 'em back to be euthanized uhuh.
That's not what we do.
Yeah.
I, mean you gotta adopt 'em out Youwant it to be a successful adoption
(41:12):
so other people hear about it andwanna go to that shelter as well so
Yeah I uh, you know, the, when wewere a child, you'd go to the pet
store and you'd buy your dog there.
I mean, that's the way it used to be.
Nobody knew about the pound, you know.
Mm-hmm
That's the best place for it.
And as I mentioned, you can goto Petfinder and you can find
(41:33):
whatever you want out there.
And honestly, if it's in Texas andit's coming in this direction, if
you wanna throw it on one of ourflights, we're happy to do it.
You just reach out to Kara, poweredat kara dog co-pilot dot org.
K a R a dog co-pilot org.
So what's the website
It's
if people wanted to reach out and
(41:54):
donate to you guys
Dub dog co-pilot dot org.
has
Mm-hmm
a link on there where you can donateand it has a lot of the stories,
has pictures of the pilots, uh,has pictures of the board members.
It has a lot of the interviews,uh, that I've done over the years.
We would love to include this one ifwe could put a link on, on our website.
(42:16):
We've got, I, don't do Facebook.
I mean, I did, It just, when Ifinally shut it down, I felt like
I graduated from high school.
It's
. Ah
It was, uh, it just took up so much time.
But we have, you know, tens ofthousands of followers for D I M C.
um, they'll, they'll go to the website,they'll, they'll pick up your podcast
(42:39):
and probably listen to some of theother podcasts, which I'm going to.
Thank you Thank you Well it's storieslike yours or for people who are
making a a difference and making animpact and uh in in the world And
as you said earlier be a part of
Yeah Yeah It it's you might notrealize it Mm-hmm it's not hard
(43:02):
to be a part of the solution andthere's a lot of dogs out there that
can bring lots of joy to different
families
or individuals as well
see stray dogs running around.
you
Mm
see that.
you go down to the Central Valleyof Merced, you'll, see stray
dogs on every street corner.
It's, it's heartbreaking.
mm
And, these dogs have beenliving on their own and they're,
(43:25):
they're hard to trap sometimes.
And
I
bet they are
and then with the cats, you know,they have the, a catch and release.
What they do, they'll catch the cat,spay a neuter of the animal, kind
of clip its ear, so you can telland then release it back into the.
. And that way
Mm-hmm
(43:45):
capture it again and they see theclipped ear, they just kind of let it go.
But, uh, that's what they'redoing in the larger cities
and that's a terrific program.
Doesn't work so well with, with dogs.
more of a dog person anyway.
My youngest wants two cats and my wife'sgonna take him to volunteer at the agency
to help clean the litter boxes and helptake care of the cats to see if he really
(44:11):
wants to help take care of a cat before
he gets
any cat
at the Animal Adoption Center, they'llfos, they'll, they'll keep cats there.
They foster all the dogs out.
don't keep any dogs there.
. There's also the, the, um,shelter that's just south of
town by the recycling center,
Yes sir
might want to take him in there,
(44:32):
. There's plenty of volunteer opportunities for him to learn how
to clean a litter box before uh
right?
he there's we've had a cat beforeand cleaning the litter box is not my
idea of fun But um we have a dog as
well so
so, and
Well
have you.
we actually got a full
breed
(44:53):
dog but we started my first dog Flashcame from the Animal Adoption Agency
when Cupcakes started it And he camefrom a no-kill shelter And to see
how he progressed as I had him asI had flash over the years was just
remarkable And he was just a sweet sweet
dog
(45:13):
know, they
And then
our emotions on the animals.
who says
that has
has never had a dog, I mean,
Yeah
have real emotions and you,
How do they do
grateful.
are
Mm-hmm
I mean, I, my two dogs that areright here, I've got a golden
and a black lab, and they're.
(45:34):
Purebred dogs.
I mean, but they ended up on my
Hmm
I mean, I didn't, didn'tgo looking for them.
If someone asked if I would transportthem, it was a night, like an
owner surrender kind of thing.
And
Mm-hmm
I said, yeah, I'll transportthem right to my house.
good I'm glad you had 'em And we triedadopting a dog but the dog we were not
(45:58):
the right family for that dog And whatwe paid for the adoption fees from the
shelter Um they said Well, we'll givethem back to you I said no keep the
adoption the fees that we pay to helpfind the right family for this dog So
that's not a barrier for the dog to be
(46:20):
adopted And they they
found a family for that dog which
story.
Uh, over a third of
hmm
that are adopted are returned.
. just doesn't fit and they
don't
fit for
for any number of reasons.
But
Mm-hmm
you know what they would do in Texas if itdidn't fit, drive along the highway, open
(46:41):
the door, kick the dog out, and take off.
That's what they do.
Brutal.
a shame.
shame.
Yeah.
The punish
It's a shame
be great.
Yeah.
Well, Dr.
Rourke, Peter, I will letyou get back to your day.
I've so enjoyed hearing the impactin the world that you're making,
and thank you for saving all thesedogs' lives and, and even the cats
(47:04):
as Well,
Stephen, thank you so much for your time.
Thanks for, uh, helpingus get the word out.
Jackson's my home.
I love Jackson.
my kids grew up there.
Graduated Jackson High School.
My son is still.
There, he, uh, tends bar at the coach andand one of the Thai restaurants in town.
So say hi to Buller when you goby and I mean, people will look at
(47:27):
him though, so you have to be Dr.
Rourke's kid.
I mean, he's like a minime , he's such a great guy too.
Oh, he smokes.
What was your kid?
I'm sure he is
you so much for
Yeah
for having me.
Thanks for, uh,
You're welcome
Dog as my copart.
You're
welcome Have a great day
To learn more about PeterRourke and Dog is my co-pilot.
(47:50):
Visit the Jackson holeconnection.com, episode number 231.
Folks, get out there andhelp save some animals.
You can donate todayto Dog is my co-pilot.
Go to their website.
and share this podcast.
Maybe there's some other dog lovers andcat lovers that you know and they would
enjoy listening to the history and howthese dogs and cats are flown around the
(48:13):
country to save them from kill shelters.
Thank you to Michael for producing,marketing and editing this podcast,
and of course to my lovely wifeLaura, and my boys Lewis and William.
your time is valuable andI appreciate your time.
I'm grateful for you spending yourtime with me and sharing your time
with me, and I will see you here backagain next week for another episode
(48:38):
of the Jackson Hole Connection.
You are tuned into the Jackson hole,connection, sharing, fascinating stories
of people connected to Jackson Hole.
I am truly grateful for each ofyou for tuning in today and support
for this podcast comes from:
Today I'm gonna beginthe episode with a quote.
This one is not an original by melike I've done the past few weeks.
(00:22):
Here we go.
What lies behind us and whatlies before us are tiny matters
compared to what lies within us.
That's from Oliver Wendell Holmes.
I pulled that quote from the book,seven Habits of Highly Effective People,
which we've probably all read, but.
if you haven't read it or peruse throughit recently, I recommend picking up that
(00:45):
book, once a year and or a few timesa year just to reference some of the
information that Stephen Covey has inthere can always help us and remind us
of what our purpose is and, why we doand how to accomplish what we want to.
And today you are listeningto episode number 231.
(01:06):
My guest today is Dr.
Peter Rourke and Dr.
Rourke.
is one of the foundersof Dog is my co-pilot.
After tragedy struck Peter.
He found himself in a really dark,place in life, and a good friend of his
suggested that Peter find a purpose.
And I would say that Peter certainlyfound a purpose that he certainly found.
(01:29):
And which is to savedogs from kill shelters.
It took some time to figure itout, but he, he did figure it out.
And dog is, my co-pilot hassaved thousands of dogs now.
They fly cats as well.
And they started off with onelittle plane, which Peter's gonna
talk about the growth of dog as myco-pilot, the nonprofit, growth of
(01:51):
one plane based in one community.
To now two planes based in twodifferent cities around the country.
And guess what?
They're getting ready to addanother plane and another community
which they serve, in this country.
So they're gonna be covering quite a bitof the country, by the end of this year.
as Peter shares with ustoday, be a part of the.
(02:13):
And that can be applied toany problem you may find.
Peter shares how you can be part of thesolution and why having some faith and
great partners will build success withtime determination and lots of hard work.
Peter thank you for joining me heretoday at the Jackson Hole Connection
I'm delighted to find you on the groundand be able to have some of your time
(02:36):
Well, thank you for having me.
S.
You're very welcome And Peter Ilove learning people's history
and
background and I'd love for you to startoff by sharing where is it that you were
raised and are you a native of JacksonAnd if not where how did you land here
Uh, my children are natives,but I am anything but I was born
(03:01):
and raised in, uh, Northern NewJersey in a New York City suburb.
, it's a community where peoplewere either on their way up
or down the economic ladder.
Ladder.
So we had a broad cross section of things.
My father was an only childand wanted a big family.
Uh, so I was one of seven.
So, uh, and he liked to take abig family vacation every year.
(03:23):
So when I was about 10 years old, weall piled up a piled into the Rambler
Ambassador Station wagon with the bass.
And, uh, he says, gonna go check outsome of these, uh, parks in the West.
So we went to Estees, Rocky MountainNational Park, grand Teton, Yellowstone.
(03:43):
Drove up to Glacier, up to BanCanada, and it changed my world.
I mean, I, I couldn't figure outwhy anybody would wanna, anywhere
but in the Rocky Mountains and, uh,I mean, I was completely smitten.
So at that point I started plottingmy escape and, being the youngest
of the four boys in the family, myfather had gone to Rutgers College,
(04:07):
which was a men's school, and somy three older brothers did not.
So it fell upon me to, to go.
So I, I did my undergradat Rutgers College.
I'd had enough in New Jersey atthat time, so I moved all the way to
Baltimore to go to medical school.
not that far away, but you know,
Mm-hmm
say it's, uh, it's like an outhouse.
(04:27):
You want it close enough for theconvenience, but far enough away
that you don't get the smell.
So . So, um, after I finishedmedical school, I matched to
the University of New Mexico inAlbuquerque and, did my internship
in residency in, uh, orthopedic.
. I then followed that with a hand surgeryfellowship at the Good Sam Hospital
(04:50):
in Phoenix, and then a knee surgeryfellowship in South Lake Tahoe with,
uh, Richard Sedman, who passed away.
Russ in peace.
got a job offer to practice in SunValley, Idaho, and I just was absolutely.
moved to Sun Valley, had mountains,aspen trees, the ski area, everything
(05:11):
I was looking for, and I just figureout what was wrong with the place.
And it, it took me a couple years andit, uh, sun Valley is, it's really an
LA suburb it's a, it's a ski resortthat built a small mountain town.
And
Hmm
After four years, I waslooking for my escape.
(05:34):
So moved over to, Jackson when patientsfrom Jackson started seeing me in Sun
Valley because the three orthopedicsurgeons who were practicing in
Jackson all left at the same time.
Some political, you know, confrontationwith the hospital administrator.
And honestly, I, I have yet to.
on an airplane flight when they,the stewards rings a button, excuse
(05:57):
me, we have a medical emergency.
Is there a hospitaladministrator on board?
You know, that just, thatjust doesn't happen anyway.
So they always look at us as thesource of the problems, and yet
we're the, we're the solution.
So I moved to Jacksonin the spring of 1990.
moved there with my wife, SQUI.
. And then, uh, we had two children,born, and they were born and raised.
(06:19):
One in the old hospital,one in the new hospital.
Uh, started building my practice and,um, just really, really loved it.
I felt I was at home.
I was at home and, so worked really hard.
I, worked hard for thecommunity and the community.
exceptionally good to I mean,it was, uh, a good relationship.
(06:42):
And one of the things they teachyou, what they never teach you in
medical school is how to say no.
So, you know, you get a call, you're inthe ER to go see your patient, uh, even
if you're not on call, I mean, that's,that's just, that's kind of old school.
You don't see a lot of that now.
. But, uh, that's, that's how I practice.
So I practice until, unfortunatelysquirrel and I went our, kind of
(07:06):
our separate ways, remained greatfriends, two children to raise and
we raised them together very well.
and then, uh, remarried.
And, two months later, my wifepassed away of a cardiac arrest and
ohh
It was brutal.
Yeah.
That it absolutely crushed me.
And that was in May of 2012 and,I just walked out of the office.
(07:28):
That was it.
I, I quit medicine and I retreatedto my lake house up in Montana.
And I mean, there were mornings Iwould make a pot of coffee, down and,
uh, with the coffee mug in my hand,and look up in the sun is setting.
I'm going, what the hell just happened?
I mean, That grief can be soconsuming and if, and hopefully
(07:50):
you'll never experience it.
But sadly, we all do andeveryone handles it differently.
But, uh, I mean, I had, youknow, it just, it destroyed me.
we had a mutual friend, my wife and I, whocalled me after a couple months and said,
, you know, Meg would want you to be happy.
She wants you to be happy, soyou need to knock that shit off.
(08:10):
I thought, okay, been a number ofmonths, um, you never really get over it.
You know, I'm still, she's still inthe back of my head mourning her and,
but, , I, been a pilot before I wentto medical school and worked my way
through medical school, teaching,flying, and doing, charter work.
(08:30):
I'd seen tours over the ChesapeakeBay, the, so I was familiar with
aviation, had my own aircraft.
I had done a couple rescue flights,uh, with my wife Meg, and it was kind
of a one dog, one location, one time.
and then you move on to the next flight.
There's an organizationcalled Pilots and Paws.
And really these are a bunch ofpilots who are using the dog as
(08:52):
an excuse to go fly the airplane.
but you know, honestly, for that, forthat dog, I mean, it's a game changer.
It changes their world.
So, you know, how can youargue against that except that
it not very cost effective.
So, I started with that model andthen Animal Adoption center in
Jackson wanted to start flyingdogs in from San Francisco.
Marty Watts runs San Francisco asPCA a and they wanted me to fly
(09:16):
them in and I thought, perfect.
All right, I'll do that.
So we, we can do a flight everyother week or however you want to.
So I flew out to San Francisco, met MartyWatts, and Marty had nice lunch out for
us and we chit chatted and Gibber javery.
And then she was sittingthere just kind of studying.
. And then after lunch he pulledme aside and said, I have a big,
(09:38):
uh, a bigger mission for you.
said, uh, these folks inJackson, yeah, that's great,
but they don't need your help.
The way this woman needs your help.
Her name is Sharon Lowman.
She's in Merced, California, which isin the Central Valley of California.
I would love for you togo down and meet her.
So I flew down the nextday and, met Sharon at the.
(09:59):
She walked me throughthe municipal shelter.
Now Sharon runs a, a private organizationcalled New Beginnings, these folks
are, were desperate to save animals.
They would go into the municipal shelter,they would find the most readily adoptable
animals, and they would put 'em in acrate, put 'em in a van, and drive 'em
to Seattle, Missoula, Boise, Spokane,salt Lake City, Denver, you name.
(10:22):
and these are like 16 hour trips andthey're taking 20, 25 dogs at a time.
And for any of you who have everbeen involved in animal transport,
you know that dog gets in the crateand the dog gets out of the crate
when it gets to its destination.
You don't stop every threehours and let 'em out and pee.
So it's brutal.
really
tough on everybody and there'san incredible sense of urgency
(10:45):
on the part of the drivers.
, they can't stop.
They, they don't, they can't stop andrest and check into a hotel overnight
or whatever, and then they get thereand turn around and drive back.
and the municipal shelter atthat time was euthanizing.
94% of all the animals that cameinto the shelter completely overrun.
(11:08):
And they didn't have an outlet.
, I mean, the dogs are comingin, people aren't going to the
shelter to, to adopt the dog.
Uh, a lot of owner surrendersmostly picked up as strays.
uh, I said, I can do that flightfor you in about four hours.
All right, let me take over for you.
So I was flying a, a small sixseater aircraft at the time,
(11:30):
Sessna 2 0 6, a capable air.
. but the size is, is rather limited.
And I could put in 20 or 25 smallcrates, you know, like chihuahuas
or min pens or cats or whatever.
And sadly, the, the big dogs were beingleft behind because if I put two of
the larger crates in, I would bulk out.
And now there's no more room.
(11:52):
Now it wasn't, it wasn't a weight issue,it was the size of the crate issue,
Mm-hmm
I struggled with that.
a couple of years, and then Iabsolutely knew I had to scale up.
So, the aircraft that I hadin mind was a Cessna caravan.
It's, it's what the FedExuses for hauling the freight.
You've seen 'em, the singleengine, high wing aircraft with a
(12:13):
turbine engine on the front, and.
I, I went looking for one, and Imean, they cost $3 million a copy.
And, you know, we didn'thave that kind of money and I
didn't have that kind of money.
so I hired a broker.
looked and looked and lookedand looked, uh, all the aircraft
that were in our price range,like got seven figures a million.
(12:34):
had either been, you know, crashed intoa lake and repaired, or, I mean, they,
they had terrible histories with thesethings so he found one up in Canada and a
mining company that was shutting down itsflight operations and they would fly it
in and out of the old backcountry strips.
And when I saw it, I mean, the paint'schipping off of it, mean, got dents all
(12:56):
over it from the rocks on the runway, theinterior, the ceiling is falling down.
The ceiling and yourgrandfather's Oldsmobile.
I mean, it was just,
in terrible shape.
But in Canada, they are very specificabout their maintenance on the aircraft.
So we went through the maintenance log.
mechanical condition, complete eyesore.
(13:18):
I said perfect
The
The dogs don't care.
, I don't care.
The only thing I care about iswhat's forward of that firewall,
you know, keep that turbinespinning and keeping me in the air.
So the, the next thing I, I hadto come up with the money and so I
mortgaged my house, gave the milliondollars to the nonprofit as a loan
(13:39):
any plan on how to get it back.
But I didn't care.
I figured this is the right next step.
So Suddenly we're, we're going fromflying from 20 animals at a time
to up to 200 animals at a time.
. And that in that created levels ofnew ways to make mistakes . And so
(14:00):
no one group can take 200 animals.
So you either have four or fivegroups, or four or five destinations,
or a combination of both.
So now I'm leaving the rightdog at the wrong airport, the
wrong dog at the right airport.
It's really,
Oh
God
it figured out now we have it, we haveit, uh, we have it, um, all ironed out.
(14:20):
know, it was interesting.
The other thing that I found was thatwhen you're loading up the airplane
and you close the door, have like150 or 200 panting dogs in there.
A lot of hot breath.
All the windows fog upand all the instruments.
I mean, think the backseat ofthe Toyota, uh, the Volkswagen
Bug high school prom night.
(14:40):
All right.
You know, I'm talking about Sowe had to carry handkerchiefs and
towels to wipe everything down and.
. But once we get up to altitude, youknow, things cool off and that's
no longer a problem cuz it startsfreezing on the windows and such.
I did that for a couple yearsand then, um, we get a phone call
from, uh, the Petco Corporation,their, their foundation arm.
(15:03):
And, uh, they said, oh, been,we've been watching you.
I said, great.
And they kept asking endlessquestions, endless que and I
didn't even know where it was.
. And, uh, so finally at the end, thegal says, well, uh, no more questions.
And, and I was really cheeky at thatpoint, and I said, are you sure?
Not even one more question?
And she
(15:23):
Yes
I'm good.
I said, oh, so what can we do for you?
She says, well, we're gonna give you theLove and Action Award for Petco, and we're
gonna grant you a quarter million dollars.
And my jaw just.
Kara Pollard, who is theexecutive director who, who
is, uh, do you know Kara?
Do you know where Kara and Mark Mark runs?
(15:44):
O s m in, uh, Jackson.
In anything?
I might know them Yeah.
Kara, it's just a sweetheart.
She, she's everything that I'm not,you know, I'm Imre, I'm rude, I'm short
with people and she's just the opposite.
So, she started crying andI thought, wow, this is.
. So now that allowed me, and up tothis point I'm flying five or six
(16:08):
days a week myself doing all therescue flights, I'm getting a little
burned out to, to be quite honest.
And I wanted to be home with my dogs.
So, it allowed me to go out andbring on a couple new pilots.
And these are all volunteer pilots, butit costs about 10,000 bucks per pilot.
To train them every year andthrough recurrent training
(16:31):
the insurance requirements.
the caravan is a simple airplane to fly.
I mean, it, it's big, it's slow, andit's noth nothing happens really quickly.
It's got a turbine enginewater power, a lot.
It's very roomy comparedto the other aircraft.
And so the, the pilots, uh,were more than happy to fly it.
So did that for a couple years.
Then I started thinking, Wecan't keep up with the demand.
(16:54):
So I'm thinking we have to, wehave to get another airplane.
So we started
Hmm
looking and started looking and my,my board, and we had just recently,
it took seven years to pay off aloan . So we had, board in their infant
wisdom said, okay, no more loans.
We're gonna pay cash for this next.
Now cost of everything goes up.
(17:15):
And so we finally found anaircraft for, close to 2 million.
And uh, Kara went out there andreally beat the bushes and she and
I worked hard raising the money andwe were able to raise the funds.
now we have two caravans and wehave, a dozen volunteer pilots
flying for the organization.
We fly from March until, . because duringthe winter, I mean, when you, when you
(17:39):
think about it, you're flying a singleengine engine airplane during the winter
over the Rocky Mountains, could go wrong?
. know, it's just,
How much
Exactly.
so now, you look at our map and itlooks like a map of Southwest Airlines.
I mean, we're, we're national and.
. Oh
We, we still kind of struggledfinancially and then, I mean, the greatest
(18:03):
thing in the world happened to us.
I got a call from Connor Knightonwho from CBS Sunday morning, and
he says, I wanna do a piece on you.
And I said, are you kidding me?
I mean, I grew up watching Charles Caral.
I mean, I would just, I wouldlove to be on that program.
And it took him a couple years to getpast his, uh, board back in New York.
But we finally shot the.
(18:24):
and it put us on the nationalmap and allowed e expanded our
fundraising because, we're a 5 01 and we never charge, we never
charge our senders or the receivers.
we offer these, these gifts for free.
I mean, it's not a gift.
I mean, we're in transportation.
and honestly, uh, people say,wow, that's really great.
(18:45):
You're a hero.
I'm going, no, I'm not.
You know, I'm a bus driver.
You know, the real heroes are the oneswho walk into those shelters every
single day and deal with those animals,cleaning out the stalls, changing
the water, exercising them, groomingthem, teaching them leash training.
Uh, simple voice commands, tryingto get them ready for adoption
(19:07):
because that's really the onlyoption a lot of these places have.
So now we have about a hundred partners.
We fly basically from the south tothe north the farther south you go in
the United States, the worse it is.
The farther north yougo, the better it is.
Jackson dog.
, Portland, Seattle, Spokane.
(19:30):
Boise.
I mean, these are all placeswhere the, and we fly the dogs in.
They're gone in a couple days.
So we're constantlyflying the same routes.
And basically we have the samerepeating flight schedule.
and it repeats over a, atwo or three week period.
And I'll give you an exampleof, of what, what I would do.
jump in the airplane.
(19:50):
I fly down to Hobbs, New Mexico.
spend the night load up at four30 in the morning, when it's
nice and cool for the dogs.
And, wheels up by about 5, 5 30.
First stop would be Denver.
second stop would.
Fort Collins.
Third stop would be Rock Springs.
(20:10):
Fourth stop would be Salt Lake City.
And then boom down to El Paso.
Spend the night, repeat.
Get up.
Start loading at four 30 in the morning.
Fly the dogs to Troutdaleor Portland, Oregon.
to Seattle to Spokane Walla Wall.
Boise, Missoula and then back.
(20:32):
And so it's a, that's a three day trip.
A lot of flying, about10 or 12 hours a day.
Sometimes weather cansometimes be an issue.
But we're all, air at tpairline transport pilot, rated.
So, uh, we can handle the weather.
It's just how much you wanna whiteknuckle it, you know, when you're
flying it's, it's supposed to be fun,you know, and this is what I tell
(20:54):
these guys, so, this and gals, cuzwe have women who fly with us too.
Uh, so I use that genericallyin a neutral sense.
This is a want to, it'snot a have to all right?
We wanna go out and we wanna do this, wewanna save, we wanna transport these dogs.
We're not saving the dogs, we're gettingthe golden ticket to get them to the
(21:14):
organizations that will get them adopted.
And so never charge thesenders or the receiv.
We only fly kill to no-kill.
So if, if they're, if we get a callfrom a no-kill shelter, we go, well,
your dog's already taken care of.
You don't need us.
There are a lot of otherpeople who need us.
So, that's kind of where we are.
(21:35):
We, I, when I first started, I thought,well, I'll do this for 10 years, or, or
10,000 animals, whichever comes first.
And when I was fine, thesmall plane, mean, I was fine.
About a thousand animals.
And, I mean, I've reallyfelt good about that.
Now, suddenly we're flying5,000 animals a year, and
Wow
we blew, I blew through that 10,000number and then, uh, last year we
(21:58):
broke through 20,000, no, 25,000.
And, uh, we're gonna hit 35,000 this year.
We have two aircraft,pilots, a nationwide map.
I'm not done.
Even.
It's, it's like one of those ads.
But wait, there's more.
So order now, and Peter Rourkewill get a third Cessna caravan
(22:22):
and he's gonna base it in Atlanta.
Because we have one inDRGs, one in Dallas.
And the Southeast, as you know,is also very rough for dogs.
very high, incidents.
Euthanasia and their shelters.
You know, 80% is not uncommon.
Probably 60% is more than norm.
(22:44):
But think about that.
You know, six out of 10 of all thenoses that go in never come out.
I mean, that's just, I'm a dogperson, you know, I, I like dogs
better than most people I know.
I mean, that's just the way it is.
I mean, I've, and I've gotmy two rescues right here.
I had four until, and I lost.
, that was a bad month.
occupational hazard, I suppose,because, you know, you see these
(23:08):
dogs and you, don't choose them.
They chose me.
So it's and the rescueis my favorite breed.
So, and I would get calls all these timeabout, oh, find a French bulldog for me.
I go French.
Forget that.
Why?
You can go to petfinder.com, putin French Bulldog and they'll
give you a list of 50 rescue.
(23:29):
that specialize in French bulldogs.
I said, my next dog's gonna be a pit bull.
Why?
Because people think they're,they're inherently dangerous.
My experience, they're the mostlovable, and affectionate dogs
out there all tongue and tail.
Because remember, the animalbehavior and this dog population
problem is not a dog problem.
(23:51):
, it's a people problem.
And so if all we have to do iseducate the people, the problem?
What can we do to fix it?
And so really, you're eitheryou're part of the solution
or you're part of the problem.
All right, And there, here are thefour ways that they can choose.
You can go adopt ananimal, adopt don't shop.
All right?
And better yet, adopt two.
(24:12):
They keep each other companyand they say, well, you know,
I don't have time for the dog.
Oh yeah, you're right.
They're be much better line ona cement floor you know, with
five other dogs crammed in there,way waiting, be euthanized.
They don't mind waiting foryou when you're at home.
and if you can't adopt, then foster a dog.
get it outta the shelter, let itknow that it has an opportunity.
(24:36):
You can see their behavior changes.
It takes about three weeks and it's,uh, they can really come around.
And if you can't adopt any,you can't foster, then go by
your local shelter and volunt.
Sweep out those stalls, change thewater, exercise the dogs, help groom 'em.
They all could, all could use some help.
(24:57):
And if you can't do that, then donate.
And you say, well, I don'twant to give 'em money.
I don't want, I don't know what they'redoing with Drop off some old blankets,
some leashes, a bag of dog food.
I mean, there's so manydifferent ways that you can help
and be part of the solution.
I mean, it's people,they're all black and white.
I mean, this whole thing is gray and.
(25:17):
We need to get more people out there.
We need to educate them and,make this problem go away.
That is a load right thereand I so appreciate it
and
I I'm not quick at math I wouldsay in the number of years that
you've been flying that what closeto half a million animals have been
(25:41):
saved
not by me.
No.
Remember I was flying a athousand animals a year.
Oh a year Okay So like I said I'm not very
quick with my math
we're, we're with the two aircraft.
We're flying a thousand a month, and
Uhhuh
passed 25,000 dogs.
, I would love to see them all in one room.
(26:01):
. A loud
room You gonna need like the super
dumb to do that
that's right.
It brings up an interesting pointbecause people always ask me, well, it
must be really noisy on those flights.
It's not.
you know, once that they're makingnoise, when we're loading the aircraft,
they're seeing the other dogs andworking and talking and, gibber jabbing.
But once that turbine spins and thenoise starts in the air, they haven't
(26:22):
heard that noise before and they'reprobably wondering is it gonna hurt?
I mean they, these dogs have had likethe worst life you can imagine and they
don't realize they're on the aircraft.
They have a golden ticket.
They're gonna go live in the northernRockies with a family that knows
how to take care of their, their.
We fly cats too, about 10%
(26:43):
. Uh
So just, just, but we put themway in the back of the aircraft.
not only because of weight andbalance, but they're noisy.
I mean, they, theyalmost never settle down.
cats The that meowing
Um so Peter we're gonna take a quick breakto get a word from one of our sponsors
and then come back I have uh a load of
questions for you
(27:04):
I'll be here.
Peter welcome back remarkable results hereyou said this year you guys will break
35,000 animals So you said you're basedyou're soon to be based in Atlanta You're
based in Dallas And where's the other you
guys are based Drakes Okay Just
on the other side of the pass
Driggs takes care of theWest, the 14 Western states.
(27:27):
Dallas
Hmm
care of the central part of the country.
And also going to the east coast,
Mm-hmm
probably not this year, but nextyear we'll get our third caravan
base in Atlanta and that will takecare of all the East Coast issues.
And basically it's movingthe dogs from south to north.
Okay And you said this is apeople issue Tell me how People
(27:52):
can be better to help solve
this issue
uh, it's hip to snip.
All right, so spay andneuter is the way to go.
say, well, you know, I,I want them to have this.
First litter or whatever, or they, theywanna buy it from a breeder or, and I
have no problem if you wanna buy it frombreeder, there should be a tax on that.
(28:13):
You know, it's interesting that you,you go in to get your hair cut and they
have to have a, license to do that.
They have a ha have tohave a license to do nails.
why don't they have to havea license to breed dogs?
Generate a revenue stream.
Create a situation where we can policeand make sure it's being done humanely.
(28:36):
the spay and neuter clinics, I mean, alot of 'em, you know, they, they give
away these coupons so it's free and, anda lot of the people who are economically
challenged may maybe don't have the timeor the ability to get to these locations.
And so now they're doingMobilePay neuter clinic.
That, that's, that's really the key.
It's the spay and neuteris, is the answer.
(28:58):
So people are
breeding
dogs and then they sell 'em and then those
dogs are not
backyard
spayed And
do they do when they don't sell them?
They dump 'em at the pound.
Oh
so, and you've seen these guys atWalmart holding up a little chihuahua,
you know, dog for sale or whatever,you know, it just, . Honestly, I
(29:18):
don't think they're bad people.
I just
don't
think they're
they're part of the solution.
Yeah And why in the south is it such anissue Is it their climate It's just more
happening there
it's a lot warmer.
The dogs are out, running around.
They're, they're not really house dogs.
(29:38):
mean, my dogs sleep on my bed with me.
All right.
In
. Mine does
too Yeah
you go.
Yeah
in the south they just kind of run wildand, and it's also a cultural thing.
They like to keep their dogs intact,you know, maybe a more of a macho thing.
I don't know.
but it certainly seems to fit and itjust, so they're out there breeding
(30:00):
like crazy the puppies get pregnant.
The, these dogs get pregnant.
The owner.
either kill the puppies or theydump the puppies at the pound.
you know, puppies actually gopretty quickly in the pound.
Everybody wants a littlepuppy until they figure out.
And a lot of 'em are returned becausethese, they don't know what the breed is.
(30:20):
And then suddenly this puppyis like 90 pound mask or
something like that, , massive
Hmm
And you know, they don'thave room for that.
And I go, well, I haveroom for it, but Yeah.
It's, it's an educational issue.
And if, uh, they shouldstart teaching it in schools.
I mean, it's, it's just toteach the kids how to be good.
(30:40):
And there's, is it,that brings up a point.
We used to do, um, a critter camp with,uh, Merced and Missoula, and once a
month I would fly an aircraft full.
Of animals up, and they would have aday camp for these kids the week, and
they would sign and assign the animalto this one child, and the child would
(31:02):
learn how to groom it, how to, youknow, how feed it and how to walk in
voice commands and stuff like that.
How to foster the animal.
And of course, , you know, thedeep, dark secret is that we
want this to be a failed foster.
Where , where the parents say, okay,well it's time to take the dog back and
, and the child is gonna go, you can't
So maybe, maybe that's manipulatinga little bit, but who cares?
(31:25):
If it gets a job done?
It gets a job done.
We're not harming.
Sure And with all these dogs that youall have saved just remarkable remarkable
numbers There are there any otherorganizations that are doing this as well
There are a lot there are alot of transport organizations,
but they're ground transport.
(31:46):
Mm-hmm
there's one other, but they're, they'rerunning into a little difficulty right
now with some personality issues.
They're based out of la and ofcourse there's the pilots and PAW
organization where you can fly theone dog the one time and and stuff.
when, when I was flying the dogsin the 2 0 6, we, uh, it costs us
(32:07):
about $75 per animal per transport.
And you go, well, that's not so, Andthen we get the caravan and it costs
us 750 bucks an hour to run this thing.
But through economies of scale.
Now the cost is about $50 per animalper transport, and that's about the
same cost as a, um, a spay neuter fee.
(32:30):
Actually, the vets maybe evencharge a little bit more.
so it's, it's cost effective.
And I mean, I, I say the more themerrier, you know, if, if you have an
airplane, and you want to put a dog init and fly it somewhere, that's great.
The, the problem is itends up costing them about.
A thousand bucks to transport thisone animal, and we're doing it for 50.
(32:51):
but they're, they like to flyand as I said earlier, they're
using the animal as an excuse.
By the way, a shout out to Dr.
Brent Blue, who lives in Jackson.
He's one of our volunteer pilots andhas just got back from flight safety
doing his annual, recurrent training.
He's looking forward.
about 12 or 15 rescuemissions for us this year.
(33:15):
We ask each of our pilots to flyabout between 10 and 15, depending
on what their, their schedule allows.
And right now we're, we already have ourschedule and it, we'll, we're gonna be
flying hundred and over a hundred rescueflights that we have on the calendar now.
We leave some blanks in there forthings that come We're, we're
(33:36):
frequently asked if we go and respondto, say, a hurricane situation or a
flood situation, and go rescue thosedogs, well we did that when they had
floods down in New Orleans so, we did.
They had the floods in New Orleans.
The shelters are killing up.
(33:57):
fly the caravan down there, fly the.
up to Seattle and, andWyoming and all over the west.
And then about a week later, the ownersare coming in looking for their dogs.
. What
So we don't do it that way anymore,
huh
if, if we have enough heads up andthere's a storm coming, we'll fly down
(34:19):
and empty the shelters so that thedogs that are recovered can stay in the
shelters till their owners come to them.
Do you follow?
. Yeah.
that makes sense
we, we did it perfectly backward.
Just yet.
Another mistake that, that wemade, no, no one was harmed.
And you know, they say, well, we wantyou to go and bring that dog back.
(34:40):
I go, no, I
Hm Well we all there's as we grow in anybusiness in in life we we make mistakes
but it doesn't mean it's an intentional
harmful mistake but you learn from itand you figure out okay how can we still
accomplish our goal but just make theeffort better so we don't have the same
(35:00):
mistake
we, I have a lot of people helpingwe've got it pretty much wired now.
We know, we tag all the animals, reverseload them according to destination.
And, um, and all the health certificatesthat go into an envelope, we have how
many crates are getting out, not howmany animals, cuz we count the crates
and sometimes there are, there are twoanimals in a, in a much larger crate.
(35:25):
know, a nursing mother with four or fiveof her pups, you know, will be in one
Hmm
So that that's,
Remarkable work Peter
Remarkable work
and
I, I'm really proud of, of, andbelieve me, I have a lot of help.
and, um, just as when I waspracticing orthopedics in
Jackson, I had a lot of help too.
(35:46):
A lot of great people there.
And, uh, and a shout out toTeun Outpatient services.
The, the, uh, outpatient surgical clinicthat I started back in the late nineties
or whatever, put me in, in a bad way withthe hospital, but the patients loved.
And when you so do you guys havea a network of shelters where
(36:09):
you guys are running these routes
with
All
do.
And that's we, I have two, KaraPollard, who's our executive director
and primary fundraiser is also ourChief Rescue flight coordinator.
got to be too much for her as wekept scaling up and expanding.
(36:29):
So we now have two full-time rescueflight coordinators and they'll make
sure that, that numbers of animalsthat they want to put on the plane
is realistic in both directions.
We're not gonna fly downand, and fly five dogs out.
That just doesn't make senseus economically when we can go
Mm
(36:50):
and fill the aircraft so they know
Sure
aircraft every time.
what we don't want to happen ishave to leave five or 10 animals
the tarmac cuz there's no room.
they learn of the crate, theylearn the number of the crates.
The rescue flight coordinators,uh, Du and Kara Pollard There's,
(37:12):
there's a group in El Paso, Kayla,she's just an absolute sweetheart.
and she was featured on the c v s Sundaymorning piece that Connor Knighton
did, uh, with us a couple years ago.
And they actually built amockup of the interior of the
aircraft and practiced loading.
it's the only
place
I go
go to where I just stand there at four30 in the morning and drink my coffee.
(37:34):
And these gals are in there justputting those crates in like a Tetris
master, I mean, and no space left.
And they know exact, and we've beenfully flown so many flights for them.
And it, it's such a pleasurewhen you're working with the
same group over and over again.
They become such great friends.
And so this is, I've, I've startedtaking the rescue flight coordinators,
(37:58):
Kara and Lynette along on these flights.
I said, you know, you'venever really met these.
need me to meet these people?
You're on the phone with them all thetime and, uh, you know, I know their face.
And so they actually just last week gotback from a 10 day, road trip around
Texas with all of our Texas partners.
And rarely we're, we're sourcing about90% of all our animals out of Texas.
(38:19):
Now it, it's, it's a mess and
Hmm
I, I think that.
Care, or maybe they can't afford it.
I, I don't know.
But you go into the sheltersdown in Edinburgh or down in
Laredo on these border towns,
mm-hmm
break your heart.
It'll, it'll
Hmm
break your heart.
And you think, it smellsbad in the airplane.
(38:41):
You go into those sheltersand it, it just, it's brutal.
And got the, the volunteerswho go in there and work.
They're the heroes in my book, not, not
mm-hmm
receiving group.
They're great too, but the sending groups,they're making do with absolutely nothing.
It's just a absolutely a labor of love,
(39:03):
What a big win for them to see allthose dogs um leave that kill shelter
as well
real
Mm-hmm
It's just, and this is whatI love about these folks.
They are emotionally involved.
They, and they, we could, we couldfly for the same group every week.
(39:23):
Every week, but there are othergroups in that same situation.
So I let the gals, I, I paint withbroad strokes where we're gonna do the
flights, how we're gonna do it, howwe're gonna coordinate it so we don't.
Send a pilot, A down and back, they'reout there for three or four or five
days sometimes stringing together alot of these trips to save, having
(39:46):
come back to the home base and theadditional expense of flying the aircraft
empty and we almost never fly, empty.
Uh, and so for an example,mentioned I get in the plane, I
fly down to Hobbs, New Mexico.
Well, what I do on the way down,I'll stop in Rock Springs in Salt
Lake City and I'll pick up the crate.
That I left off with the animals.
(40:07):
Ah
so then I return the empty crates,um, to the sending group because then,
Uhhuh
are used over and over and over again,they, they get, there's a lot of wear
and tear and once a month we havea dog that breaks out of its crate.
And it's, uh, you know,the first time you noticed.
they work their way up through the front.
(40:28):
And then you have this hotbreath on your neck, , and you
go and, and there's this dog.
And you wonder, well,I hope it's friendly.
Well, of course it's friendly becausethe sending group not going to send a
dog with behavioral issues to a receiving
Hmm
because that's the last time thereceiving group will ever work with them.
(40:50):
So the, the receiving groups will.
cherry pick the animals thatare most likely to be adopted.
Because remember, this is they'regoing to non kelp, and those,
Mm-hmm
if they, it doesn't work out, notflying 'em back to be euthanized uhuh.
That's not what we do.
Yeah.
I, mean you gotta adopt 'em out Youwant it to be a successful adoption
(41:12):
so other people hear about it andwanna go to that shelter as well so
Yeah I uh, you know, the, when wewere a child, you'd go to the pet
store and you'd buy your dog there.
I mean, that's the way it used to be.
Nobody knew about the pound, you know.
Mm-hmm
That's the best place for it.
And as I mentioned, you can goto Petfinder and you can find
(41:33):
whatever you want out there.
And honestly, if it's in Texas andit's coming in this direction, if
you wanna throw it on one of ourflights, we're happy to do it.
You just reach out to Kara, poweredat kara dog co-pilot dot org.
K a R a dog co-pilot org.
So what's the website
It's
if people wanted to reach out and
(41:54):
donate to you guys
Dub dog co-pilot dot org.
has
Mm-hmm
a link on there where you can donateand it has a lot of the stories,
has pictures of the pilots, uh,has pictures of the board members.
It has a lot of the interviews,uh, that I've done over the years.
We would love to include this one ifwe could put a link on, on our website.
(42:16):
We've got, I, don't do Facebook.
I mean, I did, It just, when Ifinally shut it down, I felt like
I graduated from high school.
It's
. Ah
It was, uh, it just took up so much time.
But we have, you know, tens ofthousands of followers for D I M C.
um, they'll, they'll go to the website,they'll, they'll pick up your podcast
(42:39):
and probably listen to some of theother podcasts, which I'm going to.
Thank you Thank you Well it's storieslike yours or for people who are
making a a difference and making animpact and uh in in the world And
as you said earlier be a part of
Yeah Yeah It it's you might notrealize it Mm-hmm it's not hard
(43:02):
to be a part of the solution andthere's a lot of dogs out there that
can bring lots of joy to different
families
or individuals as well
see stray dogs running around.
you
Mm
see that.
you go down to the Central Valleyof Merced, you'll, see stray
dogs on every street corner.
It's, it's heartbreaking.
mm
And, these dogs have beenliving on their own and they're,
(43:25):
they're hard to trap sometimes.
And
I
bet they are
and then with the cats, you know,they have the, a catch and release.
What they do, they'll catch the cat,spay a neuter of the animal, kind
of clip its ear, so you can telland then release it back into the.
. And that way
Mm-hmm
(43:45):
capture it again and they see theclipped ear, they just kind of let it go.
But, uh, that's what they'redoing in the larger cities
and that's a terrific program.
Doesn't work so well with, with dogs.
more of a dog person anyway.
My youngest wants two cats and my wife'sgonna take him to volunteer at the agency
to help clean the litter boxes and helptake care of the cats to see if he really
(44:11):
wants to help take care of a cat before
he gets
any cat
at the Animal Adoption Center, they'llfos, they'll, they'll keep cats there.
They foster all the dogs out.
don't keep any dogs there.
. There's also the, the, um,shelter that's just south of
town by the recycling center,
Yes sir
might want to take him in there,
(44:32):
. There's plenty of volunteer opportunities for him to learn how
to clean a litter box before uh
right?
he there's we've had a cat beforeand cleaning the litter box is not my
idea of fun But um we have a dog as
well so
so, and
Well
have you.
we actually got a full
breed
(44:53):
dog but we started my first dog Flashcame from the Animal Adoption Agency
when Cupcakes started it And he camefrom a no-kill shelter And to see
how he progressed as I had him asI had flash over the years was just
remarkable And he was just a sweet sweet
dog
(45:13):
know, they
And then
our emotions on the animals.
who says
that has
has never had a dog, I mean,
Yeah
have real emotions and you,
How do they do
grateful.
are
Mm-hmm
I mean, I, my two dogs that areright here, I've got a golden
and a black lab, and they're.
(45:34):
Purebred dogs.
I mean, but they ended up on my
Hmm
I mean, I didn't, didn'tgo looking for them.
If someone asked if I would transportthem, it was a night, like an
owner surrender kind of thing.
And
Mm-hmm
I said, yeah, I'll transportthem right to my house.
good I'm glad you had 'em And we triedadopting a dog but the dog we were not
(45:58):
the right family for that dog And whatwe paid for the adoption fees from the
shelter Um they said Well, we'll givethem back to you I said no keep the
adoption the fees that we pay to helpfind the right family for this dog So
that's not a barrier for the dog to be
(46:20):
adopted And they they
found a family for that dog which
story.
Uh, over a third of
hmm
that are adopted are returned.
. just doesn't fit and they
don't
fit for
for any number of reasons.
But
Mm-hmm
you know what they would do in Texas if itdidn't fit, drive along the highway, open
(46:41):
the door, kick the dog out, and take off.
That's what they do.
Brutal.
a shame.
shame.
Yeah.
The punish
It's a shame
be great.
Yeah.
Well, Dr.
Rourke, Peter, I will letyou get back to your day.
I've so enjoyed hearing the impactin the world that you're making,
and thank you for saving all thesedogs' lives and, and even the cats
(47:04):
as Well,
Stephen, thank you so much for your time.
Thanks for, uh, helpingus get the word out.
Jackson's my home.
I love Jackson.
my kids grew up there.
Graduated Jackson High School.
My son is still.
There, he, uh, tends bar at the coach andand one of the Thai restaurants in town.
So say hi to Buller when you goby and I mean, people will look at
(47:27):
him though, so you have to be Dr.
Rourke's kid.
I mean, he's like a minime , he's such a great guy too.
Oh, he smokes.
What was your kid?
I'm sure he is
you so much for
Yeah
for having me.
Thanks for, uh,
You're welcome
Dog as my copart.
You're
welcome Have a great day
To learn more about PeterRourke and Dog is my co-pilot.
(47:50):
Visit the Jackson holeconnection.com, episode number 231.
Folks, get out there andhelp save some animals.
You can donate todayto Dog is my co-pilot.
Go to their website.
and share this podcast.
Maybe there's some other dog lovers andcat lovers that you know and they would
enjoy listening to the history and howthese dogs and cats are flown around the
(48:13):
country to save them from kill shelters.
Thank you to Michael for producing,marketing and editing this podcast,
and of course to my lovely wifeLaura, and my boys Lewis and William.
your time is valuable andI appreciate your time.
I'm grateful for you spending yourtime with me and sharing your time
with me, and I will see you here backagain next week for another episode
(48:38):
of the Jackson Hole Connection.
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