Tristan Layton

Episode Transcript
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(00:00):
All right, Did I start coughing right after I hit your core?
You really? Yeah.
All right. Today I'm interviewing Tristan
Layton. He is a good friend of mine.
We go to church together, and heis a physical therapist
assistant. So, Tristan, how are things in
your world? Doing great me Blackmore more

(00:21):
than I deserve. That's great.
Yeah, same here. So just something we want to hit
on real quick or not quick, giveit all the time it deserves, but
is your testimony. So just kind of walk us through
as much as you're comfortable. Yeah, sure.
So I. Think I'm.
Trying to get the timeline rightbecause I do want to give me
some good feedback. I kind of go back to what Jane

(00:42):
was just talking about a few weeks ago, T on your every
testimony being a miracle. I thought that was a really good
way he put that, you know? Oh yeah, obviously with us, none
of us really deserve. I've thought about that a lot
since he said that. Me too, and I don't to be 100%
honest, I've never really like Inever thought with that, but it
was always like, yeah, you know,I just grew up in church like
man, but what you know what a blessing if somebody did yeah, I

(01:03):
mean that's that's that's a miracle in itself.
So yeah, for sure that really like that kind of shown some
bigger light online. But I had a awesome elementary
school teacher, Sandy Jackson was her name.
She to kind of go back a little bit more.
But my family, my step grandpa on my mother's side of was a
pastor for a long time and they kind of go to church and out of

(01:26):
church after he got done pastoring.
And we really when I was growingup until I got to about third
grade, we didn't really go much.And then I had Sandy Jackson as
a she was my third grade teacher.
She invited my mother and I at this time, it was just a little
bit around. I think there's shortly after

(01:47):
this, I'm starting when my parents are divorced.
So there's a lot of things kind of like change them all.
And and we started going on Sundays, started learning more.
And that's why I was 10 when I got saved, got back saved back
that same day. So that was pretty awesome.
Sorry and thank you and my grandpa, the same one as a
pastor. I'll call pop for work Dick of

(02:08):
thieves, but he kind of, you know, took another way and kind
of explained a little bit more on it.
You know, we talked about it andthen we still went some but
until I got to about a sophomorein high school is kind of like
we go week and then go a few weeks and ring this one go a few
weeks after I got in high school.
One of my best friends still to say being and by me, his dad's

(02:31):
pastor about 10 minutes away from I grew up starting going to
his year troop and then I started dating my wife at that
point and then I was like man. A sophomore year.
I was, let's see, we started being being started being
friends. It was my sophomore year and I
started dating my wife my senioryear high school.
So you guys are high school sweetheart?
I guess that's great. Yeah.

(02:51):
Thank you man. And at that point I was just
kind of I like that was very convicted me because I was very
nominal at that point like. You're very what?
Nominal in my fate. What does that mean?
I would. Go and like just check the boxes
kind. Of like, oh, right.
I thought, well, you know, I'm not mean to people so that you
shouldn't be good enough, you know, and really that's just,
that's not really. It's important, but like, why

(03:13):
are you doing it exactly? There are much more important
things to take correct relationship, but I feel like,
you know, the most single most sport thing about us on earth is
to have a relationship with Christ and then to help grow
other people's relationship withChrist.
So people the gospel and I was pretty much probably, to be
honest, more just like a selfishkind of view, like I'm good, you
know, so long as I'm at other men mean to other people and

(03:35):
treat people fairly well, I should be OK.
Right. And kind of once I got, I think
we, well, Hannah was a big influence on me saying like your
wife. Yes, Sir, yes.
Alright man, I can't wait to getthis together.
No, you're good. No, that does not mean need to
be polished or anything. But was me and her I thought I

(03:59):
really need to lock in and like our and she wouldn't caringly
tell us there's only one marriage and our parents and
grandparents, aunts and uncles that have stayed together with
the person they originally got married to Randy, you know, and
I thought, you know, I think I'mgoing to be a spiritual leader

(04:20):
in a household. I've really need to get this
together. So really about that point like
so you think about my senior year, I was like, you know, I'm
I need to really dive into this a little more.
I think it was probably around like my 1617 when the girl saved
to him 1617. I was kind of like, OK, like you
need to build a heavy relationship with Christ.
And luckily it's I've not been perfect by any means, but that

(04:43):
kind of write me on a better trajectory.
And especially after we've been married five year, it'll be five
years, May 23rd and our marriagehas been like so I mean the Lord
ordains all things but and this is one thing where it's like a
definitely put in my life like OK, I'm going to you need you
need a good woman to help you. Yeah, for sure.

(05:03):
So the Lord has been super faithful as a great thank you
any as he always is. And yeah, since then we've we
moved here four years ago and that's one thing that has been
good about our relationship is we've tried to always stay
consistent by going to church together.
Yeah, that's great. Thank you.
And I think that that has been such a, a bedrock of us being,

(05:29):
we're not perfect by any means, but having good commutative
skills and relying on the Lord first.
Yeah. And I think that has been a a
big help. So I guess and let's show this.
That's kind of it, man. Yeah, that's great.
And you guys go to a Grace marriage group?
We have went to a couple of the Ignite events and wonderful.
They're very valued. I do think a marriage group

(05:51):
would be super official for us, absolutely.
Yeah, that's the one I really want to interview is is Brad
Rhodes. That there's still wealth of not
and especially someone that's been married that long, you
know, it's Christ, right? Like I'm just, I just want to
listen to you talk. Yeah, right.
I could do a whole separate podcast just with episodes of
him one. 100%. Yeah, he's got, I mean, he's
super smart and like you're saying, just have wealth and

(06:11):
knowledge. Yeah.
But one thing about the podcast,one of the reasons I wanted to
start it is just that idea of like every testimony is a
miracle. Absolutely.
And, and like, just because someone doesn't like, isn't like
on stage at church every week, doesn't mean they're like a
strong Christian with a, with a great testimony and, and great

(06:35):
insights and stuff. So look, I've already forgotten
something. So when you became a Christian
or whenever you, you started like really get back into your
senior year as you're like, I need to build my life on the
foundation of Christ. Did you, were you mentored by

(06:59):
anyone? Like did you go looking for a
mentor or is it just kind of like in the word and, and just
praying and like going to, you know what I mean?
Sure, yeah, good question. My like I said, my grandfather
pop like home. So that's actually my mom's dead
Dad, we talked about that. We got we had a lot of good
discussions on it. Yeah.
And that I think that was a goodspiritual insight.

(07:22):
Y'all, we're getting like that realization of, you know, I, I
need to get together. I think was a lot of the Holy
Spirit kind of convicting me, tobe honest, you know, yeah.
And then kind of me sharing withPop on that that was a big, big
influence on me. I and probably quite honestly,
up until the last probably six to seven years, I probably had

(07:44):
too big of a ego to really probably say, hey, I really
like. I need some direction on this.
And, you know, thank you. Relinquishing over that control
to the Holy Spirit. I literally have no control or
anything. Yeah, you do.
I just really need your help because I cannot figure anything
else out on my own. I think if I had to been a

(08:06):
little bit more rather proactiveon that, I probably would have
been better about getting maybe even another mentor.
And Pop was great and he still is.
We're still talk about things tothe state, spirit, anything in
between. And as I've grown too, you know
I've had. A lot of good.
Mentors in the church and good mentors at my former church.
My former pastor Barry Cohen wasgreat.

(08:27):
We've met him, met him full time.
So just had conversations or just had general conversation
that was dead, dead Mike is awesome.
Same principle that so as I've aged up, I think the Lord's put
different people in their life, but it's just no, no strength of
my own. But I've definitely been humbled
and realize like the humility iswhat you need to have that

(08:48):
mentor. So I think I probably stalled
and I I probably, I did stall some of my growth was that
honestly, it wasn't. But, you know, having that
openness and just, you know, Roman stating you there's no
condemnation for those who are in Christ.
Jerry's kind of relinquishing that over to thank you.
The Lord knew everything you didwhen he decided to go the cross
for you. It's not going to, you know,
nothing's going to change with that.

(09:08):
Yeah. You know, so I do think the
mentorship is like just could not be stated on how important
it is. I mean, thank God that's helped
a lot. You can search out like Rd.
groups and have a community groups like that.
That's helped a lot. As far as I am way mentorship
might not be necessarily on a long one basis, but having other

(09:29):
people that are to the that are willing to lift you up and say,
Hey, I'm struggling with this too.
I pray over there too. I think you can have that like
mentorship, leadership kind of conversation with people.
I mean, just like we same thing with youth like this meaning to
offer somebody else save the income and you'll.
So that was really the biggest thing is the beginning of my

(09:50):
walk. Yeah, say yeah.
And, and you are pretty active in the youth group here.
I'm at the church. I haven't been in a while since
as I got older, I kind of went less and less sure, which I
mean, I probably still show you on kind of like as a in more of

(10:13):
a leadership role. And they even offered that and I
said, no, I'm too busy, right? Which like, I didn't I I don't
have my priorities straight probably.
I don't know if you. Have and that's probably
something I should look into, but but if you want to just talk
a little bit about what you do at youth, yeah, yeah.
Because you're not in middle school, but you still go.

(10:34):
Yeah, no, thanks for that and thanks for your vulnerability
too. But again, that takes a lot man.
And. You know, I kind of.
I've started, I'll kind of even take you back if it's OK.
A little bit further from that, I had a oh, that's Laura
Chillanga now, but a woman I watched church with who led to
worship her and Abby Snow and two sisters former church.

(10:54):
I used to go to Provincial Baptist, same one very cool and
pastor I had prior to when Hannah and I moved here to
Owensboro, they invited me to help.
It was a church camp called CampClark and it was all it's all
high school at that time as middle schoolers and high
schoolers, but always kind of had the draw drawing to high
schoolers. I'm at this point, I'm fresh out

(11:14):
of high school working construction.
I was just like, I mean, I couldn't just to be honest.
I mean, I couldn't be making money.
I don't know, you know, my mom was to go back like spiritual
leadership. My mom.
It's been cool to see like, you know, she's the one who started
taking me when, you know, like Isaid, Miss Sam started him.
She's with the Lord now. But my my mom is the one started

(11:35):
taking me then. And it's been cool to see like
we've grown spiritually togethertoo.
But my mom is the one that prompted me then.
She was like, you really should go like she was.
I think you do good. And obviously Laura thanks you.
But and I was the back of my head tells like I'm busy.
I got a lot of stuff to do. No, I'm 17.
I just graduated high school. You know, I'm like, whatever.
Yeah, I guess I'll go. To the This is camp.
Called OK, yeah, then I was justgoing to be a volunteer to help,

(11:56):
you know, maybe lead a discussion, maybe just make sure
kids don't know absolutely insane, you know, and I was
like, whatever man, I went and you talk about just like a big
spiritual knowing like check in a good way, but a big humbling
in a in a big way. And also I've seen this, like,

(12:17):
you know, how much the Lord can see people when they're
unwilling and they become willing and which was an example
with me and how much should that?
Because the thing about this is same thing with like, you know,
they I know they have like somebody now conferences or they
have chrysalis here walk Emmaus,things like that.
You know, your whole time said the whole timetable is nothing
but derived on Christ, right. There's no exterior resources.

(12:39):
You don't have your font. Well, little as would have had
the phone. There's no outdoor or there's no
extrinsic things, you know, grabbing for your attention.
It's all just focused on the Lord.
And I went, that first album waslike, and this is this is great.
Yeah, this is good. Because it's, you know, I mean,
if you know, I don't, have you ever done anything like that at
camp? Or yeah, I have.
So you can attest to it? Is it not crazy?

(13:01):
It's, I mean, it's just like every single second of the day
you're doing something. And if you're not learning about
Jesus, then you're connecting with the people around you.
Yeah. Exactly.
The fellowship is like, you can't, Yeah, you can't replicate
that, right? Yeah.
And what camp do you go to? So I've been to a few different
camps. I I went to crossings.

(13:21):
Nice. Yeah.
And I've been to this thing called Camp live in Evansville,
which that's just for elementaryschoolers.
And so after so then when I was in middle school, I was like a
like a not like a leader there, but like, like an assistant to
leader or something like that. It's similar to that's.
What I was saying, yeah, that's awesome.

(13:43):
Yeah. And so you can attest to this,
too. And yeah, after that, I helped
for a few years and it was just like every year.
I was just, you know, thought the Lord was like, that's good.
You're doing like this is what you're supposed to do, man.
Yeah. And that was.
Obviously just such a blessing. I had great help there.
We had great help, great friends.
I built a lot of like concrete relationships there.

(14:08):
Two of my best friends helped a few years, which was fantastic.
And that was just, I mean, fruitful beyond measure, you
know. Yeah.
And I think, you know, I just kind of put a higher importance
on maintaining that like throughout, you know, because
I've. It's so hard because, you know,
you leave and it's like, OK, I've, I've developed this
relationship, but the Lord is better.

(14:29):
I've, I've kind of found some things I didn't find before I
was able to and people. It is, it is.
It's wonderful to see how much more I would say than a normal
service people are willing to ask for prayer or do that
because it's like everybody elseis like, well, out of here.
I might as well. Yeah.
And nothing. The Holy Spirit just works on a
whim. I don't mean it like that, but

(14:50):
people are so much more, I guessapt to probably responsive and
and it's maintaining that responsiveness throughout.
You know, it's that was really inspiring seeing either me
talking to kids outside of it orcreating relationships and
checking in with them. But that was wonderful.
And then as I helped for a few years with that, then I ran the

(15:10):
camp for a few years and that was awesome too.
And I just really enjoyed it. And I think that was such a big
influence on how I like gain my yearning for the for youth, for
high schoolers. Yeah, 'cause man, I think that
you're just obviously you see kids a lot of people dismiss and

(15:32):
I was like, well, they're just, they're bad kid or they just
like they can't get together, right.
And then the depths of mercy that we need is a lot more than
we can get on our own. Yeah.
And I think the Lord sublicatingyou with that is so important
because I've seen a lot of kids like there's one year I did

(15:55):
that. This kind of goes on that too,
because I was trying to realize how much I missed out on high
school from a witnessing standpoint to I think he was
convicting to that too, because I was like, you know, I was just
that nominal level like, and like we were talking about, and
how many people would I miss outfor the lower binding that way,
you know, and I thought, man, you know, not doing this just as

(16:15):
I could get myself right. I'm I'm earning myself a better
standing. No, because we can't earn
anything. Right, you know, I'm, I'm doing
discipleship as a Lord would want me to, but I had one year
and I don't remember how many kids were.
I think I probably had like 16, right?
That's usually when I was like 1618 kids, you know, because it
was just high school while I wasdoing it seemed like every kid

(16:38):
they come up with something parental like my mother, father
with this so that you know, So Ithink about like the leadership
and the father ship that the Lord provides.
And when people are yearning forsomething and I think everything
that somebody, especially as a kid, like there's something
adverse that's happened that there that's wanting to fill a
gap. Yeah, I'm not saying I'm a

(16:58):
psychologist. I'm going to break it down for
you. I don't mean it like that.
But I I know that anytime that Ihave done things that are stupid
in my life or I have talked to other people or how the root of
that is, you know, not feeling like they're enough and trying
to supplicate that gap with something sinful, which I am
super guilty of not saying that I'm clean of that by any.

(17:19):
Right, but. I think just saying that
thought, man, you know, I can, you can have a position where
you can help people see like howthey can feel that.
And I feel like probably like 15to 18 is really like you.
You come into who you're going to be as a man.
Or a whole life for sure. And like, if you can supplicate
a lot of those things where it'slike generational sin or things

(17:40):
that like your family has done quote UN quote as a normal, you
know, there's threats of relative truth and so much
normals that if you can help kind of rewire just, you know,
like Ralph Shelf, you know, don't conform yourself.
The times of this world, you know, transform your mind.
And I think that. Being.
Someone that can help with that?The Lord obviously controls all

(18:04):
things with if I can be a you know, a cog and a big gear to
help with that. That was kind of my my yearning
for youth and obviously doing this by cast us have a
relationship that'd be awesome, but it's it's just really good.
It's rewarding. I did too.
Like I don't think I could even find anything to compare it to
on how much, you know, even justthrough prayer or like the

(18:25):
weekend when we're able to kind of have it and have that extra
time or even just going to youthon Wednesdays that, you know,
kid, you know, one of the kids is where you could come up and
talk and just having a conversation about the Lord or
just talking in general. You know it's right.
It's. Fruitful.
I really enjoy that. I think that's, I think the
Lord. I think it's one thing that
people miss out on. Like the Lord has something for

(18:46):
everybody and there's no higher importance or lesser than
importance than anything else. But I just feel like that is one
thing that the Lord's kind of put on my heart to do for sure.
Yeah, that's, that's great. And, and I mean, that's a really
important thing that that's needed is, is that like

(19:10):
leadership that because I mean, kids go their whole life and
they, and hopefully they've got 2 parents in the homes, but a
lot of times they don't. And then and then you go to
school and you've got these teachers, but the teachers
aren't there to mentor you per SE, especially if you go to like
a public school, like a big public school, their job is to
teach you and then you're on at a new classes in and then

(19:32):
they're teaching that class likethey're not.
I'm not saying there's teachers who don't do this, but a lot of
times at a public school or big public school, your teachers
aren't going to be going out of their way to make more
one-on-one conversation with you.
Make sure that things are OK at home and even at a private
school. I mean, like, I know our private

(19:53):
schools, like private Christian schools where where I've gone
most of my life, teachers are a lot more proactive and a lot of
times the class sizes are small,but it's still that teacher to
to pupil relationship. Like it's like, I don't think a
lot of kids are as open to talking to their teachers as
they would someone from like a youth camp who's like they're

(20:17):
just for the kids. They're just to mentor the kids
to make sure that they're doing all right.
And especially in this culture we have now where?
Where like rebelling against your parents is put in a
limelight like this is cool and and not even but and then also

(20:37):
you have kids who who just maybedon't have a mom or don't have a
dad or don't have either It's it's really sad.
Or or maybe they have a bad relationship with one of their
parents And and it's so important that there's godly men
to be a father figure if needed and godly woman to be.
Like a. Mother figure if needed.
And and so I mean, I really think that's great work that

(21:00):
you're doing and it it's really important.
And you mentioned the weekend. Yeah, I'd like you to talk a
little bit about that for cause like I've never been like I've
always had something going on. Sure, but it's it's pretty cool.
Yeah, it's great. Yeah.
Thank you, man. Yeah.
So our of course, our church present Valley puts on there's

(21:22):
other churches that usually would come in honestly forgotten
who the other church was last year about that bridge point.
I thought you too. It was so that's Friday.
Friday night. We were Friday afternoon we meet
at the church, then we stay at ahost home.
So a host home was just one of the members of the church was

(21:45):
kind enough to OfferUp their home for some kids and a couple
mentors to stay in. And they go from middle school
to high school. I've always just been lucky
enough I've had high school boys.
Yeah, so and I'm also just as wild and crazy as 17 year old
still. So I get to let that out a
little bit. Yes, it's nice.

(22:06):
But Friday, Friday night, we meet the church.
We'll have a short session and then we we break the host homes.
And then Saturday you're together all day.
So usually we'll have a message,some games and 10 just to kind
of create some bondings with with each other.
Kind of we're talking about justcreate some fellowship and then
we'll have a little bit of time just for discussion over the
message. We have a lot of that, which is

(22:28):
fantastic. Then we have a little bit of
free time just where you can, you know, bond with the kids,
don't ever do whatever you'd like.
And then we have another meeting.
At the church. Another message and then one
thing that Dan implemented this year that's been really good is
we started in come along one meetings.
So it would be kind of similar to this, you know, and it was to

(22:51):
ask you kind of OK, very honest questions, you know, have you
been saved? What's it what, what does it
mean to be saved? You know, just because kind of
we go back to that nominal level, there's a lot of people
kind of genuine hits on this too.
But you know, I go to church because my parents go to church.
All right, forget this is kind of off subject, but I'll read

(23:14):
about. It absolutely go ahead.
I went to me and friend went to it was a a Dina, the kids when I
had like a Dinale, a what a discipleship man.
It's kind of like a non scrap, kind of like just like a youth
function that there's different ones all the way around, but
it's kind of similar to the weekend.
But it's like widespread to whatI understand it to be.
And then they had some speakers,the DNR kids were there some.

(23:37):
And then other than that, it wasjust general speakers.
I don't remember who even I think it was a patient.
And Tom maybe told me about it. Spent a few years ago.
And man, like I said, my friend Ben went and there was this kid
up in front. This guy was up there preaching
and he said, you know what He said, why do you go to church?
Why do you live in Jesus, you know, And which I know I kind of
asked, looking back, I asked that in front of the crowd, I

(23:59):
guess, you know, I don't know ifthe kid would really meant this
or if he was just nervous. Would you rather my parents told
me, My parents told me to my parents told me to go to church.
It's like I don't if the kid wasserious.
Oh man, that's not good. Anyway, I just been home freaked
out because somebody asked me infront of a room of 500 people.
You know, put, I think that there's just a high level of

(24:25):
kind of like that nominal level of like, I just go because my
parents tell me to remove. My parents haven't had that
conversation. So those are one ones kind of
help with OK, like, you know, what are you saying?
What do you think and why do youthink it not in a way that's
like, Oh, I'm I'm going to, you know, I'm like Charles Berger
going to take you some not like that.
But it's like we need to kind ofhave those hard conversations

(24:46):
because you may never know. You know, I kind of even go off
piggyback off that. I had a patient once that was
telling me about her parents andher dad.
They went to church like every Sunday.
Yeah, like one of those people, like went like every time doors
were open, we went, you know, and she said that they went the
entire, this is Chris still. Like it's with ministry story.
She said her and her parents, you know, of course, I think she

(25:08):
might have said, like, I'll remember this part, but went to
church. And then her dad got like, I'll,
I don't know if he had some heart disease, he went up or
maybe cancer. But I remember he was like, was
a little sick. Then he got really sick.
Yeah. I mean, I was talking and he
just went to church and wasn't abeliever.
And they went to church for like40 years.
Wow. And she was able to share the
gospel kind of and talk about it.
And then he was OK, you know, inthe accepted Christ before he
died. Wow.

(25:29):
But could you imagine like, you know, that long going to church?
I think there's a lot of that, even mental leadership roles
that are just there just to kindof nod the head and go, Yep,
we're going to church and there's no fruit there.
You know and. I think that kind of go off your
point. I think there's a lot of like

(25:49):
that relative truth normality ofmen, especially because women
are usually the ones that like we need to go to church and do
this and check on all the kids making sure you're loved.
And I think that, yeah, there's a big lacking for men to have
that spiritual, I guess, you know, spiritual umph or a true
relationship. And maybe it's not, you know, I
don't know if I need to tell everybody I need him.

(26:09):
Kind of like we're going off of having too much ego early, you
know, And I think that's kind ofplayed with the church a little
bit. So luckily our church does not
have that's not our mindset, butI think that is not Even so much
church much as it is like we talked about the world's kind of
like culture a little bit. I think it's improved as yours

(26:30):
are on. But back the weekend, sorry, but
kind of help. Those are the ones help kind of
like smooth those things out. You know, it's like, you know,
what do you think? Why do you think it?
Then you're able to have good conversations and it's very
honest, like good questions backand forth.
So that's Saturday. That kind of ends your Saturday,
and then Sunday we all go to worship together, we assume.

(26:51):
Unity and community. And then everybody disperses.
So it's good this it's it's likea, you know, like mini camp.
You know, you've got that bread Friday night and I'm I'm, you
know, I just kind of let I'm always tell the boys I've had
the same group and they're and they're great.

(27:12):
I'm always like, hey, you know, we should have a good time long
You're not keeping somebody up. We stay up usually till about 3A
as long as we're just having a good time and nobody's nobody's
doing anything they should nobody's keeping anybody else
awake. Let's just enjoy some time
together, you know, and I think that that, you know, some I had
a few kids that hadn't been in the group before.

(27:32):
I don't know, single now, just in case, you know, they listen
to this like they they fit in. It's great and it's so awesome.
I think to see people have some fellowship in the Lord when
otherwise they may not have talked much.
I think you see that in youth a lot, right?
Could be kids, a freshman, maybesophomore, senior, maybe yeah,
same some some at school, but then they develop a relationship
with them and that just kind of breeds from there.
So I think the weekend's really good about that and it's just

(27:54):
good just to get get to know thekids.
If you see a youth a little bit better because the
intentionality is something that's really important.
It's hard to get that when you have a super big group of kids,
right, You know? Yeah, I'm going to check
something real quick. Sure.
Yeah. Check, check, check.
Oh no. It's it's it's been recording

(28:15):
from the computer. Oh man, I was afraid of that.
OK, we're going to pause real quick and hook up the
microphone. OK, we're back and we actually
have a real microphone this time.
That was, I can't believe I did that.

(28:35):
So we were recording the whole time on my MacBook speakers and
and even when we're setting up, I was like listening and I was
like, man, microphones being so weird.
They say right. I mean we basically had a a fake
microphone between us for the 1st 30 minutes of the interview.
It hopefully it sounds better now it looks it looks better

(28:59):
just the the the spiky things look better.
If you can't tell I'm a professional.
This is all right. So that's the weekend and then I
want to talk a little bit about just what you do on Wednesday
night because I, I know there's like the, I mean, you're like
playing Foursquare and you're doing the like the worship.

(29:22):
I mean, just being there and singing up and singing is a form
of leading, sure. And then but then also like what
are things that are unique each week?
Yeah, sure, man. Yeah.
So we've, we've kind of changed a little bit in the last few
weeks, Danis and I think it's, it's been really good.
We kind of use that first littlechunk just kind of to kind of

(29:42):
catch up with everybody. Something we're talking about
kind of like with the weekend when they kind of use that time
to follow up with the kids and kids and everybody in general,
you know, around the kids, even the kids you didn't have at the
weekend, but not to single anybody out.
But we kind of use that time just to kind of get together and

(30:03):
just have a a very like non, I guess pressured time together.
Like we can just, we can just play some basketball.
We can just stand here to talk. We can, you know, we can like
you said, we can stand here and play Foursquare.
Like, you know, just time just to spend, just to spend a little
bit of time together. I think that people yearn for.
And this is adults too. This isn't just kids, just

(30:24):
somebody's like, hey, I'm like you were saying earlier, I just
want to spend time with you. Like, yeah, dude, that means a
lot. I know everybody's got a little
different, you know, love language in terms of that, but
it's good just to have somebody.And just like, yeah, I'm happy
if we just sit here and talk, you know, because people know I
have that. Again, adult adults and kids,
you know, so we use that first big chunk of time just to have a

(30:45):
little bit of communication and it could be something kind of
follow up on the weekend. It could be something that is
totally awful all from that. But we try to use that time.
Dan does a good job of encouraging and and discussing
it with kids too, just to some intentional discipleship time
and with that too. Yeah.
But also some of us just talkingabout sports or Lord of the
Rings or fatal like that, you know, something off the wall.

(31:07):
And so that's really enjoyable. And then, yeah, usually we'll,
like you said, going to worship and then Dan's kind of going
through a lot of the Old Testament in the in the
different way. It's everything's breaking down,
you know, historical poetic books, prophetical books, things
of that. I'm just giving you a deeper
understanding of the how and whythe nuts and bolts of Old

(31:29):
Testament New Test. So that's kind of he's been
working through so and that's been good to see just to have
levels like follow through each week.
And then we we discussed that some too.
You know, we've been having someSunday community groups too,
with some kids just to kind of dive in, you know, a couple,
couple more feet. Deep.
Right as we do that too. So it's good just to have that

(31:51):
continuity and the worship team is great.
We usually do a handful. There's four songs usually.
Worship team does great to help us with that and it's good just
to kick that off and like you said just that immunity and
community amongst believers justto be there to worship some
That's that's nice too yeah that's you.
That's one of the nice. Yeah, it's.
Great and and you're there pretty much every time I drop by

(32:14):
and I what I found 'cause I do childcare for young kids like
4th and 5th grade. And what I found is just being
there consistently and giving them that, that face to
remember. They might not always remember
your name, but you might just beMr. Teacher.
But but just having, just being there consistently there, you

(32:35):
start to be able to trust and, and, and you want that so that
whenever something real is goingdown in that kids life, they
feel like they can talk to you and that and that allows you to
help them. And OK, there's a lot of times
the kids who have the worst stuff going on are the most
closed up. And also a lot of times the kids

(32:58):
we have the worst stuff going on, act out the most.
And so just something that I'm sure this is a common experience
we have is, is probably the mostdifficult part in, in child care
or youth ministry or whatever. It's just kids who who act out.
Sure. And, and I know everyone

(33:20):
approaches that in a different way.
So I'm just curious to hear like, what do you, what kind of
approach do you take to that? Sure.
And you know, I think you that'sreally well said, man, very well
said. And that is one thing I should
be even more consistent going toyouth than what I do go to.
But I think, you know, I'm kind of like we were going back to it
probably honestly. I'm not saying sometimes it

(33:42):
does, but I was like, Oh God, itmakes me aggravated.
But I think I'm going back to wetalked to you.
I got to check myself too, because like I was I was 16 or
17 once too times. You got it, you know.
You know it's. Like you kind of being bald
head, your being just go, hey man, what are we doing?
But I think that, like you said,there's so much more underneath
the surface. You know, I think there's a

(34:02):
there's a kind of a reason behind every action.
You know, just like we were saying earlier, you know, I
noticed that some kids too, you know, it's like honestly, you
know, you know this too, you have no idea what's going on at
home. And, and could be even like
we're talking about like that lack of leadership to have some

(34:23):
discipline during time. It is, you know, to need to
listen, need to soak things in. But I try to always think about
if I have a situation like that,just hey, man, you know, like
what's going on? Like is it what's the, what's,
what's going on here? And I think if you go in and
it's the same way with, I think how we respond to people who

(34:45):
have addiction. People are coming to church.
It's maybe to harpy or others opinion, quote UN quote, don't
look quote UN quote like they should.
You know, I think that approaching that with grace and
love is the most important thingto do.
Now. I do think the highest form
probably of love and a kid like that is some discipline too, you
know, not just saying, hey, now,you know, OK, now just I want to

(35:09):
do it again. It's like there's a lot we need
to we need to peel some layers back, especially when we get
into high school age, you know, now I kid it, somebody kid it
forward and understand a lot more, you know, But I think this
is kind of a niche group where you kind of you could you have
the availability to dig a littlebit more, not necessarily in a
negative light, but in a good light, like you want to share

(35:29):
everyone kind of what's going on.
You know, it's like you said, there's always something, it's
almost like somebody, you know, somebody behind a locked door
that's knocking. There's always something to
knocking. It's just we may not want to
keep it at Bay or not keep not give it to the Lord, you know,
so I think just kind of approaching that.
What I'm not saying I do perfectat that either because I'd be
lying, but I've noticed that my wife's been a big proponent of

(35:49):
that too, just kind of giving people more, more grace.
Just give grace as we have been given abundantly more than what
we deserve. That's a that's a factor that
and again, I said I'm perfect with that, but just viewing
people as like this kid or even this person kind of is like
they're created just like I am. I don't care if they're 60 and
they've been on drug and they'reon drugs for 30 years or if

(36:11):
they're 17 and their parents aredivorced and they don't know how
to handle it. They're created just like I was
and I'm no better than them, right?
I'm a Sinner didn't deserve whatyou just gave me, just like them
and they deserve to be loved on.So I think that kind of viewing
things of they're senators like me, I've just got a position for
maybe I can help them through the Lord is is the best approach

(36:35):
to take. Now, sure, there's different
nuances and some kids respond better to certain things, and
sometimes you kind of got to drop the hammer down.
For sure. And I, and I think that is OK,
kind of there's a lot of kids that, you know, you have to have
that level of discipline and maturity.
I mean, and you're a good example of that yourself to have
to grow your relationship with Christ, but to just kind of be a

(36:56):
good contributing person to the Kingdom.
Well, you know so and that's again, that even transcends to
adults to kids. I've seen adults and no adults
that this like like even comparing to you.
I have kids that are like 16/17/18 I've seen and they are
kind of a little more mature andgot to get through a bed at some
adults. Yes, that's for sure.
You know it does not it does not.

(37:16):
It transcends age. But yeah, I think just
approaching it the same way thatwe we're approached by the Lord
as the best. And again, I I think that people
sometimes view the discipline and.
View. Repercussions of actions is
negative, but you know, if you're to be just as a
sesolution of if we're entrustedwith a lot, we're expected to do

(37:40):
a lot and do well with that too,you know, so especially people
who were older and years or especially people who have a
large influence. I think siblings are a big
example of that. You know, you can you can have
you can create a culture pretty quickly amongst your brothers
and sisters if it's done correctly or the antithesis
created if you're not doing the things you should.
None of us are perfect. Everybody deserves grace, yes,

(38:02):
but I think instilling that and everybody is pretty important.
Yeah, and I've learned that as I'm the oldest of four.
Yeah, and I just kind of learnedthroughout the years that a lot
of times my mood and the way I'macting effects everyone else for
the whole day. And and for years I was just a

(38:25):
jerk and it just affected the whole house and and not as much
as it would if my little brotherwas being a jerk, which he's
not. He's like the best, but but just
being in that leadership position, whether you want to be
in or not, a lot of times you just are in a leadership

(38:48):
position. That's just how that's just
where you are in life. And because I know some people
don't enjoy that. I enjoy that.
But at the time I didn't and andI didn't even really see that as
a leadership position. But it is your setting example
for everyone that's young with you in the house and as a

(39:09):
leader, because it's the whole point of the podcast is to
interview Christian leaders. And as a leader, the way you act
is going to trickle down to everyone else a lot of times.
And, and I'm not saying like this like a steadfast rule, like
if like you could have someone who you're in charge of who

(39:33):
isn't affected by your bad attitude and then they're a
leader amongst the people that you're leading.
But but like, a good leader understands that the way that
they're acting effects everyone else.
And I don't even remember going.Like this.
You're right though. What do you think was the
biggest catalyst for change for you to kind of have that

(39:54):
leadership? Drop my mom dropped from the
hammer for sure. Yeah, 'cause I mean.
For years to be dropped sometimes, bro, I get it, yeah.
Yeah, for years I was just horrible.
And then just like totally a mean person and getting into
stuff I shouldn't have gotten into all through middle school
and then into high school. And then, and my mom for years

(40:20):
had different punishments, trieddifferent things, and nothing
ever worked. And, and then eventually she
sent me to this like ranch, likea therapeutic boarding school in
Missouri called Whetstone. And that place totally saved my

(40:40):
life. Because I mean, it's, there's
two parts of it. There's like disciplinary and
then like trauma therapy. And so my dad had died a few
months before this, like half a year before this.
And so that was the, the trauma therapy part for me, but I think
it was mostly for the disciplinary part.

(41:02):
But I mean, they cover both verywell.
And cause a lot of times those two things are linked.
Yes. And like I was saying.
And, and so I, I went there and,you know, so mad at her and
yeah. And you get there and like,
there's no technology. Like you can watch movies, like
they have movie nights and stuff, but you don't have the

(41:23):
phone, you don't have the computer.
You want to do something, you'regoing to be playing a board game
or reading or playing disc golf,which disc golf was fun.
Yeah, that is and, and, but I mean, they've got all this land
and they've got cows and, and a horse and, and so after a while
I really started enjoying myselfthere.
And, and, and there was kids, they're way worse than me.

(41:49):
But I never felt like, like I looked down on them.
Like it was just kind of like, Ijust felt like super bad for
them because I mean, like, I wassaying like they had horrible
stuff going on in their lives because I mean, these kids are
coming from all over the country.
And I mean, it's, it had to be getting bad for the parents for

(42:14):
them to go there. And, and there is even this one
kid who was there for 13 months and it's a it's a 6 to 12 month
program. Most people don't stay 12 months
like most people graduate around8 months.
I graduated at 8 and a. Half.

(42:34):
If you're there 12 months, something's wrong.
And he was there 13 months and he just didn't want to leave
because he had such a bad situation going on at home.
He didn't want to go back home. Yeah.
And, but the, the staff there are just so loving And, and I
mean, they don't, they, I mean, they knew when to drop the

(42:57):
hammer because that's a lot of it is learning discipline.
That's a lot of the process there, but also in love and, and
everything they did, anytime they had to punish someone, they
would always follow it up with, well, why are you doing this?
What's really behind this? So yes, that's awesome.

(43:17):
And we have a therapist, but everyone was qualified for
therapy, even if they weren't the designated therapist.
And it was, I mean, it was really great because you just
have that constant like what's what's really below the surface
here. And then every week you have
that one-on-one therapy with the, the therapist.

(43:39):
And, and she was great at her job and, and I've been to a lot
of different therapists before then.
And it was, you know, the, it was therapy and she was not how
I imagined therapy heard it. It was kind of more like tough
love, which is really what I needed at the time.
And it was just kind of like, Hey, you're she didn't say this,
but this is like the really whatI got out of is, hey, you're

(44:01):
being an idiot. You need to just I mean, you,
you've got this family that loves you, that never done
anything wrong to you and, and, and you're just being this
holder to them. And, and so, and they're also
just helping me work through sure with my dad because I never
really grieved that. And so I did while I was there.
So yeah, that place was really great for me.

(44:23):
And and it's. Awesome.
I was going down a path that wasjust really detrimental to me
and my walk with God, which is pretty much nonexistent.
Then I thought I was a Christian.
But I, I mean, I realized in thepast few months I wasn't back
then, right. Yeah.
Like I thought that I've been a Christian for like 6-7 years
now. And and only past few months

(44:47):
I've realized it was, it's really only been like a year.
Yeah. And see how Whetstone was was
great for me. That's awesome, dude.
That's fantastic. Thanks for sharing that.
What about So what was your prerequisite for graduation?
What'd you have to do to graduate?
You said. Oh yeah.
So you, you go through these levels, there's level 1, level 2
and Level 3. And it's been, it's changed a

(45:08):
little bit since I've been there.
Like the program's more expensive and they can fit more
people. And now they've built a second
house. So yeah, they're really grown.
So I don't know how much the program itself has changed, but
I know like level ones are in their own house now instead of
level 1 to it like everyone justbeing in the same house.
Also I should say everyone's in the same house.

(45:31):
A bunch of teenage guys who all have disciplinary issues.
Like there's always fights goes.Wrong.
He goes bouncing. And, and that's part of it, like
it's a, it's a safe place to getyour anger out and it's a safe
place to get your anger out and realize that didn't accomplish
anything. Right.
That's exactly what they do there because you got this house

(45:51):
and like the furniture is comfortable and all, and the
decorations are nice. No one's too upset if you break
anything though. Like that's the point of the
house. And, and all the staff are tough
and all the, all the staff are guys except for the therapist.
But she's not always there and she's tough too.
And, and so if there's a fight going on, like they've already,

(46:15):
they already know what's going to happen.
And that's that's part of like it's in the plan for their.
They don't tell you that until you're getting ready to leave.
They're like, this is like or, or after you've gotten in a big
fighter. This is kind of the point of
Whitestone is to be able to get in a fight and realize that they
didn't accomplish anything right.

(46:36):
And I got in a couple fights there and it didn't accomplish
anything right. Just made me feel worse.
Yes. Yeah.
So what was the? Question.
No, you answered. It was.
Just, Oh yeah, I graduated so, so each level you just got to do
certain things to, to level up. And some things are just like
learn how to tie a tie. Learn how to Polish your boots.

(46:59):
That's. Cool.
Have this amount of hours on like working on the ranch or and
also as you're going through it,you're going through school like
I did my whole sophomore year while I was there and then none
of the credits transferred. It was like I didn't even do my
sophomore year. It was crazy when I came back to
Evansville and so I had to go toCastle, the big public school.

(47:20):
They have theirs and I was doingall freshmen and sophomore
classes my junior year and had one junior class.
It's Castlewood. Wow.
They're the only school in town that would able would be able to
keep me on track because all theoptions they have.
Sure. Huge school, super busy.
Yeah, but it was all easy because I'd already learned it.

(47:41):
It was just super tedious. But but yeah.
And so there's some things you just got to learn how to do it
or just do it and it's but then other things are like therapy
based and and behavioral based. You have to have like a certain
track record, like a certain amount of days doing good or

(48:01):
something like that. And, and you have to, you have
to have gotten through certain points in your therapy because
everyone's kind of on the same journey and it's different for
everyone, but there's certain points that everyone hits sure,
like a like different types of therapy that she's awesome does.
And, and so you can't get to thenext point in therapy if you're

(48:26):
not working with the therapist. So it's really a way of saying
like you got to actually be doing the therapy.
And there's kids who can graduate just by playing along,
but most kids, I mean, it's sucha high pressure environment that
most kids can't do that. Like you're eventually you're
going to snap or or just be like, fine, whatever.

(48:48):
I'll do the therapy and then it ends up helping you and.
Exactly. And so I mean, that place is
just great and that's awesome. And I really wanted to, to go
back and volunteer or not volunteer, but work there as
like an intern over the summer because I mean, past residents
going back and working like theyreally well, depending on the

(49:08):
resident and like if there's someone who's qualified to work
there and who has a strong walk,walk with God, they love to have
past residents back. And I'd be the third person to
ever do that. And I was going to do it this
summer, but I'm going to. My plans have changed so many
times, but. Sure.
I'm finally locked in. I'm going to the UK, so I don't

(49:30):
want to be gone through the summer.
I want to be with my family here.
And then the summer after that I'm going to be doing boot camp
and and training for the Marines.
Should I keep Yeah. So I can go into the reserves?
I would, I would do that this summer because you can do, if
you're going into reserves, you can do all your training in one
summer and then go to college and just do the reserve thing

(49:50):
you do one week in a month and then two weeks in the summer.
Yeah, but I have braces so I can't go to boot camp.
Really. Yeah.
OK, so I got Yeah, they would. You'd have some busted up gums.
Yeah. For sure it hurt and, and so
next summer I'm going to be doing that and hopefully, of
course, my plan is probably going to change again.

(50:11):
So that's the plan right now. I think you made good points
kind of on that, like going backto Wetstone, Wetstone.
Right. Yes, Sir, that's cool, but.
Yeah, it is. Like because you're sharpening.
Yeah. All of that, dude.
But the same thing with that kind of we go back with like, I
think there's a level of like aggression a male should have in
general that that's good. But applied to the right things,

(50:33):
you just flip to the table levelof aggression.
Perfect example, aggression justbecause I can't handle my
emotions and I'm just going to hit you, right.
Sure. Now, is there certain situations
where things may boil, but thereare many, many, many times where
the water never has to hit the top of the pot?
Yeah. You crank your heat up because
you kind of want it to, you know.
Yeah, for sure. And I think that's awesome.

(50:54):
But that that they showed you kind of a balance, even from a
biblical standpoint. I think it's important to look
at having some like emotional agility really, if, if you will,
you know, and I think taking ownership of your actions and
why is super, especially like wetalked about earlier, if you
want to grow your relationship with the Lord, you got to take

(51:16):
some ownership of what you're doing wrong.
Absolutely. And I think that like, I'm
that's awesome that you went through that because I think
that I'm sure that's, that has helped.
Obviously that being such a spiritual LED program too,
that's helped a lot. Like, oh man, I do need to work
on this. Yeah.
And to go off your point, I think there's so many kids, like
you said, a lot of the kids there that going through
different things and it may be something that's directly

(51:38):
correlated to, you know, Marshall detachment or maybe
stuff that they unfortunately haven't had any control over.
This happened, it happened, it happened again to them, and
that's their only way to let it out.
Yep. You know, and I think therapy is
wonderful. That's awesome that you went
through that too, dude. That's great.
So absolutely, I think that's I think some people kind of detach
sometimes like, well, even like,well, deep waters have biblical

(52:01):
council here at the church. That's that's the best if you
can get that. But I think that, you know,
sometimes people detach like, you know, therapy and the Lord
and it's like they can call it side, you know now.
And do I think it's best to obviously have someone who's
also another believer to kind ofhelp God do a spiritually?
Absolutely. But I think, you know, if you
get someone who you may never not know, the Lord can put you

(52:23):
in that situation, I think, and use it well also.
Yeah, absolutely. And so I think, man, that's
awesome that you did that, dude.And I think, you know, kind of
go off that there is a. Book if you've.
Never read it and you especiallygoing on the marines it's called
extreme ownership. Jocko Welling to the author that
is fantastic book that mild to heart, I think are the two other

(52:45):
than the model itself. I think that the two best books
for like I kind of want to be a a man that is like consistent
and I take ownership of what I do, you know, because there's so
much of that kind of like what you were talking about going to
Whetstone. It's like you get that, like
that group of like how I'm supposed to be and it's like
jagged closed off and you're supposed to work, get it done.

(53:10):
I deserve certain things becauseI'm a man and that is very I
think that's a complete antithesis.
If if you look at anything that the Lord is currently doing, you
know, selfless and selflessness at the of the highest degree,
loving people who other people think, quote UN quote, I don't
have time for, you know, obviously woman at the whale,
you know, right, you know, who'snot the sin till the first stone

(53:32):
kind of thing, you know, and I think that like culture for a
big degree is, you know, your reflectiveness of manhood is
what you look like without sleeves on how many women you've
dated or slept with or how many beers you can drink.
You know, I think that's, you know, southern culture, not all
southern culture. I don't mean like everything
with that is bad. I don't mean it like that in the

(53:53):
least, but I think there is a Bible belt is culture of if I go
just just go to church Sunday and I'm there.
That's enough for sure. And as a male, that's like the
that's the absolute bare minimum.
You want to do the bare minimum for the most important.
I would say your your wife and your kids.
And then after that, your parents, parents and siblings
growing up are you're like biggest ministry and some people

(54:15):
who may not get get married or have kids doesn't mean that they
can't be used from a male position, right, things like
that and scrapping away. But you know, I don't think it's
good. And I'm the same thing.
The wet snow was teaching. It is not good just to think of.
I want to do the bare minimum and I kind of reigns in my head
a little bit that like, you know, what if, what if the Lord,
what if God just do the bare minimum with us?

(54:38):
Oh man, you know, yeah. What if that was it?
He just that's because the bare minimum would have just been all
right. Well, I have an Eve I'll.
See you later. Catch you later, yeah?
You know, and then you say, oh, I don't know.
Would not have lasted long, no. That's exactly right, man.
Yeah. You know, then even you think,
OK, we'll go for the flood and we'll go from here.
And then again, it was like, OK,I'm just going to give you a

(54:59):
chance. We'll give you a chance again,
and I'm going to give you a chance again.
Absolutely, You know, so. And I think that how we view
people and how we view, I think it may even be slightly more
important how you view yourself in the light, because if you're
too hard on yourself, you're much more like, I feel like to
be harder on other people. I think it's a general rule.
So. And that's great.

(55:20):
Well said and nicely done, dude.Yeah, I bet.
I think that's awesome that you did that.
That's that's fantastic. Dude, thank you.
Yeah, I'm glad my mom and it washard for her to send me there.
I'm really glad she did. I'm.
I'm glad she stuck with it. That's heavy spiritual
leadership. That's that's awesome.
Oh, yeah. And and you're like pretty much
the exact type of guy I could see work in there.
Sure. Yeah, Yeah.

(55:42):
Like you're saying with with men, I feel like culture has
distorted biblical masculinity 100%.
Like in in the Bible, you've gotbeing a man.
There's a lot of stuff that goeswith that.
Sure, yeah. And some parts of it are, are

(56:03):
the parts that are the most visible to other people, which
is leadership, I bet, which is leadership strength, like being
the head of a household, being like, in a leadership position
over like your wife or, or, or like your family.
And culture took that and they went too far.

(56:25):
They lost the other parts of being a man, which is
self-control, love, like all thefruits and spirits that applied
at inland and like gentleness and, and biblical leadership.
And they take it and they turn strength into like dominance
and, and power and yes, and justlike aggression and just like
what culture calls toxic masculinity, which is not

(56:47):
biblical. And, but then a lot of times
we'll take biblical masculinity and also call that toxic
masculinity. But, but like real, like
legitimate toxic masculinity. And, and Satan just took
biblical masculinity and they, it, he distorted it into
something that looks similar, but it's totally different.

(57:08):
And that's what he does. And then and then just in the
past 5100 years, culture said, OK, this is horrible.
We need to go the other way, which sounds good, but they
went. But then the pendulum swings too
far the other way. Well, and, and now we have men
who are not strong, who do not lead, who like other men.

(57:29):
And it's just, it's like they're, it's hard to find an in
between. Like, are you going to be like a
jerk or a wimp? Well said.
Yes, and now they do those very well put together.
You know what I think that is one thing too.
I was talking with somebody the other day 'cause I mean, I sent
a little bit of a podcast snippet to a few of my buddies
and he's like, man, he put together kind of like what we

(57:50):
were just talking about, like the things that society was goes
over. And I think that there is now I
do of course it's a dichotomy. All of it is in balance, right,
exactly right. I was talking to somebody I was
I'm really close with the other day and I was like, and I just
and I was like, Hey, you know, you think about you have a
person or a male in your life and get an outside perspective.
You know, and I said, let's get the quote UN quote, the normals.

(58:14):
Now are these good things? Yes, but just same thing.
If we rank things other high highly, then Lovejoy peace,
patient. It's kind of self-control and
the Lord at the top, and then those things that run from the
fruit of the spirit. There can be things that are
good that aren't of that, but ifwe're ranking those higher than
the Lord and how you get your validation and self self worth,
We're we're dead. The enemy says rubs his hands

(58:36):
together to me. We're the.
Yeah. But but you know, that's kind of
his thing with that. But I but I told us what if you
had a male relationship? I said we, you know, lift
weights strong say that does some good at a good at a certain
sport, whatever somebody said nocan defend.
You can do all this. And I said that and I said, you

(58:58):
know, would you rather, you know, have somebody who was like
that, who was somewhat of a biblical leadership, but like
nominal lukewarm, you know, I said, would you feel more
protected in the home and feel more protected from a leadership
role, which I will say marriage is a is a 5050 split.
Yeah, some tires and then sometimes it's a 8020.

(59:18):
I tell me and my wife could all bound as, hey, some days I'm the
tugboat, you're the lifeboat andsome days it is completely
swamped. You know, so I I do think
they're different leadership roles, but it is a play.
You got to have both. But and I said, or would you
have somebody who like the complete antithesis, kind of
like so it's like a man. You know, I don't I don't really

(59:38):
get into all that stuff, but like strong biblical leader.
And I said, what do you what? And I said in just a nutshell,
what do you think like is the the just the antithesis is what
a man is? She was kind of telling me we're
talking. She was like, you know, I got a
family member who was a veteran,older, but still just gets after
it does all these things, does all the manship just works.
And then he's like, you know, the times that we've been over

(59:59):
talked like. We've never had a spiritual
conversation and I've never seenhim open his Bible.
And then she is like, I don't really think that's a good
reflection. Yeah.
Man, that's it, you know, and not speaking I'll that person at
all. But you know, when we were
talking about it, the whole point was like it's a balance
and like you said, the Penguin can swing very far, very

(01:00:23):
quickly, right. And I think that's kind of how
it is now. And I do think that everybody,
probably every male, just to help balance some emotions.
And maybe this is more so just maybe even just a little bit
more of my opinion. But I think it's good to have
something where you can have some level of aggression,
whether it be lifting weights ora grappling sport or something,

(01:00:44):
something physical. I just write that's that's good
for most guys. You get let out a little bit so
you can get that out a little bit easier.
But to kind of go off that, you know, and you know, it's a man
more of a man because let's say that you both go to church the
same thing is a man more of a man because one guy just enjoys
painting a lot other. But he's a great spiritual
leader. Now that he's got his orders,
he's got his properties, right? You know what I mean?

(01:01:06):
And I think that there is, like you said, there's a far penal
swing that's like, I don't do these certain things, we're not
a good man. And then there's the other side
that says, like, if I do all these things, but, you know,
maybe I'm not as spiritual, I'm more caring, but I don't really
go to church, do that. Like that makes me the opposite
of these things, right? And I think in the middle of
that is like people being willing to call other people out

(01:01:30):
for sin on each side, you know, You know, and I think that we've
kind of lost a little bit of that because that turns into
either that person being judgmental and being angry
because there's people on each side politically, social,
economically or even go to church.
It's like getting that midpoint of, you know, I just want as a
brother in Christ, I want to kind of talk to you about this.

(01:01:50):
Yeah. And you brought a little same
thing, like homosexuality is another thing.
You know, I think that people will kind of put their self on
the high pedestal of, you know, at least know how to sit in and
say, at least I'm not, and then plug it in.
And we go back the same way withthat masculinity, you may be
able to lift all the way to the world.

(01:02:10):
You may look like this, You may do that.
You may work harder than anybodyelse, you know.
But if you're judgmental and youtreat other people who are
sinners the opposite of how Christ wants you to,
leadership's not really there either.
Now, am I saying like we talked about, if we need the hammer
dropped? Yeah.
But the straight guy that watches porn is married, needs
the hammer dropped, just like the gentleman that is fraction

(01:02:34):
homosexuality. Tick.
Yeah, they're both need the hammer dropped, man.
And I think there are certain things that are viewed like
Jameis had that series while back like we're I don't remember
I'm I'm it wouldn't worthwhile sin respectable sins, baby.
It was and sometimes we put those things as idol and to go
back on that I had AI think the Lord did a good job of humbling

(01:02:57):
me. A couple years ago I had a
people have had far worse thingsthan this, but I had a bulging
disc in my neck and my. You had a what?
Bulging disc in my neck. So I'll go back little PT
perspective, but you have like you have disc in between each
each vertebrae. They're kind of like, if you
think about it, they're like your mattress in between each
vertebrae. You have nerve vert index on

(01:03:19):
each side and they kind of they flip the light switch for your
nerves to say, OK, this muscle needs to work or doesn't need
to. So I had one in my neck and to
tell how much it was like, of course I've got my Bible from me
for people listening, but I'm gripping it from the side.
I couldn't. So if I've got my wrist down, I
could pull it back up, see that I'm just through.

(01:03:40):
So I had that and it was, it wasterrible.
Yeah. I don't know if I've, you know,
I've not had an injury like that.
The pain was terrible. And I think a lot of that, to be
honest, was I was putting too much on physical presence on
when I could do above where myself works was at, right.
I think the Lord humbled me through that.
And I think I definitely needed it.

(01:04:02):
It might have been something I was like, you know, being kind
of like us talking like how and how do you view yourself as a
man? What do you look at?
Like, OK, this is what makes me man.
And I don't care what it is, even if it's good, if you're
putting something above what theLord has done and what the Lord
wants you to above that, even ifon the outside looking in quote
UN quote, it's good, you're still wrong.

(01:04:22):
You know what I mean? And it is hard because we got
big egos to do that. And I think that you put it
together really well. And I think that us looking, not
letting the pendulum swing too far left or right, right, let us
settle in the middle is kind of where we need to be.
And I think having good mentorship, good study is the
biggest base proprietor of that too.

(01:04:44):
You know, man, because it's you listen to certain things.
You do that and you begin to cultivate a cultivated opinion.
And it's like this opinion of man or just biblical right
opinion. And kind of like what you were
saying earlier, sometimes there are biblical opinions that go
counter cultural that you will get some you'll catch some Flack
for. And I think you have to be
willing to have those strong opinions.

(01:05:05):
But also just like like Stewart and Cliff Neckley, like you just
look at them doing, you know, I don't know if you've ever seen
any of their videos. They got a lot of like a, a
ministry, like a colleges and stuff.
That's a good example of that. Taking hard questions and not
taking a step back from where you're at because it might be
viewed as unpopular read like you were saying, you know, doing
so in a way that would honor Christ is most important not to

(01:05:27):
get your point across because itshouldn't be your point.
It should be with the Lord has said about it.
That should be your point. Absolutely.
That's all. Yeah, man, that's for sure.
Yeah. And when I say like, like now we
have men who, like, aren't strong, I don't mean like
physically fit. Like it's important for sure,
but I mean like, like a waiver. I don't even know how to.

(01:05:49):
Yeah, exactly. I know wish washy you have
lukewarm. Yeah, for sure.
I can put no, that's a good point, yes.
And yeah, I think I see that. I see that a lot too.
And I think it's like easily, and I think probably like, I
don't care how old you are, likeyou can be very easily slayed
into that from social media and what you gather and what you
like, you know, eyes are lamped,you know, are right after your

(01:06:11):
heart, you know, And I think that, you know, you can be very
easily swayed on those things. And like you said, you know, if
people aren't willing to put their foot down or like we've
said a handful of times here, bethe hammer on what they believe,
if you're constantly in a swing of where you're at, yeah, that's
a big weakness that the enemy will love to exploit.

(01:06:34):
Absolutely. I mean, if you're easily
persuaded, what's to stop the enemy from coming in and easily
persuading you to do something? Well said yes, and I think that
the biggest way to do that is reach scripture and to you know,
we pray for the Lord for that strength.
I think there are a lot of people now, like you said, that
have probably had in some bad situations, probably had

(01:06:59):
negative church experiences. Yes, I hate that.
And that is the product of man. But you know, I think there's
also some people that have just had not even necessarily
negative exposure, but just go with what's the easiest.
A lot of men in that and what isthe easiest is not following the
Lord. That's the most worthwhile,
worthwhile thing, but it's definitely not the easiest.

(01:07:21):
I think that culture now, just to piggyback off you, loves the
easiness, loves the convenience for sure.
You know, I think that as a male, what you need to do is
though. I mean, I've, as I've been doing
this podcast, I've been remindedmultiple times because I've run
into so many roadblocks. And for a second I was like, I

(01:07:46):
don't know if I should do this. And, and I was just reminded.
I really just heard the Holy Spirit telling me like, if it's
easy, you're not doing it right.Like the fact that this is
difficult means this is probablythe way to go.
I. Love the.
Yeah, I mean, it's just like thelike you're saying with being
wishy washy. I mean, it's exactly like the
parable of those two guys with the houses like 1 build the

(01:08:10):
house on the sand and when a push can shove his house fell
over and he was left with nothing and he probably got
crushed by his house and died. And, and then the guy who built
the house on the rock, he, he had the firm foundation.
Christ is my firm foundation, which I stand.
And and so when the hard times come, when storms come, his

(01:08:34):
house stands strong because he'snot wavering.
I love that, yes. And that's, I think, yeah, I
think that is, that's well said.And I think the two just go on
like, you know, there's so much in Scripture that just kind of,
I think validates that too, thatyou might.
Yeah, I think and kind of go offanother just piggyback with
those. That's good.

(01:08:55):
The parable with the sow sowing the seeds, you know, unpaved,
you know, against on the rocky road, then in the thorn Bush and
then in the deep good soil. You know, it's like, you know,
where are you putting your time and how is it being placed?
Yeah. So that's it man.
All right. So I want to transition a little
bit. Yeah, sure.

(01:09:15):
I'm curious about your tattoo because I've seen that you've
had but I've never actually gotten a good look at it.
So for those who can't see to it's an arrow with like a banner
wrapped around it and then beneath it says I am 2nd and
then you've got on the banner, you've got 3 verses.
So just walk us through like whythose verses?
Sure. Yeah, so interestingly enough

(01:09:35):
too. Thanks for asking about it.
Interestingly enough, I actuallygot this one.
I had that neck injury so it really it wasn't super painful,
but I couldn't feel a lot of it.But oh really, it kind of ties
ties in with it. So part of the reason I got in
this Isaiah 49 two ties in with the hero.
I love bow hunting is probably my probably my favorite thing to
do on the planet. Oh, I am That's a hunting for

(01:09:56):
deer. Yeah.
That's like I'm if you ask, if you ask Canada from like
September to December. I'm pretty much just non
existent on Saturdays and when Iget open time.
So, yeah, so like you said that,you know, I've got the red, red
knock and the red arrow part of that.
I do shoot red knock. This is this is like what arrow
that shoot looks like. I do shoot the red knocks, but I

(01:10:16):
got part of the red on the fletching and I just represent,
you know, Christ sacrifice for us.
So and well, I'll go to I am second first, then I'll work my
way back up. But I actually had this one
first. I am second.
There is a guy and that I went to represent kind of high
school. So I graduated and I kind of

(01:10:36):
first heard of it. Joey Davenport was the guy's
name and he did a lot through this pro, this organization.
I am second. It's their whole point of the
movement is putting God first, put yourself second, putting
other things or putting other things second from God.
So I got that. I had a bracelet for a long time

(01:10:58):
and I thought, man, if I get this like tattooed, like on my
wrist, it's like one of those things where it's like, man,
probably some people ask, you know, and I was like, and, and
what's been cool is I have, which is, that's pretty awesome.
But I've had it for a few years.And then I thought about getting
the arrow right above it becauseit might kind of like what

(01:11:18):
you're saying, you know, it might tie.
And so that's been, that's been pretty awesome.
But so, yeah, and I've got the got the arrow course, got the
red, red fletching just kind of remind me of Christ's blood.
And so, and then I've, like you said, got the three verses,
Isaiah 49 two is at the bottom and he it's he made my words
like a sharp sword. He to me, the shadow of his

(01:11:40):
hand. He made me like a sharpen arrow
to hide in this quiver. So all that through Isaiah, like
I talked about the servant and that's just kind of like
alluding to Christ, which I kindof think is pretty cool.
And then Romans 5/8 is for God showed his love for us.
We're still sinners. He sent Christ to die for us.
So that kind of, you know, what goes on to those that one and

(01:12:01):
Galatians 220 minutes another going, you know, for my old self
was crucified with Christ. It's no longer I who live, but
Christ who lives in me. So I think they'll just kind of
tied together. And I think the, you know, the
arrow theme is kind of throughout, but I like that, you
know, yeah, I think it reminds you like.
You know if I'm. I have through the Holy Spirit
and through the Lord, like I know if I'm like a sharpened

(01:12:23):
arrow, I have, He has given me the the capability to go for the
go, spread his word, do it quickly, do it, do it with
authority, kind of like with apostles.
So yeah, yeah, man, that's it. I want about 30 more tattoos.
Then she costs money. So yeah.
You know, I just thought that would be good.
And. I was, of course, you know, the

(01:12:44):
varyingness of tattoos, spikes everywhere.
But I've definitely got a lot ofgood questions on it.
And I got it for me, you know, But I, I think it has been
pretty awesome to see other people like, hey, what's the
situations like this show? Hey, what is that?
You know, and it's like just to be able to have a little bit of

(01:13:06):
gospel conversation because I think, you know, if you see
someone else with tattoos and dothat, they're usually like, hey,
man, when did you get to that? Who did that?
And it's like, man, now if you could, that can start a little
bit of conversation. I like that.
Yeah, that's great. That's it.
Thanks man. Thank you, dude.
So you work this physical therapy?
Yeah. How'd you get into that?
So I had same grandpa as some ofthose past where it's been, you

(01:13:29):
know, a mentor to me and were thick as thieves.
That's my God. But he had to go through a
little PT. He had low back pain.
He worked a hard labor job for along time and.
He was in some low back pain. He went to some PT for this is
like probably 20 years ago. Yeah, I'm somewhere.
I was, I think I was like 7 or 8when he went through it.

(01:13:51):
And he was like, man, you know, helped his back quite a bit.
And I was like, man, that's kindof interesting, you know.
And then I just kind of like plant a little seed.
And then as I grew up, I want tobe a marine biologist or a
paleontologist really 10 years, you know, after that.
And once I got high school, I was like, I kind of want to do
something or do something healthfield.
I want to help people. But, you know, I thought about
nursing, but I was like, I'm, I'm not, I'm not tough enough to
be a nurse. I have a medical capacity to do

(01:14:14):
that. No, no.
And I don't particularly want tohave to worry about somebody
dying while I'm there. You know, So I thought, man,
what is something? What's up?
So I kind of got mad like, yeah,you know, like the pot, that's
what I call. It's like, you know, it's a
level of physical fitness I enjoy that I can talk to people
and help them get better. So let's roll with that.
Let's see how it goes. So I went through Nashville

(01:14:37):
Community College. They have a physical therapist
assistant program there. That was great.
Went through it, 2018 is when I graduated and I worked at a
small company where I grew. I grew up in Westgate
Prominence, worked for a probably owned company there for

(01:14:57):
a couple years and then when me and Hannah moved here I worked
at the same company for a littlebit and I worked at the hospital
just for a tad. I enjoyed the hospital but it's
a lot of inpatient, IE the same patient population that a nurse
would see. Sorry, I thought you.
I enjoy the athletics side of it.
I enjoy yeah. We just really, really push

(01:15:17):
people and people who are in impatient sitting, they need PT
100%. But I do feel like have enjoyed
the conversations I've had and the people I've met.
But I was like, I just don't know for sure if this is right
for me. So then had one of my best
friends, Troy, that we also go to church with him and his wife,
Christina Pleasant Valley. He told me that they had a job

(01:15:39):
opening which we stayed, We worked together before then too,
and we stayed. We were, we were good friends
before then, but of course we'rebetter friends now.
But he said I think we might have a.
Job opening. So sign me up.
So yeah, I went and had a littlemeeting, had an interview, and
then I've been working there. Lower.
Lower three years now, just a little over.

(01:15:59):
So it's great. Yeah.
It's my good man. And so you do physical therapy
for athletes? I I'll see a little bit of
everything. Athletes are my favorite.
That's that's kind of but I love, I mean, I have had
wonderful conversations and met a ton of people that were just
post op total knees. I probably see the most of post
op surgeries because the doctorsare all that are practice.

(01:16:20):
It's a doctor on practice. We see a lot of their patients
that are come off total knee rotator cuff, things like that.
But we get a lot of athletes as well.
And that's and we get just a lotof people.
It's like, hey, I haven't been able to do run and I want to be
able to run. This is what's hurting.
What is it so or whatever it maybe.
So it's a very fruitful job. Sometimes I'm like so dry got us

(01:16:42):
going back to that. You know, if it's super easy, I
don't think I would be able to see the spiritual fruit from it.
You know, I'm not saying there'sanything wrong with somebody
doing things they find easy. Hey, if you enjoy it also, you
know, but you know, I I think the good definitely outweighs
the bad. And I think a lot of that, you
know, sometimes is just managingmyself mentally on that, you
know, like if you know, talking to people throughout the day and

(01:17:04):
doing that, some days my you know, I meter to be able to talk
and do that fantastic. And other days I'm like, I don't
want to go home and do nothing. So but the fruit that I've had
from that has been awesome just from learning about other
people, you know, getting men inthe bow hunt.
I had a guy which with hip I can't say his name, but we're
still, you know, he's a fantastic guy.

(01:17:27):
We were just talking about hunting the entire town talk
about and he taught me a lot because I was first getting into
kind of bond, you know, like, hey, yeah, do this, do this.
I wouldn't have had that that job.
And I've got a spot that I hunt very regularly that come from
that job, you know, and that relationship.
They're like inherited grandparents.
They're just it's great, wonderful people.
Thank you. So, you know, there's so many
things and good gospel conversations I've been able to

(01:17:49):
have with people who otherwise may not have had it or just
being able to share the gospel with them.
Because that is one good thing about there is, you know, no
one's going to not going to be reprimanded for talking to
anybody about that. There's and there is a good
amount of believers that work there as well.
So it's a safe space sport. But everybody's also really

(01:18:10):
professional in the way that's, you know, anybody who's a brace
up in the way that they discuss that.
So it's a, it's a blessing to bea part of a, you know, part of
profession and part of that where it's like you can heal,
heal people hopefully help with that, but also being able to
spiritually talk to them about too.
So. That's great, Darren.
Thank you. That's.
Great. Yeah.
One thing I've been looking for a job and for over the summer, I

(01:18:32):
was looking for a job around around January.
I just couldn't find anything and.
And I've never had a problem getting a job until then.
And Oh my gosh, this is this is crazy.
Like, I was, I wasn't stressing about it.
I was like, oh, just Chick-fil-Ais my backup plan because I used

(01:18:54):
to work at Chick-fil-A. Yeah, sure.
And then Chick-fil-A didn't haveany spots for me.
And I was like, Oh no. My backup plan needs a back,
yeah. And so I haven't worked in a
long time, which really sucks, and I've definitely felt the
pressure on that, But sure. But as I've been looking for a
job, I've really been thinking about like, what am I going to
do if I get a job that's not open to sharing the gospel?

(01:19:16):
Like, like no matter what I'm doing, I know I need to be
sharing the gospel. Like if I have a job, God's put
me there. Like God didn't give me my job
to provide for me. He could provide for me with
with Ravens and and man like he gave me the job to to so that I

(01:19:39):
can share the gospel. Sure.
Yeah, dude, I don't disagree with that at all.
And that's I've, I'm quoting a guy and I don't remember who it
is, but I don't know how much. Like, I feel like God can
definitely provide through your job, right?
Either way, you're definitely inyour job so that you can share
your gospel with people. And I'm thinking like, well,
what if I have a job where my boss doesn't want me to be doing

(01:20:00):
that? Like am I going to be able to
work there? What if that's the only place
where I can get work and I'm nottoo worried about it now that
the summer's coming up because there's a lot of places hiring
there. But yeah, I think that's
something that's definitely important to have.
It's a good head specs for that.That's what you want to do.
Yeah, definitely. You know, I mean, that's when
you hadn't been. But yeah, definitely continue
to, you know, pray over that, too.

(01:20:21):
But I think that's. Awesome.
That's where you want to be. When I was your age, I was, I
mean, that wouldn't have been talking about done my list at
all, to be honest, and it shouldhave been.
But I think that's great. And I think I think the Lord
sees like I think the Lord is happy with that.
You know what I mean? I don't think you know, I'm not
saying you're doing that just toagain, works based style like

(01:20:42):
I'm going to do this Lord, because I'm going to try to show
you I'm doing good, you know, but I think it's one of those
where and just knowing you, I know how much the Lord is
different. This is the least I can do.
I want to do it to help other people say how good it is have
relationship Lords. That's awesome.
Thank you. Absolutely.
So tell me about bow hunting. How did you get into that?
And and what about it do you like?

(01:21:02):
Oh. Man it's you got 4 hours No kid.
Do you listen to Joe Rogan? Some, I've listened to it.
So really what probably got me into I like to hunt when I was
younger. I hunt some.
Of course, there's always gun tohunt, but and then when I got
out of high school and I was in high school, I didn't have much.

(01:21:25):
I was just like, oh, I got too much.
I should have been hunting. There's no reason for me not to.
My grand aunt and uncle, we had permission to hunt a property
behind their house. This is right in Webster County.
And me and some of my family would go out there on my mom's
side and would hunt, go hunt. And right after, right after
high school, I thought, there's no reason for me.
Now it's good. Yeah, I mean.

(01:21:46):
You know, it's as natural meat as you can get, you know?
Absolutely. Yeah.
Well, I thought, man, there's a kind of reason for me not to.
So I went during gun season. I was like, oh gosh, this is
really fun. And that point in my life I had
a lot. I was still going to college,
but I was working some. But I had a lot of.
Didn't have class till 10. It'd be 20 minutes to get to
school. That's hung for a couple hours,

(01:22:06):
you know. So I slowly got into that and
then I crossbow haunted for justa little bit.
I thought, man, there's really no excuse why I shouldn't.
Have a bow and it's. It's so much hard.
I wanted to challenge it now that there's no reason I could
have a bow. So I know if you bring up I'm
Joe Rogan podcast, I listened toCameron Haynes on that and he's

(01:22:27):
a like that's kind of what he does now as he just like kind of
professionally bow hunts and just listen to his story and
listen to that literally. And that's just man, I was
asleep. She she'll probably kill me when
she listens to this, but hopefully she you know, we'll
have some be busy during this park.
She listens to it. I was on my phone looking for

(01:22:47):
Bose driving to Florida when we went down mother Interstate.
I just got it on cruise. I had a rent, I rented a car and
I had you know, you could have like the lane where done, you
know, I just drive on my knees. I was looking at Bose with that.
I was like, dude, you got to getinto it.
So I got 1 and I started practicing.
I was like, man, it's as hard like there's a lot of things I
go through it, but really probably the biggest reason is,

(01:23:08):
you know, I thought like, hey, this is a way that like I can
provide, you know, and I'm very cheap.
So it was a good good for us to,you know, save a little bit on
groceries. But man, I think kind of within
my like general revelation, likejust being out in creation, like
I would wouldn't you doing that.I'm out, I'm out a whole lot
more because it starts second Saturday in September and goes

(01:23:30):
until the Sunday before MLK day in January.
Very long. So I just thought, man, this
just gets me out more and just the difficulty of that.
And funny enough, you think about the Lord kind of provided
almost like Ebenezer, if you will.
But I had that injury in 2023 and then I was like, I couldn't
even break. So if you, if you got a bow in

(01:23:51):
front of it, you got cams at thetop and they rotate and they
allow this the string to be pulled back, right, just to pull
back. So a lot of let off even on like
a 70 LB bow, you know when you get it, pull back to your
knocking point. Well, I couldn't even break the
cams to get them to turn over, which you know, and when I get
here and you got your arm mixed in, you go to pull you just the

(01:24:12):
start of your pool. They start to kind of rotate.
I couldn't even get to rotate. I had no strength, so I had to
tune my bow all the way down. I could still just barely pull
it back. So I kept training with it, you
know, and the Lord was so good during that.
But I had obviously my Co workers were wonderful.
They worked on me a ton, but andhand was also like a big help.

(01:24:34):
But when I haunted and I was going this is like right after
getting a season, I went out, had a Wednesday.
I work kind of shorter hours on Wednesday.
My supervisor is very good aboutme and kind of let me change my
schedule so I can see enough facial I'm supposed to see, but
also maybe hunt in the morning in the afternoon.
That's great. So I went, I was just kind of

(01:24:57):
still like, you know, honestly, just probably just a little bit
depressed and had some things and other else waning.
And this is the first time I waslike, man, I can finally pull my
bow back. You know, I got this and I was
like, Lord, just please just be with me.
And you know, just thank you forthe opportunity to be able to go
and hunt and do this. But you know, I didn't, I I went

(01:25:17):
in like hoping this would go well.
And this is the first time I'd haunted.
No, I'd haunted one other time. I'll take that back that season
and I got up and I ended up shooting this buck and I was
drawn back for what felt like aneternity.
But I just remember I was just praying.
I was like, Lord, you've helped me do this so much.
And I was like just, you know, please let me not mess.

(01:25:39):
This up tit. Ended up, yeah, shut this buck
and it ran like 20 yards piled up and it was not the the shot
place ended up being good, but it was a hard shot.
Not saying I'm some great Archer.
I don't mean it like that, but the point of this being the Lord
is like, hey man, I got you, youknow?
Yeah, 100% think that's how it was.
And no, no, but I can't really be convinced otherwise.

(01:26:02):
But that just solidified it. That was the first one I'd
killed and with the bow and I was like, oh man, I made-up with
it. You know.
So ever since then, that's yeah,I just really enjoy it.
The difficulty is so good. I think nothing wrong with gun
hunting at all. People enjoy it, do it, Nothing.
Nothing wrong with that. People doing just gun hunt.
But I feel like that almost makes it like a little too easy

(01:26:24):
in some aspects. So I enjoy the the challenge of
having to get drawn back and sit20 yards away from something
that I'm actively hunting, you know, and I think it almost just
takes you back a little. I have so much respect for
Native Americans and that, you know, how they did it like
seriously from from the jump, way tougher than I could ever
dream about being. So I think to that, you know,

(01:26:46):
was a big inspiration just kind of even going on like with that.
It was like, you know, that doeskind of fuel a little bit of
that like aggression and like madness.
You know what I mean? You know, so, and, and I think a
lot of that it too is, you know,thank God Hannah really enjoys
eating that way. And we don't want that.
You know, I try to remember to pray before I go.
And it's like, you know, I want to use that for his glory too,

(01:27:10):
because I can share that. I can give that to people.
The the place where like I was talking about hunting before
those patients, you know, I was able to take a deer, 11 deer off
their land couple years ago and I ended up, you know, Hannah and
I cooked some of it and brought it over there.
So it was like, it was just coolto be able to share because it's
like, you know, I was no, no result of my own, but it was a

(01:27:31):
result of, you know, the Lord providing it for us.
So just a challenge and being outside in the fall is just
really can't be beat. So I kind of enjoy that too.
Yeah. Yeah, man, it's a great thing.
I think everybody on the planet,male, female, doesn't matter.
Should should do it. It's just it's awesome.
I've been very blessed and very lucky, like I said, with people
who are yelling, they allow me to hunt.

(01:27:52):
I hunt at my wife's grandparentstoo.
They've got some property and usually when I get when I'm in
the harvesting one, like I'll bring it back over there and
like her grandpa, stay out thereand talk to me, her brother long
come out there, her dad and evenher grandma and I get one who
come out. Oh, that's great.
You know, the camaraderie and that be able to share share that
with them. I think, and even is, I think
that's the best part of it. And same way when I was able to

(01:28:14):
hunt at my grand uncle's behind their house, talking about the
camaraderie going in there and talking to him, that was it.
And like, I've got a I'll show you when we're when we're done.
So I don't take take time away from him.
But like when I'd gotten, I'd gotten a pretty decent deer at
my former patients place and she's, oh, I want to take a
picture, you know, and then like, you know, and it's like,

(01:28:35):
man, you know, the the camaraderie of that is just now.
You can't beat it. Yes, well, that's biggest,
biggest reason why you have fun.How do you like to cook your
venison? Man, that's a good question.
Is, I mean, I know like I could talk about steak for a while,
but I don't know as much about like venison.
I've only had it a few times, sure.

(01:28:56):
Yeah, I also love some steak. You know, we do ground a quite a
bit of it. But I've got a Steve Ronella has
another guy I kind of listened to that kind of got me into bow
hunting too. He's got a good cookbook, a
couple good cookbooks. It's hunting, butchering,
hunting, butchering. North American big game.
Hannah got me there for Christmas a few years ago.
It's got some good recipes. Honestly, probably if I had to

(01:29:17):
just pick one, would probably just be steak in general.
And then it's good. It cooks a lot like beef.
It's just so lean that you can't, you know, you got to add
a little bit to it. So I usually just do.
I love to grill, but man, cast iron is hard to beat.
It's a love cast iron, dude. Cast iron did.
Brown steak on a skillet. Well, that's I'll do man, I

(01:29:37):
could talk about this for a while.
Just a little bit. You get a steak that's got a
real good flavour, just a littlebit of salt and pepper over it
and then just like sear and. Tell them that's it did 100%,
man. Yeah, that's probably my
favorite man. And we do ground a lot and have
that like burgers, whatever. Like I can just found a couple

(01:29:58):
recipes on Pinterest will do that, yeah.
Yeah, our sister knows that. Yeah, dude, Pinterest is.
Solid for some recipes. Yeah, man, that's probably our
main way. I think that's her favorite is
the steaks. So that that, man, that works
out good. Yeah.
When you have, I've had a lot ofguys I've talked to, you know,
like work, whatever they like. They enjoy the hunt too.
But it's like, yeah, my wife won't eat any of it.
And you know what? I'd say it's like she just
doesn't really like it. And I'm like, but I'm very

(01:30:19):
lucky, you know? Yeah, that's great because you
don't have to have two dinners or anything.
But yeah, man, it is. It's awesome.
Beyoncé steaks were probably my favorite backstrat.
And then honestly, probably juststraight up burgers, man.
That's probably my one too. Yeah, yeah.
It's like bro, simplicity is great with this.
Yeah, 'cause I mean, you can cook it into like some some

(01:30:41):
super complicated meal or put itin a Stew or something, but like
you really just want to get the flavour and just put it on a bun
or just straight up eat it like a steak.
Yeah, who's who's going to be mad about?
Yeah, we're going to have steak and burgers.
OK, What time do I need to be? No, nobody's going to be mad
about that, man. That's that's that's for sure.
And where do you go to hunt? So my wife's, my wife's

(01:31:01):
grandparents have I have that place right outside of Hopkins
County. I hunt there and then I hunt
around the Saint Joe area a little bit too.
Those are my two kind of main spots that I go.
And like I said, it's it's it's I'm very lucky because I'm
really the only one that bow hunt either.

(01:31:21):
You know. So that's, it's just it.
Yeah. You know, for people who haven't
been and that you know, it's like it's being out there when
everything wakes up and no one like a man again, I talk about
general revelation, like God's creation, like you're watching
everything start to move. Yep, You know, I think there is
and this is I think this transcends gender at all, you

(01:31:44):
know, but you know, just seeing that everything wake up and
start again. It's like the Lord has put all
this emotion, you know, and it'scrazy, man, you know, just being
there, thinking like that, anticipation, especially the
mornings are like I really had amorning of 1000 a one.
Probably. You know, just because, you
know, you get to see all that, but man, the nor like the

(01:32:05):
anticipation of like, you know, the Lord's I'm hoping, you know,
like the Lord's going to provideme, you know, even if I'm
hunting doesn't like the Lord's provided me with another day to
break up and to wake up and enjoy, you know, someone.
And that's kind of a win win. You know, it's a you know, I
really can't be a bad day, you know, and even the things I've
I've either missed made a bad shot, whatever.
It's like the Lord's just provided even with those things

(01:32:27):
too, you know? Yeah.
Those are my 2 main places and like I said, I always end up.
There's been many times I've either waited too long, the
hunter got to talk and do that. I can hurry up if you doubt it.
But again, like the relationshippart of that dude, I'll be able.
I can't think I'm better. Yeah, I'm still cool.
I'll be right back. I'll let that water drink too.

(01:32:48):
You're doing great. Thank you.
You're welcome if you need it, it's just wrong.
All right, I got one more question.
Sure. So a lot of adults I know, and
this is something I definitely want to get better on they, they
have a time each day where they just spend time with God alone.
And, and my dad did that for years and it really just kind of

(01:33:11):
dictated how not dictated, but that really made a difference on
how his day went, whether or nothe's been telling God.
So like when you're out there, is that like a time where you're
just like praying and talking toGod and or is it just more about
like the hunting, which neither one is, is bad or good?
Sure. Yeah.
I think that's the beauty of like we're talking about, like
the morning hunts are so good. I try to get there, usually try

(01:33:32):
to get there an hour before first light.
So let's say daylight, 6:00, 5-30 would be first light.
I'm trying to get there by 4:30.Like I'm so I, you know, I'm,
I'm, I'm sitting. I'm not walking in like, am I?
Am I saying I get there late? How do I get there on time?
No, bro. Yeah, but my goal is to get
there and get set. So I have an hour before I can
pull my bow back, you know, if Icould even begin to shoot

(01:33:53):
something. Yep.
So yes, I do think a lot of those, that's a really good
question. Especially when I first started
bowling, you know, we kind of had some things that like going
on life loss, you know, and someother things that were really
kind of tough to get through. And the Lord seen seen us
through that. And thank you.
And I thank a big chunk of me being able to deal with that.

(01:34:14):
You know, I had my mom's dad passed.
It's been almost two years now, too.
Like those things like that, that gives me a lot of open time
that's detached. You know, my phone's unusual and
like I got a little pouch. I usually throw my phone in
there. It's just no outside
distractions. Nobody's asking me anything.

(01:34:36):
Phone's not going off. And TV.
'S not on, you know. And I think that having that
time with the Lord is and the morning usually is my time
anyway. I will usually before I go do
anything in the morning. That's usually the time that I
will read or pray as well. And then sometimes it's late at
night right before I go to bed. I am an old man, so I go to
sleep. So we're getting up at like

(01:34:57):
4:00. So, you know, I think that that
that definitely has been, again,been a big blessing to be able
to go out and like, you know, I think about you when I get out
there. It's like, man, I've already
prayed for 3045 minutes. It's not 6:00 AM.
Yeah, you know, that's great. So, yeah, I, I think that time

(01:35:18):
it is good, like I said, just toenjoy nature.
But yes, I think that the biggest part of it is, is a, a
spiritual aspect, you know, especially cuz I, you know, I
feel like everything that I've done with it has been, you know,
like all fruit of the Lord's notbeen anything that I've done.
And. Kind of go on that it's it's,

(01:35:39):
it's good. It's good when you have other
people around you that are believers that kind of like you
can like discuss that. And that's the same way it is
like with where I go hunt. They're both believers.
And then, you know, I'm all my, my wife's, my wife's family and
I go over there too. So it's like they just, you
know, it feels like it, it meansmore everybody like knows the
importance of doing that. And my favorites have been like,

(01:36:00):
I've shot one, got a little bit of blood travel.
I'm gonna wait a little bit. And dude, it's it's cool.
Like my brother-in-law who've been telling my brother-in-law,
my father-in-law and by her grand greatest grandpa, that's
just the odd grandpa in the Australia.
Like they're like, yeah, we'll go back up there and look,
They'll help you look. And dude like this.
Yeah, I'm like, do I want to find the shoot near?

(01:36:20):
Of course, but it's like, bro, this is all you know what I
mean? Like just that camera and
absolutely, you know, and it's they're always I mean like
especially normal watch that. Like you went with me when I I
shot. I got very lucky this passage
and I shot one in the morning, 1:00 in the afternoon, the
opener, 2 dose. And oh, man, yeah, you know,
he's, oh, praise the Lord. Yeah.
First I said it's like he means it, you know, And it's just

(01:36:40):
like, it's not like I said like he means it's like, this is
cool, man, you know? So I think it's just me trying
to, you know, be mindful of likein this.
It's, I think it's helped to seelike not just hunting because
I'm outside, because it's creation, but like literally
everything else is the same. You know, it's like it was
provided for this too. You know, it's, it's just, I
think it's easier to see or for my small mind, it's easier for

(01:37:03):
me to view that to that kind of window than I kind of, you get
lost in the busyness of other things I feel like.
So yeah, man, it's it's it's it's great on both cords.
Yeah, that's awesome. I mean, just being able to find
joy in something just from doingit, like incorrect if we're
wrong. But I mean, it sounds like even
if you you can go all morning and not actually take down a

(01:37:25):
deer, you're still enjoying every second of it.
Oh yeah, yeah, that's great. And also just like finding
something, like finding a hobby that you're just good at.
Sure. And just being good at something
is really, I think is honoring to the Lord, of course,
depending on what it is. But like just finding a skill,
especially a practical skill like that, and it's just

(01:37:47):
honoring to the Lord and and then just being able to praise
him do that is great. Yeah, I agree with that.
Yeah, absolutely. So that's all I have.
If you have anything to add, I mean, we can talk about
anything. Sure.
No, I think it's I think that you've done you've done solid.
Thank you, man. Absolutely, yes, Sir.
You know, and I think like just conversations like this are just

(01:38:10):
fruitful in itself. Absolutely, you know, and just
being able to sit back like we're talking about, it's just
good to have somebody just to beable to talk to, you know, And I
think that's something like those relationships are so
important, especially us, like as males for some, I'm just
like, I don't really want to talk about it or oh.
Yeah, and. I'm guilty of that, you know, my
wife has to get stuff out. I'm just like, what do you ought
to be like? Hey, can just all right, man,

(01:38:32):
listen to me. What's up?
You know, I need the push too. I'm not saying I do it all the
time long. That's a lie.
But yeah, man, it's just yeah. Thanks for the conversation.
Thanks for coming on the show, dude.
Absolutely. I pray for you.
Yeah, that'd be great. Please do, man.
Yeah. God thanks Tristan and for this
opportunity to talk to him gets known a little better.

(01:38:53):
And God, I give this podcast up to you and just use it however
you want. I pray that you'll continue to
use Tristan your Kingdom. I pray you use me and your
Kingdom and thank you for this rainy day.

(01:39:13):
I pray that the pray that we alljust have a good day today and
that whoever's listening to thisnow can just get a lot out of it
and that they'll hear you in this show and that you'll just
help them with whatever they're struggling with And just to
remember that you love them and,and you've got them.
You want to help them out. And I pray for Tristan's family

(01:39:38):
and his wife. And I just pray that you'll
continue to bless them and placeyour blessing and protection
over their home and their marriage.
And I just pray that you'll givethem a long, happy life together
and in God's never praying. Amen.
Thanks. Brother, appreciate it well.

(01:39:58):
Thanks for listening to the show.
If you enjoyed listening, that'sgreat.
And if you think you'd like to be on the show, or you think you
might know someone you'd like tohear on the show, just shoot me
a text or send me an e-mail at gunner.leaththatsleath@veachministries.com.

(01:40:22):
That e-mail should be in the description, unless I forgot.

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