June 12, 2024 • 59 mins
Ever had a date with a flat earther? Yep, we’ve been there too, and it’s just the tip of the iceberg in this wild episode of the Joosi Sex Podcast. We kick things off with that bizarre dating story, which perfectly segues into an enlightening discussion about the "ho phase"—a time in life where being less picky about partners and exploring your sexuality without societal strings attached is not just okay, but damn liberating. We reflect on our own journeys through sexual liberation, touching on the perplexing resistance to condom use in today's dating scene, and stress the crucial role of sexual autonomy and safety.
Communication and consent are the bedrock of satisfying sexual experiences, and we’ve got tales to tell! From navigating the uncharted waters of threesomes to the liberating act of ending unsatisfying sex mid-stroke, we underscore the importance of asserting control over your sexual encounters. We highlight the necessity of clear communication and consent, even in the heat of the moment, to ensure everyone’s comfort and pleasure. Our stories reinforce that no one owes their partner anything beyond their comfort, and it’s perfectly okay to call the shots when things aren’t hitting the right notes.
And for those who like a dash of adventure, we delve into the thrill of public sex, recounting escapades from gondolas to porta potties that add a spicy twist to any relationship. We also explore how a "ho phase" can impact friendships and personal growth, acknowledging the emotional toll and the liberation that comes with embracing your desires. Whether it’s a short-lived phase or a long-term choice, this episode is all about celebrating your sexual freedom, living without shame, and recognizing that your journey is uniquely yours. Join us for a candid, empowering conversation that might just change the way you think about your own sexual adventures!
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Episode Transcript
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Alisa Eddy (00:00):
This is something that my partner and I talked
(00:02):
about.
That was a big aha moment forhim and kind of changed him was
there was a guy who I had beenon a few dates with, who turned
out to be a flat earther oh God,yeah.
And I was like, wow, that's arevelation.
And I was just sitting there atthis really fancy taco place
(00:25):
being like what do I do?
Did he just say that?
And so I asked a few questionsto figure out if it was true.
And it seemed like that's wherethings were going.
And he was like and then youkicked him to the curb, right,
my partner and I was like, no, Idefinitely fucked him that
night.
And he was like what?
(00:46):
No, I definitely fucked himthat night.
And he was like what, you wouldfuck somebody like that?
And I'm like, yeah, how?
Jenn (00:52):
many like how many flat earthers are you intelligent?
Alisa Eddy (00:56):
or or low quality humans have you fucked because
they were attractive?
No, right, and as a man, no oneis like is like oh, you should
have had your principles.
Where did your value system?
Go what happened to you.
How could you do that?
Could you open your legs forthat flat earther?
I mean, he definitely ruledhimself out of any future dates.
Jenn (01:17):
That's so funny though that you fucked a flat earther.
I would have been interested inseeing what he would say in bed
.
I know right.
Oh, look the horizon.
Does it look curved now Foryour pleasure or mine?
Alisa Eddy (01:41):
I guess, yeah, for a flat earther, he did like
curves.
I can say that much.
Welcome to the Juicy SexPodcast, where my friends and I
have raw, unfiltered andhilarious conversations about
all things sex.
I'm Alisa Eddy, the founder andCEO of Juicy Sexual Wellness,
(02:02):
where we try the toys and helpyou find the right one for you.
Now on to the podcast.
Hello audience, it's time totalk about something really,
really important, which is yourho phase, and it doesn't
necessarily even need to end atall, but it is something that is
a really important part of yourlife and we're going to talk
(02:23):
about it.
Pretty much every woman I'veever been close to has a ho
phase, but it's very carefulwhen they talk about it.
Yeah, do you concur?
Jenn (02:35):
I think in certain crowds people are careful when they
talk about it In certain crowds.
Yeah, fair In ours it's alittle different, but most
people yeah.
Alisa Eddy (02:43):
Yeah.
One question is what do we meanby a ho phase?
I can tell you what I mean.
This is a phase and often thereare multiple of them in your
life where you are less pickyabout partners, you have more
partners.
More often you try new thingssexually.
(03:03):
Often you try new thingssexually and I personally look
back on these phases veryproudly and fondly, and always
(03:24):
in my life when my sexuality wasmine yeah, and it didn't really
like have anything to do withanybody else.
Yeah so that's what I woulddefine a ho phase.
How would you define a ho phase?
Jenn (03:36):
Throwing shit at the wall and see what sticks.
You know.
Alisa Eddy (03:40):
Sounds like how a chimpanzee might define a ho
phase.
Jenn (03:41):
I don't know Sounds like how a chimpanzee might define a
hoe phase.
I don't know Like I think I'vehad intermittent hoe phases,
Just depends on how I'm feelingat the time.
But I remember distinctly oneof my first very elongated hoe
phases was when I broke up withthis guy in my 20s and I felt
(04:02):
like I wasn't trapped anymoreand I was like I'm gonna fuck
everybody.
You know.
Alisa Eddy (04:08):
I'm not really.
I think that's an interestingthing that was surprising to me
about, like my later hoe phaseas an adult.
So I mean, I was an adult formost of my sex life, don't worry
everybody.
But one thing that surprised meas a person who came of age in
the 90s, when I met my long-termpartner, who I ended up
(04:34):
marrying and being with forever.
Whatever.
We're not together anymore,thank God, but anyhow, it
started when I was like 19 yearsold, I think, and before that,
when I would hook up with people, condoms were an obvious no
brainer.
No one was like, oh, why wouldwe use a condom?
It was just like, of course,let's get a condom.
(04:55):
Yeah, because I think in the90s we had the big HIV scare,
yeah, and those of us who got togo to those assemblies and all
of that were like and those ofus who got to go to those
assemblies and all of that werelike, yep, I'm going to be safe.
And then when I was 35, Ibecame single again in the I
don't know mid, like 2016.
(05:16):
And I was really shocked howmany men would pretend that they
were surprised when you askedfor a condom yeah, yeah, it's
like no, wrap that shit up.
Jenn (05:31):
Wrap that shit up, I don't want your aids.
Alisa Eddy (05:33):
I don't, I don't want any of whatever.
I don't want your head.
I don't want I don't want, Idon't know, you like that, put a
barrier on it, put a fuckingbarrier on it, but it would like
it blew my mind.
So the first time um, it wasn'tthe first time I slept with
somebody outside of my marriage,but it was like early in that
(05:53):
phase where I was on a date witha guy and we went back to his
place and we were having areally good time and I did let
him put me in restraints theywere velcro so, and it was like
I could reach them myself.
It was like so, it's like allright, I'm fine, it's good.
Um, and then we were fuckingaround and I was like okay, I
(06:13):
think it's time to have sex.
So I was like okay, do you havea condom?
And he was like condom.
And I was like yes, and he waslike well, what kind of a slut
are you?
Why do you need a condom?
And I was like I startedlaughing so hard, like cry, like
(06:35):
cry, laughing.
I was like are you fuckingserious right now?
And he's like, yeah, like what,what kind of a slut would need
a condom?
I'm like, oh my god.
I was like this is a good oneand I'm like oh my God, I was
like this is fucking hilarious,a good one, and I'm like pull
the fucking Velcro off.
Like yeah, no, no, no, no,there will not be any sex
happening without condoms.
Nice try, you just ripped itoff, fucking person.
(06:56):
What the fuck was that?
Yeah, so that was one of thebig surprises of my later ho
phase.
I would say, was this likeresurgence in men trying to get
out of using condoms?
Yeah, what is that?
What is that?
Jenn (07:12):
They're like oh, I just don't feel it as much.
Is your dick numb, I don't care.
Alisa Eddy (07:16):
Then don't try for it.
Yeah, you know what?
If it's not that great for you,then just like, don't try to
fuck people.
Jenn (07:23):
Yeah.
Alisa Eddy (07:26):
There, it's not that great for you.
Then just like, don't try tofuck people.
Yeah, there's probably dollsfor you.
Yeah, that was like I don'tknow in terms of condoms in my
later singledom.
That was just like what thefuck is going on here?
No way Shocker, yeah.
So I think the idea in the hophase for me actually, this is
(07:48):
something that my partner and Italked about that was a big aha
moment for him and kind ofchanged him, was there was a guy
who I had been on a few dateswith, who turned out to be a
flat earther oh God, yeah, and Iwas.
I was like, wow, that's arevelation.
(08:09):
And I was just sitting there atthis really fancy taco place
being like, um, what do I do?
Did he just say that?
So I asked a few like questionsto figure out if it was true.
And it seemed like that's wherethings were going.
And he was like and then youkicked him to the curb, right.
My partner and I was like, uh,no, I definitely fucked him that
(08:31):
night and he was like, what youwould fuck somebody like that?
And I'm like, yeah, how manylike unintelligent or low
quality humans have you fuckedbecause they were attractive,
seriously Right and as a man, noone is like, oh, you should
(08:53):
have had your principles.
Where did your value system?
Jenn (08:57):
go.
Alisa Eddy (08:58):
Where?
What happened to you?
How could you do?
Jenn (08:59):
that.
Alisa Eddy (09:00):
How could you open your legs for that flat earther?
I mean, he definitely ruledhimself out of any future dates.
Jenn (09:05):
That's so funny though that you fucked a flat earther.
I would have been interested inseeing what he would say in bed
.
I know right.
Oh, look the horizon.
Does it look curved now Foryour pleasure or mine?
Alisa Eddy (09:29):
I guess, yeah, for a flat earther he did like curves
, I can say that.
But yeah, I think that was a.
I know that was a big momentfor my partner because he was
like, wait, what he's like.
Wait, women do that too.
Yeah, I was like, oh yeah, wefuck people that we think are
stupid or annoying just becausethey're hot and at the moment it
(09:51):
makes sense.
And they might not even be hot,might just be like we want to
have sex, just like men are, butjust morbidly curious.
Yeah.
But sometimes, like women, weget held to this higher standard
, like there's supposed to besome meaning about us as the
fucky If, if the like, moral,intellectual qualities of the
(10:14):
fucker are not high enough thatthat we're supposed to reject
them.
And I call bullshit.
Jenn (10:20):
Yeah, I mean I have a story similar to that, not not a
flat earther, but of like justreally not that bright guys.
After this fraternity party incollege I was like flirting with
these baseball they playedbaseball at Berkeley Maybe I
shouldn't have said my collegename, but I was just like
(10:43):
they're, they're hot, and I wasjust wanted to bang them both
and I had never had a threesomebefore, so I was kind of a noob
at it and they were both tryingto get at me and I finally was
like, well, if you want me, andRight, and I was like let's have
sex.
And I mean I didn't know what Iwas doing, necessarily, but I
(11:13):
mean I, I know how to move mylimbs around, I guess more
gracefully, I used to be aballet dancer.
I'm a little bit morecoordinated and I thought maybe
they would be coordinatedbecause they're, they have
bought, they play with balls.
They should be coordinated withtheir balls one might think and
be wrong, but it was such anawkward experience.
(11:36):
they were so awkward to eachother and like they, they were
just trying to not touch andthen, like they were doing kind
of boring maneuvers, where hewas just in the back and I was
like sucking the other guy'sdick, but it was just like they
weren't moving in a rhythm thatwas like conducive to any
pleasure.
Alisa Eddy (11:53):
Oh, like they weren't syncing up at all.
So you're like on three-quartertime with one of them and on
like two-four with the other.
Jenn (12:06):
We're in the ninth inning here and you're not winning,
motherfucker.
And I in the middle of thethreesome, like a referee or
something, I was like, all right, we're done, you're out, we're
not, get out, you're out, getout, we're done.
I was like I tried.
They were really hot.
You know you never.
You never know what you'regoing to get.
Sometimes the sex might bereally good, sometimes it might
not be good, but that wasn'treally.
My goal was to have aconversation with them, you know
(12:27):
, like to really hang outafterwards?
No, purely just for pleasure.
Yeah.
So women absolutely do that too, and men should know.
Alisa Eddy (12:37):
I'm really proud of your negotiation skills.
Like there doesn't have to beone winner here, we can create
value for all parties.
Jenn (12:45):
I didn't even realize that was what I was doing in the
moment.
I was like, yeah, that'sawesome.
Alisa Eddy (12:51):
That is awesome, we're a team.
Yeah, I feel like I had anexperience during my I guess it
was during my divorce, butwhatever like during divorce ho
phase with a guy who the firsttime that he came over we met on
bumble, I think, and the firsttime that he came over we had
(13:11):
pretty good sex.
It was really fun, we had agood time and then, um, I don't
know, maybe a few weeks, monthor so later, he wanted to come
over again.
So it's like okay, this is,this is going to be pretty good.
And he was drunk.
He was drunk.
Jenn (13:26):
And I was sober.
Alisa Eddy (13:27):
Yeah and well.
Yeah, but he had no rhythm, ohyeah.
And he was just like, yeah,no-transcript, we're fucking
(14:13):
done.
And so I had started my littlecountdown and then, as I'm like
93, 94, I was like wait, holdthe fucking front door.
I don't know this dude, I don'towe him shit, I don't owe him a
single stroke inside of myvagina.
That is not feeling good to me.
And I was like wait, he's likewhat.
(14:35):
I was like I'm going to call itabsolutely.
I'm not having good sex.
Are you having good sex?
Damn good, Good for you.
And he was like well, I don'tknow, I mean, are you giving me
a chance to like?
You know, like?
Jenn (14:50):
get with it, and.
Alisa Eddy (14:51):
I was like actually, no, I'm like really turned off
now and I don't want to have sexwith you anymore and I'm just
going to call it.
And he was like blown away.
He's like really, I'm likereally okay, all right, okay.
and I was like his place, oryours, my place.
So I was like you are clearlytoo drunk to be transportating
(15:13):
yourself, so you can go lay downand relax.
You don't have to get out ofthe house, but there will not be
any more sex.
Good for you, yeah, but it waslike such a corrective
experience.
It was so liberating, yeah, tobe like I don't just be like no
to be like.
No, I don't owe you shit.
(15:33):
I don't owe you any extrastrokes.
I don't owe you any extra tries.
I don't owe you any extra time.
If I'm not enjoying this, Idon't have to sit here and count
down from 99 to get to thepoint where I can allow myself
to quit.
I can actually just be like andseen.
Jenn (15:49):
I mean, if you think about it, guys, for eons have been
like calling you a cab the nextmorning, right, I've never
personally had that happen, butit happens to women like oh yeah
, we're done, get out of myhouse now, yeah, Like so fuck
that.
If we need to truncate the sexin the middle to be like it's
not great, Thanks, I'll call youan Uber.
(16:11):
Yeah, we do that.
We can do that too.
You can do that, ladies you cando that.
Alisa Eddy (16:16):
I empower you to do that.
I think it is.
Jenn (16:19):
It saves everybody you can be a hoe at standards.
Alisa Eddy (16:21):
Yeah, you can be like it's not so much about
having to be picky about who orwhen, but being picky about
whether or not you enjoy it, Ithink is a good thing to be
picky about.
Jenn (16:33):
Yeah, 100%.
Alisa Eddy (16:34):
Right.
It was like I went, I talked tomy therapist about it.
Like two days later I went inand I was like I had a great
experience with this random dude.
She's like okay, a greatexperience with this random dude
.
She's like okay.
And I told her she's like thatis about the best corrective
experience that I could possiblycreate for a woman to have
Therapist approved yeah.
She was like stamp of approvalExcellent.
(16:55):
So I really encourage you toremember next time that you're
having sex with somebody andyou're not enjoying it, that you
don't have to try a differentposition, do something different
, move this or that.
You can also just be like I'mdone, I'm over it, and you have
your right to do that, literallymid-stroke.
Jenn (17:17):
Never forget it we need stickers now we do mid-stroke?
Alisa Eddy (17:22):
I quit mid-stroke.
Yeah, that was a really goodexperience for me to have.
So let me tell you a story.
I was really excited to buy anew clit-sucking toy.
So I went to the world'slargest online sex toy retailer
and I found hundreds of optionswith no indication which ones
(17:46):
are quality and which ones areright for me.
So I had to make my best guess.
I ordered the toy, got it inthe mail, super excited to try
it, and, bummer, it's way toostrong, even on the lowest
setting, turns out I can't evenuse it and I wasted 80 bucks.
(18:07):
So I throw it in my nightstandand a couple months later I look
to discover that it hasactually melted into another sex
toy in my nightstand.
I was so mad I decided to startmy own sex toy company, juicy.
At Juicy, we sell a highlycurated selection of body safe
(18:30):
sex toys and we test them sothat we can give you all the
deets about whether or not it'sright for you, such as how
strong or gentle it is, how loudis it and how easy is it to
operate.
How loud is it and how easy isit to operate?
So support this podcast and buyyour next sex toy at
(18:59):
getjuicycom.
That's G-E-T-J-O-O-S-I dot com.
I feel like ho phases are supervaluable as just a person who
engages the world sexually.
During these phases, you havethe chance to rapidly learn new
behaviors that you want to form.
(19:20):
Right so, true, right.
So, if you're like OK, I reallyneed to get better at asking
partners what their STD statusis before we have sex, right so,
true, kind of like, okay, whatis my, what's my way of starting
a sexual interaction withsomebody?
What are the things that Ithink need to be said and that
(19:49):
need to be discussed, andinstead of it happening so
infrequently that each time thatthere's a new partner in your
life, you're like oh, Back tothe drawing board.
Jenn (19:59):
Yeah.
Alisa Eddy (19:59):
What are the things that we're supposed to say or
ask or whatever?
Getting practice with that soyou can develop actual habits
around it?
I think is really valuable.
Jenn (20:09):
I mean that's, I've learned a lot in my whole phases
, I mean, unless you you have tohave different kinds of sex
play with different kinds oftoys, different guys with
different personalities or women, whatever you want.
You know, like figure out likewhat your vibe is, like what you
want to have during that moment, um, and I, I mean I've learned
(20:32):
a lot from trying threesomes,just doing like missionary stuff
, doing crazy shit in public,yeah.
So you're like what do I likewhere?
Where do I fit?
Yeah, where do they fit?
Literally, where do they fit?
Alisa Eddy (20:48):
Is this one a candidate for anal, yeah, or
oral, yeah, I think so.
Learning so this is an areawhere actually the poly and
swinger community have developedreally good sort of standard
operating procedures, right,where, when they're engaging
(21:09):
with a new person, it's like,first of all, what are your
boundaries?
Which sexual acts are youinterested in doing today?
Might be, I'm only interestedin oral Okay, receiving or
giving?
Maybe just giving, okay, cool,we got it.
So you've got to find out whatpeople want to do.
Then, std status when was thelast time that you were tested?
(21:32):
What are you positive for?
What are you not?
If you have some of thelong-term things, are you being
treated or not?
When was your last outbreak?
So on and so forth.
And then I really like thisco-creation possibility, which
is that, in the ideal situationof I really want to go find a
(21:54):
bar somewhere and find a sneakoff, and find a place in public
to go down on you and thatsounds really hot to me, yeah,
right which is being creativeand thinking what do I really
want here, instead of just likewhatever happens.
Jenn (22:18):
Right.
Alisa Eddy (22:20):
Mm-hmm, like whatever happens right, and so I
think that in this kind of inthe poly and swinger community,
they do a really good job ofexploring all that stuff and
learning how to get comfortabledoing it, and I think that
that's a great community to takea page from when you're going
into a ho phase.
Jenn (22:39):
Yeah, I mean definitely asking the right questions so
that you don't end up in a badsituation as long as no one lies
.
Yeah, no lying, and I mean yougot to have consent rules.
Be you know, given and receivedproperly, like if you change
your mind in the middle ofsomething that should be
respected too.
Alisa Eddy (23:07):
Yeah, Absolutely.
I was talking with someone whoI have been sexual with in the
past, who was asking about myrules, or like my rules with my
partner as a couple.
And they were asking you knowwhy we have boundaries where we
do?
And I said I don't want anyoneto feel entitled to my body ever
.
So just because you and I haveslept together does not mean
(23:27):
that you have the right to comeand put your arm around me at a
party.
Jenn (23:31):
Yeah, like the other time, right yeah, Next time yeah
absolutely To come and kiss mewithout asking yeah.
Just touch me without asking oh, we've already hooked up, so
it's okay now.
Yes, the gate is open forever.
Alisa Eddy (23:42):
No, it's not like that and it should be a
case-by-case, event-by-eventnegotiation between two people,
and if you can employ that, itcan allow you to feel much safer
experimenting with differentpeople in different places,
because you're making reallyclear expectations that it
doesn't mean just because wewere at a party and you and I
(24:04):
made out doesn't mean that youget to just kiss me without
asking me at the next party,right?
And I think I think, especiallyfor women, one of the types of
calculus we do when we considerwhether or not we're going to
take on another partner is willthey feel entitled to my body?
Jenn (24:20):
Yeah, and that's where kind of the fear comes in too.
And I was going to say on yourprevious point, when within the
swinger and like poly community,people are a little bit more
comfortable talking about thosethings, like asking the right
questions about the STDs andthings like that.
But for a lot of people theyhave a lot of shame around it
(24:40):
and they're like embarrassed orafraid to say it.
And honestly, the more youstand your ground and say it,
the more respect you're going toearn from the other person and
for yourself, and over timeit'll become easier to just be
like nope, I want to know thesethings, this is the experience I
want to have, and you're goingto find better sexual partners
that way too.
This is the experience I wantto have, and you're going to
find better sexual partners thatway too.
Alisa Eddy (25:00):
Yeah, that is very true.
Jenn (25:01):
Because the people usually that respect those things are
better at sex.
That's true Because they'veprobably had more experience.
Alisa Eddy (25:08):
Yeah, they have more experience, yeah.
Yeah, exactly know that in someplaces in the world there's this
controversy about consent interms of if a man asks a woman
before he kisses her, does thatruin all the romance or the
attraction?
And I'm gonna shoot off some ofmy opinions about that.
(25:33):
Let's go, um, here's what Iwill say.
It shouldn't and I do mean toshould all over people on this
one.
If I'm going to should my pantsright now, you're shitting me,
I'm shitting you.
Um, so I'm going to use thestereotypical gender roles, um,
(25:58):
for the sake of what is probablythe most typical experience.
But it could be anything but saythat you are a woman and you
are getting intimate,potentially with another male
partner.
You guys are getting close.
It might be like that time thatyou're about to potentially
kiss and they're like can I kissyou Now?
(26:18):
There are some people who willbe like oh, I just hate that, it
just ruins the moment.
And there are others who willsay that's essential you cannot
kiss me unless I have told youthat it is okay, right, and
everything in between.
And I would say, for those ofyou who feel like it ruins the
moment are you adult enough tosay yes to the things that you
(26:43):
want.
Is the real issue that you'renot comfortable saying yes, I
want to be kissed, and so yousay that it ruins the moment?
Is it not more important thatsomeone get your permission than
that you not feel thediscomfort of acknowledging your
own sexual desire?
Jenn (27:02):
Yeah, it's almost like consent with yourself too.
Yeah, what do I consent withmyself?
What do I want to do?
Alisa Eddy (27:09):
Yep, admitting to yourself yes, I do want to be
kissed, and I think, the waythat a lot of femmes are brought
up in our culture, it can behard to admit that, to say yeah,
I do want to be kissed rightnow it feels dangerous to do,
and yet I also think it's alittle cowardly to say that it
ruins the moment, when all thatreally ruined the moment was
(27:31):
your inability to express yourdesire or lack thereof Right.
Or lack thereof.
Jenn (27:37):
Right, that's a really good point.
Like it's not hard to say youknow, yes, I want to be kissed,
and then just have theexperience.
Yeah, Like don't put it onsomeone else to make the
decision for you whether it'slike to be kissed because you do
want to be kissed, or then bekissed and you didn't want it.
And now it's weird and awkwardit is like it can be scary.
Alisa Eddy (27:59):
I mean, I feel like when I watch the old movies
where nobody asked and they werejust like slowly lean closer
and closer and be like theirmouths are opening, and you're
like, oh God, is it going tohappen?
Oh my God, I don't know, and Iget like so weirded out.
(28:22):
It's like usually such anawkward, like once they connect
the faces, like it's always likea weird awkward, like some like
they hit their teeth or yeah,and so I just think, imagine if
you're like, oh no, it feelslike the kiss moment's about to
happen and you can be like hey,can I kiss you?
Yeah, it just breaks down thebarrier and then I have that
awkward moment, yeah, and thenthat person can be like fuck yes
, and then you can go like allthe way in it instead of like
(28:45):
was that okay?
Like you know, it's so weird,yeah, it's weird.
So to me it makes things afuckload.
Weirder to not ask and to notbe given the opportunity to give
permission than to be like arewe going to do this, yeah, we're
going to do this, and then youcan go all the way into it.
Jenn (29:08):
It's a good perspective.
I think people need to hear.
Alisa Eddy (29:10):
Yeah, and I know it can be hard, especially for
people raised as women who havebeen taught that their desires
are not okay and that it'sreally all about what other
people want.
So it's all about you know them, getting what they want, and
you're kind of the goalkeeperfor others.
(29:32):
Instead, maybe go out and beyour own advocate and be like
I'm looking at this dude, we'regetting closer and I really want
to kiss him, yeah.
And I'm going to this dude,we're getting closer and I
really want to kiss him, yeah,and I'm going to ask Right, and
so kind of taking that power Ithink is good and the more
frequent, it's sort of likescuba diving.
So if you want to get good atscuba diving, you have to go
(29:53):
like twice a day, every day, fora week or something.
You have to get this frequencyof experience doing it so that
you develop habits, because ifyou're starting from scratch
every single time and you don'thave habits, you have to think
about so much more with yourbrain, right?
So my habit is asking.
My habit is maybe, if they'regetting close and they haven't
(30:17):
asked me, I'm like whoa, wouldyou like to kiss?
Right, I can take control ofthat and I can ask do you have
partners?
Do you have?
Are you monogamous?
Are you not?
Do you have consent to do whatwe're talking about doing from
any potential partners?
Do you have STDs?
When were you last tested?
All those things, getting inthe habit of it.
(30:39):
So it's the same thing as scubadiving, like checking your
weight belt, checking yourregulator, you know checking
your mask and then you're notskipping really important shit
when you're hooking up.
Jenn (30:53):
I was just thinking under the sea for like cunt or cock.
Alisa Eddy (30:56):
I'm not a sea, yeah, so I think that it's good for
that in terms of habits.
I think also, negotiating theexperience you want in terms of,
like, what sounds hot to youright now is sort of some next
level shit in terms of hookingup with people who you aren't as
familiar with, and I thinkthat's the opportunity to take
(31:16):
what could be bad sex.
So here's the.
I have a theory that one reasonthat a lot of women, especially
those who are more in themonogamous community, don't have
as many partners as maybe theycould is because they don't want
bad sex.
Yeah, and most of the time,it's true, your first sex with
someone is not usually great.
Jenn (31:36):
If you find someone really good, you're kind of like it
gets you get scared to lose that.
Alisa Eddy (31:42):
Yeah, it's hard to find good sex.
It is hard to find good sex,especially the first time.
Yeah, you gotta try out a bunchof them.
Exactly, you gotta have a lotof auditions, yeah, yeah, but I
think, because so often ourfirst time with a new partner
isn't great.
Like it's, you can tell theirskill level, you can identify
certain things about them, butit's often not that you're going
(32:02):
to have mind blowing orgasmsthe first time that you fuck
somebody.
And given that, that's where wecan say, well, why, why is that
?
Well, because you have to learneach other.
Do you have to learn each other?
Or could you communicate toeach other about yourselves?
And, um, an example, I think Iknow I've read an article
(32:25):
actually that, uh, sexualchoking is becoming a big thing
right now and that it'sdangerous because a lot of the
young people are just writingabout it more, right a?
lot of young people are doing it, but they haven't learned how
to do it safely.
Oh yeah, right, yeah, and theysee it in a lot of porn and
they're like, oh, I'm gonna dothis thing, I'm gonna choke you.
Well, I personally know a lotof women who who do like to be
(32:50):
choked sexually, and a lot ofthem who will fucking karate,
chop your balls off if you tryto choke them sexually.
And I think an hey, we're aboutto have our first sexual
encounter.
I actually really like to becalled, I don't know, a slut,
but I do not want you to chokeme, right?
So I don't care how many pornosyou watched, where that was
(33:12):
what they did.
Please do not do that.
That will not go well for us.
And then the person knows oh,okay, cool.
But now I'm going to call you adirty little slut and it's like
oh yeah, fuck yeah, I think thatyeah, I, I kind of want to talk
about public sex first.
Jenn (33:31):
Oh yeah, let's talk about it, because I've had sex in some
weird places.
Oh, okay, I want to know.
Okay, and I, I consider thiskind of like part of the whole
phase for me is just likewhenever I decide that I'm
feeling extra hoey at that point.
But I want to hear some placesfrom you, okay, but here's some
of the weirdest places that justcome up on top of my mind.
(33:52):
Okay, we had this place incollege, called it was like frat
row basically and there wasChanning Circle, which is like a
famous street in Berkeley.
Okay, and I was like we shouldhave sex in Channing Circle,
like right in front of thisprofessor's house.
(34:15):
Ooh, and I knew where thischemistry professor lived, lived
, and I did not like him.
So we did, we ended up and wewere like fucking outside of the
door.
Alisa Eddy (34:30):
Yeah.
Jenn (34:31):
And I was like fuck you, you know like fuck me and fuck
you.
And it ended up not being hishouse oh no, oh my God, oh my
God what.
And it ended up not being hishouse.
Oh no, oh my god, oh my godwhat.
(34:51):
Oh no, it was this really oldlady and I was like, oh sorry,
and I am like literally likebuck naked, like just out on the
street, oh my God.
Like it was kind of later atnight so there wasn't a lot of
people around, so we were likewhatever, but I was just, it was
just like literally in public,and I was like I must have given
(35:15):
her like a heart attack.
So that was one weird place.
Another place I think maybeI've said this before I was a
porta potty at a festival, yeah,which is bold.
Let's be clear it wasn't like adisgusting porta potty.
Alisa Eddy (35:30):
It was a fancy one.
Jenn (35:34):
Okay, it was a palatial.
No, it was one of those biggerones.
I don't know if this reallyhelps my case.
I don't think this helps mycase, but it was a bigger one
that was like multiple urinals,it was just it was bigger and I
was horny at this festival andlike all the other lines were
(35:55):
really long and like obviouslythe men's line was shorter and I
just kind of like ran in therewith my ex and I was just like
I'm really fucking horny and wefucked in a porta potty and
people were like banging on thedoor.
I literally in the moment waslike I cannot believe I'm
fucking in a porta potty rightnow.
I hope no one ever finds out.
(36:15):
And then one other weird placewas a gondola.
Oh, that's hot.
I think in I don't know, Ithink it was in heavenly and in
south lake tahoe and people werecalling it the gondola because
they were like smoking eachother out in the gondola.
And then everyone got out andwe just like went back around
(36:38):
and like decided to bone in thegondola and I got such a bad.
I got so contact high.
Alisa Eddy (36:44):
Oh really.
Jenn (36:45):
Like literally, like it was so hard to put our clothes
back on.
We were so high and like mylike limbs were numb.
I was like, is it still in?
Because I don't really smokeweed, you know like it would fit
me really hard In the gondola.
Alisa Eddy (37:00):
That would get me too.
I think I would be toast.
Yeah, oh, my God.
I think for public sex.
I've had a decent amount ofpublic sex and I'm not going to
name like exact locations.
Jenn (37:16):
So not just in front of people like lawyers and stuff.
We've done that a few times,yeah, like public public, public
public.
Alisa Eddy (37:23):
So okay.
So for my, I think it was Oneof my anniversaries with my
partner, maybe like it wouldhave been before COVID, so maybe
like a four year anniversary wedecided to go on a public sex
pub crawl.
Oh yeah, I love that.
So we asked our friends whereare places around town that you
(37:49):
have had public sex successfully?
So that we could hit up thosespots and each place.
Our challenge was to find a wayto have sex in that place, and
so we definitely fucked in aphoto booth.
Jenn (38:04):
Nice, yes, nice, a photo booth, which is actually
trickier than you think.
They're so small.
They're so small.
I'm impressed actually.
Yeah, you're like when you gettwo people in there and take a
picture, it's tough, likeeveryone's got an elbow in your
face and someone's kneeing yourback.
Alisa Eddy (38:18):
Yeah, and we actually got a picture while we
were fucking Nice, nice, nice.
But the thing is like thelittle curtain.
I don't know if you now payattention.
This is probably why they dothis, but the curtain only goes
to like your waist.
Jenn (38:33):
It does.
Alisa Eddy (38:33):
I wasn't even thinking about that it does not
go all the way down.
Does not go all the way down,but I was wearing a really short
dress, but he went all the waydown yeah right, I was wearing a
really short dress and nounderwear and so I definitely
fucked in a photo booth, fuckedin a bathroom I'm saying all on
this one night, um, at a bar andthen we tried to have sex, like
(38:57):
well, at the bar, like reallytricky, didn't happen, didn't
happen, but we got close.
It was just like couldn't getthe, get it into the right spot
without being angle without thebe able to reach behind.
Too obvious at that point.
Too obvious um dressing roomsof a number of different places
(39:22):
we've had sex in.
Um.
I remember we were on avacation in hawaii and we were
shopping.
And we're just innocentlyshopping as people do, right, I
just happen to be wearing areally short dress without
underwear, but we were trulyinnocently shopping.
And then I had some things totry on and my partner had some
things to try on and the lady atthe store was like oh, do you
(39:44):
guys want to go in together?
And we just looked at eachother and were like, like, is
she egging you on?
Jenn (39:50):
Yeah?
Alisa Eddy (39:52):
We're like, you picked the wrong people.
Yeah, sure, We'll do that,We'll work together.
So that's happened a number oftimes and in these experiences
we have been very mindful of notleaving fluids in places and
not exposing people to that.
So just to be clear, like youknow, clean up after yourself.
Jenn (40:12):
What were you using to clean up?
Like, did you know, like that,just the clothes we tried on
okay, because I was like youtotally did that.
(40:35):
No, I was like, because the pubcrawl one, you were prepared,
right.
Yeah, we were prepared, but forthis one it was like Well, so
you didn't know.
Yeah, when you do public sex, Imean, but you weren't wearing
underwear, so yeah, so I meantheoretically, but what did?
Alisa Eddy (40:49):
It could be something.
Jenn (40:50):
What did you Like?
I almost am like, should I Likeif we, if we were kind of like
going out for for nowhere, goingto get horny, but sometimes you
just don't know you don't know.
Alisa Eddy (41:00):
Yeah, like what you just use your clothes or yeah,
you just use your clothes ornapkins that are handy.
Jenn (41:07):
You just walk around crusty now.
You're like that was good.
Alisa Eddy (41:09):
It's OK.
But now you're like that wasgood, it's okay.
But well, here's the thing youdon't usually with rare
exception, you don't usuallyfuck to completion during public
sex.
Oh yeah, you just fuck.
Jenn (41:20):
You fuck for a little while and then you got your fuck
on, so now you're limpingaround with blue clit and yeah
you got blue clit and balls, butit just, it just makes you
hotter edging each other.
Yeah, until you get to thehotel.
Alisa Eddy (41:32):
No, because if you're actually gonna, you know,
go to completion, you need somemore supplies that that I don't
necessarily always have aroundyeah but if you're just gonna
slip it in for a little minutefor a little bit, for a little
tiny bit, then you can do prettymuch anywhere yeah that's good,
right, yeah, yeah.
so I think public sex is areally fun thing to try if
(41:54):
you're trying to spice things upa little bit with your partner.
Clearly there's weirdos like usaround that do it all kinds of
places and you can do it too.
I think it's a good way to be ahoe.
Jenn (42:05):
I'm like we're giving advice to give people do public
sex.
I know Like are we going to getin?
Alisa Eddy (42:10):
trouble we might.
Jenn (42:13):
Whatever, do it only at a nudist colony or that's even
weirder I know it's even weirderbecause that's like a safe
place for like nudity yeah, itis, and you don't want to make
it weird and sometimes you don'twant to do it in front of
certain people that are thereeither.
Alisa Eddy (42:29):
But for sure.
So for me personally, it's notabout getting caught.
I don't want anybody to caught.
I don't want anybody to catchus.
I don't want anybody to noticeor know, and so we've never
wanted to do it in a way wherepeople knew what was happening,
because I don't want to, like,violate somebody else's personal
experience.
It's more like doing somethingsneaky, where there's some
excitement about the fear ofgetting caught, but it's not
(42:51):
about actually getting caught.
Right, that's not my jam.
Personally, I think that that'sethically questionable.
Yeah, I agree with that, yeah,yeah.
So when you're talking aboutwhat you want to do, like let's
go have sex in that photo boothImportant things to talk about
(43:12):
are positions, right, so I wantyou to fuck me from behind doggy
style.
Maybe that's the way that youcome the best right.
Imagine just telling your firsttime partner this, instead of
waiting six months for them tofigure it out.
Jenn (43:29):
oh god no right, and because then you speed it up to
see if they're even good at that, you know, yeah, otherwise
you're like, ok, we're engagedand I just figured out that you
can't fuck and we're in trouble.
Alisa Eddy (43:40):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
So what positions you want?
Really important things to askin terms of that.
We talked about choking.
That's something to ask Like ifyou are, don't ever choke
somebody without theirpermission ahead of time, number
one.
But also, um, dirty talk.
Some people love it, some peopleget really triggered by it, so
(44:00):
I would not or annoyed yeah, orannoyed, like I would not assume
that somebody wants you to say,you know, talk dirty to them.
I would ask, like, can I talkdirty to you?
And if they want it, hopefullythey have the confidence to say
yes, and if they don't,hopefully they have the
confidence to say no.
Um, but I think asking for whatyou want just fast forwards
(44:20):
your sexual relationship withthat person to really you can
figure out if you're compatible,instead of trying to be so
subtle about what you like thatyou spend that six months being
like I wish that he would justfuck me doggy style.
Jenn (44:35):
I think.
One thing I want to say, though, about that sometimes you don't
know what you want, true, soit's okay to try things out,
right?
Like you don't always have toask for exactly what you want if
you don't really know.
But you, it's okay to say no ifyou don't like it when it
starts happening.
Yeah, so it's okay to say no ifyou don't like it when it
starts happening.
Yeah, so it's okay to kind oflike experiment and learn as you
(44:56):
go, because I've definitelydone that before.
I didn't know everything Iwanted until I did things I
liked or things I didn't like.
And now I like, know thosethings, so I know to ask for it.
But like there is a periodsometimes when you're on ramping
in your ho phase and youhaven't reached the climax yet.
Alisa Eddy (45:13):
I like this analogy Okay.
Jenn (45:17):
That you are kind of figuring things out, right,
you're like seeing what feelsgood, what sounds good and for
you and the person you'repartnered with, and it's okay.
But like, don't let somethingkeep happening that you are
uncomfortable with.
Yeah, don't give that personthat power.
Don't lose your power.
(45:38):
And you know, especially if youdon't like it and you want to
try something else, trysomething else, yeah.
But like I don't know, I'velike two, three times and during
during you're trying differentthings.
I think game over.
You know like that's not theperson for you.
But yeah, um, it is so okay toexperiment and stuff.
Just hold your ground and makesure that you protect yourself
(45:59):
and your body, you know, andyour mental health and
everything yeah, and that ifyou're not wanting to do it
anymore, that you say I'm goingto call it.
Alisa Eddy (46:07):
Stop, blow the whistle, it's done.
Um, I think so.
There's an interesting thingabout when you're in a
promiscuous phase, making itclear what this, what this
moment is to you, so that theperson doesn't necessarily
(46:28):
misinterpret where you're comingfrom, which can be hey, I want
to hook up, I think you're hot,this is sexy.
I'm not really looking to dateanybody right now, but I really
enjoy.
Hooking up with you Is great.
Or, hey, I actually really likeyou.
I've kind of had my eye on youfor like a couple months and
(46:48):
you're really cool.
Maybe after this, we can go on adate.
I don't know, but I'm open toit and I want to see where this
goes Right.
These are different things, andI think when we can have the
courage to be clear about that,first of all, I think it could
open up some opportunities.
Where do I treat them like ahookup or do I treat them like a
guy?
I went on a date with Cause.
We didn't go on a date, youknow, right, and so that's true.
(47:10):
But then also, you know, youdon't have to worry as much
about people putting themselvesout there, being really
vulnerable emotionally, ifthat's not really what you're
looking for where you're comingfrom.
Jenn (47:28):
Yeah, cut the bullshit from the beginning.
Yeah, it's so much easier.
Alisa Eddy (47:32):
Yeah, just Cut the bullshit from the beginning.
Yeah, it's so much easier.
Yeah, just being honest, justbeing honest and taking.
Jenn (47:35):
Don't be a coward, you know.
Like just say what you want andwhat your expectations are, and
don't like drag someone along,you know.
Alisa Eddy (47:44):
Yeah, yeah, absolutely Like that person will
give me attention, or I likedtheir attention, and maybe I
don't really want to date them,but I want them to pursue me.
Let's be careful about thatkind of stuff.
Jenn (48:01):
Yeah.
Alisa Eddy (48:02):
Like, let's be real clear, I think, one thing that
really surprised me, so myearlier ho phases.
I was young and later in life,when I was 36 and I was getting
a divorce and I went throughthat whole phase.
It was hard on some of myfriends who were not in a whole
(48:23):
phase and I was going through.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, andactually I mean some friends.
I sort of lost as friendsthrough that process and I think
it sucks, it does.
It sucks, it sucks, and I thinkthat's just sort of life where
(48:43):
you're not always in the samestage of life as all of your
friends, but particularly whenit comes to being promiscuous,
it can be really triggering forpeople who are not in the same
phase as you and I think itwould be bullshit to not
acknowledge that.
And then it's a dynamic.
Jenn (49:02):
Yeah, like especially I think it's a values thing too
you just can't understand thatyour friend is kind of dating
around and fucking around Justtrying to have some fun and not
let that affect you.
Then you're more grounded andsecure.
But I think that when itaffects people, to be honest,
(49:24):
they have some insecurity abouttheir own relationship.
Yeah, and it like freaks themout that, oh, is my partner
going to just go around and fuckeveryone now and do all this
crazy shit and it like rattlestheir world, or maybe they just
feel like they can't relate toyou anymore, which you haven't.
Your core personality hasn'tchanged.
You're just a hoe, you're justfucking more people.
(49:45):
But you as a person hasn'tchanged, but also you're growing
right.
you're like kind of stretchingyour mind and your stretching
something, yeah I didn't evenmean to make that joke, but
there we, here we are.
Yeah, um, but but you know, andsome people stay stuck in in
(50:07):
the fate where they're at, andand you know what it's okay to
have seasons of friends.
Yeah, some friends are longterm and stick around for a
lifetime, or for most of yourlife at least, or for different
parts of your life, like yourchildhood or adulthood, like you
know.
And some, some friends arethere for you in seasons.
(50:28):
And also, history does notequal friendship, true things,
things can change.
True, you can change, you know,and so don't feel guilty about
trying to figure out who you areand what you like, and yeah.
But I mean, yeah, I'm not, I'mnot dismissing the fact that it
hurts, you know, and it's reallyhard to heal from that.
Alisa Eddy (50:49):
Yeah, I think my personal experience was that I
got the sense that I, as theonly single person in a group of
people, suddenly was supposedto be unhappy with being single,
and I was not.
Jenn (51:10):
Oh, yeah, that thing, that whole energy, like like you.
Like you have to have a partnerto be happy.
Yeah, it's like.
No, I'm free of my gilded cage,ready to cage others.
So true, it was mistress to youyeah, yeah, I felt like um felt
(51:32):
like that too when I, when Ibroke up with this guy, I was
like I am not even exaggerating,I was literally skipping to
work.
I was like I'm free, I get tofuck all these guys now.
I was like so stoked.
Alisa Eddy (51:45):
I was like and it just goes to show you that you
outgrew this person, or justsomething happened where you
just aren't compatible anymoreand you just want to discover
what's out there you know, yeah,and I think, let's see, I try
really hard to be empathetic tothe people who had a problem
with my ho phase and when I'msitting there like oh, what was
(52:09):
going on with them?
I'm like trying to think backto when I was in a marriage and
a committed relationship and Iwas exposed to people who were
being promiscuous and I mean, Ikind of got over this kind of
shit early because my friendswere a bunch of gay guys.
So like that was just kind ofthe deal, but the idea is that
it's not safe.
(52:29):
You're not safe.
This is what they will tell you.
You're not being safe.
I'm just worried about you.
I'm just worried about yoursafety because you have this
many sexual partners.
I'm just worried about yoursafety.
I'm worried that you're notfulfilled or feeling joy because
you don't have a partner.
It's this like feigned worry,sounds religious, which not even
(52:55):
necessarily religious, I know,but it's just like kind of
associated with that it is.
I'm sure subconsciously it is.
But I also think it's like whenI was with my ex and I didn't
want to be anymore.
But I was like, oh god, andthis is hilarious to me now is
that I thought, oh, who, who canhandle being single at 36?
(53:17):
Way too old for that.
And now I'm like, oh girl, comeon, that's silly.
But I would sometimes think tomyself I don't want to be
married, I don't want to do thisanymore.
But I'm like but Elisa, what isit really like to be single?
What is it really like?
It's dangerous, it's lonely,and it wasn't dangerous in
(53:41):
particular, and it definitelywasn't lonely in reality.
And I think it scares people tobe around someone who is single
and fucking around with a lotof people and is not lonely and
is not in danger.
Yeah, because then it's likewell, why am I staying in this
situation?
Jenn (54:02):
right.
Maybe yeah, that's true maybeit scares them because they're
like looking at their own livesnow and they're like am I happy
in my situation, am I trapped?
Alisa Eddy (54:13):
and so they almost have to like bring you down to
their misery, like misery,loving company kind of you know,
I think for some people yesyeah that's hard and I also,
with some people, got the sensethat, um, they were threatened
in the concern about maybe howtheir partner would perceive me,
like maybe their partner wouldperceive me as sexually
(54:35):
available to them because Iwould be so open about my, I
should tell them a lot abouttheir relationship yeah, yeah,
it should.
Um, so you know, those arethings.
If you're going through a hophase and the rest of your world
isn't in the ho phase, first ofall, give me a call.
I got you.
Second of all, it's normal andthere's a lot of dynamics to
(54:59):
consider that are real, and I'vebeen to some extent on both
sides of those dynamics and Ithink the more that you can just
openly talk about it, thebetter that it is.
You don't have to change yourfriends or get new friends
unless those people just can'troll with your new life right,
yeah, I mean friendship honestly.
Jenn (55:19):
Every relationship takes work.
But friendship should be notorganic.
It shouldn't be so much forcedwork.
Alisa Eddy (55:27):
It should not be forced at all yeah, yeah, I mean
, if you guys, you know, if youand your friend get together on
Sunday for brunch and yourstories about your weekend
completely freak them out, maybe, maybe this isn't the season
for that friendship.
So I guess that's just one ofthose weird little dynamics to
(55:53):
keep in mind when it comes tothat.
Jenn (56:07):
But I think one big benefit to the ho phase is
recognizing your market value.
Alisa Eddy (56:09):
Ooh, yeah, true, yeah, so like for me, having
been married for so long, beenwith the same person from like
19 or 20.
It's like, limited to theirpoint of view, yeah, so like for
me, having been married for solong, been with the same person
from like 19 or 20.
It's like, limited to theirpoint of view, yeah, well.
And also you're just like, ohGod, you know, I don't want to
be single.
I don't know what that's goingto be like.
And then you're like, oh,there's a lot of takers and it's
(56:30):
fine.
Like you might just be like oh,actually I am a really
desirable person who should bechoosing my partners based on
whether or not they bring me joyand are good for me.
Yeah, as opposed to feelinglike there is a dearth of good
partners out there in the worldor a lack of people who will be
(56:51):
interested in me.
And so I think getting outthere and and kind of slutting
it up every now and again can bea good thing to remind yourself
oh, I'm actually kind of a hotpiece of ass.
I got some good things going forme Right?
Yeah, yeah, that's great.
Yeah, yeah, it's good.
I think it's, it's uh, it'svaluable for sure.
Um yeah.
So let's see, I think we'vekind of covered this time.
(57:12):
We talked about sex.
Yeah yeah, we did really good.
We've been doing some podcastslately where we kind of forgot
that sex was part of it.
Jenn (57:20):
So proud of us for this one, to our level, I think.
But I think sex is still partof it for other, maybe some
people.
Alisa Eddy (57:29):
But you're right, yeah, yeah, so we did a good job
there, but yeah, so I thinkwe're going to sign off.
I think my parting words areit's really healthy to have
phases in your life where youcan be really promiscuous and
just go and get and have whatyou want and not worry about
(57:50):
other people and what they wantor what they expect from you or
what they expect you to not doall that crap and get other
people's rules and opinions offof your fucking body and just
experience that freedom word.
Yeah, yeah, and it doesn't haveto be how you live all the time
.
It is probably going to besomething that ebbs and flows
and phases for various reasons,but it's really good for you.
(58:14):
And so, like I said, most womenwho I know well enough to talk
about it have had a lot of hophases and they'll be like, oh
yeah, I used to do that back inthe day, back you know when,
when I broke up with that oneguy for six months, and you know
, and they have good stories totell.
So I would encourage you to nothide it.
If you have this history andyou have these great war stories
and you have this fun time inyour past, share it, be proud of
(58:39):
it, think about all the greatthings that you learned from it
and just embrace it.
And I think a big note also isit doesn't have to be a phase.
It can be a whole life, it canbe your whole life, your whole
life.
Fuck can be your whole life,your whole life.
Fuck, shame, fuck, shame.
You can live a whole life as aslut, or whatever you want to
(59:02):
call it.
I'm reclaiming that term, so Idon't mean it in a derogatory
fashion, but you can decide hey,actually having a lot of
partners gets my juices flowing,rubs my engine.
I like this.
You can decide I need morevariety in my sex life all of
the time.
It doesn't have to just be aphase.
It might be, but there's alsothe possibility.
(59:24):
It could be your new life,could be new lifestyle, and it
doesn't have to precludepartnership.
You can be not single andliving the whole life.
Yeah, yeah, on that note, allright, thank you everybody.
We love you.
This is something that my partner and I talked
(00:02):
about.
That was a big aha moment forhim and kind of changed him was
there was a guy who I had beenon a few dates with, who turned
out to be a flat earther oh God,yeah.
And I was like, wow, that's arevelation.
And I was just sitting there atthis really fancy taco place
(00:25):
being like what do I do?
Did he just say that?
And so I asked a few questionsto figure out if it was true.
And it seemed like that's wherethings were going.
And he was like and then youkicked him to the curb, right,
my partner and I was like, no, Idefinitely fucked him that
night.
And he was like what?
(00:46):
No, I definitely fucked himthat night.
And he was like what, you wouldfuck somebody like that?
And I'm like, yeah, how?
Jenn (00:52):
many like how many flat earthers are you intelligent?
Alisa Eddy (00:56):
or or low quality humans have you fucked because
they were attractive?
No, right, and as a man, no oneis like is like oh, you should
have had your principles.
Where did your value system?
Go what happened to you.
How could you do that?
Could you open your legs forthat flat earther?
I mean, he definitely ruledhimself out of any future dates.
Jenn (01:17):
That's so funny though that you fucked a flat earther.
I would have been interested inseeing what he would say in bed
.
I know right.
Oh, look the horizon.
Does it look curved now Foryour pleasure or mine?
Alisa Eddy (01:41):
I guess, yeah, for a flat earther, he did like
curves.
I can say that much.
Welcome to the Juicy SexPodcast, where my friends and I
have raw, unfiltered andhilarious conversations about
all things sex.
I'm Alisa Eddy, the founder andCEO of Juicy Sexual Wellness,
(02:02):
where we try the toys and helpyou find the right one for you.
Now on to the podcast.
Hello audience, it's time totalk about something really,
really important, which is yourho phase, and it doesn't
necessarily even need to end atall, but it is something that is
a really important part of yourlife and we're going to talk
(02:23):
about it.
Pretty much every woman I'veever been close to has a ho
phase, but it's very carefulwhen they talk about it.
Yeah, do you concur?
Jenn (02:35):
I think in certain crowds people are careful when they
talk about it In certain crowds.
Yeah, fair In ours it's alittle different, but most
people yeah.
Alisa Eddy (02:43):
Yeah.
One question is what do we meanby a ho phase?
I can tell you what I mean.
This is a phase and often thereare multiple of them in your
life where you are less pickyabout partners, you have more
partners.
More often you try new thingssexually.
(03:03):
Often you try new thingssexually and I personally look
back on these phases veryproudly and fondly, and always
(03:24):
in my life when my sexuality wasmine yeah, and it didn't really
like have anything to do withanybody else.
Yeah so that's what I woulddefine a ho phase.
How would you define a ho phase?
Jenn (03:36):
Throwing shit at the wall and see what sticks.
You know.
Alisa Eddy (03:40):
Sounds like how a chimpanzee might define a ho
phase.
Jenn (03:41):
I don't know Sounds like how a chimpanzee might define a
hoe phase.
I don't know Like I think I'vehad intermittent hoe phases,
Just depends on how I'm feelingat the time.
But I remember distinctly oneof my first very elongated hoe
phases was when I broke up withthis guy in my 20s and I felt
(04:02):
like I wasn't trapped anymoreand I was like I'm gonna fuck
everybody.
You know.
Alisa Eddy (04:08):
I'm not really.
I think that's an interestingthing that was surprising to me
about, like my later hoe phaseas an adult.
So I mean, I was an adult formost of my sex life, don't worry
everybody.
But one thing that surprised meas a person who came of age in
the 90s, when I met my long-termpartner, who I ended up
(04:34):
marrying and being with forever.
Whatever.
We're not together anymore,thank God, but anyhow, it
started when I was like 19 yearsold, I think, and before that,
when I would hook up with people, condoms were an obvious no
brainer.
No one was like, oh, why wouldwe use a condom?
It was just like, of course,let's get a condom.
(04:55):
Yeah, because I think in the90s we had the big HIV scare,
yeah, and those of us who got togo to those assemblies and all
of that were like and those ofus who got to go to those
assemblies and all of that werelike, yep, I'm going to be safe.
And then when I was 35, Ibecame single again in the I
don't know mid, like 2016.
(05:16):
And I was really shocked howmany men would pretend that they
were surprised when you askedfor a condom yeah, yeah, it's
like no, wrap that shit up.
Jenn (05:31):
Wrap that shit up, I don't want your aids.
Alisa Eddy (05:33):
I don't, I don't want any of whatever.
I don't want your head.
I don't want I don't want, Idon't know, you like that, put a
barrier on it, put a fuckingbarrier on it, but it would like
it blew my mind.
So the first time um, it wasn'tthe first time I slept with
somebody outside of my marriage,but it was like early in that
(05:53):
phase where I was on a date witha guy and we went back to his
place and we were having areally good time and I did let
him put me in restraints theywere velcro so, and it was like
I could reach them myself.
It was like so, it's like allright, I'm fine, it's good.
Um, and then we were fuckingaround and I was like okay, I
(06:13):
think it's time to have sex.
So I was like okay, do you havea condom?
And he was like condom.
And I was like yes, and he waslike well, what kind of a slut
are you?
Why do you need a condom?
And I was like I startedlaughing so hard, like cry, like
(06:35):
cry, laughing.
I was like are you fuckingserious right now?
And he's like, yeah, like what,what kind of a slut would need
a condom?
I'm like, oh my god.
I was like this is a good oneand I'm like oh my God, I was
like this is fucking hilarious,a good one, and I'm like pull
the fucking Velcro off.
Like yeah, no, no, no, no,there will not be any sex
happening without condoms.
Nice try, you just ripped itoff, fucking person.
(06:56):
What the fuck was that?
Yeah, so that was one of thebig surprises of my later ho
phase.
I would say, was this likeresurgence in men trying to get
out of using condoms?
Yeah, what is that?
What is that?
Jenn (07:12):
They're like oh, I just don't feel it as much.
Is your dick numb, I don't care.
Alisa Eddy (07:16):
Then don't try for it.
Yeah, you know what?
If it's not that great for you,then just like, don't try to
fuck people.
Jenn (07:23):
Yeah.
Alisa Eddy (07:26):
There, it's not that great for you.
Then just like, don't try tofuck people.
Yeah, there's probably dollsfor you.
Yeah, that was like I don'tknow in terms of condoms in my
later singledom.
That was just like what thefuck is going on here?
No way Shocker, yeah.
So I think the idea in the hophase for me actually, this is
(07:48):
something that my partner and Italked about that was a big aha
moment for him and kind ofchanged him, was there was a guy
who I had been on a few dateswith, who turned out to be a
flat earther oh God, yeah, and Iwas.
I was like, wow, that's arevelation.
(08:09):
And I was just sitting there atthis really fancy taco place
being like, um, what do I do?
Did he just say that?
So I asked a few like questionsto figure out if it was true.
And it seemed like that's wherethings were going.
And he was like and then youkicked him to the curb, right.
My partner and I was like, uh,no, I definitely fucked him that
(08:31):
night and he was like, what youwould fuck somebody like that?
And I'm like, yeah, how manylike unintelligent or low
quality humans have you fuckedbecause they were attractive,
seriously Right and as a man, noone is like, oh, you should
(08:53):
have had your principles.
Where did your value system?
Jenn (08:57):
go.
Alisa Eddy (08:58):
Where?
What happened to you?
How could you do?
Jenn (08:59):
that.
Alisa Eddy (09:00):
How could you open your legs for that flat earther?
I mean, he definitely ruledhimself out of any future dates.
Jenn (09:05):
That's so funny though that you fucked a flat earther.
I would have been interested inseeing what he would say in bed
.
I know right.
Oh, look the horizon.
Does it look curved now Foryour pleasure or mine?
Alisa Eddy (09:29):
I guess, yeah, for a flat earther he did like curves
, I can say that.
But yeah, I think that was a.
I know that was a big momentfor my partner because he was
like, wait, what he's like.
Wait, women do that too.
Yeah, I was like, oh yeah, wefuck people that we think are
stupid or annoying just becausethey're hot and at the moment it
(09:51):
makes sense.
And they might not even be hot,might just be like we want to
have sex, just like men are, butjust morbidly curious.
Yeah.
But sometimes, like women, weget held to this higher standard
, like there's supposed to besome meaning about us as the
fucky If, if the like, moral,intellectual qualities of the
(10:14):
fucker are not high enough thatthat we're supposed to reject
them.
And I call bullshit.
Jenn (10:20):
Yeah, I mean I have a story similar to that, not not a
flat earther, but of like justreally not that bright guys.
After this fraternity party incollege I was like flirting with
these baseball they playedbaseball at Berkeley Maybe I
shouldn't have said my collegename, but I was just like
(10:43):
they're, they're hot, and I wasjust wanted to bang them both
and I had never had a threesomebefore, so I was kind of a noob
at it and they were both tryingto get at me and I finally was
like, well, if you want me, andRight, and I was like let's have
sex.
And I mean I didn't know what Iwas doing, necessarily, but I
(11:13):
mean I, I know how to move mylimbs around, I guess more
gracefully, I used to be aballet dancer.
I'm a little bit morecoordinated and I thought maybe
they would be coordinatedbecause they're, they have
bought, they play with balls.
They should be coordinated withtheir balls one might think and
be wrong, but it was such anawkward experience.
(11:36):
they were so awkward to eachother and like they, they were
just trying to not touch andthen, like they were doing kind
of boring maneuvers, where hewas just in the back and I was
like sucking the other guy'sdick, but it was just like they
weren't moving in a rhythm thatwas like conducive to any
pleasure.
Alisa Eddy (11:53):
Oh, like they weren't syncing up at all.
So you're like on three-quartertime with one of them and on
like two-four with the other.
Jenn (12:06):
We're in the ninth inning here and you're not winning,
motherfucker.
And I in the middle of thethreesome, like a referee or
something, I was like, all right, we're done, you're out, we're
not, get out, you're out, getout, we're done.
I was like I tried.
They were really hot.
You know you never.
You never know what you'regoing to get.
Sometimes the sex might bereally good, sometimes it might
not be good, but that wasn'treally.
My goal was to have aconversation with them, you know
(12:27):
, like to really hang outafterwards?
No, purely just for pleasure.
Yeah.
So women absolutely do that too, and men should know.
Alisa Eddy (12:37):
I'm really proud of your negotiation skills.
Like there doesn't have to beone winner here, we can create
value for all parties.
Jenn (12:45):
I didn't even realize that was what I was doing in the
moment.
I was like, yeah, that'sawesome.
Alisa Eddy (12:51):
That is awesome, we're a team.
Yeah, I feel like I had anexperience during my I guess it
was during my divorce, butwhatever like during divorce ho
phase with a guy who the firsttime that he came over we met on
bumble, I think, and the firsttime that he came over we had
(13:11):
pretty good sex.
It was really fun, we had agood time and then, um, I don't
know, maybe a few weeks, monthor so later, he wanted to come
over again.
So it's like okay, this is,this is going to be pretty good.
And he was drunk.
He was drunk.
Jenn (13:26):
And I was sober.
Alisa Eddy (13:27):
Yeah and well.
Yeah, but he had no rhythm, ohyeah.
And he was just like, yeah,no-transcript, we're fucking
(14:13):
done.
And so I had started my littlecountdown and then, as I'm like
93, 94, I was like wait, holdthe fucking front door.
I don't know this dude, I don'towe him shit, I don't owe him a
single stroke inside of myvagina.
That is not feeling good to me.
And I was like wait, he's likewhat.
(14:35):
I was like I'm going to call itabsolutely.
I'm not having good sex.
Are you having good sex?
Damn good, Good for you.
And he was like well, I don'tknow, I mean, are you giving me
a chance to like?
You know, like?
Jenn (14:50):
get with it, and.
Alisa Eddy (14:51):
I was like actually, no, I'm like really turned off
now and I don't want to have sexwith you anymore and I'm just
going to call it.
And he was like blown away.
He's like really, I'm likereally okay, all right, okay.
and I was like his place, oryours, my place.
So I was like you are clearlytoo drunk to be transportating
(15:13):
yourself, so you can go lay downand relax.
You don't have to get out ofthe house, but there will not be
any more sex.
Good for you, yeah, but it waslike such a corrective
experience.
It was so liberating, yeah, tobe like I don't just be like no
to be like.
No, I don't owe you shit.
(15:33):
I don't owe you any extrastrokes.
I don't owe you any extra tries.
I don't owe you any extra time.
If I'm not enjoying this, Idon't have to sit here and count
down from 99 to get to thepoint where I can allow myself
to quit.
I can actually just be like andseen.
Jenn (15:49):
I mean, if you think about it, guys, for eons have been
like calling you a cab the nextmorning, right, I've never
personally had that happen, butit happens to women like oh yeah
, we're done, get out of myhouse now, yeah, Like so fuck
that.
If we need to truncate the sexin the middle to be like it's
not great, Thanks, I'll call youan Uber.
(16:11):
Yeah, we do that.
We can do that too.
You can do that, ladies you cando that.
Alisa Eddy (16:16):
I empower you to do that.
I think it is.
Jenn (16:19):
It saves everybody you can be a hoe at standards.
Alisa Eddy (16:21):
Yeah, you can be like it's not so much about
having to be picky about who orwhen, but being picky about
whether or not you enjoy it, Ithink is a good thing to be
picky about.
Jenn (16:33):
Yeah, 100%.
Alisa Eddy (16:34):
Right.
It was like I went, I talked tomy therapist about it.
Like two days later I went inand I was like I had a great
experience with this random dude.
She's like okay, a greatexperience with this random dude
.
She's like okay.
And I told her she's like thatis about the best corrective
experience that I could possiblycreate for a woman to have
Therapist approved yeah.
She was like stamp of approvalExcellent.
(16:55):
So I really encourage you toremember next time that you're
having sex with somebody andyou're not enjoying it, that you
don't have to try a differentposition, do something different
, move this or that.
You can also just be like I'mdone, I'm over it, and you have
your right to do that, literallymid-stroke.
Jenn (17:17):
Never forget it we need stickers now we do mid-stroke?
Alisa Eddy (17:22):
I quit mid-stroke.
Yeah, that was a really goodexperience for me to have.
So let me tell you a story.
I was really excited to buy anew clit-sucking toy.
So I went to the world'slargest online sex toy retailer
and I found hundreds of optionswith no indication which ones
(17:46):
are quality and which ones areright for me.
So I had to make my best guess.
I ordered the toy, got it inthe mail, super excited to try
it, and, bummer, it's way toostrong, even on the lowest
setting, turns out I can't evenuse it and I wasted 80 bucks.
(18:07):
So I throw it in my nightstandand a couple months later I look
to discover that it hasactually melted into another sex
toy in my nightstand.
I was so mad I decided to startmy own sex toy company, juicy.
At Juicy, we sell a highlycurated selection of body safe
(18:30):
sex toys and we test them sothat we can give you all the
deets about whether or not it'sright for you, such as how
strong or gentle it is, how loudis it and how easy is it to
operate.
How loud is it and how easy isit to operate?
So support this podcast and buyyour next sex toy at
(18:59):
getjuicycom.
That's G-E-T-J-O-O-S-I dot com.
I feel like ho phases are supervaluable as just a person who
engages the world sexually.
During these phases, you havethe chance to rapidly learn new
behaviors that you want to form.
(19:20):
Right so, true, right.
So, if you're like OK, I reallyneed to get better at asking
partners what their STD statusis before we have sex, right so,
true, kind of like, okay, whatis my, what's my way of starting
a sexual interaction withsomebody?
What are the things that Ithink need to be said and that
(19:49):
need to be discussed, andinstead of it happening so
infrequently that each time thatthere's a new partner in your
life, you're like oh, Back tothe drawing board.
Jenn (19:59):
Yeah.
Alisa Eddy (19:59):
What are the things that we're supposed to say or
ask or whatever?
Getting practice with that soyou can develop actual habits
around it?
I think is really valuable.
Jenn (20:09):
I mean that's, I've learned a lot in my whole phases
, I mean, unless you you have tohave different kinds of sex
play with different kinds oftoys, different guys with
different personalities or women, whatever you want.
You know, like figure out likewhat your vibe is, like what you
want to have during that moment, um, and I, I mean I've learned
(20:32):
a lot from trying threesomes,just doing like missionary stuff
, doing crazy shit in public,yeah.
So you're like what do I likewhere?
Where do I fit?
Yeah, where do they fit?
Literally, where do they fit?
Alisa Eddy (20:48):
Is this one a candidate for anal, yeah, or
oral, yeah, I think so.
Learning so this is an areawhere actually the poly and
swinger community have developedreally good sort of standard
operating procedures, right,where, when they're engaging
(21:09):
with a new person, it's like,first of all, what are your
boundaries?
Which sexual acts are youinterested in doing today?
Might be, I'm only interestedin oral Okay, receiving or
giving?
Maybe just giving, okay, cool,we got it.
So you've got to find out whatpeople want to do.
Then, std status when was thelast time that you were tested?
(21:32):
What are you positive for?
What are you not?
If you have some of thelong-term things, are you being
treated or not?
When was your last outbreak?
So on and so forth.
And then I really like thisco-creation possibility, which
is that, in the ideal situationof I really want to go find a
(21:54):
bar somewhere and find a sneakoff, and find a place in public
to go down on you and thatsounds really hot to me, yeah,
right which is being creativeand thinking what do I really
want here, instead of just likewhatever happens.
Jenn (22:18):
Right.
Alisa Eddy (22:20):
Mm-hmm, like whatever happens right, and so I
think that in this kind of inthe poly and swinger community,
they do a really good job ofexploring all that stuff and
learning how to get comfortabledoing it, and I think that
that's a great community to takea page from when you're going
into a ho phase.
Jenn (22:39):
Yeah, I mean definitely asking the right questions so
that you don't end up in a badsituation as long as no one lies
.
Yeah, no lying, and I mean yougot to have consent rules.
Be you know, given and receivedproperly, like if you change
your mind in the middle ofsomething that should be
respected too.
Alisa Eddy (23:07):
Yeah, Absolutely.
I was talking with someone whoI have been sexual with in the
past, who was asking about myrules, or like my rules with my
partner as a couple.
And they were asking you knowwhy we have boundaries where we
do?
And I said I don't want anyoneto feel entitled to my body ever
.
So just because you and I haveslept together does not mean
(23:27):
that you have the right to comeand put your arm around me at a
party.
Jenn (23:31):
Yeah, like the other time, right yeah, Next time yeah
absolutely To come and kiss mewithout asking yeah.
Just touch me without asking oh, we've already hooked up, so
it's okay now.
Yes, the gate is open forever.
Alisa Eddy (23:42):
No, it's not like that and it should be a
case-by-case, event-by-eventnegotiation between two people,
and if you can employ that, itcan allow you to feel much safer
experimenting with differentpeople in different places,
because you're making reallyclear expectations that it
doesn't mean just because wewere at a party and you and I
(24:04):
made out doesn't mean that youget to just kiss me without
asking me at the next party,right?
And I think I think, especiallyfor women, one of the types of
calculus we do when we considerwhether or not we're going to
take on another partner is willthey feel entitled to my body?
Jenn (24:20):
Yeah, and that's where kind of the fear comes in too.
And I was going to say on yourprevious point, when within the
swinger and like poly community,people are a little bit more
comfortable talking about thosethings, like asking the right
questions about the STDs andthings like that.
But for a lot of people theyhave a lot of shame around it
(24:40):
and they're like embarrassed orafraid to say it.
And honestly, the more youstand your ground and say it,
the more respect you're going toearn from the other person and
for yourself, and over timeit'll become easier to just be
like nope, I want to know thesethings, this is the experience I
want to have, and you're goingto find better sexual partners
that way too.
This is the experience I wantto have, and you're going to
find better sexual partners thatway too.
Alisa Eddy (25:00):
Yeah, that is very true.
Jenn (25:01):
Because the people usually that respect those things are
better at sex.
That's true Because they'veprobably had more experience.
Alisa Eddy (25:08):
Yeah, they have more experience, yeah.
Yeah, exactly know that in someplaces in the world there's this
controversy about consent interms of if a man asks a woman
before he kisses her, does thatruin all the romance or the
attraction?
And I'm gonna shoot off some ofmy opinions about that.
(25:33):
Let's go, um, here's what Iwill say.
It shouldn't and I do mean toshould all over people on this
one.
If I'm going to should my pantsright now, you're shitting me,
I'm shitting you.
Um, so I'm going to use thestereotypical gender roles, um,
(25:58):
for the sake of what is probablythe most typical experience.
But it could be anything but saythat you are a woman and you
are getting intimate,potentially with another male
partner.
You guys are getting close.
It might be like that time thatyou're about to potentially
kiss and they're like can I kissyou Now?
(26:18):
There are some people who willbe like oh, I just hate that, it
just ruins the moment.
And there are others who willsay that's essential you cannot
kiss me unless I have told youthat it is okay, right, and
everything in between.
And I would say, for those ofyou who feel like it ruins the
moment are you adult enough tosay yes to the things that you
(26:43):
want.
Is the real issue that you'renot comfortable saying yes, I
want to be kissed, and so yousay that it ruins the moment?
Is it not more important thatsomeone get your permission than
that you not feel thediscomfort of acknowledging your
own sexual desire?
Jenn (27:02):
Yeah, it's almost like consent with yourself too.
Yeah, what do I consent withmyself?
What do I want to do?
Alisa Eddy (27:09):
Yep, admitting to yourself yes, I do want to be
kissed, and I think, the waythat a lot of femmes are brought
up in our culture, it can behard to admit that, to say yeah,
I do want to be kissed rightnow it feels dangerous to do,
and yet I also think it's alittle cowardly to say that it
ruins the moment, when all thatreally ruined the moment was
(27:31):
your inability to express yourdesire or lack thereof Right.
Or lack thereof.
Jenn (27:37):
Right, that's a really good point.
Like it's not hard to say youknow, yes, I want to be kissed,
and then just have theexperience.
Yeah, Like don't put it onsomeone else to make the
decision for you whether it'slike to be kissed because you do
want to be kissed, or then bekissed and you didn't want it.
And now it's weird and awkwardit is like it can be scary.
Alisa Eddy (27:59):
I mean, I feel like when I watch the old movies
where nobody asked and they werejust like slowly lean closer
and closer and be like theirmouths are opening, and you're
like, oh God, is it going tohappen?
Oh my God, I don't know, and Iget like so weirded out.
(28:22):
It's like usually such anawkward, like once they connect
the faces, like it's always likea weird awkward, like some like
they hit their teeth or yeah,and so I just think, imagine if
you're like, oh no, it feelslike the kiss moment's about to
happen and you can be like hey,can I kiss you?
Yeah, it just breaks down thebarrier and then I have that
awkward moment, yeah, and thenthat person can be like fuck yes
, and then you can go like allthe way in it instead of like
(28:45):
was that okay?
Like you know, it's so weird,yeah, it's weird.
So to me it makes things afuckload.
Weirder to not ask and to notbe given the opportunity to give
permission than to be like arewe going to do this, yeah, we're
going to do this, and then youcan go all the way into it.
Jenn (29:08):
It's a good perspective.
I think people need to hear.
Alisa Eddy (29:10):
Yeah, and I know it can be hard, especially for
people raised as women who havebeen taught that their desires
are not okay and that it'sreally all about what other
people want.
So it's all about you know them, getting what they want, and
you're kind of the goalkeeperfor others.
(29:32):
Instead, maybe go out and beyour own advocate and be like
I'm looking at this dude, we'regetting closer and I really want
to kiss him, yeah.
And I'm going to this dude,we're getting closer and I
really want to kiss him, yeah,and I'm going to ask Right, and
so kind of taking that power Ithink is good and the more
frequent, it's sort of likescuba diving.
So if you want to get good atscuba diving, you have to go
(29:53):
like twice a day, every day, fora week or something.
You have to get this frequencyof experience doing it so that
you develop habits, because ifyou're starting from scratch
every single time and you don'thave habits, you have to think
about so much more with yourbrain, right?
So my habit is asking.
My habit is maybe, if they'regetting close and they haven't
(30:17):
asked me, I'm like whoa, wouldyou like to kiss?
Right, I can take control ofthat and I can ask do you have
partners?
Do you have?
Are you monogamous?
Are you not?
Do you have consent to do whatwe're talking about doing from
any potential partners?
Do you have STDs?
When were you last tested?
All those things, getting inthe habit of it.
(30:39):
So it's the same thing as scubadiving, like checking your
weight belt, checking yourregulator, you know checking
your mask and then you're notskipping really important shit
when you're hooking up.
Jenn (30:53):
I was just thinking under the sea for like cunt or cock.
Alisa Eddy (30:56):
I'm not a sea, yeah, so I think that it's good for
that in terms of habits.
I think also, negotiating theexperience you want in terms of,
like, what sounds hot to youright now is sort of some next
level shit in terms of hookingup with people who you aren't as
familiar with, and I thinkthat's the opportunity to take
(31:16):
what could be bad sex.
So here's the.
I have a theory that one reasonthat a lot of women, especially
those who are more in themonogamous community, don't have
as many partners as maybe theycould is because they don't want
bad sex.
Yeah, and most of the time,it's true, your first sex with
someone is not usually great.
Jenn (31:36):
If you find someone really good, you're kind of like it
gets you get scared to lose that.
Alisa Eddy (31:42):
Yeah, it's hard to find good sex.
It is hard to find good sex,especially the first time.
Yeah, you gotta try out a bunchof them.
Exactly, you gotta have a lotof auditions, yeah, yeah, but I
think, because so often ourfirst time with a new partner
isn't great.
Like it's, you can tell theirskill level, you can identify
certain things about them, butit's often not that you're going
(32:02):
to have mind blowing orgasmsthe first time that you fuck
somebody.
And given that, that's where wecan say, well, why, why is that
?
Well, because you have to learneach other.
Do you have to learn each other?
Or could you communicate toeach other about yourselves?
And, um, an example, I think Iknow I've read an article
(32:25):
actually that, uh, sexualchoking is becoming a big thing
right now and that it'sdangerous because a lot of the
young people are just writingabout it more, right a?
lot of young people are doing it, but they haven't learned how
to do it safely.
Oh yeah, right, yeah, and theysee it in a lot of porn and
they're like, oh, I'm gonna dothis thing, I'm gonna choke you.
Well, I personally know a lotof women who who do like to be
(32:50):
choked sexually, and a lot ofthem who will fucking karate,
chop your balls off if you tryto choke them sexually.
And I think an hey, we're aboutto have our first sexual
encounter.
I actually really like to becalled, I don't know, a slut,
but I do not want you to chokeme, right?
So I don't care how many pornosyou watched, where that was
(33:12):
what they did.
Please do not do that.
That will not go well for us.
And then the person knows oh,okay, cool.
But now I'm going to call you adirty little slut and it's like
oh yeah, fuck yeah, I think thatyeah, I, I kind of want to talk
about public sex first.
Jenn (33:31):
Oh yeah, let's talk about it, because I've had sex in some
weird places.
Oh, okay, I want to know.
Okay, and I, I consider thiskind of like part of the whole
phase for me is just likewhenever I decide that I'm
feeling extra hoey at that point.
But I want to hear some placesfrom you, okay, but here's some
of the weirdest places that justcome up on top of my mind.
(33:52):
Okay, we had this place incollege, called it was like frat
row basically and there wasChanning Circle, which is like a
famous street in Berkeley.
Okay, and I was like we shouldhave sex in Channing Circle,
like right in front of thisprofessor's house.
(34:15):
Ooh, and I knew where thischemistry professor lived, lived
, and I did not like him.
So we did, we ended up and wewere like fucking outside of the
door.
Alisa Eddy (34:30):
Yeah.
Jenn (34:31):
And I was like fuck you, you know like fuck me and fuck
you.
And it ended up not being hishouse oh no, oh my God, oh my
God what.
And it ended up not being hishouse.
Oh no, oh my god, oh my godwhat.
(34:51):
Oh no, it was this really oldlady and I was like, oh sorry,
and I am like literally likebuck naked, like just out on the
street, oh my God.
Like it was kind of later atnight so there wasn't a lot of
people around, so we were likewhatever, but I was just, it was
just like literally in public,and I was like I must have given
(35:15):
her like a heart attack.
So that was one weird place.
Another place I think maybeI've said this before I was a
porta potty at a festival, yeah,which is bold.
Let's be clear it wasn't like adisgusting porta potty.
Alisa Eddy (35:30):
It was a fancy one.
Jenn (35:34):
Okay, it was a palatial.
No, it was one of those biggerones.
I don't know if this reallyhelps my case.
I don't think this helps mycase, but it was a bigger one
that was like multiple urinals,it was just it was bigger and I
was horny at this festival andlike all the other lines were
(35:55):
really long and like obviouslythe men's line was shorter and I
just kind of like ran in therewith my ex and I was just like
I'm really fucking horny and wefucked in a porta potty and
people were like banging on thedoor.
I literally in the moment waslike I cannot believe I'm
fucking in a porta potty rightnow.
I hope no one ever finds out.
(36:15):
And then one other weird placewas a gondola.
Oh, that's hot.
I think in I don't know, Ithink it was in heavenly and in
south lake tahoe and people werecalling it the gondola because
they were like smoking eachother out in the gondola.
And then everyone got out andwe just like went back around
(36:38):
and like decided to bone in thegondola and I got such a bad.
I got so contact high.
Alisa Eddy (36:44):
Oh really.
Jenn (36:45):
Like literally, like it was so hard to put our clothes
back on.
We were so high and like mylike limbs were numb.
I was like, is it still in?
Because I don't really smokeweed, you know like it would fit
me really hard In the gondola.
Alisa Eddy (37:00):
That would get me too.
I think I would be toast.
Yeah, oh, my God.
I think for public sex.
I've had a decent amount ofpublic sex and I'm not going to
name like exact locations.
Jenn (37:16):
So not just in front of people like lawyers and stuff.
We've done that a few times,yeah, like public public, public
public.
Alisa Eddy (37:23):
So okay.
So for my, I think it was Oneof my anniversaries with my
partner, maybe like it wouldhave been before COVID, so maybe
like a four year anniversary wedecided to go on a public sex
pub crawl.
Oh yeah, I love that.
So we asked our friends whereare places around town that you
(37:49):
have had public sex successfully?
So that we could hit up thosespots and each place.
Our challenge was to find a wayto have sex in that place, and
so we definitely fucked in aphoto booth.
Jenn (38:04):
Nice, yes, nice, a photo booth, which is actually
trickier than you think.
They're so small.
They're so small.
I'm impressed actually.
Yeah, you're like when you gettwo people in there and take a
picture, it's tough, likeeveryone's got an elbow in your
face and someone's kneeing yourback.
Alisa Eddy (38:18):
Yeah, and we actually got a picture while we
were fucking Nice, nice, nice.
But the thing is like thelittle curtain.
I don't know if you now payattention.
This is probably why they dothis, but the curtain only goes
to like your waist.
Jenn (38:33):
It does.
Alisa Eddy (38:33):
I wasn't even thinking about that it does not
go all the way down.
Does not go all the way down,but I was wearing a really short
dress, but he went all the waydown yeah right, I was wearing a
really short dress and nounderwear and so I definitely
fucked in a photo booth, fuckedin a bathroom I'm saying all on
this one night, um, at a bar andthen we tried to have sex, like
(38:57):
well, at the bar, like reallytricky, didn't happen, didn't
happen, but we got close.
It was just like couldn't getthe, get it into the right spot
without being angle without thebe able to reach behind.
Too obvious at that point.
Too obvious um dressing roomsof a number of different places
(39:22):
we've had sex in.
Um.
I remember we were on avacation in hawaii and we were
shopping.
And we're just innocentlyshopping as people do, right, I
just happen to be wearing areally short dress without
underwear, but we were trulyinnocently shopping.
And then I had some things totry on and my partner had some
things to try on and the lady atthe store was like oh, do you
(39:44):
guys want to go in together?
And we just looked at eachother and were like, like, is
she egging you on?
Jenn (39:50):
Yeah?
Alisa Eddy (39:52):
We're like, you picked the wrong people.
Yeah, sure, We'll do that,We'll work together.
So that's happened a number oftimes and in these experiences
we have been very mindful of notleaving fluids in places and
not exposing people to that.
So just to be clear, like youknow, clean up after yourself.
Jenn (40:12):
What were you using to clean up?
Like, did you know, like that,just the clothes we tried on
okay, because I was like youtotally did that.
(40:35):
No, I was like, because the pubcrawl one, you were prepared,
right.
Yeah, we were prepared, but forthis one it was like Well, so
you didn't know.
Yeah, when you do public sex, Imean, but you weren't wearing
underwear, so yeah, so I meantheoretically, but what did?
Alisa Eddy (40:49):
It could be something.
Jenn (40:50):
What did you Like?
I almost am like, should I Likeif we, if we were kind of like
going out for for nowhere, goingto get horny, but sometimes you
just don't know you don't know.
Alisa Eddy (41:00):
Yeah, like what you just use your clothes or yeah,
you just use your clothes ornapkins that are handy.
Jenn (41:07):
You just walk around crusty now.
You're like that was good.
Alisa Eddy (41:09):
It's OK.
But now you're like that wasgood, it's okay.
But well, here's the thing youdon't usually with rare
exception, you don't usuallyfuck to completion during public
sex.
Oh yeah, you just fuck.
Jenn (41:20):
You fuck for a little while and then you got your fuck
on, so now you're limpingaround with blue clit and yeah
you got blue clit and balls, butit just, it just makes you
hotter edging each other.
Yeah, until you get to thehotel.
Alisa Eddy (41:32):
No, because if you're actually gonna, you know,
go to completion, you need somemore supplies that that I don't
necessarily always have aroundyeah but if you're just gonna
slip it in for a little minutefor a little bit, for a little
tiny bit, then you can do prettymuch anywhere yeah that's good,
right, yeah, yeah.
so I think public sex is areally fun thing to try if
(41:54):
you're trying to spice things upa little bit with your partner.
Clearly there's weirdos like usaround that do it all kinds of
places and you can do it too.
I think it's a good way to be ahoe.
Jenn (42:05):
I'm like we're giving advice to give people do public
sex.
I know Like are we going to getin?
Alisa Eddy (42:10):
trouble we might.
Jenn (42:13):
Whatever, do it only at a nudist colony or that's even
weirder I know it's even weirderbecause that's like a safe
place for like nudity yeah, itis, and you don't want to make
it weird and sometimes you don'twant to do it in front of
certain people that are thereeither.
Alisa Eddy (42:29):
But for sure.
So for me personally, it's notabout getting caught.
I don't want anybody to caught.
I don't want anybody to catchus.
I don't want anybody to noticeor know, and so we've never
wanted to do it in a way wherepeople knew what was happening,
because I don't want to, like,violate somebody else's personal
experience.
It's more like doing somethingsneaky, where there's some
excitement about the fear ofgetting caught, but it's not
(42:51):
about actually getting caught.
Right, that's not my jam.
Personally, I think that that'sethically questionable.
Yeah, I agree with that, yeah,yeah.
So when you're talking aboutwhat you want to do, like let's
go have sex in that photo boothImportant things to talk about
(43:12):
are positions, right, so I wantyou to fuck me from behind doggy
style.
Maybe that's the way that youcome the best right.
Imagine just telling your firsttime partner this, instead of
waiting six months for them tofigure it out.
Jenn (43:29):
oh god no right, and because then you speed it up to
see if they're even good at that, you know, yeah, otherwise
you're like, ok, we're engagedand I just figured out that you
can't fuck and we're in trouble.
Alisa Eddy (43:40):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
So what positions you want?
Really important things to askin terms of that.
We talked about choking.
That's something to ask Like ifyou are, don't ever choke
somebody without theirpermission ahead of time, number
one.
But also, um, dirty talk.
Some people love it, some peopleget really triggered by it, so
(44:00):
I would not or annoyed yeah, orannoyed, like I would not assume
that somebody wants you to say,you know, talk dirty to them.
I would ask, like, can I talkdirty to you?
And if they want it, hopefullythey have the confidence to say
yes, and if they don't,hopefully they have the
confidence to say no.
Um, but I think asking for whatyou want just fast forwards
(44:20):
your sexual relationship withthat person to really you can
figure out if you're compatible,instead of trying to be so
subtle about what you like thatyou spend that six months being
like I wish that he would justfuck me doggy style.
Jenn (44:35):
I think.
One thing I want to say, though, about that sometimes you don't
know what you want, true, soit's okay to try things out,
right?
Like you don't always have toask for exactly what you want if
you don't really know.
But you, it's okay to say no ifyou don't like it when it
starts happening.
Yeah, so it's okay to say no ifyou don't like it when it
starts happening.
Yeah, so it's okay to kind oflike experiment and learn as you
(44:56):
go, because I've definitelydone that before.
I didn't know everything Iwanted until I did things I
liked or things I didn't like.
And now I like, know thosethings, so I know to ask for it.
But like there is a periodsometimes when you're on ramping
in your ho phase and youhaven't reached the climax yet.
Alisa Eddy (45:13):
I like this analogy Okay.
Jenn (45:17):
That you are kind of figuring things out, right,
you're like seeing what feelsgood, what sounds good and for
you and the person you'repartnered with, and it's okay.
But like, don't let somethingkeep happening that you are
uncomfortable with.
Yeah, don't give that personthat power.
Don't lose your power.
(45:38):
And you know, especially if youdon't like it and you want to
try something else, trysomething else, yeah.
But like I don't know, I'velike two, three times and during
during you're trying differentthings.
I think game over.
You know like that's not theperson for you.
But yeah, um, it is so okay toexperiment and stuff.
Just hold your ground and makesure that you protect yourself
(45:59):
and your body, you know, andyour mental health and
everything yeah, and that ifyou're not wanting to do it
anymore, that you say I'm goingto call it.
Alisa Eddy (46:07):
Stop, blow the whistle, it's done.
Um, I think so.
There's an interesting thingabout when you're in a
promiscuous phase, making itclear what this, what this
moment is to you, so that theperson doesn't necessarily
(46:28):
misinterpret where you're comingfrom, which can be hey, I want
to hook up, I think you're hot,this is sexy.
I'm not really looking to dateanybody right now, but I really
enjoy.
Hooking up with you Is great.
Or, hey, I actually really likeyou.
I've kind of had my eye on youfor like a couple months and
(46:48):
you're really cool.
Maybe after this, we can go on adate.
I don't know, but I'm open toit and I want to see where this
goes Right.
These are different things, andI think when we can have the
courage to be clear about that,first of all, I think it could
open up some opportunities.
Where do I treat them like ahookup or do I treat them like a
guy?
I went on a date with Cause.
We didn't go on a date, youknow, right, and so that's true.
(47:10):
But then also, you know, youdon't have to worry as much
about people putting themselvesout there, being really
vulnerable emotionally, ifthat's not really what you're
looking for where you're comingfrom.
Jenn (47:28):
Yeah, cut the bullshit from the beginning.
Yeah, it's so much easier.
Alisa Eddy (47:32):
Yeah, just Cut the bullshit from the beginning.
Yeah, it's so much easier.
Yeah, just being honest, justbeing honest and taking.
Jenn (47:35):
Don't be a coward, you know.
Like just say what you want andwhat your expectations are, and
don't like drag someone along,you know.
Alisa Eddy (47:44):
Yeah, yeah, absolutely Like that person will
give me attention, or I likedtheir attention, and maybe I
don't really want to date them,but I want them to pursue me.
Let's be careful about thatkind of stuff.
Jenn (48:01):
Yeah.
Alisa Eddy (48:02):
Like, let's be real clear, I think, one thing that
really surprised me, so myearlier ho phases.
I was young and later in life,when I was 36 and I was getting
a divorce and I went throughthat whole phase.
It was hard on some of myfriends who were not in a whole
(48:23):
phase and I was going through.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, andactually I mean some friends.
I sort of lost as friendsthrough that process and I think
it sucks, it does.
It sucks, it sucks, and I thinkthat's just sort of life where
(48:43):
you're not always in the samestage of life as all of your
friends, but particularly whenit comes to being promiscuous,
it can be really triggering forpeople who are not in the same
phase as you and I think itwould be bullshit to not
acknowledge that.
And then it's a dynamic.
Jenn (49:02):
Yeah, like especially I think it's a values thing too
you just can't understand thatyour friend is kind of dating
around and fucking around Justtrying to have some fun and not
let that affect you.
Then you're more grounded andsecure.
But I think that when itaffects people, to be honest,
(49:24):
they have some insecurity abouttheir own relationship.
Yeah, and it like freaks themout that, oh, is my partner
going to just go around and fuckeveryone now and do all this
crazy shit and it like rattlestheir world, or maybe they just
feel like they can't relate toyou anymore, which you haven't.
Your core personality hasn'tchanged.
You're just a hoe, you're justfucking more people.
(49:45):
But you as a person hasn'tchanged, but also you're growing
right.
you're like kind of stretchingyour mind and your stretching
something, yeah I didn't evenmean to make that joke, but
there we, here we are.
Yeah, um, but but you know, andsome people stay stuck in in
(50:07):
the fate where they're at, andand you know what it's okay to
have seasons of friends.
Yeah, some friends are longterm and stick around for a
lifetime, or for most of yourlife at least, or for different
parts of your life, like yourchildhood or adulthood, like you
know.
And some, some friends arethere for you in seasons.
(50:28):
And also, history does notequal friendship, true things,
things can change.
True, you can change, you know,and so don't feel guilty about
trying to figure out who you areand what you like, and yeah.
But I mean, yeah, I'm not, I'mnot dismissing the fact that it
hurts, you know, and it's reallyhard to heal from that.
Alisa Eddy (50:49):
Yeah, I think my personal experience was that I
got the sense that I, as theonly single person in a group of
people, suddenly was supposedto be unhappy with being single,
and I was not.
Jenn (51:10):
Oh, yeah, that thing, that whole energy, like like you.
Like you have to have a partnerto be happy.
Yeah, it's like.
No, I'm free of my gilded cage,ready to cage others.
So true, it was mistress to youyeah, yeah, I felt like um felt
(51:32):
like that too when I, when Ibroke up with this guy, I was
like I am not even exaggerating,I was literally skipping to
work.
I was like I'm free, I get tofuck all these guys now.
I was like so stoked.
Alisa Eddy (51:45):
I was like and it just goes to show you that you
outgrew this person, or justsomething happened where you
just aren't compatible anymoreand you just want to discover
what's out there you know, yeah,and I think, let's see, I try
really hard to be empathetic tothe people who had a problem
with my ho phase and when I'msitting there like oh, what was
(52:09):
going on with them?
I'm like trying to think backto when I was in a marriage and
a committed relationship and Iwas exposed to people who were
being promiscuous and I mean, Ikind of got over this kind of
shit early because my friendswere a bunch of gay guys.
So like that was just kind ofthe deal, but the idea is that
it's not safe.
(52:29):
You're not safe.
This is what they will tell you.
You're not being safe.
I'm just worried about you.
I'm just worried about yoursafety because you have this
many sexual partners.
I'm just worried about yoursafety.
I'm worried that you're notfulfilled or feeling joy because
you don't have a partner.
It's this like feigned worry,sounds religious, which not even
(52:55):
necessarily religious, I know,but it's just like kind of
associated with that it is.
I'm sure subconsciously it is.
But I also think it's like whenI was with my ex and I didn't
want to be anymore.
But I was like, oh god, andthis is hilarious to me now is
that I thought, oh, who, who canhandle being single at 36?
(53:17):
Way too old for that.
And now I'm like, oh girl, comeon, that's silly.
But I would sometimes think tomyself I don't want to be
married, I don't want to do thisanymore.
But I'm like but Elisa, what isit really like to be single?
What is it really like?
It's dangerous, it's lonely,and it wasn't dangerous in
(53:41):
particular, and it definitelywasn't lonely in reality.
And I think it scares people tobe around someone who is single
and fucking around with a lotof people and is not lonely and
is not in danger.
Yeah, because then it's likewell, why am I staying in this
situation?
Jenn (54:02):
right.
Maybe yeah, that's true maybeit scares them because they're
like looking at their own livesnow and they're like am I happy
in my situation, am I trapped?
Alisa Eddy (54:13):
and so they almost have to like bring you down to
their misery, like misery,loving company kind of you know,
I think for some people yesyeah that's hard and I also,
with some people, got the sensethat, um, they were threatened
in the concern about maybe howtheir partner would perceive me,
like maybe their partner wouldperceive me as sexually
(54:35):
available to them because Iwould be so open about my, I
should tell them a lot abouttheir relationship yeah, yeah,
it should.
Um, so you know, those arethings.
If you're going through a hophase and the rest of your world
isn't in the ho phase, first ofall, give me a call.
I got you.
Second of all, it's normal andthere's a lot of dynamics to
(54:59):
consider that are real, and I'vebeen to some extent on both
sides of those dynamics and Ithink the more that you can just
openly talk about it, thebetter that it is.
You don't have to change yourfriends or get new friends
unless those people just can'troll with your new life right,
yeah, I mean friendship honestly.
Jenn (55:19):
Every relationship takes work.
But friendship should be notorganic.
It shouldn't be so much forcedwork.
Alisa Eddy (55:27):
It should not be forced at all yeah, yeah, I mean
, if you guys, you know, if youand your friend get together on
Sunday for brunch and yourstories about your weekend
completely freak them out, maybe, maybe this isn't the season
for that friendship.
So I guess that's just one ofthose weird little dynamics to
(55:53):
keep in mind when it comes tothat.
Jenn (56:07):
But I think one big benefit to the ho phase is
recognizing your market value.
Alisa Eddy (56:09):
Ooh, yeah, true, yeah, so like for me, having
been married for so long, beenwith the same person from like
19 or 20.
It's like, limited to theirpoint of view, yeah, so like for
me, having been married for solong, been with the same person
from like 19 or 20.
It's like, limited to theirpoint of view, yeah, well.
And also you're just like, ohGod, you know, I don't want to
be single.
I don't know what that's goingto be like.
And then you're like, oh,there's a lot of takers and it's
(56:30):
fine.
Like you might just be like oh,actually I am a really
desirable person who should bechoosing my partners based on
whether or not they bring me joyand are good for me.
Yeah, as opposed to feelinglike there is a dearth of good
partners out there in the worldor a lack of people who will be
(56:51):
interested in me.
And so I think getting outthere and and kind of slutting
it up every now and again can bea good thing to remind yourself
oh, I'm actually kind of a hotpiece of ass.
I got some good things going forme Right?
Yeah, yeah, that's great.
Yeah, yeah, it's good.
I think it's, it's uh, it'svaluable for sure.
Um yeah.
So let's see, I think we'vekind of covered this time.
(57:12):
We talked about sex.
Yeah yeah, we did really good.
We've been doing some podcastslately where we kind of forgot
that sex was part of it.
Jenn (57:20):
So proud of us for this one, to our level, I think.
But I think sex is still partof it for other, maybe some
people.
Alisa Eddy (57:29):
But you're right, yeah, yeah, so we did a good job
there, but yeah, so I thinkwe're going to sign off.
I think my parting words areit's really healthy to have
phases in your life where youcan be really promiscuous and
just go and get and have whatyou want and not worry about
(57:50):
other people and what they wantor what they expect from you or
what they expect you to not doall that crap and get other
people's rules and opinions offof your fucking body and just
experience that freedom word.
Yeah, yeah, and it doesn't haveto be how you live all the time
.
It is probably going to besomething that ebbs and flows
and phases for various reasons,but it's really good for you.
(58:14):
And so, like I said, most womenwho I know well enough to talk
about it have had a lot of hophases and they'll be like, oh
yeah, I used to do that back inthe day, back you know when,
when I broke up with that oneguy for six months, and you know
, and they have good stories totell.
So I would encourage you to nothide it.
If you have this history andyou have these great war stories
and you have this fun time inyour past, share it, be proud of
(58:39):
it, think about all the greatthings that you learned from it
and just embrace it.
And I think a big note also isit doesn't have to be a phase.
It can be a whole life, it canbe your whole life, your whole
life.
Fuck can be your whole life,your whole life.
Fuck, shame, fuck, shame.
You can live a whole life as aslut, or whatever you want to
(59:02):
call it.
I'm reclaiming that term, so Idon't mean it in a derogatory
fashion, but you can decide hey,actually having a lot of
partners gets my juices flowing,rubs my engine.
I like this.
You can decide I need morevariety in my sex life all of
the time.
It doesn't have to just be aphase.
It might be, but there's alsothe possibility.
(59:24):
It could be your new life,could be new lifestyle, and it
doesn't have to precludepartnership.
You can be not single andliving the whole life.
Yeah, yeah, on that note, allright, thank you everybody.
We love you.
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