Questioning the Unseen: A Deep Dive with Caroline

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Have you ever questioned the societal norms and wondered if there's more to what meets the eye? Well, in our intense conversation with Caroline, we unravel the often overlooked aspects of our world, challenging the status quo and unearthing fascinating narratives. From the intricacies of government manipulation and the role of ammunition in our society, to the unsettling realities of surveillance technology, we go farther than the surface, eliciting thought-provoking dialogues and insights.

From the streets of California to the global political stage, we traverse a myriad of topics, opening up discussions on the divisive political climate, the implications of AI and technology, and the chilling prospect of a thousand-year war. We also delve into the mind-bending world of Caroline's science fiction and paranormal books, bringing to life characters and plots that will keep you on the edge of your seat. No topic is off-limits, as we share personal stories, discuss intelligent farm animals, and ponder over the human concept of time, religion, and karma.

We wrap up this rollercoaster of a conversation by probing into trigger warnings, their sensitivity, and how they've become an integral part of our society. We journey through stories of personal conflict and surprising animal intelligence, all while exploring the power of narrative. Join us as we navigate chaos, philosophy, and the fascinating intricacies of our world. Sit back, grab your popcorn, and be prepared to be thrilled! One thing's for sure - Caroline's captivating insights and stories are something you wouldn't want to miss!

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hello, hello, hello.
My friends, how are you alldoing today?
Today we are in for a hell of aride.
Caroline comes on again and boyoh boy, do we just kind of jump
right into it and not care whatwe say?
For context, because we I, likethe last interview I did, I
just pretty much had to hit therecord button because I was like
I'm never going to hit it, kindof thing.

(00:21):
And we just start talking aboutCOVID and hurricanes and the
government and how they'remanipulating people and we get
it a little into a politicalunrest and stuff like that.
And yeah, it is fun, hang inthere.
We do get around to her storiesand boy oh boy, her stories.

(00:42):
A hell of a ride too.
It really gets you thinking.
So here we go, let's buckle up,get some popcorn, get your
drinks and let's rock and roll.
Welcome to the Josh Bolton show.
We've done interesting andinspiring conversations, and now

(01:05):
your host.

Speaker 3 (01:07):
Josh.

Speaker 1 (01:07):
Bolton.

Speaker 3 (01:10):
Patient program or any other type of government
program or anything like that.
The reason why they're neversuccessful is because if we're
ever successful with something,if we solve a problem, if we go,
oh, this is how you stop thisfrom happening or this is how

(01:33):
you make this happen, then themoney dries up.

Speaker 1 (01:37):
Oh yeah, where I live in my part of California, my
city, the police alone.
They have three armored trucksand armored RV.
They have enough armory to makethe military blush Like they
have full and gatling guns.
We're a small town.
Why do you have a gatling gunand armored RV?

Speaker 3 (02:00):
I don't think we're supposed to ask those big
questions, Josh.

Speaker 1 (02:05):
I've actually said it to the chief herself.
I was like why do we have thatarmored RV?
Kind of like that makes nosense.

Speaker 3 (02:13):
I think most likely, and we'll probably both
disappear and end up in Siberiaafter me saying this and you ask
in the question.
But I think that communitieshave those in case of what they
would call a national emergencyor martial law being imposed

(02:35):
that way.
They've already stationed thattype of equipment around the
country.

Speaker 1 (02:42):
Oh yeah, I know that's.
That was pretty much what shesaid.
She's like we're given a budget, we were under budget, so we
had to spend everything to makesure we were overspending.
So they give us more money nextyear.

Speaker 3 (02:53):
Oh well, yeah, that makes that makes sense too, but
I also think that they do thatkind of thing to make sure that
every place that they couldpossibly need rapid deployment
of military type behavior thatthey can.
The interstate highway systemisn't so we can all go to

(03:14):
Disneyland easier.
That's not what that's for.
It's completely set up so thatthe military can mobilize
quickly if they have to.
Oh yeah.
And that's just that.
That's not like a conspiracy oranything, that's just the way
it is.
That's why they were built.

Speaker 1 (03:35):
Yeah, like if you take, you can take.
I think it's the five from SanDiego all the way to Washington.
So you literally just hop onthe five and you can go north.
You got two guys cranking redbulls.
You can do it in 24 hours, kindof thing.

Speaker 3 (03:49):
Yeah, yeah, or you know.
Just look at the way the entiresystem is laid out.
It's just a straight shot fromone part of the country to the
next.

Speaker 1 (04:04):
Well, it's the same for me.
When I went earlier in the year, I went out to Texas for a
railroad job.
I literally just hopped on.
See the 10.
Yeah, the 10, because I wentpast the Grand Canyon and then
came in.
It was literally just straightand then a sharp turn right into
Texas.

Speaker 3 (04:23):
I was just one of those 1010 goes south, 10 goes
along like the like.

Speaker 1 (04:32):
17 is that for something then?

Speaker 3 (04:37):
Okay, I 40.

Speaker 1 (04:40):
That could be it, yeah.

Speaker 3 (04:42):
Okay, yeah, because I 40 even goes across Missouri.

Speaker 1 (04:48):
Yeah, yeah, I went.
I went from California, nevadaa little bit in New Mexico,
tapped Missouri for a second andthen it came back to Texas.

Speaker 3 (04:59):
Yep, that would probably be it.
Cool.
But yeah, it's a lot of thingsthat people just think are, you
know, for making their lifeeasier.
That's not really what theywere designed for.

Speaker 1 (05:15):
No, no, they.
They're just waiting forsomething.
Well, they've been waitingsince like the six.
Yeah, they've been waitingsince the 80s, but they know
something's coming and that'swhy they're arming their teeth.

Speaker 3 (05:29):
Well, and you look at things like how many millions
of bullets FEMA thought why doesthe?
Why does FEMA need millions ofboxes of bullets?

Speaker 1 (05:47):
FEMA.
What's, what's that?

Speaker 3 (05:48):
one again the federal emergency management agency.
Yeah, like the people who showup if a hurricane happens or
something like that.
Why are those bullets?

Speaker 1 (06:03):
Well, here's the crazy thing here in California,
essentially to legally buybullets, they have to do a
background check on you andyou're you're given limits, so
you can only buy up to.
You can only buy up to twoboxes and within a one month
period, and they're not takingour guns away, but they're

(06:25):
taking the thing that goes boomaway.

Speaker 3 (06:30):
Yeah, you can't do much but the WACA and intruder
over the head with your gun ifyou don't have a bullet.

Speaker 1 (06:37):
Pretty much.
But here's the weird partthough with California salt
shots and buckshot, that was notlimited Really, yeah, that's,
that's the weird part.

Speaker 3 (06:51):
That is I mean you can.
If you're up close to somebody,you can inflict some real
serious harm with the shot.

Speaker 1 (07:02):
Yeah, I was, I think, yeah, I think buck, they do
have a limit, but it's not crazylike two, but birdshot is like
no limit.
Even if a birdshot you canreally mess up a human.

Speaker 3 (07:14):
You could, especially if you're a good shot and
nowhere to aim.
So go for one of those weakpoints in the body.

Speaker 1 (07:23):
Well, just somebody's face, yeah, their throat, their
face, exactly, oh, that's notgood, right, but this is like
wait, why is birdshot like allyou can eat buffet kind of thing
?
It's like unless they, unlessthey think like no one's
actually going to be smartenough to use it that way.

Speaker 3 (07:45):
And it's also because your birdshot.
You could have a whole stockpile of birdshot, but if it's
the government that has controlof the actual bullets that are
going to inflict danger from adistance, you're still screwed,
you're out of luck.

Speaker 1 (08:01):
Yeah, oh my gosh, you're screwed.
Yeah, I mean, I've interviewedmany like Navy SEALs, military,
one guy that was active specialops and he even told me he's
like, oh yeah, he's like, if youthink you're not being watched,
you are so wrong.
He's like, and he's like, thisis watching you, that's watching

(08:25):
you, and he's like thosehelicopters like they're always
watching you and I'm like Ithought it was news.
He's like, yeah, about that,it's not the news.

Speaker 3 (08:35):
Yeah, yeah.
People talk about invasion ofprivacy and everything.
If they think that we haveprivacy, they're deluding
themselves because we don't.
Everything can track you thesedays.
Your car can.
I mean people who have thingslike on star.
You'll hear on the news where aburglar stole a car and on star

(09:03):
was able to turn off the carand they slowed down and we're
at a complete stop on theinterstate and the police just
surround them.
Well, guess what they can do?
That if they decide your publicenemy number one, two, even if
you're not doing anything wrong.

Speaker 1 (09:19):
Oh yeah, no, this is the funny thing I tell people.
I said Elon Musk is smart, hesells the people what they want.
But I said but he's notactually selling what people
want, it's what the governmentwants.
I said if everyone goes allelectric and they have some AI
bond that controls them,everything about the car I'm

(09:42):
like I could be trying to headout to that valley and something
.
My car decides to turn aroundand then bring me back to jail.

Speaker 3 (09:49):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (09:50):
What are you going to do about that?

Speaker 3 (09:52):
Exactly.
Yeah, I don't know.
I think people have a misguidedsense that they have more
rights than what they really do.

Speaker 1 (10:04):
I mean I bought a for the railroad job.
I bought a Toyota Tacoma but itwas like the last one without
like the actual auto assistdriving.
Which is actually one of myaunt in Texas had the Kia,
whatever with the auto assist.
Okay, it's kind of cool, youpress a button and it keeps you
in a lane, kind of thing like.
So she literally was talked tous for like 70 miles, never

(10:27):
touched the steering wheel.
That was cool, but it'sterrifying at the same time
because it could drive itself.

Speaker 3 (10:33):
Yeah, and go where it wanted to, and I know, okay, so
this was a crazy thing thathappened to me, okay, so in late
March my old car got hit forthe third time by a deer and it
was a fatal blow the last time.
I couldn't have?
Yeah it, I mean the highwaypatrolman picked up one of its

(10:58):
headlights Down the highway.
You know it was in bad shape.
Yeah, now I'm okay, but Sparkyis no more, and so I had to get
a Nissan.
Well, I didn't have to get aNissan, but I had to get a new
car.
And I got a Nissan and itdoesn't have on star, so, and

(11:25):
I'd been used to using on starwith my Chevy Well.
So then I thought, okay, I'llswitch to using Google maps on
my phone Right or whatever thewill map app is.
That's on my phone, justautomatically my iPhone.
And I remember I had gone to seeKeith and that was it.

(11:53):
Like that was the first timeI'd ever plugged directions by
putting an address in.
And I got in my car and myphone gave me an alert telling
me and I was like I'm going tobe on the return, on the return
trip, when I left seeing him,how long it would take me to

(12:14):
return home and I thought, well,wait a minute, I never told you
where my home is.
And then the next day was aMonday and I was going to go
into town and it told me thiswas during summer break.
It told me it already knewwhere I worked and I'd never

(12:40):
used it for that.

Speaker 1 (12:43):
Yeah, and I have an iPhone too and I had to like go
into the settings and turn allthat off, Like I know it's still
tracking me, but it's not goingto tell me that anymore,
Because before I got this this,my new job of being like a pool
guy I was going down literallylike a mile down the street to
my janitor job at night, itwould tell me, at exactly 1121.

(13:04):
Don't know why 1121 to pickthat.
Your drive to work should beclear.
You should only take you fiveminutes.
I would always get frustratedwith that was my day off.
I'm like I'm not going to work,Dang it.

Speaker 3 (13:20):
Yeah, it just knows too much about us.
It just does.
And there's not much we can doabout it at this point, because
even if we don't have any kindof device that would track us,
every business has surveillancecameras.
Now, I mean, I see, I see thehouses.

Speaker 1 (13:40):
when I do pools, everyone has the ring or some
sort of like Chinese knockoffsurveillance system, which
there's a whole problem withthat, but yeah yeah it's cameras
everywhere.

Speaker 3 (13:54):
And the Chinese situations just like really a
little under evasion.

Speaker 1 (14:01):
They're about to collapse their economy, though.

Speaker 3 (14:04):
Are they?

Speaker 1 (14:05):
They're about to have their own version of Lehman
Brothers here.

Speaker 3 (14:09):
Really what's going on?

Speaker 1 (14:13):
So essentially so.
For that one, it started backin like 2017.
They essentially were justprinting bonds and just giving
these developers money so theycould make China stronger more
money.
Well, suddenly the bonds camedue and they didn't have the
money.
So they kind of like.

(14:36):
So they kind of like, did like ahey, just give us like a month
or two to get the money, kind ofthing, because it's all in our
buildings.
So they avoided default duringCOVID.
But now it's coming due againand essentially the Lehman
Brother, all these people whonormally shouldn't have a house

(14:57):
have houses and cars and stuffit's all going to suddenly come
due.

Speaker 3 (15:02):
Oh my gosh, that's crazy.

Speaker 1 (15:06):
And this is where, like America is heavily invested
in China, china is heavilyinvested in us.
So if one goes down, the othergoes down, and if we go down,
like Europe goes down, if you'rea go down, saudi Arabia area
goes down.
So it's like I'm just sittinghere watching.
I'm like when's it going to go?

Speaker 3 (15:26):
Yeah, yeah, I mean talk about too big to fail.

Speaker 1 (15:31):
Oh, it can fail.

Speaker 3 (15:33):
It can fail.

Speaker 1 (15:35):
I got when I was doing martial arts with one of
my buddies new martial artsstudio.
He's talking about how we'relosing rights as American, this
and that, and how America isscrewing over people.
And I said he's like, oh no,he's like take China, can take
us over any day now if theyreally want to.
China's got their own bigproblems.

(15:56):
I said, plus, why do they needto attack us?
They already got in.
And he's like what do you mean?
I'm like tick, tock, like it isscrewing all the kids memories
and what is real and what's not.
The divisiveness of transpeople to this community, to
that community.
They already have us findingamongst ourselves.
Why do they need to step in?

Speaker 3 (16:17):
And add to that AI when pretty soon, if it's not
already happened, how are wegoing to know if that was an
actual news report or was itcomputer generated?

Speaker 1 (16:35):
The AI right now because I've been studying
coding.
I'm not like some prolific AIcoder, but I just want to know
the basics.
If you know what you're lookingfor, there's distinct tells
that's AI generated.
There's glitches where thereshouldn't be glitches and
stutters where there shouldn'tbe stutters.
But it's super subtle.
Unless you're really lookingfor that, you can't tell the

(16:58):
difference.

Speaker 3 (16:59):
And do you think that 95% of the American public
would know what to look for?

Speaker 1 (17:04):
No, not one bit.

Speaker 3 (17:07):
I mean, these are the same people who believe
politicians promises on bothsides.
They already suspend disbelief.

Speaker 1 (17:18):
Yeah, well, it's wild .
I mean just the politicaldivisiveness we're in.
I was actually a big one.
I was talking with the martialarts crew when I was helping
them clean their masks.
I told them when I said WorldWar III is the greatest war to
ever happen, but it's thegreatest war that we have never

(17:41):
seen as a species before.
So World War I was the trenchesand mustard gas.
World War II was the Holocaustand the nukes.
What's something we haven'tseen yet before?
And they're all like I said howabout dividing us as a species?
Ai and automation and likecyber warfare?

Speaker 3 (18:05):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (18:07):
And I said we as a species have never seen that
before, and I said we're alreadyseeing the starts of it, and I
said this could be a thousandyear war.
This could be one that justkeeps going and pretty much
never ends.

Speaker 3 (18:24):
And there's not going to be too much concern about
the emotional or physicalwell-being of the mere humans.
Well, I know it's so divisiveright now that I actually made a
comment on somebody's post onsocial media that said Well, if

(18:52):
either or both Biden or Trumpbroke the law, then they need to
be held accountable, either oneof them.
Right.
And that's all I said was ifeither or both of them broke the
law, hold them accountable.
And the shitstorm that hit wasjust amazing.

(19:18):
I this guy came yesterday.
This guy came out of thewoodwork on that post and called
me a brainwashed communist.
He said that these were myindictments.
And I'm like, wait a minute.
I wasn't supporting Biden andhe was.

(19:38):
I wasn't saying Biden didn't doanything wrong.
I don't know if he did.
I said let's just see how thecourt proceedings go.

Speaker 1 (19:47):
It's the Hunter Biden situation is what he's
referencing.

Speaker 3 (19:51):
Oh no, I know, I know , but I mean I understand what
both sides are talking about.
But that's why I said if eitherBiden or Trump did something
wrong, let them have their dayin court and we'll see what the
evidence was right.
And I was told that I was unfitto be an American Because I

(20:13):
said if somebody broke the lawthey should be held accountable.
It's just crazy that they're sodivided and so much this is my
team versus your team, and bothsides think the other team is
the devil.
But they can't even say well,you know what?

(20:35):
Yeah, if my guy did break thelaw, then he should be punished.
You never saw anything likethat happen during the Nixon
administration, where, when itcame out that, yeah, he had been
doing some really shady stuff,there weren't Republicans
protesting saying that it was awitch hunt.

Speaker 1 (21:00):
It's literally.
I do futures contract ratingand my mentor has a zoom call
every Thursday at like 4pmAlabama time.
So to my time I don't goanymore, because the one hedge
fund broker guy.
All he talks about is Trump isa crump.
The 2000 meals to the Lib Tardsruined America and yeah, we

(21:31):
might want to talk about that,but then he's like I didn't get
to talk to election away, trump.
And he's like the kind of guylike I imagine him looking at a
poster of Trump on the wall andjust at 70, not Harakai, but
he's just like Trump, trump,trump yeah, yeah, no, it's.

Speaker 3 (21:53):
I don't understand, Like my degrees in political
science, but honestly I don'tlike any politician to be that
excited about them.

Speaker 1 (22:06):
Me neither.

Speaker 3 (22:07):
They're just people.
They are just people.

Speaker 1 (22:11):
Seriously, that's the like for me.
Like, especially because we'regetting into election next year.
Yeah everyone was like who youvoting for?
Are you voting?
Oh, by the way, fun fact beforewe get back to that, I guess
Gavin Newsom is going to run.

Speaker 3 (22:28):
Is he really?

Speaker 1 (22:30):
I guess he's going to run.
I guess he did a debate againstSantos last night.
I want to look that up.
I'm like how did that go?

Speaker 3 (22:38):
Oh my, yeah, I'd heard his name tossed around,
but I didn't know he wasactually running.

Speaker 1 (22:45):
He hasn't officially thrown his hat in.
I think he wanted to see how itwent with the debate before he
full, fully threw his hat in,kind of thing.
But he's so high and mighty, Imean he's got anti Pelosi, that
got him in.
Like I think it's one of those,he's good.
Yeah, you want, miss, miss,anti Pelosi will figure it out,

(23:06):
kind of thing.
Back to the other one I was.
Everyone was like oh, who areyou going to vote for?
Like blue or red?
I'm like where have the persons?
That's not batshit crazy.
So it's usually the yellowparty.
They're actually moderate.

Speaker 3 (23:22):
Oh, it's just.
I don't understand people thatused to seem like normal human
beings, who now, if someone's aRepublican, they hate him.
If somebody's a Democrat, theyhate him.
And it says, though, nothingelse in life matters.

(23:47):
And all of us I don't carewhich party you belong to or if
you don't belong to a party atall, most of us have the vast
majority of character traits thesame Everybody wants their
family safe, well fed, secure.
They want to be able tocelebrate birthdays with their

(24:09):
loved ones.
They want to be able to taketheir loved one to the doctor if
they need some kind of medicalcare.
We have so many similaritiesbeyond what box.
Has checked on a voter ID card?
And it's a big one.

Speaker 1 (24:39):
I mean it's funny but it's not.
I was first starting when I waslearning how to do pools
because my uncle had a kneesurgery.
That's how I got into the gig,because I got fired from the
river and stuff.
Pool stuff is like introvertstream.
No one really bugs you.
No one really talks to youother than like the manager,
like hey, I noticed a dead cat,can you get that out of the pool
?
It's like, yeah, yeah, thendump in the chlorine, clean that

(25:01):
, all that up.
Then that no one bugs me.
This lady comes out of nowhereLike I was working and then I
had my AirPods in and I turn andgo oh shit, and she's like
sunny.
I want you to know that Isexually identify as a unicorn.

(25:23):
I'm like, I'm really.
I heard this before at StaterBrothers and I was like, wait,
wait, can you explain to me whatthat means?
What identity?
Like?
Are you trans?
Are you this?
Are you that?
Like, I just identify as aunicorn.
I'm like because you're alwayshorny, like.

(25:45):
I'm really confused.
She lost her shit, lost it, youignorant, bigot this, and that
you homophobic, whatever.
And I was like.
And then she said you, sir, andI'm really just used her own
game.
You assumed my gender.
How dare you?

(26:05):
She's all like.
Oh no, she's like.
She's like cowering in thecorner.

Speaker 3 (26:10):
Oh my gosh.
Yeah Well, the only thing thatI care about somebody
identifying as is I want mystudents to all identify as
someone who's going to work hardand pass my class, that's a
rainbow.

Speaker 1 (26:25):
You could be a helicopter or a leprechaun, I
don't care, just pass this.

Speaker 3 (26:29):
Make sure you learn what you're supposed to be
learning.
I don't care otherwise.

Speaker 1 (26:34):
Seriously, but that was the wildest one.
I was like I laughed because itwas like I was telling my, my
girlfriend.
I was like this is almost likethose internet trolling things,
but in real life.

Speaker 3 (26:49):
Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1 (26:51):
I'm like people are so blurring Twitter to reality.

Speaker 3 (26:56):
Next step trolling.
Right or just completelyignorant oh yeah, I don't know,
I don't know where we're going,but here's, here's the here's
the solution.
Okay.
So we're going to take care ofall of our problems.
If what's going on in thosevideo tapes that the hearing was

(27:21):
based on about UAPs, anidentified aerial phenomenon, we
might be worried about problems.
We will never exist.
We might not have to worryabout AI taking over If there's
an alien invasion.

Speaker 1 (27:37):
you know they might just Well, here's what if it's
already happened.

Speaker 3 (27:42):
Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1 (27:44):
What if it's?
Well they're way smarter thanus, they have better technology,
and thus we're just like this.
We're still cavemen runningaround with sticks.
These people, these speciescould still be so sophisticated
that they could embody us like ashape shifter.

Speaker 3 (28:00):
I just wrote a story, actually, that the gist of it
is that AI has taken oversociety and has turned humans
into slaves and aliens andeverybody's like, oh shit, great

(28:21):
, now aliens have landed.
How much worse is this going toget?
Well, then it turns out thatthe aliens are the only ones who
are far enough advanced withintelligence that they can
outsmart the AI.
So they come in, they fight ourbattle, and then they're like
we're going to stay here tillyou stabilize your government
and your society, and then we'regoing to leave again.
Thank you very much.

(28:42):
We knew this day would come.

Speaker 1 (28:45):
Here's the wild thing .
I've been getting a lot of thison YouTube and TikTok.
I actually had to leave TikTokbut my attention span got so
short with that, but that's abig one.
People are saying what if we asa species, like how the
pyramids were perfectly lined upwith everything, how these
labyrinths in Egypt are nowbeing found?
We, as the species, could neverhave done that on our own.

(29:06):
What if we had, like, starpeople coming down with their
technology and helping us kindof thing?
And it could be like your storythey're coming back to like we
just did this, Like ah, come on.

Speaker 3 (29:20):
I couldn't leave you all for more than a few thousand
years.

Speaker 1 (29:24):
Seriously.

Speaker 3 (29:24):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (29:27):
So I think, if anything, if there is an alien
vision, I don't think it's likemore of the world situation.
I think it's going to be morelike they're trying to be like
help us, without us knowing it.

Speaker 3 (29:38):
Yeah, yeah, I just think there's so much stuff
going on and then you know I'lllisten to a paranormal podcast
just because it's kind of funand my stories don't necessarily
come from any of those, butit's just kind of funny.
I want to hear the ideas thatare out there.
You know, and I think you know,even 5% of what these talk

(30:05):
about is real.
Then there's a whole lot goingon on our own planet that we
don't even understand or aren'taware of.
And yeah, that's, you know, justgoing beyond aliens or anything
like that.
There could be a whole lot ofstuff going on on this planet

(30:27):
that we were just oblivious to.

Speaker 1 (30:30):
Or you could get into the metaphysical, where we are
only on this frequency butthere's still all that other
stuff going around, but we inthis flesh body can't see that.

Speaker 3 (30:42):
Right, interdimensionalism and kind of
like.
Looking at a sheet of paperfrom the side view, we only see
this little thin slice of it,and if you turned it over,
there'd be so much more that weshould know about.
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (31:00):
Oh yeah, well, because it's like the concept,
like time actually is only aman-made thing, like the idea
that we've been sitting here for31 minutes is actually not a
thing.
Right, we decided it was,though.

Speaker 3 (31:15):
Yeah, I mean.
It's completely a humanconstruct to determine how long
a second is or a thousand years.
Mm-hmm.
That's just.
I mean, what if each day iswhat we consider five days, but
we're just built to sleep fivetimes a day?

(31:36):
How would I mean?
exactly.
But I know somebody in myfamily was making the argument.
Oh, she was mad as a hornet.

(31:56):
Because they were, because thetime change, and she said that
this is what's wrong with thiscountry and this is why God has
abandoned us, because weshouldn't be messing with time,

(32:17):
because God established whattime is.
And I'm like no, actually.
I told her this.
I said no, actually, time is aman-made construct.
Mm-hmm.
God didn't.
What do you mean?
So you go.
Well, just nowhere in the Bibledoes it say and God said a

(32:38):
second is going to be this long,or a minute is going to be made
up of 60 seconds.
People get too wrapped up inthings that really were just
something that it was easier forsomebody to break it down into.
That time for us to understand.

Speaker 1 (32:59):
Well, it's what I was going to get to is like the
seven days, and on the seventhday he rested, kind of thing,
but the concept of time wasnever introduced into.
Like the idea of time was neverintroduced but it's used as if
it's already been introduced.
So was that humans or was thatactually God?

Speaker 3 (33:20):
Yeah, Sorry you go.
Oh no, I was just going to saythat I thought for quite a while
that one of the biggestproblems that we have, and the
division that happensreligiously, even between
different Christiandenominations, is that too many

(33:42):
people and it spills over topolitics too with this, but too
many people try to create God intheir image, instead of God
made man in his image.
We try to create God to be whatwe want God to be and to be the

(34:07):
one that justifies our ownnarrow perspective of what's
okay and what's not okay.
And I'm not saying you know itshould be a free for all and
complete anarchy.
You know what I'm saying, thatyeah, you know.
When you look at genders andstuff like that, you know it's

(34:28):
not my place to say whethersomebody's going to help because
they're different than I am,but a lot of people love to make
that argument.

Speaker 1 (34:38):
Oh yeah, well, it's one of those.
I actually had a chat with oneof the clients and then, but
also my uncle, when he wastraining me, and I told him, I
said, where does it specificallysay in the Bible that?
And he couldn't render whatever.
I was like essentially like, ifyou judge, it's okay.

(34:59):
Because I told him, I said I'vealways interpreted the text as
if you judge someone, whetheryou're right or wrong, you have
done.
You have done a sin, andunforgivable sin.
So to say, oh, that person'sgoing to hell from what I've
read.
And I showed him the text andeverything I said that's what I
got.
It's like you're not supposedto judge, you're just helping.

(35:21):
And then, like, karma kicks in,eventually it evens itself out.
Where does it say that?
Like I and that's where he got.
Well, man, my uncles are prettychill dude I, he, his blood was
boiling, his face was turningred, I was like he had a knee
surgery and he's sitting in mycar and I'm like, oh my God,
he's going to randomly come overand hit me, kind of thing.

(35:43):
But yeah, that's where.
It was just one of the.
I told him like but where doesthis say that?
Like?
I'm genuinely curious becauseit's not adding up for me.
And that's where he he sent youlater on, told me he's like you
know you're actually right onwhen it comes to that text and
I'm like, wait what?

Speaker 3 (36:08):
Could have been one more time.

Speaker 1 (36:10):
Do you see that when I turned my phone on, yeah.
But it was just one of thosehe's like yeah, he's like.
I guess at his church theytalked about the same thing with
that, that exact quote.
And that's where he said it isnot your place to judge whether
someone's going to hear therekind of thing.
But then I started telling him.
I said, well, since I got onewin, I'm going to take you.

(36:31):
Give me an inch of going a mile.
What about this, this and this?
He's like no, but, but that wasa big one.
He told me.
He's like how did you learnthat?
I'm like dude.
I listened to this author namedJoseph Murphy.
He talks about metaphysical andall that, but he talks about
how the Bible is more of apsychological trauma.

(36:51):
So if you look at like Jesus as, yes, he's God.
But if God is your subconsciousbecause we don't fully
understand the subconscious andwhat it can and can't do If you
look at it as your subconscious,as a God, and can literally
manifest something, well, we saythat's God.
But if that's just, all, ushumans are intrinsically God.

Speaker 3 (37:18):
In his image right.

Speaker 1 (37:22):
In his image.
So and that's where me and himdiffered.
But he said, I said but a lotof what he says is the Bible is
more of a psychological drama.
It's not supposed to be takenliteral.

Speaker 2 (37:34):
He's like because I'm like, I told him like there's
Go ahead.

Speaker 3 (37:37):
It's okay.
Well, I was just gonna say mymy brother in law is one that
says that there's no way thataliens actually exist because
it's not mentioned in the Bible.

Speaker 1 (37:50):
And so that it's not scriptural.

Speaker 3 (37:53):
Well, and so my my response to that is that the
Bible deals with earth.
What goes on with us peoplehere on earth when we go to the
doctor?
We don't want the doctortelling us all the things he's
doing to heal his other patients.

(38:15):
We just want to know what he'sgoing to do for us, and the
Bible is our, our path to healand and be spiritually
reconstructed from being broken,and God didn't intend to have

(38:37):
to tell everything to us, justwhat we need to know.

Speaker 1 (38:42):
Right, it was just enough so you could get an idea
where to go.
Yeah, like, like I tell peoplelike if you're going to the
mountain, the top of a mountain,there could be up to a million
ways to the top.
Now, some of them are fruitlessand some are really dangerous
and will get you killed, butthere are generally good spots
to go that are safe.
That doesn't mean you'rebending to whatever will or

(39:05):
manipulating people, it's justgenerally, this path is proven
and safe kind of thing.
You should probably take it.
And I said I'm like that's kindof the Bible.
It's like this is a really good, safe path.
It doesn't mean it's right, wehave Buddhism, confucianism,
hinduism, whatever else ismskind of thing it's like.
But it all leads to the samething.

(39:27):
Like if you really look atBuddhism, all it is is life or
suffering.
You choose to be where you'reat, do good more than evil, help
your neighbor and think higherof yourself.
Wow, that's Christianity kindof in a nutshell.
Oh wait, that's also kind ofConfucianism and Hinduism and

(39:48):
Muslim Muslim, muslim Islam,islam.
Yes, it's the same.
The root concepts are the same.
And that's where I tell peopleMike, all religion is just more
of like a subtle way of sayingthis is a good path.
Generally should probably takethis.

Speaker 3 (40:10):
No, yes, obviously there's a little manipulation in
there, but if you look at evenwhen Jesus was on the cross and
he was being crucified, with twocriminals, the one Repented and
said I believe you, you're theson of God, and he said that

(40:33):
that man would be with him inparadise.
But the other one, who stuck tonot believing in going a better
way, wasn't To say that there'snot more than One way to the
top of the mountain, means thatyou had to only live your life

(40:54):
the way One type of person lives, where that, right there, shows
that Jesus is like.
No, you lived a life of crimeand Yet you're still able to get
there.
You know you didn't have totake the the long route as as

(41:17):
long as you want to get to thesame place and right.
So people think that unlessSomeone lives their life exactly
the way that person thinks thatEveryone else should be living
their lives, that they're notgoing to make it into heaven,
and that just seems Extremelyself-centered, which is also

(41:41):
supposed to be something thatChristians aren't.

Speaker 1 (41:45):
That's my biggest argument with my sister,
actually she's, she's going totheology school and getting her
seminaries and all that, andActually the biggest one I had
with her and I said this is thetides and something else.
And back to her, the, theself-centeredness.
But I told her, said I think ifJesus was real, I Said what

(42:08):
would he have done?
She's like oh, what he saidthey say in the Bible, mike.
No, because the Bible wasn'tactually built until a council
people came together with thedead sea scrolls and they
literally just raised their handif they liked that verse or not
, so that there's a lot of humanmanipulation in there saying
like, oh, we should, because Isaid there is a quote that was
removed.
But if you find the debt, thereis a dead sea scroll to this

(42:31):
same.
Reincarnation is a thing Sad inthe Bible.
Oh Wait, because if they haveone life and they will actually
listen to their overlords andtheir slave drivers, you have
one life.
If I kill you, that's it.
There's no coming back.
But there was a reference toreincarnation.
Just just so happens it's notin there anymore.

(42:53):
I said what if also Jesus had awife and kids?
Oh Wait, that makes him seemnormal and whole other than now.
He's not a soul bit virgin.
That dies on a cross, there'sreferences and that screws to

(43:13):
dead sea scrolls.
To that.
That's older Mike.
There's a lot of moremanipulation and you realize in
the Bible Well then you look atKing James.
Okay, he altered it so he canlive his lifestyle.
I can trouble.
Exactly and then everything'sbased off his too.

Speaker 3 (43:32):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (43:35):
And that's where she actually was doing the dead sea
scrolls and essentially the.
She made an argument with her,her professor essentially Back
to the self-centeredness she'slike her maker break paper was
prove God's not real.
She couldn't, so she came to meso I told her everything that

(44:00):
I've from my studies, thecontradictions and this and that
.
But then so she wrote it.
But the self-centeredness forher was like but I don't believe
this, so I can't sign off onthis.
And I'm like you don't have tobelieve it.
That's the whole point of this.
Can you present the evidencethat before you?
But I believe my calling is toprove that God is real.
I'm like is that like a voicein your head, or is that You're

(44:26):
told by your teacher to do this?
You did it.
And then that's where she's likewell, the people at my whatever
will understand.
Well, they, you're a shepherd,they're the sheep, the
shepherd's expressing the sheepto leave the shepherd, but the
shepherd has to leave the sheep.
Do you see the problem here,kind of thing.

(44:47):
And that's where she that meand her don't really talk about
religion.
But that's where I told her,like you, how you present
Christianity is very selfish.
God is for me and only me.
Yeah, no kind of thing.

Speaker 3 (45:00):
Yeah, cuz it is not our place to decide if anybody
else is going to heaven.
That's not our call.

Speaker 1 (45:07):
It's not.

Speaker 3 (45:13):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (45:15):
I had people that was so you go oh, just.

Speaker 3 (45:19):
People like to twist, whether it's Religion, politics
, money.
Yeah they put value.
You know even music.
There are people who try totell you what music remember

(45:40):
Rock and roll was gonna sendeverybody to hell.
They, their notes, theirinstrumental notes that are no
different than notes that wereplayed by Beethoven or Bach or
any anybody else, or any other,or Bach or any anybody else, or

(46:01):
some good old boy on his fiddleplaying bluegrass.
And Even as a kid I was likeYou're gonna have to be a pretty
weak person and Really weak inyour faith if you think it's
gonna take some musical notes toCause your sin to go.

(46:23):
You know, cause you to sin andgo to hell.
Oh, yeah you're you're not veryfaithful to begin with.
If that's all it took.

Speaker 1 (46:36):
And it's sad.
I mean like when I was going tochurch when I was younger, this
when my parents were taking meand I didn't really have a
choice or no, knew better,although actually Christian, I
knew better.
I would actually ditch classthings, go like sit in the
library instead.
But the female pastor at thetime was really progressive in
the 90s, was a female pastorKind of thing.

(46:57):
They're like we're edgy andpolitically correct before it
was even a thing.
She pulled me aside.
I was a big boy back then.
I mean, I had a young age.
They gave me meds and all that.
One of them made me a littleSeven year old.
Seven year old gain essentially60 pounds in like two months.

Speaker 3 (47:16):
Whoo.

Speaker 1 (47:17):
I.
No one told me.
So they're all like oh your fat, jesus don't like fat people.
She literally grabbed me andjust went Josh, god doesn't like
fat people.
Fat people, go to hell.
Do you like Jesus?
You need to lose fat or you'regoing to hell.
I Was literally turned and saidif that's your God, I don't

(47:38):
want him, kind of thing.
That was a whole blow up overthere, but that that's what made
me realize, kind of like whatwe were doing to self-centered,
like she didn't, like I was fat.
She was using hell as areference for me to was way.
But that's judging which.

Speaker 3 (47:57):
Back to the original yeah, and that's trying to put
yourself On an even par with Godthat supposedly you worship and
serve.

Speaker 1 (48:08):
Oh, but we're buddy buddies.
We talk all the time, it's okay.

Speaker 3 (48:13):
Yeah, he doesn't need our help in deciding things
like that.
In fact, he doesn't need ourhelp in deciding anything.

Speaker 1 (48:20):
Yeah, and that was, that was a big one.
That's when I started likeditching and just going to like
the library or at a young age Istarted the guys were like, cook
, make the, bring out thecookies and the really, really
bitter coffee.
Yeah, so I had like eight.
I would come out for my coffeeand he's like, hey, I can't give

(48:42):
you real coffee because it'llbe obvious, but I'll give you
decaf, which is like little tono caffeine.
I'd be sitting there all happy,like sipping my coffee and
talking to him with my littlescone, and so he, that's where
he talked about different stuffand that's when I realized I'm
like At a young age I realizedreligions, like art, we can all
see the same thing but getdifferent things out of it.

Speaker 3 (49:03):
Yeah, that's a good point.
Well, we haven't talked at allyet about your book.

Speaker 1 (49:15):
If they are still sitting here because of all the
shit we've talked about.
That's impressive.
You all are amazing, love youall.
So tell you, told me about theAI and the aliens, tell me more
about it.
I like give me the like, thelead-up, like the build-up point
, like oh, oh, of that, of thatone short story.

Speaker 3 (49:34):
Oh, oh no, the new one then well, well, all all of
my books, all of my sciencefiction and paranormal books,
are short story collections, sothere's like 30 short stories in
each of them.
So that just happens to be oneof the stories that I wrote for,
for, actually for book fourthat comes out in large.

(49:58):
I finished book four already.
I know I said I set a goal formyself to finish it Before
school started again and I didit with two days to spare.
Yeah, yeah happy, and but theone that came out July 1st is
called a starry night okay andit has some really fun stories

(50:22):
in it too, and I have written somany stories.
This sounds Terrible.
I should probably be on herebeing the warrior for a starry
night right now, but I Wrote somany stories over the summer To
make book four that now I'mhaving trouble off the top of my

(50:44):
head remembering which ones arein a starry night, which ones
are in the next book, which isgoing to be called which way to
go?

Speaker 1 (50:53):
Hell is.
Just tell us about whicheverones that come to your mind.
Whether then, people, if it'syour your fourth book, I'm like
oh well, gotta go get thatfourth one now.

Speaker 3 (51:01):
Okay, all right, so I wrote a really long one to
finish up which way to go, andit's w itch which way to go, and
it's called an arm and a leg.
Okay and it is about a policeofficer who Is called to the

(51:26):
scene of a stranded motoristdown this deserted, dirt road
and he gets there and it was anambush and he's oh yeah, he's
attacked and he ends up Losingone of his arms.
Whatever, whoever this was,they used what was presumed to

(51:48):
be an axe on him and they cutoff one of his arms and legs and
he almost bled to death andhe's in the hospital for a long,
long time, for weeks, andfinally gets to go home and only
one of his friends he talks toa counselor but only one of his

(52:09):
friends from the force Does hetalk to you about all the anger
that he has and he wants revenge.
He wants to find who did thisright, because now he can't be a
cop anymore.
His whole life has been turnedupside down, and so his buddy is
like Don't worry about it, I'mwith you and I'll do whatever it

(52:34):
takes, legal or not legal, toget this person.
Mm-hmm well, and this is a verycondensed version of it.
This is just the high points ofit.
So, anyway, one night theydecided to go out to where the
attack had happened and it thewhole thing with that seemed

(52:59):
like the air vibrated and theycould hear A voice.
You know, here and there andthey're looking around with
their flashlights and they getattacked again and In the final
scene there's a young officerwho's answering a call that
dispatch has sent him out on togo find the the officers because

(53:25):
they were in peril, and he'sjust being sent out there to be
another victim, because it turnsout that the dispatcher Is
actually the one who is sendingthem out there because her
otherworldly family that livesout in this hollow actually eats

(53:45):
people.
Hey.
And the cost of raising thefamily on a dispatcher's income
costs an arm and a leg.
I like it.

Speaker 1 (54:02):
That's cool.

Speaker 3 (54:06):
So I always have a twist of some kind in all my
stories and the good guys aren'talways who you assume are the
good guys and sometimes the badguys aren't even all that bad.
There's this one story calledthe trophy hunter.
That's in a starry night andit's this guy and he's bragging

(54:30):
about his hunting prowess andhow he knows that people who
aren't hunters think that it'sjust horrible that he goes out
and he trophy hunts.
But he likes to go out and huntapex predators.
That's his thing because youknow any.
Yeah, well, the whole reason forit is that's the challenge.

(54:56):
Anybody can kill somethingthat's not going to possibly get
you, but looking something inthe eye that you know could kill
you too, and you still winChallenge it yeah.
Yeah, that you know, macho rush,that he gets from it.
Well, and it talks about he'son this hunt, the safari, and

(55:22):
there were three apex predatorsthat he wanted to get.
And it's coming down to thelast night that he's going to be
on the hunt and he's thinkinghe might come up with only two
of the three.
Each time he describes brieflyhow he goes about killing them

(55:43):
and getting his prey and it'swritten so that people go.
That's just horrible.
Oh, those horrible hunters, oh,that's awful.
Well, it turns out he'sactually an alien and he comes
down to earth and, like one ofhis apex predators was a
murderer, one's a rapist and onedid something else.

(56:06):
That's horrible, like apedophile or something like that
.
Okay, so people go.
Oh, wait a minute.
We're always saying that thosepeople should die anyway.
You know, suddenly theperspective flipped.

Speaker 1 (56:18):
You're getting Peter really involved on that one.

Speaker 3 (56:20):
Yeah, well, just when you think that you're going to
hate this guy who's the narrator, then it's like oh wait, he was
kind of doing earth a favor ina lot of people's minds, so
anyway that's cool.

Speaker 1 (56:41):
That's really cool.
Do you have any psychological,like Jekyll and high breakdowns
stories?

Speaker 3 (56:50):
I have ones where people, characters, aren't
necessarily what they seem to be, as far as like in this one
story that I wrote.
It's in which way to go.
It is about a boy who hisgrandfather dies.

(57:12):
It's called in search ofAlistair Lane and his
grandfather, on a deathbed, saysyou've got to find Alistair
Lane, he's like, but I don'tknow where that is.
Well then his grandfather diesand he's left all alone and he
ends up being put in foster carebecause his grandfather was the
only family that he had and hiswhole life he's like.

(57:33):
You know, mulberry Lane was twoblocks over and this and that
was, you know, this lane wasover here.
And he's looking and he can'tfind any record of there being
an Alistair Lane in their town.
Well then he finally ends upwith a good foster family and

(57:53):
but they understand, when heturns 18, he wants to go find
this out.
He wants to find this placebecause his grandfather had said
all of his trouble began there.
And it turns out that AlistairLane is a person, a who not
aware, and he's a demon thatbasically takes his victims as

(58:23):
like their souls as payment.
Right, they belong to him then?
Well, and the only way that youcan not have that fate is you
have to hand over somebody elseto them.
Well then, out of the shadows,where this kid has gone to meet

(58:46):
up with this Alistair Lane tohunt him down.
The grandfather comes out ofthe shadows and the grandfather
is the one that sold him out.
God damn, I know Reginald was abad dude.
Yeah, damn, yeah.
Friends like that, who needsenemies?

(59:08):
Huh.

Speaker 1 (59:09):
Right Dang, and you try to he, and he trusted him
too and it was like that yeah,he's still the man like wow.

Speaker 3 (59:18):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (59:18):
Dang girl.
You're like you're all tryingto piss off everyone.
Oh, christians, this and that.
Peter, you said if you go yougo missing for a different
reason, like I know where she'sat, it's okay.

Speaker 3 (59:31):
Just call me salmon rush, right.

Speaker 1 (59:38):
I am just curious, though on a side note are you
worried about like cancelculture and all that like coming
after you?

Speaker 3 (59:46):
Not too much.
No.
Why.
Just because the whole reasonfor the stories is to make
people think and to to challengeexpectations.
So it's.
It's not as though.
It's not as though I have someagenda that I'm trying to impose

(01:00:12):
on other people or anythinglike that.
I just like to upend people'sexpectations of what they think
something's going to be.
That's all.

Speaker 1 (01:00:24):
Okay, yeah, and if they get all hot and bothered,
all it is is free advertised foryou because you're going to be
like look these, these just tocry about.
We got to get more book sales.

Speaker 3 (01:00:36):
Yeah, go see what they're complaining about.
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:00:41):
Yeah, that's a big one because I've been reading
different like books and likesave the cat writes a novel by
Jessica something, and then thisother one I bought on audible
called great courses, like howto rate great fiction.
Then I also listened to StephenKing's memoir on writing and
all of them unanimously say ifyou want to be a successful

(01:01:04):
author, do not expect to makefriends.
Yeah, if you're like, if youwant to make friends as an
author, you're in the wrongbusiness Kind of thing.
Yeah, we're.

Speaker 3 (01:01:15):
We're here to tell stories and to tell stories.
Well, not not worry about see.
I have a problem with peoplewith who think that all stories
should have trigger warnings.
I'm serious.

(01:01:37):
The trigger that's.
That's why people watch scarymovies.

Speaker 1 (01:01:42):
Yeah, because you don't want to be warned.

Speaker 3 (01:01:44):
Yeah, they want the surprise If you go.
Oh, by the way, this is aboutanimals being killed.
But don't worry, it's notanimals, it's just pedophiles.
And if you're a pedophile andyou're going to feel triggered
by this just a little morning,maybe you shouldn't read this
story.
It's going to hurt your littleboo boo's, you know, and no, no,

(01:02:06):
I like for me.

Speaker 1 (01:02:09):
I don't put trigger warnings on stuff like this,
because it's like we had a greatconversation.
The thing with podcasts iswe're having a great
conversation and you get tolisten in.
Yeah if you don't like it, youcan always click off and go
somewhere else, kind of thing.

Speaker 3 (01:02:25):
Exactly.
They're like I'm not and it'snot that much, yeah, and we're
not being insulting to eachother either.

Speaker 1 (01:02:32):
No, we were just challenging each other.
Exactly, and that's where likeone of the guests actually
listened to me and she's likeman, you should put trigger
warnings on stuff.
I'm like man, if I did that Iwould raise them.
Like this whole notebook wouldbe full by the end of a week of
everything I have to remember.
Yeah, because I was like,because I told her, like there's

(01:02:54):
always new triggers, I saidthere's a new one, I hear, and
it's so disgustingly weird, youhave to warn people about
cutting plants.

Speaker 3 (01:03:04):
What.

Speaker 1 (01:03:05):
Yeah, If someone's cutting grass, apparently that's
triggering.
I didn't know that to like acouple of weeks ago.
I feel like my girlfriendlistens to like this podcast
with two ladies and they getdrunk and have ADHD
conversations.
There was 10 minutes of triggerwarning 10 minutes.

(01:03:26):
I'm like oh my God.
And then they do like another10 minutes of ads and I was like
, okay, by the time I was atthat point, why are you?

Speaker 3 (01:03:36):
listening what's the point of listening if you
already know what topics aregoing to be discussed.

Speaker 1 (01:03:41):
Exactly.
I was like wait, that's sostupid kind of thing.
And this is the whole thingwhere they really enable ladies
to do whatever they want, butnot for the betterment of a
relationship, just forthemselves At part.
Mostly why I stopped listeningbecause they're like girl, you
want to go get some dick, go getsome, you got a boyfriend,

(01:04:02):
don't worry about it, he's justa little bitch anyways.
And I said I sat down likethat's more, was like I'm done,
I'm not going to listen to this.

Speaker 3 (01:04:11):
Yeah, now that that deserves a trigger warning right
there that they're going totell people trash your life, go
out there, ruin your life andyour relationship, do it.

Speaker 1 (01:04:24):
It's okay, girl.
Yeah, and I was just one ofthose.
I was like I know that's whatthose extremist feminists want
to hear, kind of thing, whereit's like you just embody the
masculine and the feminine.
It's okay, girl, pass bitch,kind of thing, and it's like
there's a reason why it's calledfemale or feminine energy

(01:04:46):
versus male or masculine energy.
There's there's intentionally adivide, but when they unite
it's like Union Yang kind ofthing, not because supposed to
be all black, little white, kindof thing.

Speaker 3 (01:04:59):
Well, and I hate to be the one I mean trigger
warning to those podcasters.
I hate to be the one to tellyou this, but women have been
out doing that.
Yeah.
You're not telling themanything remarkable.

(01:05:19):
Anybody who's going to want todo that already has been doing
it.

Speaker 1 (01:05:25):
And they're probably not listening to your podcast
because they're embeddingsomeone else.

Speaker 3 (01:05:30):
They're too busy doing their thing.

Speaker 1 (01:05:35):
But it was just that's where like for me.
That's why I stopped listeningto that, because I'm like that's
all that's doing is adding tothe divisiveness we were talking
about earlier, because it'slike really like kind of thing.
But so sorry for that side.
Tension for the.
Tell me a couple more of yourother stories.

Speaker 3 (01:05:59):
Oh my goodness, let me think of the recent ones.

Speaker 1 (01:06:10):
What's the one that sticks out to you the most,
whether it's the old one or anew one?

Speaker 3 (01:06:17):
Well, there's this one.
That is the first story in booktwo.
Book two is called when the cowbird sings and the very first
story is called Ice House Canyon.
And when I lived in Globe,arizona, I taught at a

(01:06:37):
alternative school that was downin Ice House Canyon and there
is a legend down there aboutthis goat man that lives down
there and yeah, he apparently issuper scary and looks at
people's window and stuff likethat.
No, not just like a Capricorn.

Speaker 1 (01:06:57):
I was like a Capricorn.

Speaker 3 (01:07:01):
But no, supposedly there's this guy.
I'm not a guy, it's a goat manthat lives down there, walks on
hooves and everything.
And it's been a legend in thatarea for a long, long time and
actually one of my oldest son'sfriends from elementary school

(01:07:21):
swore that he had seen it onenight and the kid was like being
absolutely serious, not tryingto pull our leg or anything.
He was terrified.
I started off with the conceptof the goat man of Ice House
Canyon and then I blended inbecause I needed somebody to be

(01:07:47):
the bad guy, the little punk whopicks on the good kid, johnny
Pensinger, who has just moved tothe area right.
Right.
And so when my youngest son wasin eighth grade, he had never
had trouble with this kid beforethe kids going around all day

(01:08:09):
long.
I'm going to kick Kevin Petersass.
I'm going to kick his ass.
Where's Kevin?
I'm going to kick his ass andeverybody's going.
Why are you saying that you andKevin have never had any kind of
beef before?
Even a couple of teachers werelike why are you saying that?
You need to stop saying that.
So Kevin finally told the kidwell, okay, you know, if that's

(01:08:33):
what you want, you know, thenmeet me after school, but I'm
not looking for a fight.
So Kevin had to walk onedirection to get to our house.
The other kid had to go theother direction to get to his

(01:08:54):
house.
Well, kevin had kind of lookedaround after school, didn't see
the kid.
So he and his best friend camewalking down to go to our house.
The other kid saw Kevin turnaround, came and picked a fight
with Kevin and Kevin's like youknow what guy?

(01:09:15):
All right, fine, I'll even letyou have the first hit, but you
better make it count, becauseafter that the fight.
Yeah.
Yeah, and he had his best friend, jeremy, hold his arms behind
his back, had this kid hit himand then Kevin beat the crap out

(01:09:36):
of the kid and turned andwalked home right.
So next thing, you know this,this blows up into this huge
thing.
Kevin is out of school,suspended for 10 days for gang
fighting.

Speaker 1 (01:09:58):
It was just him.

Speaker 3 (01:10:01):
Right.
But after he had beaten thiskid up, these other two boys who
had heard this kid meld in theentire day about how he's going
to beat up Kevin, one of thempassed the kid who was on the
ground crying and he gave him alittle kick with his foot Like
nothing serious, just bumped himwith his foot like you know cry

(01:10:23):
baby, baby.
A little jerk, right.
Well, they use that to say thatKevin was in a gang fight.
Well, I complained to theprincipal, got nowhere, went to
the superintendent's office andthe superintendent she says oh
yeah, I know all about this.
And I'm like how could you knowall about this?

(01:10:44):
It just happened yesterday.
She goes wow, his grandmotheris my secretary, so I already
know all about this.
Because the other kid didn'tget in trouble at all.
That kid's name was TylerAllard.
So in my Ice House Canyon story, the little bully who gets

(01:11:06):
punked and becomes a littlebitch, I named him Tyler Allard.

Speaker 1 (01:11:14):
Sweet revenge.

Speaker 3 (01:11:16):
Exactly, that's cool.

Speaker 1 (01:11:21):
So then, how does the Goat man thing do they find him
and realize it's just like aweird mutated man.
Was it a monster?

Speaker 3 (01:11:29):
It turns out that Johnny Pinsinger the reason why
his family moved there, wasbecause that was actually where
they were from and his wholefamily, like his mom and his
uncle, the Goat man.
They all transformed into goatsand he extended his own feet

(01:11:52):
that had also changed intohooves.
Okay, okay, yeah, so the Goatman wasn't bad.
He had just seen what washappening with that Tyler kid
and he paid a little visit overto Tyler's house and they
decided after that, tyler andhis father decided they didn't

(01:12:16):
want any trouble with thePinsingers.

Speaker 1 (01:12:19):
Yeah, I would think so.
Yeah, giant Goat man thing camein and you're like oh, and if
they were simple Christians?
You would be like say please,there say.
That's cool, though I like thestories.

Speaker 3 (01:12:37):
I will think just real quick, a farm story.
I saw something incredible.
It was about two weeks ago onmy farm.
I should take in a video, but Iwas so stunned at what I was
witnessing that I didn't.
But I did take a couple ofstill photos once she

(01:12:57):
accomplished her task.
But I feel like I'm Jane Goodallwith goats, because one of my
baby goats, matilda and she ispretty smart Like she learned
her name within like a day, thewhole thing.
She's a pretty sharp goat.
I had no idea she was thissmart, though.

(01:13:19):
She was standing there and shewas looking up at the fence at
some vines that were growing onthe top of the fence, but since
she's a baby, she can't reach itright.
So she looked over and therewas a rubber made tub that I had
out in the yard to kick out intheir yard to catch rainwater
for them.
She went over, she pushed ittowards the fence up, ended it

(01:13:46):
so that it went upside down, andthen hopped on top of the
turned over rubber made tub soshe could get up and eat the
leaves.
Yes, amazing, I could notbelieve it.
She's a genius.
I think she's probably alreadystudying calculus at this point.

Speaker 1 (01:14:05):
Honestly, this is the one thing I tell people.
I said who's to say animals areas, not as smart as us.
The only difference between usand animals is how we
communicate.
What if we don't even know that?

Speaker 3 (01:14:22):
We don't even know that.
I tell Keith, people talk abouthow stupid animals are, but
they can understand what we'resaying and we don't understand a
thing that they're saying.

Speaker 1 (01:14:33):
Well, like these fish , they're super smart.
I also figured out some of themare carnivorous, so when a fish
dies, there's suddenly amissing body.
But that's a different story.
I didn't do my homework on that, but literally they know, they
learn that.
I got them when I was stillworking night shift, so they
learned when the light turns onfood time, but also when I sit

(01:14:55):
here I talk to them.
There's a lot more of them.
They would start schoolingwhere that blue thing is.

Speaker 3 (01:15:01):
Really.

Speaker 1 (01:15:02):
When I talk to them, but then they would go back to
normal and just be over here.
It was the weirdest thing andthat's where I was like, oh my
gosh, that's like I'm talking tothem, they know.

Speaker 3 (01:15:17):
Yeah, well, matilda's dad, his name's Hercules.
I'll let him free range in thein the actual my yard to eat
down weeds and stuff like that.
And it's a good thing that hedoes not have opposable thumbs,

(01:15:41):
because he tries he would havethought so much.
Well, he tries to get in thehouse.
He understands I have watchedhim.
He understands that the screendoor is manipulated by the
handle and he'll come up andhe'll be like he'll put his

(01:16:03):
front hooves on the door and bebiting the handle, trying to
pull on it to open it.
If he ever figures out that hejust needs to put his hooves on
the wall of the house and thenpull with his mouth on the
handle, he could very well startletting himself in.

Speaker 1 (01:16:20):
You're just going to come home one day and Hercules
is going to be on the couchgoing like hey lady.

Speaker 3 (01:16:25):
Exactly yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:16:27):
Yeah, I mean, I got myself a brusky, it's OK yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:16:32):
The dogs they're being pretty well behaved and
dinners on the stove, yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:16:41):
The real life goat man.
He just said, hey, yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:16:45):
That's cool.

Speaker 1 (01:16:48):
I mean honestly, though, it's just a curious
little goat.
Well, big goat he's good,they're Nigerian dwarfs, so they
aren't very good, ok, but Imean like years ago before COVID
, my sister bought chickens.
She got on a whole chicken coopthing.
She bought them and she tendedthem for about three weeks and

(01:17:10):
then totally abandoned herchickens and I inherited them.
But the one thing is two ofthem died from egg impaction.
I didn't know that was a thing.

Speaker 3 (01:17:19):
No, it's real.

Speaker 1 (01:17:21):
Yeah, I guess it's a really excruciating death for
them too.
So those two died and theynever really liked me.
There was this little brownoddball and so, like the little
brown ball was the one I wasleft and it's still when I was
working night shift.
So I would go out and I'dliterally just open the gate and
let her roam the yard becausewe have a lot of bugs and a lot
of grass.
So she'd go out and clean upour bugs.

(01:17:42):
And there was one day I wasreally depressed for some reason
I was probably just gettingenough sunlight or whatever.
She hopped on my lap, looked atme, pecked my cheek, but didn't
hurt me a few times, and thenjust snuggled with me.
How did she know that I neededthat?
Unless she was smarter than wethought?

Speaker 3 (01:18:03):
Yeah, they are smart.
I think it just makes peoplefeel bad to think that we eat
things that are really smart.
And as much as I love mychickens, I also love to eat
chicken, so it just kind of getsnobody we know, so it's okay.

Speaker 1 (01:18:22):
But also it's like our body does need animal
protein, and as much as people.
Oh, you can make it with soy.
I've seen more damage with soy.
Well, okay, yeah, the wholeargument of veganism is actually
killing the world more thancows.
But essentially I told them I'mlike the one person at work was
like oh, soy is great for you.
I'm like have you heard of menactually getting breast cancer

(01:18:44):
because of eating so much soy?
Uh huh, he's like no, that'snot real.
Like, oh, it's totally a thingit produces estrogen, doesn't it
?

Speaker 3 (01:18:52):
Doesn't it cause their bodies?

Speaker 1 (01:18:54):
Yeah, yeah, it produces more estrogen than even
a woman can produce.
So and that's where I'm sittinghere telling him like dude, you
want to get bitch tits andbreast cancer at like 35?
Go for it.
Kind of thing.
Oh, that's all you're going toget.

(01:19:18):
Because he's like, oh, I'm doingit to save animal lives.
So I was like, okay, is thatyou an argument I have I don't
usually use it often becauseyou're trying to save one life
right?
And he's like, yes, I said,okay, what about those farmers
in South America who torched therainforest?
Let's just talk about thethousand, not talk about the
thousands of rare indigenousspecies that might be exclusive

(01:19:40):
to that one tree that he justcut down for your soy.
Let's skip those thousands.
What about the tens of, evenhundreds of thousands of insects
that they use pesticides tocommit genocide in the area, on
top of any foxes, turtles, birdsthat they have to shoot?
I said we're talking in thehundreds of thousands of dollars

(01:20:04):
per crop, no, hundreds ofthousands of lives per crop.
But that's not one cow.
And I said that one cow maybein his lifetime will kill I'm
being really conservative like500 flies in his lifetime
compared to hundreds ofthousands of indigenous species,

(01:20:25):
turtles, this and that.
Oh, but it's one life kind ofthing.
It's like that's just crops.
It's not actually real.
And I said here's my otherargument what if plants like our
talk?
What if plants are talking tous?
But we're too stupid to hearhim.
What if the cracking of thebranches, actually the tree,

(01:20:47):
screaming and agony, and that'sthe one time we can actually
hear it.

Speaker 3 (01:20:51):
I like that.

Speaker 1 (01:20:53):
So then you are taking life.

Speaker 3 (01:20:56):
I may have to use that in a story, just so you
know, josh.

Speaker 1 (01:20:59):
Go for it.
Because I told him.
I said there's where I'm at,there's 150 year old fig tree.
And when I was working nightshift I had to go sit in that
tree during the night.
I felt like a old whisperingwillow, like in Lord of the
Rings, was talking to me.
Could be hallucinating, couldbe whatever, but it felt like it

(01:21:23):
was coming from the ground,though what I don't, I don't
well, I would just.
It pretty much said to me it'slike why are you so sad?
You are a heavy burden on me.
And I said, oh, I'm just sadbecause life, like I'm doing the
same thing over and over again.
And the tree was just like butthat's life, I do the same thing

(01:21:47):
over and over again, kind ofthing.
That is the cycle it is normalfor for this, this planet, kind
of thing.

Speaker 3 (01:21:59):
That's really cool.

Speaker 1 (01:22:01):
Right, I was just one of those.
That's right.
I always do the argument oflike frequencies.
I must have got down to acertain frequency.
I could hear it.

Speaker 3 (01:22:12):
Well, and I think we all were maybe not all, but
quite a few of us for whateverreason, we don't know why, but
we'll have a favorite tree, youknow, or you know maybe.
Well, I grew up in the countryand we had lots of trees and I,

(01:22:33):
you know, it's not that I hadanything against any of the
others, but my two favoritetrees were the hickory tree in
the front yard and the mulberrytree down on the side yard.
Not for like, rationally,there's probably not any reason
why I liked that one better.
But what if there is somethingabout the frequency?

(01:22:54):
And, to a certain degree,certain plants, excuse me, do
speak to you a certain way.
Why is it that some people likeparticular flowers more than
others?
There could be all kinds ofreasons.

Speaker 1 (01:23:17):
Again back to the.
We don't even fully understandour brain, so I'm really
expecting them to know.

Speaker 3 (01:23:22):
Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:23:25):
And that's, and that's kind of like the big.
Once I told them that I said ifwe ever put a body count on how
much life is taken, I promiseyou possible burgers and the
like, the fo meat stuff.
That would suddenly stop.
Yeah, because the wholeargument of veganism just blows
up right there.

Speaker 3 (01:23:42):
Well, and also you look at things like even the
microorganisms in the soil wherea cow is actually giving back
nutrients that they live on, andso if you stop raising cows,

(01:24:02):
how many of those microorganismsare going to lose their food
source?

Speaker 1 (01:24:07):
Which then affects the quality of the food, which
then affects us, kind of thing.

Speaker 3 (01:24:11):
Yep.

Speaker 1 (01:24:14):
Definitely so.
If you ever do one with a plantstory like that, I'd love to
hear about it.

Speaker 3 (01:24:22):
Okay, I mean I did write one that had to do with
plants and I'll send it to you.
It's called how Does yourGarden Grow?
Okay.

Speaker 1 (01:24:31):
Yeah, that sounds interesting, but I would love to
hear your take on like kind oflike what we just chatted about,
like making your short storiesto make people think That'd be
cool.
Okay, that'd be fun.
That would Well Let me see yourready, your brain just going
for it.

Speaker 3 (01:24:53):
I'm thinking, hmm, this will be fun.

Speaker 1 (01:24:58):
Will be.
Is your phone about to die?

Speaker 3 (01:25:01):
No, I was.
I just saw that it's almostseven o'clock here.
Oh, I wasn't sure how long youneeded to be talking.

Speaker 1 (01:25:14):
I'm here as long as you want to be here.
I'm here the way.
But yeah, I think that's a goodone.
I think we caused a lot ofchaos in the middle of people
listening to the stories, andthen we had a little philosophy
at the end.
I think it was a good one.

Speaker 3 (01:25:28):
I think so too.

Speaker 1 (01:25:31):
I appreciate it.

Speaker 3 (01:25:32):
We need to do this again.

Speaker 1 (01:25:34):
Absolutely.
You have my link, you canalways book.

Speaker 3 (01:25:39):
You can just tell me about your fishing trip, if
nothing else.

Speaker 1 (01:25:43):
Fishing trip okay.
Sounds good.

Speaker 3 (01:25:48):
It's always fun to talk with you it is, it is.

Speaker 1 (01:25:53):
Well, I'm going to.
Just if people made it to theend in our soliciting, where can
they get to you?

Speaker 3 (01:26:02):
They can find my books on Amazon and my name's
Caroline Giamanco I'm sureyou'll have that information
attached to the podcast on howto spell it.
On Facebook, I'm CarolineGiamanco author and my fan page
is Caroline Giamanco author fans.

(01:26:24):
On Twitter, I'm at Giamancobook.

Speaker 1 (01:26:30):
Giamanco book.
Okay, Cool, cool.
Well, absolute honor and apleasure.
Like always, we could sinkthree hours in this conversation
, and only just.
We don't have enough liquiddebt for that kind of thing.

Speaker 3 (01:26:44):
This is true.
I think I'm losing my voice alittle bit, so I apologize for
coughing earlier.

Speaker 1 (01:26:49):
It's okay.