All In or Get Out: Troy Allen from Rise Brands on Reputation, Reinvention & What's Next

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Let’s just call it like it is—Troy Allen has a reputation. Some people call him a visionary. Others? An a**hole.

On this week’s episode, I sit down with the man behind Pins, 16-Bit, and some of the biggest nightlife and entertainment concepts in Columbus and beyond. Troy’s been building incredible brands people actually feel for decades—and he’s not afraid to ruffle feathers along the way.

We talk about the highs, the hits, and the hard truths that come with being known as a controversial leader. From losing his marriage and shutting down concepts, to reinventing brands and confronting depression head-on, Troy opens up about his reputation, how he’s evolved, and what he’s learned from both failure and success.

And for everyone asking—yes, we get into the future of The Bogey project. But I'm not spilling the tea here—you'll have to tune in for that 😉.

This conversation is raw, real, and full of the kind of unfiltered honesty you don’t get from most business leaders. Whether you think Troy’s misunderstood or just brutally direct, you’ll hear a side of him you’ve never seen before.

Because at the end of the day, building big shit isn’t about playing nice—it’s about being all in or getting out.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:03):
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How do you feel about ourbranding?

(01:59):
Being the brand snob that youare, give me some advice on how
we should up our branding game.

Speaker 2 (02:07):
And how, so though I don't know.
Are you talking name In?

Speaker 1 (02:10):
general, like when you you know a brand is a vibe,
so what's your?

Speaker 2 (02:15):
No, I mean you guys.
So I've been trying to figureout what your end goal with all
this is for a while now.
Yes, because it has evolved youand everybody else no, but it
has evolved and and and I, likethe, the production level has
gone up, like the.
You know, I go back and I lookat some of the early stuff and
now you guys are doing a lot oflittle promo things and and and.

(02:35):
So now I, I, the brand is you,um, the.
I think you guys do a good jobwith it.

Speaker 1 (02:43):
Yeah, but keep cause, because we're.
This is a big conversationright now about, you know, I
leave SOS, sell my interest andI, before I left SOS, I started
the show.
So I think that was kind oflike the subconscious, like me,
kind of moving away and likejust doing something fun to
figure it out Right.
And to the outside person it'slike what is she into?

(03:08):
Like she's talking aboutsurrogacy, she's talking about,
you know, business.
We got hip-hop artists on.
So like what is that what yourperception is?

Speaker 2 (03:21):
It's eclectic.

Speaker 1 (03:22):
Yeah, but I like that .

Speaker 2 (03:23):
I think if you focus on one topic all the time, uh, I
think things can get stale overtime and I think you also don't
know what a guest is going tobring coming into it.
So I think the, the morevariety that you have and I mean
the energy is always great, butmy here's.
My question, though, is is whydid you want to do the first one
, like what, what made you do it?
And and and?

(03:43):
How'd you get to the guest ofthe first one?

Speaker 1 (03:48):
So why did I do it?
I always, I've alwaysinterviewed people in my head
and I've always listened toHoward Stern Like I just love
the art of what he does and Ilove I have a genuine curiosity
about human beings and I think,along with that, I was just.
I wanted to have fun justsitting with someone like I.
So with SOS, I loved it.

(04:08):
It was such a great climb.
It was a decade of just likecommunity and like grit, and we
did a lot of things right, did alot of things wrong, but I
always felt like very caged in.
I always felt like when peoplewould come in, I'd be like, but
I won't, I don't want to talk toyou about a burpee I don't want

(04:30):
to talk to you about.
I want to talk to you about somany other things and I always
felt like, well, they just seeme as like this fitness person
and that I did love.
I love fitness, but I always Ifelt like I was already
outgrowing that part of it along time ago.
Okay, all right.
So my genuine curiosity is justwanting to sit down with people
and that's that's probably whyI did the Keri Cross show a

(04:51):
great way to create awareness,kind of figure out what I want
to do and just be me and justlike this is all the stuff I'm
into.

Speaker 2 (04:59):
So would you consider yourself a creative?

Speaker 1 (05:01):
Oh yeah.
But, I'm also.
I'm like the hybrid.
I'm a creative, but I'm alsolike an operational person to an
extent.
So I definitely um, I mergedthose worlds for sure.

Speaker 2 (05:13):
I get that 1000% I so I've always been on the
creative side, but I'm one ofthe few creatives that
understand the business side aswell, which I never realized
that that wasn't really a thing,because, I mean, to me, people
are very divided when it comesto that.
On the creative side, I loveeverything about you know doing

(05:36):
stuff new or thinking what'snext, but a lot of times people
that think that way can'tunderstand the business side of
how to grow something.
And so, for me, it's this, it'sthis balance where, if I don't
have both like I don't know if Ijust have one or the other if
it would be enough yeah, I haveto have both.

Speaker 1 (05:52):
Yeah, because I I geek out on things like I geek
out on certain numbers, certainlike wanting, like analytics,
figuring things out, solvingproblems like the, the couple
that like I'm doing, basicallylike the modern day business
consulting stuff with the b lab,okay, um, so we have like six
prototypes that we, like thebeginner blocked brand gap,

(06:13):
brave shift build out, um, andyou know, we have a clarity quiz
.
You can go in, you can.
It's all very new.
This is we're not even like,our website isn't even done yet.
So those are the beat, thoseare the prototypes.
Like, if you go do the clarityquiz, like, oh, troy, you're, uh
, you're blocked, and then we,we go through, we figure out,
and then there's a bottleneck isthe other one.

(06:34):
So there's a couple in thereand you know they're struggling
with basic business stuff.
You know, first of all,financials are the lifeblood of
your business.
If your financials aren'tworking, nothing's working.
So you got to like, you got totriage that.
But then when you have no brandclarity, your user experience
is a two out of 10.

(06:55):
Right, but see, I love, I lovethe operational part of like
trying to help them Rubik's cubethrough that.
But then I also love the design.
I'm a design snob abouteverything which gets me in a
real problem.

Speaker 2 (07:10):
So you're doing the consulting stuff too, then as
well.

Speaker 1 (07:12):
So what happened was when I was doing the show I
didn't want to do anything.
I'm like what do I do?
Go do like another fitnessplace, that's basic.
Like I'm going to go competewith Gretchen and like be no, I
don't want to do that.
If I did another fitness thing,it would be like later and it
would be something that I,that's not in the city, that is

(07:34):
evolved.
You know, there's so much to bedesired here.
But I guess I had a momentwhere I was like well, what do I
do?
Well, and what did I do for SOS?
Like, basically, I met Gretchenshe was, you know, had a couple
of clients, couldn't figure outhow to like communicate it Like
it was.
I'm like, hey, I'll, I'llexchange you, like I'll give you
business advice for a freetrain, you know.

(07:56):
So I basically like was takingthe Christmas lights, you know,
and I'm like that's what I'mgood, like that's what I want to
do, is like that Right.
And so that's kind of what I'mdoing now with the B lab.
I got very exciting Enough aboutme.
Troy Allen, welcome to the KeriCroft show.
Thank you, glad to be here.

Speaker 2 (08:11):
It's great to have you.
Yeah, sorry, I canceled oncealready.

Speaker 1 (08:15):
That's okay, I'm analyzing you.
I am very impressed with youroutfit.
It's pretty basic but it's very, it's basic and it's almost
like it's urban cool, it'sworking for you and you're
taller than what I thought.

Speaker 2 (08:28):
Yeah, I think I'm shrinking as I get older.

Speaker 1 (08:30):
How tall are you?

Speaker 2 (08:31):
I would say I used to be 6'1" but I'm probably 6' now
.

Speaker 1 (08:34):
Oh, come on, You're not like an old man.
You don't shrink until you'relike what 60?
.

Speaker 2 (08:39):
Well, I'm pushing it.
I mean I'm 53.
You live clean.
Well, that depends on whatclean is.
Do you work out?
I do a lot more now.
I would say the last year I'vestarted to refocus on that a lot
more where I think, as I wasgrowing my business, I kind of
let all that get away from mefor a while.
So, yes, I do work out prettymuch every morning.

(09:02):
You look pretty tight, yeah.

Speaker 1 (09:03):
You look pretty tight , yeah, you look pretty fit.
What are you doing right now?

Speaker 2 (09:07):
Well, that's funny, because if you would have seen
me a year ago so people haven'tseen me in some time like I get
that all the time now I wouldsay At my heaviest I was
probably 305.
Stop it, yeah.
And so right now I'm 210.
And that's probably over thelast year and a half two years.

Speaker 1 (09:30):
You doing a lot of weights.

Speaker 2 (09:31):
I do a lot of free weights.
Yeah, I do a lot of freeweights.

Speaker 1 (09:33):
Isn't it funny how a lot of successful people will go
balls to the wall with thebusiness side making money.
They get so obsessed and theycompletely leave the most
precious valuable parts of lifeto the wolves.

Speaker 2 (09:46):
I'm all in or all out on everything.

Speaker 1 (09:49):
You're an extremist.
Yes.

Speaker 2 (09:50):
And so if I'm in on something, I obsess about it and
I don't stop, but if I'm on thefence, I just I can't.
I have to be all in or all out,and so, yeah, as you look at
the journey of my career, mylife and kind of where, I am now
.

Speaker 1 (10:08):
I'm trying to figure out if I want to be all in or
all out.
Still Are we all trying tofigure that out?

Speaker 2 (10:10):
Yeah, I mean my whole goal in life, I think, for the
last 20 years, was always justto replace myself.

Speaker 1 (10:14):
Yeah Right, you haven't done that yet I'm
getting close.
Yeah, I'm getting close, let'stalk about the bogey first, oh,
you say that is like, oh, so, ok, so was that something like for
years you'd like look at thatand go, man, that's, that's got
to be like a cash cow, or Iwould love to like.
I used to always in my mindthink I always want to know how

(10:35):
much money they made during thememorial and then how much they
made otherwise.
And then when they close it, Iwas like what the hell?
It's the bogey, it's a staple.
And then you swoop in Like howdid all that happen?

Speaker 2 (10:46):
So, first off, I never wanted to be a bar or
restaurant owner.
I know.

Speaker 1 (10:50):
I heard that on Conquering Columbus.
I was like, well, sorry aboutit.

Speaker 2 (10:54):
Yeah, so no.
So with the bogey I live upthat way.
I live in Dublin, I mean I goto the tournament every year and
I know the bogey for the last20 years, as it changed
ownership and kind of keptstruggling there for a while and
was open and closed.
I was asked several times for alot of years to do something
with it or come in, and myanswer was always hell, no,

(11:15):
absolutely not, I don't want todo it.
And we have been developing agolf concept now for the last
five years and that with acombination of another concept
we were working on and then thebogey opportunity came up and so
for me it was.
It was kind of merging twothings and doing it under the
bogey brand.
Everything we do is isnostalgia driven and when you

(11:36):
think of, you know the historyand the nostalgia behind the
bogey and and for.
So for me to to be able tobring that back and do something
better and kind of reinvent itwas it gets me excited because
we really excited.
That site is a bit of a problem, which is why it hasn't been
built on it for so long and it'sbeen a struggle to kind of

(11:59):
redevelop up there.

Speaker 1 (12:00):
Why is it a problem?

Speaker 2 (12:01):
Well, the you have multiple municipalities, so, uh,
you have Shawnee Hills, youhave Dublin, you have Delaware
County, uh, when it comes to theutilities, and then you have
the city of Columbus, when itcomes to the roads, and so that
our plot of land, where we were,we were doing the project, it's

(12:22):
actually on Shawnee Hills inDublin, um, but so instead of us
going, you know, like, when webuild in the project, it's
actually on Shawnee Hills inDublin.
So, instead of us going, youknow, like, when we build in
Bridge Park, that's all Dublin,or we build in another market,
you're working with onemunicipality and you're working
together.
This one, it's four, and sotrying to get everyone to agree
on stuff or come together, orone wants this, the other one
wants that, and it's like, okay,then who's going to pay for it?

(12:43):
Uh, so that has not been aneasy project, of course, and so
so, yeah, the I'm so excitedabout that project.
Uh, I don't know if it's goingto happen or not.
To be honest, oh, you don't, no,and that's the thing is because
I I get this question all thetime and this will be the first
time I'm actually talking aboutit um, the, so we're close.
uh, it's just the math doesn'twork anymore.

(13:04):
Uh, for what we have to putinto it and what the original
budget was everything that wehave to do.
We always look at our projectsas a certain amount of your
payback that we're going to get,and right now this is double
what is in our normal pro forma,and so it doesn't paper anymore
.

Speaker 1 (13:20):
The math ain't mathin' no it's not.

Speaker 2 (13:23):
I still believe in the concept, I believe in the
bogey.
We'll see if it happens thereand if it happens under that
brand.
Uh, but it's, it's not a, it'snot an idea and something we've
been working on for so long thatI'm gonna, I'm gonna let die
damn.

Speaker 1 (13:36):
Yeah, what's the golf concept?

Speaker 2 (13:38):
you're working on.
Well, that's what evolved intothe bogey worked on several
different entertainment concepts.
The golf one, I mean, when westarted out you had the puttery,
putt shack, golf-centric, topgolf.
All kind of come into theentertainment space and they all
blew up really quick For us.

(13:58):
Pop stroke is Tiger Woods'concept.
It's a big putty one.
No one's gone up against themyet.
And again, I think in thatrealm the top golfs and the pop
strokes are very tech-driven,and so I feel like they've lost
personality and they lost thegame and the nostalgia behind it
, and so, with what we do, wereally focus in on that, and so

(14:22):
our concept was more about thepersonality.
It was more about leading in tocountry clubs while poking fun
at them and being more analogthan tech, and so it was kind of
it's taking everything back tohow it was, and that's just how
it is how we do things.
Everything comes back around.
I just don't always think ithas to be tech driven.

Speaker 1 (14:42):
Do you see the landline thing that's coming out
?

Speaker 2 (14:44):
The landline thing For kids.

Speaker 1 (14:47):
Yeah, I want to know who.
I haven't had a chance to likeperv into like who did it, but
probably some geek in basementsomewhere, but it's called like
the landline.

Speaker 2 (14:55):
Okay.

Speaker 1 (14:55):
And it's a it's a landline phone that they're like
connecting so kids can talk.

Speaker 2 (15:00):
Oh, really Mm-hmm.
Is it just going to connectthrough the?

Speaker 1 (15:02):
internet.
I don't I mean probably Huh,but it's going to be.
Yeah, it's kind of like an oldbringing back the old school.
You'd probably be interested init Again, everything in the
background, because it's goingto be hot this.
It's going to be hot thisholiday for sure.
How would you describe yourchildhood?
In like a sentence.

Speaker 2 (15:27):
You said growing up?
Well, right, Um, I was, uh, Iwas a coach's son and so, um,
you know, everyone loved my dadand my dad was amazing, but he
was really hard on me and so Ialways just saw my dad as the
coach and and so you know, wedidn't come from much very blue
collar family, Uh, but I wouldsay I had a lot of expectations
of kind of doing more orexpectations when it came to

(15:50):
sports, and I think sports hadburned me out early.
Were you a good athlete I wasand that was the weirdest thing,
especially through junior highand high school, is because I
was an athlete, but I was alsothe kid who could draw and be
creative, and so I had thiscrossover of like two groups

(16:11):
that normally wouldn't cometogether and be friends, but I
was.
I was kind of friends with bothand so it allowed me to kind of
see both worlds what'd you play?
Uh, I played.
Baseball was my number onesport and and then football and
basketball.

Speaker 1 (16:22):
What did you like to draw?

Speaker 2 (16:24):
Back then I used to do a lot of portraits and it's
funny because this actually cameup a couple weeks ago.
You can do really detailedrealistic portraits and
paintings, and the last timethat I drew has been years I
mean, we're talking probably 15,20 years and I'm almost scared

(16:46):
to try because I feel like Iwouldn't be able to do it
anymore and so it's like one ofthose things.
But yeah, I used to draw allthe time.

Speaker 1 (16:51):
See, I'm surprised that you haven't had like a
creative pull to want to get acanvas or something and just
draw or piece of paper orsomething.

Speaker 2 (16:58):
It's different now.
I mean so like when now, likewhen I'm concepting or thinking
of new things.
It's just, it's also computernow and and it just I get more
into that design mode where youknow, and I can imagine that's a
grind of an industry.

Speaker 1 (17:24):
I mean clearly there's pros and cons to
everything.
I mean alcohol margins have tobe pretty healthy.
What is it?

Speaker 2 (17:31):
70%, 80%, something like that yeah, between 70 and
80.

Speaker 1 (17:35):
What was this last year?
Like I know, you closed 16-bitdowntown.
That had to be hard right.

Speaker 2 (17:41):
It was, that was the first concept that we did as
rice brands.
How?

Speaker 1 (17:45):
long until?
Like how long were you guysflailing there?
Or what?
Talk to me about the thoughtprocess.
When did you start to see it gosideways?
And what?
Give me a little back?

Speaker 2 (17:53):
well, story on that thing is that it was still a
profitable business.
Um, but the that area like justsouth forth I mean it's not what
it was eight years ago and withredevelopment that was
happening over there, we were ona month-to-month lease and a
lot of our other we had 16-bit.

(18:14):
We did pins and so as westarted to expand they started
to be side-by-side and then theystarted to kind of merge
together and so a lot of ourlike our Cincinnati location,
our Charlotte location weactually rolled 16-bit into our
Pins locations.
So it was like kind of oneexperience and we haven't done
that yet here in town we stillhave the freestanding 16-bit in

(18:35):
Columbus and we have one inIndianapolis.
It was just time it was.
You know, it wasn't making themoney that it used to, but for
me it wasn't making the moneythat it used to, but for me that
wasn't important.
It was such a community thingand it was such a it was infancy
of kind of what we did and whatgot us started, and so it was
tough.
It was tough to let that one go.

(18:55):
Yeah, I can imagine, A lottougher than I thought, but it
was just time.
That area is just strugglingright now and it does need
redeveloped.

Speaker 1 (19:05):
Do you make any money on the food?

Speaker 2 (19:07):
So we don't have food .

Speaker 1 (19:08):
You don't have any food, no snacks.
You have Mikey's, come in tolike.

Speaker 2 (19:11):
Yeah, so Mikey's is at our Easton location and at
our Dublin location.
They're going to be close to usin Dayton now as well.
We opened up there a few monthsago.

Speaker 1 (19:20):
I was going to say you have to have something for
somebody to eat.

Speaker 2 (19:23):
Well, no, but that's the thing.
That was one of the things thatwas kind of ingenious about
what we did.
So when you look at the margins, okay, most bars they have food
or they show sporting eventsbecause they want you to stay
there longer yeah.
Okay, and so you drink more.
And so when we provide theentertainment side of it, you
know our average guest will staytwo to two and a half hours.

(19:43):
I can calculate down to theminute like what it means to us
financially.
And so we don't need to do thefood because the margins aren't
as good.

Speaker 1 (19:53):
God, and it takes it yeah, it takes it all that, all
complexity out of there.

Speaker 2 (19:57):
And so for us, it was let's focus on this side of it,
provide a really goodexperience, keep people there
and allow people to bring foodin, you know?
I mean, that's why people canorder in.
That's why we, we support allthe bricks and mortar that's
around us.
Uh, if not, we'll do food truckprograms.
Um, for us it just wasn't partof the business side of it, so

(20:17):
we stayed away from it.

Speaker 1 (20:18):
You don't make money on the games, or do you make
money on the games?

Speaker 2 (20:21):
So we make money on on some of them.
So we charge for the duck pinbowling.
Um, we used to charge 50 centsfor pinball and all the video
games were free.
All the video games are stillfree, a lot of the activities
and stuff are free, but now wecharge, I think, a dollar for
pinball.
So we pinball we charge for andthe duck pin bowling we charge
for what are?

Speaker 1 (20:40):
what has been the?
Because you said somethingabout surviving and that, like
the last year, has been tough,right.
So what get like for somebodywho's out there and they're want
to open a bar or they're,they're in the throes of it and
they're like shit.

Speaker 2 (20:55):
This is hard, like what are you experiencing?
Yeah, I mean so the this is thefirst year and I forget how
many years now where, when youlook at alcohol consumption,
it's decreased and so it hasevery year.
It goes up, up, up, up.
This is the first year it'sreally decreased and people are
drinking less.
And so when you look at, youknow, low proof, no proof, thc

(21:16):
those are all categories nowthat are that are expanding, and
so it it's a little misleadingbecause people be like well, thc
or my low proof menu has grown20% over the last year.
Yeah, it's 20%, but it's alsomaybe 4% of your overall
business.
But that's where things aregoing, and so you have to have
those options.
Now the entire industry is, I'dsay, down 10% to 15%, okay, on

(21:41):
the hospitality side is, I'd say, down 10 to 15 percent.
Ok, on the hospitality side,we're, we're ahead of that.
I mean, we're down probably sixto eight percent, but it's
still when you look at year overyear numbers and you see that
it gets demoralizing, and sowe've, we've reforecast it and
and it's just, people aren'tgoing out as much, not drinking
as much as they used to, but,but again, it's for our business

(22:04):
, it's still drinking as much,um uh as they used to, but uh,
but again, it's for our business.
It's still a very profitable,successful business.

Speaker 1 (22:08):
Yeah, I mean, I think , as the world's on tilt people
are, you know there's a lot ofpeople are just out there
surviving, you know.
So maybe going to pins may notbe as easy as it was before.
I don't know.
I mean I feel like the world'sjust nuts.

Speaker 2 (22:22):
I think there's a lot of that.
But I also think that thepeople started demanding more
out of, you know, entertainmentand bars and restaurants.
When we first did it we came inearly before there was like
eat-ertainment as they call itnow, and so it was pretty easy
to kind of reinvent the spaceand find a niche and do things
that were more brand-ric.

(22:43):
You know, I mean we surroundpeople with our brand and
nothing else, you know, from themusic to everything else that
you hear and see.
We want it to be an experienceand we're very dialed in on that
.
It's just over time.
You know the people demand more.
So you look at in theentertainment space how many
more concepts are out there, howmuch even restaurants you go to

(23:06):
.
Now it's a different experience.
I just think there's more outthere for people and people got
so much more demanding on whatthey want on a night out or an
experience, and I think that'sall a good thing, but there's
just a lot more competition.

Speaker 1 (23:19):
What's your music philosophy?

Speaker 2 (23:22):
That's a huge debate within our stores.
Every market's different.
I always think the music has tobe a bit upbeat or more
nostalgic bass, where it's likeyou hear that song you haven't
heard for 10 years and you justwant to dance to it.
But again, it depends on themarket.
What we don't like is whenthings start to skew toward,

(23:44):
like our management teams ofthey have a personal taste and
they start to infuse that.
It still has to be on brand andit still has to be about the
people that are there and whatthey want to hear.
So I'm a rock guy and so for meit's you know, I love the Black
Keys, I love, you know, moremusic like that.

Speaker 1 (24:02):
That to me is more, it's wider I thought you're a
beastie boys guy too.
I'm beastie boys guy too.
What's your favorite beastieboy song?

Speaker 2 (24:08):
so what you, what you , what you want no oh, I love
that song so my mine wasprobably yeah, like the, the for
me that that's a hard, it's ahard hitter yeah, it was the
first time, like it's like rockand rap kind of came together,
yeah, and so, yeah, everymarket's different for us when
it comes to the music, and it'salways a debate within our

(24:30):
stores.

Speaker 1 (24:31):
Are you a ball buster ?
You feel like a ball buster tome.

Speaker 2 (24:35):
Yes, I am.

Speaker 1 (24:37):
So you said, like you gave me this softball, which I
would have asked you anyway,like you said, people would call
you an asshole.

Speaker 2 (24:42):
Oh without question.

Speaker 1 (24:43):
So, and this softball which I would have asked you
anyway, like you said, peoplewill call you an asshole.
Oh, without question.
So, and I looked up online.
There's a couple of things outthere like you know, a little
trolling.
I'm like damn, they're trolling, but we get that, people get
that right, especially whenyou're successful and you're
known like.
You get like this, the wayyou're perceived in the streets,
you know.
So why the asshole?
Like what is?
I think just from like, just soeveryone knows.
I've only known you now forwhat?

(25:05):
20 minutes in person, right?
Yes, the energy is very likestealthy, it was quiet, but I
just think your tolerance forbullshit is probably like really
small.

Speaker 2 (25:19):
It is.
I like to say I'm honest to afault, because I'll say
whatever's on my mind and a lotof times that gets me in trouble
.
I would also say that I'm veryhard charging.
I have very high standards andI don't lower them often, and so
I'm a tough person to work for.
I would also say that I'm avery different person to work

(25:41):
for now than I was 10 years ago.
I look back, you know, like howI would just bowl in a china
shop like come in and say thisis how we're going to do it,
this is how things are going tobe, and that's just how I would
run the business.
That's evolved and that'schanged Now.
Was I that person?

(26:01):
Yeah, without question.
Am I still that person?
Yeah, without question.
Am I still that person?
Yeah, without question.
I think I've just learned nowhow it affects other people and
and you know, you have to haveboth- so in the last 10 years,
what was a moment that you canremember?

Speaker 1 (26:16):
where you, that you were like okay, I just learned
from that.

Speaker 2 (26:19):
I mean shit.
I don't get surprised by much.
I really get surprised byanything, because I look at
every angle and I overanalyzeeverything.
For me it was two things atonce.
And then there was a third onethat humbled me.
So COVID happened.
Did not see that coming, didnot expect in three days to have

(26:40):
to close all of our businessesand lay everyone off.
In three days to have to closeall of our businesses and lay
everyone off During all that, Igot divorced and I didn't see
that coming either.
And so for me it was these twothings that were major things in
your life.
That and again, I'm a planner.
I plan for everything.
I can look back and I canunderstand both now, but at that

(27:02):
time it was a no-fuck momentfor me.
I didn't see this stuff comingand it was like move on,
continue being there for thefamily, the business, regrow the
business.
But then we had a conceptcalled Weenie Wonder.

Speaker 1 (27:18):
I love it.

Speaker 2 (27:20):
I still believe in the brand.
I believe in the concept.
We were horrible operatorsthat's why we don't do food, but
when I decided to close that,because we had two locations,
that's where Mikey's is now at.
Dublin and Easton, and then wehad a third one under
construction and we just weren'tdelivering the product that we

(27:41):
set out to do.
And so I'll never forget, whenwe closed it, I had an all
company meeting where I wouldshow, you know, our marketing
materials of like what thisChicago dog is supposed to look
like.
And then the day before I went,and I was the last person to
order at our Dublin location andI took a picture of what I was
served and it was two totallydifferent things and it was it's
like this is not who we are,like we're out here marketing

(28:03):
this.
We, you know, we have greatexperiences, we train.
You know, coming out of COVID,it was a tough time to employ
people.
I mean, we had people making$24 an hour, you know, working
on a, on a line and so, closingthat, I think it's the first
time that I developed somethingthat failed, like it failed and

(28:25):
and and that was tough.
And I think when I, when Iclosed that a lot of stuff that
I went through during COVID andmy divorce and I never dealt
with it all hit at once and Igot to a really dark spot, like
it's a really dark place, causeI felt like the biggest failure
in the world.
Those three major things allkind of happened at the same

(28:45):
time.

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So you didn't see the divorce.
Your wife one day was just likeI'm out yeah.

Speaker 2 (30:05):
So I look back and I get it now.
I totally see it now.
Um, the the way that I justwasn't present.
Um, I was growing the businessand so at the time, um, we were
building locations in nashvilleand charlotte and so, and they
had timing worked out where theywere overlapping, which is not
what we normally do.
So I was gone a lot and you andyou know I, I come home, you

(30:27):
know, on on the weekends and I'dbe so exhausted that I just
didn't want to do anything.
And you know my, my, my wife,you know she, she was with the
kids all week.
We had two young kids, and soat that moment she's like, all
right, let's go to this event orthis party or this and that.
And I was just like I just wantto lay down and do nothing.
And so I get it now.

(30:47):
Um, I just I wasn't there forher.
It's like I, I'm all in or allout.
I was all in on the business.
I thought everything I wasdoing was I'm supposed to
support the family, provide forthe family.
And yeah, in the end it was.
It was, I think, two daysbefore Christmas.
It was.
Yeah, I don't want to do thisanymore.
I'm out and I was like, Didn'tsee that one coming.

(31:08):
But I, I fully understand that.

Speaker 1 (31:10):
Are you single?

Speaker 2 (31:12):
After my divorce I did get into another
relationship for quite a while,but I'd say now for the last,
probably year, year and a half,you know I'll date- but, I
purposely try to spend time bymyself.

Speaker 1 (31:28):
Well, do you know that I also in my repertoire of
skills that I'm a low-keymatchmaker as well?

Speaker 2 (31:36):
Uh-oh yeah, good luck with this one.
I mean no, no, for me it'ssomething that just hasn't been
important, right?

Speaker 1 (31:51):
now.
Yeah, no, I think it's probablygood for you to spend time
alone.
Do you know?
There's a statistic, and likewhen I say this, don't you ever
wonder like who these people are?
People be like.
Well, statistics show that youknow 32.
I'm like people can just makethis shit up, but there is a
statistic out there currentlyfloating around that single
women live longer than marriedwomen and they're much happier

(32:16):
and, conversely, married menlive longer and are much happier
.

Speaker 2 (32:19):
Married men are much happier.
Yes, oh, wow.

Speaker 1 (32:20):
What do you think that says about the male species
versus the female species?

Speaker 2 (32:25):
Oh, I have so many things I want to say right now
that they're all inappropriate.

Speaker 1 (32:30):
That's what this show is about.
That's what this show is about.

Speaker 2 (32:33):
I would say that I think that shows that men are
more patient and will deal withmore.
Yeah Right.

Speaker 1 (32:43):
Men are weenie wonders yeah.

Speaker 2 (32:45):
Yeah, I can kind of see that.
And again I would say, eversince I was in high school, I
can't remember many times whereI wasn't in a relationship like
a long relationship, and so thislast year and a half has been
it again it's it.
I've worked on myself.
I've, you know, dealt with alot of stuff, but I yeah, I

(33:09):
think for the last year and ahalf I've just been undateable.

Speaker 1 (33:10):
Just for shits and giggles.

Speaker 2 (33:11):
What's your type?
Uh, I've just been undateable,Just for shits and giggles.
What's your type?
So tall women scare me sotypically.

Speaker 1 (33:23):
So me being 5'9", almost 5'10" and Kate being
5'10" does not bode well for us.

Speaker 2 (33:29):
That's the funny thing, though, is after my
divorce.
I was in a relationship forabout two years to someone who
was 5'10" and so typically it'sblonde hair, more petite,
athletic, not all the dolled upstuff.
I still like to be able to gohike and then go to dinner, so I
used to have a very specifictype, but that's changed over

(33:52):
the.

Speaker 1 (33:52):
Why do tall women scare you?

Speaker 2 (33:54):
Growing up, it was just something you, they just
like.
Growing up, it was justsomething.
I don't know what it was like.
Uh, it's.
That's the intimidation thingfor me, are you?

Speaker 1 (34:01):
intimidated by me at all, not even close, like when
you first met me downstairs.
You weren't like oh, she'sscary, she's no, no, I don't.

Speaker 2 (34:09):
I don't.
I don't get intimidated by manypeople um the, and I think a
lot of times, if I'll workmyself up on something, it's not
the other person it's me doingit.
But no, no, I, I, I've listenedto this enough and you've
interviewed enough people that Iknow that I, I knew it was
going to be good, I knew Iwasn't going to like attack you.

Speaker 1 (34:31):
So what kind of dad like are you?
Are you a hard charger dad tooLike?
You said that your dad like waskind of hard on you.
How has that transcended intoyou being a parent, and what are
you trying to really watch for?

Speaker 2 (34:46):
So I would say I'm probably three times worse than
my dad.
I'm, I'm tough, I'm, I'm tough.
You know, the, the, the, mykids always know where they
stand.
But it's, it's pretty black orwhite with me.
But you know, I also realizedearly on again, I think I've
evolved over the last five yearsbut I tried to coach my, my son

(35:09):
, in football and in basketballand I realized really quick that
I don't have the temperamentfor that, like I, I, I can't
like.
And I then I realized, like mydad growing up, how awesome he
was at it.
Uh, cause, there's just no wayI could do it.
Um, I think I lasted one seasonand I was like I'm never doing
this again.

Speaker 1 (35:29):
Do you get angry or?

Speaker 2 (35:30):
are you?

Speaker 1 (35:30):
like too stressed out , or what's your demeanor out
there?

Speaker 2 (35:34):
Angry is a good word To me, it's not a stress thing.
It's like I don't like to loseand I don't like when someone's
not prepared, and so if they'refailing, I feel like I'm failing
, and so, yeah, I motivatethrough fear sometimes and so,

(35:56):
yeah, I'm just not a good coach.
But, yes, I'm hard on my kids.
My son just he's first year atUniversity of Kentucky, which I
think is awesome because youknow he's been through a lot the
last five years.
You know the divorce andeverything else like that.
And so for him to go be on hisown now and have to figure it

(36:17):
out and uh, like I was reallylooking forward to him going
away and having to kind of dothis uh, they just kind of had a
more sheltered life than I didgrowing up.

Speaker 1 (36:28):
Well, yeah, yeah, of course.
One more thing about yourex-wife.
Yeah, are you guys good now,like now that you've reflected
and you're like, hey, I realizethat, like I see where you're
coming from, kind of thing,because not everybody gets there
with their exes.

Speaker 2 (36:41):
Yeah, I mean, I'm not fully there.
Yeah, I will also say thatwe're both very different people
now and we're not who.
We met each other 28 years agonow.
We met each other, yeah, 28years ago now.
Um, the and you know, she'svery different person than than

(37:02):
she was when we were married.
I'm a very different person, um, so I I guess she's the most
amazing mom in the world, like,she is absolutely amazing.
She's.
She's a great person.
She's just not the person Iknow anymore, and so it's it's.
It's tough for me to react tothat Like would I be friends
with her if I just knew her now?
Yeah, probably without question, but I have this long history

(37:24):
and you know the ups and thedowns of it.
But no, we still co-parentreally good.
I know how to push her buttons,she knows how to push my
buttons, and so you know we'llgo a long time without talking
and then, if I ever neededsomething, she'd be there in a
heartbeat.
If she ever needed something,I'd be there in a heartbeat, but
yeah yeah, different people now.

Speaker 1 (37:44):
So what do you do in terms of, like you said, you
spent some more time alone andyou've been like self-reflecting
what have you done, what kindof work on yourself and like
specifics.

Speaker 2 (37:56):
So I've every year, I will always do a trip on my own
, and so it's.
It's something that usuallyit's after, typically at the
beginning of the year, but I'llneed to go away and truly reset
and like plan the year to come,and so I've been, you know,
specific and of doing that everyyear.

(38:18):
And I think over the lastseveral years it it's not a once
a year thing anymore, like if I, if I find myself getting to a
low point or I find myself kindof losing my energy or kind of
my fire, um, I'll, I'll go away,and so I'll I'll.
I mean, I've gone to, uh,places like the ranch um, which
is a health and wellness placeyou can go to and you just eat

(38:40):
right for the week and work outand you do all this health and
spiritual stuff I've doneanother place called Pritikin
down in Miami.
Um, I either need to be out inthe woods in the middle of
nowhere, like by myself, tryingto survive, or I need to be in a
very structured program that ifI don't show up for a class or
I don't go to a workout or Idon't like I, I need to be very

(39:03):
regimented so when you saytrying to survive, you get like
a 10 out there and just likeplop yourself in the wilderness
and yeah, I wouldn't go that far.
I wish I could do that.
Um, I, I used to do that a lotmore than I do now.
Um, but but that's what I like,I, I, I like the isolation,
like, uh, you know, when I hearpeople, you know they they go do
the week with, like in dark andlike not talking, like I, I

(39:26):
live for that type of stuff.

Speaker 1 (39:27):
Like in the dark, though, you would do.

Speaker 2 (39:29):
Yeah, I would do that .
I would try anything once.
Um no, I like that type ofstuff.

Speaker 1 (39:36):
I'm into, like the trip alone.
I think that's a luxury thatmost people would love, right, I
think that's cool.
I think the dark thing I'd bebored.
I'd be like what the hell?
I talked to that guy that didit, that came to RTRX last year.
He was in the dark for, likeyou know, so we were all asking
him a bunch of questions and youknow.

Speaker 2 (39:53):
So we were all asking him a bunch of questions and,
you know, maybe after a day I'dbe like screw this, I'm not
doing it anymore, but I youdon't know until you try it.

Speaker 1 (39:58):
Yeah, that's true.

Speaker 2 (39:58):
Yeah, I just I think it's it to me, it's you're,
you're, you're trying to pushyour limits on something, and
it's not comfort, but it's, it'sknowing that you conquered it.

Speaker 1 (40:08):
Yeah, when you say you went into a really like dark
place before.
How long did that last?
And like would you say you werein a full fledged depression?
Did you have anxiety?

Speaker 2 (40:20):
I don't think I had anxiety, but you know for me to
say that, you know I was.
I had depression, I wasdepressed.
It's a tough one, but but yeah,no, I was I, I was, I was in a
very dark place.
I was in a very dark place.
I mean, there was there's onething about getting up and not
feeling motivated in the morning, but like getting up and I

(40:42):
didn't want to get out of bed.
Yeah, and I mean, I think therewas one period where probably
four days, like, I didn't leavemy house, you know, and I just
it just got to a really darkplace.
Now what I've realized is, youknow, one, I got help with that,
uh.
Two, I talked to people aboutit and and so you know, I'm

(41:03):
fortunate one to have reallygood friends and then to have
some networks that allow me tobe able to talk and share things
the top five percent or bottomfive percent of your life.
But the one, the one that Ididn't realize was because I
stepped away from the companyfor a little bit and then I came
back and I was honest witheverybody of why I left for a

(41:24):
few weeks and what I was goingthrough, and I think that helped
me more, just talking about itand being honest about it, than
anything I physically did oranything I worked on.
And what was crazy was theamount of people within the
company that that reached outand to for them to hear that
from me.
Uh, how important that was.

(41:45):
Um, because everyone struggles.

Speaker 1 (41:48):
I mean everyone does.

Speaker 2 (41:49):
I just don't think it's something that people talk
about.
I went away on a trip by myselfagain about three months ago
because I was just.
I was back there where I waslike kind of stuck again and so
it was time for me to reset.
So I reset a lot.

Speaker 1 (42:06):
I feel like it's just like the universe is designed
for us to get stuck and for usto unstuck, because I can
picture you here you are, youbuild all this great stuff and
then you lose your wife.
Covid is like this you know,extraordinary wild thing nobody
ever anticipated.
But like we beat ourselves upright, you're like well, I've, I
thought that's what I wassupposed to do, is work hard,
and I've, I've been sosuccessful over here and now

(42:28):
it's cost me this.
And like you want to redo ortwist or like it's, it's this
crazy.
Like trying to figure it allout.

Speaker 2 (42:36):
Yeah, I think for me, the toughest thing is and I
still can't, and I literallywork on this every day I can't
let things go and so where, if Ithink I failed as a dad or I
failed as a husband, um it it's.
It's not about okay the nextday and okay that's in the past.
Let's correct it.
Like I want to go back and fixeverything and so I can't let

(42:58):
stuff go and it's hard for me toforgive and so I get stuck in
this cycle of stuff that'sreally bothering me or I'm
beating myself up about.
It's a circle, like I keepdoing it.
I keep doing it.
I actually have a presentationtomorrow with EO, a
controversial organization, onthat topic, because I can't let

(43:21):
go and forgive.

Speaker 1 (43:23):
So you hold a grudge.

Speaker 2 (43:24):
Oh, yeah, yeah, I do.

Speaker 1 (43:27):
But see, the fact that you can acknowledge it is
huge, because I feel, like a lotof people I know that are big
grudge holders, like they can'teven really acknowledge it.

Speaker 2 (43:35):
Yeah, I think a lot of times it's because they don't
give the other person thesatisfaction, or the situation
the satisfaction, of admittingit's bothering them.
Now I hold a grudge like I,yeah, I, I wish I, I wish I
could let stuff go well, youknow the poison, the.

Speaker 1 (43:47):
The quote about the poison right, it's like drinking
poison and expecting the otherperson to die oh yeah because
but it, but it's, but it's sotrue Cause I that I that's what
I've always.
I don't know how I.
I kind of do know how I don'thold a grudge.
I've seen some you know prettygnarly things in terms of people
who know how to hold grudgesand um, what it does, and so

(44:09):
I've just been that way.
But I do believe in that.
Yeah, thoroughly like that it.
You hold those things insideand it manifests.

Speaker 2 (44:17):
I think I think the way I do it's even worse because
, like you wouldn't, a lot ofpeople would never think that
something still bothers me, or Ithink back ten years, or, but
it's all internal like it's notexternal.
For me it's like I don't showit, yeah, but man, yeah, I can't
let stuff go.

Speaker 1 (44:35):
Do you go to therapy regularly?

Speaker 2 (44:37):
No, so that's the other one that I probably should
uh do.
Um, you know, even like mydivorce, like I we never went to
therapy, like, uh, I think wewent two or three times when all
that happened.
Um, but no, there's.
There's a lot of shit that Ineed to work on.
That would probably be reallygood for me, but it's also.

(44:59):
I just haven't found the rightperson that I can talk to.

Speaker 1 (45:02):
It really is.
I think that's the I was luckyto find.
I have a woman that I go to.
I love her and I think sheprobably thinks I'm batshit
crazy.
Sometimes I'm like do you thinkI'm this?
What do you think about this?
And she's probably thinkinglike no one tries to
self-diagnose the way that youdo, but it's like, even if you
don't have like and you don'thave to go every week and we've

(45:24):
gone months and months without,but it's nice to just have this
person that has your history andlike can just give you.
She's given me so many toolsyeah, like weird tools that I
can think of mentally that I useto this day.
You know it's so.
It's just so helpful, but it ishard.
It's like dating, yeah.

Speaker 2 (45:43):
I mean, it's not that I haven't tried or I haven't
met with people, or I haven'ttried different things, just
nothing stuck for me yet.
Yeah no-transcript anymore andit allows you to see kind of a

(46:25):
bigger picture, but it got me toa point where I just didn't
care, like I didn't care aboutanything and and so that's when
I got to.
My really dark spot was, uh,was after all that and I talked
to Dave about it, yeah, but yeah, so that one wasn't for me.

Speaker 1 (46:40):
How many, how many did you do?

Speaker 2 (46:42):
I did the five sessions so the like it was five
weeks in a row, uh, they'relike one hour sessions, all
controlled and um, and thatexperience doing it is amazing.
It's especially after the firstone, because then you kind of
realize your journey and how youcan kind of control it and if

(47:03):
you do see like a dark spot, youkind of go to it instead of
away from it.
But yeah, it spiraled me.

Speaker 1 (47:11):
Interesting.

Speaker 2 (47:13):
But I still recommend it.
I mean, I think it was a goodexperience.

Speaker 1 (47:15):
Yeah.
So what's the future for PinsLike what are you seeing?
What's the like?
What's your?
Do you see yourself still doingthat in five years?
Like what's the plan?

Speaker 2 (47:24):
The way that we're set up with Rise is, you know,
we bring things to market, scalethem, show profitability, and
then we let them go.
Pins was ago, pims was gettingto that, that stage where, and
you know, earlier this year wewent through a sale process.
We started it last year and um,and so you know other business
owners will say, you know, goinggoing through a sale process or
anything like that, it's, it'sdraining.

(47:44):
I didn't realize how, howdraining it was, not just for me
but for my, my team as well, togo through that.
And then you go through it andyou know the number's not where
you want it, or the multiple'snot there, or your same store
sales are down.
And then again you feel like youwere solving to this thing and
it was all in the plan, and thenit didn't happen.

(48:06):
And so you know we pulled itand we said we're not going to
do this right now, and so again,it's one of those things where
it's like, did I just fail atsomething, you know.
And so again, it's one of thosethings where it's like, did I
just fail at something?
And so I concentrate on that, Iconcentrate on not getting that
done this year and I don'tconcentrate on.
We opened three new locationsin the last four months and we
did an amazing job and the teamdid a great job on that.
I just can't focus on the good,I just can't.

Speaker 1 (48:31):
Do you think it's because of how you grew up?

Speaker 2 (48:33):
Yeah, without question.
Again, I've always wanted more,I've always.

Speaker 1 (48:39):
I've just, it's just the way I've always been and but
yeah, I mean at some point it'slike one's enough enough well,
I was just gonna ask you, like,have you ever, have you ever
like sat with yourself in thesemoments of solitude to say, like
what is enough for me?
Like, as you're mapping out theyear and this is a question I'm
asking myself, so it's likewhat is enough?

Speaker 2 (48:59):
I would say it, as every day goes by, um it, it
gets less and less, because it's, uh, at some point, just the,
the, the peace and the just notthe total grind.
All the time, it just it wearson you.
And so, yeah, there was alwaysa number in my head and there's,
there's always a number in myhead, like for the business we

(49:20):
develop, because it's part ofthe plan, but I don't know if
that number is so importantanymore as it is.
You know the, you know the teamthat got us there, rewarding
them and them getting somethingout of it and and being able to
move on to what's next.

Speaker 1 (49:35):
Uh, so, how do you talk to yourself inside, are you
?
Are you pretty hard on yourself, like like, are you real
critical?

Speaker 2 (49:42):
of yourself.

Speaker 1 (49:43):
Yeah, again, I focus on what's wrong right, but like
so, have you ever tried?
Like, have you ever shiftedthat dialogue and tried it?

Speaker 2 (49:53):
I've I've tried so many things do?

Speaker 1 (49:56):
you didn't realize you're in a therapy session, did
you know the fuck?
Guess what?
I'm really cheap by the hour.
Um, I'm a bargain basementtherapist, but it's called
street therapy.

Speaker 2 (50:07):
But I'm telling you what troy nice, nice I'll turn
this ship right around, yeah no,no, I've tried tons of
different techniques.
I've tried a lot of differentthings.
I think I mean, yeah, justnothing is stuck.
I'm also impatient, though.

Speaker 1 (50:23):
Well, you know what I also think?
I think that at least what Isee, especially for you know
successful males, and not justmales.
But I think everyone's lookingfor like this big thing and I'm
not saying that like ketaminedoesn't work or I have no
experience with these thosethings to say yes or no.

(50:44):
I sometimes just think it's thetiny hinge that can swing the
door like the big door, and Ithink, like a smart guy like you
that would say, okay, you know,it's just like building any
kind of muscle.
It's like, well, how do I talkto myself?
That might sound silly, butlike just shifting, kind of like
, instead of like constantly,like fuck why, it's like damn, I

(51:07):
did that, or that's prettyfucking cool.
Or like trying to like justlittle shifts in the way you're.

Speaker 2 (51:15):
I think deep down it it's, it's not important to me.
So, like I try to do that, likeI'll try to.
This year, for example, if Ilook back, like what we've
accomplished this year, um, thata lot of great things.
I mean, you know, business wise, you know, but I'll, I'll and
I'll, I'll try to build myselfup and be like you know,

(51:36):
celebrate the wins, you know.
Uh, you look back and I canwrite on a list everything that
we've accomplished.
But those five things over onthe other side that we didn't or
didn't go right, they justalways take precedent.
For me, like they're.
To me they're more important.
I, I, I do just, it's just theway I'm wired and I guess that's
why I'm just so fucked up andI'm an angry person.

Speaker 1 (51:58):
Hey, back to you being an asshole Way to swing
that back around Troy.

Speaker 2 (52:10):
No, it's because you know.
So my friends that know me,like you, put me in any
situation and I'm fine and I canbe personable, but I generally
don't like people personable andbut I generally don't like
people, uh, and so I would muchrather be by myself or with a
small group, or then then, like,I don't like going to events
and I don't like that type ofstuff.

Speaker 1 (52:22):
so I can feel that, yeah, so what made you say yes
to this?

Speaker 2 (52:27):
I followed the show.
Uh, that I I'll always, I'malways up for a conversation,
and uh, you just, you alwaysseem positive and happy, and so
I just wanted to come in hereand piss you off and make you
angry, or something.
I think you're, I think you'regreat.
No, and I again I've.

(52:47):
I've purposely, this last yearand a half, continue to put
myself in situations that Inormally wouldn't do.
Cause it.
Yeah, it'd be easy for me tojust say, no, I'm not going to
do it yeah and you know, Icanceled once because my eye,
literally I broke a blood vesselin my eye.
It was solid, red and you know,and we rescheduled and I was

(53:08):
like god damn it.
Now I gotta build myself up todo this again.
So, uh, no, so I I even thoughit's not something I would
normally do or like to do Irealized that when I make myself
do it afterwards, it it makes,it gives me a different
perspective.

Speaker 1 (53:23):
Well, I hope it hasn't been that painful for you
.

Speaker 2 (53:25):
No, it's not.

Speaker 1 (53:27):
So what would you say to people who do say that those
things about you, or do youjust not even care?

Speaker 2 (53:31):
You know.
So I, I, I care, care.
I think there was a time when Ireally didn't, and I think it's
more.
I think I care more now becausethere was times when, yeah, I
was an asshole or I didn'tapproach things the right way,
or you know, and I still don'tLike I have no filter, like my

(53:52):
ex-wife or anybody who's everdated me will say my delivery is
awful.
But I also, I care more thanmost people do For me.
It's, it's more like I yeah if,if people feel that way about me
, fine, I'm fine with that.
You have every right to.
But get to know me as I'veevolved as a person.

(54:13):
You know and and frankly Ithink I owe it to them more than
anything.
Um the, and yeah, it's, it's.
It's easy to to blameeverything on, like the owner of
the company or this or that,but you know, I'd say 75% of I
probably earned.
I mean to be completely fuckinghonest, like it just is what it
is.

Speaker 1 (54:36):
Yeah, no, but you, you're, you're self-reflective,
you know, and I think too,people can like take a snapshot
in time of someone and then callthem something.
And, like you said, I'veevolved a lot since the asshole
days.
I'm still an asshole, but maybeI have a three on a scale of
you know, I just know, I am nowone just listen, I'm all about
accountability.
I love it.
Well, I've really enjoyed this.
I mean I, I give I give you agood solid 10 out of 10.

(54:57):
Anything else you want to spitout, make sure you get out
before we close the door.

Speaker 2 (55:04):
No, I can't believe you got me to talk about the
bogey though.
Really so I opened with that Iknow Again, I get a lot of
questions about that right now.
I know Again, I get a lot ofquestions about that right now.

Speaker 1 (55:15):
So maybe putting it out there, though, is like OK,
that would be such a great likehow to improve the atmosphere
there, like that's an incredibleopportunity for whatever these
four quadrants, shawnee Hills,dublin, whoever Like let's all

(55:36):
just figure out a way to play inthe sandbox and get this
incredible thing happening.
I think it's so neat I meanagain I who do I need to call?

Speaker 2 (55:42):
yeah, that's the first thing everyone says and
everyone's like well, I'm gonna,I'm gonna do this, I'm gonna do
that, and so that's the onething, and I think this is, like
also the important thing that'sallowed me to evolve and kind
of work on myself is I Isurround myself with really good
people, like my team and andwhat they do and how they've

(56:03):
allowed me to kind of step awayand concentrate on what I'm
really good at, like I love todevelop, I love to create, I
love what's new and I get soexcited about that.
I've realized over the yearsthat my CFO feels the same way
about money, and and so there'slike, because I'm really good at
you know these three things.
Uh, there's other people thatare the things that I'm not good

(56:24):
at they're just so passionateabout and they geek out at and I
think, the more that I pullmyself out of it or I step away.
Um, that's why we've been ableto grow the way we have and take
on things.
I have a really, really goodteam around us.

Speaker 1 (56:38):
That's awesome.
Well, I really appreciate youcoming and not canceling on me
again, and I really appreciateyou bringing gifts.
Where is that gift?
We should open it while I'm onhere.

Speaker 2 (56:47):
But yeah, so it's a lot of our swag and one of my
new favorite shirts.

Speaker 1 (56:55):
That's our Austin location generous that's a new
knit cap.

Speaker 2 (56:59):
I didn't realize we had those until we put in the
bag.
Yeah, okay.

Speaker 1 (57:04):
I love that, love the color.

Speaker 2 (57:05):
I'll be keeping that you know that that's my one menu
favorites, so that's from ourAustin location love it.
It's a big one, though I loveit.

Speaker 1 (57:14):
Well, lucky good thing I'm a big woman.

Speaker 2 (57:18):
Not big that way.

Speaker 1 (57:19):
Good thing I'm a big woman.

Speaker 2 (57:22):
So you gotta, oh, there you go.
So this was a.

Speaker 1 (57:25):
Is this a buckle?
I mean, you are really outdoingyourself here, are you kidding
me?
Oh my god, how cool is that.

Speaker 2 (57:34):
So that was kind of a joke.
That's so great I was like, I'mgoing to get these made and
I've never worn one yet.

Speaker 1 (57:40):
But oh my gosh, I love You're really raising the
bar here.

Speaker 2 (57:48):
And then I will say this is cool, that one got worn
on.
I think the I'll be wearingthat the Tonight Show or
something by someone, and then,yeah, we have the most
comfortable sweatshirts.
I love it.
Look at that well, thank you,troy see if I would have
canceled again, you would havegot twice as much damn you

(58:08):
couldn't cancel on me again andyou know, once you say yes to me
, though, I just keep followingyou like literally.

Speaker 1 (58:13):
And you know, once you say yes to me, though I just
keep following you Likeliterally.
I'll just keep following you,All right.
Thank you so much.

Speaker 2 (58:16):
Troy, you're welcome this has been a pleasure.

Speaker 1 (58:18):
And if you're still out there following your girl,
follow me on YouTube, spotify,apple or wherever you get your
podcasts.
And until next time, go to pinsand keep moving baby.