July 10, 2025 • 53 mins
Dead End takes you deep into the Lake District’s darkest secrets. When an old Earl is found hanged and two young women vanish after declaring their love, DI Kelly Porter is drawn into a tangled web of incest, betrayal, and sadistic violence.
Forensic expert Ted Wallis’s autopsy reveals murder, not suicide, while dive teams uncover hidden evidence beneath the lakes. Kelly, a fiercely independent and sharp-minded investigator, navigates family trauma, power struggles, and dangerous suspects.
With vivid flashbacks, haunting locations, and emotional confrontations, Dead End asks: in a place full of ghosts, maybe Kelly did belong here after all.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:22):
Good day and welcome to the Killer Storyteller podcast.
I'm Christy Horne, your Co host coming to you from a very chilly
and wintery Melbourne. Thanks so much for tuning in for
another killer episode and as always I'm joined by my UK mate,
crime queen and million copy selling author and all round
bloody legend Rachel Lynch. Good day, Rach.
(00:44):
Hiya, Christy. Oh, what an introduction.
I'm not sure I can live up to all of that.
Oh, massive hello to everybody listening in.
How is everybody? Great to have you all with us
again. So looking forward to this one.
And today we are talking about Dead end #3 in the Kelly Porter
series. Yes, we certainly are.
(01:05):
But before we crack this episodeopen, rage how you going and
what's been happening in your side of the world.
We are actually having a summer,Christie.
So it doesn't, yeah, it doesn't happen very often, but yeah,
it's been really hot. And do you know what goes with
summer? It's sport in in Britain and,
and I was lucky enough a couple of weeks ago to be at the, the
(01:27):
World Cup final of, of the cricket and, and you know, it
was South Africa against Aussie and and those, those baggy caps.
I mean, I just that they should have won, OK, just on the kit
because I just love the Aussie kit.
Not I was concentrating on the cricket obviously, but yeah,
(01:47):
that was amazing. I loved it at Lourdes.
It's such a great venue. I had a great day.
It's just lots of people, you know, just having picnics and
and chilling, a beautiful day. The sun was shining, cricket was
amazing. And South Africa have never won
before. So watching them, you know,
raise the trophy for the first time was really quite special,
even though it wasn't Australia,sorry.
Yeah, it was really special for South Africa and it was great to
(02:10):
see them win and good, you know,it's good for the Aussies as
well. I think they're in the West
Indies right now, so we follow the cricket here in Melbourne.
But it was lovely to see their rage.
But also Wimbledon is another one of my favourites and Tour de
France starts tonight. So I absolutely love the Tour de
France and watch it religiously.But you guys are having like
(02:32):
this massive European heat wave.We've been very jealous down
here in the southern hemisphere,but it's been quite cold.
Look, you don't get to be jealous, right?
With your weather, with your summers, you don't get to be
jealous. This is like crumbs, you know,
31° for a week is, is, is something and, and it, it makes
(02:55):
everyone smile. So, so Brits are known for being
totally miserable about the weather.
And we just sort of shuffle around most of the year moaning
about the weather, but then we get a week's heat wave and we
all turn into really happy people.
Isn't. That lovely.
Is it is it's lovely and and yeah, so I've been really
enjoying it. I'm a bit of a Sun Queen and I
like to, well, I know, but isn'tit amazing how you know how many
(03:18):
platforms we've been, we've beenon and, and just, we've blown
away by all the support and the comments and the really fun
engagement with so many people. Yeah, you have.
I've said this before and I'll say it again.
You have the absolutely loveliest followers and people
will support and read your books.
And one of one of the other things that's up and running is
(03:39):
our YouTube page. And now you can watch.
Hello. Hello.
And watch and enjoy all of our recordings.
But I have to warn you, there's no edits here, guys.
So if you see us make a mistake or actually you probably can
just see how much we're laughingand having a really good time.
So the the YouTube channel is called, obviously the Killer
(04:00):
Storyteller Podcast, and you canfind us on YouTube.
So yeah, it's been pretty good. And what about our playlist on
Spotify? I know, I know.
And we need to add to that, don't we?
We need to get some really groovy tunes in there for for
Kelly and Johnny to run up thoseHells too.
I. Know I've added a couple of
songs in there, but I need to add, we need to add some more.
(04:20):
We want your input too, guys. So if anyone has some awesome
songs that they want to add intothe Killer Storyteller playlist,
let us know because we'll add them in.
So every now and then there's a song that comes up in in some of
the books. So we're adding those in as
well. So yeah, please feel free to
suggest some songs to add into the playlist.
(04:41):
Alrighty Rach. Dead End is the title, but we're
just getting started. Sorry not sorry for the puns and
I'm not going to stop. I absolutely cannot help it.
So let's go. OK?
This episode we are discussing book #3 Three dead end
innocence, Lost secrets revealed.
(05:02):
And again, we need to say upfront that we are going to try
our best not to give away any spoilers if you haven't read the
book yet or if you're halfway through catching up.
We're not going to share any endings, but we are going to be
discussing the themes in the book and the storyline and
focusing on the things like, youknow, the setting and the
(05:23):
characters. So if you're reading along with
us, that's OK. We won't spoil anything for you,
we promise, but we'd also like to hear from you where you're up
to, which book you're on if you're just starting.
And we know that a lot of you are reading along and listening
to the podcast in order, which is just epic.
We're getting so much feedback, which is brilliant.
(05:44):
Now I every, every time we, me and Christy talk about a book,
we have a little intro on just like the the statistics.
So this one Dead End was writtenas part of the first three in
2018. It was published in 2018 as
well. That was a really busy year for
Kelly. All three came out in the same
(06:05):
year. It was written at home, probably
in my garden, in my kitchen, in my front room.
And it took a little bit longer this one, because I was getting
into the groove. It took about 3 months to write.
And for the first time, this book is about family drama and
the secrets and revenge that sort of unfold from that
(06:27):
tragedy. So I had a brilliant time
researching this and, and, and, and I set it in May.
So it's late spring, not as manytourists, not as hot, but the
the the researching, I think we're going to go into later,
aren't we, Christy? All right, Christy, over to you
to give your summary of dead endfrom your point of view, what
(06:49):
stood out? I'm really curious to to get
your take on this. What grabbed you?
What lingered? What gave you the chills?
OK, well, I loved how we did this last episode, Rach.
And so here goes again. It's 100 words.
It's summer in the lakes when anold Earl is found hanged.
He's safe dumped in the lake. Soon after, 2 girls vanish
(07:11):
following a secret midnight walkto to declare their love.
When a duffel bag resurfaces, linked to another missing girl,
dark secrets begin to rise. DI Kelly Porter investigates A
tangled web of incest, illegitimacy, and cruelty while
juggling family trauma and betrayal.
(07:32):
A detailed autopsy by Ted Wallace points to murder, not
suicide, and expert dive teams uncover clues beneath the
surface. Abandoned huts, buried
histories, and a final showdown on Place Fell pushed Kelly to
the edge. Fiercely independent, she
resists promotion, challenges tradition, and leads with heart
and steel. As she confronts the truth of
(07:54):
her past, she's left wondering maybe she did belong here after
all. What do you think?
No, that's just give me goosebumps.
Really. Did you like that?
Nick Yeah, epic. Now let's unpack some of the
storylines and the characters. OK, First off, the setting, that
mansion, I mean, was Dale Hall. It's spooky and it's decaying
(08:18):
and it just oozes tension. I could smell the mould coming
off the pages, right? It's dusty, the peeling
wallpaper, and I was actually getting full creeping mana
energy. It's almost like the house is a
character in itself. So tell me, why did you choose
Wasdell Hall? So I was looking for a, for a
name and, you know, in the Lake District, there's quite a lot of
(08:40):
these old halls kicking about because the whole, a lot of
Cumbria is owned by noble families.
And it's actually the Lauders, the family, the Lauders that
that own this sort of area. So I couldn't use their name,
even though we do know one of one of the, the members of the
(09:04):
family, because he actually wentto the Military Academy at
Sandhurst with, with my husband Mike.
So we've got his permission to use the, you know, the sort of
me alluding to that type of history in the story.
He was absolutely stoked and he and he asked his his uncle for
permission. We got it, but I needed to
(09:27):
change the name. So Wasdale just struck me
because it's one of my favouriteplaces.
Wasdale is actually up by Scarfell Pike and it just sort
of came together. But yeah, that that the whole
sort of mansion atmosphere, I loved creating that.
And, and it's, it's, it's the remoteness, isn't it?
And it's so isolated and eerie. It's quite sad as well, how it's
(09:50):
sort of decayed over the years. And, and like you say, this sort
of heavy stillness. And I thought, and This is why I
got excited about the story. There's something about the
setting of a grand aristocratic hall, you know, adding like an
extra character. And I've always loved that
thought of, of, you know, like you say, the peeling wallpaper
(10:13):
and, and that the forgotten horde corners hiding something.
And so, you know, it's a bit like finding something behind,
you know, a rock or under a lake.
That's the type of deal I was going for.
And it's kind of frozen in time,isn't it?
What did you make of the house? When I was reading the stories,
particularly the scenes that areset inside the house, I could
(10:36):
really feel that. And you've described some Kelly
goes in to sit down on a cushionand then all the dust comes up
and through the lights coming through the windows.
It had former glory with all with some of the the big events
that happened there. So I felt like you totally
nailed the description and I felt like it was just coming off
(10:56):
at me in in the book. So really, really great writing.
Amazing that. That's awesome.
Thanks, Christy. Speaking of the like the time
warp and the time warp with the house, you really played with
time in this book. Rage where where you're jumping
between past and present, back and forth.
What was behind that? It's, yeah, I think like, like
(11:20):
we were just talking about, you know, the former glory and this
retro glamour that clearly used to be holding the house up.
And so I really needed to pull that into the story.
So it came quite naturally with this one.
And I loved, I loved doing it. So it was really important to
get to know the Earl's history and and his wife, Delilah.
(11:41):
I just love that name. Don't know where that came from.
And, and so it enabled me to, toreally write about the romance
and the style of the 70s when they were in love and their love
story sort of, you know, 50 years ago, things like, you
know, her, her perfume and, and,and the fashion, you know, those
amazing balls that they used to throw.
(12:02):
So getting that in was really important to me because to, to
have a great fall, you need to know where they're coming from,
where they're falling from, right?
So I needed to write about that forgotten time of happiness.
What stood out for you in in those old retro scenes?
But her perfume and the the perfume that you've picked is
(12:23):
like absolutely perfect for thattime, like the romance of the
big events that they had there. And we're going to get to 1 of
my favourite scenes in a little while.
When you went back in time, gaveyou a greater understanding of
what's happening in the now, particularly with two of the
young boys that used to play together a lot and all some of
(12:43):
the other characters as well. They were great scenes to toggle
between the here and the now because it's like, aha, OK, that
totally makes sense. Really loved that.
Yeah. The context is really important,
isn't it? Yeah.
To to understand the tragedy. Yes, yes, absolutely.
The family story, their history is so tragic.
How did you factor that in? Yeah, it's as if they're all
(13:05):
cursed, isn't it? And that that generational
trauma is dumped, all building up from the 1970s, trauma after
trauma. And now it's dumped on poor 17
year old Zach. You know, it's like, it's like a
crumbling legacy. I love the way you describe
that. That is so perfect.
It is a crumbling legacy. Yeah, and the Earl is, is the
(13:26):
last Earl, isn't it? And because the only thing
that's left is illegitimacy. And so I, I love that part of
it. But you know, and it was only in
the writing of it that it struckme because of the ages of Ted
and the Earl, that they probablywould know each other because
this, this this old glamorous Cumbrian set, you know, would
(13:50):
have been quite small and it would have consisted of land
owners. It would have consisted of high
up coppers, town councillors andprobably a pathologist.
And professionals. Yeah, professionals and and rich
people, so the elite. So it wasn't too far a stretch
to have them knowing each other.And of course the the their
(14:11):
reunion is when and Ted is is autopsy in him.
So that was a real chilly connection as well.
Which brings us to the autopsy. The early scene is really
graphic, but it's also really fascinating as well.
And you've got all the scientific detail, rage, and
I've said it before, it never feels gratuitous.
How do you balance the goal withthe science?
(14:33):
And also, can we talk about Ted and how he came to his
conclusion like suffocation before hanging?
It was brilliant. Yeah.
And, and, and that, that to me, Christie is, is a real
compliment. You know, when you say it's not
gratuitous, it's, you know, I amdealing with gore and grew.
And so I have to and, and this this is something that that I
(14:54):
like to read as a reader is balancing the grew and the gore
comes through because of the goodness.
And so when you've got good people like Kelly, Johnny, Zach
Kelly's Team Ted, then the the the guru and the gore is feels
more chilling without being gratuitous, because then
(15:17):
hopefully fans, you know, like yourself and, and all the people
listening are actually going to get behind them.
And the guru and the Goran aren't just there to score
points and to show off. They're there to sort of balance
the goodness. And I just adore the research.
And yeah, I find it fascinating how you know what a pathologist
(15:40):
can discover. And it's all about, you know,
the, the marks on the neck, how,how they present the damage
inside and the weight ratios andall of that.
And so my research when I'm researching the, the autopsy
scenes is actually really scientific and it just sets my
brain alight. I love it.
(16:02):
And I love how he's so professional, isn't he?
He's all precision, no fluff, just gets on with it.
Kelly's there swearing, you know, and, and he, he knows that
Kelly swears a lot, but, you know, he sort of just ignores
it. And he's such an upstanding, you
know, guy who clearly, you know,rubbed shoulders, you know, with
people like the Earl. But he just gets on with his
job. And that twist just sort of
(16:25):
changes the whole tone of the case, doesn't it?
Comes early, too. So I really, really like that.
And I know you've said before, Ted deserves his own spinoff.
Yeah, I'd love to do that. I'd love to write a series on
just on a pathologist, whether it be Ted in the Lake District.
That would be awesome. Or or, you know, a new
character. But yeah, that is definitely on
my radar. I don't suffer from lack of
(16:47):
ideas, that's for sure. And then you've got all those
wilderness scenes and the wild landscapes.
It's so evocative. I had to Google Shingle Beach by
the way, but there's more on that later.
That's just hysterical. I mean, yeah, everything's
smaller here. So, you know, all, all of our,
all of our little beaches are ground down to this little dust.
(17:08):
But I, I, you know, one day, oneday I will take you there.
Christy. That is an absolute promise.
But these little beaches that are, that are on the, you know,
on the lakes, I'm trying to think I don't.
There is a little bit of sand, you know, sort of interspersed
in between these shingly, but it's mainly shingle and rocky,
but it's soft on the foot and itit's got this smell, this sort
(17:32):
of fresh lake smell and it's cold.
You know how sand is warm under far Yeah, these shingles are
cold. OK.
And so again, yeah, it just matches the environment and and
the, you know, the terrain around that area around Doles
water is really quite wild because there are not a lot of
roads there aren't there isn't easy access.
(17:52):
That's why the North lakes are so much quieter than the South
lakes. And I've been to a lot of these
spots and I just I just love Olds water.
That whole it's one of the longest.
It's not quite the biggest. Windermere is the biggest by
area, but Olds water has this huge coastline, which is
probably about 50 miles all the way around.
No, probably, yeah, a bit less than that.
(18:14):
And, and so, you know, it's a huge, huge coastline and, and
they're, they're stunning, but the landscape is also very
unforgiving. Yeah, perfect.
Quick question without notice from an Aussie to someone in the
UK. When you go into the lake, do
you wear like little booties or your thongs or your runners?
I absolutely do. I wear dive boots.
(18:36):
Yeah, the appreciation. OK.
Yeah, got them as well, because when they were little, you know,
there was a lot of, there was a lot of that.
So. Oh yeah, our old dive boots,
that would be good. So every time we go now, we take
little booties and I've got likea Shorty jacket wet suit that if
I'm going wild swimming, I'll wear a little jacket wet suit as
(18:59):
well. It doesn't really, you know,
make much difference because it's, I don't know, it's about
two degrees or it's probably not, but that's how it feels.
But yeah. Oh good, OK great.
So remember to pack my booties when I come because I'm taking
you up on that offer, mate. Fair dinkum, I really am.
Right in the middle of all of that bleakness you managed to
(19:21):
weave in this beautiful love story between Sophie and Hannah,
and you always seem to bring that human layer into the
horror. Is that intentional?
Oh, thanks, Christy. And yeah, I'd, I'd, and again,
it's the same thing. It's it's about balancing that,
you know, good and evil because something's got to be at stake
emotionally, hasn't it? It's not all about plot.
(19:43):
I think people have got to feel something.
And so if you're used to the series, you obviously already
feel something for Kelly. If you're coming back, then you
obviously are emotionally invested in her.
But every story I try and introduce other characters for
(20:03):
people to get emotionally invested in as well.
And crime, you know. Doesn't have to have that, that
punch just just on its own. I think there's got to be this
push and pull, like I said before, the good versus the
evil. And how how important is that
for you, Christy? As a reader, you know that that
dark and light, that light and shade.
(20:24):
I really enjoy that and I reallyenjoy the the different
variations within the the light and the dark as well.
So for example, in the last bookthat we did fear, yeah, one of
the the guys was like a, you know, a baddie in the in the
book, he was actually hilarious.So there was he was a really bad
(20:47):
guy, but you know, he was a guy that was, you know, watching
Love Island or Master Chef. That was kind of really funny.
So I like the way that you have the different shades of light
and dark, and I find that keeps me kind of flicking through the
pages because I'm so invested init.
It's just like, oh, you're such a horrible person.
Look what's happening here. Then you get the beauty of like
(21:09):
in, in this case, we've got Hannah and Sophie that are new
into their relationship. And, you know, that
counterbalances the storyline really beautifully.
That's just one example. So I find it, I think it's
really important. And I I love the way that you
can do that. It's such an incredible skill.
It's, it's like the Ying and theYang, isn't it?
Not to get too philosophical, but I, you know, I used to be a
(21:30):
history teacher and, and one thing that annoys me a little
bit about, about any sort of political or social commentary
and not to bring politics into it because obviously that would
be really bad. These, these sweeping statements
about people and, and, and countries like, you know,
you're, you're either all bad oryou're all good and life isn't
(21:51):
like that. And, you know, everybody has,
you know, darkness and everybodyhas light.
And I, and I guess that's what'salways inside me when I'm
writing characters, because I don't believe that that anybody
is all bad or anybody is it's all good.
Yeah, there's also a really amazing surprise link between
Kelly's own family and Wasdale Hall.
(22:11):
That must have been so much fun to write.
How did that twist come about? Rage.
Yeah, it was just one of those little things I was that jumped
into my head when when Ted, whenI put Ted at one of the balls at
the at Wasdale Hall with the Earl.
I just thought, you know, this is this is actually really
plausible and and that that's the thing about fiction is that
(22:34):
it doesn't have to be true because obviously it's fiction,
although some fans do do pick you up on that.
They say, Oh, is the late district really like that?
Right. I'm not going anymore.
Then it doesn't have to be true,but it does have to be
plausible. It has to be believable.
And I thought this little touch was was plausible.
You know, Ted's the right age. He would have rubbed shoulders
with him, you know, with the sort of Cumbria elite at these
(22:56):
famous parties that that the Earl Xavier and and Delilah were
throwing. Everybody wanted to be there.
It was like the, you know, the Bezos wedding of of the 70s, you
know, respected copper like JohnPorter would have been invited
to. So of course you know Wendy.
She has to go. Well, Wendy has to go with a
(23:17):
green frock that matches her eyes.
Interesting we come to a one of our favourite bits in a moment
that weaves kind of into one of my most favourite bits in the
book. And when I read re read dead end
again, I texted you when I got to a certain point took AI wrote
in the book, sent back to photo.Look what I'm up to.
(23:39):
This is my favourite part in thebook.
I love that bit so much. We'll get to that in a SEC in
this book. Now hang on in last.
In the last book we had a forensic dentist as an expert.
Remember In Deep Fear. Yeah, yeah, I'll bring one in.
I bloody love that. So I love the recurring theme of
the underwater scenes, and this time we have Dive Master Steve
(24:02):
McKellen from the Underwater Search team.
That was a great addition. The diving scenes come up fairly
regularly in some of your books.Why is that?
Yeah. Well, it's really easy to answer
that because I trained as a sports diver in in Cyprus when,
when was there with the military.
So we, we trained with the military and, and very off
(24:23):
Lanica. There is one of the most famous
wrecks in the world called the Zenobia.
It's actually in one of my otherseries.
It's in the Helen Scott series in the line.
And so I write dive scenes a lotbecause I just, and they're so
atmospheric, aren't they? There's something about, you
know, something so haunting about the water.
(24:44):
It doesn't have to be deep. I mean, I've done dives at 10
metres at night, you know, with the torch, which are really
scary and, and, you know, haunting.
And then I've done dives at 50 metres in the, in the light.
And I haven't really, you know, had the same feeling.
(25:04):
And it's, it's the silence, the pressure, the danger, the
potential. You can hide A lot down there.
So, you know, Steve brought realphysicality to those scenes.
And again, I just love dropping in, you know, one of those
characters like, like him and you know, he's, he's part of a
proper search team, really professional, you know, going up
(25:24):
and down in that grid arrangement.
And because when I have a technical scene, I like to
create a 3D character to flesh it out for me instead of me just
having a narrative and, oh, thisis what happened.
I choose a character to do it for me.
So you that you wouldn't get me diving.
And I was. Christy, I'm not a hope in hell.
Oh, please. And the Jaws generation.
(25:47):
No, thank you. Would you?
Yeah. I've been on the Great Barrier
Reef, and then the Great BarrierReef's on one side of Australia
and directly on the other side of Australia is the Ningaloo
Reef. And it was, yeah, last year or
the year before, Howie, my partner and I, we went to
Ningaloo Reef and we swam with the whale sharks.
(26:08):
Oh my God, that's a mate. That must have been incredible
because they're huge, aren't they?
They are so massive. Wow, and that massive mouth as
well. This gaping mouth.
Yeah, and they're so graceful underneath.
So yeah, we went out on a day trip and then on the Great
Barrier Reef, yeah, we swam withthem, but they have mainly reef
(26:29):
sharks up there, so the water's too warm.
So I've swam with reef sharks before.
So at Sea World, that still counts, right?
Of course it does. Yeah, they're they're still in
the water, so they can still nibble you.
Yeah, just the white tip or the black tip.
Reef sharks, they generally do, Yeah, they generally don't
attack people. They have come face to face with
a shark before. And I was snorkelling in the
(26:51):
North Coast of NSW and I was just in a little little stream
that came out from the mouth of the ocean and I was, I was
probably in about knee deep water and I was just snorkelling
along and anyway came face to face with a wobby gong shark.
Google it if you don't know whata wobby gong shark is, is quite
possibly the ugliest shark in the world.
(27:13):
And anyway, I saw it and I stoodup, just ran out of the water.
Screaming with my snorkelling. It's a fading human true story,
people. Yeah.
Oh my God. Well, that's definitely not
going to happen in Hell's water.Yeah, you might.
My kind of pair of undies or, you know, an L suitcase.
(27:35):
No. Walk along.
In WA when we were there the other week the other year, we
how we know for a big hike alongthe coastline and we came across
a baby shark nursery. I'll share some photos on on my
social media or I'll share them to the killer storyteller.
But there were so many baby sharks, just little cute ones.
(27:56):
You know, this big, this big, they're only little.
But they're all just in this really shallow, really warm
water, the heaps and heaps of sharks.
Wow. But Mom, did you see Mom?
They're not, I don't think They hang around, Yeah.
Well, they're, they're left alone, are they like but.
Oh God, we digress. We could talk about sharks all,
all day. We all quite diving.
(28:17):
All right, let's get this back on track, honey bun.
All right, where were we up to? All right, so quick change of
pace from sharks. But I love it when Kelly and
Johnny go running together. And is that their version of
plot runs? And let's be honest, Johnny
definitely enjoys the view from behind.
(28:38):
OK, this is this is probably TMI, but this is this is
directly from my husband. When when we go running, he
runs, he runs behind me and I'm like, do you want to go in
front? He's like, no, no, no, it's
fine. I'm just enjoying.
That's so hilarious. So that's direct link.
(29:01):
It's, you know, oh, mimicking life.
Oh, that's my relationship has to be realistic, isn't it?
And and it's developing, you know, it's still pretty new.
I mean, they've only been together for about a year at
this point and plot runs. I love that because you can feel
them, can't you can you can hearthem runny.
And she's like, yeah. And I interviewed this guy and,
(29:24):
you know, he was such an idiot and.
And what do you think? And he's like, yeah, you know,
and I was bringing this guy downoff the mountain or I can just
see them doing it. And I I'm a real visual writer.
So I love that movie playing in my head when when I'm I'm
writing about them going for a run.
I think it's really important. And also it's kind of a good off
gas in the story, you know, justto relieve the pressure because
(29:48):
because you've got, you know, all of this, you know,
negativity and tragedy in all ofKelly's stories.
And then you can just decompressa bit with a plot run.
You can just sort of have a breather because I don't think
you're really intense the whole time.
Yeah, it breaks it up really nicely, doesn't it?
Hey, the Peaks Bay Hotel isn't real or fiction because I need
(30:12):
to go there. It sounds bloody unreal.
Doesn't it? I know.
And there is in the place where I imagine it.
Yeah, again, I had to make up myown name, but there is a famous
hotel called the Sharrow Bay, and it's really exclusive.
And one day I will stay there. Oh, my God, It looks amazing.
But it's been closed for quite along time now.
(30:34):
And apparently new American owners are refurbing it.
It closed during COVID and then these American owners, new
owners, bought it. And it says on their website
that they're refurbing and it was due to open this year.
But I don't know whether they'regoing to make that deadline.
But I cannot wait. You wait to Google it.
You wait till you see the location.
(30:55):
Oh, yeah. It's a real location with my own
name. Well, if they happen to be
listening and want to bring us there for an an outside
broadcast or we could podcast live from the the opening, that
kind of makes sense too. I'm free, I'm free.
Totally just need to pack my my booties when I go for a swim.
(31:19):
And you snorkel got them, yeah. Got them.
There's a really lovely scene when Kelly takes her mum to
dinner and it's just the two of them and we see another side to
their relationship. How do you take Kelly's personal
life even further with every single book?
And in this scene that I'm referring to, her mum's being a
bit of a wine goblin and complaining about the bill.
(31:41):
It's just so real. Isn't it she's got she's got one
eye on Kelly, isn't she? She's got one eye on the the
prices. We've all been to dinner with
somebody like that and awfully of a certain age and, and I
could just see Wendy sort of, you know, just just slightly
sort of tensing, you know, when she saw, you know, £26 or
(32:05):
something, you know, for a scallop, which, you know, the
Peaks Bay is that type of place.I mean, they've only been there
a couple of times because, you know, they scattered John John
Porter's ashes there under a rhododendron.
Bush. Sorry, John.
I mean, again, that was sort of one of my experiences.
(32:27):
Sadly, I lost my mom quite a long time ago and we took her
ashes to Lanzarote in the Canaries and we put her under a
Bush. And I just hope to this day that
she doesn't mind. It's, it seemed a really good
idea at the time because she loved travelling.
OK. But yeah, so that's, that's,
that's the connection there. I loved writing that scene.
(32:48):
And I love, I love scenes that make me smile when I'm writing
them or they make me feel something.
And I can't know if I'm feeling something like happiness or joy
or or terror or, you know, the chills, then it's probably going
to have the same effects on my readers.
So and again, it was an off gassing scene.
(33:09):
You know that lovely scene with her mum.
And of course you know her mum without giving any spoilers
away, you know her mum isn't well when they go there.
So it's a really, it's another way to show that softer side of
Kelly. Yeah, it was really lovely to
see her mum and her enjoying that time together.
You describe the nature of hotelwork superbly in the book.
(33:31):
Is this one personal experience?Plus it's a bit of a link back
to book #1 Dark game with the transient workers, remember?
Yeah. And, and that, and again, that
is that it's really indicative of that, you know, the Lake
District setting this idea of, you know, you've got so many
different transient workers because of the hotels.
And that lends itself to crime really well because you've got
(33:54):
people coming in and out undocumented.
And of course, in dart game, youhad these these girls who had to
hand their passports over. And even though obviously we
were in Schengen then, you know,we, we were still part of
Europe, anybody from Europe, youknow, including Poland, that
because they signed the Schengentoo, they, they could have, you
(34:15):
know, come over legally. The point in dart game is that
they didn't want to, you know, do go the legal route because
they didn't want to pay taxes. So they were under the radar on
purpose. And of course, that leaves them
vulnerable. But yeah, I mean, I've, I've
worked all over the late district and it's hard, bloody
work, you know, serving breakfast from, you know, 5:00
(34:36):
on your feet until when you clear up at 11.
It's really hard work. And, and all of these hotels,
these glamorous hotels, you know, they don't pay very well
and you stink after your, after your shift, you your uniform is,
is pretty grimy, you know, from,from the, the food smells.
So it's really hard work, especially if it's hot.
(34:59):
And, and I just one little side,I had a, a couple of people
staying in a hotel arguing over my tips because this, this guy
tipped me and I didn't notice. And one of the other waitresses
stole my tip. And so and he saw and so there
was a big Hoo ha about it. So there's all that sort of
(35:20):
going on going on as well. So there is this tension, you
know, behind the scenes, like there was in that game between
and, you know, Rosa and Gabriella.
That's right, yeah. And I think that, you know it,
she's, she's becoming, Kelly's becoming more anchored in her
environment, isn't she? As as time goes on.
And so as she gets more comfortable, I'm sort of
(35:41):
introducing, you know, a bit a few more elements of the late
district experience. Yeah.
I mean, when, when I was at uni,I had these part time jobs there
that I'll never forget. So.
Yeah. I've been there.
And those part time jobs just want to earn an extra couple of
dollars to do whatever you're doing.
Yeah, Yeah. And I guess that's exactly what
you want your readers to feel, right?
(36:02):
Kelly is really rooted there now.
And within each book, her the bond kind of deepens.
So I'm kind of thinking, you know, what is it going to be
like for book 13? What's it going to be like?
So I've got to hurry up and keepon reading these books.
So because I'm rereading the book so I can make my notes.
But now I just want to skip forward to book #8 or 9 that I'm
actually really up to. But in fact, I've just started
(36:25):
reading the famous. Yeah, my husband's just finished
that. Is he?
Yeah, really different. And my standalones are, are
different, which is on purpose, right?
Because, you know, I don't, I don't just want to write in one
way. I want to experiment And and I'm
glad I gave it a go with the thestandalones.
Because you loved the rich, didn't you?
(36:45):
Love so much. Yeah.
Yeah, and, and I just think it'sgood to, you know, broaden, you
know, my, my skills. I'm always working on something
different. But Kelly is like my main
series. So I mean on on on that, you
know, her getting more comfortable in her environment
as well. Christy, this is something that
comes up over and over again is a lot of people on, you know, on
(37:09):
the reviews do mention that the Lake District is like a
character in itself and there's some great scenery in dead end.
And I always try and do that because I just that's what I
enjoy. I really enjoy writing about the
Lake District because it's so beautiful and it gives a really
good sort of juxtaposition to the crime.
So in Dead End we're we, we are in Place Vale, we're in
(37:32):
Oldswater. Place Vale is actually one of my
favourite peaks to to climb. It's really steep.
The view from the top is amazingthat just to give you some
context, that's where Hannah andSophie, they're missing.
So that's placed Val and it's really quiet and you you can't
drive there. You know, this is the thing
about the is when you think of mountain ranges elsewhere in the
(37:55):
world, you know, you can, you can do quite a lot of driving to
get there or trekking through villages and towns.
But it's not like that. It's really, you know, you have
to leave your car. There's no public transport.
So to get some, a lot of these places it is, it is just, you
know, walking and sheep, lots ofsheep with the herdies, the
(38:16):
local herdies with their black faces, they are so.
Cute. So you start at the bottom and
walk to the top basically. So you can't drive halfway and
then walk the other half? Oh no.
OK, yeah, they are. They're tiny compared to, you
know, other places in the world.They are, you know, remote, hard
to get to. So I'm not sure if I've told you
(38:38):
this story before, but I took mygirlfriends up there and then I
have a Swiss friend and and we we got halfway up and she said,
is it, you know, can we go to the toilet and have a drink at
the top? Is it like a really nice cafe
like there is in No? Sorry, bring your thermos and
your little sandwich. Exactly.
(38:59):
Certain spots really leap off the page, like some of the the
fells and the mountains. But also was Dale Hall the
shingle beach that we talked about earlier, those remote,
those remote campsites and huts,like they all feel really alive.
And it's more than just a backdrop, isn't it, Rach?
The landscape shapes the mood, the tension and the characters.
(39:21):
And Kelly's not just working in the lakes anymore.
She's part of it. And you can really feel her
settling in and and that bond with the place is just getting
stronger with every book, isn't it?
Yeah. And, and it's, it's, it's really
lent itself to leaping back and and forth as well because I've
just, I've just written the prequel to the Kelly series
(39:44):
that's coming out in January. And, you know, it's, it's 10
years earlier. It's 2008 in London and she's
missing home. She wanted to run to the bright
lights of the city to prove something to her father back in
2008. But she there are moments in
there and I've been able to put these moments in of her missing
(40:06):
this lovely, you know, circle moment.
Because obviously, Fast forward to her being in charge of the
serious Crime unit. And like you say, in by book 3,
she is part of this landscape. She's really home and she's,
she's really where she was destined to be.
So in the prequel, I've been able to put these moments in
(40:28):
when she's in London and she's she's thinking, you know, about
the Lake District, which has been just so lovely for me.
Oh. Wow, I can't wait to read that
when it comes out. You know, we're talking about
some of these old huts and remote campsites and huts in
Australia. We have a lot of these old huts
in the high country, particularly here in Victoria
where I am, and we call them cattlemen huts.
(40:50):
When I was reading the book, I was really visualising this in
my head. So in these huts, they're really
remote. There's no roads to them.
You got to hike in or horse rideor whatever.
They're really cool. And then there's lots of those
in Australia. Anyone can go to these huts and
there's beds and stoves inside them, but there's like a, a
place where you can tie up all your cattle or your horses.
So, and when you go there, you always leave some food for the
(41:12):
next person. So they're really, really cool.
So I could imagine that I was imagining that when I was
reading this book. Dead end.
Yeah, that, that's amazing. And I think all sort of mountain
ranges have that their own version, don't they?
And then and off the Lake District, there's a lot sort of
on a much smaller scale than that.
The way that you're describing that reminds me of Argentina,
you know, the Estancias and the gauchos riding through.
(41:35):
Yeah, the wilderness. And, and on a much smaller scale
in in Cumbria, we call them bothies.
And any, any, any Scots listening are probably going to
go crazy because that's their word.
It's Scottish world, Yeah. Yeah.
Yeah, the bothy is just like that.
And and usually you, you definitely can't drive to them.
You've got a height and you do, you take food and you leave
(41:55):
food, you leave little sort of reminders.
You might leave a map and there's, there's basic beds
sometimes and there's this fire firewood and, and, and some of
them have amazing views. Some of them are quite, quite
famous and, you know, trend on Instagram and stuff like that.
Yeah. So absolutely, yeah.
(42:17):
They're dotted all over the LakeDistrict And and of course, you
know, people who know the Lake District, well, they go from,
you know, boffy to boffy camping.
Yeah. That is so cool.
Love that. All right, Rach, as we wrap up
this episode, let's dive into a few fun and thoughtful
reflections on dead end. So kind of rapid fire style.
(42:37):
Are you ready? Let's go, OK.
OK, so I had to Google this. So remember last time it was
soporific eggs? Remember there was we had to
look up. So what did you have to Google
this time? So I loved researching the
Striker saw. So Striker is the brand name and
it's the saw that Ted uses to get into the chest to open the
(42:59):
chest and eviscerate the body during autopsy.
That's can you hear me salivating?
Just doing the action to everybody.
Oh God. Well, I had to Google a couple
of things. And Hobson's Choice, and the
Hyoid Bone and Kagoolies. Oh, my God, That is too funny.
It's it's pronounced Kagools. It's a very, very English thing.
(43:24):
Right. So I will find a picture of me
in the Kagool. And this is.
Yeah. It's so embarrassing because
when you're 15 and been dragged around the Lake District in a
bright orange kagool, you hate your parents.
And you can imagine it's miserable.
It's raining and so yeah, I'll I'll find a nice picture.
Beautiful, all right? Best character and why?
(43:44):
And who stole the show for you, mate?
Zach I loved writing about Zach.He's this quiet, pure strength
and that you that every family'sgot one, haven't they?
He's battling against the odds. Yeah, Zach, he was also my
favourite character. He's sweet, he's kind, he's
introvert, he doesn't care aboutmoney and he loves fishing.
And he will move on if he has to.
(44:06):
He said that in the book. And just FYI, everybody, Rach
and I did these separately and we only just stitched them
together recently. And I can't believe that we've
picked a lot of the same things.All righty Rach, worst character
in a good way, bad way. Who gave you the ick or who did
you just love to hate? Yeah, I can't.
It's I can't say the the names obviously it'd be spoiler, but
(44:27):
the the killer just gave me the absolute chills.
The pure evil and devoid of all emotional emotion and empathy
all. Right.
My, my one was Michelle Hammond.So she's an ex schoolmate of
Kelly Porter. She was so mean and hurtful and
she's in this one scene. It's only a short scene in the
(44:49):
book, but Oh my God, it's incredibly harsh.
She's a cow. Yeah, it's really important how
you pick that out because again,it's about showing Kelly about
how hard it was to go back. This is what she faces
sometimes. So it's really interesting you
you pick that one out. Yeah, that really stood out for
me. What was your favourite quote or
scene and the moment that stuck with you the most?
(45:11):
I I picked out the very last line of the book.
Maybe she did belong here after all, because I think this book
by #3 she, she really is settled.
And I love that last line. What about you?
Yeah, I absolutely love that. I had a couple, so I'll try and
keep it quick. The water fountain scene with
(45:31):
Ted Wallace and Wendy and they're meeting.
It's on page 194 if you're reading along.
They both needed air. They they're at this big
glamorous party. They both didn't want to be at
the party. And the coolness of the water
fountain and the introduction toeach other, it was just so good.
And that was a bit when I I texted you and I sent you a
photo of the page that I was up to.
(45:54):
I just love that bit in the book.
And if you're reading along, you'll understand why.
But and also the Hermes Amazoni,the green, the classic green
floral fragrance for women. We talked about that before.
So evocative. Delilah.
The name Delilah just lends itself to this.
Hermes perfume doesn't matter. Yeah, I love.
(46:16):
And Kelly, Kelly Porter favourite moment.
Her standout scene for me for me, it was the surprise
helicopter ride with Johnny. So he obviously sees that she's
stressed and you know, Kelly is really professional.
She's she never gives up And youknow, he, he surprises her with
this helicopter ride over the Lake District because, you know,
(46:38):
he's buddies with the, the mountain rescue pilot and you
know, they've got to it happens,doesn't it?
You know, in, in all sorts of jobs.
And it's just a like a little snippet of escapism and the way
that head of helicopters, but the, the, the, the, the view and
the scenery just take a breath away and you can actually hear
(46:59):
her exhale and you can feel it. I love that.
What about you? Is with Kelly and her
interviewing style in this book the way she on purpose is abrupt
to Linda Cairns when she to get to spark a response.
She really, it was just really clever.
And also the scene with Brian Walker and she and I can just
(47:20):
hear her in my head going with respect Mr. Walker with such
authority, like she was just boss.
Yeah, yeah, I love that. It was really cool.
How do you reckon this book is different to the last one?
The tone, the theme, the body count.
And yeah, it's, I mean, certainly not as big as body
count as as dead fair or dark game, but that's kind of because
(47:43):
it's more of a family drama. So it's a bit more personal and
evocative and I really loved experimenting in that field.
What about? Well, it was the hatred from the
killer and wanting what is owed to the killer that was really
that just stood out to me as a little bit different than the
last one. And I really like how you've
(48:05):
LinkedIn back to previous books.So in this one, we had the link
back to Water Millik and the reference to Moira from book
number #2 right? Yeah, that's right.
And then the teacher and the letters are still coming from
the teacher. So that link, I really like the
way that you've linked them in together.
Yeah, I, I thought that was quite plausible that that, you
(48:29):
know, a weirdo with, with the ego of the teacher and, and the
narcissism of the teacher would still think that they were
important in Kelly's life and they would try and harass her.
So that was, that was a good little twist.
Yeah. All right, lastly, Rach,
something funny. It could be from the book or
behind the scenes. Give us a laugh.
(48:50):
So, so for me, and this was, wasreally like personal as well,
because when I wrote this back in 2018, so that's about 8 years
ago. Yeah.
So my, my teenage daughter wouldhave been 12 and she was so like
Josie, like really stroppy, knows everything.
So, so obviously, you know, Kelly and Johnny are trying to,
you know, get on with this. Really romantic, pretty sexy
(49:13):
relationship, you know, just sort of discovering each other
and you know, you know, they're,they're getting on and it's,
it's lovely. And they're, they're staying
over at each other's. And then Josie, you know, come
and say she, she says that she'smoving, I'm moving in with your
dad and, and it's such a fuckingkiller.
And Kelly's like, holy shit, howam I going to cope with this?
(49:36):
So that that to me was like, what are you?
I had two. There was a really cute scene in
the water with Jelly, Jelly, Kelly.
Just merge your names there. Jelly with Kelly and Johnny and
she decked him in the water. That was really funny.
(49:56):
I thought that was cute. And also, you mentioned this
before, but I thought this was actually pretty funny.
The spreading of the ashes of John Porter at the Peaks Bay
behind the Rhododendra Bush. Right.
Yeah, in secret. No one's looking.
Go. And finally, Aussie Jayden,
Jayden G'day. We haven't even gone there yet.
(50:18):
That's the second Aussie reference I've read so, and I'm
pretty sure there must be more to come.
Rage. I love he's he's there, he's
working this summer and he's like, hi, girls.
You know, we're going to do thistoday and it's going to be chill
and, and obviously, you know, they find something on the dive,
but you know, he's loving the chicks in the bikinis even
(50:39):
though it's absolutely bloody freezing.
Yeah. Oh, so.
So did I pull off? Was he Jaden?
Awesome, mate. Hi girls.
Good day. How's it going?
Jaden's the name. Diving's the game.
Oh quickly, what? That wraps up today's episode of
(51:00):
The Killer Storyteller with withme, Rach and and Christy Horne
over in in Melbourne. What a brilliant episode.
Loved it. We really hope that you have
enjoyed listening as much as we've loved chatting about
everything Kelly. And next time, slight departure,
we're going to choose a different book, The Rich, which
(51:21):
is actually Christie's favourite, I.
Love this book so much, I cannotwait to really unpack it with
you. I'll have to read it again for
the 4th time. Yes, fourth time people.
I loved it that much. But yeah.
So that will be our next 1. And in the meantime, come along
with us as we keep diving into all the book.
It's been amazing connecting with everybody and keep the
(51:43):
messages and the comments and the reviews on seriously, it
means the world. It's brilliant.
Thank you. And remember, you can find us
pretty much absolutely everywhere.
Spotify, Amazon Music, there's YouTube, but even on
iHeartRadio, which is doing really, really well.
Also Apple Pods is next but if I'm having a bit of a brain fade
here so if anyone knows how to link to Apple pods help me out
(52:07):
here. But wherever you can hit follow
subscribe so you never miss a killer episode.
And if you've got thoughts on today's chat, drop us a comment,
we'd seriously love to hear fromyou.
And it's, it is really us replying on us.
We read everything and we've gotboth sides of the hemisphere
covered as well. So, so Christie replied with one
time zone. I wake up and I see all the
(52:28):
comments and then I do my best. That's good, isn't it?
All right, Rach, that was another killer episode into the
bag for us. How did you enjoy this one?
I loved it, absolutely loved it.What about you?
Same here, absolutely loved it as well.
I'm kind of sad to see dead end go, but I'm excited to read to
get into the rich on the next one.
All right guys, that is it for now.
We're over and out and we'll seeyou next time.
(52:50):
Thanks so much. See you next time.
Bye, Christy all. Right, see you.
Good day and welcome to the Killer Storyteller podcast.
I'm Christy Horne, your Co host coming to you from a very chilly
and wintery Melbourne. Thanks so much for tuning in for
another killer episode and as always I'm joined by my UK mate,
crime queen and million copy selling author and all round
bloody legend Rachel Lynch. Good day, Rach.
(00:44):
Hiya, Christy. Oh, what an introduction.
I'm not sure I can live up to all of that.
Oh, massive hello to everybody listening in.
How is everybody? Great to have you all with us
again. So looking forward to this one.
And today we are talking about Dead end #3 in the Kelly Porter
series. Yes, we certainly are.
(01:05):
But before we crack this episodeopen, rage how you going and
what's been happening in your side of the world.
We are actually having a summer,Christie.
So it doesn't, yeah, it doesn't happen very often, but yeah,
it's been really hot. And do you know what goes with
summer? It's sport in in Britain and,
and I was lucky enough a couple of weeks ago to be at the, the
(01:27):
World Cup final of, of the cricket and, and you know, it
was South Africa against Aussie and and those, those baggy caps.
I mean, I just that they should have won, OK, just on the kit
because I just love the Aussie kit.
Not I was concentrating on the cricket obviously, but yeah,
(01:47):
that was amazing. I loved it at Lourdes.
It's such a great venue. I had a great day.
It's just lots of people, you know, just having picnics and
and chilling, a beautiful day. The sun was shining, cricket was
amazing. And South Africa have never won
before. So watching them, you know,
raise the trophy for the first time was really quite special,
even though it wasn't Australia,sorry.
Yeah, it was really special for South Africa and it was great to
(02:10):
see them win and good, you know,it's good for the Aussies as
well. I think they're in the West
Indies right now, so we follow the cricket here in Melbourne.
But it was lovely to see their rage.
But also Wimbledon is another one of my favourites and Tour de
France starts tonight. So I absolutely love the Tour de
France and watch it religiously.But you guys are having like
(02:32):
this massive European heat wave.We've been very jealous down
here in the southern hemisphere,but it's been quite cold.
Look, you don't get to be jealous, right?
With your weather, with your summers, you don't get to be
jealous. This is like crumbs, you know,
31° for a week is, is, is something and, and it, it makes
(02:55):
everyone smile. So, so Brits are known for being
totally miserable about the weather.
And we just sort of shuffle around most of the year moaning
about the weather, but then we get a week's heat wave and we
all turn into really happy people.
Isn't. That lovely.
Is it is it's lovely and and yeah, so I've been really
enjoying it. I'm a bit of a Sun Queen and I
like to, well, I know, but isn'tit amazing how you know how many
(03:18):
platforms we've been, we've beenon and, and just, we've blown
away by all the support and the comments and the really fun
engagement with so many people. Yeah, you have.
I've said this before and I'll say it again.
You have the absolutely loveliest followers and people
will support and read your books.
And one of one of the other things that's up and running is
(03:39):
our YouTube page. And now you can watch.
Hello. Hello.
And watch and enjoy all of our recordings.
But I have to warn you, there's no edits here, guys.
So if you see us make a mistake or actually you probably can
just see how much we're laughingand having a really good time.
So the the YouTube channel is called, obviously the Killer
(04:00):
Storyteller Podcast, and you canfind us on YouTube.
So yeah, it's been pretty good. And what about our playlist on
Spotify? I know, I know.
And we need to add to that, don't we?
We need to get some really groovy tunes in there for for
Kelly and Johnny to run up thoseHells too.
I. Know I've added a couple of
songs in there, but I need to add, we need to add some more.
(04:20):
We want your input too, guys. So if anyone has some awesome
songs that they want to add intothe Killer Storyteller playlist,
let us know because we'll add them in.
So every now and then there's a song that comes up in in some of
the books. So we're adding those in as
well. So yeah, please feel free to
suggest some songs to add into the playlist.
(04:41):
Alrighty Rach. Dead End is the title, but we're
just getting started. Sorry not sorry for the puns and
I'm not going to stop. I absolutely cannot help it.
So let's go. OK?
This episode we are discussing book #3 Three dead end
innocence, Lost secrets revealed.
(05:02):
And again, we need to say upfront that we are going to try
our best not to give away any spoilers if you haven't read the
book yet or if you're halfway through catching up.
We're not going to share any endings, but we are going to be
discussing the themes in the book and the storyline and
focusing on the things like, youknow, the setting and the
(05:23):
characters. So if you're reading along with
us, that's OK. We won't spoil anything for you,
we promise, but we'd also like to hear from you where you're up
to, which book you're on if you're just starting.
And we know that a lot of you are reading along and listening
to the podcast in order, which is just epic.
We're getting so much feedback, which is brilliant.
(05:44):
Now I every, every time we, me and Christy talk about a book,
we have a little intro on just like the the statistics.
So this one Dead End was writtenas part of the first three in
2018. It was published in 2018 as
well. That was a really busy year for
Kelly. All three came out in the same
(06:05):
year. It was written at home, probably
in my garden, in my kitchen, in my front room.
And it took a little bit longer this one, because I was getting
into the groove. It took about 3 months to write.
And for the first time, this book is about family drama and
the secrets and revenge that sort of unfold from that
(06:27):
tragedy. So I had a brilliant time
researching this and, and, and, and I set it in May.
So it's late spring, not as manytourists, not as hot, but the
the the researching, I think we're going to go into later,
aren't we, Christy? All right, Christy, over to you
to give your summary of dead endfrom your point of view, what
(06:49):
stood out? I'm really curious to to get
your take on this. What grabbed you?
What lingered? What gave you the chills?
OK, well, I loved how we did this last episode, Rach.
And so here goes again. It's 100 words.
It's summer in the lakes when anold Earl is found hanged.
He's safe dumped in the lake. Soon after, 2 girls vanish
(07:11):
following a secret midnight walkto to declare their love.
When a duffel bag resurfaces, linked to another missing girl,
dark secrets begin to rise. DI Kelly Porter investigates A
tangled web of incest, illegitimacy, and cruelty while
juggling family trauma and betrayal.
(07:32):
A detailed autopsy by Ted Wallace points to murder, not
suicide, and expert dive teams uncover clues beneath the
surface. Abandoned huts, buried
histories, and a final showdown on Place Fell pushed Kelly to
the edge. Fiercely independent, she
resists promotion, challenges tradition, and leads with heart
and steel. As she confronts the truth of
(07:54):
her past, she's left wondering maybe she did belong here after
all. What do you think?
No, that's just give me goosebumps.
Really. Did you like that?
Nick Yeah, epic. Now let's unpack some of the
storylines and the characters. OK, First off, the setting, that
mansion, I mean, was Dale Hall. It's spooky and it's decaying
(08:18):
and it just oozes tension. I could smell the mould coming
off the pages, right? It's dusty, the peeling
wallpaper, and I was actually getting full creeping mana
energy. It's almost like the house is a
character in itself. So tell me, why did you choose
Wasdell Hall? So I was looking for a, for a
name and, you know, in the Lake District, there's quite a lot of
(08:40):
these old halls kicking about because the whole, a lot of
Cumbria is owned by noble families.
And it's actually the Lauders, the family, the Lauders that
that own this sort of area. So I couldn't use their name,
even though we do know one of one of the, the members of the
(09:04):
family, because he actually wentto the Military Academy at
Sandhurst with, with my husband Mike.
So we've got his permission to use the, you know, the sort of
me alluding to that type of history in the story.
He was absolutely stoked and he and he asked his his uncle for
permission. We got it, but I needed to
(09:27):
change the name. So Wasdale just struck me
because it's one of my favouriteplaces.
Wasdale is actually up by Scarfell Pike and it just sort
of came together. But yeah, that that the whole
sort of mansion atmosphere, I loved creating that.
And, and it's, it's, it's the remoteness, isn't it?
And it's so isolated and eerie. It's quite sad as well, how it's
(09:50):
sort of decayed over the years. And, and like you say, this sort
of heavy stillness. And I thought, and This is why I
got excited about the story. There's something about the
setting of a grand aristocratic hall, you know, adding like an
extra character. And I've always loved that
thought of, of, you know, like you say, the peeling wallpaper
(10:13):
and, and that the forgotten horde corners hiding something.
And so, you know, it's a bit like finding something behind,
you know, a rock or under a lake.
That's the type of deal I was going for.
And it's kind of frozen in time,isn't it?
What did you make of the house? When I was reading the stories,
particularly the scenes that areset inside the house, I could
(10:36):
really feel that. And you've described some Kelly
goes in to sit down on a cushionand then all the dust comes up
and through the lights coming through the windows.
It had former glory with all with some of the the big events
that happened there. So I felt like you totally
nailed the description and I felt like it was just coming off
(10:56):
at me in in the book. So really, really great writing.
Amazing that. That's awesome.
Thanks, Christy. Speaking of the like the time
warp and the time warp with the house, you really played with
time in this book. Rage where where you're jumping
between past and present, back and forth.
What was behind that? It's, yeah, I think like, like
(11:20):
we were just talking about, you know, the former glory and this
retro glamour that clearly used to be holding the house up.
And so I really needed to pull that into the story.
So it came quite naturally with this one.
And I loved, I loved doing it. So it was really important to
get to know the Earl's history and and his wife, Delilah.
(11:41):
I just love that name. Don't know where that came from.
And, and so it enabled me to, toreally write about the romance
and the style of the 70s when they were in love and their love
story sort of, you know, 50 years ago, things like, you
know, her, her perfume and, and,and the fashion, you know, those
amazing balls that they used to throw.
(12:02):
So getting that in was really important to me because to, to
have a great fall, you need to know where they're coming from,
where they're falling from, right?
So I needed to write about that forgotten time of happiness.
What stood out for you in in those old retro scenes?
But her perfume and the the perfume that you've picked is
(12:23):
like absolutely perfect for thattime, like the romance of the
big events that they had there. And we're going to get to 1 of
my favourite scenes in a little while.
When you went back in time, gaveyou a greater understanding of
what's happening in the now, particularly with two of the
young boys that used to play together a lot and all some of
(12:43):
the other characters as well. They were great scenes to toggle
between the here and the now because it's like, aha, OK, that
totally makes sense. Really loved that.
Yeah. The context is really important,
isn't it? Yeah.
To to understand the tragedy. Yes, yes, absolutely.
The family story, their history is so tragic.
How did you factor that in? Yeah, it's as if they're all
(13:05):
cursed, isn't it? And that that generational
trauma is dumped, all building up from the 1970s, trauma after
trauma. And now it's dumped on poor 17
year old Zach. You know, it's like, it's like a
crumbling legacy. I love the way you describe
that. That is so perfect.
It is a crumbling legacy. Yeah, and the Earl is, is the
(13:26):
last Earl, isn't it? And because the only thing
that's left is illegitimacy. And so I, I love that part of
it. But you know, and it was only in
the writing of it that it struckme because of the ages of Ted
and the Earl, that they probablywould know each other because
this, this this old glamorous Cumbrian set, you know, would
(13:50):
have been quite small and it would have consisted of land
owners. It would have consisted of high
up coppers, town councillors andprobably a pathologist.
And professionals. Yeah, professionals and and rich
people, so the elite. So it wasn't too far a stretch
to have them knowing each other.And of course the the their
(14:11):
reunion is when and Ted is is autopsy in him.
So that was a real chilly connection as well.
Which brings us to the autopsy. The early scene is really
graphic, but it's also really fascinating as well.
And you've got all the scientific detail, rage, and
I've said it before, it never feels gratuitous.
How do you balance the goal withthe science?
(14:33):
And also, can we talk about Ted and how he came to his
conclusion like suffocation before hanging?
It was brilliant. Yeah.
And, and, and that, that to me, Christie is, is a real
compliment. You know, when you say it's not
gratuitous, it's, you know, I amdealing with gore and grew.
And so I have to and, and this this is something that that I
(14:54):
like to read as a reader is balancing the grew and the gore
comes through because of the goodness.
And so when you've got good people like Kelly, Johnny, Zach
Kelly's Team Ted, then the the the guru and the gore is feels
more chilling without being gratuitous, because then
(15:17):
hopefully fans, you know, like yourself and, and all the people
listening are actually going to get behind them.
And the guru and the Goran aren't just there to score
points and to show off. They're there to sort of balance
the goodness. And I just adore the research.
And yeah, I find it fascinating how you know what a pathologist
(15:40):
can discover. And it's all about, you know,
the, the marks on the neck, how,how they present the damage
inside and the weight ratios andall of that.
And so my research when I'm researching the, the autopsy
scenes is actually really scientific and it just sets my
brain alight. I love it.
(16:02):
And I love how he's so professional, isn't he?
He's all precision, no fluff, just gets on with it.
Kelly's there swearing, you know, and, and he, he knows that
Kelly swears a lot, but, you know, he sort of just ignores
it. And he's such an upstanding, you
know, guy who clearly, you know,rubbed shoulders, you know, with
people like the Earl. But he just gets on with his
job. And that twist just sort of
(16:25):
changes the whole tone of the case, doesn't it?
Comes early, too. So I really, really like that.
And I know you've said before, Ted deserves his own spinoff.
Yeah, I'd love to do that. I'd love to write a series on
just on a pathologist, whether it be Ted in the Lake District.
That would be awesome. Or or, you know, a new
character. But yeah, that is definitely on
my radar. I don't suffer from lack of
(16:47):
ideas, that's for sure. And then you've got all those
wilderness scenes and the wild landscapes.
It's so evocative. I had to Google Shingle Beach by
the way, but there's more on that later.
That's just hysterical. I mean, yeah, everything's
smaller here. So, you know, all, all of our,
all of our little beaches are ground down to this little dust.
(17:08):
But I, I, you know, one day, oneday I will take you there.
Christy. That is an absolute promise.
But these little beaches that are, that are on the, you know,
on the lakes, I'm trying to think I don't.
There is a little bit of sand, you know, sort of interspersed
in between these shingly, but it's mainly shingle and rocky,
but it's soft on the foot and itit's got this smell, this sort
(17:32):
of fresh lake smell and it's cold.
You know how sand is warm under far Yeah, these shingles are
cold. OK.
And so again, yeah, it just matches the environment and and
the, you know, the terrain around that area around Doles
water is really quite wild because there are not a lot of
roads there aren't there isn't easy access.
(17:52):
That's why the North lakes are so much quieter than the South
lakes. And I've been to a lot of these
spots and I just I just love Olds water.
That whole it's one of the longest.
It's not quite the biggest. Windermere is the biggest by
area, but Olds water has this huge coastline, which is
probably about 50 miles all the way around.
No, probably, yeah, a bit less than that.
(18:14):
And, and so, you know, it's a huge, huge coastline and, and
they're, they're stunning, but the landscape is also very
unforgiving. Yeah, perfect.
Quick question without notice from an Aussie to someone in the
UK. When you go into the lake, do
you wear like little booties or your thongs or your runners?
I absolutely do. I wear dive boots.
(18:36):
Yeah, the appreciation. OK.
Yeah, got them as well, because when they were little, you know,
there was a lot of, there was a lot of that.
So. Oh yeah, our old dive boots,
that would be good. So every time we go now, we take
little booties and I've got likea Shorty jacket wet suit that if
I'm going wild swimming, I'll wear a little jacket wet suit as
(18:59):
well. It doesn't really, you know,
make much difference because it's, I don't know, it's about
two degrees or it's probably not, but that's how it feels.
But yeah. Oh good, OK great.
So remember to pack my booties when I come because I'm taking
you up on that offer, mate. Fair dinkum, I really am.
Right in the middle of all of that bleakness you managed to
(19:21):
weave in this beautiful love story between Sophie and Hannah,
and you always seem to bring that human layer into the
horror. Is that intentional?
Oh, thanks, Christy. And yeah, I'd, I'd, and again,
it's the same thing. It's it's about balancing that,
you know, good and evil because something's got to be at stake
emotionally, hasn't it? It's not all about plot.
(19:43):
I think people have got to feel something.
And so if you're used to the series, you obviously already
feel something for Kelly. If you're coming back, then you
obviously are emotionally invested in her.
But every story I try and introduce other characters for
(20:03):
people to get emotionally invested in as well.
And crime, you know. Doesn't have to have that, that
punch just just on its own. I think there's got to be this
push and pull, like I said before, the good versus the
evil. And how how important is that
for you, Christy? As a reader, you know that that
dark and light, that light and shade.
(20:24):
I really enjoy that and I reallyenjoy the the different
variations within the the light and the dark as well.
So for example, in the last bookthat we did fear, yeah, one of
the the guys was like a, you know, a baddie in the in the
book, he was actually hilarious.So there was he was a really bad
(20:47):
guy, but you know, he was a guy that was, you know, watching
Love Island or Master Chef. That was kind of really funny.
So I like the way that you have the different shades of light
and dark, and I find that keeps me kind of flicking through the
pages because I'm so invested init.
It's just like, oh, you're such a horrible person.
Look what's happening here. Then you get the beauty of like
(21:09):
in, in this case, we've got Hannah and Sophie that are new
into their relationship. And, you know, that
counterbalances the storyline really beautifully.
That's just one example. So I find it, I think it's
really important. And I I love the way that you
can do that. It's such an incredible skill.
It's, it's like the Ying and theYang, isn't it?
Not to get too philosophical, but I, you know, I used to be a
(21:30):
history teacher and, and one thing that annoys me a little
bit about, about any sort of political or social commentary
and not to bring politics into it because obviously that would
be really bad. These, these sweeping statements
about people and, and, and countries like, you know,
you're, you're either all bad oryou're all good and life isn't
(21:51):
like that. And, you know, everybody has,
you know, darkness and everybodyhas light.
And I, and I guess that's what'salways inside me when I'm
writing characters, because I don't believe that that anybody
is all bad or anybody is it's all good.
Yeah, there's also a really amazing surprise link between
Kelly's own family and Wasdale Hall.
(22:11):
That must have been so much fun to write.
How did that twist come about? Rage.
Yeah, it was just one of those little things I was that jumped
into my head when when Ted, whenI put Ted at one of the balls at
the at Wasdale Hall with the Earl.
I just thought, you know, this is this is actually really
plausible and and that that's the thing about fiction is that
(22:34):
it doesn't have to be true because obviously it's fiction,
although some fans do do pick you up on that.
They say, Oh, is the late district really like that?
Right. I'm not going anymore.
Then it doesn't have to be true,but it does have to be
plausible. It has to be believable.
And I thought this little touch was was plausible.
You know, Ted's the right age. He would have rubbed shoulders
with him, you know, with the sort of Cumbria elite at these
(22:56):
famous parties that that the Earl Xavier and and Delilah were
throwing. Everybody wanted to be there.
It was like the, you know, the Bezos wedding of of the 70s, you
know, respected copper like JohnPorter would have been invited
to. So of course you know Wendy.
She has to go. Well, Wendy has to go with a
(23:17):
green frock that matches her eyes.
Interesting we come to a one of our favourite bits in a moment
that weaves kind of into one of my most favourite bits in the
book. And when I read re read dead end
again, I texted you when I got to a certain point took AI wrote
in the book, sent back to photo.Look what I'm up to.
(23:39):
This is my favourite part in thebook.
I love that bit so much. We'll get to that in a SEC in
this book. Now hang on in last.
In the last book we had a forensic dentist as an expert.
Remember In Deep Fear. Yeah, yeah, I'll bring one in.
I bloody love that. So I love the recurring theme of
the underwater scenes, and this time we have Dive Master Steve
(24:02):
McKellen from the Underwater Search team.
That was a great addition. The diving scenes come up fairly
regularly in some of your books.Why is that?
Yeah. Well, it's really easy to answer
that because I trained as a sports diver in in Cyprus when,
when was there with the military.
So we, we trained with the military and, and very off
(24:23):
Lanica. There is one of the most famous
wrecks in the world called the Zenobia.
It's actually in one of my otherseries.
It's in the Helen Scott series in the line.
And so I write dive scenes a lotbecause I just, and they're so
atmospheric, aren't they? There's something about, you
know, something so haunting about the water.
(24:44):
It doesn't have to be deep. I mean, I've done dives at 10
metres at night, you know, with the torch, which are really
scary and, and, you know, haunting.
And then I've done dives at 50 metres in the, in the light.
And I haven't really, you know, had the same feeling.
(25:04):
And it's, it's the silence, the pressure, the danger, the
potential. You can hide A lot down there.
So, you know, Steve brought realphysicality to those scenes.
And again, I just love dropping in, you know, one of those
characters like, like him and you know, he's, he's part of a
proper search team, really professional, you know, going up
(25:24):
and down in that grid arrangement.
And because when I have a technical scene, I like to
create a 3D character to flesh it out for me instead of me just
having a narrative and, oh, thisis what happened.
I choose a character to do it for me.
So you that you wouldn't get me diving.
And I was. Christy, I'm not a hope in hell.
Oh, please. And the Jaws generation.
(25:47):
No, thank you. Would you?
Yeah. I've been on the Great Barrier
Reef, and then the Great BarrierReef's on one side of Australia
and directly on the other side of Australia is the Ningaloo
Reef. And it was, yeah, last year or
the year before, Howie, my partner and I, we went to
Ningaloo Reef and we swam with the whale sharks.
(26:08):
Oh my God, that's a mate. That must have been incredible
because they're huge, aren't they?
They are so massive. Wow, and that massive mouth as
well. This gaping mouth.
Yeah, and they're so graceful underneath.
So yeah, we went out on a day trip and then on the Great
Barrier Reef, yeah, we swam withthem, but they have mainly reef
(26:29):
sharks up there, so the water's too warm.
So I've swam with reef sharks before.
So at Sea World, that still counts, right?
Of course it does. Yeah, they're they're still in
the water, so they can still nibble you.
Yeah, just the white tip or the black tip.
Reef sharks, they generally do, Yeah, they generally don't
attack people. They have come face to face with
a shark before. And I was snorkelling in the
(26:51):
North Coast of NSW and I was just in a little little stream
that came out from the mouth of the ocean and I was, I was
probably in about knee deep water and I was just snorkelling
along and anyway came face to face with a wobby gong shark.
Google it if you don't know whata wobby gong shark is, is quite
possibly the ugliest shark in the world.
(27:13):
And anyway, I saw it and I stoodup, just ran out of the water.
Screaming with my snorkelling. It's a fading human true story,
people. Yeah.
Oh my God. Well, that's definitely not
going to happen in Hell's water.Yeah, you might.
My kind of pair of undies or, you know, an L suitcase.
(27:35):
No. Walk along.
In WA when we were there the other week the other year, we
how we know for a big hike alongthe coastline and we came across
a baby shark nursery. I'll share some photos on on my
social media or I'll share them to the killer storyteller.
But there were so many baby sharks, just little cute ones.
(27:56):
You know, this big, this big, they're only little.
But they're all just in this really shallow, really warm
water, the heaps and heaps of sharks.
Wow. But Mom, did you see Mom?
They're not, I don't think They hang around, Yeah.
Well, they're, they're left alone, are they like but.
Oh God, we digress. We could talk about sharks all,
all day. We all quite diving.
(28:17):
All right, let's get this back on track, honey bun.
All right, where were we up to? All right, so quick change of
pace from sharks. But I love it when Kelly and
Johnny go running together. And is that their version of
plot runs? And let's be honest, Johnny
definitely enjoys the view from behind.
(28:38):
OK, this is this is probably TMI, but this is this is
directly from my husband. When when we go running, he
runs, he runs behind me and I'm like, do you want to go in
front? He's like, no, no, no, it's
fine. I'm just enjoying.
That's so hilarious. So that's direct link.
(29:01):
It's, you know, oh, mimicking life.
Oh, that's my relationship has to be realistic, isn't it?
And and it's developing, you know, it's still pretty new.
I mean, they've only been together for about a year at
this point and plot runs. I love that because you can feel
them, can't you can you can hearthem runny.
And she's like, yeah. And I interviewed this guy and,
(29:24):
you know, he was such an idiot and.
And what do you think? And he's like, yeah, you know,
and I was bringing this guy downoff the mountain or I can just
see them doing it. And I I'm a real visual writer.
So I love that movie playing in my head when when I'm I'm
writing about them going for a run.
I think it's really important. And also it's kind of a good off
gas in the story, you know, justto relieve the pressure because
(29:48):
because you've got, you know, all of this, you know,
negativity and tragedy in all ofKelly's stories.
And then you can just decompressa bit with a plot run.
You can just sort of have a breather because I don't think
you're really intense the whole time.
Yeah, it breaks it up really nicely, doesn't it?
Hey, the Peaks Bay Hotel isn't real or fiction because I need
(30:12):
to go there. It sounds bloody unreal.
Doesn't it? I know.
And there is in the place where I imagine it.
Yeah, again, I had to make up myown name, but there is a famous
hotel called the Sharrow Bay, and it's really exclusive.
And one day I will stay there. Oh, my God, It looks amazing.
But it's been closed for quite along time now.
(30:34):
And apparently new American owners are refurbing it.
It closed during COVID and then these American owners, new
owners, bought it. And it says on their website
that they're refurbing and it was due to open this year.
But I don't know whether they'regoing to make that deadline.
But I cannot wait. You wait to Google it.
You wait till you see the location.
(30:55):
Oh, yeah. It's a real location with my own
name. Well, if they happen to be
listening and want to bring us there for an an outside
broadcast or we could podcast live from the the opening, that
kind of makes sense too. I'm free, I'm free.
Totally just need to pack my my booties when I go for a swim.
(31:19):
And you snorkel got them, yeah. Got them.
There's a really lovely scene when Kelly takes her mum to
dinner and it's just the two of them and we see another side to
their relationship. How do you take Kelly's personal
life even further with every single book?
And in this scene that I'm referring to, her mum's being a
bit of a wine goblin and complaining about the bill.
(31:41):
It's just so real. Isn't it she's got she's got one
eye on Kelly, isn't she? She's got one eye on the the
prices. We've all been to dinner with
somebody like that and awfully of a certain age and, and I
could just see Wendy sort of, you know, just just slightly
sort of tensing, you know, when she saw, you know, £26 or
(32:05):
something, you know, for a scallop, which, you know, the
Peaks Bay is that type of place.I mean, they've only been there
a couple of times because, you know, they scattered John John
Porter's ashes there under a rhododendron.
Bush. Sorry, John.
I mean, again, that was sort of one of my experiences.
(32:27):
Sadly, I lost my mom quite a long time ago and we took her
ashes to Lanzarote in the Canaries and we put her under a
Bush. And I just hope to this day that
she doesn't mind. It's, it seemed a really good
idea at the time because she loved travelling.
OK. But yeah, so that's, that's,
that's the connection there. I loved writing that scene.
(32:48):
And I love, I love scenes that make me smile when I'm writing
them or they make me feel something.
And I can't know if I'm feeling something like happiness or joy
or or terror or, you know, the chills, then it's probably going
to have the same effects on my readers.
So and again, it was an off gassing scene.
(33:09):
You know that lovely scene with her mum.
And of course you know her mum without giving any spoilers
away, you know her mum isn't well when they go there.
So it's a really, it's another way to show that softer side of
Kelly. Yeah, it was really lovely to
see her mum and her enjoying that time together.
You describe the nature of hotelwork superbly in the book.
(33:31):
Is this one personal experience?Plus it's a bit of a link back
to book #1 Dark game with the transient workers, remember?
Yeah. And, and that, and again, that
is that it's really indicative of that, you know, the Lake
District setting this idea of, you know, you've got so many
different transient workers because of the hotels.
And that lends itself to crime really well because you've got
(33:54):
people coming in and out undocumented.
And of course, in dart game, youhad these these girls who had to
hand their passports over. And even though obviously we
were in Schengen then, you know,we, we were still part of
Europe, anybody from Europe, youknow, including Poland, that
because they signed the Schengentoo, they, they could have, you
(34:15):
know, come over legally. The point in dart game is that
they didn't want to, you know, do go the legal route because
they didn't want to pay taxes. So they were under the radar on
purpose. And of course, that leaves them
vulnerable. But yeah, I mean, I've, I've
worked all over the late district and it's hard, bloody
work, you know, serving breakfast from, you know, 5:00
(34:36):
on your feet until when you clear up at 11.
It's really hard work. And, and all of these hotels,
these glamorous hotels, you know, they don't pay very well
and you stink after your, after your shift, you your uniform is,
is pretty grimy, you know, from,from the, the food smells.
So it's really hard work, especially if it's hot.
(34:59):
And, and I just one little side,I had a, a couple of people
staying in a hotel arguing over my tips because this, this guy
tipped me and I didn't notice. And one of the other waitresses
stole my tip. And so and he saw and so there
was a big Hoo ha about it. So there's all that sort of
(35:20):
going on going on as well. So there is this tension, you
know, behind the scenes, like there was in that game between
and, you know, Rosa and Gabriella.
That's right, yeah. And I think that, you know it,
she's, she's becoming, Kelly's becoming more anchored in her
environment, isn't she? As as time goes on.
And so as she gets more comfortable, I'm sort of
(35:41):
introducing, you know, a bit a few more elements of the late
district experience. Yeah.
I mean, when, when I was at uni,I had these part time jobs there
that I'll never forget. So.
Yeah. I've been there.
And those part time jobs just want to earn an extra couple of
dollars to do whatever you're doing.
Yeah, Yeah. And I guess that's exactly what
you want your readers to feel, right?
(36:02):
Kelly is really rooted there now.
And within each book, her the bond kind of deepens.
So I'm kind of thinking, you know, what is it going to be
like for book 13? What's it going to be like?
So I've got to hurry up and keepon reading these books.
So because I'm rereading the book so I can make my notes.
But now I just want to skip forward to book #8 or 9 that I'm
actually really up to. But in fact, I've just started
(36:25):
reading the famous. Yeah, my husband's just finished
that. Is he?
Yeah, really different. And my standalones are, are
different, which is on purpose, right?
Because, you know, I don't, I don't just want to write in one
way. I want to experiment And and I'm
glad I gave it a go with the thestandalones.
Because you loved the rich, didn't you?
(36:45):
Love so much. Yeah.
Yeah, and, and I just think it'sgood to, you know, broaden, you
know, my, my skills. I'm always working on something
different. But Kelly is like my main
series. So I mean on on on that, you
know, her getting more comfortable in her environment
as well. Christy, this is something that
comes up over and over again is a lot of people on, you know, on
(37:09):
the reviews do mention that the Lake District is like a
character in itself and there's some great scenery in dead end.
And I always try and do that because I just that's what I
enjoy. I really enjoy writing about the
Lake District because it's so beautiful and it gives a really
good sort of juxtaposition to the crime.
So in Dead End we're we, we are in Place Vale, we're in
(37:32):
Oldswater. Place Vale is actually one of my
favourite peaks to to climb. It's really steep.
The view from the top is amazingthat just to give you some
context, that's where Hannah andSophie, they're missing.
So that's placed Val and it's really quiet and you you can't
drive there. You know, this is the thing
about the is when you think of mountain ranges elsewhere in the
(37:55):
world, you know, you can, you can do quite a lot of driving to
get there or trekking through villages and towns.
But it's not like that. It's really, you know, you have
to leave your car. There's no public transport.
So to get some, a lot of these places it is, it is just, you
know, walking and sheep, lots ofsheep with the herdies, the
(38:16):
local herdies with their black faces, they are so.
Cute. So you start at the bottom and
walk to the top basically. So you can't drive halfway and
then walk the other half? Oh no.
OK, yeah, they are. They're tiny compared to, you
know, other places in the world.They are, you know, remote, hard
to get to. So I'm not sure if I've told you
(38:38):
this story before, but I took mygirlfriends up there and then I
have a Swiss friend and and we we got halfway up and she said,
is it, you know, can we go to the toilet and have a drink at
the top? Is it like a really nice cafe
like there is in No? Sorry, bring your thermos and
your little sandwich. Exactly.
(38:59):
Certain spots really leap off the page, like some of the the
fells and the mountains. But also was Dale Hall the
shingle beach that we talked about earlier, those remote,
those remote campsites and huts,like they all feel really alive.
And it's more than just a backdrop, isn't it, Rach?
The landscape shapes the mood, the tension and the characters.
(39:21):
And Kelly's not just working in the lakes anymore.
She's part of it. And you can really feel her
settling in and and that bond with the place is just getting
stronger with every book, isn't it?
Yeah. And, and it's, it's, it's really
lent itself to leaping back and and forth as well because I've
just, I've just written the prequel to the Kelly series
(39:44):
that's coming out in January. And, you know, it's, it's 10
years earlier. It's 2008 in London and she's
missing home. She wanted to run to the bright
lights of the city to prove something to her father back in
2008. But she there are moments in
there and I've been able to put these moments in of her missing
(40:06):
this lovely, you know, circle moment.
Because obviously, Fast forward to her being in charge of the
serious Crime unit. And like you say, in by book 3,
she is part of this landscape. She's really home and she's,
she's really where she was destined to be.
So in the prequel, I've been able to put these moments in
(40:28):
when she's in London and she's she's thinking, you know, about
the Lake District, which has been just so lovely for me.
Oh. Wow, I can't wait to read that
when it comes out. You know, we're talking about
some of these old huts and remote campsites and huts in
Australia. We have a lot of these old huts
in the high country, particularly here in Victoria
where I am, and we call them cattlemen huts.
(40:50):
When I was reading the book, I was really visualising this in
my head. So in these huts, they're really
remote. There's no roads to them.
You got to hike in or horse rideor whatever.
They're really cool. And then there's lots of those
in Australia. Anyone can go to these huts and
there's beds and stoves inside them, but there's like a, a
place where you can tie up all your cattle or your horses.
So, and when you go there, you always leave some food for the
(41:12):
next person. So they're really, really cool.
So I could imagine that I was imagining that when I was
reading this book. Dead end.
Yeah, that, that's amazing. And I think all sort of mountain
ranges have that their own version, don't they?
And then and off the Lake District, there's a lot sort of
on a much smaller scale than that.
The way that you're describing that reminds me of Argentina,
you know, the Estancias and the gauchos riding through.
(41:35):
Yeah, the wilderness. And, and on a much smaller scale
in in Cumbria, we call them bothies.
And any, any, any Scots listening are probably going to
go crazy because that's their word.
It's Scottish world, Yeah. Yeah.
Yeah, the bothy is just like that.
And and usually you, you definitely can't drive to them.
You've got a height and you do, you take food and you leave
(41:55):
food, you leave little sort of reminders.
You might leave a map and there's, there's basic beds
sometimes and there's this fire firewood and, and, and some of
them have amazing views. Some of them are quite, quite
famous and, you know, trend on Instagram and stuff like that.
Yeah. So absolutely, yeah.
(42:17):
They're dotted all over the LakeDistrict And and of course, you
know, people who know the Lake District, well, they go from,
you know, boffy to boffy camping.
Yeah. That is so cool.
Love that. All right, Rach, as we wrap up
this episode, let's dive into a few fun and thoughtful
reflections on dead end. So kind of rapid fire style.
(42:37):
Are you ready? Let's go, OK.
OK, so I had to Google this. So remember last time it was
soporific eggs? Remember there was we had to
look up. So what did you have to Google
this time? So I loved researching the
Striker saw. So Striker is the brand name and
it's the saw that Ted uses to get into the chest to open the
(42:59):
chest and eviscerate the body during autopsy.
That's can you hear me salivating?
Just doing the action to everybody.
Oh God. Well, I had to Google a couple
of things. And Hobson's Choice, and the
Hyoid Bone and Kagoolies. Oh, my God, That is too funny.
It's it's pronounced Kagools. It's a very, very English thing.
(43:24):
Right. So I will find a picture of me
in the Kagool. And this is.
Yeah. It's so embarrassing because
when you're 15 and been dragged around the Lake District in a
bright orange kagool, you hate your parents.
And you can imagine it's miserable.
It's raining and so yeah, I'll I'll find a nice picture.
Beautiful, all right? Best character and why?
(43:44):
And who stole the show for you, mate?
Zach I loved writing about Zach.He's this quiet, pure strength
and that you that every family'sgot one, haven't they?
He's battling against the odds. Yeah, Zach, he was also my
favourite character. He's sweet, he's kind, he's
introvert, he doesn't care aboutmoney and he loves fishing.
And he will move on if he has to.
(44:06):
He said that in the book. And just FYI, everybody, Rach
and I did these separately and we only just stitched them
together recently. And I can't believe that we've
picked a lot of the same things.All righty Rach, worst character
in a good way, bad way. Who gave you the ick or who did
you just love to hate? Yeah, I can't.
It's I can't say the the names obviously it'd be spoiler, but
(44:27):
the the killer just gave me the absolute chills.
The pure evil and devoid of all emotional emotion and empathy
all. Right.
My, my one was Michelle Hammond.So she's an ex schoolmate of
Kelly Porter. She was so mean and hurtful and
she's in this one scene. It's only a short scene in the
(44:49):
book, but Oh my God, it's incredibly harsh.
She's a cow. Yeah, it's really important how
you pick that out because again,it's about showing Kelly about
how hard it was to go back. This is what she faces
sometimes. So it's really interesting you
you pick that one out. Yeah, that really stood out for
me. What was your favourite quote or
scene and the moment that stuck with you the most?
(45:11):
I I picked out the very last line of the book.
Maybe she did belong here after all, because I think this book
by #3 she, she really is settled.
And I love that last line. What about you?
Yeah, I absolutely love that. I had a couple, so I'll try and
keep it quick. The water fountain scene with
(45:31):
Ted Wallace and Wendy and they're meeting.
It's on page 194 if you're reading along.
They both needed air. They they're at this big
glamorous party. They both didn't want to be at
the party. And the coolness of the water
fountain and the introduction toeach other, it was just so good.
And that was a bit when I I texted you and I sent you a
photo of the page that I was up to.
(45:54):
I just love that bit in the book.
And if you're reading along, you'll understand why.
But and also the Hermes Amazoni,the green, the classic green
floral fragrance for women. We talked about that before.
So evocative. Delilah.
The name Delilah just lends itself to this.
Hermes perfume doesn't matter. Yeah, I love.
(46:16):
And Kelly, Kelly Porter favourite moment.
Her standout scene for me for me, it was the surprise
helicopter ride with Johnny. So he obviously sees that she's
stressed and you know, Kelly is really professional.
She's she never gives up And youknow, he, he surprises her with
this helicopter ride over the Lake District because, you know,
(46:38):
he's buddies with the, the mountain rescue pilot and you
know, they've got to it happens,doesn't it?
You know, in, in all sorts of jobs.
And it's just a like a little snippet of escapism and the way
that head of helicopters, but the, the, the, the, the view and
the scenery just take a breath away and you can actually hear
(46:59):
her exhale and you can feel it. I love that.
What about you? Is with Kelly and her
interviewing style in this book the way she on purpose is abrupt
to Linda Cairns when she to get to spark a response.
She really, it was just really clever.
And also the scene with Brian Walker and she and I can just
(47:20):
hear her in my head going with respect Mr. Walker with such
authority, like she was just boss.
Yeah, yeah, I love that. It was really cool.
How do you reckon this book is different to the last one?
The tone, the theme, the body count.
And yeah, it's, I mean, certainly not as big as body
count as as dead fair or dark game, but that's kind of because
(47:43):
it's more of a family drama. So it's a bit more personal and
evocative and I really loved experimenting in that field.
What about? Well, it was the hatred from the
killer and wanting what is owed to the killer that was really
that just stood out to me as a little bit different than the
last one. And I really like how you've
(48:05):
LinkedIn back to previous books.So in this one, we had the link
back to Water Millik and the reference to Moira from book
number #2 right? Yeah, that's right.
And then the teacher and the letters are still coming from
the teacher. So that link, I really like the
way that you've linked them in together.
Yeah, I, I thought that was quite plausible that that, you
(48:29):
know, a weirdo with, with the ego of the teacher and, and the
narcissism of the teacher would still think that they were
important in Kelly's life and they would try and harass her.
So that was, that was a good little twist.
Yeah. All right, lastly, Rach,
something funny. It could be from the book or
behind the scenes. Give us a laugh.
(48:50):
So, so for me, and this was, wasreally like personal as well,
because when I wrote this back in 2018, so that's about 8 years
ago. Yeah.
So my, my teenage daughter wouldhave been 12 and she was so like
Josie, like really stroppy, knows everything.
So, so obviously, you know, Kelly and Johnny are trying to,
you know, get on with this. Really romantic, pretty sexy
(49:13):
relationship, you know, just sort of discovering each other
and you know, you know, they're,they're getting on and it's,
it's lovely. And they're, they're staying
over at each other's. And then Josie, you know, come
and say she, she says that she'smoving, I'm moving in with your
dad and, and it's such a fuckingkiller.
And Kelly's like, holy shit, howam I going to cope with this?
(49:36):
So that that to me was like, what are you?
I had two. There was a really cute scene in
the water with Jelly, Jelly, Kelly.
Just merge your names there. Jelly with Kelly and Johnny and
she decked him in the water. That was really funny.
(49:56):
I thought that was cute. And also, you mentioned this
before, but I thought this was actually pretty funny.
The spreading of the ashes of John Porter at the Peaks Bay
behind the Rhododendra Bush. Right.
Yeah, in secret. No one's looking.
Go. And finally, Aussie Jayden,
Jayden G'day. We haven't even gone there yet.
(50:18):
That's the second Aussie reference I've read so, and I'm
pretty sure there must be more to come.
Rage. I love he's he's there, he's
working this summer and he's like, hi, girls.
You know, we're going to do thistoday and it's going to be chill
and, and obviously, you know, they find something on the dive,
but you know, he's loving the chicks in the bikinis even
(50:39):
though it's absolutely bloody freezing.
Yeah. Oh, so.
So did I pull off? Was he Jaden?
Awesome, mate. Hi girls.
Good day. How's it going?
Jaden's the name. Diving's the game.
Oh quickly, what? That wraps up today's episode of
(51:00):
The Killer Storyteller with withme, Rach and and Christy Horne
over in in Melbourne. What a brilliant episode.
Loved it. We really hope that you have
enjoyed listening as much as we've loved chatting about
everything Kelly. And next time, slight departure,
we're going to choose a different book, The Rich, which
(51:21):
is actually Christie's favourite, I.
Love this book so much, I cannotwait to really unpack it with
you. I'll have to read it again for
the 4th time. Yes, fourth time people.
I loved it that much. But yeah.
So that will be our next 1. And in the meantime, come along
with us as we keep diving into all the book.
It's been amazing connecting with everybody and keep the
(51:43):
messages and the comments and the reviews on seriously, it
means the world. It's brilliant.
Thank you. And remember, you can find us
pretty much absolutely everywhere.
Spotify, Amazon Music, there's YouTube, but even on
iHeartRadio, which is doing really, really well.
Also Apple Pods is next but if I'm having a bit of a brain fade
here so if anyone knows how to link to Apple pods help me out
(52:07):
here. But wherever you can hit follow
subscribe so you never miss a killer episode.
And if you've got thoughts on today's chat, drop us a comment,
we'd seriously love to hear fromyou.
And it's, it is really us replying on us.
We read everything and we've gotboth sides of the hemisphere
covered as well. So, so Christie replied with one
time zone. I wake up and I see all the
(52:28):
comments and then I do my best. That's good, isn't it?
All right, Rach, that was another killer episode into the
bag for us. How did you enjoy this one?
I loved it, absolutely loved it.What about you?
Same here, absolutely loved it as well.
I'm kind of sad to see dead end go, but I'm excited to read to
get into the rich on the next one.
All right guys, that is it for now.
We're over and out and we'll seeyou next time.
(52:50):
Thanks so much. See you next time.
Bye, Christy all. Right, see you.
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