November 28, 2025 • 42 mins
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I sat down with Connor Gross ( https://x.com/c_gro ) in New York and we went deep on one simple idea taking proven products and changing the form factor to unlock ridiculous upside. We talk about how Billy Mays, OxiClean, and late night infomercials turned into today’s DTC and TikTok style direct response, then riff on everything from “AG1 in a gummy” and brands like Grüns, Starface pimple stickers, and stain remover stickers for kids clothes, all the way to race day temporary tattoos that show your elevation profile and aid stations. From there we get into filtration for cyclists and runners, mouth tape for performance and pollution, third party testing apps like SuppCo and Seed Oil Scout, and the crazy opportunity in being the trusted auditor for supplements, snacks, and food labels. We wrap by talking about city based silent retreat concepts inspired by OtherShip, how to productize attention and stillness in a noisy world, and why there is so much money sitting in boring categories if you are willing to innovate on packaging, distribution, and trust.
Enjoy!
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
It is AG one in a gummy, all it is.
Sometimes you hear ideas and you're like, it's too easy.
Of course that works. They launched 3 years ago.
I'm fairly confident it's 500 million in sales.
Oh my gosh dude, that's a whole industry. 500 million in three
years tells me way more demand than supply.
Take something that's already really popular and just change
(00:20):
the form factor and it'll crush.Actually clean has done 5
billion plus in sales at this point.
Big money industry, very big money.
And so I think what you can do is try to figure out what the
other categories that you can put that in.
You're selling a very cheap thing for a pretty high markup
because you're solving that embarrassment problem.
Yeah, that is an amazing idea. It's a no brainer.
(00:43):
You may recognize Connor. He's been on the pod 5 or 6
times. He lives here in New York.
So I flew to New York and sat down with him to talk business
ideas. Please enjoy.
So tell me what you've been learning about Billy Mays.
Man Billy Mays. Is he still alive?
No. RFP.
Billy Mays born out. Billy Mays.
Yeah. This guy made billions,
basically. Long story short, you think like
(01:03):
the late night infomercial that maybe like people's crazy
cousins or crazy uncles now watch these days.
He was the king of it. And what I wanted to come into
today's conversation with was kind of understanding how he
made so much money and like whatthe top products were.
And like, back then, late night infomercials were the way to
sell products. That's how you moved, moved
volume. Now it's D to C.
(01:24):
Now it's meta ads and like it's TikTok, TikTok TA GPT search,
little Geo stuff. And so I was like, he's clearly
selling stuff that people wantedto buy.
How do you sell it again in a way that is not on ATV and not
using CTV because you know, the audience for that is dwindled to
a fraction of the size. And so I started diving into
some of the top sellers and do do you know where the stop
(01:47):
sellers are? Have you done any research?
Here on this was he the flex seal guy?
Yes, yeah, yeah, yeah. The, the well, we spray painted
an entire boat. He's like we put a screen door
in the bottom of this canoe. Like what?
A visual hook on that commercial.
It was classic direct response marketing, like, yeah, to AT and
now I feel like you have all these e-commerce guys who are
turning around and they're like,we're doing 45 minute long VS LS
(02:07):
and like we are going after heavy hooks and all that stuff.
And all they're doing is they'rejust taking the stuff that
worked in direct response back in the 90s and early 2000s.
They're just putting it on meta.And So what I thought was like,
what were the categories and theproducts that somebody who was
as iconic as Billy Mays was? What was he selling?
And how can you then apply that to social media and sell it
(02:28):
again? And so you remember the Flex
seal? Flex Seal's iconic.
The slap it on is like the classic meme but his number one
products. Any guesses do do you know any?
Categories. I saw your tweet so I'm going.
To. It's not that.
Oh really? OK, so your tweet was about
rosary chicken. So that was not him, I don't
think. Oh, OK.
Yeah, I don't even remember his products.
Like what? Let's do this.
(02:48):
Yeah, tell me all of his products and I'll try to guess
the more successful ones. You're going to know when I say
it. So it's it's Oxyclean.
Oh. He was Oxyclean.
He was Oxyclean, OK. And Oxyclean has done 5 billion
plus in sales at this point. So like simple idea of what
Oxyclean is stain remover. Now they have it more on the
spray. Before it was like this little
(03:09):
tub and you would scoop out thispowder, you put it on the shirt,
you kind of like rub it in a little bit and you toss the
shirt in the wash. And so Oxyclean was one of the
top categories. You look at all of the other
products, it's bathroom cleaners.
It's like a glue that was remodeled to like fix up seams
of jeans and like if your couch cushion split like it's a fabric
sealant, you have like hardwood floor, like cleaner, stuff like
(03:32):
that. So it's all home products, all
consumables and the type of thing that like has some unique
level of form factor on it and something that you are going to
use time and time again once youbuild up that habit.
And so I'm working with a lot ofDC brands right now.
I think you know this and I'm seeing the best people that are
consistently crushing it today have very small tweaks on form
(03:56):
factor and then very good directresponse marketing.
And so like classic example thateveryone's talking about in the
news today is grunes. You know, grunes like the the
vitamin gummy. No, I don't.
You haven't seen them? No grunes.
Gru with like the little 2 dots on top.
NS it is athletic greens. You know, athletic greens.
Yeah, yeah, it's AG1AG1. It is AG one in a gummy.
(04:19):
Sometimes you hear ideas and you're like, it's too easy.
Of course that works. They launched 3 years ago, which
somebody who's watching this on the Internet is going to miss.
Quote or tell me the exact numbers.
I'm fairly confident it's 500 million in sales three years
ago. Just think if we were sitting
here 1000 days ago. Oh.
My gosh, dude, that's a whole industry.
It's like XYZ in a gummy. Yeah, we sell confidence in a
(04:42):
gummy. Yeah, we what wouldn't work in a
gummy. So I think this is where I think
you can literally come up with alaundry list of ideas of things
that would work is take something that's already really
popular and just change the formfactors.
You have this massive Tam novel version of doing it and then go
direct response and it'll crush the other example.
(05:04):
Also very big business. Have you heard of the company
called Starface? No.
OK, you have a daughter, right? How old is your daughter?
13. She'll probably start using
Starface soon. I'm guessing it's like it is a
pimple patch thing. Have you seen this at all?
No, so massive category, Proactive, Neutrogena, whatever
like and all these skin care brands for blemishes normally.
(05:25):
That was how when I was growing up, you clean your face and I
guess people still clean their face, whatever.
But now if you have a pimple, you get acne and it's on your
face. The trendy thing to do is get a
sticker, a star. You put it on your face, like in
public, in public. Wow, so like what Alex Hermosi
is doing with his nose? Strip.
That is perfect analogy, yes. So like before wearing a nose
(05:47):
strip out in public. Weird thing to do.
Nelly. Remember Nelly with the Band-Aid
that was before your. Time.
Yeah, not the rapper, but you just always wear a Band-Aid.
Yeah, I mean, he only wore a Band-Aid for what?
Nothing. That was his brand.
He put a Band-Aid right here. Not even.
Hiding like a little teardrop tattoo or nothing, no.
That was just his trademark. Was the Band-Aid on the face?
So this is something that's trendy starface, big company and
(06:08):
they basically said people have acne, It's a big category.
We're not going to try to fix itat its root cause.
We're going to try to give you astylish way to hide it.
And so I feel like the main ideathat it came in here with that
I've been I know I'm on short notice, I've tried to spin up
some stuff quickly was like withthis oxy clean to bring it full
circle, it's a not great form factor.
(06:31):
Now they have spray. So I will be the first to admit
it's a slightly better form factor.
But like they have the tie to gosticks, they have the spray do.
They do the magic erasers. Is that oxy clean?
I don't know, they might. They probably probably like one
of these big Unilever, Procter and Gamble types of brands at
this point. I'm thinking though, could you
do this in a sticker? And I'm thinking like dad's
(06:51):
wallet's mom's purses, you're out to eat you rather than
having, you know, something that's this big that's kind of
like a wander magic race or whatever.
Can you have something that likehides in your in your wallet?
You pull it out, you peel it, you stick it on the stain and it
releases something instantly. It just stays on the shirt.
Oh OK, so like a stain remover sticker?
Interesting. And it can be different colors.
(07:13):
You know, obviously I'm assumingWhite's going to be the most
popular to kind of blend in witha shirt or whatever.
But maybe there's something out there around like it has to stay
on it longer, therefore the sticker is better.
Or like you don't want to be walking around with a wet shirt
or, I don't know, like, do you want to be walking around with a
sticker? I don't know.
But if you can make it cool, if it's like a little kid and he's
getting food all over stuff, youput a dinosaur sticker on and
you know that's going to clean. It so for clothes specifically.
(07:35):
That's my thought to. Yeah, I don't know.
I think that makes more sense than like carpet because there's
not enough like surface area to I don't know.
I'm thinking like you walk around though with like a power
range. I don't know if Power Rangers
are still cool, like dinosaur stickers, some kind of
licensing, some Disney things, Pokémon, and next thing you
know, it's got like some kind ofsticky residue on the outside
with a cleaning residue on the inside.
(07:58):
Put it on a shirt. I think that could work really
well. That is an amazing idea because
like, first of all, it doesn't have to work all that well
because that's not the problem you're solving.
You're you're solving embarrassment.
But the parent kid doesn't care,right?
If I'm out with my kids and theyget a big stain on their shirt
and we're about to go somewhere nice, it is what it is.
They're kids. But if I could have a solution
(08:18):
to that problem, I would buy it,right?
And if I could know, as a bonus,it's going to help that stain
come out when you do throw it inthe wash.
It's a no brainer and it's consumable.
So you buy more and more of them.
Buy a pack of them. You're selling a very cheap
thing for a pretty high markup because you're solving that
embarrassment problem. Yeah, that's really interesting.
I want to know more about Starface like you know their
(08:40):
what their founding story is or?So I think the CEO does a lot of
these beauty products and is is really good retail connections.
And so I think they've gone a little bit of a different way
rather than going traditionally D to C but I know that they've
scaled up fast in just a couple of years time.
And like, I think culturally they've really defined a lot of
stuff. Are they in stores or is it?
Yeah, no, I think it's like it'sUlta targets all that, all that
(09:01):
stuff. Are boys wearing them?
I'm not wearing them. But like is it a thing just for
girls or are both genders wearing it I've.
Seen guys wear them. Really.
Yeah. Even in your 20s, thirties,
people wear. Them, I think it's one of those
things where like you're in a city like New York, you're going
to have a lot of people wearing them.
Like I'm, I'm trying to think like you go to like raves or
like if you go to like music, music festivals, this stuff is
done all the time. I think it's something that like
(09:23):
would would I wear it to work? Absolutely not.
Would the average creative maybe.
Yeah. Like I think middle school,
early high school, those are a lot more like kind of the target
markets and like the early times.
See, I would think that draws more attention to a a pimple.
It definitely does, but it's nota pimple anymore.
Do they tell people what it is or why they're using it?
(09:44):
I think people know. I think people know at this
point. And honestly, like, I didn't
know. And then as soon as I heard it,
like I bet, I don't know if it'sas blatant as like you're going
to walk to the go to the airportafter this and see them, but
like you'll start seeing them pop up in your life.
And what I would have originallyattributed to, oh, maybe
someone's going to a concert or they're doing some special event
later. I'm now realizing is, Oh no,
(10:05):
they're just, they're going to the library, they're going to
the supermarket, and they just had this cover up on and it's
that simple. Do you know how they grew?
Was it just Facebook ads? I think retail, I think a lot of
retail connections, which is interesting.
It's like you have a lot of these different buyers.
Once you form a connection with them in one category, like you
know, you have target, you have Walmart, you have Ulta, you have
Sephora. I think Sephora's a part of
(10:27):
Ulta. Once you get connected with like
the health and Wellness buyer orthe beauty buyer or the whatever
buyer, then that's your channel,right?
And so now it's, it is let me sell as much as possible and
make sure that the product is good.
But now let me get more productsto also sell to you because now
I can fill out more shells and Italk to them and I say, Hey,
what's your worst products on this category in the let's say
(10:48):
we're talking supplements. Like what is your worst?
Are you guys moving a lot of torrent today?
Are you guys moving a lot of creatine today?
Oh, we're moving a ton of creatine.
OK. Like what can we do to get
another product in there? That's a differentiator.
Oh, we've been talking with our buying team and like people want
to see creatine with caffeine. Great.
I'm going to work on that. I'll get back to you in six
months. And you build up those
relationships really strong. What have people not put in the
(11:09):
gummy yet? What's left out there?
That's the ultimate question. There's caffeine.
There's there's every. There's every a health one,
right? Like I don't know if you ever
took like the Flintstone gummiesgrowing up, but like that was a
staple. I think what you have to do is
find the most annoying form factor and like the creatine
gummies are blowing up. I'm sure you've ever seen those.
Those are great because creatine's chalky and it's
(11:30):
annoying to take. So then you see goalie was the
original guise of it and I thinkthey did the apple cider vinegar
ones, but so green juices, people want that.
I think like maybe like better magnesium gummies, but these
days gummies are you're probablylate on the gummy curve at this
point. When I hear $500 million in
three years with a gummy I don'tlike, I'm asking the question to
(11:52):
you. What other things do you put in
a gummy? But really what the question is,
is like should someone just go compete directly with them?
With the grins, yes, I think they have a lot.
But like 500 million in three years tells me way more demand
than supply. Take a little bit of a different
angle or the same angle. Just capture a little bit of
that. OK, so the other thing that
they've done that I think is really clever is if you go to
(12:13):
CVS and you go down the vitamin aisle and you're looking at a
bunch of gummies. It is this big plastic tub with
150 gummies in it and you pick it off whatever.
What they've done, which is really cool, is everything is a
travel pack. So you get this big bag and then
within that bag, environmentalist cover years,
there's like 50 more little bags.
Oh I hate that so much. Like as a capitalist I love it
(12:36):
as someone who just doesn't wantto waste stuff.
I get it, I get it, but it probably increases consumption
so much because then you're travelling for a week, you don't
want to break that habit and then you have to go grab a
bunch. So I listened to the founder on
a podcast before and he talked about how that packaging no Co
manufacturer would do it for them.
Like they literally had to go toevery single one of these
(12:56):
commands and have them reinvent one of their processes to figure
out how to get I don't know the exact number.
I think it's like 7 or 8 little gummies into one sachet and then
put that all the sachets into one bigger like bigger bag.
So like that was that was a lot of the innovation that had to go
in there. Yeah.
I mean, they wouldn't have done that if they didn't think it
would work. Agreed.
So I think if if the question iswhat other gummies are going to
(13:19):
work, I know that grunes just released an immunity one, which
is different than I guess greens.
It's like, you know, your vitamin C stuff.
I know that sleep is a massive category that gets talked about
a lot these days. I think that caffeine would be a
really interesting one as well. What about custom gummies?
What about you go to a fancy Shopify site and there's a
little form and you say, what doyou want to optimize for sleep,
(13:42):
creatine, health, right? And maybe like on the back end
there's like 20 different combinations.
That way there's not like 2 million combinations of
supplements and you just order your own custom gummies I.
Think that makes total sense? Like you're never going to go
somewhere else to buy those. I think, I think as long as it's
easy enough to make or like you have to buy a year's worth
(14:02):
something like that, I think that the hard part there is the
manufacturing, but the marketingsells itself.
Yeah, the two biggest categoriesin GTC right now are probably
the the gummification of things and electrolytes.
Right now you just see every electrolyte brand out of the sun
just running up. I still need to make my busy
juice and sell that. I think it would do well.
I think it would do well. Maybe some kind of combination
(14:25):
of that, right? Rather than like like the gummy
of Gatorade, basically. Yeah, you know, Gummy of
Gatorade. Like that a GGI.
Like that? Yeah, this is reminds me of an
idea I've had. So one of my hundred 200 domain
names is racetattoos.com. OK.
Now I used to run ultra marathons, trail races, and have
(14:45):
you ever ran on like a trail race?
I've done a marathon, not a trail race.
OK. So even with a marathon, like
there's two things you want to kind of keep track of throughout
the race. The elevation profile.
When am I going uphill? When am I going downhill?
And like the, the pacing, where are the aid stations?
Is this 3 loops? Is it and, and is it out and
back? Is it like a lollipop?
(15:06):
Right? They have all different types
and like when you're out there, especially for 5 to 50 hours,
like you kind of want to know where am I at, right?
So I thought it would be cool tokind of do like a permissionless
marketing thing where you make these temporary tattoos and
there's a bunch of companies that make them, but they're it's
a temporary tattoo of the elevation profile of your race.
(15:27):
And you can do it for five KS. It doesn't have to be ultra
marathons, right? And then you get there, you
anytime you do a race, you get alittle packet, a shirt, metal or
whatever adds. What's the LMNT that?
You get stuff like that that's great.
And you just pull out a temporary tattoo and you put it
on before the race. And as you're running, you're
just like, oh, here. Oh, I got an aid station coming
(15:47):
up. It's like a Google Maps.
I think that's I think that's great and I feel like there's so
many ways you can play with it too.
Like even if it's like if you'remaking bespoke ones, it can be
like, all right, let me overlay like what I want my nutrition
plan to be on it to like add this mile marker I should eat.
I don't know if you already haveguides that and aids that like
do that for you, but like, it atleast gives you a couple like
reminders or things like that you can keep in the back of your
(16:09):
mind too. Yeah.
Well, it's also like it's very Instagrammable.
If you put that on, you're goingto post it, right?
And they have like semi permanent tattoos that will last
for like weeks or months, right?And if it were something like
that, then it's like it's just free marketing.
So to the. Race to the tattoo company.
I think it would do super well. I also think that yeah, like you
(16:30):
get it in your in your starter pack or whatever like that.
I think another version of this that could be really interesting
and this depends on how hard it is to make custom temporary
tattoos. So hinges a lot on the
manufacturing. So have you, you're down in
Dallas, Have you ever been at ACL or any of these big kind of
music festivals things? No.
OK, Austin City Lament. Yeah, no, haven't been.
(16:52):
So you basically get this crazy lineup at the beginning of the
thing, and I'm gonna connect this idea in a second, but you
get this crazy lineup of like, here's three days, here's 100
acts, whatever. These bands on Thursday, Friday,
Saturday and. So then you can have a group
chat with your friends and you say, who do you wanna see?
And every single day, And these things literally draw hundreds
of thousands of people out to them every single day.
(17:15):
What people that are my age do will be they, they get their
Friday lineup and they highlightit and they'll make something
kind of bespoke and they'll screenshot it and they'll put it
as their phone background. And then Saturday, they'll.
Wake up, you're always referringto it.
Yes. And then Saturday they'll wake
up and they'll be like here's like, I wanna go from Stage 1 to
Stage 2 to Stage 3. I wanna see this person at 7:00
PM and this person at 9:00 PM. So 100% right.
(17:36):
So, so you're going to the weekend and it's EDC Orlando and
it's Friday. We got this stage, this time,
this person. And it's like you're walking
around. It's like, oh, where are you
going at 7? It's like, let me check.
Yeah, exactly. And it's a, it's a big event.
It's something that like people spend a lot of money on.
Tickets for these things can range from 500 to $1200 if not
more for the full weekend type of event.
(17:58):
You're paying for lodging already, you're paying for food,
you're paying for all of this stuff that like if you tell me
it's $50.00 for a spoke thing cuz girls and everyone's already
paying for like makeup and hair and other stuff.
I think it could be a pretty bigmarket.
Dude, the question is do you tryto get the people to pay for it
or do you get Austin City Limitsto pay for it and include it for
free? Yeah, I think if it's you get
(18:20):
everything, then Austin City Limits will do it.
If it's no, I want Chris's lineup and I want like, I don't
care about Rascal Flatts, but I can't miss Zac Bryant and
therefore Zac Rascal Flatts is not on here, but the Zac Bryant
at Xfinity stage at 7:00 PM is then that would be a better one.
Yeah, cuz when I first started looking at this idea, I found a
dozen companies that will make custom temporary tattoos.
(18:41):
How much do they cost? A few bucks really.
Yeah, it's not bad. It's pretty great.
Just send them a design and they're like, you know, 100
piece minimum or whatever the cheaper it gets.
But so you don't have to become like a manufacturer.
You're just like white labeling it, right.
Listen, Beehive has always been the best newsletter platform for
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(19:45):
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code Chris 30 to get 30% off your first three months.
That's BEHII v.com/chris. If we go back to races, like
(20:09):
there's no company that only puts on one race a year, right?
Like generally it's a business. They'll have multiple races a
year. And so I would just proactively
send the race director, you know, if I know they're, they
have 3000 spots, I'll send them 3000 tattoos and say hey, this
is free. I thought you'd like.
Like it, Go ahead and put them in every bag or whatever,
they're for sure going to come back and buy from you.
(20:29):
Assuming people like it, they get good feedback.
And putting a hats on that wouldbe pretty hilarious.
Yeah. I mean, racetattoos.com right
there, right? Or I'm thinking like, or like
sell ad space on the tattoo. Nobody, nobody has successfully
gotten tattoo advertising down the way that it should.
Kind of like, you know, use Gatorade as an example, like,
but you have Gatorade on top of it and you can tell Gatorade,
(20:52):
hey, I know for a fact, you know, we have a 10% adoption
rate of all that we send New York City Marathon is 50,000
people running it. We're going to have 5000 people
with Gatorade temporarily tattooed on their arm for the
next week. It's pretty good.
Oh, all day. Right.
Oh, man, Especially if you couldget like, you could get multiple
people to pay for it. Yeah, you get Gatorade to pay
(21:13):
for it. You can get the race to pay for
it and then you could even, you could upsell like more custom
temporary tattoos to the actual participants if they wanted to
show it off right? You, you could just direct
people to your website with AQR code or something 'cause I'm
thinking like if I have all thatsurface area for people wearing
my product, I want to try to sell them something as well.
(21:35):
Now what is that? I don't know, Maybe it's just
like a semi permanent tattoo business where they can say like
I ran out an ultra marathon, youknow, for like 3 months.
So honestly, what I was. Expecting you to say when you
first brought up race tattoos, it was like a badge of honor
type of thing. And like, you know, I'm sure if
I was a bigger runner or like people who are just, you know,
the truer Hanes of the world, whatever, like these guys could
(21:58):
probably just start checking it off and almost make it like a
cool like badge thing. I wonder if there's something
there or it's like, fill it in and you like the hard part there
is, you know, a big enough market size and then you just
make it culturally relevant. So like the idea of you showing
up to a race right now with all of your races that you've ever
run tattooed. I'd be like, OK, this guy's
pretty freaking legit. And that's probably a small
market size, But if you can makeit culturally relevant of like
(22:20):
we're going from the LA to the New York City Marathon are we
just did the Moab 240, now we'redoing the Bigfoot 200.
Like that would be a lot cooler,I think, yeah, especially
because. It's such a passionate audience
and they're proud of what they did.
It's like a it's like a human bumper sticker, right?
Like how many times have you seen a bumper sticker?
This is 13.1 point 6.2. It's like a tattoo version of
(22:41):
that. I like that dude.
Here's. Another idea in the.
Same vein so bike races right? I read this stat that said Rd.
cyclists ingest like so much exhaust from cars it.
More than. Offsets like the health benefits
they get from cycling it either more than offsets or it
partially offsets to where it's like you net out even right
(23:03):
'cause there's that's a crazy. Stat.
It's crazy. And so I was looking into these
things and we all remember the COVID era at the face mask, this
guy like in India or somewhere invented like this nostril mask.
And it's just like a little sticker.
You put one there, you put one there and it's a filter, right?
Yep. Love so same.
(23:24):
Distribution idea. You give it to the races for
free, they put them in the bags and cyclists can wear them.
And then when they pull up to a stop light and they're behind
cars, they just don't open theirmouth and it filters out the
crap. How well does it work?
Nobody knows. Yeah, yeah, certainly better
than not having anything, right?I mean the.
Reality is with a lot of this stuff, it is problem solution
(23:44):
framework. It is deer exactly solution
framework, like everyone who cycles this health conscious,
obviously to start. And so to even just basically
say like this will do something and like have some results, like
don't don't be selling snake oilor whatever, like to have some
results. People are going to buy it.
And the nice part is it's subscription and you're going to
be able to have these different packs like similar with like
(24:05):
hostage and you can ship as from.
Coming from an e-commerce background, like you could ship
it in an envelope for like 50-4 cents, whatever the cost of a
stamp is because they're so flatit's less than an ounce.
Do you cycle? Yeah, do.
You I'm just. Thinking do you breathe through
your mouth or do you breathe your nose?
I don't even know well. The reason I ask is because.
And I'm wondering something that's already pretty popular is
a lot of this mouth tape for sleeping.
(24:26):
Yeah. So you think of like hostage
tape. Think of a couple other
companies like that. Could you just do the mouth tape
for recycling? Like can you take the same exact
product and rather than putting somebody sleeping on it, just
put somebody cycling and then cuz like your nose is already
natural filter. Yeah, yeah.
And so if people have the tendency and listen, not medical
advice consultant Dr. But like if people already have the
(24:47):
tendency to breathe through their mouth, however people can
breathe through their nose and it is just a habit that needs to
be formed and you can say your nose is a natural filtration
device, whatever, then I think it would be interesting to sell
bike tape and it's right over your mouth.
Well, it doesn't just have to be.
Cycling either, like I don't remember, but I've heard like in
running to optimize your breathing or endurance or
whatever you like inhale throughyour mouth and exhale through
(25:10):
your mouth, something like that.And that's like common
knowledge, right? For runners, Clearly I'm not a
runner because I don't remember what that knowledge is.
But if you were to just sell like the mouth tape for that,
like a, a functional mouth tape for a different purpose, that
might not work 5 or 10 years agobefore the mouth tape company.
But now that people are accustomed to seeing the ads,
seeing that it's normal, it's like, oh, this is just for
(25:30):
running. This has helped me remember to
run better. Therefore, I'll have more
endurance and I'll get a better time.
Theoretically, I think it makes a.
Lot of sense I think also the the fear part there's the
benefit part of I'm gonna be a better athlete out of this,
which is like aspirational sell that vision, whatever then
there's the don't you want to actually make sure you're not
breathing in toxic stuff, especially when you're breathing
(25:52):
the most that you ever do in anygiven day and I feel like that
would sell really well yeah yeahwith the.
Nostril things I love that it's already a product cuz it's right
now it's being marketed as like a a slimmer alternative to the
face mask right. You just license that thing put
it in different packaging. There's, I think, a big.
Trend in a lot of products around there around filtration,
(26:12):
filtration of water filtration of air, filtration of all of the
dust that's in your vents, whichI guess is the air part of it.
Big money industry, very big money.
And so I think what you can do is try to figure out what are
the other categories that you can put that in.
I love the filtration of air forcyclists, filtration of air for
athletes, filtration of water. I don't really know.
Like you see a lot of like the shower head stuff popping up
(26:34):
right now, a lot of faucet stuff, a lot of harsh chemicals
that like there's probably a lotof money to be made in that
space just with like more niche positioning.
Yeah, I know that they have. Like filtered shower heads,
right? What are those filters supposed
to be removing Chloride. Chloridea heavy metals, this is
what they told me, but it's it'sheavy metals.
(26:55):
It's a lot of like, I don't knowif it's bacteria.
I don't know what, what exactly it is, but it's stuff that
impacts your skin and your hair.Like the value prop that you see
on a lot of the ads is better, fuller hair, cleaner, healthier
skin and all that stuff. Do they have one for?
Microplastics like a shower headto filter out microplastics?
No, but that would be. Interesting.
(27:17):
Somebody just launched a companythat audits your environments.
Have you heard about this? Do you know what I'm talking
about at all? It's like I haven't heard of
the. Specific company you're thinking
of, but I'm familiar with the concept with the industry, so I
think. Like I'd be wrong about this.
Somebody will come to your houseor somebody will do a zoom call
around your house and they'll say show me how you cook and
you'll you'll show them a not stainless steel pan.
They'll be like, OK, check mark.Yeah, exactly.
(27:40):
You hate your kids. They'll be like, bring me up to
your event. All right, I see some dust over
there, like see your filter or whatever it is basically like AI
don't know if it's A at cost or a free consultation and then UPS
all these product enhancements, whether it's a lighting, your
ceilings or the shower drain or whatever the hell it is.
Right. And so to your point on
filtering out microplastics, I think this initial consulting
(28:01):
service based business is reallygreat to capture a large
audience. And then as far as filtering out
microplastics, it's probably probably a new microwave or like
it's probably like not heating the plastic or like removing
like it's a hard, it's a hard holistic problem.
I think, you know, yeah, I feel like with those home.
Audits. People would pay for that like
(28:22):
they would pay to be up sold other products.
So this is where like. You and I might have talked
about this in the past, Merrick Health.
Do you remember this at all? We might have not talked about
it. Merrick Health, Merrick Health,
something like that. It is a company that will do a
relatively low cost blood test because for them the blood test
is like, all right, we're going to get you in the door and we're
going to be like The Pioneers ofdata.
(28:42):
Like we're going to be very consultative and you're going to
trust us. And then once you get the blood
test back, it's like, Chris, you're actually really low on
iron and vitamin D and like you're pretty deficient in these
other five categories. We can put you on a program
that's customer and bespoke to you and buy all the gummies and
vitamins to rust directly and just stay on subscription.
And then we'll test your blood again in six months and you'll
see if we've improved anything. And that's a really good way to
(29:05):
do it because you get this consultative, these people are
smart approach. And then it's, well, you just
gave me the problem now give me the solution.
And I think for the what's wrongwith my environment, there's
like you can change out iridescent light bulbs.
Like I'm currently in my apartment right now just going
through all that phase of doing like floor up lighting and like
trying to make it a softer spaceat night.
(29:26):
And like, I watched a bunch of these YouTube videos and kind of
hacked it together. But if there's somebody that I
could call instantly and I'm like, hey, here's my apartment.
Like give me 5 lamps and like where to put them in and like
set up my Alexa for me. Like that would be a great
service. And I think that you could do
that for your environment. For health products.
Yeah. Have you heard of?
Function Health, yes. Yeah, they're, they're big and
you can't use them in New York City though.
(29:48):
Really. Yeah.
I think it's, I think. There's some legal thing there.
OK, I I'm. Using them?
Do you like it? Yeah.
I mean it's like I think it's like 6 or 800 bucks a year and
you that includes 2 blood tests.It seems like a no.
Brainer. Yeah.
And you just go to. Like a LabCorp or whatever and
you get like 12 vials of blood drawn and two weeks later they
(30:08):
give you your testosterone and your blood like, oh, it's like
103 different biomarkers, right?What I did with that is
tediously screenshotted every single result and it was like
green, yellow, red. It's got beautiful design.
It's like an Airbnb feel. And then I just uploaded it to a
Chai GBT project and I was like fix me and now I take pills
every night like a boomer. Right But but do you add?
(30:31):
That do your do your new biomarkers look better?
I haven't taken the. Second one yet it's been like 3
months. I'm going to get another one in
three months. I take fish oil, I take niacin,
I take vitamin B complex and like, I just think it's so funny
when people start like taking pills and they're like, dude, I
just feel so much better. I just feel so much.
(30:52):
It's like nothing. Do you?
It's cheap insurance. I just I've never had a.
Period in my life where like I just, I always feel good.
I was 260 lbs and I felt good. I just don't know.
It's all confirmation bias, right?
I think there's SO. Much there's a personality type
that is super optimized heavy and as a result of that it makes
(31:12):
it such that you actually never feel good because you can always
be doing a little bit better. And I actually think this is a
maybe a side tangent that's not as business related, but like
the good that probably a lot of the Huberman and fairest stuff
of the world has done can probably also be pretty offset
by the person who actually feelsworse the next day because they
(31:32):
got 7 hours and 55 minutes of sleep versus the exact, you
know, 8 1/2 hours that they wereregimented to get more like, you
know, God forbid they looked at their phone within an hour of
going to sleep. And like at a grant at a high
level, I think all of this advice is actually very helpful
and directionally correct. But like when you are obsessed
with getting the perfect thing, whether it's the perfect level
of fish oil in your bloodstream or like the perfect weight on
(31:55):
the scale or whatever, you're actually never going to feel
good no matter what. And so I think that it's just
like a mindset shift, honestly, for a lot of it, like the the
pills do very little, especiallywith these supplements.
Yeah. And really the.
Only thing that makes me feel like really good is caffeine.
Everything else is just secondary.
I want to say I think I think. Creatine does a little bit for
me at the gym. I need to do it.
I need to. Take it, I think.
(32:16):
I think there's like the. Meme of like what you think
you're going to feel like when you have creatine and it's like
the it's like an Instagram videoof everyone using those fake
glass bottles. It's like your toast, me, your
beer just smashes in his hand. Like the reality is you'll
probably get one or two more reps on everything in the gym.
That's kind of it. And that's if you're consistent
with it. But it's like the very tiny
game. I was listening.
To another podcast and they saidthat of the top three best
(32:39):
selling creatine gummies on Amazon, two of them had 0
creatine 0. And So what Sup code does is
they'll test everything. They'll they'll take it into a
lab unbiased third party. They're not like they
strategically don't have affiliate links.
Like they're unbiased. Like they charge for the app.
That's how they make money because they know they have to,
right? They'll be unbiased.
(33:00):
So you can go use the app and see like, oh, like I need to
take these creatine gummies. Oh, these might be good, but
they haven't been tested yet. Oh, these.
I thought that's a really interesting business model and
I'm wondering what else you could do that with.
I'm trying to think it's like. It's almost like giving like
you're selling trust, right? And so I'm thinking like it's
like the Michelin stars of rating or like the IMDb, which
if that was actually relevant ofthe Rotten Tomatoes, whatever of
(33:22):
food. I don't really think you need
that in a different category or I guess you do for the sake of
thinking of new business ideas. But there's free of pure is the
name of the brand that everyone goes to and you almost want to
see their manufacturing brand ontheir logo.
And you see like David's proteinButch spot.
I forget. Do you remember about like the
(33:43):
EPG thing? No, they bought like whatever
protein allows them to have likethis crazy caloric difference.
Oh, I did hear about that. It's.
All manufactured, I don't think.It's EPG.
It's just something like that. The David Bar, Yeah.
Exactly, I think finding. Like a trusted third party of
one specific thing, whether that's creatine, whether that's
the bioavailability of a certainsupplement, I think makes sense.
(34:04):
I know that there's another company out there called Seed
Oil Scout. I've heard of that.
You heard of them? Yes.
They will do like all of the restaurants in New York City and
show you the ones that do not use CEO and they have like a
Yelp like. The directory for exactly so I
think you still. Find something that people
really care about, like probablya good one based on that earlier
conversation would be like filtration and like air quality.
Yeah. Or something like that.
Like can you have someone test air quality at every Marriott
(34:27):
across America and that therefore you're staying in
hotels that like only actually are sanitary and like follow a
code or something like that? What if you did like a?
Sepco for popular snacks or foods.
Yeah, for their, their caloric contents or their ingredients,
right. So I, I love old trapper beef
jerky and they have this, it's like teriyaki and they have
(34:48):
these medallions and they're really good.
And I was eating them last summer like a ton and they were
like, I think they were like 10 calories per medallion.
And I was just crushing them, right.
But then I looked at the, the weight and it was like 1
medallion was like 28g, which isan ounce.
And when I did the math on like the, the nutritional facts
differently, it was off by 100%,right?
(35:09):
So basically I, I just divided by the weight of the serving
size or something. They were 20 calories per,
right? And I think it was because they
were like 14 pieces for 140 calories.
But when you looked at the weight, it was actually 280
calories. And I was like, this is like a
massive brand. These are sold in every gas
station every and it's wrong by 100%.
And it's just because I happen to do the math.
(35:31):
It's got to be wrong everywhere.I don't know how it works.
With some of these companies that you would think that they
would be more conscious of it sothat way they don't get in
trouble with like the FDA or whoever monitors this type of
stuff. I can tell you right now for the
supplement space, it is like it is probably the one thing that
you can get away with so much asyou kind of just pointed out
with Sups. I mean, at the end of the day,
like people are going to eat that beef jerky because they
(35:52):
like it tastes good and fills them up, whatever.
No one is taking supplements because they taste, I guess the
gummies maybe, but like because they taste good and because it
like fills them up necessarily, you're only doing it because you
want the desired outcome that you think of this will make you
more healthy. And so if it's not accomplishing
that goal, the efficacy is just really important for this type
of stuff. Well, I found out the.
(36:13):
Same thing when I was trying to make my busy juice drink.
I was trying to buy lemon powderand I learned by accident that
this lemon powder I had been using for mine, it was supposed
to be pure 100% lemon. That's what the IT showed, but
it wasn't at all. It was like crystallized.
And I talked to this chemist andhe's like, if it's crystallized,
they've added the sweeteners like this should not be sweet at
all. And it was.
(36:33):
I'm like. Right, like isn't.
Anyone looking at this and then when I was doing keto for like 6
months, I had like these this product from Trader Joe's and it
was like 2 net carbs and like I was testing my blood for ketones
and it was right wrong. So it's like, OK, the three
times that I've actually held the, you know, the nutritional
value feet to the phone, Yeah, that's crazy.
(36:54):
They. Were all wrong.
Yeah, so just so. A food ACPG version of Subs?
Yes, all you. Need is a it's called a bomb
calorimeter. It's like this little device
that anyone can buy where you you take food, you grind it up,
you dehydrate it to get all the water content out, and then you
put it in like a pill form and you burn it and the machine
measures how much energy is emitted from burning it.
(37:16):
That's the calories. Those are the calories, right?
That's cool. And however.
Many heat. Calories are emitted that's how
many calories that that food had.
So you had to get you got to basically take a slice of pizza.
You let it dry 100% blend it up,put it in a pill form and then
you light on fire in this enclosed space and it measures
how much energy is coming out. Oh, that's super fun.
I. Have no idea.
(37:37):
You would basically take like. A box of Cheez its or something
and you would do all that and then you'd say, all right, we
can affirm that this lot number has actually this many calories.
The carbs are this much, the fats are this much.
And so, you know, a lot of thesefoods we eat every single day,
Like I'll eat a quest bar one totwo times a day, the same thing.
And it could be completely wrongand it could be having a
(37:57):
completely detrimental effect onmy body and I have no idea.
That's really interesting. Eat Whole Foods I think is the
eat Whole Foods and develop Subsfor CPG.
There you go that. I think there could be a
business there, especially if there's just like.
A verified like I think you haveto basically how do you do it
though? Because I think you have to make
a marketing campaign that your nutritional labels are lying to
you and basically an attack on the government and the FDA and
(38:20):
whoever makes that kind of stuffand says if you want the real
information, come here and basically start with the whole
like actually audited version ofthat.
That could spread so. Easily with short period video.
Yeah, I like that. All right, What's your idea all?
Right. How much time do we have all?
Right. We got, we got 3 minutes.
Let me you're going to get an elevator pitch and if we want to
do a deep dive on this later, wecan.
So you're in New York right now,there are ton of bath houses
(38:41):
here and one that has recently popped up that is taking over
New York City. And if you're in your 20s and
30s, like you've probably heard about it 'cause it's a big like
social Wellness thing is othership other ship is crushing
it. They are this like sonar cold
plunge steam room type. I don't think I've seen steam
rooms, but really cool novel experience.
And they took this, you know, however many year old, hundreds
(39:04):
of year old concept, hot and cold and they made it trendy and
cool. So there's another concept that
is hundreds of years old or or has been around for a while that
has gotten a little bit trendier, but honestly hasn't
had like a good brand dominate it.
And that's silent meditation retreats.
And so we've seen it pop up morein the last tech era of like the
(39:24):
last 15 years, whatever of like these tech gurus, they're going
away for three days, five days, seven days, whatever.
They're not talking to anybody. No phones disconnected from
technology. They come back, they were
healed, they had the realizationabout themselves, whatever.
But if I asked anybody, you know, what, what sign of
meditation or did you do? There is not a, there's no
brand. There's not a clear one thing.
(39:46):
And maybe that's because the market's not big enough.
Maybe that's because the versionof it is not accessible enough
yet, whatever that looks like. But like, you know, people made
tiny houses trendy via like getaway, they've made cold
plunges and Sauna's trendy from other ship.
And so there's a lot of ways that I think that you can make
this concept trendy, and a lot of it probably comes down to,
you know, make it more accessible.
(40:07):
You didn't do a seven day silentmeditation retreat.
You did a 48 hour silent meditation retreat. 4 hours.
Or like an afternoon, honestly. Yeah, yeah, probably.
And I think it's in the maybe, maybe you can do it within a
place, right? Like, hey, I'm going here on a
Thursday night to just clear my thoughts and not think about
anything like shut the world outand they take my phone in the
beginning or whatever. 4 hours. It's actually probably the
(40:28):
smarter version. I didn't think about that.
I was going to say do it, you know, within a 90 minute drive
of the city. To your point, do it in the
city, like New York City is the loudest, most busy place on that
freaking planet, or at least in the US.
And if you can walk in and reliably say I'm going to give
you this, I'm going to use my phone.
Maybe there's like some de stress protocol.
And then it's 4 hours sitting ata freaking wall and like you're
(40:50):
in a distraction and free environment where you're like,
why don't you just do that in your living room?
It's like my TV, my Kindle, my iPad, my laptop, my phone.
And so like this forces me to bepresent.
What do you think? I love it and kind of like.
People taking supplements sayingI feel so much better, they're
going to come out of there beinglike, that was incredible.
Yep, I changed my life. Yep.
And it's going to. Spread and it's going to be,
I've got a lot to think about. I'm going to go into Chamber,
(41:11):
whatever you want to brand it as, I think it could do really
well, call it. Quiet Place.
Quiet Place like the movie? Yeah, I was going to say quick.
Quick lawsuit and then we're right back.
That's fine. That's fine.
That's a good one. You wouldn't need a lot of
space. It could be like a very small
room. I think it could be a very.
Small room. You could probably have two
versions. You could probably have like
like a phone booth, like a weekly phone booth kind of set
up almost where it's like, all right, I'm here.
(41:33):
And then you could probably havea group room where it's like you
walk in and I've talked to some people who have done these
things and some of it's like, you know, they walk in a circle
for four hours or like they sit on a pillow and they look at the
wall. But like the point is that it's
intentionally pretty unstructured and unguided.
And I would say for something like other ship, other ship got
a lot of notoriety because they'll do like these classes
(41:54):
and they'll do these breath workclasses.
And so there's probably a world where you can mix breath work
into it. There's probably a world where
like you can work with somebody on like setting intentions going
into it or like get a prompt to reflect on or like there's a
coaching element to it. Like there's probably a lot of
like upsells and like flavors ofit.
But I think that you could also sell like to your point, like,
could you sell a 2 hour slot for120 bucks?
(42:15):
Would people pay that? I don't know.
But like you're, you're basically selling the ability to
get away from all distractions. I bet people would pay it.
I love it, man. Yeah, Thank you.
Cool. All right.
It is AG one in a gummy, all it is.
Sometimes you hear ideas and you're like, it's too easy.
Of course that works. They launched 3 years ago.
I'm fairly confident it's 500 million in sales.
Oh my gosh dude, that's a whole industry. 500 million in three
years tells me way more demand than supply.
Take something that's already really popular and just change
(00:20):
the form factor and it'll crush.Actually clean has done 5
billion plus in sales at this point.
Big money industry, very big money.
And so I think what you can do is try to figure out what the
other categories that you can put that in.
You're selling a very cheap thing for a pretty high markup
because you're solving that embarrassment problem.
Yeah, that is an amazing idea. It's a no brainer.
(00:43):
You may recognize Connor. He's been on the pod 5 or 6
times. He lives here in New York.
So I flew to New York and sat down with him to talk business
ideas. Please enjoy.
So tell me what you've been learning about Billy Mays.
Man Billy Mays. Is he still alive?
No. RFP.
Billy Mays born out. Billy Mays.
Yeah. This guy made billions,
basically. Long story short, you think like
(01:03):
the late night infomercial that maybe like people's crazy
cousins or crazy uncles now watch these days.
He was the king of it. And what I wanted to come into
today's conversation with was kind of understanding how he
made so much money and like whatthe top products were.
And like, back then, late night infomercials were the way to
sell products. That's how you moved, moved
volume. Now it's D to C.
(01:24):
Now it's meta ads and like it's TikTok, TikTok TA GPT search,
little Geo stuff. And so I was like, he's clearly
selling stuff that people wantedto buy.
How do you sell it again in a way that is not on ATV and not
using CTV because you know, the audience for that is dwindled to
a fraction of the size. And so I started diving into
some of the top sellers and do do you know where the stop
(01:47):
sellers are? Have you done any research?
Here on this was he the flex seal guy?
Yes, yeah, yeah, yeah. The, the well, we spray painted
an entire boat. He's like we put a screen door
in the bottom of this canoe. Like what?
A visual hook on that commercial.
It was classic direct response marketing, like, yeah, to AT and
now I feel like you have all these e-commerce guys who are
turning around and they're like,we're doing 45 minute long VS LS
(02:07):
and like we are going after heavy hooks and all that stuff.
And all they're doing is they'rejust taking the stuff that
worked in direct response back in the 90s and early 2000s.
They're just putting it on meta.And So what I thought was like,
what were the categories and theproducts that somebody who was
as iconic as Billy Mays was? What was he selling?
And how can you then apply that to social media and sell it
(02:28):
again? And so you remember the Flex
seal? Flex Seal's iconic.
The slap it on is like the classic meme but his number one
products. Any guesses do do you know any?
Categories. I saw your tweet so I'm going.
To. It's not that.
Oh really? OK, so your tweet was about
rosary chicken. So that was not him, I don't
think. Oh, OK.
Yeah, I don't even remember his products.
Like what? Let's do this.
(02:48):
Yeah, tell me all of his products and I'll try to guess
the more successful ones. You're going to know when I say
it. So it's it's Oxyclean.
Oh. He was Oxyclean.
He was Oxyclean, OK. And Oxyclean has done 5 billion
plus in sales at this point. So like simple idea of what
Oxyclean is stain remover. Now they have it more on the
spray. Before it was like this little
(03:09):
tub and you would scoop out thispowder, you put it on the shirt,
you kind of like rub it in a little bit and you toss the
shirt in the wash. And so Oxyclean was one of the
top categories. You look at all of the other
products, it's bathroom cleaners.
It's like a glue that was remodeled to like fix up seams
of jeans and like if your couch cushion split like it's a fabric
sealant, you have like hardwood floor, like cleaner, stuff like
(03:32):
that. So it's all home products, all
consumables and the type of thing that like has some unique
level of form factor on it and something that you are going to
use time and time again once youbuild up that habit.
And so I'm working with a lot ofDC brands right now.
I think you know this and I'm seeing the best people that are
consistently crushing it today have very small tweaks on form
(03:56):
factor and then very good directresponse marketing.
And so like classic example thateveryone's talking about in the
news today is grunes. You know, grunes like the the
vitamin gummy. No, I don't.
You haven't seen them? No grunes.
Gru with like the little 2 dots on top.
NS it is athletic greens. You know, athletic greens.
Yeah, yeah, it's AG1AG1. It is AG one in a gummy.
(04:19):
Sometimes you hear ideas and you're like, it's too easy.
Of course that works. They launched 3 years ago, which
somebody who's watching this on the Internet is going to miss.
Quote or tell me the exact numbers.
I'm fairly confident it's 500 million in sales three years
ago. Just think if we were sitting
here 1000 days ago. Oh.
My gosh, dude, that's a whole industry.
It's like XYZ in a gummy. Yeah, we sell confidence in a
(04:42):
gummy. Yeah, we what wouldn't work in a
gummy. So I think this is where I think
you can literally come up with alaundry list of ideas of things
that would work is take something that's already really
popular and just change the formfactors.
You have this massive Tam novel version of doing it and then go
direct response and it'll crush the other example.
(05:04):
Also very big business. Have you heard of the company
called Starface? No.
OK, you have a daughter, right? How old is your daughter?
13. She'll probably start using
Starface soon. I'm guessing it's like it is a
pimple patch thing. Have you seen this at all?
No, so massive category, Proactive, Neutrogena, whatever
like and all these skin care brands for blemishes normally.
(05:25):
That was how when I was growing up, you clean your face and I
guess people still clean their face, whatever.
But now if you have a pimple, you get acne and it's on your
face. The trendy thing to do is get a
sticker, a star. You put it on your face, like in
public, in public. Wow, so like what Alex Hermosi
is doing with his nose? Strip.
That is perfect analogy, yes. So like before wearing a nose
(05:47):
strip out in public. Weird thing to do.
Nelly. Remember Nelly with the Band-Aid
that was before your. Time.
Yeah, not the rapper, but you just always wear a Band-Aid.
Yeah, I mean, he only wore a Band-Aid for what?
Nothing. That was his brand.
He put a Band-Aid right here. Not even.
Hiding like a little teardrop tattoo or nothing, no.
That was just his trademark. Was the Band-Aid on the face?
So this is something that's trendy starface, big company and
(06:08):
they basically said people have acne, It's a big category.
We're not going to try to fix itat its root cause.
We're going to try to give you astylish way to hide it.
And so I feel like the main ideathat it came in here with that
I've been I know I'm on short notice, I've tried to spin up
some stuff quickly was like withthis oxy clean to bring it full
circle, it's a not great form factor.
(06:31):
Now they have spray. So I will be the first to admit
it's a slightly better form factor.
But like they have the tie to gosticks, they have the spray do.
They do the magic erasers. Is that oxy clean?
I don't know, they might. They probably probably like one
of these big Unilever, Procter and Gamble types of brands at
this point. I'm thinking though, could you
do this in a sticker? And I'm thinking like dad's
(06:51):
wallet's mom's purses, you're out to eat you rather than
having, you know, something that's this big that's kind of
like a wander magic race or whatever.
Can you have something that likehides in your in your wallet?
You pull it out, you peel it, you stick it on the stain and it
releases something instantly. It just stays on the shirt.
Oh OK, so like a stain remover sticker?
Interesting. And it can be different colors.
(07:13):
You know, obviously I'm assumingWhite's going to be the most
popular to kind of blend in witha shirt or whatever.
But maybe there's something out there around like it has to stay
on it longer, therefore the sticker is better.
Or like you don't want to be walking around with a wet shirt
or, I don't know, like, do you want to be walking around with a
sticker? I don't know.
But if you can make it cool, if it's like a little kid and he's
getting food all over stuff, youput a dinosaur sticker on and
you know that's going to clean. It so for clothes specifically.
(07:35):
That's my thought to. Yeah, I don't know.
I think that makes more sense than like carpet because there's
not enough like surface area to I don't know.
I'm thinking like you walk around though with like a power
range. I don't know if Power Rangers
are still cool, like dinosaur stickers, some kind of
licensing, some Disney things, Pokémon, and next thing you
know, it's got like some kind ofsticky residue on the outside
with a cleaning residue on the inside.
(07:58):
Put it on a shirt. I think that could work really
well. That is an amazing idea because
like, first of all, it doesn't have to work all that well
because that's not the problem you're solving.
You're you're solving embarrassment.
But the parent kid doesn't care,right?
If I'm out with my kids and theyget a big stain on their shirt
and we're about to go somewhere nice, it is what it is.
They're kids. But if I could have a solution
(08:18):
to that problem, I would buy it,right?
And if I could know, as a bonus,it's going to help that stain
come out when you do throw it inthe wash.
It's a no brainer and it's consumable.
So you buy more and more of them.
Buy a pack of them. You're selling a very cheap
thing for a pretty high markup because you're solving that
embarrassment problem. Yeah, that's really interesting.
I want to know more about Starface like you know their
(08:40):
what their founding story is or?So I think the CEO does a lot of
these beauty products and is is really good retail connections.
And so I think they've gone a little bit of a different way
rather than going traditionally D to C but I know that they've
scaled up fast in just a couple of years time.
And like, I think culturally they've really defined a lot of
stuff. Are they in stores or is it?
Yeah, no, I think it's like it'sUlta targets all that, all that
(09:01):
stuff. Are boys wearing them?
I'm not wearing them. But like is it a thing just for
girls or are both genders wearing it I've.
Seen guys wear them. Really.
Yeah. Even in your 20s, thirties,
people wear. Them, I think it's one of those
things where like you're in a city like New York, you're going
to have a lot of people wearing them.
Like I'm, I'm trying to think like you go to like raves or
like if you go to like music, music festivals, this stuff is
done all the time. I think it's something that like
(09:23):
would would I wear it to work? Absolutely not.
Would the average creative maybe.
Yeah. Like I think middle school,
early high school, those are a lot more like kind of the target
markets and like the early times.
See, I would think that draws more attention to a a pimple.
It definitely does, but it's nota pimple anymore.
Do they tell people what it is or why they're using it?
(09:44):
I think people know. I think people know at this
point. And honestly, like, I didn't
know. And then as soon as I heard it,
like I bet, I don't know if it'sas blatant as like you're going
to walk to the go to the airportafter this and see them, but
like you'll start seeing them pop up in your life.
And what I would have originallyattributed to, oh, maybe
someone's going to a concert or they're doing some special event
later. I'm now realizing is, Oh no,
(10:05):
they're just, they're going to the library, they're going to
the supermarket, and they just had this cover up on and it's
that simple. Do you know how they grew?
Was it just Facebook ads? I think retail, I think a lot of
retail connections, which is interesting.
It's like you have a lot of these different buyers.
Once you form a connection with them in one category, like you
know, you have target, you have Walmart, you have Ulta, you have
Sephora. I think Sephora's a part of
(10:27):
Ulta. Once you get connected with like
the health and Wellness buyer orthe beauty buyer or the whatever
buyer, then that's your channel,right?
And so now it's, it is let me sell as much as possible and
make sure that the product is good.
But now let me get more productsto also sell to you because now
I can fill out more shells and Italk to them and I say, Hey,
what's your worst products on this category in the let's say
(10:48):
we're talking supplements. Like what is your worst?
Are you guys moving a lot of torrent today?
Are you guys moving a lot of creatine today?
Oh, we're moving a ton of creatine.
OK. Like what can we do to get
another product in there? That's a differentiator.
Oh, we've been talking with our buying team and like people want
to see creatine with caffeine. Great.
I'm going to work on that. I'll get back to you in six
months. And you build up those
relationships really strong. What have people not put in the
(11:09):
gummy yet? What's left out there?
That's the ultimate question. There's caffeine.
There's there's every. There's every a health one,
right? Like I don't know if you ever
took like the Flintstone gummiesgrowing up, but like that was a
staple. I think what you have to do is
find the most annoying form factor and like the creatine
gummies are blowing up. I'm sure you've ever seen those.
Those are great because creatine's chalky and it's
(11:30):
annoying to take. So then you see goalie was the
original guise of it and I thinkthey did the apple cider vinegar
ones, but so green juices, people want that.
I think like maybe like better magnesium gummies, but these
days gummies are you're probablylate on the gummy curve at this
point. When I hear $500 million in
three years with a gummy I don'tlike, I'm asking the question to
(11:52):
you. What other things do you put in
a gummy? But really what the question is,
is like should someone just go compete directly with them?
With the grins, yes, I think they have a lot.
But like 500 million in three years tells me way more demand
than supply. Take a little bit of a different
angle or the same angle. Just capture a little bit of
that. OK, so the other thing that
they've done that I think is really clever is if you go to
(12:13):
CVS and you go down the vitamin aisle and you're looking at a
bunch of gummies. It is this big plastic tub with
150 gummies in it and you pick it off whatever.
What they've done, which is really cool, is everything is a
travel pack. So you get this big bag and then
within that bag, environmentalist cover years,
there's like 50 more little bags.
Oh I hate that so much. Like as a capitalist I love it
(12:36):
as someone who just doesn't wantto waste stuff.
I get it, I get it, but it probably increases consumption
so much because then you're travelling for a week, you don't
want to break that habit and then you have to go grab a
bunch. So I listened to the founder on
a podcast before and he talked about how that packaging no Co
manufacturer would do it for them.
Like they literally had to go toevery single one of these
(12:56):
commands and have them reinvent one of their processes to figure
out how to get I don't know the exact number.
I think it's like 7 or 8 little gummies into one sachet and then
put that all the sachets into one bigger like bigger bag.
So like that was that was a lot of the innovation that had to go
in there. Yeah.
I mean, they wouldn't have done that if they didn't think it
would work. Agreed.
So I think if if the question iswhat other gummies are going to
(13:19):
work, I know that grunes just released an immunity one, which
is different than I guess greens.
It's like, you know, your vitamin C stuff.
I know that sleep is a massive category that gets talked about
a lot these days. I think that caffeine would be a
really interesting one as well. What about custom gummies?
What about you go to a fancy Shopify site and there's a
little form and you say, what doyou want to optimize for sleep,
(13:42):
creatine, health, right? And maybe like on the back end
there's like 20 different combinations.
That way there's not like 2 million combinations of
supplements and you just order your own custom gummies I.
Think that makes total sense? Like you're never going to go
somewhere else to buy those. I think, I think as long as it's
easy enough to make or like you have to buy a year's worth
(14:02):
something like that, I think that the hard part there is the
manufacturing, but the marketingsells itself.
Yeah, the two biggest categoriesin GTC right now are probably
the the gummification of things and electrolytes.
Right now you just see every electrolyte brand out of the sun
just running up. I still need to make my busy
juice and sell that. I think it would do well.
I think it would do well. Maybe some kind of combination
(14:25):
of that, right? Rather than like like the gummy
of Gatorade, basically. Yeah, you know, Gummy of
Gatorade. Like that a GGI.
Like that? Yeah, this is reminds me of an
idea I've had. So one of my hundred 200 domain
names is racetattoos.com. OK.
Now I used to run ultra marathons, trail races, and have
(14:45):
you ever ran on like a trail race?
I've done a marathon, not a trail race.
OK. So even with a marathon, like
there's two things you want to kind of keep track of throughout
the race. The elevation profile.
When am I going uphill? When am I going downhill?
And like the, the pacing, where are the aid stations?
Is this 3 loops? Is it and, and is it out and
back? Is it like a lollipop?
(15:06):
Right? They have all different types
and like when you're out there, especially for 5 to 50 hours,
like you kind of want to know where am I at, right?
So I thought it would be cool tokind of do like a permissionless
marketing thing where you make these temporary tattoos and
there's a bunch of companies that make them, but they're it's
a temporary tattoo of the elevation profile of your race.
(15:27):
And you can do it for five KS. It doesn't have to be ultra
marathons, right? And then you get there, you
anytime you do a race, you get alittle packet, a shirt, metal or
whatever adds. What's the LMNT that?
You get stuff like that that's great.
And you just pull out a temporary tattoo and you put it
on before the race. And as you're running, you're
just like, oh, here. Oh, I got an aid station coming
(15:47):
up. It's like a Google Maps.
I think that's I think that's great and I feel like there's so
many ways you can play with it too.
Like even if it's like if you'remaking bespoke ones, it can be
like, all right, let me overlay like what I want my nutrition
plan to be on it to like add this mile marker I should eat.
I don't know if you already haveguides that and aids that like
do that for you, but like, it atleast gives you a couple like
reminders or things like that you can keep in the back of your
(16:09):
mind too. Yeah.
Well, it's also like it's very Instagrammable.
If you put that on, you're goingto post it, right?
And they have like semi permanent tattoos that will last
for like weeks or months, right?And if it were something like
that, then it's like it's just free marketing.
So to the. Race to the tattoo company.
I think it would do super well. I also think that yeah, like you
(16:30):
get it in your in your starter pack or whatever like that.
I think another version of this that could be really interesting
and this depends on how hard it is to make custom temporary
tattoos. So hinges a lot on the
manufacturing. So have you, you're down in
Dallas, Have you ever been at ACL or any of these big kind of
music festivals things? No.
OK, Austin City Lament. Yeah, no, haven't been.
(16:52):
So you basically get this crazy lineup at the beginning of the
thing, and I'm gonna connect this idea in a second, but you
get this crazy lineup of like, here's three days, here's 100
acts, whatever. These bands on Thursday, Friday,
Saturday and. So then you can have a group
chat with your friends and you say, who do you wanna see?
And every single day, And these things literally draw hundreds
of thousands of people out to them every single day.
(17:15):
What people that are my age do will be they, they get their
Friday lineup and they highlightit and they'll make something
kind of bespoke and they'll screenshot it and they'll put it
as their phone background. And then Saturday, they'll.
Wake up, you're always referringto it.
Yes. And then Saturday they'll wake
up and they'll be like here's like, I wanna go from Stage 1 to
Stage 2 to Stage 3. I wanna see this person at 7:00
PM and this person at 9:00 PM. So 100% right.
(17:36):
So, so you're going to the weekend and it's EDC Orlando and
it's Friday. We got this stage, this time,
this person. And it's like you're walking
around. It's like, oh, where are you
going at 7? It's like, let me check.
Yeah, exactly. And it's a, it's a big event.
It's something that like people spend a lot of money on.
Tickets for these things can range from 500 to $1200 if not
more for the full weekend type of event.
(17:58):
You're paying for lodging already, you're paying for food,
you're paying for all of this stuff that like if you tell me
it's $50.00 for a spoke thing cuz girls and everyone's already
paying for like makeup and hair and other stuff.
I think it could be a pretty bigmarket.
Dude, the question is do you tryto get the people to pay for it
or do you get Austin City Limitsto pay for it and include it for
free? Yeah, I think if it's you get
(18:20):
everything, then Austin City Limits will do it.
If it's no, I want Chris's lineup and I want like, I don't
care about Rascal Flatts, but I can't miss Zac Bryant and
therefore Zac Rascal Flatts is not on here, but the Zac Bryant
at Xfinity stage at 7:00 PM is then that would be a better one.
Yeah, cuz when I first started looking at this idea, I found a
dozen companies that will make custom temporary tattoos.
(18:41):
How much do they cost? A few bucks really.
Yeah, it's not bad. It's pretty great.
Just send them a design and they're like, you know, 100
piece minimum or whatever the cheaper it gets.
But so you don't have to become like a manufacturer.
You're just like white labeling it, right.
Listen, Beehive has always been the best newsletter platform for
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(19:04):
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(19:24):
I can pull my entire podcast directly into my Beehive site
and it automatically creates episode pages with show notes
and audio player and embedded YouTube videos.
This replaces POD page and I've already started messing around
with their digital products. Now you can sell ebooks,
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(19:45):
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code Chris 30 to get 30% off your first three months.
That's BEHII v.com/chris. If we go back to races, like
(20:09):
there's no company that only puts on one race a year, right?
Like generally it's a business. They'll have multiple races a
year. And so I would just proactively
send the race director, you know, if I know they're, they
have 3000 spots, I'll send them 3000 tattoos and say hey, this
is free. I thought you'd like.
Like it, Go ahead and put them in every bag or whatever,
they're for sure going to come back and buy from you.
(20:29):
Assuming people like it, they get good feedback.
And putting a hats on that wouldbe pretty hilarious.
Yeah. I mean, racetattoos.com right
there, right? Or I'm thinking like, or like
sell ad space on the tattoo. Nobody, nobody has successfully
gotten tattoo advertising down the way that it should.
Kind of like, you know, use Gatorade as an example, like,
but you have Gatorade on top of it and you can tell Gatorade,
(20:52):
hey, I know for a fact, you know, we have a 10% adoption
rate of all that we send New York City Marathon is 50,000
people running it. We're going to have 5000 people
with Gatorade temporarily tattooed on their arm for the
next week. It's pretty good.
Oh, all day. Right.
Oh, man, Especially if you couldget like, you could get multiple
people to pay for it. Yeah, you get Gatorade to pay
(21:13):
for it. You can get the race to pay for
it and then you could even, you could upsell like more custom
temporary tattoos to the actual participants if they wanted to
show it off right? You, you could just direct
people to your website with AQR code or something 'cause I'm
thinking like if I have all thatsurface area for people wearing
my product, I want to try to sell them something as well.
(21:35):
Now what is that? I don't know, Maybe it's just
like a semi permanent tattoo business where they can say like
I ran out an ultra marathon, youknow, for like 3 months.
So honestly, what I was. Expecting you to say when you
first brought up race tattoos, it was like a badge of honor
type of thing. And like, you know, I'm sure if
I was a bigger runner or like people who are just, you know,
the truer Hanes of the world, whatever, like these guys could
(21:58):
probably just start checking it off and almost make it like a
cool like badge thing. I wonder if there's something
there or it's like, fill it in and you like the hard part there
is, you know, a big enough market size and then you just
make it culturally relevant. So like the idea of you showing
up to a race right now with all of your races that you've ever
run tattooed. I'd be like, OK, this guy's
pretty freaking legit. And that's probably a small
market size, But if you can makeit culturally relevant of like
(22:20):
we're going from the LA to the New York City Marathon are we
just did the Moab 240, now we'redoing the Bigfoot 200.
Like that would be a lot cooler,I think, yeah, especially
because. It's such a passionate audience
and they're proud of what they did.
It's like a it's like a human bumper sticker, right?
Like how many times have you seen a bumper sticker?
This is 13.1 point 6.2. It's like a tattoo version of
(22:41):
that. I like that dude.
Here's. Another idea in the.
Same vein so bike races right? I read this stat that said Rd.
cyclists ingest like so much exhaust from cars it.
More than. Offsets like the health benefits
they get from cycling it either more than offsets or it
partially offsets to where it's like you net out even right
(23:03):
'cause there's that's a crazy. Stat.
It's crazy. And so I was looking into these
things and we all remember the COVID era at the face mask, this
guy like in India or somewhere invented like this nostril mask.
And it's just like a little sticker.
You put one there, you put one there and it's a filter, right?
Yep. Love so same.
(23:24):
Distribution idea. You give it to the races for
free, they put them in the bags and cyclists can wear them.
And then when they pull up to a stop light and they're behind
cars, they just don't open theirmouth and it filters out the
crap. How well does it work?
Nobody knows. Yeah, yeah, certainly better
than not having anything, right?I mean the.
Reality is with a lot of this stuff, it is problem solution
(23:44):
framework. It is deer exactly solution
framework, like everyone who cycles this health conscious,
obviously to start. And so to even just basically
say like this will do something and like have some results, like
don't don't be selling snake oilor whatever, like to have some
results. People are going to buy it.
And the nice part is it's subscription and you're going to
be able to have these different packs like similar with like
(24:05):
hostage and you can ship as from.
Coming from an e-commerce background, like you could ship
it in an envelope for like 50-4 cents, whatever the cost of a
stamp is because they're so flatit's less than an ounce.
Do you cycle? Yeah, do.
You I'm just. Thinking do you breathe through
your mouth or do you breathe your nose?
I don't even know well. The reason I ask is because.
And I'm wondering something that's already pretty popular is
a lot of this mouth tape for sleeping.
(24:26):
Yeah. So you think of like hostage
tape. Think of a couple other
companies like that. Could you just do the mouth tape
for recycling? Like can you take the same exact
product and rather than putting somebody sleeping on it, just
put somebody cycling and then cuz like your nose is already
natural filter. Yeah, yeah.
And so if people have the tendency and listen, not medical
advice consultant Dr. But like if people already have the
(24:47):
tendency to breathe through their mouth, however people can
breathe through their nose and it is just a habit that needs to
be formed and you can say your nose is a natural filtration
device, whatever, then I think it would be interesting to sell
bike tape and it's right over your mouth.
Well, it doesn't just have to be.
Cycling either, like I don't remember, but I've heard like in
running to optimize your breathing or endurance or
whatever you like inhale throughyour mouth and exhale through
(25:10):
your mouth, something like that.And that's like common
knowledge, right? For runners, Clearly I'm not a
runner because I don't remember what that knowledge is.
But if you were to just sell like the mouth tape for that,
like a, a functional mouth tape for a different purpose, that
might not work 5 or 10 years agobefore the mouth tape company.
But now that people are accustomed to seeing the ads,
seeing that it's normal, it's like, oh, this is just for
(25:30):
running. This has helped me remember to
run better. Therefore, I'll have more
endurance and I'll get a better time.
Theoretically, I think it makes a.
Lot of sense I think also the the fear part there's the
benefit part of I'm gonna be a better athlete out of this,
which is like aspirational sell that vision, whatever then
there's the don't you want to actually make sure you're not
breathing in toxic stuff, especially when you're breathing
(25:52):
the most that you ever do in anygiven day and I feel like that
would sell really well yeah yeahwith the.
Nostril things I love that it's already a product cuz it's right
now it's being marketed as like a a slimmer alternative to the
face mask right. You just license that thing put
it in different packaging. There's, I think, a big.
Trend in a lot of products around there around filtration,
(26:12):
filtration of water filtration of air, filtration of all of the
dust that's in your vents, whichI guess is the air part of it.
Big money industry, very big money.
And so I think what you can do is try to figure out what are
the other categories that you can put that in.
I love the filtration of air forcyclists, filtration of air for
athletes, filtration of water. I don't really know.
Like you see a lot of like the shower head stuff popping up
(26:34):
right now, a lot of faucet stuff, a lot of harsh chemicals
that like there's probably a lotof money to be made in that
space just with like more niche positioning.
Yeah, I know that they have. Like filtered shower heads,
right? What are those filters supposed
to be removing Chloride. Chloridea heavy metals, this is
what they told me, but it's it'sheavy metals.
(26:55):
It's a lot of like, I don't knowif it's bacteria.
I don't know what, what exactly it is, but it's stuff that
impacts your skin and your hair.Like the value prop that you see
on a lot of the ads is better, fuller hair, cleaner, healthier
skin and all that stuff. Do they have one for?
Microplastics like a shower headto filter out microplastics?
No, but that would be. Interesting.
(27:17):
Somebody just launched a companythat audits your environments.
Have you heard about this? Do you know what I'm talking
about at all? It's like I haven't heard of
the. Specific company you're thinking
of, but I'm familiar with the concept with the industry, so I
think. Like I'd be wrong about this.
Somebody will come to your houseor somebody will do a zoom call
around your house and they'll say show me how you cook and
you'll you'll show them a not stainless steel pan.
They'll be like, OK, check mark.Yeah, exactly.
(27:40):
You hate your kids. They'll be like, bring me up to
your event. All right, I see some dust over
there, like see your filter or whatever it is basically like AI
don't know if it's A at cost or a free consultation and then UPS
all these product enhancements, whether it's a lighting, your
ceilings or the shower drain or whatever the hell it is.
Right. And so to your point on
filtering out microplastics, I think this initial consulting
(28:01):
service based business is reallygreat to capture a large
audience. And then as far as filtering out
microplastics, it's probably probably a new microwave or like
it's probably like not heating the plastic or like removing
like it's a hard, it's a hard holistic problem.
I think, you know, yeah, I feel like with those home.
Audits. People would pay for that like
(28:22):
they would pay to be up sold other products.
So this is where like. You and I might have talked
about this in the past, Merrick Health.
Do you remember this at all? We might have not talked about
it. Merrick Health, Merrick Health,
something like that. It is a company that will do a
relatively low cost blood test because for them the blood test
is like, all right, we're going to get you in the door and we're
going to be like The Pioneers ofdata.
(28:42):
Like we're going to be very consultative and you're going to
trust us. And then once you get the blood
test back, it's like, Chris, you're actually really low on
iron and vitamin D and like you're pretty deficient in these
other five categories. We can put you on a program
that's customer and bespoke to you and buy all the gummies and
vitamins to rust directly and just stay on subscription.
And then we'll test your blood again in six months and you'll
see if we've improved anything. And that's a really good way to
(29:05):
do it because you get this consultative, these people are
smart approach. And then it's, well, you just
gave me the problem now give me the solution.
And I think for the what's wrongwith my environment, there's
like you can change out iridescent light bulbs.
Like I'm currently in my apartment right now just going
through all that phase of doing like floor up lighting and like
trying to make it a softer spaceat night.
(29:26):
And like, I watched a bunch of these YouTube videos and kind of
hacked it together. But if there's somebody that I
could call instantly and I'm like, hey, here's my apartment.
Like give me 5 lamps and like where to put them in and like
set up my Alexa for me. Like that would be a great
service. And I think that you could do
that for your environment. For health products.
Yeah. Have you heard of?
Function Health, yes. Yeah, they're, they're big and
you can't use them in New York City though.
(29:48):
Really. Yeah.
I think it's, I think. There's some legal thing there.
OK, I I'm. Using them?
Do you like it? Yeah.
I mean it's like I think it's like 6 or 800 bucks a year and
you that includes 2 blood tests.It seems like a no.
Brainer. Yeah.
And you just go to. Like a LabCorp or whatever and
you get like 12 vials of blood drawn and two weeks later they
(30:08):
give you your testosterone and your blood like, oh, it's like
103 different biomarkers, right?What I did with that is
tediously screenshotted every single result and it was like
green, yellow, red. It's got beautiful design.
It's like an Airbnb feel. And then I just uploaded it to a
Chai GBT project and I was like fix me and now I take pills
every night like a boomer. Right But but do you add?
(30:31):
That do your do your new biomarkers look better?
I haven't taken the. Second one yet it's been like 3
months. I'm going to get another one in
three months. I take fish oil, I take niacin,
I take vitamin B complex and like, I just think it's so funny
when people start like taking pills and they're like, dude, I
just feel so much better. I just feel so much.
(30:52):
It's like nothing. Do you?
It's cheap insurance. I just I've never had a.
Period in my life where like I just, I always feel good.
I was 260 lbs and I felt good. I just don't know.
It's all confirmation bias, right?
I think there's SO. Much there's a personality type
that is super optimized heavy and as a result of that it makes
(31:12):
it such that you actually never feel good because you can always
be doing a little bit better. And I actually think this is a
maybe a side tangent that's not as business related, but like
the good that probably a lot of the Huberman and fairest stuff
of the world has done can probably also be pretty offset
by the person who actually feelsworse the next day because they
(31:32):
got 7 hours and 55 minutes of sleep versus the exact, you
know, 8 1/2 hours that they wereregimented to get more like, you
know, God forbid they looked at their phone within an hour of
going to sleep. And like at a grant at a high
level, I think all of this advice is actually very helpful
and directionally correct. But like when you are obsessed
with getting the perfect thing, whether it's the perfect level
of fish oil in your bloodstream or like the perfect weight on
(31:55):
the scale or whatever, you're actually never going to feel
good no matter what. And so I think that it's just
like a mindset shift, honestly, for a lot of it, like the the
pills do very little, especiallywith these supplements.
Yeah. And really the.
Only thing that makes me feel like really good is caffeine.
Everything else is just secondary.
I want to say I think I think. Creatine does a little bit for
me at the gym. I need to do it.
I need to. Take it, I think.
(32:16):
I think there's like the. Meme of like what you think
you're going to feel like when you have creatine and it's like
the it's like an Instagram videoof everyone using those fake
glass bottles. It's like your toast, me, your
beer just smashes in his hand. Like the reality is you'll
probably get one or two more reps on everything in the gym.
That's kind of it. And that's if you're consistent
with it. But it's like the very tiny
game. I was listening.
To another podcast and they saidthat of the top three best
(32:39):
selling creatine gummies on Amazon, two of them had 0
creatine 0. And So what Sup code does is
they'll test everything. They'll they'll take it into a
lab unbiased third party. They're not like they
strategically don't have affiliate links.
Like they're unbiased. Like they charge for the app.
That's how they make money because they know they have to,
right? They'll be unbiased.
(33:00):
So you can go use the app and see like, oh, like I need to
take these creatine gummies. Oh, these might be good, but
they haven't been tested yet. Oh, these.
I thought that's a really interesting business model and
I'm wondering what else you could do that with.
I'm trying to think it's like. It's almost like giving like
you're selling trust, right? And so I'm thinking like it's
like the Michelin stars of rating or like the IMDb, which
if that was actually relevant ofthe Rotten Tomatoes, whatever of
(33:22):
food. I don't really think you need
that in a different category or I guess you do for the sake of
thinking of new business ideas. But there's free of pure is the
name of the brand that everyone goes to and you almost want to
see their manufacturing brand ontheir logo.
And you see like David's proteinButch spot.
I forget. Do you remember about like the
(33:43):
EPG thing? No, they bought like whatever
protein allows them to have likethis crazy caloric difference.
Oh, I did hear about that. It's.
All manufactured, I don't think.It's EPG.
It's just something like that. The David Bar, Yeah.
Exactly, I think finding. Like a trusted third party of
one specific thing, whether that's creatine, whether that's
the bioavailability of a certainsupplement, I think makes sense.
(34:04):
I know that there's another company out there called Seed
Oil Scout. I've heard of that.
You heard of them? Yes.
They will do like all of the restaurants in New York City and
show you the ones that do not use CEO and they have like a
Yelp like. The directory for exactly so I
think you still. Find something that people
really care about, like probablya good one based on that earlier
conversation would be like filtration and like air quality.
Yeah. Or something like that.
Like can you have someone test air quality at every Marriott
(34:27):
across America and that therefore you're staying in
hotels that like only actually are sanitary and like follow a
code or something like that? What if you did like a?
Sepco for popular snacks or foods.
Yeah, for their, their caloric contents or their ingredients,
right. So I, I love old trapper beef
jerky and they have this, it's like teriyaki and they have
(34:48):
these medallions and they're really good.
And I was eating them last summer like a ton and they were
like, I think they were like 10 calories per medallion.
And I was just crushing them, right.
But then I looked at the, the weight and it was like 1
medallion was like 28g, which isan ounce.
And when I did the math on like the, the nutritional facts
differently, it was off by 100%,right?
(35:09):
So basically I, I just divided by the weight of the serving
size or something. They were 20 calories per,
right? And I think it was because they
were like 14 pieces for 140 calories.
But when you looked at the weight, it was actually 280
calories. And I was like, this is like a
massive brand. These are sold in every gas
station every and it's wrong by 100%.
And it's just because I happen to do the math.
(35:31):
It's got to be wrong everywhere.I don't know how it works.
With some of these companies that you would think that they
would be more conscious of it sothat way they don't get in
trouble with like the FDA or whoever monitors this type of
stuff. I can tell you right now for the
supplement space, it is like it is probably the one thing that
you can get away with so much asyou kind of just pointed out
with Sups. I mean, at the end of the day,
like people are going to eat that beef jerky because they
(35:52):
like it tastes good and fills them up, whatever.
No one is taking supplements because they taste, I guess the
gummies maybe, but like because they taste good and because it
like fills them up necessarily, you're only doing it because you
want the desired outcome that you think of this will make you
more healthy. And so if it's not accomplishing
that goal, the efficacy is just really important for this type
of stuff. Well, I found out the.
(36:13):
Same thing when I was trying to make my busy juice drink.
I was trying to buy lemon powderand I learned by accident that
this lemon powder I had been using for mine, it was supposed
to be pure 100% lemon. That's what the IT showed, but
it wasn't at all. It was like crystallized.
And I talked to this chemist andhe's like, if it's crystallized,
they've added the sweeteners like this should not be sweet at
all. And it was.
(36:33):
I'm like. Right, like isn't.
Anyone looking at this and then when I was doing keto for like 6
months, I had like these this product from Trader Joe's and it
was like 2 net carbs and like I was testing my blood for ketones
and it was right wrong. So it's like, OK, the three
times that I've actually held the, you know, the nutritional
value feet to the phone, Yeah, that's crazy.
(36:54):
They. Were all wrong.
Yeah, so just so. A food ACPG version of Subs?
Yes, all you. Need is a it's called a bomb
calorimeter. It's like this little device
that anyone can buy where you you take food, you grind it up,
you dehydrate it to get all the water content out, and then you
put it in like a pill form and you burn it and the machine
measures how much energy is emitted from burning it.
(37:16):
That's the calories. Those are the calories, right?
That's cool. And however.
Many heat. Calories are emitted that's how
many calories that that food had.
So you had to get you got to basically take a slice of pizza.
You let it dry 100% blend it up,put it in a pill form and then
you light on fire in this enclosed space and it measures
how much energy is coming out. Oh, that's super fun.
I. Have no idea.
(37:37):
You would basically take like. A box of Cheez its or something
and you would do all that and then you'd say, all right, we
can affirm that this lot number has actually this many calories.
The carbs are this much, the fats are this much.
And so, you know, a lot of thesefoods we eat every single day,
Like I'll eat a quest bar one totwo times a day, the same thing.
And it could be completely wrongand it could be having a
(37:57):
completely detrimental effect onmy body and I have no idea.
That's really interesting. Eat Whole Foods I think is the
eat Whole Foods and develop Subsfor CPG.
There you go that. I think there could be a
business there, especially if there's just like.
A verified like I think you haveto basically how do you do it
though? Because I think you have to make
a marketing campaign that your nutritional labels are lying to
you and basically an attack on the government and the FDA and
(38:20):
whoever makes that kind of stuffand says if you want the real
information, come here and basically start with the whole
like actually audited version ofthat.
That could spread so. Easily with short period video.
Yeah, I like that. All right, What's your idea all?
Right. How much time do we have all?
Right. We got, we got 3 minutes.
Let me you're going to get an elevator pitch and if we want to
do a deep dive on this later, wecan.
So you're in New York right now,there are ton of bath houses
(38:41):
here and one that has recently popped up that is taking over
New York City. And if you're in your 20s and
30s, like you've probably heard about it 'cause it's a big like
social Wellness thing is othership other ship is crushing
it. They are this like sonar cold
plunge steam room type. I don't think I've seen steam
rooms, but really cool novel experience.
And they took this, you know, however many year old, hundreds
(39:04):
of year old concept, hot and cold and they made it trendy and
cool. So there's another concept that
is hundreds of years old or or has been around for a while that
has gotten a little bit trendier, but honestly hasn't
had like a good brand dominate it.
And that's silent meditation retreats.
And so we've seen it pop up morein the last tech era of like the
(39:24):
last 15 years, whatever of like these tech gurus, they're going
away for three days, five days, seven days, whatever.
They're not talking to anybody. No phones disconnected from
technology. They come back, they were
healed, they had the realizationabout themselves, whatever.
But if I asked anybody, you know, what, what sign of
meditation or did you do? There is not a, there's no
brand. There's not a clear one thing.
(39:46):
And maybe that's because the market's not big enough.
Maybe that's because the versionof it is not accessible enough
yet, whatever that looks like. But like, you know, people made
tiny houses trendy via like getaway, they've made cold
plunges and Sauna's trendy from other ship.
And so there's a lot of ways that I think that you can make
this concept trendy, and a lot of it probably comes down to,
you know, make it more accessible.
(40:07):
You didn't do a seven day silentmeditation retreat.
You did a 48 hour silent meditation retreat. 4 hours.
Or like an afternoon, honestly. Yeah, yeah, probably.
And I think it's in the maybe, maybe you can do it within a
place, right? Like, hey, I'm going here on a
Thursday night to just clear my thoughts and not think about
anything like shut the world outand they take my phone in the
beginning or whatever. 4 hours. It's actually probably the
(40:28):
smarter version. I didn't think about that.
I was going to say do it, you know, within a 90 minute drive
of the city. To your point, do it in the
city, like New York City is the loudest, most busy place on that
freaking planet, or at least in the US.
And if you can walk in and reliably say I'm going to give
you this, I'm going to use my phone.
Maybe there's like some de stress protocol.
And then it's 4 hours sitting ata freaking wall and like you're
(40:50):
in a distraction and free environment where you're like,
why don't you just do that in your living room?
It's like my TV, my Kindle, my iPad, my laptop, my phone.
And so like this forces me to bepresent.
What do you think? I love it and kind of like.
People taking supplements sayingI feel so much better, they're
going to come out of there beinglike, that was incredible.
Yep, I changed my life. Yep.
And it's going to. Spread and it's going to be,
I've got a lot to think about. I'm going to go into Chamber,
(41:11):
whatever you want to brand it as, I think it could do really
well, call it. Quiet Place.
Quiet Place like the movie? Yeah, I was going to say quick.
Quick lawsuit and then we're right back.
That's fine. That's fine.
That's a good one. You wouldn't need a lot of
space. It could be like a very small
room. I think it could be a very.
Small room. You could probably have two
versions. You could probably have like
like a phone booth, like a weekly phone booth kind of set
up almost where it's like, all right, I'm here.
(41:33):
And then you could probably havea group room where it's like you
walk in and I've talked to some people who have done these
things and some of it's like, you know, they walk in a circle
for four hours or like they sit on a pillow and they look at the
wall. But like the point is that it's
intentionally pretty unstructured and unguided.
And I would say for something like other ship, other ship got
a lot of notoriety because they'll do like these classes
(41:54):
and they'll do these breath workclasses.
And so there's probably a world where you can mix breath work
into it. There's probably a world where
like you can work with somebody on like setting intentions going
into it or like get a prompt to reflect on or like there's a
coaching element to it. Like there's probably a lot of
like upsells and like flavors ofit.
But I think that you could also sell like to your point, like,
could you sell a 2 hour slot for120 bucks?
(42:15):
Would people pay that? I don't know.
But like you're, you're basically selling the ability to
get away from all distractions. I bet people would pay it.
I love it, man. Yeah, Thank you.
Cool. All right.
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