Episode Summary: In this episode of the L3 Leadership Podcast, Anne Beiler joins Doug to discuss her upbringing, Auntie Anne’s, and shares advice with listeners who may be struggling on how she navigates life’s more difficult seasons.
About Anne Beiler: Anne Beiler, raised in an Amish-Mennonite community, faced immense tragedy when her 19-month-old daughter died in a farming accident, leading her into darkness and depression. Her marriage with Jonas suffered, exacerbated by an abusive pastor. Seeking healing, they pursued counseling and reconciliation, birthing a vision to offer free counseling services. To support this vision, Anne bought a concession stand, which evolved into Auntie Anne’s, the world's largest pretzel franchise. Despite her success, Anne battled depression, finding solace in sharing her story publicly. This act of confession liberated her and inspired her to help other women find similar freedom. In 2005, Anne sold Auntie Anne’s to pursue speaking engagements on leadership, purpose, and the power of confession.
3 Key Takeaways:
1. Anne recounts her childhood growing up within the Amish community.
2. She shares how she came out of a difficult time in her life with guidance from The Holy Spirit.
3. Anne gives advice to others who may be struggling with feelings of depression or grief.
Quotes From the Episode:
“There is no way to be well unless you tell. Unless you feel the pain of it all.”
“I don’t have secrets anymore, I just bring them into the light.”
Resources Mentioned:
The Secret Lies Within by Anne Beiler
Connect with Anne:
Website | Facebook | Instagram
Episode Webpage: https://l3leadership.org/413
L3 Mastermind Groups: https://l3leadership.org/mastermind
L3 Leadership Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/L3Leader/
Follow us on Linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/company/l3-leadership
Rate This Podcast: https://ratethispodcast.com/l3leadership
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Anne Beiler (00:00):
It keeps me in the light.
I don't have secrets anymore.
I just bring them into thelight, either with somebody or
with my husband, or in prayer.
That's the lifestyle ofovercoming.
Doug Smith (00:17):
Hey, leader, and welcome to another episode of
the L3 Leadership Podcast, wherewe are obsessed with helping
you grow to your maximumpotential and to maximize the
impact of your leadership.
My name is Doug Smith and I amyour host In today's episode.
It's brought to you by myfriends Beratung Advisors.
We also recorded this live fromthe new Birgo Realty Studio.
If you're new to the podcast,welcome.
I'm so glad that you're hereand I hope that you enjoy our
content and become a subscriber.
(00:38):
Know that you can also watchall of our episodes over on our
YouTube channel, so make sureyou're subscribed there as well.
And, as always, if you've beenlistening to the podcast and its
impact on your life, it wouldmean the world to me if you'd
leave us a rating and review onApple Podcasts or Spotify or
wherever you listen to podcaststhrough.
That really does help us togrow our audience and reach more
leaders, so thank you inadvance for that.
While, leader, in today'sepisode you're going to hear my
(00:58):
conversation with the founder ofAnnie Ann's Pretzels who
doesn't love those, ann Beilerand I would tell you a lot more
about her now, but she'sactually going to share her
story and I'm pretty sureeveryone on the planet knows
Annie Ann's Pretzels and ifyou've never heard Ann and
you've never heard her story,just get ready.
It is so powerful and I knowyou're going to be challenged, I
know you're going to beinspired and I'm just so
(01:19):
grateful that she was willing totake the time to share this
here.
So I know you're going to beblessed.
But before we dive into herstory, just a few announcements.
This episode of the L3Leadership Podcast is sponsored
by Beratung Advisors.
The financial advisors atBeratung Advisors help educate
and empower clients to makeinformed financial decisions.
You can find out how BeratungAdvisors can help you develop a
(01:40):
customized financial plan foryour financial future by
visiting their website atbaritungadvisorscom.
That'sB-E-R-A-T-U-N-G-Advisorscom.
Securities and investmentproducts and services offered
through LPL Financial, memberFINRA and SIPC.
Beratung Advisors, lplFinancial and L3 Leadership are
separate entities.
(02:00):
I also want to thank our sponsor, Henne Jewelers.
They're a jeweler owned by myfriend and mentor, John Henne,
and my wife Laura and I got ourengagement and wedding rings
through Henne Jewelers and hadan incredible experience.
And not only do they have greatjewelry, but they also invest
in people.
In fact, for every couple thatcomes in engage, they give them
a book to help them prepare formarriage, and we just love that.
So if you're in need of a goodjeweler, check out
hennyjewelerscom.
(02:21):
And with all that being said,let's dive right in.
Here's my conversation withAnne Beiler the founder of
Auntie Anne's Pretzels.
Enjoy.
Anne Beiler, welcome to the L3Leadership Podcast.
I'm extremely excited for thisconversation.
We're so glad to have you.
Anne Beiler (02:37):
Well, it's my pleasure to be on your podcast
today, Doug, and thank you forhaving me.
Doug Smith (02:42):
Yeah Well, we're going to go into all kinds of
different directions with youand your story, but obviously
you're most known for being thefounder of Auntie Anne's
Pretzels, which I don't thinkthere's a person on the planet
that doesn't love those.
When I told people I wasinterviewing you, they're like
can we get some free pretzels?
Anne Beiler (02:57):
I know People still want freebies.
Doug Smith (03:00):
So funny.
But I want to dive in yourstory, but before we do and
we'll dive more into AuntieAnne's later but can you at
least give people an idea of thescope of where Auntie Anne's
was and what you built it toprior to selling it, and then
we'll dive into your story.
Anne Beiler (03:14):
Yeah, sure.
So we started back in 1988 in alittle farmer's market in
downtown Pennsylvania.
I grew up in the Amish culturewhich my mom and dad were old
order Amish until I was threeand then we went to the black
car Amish.
We moved on up which meant wecould have a car it had to be
black and my dad could farm witha tractor instead of horses and
(03:36):
we had electricity.
So it wasn't so bad.
We had some.
It was pretty cool.
But on the other hand, we lookedat Amish and I grew up in that
culture, very knowledgeable andunderstand the traditions and I
grew up in this very, I want tosay it was a very good
(04:00):
environment for me as a child.
My mom and dad loved us, caredfor eight of us kids, or three
boys, three girls and five boysand it wasn't almost.
Looking back I just realizedhow good it was and how it
almost seems idyllic to me todaybecause I've experienced a lot
of life since that time.
At the age of 16, I met myhusband, jonas, and he was my
(04:26):
attraction and the love of mylife.
As soon as I met him andobviously at that point in my
life was pretty short, but hewas a good man Also grew up in
the Amish culture, and a goodlooking guy and worked hard and
love God.
I'm like, wow, okay, I hit thejackpot with this guy.
I hope I can marry him one day.
And three years later we gotmarried.
I was 19 in the year 21.
(04:48):
And it's still very culturally.
That's Amish people, amish men,and eight he's still married,
most of them married very young,because we are taught well
about how to do family, workhard and care for each other.
My mom always said littlechildren, love each other, do
not give each other pain.
When one speaks to you in anger, do not answer them again.
So we had all these.
(05:08):
You know, forgive and peace,salt and light and go this heck
of a mouth.
So you know I really had agreat starting life, doug, and
when I look back at that Irealized that was enough.
You know that foundation helpedme weather the storms of life.
Mama, dad took us to church, ofcourse, every Sunday, without
(05:31):
fail.
We sat around our dinner table,three around our kitchen table,
I might say three times a daybreakfast lunch and dinner
without fail All of the years Iwas at home.
There was never an exception tothat, unless we may have been
out visiting or something.
But yeah, that's what we did.
And so I realized that thearound the table being with my
(05:53):
family, mom and dad always beingaround was.
I look at that right now and Ididn't think, of course, didn't
realize at the time, but what agift to our family that they
were always around.
In particular, my mom and dadwent to farmers markets from in
Philadelphia for a couple ofyears and during those years I
was around 11, 12 and 13.
(06:16):
And I would come home frommarket and my mom that was the
only night that she was not athome when I got over from school
and she would have a list forme to a pies and cakes that she
wanted me to bake and I would dothat in my farmhouse kitchen
I'm sorry, basement.
I would go down the basementsteps as a little girl I
remember I would.
Many times I would cry becausemy mom was not there and but I
(06:39):
knew how to do this and I made60 to 70 pies and cakes every
Thursday night for maybe twoyears by myself while the other
kids were out doing their chores, you know anyway.
So I feel like God set me upfor something that I would never
have dreamed of, which wasAuntie and Sup Pretzels and
going from one store, a DowningTown, and then two stores that
(07:02):
that year, the very first year,12 stores the next year, 35 the
next and 15 years so thefollowing year.
So we just kept growing untilwe sold the company in 2015.
And by that time we had almost900 locations.
So for this little Amish gofrom Anixtra County,
pennsylvania, let me tell you,god worked an amazing work in my
(07:23):
heart, in my mind, in myprofessional world, in my
personal life, in my spirituallife.
Those almost 20 years I alwayssay that Auntie and grew me up.
That's where.
I learned real life.
Doug Smith (07:35):
Wow.
Well, I certainly want to diveinto leadership lessons with
that a little bit later, butwhat I think so interesting is,
you know, you just shared yourstory.
If we just shared what you justshared, it's business like hey
had a great childhood, had greatparents, and basically you
started a company and scaled andwe sold it and it was fantastic
.
Anne Beiler (07:52):
But that's right.
Doug Smith (07:54):
Behind the scenes.
You know, I know your story,that that you know it wasn't all
up into the right, it wasn'tall perfect, and you actually
experienced.
You know a lot.
Can you share a little bitabout?
You know your story beyond,behind the veil of any ends and
in your upbringing.
Anne Beiler (08:09):
Thank you, doug.
Yeah, because that's reallywhat.
That's really what made me whoI am today, you know, not the
success of the ends, althoughthat grew me up, but what really
sparked my spiritual journey.
As a kid I knew I knew God andI loved him and I believed that
life is good because it was, andthat God is harsh.
(08:34):
Because I was taught that ifyou keep the 10 commandments and
you know, do your very best tokeep them all that God would be
very pleased with me and hewould smile on me.
But if I did something, youknow I don't know how wrong
something should be to be wrong,but I just knew that if I did
something wrong, maybe God wouldbe just pleased with me.
(08:54):
What I know today, doug, isthat that's bad theology number
one.
And also what I know is that,after over seven decades of real
life experiences, I know todaythat life is hard.
God is good, and I'm notconfused about that anymore, but
I sure was for many years.
So Jonas and I were happilymarried for about seven years
(09:16):
and we had two little girls, onefour and one 19 months old, and
our sweet Angie Angela Joy.
We live right next to myparents during that time and she
would always make her littletrek up to my mom's house for
her second breakfast very often,and one particular morning she
(09:36):
went up to mom's house and welived in the country, so it was
a very common, or sometimes thetwo of the girls would walk up
together.
But that particular morning Isaw her walk out our drive, out
our, through our yard, headedfrom my mom's house, which I
always stood at my door waiting,watching her go to make sure
that she got around the cornerand was heading in the right
(09:57):
direction.
Then I would call mom and tellher she's on the way, and that
morning I watched her, neversaid goodbye to her, never
called her back, and the unusualpart about that morning was
that she still had her pajamason and I kept thinking I should
call her back and, you know,change her for the day, and.
But I didn't.
And so I turned around, walkedinto the house and I put my hand
(10:19):
on the phone and as I did, Iheard all of this commotion,
screaming, yelling.
I had never heard anything likeit, but in my heart,
immediately I knew that Angiewas gone.
And I don't know how I knewthat, except that a mother's
instinct is very strong and it'svery real and it's most times
(10:41):
right.
And so I ran to my front doorand in that moment my father was
bringing, carrying Angie's bodyin his arms, just wailing that
I believe she's dead.
I believe she's dead.
Well, of course, doug, you knowthat's tragic and traumatic
because I had been, I was, I wasliving a good life, I'd been a
(11:05):
pretty good girl according tothe standards of the, you know,
the church, and immediately, asAngie made her ascended to
heaven that morning, I knewwhere she went and there was
some comfort in that.
But as time went on, the longingand the loneliness and the
questions and the grief and justas sadness was overwhelming and
I began my very slow andgradual descent into a world
(11:28):
that I knew nothing aboutemotional pain and spiritual
confusion.
That journey, you know it'shard for me to explain it.
You know just how, how ithappened for me.
But I went from reallybelieving and trusting in God to
why, if I was good, why did youdo this to me?
(11:50):
I know today that's everybodyasked that question.
Why, god?
You know, and I think that weforget that Jesus was very clear
when he said the enemy has cometo steal, to kill and to
destroy, and I have come to giveyou life, and so I think that
we're very confused about that.
But we all everybody asked thatquestion why God?
(12:10):
And that became my question.
There were no answers for me.
Even though I kept calling thechurch my husband, I began to
drift apart emotionally.
We, of course, stayed togetherand after a couple of months of
and I would always cry whennobody was watching and I tried
to be strong I felt like I hadto carry this grief.
You know, I had to carry it bymyself.
(12:32):
That was so.
It's not okay to carry ourgrief by ourselves, and Jonah's
not going to be able to talkabout things.
And so we then began to live ina silent marriage and a couple
of months, a very short timelater, my pastor gave to me at
church and and it has to be tocome to his office and just to
(12:57):
talk, and I'd never talked tohim before about anything that I
was feeling or anything in life, about my experience, and I had
never really taken the time todo that because life had been
good for me.
So I was relieved when I feltlike, wow, I can.
I can just at least try to talkabout what I'm feeling.
It was a very difficult thingfor me to think about talking
(13:19):
about it, but I went and so itwas.
It was a good conversation forthe most part and at the very
end of it, though, he tookadvantage of me physically and I
I, I was devastated because Ididn't understand the number one
, why?
And number two, I guess I didsomething that I don't know that
(13:42):
made him do that to me.
So of course, the guilt, youknow Angie, took me into a place
of sad, deep sadness and grief.
But this was the journey for meof guilt and shame, and it
wasn't my fault that that he didthat to me.
I know that now.
But at the time, when I walkedout of the office, out of his
(14:04):
office, I clearly remembermaking a choice that I would
never tell.
And let me tell you, doug,that's, that's a big lie, and
that's where Satan very oftengrips us in our secrets, and
I've never in my life kept asecret from Jonas, ever.
(14:26):
I mean, there was no need to,you know.
So that took me then into thedark world.
And that one choice, that wasmy choice.
And but I made that choicebecause I felt like there was no
alternative because I didn'tknow, you know, like who, who,
who did I tell anything?
I didn't know how to talk aboutAngie's death, how would I know
(14:46):
how to describe or even havethe vocabulary to talk about
abuse?
And that one, that one secretkept me in nearly seven years of
abuse of every kind and took meinto the dark world and kept me
there.
And Satan gave me the tools Ineeded to keep me there and I
almost succumbed and almost,almost died there, physically,
(15:09):
almost died there.
Doug Smith (15:14):
Well, thank you for sharing that story.
So after the seven years, I dothink it's important.
So what happened after thatseven year period that kind of
brought you out of that?
Anne Beiler (15:23):
Well, you know, I stayed there too long and my
message today is for people thatare in dark places and don't
know how to get out.
I felt stuck, I felt like therewas no, no way out and I I, I
believe truly believed that lifewas over for me.
I knew I believe the lies thatI was unlovable, I was
unforgivable and for sure, I wasunchangeable.
(15:47):
I didn't feel like there wasanything within me that I had to
offer to anyone.
I didn't feel like I had theability to change anything.
I was stuck in this, this darkplace, and did not know how to
get out.
And I weighed 90 pounds.
I was falling apart from theinside out.
(16:08):
I was majorly depressed andwent to the doctor a couple of
times because, physically, Ithought that I had ulcers in my
stomach and my heart raced and Ithought I was having a heart
attack.
So I mean physically secretsover time will kill you.
If not physically, you dieemotionally.
And Dr Richard Dobbins saysthat the tragedy is not in dying
(16:31):
, but it's what dies inside ofus while we live.
I was dying inside and I wastrying to live, and so at the
end of all those years, I prayedand I wept and I just got to
deliver me.
And I knew that one day it wasjust like I don't know, come
down and somehow just deliver meout of this dark place.
But one day I was compelled bya Holy Spirit within me that
(16:54):
said get up off your knees, stopcrying and go tell.
Go tell your husband.
You know the story of the man bythe pool of the pesta.
You know, for 38 years he satthere, waited, tried to get into
the pool and he wasn't able tomanage that and had all the
(17:14):
reasons as to why he couldn'tget into the pool for his
healing.
When Jesus came to him that dayhe said to him Sir, would you
like to be healed?
You know, and that's a questionof all time, do we want to be
healed?
And my, the question, for me,was I wanted to be healed but,
like, like the man by the pool,I didn't know how to get into
(17:36):
the water, I didn't know how, Ididn't know where to go, what to
do.
But that morning Holy Spiritwas very clear with me and go
tell.
And I gathered my broken selftogether.
I'm sorry, it's okay, I'mgrateful.
(17:57):
I remember it very clearly.
I gather myself together inHoly Spirit within me Never left
me, doug.
He never left me because it washim.
It was him he gave me thecourage.
Wow.
So I gathered it all up in myheart and palm sweating and
(18:21):
heart racing, and all the way tomy husband's, jonas's repair
shop I kept saying, god, I can'tdo this, I can't, do this, I
can't.
But I kept driving and when Igot there I made a very hard.
When I say hard, no feeling, noemotion, two sentences could
passionate him and the look inhis eyes was scary.
(18:45):
I had never seen the sadness orthe that look and whatever that
look was.
I had to turn around and leave.
I couldn't touch him.
I didn't say it.
Forgive me please.
My end, my the end of myconversation confessional, is
simply I'm sorry and I'm a sorryperson, and that that
principles founded James 516.
(19:06):
I didn't really understand thatprinciple at the time.
I didn't even know it was inthe Bible.
I just know Holy Spirit gave methe courage to do what I had to
do that morning.
But, as from that day to thisday, doug, I've learned the
power of of being real, open,honest.
And let me tell you somethingthere's no other way.
There is no other way.
(19:28):
I prayed for seven years and Istayed in this dark place.
Jesus and God, holy Spirit,sustain me.
They never let go because theywon't.
They promised that they wouldstay with us forever and they
stayed with me.
But wow.
And so that day, though thechoice I made to tell Jonas that
(19:50):
James 516 model can bet yourballs one to another and pray,
and then you'll be healed.
And that's the model.
I feel like us, as Christians,as believers, followers of
Christ, whoever we think we are,whatever we're following Christ
.
But you know, what we want todo is pray, never tell and
(20:11):
expect God to heal.
And I believe that James 516 isnot the spiritual connection
with Jesus, it's the relationalmodel.
It's the model that builds andheals, heals and builds
relationships.
Without that confession to Jonasthat day it was long before, it
was five years before he endsthere would not be an anti-an.
(20:33):
Wow, jonas and I would not betogether today and there would
not be an anti-an.
And I always say can youimagine a world without anti-an
self-rencils?
No, I mean so.
I mean it sounds silly, butthat is a truth.
Every time I say that it is, myheart feels it, my stomach
feels it.
It's true.
So the point to that is, youknow, satan wants to destroy you
(20:57):
.
Why, why?
Because he doesn't want you tofulfill the purpose for which
God created you, for that's whyhe wants to destroy you, because
he knows that once you are well, once if you're able to
overcome and you're able to livea life of freedom and truth,
honesty, transparency.
You know confession is, itfeels like a, it feels hard and
(21:21):
harsh and subjective, but youknow what it really means.
You know.
Be open, honest, transparent,because as you do that, then you
are actually walking in thelight with your faults, your
failures, your sin, yourmistakes, your struggles.
You know, we all live thosethings every day.
But as we are able to talk andtalk about it and confess it to
(21:45):
someone, that's where we beginto live in the light.
We walk in the light, as he isin the light, and then we have
fellowship with one another.
What we're doing right now,doug, is we have fellowship with
one another, and then the bloodof Christ cleanses us from all
sin.
It's all about bringing ourdeeds into the light, no matter
(22:05):
how hard, no matter how bad, nomatter what the struggle is.
But when you begin to do that,as it happened for me that day
with Jones, there was not aninstant miracle, let me tell you
for sure.
But there was something insideof me that I began to feel
lighter, slowly but surely.
I mean, the weight of it wasstill here, but I knew I had
(22:27):
done the right thing.
And when Jonas came home thatnight, he simply said to me we
need to talk.
And I didn't want to talk.
I had just given him thegreatest, the most information
that I had told anyone about mysecret, and he wants to talk
about it.
It was a hard, hard evening.
(22:49):
But what he said to me afterthat is what got me on the path
of really truth and believingthat maybe there's hope for me.
I was done, life was over.
During those years I trulybelieved, doug, that my only
option was to take my life.
That seemed easier than to tellmy secret.
(23:12):
Can you, I mean, think aboutthat?
But that's where I stayed forabout three years of those
nearly seven.
I thought about it, hadsuicidal thoughts, but yet I
still wanted family, I stillwanted my children, I still
wanted to be married to Jonas,but I didn't know how to get
back to that.
So, anyway, as we began to talk, he said I know that you have
(23:34):
not been happy, but if you wantto be happy, I want you to be
happy and if you have to leave,if you have to go somewhere,
please don't leave a note on theaddress or on the middle of the
night and go, but just come tome and talk to me.
Tell me what you need, we'lltalk about it.
(23:59):
I'll help you find a house.
Wow.
And I'll help you pack your bags, but you have to take your
girls with you because they needtheir mother.
Okay, doug, so that was itright there.
He believed in me.
And how could he do that?
It's because during that day hecalled a counselor and the
(24:23):
counselors and Jonas wascompletely distraught.
He I can't tell the story rightnow because it takes too long
but in the few hours maybe eighthours he had called a counselor
and the counselor had said tome, or had said to him you have
a right to divorce your wife.
I guess Even at that time, doug, we didn't understand actual
(24:47):
abuse of spiritual power.
We didn't even understand.
It's like I hadn't up there foralmost seven years.
But I understand.
I understood much later.
Abuse is not the same as anaffair and anyway, that's a
whole other subject which Ispeak about in my book.
It's called those Secret LiesWithin.
But that day, when he said thatto me that the girls need their
(25:13):
mother, you can't evenunderstand the impact that had
on me because, again, I wasunforgivable and lovable and
changeable.
I don't deserve anything good.
I was unworthy of the shame,the cloak of shame I wore every
single day.
There was nothing good.
I could never have writtenanything good or anything that I
(25:34):
liked about myself at thatpoint.
And so I said okay, I promiseyou I won't leave you in the
middle of the night.
And then I asked him can youmake a promise to me?
And he said sure.
I said promise me you won't rubmy past in my face ever.
Wow, he's right.
And you know what, Doug, fromthat day.
(25:54):
And he said I promise, fromthat day to this he has never.
We have talked about it a lot,all as well.
But the challenge that thecounselor gave in that day was
you can either go and divorceyour wife and have a committed
adultery and you can go do whatyour wife has done, or you can
(26:18):
love her like Jesus loves you,not like Jesus loves the church,
because he heard that all hislife.
But he said there was somethingabout when the man challenged
him to love your wife like Jesusloves you, he said.
(26:38):
In that moment I began to weeplike a baby because I began to
think about how is it, how doesJesus love me?
And my focus changed from whathappened to Anne or what Anne
did to me to how is it that heloves me and how can I love Anne
(27:02):
and the girls in the same way.
And that, doug, is what kept ourmarriage together and he would
tell you that God did a work ofgrace in both of us, and that's
why we're still one today, after55 years.
Doug Smith (27:18):
Wow.
Well, thank you so much forsharing your story and thank God
for your husband, thank God forGod speaking to you, and thank
God that you had the courage toconfess and not just give it all
up.
So thank you for that.
A few follow-up questions justthat, I think, will help One.
I just love that you arevulnerable and willing to share
your story, because I feel likeso many people are going through
(27:39):
similar things and they don'tspeak up and they think they're
the only person on the planetdealing with this, and so I
guess my first question wouldjust be if someone's listening
to us and they're in the middleof being sexually abused or in a
situation where they're beingvictimized and they feel similar
to you do, if I share this, ifthis ever comes out, my life's
already over.
(28:00):
They've been in forever.
What would you say to thatperson?
Anne Beiler (28:04):
Well, I've written a book about it.
Again, I'll mention that it'ssecretized within.
So that's a very, that's a deepquestion, a loaded question,
but I'll just share myexperience with that which I
mentioned a minute ago, was to,first of all, be courageous.
It takes courage, it takesstrength.
(28:27):
It's almost impossible to do itby yourself.
So I would encourage anyone towho is in your life right now,
that you know loves you.
Number one that you know hasbeen down the road and has
experienced, maybe hasexperienced some, some hardships
(28:49):
in their life and they havegotten to a point in life where
they've overcome and you knowthey're strong and they're
steady and they, they, they canlove you and guide you.
You don't want to go to the barand talk about your troubles at
a bar.
I mean, people do that all thetime and there's something kind
of like appealing to me aboutthat, Like, actually, why can we
(29:09):
not do that in the church?
Why?
can we not, you know, just goand say, hey, this is my problem
, this is what I'm strugglingwith, and I'm like, why can we
not do that?
We should be able to, becauseyou know, we've we've been
instructed to bear one another'sburdens and so, as we do that,
(29:30):
we fulfill the law of Christ.
So I believe that it's reallythe only way that you'll be able
to overcome any of your, yourstruggles and the and the
depression and the, the anxiety,and you know, we hear so.
So many people today, you know,struggle with panic attacks and
and it's all around.
(29:51):
I don't, I don't know that I gothrough a day without somebody
telling me that I'm I'm anxiousor I haven't.
I feel like I'm having anxietyor I'm having a panic attack.
It's almost like a buzzword andI'm saying there is a better
way and I truly believe.
You know, I love the fact thatJesus died for our sins.
(30:12):
That's like wow.
But I just, you know, a coupleof years ago, I realized, as I
read the Easter story once againread Isaiah and Easter story
and I realized Jesus not onlydied for my sins, but he carried
my shame and what most of itexperience with abuse of any
(30:36):
kind, whether it's verbal,physical, sexual bullying,
whatever it may be, the abusethat we've experienced, you know
, somehow it fills us with shame.
What someone has done to us tohurt us fills us with shame,
(30:56):
Like it's my fault, Like I musthave done something wrong.
And yes, you know, after Iexperienced what I did with the
abuse, I became, you know, hurtpeople, hurt other people.
I abandoned my children, notnot physically, but emotionally.
I abandoned my children.
I mean I could, I can write abook, I have written a book
about you know how I respondedto the pain and that was
(31:18):
inflicted on me.
But then I began to inflict painon my family.
And so the shame that you feel,number one, is that somebody
did this to me.
And then, number two, you feelashamed because now you are, you
know, I know some young peoplethat I've isolated themselves.
They're mean and short temperedand angry at their families, at
(31:40):
their parents, and are mad atmom and dad and mad at God.
So all of these things, youknow, there's really only one
way we try to drug it away, wetry to sex it away.
We become workaholics, we, we,we come, we can even become
ministers.
We start, you know, busy in theministry.
(32:00):
We exercise it away, we try to.
This pain is inside of us.
We're up to here.
We can know we can hardly carryit anymore, and I know that
there's people in your audiencethat are there right now.
And the only way for me I triedeverything the only way for me
(32:21):
was to begin to unload, and theonly way you can do that is to
actually talk about it.
It's so hard, I know.
So when I talk about findingsomeone that could help you and
you know I'm careful about thisbecause I felt like I went to
the right place I mean I went tomy pastor, someone that I truly
(32:45):
trusted.
So how do you know who to go to?
I pray that you ask, that youask, first of all, ask Holy
Spirit to help you find theright person and gather one or
two close friends that can guideyou.
And then, ultimately, if you'reabused, you find yourself
(33:07):
almost depressed, so bad thatyou want to take your life.
You have to call.
Maybe it's a helpline, maybeit's somebody in your church,
maybe it's someone in yourneighborhood, maybe it's someone
at school that your teacher oryour I don't know, but you have
to find somebody to talk to.
And that jug is then thebeginning of opening a door to a
(33:29):
better life.
And there's a verse in Proverbs6-5 that if the audience that
you have is they're not allbelievers.
But let me tell you this ispractical advice, and it says in
Proverbs 6-5, set yourself freelike a gazelle from the hand of
the hunter, like a bird fromthe snare of the fallow.
(33:49):
Think about that picture.
That means great struggle.
So what you're about to do isnot easy.
It is a great struggle, like itwas for me, and even after I
made my confession, I began totalk to Jonas.
I had no idea how deep I was inmy darkness and how long it
(34:12):
would take me to get to a placeof total freedom.
But I have to tell you I mean,that has been my experience it's
beginning to talk, finding theright person and eventually
finding a trauma therapist, agood Christian, solid trauma
therapist, or start with just aChristian counselor, but someone
(34:34):
that is, I have to almost say,professional, because I didn't
want to talk to anyone, doug,that would talk to me about
Bible verses.
I mean, I hate to admit that,but I knew all the verses, I
knew what to do, but I couldn'tdo it.
And so the Word of God is veryimportant, going to church and
(34:58):
doing all the things that we doas followers of Christ is really
important.
But I did all that and the onlything that set me free was to
begin to talk.
And there's, you know, theBible says that we are
overcomers by the blood of theLamb and the Word of our
testimony.
I want to say, by your story,tell your story and the blood of
(35:19):
the Lamb.
The combination is why I'm onyour podcast today, doug.
That's why I'm here today.
The blood of the Lamb and beingable to tell my story.
I started out just a littlefall.
I'll never forget the veryfirst time with Jonas, and then
after that we went to acounselor for five times.
Five times my husband said weneed to go for help.
(35:39):
I fought him, I resisted him.
I said I don't want to go.
So you know everything is scary,but you've got to be courageous
and you have to keep movingforward toward the light, the
darkness.
Get out of the darkness as fastas you can and begin to look
(36:00):
toward the light and people thatare light filled, people that
you know are followers of Christ.
Doug Smith (36:09):
It may be the same answer, but I'm curious.
You know, obviously you lostthe unthinkable.
You lost a daughter 19 monthsold.
We were talking a little bitbefore.
You know, I lost my mom when Iwas 17.
I lost a sister a few years agoto an overdose.
So it was interesting a fewyears ago, nine months after I
lost my sister.
Basically, I have what I referto as a mental breakdown, and so
(36:31):
what you said I reached out forhelp and my counselor said
something to me I thought was sointeresting he said.
He said, doug, I don't thinkyou've ever grieved.
So what do you mean?
He's like I don't think you'vegrieved your mom, I don't think
you've grieved your sister.
And in my mind, again, goingback to the Bible verse, it's
like hey, we don't grieve likeothers grieve.
Anne Beiler (36:47):
I know I'll see him again one day Exactly.
Doug Smith (36:50):
And he said, doug, you can't say goodbye to
something that you've never saidhello to.
And that hit me just like a tonof bricks.
And he sent me on this wholeprocess.
He actually had me go to thegrave sites of those I've lost
and write letters.
You know I have four kids underseven and I can't imagine
losing a child.
The grief that comes with thatDo you have and so many people
listen to this have lost lovedones and had traumatic events.
Do you have any advice inaddition to what you already
(37:13):
shared when it just comes togrieving and getting over the
loss in our lives?
Anne Beiler (37:18):
Well, I think what you just shared, doug is
powerful and we run from it likeour grief and pain, we actually
run away from it and I wantedto say run towards it.
What I learned to do over timewas sit in my chair and when I
had these feelings of sadnessand guilt and shame and whatever
(37:41):
it may have been, there was aload of just emotions of all
kinds that I would experienceafter I told my secret and
eventually I learned to sit inmy chair instead of running away
from my pain and the feelingsthat made me feel bad.
I just talked to somebody at aplace a couple of weeks ago
where I was speaking and agentleman came to me and was
(38:04):
talking to me about my story andI said so what's your story?
He said, well, I can't talkabout it.
And I said, wow, can you tellme why you don't want to talk
about it?
He said, well, because if I do,then I will feel all of the
pain again.
I'm like, wow, exactly, we don'twant to feel the pain, but
there is no way to be well,unless you tell, unless you feel
(38:27):
the pain of it all, you cannever be better.
It's mind-blowing and that'skind of like a.
Some people have never heardthat.
They may never have heard thatphrase, but you said what I'm
saying, but it's true.
You have to tell to be well,and so I believe that when
people experience this kind oftragedy as time goes on, like
(38:49):
you said, nine months later, isthat what you said after?
Doug Smith (38:51):
a year or six months ?
Anne Beiler (38:52):
Yeah, nine months, nine months, that's a very short
time.
I'm proud of you for doing that.
I mean understanding.
I can't go on it, it's tooheavy, you can't bury it forever
.
And so the tragedy people walkthrough it, they keep walking to
walk it away from it, and thefurther they get away from it,
the more they feel like, oh, wow, I survived.
(39:12):
Right, I survived, but at onepoint survival is not good
enough.
It's the tragedy, the traumawhich you experienced, and then
the survival.
We move on and we feel likewe're okay and I see survival.
As for me, it was like wow, Isurvived the death of Angie.
And then, as I got out of theabuse, I survived, that I was so
(39:34):
proud of myself I survived.
This is amazing.
But survival, I picture that inmy mind like you're on a raft on
the middle of the ocean andyou're on the raft, you're
keeping your head above water,but I mean, the waves are
crashing, you're not living,you're surviving.
And so then it's tragedy,trauma, and then it's surviving,
(39:58):
and then it's overcoming, andthe overcoming is Doug, what I
believe that you're beginning tofeel and experience, as you
began to open up and begin totalk about your pain.
I may not be right about that,but the overcoming happens as we
begin to talk.
Yes.
And that's why I can't.
You know there's so much in mybook about that and I love what
(40:22):
Dr Richard Jarbens says.
The Christian psychiatriststhat helped me out of the
emerged ministries in Akron,ohio, which would be near where
you are yeah, they're stillthere today emerge ministries If
you need help, emergeministries is there for you.
They do trauma counseling,counseling about kids.
(40:43):
But Dr Richard Talbott, he hadone line that I love that it was
he paraphrased James 516.
He says Satan builds hisstrongholds in the secrets of
our lives and he reinforces themby silence.
Don't talk.
But when I break the silence,when I begin to talk, I break
(41:04):
the stronghold.
That is, in fact, the James 516model.
Satan builds his strongholds inthe secrets of our lives.
He builds this, he's buildingthat secret.
He's building it's gettingbigger and bigger and bigger.
It becomes a stronghold in ourlife.
(41:26):
But when I begin to talk, Ibreak the stronghold.
And that's my story and I'msticking to it.
Your stronghold, it's so big inyour mind, so hard to bear,
that eventually you cannot bearit anymore.
And I just want to encourageyou whether you're 20, 15, 30, a
young age, don't wait.
(41:48):
I was almost 40 before I wasable to talk about the death of
my daughter and the abuse Ithink I was actually 37 and the
abuse of my pastor, and I was sowrecked that it took me years
to overcome.
If you can begin to live thislifestyle I call it the
(42:09):
lifestyle of compassion If youcan begin to live this lifestyle
every single day, when thingsbegin to come at you and you're
feeling overwhelmed or you feelyour stomach and knots, or
you're hurting your heart's,hurting the feelings, their real
feelings begin to pay attentionto that.
And so what I do to live theovercoming lifestyle is when I
feel like I've hurt someone andI can't just pray about it and
(42:31):
say, father, forgive me, I'msorry.
It lingers in my belly or in myheart, I know.
Then I need to make an honestconfession, or just when I'm
sorry, or if they've hurt mesometimes I can't get over it
right away.
Over time I will go say to themyou know what you said to me
the other day or the other week,whatever.
What you did hurt me and I justwant you to know I forgive you
(42:53):
for hurting me.
That sounds silly, but it's aprinciple in the Word of God
that keeps me free.
It keeps me in the light.
I don't have secrets anymore.
I just bring them into thelight, either with somebody or
with my husband, or in prayer.
That's the lifestyle ofovercoming and that's where I
live today.
And listen, doug, I have gonefrom the darkest of nights for
(43:16):
years hopeless, depressed,suicidal to the brightest of
light.
It's so big and the more I tellmy story Doug I don't even
understand this the greater thelight becomes.
Wow.
Doug Smith (43:31):
Well, thank you for sharing that.
I don't think we're going toget to the leadership, but
people are saying what does thishave to do with leadership?
Everything it's like.
Anne Beiler (43:37):
Oh, everything.
Doug Smith (43:39):
Yeah, do you want to say anything to that?
Anne Beiler (43:40):
I mean yes, well, I just want to say I believe that
God wants to equip.
In these days in particular, hewants an army of people that
are overcomers, that can helpthose who are living in this
survival mode, in thismarketplace, but he wants to
take us to a place of leadership, live the overcoming lifestyle.
(44:03):
He wants it.
It's going to take an army ofus, a whole army of soldiers
that are strong and courageous,that can reach down to the
downtrodden and lift them up,and I feel like that's my
mission.
My mission is to the church,help people, just to lift them
up, and God needs all of us todo that.
Doug Smith (44:24):
Yeah, and this probably be.
We can land a plane with thisquestion.
But you mentioned, you know,even just recently, just if
something's in shumbling you'reholding on forgiveness, forgive
someone If someone's been inabuse.
Like how have you?
I don't know how much detailyou want to go to, but you
talked about spiritual abuse orabuse of authority, and that
happened.
This happened.
Unfortunately, statistics saythis happens every day.
(44:45):
I think one, one in three orfour children are abused.
Like which is crazy.
So how, how do you deal BecauseI think that I'm assuming that
that's part of the fear andtelling too.
If I tell, then then thisperson who has authority over me
, how do you, how do how dovictims deal with that?
Anne Beiler (45:01):
There's such, there's so many, there's so many
the, the, the tentacles youknow to abuse is.
There's so many pieces to it.
It's so deep and so troublingand so confusing.
But you know, as a, as a child,it's hard to deal with abuse.
I mean as a child, but I shouldgrow it.
For me I was a grown woman so Icannot even imagine.
(45:22):
But what I know is is that theabuse that I experienced, it
felt, and then also the samepastor abused our oldest
daughter from all the whole timehe was abusing me he was a
part of her life as well, and Ididn't know that till she was 25
.
And that was that's a wholeother story that took me.
(45:43):
That almost made me crash andburn.
So you know, the questionbecomes how can I forgive?
How can I forgive?
I don't.
I'm going to answer this veryquickly because I know we're
running out of time, but but themost comfort that I got as far
as forgiveness was many, manyyears after my story unfolded,
(46:05):
and it was actually in the year2003.
And I, I was sitting on mychair and thinking about
forgiveness and just telling theLord I don't know, I don't know
.
And I remember the story ofJesus on the cross, when, when
he was dying, and he said I know, you know what he said, but we,
(46:28):
I went over.
I just read this so many timesthat I never saw it.
But on the cross, jesus said, Ibelieve the weight of the world
was too much for him.
He was Jesus, he was God in theflesh.
How can you take the world, theweight of the whole world, from
beginning of time to the end oftime, upon yourself?
(46:50):
And he said, father, forgivethem, because they don't know
what they're doing.
And you know, when I read thatin the year 2003,.
I realized that sometimesthings are so hard for us as
human beings to bear and I beganto pray that prayer Father,
(47:13):
would you forgive him Because hereally doesn't know what he did
to me and my family?
And you want Doug, even to thisday, if I struggle with how do
I forgive?
Maybe it's something there'sstill trigger points in my
family, or I hear stories, my, I, that's my, go to prayer Father
(47:33):
, forgive him, for he does notknow what he did.
And that was a.
That was a way of forgivenessthat I experienced, that gave me
peace, no guilt, no shame on mypart, like, oh, you have to
forgive.
I have.
To the best of my ability, I'veforgiven, but sometimes, when
it feels hard, even today, Ijust read that prayer Father
(47:56):
forgive, or he doesn't know whathe did.
Try it yourself, it might work,I don't know.
Yeah Well, thank you forsharing that and I guess I'll
just leave this open at the end.
Doug Smith (48:06):
Is there anything else you want to leave our
listeners with today, before wewrap up?
Anne Beiler (48:10):
You know, I just, I just believe that God is bigger
than all of us Even can imagine.
His, his grace goes furtherthan our pain.
His forgiveness is deeper thanany sin, any shame that we've
borne.
He is greater than all of thatand believe that.
You know, faith is believingthat God will do what he said he
(48:30):
would do.
Whatever God said he would do,he will do.
That's that's who he is.
So I want to encourage youraudience to just believe that
God is.
He is as good as his word andhe has promised to give you life
and to help you live anovercoming life, the life that
(48:50):
he died for, and that's whathe's.
He's.
He's offering that to you today.
Work out your own salvation andfear and trembling.
There's a lot of work that wedo in faith.
We call out to him constantly.
There's a lot of work that wedo.
Do the hard work, Set yourselffree and you'll begin to live a
life that you didn't even knowwas possible.
Doug Smith (49:13):
Yeah well, and thank you so much for doing the hard
work yourself and allowing Godto use your story and the
circumstances you've gonethrough to glorify him and help
other people.
I'm believing, god, that youknow everyone listening to this,
those who need help or or in asimilar position, that this will
be the the key to them gettingfree, and so thank you for your
ministry and, of course, thankyou for for great pretzels to
(49:35):
everyone on the planet.
My family is extremelyappreciative.
So thank you so much, andhopefully we'll get to do this
again sometime.
Anne Beiler (49:43):
Awesome.
Thank you for the opportunity.
God bless you and MerryChristmas to you.
Doug Smith (49:47):
Merry Christmas.
Well, leader, thank you so muchfor listening to my
conversation with Anne.
I hope that you enjoyed it asmuch as I did.
You can find ways to connectwith her and links to everything
that we discussed in the shownotes at L3 leadershiporg
forward, slash 413.
And as always, leader, I liketo end every episode of the
quote, and I'll quote PresidentRonald Reagan, who said this the
greatest leader is notnecessarily the one who does the
greatest things.
(50:07):
He is the one that gets thepeople to do the greatest things
.
And leader leadership is allabout others, and so make sure
you always remember that.
As I say at the end of everyepisode, know that my wife
Lauren, I love you, we believein you and don't quit.
Keep leading.
The world desperately needsyour leadership.
We'll talk to you next episode.
It keeps me in the light.
I don't have secrets anymore.
I just bring them into thelight, either with somebody or
with my husband, or in prayer.
That's the lifestyle ofovercoming.
Doug Smith (00:17):
Hey, leader, and welcome to another episode of
the L3 Leadership Podcast, wherewe are obsessed with helping
you grow to your maximumpotential and to maximize the
impact of your leadership.
My name is Doug Smith and I amyour host In today's episode.
It's brought to you by myfriends Beratung Advisors.
We also recorded this live fromthe new Birgo Realty Studio.
If you're new to the podcast,welcome.
I'm so glad that you're hereand I hope that you enjoy our
content and become a subscriber.
(00:38):
Know that you can also watchall of our episodes over on our
YouTube channel, so make sureyou're subscribed there as well.
And, as always, if you've beenlistening to the podcast and its
impact on your life, it wouldmean the world to me if you'd
leave us a rating and review onApple Podcasts or Spotify or
wherever you listen to podcaststhrough.
That really does help us togrow our audience and reach more
leaders, so thank you inadvance for that.
While, leader, in today'sepisode you're going to hear my
(00:58):
conversation with the founder ofAnnie Ann's Pretzels who
doesn't love those, ann Beilerand I would tell you a lot more
about her now, but she'sactually going to share her
story and I'm pretty sureeveryone on the planet knows
Annie Ann's Pretzels and ifyou've never heard Ann and
you've never heard her story,just get ready.
It is so powerful and I knowyou're going to be challenged, I
know you're going to beinspired and I'm just so
(01:19):
grateful that she was willing totake the time to share this
here.
So I know you're going to beblessed.
But before we dive into herstory, just a few announcements.
This episode of the L3Leadership Podcast is sponsored
by Beratung Advisors.
The financial advisors atBeratung Advisors help educate
and empower clients to makeinformed financial decisions.
You can find out how BeratungAdvisors can help you develop a
(01:40):
customized financial plan foryour financial future by
visiting their website atbaritungadvisorscom.
That'sB-E-R-A-T-U-N-G-Advisorscom.
Securities and investmentproducts and services offered
through LPL Financial, memberFINRA and SIPC.
Beratung Advisors, lplFinancial and L3 Leadership are
separate entities.
(02:00):
I also want to thank our sponsor, Henne Jewelers.
They're a jeweler owned by myfriend and mentor, John Henne,
and my wife Laura and I got ourengagement and wedding rings
through Henne Jewelers and hadan incredible experience.
And not only do they have greatjewelry, but they also invest
in people.
In fact, for every couple thatcomes in engage, they give them
a book to help them prepare formarriage, and we just love that.
So if you're in need of a goodjeweler, check out
hennyjewelerscom.
(02:21):
And with all that being said,let's dive right in.
Here's my conversation withAnne Beiler the founder of
Auntie Anne's Pretzels.
Enjoy.
Anne Beiler, welcome to the L3Leadership Podcast.
I'm extremely excited for thisconversation.
We're so glad to have you.
Anne Beiler (02:37):
Well, it's my pleasure to be on your podcast
today, Doug, and thank you forhaving me.
Doug Smith (02:42):
Yeah Well, we're going to go into all kinds of
different directions with youand your story, but obviously
you're most known for being thefounder of Auntie Anne's
Pretzels, which I don't thinkthere's a person on the planet
that doesn't love those.
When I told people I wasinterviewing you, they're like
can we get some free pretzels?
Anne Beiler (02:57):
I know People still want freebies.
Doug Smith (03:00):
So funny.
But I want to dive in yourstory, but before we do and
we'll dive more into AuntieAnne's later but can you at
least give people an idea of thescope of where Auntie Anne's
was and what you built it toprior to selling it, and then
we'll dive into your story.
Anne Beiler (03:14):
Yeah, sure.
So we started back in 1988 in alittle farmer's market in
downtown Pennsylvania.
I grew up in the Amish culturewhich my mom and dad were old
order Amish until I was threeand then we went to the black
car Amish.
We moved on up which meant wecould have a car it had to be
black and my dad could farm witha tractor instead of horses and
(03:36):
we had electricity.
So it wasn't so bad.
We had some.
It was pretty cool.
But on the other hand, we lookedat Amish and I grew up in that
culture, very knowledgeable andunderstand the traditions and I
grew up in this very, I want tosay it was a very good
(04:00):
environment for me as a child.
My mom and dad loved us, caredfor eight of us kids, or three
boys, three girls and five boysand it wasn't almost.
Looking back I just realizedhow good it was and how it
almost seems idyllic to me todaybecause I've experienced a lot
of life since that time.
At the age of 16, I met myhusband, jonas, and he was my
(04:26):
attraction and the love of mylife.
As soon as I met him andobviously at that point in my
life was pretty short, but hewas a good man Also grew up in
the Amish culture, and a goodlooking guy and worked hard and
love God.
I'm like, wow, okay, I hit thejackpot with this guy.
I hope I can marry him one day.
And three years later we gotmarried.
I was 19 in the year 21.
(04:48):
And it's still very culturally.
That's Amish people, amish men,and eight he's still married,
most of them married very young,because we are taught well
about how to do family, workhard and care for each other.
My mom always said littlechildren, love each other, do
not give each other pain.
When one speaks to you in anger, do not answer them again.
So we had all these.
(05:08):
You know, forgive and peace,salt and light and go this heck
of a mouth.
So you know I really had agreat starting life, doug, and
when I look back at that Irealized that was enough.
You know that foundation helpedme weather the storms of life.
Mama, dad took us to church, ofcourse, every Sunday, without
(05:31):
fail.
We sat around our dinner table,three around our kitchen table,
I might say three times a daybreakfast lunch and dinner
without fail All of the years Iwas at home.
There was never an exception tothat, unless we may have been
out visiting or something.
But yeah, that's what we did.
And so I realized that thearound the table being with my
(05:53):
family, mom and dad always beingaround was.
I look at that right now and Ididn't think, of course, didn't
realize at the time, but what agift to our family that they
were always around.
In particular, my mom and dadwent to farmers markets from in
Philadelphia for a couple ofyears and during those years I
was around 11, 12 and 13.
(06:16):
And I would come home frommarket and my mom that was the
only night that she was not athome when I got over from school
and she would have a list forme to a pies and cakes that she
wanted me to bake and I would dothat in my farmhouse kitchen
I'm sorry, basement.
I would go down the basementsteps as a little girl I
remember I would.
Many times I would cry becausemy mom was not there and but I
(06:39):
knew how to do this and I made60 to 70 pies and cakes every
Thursday night for maybe twoyears by myself while the other
kids were out doing their chores, you know anyway.
So I feel like God set me upfor something that I would never
have dreamed of, which wasAuntie and Sup Pretzels and
going from one store, a DowningTown, and then two stores that
(07:02):
that year, the very first year,12 stores the next year, 35 the
next and 15 years so thefollowing year.
So we just kept growing untilwe sold the company in 2015.
And by that time we had almost900 locations.
So for this little Amish gofrom Anixtra County,
pennsylvania, let me tell you,god worked an amazing work in my
(07:23):
heart, in my mind, in myprofessional world, in my
personal life, in my spirituallife.
Those almost 20 years I alwayssay that Auntie and grew me up.
That's where.
I learned real life.
Doug Smith (07:35):
Wow.
Well, I certainly want to diveinto leadership lessons with
that a little bit later, butwhat I think so interesting is,
you know, you just shared yourstory.
If we just shared what you justshared, it's business like hey
had a great childhood, had greatparents, and basically you
started a company and scaled andwe sold it and it was fantastic
.
Anne Beiler (07:52):
But that's right.
Doug Smith (07:54):
Behind the scenes.
You know, I know your story,that that you know it wasn't all
up into the right, it wasn'tall perfect, and you actually
experienced.
You know a lot.
Can you share a little bitabout?
You know your story beyond,behind the veil of any ends and
in your upbringing.
Anne Beiler (08:09):
Thank you, doug.
Yeah, because that's reallywhat.
That's really what made me whoI am today, you know, not the
success of the ends, althoughthat grew me up, but what really
sparked my spiritual journey.
As a kid I knew I knew God andI loved him and I believed that
life is good because it was, andthat God is harsh.
(08:34):
Because I was taught that ifyou keep the 10 commandments and
you know, do your very best tokeep them all that God would be
very pleased with me and hewould smile on me.
But if I did something, youknow I don't know how wrong
something should be to be wrong,but I just knew that if I did
something wrong, maybe God wouldbe just pleased with me.
(08:54):
What I know today, doug, isthat that's bad theology number
one.
And also what I know is that,after over seven decades of real
life experiences, I know todaythat life is hard.
God is good, and I'm notconfused about that anymore, but
I sure was for many years.
So Jonas and I were happilymarried for about seven years
(09:16):
and we had two little girls, onefour and one 19 months old, and
our sweet Angie Angela Joy.
We live right next to myparents during that time and she
would always make her littletrek up to my mom's house for
her second breakfast very often,and one particular morning she
(09:36):
went up to mom's house and welived in the country, so it was
a very common, or sometimes thetwo of the girls would walk up
together.
But that particular morning Isaw her walk out our drive, out
our, through our yard, headedfrom my mom's house, which I
always stood at my door waiting,watching her go to make sure
that she got around the cornerand was heading in the right
(09:57):
direction.
Then I would call mom and tellher she's on the way, and that
morning I watched her, neversaid goodbye to her, never
called her back, and the unusualpart about that morning was
that she still had her pajamason and I kept thinking I should
call her back and, you know,change her for the day, and.
But I didn't.
And so I turned around, walkedinto the house and I put my hand
(10:19):
on the phone and as I did, Iheard all of this commotion,
screaming, yelling.
I had never heard anything likeit, but in my heart,
immediately I knew that Angiewas gone.
And I don't know how I knewthat, except that a mother's
instinct is very strong and it'svery real and it's most times
(10:41):
right.
And so I ran to my front doorand in that moment my father was
bringing, carrying Angie's bodyin his arms, just wailing that
I believe she's dead.
I believe she's dead.
Well, of course, doug, you knowthat's tragic and traumatic
because I had been, I was, I wasliving a good life, I'd been a
(11:05):
pretty good girl according tothe standards of the, you know,
the church, and immediately, asAngie made her ascended to
heaven that morning, I knewwhere she went and there was
some comfort in that.
But as time went on, the longingand the loneliness and the
questions and the grief and justas sadness was overwhelming and
I began my very slow andgradual descent into a world
(11:28):
that I knew nothing aboutemotional pain and spiritual
confusion.
That journey, you know it'shard for me to explain it.
You know just how, how ithappened for me.
But I went from reallybelieving and trusting in God to
why, if I was good, why did youdo this to me?
(11:50):
I know today that's everybodyasked that question.
Why, god?
You know, and I think that weforget that Jesus was very clear
when he said the enemy has cometo steal, to kill and to
destroy, and I have come to giveyou life, and so I think that
we're very confused about that.
But we all everybody asked thatquestion why God?
(12:10):
And that became my question.
There were no answers for me.
Even though I kept calling thechurch my husband, I began to
drift apart emotionally.
We, of course, stayed togetherand after a couple of months of
and I would always cry whennobody was watching and I tried
to be strong I felt like I hadto carry this grief.
You know, I had to carry it bymyself.
(12:32):
That was so.
It's not okay to carry ourgrief by ourselves, and Jonah's
not going to be able to talkabout things.
And so we then began to live ina silent marriage and a couple
of months, a very short timelater, my pastor gave to me at
church and and it has to be tocome to his office and just to
(12:57):
talk, and I'd never talked tohim before about anything that I
was feeling or anything in life, about my experience, and I had
never really taken the time todo that because life had been
good for me.
So I was relieved when I feltlike, wow, I can.
I can just at least try to talkabout what I'm feeling.
It was a very difficult thingfor me to think about talking
(13:19):
about it, but I went and so itwas.
It was a good conversation forthe most part and at the very
end of it, though, he tookadvantage of me physically and I
I, I was devastated because Ididn't understand the number one
, why?
And number two, I guess I didsomething that I don't know that
(13:42):
made him do that to me.
So of course, the guilt, youknow Angie, took me into a place
of sad, deep sadness and grief.
But this was the journey for meof guilt and shame, and it
wasn't my fault that that he didthat to me.
I know that now.
But at the time, when I walkedout of the office, out of his
(14:04):
office, I clearly remembermaking a choice that I would
never tell.
And let me tell you, doug,that's, that's a big lie, and
that's where Satan very oftengrips us in our secrets, and
I've never in my life kept asecret from Jonas, ever.
(14:26):
I mean, there was no need to,you know.
So that took me then into thedark world.
And that one choice, that wasmy choice.
And but I made that choicebecause I felt like there was no
alternative because I didn'tknow, you know, like who, who,
who did I tell anything?
I didn't know how to talk aboutAngie's death, how would I know
(14:46):
how to describe or even havethe vocabulary to talk about
abuse?
And that one, that one secretkept me in nearly seven years of
abuse of every kind and took meinto the dark world and kept me
there.
And Satan gave me the tools Ineeded to keep me there and I
almost succumbed and almost,almost died there, physically,
(15:09):
almost died there.
Doug Smith (15:14):
Well, thank you for sharing that story.
So after the seven years, I dothink it's important.
So what happened after thatseven year period that kind of
brought you out of that?
Anne Beiler (15:23):
Well, you know, I stayed there too long and my
message today is for people thatare in dark places and don't
know how to get out.
I felt stuck, I felt like therewas no, no way out and I I, I
believe truly believed that lifewas over for me.
I knew I believe the lies thatI was unlovable, I was
unforgivable and for sure, I wasunchangeable.
(15:47):
I didn't feel like there wasanything within me that I had to
offer to anyone.
I didn't feel like I had theability to change anything.
I was stuck in this, this darkplace, and did not know how to
get out.
And I weighed 90 pounds.
I was falling apart from theinside out.
(16:08):
I was majorly depressed andwent to the doctor a couple of
times because, physically, Ithought that I had ulcers in my
stomach and my heart raced and Ithought I was having a heart
attack.
So I mean physically secretsover time will kill you.
If not physically, you dieemotionally.
And Dr Richard Dobbins saysthat the tragedy is not in dying
(16:31):
, but it's what dies inside ofus while we live.
I was dying inside and I wastrying to live, and so at the
end of all those years, I prayedand I wept and I just got to
deliver me.
And I knew that one day it wasjust like I don't know, come
down and somehow just deliver meout of this dark place.
But one day I was compelled bya Holy Spirit within me that
(16:54):
said get up off your knees, stopcrying and go tell.
Go tell your husband.
You know the story of the man bythe pool of the pesta.
You know, for 38 years he satthere, waited, tried to get into
the pool and he wasn't able tomanage that and had all the
(17:14):
reasons as to why he couldn'tget into the pool for his
healing.
When Jesus came to him that dayhe said to him Sir, would you
like to be healed?
You know, and that's a questionof all time, do we want to be
healed?
And my, the question, for me,was I wanted to be healed but,
like, like the man by the pool,I didn't know how to get into
(17:36):
the water, I didn't know how, Ididn't know where to go, what to
do.
But that morning Holy Spiritwas very clear with me and go
tell.
And I gathered my broken selftogether.
I'm sorry, it's okay, I'mgrateful.
(17:57):
I remember it very clearly.
I gather myself together inHoly Spirit within me Never left
me, doug.
He never left me because it washim.
It was him he gave me thecourage.
Wow.
So I gathered it all up in myheart and palm sweating and
(18:21):
heart racing, and all the way tomy husband's, jonas's repair
shop I kept saying, god, I can'tdo this, I can't, do this, I
can't.
But I kept driving and when Igot there I made a very hard.
When I say hard, no feeling, noemotion, two sentences could
passionate him and the look inhis eyes was scary.
(18:45):
I had never seen the sadness orthe that look and whatever that
look was.
I had to turn around and leave.
I couldn't touch him.
I didn't say it.
Forgive me please.
My end, my the end of myconversation confessional, is
simply I'm sorry and I'm a sorryperson, and that that
principles founded James 516.
(19:06):
I didn't really understand thatprinciple at the time.
I didn't even know it was inthe Bible.
I just know Holy Spirit gave methe courage to do what I had to
do that morning.
But, as from that day to thisday, doug, I've learned the
power of of being real, open,honest.
And let me tell you somethingthere's no other way.
There is no other way.
(19:28):
I prayed for seven years and Istayed in this dark place.
Jesus and God, holy Spirit,sustain me.
They never let go because theywon't.
They promised that they wouldstay with us forever and they
stayed with me.
But wow.
And so that day, though thechoice I made to tell Jonas that
(19:50):
James 516 model can bet yourballs one to another and pray,
and then you'll be healed.
And that's the model.
I feel like us, as Christians,as believers, followers of
Christ, whoever we think we are,whatever we're following Christ
.
But you know, what we want todo is pray, never tell and
(20:11):
expect God to heal.
And I believe that James 516 isnot the spiritual connection
with Jesus, it's the relationalmodel.
It's the model that builds andheals, heals and builds
relationships.
Without that confession to Jonasthat day it was long before, it
was five years before he endsthere would not be an anti-an.
(20:33):
Wow, jonas and I would not betogether today and there would
not be an anti-an.
And I always say can youimagine a world without anti-an
self-rencils?
No, I mean so.
I mean it sounds silly, butthat is a truth.
Every time I say that it is, myheart feels it, my stomach
feels it.
It's true.
So the point to that is, youknow, satan wants to destroy you
(20:57):
.
Why, why?
Because he doesn't want you tofulfill the purpose for which
God created you, for that's whyhe wants to destroy you, because
he knows that once you are well, once if you're able to
overcome and you're able to livea life of freedom and truth,
honesty, transparency.
You know confession is, itfeels like a, it feels hard and
(21:21):
harsh and subjective, but youknow what it really means.
You know.
Be open, honest, transparent,because as you do that, then you
are actually walking in thelight with your faults, your
failures, your sin, yourmistakes, your struggles.
You know, we all live thosethings every day.
But as we are able to talk andtalk about it and confess it to
(21:45):
someone, that's where we beginto live in the light.
We walk in the light, as he isin the light, and then we have
fellowship with one another.
What we're doing right now,doug, is we have fellowship with
one another, and then the bloodof Christ cleanses us from all
sin.
It's all about bringing ourdeeds into the light, no matter
(22:05):
how hard, no matter how bad, nomatter what the struggle is.
But when you begin to do that,as it happened for me that day
with Jones, there was not aninstant miracle, let me tell you
for sure.
But there was something insideof me that I began to feel
lighter, slowly but surely.
I mean, the weight of it wasstill here, but I knew I had
(22:27):
done the right thing.
And when Jonas came home thatnight, he simply said to me we
need to talk.
And I didn't want to talk.
I had just given him thegreatest, the most information
that I had told anyone about mysecret, and he wants to talk
about it.
It was a hard, hard evening.
(22:49):
But what he said to me afterthat is what got me on the path
of really truth and believingthat maybe there's hope for me.
I was done, life was over.
During those years I trulybelieved, doug, that my only
option was to take my life.
That seemed easier than to tellmy secret.
(23:12):
Can you, I mean, think aboutthat?
But that's where I stayed forabout three years of those
nearly seven.
I thought about it, hadsuicidal thoughts, but yet I
still wanted family, I stillwanted my children, I still
wanted to be married to Jonas,but I didn't know how to get
back to that.
So, anyway, as we began to talk, he said I know that you have
(23:34):
not been happy, but if you wantto be happy, I want you to be
happy and if you have to leave,if you have to go somewhere,
please don't leave a note on theaddress or on the middle of the
night and go, but just come tome and talk to me.
Tell me what you need, we'lltalk about it.
(23:59):
I'll help you find a house.
Wow.
And I'll help you pack your bags, but you have to take your
girls with you because they needtheir mother.
Okay, doug, so that was itright there.
He believed in me.
And how could he do that?
It's because during that day hecalled a counselor and the
(24:23):
counselors and Jonas wascompletely distraught.
He I can't tell the story rightnow because it takes too long
but in the few hours maybe eighthours he had called a counselor
and the counselor had said tome, or had said to him you have
a right to divorce your wife.
I guess Even at that time, doug, we didn't understand actual
(24:47):
abuse of spiritual power.
We didn't even understand.
It's like I hadn't up there foralmost seven years.
But I understand.
I understood much later.
Abuse is not the same as anaffair and anyway, that's a
whole other subject which Ispeak about in my book.
It's called those Secret LiesWithin.
But that day, when he said thatto me that the girls need their
(25:13):
mother, you can't evenunderstand the impact that had
on me because, again, I wasunforgivable and lovable and
changeable.
I don't deserve anything good.
I was unworthy of the shame,the cloak of shame I wore every
single day.
There was nothing good.
I could never have writtenanything good or anything that I
(25:34):
liked about myself at thatpoint.
And so I said okay, I promiseyou I won't leave you in the
middle of the night.
And then I asked him can youmake a promise to me?
And he said sure.
I said promise me you won't rubmy past in my face ever.
Wow, he's right.
And you know what, Doug, fromthat day.
(25:54):
And he said I promise, fromthat day to this he has never.
We have talked about it a lot,all as well.
But the challenge that thecounselor gave in that day was
you can either go and divorceyour wife and have a committed
adultery and you can go do whatyour wife has done, or you can
(26:18):
love her like Jesus loves you,not like Jesus loves the church,
because he heard that all hislife.
But he said there was somethingabout when the man challenged
him to love your wife like Jesusloves you, he said.
(26:38):
In that moment I began to weeplike a baby because I began to
think about how is it, how doesJesus love me?
And my focus changed from whathappened to Anne or what Anne
did to me to how is it that heloves me and how can I love Anne
(27:02):
and the girls in the same way.
And that, doug, is what kept ourmarriage together and he would
tell you that God did a work ofgrace in both of us, and that's
why we're still one today, after55 years.
Doug Smith (27:18):
Wow.
Well, thank you so much forsharing your story and thank God
for your husband, thank God forGod speaking to you, and thank
God that you had the courage toconfess and not just give it all
up.
So thank you for that.
A few follow-up questions justthat, I think, will help One.
I just love that you arevulnerable and willing to share
your story, because I feel likeso many people are going through
(27:39):
similar things and they don'tspeak up and they think they're
the only person on the planetdealing with this, and so I
guess my first question wouldjust be if someone's listening
to us and they're in the middleof being sexually abused or in a
situation where they're beingvictimized and they feel similar
to you do, if I share this, ifthis ever comes out, my life's
already over.
(28:00):
They've been in forever.
What would you say to thatperson?
Anne Beiler (28:04):
Well, I've written a book about it.
Again, I'll mention that it'ssecretized within.
So that's a very, that's a deepquestion, a loaded question,
but I'll just share myexperience with that which I
mentioned a minute ago, was to,first of all, be courageous.
It takes courage, it takesstrength.
(28:27):
It's almost impossible to do itby yourself.
So I would encourage anyone towho is in your life right now,
that you know loves you.
Number one that you know hasbeen down the road and has
experienced, maybe hasexperienced some, some hardships
(28:49):
in their life and they havegotten to a point in life where
they've overcome and you knowthey're strong and they're
steady and they, they, they canlove you and guide you.
You don't want to go to the barand talk about your troubles at
a bar.
I mean, people do that all thetime and there's something kind
of like appealing to me aboutthat, Like, actually, why can we
(29:09):
not do that in the church?
Why?
can we not, you know, just goand say, hey, this is my problem
, this is what I'm strugglingwith, and I'm like, why can we
not do that?
We should be able to, becauseyou know, we've we've been
instructed to bear one another'sburdens and so, as we do that,
(29:30):
we fulfill the law of Christ.
So I believe that it's reallythe only way that you'll be able
to overcome any of your, yourstruggles and the and the
depression and the, the anxiety,and you know, we hear so.
So many people today, you know,struggle with panic attacks and
and it's all around.
(29:51):
I don't, I don't know that I gothrough a day without somebody
telling me that I'm I'm anxiousor I haven't.
I feel like I'm having anxietyor I'm having a panic attack.
It's almost like a buzzword andI'm saying there is a better
way and I truly believe.
You know, I love the fact thatJesus died for our sins.
(30:12):
That's like wow.
But I just, you know, a coupleof years ago, I realized, as I
read the Easter story once againread Isaiah and Easter story
and I realized Jesus not onlydied for my sins, but he carried
my shame and what most of itexperience with abuse of any
(30:36):
kind, whether it's verbal,physical, sexual bullying,
whatever it may be, the abusethat we've experienced, you know
, somehow it fills us with shame.
What someone has done to us tohurt us fills us with shame,
(30:56):
Like it's my fault, Like I musthave done something wrong.
And yes, you know, after Iexperienced what I did with the
abuse, I became, you know, hurtpeople, hurt other people.
I abandoned my children, notnot physically, but emotionally.
I abandoned my children.
I mean I could, I can write abook, I have written a book
about you know how I respondedto the pain and that was
(31:18):
inflicted on me.
But then I began to inflict painon my family.
And so the shame that you feel,number one, is that somebody
did this to me.
And then, number two, you feelashamed because now you are, you
know, I know some young peoplethat I've isolated themselves.
They're mean and short temperedand angry at their families, at
(31:40):
their parents, and are mad atmom and dad and mad at God.
So all of these things, youknow, there's really only one
way we try to drug it away, wetry to sex it away.
We become workaholics, we, we,we come, we can even become
ministers.
We start, you know, busy in theministry.
(32:00):
We exercise it away, we try to.
This pain is inside of us.
We're up to here.
We can know we can hardly carryit anymore, and I know that
there's people in your audiencethat are there right now.
And the only way for me I triedeverything the only way for me
(32:21):
was to begin to unload, and theonly way you can do that is to
actually talk about it.
It's so hard, I know.
So when I talk about findingsomeone that could help you and
you know I'm careful about thisbecause I felt like I went to
the right place I mean I went tomy pastor, someone that I truly
(32:45):
trusted.
So how do you know who to go to?
I pray that you ask, that youask, first of all, ask Holy
Spirit to help you find theright person and gather one or
two close friends that can guideyou.
And then, ultimately, if you'reabused, you find yourself
(33:07):
almost depressed, so bad thatyou want to take your life.
You have to call.
Maybe it's a helpline, maybeit's somebody in your church,
maybe it's someone in yourneighborhood, maybe it's someone
at school that your teacher oryour I don't know, but you have
to find somebody to talk to.
And that jug is then thebeginning of opening a door to a
(33:29):
better life.
And there's a verse in Proverbs6-5 that if the audience that
you have is they're not allbelievers.
But let me tell you this ispractical advice, and it says in
Proverbs 6-5, set yourself freelike a gazelle from the hand of
the hunter, like a bird fromthe snare of the fallow.
(33:49):
Think about that picture.
That means great struggle.
So what you're about to do isnot easy.
It is a great struggle, like itwas for me, and even after I
made my confession, I began totalk to Jonas.
I had no idea how deep I was inmy darkness and how long it
(34:12):
would take me to get to a placeof total freedom.
But I have to tell you I mean,that has been my experience it's
beginning to talk, finding theright person and eventually
finding a trauma therapist, agood Christian, solid trauma
therapist, or start with just aChristian counselor, but someone
(34:34):
that is, I have to almost say,professional, because I didn't
want to talk to anyone, doug,that would talk to me about
Bible verses.
I mean, I hate to admit that,but I knew all the verses, I
knew what to do, but I couldn'tdo it.
And so the Word of God is veryimportant, going to church and
(34:58):
doing all the things that we doas followers of Christ is really
important.
But I did all that and the onlything that set me free was to
begin to talk.
And there's, you know, theBible says that we are
overcomers by the blood of theLamb and the Word of our
testimony.
I want to say, by your story,tell your story and the blood of
(35:19):
the Lamb.
The combination is why I'm onyour podcast today, doug.
That's why I'm here today.
The blood of the Lamb and beingable to tell my story.
I started out just a littlefall.
I'll never forget the veryfirst time with Jonas, and then
after that we went to acounselor for five times.
Five times my husband said weneed to go for help.
(35:39):
I fought him, I resisted him.
I said I don't want to go.
So you know everything is scary,but you've got to be courageous
and you have to keep movingforward toward the light, the
darkness.
Get out of the darkness as fastas you can and begin to look
(36:00):
toward the light and people thatare light filled, people that
you know are followers of Christ.
Doug Smith (36:09):
It may be the same answer, but I'm curious.
You know, obviously you lostthe unthinkable.
You lost a daughter 19 monthsold.
We were talking a little bitbefore.
You know, I lost my mom when Iwas 17.
I lost a sister a few years agoto an overdose.
So it was interesting a fewyears ago, nine months after I
lost my sister.
Basically, I have what I referto as a mental breakdown, and so
(36:31):
what you said I reached out forhelp and my counselor said
something to me I thought was sointeresting he said.
He said, doug, I don't thinkyou've ever grieved.
So what do you mean?
He's like I don't think you'vegrieved your mom, I don't think
you've grieved your sister.
And in my mind, again, goingback to the Bible verse, it's
like hey, we don't grieve likeothers grieve.
Anne Beiler (36:47):
I know I'll see him again one day Exactly.
Doug Smith (36:50):
And he said, doug, you can't say goodbye to
something that you've never saidhello to.
And that hit me just like a tonof bricks.
And he sent me on this wholeprocess.
He actually had me go to thegrave sites of those I've lost
and write letters.
You know I have four kids underseven and I can't imagine
losing a child.
The grief that comes with thatDo you have and so many people
listen to this have lost lovedones and had traumatic events.
Do you have any advice inaddition to what you already
(37:13):
shared when it just comes togrieving and getting over the
loss in our lives?
Anne Beiler (37:18):
Well, I think what you just shared, doug is
powerful and we run from it likeour grief and pain, we actually
run away from it and I wantedto say run towards it.
What I learned to do over timewas sit in my chair and when I
had these feelings of sadnessand guilt and shame and whatever
(37:41):
it may have been, there was aload of just emotions of all
kinds that I would experienceafter I told my secret and
eventually I learned to sit inmy chair instead of running away
from my pain and the feelingsthat made me feel bad.
I just talked to somebody at aplace a couple of weeks ago
where I was speaking and agentleman came to me and was
(38:04):
talking to me about my story andI said so what's your story?
He said, well, I can't talkabout it.
And I said, wow, can you tellme why you don't want to talk
about it?
He said, well, because if I do,then I will feel all of the
pain again.
I'm like, wow, exactly, we don'twant to feel the pain, but
there is no way to be well,unless you tell, unless you feel
(38:27):
the pain of it all, you cannever be better.
It's mind-blowing and that'skind of like a.
Some people have never heardthat.
They may never have heard thatphrase, but you said what I'm
saying, but it's true.
You have to tell to be well,and so I believe that when
people experience this kind oftragedy as time goes on, like
(38:49):
you said, nine months later, isthat what you said after?
Doug Smith (38:51):
a year or six months ?
Anne Beiler (38:52):
Yeah, nine months, nine months, that's a very short
time.
I'm proud of you for doing that.
I mean understanding.
I can't go on it, it's tooheavy, you can't bury it forever
.
And so the tragedy people walkthrough it, they keep walking to
walk it away from it, and thefurther they get away from it,
the more they feel like, oh, wow, I survived.
(39:12):
Right, I survived, but at onepoint survival is not good
enough.
It's the tragedy, the traumawhich you experienced, and then
the survival.
We move on and we feel likewe're okay and I see survival.
As for me, it was like wow, Isurvived the death of Angie.
And then, as I got out of theabuse, I survived, that I was so
(39:34):
proud of myself I survived.
This is amazing.
But survival, I picture that inmy mind like you're on a raft on
the middle of the ocean andyou're on the raft, you're
keeping your head above water,but I mean, the waves are
crashing, you're not living,you're surviving.
And so then it's tragedy,trauma, and then it's surviving,
(39:58):
and then it's overcoming, andthe overcoming is Doug, what I
believe that you're beginning tofeel and experience, as you
began to open up and begin totalk about your pain.
I may not be right about that,but the overcoming happens as we
begin to talk.
Yes.
And that's why I can't.
You know there's so much in mybook about that and I love what
(40:22):
Dr Richard Jarbens says.
The Christian psychiatriststhat helped me out of the
emerged ministries in Akron,ohio, which would be near where
you are yeah, they're stillthere today emerge ministries If
you need help, emergeministries is there for you.
They do trauma counseling,counseling about kids.
(40:43):
But Dr Richard Talbott, he hadone line that I love that it was
he paraphrased James 516.
He says Satan builds hisstrongholds in the secrets of
our lives and he reinforces themby silence.
Don't talk.
But when I break the silence,when I begin to talk, I break
(41:04):
the stronghold.
That is, in fact, the James 516model.
Satan builds his strongholds inthe secrets of our lives.
He builds this, he's buildingthat secret.
He's building it's gettingbigger and bigger and bigger.
It becomes a stronghold in ourlife.
(41:26):
But when I begin to talk, Ibreak the stronghold.
And that's my story and I'msticking to it.
Your stronghold, it's so big inyour mind, so hard to bear,
that eventually you cannot bearit anymore.
And I just want to encourageyou whether you're 20, 15, 30, a
young age, don't wait.
(41:48):
I was almost 40 before I wasable to talk about the death of
my daughter and the abuse Ithink I was actually 37 and the
abuse of my pastor, and I was sowrecked that it took me years
to overcome.
If you can begin to live thislifestyle I call it the
(42:09):
lifestyle of compassion If youcan begin to live this lifestyle
every single day, when thingsbegin to come at you and you're
feeling overwhelmed or you feelyour stomach and knots, or
you're hurting your heart's,hurting the feelings, their real
feelings begin to pay attentionto that.
And so what I do to live theovercoming lifestyle is when I
feel like I've hurt someone andI can't just pray about it and
(42:31):
say, father, forgive me, I'msorry.
It lingers in my belly or in myheart, I know.
Then I need to make an honestconfession, or just when I'm
sorry, or if they've hurt mesometimes I can't get over it
right away.
Over time I will go say to themyou know what you said to me
the other day or the other week,whatever.
What you did hurt me and I justwant you to know I forgive you
(42:53):
for hurting me.
That sounds silly, but it's aprinciple in the Word of God
that keeps me free.
It keeps me in the light.
I don't have secrets anymore.
I just bring them into thelight, either with somebody or
with my husband, or in prayer.
That's the lifestyle ofovercoming and that's where I
live today.
And listen, doug, I have gonefrom the darkest of nights for
(43:16):
years hopeless, depressed,suicidal to the brightest of
light.
It's so big and the more I tellmy story Doug I don't even
understand this the greater thelight becomes.
Wow.
Doug Smith (43:31):
Well, thank you for sharing that.
I don't think we're going toget to the leadership, but
people are saying what does thishave to do with leadership?
Everything it's like.
Anne Beiler (43:37):
Oh, everything.
Doug Smith (43:39):
Yeah, do you want to say anything to that?
Anne Beiler (43:40):
I mean yes, well, I just want to say I believe that
God wants to equip.
In these days in particular, hewants an army of people that
are overcomers, that can helpthose who are living in this
survival mode, in thismarketplace, but he wants to
take us to a place of leadership, live the overcoming lifestyle.
(44:03):
He wants it.
It's going to take an army ofus, a whole army of soldiers
that are strong and courageous,that can reach down to the
downtrodden and lift them up,and I feel like that's my
mission.
My mission is to the church,help people, just to lift them
up, and God needs all of us todo that.
Doug Smith (44:24):
Yeah, and this probably be.
We can land a plane with thisquestion.
But you mentioned, you know,even just recently, just if
something's in shumbling you'reholding on forgiveness, forgive
someone If someone's been inabuse.
Like how have you?
I don't know how much detailyou want to go to, but you
talked about spiritual abuse orabuse of authority, and that
happened.
This happened.
Unfortunately, statistics saythis happens every day.
(44:45):
I think one, one in three orfour children are abused.
Like which is crazy.
So how, how do you deal BecauseI think that I'm assuming that
that's part of the fear andtelling too.
If I tell, then then thisperson who has authority over me
, how do you, how do how dovictims deal with that?
Anne Beiler (45:01):
There's such, there's so many, there's so many
the, the, the tentacles youknow to abuse is.
There's so many pieces to it.
It's so deep and so troublingand so confusing.
But you know, as a, as a child,it's hard to deal with abuse.
I mean as a child, but I shouldgrow it.
For me I was a grown woman so Icannot even imagine.
(45:22):
But what I know is is that theabuse that I experienced, it
felt, and then also the samepastor abused our oldest
daughter from all the whole timehe was abusing me he was a
part of her life as well, and Ididn't know that till she was 25
.
And that was that's a wholeother story that took me.
(45:43):
That almost made me crash andburn.
So you know, the questionbecomes how can I forgive?
How can I forgive?
I don't.
I'm going to answer this veryquickly because I know we're
running out of time, but but themost comfort that I got as far
as forgiveness was many, manyyears after my story unfolded,
(46:05):
and it was actually in the year2003.
And I, I was sitting on mychair and thinking about
forgiveness and just telling theLord I don't know, I don't know
.
And I remember the story ofJesus on the cross, when, when
he was dying, and he said I know, you know what he said, but we,
(46:28):
I went over.
I just read this so many timesthat I never saw it.
But on the cross, jesus said, Ibelieve the weight of the world
was too much for him.
He was Jesus, he was God in theflesh.
How can you take the world, theweight of the whole world, from
beginning of time to the end oftime, upon yourself?
(46:50):
And he said, father, forgivethem, because they don't know
what they're doing.
And you know, when I read thatin the year 2003,.
I realized that sometimesthings are so hard for us as
human beings to bear and I beganto pray that prayer Father,
(47:13):
would you forgive him Because hereally doesn't know what he did
to me and my family?
And you want Doug, even to thisday, if I struggle with how do
I forgive?
Maybe it's something there'sstill trigger points in my
family, or I hear stories, my, I, that's my, go to prayer Father
(47:33):
, forgive him, for he does notknow what he did.
And that was a.
That was a way of forgivenessthat I experienced, that gave me
peace, no guilt, no shame on mypart, like, oh, you have to
forgive.
I have.
To the best of my ability, I'veforgiven, but sometimes, when
it feels hard, even today, Ijust read that prayer Father
(47:56):
forgive, or he doesn't know whathe did.
Try it yourself, it might work,I don't know.
Yeah Well, thank you forsharing that and I guess I'll
just leave this open at the end.
Doug Smith (48:06):
Is there anything else you want to leave our
listeners with today, before wewrap up?
Anne Beiler (48:10):
You know, I just, I just believe that God is bigger
than all of us Even can imagine.
His, his grace goes furtherthan our pain.
His forgiveness is deeper thanany sin, any shame that we've
borne.
He is greater than all of thatand believe that.
You know, faith is believingthat God will do what he said he
(48:30):
would do.
Whatever God said he would do,he will do.
That's that's who he is.
So I want to encourage youraudience to just believe that
God is.
He is as good as his word andhe has promised to give you life
and to help you live anovercoming life, the life that
(48:50):
he died for, and that's whathe's.
He's.
He's offering that to you today.
Work out your own salvation andfear and trembling.
There's a lot of work that wedo in faith.
We call out to him constantly.
There's a lot of work that wedo.
Do the hard work, Set yourselffree and you'll begin to live a
life that you didn't even knowwas possible.
Doug Smith (49:13):
Yeah well, and thank you so much for doing the hard
work yourself and allowing Godto use your story and the
circumstances you've gonethrough to glorify him and help
other people.
I'm believing, god, that youknow everyone listening to this,
those who need help or or in asimilar position, that this will
be the the key to them gettingfree, and so thank you for your
ministry and, of course, thankyou for for great pretzels to
(49:35):
everyone on the planet.
My family is extremelyappreciative.
So thank you so much, andhopefully we'll get to do this
again sometime.
Anne Beiler (49:43):
Awesome.
Thank you for the opportunity.
God bless you and MerryChristmas to you.
Doug Smith (49:47):
Merry Christmas.
Well, leader, thank you so muchfor listening to my
conversation with Anne.
I hope that you enjoyed it asmuch as I did.
You can find ways to connectwith her and links to everything
that we discussed in the shownotes at L3 leadershiporg
forward, slash 413.
And as always, leader, I liketo end every episode of the
quote, and I'll quote PresidentRonald Reagan, who said this the
greatest leader is notnecessarily the one who does the
greatest things.
(50:07):
He is the one that gets thepeople to do the greatest things
.
And leader leadership is allabout others, and so make sure
you always remember that.
As I say at the end of everyepisode, know that my wife
Lauren, I love you, we believein you and don't quit.
Keep leading.
The world desperately needsyour leadership.
We'll talk to you next episode.
Popular Podcasts
Cold Case Files: Miami
Joyce Sapp, 76; Bryan Herrera, 16; and Laurance Webb, 32—three Miami residents whose lives were stolen in brutal, unsolved homicides. Cold Case Files: Miami follows award‑winning radio host and City of Miami Police reserve officer Enrique Santos as he partners with the department’s Cold Case Homicide Unit, determined family members, and the advocates who spend their lives fighting for justice for the victims who can no longer fight for themselves.
24/7 News: The Latest
The latest news in 4 minutes updated every hour, every day.
Crime Junkie
Does hearing about a true crime case always leave you scouring the internet for the truth behind the story? Dive into your next mystery with Crime Junkie. Every Monday, join your host Ashley Flowers as she unravels all the details of infamous and underreported true crime cases with her best friend Brit Prawat. From cold cases to missing persons and heroes in our community who seek justice, Crime Junkie is your destination for theories and stories you won’t hear anywhere else. Whether you're a seasoned true crime enthusiast or new to the genre, you'll find yourself on the edge of your seat awaiting a new episode every Monday. If you can never get enough true crime... Congratulations, you’ve found your people. Follow to join a community of Crime Junkies! Crime Junkie is presented by audiochuck Media Company.