The Labyrinth

The Labyrinth

An intentional space to navigate life's paradox in the same way that an arrow is shot from the bow where our aim is true but the destination is not known. You are invited into this community as an intrepid explorer of purpose, meaning, and service regarding the open terrain of spirituality, psychology, motherhood, relationships, The Arts, human potential, awareness, education, science and technology as a springboard to societal innovation and evolution. In a cross-collaboration with both Henry Crettela's Alchemical Dialogues podcast, and Joel Lesses' Unraveling Religion podcast, The Labyrinth seeks to further and promote conversations evolving our understanding of the vital topics of spirituality, the humanities, psychology, and The Arts, and we find deepening community in our mutual support. We have begun posting 'Selected, Best of Alchemical Dialogues' and 'Selected, Best of Unraveling Religion' episodes on 'The Labyrinth.'

Episodes

August 19, 2026 42 mins

In this episode of The Labyrinth, co-hosts Rich Grego and Lisa Carley welcome Joel David Lesses for a conversation about artificial intelligence, education, critical thinking, ethics, creativity, and the future of learning. At the center of the discussion is a fundamental question: what happens to education when artificial intelligence can perform many of the tasks students have traditionally been expected to learn?

The conversatio...

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The Labyrinth, hosted by Lisa Carley, introduces Rich Grego, Ph.D., as Lisa’s new co-host and longtime intellectual, spiritual, and personal companion.

Lisa first knew Rich as her philosophy professor when she was an undergraduate, and their relationship developed into a deep resonance that has continued throughout their lives.

Lisa describes the purpose of The Labyrinth as entering a space of genuine presence with another pe...

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In this episode of The Labyrinth, Lisa Carley introduces Joel Lesses and Rich Grego and engage in a deeply personal narrative exploring purpose, spirituality, identity, and the role of solitude in living an authentic life. 

Lisa begins by reflecting on a question that has become central to her life: how can she use her time in ways that are meaningful not only in the present moment but also in service of a larger purpose? She ...

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This episode of Alchemical Dialogues features host Henry Cretella in conversation with Micha-El (Alan Berkowitz) on the life and teachings of Paul Brunton, and the intersections of Sufism, Vedanta, and other contemplative traditions. The discussion begins with Henry describing how he first encountered Brunton’s book The Short Path to Enlightenment, which he initially bought simply because of the title but left unread for year...

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Part 2 continues panel discussion by exploring the lived experience of unity, spirituality, and what it means to feel 'at home' in the universe, beginning with reflections on whether healing and awakening dissolve the sense of separation.

Andy, drawing from his 12-step recovery background, describes spirituality as a relationship with a higher power understood personally, sharing that his connection takes shape through Christian sy...

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Part 1

In the continuation of the cross-collabaortion of Alchemical Dialogues, Unraveling Religion, and The Labyrinth, we are posting this Panel Discussion.

Alchemical Dialogues and Unraveling Religion co-hosts Joel Lesses and Henry Cretella convene a panel exploring spirituality, recovery, philosophy, and science through lived experience, centered on the theme of transformation as an embodied, ongoing process.

Ben, a therapist and...

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Part 2 of 'Echoes of the Tao, Seeking Truth Across Traditions,' starts with 'what does it mean to Serve and Love God (or Tao)?

  • God (Tao) says, 'be what I made you to be!'
  • God (Tao) is found in relationship.
  • Does God want us to know Him (or ourselves) most intimately?
  • Dependent Co-arising?
  • 'Simultaneously, I and all beings attain the Way' (Awaken to Reality) ~Buddha
  • 'Essentially, outside of me, nothing exists'
  • Verse 18
  • What doe...
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In this exploration of the Tao Te Ching and other traditions, the conversation opens to introductions  of the five Panelists and a invocation of hope of others to investigate the Tao Te Ching. 

Bob, Brian, Rich, Henry and Joel share Verse 1 and questions arise:

  • What is Reality?
  • Is the Tao Reality?
  • What is the Tao?
  • What does the term Anti-foundational mean?
  • Reversal Yin/ Yang in relation to Tao.
  • Paradox and the Tao.
  • E...
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On this cross-posted episode from the Unraveling Religion podcast, Pádraig Ó Tuama joins Unraveling Religion's Host, Joel Lesses, and shares a conversation from the heart about poetry, spirituality, community, and communion.

The conversation opens to how Joel and Pádraig met, and what informed Pádraig's life as a Poet and Theologian. Pádraig recalls the influences of Ireland and school and the foundation of poetry in that expe...

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Unraveling Religion's episode with Crazywise Documentary Filmmaker Phil Borges who joins Joel for a discussion of Phil's life post Crazywise and together they explore mental health and its relation spirituality, beginning with how does one define spirituality. 

Phil's history of experiences into spirituality, beginning with the death of his father and Phil's Aunt returning from a psychiatric hospitalization to Phil's home...

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Unraveling Religion's Joel David Lesses holds a conversation with Naomi Shihab Nye and Dr. Izzeldin Abuelaish, cross posted on The Labyrinth as a part of the ongoing cross-pollination with Unraveling Religion, Alchemical Dialogues, and The Labyrinth. 
Naomi Shihab Nye opens the talk reading a new, recently penned poem, Current Affairs.
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In a collaboration of Alchemical Dialogues and Unraveling Religion, co-hosted by Henry Cretella and Joel Lesses, Part 2 the Panels opens to discuss:

  • 'What makes us come alive?'
  • 'What is your 'note' in life?' (Rumi's 'be your note.')
Discussion turns to Rumi's quote 'when I was young I wanted to change the world, when I grew older I wanted only to change myself.'

How do we attune to spiritual teachers?
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In a collaboration of Alchemical Dialogues and Unraveling Religion, co-hosted by Henry Cretella and Joel Lesses, Part 1 of this discussion examines psychology, philosophy, religion, spiritually, science, and medicine, a panel of five (5) people opens with the question, 'where am I?' and 'what is going on [in the world]?' and refers to James Hillman, ideas and action as an artificial distinction, are they the same thing? How are the...

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On February 7th, 2023, Chris Meek interviewed Joel for the podcast Next Steps Forward, and explored:

  • Does God Exist?
  • How does meditation reveal God?
  • What is the nature of evil?
  • Where does God exist?
  • Can we experience God directly?
  • Why are we here on earth?
  • What is the purpose of life?
  • Why does God ask us to struggle?
  • Does morality matter?
  • Is there life after death?
  • What is a koan?


Next Steps Forward is a podcas...

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After a Sunday Brunch at Lisa Carley's friend Joel Lesses' house, on his Two Schmoes Sanctuary patio, Lisa and Sam had an ongoing conversation into the afternoon and evening where a suggestion was made to throw down a phone and record the discussion.

Topics of this conversation include travel (i.e., Ireland and India), philosophy, humanity's limitations and failures, and the desire to seek a 'hive-mind' for all people, constructive...

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In today’s The Labyrinth podcast, retired psychiatrist Henry Cretella joins us to share both his philosophy and personal experience with surrender. We begin our conversation with Eckart Tolle’s view that surrender requires an expansion (and often suspension) of our rational mind. From there, we discuss the general nature of surrender and the role of intuition. We move into sharing stories ...

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Recorded for Alchemical Dialogues podcast, Henry Cretella hosts Lisa Carley regarding mental health and spirituality and Lisa's lived experience.

Avoiding and easing unnecessary suffering is a worthwhile goal, but so is the less often discussed opportunity for transformation that distress provides.  

Mystics teach that the heart and mind o...

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In today’s The Labyrinth podcast, I’m honored to join one of my closest spiritual companions, Shobitha Kedlaya and her spiritual friend Ramesh Krishnan.

I met Shobitha four years ago at her organic farm and community in Andhra Pradesh. We immediately connected through a shared narrative of our complex maternal identities. Shobitha is a trained dancer, holds an MBA, and left a thriving career in the textile industry to c...

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As a part of The Labyrinth's collaboration with Unraveling Religion podcast, this conversation with Crazywise Producer Phil Borges and Unraveling Religion's Joel Lesses is shared:

'Crazy…or wise? The traditional wisdom of indigenous cultures often contradicts modern views about a mental health crisis. Is it a ‘calling’ to grow or just a ‘broken brain’? The documentary Crazywise explores what can be le...

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This conversation with Lisa and Joel explores the podcast 'The Labyrinth' and its slogan 'Destination Unknown' and its relationship to the 'Unraveling Religion' podcast, whose own slogan 'What You Are Is More Than What You Want.' These two old friends share deep vision of hope and work toward a brighter future as they deconstruct meaning, mission, and purpose, and the mechanisms of what comprises the most vital aspects of life and ...

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