May 15, 2025 • 42 mins
Text The Late Bloomer Actor a Question or Comment.
In this episode of The Late Bloomer Actor, we speak with Ivana Chubbuck, the founder of the Ivana Chubbuck Studio and creator of the Chubbuck Technique. We discuss Ivana's journey from actress to acting coach, the importance of mindset and bold choices in acting, and how life experiences shape an actor's craft. Ivana emphasizes the need for actors to understand human behavior and to make proactive choices in their careers. The conversation also touches on the cyclical nature of history and storytelling, and Ivana offers valuable advice for struggling actors with a focus on this year's theme of the business side of acting.
Takeaways
- The Chubbuck Technique empowers actors to use their life experiences.
- Mindset is crucial for success in the acting business.
- Actors should make bold choices and not play it safe.
- Understanding human behavior is key to effective acting.
- Life experiences enrich an actor's performance.
- The acting industry is unpredictable, but hard work pays off.
- Cyclical patterns in history influence storytelling.
- Actors must humanize their characters to connect with audiences.
- Greatness in acting comes from attention to detail.
Find out about Ivana, her studio and technique here.
And purchase her updated book, The Power Of The Actor at Amazon.com.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
David John Clark (00:00):
Hello, hello, hello everyone and welcome back
to another episode of the LateBloomer Actor.
Today I have a wonderfulepisode for you.
I'm very excited by this one.
We are talking to the wonderfulIvana Chubbuck.
She is the founder of the IvanaChubbuck Studio in Los Angeles
and the creator of the globallyrenowned Chubbuck Technique,
which has been used by some ofthe industry's most celebrated
(00:22):
actors, including Oscar winnersand nominees.
She's also the author of thebestselling book, The Power of
the Actor, which has beentranslated into over 20
languages and is used by actors,directors, and coaches around
the world.
And she's re-releasing ThePower of the Actor on April
27th, which has no doubt alreadyoccurred when you're listening
to this episode.
So check it out on Amazon.comor any good bookstore.
(00:45):
It will be a wonderful updateto the original book.
She's had 20 years of furtherexperience and life has changed
as we all know it.
So I'm sure there is new thingsto add to her technique and how
to make the process work.
Ivana joins me for aconversation that goes well
beyond acting technique.
Yes, we talk about herwell-renowned method, the
Chubbuck technique, but whatreally struck me was how deeply
(01:08):
her work speaks to the businessof being an actor, which is
fantastic because that is thetheme of this year's podcast,
The Business Side of Acting.
This episode is about more thanjust landing the role.
It's about understanding humanbehavior, embracing bold
choices, and building a careerthat is emotionally authentic
(01:29):
and professionally sustainable.
Ivana doesn't just teach actorshow to act.
She teaches them how to win,how to evolve, and how to turn
life's toughest experiences intosuccess.
creative fuel.
So whether you're a workingactor or a late bloomer like me,
or just someone navigating acreative career, there is
something in this conversationthat will shift your
(01:51):
perspective.
Please excuse the quality.
We had to record on Zoom.
I'm sorry, Zoom, you just don'tcut it as good as my favorite
platform Riverside FM but it isstill good quality and I was
able to edit in my platformRiverside so you're getting the
same output as normal.
So please enjoy.
I absolutely loved this chat.
It was fantastic and here wego.
(02:14):
Here's my chat with theincredible Ivana Chubbuck.
Welcome, welcome everybody toanother episode of The Late
Bloomer Actor.
I'm always excited by everyperson that I have on the show
because as you know, I inviteguests that have been a part of
my journey as a late bloomeractor.
So I'm always very excited whenI have the chance to chat with
another guest.
Today is no different as I amabout to chat with an author of
(02:37):
one of my favorite acting books.
I'm truly blown away to havethe chance to speak to someone
that actress Halle Berry says,and I quote, is the premier
acting coach of the 21stcentury.
So please welcome Welcome tothe show, the wonderful acting
coach, creator of The ChubbuckTechnique and author of The
Power of the Actor, IvanaChubbuck.
Welcome, Ivana.
Ivana Chubbuck (02:58):
Oh, hello.
And also, we can't forget tomention that the new revised
updated version is about to comeout in a couple of weeks.
David John Clark (03:05):
Exactly.
And I think by the time theshow goes to air, that will be
out and ready.
I had that already to mentionfor everyone.
So very excited for thatbecause that's the first time
you've updated the book sinceyou published it originally,
isn't it?
Ivana Chubbuck (03:17):
Yeah, and it was a part of the 20-year
anniversary.
And just a quick, quick story.
The publisher asked me, do youhave enough new stuff to put in
a revised edition in 20 years?
And I said, do I have enoughstuff?
I've been doing workshops allover the world.
And of course, you know that Ihave...
my studio here, my private, andall that kind of stuff.
(03:42):
And I've learned so much.
I have so many new things thatI'm teaching that are making the
experience not only more fun,but more deep and more authentic
to the human experience.
David John Clark (03:55):
That's wonderful.
That's wonderful.
And we're certainly going tochat about that.
Now, if I've done my researchproperly, I believe you moved to
LA to become an actress.
And whilst working alongsidemany other actors, you
discovered you had a love forhelping others improve on their
own performances, which led youto become a full-time acting
teacher and coach.
Can you just give us a quickinsight into this journey and
(04:17):
how you developed theworld-renowned technique known
today as the Chubbuck technique?
Ivana Chubbuck (04:22):
Okay, well, I'm going to try to give the short
version because I do have atendency to blab on.
I'm a teacher after all.
So the bottom line is actorshelp other actors.
You're an actor, youunderstand.
So people are on a set orbefore they go on, they meet up
in hotel rooms if they're ontheir location and they talk
(04:44):
about it, they rehearse, takecare of one another and help
each other with their journeyand doing script analysis.
And so I found myself doingthat when I was working and they
were doing that for me.
But they would come back at meand say, I'm doing the best work
I've ever done.
Can you just help me on thisnext one, even though you're not
a part of this particularproject?
(05:05):
And then there became a pointin time that there were so many
people that I had to start.
Well, I didn't have to, but Idid start charging.
But it was a very little amountof money, just the idea of the
thing, like an honorarium.
And then it just became such athing that I really quite liked
doing so much that I decidedthat I didn't really want to act
(05:26):
anymore.
I really preferred taking careof other people because I love
the purity of the craft ofacting.
Now, what's really importantabout that is that I feel that
time went by really slow when Iwas in front of the camera or on
(05:47):
the stage.
But when I was helping people,time went really fast, which is
a marker to me that I like thisa whole lot better.
So when people ask me, do youever miss acting?
And I say, I don't because Iget to play different
characters, each actor I workwith.
So I actually get to playcharacters I would never have
been able to play from before.
(06:08):
you know, men roles todifferent kinds of people that
I, to understand them from aplace of the beauty of this
wonderfully gorgeous art formthat we both have the, it's such
an honor to be able to have.
And how did I come up with thistechnique?
It's all about The thing when Iwas taking acting classes is
(06:32):
that I always felt that they'reasking me to dig deep and just
sit in my pain.
And I said, I don't want tojust sit in my pain.
It doesn't feel good.
It doesn't make me happy.
It makes me feel verydepressed.
And so I figured let's take thesame information and use it to
fuel our ability to overcome andwin with it rather than
self-destruct and be defeated byour pain.
(06:53):
the things that have happenedto us in our lives.
Insecurities, fears, traumas,dramas, all these things, it's
really very, very powerful tomake a choice to, like I call
it, spinning it, to spin theidea that this is information
that I can can use to resolve,solve, evolve, and then
(07:17):
ultimately have catharsis withit.
So then it becomes anempowering experience.
It becomes something thatlightens the load and it gives
you a purpose of an importantmeeting to pass along to your
audience because they take whatyou're going through and they
have similar issues becausepeople, you know, just around
(07:39):
the science of being a humanbeing, we're all got the same
stuff going on and they see youdoing something about it and
changing things using the samehitting bottom that maybe they
have had experience or arecurrently experiencing and doing
something about it that makesthem feel hopeful that they can
do the same so it becomes ajourney not just for yourself it
(08:00):
becomes a journey that you'rehelping other people your
audience and your co-star to beable to have a life change, be
empowered by their stuff asopposed to emboldened by your
stuff.
Again, it's a choice.
People have those choices allthe time to make something a
learning experience or somethingthat gives you a way to resolve
(08:22):
a longstanding problem thatyou've been dealing with.
And we can do it through ourwork, which is wonderful that we
can create a beautiful picturewith our I
David John Clark (08:38):
love that.
And I love that you're talkingabout that journey.
And I mean, I mentioned at thestart of this show about that
journey of people that have beeninvolved with my acting career
and you through your book.
So it's interesting to look atthat as the journey of sharing
that journey with the peoplethat watch our shows and our
stage shows, et cetera, as well,isn't it?
Absolutely.
(08:59):
Now, many of your listenersknow your book and know your
technique well, I would think.
And with many interviews andonline articles about your
technique, I'd like to ask yousome questions with a bit of a
different spin on the standardquestions you probably usually
get.
That is because in this season,I'm focusing on the business
side of acting.
But with the guests I'vealready had on, it's been very
surprising how much the craft ofacting and the business of
(09:23):
acting interchange.
That being said, your techniqueteaches actors how to win.
How do you think that mindsettranslates to an act of success
in the business side of theircareer, beyond the work on set
or stage?
Ivana Chubbuck (09:38):
Well, what's interesting is that 40% of the
people that I work with aredirectors and writer-producers.
So they send me tapes all thetime of who their choices are
and why.
And Often it's becausebehavior, behavior that's trying
to do something, beingproactive.
It's rarely about how someonesays a line where actors get so
(10:00):
caught up in like making thatline real and then just kind of
emptying out when it's time tolisten or being afraid to make
bold choices because that's whatexcites them because they know
that that person is going tocome in with those bold choices
to make their show somethingthat's of bigger importance and
(10:20):
make a bigger impact to theworld stage because we're not in
this world we live in right nowif it's movies and TV we want
the world to see it we're notjust doing this for your country
anymore you know it's like it'sa different world because of
technology so we have to pleaseeverybody and the planet is well
(10:42):
and that's okay that's a goodthing because it's because I
want to be able to say that I'myou know, casting, whether from
the point of view of castingdirector or director or
producer, that this person isgoing to help me make that piece
that's going to have gravitas,that's going to have emotion,
(11:04):
that's going to have a mission,that's going to have something
that's going to touch people'shearts in a way that's saying,
let's keep on...
I call it emotional hero.
So if you become an emotionalhero by using this stuff instead
of to be...
defeated by something, butrather empowered by the journey
to say, I'm going to win inspite of it and because of you.
(11:28):
And so when that happens, it'slike, there are people that are
watching, you know, I knowpeople don't think so, but
producers and directors arepeople.
They're just like you and I,and they have the same reactions
that anybody they can be.
or middle of Australia orwhatever middle you come from
that you don't necessarily haveto come from a big city to
(11:50):
understand.
They're just people respondingor not.
And get them to go like, I hopethat that person...
That's what they want becausethey become a rooting section.
I would say sports, people arerabid sports fans, right?
So we got to create thewin-lose aspect of it.
(12:10):
So people are so invested.
And if you're going to win,whatever it is you're trying to
win.
And so you created thatinvestment in those people that
are going to cast you that makethem They can't get you out of
their head.
And I've had people be able totake a part that wasn't them at
all on the page.
I mean, the description waswrong on many levels, book the
(12:34):
job.
Because it's like, it's really,again, they want to just get
excited.
They want to get caught up inlike, just like any audience.
And so we have to humanizethese people.
That's really important.
And know that if you say you goon a date, Are you going to sit
there and ramble on about yourpast life and all the ugly shit
that happened to you?
David John Clark (12:55):
Some people probably would.
Ivana Chubbuck (12:57):
And a lot of people do, but do they get a
second date?
No, that's called the callback.
Okay.
David John Clark (13:05):
Love it.
Love it.
Ivana Chubbuck (13:06):
The callback, you know, it's the same kind of
thing.
You want to get them to want tomarry you, right?
So they have to fall in lovewith you.
And they're not going to fallin love with you if they don't
feel that they found someone whoreally gets them through the
work, the choices that you makethat are universal issues,
primal issues.
This is the science of being ahuman being.
(13:27):
It's like really kind of Bottomlining and bottom lining your
choices so they become primal.
And then you go after trying toovercome and win what those
are, which makes everybody wantto participate in watching it
because they feel like they're apart of the journey.
They're included and invested.
(13:49):
And it's like if you look atParasite.
Have you ever seen the movieParasite?
David John Clark (13:54):
I haven't yet.
I'm sorry.
It's on my long list.
Ivana Chubbuck (13:59):
Parasite, the reason that it won is the only
thing in Oscar history that'sever won Best Movie and Best
Foreign Film.
Only time it's ever happened.
David John Clark (14:07):
That's correct, yeah.
Ivana Chubbuck (14:08):
Only in Korean.
So it's like, with subtitles.
And most people just don't liketo be bothered with subtitles,
but that was a huge success.
Why?
Overall objective was forevery...
of the script.
First, we look at the script.
What is the script's mission?
The script's mission is talkingabout how far you go for
family.
And then each aspect of it isfrom the lowest hierarchy to the
(14:34):
rich people, to themiddle-class people, to the
servants, you know, and allthese different things.
It's all about family and howfar you would go for family.
And so it's rather the drama,the comedy.
It was very funny, but it wasalso very...
It was...
That's your heart.
So at some levels, and that'swhy it won that.
(14:55):
So you have to take that aspectof things and say, let's create
the ability for people to like,say, I need that person.
The same way you say you needthe person that you fall in love
with.
So.
If we sit there in our stuffand our hurt and pain, I always
say, if you don't like beingaround those people for free,
(15:17):
why would you pay them money tosee them?
Fair enough.
I have friends that I kind offind myself subconsciously
avoiding because they're thosekind of people, but I love them.
It doesn't negate my love forthem.
It's just, I don't want tospend my time with them because
(15:40):
I know I'm going to hear a wholebunch of stuff.
So it's the same thing.
Again, let's go back to acting.
It's acting.
You have to like, look at whatis this that's going to help me
promote my ability to find someversion of solution, resolution,
conclusion, whatever.
The idea is like somethingthat's being proactive, right?
We always support someone who'strying to do something about
(16:03):
it, not the person who just goesfor me.
David John Clark (16:08):
It's really interesting because a lot of the
concepts you're talking about,they aren't acting concepts, are
they?
About the techniques of how todeliver a scene, how to be a
character.
It's about something moreintangible.
within you, your mindset, howyou approach life.
Is that what your primary focusin your book and your teachings
are?
I mean, you've taught somegreat actors.
(16:30):
One of my favorites, SylvesterStallone from amongst dozens
without dropping too many names,but these are people that we
already find iconic, but they'vecome to you looking for
something.
So something that's not anacting technique, so to speak.
Is that what you approach?
Ivana Chubbuck (16:49):
No, it's technique.
It's like my system is 12steps, and there's 12 steps, and
every exercise of how to feelorganically drunk, when you
really feel drunk or stoned orfeel like you're pregnant, it's
a formula.
It's based on that.
It's then science and a way toapply it, real nuts and bolts
(17:10):
practical application and how todo script analysis and create
character, how to create thereality of feeling like a
paraplegic or quadriplegic.
But there's a formula to allthese things to truly feel it.
And so, and then I saycharacter traits.
It's like you have to look atsomebody who's mentally ill.
Where is that mental illness?
(17:31):
We have to look at thecharacter first on the page.
Where does that particularmental illness emanate from?
Do your research and figure outwhy.
It's in the book, too, how todetermine different addictions,
what the addict feels that thissolves for them.
And we'll go back to theconcept of mental illness.
(17:52):
It's like there's reasons formental illness.
It just doesn't pop up.
you have to look at thederivation of it.
Well, how did it emanate?
It's usually a childhood thing.
And then you have to kind oflook at the process of what the
end result of behaviors are, whythe behaviors are, the power of
why.
And then the behaviors, thenbecome, you say, how does that
(18:16):
relate to my journey?
Because there's a littlefraction of every mental illness
in all of us.
But the thing is, it's not anillness.
It's just the aspect of beinghuman until it becomes vast
amounts.
So it's your job to understandit so you can take that fraction
and turn it into a whole.
How do you do that?
It's in the book.
How do you figure out you haveto play an addict?
(18:38):
There's different things thatdifferent editions solve.
For example, anything withspeed in it, cocaine solves
power, gives you power becauseyou feel powerless and it solves
your feelings of beingpowerless and it gives you
power.
Food issues are usually peoplewho feel like there's a lack of
nurture.
And so food is about gettingnurture through that addiction.
(19:04):
Alcohol is liquid couragebecause you have so much fear.
Opioids, pain medication,heroin, morphine, those are all
about getting rid of emotionalpain because you feel inordinate
amounts of emotional pain andit And it takes that away.
The addiction to sexuality, sexaddicts, that's people who want
(19:26):
to have love without painbecause without the intimacy and
long-term relationship, youcan't get hurt.
So it's people who've been hurtby love that seek sexual
addiction and, and, and.
So about 25 of them in the newbook that range from things that
are obvious to things thatsometimes people are addicted to
their misery.
And so, yeah.
(19:47):
You know, we got to look atsome people are addicted to not
being able to leave their homeor not being able to go outside.
It's like there's some reallyinteresting addictions.
The beauty of writing, ofsomeone's writing, is it makes a
character more interesting whenthey're flawed.
And the more flaws they have,the more...
(20:08):
interesting it is for not onlyfor the audience but for the
director for the writer to writedirector to direct and for the
actor to perform some the moreflaws the more quirks the more
mannerisms the more layers andand richness that you bring to
it but you have to learn how todo it as a process it's not just
a mind a mind thing you knowit's just i have to think
(20:32):
differently i think positivelybecause that's a bunch of
bullshit in my head The idea isfiguring out why people do what
they do, kind of profiling in away.
It's kind of forensic becauseit duplicates the forensic and
profiling
David John Clark (20:52):
situation.
Ivana Chubbuck (20:55):
But in order to truly bring in all those layers
and richness and density, youhave to truly understand that
the particular issues that thosecharacters are.
First from the point of view ofthe character, and then from
the point of view of yourselfand how that duplicates in your
own world.
And you are so different fromanybody else.
(21:15):
So the way you take in thatsame information that the
character has, you're plumpingout a two-page, two-dimensional
reality, which is a script, andthen you're turning it and
plumping it into athree-dimensional reality that
is what they need you for.
If they don't, So your lifeexperiences and how you
(21:37):
negotiate life makes it specialand unique.
If people wanted just exactlywhat was on the script, they
would just put the script on thescreen and read it.
David John Clark (21:46):
Read it, yes.
Ivana Chubbuck (21:48):
As anybody else is.
So that's your job to plump itout.
Okay, now let's go back to,okay, I would say I used to be
in casting.
So eight times out of ten,people would do the same
reading, but they're tendifferent people.
Why are they doing exactly thesame reading?
Because I think that's how it'ssupposed to sound.
That's how it's supposed to be.
And then you have that one ortwo people that...
(22:10):
if they don't get cast, theyremember them for future
casting.
That person is just like, itliterally wakes you up.
I used to have people come upto me on the street and say, it
was so nice to read for youyesterday.
I don't remember them becausethey become a blur of the same.
And I also produced it.
I was married to a directorwho's won lots of awards at TV
movies.
I just really know what peoplewant to see.
(22:32):
And you got to give it to them.
And you got to give it to themin a way that doesn't have to...
do something that you don'twant to do in the first place.
You're doing something that's,and my philosophy is to win with
your pain, to find pain equalsprosperity.
So it feels good.
You're going to get more partsthat way.
More audiences will make it,you'll make it a hit show.
(22:56):
And then people will want touse you to say, no, you bring
audiences to it and, and, and,and.
And so the thing is, is thatyou're not doing anything that
doesn't feel good.
Cause I feel that you're notdoing, Enjoy yourself.
You shouldn't do it.
It's fun.
So it's like, I always say youhave to bring comedy to
(23:17):
everything.
I don't care how dark somethingis.
The great actors always knowthat there's, there's it's
sardonic comedy.
It's dark comedy, but you gottahave the light for the dark.
David John Clark (23:29):
Wow.
Ivana Chubbuck (23:30):
Meaning of life, you know?
So I don't know if you sit inthe dark long enough, you can
see things, but if there's,There's a trick in horror films,
and it's like they do somethingfunny or outrageous, and then
the killer happens.
That's true.
Because that's the way to makepeople just have that
(23:50):
rollercoaster ride that we wantto give them.
David John Clark (23:53):
I love that.
I love that.
And you alluded to before withyour new book, the publishers
asked you, do you have enoughinformation to add to it?
And you were saying, yes, youhad heaps.
So do you find that actors or–our life experiences which is
such a big thing that you teachis to draw on your life
experiences for your charactersetc is so different now we live
(24:14):
in a world that is changing imean we could talk for hours
about what's happening in theworld politics and wars and
everything like that so doesthat do you find that's making
it different better harder
Ivana Chubbuck (24:25):
i wanted to say all things are cyclical because
like one of the things i i usethree things i
David John Clark (24:31):
use
Ivana Chubbuck (24:31):
are the science of behavior, behavioral science,
psychology, science ofpsychology, and cultural
anthropology.
which is the history ofculture.
And that means you can playdifferent periods of why people
did the way, sat the way theydid, why they dressed the way
they did, and why the religionthat they believed in was
apropos to the realities of whatwas going on in that particular
(24:56):
time.
So the idea is that you want tofind a way to explore from the
human aspect, from thescientific, being a human being
aspect of things, and not try tomuddy your brain with like
(25:17):
things that is the job of thescripty or is a job of like
lighting or whatever.
It's just like, go after whatyou want to go after and do it
from the point of view in termsof like a primal need and do it
from the point of view of thecharacter first, understanding
that, and then kind ofduplicating that from your home,
your real life is important.
(25:40):
the same let's go back to thehistory of history it's like
it's cyclical it's weirdlycyclical if you look at um
what's happening now there's alot of like giving voice to hate
so it's so the thing is is thatwhen when did that happen
before you tell me
David John Clark (26:01):
well there's big dozens of times isn't there
so every every world war for onething
Ivana Chubbuck (26:05):
Yes, exactly.
So the thing is, and thenbefore that, and then before
that, before that, it'scyclical, you know, so the idea
is, is this going to be, is thisthe biggest, worst thing ever?
Well, it feels like it's we'reliving in, it's not in our
history books, you know.
We only understand from ourhistory books that it happened.
But living in it is a horrorshow.
(26:28):
But the fact is, it's happenedbefore.
And those people experienced itat that particular point in
time.
My family, my father's side areHolocaust survivors.
And so there's a lot of feelingof duplication.
I'm aging myself becausethere's...
(26:48):
you know, the idea that it'snot my grandparents, it's my
actual parents.
And so I understand like fromlike just watching behaviors
based on that and like how, andthen the stories and the, and
it's like my uncles were thepeople that were, they were only
17, 18 at the time were part ofthe underground that got people
(27:11):
from Germany to Israel.
And so I just, it's just to me,The more things change, the
more they stay the same.
So how do we live in this crazyworld we live in today?
I think we've got to beproactive, but we've got to be
proactive through the mediumthat we have, which is making
choices that say we don't haveto suffer from the things that
(27:35):
are oppressing us, but we can dosomething about it within
subliminally affecting thepublic that you have choices.
Absolutely.
choices that you make.
And it's your obligation as anartist to do so.
That's why we don't want tomake depressing choices.
Well, it is what it is, becauseyou're taking away the ability
for people to have solutions.
David John Clark (27:57):
And it's a pity because as actors and as
people, we evolve, we learn, wegrow, and we hopefully don't
make the same mistakes thatwe've made in the past.
It's how we become betteractors.
It's a pity as a society thatWe don't do the same thing and
learn and grow and don't makethe same mistakes.
We continually continue on thatsame path, don't we, which is a
bit sad.
But it makes storytellinginteresting, doesn't it?
Ivana Chubbuck (28:21):
It's like, again, you get ideas from
watching something when you'rejust being entertained.
And if it comes into yoursystem subliminally, you're
going like, that person isreally fighting to overcome the
oppression.
And you're going like, ah, ah.
When such and such happens inyour world, whatever side you're
(28:41):
taking, because everybody hastheir side in these things, so I
try to have one.
Because I say all actors have,they need to say what they need
to say and they need to expressfrom whatever reasons they need
to express it.
But then you do something aboutit because your favorite
characters did.
Inspire to do somethingyourself.
(29:03):
You want to inspire people.
Give them hope because we'renot just being truthful.
Truthful is, it can be boring.
I always use the example of, Ijust painted my wall yellow and
it's drying.
It's literally, truthfully,honestly drying.
And it does change a tad colorwhen it goes from white to dry,
(29:28):
right?
But do you want to watch itdry?
No.
Okay, so.
I'm being honest, I'm beingtruthful, but that's not enough.
You've got to explore beingproactive in whatever the
journey that needs to be fixedand the script needs to be
(29:48):
fixed, and the personalizations,therefore, make it more
personal to the people that arewatching, again, giving them
ideas.
Some of them are going toleave, but then it does find its
way.
David John Clark (30:00):
That's wonderful.
That's wonderful.
That sort of being said andbringing it back to, you know,
the business side of acting foractors and that.
So your studio focuses onempowering actors to make these
proactive choices that we'vebeen talking about.
How does that philosophy helpactors build a sustainable and
marketable career in what is anunpredictable industry today?
Ivana Chubbuck (30:23):
I got to tell you, every day I get another
email or text saying I bookedthat role.
I booked that role.
David John Clark (30:31):
I love it.
Ivana Chubbuck (30:32):
So it's like the mystery is do the work, do the
work that makes it exciting.
It may not be, I may not be theperfect solution, but find a
place that really affects you ina way that allows you to do
something dynamic.
I want to create dynamiccharacters because we want to
see people do extraordinarythings because of that.
(30:56):
horrible things that havehappened to them that have
motivated them to do somethingextraordinary.
And so the idea is that'sexciting to watch the journey of
a dynamic person.
Put a John Wick in everybody,right?
And so the thing is, and I'mnot kidding, that's kind of a
good analogy.
So the idea is when my peopledie, sending their self-tapes or
(31:22):
going to the auditions, they dothings that excite the people
there.
So I literally, every day, inan email or text, someone using
my technique, whether it's fromthe book or whether it's from my
school or from the schools thatI have all over the world, it's
like people are booking.
(31:44):
People are working.
So to me, if you're not,something's wrong and you've got
to fix it.
And so, again, having been onthe other side producing, having
worked with 40% of my clientbases, directors, and
producer-writers, it's likeyou're doing something wrong if
(32:08):
you're consistently gettingthose.
Or you're getting in the mix,but you're not getting booked.
And we can't take...
a callback or good feedback tothe bank.
You have to book.
So in order to book, you haveto do something that makes it
extraordinary.
Not just be untruthful or notjust get caught up in an insular
(32:29):
reality because your littlebubble that you've created keeps
people out.
You're like, hey, I'm here.
It's like we go to a party andsomeone says to you, hey, how
are you doing?
And I keep on walking.
Now they ask you a question andnormally a question requires a
response.
However, they didn't require aresponse.
(32:51):
And how does that make youfeel?
Invisible, not cared for.
to the other character, otherperson that you're reading.
You're reading with a personthat's just a reader, or you're
reading with a person that youasked to read on the other side
(33:11):
of this for yourself tape, orwhether you're doing it in the
room for the casting director.
The thing is, if you areignoring and not needing a
reaction from them, it makes youfeel exactly the same way
that...
The person at a party who getsasked a question, they're
(33:32):
talking, they're asking aquestion, but they don't really
want an answer from you.
David John Clark (33:38):
Yeah, fair enough.
It's all about personalities,really, isn't it?
People, personalities, and justbringing that to the screen.
Ivana Chubbuck (33:47):
It means that you have to want something so
bad you're willing to doanything to get it, and that
creates interesting behavior.
I love
Speaker 02 (33:53):
that.
Ivana Chubbuck (33:54):
The means justify the ends kind of thought
process.
So I may do some sane stuff,but it makes sense to what I
want.
Because I will get it if I doA, B, C, D, and E.
Working with Stallone on Creed,it was all about, he has a
(34:14):
cancer disease.
diagnosis and he could die.
He wants to, he doesn't careabout dying.
All the people he loves aredead.
So he'll meet them in heaven.
It's not, it's not such a badthing for him, but what he does
and what we came up with, whichwas to make Creed feel like if
you don't really go after tryingto win this boxing match, then
(34:38):
I will not take that.
the chemo, but I will take thechemo if you really go after it.
And so, but that was innerwork.
That was not, we didn't change,we changed a little bit on the
page, but for the most part, wejust kept it the way it was.
But it was the inner work thatdrove that, his looking at him
(34:59):
the way the inner monologue wasgoing on.
You don't do this, I'm gonnadie.
So you have that on yourshoulders.
And I don't care.
It's not a threat that I careabout.
The thing is that I want to fixthe, and this is again about
fixing, because the Rockycharacter has had, through the
Rocky legend, has always hadproblems with his kid.
(35:23):
And so his boy, sometimesthey're together, most of the
time they have a problemtogether.
And this is his second chanceto fix what happened to him and
his child, or his relationshipwith him and Preet.
And Preet's son.
Wow, I like that.
So it becomes like so profoundof a mission from doing all
(35:43):
that.
Of course, we personalized allthat so that it became a very
important mission for Mr.
Stallone himself.
And he told the New York Times,he told NPR, he said, this was
the work that we did together.
And he said, my name, he said,the work we did together made
him feel comforted and alsocathartic.
David John Clark (36:06):
I love that.
Oh, that's fantastic.
That's fantastic.
Well, Ivana, thank you.
I'm just mindful of the timethat we're running out of here,
but it's been truly special totalk to you.
And I thank you greatly forgiving me your time to help not
only me, but my listeners on ourjourneys as actors.
But before we go, and withthe...
Three minutes we've got left.
Could I ask you one lastquestion?
(36:27):
If you were to speak to astruggling actor of any age or
background, what one piece ofadvice would you give them that
might spur them on towardssuccess in their career, making
everything work both on set andoff set?
Ivana Chubbuck (36:42):
Study, study, study.
Work ethic.
Break down your script.
It takes a lot of work to begreat.
Greatness is in the details.
And take risks.
Make bold choices.
Do not play it safe.
So work your ass off.
Work ethic.
Do proper script analysis.
Really do your work.
A lot of work.
(37:03):
And then make bold choices.
Do not play it safe.
Make bold choices.
David John Clark (37:09):
Wonderful.
And the new release of ThePower of the Actor was released
on April the 27th, so availablein all good bookstores at
Amazon.com, I'm assuming.
And you have the digitalversions, do you, Kindle?
Ivana Chubbuck (37:23):
Digital, but also it's an audio in my voice.
David John Clark (37:26):
Oh, wow.
That is fantastic.
Well, I do love listening to agood audio book because you get
such a different...
aspect of it don't you you getit from the heart and from the
from the mouth of the speaker soso to speak so that's wonderful
so thank you very
Ivana Chubbuck (37:41):
much i think it's a double thing because you
get things in differently fromreading and you get things in
differently when you listen soit's a combination
David John Clark (37:48):
of course of course wonderful thank you very
much it's
Ivana Chubbuck (37:52):
been everybody get some
David John Clark (37:53):
time Thank you.
I'm sure I will put the linksfor people to purchase the book
in the show notes for the show.
It's been, as I said, sometimesI get the guests on the show
and I'm so excited to have them.
And when I found out I wastalking to the wonderful Ivana
Chubbuck, I was just over themoon.
So thank you very much.
It's been a pleasure.
Ivana Chubbuck (38:13):
It's been my pleasure too.
David John Clark (38:16):
Thank you.
Hello, hello, hello everyone and welcome back
to another episode of the LateBloomer Actor.
Today I have a wonderfulepisode for you.
I'm very excited by this one.
We are talking to the wonderfulIvana Chubbuck.
She is the founder of the IvanaChubbuck Studio in Los Angeles
and the creator of the globallyrenowned Chubbuck Technique,
which has been used by some ofthe industry's most celebrated
(00:22):
actors, including Oscar winnersand nominees.
She's also the author of thebestselling book, The Power of
the Actor, which has beentranslated into over 20
languages and is used by actors,directors, and coaches around
the world.
And she's re-releasing ThePower of the Actor on April
27th, which has no doubt alreadyoccurred when you're listening
to this episode.
So check it out on Amazon.comor any good bookstore.
(00:45):
It will be a wonderful updateto the original book.
She's had 20 years of furtherexperience and life has changed
as we all know it.
So I'm sure there is new thingsto add to her technique and how
to make the process work.
Ivana joins me for aconversation that goes well
beyond acting technique.
Yes, we talk about herwell-renowned method, the
Chubbuck technique, but whatreally struck me was how deeply
(01:08):
her work speaks to the businessof being an actor, which is
fantastic because that is thetheme of this year's podcast,
The Business Side of Acting.
This episode is about more thanjust landing the role.
It's about understanding humanbehavior, embracing bold
choices, and building a careerthat is emotionally authentic
(01:29):
and professionally sustainable.
Ivana doesn't just teach actorshow to act.
She teaches them how to win,how to evolve, and how to turn
life's toughest experiences intosuccess.
creative fuel.
So whether you're a workingactor or a late bloomer like me,
or just someone navigating acreative career, there is
something in this conversationthat will shift your
(01:51):
perspective.
Please excuse the quality.
We had to record on Zoom.
I'm sorry, Zoom, you just don'tcut it as good as my favorite
platform Riverside FM but it isstill good quality and I was
able to edit in my platformRiverside so you're getting the
same output as normal.
So please enjoy.
I absolutely loved this chat.
It was fantastic and here wego.
(02:14):
Here's my chat with theincredible Ivana Chubbuck.
Welcome, welcome everybody toanother episode of The Late
Bloomer Actor.
I'm always excited by everyperson that I have on the show
because as you know, I inviteguests that have been a part of
my journey as a late bloomeractor.
So I'm always very excited whenI have the chance to chat with
another guest.
Today is no different as I amabout to chat with an author of
(02:37):
one of my favorite acting books.
I'm truly blown away to havethe chance to speak to someone
that actress Halle Berry says,and I quote, is the premier
acting coach of the 21stcentury.
So please welcome Welcome tothe show, the wonderful acting
coach, creator of The ChubbuckTechnique and author of The
Power of the Actor, IvanaChubbuck.
Welcome, Ivana.
Ivana Chubbuck (02:58):
Oh, hello.
And also, we can't forget tomention that the new revised
updated version is about to comeout in a couple of weeks.
David John Clark (03:05):
Exactly.
And I think by the time theshow goes to air, that will be
out and ready.
I had that already to mentionfor everyone.
So very excited for thatbecause that's the first time
you've updated the book sinceyou published it originally,
isn't it?
Ivana Chubbuck (03:17):
Yeah, and it was a part of the 20-year
anniversary.
And just a quick, quick story.
The publisher asked me, do youhave enough new stuff to put in
a revised edition in 20 years?
And I said, do I have enoughstuff?
I've been doing workshops allover the world.
And of course, you know that Ihave...
my studio here, my private, andall that kind of stuff.
(03:42):
And I've learned so much.
I have so many new things thatI'm teaching that are making the
experience not only more fun,but more deep and more authentic
to the human experience.
David John Clark (03:55):
That's wonderful.
That's wonderful.
And we're certainly going tochat about that.
Now, if I've done my researchproperly, I believe you moved to
LA to become an actress.
And whilst working alongsidemany other actors, you
discovered you had a love forhelping others improve on their
own performances, which led youto become a full-time acting
teacher and coach.
Can you just give us a quickinsight into this journey and
(04:17):
how you developed theworld-renowned technique known
today as the Chubbuck technique?
Ivana Chubbuck (04:22):
Okay, well, I'm going to try to give the short
version because I do have atendency to blab on.
I'm a teacher after all.
So the bottom line is actorshelp other actors.
You're an actor, youunderstand.
So people are on a set orbefore they go on, they meet up
in hotel rooms if they're ontheir location and they talk
(04:44):
about it, they rehearse, takecare of one another and help
each other with their journeyand doing script analysis.
And so I found myself doingthat when I was working and they
were doing that for me.
But they would come back at meand say, I'm doing the best work
I've ever done.
Can you just help me on thisnext one, even though you're not
a part of this particularproject?
(05:05):
And then there became a pointin time that there were so many
people that I had to start.
Well, I didn't have to, but Idid start charging.
But it was a very little amountof money, just the idea of the
thing, like an honorarium.
And then it just became such athing that I really quite liked
doing so much that I decidedthat I didn't really want to act
(05:26):
anymore.
I really preferred taking careof other people because I love
the purity of the craft ofacting.
Now, what's really importantabout that is that I feel that
time went by really slow when Iwas in front of the camera or on
(05:47):
the stage.
But when I was helping people,time went really fast, which is
a marker to me that I like thisa whole lot better.
So when people ask me, do youever miss acting?
And I say, I don't because Iget to play different
characters, each actor I workwith.
So I actually get to playcharacters I would never have
been able to play from before.
(06:08):
you know, men roles todifferent kinds of people that
I, to understand them from aplace of the beauty of this
wonderfully gorgeous art formthat we both have the, it's such
an honor to be able to have.
And how did I come up with thistechnique?
It's all about The thing when Iwas taking acting classes is
(06:32):
that I always felt that they'reasking me to dig deep and just
sit in my pain.
And I said, I don't want tojust sit in my pain.
It doesn't feel good.
It doesn't make me happy.
It makes me feel verydepressed.
And so I figured let's take thesame information and use it to
fuel our ability to overcome andwin with it rather than
self-destruct and be defeated byour pain.
(06:53):
the things that have happenedto us in our lives.
Insecurities, fears, traumas,dramas, all these things, it's
really very, very powerful tomake a choice to, like I call
it, spinning it, to spin theidea that this is information
that I can can use to resolve,solve, evolve, and then
(07:17):
ultimately have catharsis withit.
So then it becomes anempowering experience.
It becomes something thatlightens the load and it gives
you a purpose of an importantmeeting to pass along to your
audience because they take whatyou're going through and they
have similar issues becausepeople, you know, just around
(07:39):
the science of being a humanbeing, we're all got the same
stuff going on and they see youdoing something about it and
changing things using the samehitting bottom that maybe they
have had experience or arecurrently experiencing and doing
something about it that makesthem feel hopeful that they can
do the same so it becomes ajourney not just for yourself it
(08:00):
becomes a journey that you'rehelping other people your
audience and your co-star to beable to have a life change, be
empowered by their stuff asopposed to emboldened by your
stuff.
Again, it's a choice.
People have those choices allthe time to make something a
learning experience or somethingthat gives you a way to resolve
(08:22):
a longstanding problem thatyou've been dealing with.
And we can do it through ourwork, which is wonderful that we
can create a beautiful picturewith our I
David John Clark (08:38):
love that.
And I love that you're talkingabout that journey.
And I mean, I mentioned at thestart of this show about that
journey of people that have beeninvolved with my acting career
and you through your book.
So it's interesting to look atthat as the journey of sharing
that journey with the peoplethat watch our shows and our
stage shows, et cetera, as well,isn't it?
Absolutely.
(08:59):
Now, many of your listenersknow your book and know your
technique well, I would think.
And with many interviews andonline articles about your
technique, I'd like to ask yousome questions with a bit of a
different spin on the standardquestions you probably usually
get.
That is because in this season,I'm focusing on the business
side of acting.
But with the guests I'vealready had on, it's been very
surprising how much the craft ofacting and the business of
(09:23):
acting interchange.
That being said, your techniqueteaches actors how to win.
How do you think that mindsettranslates to an act of success
in the business side of theircareer, beyond the work on set
or stage?
Ivana Chubbuck (09:38):
Well, what's interesting is that 40% of the
people that I work with aredirectors and writer-producers.
So they send me tapes all thetime of who their choices are
and why.
And Often it's becausebehavior, behavior that's trying
to do something, beingproactive.
It's rarely about how someonesays a line where actors get so
(10:00):
caught up in like making thatline real and then just kind of
emptying out when it's time tolisten or being afraid to make
bold choices because that's whatexcites them because they know
that that person is going tocome in with those bold choices
to make their show somethingthat's of bigger importance and
(10:20):
make a bigger impact to theworld stage because we're not in
this world we live in right nowif it's movies and TV we want
the world to see it we're notjust doing this for your country
anymore you know it's like it'sa different world because of
technology so we have to pleaseeverybody and the planet is well
(10:42):
and that's okay that's a goodthing because it's because I
want to be able to say that I'myou know, casting, whether from
the point of view of castingdirector or director or
producer, that this person isgoing to help me make that piece
that's going to have gravitas,that's going to have emotion,
(11:04):
that's going to have a mission,that's going to have something
that's going to touch people'shearts in a way that's saying,
let's keep on...
I call it emotional hero.
So if you become an emotionalhero by using this stuff instead
of to be...
defeated by something, butrather empowered by the journey
to say, I'm going to win inspite of it and because of you.
(11:28):
And so when that happens, it'slike, there are people that are
watching, you know, I knowpeople don't think so, but
producers and directors arepeople.
They're just like you and I,and they have the same reactions
that anybody they can be.
or middle of Australia orwhatever middle you come from
that you don't necessarily haveto come from a big city to
(11:50):
understand.
They're just people respondingor not.
And get them to go like, I hopethat that person...
That's what they want becausethey become a rooting section.
I would say sports, people arerabid sports fans, right?
So we got to create thewin-lose aspect of it.
(12:10):
So people are so invested.
And if you're going to win,whatever it is you're trying to
win.
And so you created thatinvestment in those people that
are going to cast you that makethem They can't get you out of
their head.
And I've had people be able totake a part that wasn't them at
all on the page.
I mean, the description waswrong on many levels, book the
(12:34):
job.
Because it's like, it's really,again, they want to just get
excited.
They want to get caught up inlike, just like any audience.
And so we have to humanizethese people.
That's really important.
And know that if you say you goon a date, Are you going to sit
there and ramble on about yourpast life and all the ugly shit
that happened to you?
David John Clark (12:55):
Some people probably would.
Ivana Chubbuck (12:57):
And a lot of people do, but do they get a
second date?
No, that's called the callback.
Okay.
David John Clark (13:05):
Love it.
Love it.
Ivana Chubbuck (13:06):
The callback, you know, it's the same kind of
thing.
You want to get them to want tomarry you, right?
So they have to fall in lovewith you.
And they're not going to fallin love with you if they don't
feel that they found someone whoreally gets them through the
work, the choices that you makethat are universal issues,
primal issues.
This is the science of being ahuman being.
(13:27):
It's like really kind of Bottomlining and bottom lining your
choices so they become primal.
And then you go after trying toovercome and win what those
are, which makes everybody wantto participate in watching it
because they feel like they're apart of the journey.
They're included and invested.
(13:49):
And it's like if you look atParasite.
Have you ever seen the movieParasite?
David John Clark (13:54):
I haven't yet.
I'm sorry.
It's on my long list.
Ivana Chubbuck (13:59):
Parasite, the reason that it won is the only
thing in Oscar history that'sever won Best Movie and Best
Foreign Film.
Only time it's ever happened.
David John Clark (14:07):
That's correct, yeah.
Ivana Chubbuck (14:08):
Only in Korean.
So it's like, with subtitles.
And most people just don't liketo be bothered with subtitles,
but that was a huge success.
Why?
Overall objective was forevery...
of the script.
First, we look at the script.
What is the script's mission?
The script's mission is talkingabout how far you go for
family.
And then each aspect of it isfrom the lowest hierarchy to the
(14:34):
rich people, to themiddle-class people, to the
servants, you know, and allthese different things.
It's all about family and howfar you would go for family.
And so it's rather the drama,the comedy.
It was very funny, but it wasalso very...
It was...
That's your heart.
So at some levels, and that'swhy it won that.
(14:55):
So you have to take that aspectof things and say, let's create
the ability for people to like,say, I need that person.
The same way you say you needthe person that you fall in love
with.
So.
If we sit there in our stuffand our hurt and pain, I always
say, if you don't like beingaround those people for free,
(15:17):
why would you pay them money tosee them?
Fair enough.
I have friends that I kind offind myself subconsciously
avoiding because they're thosekind of people, but I love them.
It doesn't negate my love forthem.
It's just, I don't want tospend my time with them because
(15:40):
I know I'm going to hear a wholebunch of stuff.
So it's the same thing.
Again, let's go back to acting.
It's acting.
You have to like, look at whatis this that's going to help me
promote my ability to find someversion of solution, resolution,
conclusion, whatever.
The idea is like somethingthat's being proactive, right?
We always support someone who'strying to do something about
(16:03):
it, not the person who just goesfor me.
David John Clark (16:08):
It's really interesting because a lot of the
concepts you're talking about,they aren't acting concepts, are
they?
About the techniques of how todeliver a scene, how to be a
character.
It's about something moreintangible.
within you, your mindset, howyou approach life.
Is that what your primary focusin your book and your teachings
are?
I mean, you've taught somegreat actors.
(16:30):
One of my favorites, SylvesterStallone from amongst dozens
without dropping too many names,but these are people that we
already find iconic, but they'vecome to you looking for
something.
So something that's not anacting technique, so to speak.
Is that what you approach?
Ivana Chubbuck (16:49):
No, it's technique.
It's like my system is 12steps, and there's 12 steps, and
every exercise of how to feelorganically drunk, when you
really feel drunk or stoned orfeel like you're pregnant, it's
a formula.
It's based on that.
It's then science and a way toapply it, real nuts and bolts
(17:10):
practical application and how todo script analysis and create
character, how to create thereality of feeling like a
paraplegic or quadriplegic.
But there's a formula to allthese things to truly feel it.
And so, and then I saycharacter traits.
It's like you have to look atsomebody who's mentally ill.
Where is that mental illness?
(17:31):
We have to look at thecharacter first on the page.
Where does that particularmental illness emanate from?
Do your research and figure outwhy.
It's in the book, too, how todetermine different addictions,
what the addict feels that thissolves for them.
And we'll go back to theconcept of mental illness.
(17:52):
It's like there's reasons formental illness.
It just doesn't pop up.
you have to look at thederivation of it.
Well, how did it emanate?
It's usually a childhood thing.
And then you have to kind oflook at the process of what the
end result of behaviors are, whythe behaviors are, the power of
why.
And then the behaviors, thenbecome, you say, how does that
(18:16):
relate to my journey?
Because there's a littlefraction of every mental illness
in all of us.
But the thing is, it's not anillness.
It's just the aspect of beinghuman until it becomes vast
amounts.
So it's your job to understandit so you can take that fraction
and turn it into a whole.
How do you do that?
It's in the book.
How do you figure out you haveto play an addict?
(18:38):
There's different things thatdifferent editions solve.
For example, anything withspeed in it, cocaine solves
power, gives you power becauseyou feel powerless and it solves
your feelings of beingpowerless and it gives you
power.
Food issues are usually peoplewho feel like there's a lack of
nurture.
And so food is about gettingnurture through that addiction.
(19:04):
Alcohol is liquid couragebecause you have so much fear.
Opioids, pain medication,heroin, morphine, those are all
about getting rid of emotionalpain because you feel inordinate
amounts of emotional pain andit And it takes that away.
The addiction to sexuality, sexaddicts, that's people who want
(19:26):
to have love without painbecause without the intimacy and
long-term relationship, youcan't get hurt.
So it's people who've been hurtby love that seek sexual
addiction and, and, and.
So about 25 of them in the newbook that range from things that
are obvious to things thatsometimes people are addicted to
their misery.
And so, yeah.
(19:47):
You know, we got to look atsome people are addicted to not
being able to leave their homeor not being able to go outside.
It's like there's some reallyinteresting addictions.
The beauty of writing, ofsomeone's writing, is it makes a
character more interesting whenthey're flawed.
And the more flaws they have,the more...
(20:08):
interesting it is for not onlyfor the audience but for the
director for the writer to writedirector to direct and for the
actor to perform some the moreflaws the more quirks the more
mannerisms the more layers andand richness that you bring to
it but you have to learn how todo it as a process it's not just
a mind a mind thing you knowit's just i have to think
(20:32):
differently i think positivelybecause that's a bunch of
bullshit in my head The idea isfiguring out why people do what
they do, kind of profiling in away.
It's kind of forensic becauseit duplicates the forensic and
profiling
David John Clark (20:52):
situation.
Ivana Chubbuck (20:55):
But in order to truly bring in all those layers
and richness and density, youhave to truly understand that
the particular issues that thosecharacters are.
First from the point of view ofthe character, and then from
the point of view of yourselfand how that duplicates in your
own world.
And you are so different fromanybody else.
(21:15):
So the way you take in thatsame information that the
character has, you're plumpingout a two-page, two-dimensional
reality, which is a script, andthen you're turning it and
plumping it into athree-dimensional reality that
is what they need you for.
If they don't, So your lifeexperiences and how you
(21:37):
negotiate life makes it specialand unique.
If people wanted just exactlywhat was on the script, they
would just put the script on thescreen and read it.
David John Clark (21:46):
Read it, yes.
Ivana Chubbuck (21:48):
As anybody else is.
So that's your job to plump itout.
Okay, now let's go back to,okay, I would say I used to be
in casting.
So eight times out of ten,people would do the same
reading, but they're tendifferent people.
Why are they doing exactly thesame reading?
Because I think that's how it'ssupposed to sound.
That's how it's supposed to be.
And then you have that one ortwo people that...
(22:10):
if they don't get cast, theyremember them for future
casting.
That person is just like, itliterally wakes you up.
I used to have people come upto me on the street and say, it
was so nice to read for youyesterday.
I don't remember them becausethey become a blur of the same.
And I also produced it.
I was married to a directorwho's won lots of awards at TV
movies.
I just really know what peoplewant to see.
(22:32):
And you got to give it to them.
And you got to give it to themin a way that doesn't have to...
do something that you don'twant to do in the first place.
You're doing something that's,and my philosophy is to win with
your pain, to find pain equalsprosperity.
So it feels good.
You're going to get more partsthat way.
More audiences will make it,you'll make it a hit show.
(22:56):
And then people will want touse you to say, no, you bring
audiences to it and, and, and,and.
And so the thing is, is thatyou're not doing anything that
doesn't feel good.
Cause I feel that you're notdoing, Enjoy yourself.
You shouldn't do it.
It's fun.
So it's like, I always say youhave to bring comedy to
(23:17):
everything.
I don't care how dark somethingis.
The great actors always knowthat there's, there's it's
sardonic comedy.
It's dark comedy, but you gottahave the light for the dark.
David John Clark (23:29):
Wow.
Ivana Chubbuck (23:30):
Meaning of life, you know?
So I don't know if you sit inthe dark long enough, you can
see things, but if there's,There's a trick in horror films,
and it's like they do somethingfunny or outrageous, and then
the killer happens.
That's true.
Because that's the way to makepeople just have that
(23:50):
rollercoaster ride that we wantto give them.
David John Clark (23:53):
I love that.
I love that.
And you alluded to before withyour new book, the publishers
asked you, do you have enoughinformation to add to it?
And you were saying, yes, youhad heaps.
So do you find that actors or–our life experiences which is
such a big thing that you teachis to draw on your life
experiences for your charactersetc is so different now we live
(24:14):
in a world that is changing imean we could talk for hours
about what's happening in theworld politics and wars and
everything like that so doesthat do you find that's making
it different better harder
Ivana Chubbuck (24:25):
i wanted to say all things are cyclical because
like one of the things i i usethree things i
David John Clark (24:31):
use
Ivana Chubbuck (24:31):
are the science of behavior, behavioral science,
psychology, science ofpsychology, and cultural
anthropology.
which is the history ofculture.
And that means you can playdifferent periods of why people
did the way, sat the way theydid, why they dressed the way
they did, and why the religionthat they believed in was
apropos to the realities of whatwas going on in that particular
(24:56):
time.
So the idea is that you want tofind a way to explore from the
human aspect, from thescientific, being a human being
aspect of things, and not try tomuddy your brain with like
(25:17):
things that is the job of thescripty or is a job of like
lighting or whatever.
It's just like, go after whatyou want to go after and do it
from the point of view in termsof like a primal need and do it
from the point of view of thecharacter first, understanding
that, and then kind ofduplicating that from your home,
your real life is important.
(25:40):
the same let's go back to thehistory of history it's like
it's cyclical it's weirdlycyclical if you look at um
what's happening now there's alot of like giving voice to hate
so it's so the thing is is thatwhen when did that happen
before you tell me
David John Clark (26:01):
well there's big dozens of times isn't there
so every every world war for onething
Ivana Chubbuck (26:05):
Yes, exactly.
So the thing is, and thenbefore that, and then before
that, before that, it'scyclical, you know, so the idea
is, is this going to be, is thisthe biggest, worst thing ever?
Well, it feels like it's we'reliving in, it's not in our
history books, you know.
We only understand from ourhistory books that it happened.
But living in it is a horrorshow.
(26:28):
But the fact is, it's happenedbefore.
And those people experienced itat that particular point in
time.
My family, my father's side areHolocaust survivors.
And so there's a lot of feelingof duplication.
I'm aging myself becausethere's...
(26:48):
you know, the idea that it'snot my grandparents, it's my
actual parents.
And so I understand like fromlike just watching behaviors
based on that and like how, andthen the stories and the, and
it's like my uncles were thepeople that were, they were only
17, 18 at the time were part ofthe underground that got people
(27:11):
from Germany to Israel.
And so I just, it's just to me,The more things change, the
more they stay the same.
So how do we live in this crazyworld we live in today?
I think we've got to beproactive, but we've got to be
proactive through the mediumthat we have, which is making
choices that say we don't haveto suffer from the things that
(27:35):
are oppressing us, but we can dosomething about it within
subliminally affecting thepublic that you have choices.
Absolutely.
choices that you make.
And it's your obligation as anartist to do so.
That's why we don't want tomake depressing choices.
Well, it is what it is, becauseyou're taking away the ability
for people to have solutions.
David John Clark (27:57):
And it's a pity because as actors and as
people, we evolve, we learn, wegrow, and we hopefully don't
make the same mistakes thatwe've made in the past.
It's how we become betteractors.
It's a pity as a society thatWe don't do the same thing and
learn and grow and don't makethe same mistakes.
We continually continue on thatsame path, don't we, which is a
bit sad.
But it makes storytellinginteresting, doesn't it?
Ivana Chubbuck (28:21):
It's like, again, you get ideas from
watching something when you'rejust being entertained.
And if it comes into yoursystem subliminally, you're
going like, that person isreally fighting to overcome the
oppression.
And you're going like, ah, ah.
When such and such happens inyour world, whatever side you're
(28:41):
taking, because everybody hastheir side in these things, so I
try to have one.
Because I say all actors have,they need to say what they need
to say and they need to expressfrom whatever reasons they need
to express it.
But then you do something aboutit because your favorite
characters did.
Inspire to do somethingyourself.
(29:03):
You want to inspire people.
Give them hope because we'renot just being truthful.
Truthful is, it can be boring.
I always use the example of, Ijust painted my wall yellow and
it's drying.
It's literally, truthfully,honestly drying.
And it does change a tad colorwhen it goes from white to dry,
(29:28):
right?
But do you want to watch itdry?
No.
Okay, so.
I'm being honest, I'm beingtruthful, but that's not enough.
You've got to explore beingproactive in whatever the
journey that needs to be fixedand the script needs to be
(29:48):
fixed, and the personalizations,therefore, make it more
personal to the people that arewatching, again, giving them
ideas.
Some of them are going toleave, but then it does find its
way.
David John Clark (30:00):
That's wonderful.
That's wonderful.
That sort of being said andbringing it back to, you know,
the business side of acting foractors and that.
So your studio focuses onempowering actors to make these
proactive choices that we'vebeen talking about.
How does that philosophy helpactors build a sustainable and
marketable career in what is anunpredictable industry today?
Ivana Chubbuck (30:23):
I got to tell you, every day I get another
email or text saying I bookedthat role.
I booked that role.
David John Clark (30:31):
I love it.
Ivana Chubbuck (30:32):
So it's like the mystery is do the work, do the
work that makes it exciting.
It may not be, I may not be theperfect solution, but find a
place that really affects you ina way that allows you to do
something dynamic.
I want to create dynamiccharacters because we want to
see people do extraordinarythings because of that.
(30:56):
horrible things that havehappened to them that have
motivated them to do somethingextraordinary.
And so the idea is that'sexciting to watch the journey of
a dynamic person.
Put a John Wick in everybody,right?
And so the thing is, and I'mnot kidding, that's kind of a
good analogy.
So the idea is when my peopledie, sending their self-tapes or
(31:22):
going to the auditions, they dothings that excite the people
there.
So I literally, every day, inan email or text, someone using
my technique, whether it's fromthe book or whether it's from my
school or from the schools thatI have all over the world, it's
like people are booking.
(31:44):
People are working.
So to me, if you're not,something's wrong and you've got
to fix it.
And so, again, having been onthe other side producing, having
worked with 40% of my clientbases, directors, and
producer-writers, it's likeyou're doing something wrong if
(32:08):
you're consistently gettingthose.
Or you're getting in the mix,but you're not getting booked.
And we can't take...
a callback or good feedback tothe bank.
You have to book.
So in order to book, you haveto do something that makes it
extraordinary.
Not just be untruthful or notjust get caught up in an insular
(32:29):
reality because your littlebubble that you've created keeps
people out.
You're like, hey, I'm here.
It's like we go to a party andsomeone says to you, hey, how
are you doing?
And I keep on walking.
Now they ask you a question andnormally a question requires a
response.
However, they didn't require aresponse.
(32:51):
And how does that make youfeel?
Invisible, not cared for.
to the other character, otherperson that you're reading.
You're reading with a personthat's just a reader, or you're
reading with a person that youasked to read on the other side
(33:11):
of this for yourself tape, orwhether you're doing it in the
room for the casting director.
The thing is, if you areignoring and not needing a
reaction from them, it makes youfeel exactly the same way
that...
The person at a party who getsasked a question, they're
(33:32):
talking, they're asking aquestion, but they don't really
want an answer from you.
David John Clark (33:38):
Yeah, fair enough.
It's all about personalities,really, isn't it?
People, personalities, and justbringing that to the screen.
Ivana Chubbuck (33:47):
It means that you have to want something so
bad you're willing to doanything to get it, and that
creates interesting behavior.
I love
Speaker 02 (33:53):
that.
Ivana Chubbuck (33:54):
The means justify the ends kind of thought
process.
So I may do some sane stuff,but it makes sense to what I
want.
Because I will get it if I doA, B, C, D, and E.
Working with Stallone on Creed,it was all about, he has a
(34:14):
cancer disease.
diagnosis and he could die.
He wants to, he doesn't careabout dying.
All the people he loves aredead.
So he'll meet them in heaven.
It's not, it's not such a badthing for him, but what he does
and what we came up with, whichwas to make Creed feel like if
you don't really go after tryingto win this boxing match, then
(34:38):
I will not take that.
the chemo, but I will take thechemo if you really go after it.
And so, but that was innerwork.
That was not, we didn't change,we changed a little bit on the
page, but for the most part, wejust kept it the way it was.
But it was the inner work thatdrove that, his looking at him
(34:59):
the way the inner monologue wasgoing on.
You don't do this, I'm gonnadie.
So you have that on yourshoulders.
And I don't care.
It's not a threat that I careabout.
The thing is that I want to fixthe, and this is again about
fixing, because the Rockycharacter has had, through the
Rocky legend, has always hadproblems with his kid.
(35:23):
And so his boy, sometimesthey're together, most of the
time they have a problemtogether.
And this is his second chanceto fix what happened to him and
his child, or his relationshipwith him and Preet.
And Preet's son.
Wow, I like that.
So it becomes like so profoundof a mission from doing all
(35:43):
that.
Of course, we personalized allthat so that it became a very
important mission for Mr.
Stallone himself.
And he told the New York Times,he told NPR, he said, this was
the work that we did together.
And he said, my name, he said,the work we did together made
him feel comforted and alsocathartic.
David John Clark (36:06):
I love that.
Oh, that's fantastic.
That's fantastic.
Well, Ivana, thank you.
I'm just mindful of the timethat we're running out of here,
but it's been truly special totalk to you.
And I thank you greatly forgiving me your time to help not
only me, but my listeners on ourjourneys as actors.
But before we go, and withthe...
Three minutes we've got left.
Could I ask you one lastquestion?
(36:27):
If you were to speak to astruggling actor of any age or
background, what one piece ofadvice would you give them that
might spur them on towardssuccess in their career, making
everything work both on set andoff set?
Ivana Chubbuck (36:42):
Study, study, study.
Work ethic.
Break down your script.
It takes a lot of work to begreat.
Greatness is in the details.
And take risks.
Make bold choices.
Do not play it safe.
So work your ass off.
Work ethic.
Do proper script analysis.
Really do your work.
A lot of work.
(37:03):
And then make bold choices.
Do not play it safe.
Make bold choices.
David John Clark (37:09):
Wonderful.
And the new release of ThePower of the Actor was released
on April the 27th, so availablein all good bookstores at
Amazon.com, I'm assuming.
And you have the digitalversions, do you, Kindle?
Ivana Chubbuck (37:23):
Digital, but also it's an audio in my voice.
David John Clark (37:26):
Oh, wow.
That is fantastic.
Well, I do love listening to agood audio book because you get
such a different...
aspect of it don't you you getit from the heart and from the
from the mouth of the speaker soso to speak so that's wonderful
so thank you very
Ivana Chubbuck (37:41):
much i think it's a double thing because you
get things in differently fromreading and you get things in
differently when you listen soit's a combination
David John Clark (37:48):
of course of course wonderful thank you very
much it's
Ivana Chubbuck (37:52):
been everybody get some
David John Clark (37:53):
time Thank you.
I'm sure I will put the linksfor people to purchase the book
in the show notes for the show.
It's been, as I said, sometimesI get the guests on the show
and I'm so excited to have them.
And when I found out I wastalking to the wonderful Ivana
Chubbuck, I was just over themoon.
So thank you very much.
It's been a pleasure.
Ivana Chubbuck (38:13):
It's been my pleasure too.
David John Clark (38:16):
Thank you.
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