June 11, 2024 • 26 mins
Discover how you can transform your leadership approach by building strong networks with insights from David Gow, the visionary founder and chairman of Gow Media. David shares his inspiring journey, detailing how overcoming personal challenges like introversion and actively seeking help has led to the creation of genuine relationships and successful collaborations. Learn how community connections and partnerships have been a cornerstone in the resilience and shared success of his ventures.
Explore the rapidly evolving landscape of media entrepreneurship through David's experience. From the traditional roots of sports radio to the dynamic realms of digital platforms like Twitter and Instagram, David provides a front-row seat to the shifts in media and advertising. Hear the compelling story of Gow Media's strategic acquisition of CultureMap and the roller coaster ride of leading a media company through the trials of the COVID-19 pandemic, including the tough choices and sacrifices that kept the team united.
Finally, gain invaluable advice on leading with compassion and building networks that support professional growth. David reveals the excitement of storytelling, the pride in watching colleagues advance, and the essential practice of reaching out for help when needed. We also touch on the delicate process of terminating employees with respect and care, ensuring they continue to feel valued even after their departure. Tune in for a thoughtful conversation on leadership, community, and the profound impact of networks on personal and professional development.
Connect with David:
David Gow | LinkedIn
David Gow | Email
Gow Media | LinkedIn
CultureMap | Website
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Order your copy of Jon's book at RedefineYourServantLeadership.com, and don't forget to utilize the additional resources, or purchase access to the Workbook and Coaching Videos.
Send your Leadership and Business questions to Jon at podcast@leadwell.com.
For more information visit https://leadwell.com
The Leadwell Podcast gives mission-driven leaders principled and practical advice to do just that, lead well.
In each episode, your host Jon Kidwell, interviews leaders with great stories, to share strategies that help leaders navigate complex, confusing, and often down-right challenging leadership, personal growth, business, and workplace culture situations.
Jon is a nonprofit executive turned coach, speaker, author, and CEO of a leadership development company. In working with nonprofits and businesses, big and small, he realized the unique challenges leaders face when they are committed to keeping the mission and people the top priority. Those leaders’ commitment to their principles and the people they lead, plus seeing the need for more leaders who strive to do the right thing, the right way, for the right reasons, is what inspired Jon to start a leadership development company dedicated to the success of mission-driven leaders and their organiza...
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Episode Transcript
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Jon Kidwell (00:00):
If you run into a problem, if you need to partner
with another business, if youhave something that you need,
who are you going to call?
Have you ever heard the oldAfrican proverb if you want to
go fast, go alone.
If you want to go far, gotogether.
Today's guest, david Gow, hasgone far.
(00:21):
He's also gone pretty fast too.
He's the founder of Gow Media.
He's also gone pretty fast too.
He's the founder of Gao Media.
He currently serves as theirchairman.
He has brought businesses fromIPO to partnership and still
leads there.
He is a member of Goose Capitaland he is very involved in
ecosystem development here inHouston through the Canon
Amazing places that bringentrepreneurs and businesses
(00:43):
together in a co-location form.
And he's going to talk to ustoday all about the power of
building a strong leadershipnetwork externally and internal
to the business.
You don't want to miss it.
Let's dive in right now.
David, thank you so much forjoining me on the Leadwell
(01:06):
podcast and talking about why itis so important for us to build
networks as leaders.
David Gow (01:14):
Thank you.
It's great to be here, excitedto be here.
Jon Kidwell (01:18):
Yeah, so as I was researching and as you shared
got to look at, you've builtGalmedia, you have built a
sports network, you have anecosystem that you are working
on here in Houston.
Kind of the thread through allof this is you build businesses
where you absolutely must workwith other people and other
(01:40):
organizations, and can you talkabout?
Was this an intentional thing?
Was this something that youfound yourself in after you
started doing this?
How did you get into wherebuilding networks was so crucial
to your businesses and to howyou lead Well, thanks, ed.
David Gow (01:55):
It's great to be here .
You know it is interesting.
You asked that question because, when I go back to why did we
start Gal Media?
It was a window of time whenI'd sold out of a business and
had not figured out what Iwanted to be when I grew up.
I was wrestling with thatquestion in my probably my early
forties at the time and Ireally landed on three criteria
(02:18):
for what I wanted to do next.
But the first one was to be apart of something where the
mission of the work exceeded theday-to-day tasks, where we were
tied to something exciting andbigger than what we were doing
every day.
And, of course, when mostpeople look at their day-to-day
(02:39):
tasks what they do they're notparticularly exciting.
I mean, if you're an accountant, you're booking entries.
If you're a salesperson, you'remaking calls.
But to be tied to somethingbigger than the tasks was a
really exciting opportunity forme.
It's something I really wantedto pursue, and media seemed like
a platform, a way to do that,because one of the great things
(03:00):
about media is that we can useour platforms to support lots of
great causes across the city,and so we do promote, as
regularly as we can, wonderfulcauses that are making a mark
and changing lives in Houston,and we love to do so.
So that was one premise.
(03:20):
And then the second thing isyou talk about building networks
, but you can't build a mediacompany without being deeply
connected to your community andmeeting lots of people and
touching lots of bases.
And that was certainly truewhen we got started.
We were started purely as asports radio company.
Now, because we'remulti-platform and our content
(03:44):
sites cover all kinds of topicsculture map, sports map,
innovationmapcom and what thoseplatforms do, of course, is they
connect us to certaincommunities the innovation
ecosystems in Houston, thecultural communities and the
charity events of the city, andthen, of course, the sports
community and the sports fans.
So, yes, a part of being inmedia is being deeply connected
(04:06):
to the community and buildingthose networks.
Jon Kidwell (04:11):
So what I find so interesting is, as I look at
this and I look at you andothers, that that build these is
the resilience, thecollaboration and a lot of the
shared success and strugglesthat come with doing work this
way.
But what are some of the thingsthat you have found that have
(04:32):
been extremely positive, thatmaybe you weren't expecting
going in to being so reliant onand building such a strong kind
of network all around gal mediaand ecosystem development, like
you and others are doing at thecanon?
David Gow (04:49):
the thing is, of course, to build a network.
I guess I might say two things.
One is you've got to show upand be out and about and be
willing to meet with people.
Uh, you know I'm a I'm a littlebit of an introvert, and so it
takes some energy to get outinto the workplace and to meet
folks, but the energy is alwaysrepaid back many, many times
(05:12):
over.
Every relationship has somereal nuggets out of it that have
always been enriching andcertainly worth the energy that
I put forth.
And so being outbound and goingout and connecting with people
is certainly an endemic part ofbuilding a network.
But the second thing is thatsurprised me a little bit, and
(05:32):
this one has taken me longer todo.
Well is, I hate to admit when Idon't have an answer or I need
help?
I hate to admit that I needhelp, but what I find is if I go
to people and I tell them thatI need help, that I'm in a tough
spot or that I don't know theanswer, that's actually a way to
get connected to people,probably in a faster way than if
(05:57):
I come in with all the answers.
People love to connect with youwhen they realize that you have
some of the same challenges,dilemmas, highs and lows, and
ups and downs that they do, andso getting to a place where I
was willing to admit my need wasanother key lever in building a
network of relationships,friendships and business
(06:20):
acquaintances.
Jon Kidwell (06:22):
That is so powerful .
I mean, we forget that.
I forget that that if I'm theone that likes to give and give
and give, that one I need toreceive, and two that other
people love to reciprocate, justas I do.
What are some of the greatestthings that have come out of
that?
When you have said, hey, hereis a need.
Is it space, is it people?
(06:44):
Is it collaboration on events?
What are some of the outcomesof you stepping out and saying,
hey, I need help in this way orin this area?
David Gow (06:53):
I think what's been great for me is this notion that
I don't have to feel totalresponsibility, the full weight
of the outcome of the entity, onmy own shoulders.
It's been wonderful to havepeople outside the organization
and people inside theorganization to feel ownership
(07:14):
for outcomes at the company, andI've been uplifted by that, by
people's willingness to help andbe supportive.
You know it's interesting withleadership and thinking about
internally in the organization.
For a good long time I used totry to walk the halls like I had
(07:40):
every answer, like I was theone with all the plan, and that
maybe made some people feel like, oh, their leader knows where
we're going and that gave themsome comfort.
But I think equally so, maybeeven more so, our team, our
employees, wanted to be part ofthe problem solving effort.
So to engage in that way, tosay, hey, this is something
we're wrestling with as anentity, come and engage with us
(08:03):
on how we handle this particularsituation or how we chase a
particular opportunity it's notalways challenges, but it might
be a new opportunity andformulate the opportunity
alongside us, boy, thatinclusivity is really really
great for the whole organization.
Jon Kidwell (08:19):
And what a powerful awareness at least I'm getting
it right now.
The reminder of buildingnetworks isn't just about
building connections to help you, but what you really what I
just heard you say is includepeople in what we are in fact
working on, and that creates inand of itself a more
well-connected, resilient,stronger kind of network,
(08:42):
internal to the organization orexternal.
David Gow (08:52):
Yeah, I don't know, I mean it's an overused
expression, but I do believe, uh, people felt like we had an
open door policy, that somebodycould come in.
I mean, I had to temper that alittle bit sometimes because you
could have a line coming outthe door, but especially as an
introvert, you probably had likeI am open door and in this way,
Only these times.
Right, there's obviously amoment where you've got to go
off and do your own individualwork.
(09:13):
But at the same time, I do feellike people felt like we had an
open door.
There was an opportunity tocome and talk through questions
about the company and that, Ithink, enabled relationships and
relationships with thefoundation for soaring as an
organization, and that, I think,enabled relationships and
relationships with thefoundation for soaring as an
organization, and thoserelationships were something.
When I look back on my time atGal Media, it's the
(09:34):
relationships that I find themost fulfilling.
It's the people who grew,people who were transformed,
people who came in as one personand left as another person.
And when I look back, thosethings transcend the business
success.
Now you have to make payroll,you've got to be profitable, but
to get beyond that and to havesomething where you can connect
(09:59):
with people, build relationshipsand use that as a foundation
for growth, I think that's areally great step for the
company.
Jon Kidwell (10:06):
I love hearing you talk about doing that with
people.
That bleeds over into the workthat you do.
You also have Goose Capital,where you do early stage
investment, and this has alsoled into some of the ecosystem
development that you are a partof, especially here in Houston.
For those that don't know whatthat term ecosystem development
means, like myself, can youexplain to us exactly what that
(10:33):
means and how you are thinkingabout ecosystem development in a
community or through a varietyof businesses?
David Gow (10:38):
You bet.
So I think the concept of anecosystem is simply that if we
bring different companiestogether and co-locate them and
create programs that will unitethem or enable connections, that
by their being together theywill accomplish more than if
(11:02):
they're all operatingindependently.
And so the illustration of that, as we were talking about, the
Cannon is a big innovation hubon the west side of town.
There are actually otherlocations now, some really
attractive locations, but theCannon on the west side of town
is sort of the flagship facilityon the west side, and one of
the great things that happensthere to show how ecosystems can
develop is lots of youngentrepreneurial businesses.
(11:25):
Entrepreneurs will come andlocate there.
There are educational programsthat are very, very useful for
these entrepreneurs.
There's community buildingactivities, such as the
champagne room down at the endof the hall.
If somebody closes a big VCround, everybody runs down there
at the end of the day.
They ring a bell, they drinkthe champagne, they toast the
(11:45):
company and then celebrate winstogether and they endure
challenges together.
And so when you think abouteducational programs, community
building and even things like amentor network, an angel network
, what happens is, byco-locating all these businesses
, you create a set of resourcesthat enable companies to scale
(12:07):
faster, and that's the benefitof an ecosystem.
Jon Kidwell (12:11):
Yeah, it becomes a thing that starts to feed itself
, and what I heard you say isthat you put all these things
together, you guys start tofacilitate, but you are really
saying that, hey, part of thisis we also have to be proximate,
like we might have the bestintentions, but if we're not
actually around each other,doing work or life together,
(12:33):
we're not ever actually going todo it.
David Gow (12:36):
Well, I mean, I'll just highlight how hard
entrepreneurialism is.
The highs are really reallyhigh, the lows are really really
low, and for an entrepreneur tobe off in some remote office
somewhere doing this on his orher own is really really
challenging.
But to put that entrepreneur inan ecosystem of other
(12:58):
entrepreneurs, I think greatlyenhances the probability of
success.
Jon Kidwell (13:04):
Yeah, absolutely.
We start to seek other people,we start to run and be motivated
and behave like those that arewinning around us, where
sometimes we're our own worstenemy, sitting all alone, not
closing a deal and thinking thatthe world is about to end.
So, as you are in there and youhave these networks, you also
(13:26):
have extremely I wouldn't sayvolatile, but they're just very
responsive and connected to theeconomy and to kind of big wins
and maybe fast failures, frommedia to capital to again
building this ecosystem withproperty.
What have some of those ups anddowns look like?
David Gow (13:49):
Well, the easy one to describe is media in this sense
.
When we founded Dow Media, wewere solely a sports radio
station, and that was beforeTwitter even existed, and so we
were in the old media world.
And then along came Twitter andInstagram and all these other
platforms, and it's just amazingto see how media has sort of
(14:13):
fragmented and evolved over theyears.
I mean, here we are, you'recreating a media outlet and you
are going direct to the publicthrough your own work.
It used to be it wasn't thatlong ago, 15, 20 years ago that
if you really wanted to buildaudiences you had to be part of
a big entity, a broadcast entity.
(14:34):
But now there's been thisfragmenting and all these
changes and all these newplatforms where audiences have
gone, and so it's a radicallydifferent world, and I would say
that it is felt like ever sincewe started Gal Media, we were
always working to catch up to orget ahead of the next trend in
media.
(14:55):
So here's an illustration whenwe started, we were sports radio
only, but what we perceived isthat ad dollars and we were
dependent upon advertisingdollars for our business that ad
(15:19):
dollars were migrating out ofold media radio and into new
media, digital, and so it wasimperative for us to spread our
wings and get beyond just radio.
You know, interestingly,listenership didn't change that
much, according to Nielsenratings.
Our listenership was stillpretty rock solid and stable,
but the ad dollars weremigrating.
They love the accountability ofdigital and they love the shiny
new toy that was digital.
Jon Kidwell (15:37):
None of us ever liked shiny new toys?
No, no, never, never.
David Gow (15:41):
So we went out and bought our own shiny new toy,
which was CultureMap.
Culturemapcom had been aroundfor about 10 years by the time
we bought it.
It had built a large and loyalfollowing, but they were
struggling to monetize what theyhad built.
It was a standalone.
It needed to be part of agreater whole, and so to buy
CultureMap was a really goodmove for us, because then we
(16:03):
were positioned in front of allthose ad dollars coming to
digital and it gave us aplatform CultureMap did to
launch these other digitalcontent sites which we have
SportsMap, innovationmap and nowEnergy Capital HTX.
So it's been a good move for us, but it was one that was
required by all of theever-changing landscape in media
(16:24):
.
Jon Kidwell (16:25):
Yeah, how amazing because, as you said, that whole
space has changed and, like us,we have the podcast, which is
part of our media thing.
We also self-publish a book,all of which was not possible,
and you have steered and kind ofgone through that entire
exchange that I'm sure had atremendous amount of ups and
(16:47):
downs and having to sacrificewhat once worked for what may or
may not work.
David Gow (16:52):
Yes.
Jon Kidwell (16:53):
And just the exhilaration and the exhaustion
that comes with that.
David Gow (16:58):
Well, yes, it's been a bit of a roller coaster, and
never more so than when COVIDhit, I mean, when you step back
and think about it.
When COVID hit, a lot ofbusinesses were required to shut
down and so, of course, theyweren't going to spend any money
on marketing.
Why would a sports bar say, hey, come in and see us on Thursday
night football?
Because they weren't even open.
(17:19):
So everybody slashed theirmedia spend quite significantly.
I think our revenues were downaround 45 to 50 percent year
over year at the peak of theCOVID crisis, and that was a
real challenge because we had aninability to make money and we
(17:40):
had a lot of employees who wereon the payroll, people whom we
wanted to have around once wegot to a post COVID world.
But the question was could wekeep them to the post COVID
world?
Could we hold it all togetherduring that stretch?
And that was an extraordinarychallenge that required a whole
lot of effort and a lot ofconversations in the company.
Jon Kidwell (18:02):
Yeah, how did it play out for you all?
David Gow (18:07):
So I guess I'd say two or three things.
First is and I love this aboutthe team we had, but rather the
pitch was I went to them andsaid look, we're going to have
to cut costs by about 15 to 20percent and we could cast out 15
to 20 percent of our employees,or we could keep the employees.
(18:29):
Let's not cast them out into anuncertain job market in the
midst of COVID.
Let's not cast them out into anuncertain job market in the
midst of COVID.
Let's keep those employees andeveryone take a 15 to 20 percent
pay cut with the idea of sharedsacrifice, so that we would all
take a hit in the short term toenable us to keep the team
together and avoid castingpeople out into an uncertain job
(18:50):
market.
And so that was step one, andthen step two.
Of course we were fortunatemarket, and so that was step one
.
And then step two.
Of course we were fortunate, wewere able to get into the PPP
business.
The payroll protection plan thatthe government allotted and
those two steps some payrollreductions and the government
funding enabled us to navigatethrough that time.
But it was still a challengebecause, if you think about it,
(19:13):
when we wanted to bring theadvertisers back when they were
ready to open their doors again.
We had to sort of resell them.
It wasn't sort of hey, let'sjust roll your plan over to the
next year.
We had to reconvince them thatthis thing that they had done
previously was now going to be agood thing again, and it took
some time.
Thankfully, business is back.
We're above where we were in2019, pre-covid.
(19:35):
But it took some time.
It took well a couple of yearsto sort of build back the
business, brick by brick bybrick, and we finally got there.
Jon Kidwell (19:45):
I'm curious about your sacrifice and the
collective sacrifice and howthat kind of really solidified
that network at GOW and probably, like you see, in other places.
When there is this sharedsacrifice, organizations that we
work with, who kept people andmade sacrifices for that to
happen, are reporting higherretention way, different kind of
(20:10):
post-COVID employee engagement,everything and is it playing
out similar for you all?
David Gow (20:16):
It is.
We have great retention rates,we rarely lose people, and maybe
part of that is the way we wentthrough COVID the shared
sacrifice of the collectiveeffort to get through it.
I think part of it is we'refortunate to be in media.
I mean, everybody wants to bein media, right, in some way.
It's fun, it's exciting to betelling the stories of what's
(20:37):
going on across the city and so,yes, usually when we get people
into the realm of media, theywant to stick around unless
they're advancing onto a bigger,better platform.
We've had guys who were local,who've gone national, and that's
always a fun thing to see someof our people graduate that way.
But that's a good loss, right,a healthy loss.
(20:59):
It's a loss where somebody hasreally achieved something and we
can all take pride in theirgrowth.
Jon Kidwell (21:06):
So some of the things that I'm taking away is
just the power of building anetwork, both externally and
internally, that in, you know,casting the vision with this
greater mission than any of theday-to-day work and and really
including and inspiring folks togo that way.
If somebody is listening andthey're sitting there thinking,
oh my goodness, I feel all ofthe weight of that solo
(21:28):
responsibility.
There's nothing shared.
If I'm thinking, well, you,you're saying to ask people for
help or to try to build thatbridge, and I don't even have a
person, what's something thatyou would give them as advice or
encouragement?
David Gow (21:42):
to start, Well, I do believe that there's more help
out there than one mightnaturally think, and going to
business networking events, youcan stumble into lots of people
who are very useful, helpful andthoughtful.
I'm amazed at some people whowill reach out to me on LinkedIn
.
We don't really know each other, but they may be a friend of a
(22:09):
friend or there's some mutualconnection and they're just
asking for a cup of coffee, andI think it's hard to say no to
people who are just seeking helpand who are earnest about it
and trying to build a goodbusiness.
And I think there's more helpout there than people believe
instinctively, and so I wouldjust encourage everyone to reach
out, connect and find ways tobuild a network and build
(22:34):
trusted relationships and folkswho can be great thought
partners and maybe evenaccountability partners.
Jon Kidwell (22:41):
Yeah, and the way that you and I got connected to
do this podcast today wasthrough a mutual friend who is a
super connector.
A great collaborator said youall got to get together and talk
and, by the way, do this show,and so we were the benefit of
that as well.
And I'm about to ask you whatyou would say.
(23:02):
It is to lead well, but beforewe do, where would you send
anyone that's listening if theywant to learn more about
Galmedia, about the ecosystemdevelopment you're doing here in
Houston through the Canon andany of your other work?
Where should we send people?
David Gow (23:15):
You bet.
So our biggest website, galMedia, is culturemapcom and
there's something on culturemapfor everybody, which is one
reason I love that site, becausewe are covering food, fun,
lifestyle, travel, society, allkinds of arts.
It's amazing.
Culturemapcom is a wonderfulresource for the city and where
(23:36):
to go and what to do.
Pitchmapcom is a wonderfulresource for the city and where
to go and what to do.
In terms of leadership, thenumber one principle I keep
thinking about and trying toimplement well is speaking the
truth in love.
We have to have lots of hardconversations, but I think we
have a model for it.
It actually comes out of theBible Truth in love.
(23:56):
Lead with affirmation of thepeople, lead with your
connection to them, have arelationship with them, and from
that place, from that vantagepoint, there's an opportunity to
speak the truth.
Sometimes the hard truth aboutneeds, performance, development,
objectives, things that need tobe accomplished it all starts
(24:17):
with a relationship and that'sthe foundation that enables you
to speak the truth.
Jon Kidwell (24:20):
Yeah, Wow, thank you, david.
Would you consider that?
Your answer to what does itmean to you to lead well is
speak.
Truth in love, kind heart,truth with care and compassion.
David Gow (24:32):
Yes, that is my answer to that question, and
I'll give one illustration isthat unfortunately, it is often
the case we've had to let somepeople go for different windows
of time.
They just weren't a fit, andit's strange dynamic.
But often maybe this is true inmedia, but I think it's true in
a lot of places when youterminate somebody, when you
(24:54):
cast them out, when they'reready to go on to another job,
when you decided they're not afit at the company, there's
something in the company whereeverybody wants to say, well, he
or she was never really this,or he or she never did that.
Well, there's sort of acollective statement about that
person that's somewhat negative,and I think it's in part it's
the organization's collectivesense that they need to justify
(25:16):
why that person's gone, and sothey come up with these negative
reasons and what we try to dois separate the individual from
the decision to terminate them.
And the individual has greatworth.
We like that person.
No one we fired is anybody wedidn't like.
They're actually wonderfulpeople that are part of our
community, but they just weren'ta good fit, they weren't doing
(25:38):
the right job, or maybe we evenmiscast them, maybe it was our
fault.
But the point is is that whenwe're letting somebody go, we
really work hard internally tostill honor them as a person and
then, even after they're gone,we try to keep them in the fold.
We'll have company happy hours,we'll still invite them.
We want them to still feel likethey're still cared for and
(26:05):
important to us as individuals,even if they're not a part of
our organization anymore.
Jon Kidwell (26:09):
That is perhaps the most powerful example for all
of us to end on, because itprobably sits viscerally with so
many of us in terms of howpeople are let go.
So, for all that are listening,we can take David's example.
We can just try to internalizethat one thing outside of the
other myriad of things that hegave us today that are wonderful
(26:29):
us to go do Honor people afterthey're gone and remember the
humanity in it.
My friends, thank you so muchfor being here with David and I
today.
Be well, lead on and God bless.
If you run into a problem, if you need to partner
with another business, if youhave something that you need,
who are you going to call?
Have you ever heard the oldAfrican proverb if you want to
go fast, go alone.
If you want to go far, gotogether.
Today's guest, david Gow, hasgone far.
(00:21):
He's also gone pretty fast too.
He's the founder of Gow Media.
He's also gone pretty fast too.
He's the founder of Gao Media.
He currently serves as theirchairman.
He has brought businesses fromIPO to partnership and still
leads there.
He is a member of Goose Capitaland he is very involved in
ecosystem development here inHouston through the Canon
Amazing places that bringentrepreneurs and businesses
(00:43):
together in a co-location form.
And he's going to talk to ustoday all about the power of
building a strong leadershipnetwork externally and internal
to the business.
You don't want to miss it.
Let's dive in right now.
David, thank you so much forjoining me on the Leadwell
(01:06):
podcast and talking about why itis so important for us to build
networks as leaders.
David Gow (01:14):
Thank you.
It's great to be here, excitedto be here.
Jon Kidwell (01:18):
Yeah, so as I was researching and as you shared
got to look at, you've builtGalmedia, you have built a
sports network, you have anecosystem that you are working
on here in Houston.
Kind of the thread through allof this is you build businesses
where you absolutely must workwith other people and other
(01:40):
organizations, and can you talkabout?
Was this an intentional thing?
Was this something that youfound yourself in after you
started doing this?
How did you get into wherebuilding networks was so crucial
to your businesses and to howyou lead Well, thanks, ed.
David Gow (01:55):
It's great to be here .
You know it is interesting.
You asked that question because, when I go back to why did we
start Gal Media?
It was a window of time whenI'd sold out of a business and
had not figured out what Iwanted to be when I grew up.
I was wrestling with thatquestion in my probably my early
forties at the time and Ireally landed on three criteria
(02:18):
for what I wanted to do next.
But the first one was to be apart of something where the
mission of the work exceeded theday-to-day tasks, where we were
tied to something exciting andbigger than what we were doing
every day.
And, of course, when mostpeople look at their day-to-day
(02:39):
tasks what they do they're notparticularly exciting.
I mean, if you're an accountant, you're booking entries.
If you're a salesperson, you'remaking calls.
But to be tied to somethingbigger than the tasks was a
really exciting opportunity forme.
It's something I really wantedto pursue, and media seemed like
a platform, a way to do that,because one of the great things
(03:00):
about media is that we can useour platforms to support lots of
great causes across the city,and so we do promote, as
regularly as we can, wonderfulcauses that are making a mark
and changing lives in Houston,and we love to do so.
So that was one premise.
(03:20):
And then the second thing isyou talk about building networks
, but you can't build a mediacompany without being deeply
connected to your community andmeeting lots of people and
touching lots of bases.
And that was certainly truewhen we got started.
We were started purely as asports radio company.
Now, because we'remulti-platform and our content
(03:44):
sites cover all kinds of topicsculture map, sports map,
innovationmapcom and what thoseplatforms do, of course, is they
connect us to certaincommunities the innovation
ecosystems in Houston, thecultural communities and the
charity events of the city, andthen, of course, the sports
community and the sports fans.
So, yes, a part of being inmedia is being deeply connected
(04:06):
to the community and buildingthose networks.
Jon Kidwell (04:11):
So what I find so interesting is, as I look at
this and I look at you andothers, that that build these is
the resilience, thecollaboration and a lot of the
shared success and strugglesthat come with doing work this
way.
But what are some of the thingsthat you have found that have
(04:32):
been extremely positive, thatmaybe you weren't expecting
going in to being so reliant onand building such a strong kind
of network all around gal mediaand ecosystem development, like
you and others are doing at thecanon?
David Gow (04:49):
the thing is, of course, to build a network.
I guess I might say two things.
One is you've got to show upand be out and about and be
willing to meet with people.
Uh, you know I'm a I'm a littlebit of an introvert, and so it
takes some energy to get outinto the workplace and to meet
folks, but the energy is alwaysrepaid back many, many times
(05:12):
over.
Every relationship has somereal nuggets out of it that have
always been enriching andcertainly worth the energy that
I put forth.
And so being outbound and goingout and connecting with people
is certainly an endemic part ofbuilding a network.
But the second thing is thatsurprised me a little bit, and
(05:32):
this one has taken me longer todo.
Well is, I hate to admit when Idon't have an answer or I need
help?
I hate to admit that I needhelp, but what I find is if I go
to people and I tell them thatI need help, that I'm in a tough
spot or that I don't know theanswer, that's actually a way to
get connected to people,probably in a faster way than if
(05:57):
I come in with all the answers.
People love to connect with youwhen they realize that you have
some of the same challenges,dilemmas, highs and lows, and
ups and downs that they do, andso getting to a place where I
was willing to admit my need wasanother key lever in building a
network of relationships,friendships and business
(06:20):
acquaintances.
Jon Kidwell (06:22):
That is so powerful .
I mean, we forget that.
I forget that that if I'm theone that likes to give and give
and give, that one I need toreceive, and two that other
people love to reciprocate, justas I do.
What are some of the greatestthings that have come out of
that?
When you have said, hey, hereis a need.
Is it space, is it people?
(06:44):
Is it collaboration on events?
What are some of the outcomesof you stepping out and saying,
hey, I need help in this way orin this area?
David Gow (06:53):
I think what's been great for me is this notion that
I don't have to feel totalresponsibility, the full weight
of the outcome of the entity, onmy own shoulders.
It's been wonderful to havepeople outside the organization
and people inside theorganization to feel ownership
(07:14):
for outcomes at the company, andI've been uplifted by that, by
people's willingness to help andbe supportive.
You know it's interesting withleadership and thinking about
internally in the organization.
For a good long time I used totry to walk the halls like I had
(07:40):
every answer, like I was theone with all the plan, and that
maybe made some people feel like, oh, their leader knows where
we're going and that gave themsome comfort.
But I think equally so, maybeeven more so, our team, our
employees, wanted to be part ofthe problem solving effort.
So to engage in that way, tosay, hey, this is something
we're wrestling with as anentity, come and engage with us
(08:03):
on how we handle this particularsituation or how we chase a
particular opportunity it's notalways challenges, but it might
be a new opportunity andformulate the opportunity
alongside us, boy, thatinclusivity is really really
great for the whole organization.
Jon Kidwell (08:19):
And what a powerful awareness at least I'm getting
it right now.
The reminder of buildingnetworks isn't just about
building connections to help you, but what you really what I
just heard you say is includepeople in what we are in fact
working on, and that creates inand of itself a more
well-connected, resilient,stronger kind of network,
(08:42):
internal to the organization orexternal.
David Gow (08:52):
Yeah, I don't know, I mean it's an overused
expression, but I do believe, uh, people felt like we had an
open door policy, that somebodycould come in.
I mean, I had to temper that alittle bit sometimes because you
could have a line coming outthe door, but especially as an
introvert, you probably had likeI am open door and in this way,
Only these times.
Right, there's obviously amoment where you've got to go
off and do your own individualwork.
(09:13):
But at the same time, I do feellike people felt like we had an
open door.
There was an opportunity tocome and talk through questions
about the company and that, Ithink, enabled relationships and
relationships with thefoundation for soaring as an
organization, and that, I think,enabled relationships and
relationships with thefoundation for soaring as an
organization, and thoserelationships were something.
When I look back on my time atGal Media, it's the
(09:34):
relationships that I find themost fulfilling.
It's the people who grew,people who were transformed,
people who came in as one personand left as another person.
And when I look back, thosethings transcend the business
success.
Now you have to make payroll,you've got to be profitable, but
to get beyond that and to havesomething where you can connect
(09:59):
with people, build relationshipsand use that as a foundation
for growth, I think that's areally great step for the
company.
Jon Kidwell (10:06):
I love hearing you talk about doing that with
people.
That bleeds over into the workthat you do.
You also have Goose Capital,where you do early stage
investment, and this has alsoled into some of the ecosystem
development that you are a partof, especially here in Houston.
For those that don't know whatthat term ecosystem development
means, like myself, can youexplain to us exactly what that
(10:33):
means and how you are thinkingabout ecosystem development in a
community or through a varietyof businesses?
David Gow (10:38):
You bet.
So I think the concept of anecosystem is simply that if we
bring different companiestogether and co-locate them and
create programs that will unitethem or enable connections, that
by their being together theywill accomplish more than if
(11:02):
they're all operatingindependently.
And so the illustration of that, as we were talking about, the
Cannon is a big innovation hubon the west side of town.
There are actually otherlocations now, some really
attractive locations, but theCannon on the west side of town
is sort of the flagship facilityon the west side, and one of
the great things that happensthere to show how ecosystems can
develop is lots of youngentrepreneurial businesses.
(11:25):
Entrepreneurs will come andlocate there.
There are educational programsthat are very, very useful for
these entrepreneurs.
There's community buildingactivities, such as the
champagne room down at the endof the hall.
If somebody closes a big VCround, everybody runs down there
at the end of the day.
They ring a bell, they drinkthe champagne, they toast the
(11:45):
company and then celebrate winstogether and they endure
challenges together.
And so when you think abouteducational programs, community
building and even things like amentor network, an angel network
, what happens is, byco-locating all these businesses
, you create a set of resourcesthat enable companies to scale
(12:07):
faster, and that's the benefitof an ecosystem.
Jon Kidwell (12:11):
Yeah, it becomes a thing that starts to feed itself
, and what I heard you say isthat you put all these things
together, you guys start tofacilitate, but you are really
saying that, hey, part of thisis we also have to be proximate,
like we might have the bestintentions, but if we're not
actually around each other,doing work or life together,
(12:33):
we're not ever actually going todo it.
David Gow (12:36):
Well, I mean, I'll just highlight how hard
entrepreneurialism is.
The highs are really reallyhigh, the lows are really really
low, and for an entrepreneur tobe off in some remote office
somewhere doing this on his orher own is really really
challenging.
But to put that entrepreneur inan ecosystem of other
(12:58):
entrepreneurs, I think greatlyenhances the probability of
success.
Jon Kidwell (13:04):
Yeah, absolutely.
We start to seek other people,we start to run and be motivated
and behave like those that arewinning around us, where
sometimes we're our own worstenemy, sitting all alone, not
closing a deal and thinking thatthe world is about to end.
So, as you are in there and youhave these networks, you also
(13:26):
have extremely I wouldn't sayvolatile, but they're just very
responsive and connected to theeconomy and to kind of big wins
and maybe fast failures, frommedia to capital to again
building this ecosystem withproperty.
What have some of those ups anddowns look like?
David Gow (13:49):
Well, the easy one to describe is media in this sense
.
When we founded Dow Media, wewere solely a sports radio
station, and that was beforeTwitter even existed, and so we
were in the old media world.
And then along came Twitter andInstagram and all these other
platforms, and it's just amazingto see how media has sort of
(14:13):
fragmented and evolved over theyears.
I mean, here we are, you'recreating a media outlet and you
are going direct to the publicthrough your own work.
It used to be it wasn't thatlong ago, 15, 20 years ago that
if you really wanted to buildaudiences you had to be part of
a big entity, a broadcast entity.
(14:34):
But now there's been thisfragmenting and all these
changes and all these newplatforms where audiences have
gone, and so it's a radicallydifferent world, and I would say
that it is felt like ever sincewe started Gal Media, we were
always working to catch up to orget ahead of the next trend in
media.
(14:55):
So here's an illustration whenwe started, we were sports radio
only, but what we perceived isthat ad dollars and we were
dependent upon advertisingdollars for our business that ad
(15:19):
dollars were migrating out ofold media radio and into new
media, digital, and so it wasimperative for us to spread our
wings and get beyond just radio.
You know, interestingly,listenership didn't change that
much, according to Nielsenratings.
Our listenership was stillpretty rock solid and stable,
but the ad dollars weremigrating.
They love the accountability ofdigital and they love the shiny
new toy that was digital.
Jon Kidwell (15:37):
None of us ever liked shiny new toys?
No, no, never, never.
David Gow (15:41):
So we went out and bought our own shiny new toy,
which was CultureMap.
Culturemapcom had been aroundfor about 10 years by the time
we bought it.
It had built a large and loyalfollowing, but they were
struggling to monetize what theyhad built.
It was a standalone.
It needed to be part of agreater whole, and so to buy
CultureMap was a really goodmove for us, because then we
(16:03):
were positioned in front of allthose ad dollars coming to
digital and it gave us aplatform CultureMap did to
launch these other digitalcontent sites which we have
SportsMap, innovationmap and nowEnergy Capital HTX.
So it's been a good move for us, but it was one that was
required by all of theever-changing landscape in media
(16:24):
.
Jon Kidwell (16:25):
Yeah, how amazing because, as you said, that whole
space has changed and, like us,we have the podcast, which is
part of our media thing.
We also self-publish a book,all of which was not possible,
and you have steered and kind ofgone through that entire
exchange that I'm sure had atremendous amount of ups and
(16:47):
downs and having to sacrificewhat once worked for what may or
may not work.
David Gow (16:52):
Yes.
Jon Kidwell (16:53):
And just the exhilaration and the exhaustion
that comes with that.
David Gow (16:58):
Well, yes, it's been a bit of a roller coaster, and
never more so than when COVIDhit, I mean, when you step back
and think about it.
When COVID hit, a lot ofbusinesses were required to shut
down and so, of course, theyweren't going to spend any money
on marketing.
Why would a sports bar say, hey, come in and see us on Thursday
night football?
Because they weren't even open.
(17:19):
So everybody slashed theirmedia spend quite significantly.
I think our revenues were downaround 45 to 50 percent year
over year at the peak of theCOVID crisis, and that was a
real challenge because we had aninability to make money and we
(17:40):
had a lot of employees who wereon the payroll, people whom we
wanted to have around once wegot to a post COVID world.
But the question was could wekeep them to the post COVID
world?
Could we hold it all togetherduring that stretch?
And that was an extraordinarychallenge that required a whole
lot of effort and a lot ofconversations in the company.
Jon Kidwell (18:02):
Yeah, how did it play out for you all?
David Gow (18:07):
So I guess I'd say two or three things.
First is and I love this aboutthe team we had, but rather the
pitch was I went to them andsaid look, we're going to have
to cut costs by about 15 to 20percent and we could cast out 15
to 20 percent of our employees,or we could keep the employees.
(18:29):
Let's not cast them out into anuncertain job market in the
midst of COVID.
Let's not cast them out into anuncertain job market in the
midst of COVID.
Let's keep those employees andeveryone take a 15 to 20 percent
pay cut with the idea of sharedsacrifice, so that we would all
take a hit in the short term toenable us to keep the team
together and avoid castingpeople out into an uncertain job
(18:50):
market.
And so that was step one, andthen step two.
Of course we were fortunatemarket, and so that was step one
.
And then step two.
Of course we were fortunate, wewere able to get into the PPP
business.
The payroll protection plan thatthe government allotted and
those two steps some payrollreductions and the government
funding enabled us to navigatethrough that time.
But it was still a challengebecause, if you think about it,
(19:13):
when we wanted to bring theadvertisers back when they were
ready to open their doors again.
We had to sort of resell them.
It wasn't sort of hey, let'sjust roll your plan over to the
next year.
We had to reconvince them thatthis thing that they had done
previously was now going to be agood thing again, and it took
some time.
Thankfully, business is back.
We're above where we were in2019, pre-covid.
(19:35):
But it took some time.
It took well a couple of yearsto sort of build back the
business, brick by brick bybrick, and we finally got there.
Jon Kidwell (19:45):
I'm curious about your sacrifice and the
collective sacrifice and howthat kind of really solidified
that network at GOW and probably, like you see, in other places.
When there is this sharedsacrifice, organizations that we
work with, who kept people andmade sacrifices for that to
happen, are reporting higherretention way, different kind of
(20:10):
post-COVID employee engagement,everything and is it playing
out similar for you all?
David Gow (20:16):
It is.
We have great retention rates,we rarely lose people, and maybe
part of that is the way we wentthrough COVID the shared
sacrifice of the collectiveeffort to get through it.
I think part of it is we'refortunate to be in media.
I mean, everybody wants to bein media, right, in some way.
It's fun, it's exciting to betelling the stories of what's
(20:37):
going on across the city and so,yes, usually when we get people
into the realm of media, theywant to stick around unless
they're advancing onto a bigger,better platform.
We've had guys who were local,who've gone national, and that's
always a fun thing to see someof our people graduate that way.
But that's a good loss, right,a healthy loss.
(20:59):
It's a loss where somebody hasreally achieved something and we
can all take pride in theirgrowth.
Jon Kidwell (21:06):
So some of the things that I'm taking away is
just the power of building anetwork, both externally and
internally, that in, you know,casting the vision with this
greater mission than any of theday-to-day work and and really
including and inspiring folks togo that way.
If somebody is listening andthey're sitting there thinking,
oh my goodness, I feel all ofthe weight of that solo
(21:28):
responsibility.
There's nothing shared.
If I'm thinking, well, you,you're saying to ask people for
help or to try to build thatbridge, and I don't even have a
person, what's something thatyou would give them as advice or
encouragement?
David Gow (21:42):
to start, Well, I do believe that there's more help
out there than one mightnaturally think, and going to
business networking events, youcan stumble into lots of people
who are very useful, helpful andthoughtful.
I'm amazed at some people whowill reach out to me on LinkedIn
.
We don't really know each other, but they may be a friend of a
(22:09):
friend or there's some mutualconnection and they're just
asking for a cup of coffee, andI think it's hard to say no to
people who are just seeking helpand who are earnest about it
and trying to build a goodbusiness.
And I think there's more helpout there than people believe
instinctively, and so I wouldjust encourage everyone to reach
out, connect and find ways tobuild a network and build
(22:34):
trusted relationships and folkswho can be great thought
partners and maybe evenaccountability partners.
Jon Kidwell (22:41):
Yeah, and the way that you and I got connected to
do this podcast today wasthrough a mutual friend who is a
super connector.
A great collaborator said youall got to get together and talk
and, by the way, do this show,and so we were the benefit of
that as well.
And I'm about to ask you whatyou would say.
(23:02):
It is to lead well, but beforewe do, where would you send
anyone that's listening if theywant to learn more about
Galmedia, about the ecosystemdevelopment you're doing here in
Houston through the Canon andany of your other work?
Where should we send people?
David Gow (23:15):
You bet.
So our biggest website, galMedia, is culturemapcom and
there's something on culturemapfor everybody, which is one
reason I love that site, becausewe are covering food, fun,
lifestyle, travel, society, allkinds of arts.
It's amazing.
Culturemapcom is a wonderfulresource for the city and where
(23:36):
to go and what to do.
Pitchmapcom is a wonderfulresource for the city and where
to go and what to do.
In terms of leadership, thenumber one principle I keep
thinking about and trying toimplement well is speaking the
truth in love.
We have to have lots of hardconversations, but I think we
have a model for it.
It actually comes out of theBible Truth in love.
(23:56):
Lead with affirmation of thepeople, lead with your
connection to them, have arelationship with them, and from
that place, from that vantagepoint, there's an opportunity to
speak the truth.
Sometimes the hard truth aboutneeds, performance, development,
objectives, things that need tobe accomplished it all starts
(24:17):
with a relationship and that'sthe foundation that enables you
to speak the truth.
Jon Kidwell (24:20):
Yeah, Wow, thank you, david.
Would you consider that?
Your answer to what does itmean to you to lead well is
speak.
Truth in love, kind heart,truth with care and compassion.
David Gow (24:32):
Yes, that is my answer to that question, and
I'll give one illustration isthat unfortunately, it is often
the case we've had to let somepeople go for different windows
of time.
They just weren't a fit, andit's strange dynamic.
But often maybe this is true inmedia, but I think it's true in
a lot of places when youterminate somebody, when you
(24:54):
cast them out, when they'reready to go on to another job,
when you decided they're not afit at the company, there's
something in the company whereeverybody wants to say, well, he
or she was never really this,or he or she never did that.
Well, there's sort of acollective statement about that
person that's somewhat negative,and I think it's in part it's
the organization's collectivesense that they need to justify
(25:16):
why that person's gone, and sothey come up with these negative
reasons and what we try to dois separate the individual from
the decision to terminate them.
And the individual has greatworth.
We like that person.
No one we fired is anybody wedidn't like.
They're actually wonderfulpeople that are part of our
community, but they just weren'ta good fit, they weren't doing
(25:38):
the right job, or maybe we evenmiscast them, maybe it was our
fault.
But the point is is that whenwe're letting somebody go, we
really work hard internally tostill honor them as a person and
then, even after they're gone,we try to keep them in the fold.
We'll have company happy hours,we'll still invite them.
We want them to still feel likethey're still cared for and
(26:05):
important to us as individuals,even if they're not a part of
our organization anymore.
Jon Kidwell (26:09):
That is perhaps the most powerful example for all
of us to end on, because itprobably sits viscerally with so
many of us in terms of howpeople are let go.
So, for all that are listening,we can take David's example.
We can just try to internalizethat one thing outside of the
other myriad of things that hegave us today that are wonderful
(26:29):
us to go do Honor people afterthey're gone and remember the
humanity in it.
My friends, thank you so muchfor being here with David and I
today.
Be well, lead on and God bless.
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