March 25, 2025 • 46 mins
What You’ll Learn:
In this episode, hosts Patrick Adams, Catherine McDonald, and guest Vince Lanni, discuss the power of curiosity in business improvement. Vince, a restaurant consultant, emphasizes the importance of curiosity in problem-solving and team engagement.
About the Guest:
Vince helps bars and restaurants make more money, faster — guaranteed. After a successful career opening and improving some of the most prominent bars on Broadway in Nashville, he launched his consulting business to help even more people in the restaurant industry implement strategies that boost productivity and profit.
Links:
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Patrick Adams (00:04):
You are looking for the types of clients that
are willing to change, that areinterested in changing, curious
to change.
Vince Lanni (00:12):
I'm gonna continue to find solutions and learn with
you. That's the value is thatyou're not in this alone. I'm
I'm gonna help you get there.Like, we're gonna figure this
out. This is where curiosityplays such valuable, you know,
part in the arrangement.
Catherine McDonald (00:27):
The best way to develop ourselves is to
develop our mindset and ourskills to enable us to move
further up that continuum fromjudgment towards curiosity.
Vince Lanni (00:35):
We're all in this together, and we're finding
solutions together. We feel likemore of a team when there's that
kind of common goal. Curiosityis a great tool to have that
that you can really keep staystay engaged with your team, and
your team can stay engaged with,the goals of the company.
Patrick Adams (01:03):
Hello, and welcome to this episode of the
Lean Solutions Podcast led byyour host, Catherine McDonald
from Ireland and myself, PatrickAdams. How's it going,
Catherine?
Catherine McDonald (01:12):
I'm great, Patrick. Great. How are you?
Patrick Adams (01:14):
I'm doing amazing. I'm not sure when this
episode will air, but literallylast week from the point of this
recording last week, Wednesday,my daughter had her first baby
which means my first grandchild.So, I couldn't be I couldn't be
better than I am right now.
Catherine McDonald (01:34):
Oh, big smile on your face.
Congratulations. That's so you.All doing well.
Patrick Adams (01:38):
I appreciate it.
Catherine McDonald (01:39):
All doing well, I hope. Yeah.
Patrick Adams (01:40):
All doing well. Yes. All doing well. Healthy
baby boy. His name is Edmund.
Edmund Oak, TBoss. They're goingto call him Eddie. So, yeah.
Catherine McDonald (01:51):
Oh, that's
Patrick Adams (01:51):
about was pretty amazing to hold hold my
grandchild in my arms for thevery first time. Pretty awesome.
So Bit of a high
Catherine McDonald (02:00):
high for the next while, I'd say.
Patrick Adams (02:02):
Yes. Yeah. And they've they've actually lived
since the time they weremarried. They've lived outside
of the state. They've lived inMontana for about two years.
And so they moved home about ayear ago and which I'm obviously
thankful for. Now they're livinghere locally so it's nice.
Catherine McDonald (02:19):
Amazing. You'll see the baby grow up.
Lovely.
Patrick Adams (02:22):
Yes. He's a curious little guy and I say
that for two reasons. One,because, his his eyes are
everywhere just always wantingto know what's going on. Right?
But I I say it for a secondreason because of our topic for
the day.
So, good lead in here to ourtopic, the power of curiosity.
We're gonna be talking with ourguest Vince Lani from Nashville
(02:48):
and it's funny, Vince and I meteach other a while back. We'll
talk a little bit about thatonce we bring him onto the stage
here, but it's an interestingstory about how we met but I'm
interested to hear from himabout how he's applying
continuous improvement in therestaurant industry. So, yeah.
So, with that with withoutfurther ado, do you mind,
(03:11):
introducing Vince and we canbring him to the stage?
Catherine McDonald (03:13):
I will indeed. And I am, yeah, I'm
excited to hear what Vince hasto say. I used to work in the
hospitality sector for a goodmany years. So I'm really
interested to see how Vince hasapproached this. So let me
introduce Vince.
So Vince helps bars andrestaurants make more money
faster, guaranteed. After asuccessful career opening and
improving some of the mostprominent bars on Broadway in
(03:36):
Nashville, he launched hisconsulting business to help even
more people in the restaurantindustry implement strategies
that boost productivity andprofit. Welcome to the show,
Vince.
Vince Lanni (03:46):
Thanks for having me. It's great to be here. Good
to see you, Patrick.
Patrick Adams (03:49):
Yeah. Good to see you too, Vince. It's been a
little while, but I'm excited toto get back on with you here.
And you and I were together. Forthose of those of you that are
listening in that don't knowthis yet, because it hasn't been
made public, but Vince and Iwere actually on a reality TV
show together.
So I'm just gonna I'm gonnaleave it at that. Let your your
(04:11):
curiosity, know, is the
Vince Lanni (04:16):
topic of the day curiosity, right?
Patrick Adams (04:18):
That's right. So more to come on that. You will
hear more on the reality TV showthat Vince and I were on
together a few months back andit'll be coming out. Well, we
don't know sometime this summer,maybe in the fall. So more to
come on that.
But Vince and I had some reallygreat conversations while we
were together around the topicof continuous improvement
(04:41):
because that's all I think aboutand talk about. So Vince
probably got overwhelmed with myconversations. But in those
conversations, funny thing isfor many people, are using
continuous improvementprinciples and techniques in the
work that they do, but manytimes they don't even know it or
(05:03):
they don't call it that orthey've never made that
connection. And for Vince, Vinceis at the time when him and I
met was not familiar with theToyota Production System
manufacturing or processimprovement being applied. But
as we continue to haveconversations about the work
that he's doing in therestaurant industry in
(05:25):
Nashville, I was like, Vince,everything that you're doing
aligns exactly with the workthat we're doing, with our
clients.
And so obviously we hit it offand, and had some really, really
great conversations about,continuous improvement, you
know, in the restaurantindustry. So I'm excited to have
you on the show, Vince. It'sgreat to see you again.
Vince Lanni (05:47):
Thanks. Yeah, good to see you. I'm excited to be
here. And I do think a lot of itrelates. We were talking on the
show and getting to know eachother and it was really like, We
were there for self improvementanyway, really, at the end of
the not to give too much away,but entrepreneurs, self
improvement stuff.
That's something that I'vealways been trying to do,
(06:08):
whether personal life orbusiness, is always trying to
improve. There's always room toimprove. So how can we do that?
Patrick Adams (06:16):
That's right. That's the question. Yeah.
That's right. Go ahead,Katherine.
Catherine McDonald (06:20):
You guys competing? So, obviously, you
didn't fall out because, youknow, you're here today, Vince.
Were you were you competing, orwere you on the same team? Or
not to let's give way too ButI'm really We
Vince Lanni (06:28):
were compete we were competing. Not in the but
it's a very supportivecompetition. You know? It's not
like I can't think of a show tocompare it to, but not nothing
nothing crazy. We're notbackstabbing each other or
anything like that.
Patrick Adams (06:40):
Yeah. No no no backstabbing. It was more all
all the individuals that werethere were competing for, you
know, top three or whatever, topfive, top 10, whatever but it
was a self development show aswell. So your entrepreneurs,
business owners are going on tothe show and they're learning
(07:02):
how they can take thesedifferent techniques and apply
them to their business to beable to improve their business.
So, you know, again, Vince and Iwere kind of competing against
each other, but at the same timealso helping each other and
lifting each other up andsupporting each other through
the entire process, along withmany other amazing entrepreneurs
that we met while we were there.
(07:22):
So,
Catherine McDonald (07:23):
yeah. Sounds amazing. Definitely, definitely
keep us updated. I really wantto see this now. So, Vince, you
know that our topic today iscuriosity, and it is a great
topic.
It's not something we've broughtup too many times. I think even
though it pops into ourconversations every now and
then, it hasn't been our mainfocus. And I think it's great
that it is today because it'sjust so important. As we were
(07:45):
talking earlier, I mentionedthat I really think it's just a
cornerstone of a good way toimprove, effective way to
continuously improve. Andwithout it, I'm not sure we can.
So maybe you can give us yourthoughts, Vince, on the power of
curiosity and where it all fitsinto what you do in your work
with bars and the hospitalitysector?
Vince Lanni (08:08):
Yeah. For me, it's really I think of when I'm
curious about something. Right?Like, I'm engaged in it. I'm I
I'm I wanna know the answer.
I'm determined to find theanswer. I'm motivated to find
the answer, and I feel like I'mcontributing to something if I'm
curious and we're we're learningsomething together as a team or
(08:30):
we're trying to solve a problemor, you know, fix up find a
solution for something. I think,you know, curiosity is a great
tool to have that you can reallystay engaged with your team and
your team can stay engaged withthe goals of the company.
Patrick Adams (08:46):
Vince, when you go into work restaurant in the
Nashville area, how doescuriosity come into play when
you're talking? Just thinkpersonally, I think about some
of the companies that we go intowhere, I'll just give you the
other side of it, where I haveleaders who think they know it
all, And they don't have anyform of curiosity whatsoever.
(09:10):
They just like, they think thatthey have the right path. They
know what they want. They'reheading down a path.
And I think there can be somebenefits to that, right? To have
a strong leader that knows wherethey're going. But there's also,
I think, a downside to thatbecause without some level of
curiosity, are you 100% rightall the time? I mean, how many
(09:32):
leaders can say that, right? Sothere has to be some level of
curiosity where it's like, okay,we have certain problems that I
don't know how to solve.
And I need to be curious abouthow to get to the solution.
What's the right approach tothis? And what about my team
members and their level ofcuriosity and being able to
(09:54):
drive innovation from withinwhatever the things are that are
within their control? So guess,yeah, so back to the question,
how does curiosity play a rolewhen you go into a new
restaurant or a bar or somewherethat needs help with
improvement? How do you engagethe leaders or the team members
in some level of curiosity?
Vince Lanni (10:17):
Well, a couple of things with that. They have to
be already kind of I'm not goingto convince a leader that's set
in their ways to change. Somepeople aren't for me yet or I'm
not for them yet. They're notthere in that they want to
improve or that they see thatthe way they're doing it could
be better. Some people do thinkthat they're right 100% of the
(10:39):
time.
Some people still are like that.I'm looking for and finding,
being attracted to whatever youwant to call it, people that are
looking for that selfimprovement already and just
don't know exactly what to donext or don't know exactly where
to find it. This is where I cancome in and help bridge the gap
on all the trial and error. Isthe strategy that they're going
(11:02):
with going to work? Might, mightnot, might need a tweak.
Who knows? And for me as aconsultant for restaurants, I
love this topic. I think this isa great overview kind of what I
do because I'm not just going toshare what I know. Going to I am
curious about their business.I'm curious about their
problems.
I'm curious about solving them.I am genuinely interested in
(11:24):
solving the problems and helpingthem find solutions. I think
that part kind of separates mefrom other restaurant
consultants who will just kindof give them a course, give them
homework to do and share whatthey know. What I say is I don't
know it all. I'm going tocontinue to find solutions and
learn with you, but that's thevalue is that you're not in this
(11:46):
alone.
I'm going to help you get there.We're going to figure this out.
This is where curiosity playssuch a valuable part in the
arrangement.
Patrick Adams (11:55):
I love that. Two things that I heard there that I
think are important to repeat.One is you're not you you are
looking for the types of clientsthat are willing to change, that
are interested in changing,curious to change, where, you
know, those those, restaurantowners that are set in their
(12:18):
ways and don't think they needto improve or don't think they
have problems, that's probablynot the right client for you,
right? Mean, I think, Katherine,I think that's the same for us
too. I mean, it's unfortunately,there's been times where I've
landed at companies where thathappens and I didn't realize it
until it was too late.
(12:39):
But to your point, Vince, Iwould rather not work with
companies where that's thefeeling of leadership. They're
just not ready for change.
Vince Lanni (12:51):
Now, do they have like a lot to benefit from being
ready to that and open to that?Yeah, sure. But if they're not
there yet, I mean, you reallycan't beat them down with all
the information on why that's abetter way to do it. They kind
of have to get there themselves.People don't change until it's
kind of staying the same is alittle more damaging than the
(13:11):
change is.
Catherine McDonald (13:14):
Yeah. Yeah, it is a good point. And I see
it, and I suppose I would be thesame. It's very hard to work
with somebody who's on a totallydifferent mindset to you. Often
what I've seen when it comes tocuriosity, there are a few
people who talk about this, thatcuriosity occurs sort of on a
continuum, where on the farleft, you've got judgment on the
(13:35):
far right, you've got curiosity.
Vince Lanni (13:38):
And
Catherine McDonald (13:38):
I've heard people speak about the fact that
we're human and we all have alittle bit of judgment in us.
But we will I guess the best wayto develop ourselves is to
develop our mindset and ourskills to enable us to move
further up that continuum fromjudgment towards curiosity. And
sometimes when we go into anorganization, what I found and I
(13:59):
don't know if you found this,Vince, is that there's an awful
lot of blame going on. There's areal lack of curiosity. There's
just quick judgments going on,and that's leading to obviously
a lot of conflict and teamissues.
And oftentimes those are theorganizations that need
consultant most. They need anexternal person to come in to
help them see and understandwhat's happening and to help
(14:20):
them understand their ownmindset and maybe skill gaps and
work on them with them. But asyou say, they have to be open to
all of understanding that theyneed to develop. So I totally
get what you're saying there. Idon't know, have you ever been
in that situation where you goin to help an organisation and
you see this kind of practice isgoing on and you can step in and
(14:43):
help them with that?
Vince Lanni (14:44):
Well, one thing you touched on is the blame game
kind of thing. And I think thatthat's super important because
when we're trying to solveproblems together, that kind of
brings us all together in acommunity. So this is where that
curiosity really plays a valuein the culture of not playing
the blame game. We're all inthis together and we're finding
(15:06):
solutions together. We feel likemore of a team when there's that
kind of common goal.
But to answer your question, Itypically don't get that far. So
if the owner is interested inthey're going to make the
decision to hire me or If theowner is interested in the self
improvement stuff, and maybehe's got a couple of leaders on
the team that are stuck in theirways, they don't think they need
(15:28):
to improve, whatever. I haven'tgotten that yet, but I don't
think that that's outside of therealm of possibility by any
means. I can totally see thathappening. Typically, I'll get
that from the owner right offthe bat.
And it'll kind of end the movingforward and working together
(15:50):
thing before I even get to theteam because the owner is just
set in a ways and they don't seethe value. But they're like, I
make a ton of money. I'm good.I'm like, You are. Yeah, you
make millions of dollars withthis bar or restaurant, right?
You could make an extra halfmillion a year probably if you
did. Is that of interest to you?Some people don't really see the
value in a lot of this and somepeople do and they're open to
(16:12):
this kind of self improvementcuriosity type thing.
Patrick Adams (16:16):
So let's back up a little bit based on what you
just said, because I'm surethere are people that would be
interested to hear your approachwhen you go into a new
restaurant or bar. I'm sure it'sdifferent depending on the size
or the, again, whether it's abar or restaurant. But when I
think about the kind of workthat you do, I think about the
(16:37):
TV show, is it called BarRescue? Yeah. Is that kind of
similar?
I mean, that's probably elevatedfor TV, you know, but, you know,
I guess I'm asking you, what isyour approach? Like, what does
it look like when you have arestaurant owner that says,
Vince, we'd love to have youcome in and work with us? Where
(16:57):
do you start? What do you do?
Vince Lanni (16:59):
Well, first off, that show, I always hated that
comparison. And because the guyis such an asshole on the show.
Patrick Adams (17:06):
He is.
Vince Lanni (17:07):
He is. And I'm just like, oh, I'm not like that. I'm
a nice guy. Like, I'm here tohelp. And I'm also not going to
invest a ton of money into therenovations like they do on the
show because they got all themoney and the sponsors.
But then I kind of retrained mymind on that self improvement
and thought, well, at leastthat's something people know
(17:27):
about and can relate to kind ofwhat I do, so let's go from
there. So to answer yourquestion, I do that a bit, but
my first step is to find notonly the money that it costs to
hire me, but a lot more thanthat. So we're going to look
through their order guides,we're going do an inventory
audit, look through their vendorpricing, and find the best
(17:48):
pricing for them. A client Iworked with recently, they're on
track to save over 100,000 in,2025 based on this. Like, we
just went through, looked ateverything, took a couple months
to negotiate some pricing.
I have a network of resourcesand vendors here in Nashville
that I have connections with. Sokind of setting them up with
different options for POSsystems or linen services, stuff
(18:12):
like that and and the food isthe big one. You know, food
prices are always fluctuating.When you're trying to shop
around for prices, you don't getthe best prices. So, we have
some strategies that that makesure that we're finding you the
best prices available for yourrestaurant, and the savings are
incredible.
And then they think, wow, I'vejust been ordering this from
(18:32):
this company for so long. I'mlike, yeah, now what are you
going to do with that $100,000This is where step two comes in
now. Step two is what do we dowith it? Do you want to do
marketing spend? Do you need tohire another manager, focus on
leadership development, get somemore support in there on your
leadership team so you can domore work on the business and
(18:53):
not be so into the day to day asan owner?
Or maybe there's some incentiveprograms that you've wanted to
do for your leadership team thatjust haven't been in the budget.
Well, you don't even have to digit out of the current budget.
We're going to find you thatmoney. So that's the big step
one. And then steps two andthree are are, you know, just
kind of trying to find ways toimprove staff retention and
(19:20):
guest retention.
So, staff training, morale,leadership development, all
kinds of self improvementpractices, and we're gonna talk
more on curiosity and all thatstuff coming up on how it
applies. And then, yeah, someother, you know, guest retention
practices that I've done throughmy time to help other
restaurants.
Patrick Adams (19:39):
Okay. So that all makes a ton of sense. And I'm
sure I have to imagine thatmaybe it's not the case, but
restaurants and bars probablyhave a high turnover rate when
it comes to their employees, Iwould guess. So some of the work
that you're talking about thatyou do maybe would help increase
some of that retention and helpkeep people around longer, which
(20:02):
obviously is a huge expense forowners to have to retrain and
we'll go find and then retrainpeople. What about systems?
Like, do you work? Do you do alot of work on the back end
system side of things like theprocesses that they follow in
order to order the supplies thatthey need or to the process of
(20:25):
inputting orders into the systemor whatever it might be. You do
some work on that?
Vince Lanni (20:30):
Yeah. A little bit. We can do some people don't have
a great inventory trackingsystem. We can help there. Sales
forecasting and budgeting fororders weekly.
Okay. So you're ordering basedon what your expected sales are
instead of just bringing it upto par. You know? Okay. Only
order what you need.
Like, let's let's keep it lean.You know? Yeah. Yeah. So we we
(20:52):
have some tools, and we'll helpthem with that as well.
And then also just, yeah, as faras systems, systems in the non,
like, tech way or somethingmight be workflow of the servers
and the bartenders and the barbacks and making that a more
efficient process.
Patrick Adams (21:11):
Gotcha. Okay.
Vince Lanni (21:12):
Good. Really varies from different place.
Patrick Adams (21:14):
Right, I figured that. So thank you for that. I
wanted to take a couple of stepsback just because there's a lot
of people that are listeningright now who probably maybe
have never watched any processimprovement or continuous
improvement tools being appliedto restaurants or to bars. So
it's just kind of nice to knowyour high level approach.
Catherine McDonald (21:38):
Yeah. And seems to me that really the key
is to ask questions. It's reallyas simple as that. You know,
we're talking about going intoorganizations and understanding
what's happening. And the onlyway to understand is, well, two
things go to as we call it theGEMBA in Lean events.
That's the word that supposeLean practitioners would use, go
to GEMBA, see what's happening.But that's essentially what
(22:00):
you're talking about. Go in, seewhat's happening, observe the
work and ask questions. Itreally does come down to doing
that really, really well. Right?
Vince Lanni (22:09):
Yeah. Absolutely. And, I mean, like, some of the
best ideas come from the thefrontline people too. So keeping
them curious and letting themknow that, like, you're open to
their suggestions.
Patrick Adams (22:20):
Absolutely. I loved the other thing I said
earlier. I said I had two pointsand I don't want to miss that
second point because the otherthing that you said earlier was
you said that not only are youlooking for ways to help
generate curiosity within thecompanies that you're working
with, But you said you approachthem with curiosity and that you
(22:42):
don't have to have all theanswers. And I think, again,
that's probably the mostimportant thing that helped me
be more confident. You know,when I'm going into all these
different companies that aremaybe in different industries,
maybe different parts of theworld, they don't even speak
English potentially, but I canbe confident knowing I don't
have to know everything abouttheir process.
(23:04):
I don't have to know everythingabout what they do. I just have
to be curious. Catherine, toyour point, ask the right
questions because they're theexperts. They know their
process. They know the work thatthey're doing.
Now, yes, there could be someinefficient processes. There
could be some wastefulactivities that are happening,
(23:24):
but asking the right questionswill help bring some of that to
the surface. Would you agree,Vince?
Vince Lanni (23:31):
Yeah, absolutely. Definitely the key to confidence
really is not that you know itall, but that you can solve
you'll figure it out. You know?That's really confidence at the
end of the day is knowing thatbecause I'm not arrogant. I'm
not going to sit there and say,I know everything and that I can
solve any problem.
(23:51):
That's crazy. No one knowseverything. But I'm confident
that whatever the problem is,I'll figure it out. I've
probably seen something similaror I've seen enough that I know
that I'm building thatconfidence by this happened. I
didn't know how to handle it,but I solved it.
The next thing happens. Youdon't know how to handle it, but
you solve it. And this is justgrowth and self improvement. As
(24:12):
you continue to do that throughyour life and career, you
develop that confidence that nomatter what happens, I'll figure
it out.
Patrick Adams (24:20):
And that leads me into my next question,
specifically around problemsolving and continuous
improvement. So for youpersonally, do you have any
stories or maybe your approachto how or why curiosity is so
critical when being applied toproblem solving or to continuous
(24:42):
improvement? Any specificstories or just how use that
curiosity piece to really createsome good problem solving
solutions?
Vince Lanni (24:56):
Yeah, I like puzzles. And it's really like a
game or a puzzle when there'swhen there's something going on.
And I had an employee that Iworked with who every bar that I
would go into, I'm the problemsolver. And I don't know. It's
probably just because of this,you know, take on curiosity and
and confidence in problemsolving.
But I came into this place andhe was the guy. He was the
(25:18):
problem solver. Things wouldbreak. I don't know how to fix
this, but the POS systems areshut down at midnight and we got
100,000 people in there. We'recompeting against each other in
a fun way to try and solve theproblem first.
That made us a little moreefficient in doing it. The staff
(25:39):
would get a kick out of itbecause they'd be like, Oh,
who's going to win, VinceCurtis? Who's going to win this
time? Kind of thing. Then also,this is the other important
thing, too.
When you make it like a game orlike a puzzle and you don't
treat it so seriously, you'renot so frantic about it, the
staff feels that they're waymore confident, they're way more
(26:00):
comfortable, they know that it'sgoing to get taken care of,
they're not going to freak out,the guests are still going to
have a good experience becausethe team's not freaking out
because you're not freaking out.That's what I think really plays
a big role in it.
Catherine McDonald (26:14):
And what about Vince? So you go in,
you're a great problem solver.You're an external person coming
in to help this organization.They're delighted to have your
help. You have excellent problemsolving skills.
But how do you help them tobecome better problem solvers so
they don't become reliant onyou?
Vince Lanni (26:29):
That's the big thing, teaching them how to do
it. So ask them questions. Ifthey have a solution or a
potential solution, say, Okay,does this solution solve the
problem the way you want it to?And then make them answer that.
Does it?
Is this going to have the resultthat you're looking for? Or are
you just throwing stuff at thewall? And it's Okay if you are,
(26:50):
but let's dive in and figure itout. And if they really do think
that it's going to work, thenthey can try it. And if it
doesn't work or if it does workor maybe there's a hiccup along
the way, we're going to gothrough more of the why on why
that happened and how they thinkthat could be more efficient in
the future.
(27:11):
Yeah, really getting them tothink ahead on, Okay, does this
actually solve the problem? Oris this just something that I
feel like I need to do now?
Catherine McDonald (27:21):
Yeah, that's really good. Because obviously,
we know that critical thinkingskills are on a decline in a lot
of organizations. There are alot of reasons why that could
be. But we know that engagingfrontline staff and workers in
this kind of problem solving andinnovation and giving them
ownership of issues andinvolving them every step we
(27:43):
know that works. So it's greatto hear that that's your
approach.
And I suppose I had anotherquestion because having worked
in bars and restaurants, I knowhow busy they can be. And I
think this applies not just tobars and restaurants, but to
lots of other service sectororganizations where the actually
the frontline staff are so busy,they don't really have a lot of
time to stop and think they'reall go, go, go, do, do, do. But
(28:06):
we know that as consultants inthis kind of trade where we go
in to try and helporganizations, that they do need
to take a step back in order tothink and to see how to improve
and to take that ownership. Sohow do you do that, Vince? How
do you go into these really busyplaces and convince management,
first of all, to let you go inand spend the time with people?
(28:29):
And then I suppose, secondly,make the most of that time
because they have to get back towork?
Patrick Adams (28:35):
That's a good question.
Vince Lanni (28:36):
It is a good question. And the main thing
that I want to do is to definewho works for who. In my
opinion, and what I've had themost success in, is that the
leadership team, the managers,they work for the team. So if
they're too busy running around,why don't they have time to
think and come up with asolution? Why are they so busy?
(28:58):
You need to go in and help them.I think that's the first step is
to really define your role as aleader. And that's you work for
your team, they don't work foryou.
Catherine McDonald (29:09):
Real story.
Patrick Adams (29:09):
It's an important point. Yeah. Yeah, that's an
important point. You'd besurprised how many leaders don't
understand the power of justbeing the person that's in the
back, not in the forefront, butin the back that's helping to
remove those roadblocks and settheir team up for success. I
mean, those are the leaders thatfind the most success hands
(29:31):
down.
You know, they understand thevalue. Go ahead.
Vince Lanni (29:34):
Think of it this way. I mean, we're in the
service industry. We call it thebar and restaurant, like we're
in service of the guests. Thefrontline workers are in service
of the guests, but as a leader,who are you in service of?
You're in service of your team.
Patrick Adams (29:46):
Right. Right. So true. Now I want to go back to
the question though, I want todig a little bit deeper on this
because I think not just in thehospitality industry, but in
many of manufacturing andhealthcare, we find ourselves so
busy that sometimes we feel likewe don't have time for self
(30:07):
development or we don't havetime to challenge existing
processes or we don't have timeto improve this or that. How do
you get around that Vince?
What do you what do you do? Doyou do you you recommend that
they block time forimprovements? Do you pull them
off their work? Do you do itoutside of regular business
(30:28):
hours? I mean, what how do youdo it?
Vince Lanni (30:30):
Yeah, that that's a great question, Patrick. I I
think you have kids, you'llunderstand this. If you can't,
if you don't have time to have acatch with your kid, did you not
have time or did you not maketime? And when you think of it
like that, you're you're you'reyou're yet like and then that
would make you feel pretty bad.You know, if I, oh, I didn't
(30:51):
make time for that.
Like, I didn't prioritize this.So, take that to managing a bar
restaurant. Do you notprioritize the well-being of
your team? Do you not prioritizeincreasing sales and your
bonuses and all that stuff?Everyone's going be like, no, I
do.
I do. Well, then why aren't Soyes to time blocking. I love
(31:13):
time blocking.
Catherine McDonald (31:14):
And it doesn't have to be complex
either, right? I mean, thirtyminutes before a shift or at the
end of a shift can be added andtaken back by people. I think
what we have to ask for here isflexibility from people, from
management, but also fromeverybody,
Vince Lanni (31:30):
from
Catherine McDonald (31:30):
the entire staff team if we want to do
this. It's going to takeflexibility. Would you agree?
Vince Lanni (31:36):
Flexibility is it's a bonus in the industry that you
have flexibility. That's a greatpro of the industry. Use that
valuable tool. Use that as aresource because you don't have
to go in and do the same thingall day. You have those ups and
downs in business, right?
Like you get the lunch pop andyou die down a little bit before
(31:58):
dinner and you get busy atdinner. It depends on the
restaurant you're in. Buttypically, there's these ups and
downs and busy times in therestaurant where you might have
some time to sneak away or sometime to huddle up the team and
be like, cool, we got our asseskicked there. What do you think
we could have done? And I'vedone this as a new manager or a
consulting company.
I'm like, what could I have donein that scenario that would help
(32:21):
you get through that shifteasier? Finding that little
time, making time for that stuffis so important. So I use some
tools, I guess you could callthem templates, that are to keep
topics on top of mind of how amI going to help my team today
and how am I going to increasesales? And keeping those two
questions always at theforefront, ask myself before the
(32:43):
shift, write it down, check-inmidway through the shift, have I
done that yet? If not, let memake that a priority moving
forward through the rest of theshift, and then a recap at the
end.
That sounds like it's a lot ofextra stuff, but it's really
not. If you think about how longit takes you to answer two
little questions, a minute, thenyou review it halfway through
the shift, it takes anotherminute or two, and Then you do
(33:05):
it at the end of the shift.We're talking five minutes here
to make such a big impact. Soit's not that they don't have
time, it's that they're notmaking the time and they're not
using their time efficiently.
Patrick Adams (33:16):
Right. Yeah. For us in the lean world, we use a
tool called leader standardwork. And it's really a lot of
what you're talking about whereprioritizing is important
because busyness is going tocome. When you show up to work
in a restaurant, in a bar, orfor any listeners, work whatever
(33:37):
work that you're in, you showup, you don't have to have a
plan for the day if you don'twant to, and you're you'll be
busy.
And by the end of the day,you'll feel like you did a lot.
But then if you stop and thinkabout, okay, what did I actually
accomplish today? What are theone or two things that I got
done today? A lot of times, ifyou don't have a plan, if you
(33:59):
don't prioritize, you get to theend of the day and you're like,
I mean, I feel like I was busyall day, but what did I actually
get done? Versus I'm going to doone on ones with my frontline
team leaders today.
I'm going to get two of thosedone. I'm going to walk the, we
would say, Gemba, but I'm goingto walk the floor and I'm going
(34:20):
to look for opportunities forimprovement. I'm going to find
at least one opportunity forimprovement today. And I'm going
to dive into the financialsmaybe, and I'm going to look for
one opportunity to make animprovement today. So I'm going
to do those four things today.
I'm prioritizing those. Thoseare part of my standard work for
the day. So now at the end ofthe day, you're still going to
(34:41):
be busy all day. But at the endof the day, now you can look
back and go check, check, check,check. I was able to complete
those four things.
Vince Lanni (34:50):
Right. And it's a difference. Are you busy or are
you productive? Mean, there'ssuch a difference. I always
think that busy is a feeling.
It's how you feel. You feelbusy. But you're not necessarily
any amount of productive justbecause you feel busy. You have
a lot to do or you're doing alot. But like you said, are you
(35:13):
actually doing a lot or is itjust kind of running in circles?
Catherine McDonald (35:17):
I actually think that sometimes these
service sectors, they arewithout knowing it solely
without even trying a lot of thetime. Okay, sometimes they're
not and there's issues, but theyhave to be so lean.
Vince Lanni (35:29):
That's true.
Catherine McDonald (35:30):
They have no choice but to be lean because
they're customer facing. Thecustomer sees everything. So
they have to the voice of thecustomer comes first. They get
the voice of the customer soquickly and easily compared to
sectors that are not customerfacing. And so I've worked in
the hotel sector and I've workedin nonprofits.
And there's a similarity there,really. And I know you don't
(35:52):
technically use the word lean,Vince, but I suppose what have
you seen in terms of bars andrestaurants to maybe prove that
point? What are they doing thatis actually really efficient?
What can they teach othersectors, do you think?
Vince Lanni (36:08):
Yeah, there's a lot of those intangible metrics in a
bar and restaurant, right? Sowe're talking ticket time You
can't track Some things, youlook at the sales, that's like a
clear metric. You look at timeof day and all that stuff.
That's like on paper in thecomputer, you have that. But how
many times is your serverrunning back to the kitchen to
(36:31):
grab a side of ranch that theyforgot with the order?
How much time does that take?How much time are people waiting
to be seated or waiting for adrink at the bar? These are
things that you can't get byrunning a report on your
business. These are things thatyou need to watch, track in your
head, make notes if you to writethem down through the shift, go
ahead. But these are all thelittle things and so much more
(36:53):
that you have to be on top of.
And these are the things thatreally matter. To your point,
you get that information rightthen and there, you can make
changes and improvements. Itdoesn't even have to be at the
end of the shift. You can do iton the fly. You can jump in and
be in service to your team andhelp out to improve any of those
metrics that are failing.
(37:15):
And then you can take it to dorefresh topics or a little more
training or a little morefollow-up with some people to
improve those over the nextweek. But it's definitely a
quicker information gatheringprocess and being able to
improve it a lot faster.
Patrick Adams (37:33):
Love that. I didn't really think about that
until you said it, Kathryn, it'sso true. I mean, for many
organizations, customers, theynever meet the customer or most
people don't. The customerplaces an order and you're
fulfilling that order throughthis long value stream. But for
(37:54):
you guys, Vince, I mean, thecustomer's standing right there
and they're like, I need adrink.
How long does it take? You canhave
Vince Lanni (38:02):
facial expressions, the body language, all of it.
Patrick Adams (38:05):
Right. That's really interesting. We maybe we
should bring a group down and dodo our own, little gemba, waste
activity, that'd be pretty cool.Some guys that work with you.
Vince Lanni (38:18):
That'd be awesome.
Patrick Adams (38:20):
So we've talked about a lot of things in a short
amount of time, but if you couldsum up, you know, maybe some
practical strategies for anyonethat's listening for integrating
curiosity into their dailypractices or integrating their
curiosity into how they makedecisions or how they improve
(38:45):
processes. What would be acouple of things that you would
say, these are just a couple ofpractical strategies that you
should follow?
Vince Lanni (38:53):
I mean, think first, number one is lose the
ego. You don't know it all andbe open. Be curious. Number two
is I I I if I if I'm, like,bringing up the idea on
something, like, something Iwanna change or an, you know, an
idea for improvement, of course,I think it's a great idea. It's
my idea.
But I want the team practice,this is the practical part,
(39:15):
right? Tell the team to pokeholes in it for you, whether
that's your other leadershipteam or your front of house
team, whatever it is. Have thempoke holes in it because that's
going to give you some feed, youknow, the feedback that you need
to really make it a great planor a great improvement moving
forward and you don't have todouble back and kind of fix
things as you go because itdidn't work the way you thought
(39:38):
it was going to. Like, there'sso much value in in the team and
their opinions. Make them feellike their opinions matter and
that you they can always come toyou with cool ideas or or any
any type of improvement options.
Like, your door is always open.Kinda have that practice that
culture of we're always lookingto improve. I'm not going to
(39:58):
always have the best ideas.Y'all might have the best ideas
and if they are great, give themcredit. If they're not great,
you take the credit and you tryto help them make em better.
You know, people will come to meand say, whatever it is and I'm
like, Here's why I don't thinkit'll work. And then sometimes
(40:20):
it just won't work. Or sometimesthey'll come back to me a week
later and a bartender will comeback and be like, Okay, you said
it wouldn't work because ofthis, but what if we did this
that solves that problem? I'mlike, Okay, cool. Let's try it.
Right?
Catherine McDonald (40:34):
Yeah. So what you're saying is what
you're saying is organizationalimprovement really does start
with individual self improvementand developing those like
humility and the skills ofcuriosity. That's kind of what
I'm getting from you, Vince.
Vince Lanni (40:47):
Yeah, absolutely. And and from top to bottom of
the organization that it's okayto question what you've been
doing forever there, and it'sokay to question new ideas no
matter who they come from,whether they come from the owner
or it's okay to question them.
Patrick Adams (41:03):
Vince, one last question from me, and then I
don't know if Catherine has onemore. But just if you were to
think about all the differentbars, restaurants, owners that
you've worked with, you don'thave to say names here, but who
would be or what would theorganization be that maybe you
(41:26):
would say was the best customeror I guess the best improvement
activities that happened withthem would be like your
highlight, maybe just a littlestory about them. And then the
opposite side of that, yourbiggest challenge and what did
that look like?
Vince Lanni (41:44):
Yeah. Biggest challenge first is I can't do it
all. I'm just kind of givingthem I'm helping them. But at
the end of the day, they had toexecute. And sometimes I put a
lot of faith into that they canexecute what we've talked about
doing, and they don't always dothat.
(42:06):
And that's kind of the risk youtake as a consultant on are
they? They're going blame me nowbecause it didn't work, but they
didn't actually do it, right?Kind of thing. So I have worked
with a client like that before.And then a success story is a
place called Greenery Co.
That I work with, and they arereally open to it. I mean, they
(42:32):
knew what they needed. They knewtheir weaknesses, I guess, and
they were very clear and veryopen about that. They very much
wanted to improve, and they'reso willing to try new things.
And that's really theircuriosity and their willingness
to improve is why they've savedover $100 for this year.
(42:54):
And they're on track to increasesales by 10% to 15% for 2025.
Patrick Adams (43:01):
That's amazing. Yeah. The story, the initial,
the challenge too, as far asthat one goes, I mean, that's a
tough one. And I think even formany who are listening in, a
coach internally, I think theycan resonate, even if they're
not a consultant or runningtheir own business, just even as
(43:24):
an internal coach. A lot ofthese concepts that we're
talking about, they definitelymatter for sure.
So Catherine, last question foryou.
Catherine McDonald (43:35):
Yeah, I just I had something in my mind there
about curiosity. So I think it'sa skill we lose over time. We
start out really, reallycurious. Patrick, you said about
your new little grandchild andhow curious children are. And as
we grow up and get older, wedefinitely, definitely lose
those skills.
(43:56):
And I'm just wondering, Vince,because obviously you see the
value in curiosity. You rolemodel it with every organization
you go into, and it's somethingyou try to develop in your team.
How do you think, Vince, we can,I suppose, promote the power of
curiosity in people? How can weget the people we work with to
(44:18):
work on that skill and to bemore curious? What do you think?
Vince Lanni (44:23):
I think it's more of like the human vulnerability
of it's Okay to not know it all.And especially from an owner
standpoint or a leader that islooked to for answers and feels
like they should know it all andthey need to have this kind of
tough exterior like it doesn'tneed to be like that, you know?
I think leadership years ago wasalways about strength and a lot
(44:47):
of that still carries over andlike you said, as we get older,
like, that's definitely,something we'd pride ourselves
on. But leadership really isit's kind of changed with the
tech era to turn into brains alittle bit more. And then now I
feel like, as we're talkingabout self improvement and
curiosity, heart is the bigthing in leadership.
(45:09):
So I I I think being willing toopen yourself up to the new
experiences and to beingvulnerable and admitting that
you don't know it all, buthaving that same strength and
confidence and brainpower toknow that you can figure it out.
Catherine McDonald (45:24):
Yeah. Yeah. I guess what leaders role
modeling that every day, it itrubs off.
Vince Lanni (45:30):
Yeah. And if they're okay to ask questions,
then their team's gonna feelcomfortable to ask questions
too. That's what we want. Ifthey don't know something, we
wanna make sure that they havethis information so they can do
a better job. And also, theymight have a question that
prompts a really innovativechange that helps the company
too.
Patrick Adams (45:52):
Yeah. So true. Vince, the last thing I'm gonna
ask as we close here witheveryone listening in, the next
time that Catherine and I are inNashville, will you bring us to
your favorite pub?
Vince Lanni (46:06):
Absolutely. Oh, yeah. Yay.
Patrick Adams (46:09):
Alright. Good. I'm glad. I'm looking forward to
that. We definitely wanna getdown there and and see you.
And, yeah, we we, we're excitedto to have you on and appreciate
all your insight. I know ourlisteners definitely will take
value from this episode and justappreciate you coming on.
Vince Lanni (46:26):
Absolutely. Yeah. I hope there was some value there
for everyone listening and Iappreciate your time and it's
great to see you again.
You are looking for the types of clients that
are willing to change, that areinterested in changing, curious
to change.
Vince Lanni (00:12):
I'm gonna continue to find solutions and learn with
you. That's the value is thatyou're not in this alone. I'm
I'm gonna help you get there.Like, we're gonna figure this
out. This is where curiosityplays such valuable, you know,
part in the arrangement.
Catherine McDonald (00:27):
The best way to develop ourselves is to
develop our mindset and ourskills to enable us to move
further up that continuum fromjudgment towards curiosity.
Vince Lanni (00:35):
We're all in this together, and we're finding
solutions together. We feel likemore of a team when there's that
kind of common goal. Curiosityis a great tool to have that
that you can really keep staystay engaged with your team, and
your team can stay engaged with,the goals of the company.
Patrick Adams (01:03):
Hello, and welcome to this episode of the
Lean Solutions Podcast led byyour host, Catherine McDonald
from Ireland and myself, PatrickAdams. How's it going,
Catherine?
Catherine McDonald (01:12):
I'm great, Patrick. Great. How are you?
Patrick Adams (01:14):
I'm doing amazing. I'm not sure when this
episode will air, but literallylast week from the point of this
recording last week, Wednesday,my daughter had her first baby
which means my first grandchild.So, I couldn't be I couldn't be
better than I am right now.
Catherine McDonald (01:34):
Oh, big smile on your face.
Congratulations. That's so you.All doing well.
Patrick Adams (01:38):
I appreciate it.
Catherine McDonald (01:39):
All doing well, I hope. Yeah.
Patrick Adams (01:40):
All doing well. Yes. All doing well. Healthy
baby boy. His name is Edmund.
Edmund Oak, TBoss. They're goingto call him Eddie. So, yeah.
Catherine McDonald (01:51):
Oh, that's
Patrick Adams (01:51):
about was pretty amazing to hold hold my
grandchild in my arms for thevery first time. Pretty awesome.
So Bit of a high
Catherine McDonald (02:00):
high for the next while, I'd say.
Patrick Adams (02:02):
Yes. Yeah. And they've they've actually lived
since the time they weremarried. They've lived outside
of the state. They've lived inMontana for about two years.
And so they moved home about ayear ago and which I'm obviously
thankful for. Now they're livinghere locally so it's nice.
Catherine McDonald (02:19):
Amazing. You'll see the baby grow up.
Lovely.
Patrick Adams (02:22):
Yes. He's a curious little guy and I say
that for two reasons. One,because, his his eyes are
everywhere just always wantingto know what's going on. Right?
But I I say it for a secondreason because of our topic for
the day.
So, good lead in here to ourtopic, the power of curiosity.
We're gonna be talking with ourguest Vince Lani from Nashville
(02:48):
and it's funny, Vince and I meteach other a while back. We'll
talk a little bit about thatonce we bring him onto the stage
here, but it's an interestingstory about how we met but I'm
interested to hear from himabout how he's applying
continuous improvement in therestaurant industry. So, yeah.
So, with that with withoutfurther ado, do you mind,
(03:11):
introducing Vince and we canbring him to the stage?
Catherine McDonald (03:13):
I will indeed. And I am, yeah, I'm
excited to hear what Vince hasto say. I used to work in the
hospitality sector for a goodmany years. So I'm really
interested to see how Vince hasapproached this. So let me
introduce Vince.
So Vince helps bars andrestaurants make more money
faster, guaranteed. After asuccessful career opening and
improving some of the mostprominent bars on Broadway in
(03:36):
Nashville, he launched hisconsulting business to help even
more people in the restaurantindustry implement strategies
that boost productivity andprofit. Welcome to the show,
Vince.
Vince Lanni (03:46):
Thanks for having me. It's great to be here. Good
to see you, Patrick.
Patrick Adams (03:49):
Yeah. Good to see you too, Vince. It's been a
little while, but I'm excited toto get back on with you here.
And you and I were together. Forthose of those of you that are
listening in that don't knowthis yet, because it hasn't been
made public, but Vince and Iwere actually on a reality TV
show together.
So I'm just gonna I'm gonnaleave it at that. Let your your
(04:11):
curiosity, know, is the
Vince Lanni (04:16):
topic of the day curiosity, right?
Patrick Adams (04:18):
That's right. So more to come on that. You will
hear more on the reality TV showthat Vince and I were on
together a few months back andit'll be coming out. Well, we
don't know sometime this summer,maybe in the fall. So more to
come on that.
But Vince and I had some reallygreat conversations while we
were together around the topicof continuous improvement
(04:41):
because that's all I think aboutand talk about. So Vince
probably got overwhelmed with myconversations. But in those
conversations, funny thing isfor many people, are using
continuous improvementprinciples and techniques in the
work that they do, but manytimes they don't even know it or
(05:03):
they don't call it that orthey've never made that
connection. And for Vince, Vinceis at the time when him and I
met was not familiar with theToyota Production System
manufacturing or processimprovement being applied. But
as we continue to haveconversations about the work
that he's doing in therestaurant industry in
(05:25):
Nashville, I was like, Vince,everything that you're doing
aligns exactly with the workthat we're doing, with our
clients.
And so obviously we hit it offand, and had some really, really
great conversations about,continuous improvement, you
know, in the restaurantindustry. So I'm excited to have
you on the show, Vince. It'sgreat to see you again.
Vince Lanni (05:47):
Thanks. Yeah, good to see you. I'm excited to be
here. And I do think a lot of itrelates. We were talking on the
show and getting to know eachother and it was really like, We
were there for self improvementanyway, really, at the end of
the not to give too much away,but entrepreneurs, self
improvement stuff.
That's something that I'vealways been trying to do,
(06:08):
whether personal life orbusiness, is always trying to
improve. There's always room toimprove. So how can we do that?
Patrick Adams (06:16):
That's right. That's the question. Yeah.
That's right. Go ahead,Katherine.
Catherine McDonald (06:20):
You guys competing? So, obviously, you
didn't fall out because, youknow, you're here today, Vince.
Were you were you competing, orwere you on the same team? Or
not to let's give way too ButI'm really We
Vince Lanni (06:28):
were compete we were competing. Not in the but
it's a very supportivecompetition. You know? It's not
like I can't think of a show tocompare it to, but not nothing
nothing crazy. We're notbackstabbing each other or
anything like that.
Patrick Adams (06:40):
Yeah. No no no backstabbing. It was more all
all the individuals that werethere were competing for, you
know, top three or whatever, topfive, top 10, whatever but it
was a self development show aswell. So your entrepreneurs,
business owners are going on tothe show and they're learning
(07:02):
how they can take thesedifferent techniques and apply
them to their business to beable to improve their business.
So, you know, again, Vince and Iwere kind of competing against
each other, but at the same timealso helping each other and
lifting each other up andsupporting each other through
the entire process, along withmany other amazing entrepreneurs
that we met while we were there.
(07:22):
So,
Catherine McDonald (07:23):
yeah. Sounds amazing. Definitely, definitely
keep us updated. I really wantto see this now. So, Vince, you
know that our topic today iscuriosity, and it is a great
topic.
It's not something we've broughtup too many times. I think even
though it pops into ourconversations every now and
then, it hasn't been our mainfocus. And I think it's great
that it is today because it'sjust so important. As we were
(07:45):
talking earlier, I mentionedthat I really think it's just a
cornerstone of a good way toimprove, effective way to
continuously improve. Andwithout it, I'm not sure we can.
So maybe you can give us yourthoughts, Vince, on the power of
curiosity and where it all fitsinto what you do in your work
with bars and the hospitalitysector?
Vince Lanni (08:08):
Yeah. For me, it's really I think of when I'm
curious about something. Right?Like, I'm engaged in it. I'm I
I'm I wanna know the answer.
I'm determined to find theanswer. I'm motivated to find
the answer, and I feel like I'mcontributing to something if I'm
curious and we're we're learningsomething together as a team or
(08:30):
we're trying to solve a problemor, you know, fix up find a
solution for something. I think,you know, curiosity is a great
tool to have that you can reallystay engaged with your team and
your team can stay engaged withthe goals of the company.
Patrick Adams (08:46):
Vince, when you go into work restaurant in the
Nashville area, how doescuriosity come into play when
you're talking? Just thinkpersonally, I think about some
of the companies that we go intowhere, I'll just give you the
other side of it, where I haveleaders who think they know it
all, And they don't have anyform of curiosity whatsoever.
(09:10):
They just like, they think thatthey have the right path. They
know what they want. They'reheading down a path.
And I think there can be somebenefits to that, right? To have
a strong leader that knows wherethey're going. But there's also,
I think, a downside to thatbecause without some level of
curiosity, are you 100% rightall the time? I mean, how many
(09:32):
leaders can say that, right? Sothere has to be some level of
curiosity where it's like, okay,we have certain problems that I
don't know how to solve.
And I need to be curious abouthow to get to the solution.
What's the right approach tothis? And what about my team
members and their level ofcuriosity and being able to
(09:54):
drive innovation from withinwhatever the things are that are
within their control? So guess,yeah, so back to the question,
how does curiosity play a rolewhen you go into a new
restaurant or a bar or somewherethat needs help with
improvement? How do you engagethe leaders or the team members
in some level of curiosity?
Vince Lanni (10:17):
Well, a couple of things with that. They have to
be already kind of I'm not goingto convince a leader that's set
in their ways to change. Somepeople aren't for me yet or I'm
not for them yet. They're notthere in that they want to
improve or that they see thatthe way they're doing it could
be better. Some people do thinkthat they're right 100% of the
(10:39):
time.
Some people still are like that.I'm looking for and finding,
being attracted to whatever youwant to call it, people that are
looking for that selfimprovement already and just
don't know exactly what to donext or don't know exactly where
to find it. This is where I cancome in and help bridge the gap
on all the trial and error. Isthe strategy that they're going
(11:02):
with going to work? Might, mightnot, might need a tweak.
Who knows? And for me as aconsultant for restaurants, I
love this topic. I think this isa great overview kind of what I
do because I'm not just going toshare what I know. Going to I am
curious about their business.I'm curious about their
problems.
I'm curious about solving them.I am genuinely interested in
(11:24):
solving the problems and helpingthem find solutions. I think
that part kind of separates mefrom other restaurant
consultants who will just kindof give them a course, give them
homework to do and share whatthey know. What I say is I don't
know it all. I'm going tocontinue to find solutions and
learn with you, but that's thevalue is that you're not in this
(11:46):
alone.
I'm going to help you get there.We're going to figure this out.
This is where curiosity playssuch a valuable part in the
arrangement.
Patrick Adams (11:55):
I love that. Two things that I heard there that I
think are important to repeat.One is you're not you you are
looking for the types of clientsthat are willing to change, that
are interested in changing,curious to change, where, you
know, those those, restaurantowners that are set in their
(12:18):
ways and don't think they needto improve or don't think they
have problems, that's probablynot the right client for you,
right? Mean, I think, Katherine,I think that's the same for us
too. I mean, it's unfortunately,there's been times where I've
landed at companies where thathappens and I didn't realize it
until it was too late.
(12:39):
But to your point, Vince, Iwould rather not work with
companies where that's thefeeling of leadership. They're
just not ready for change.
Vince Lanni (12:51):
Now, do they have like a lot to benefit from being
ready to that and open to that?Yeah, sure. But if they're not
there yet, I mean, you reallycan't beat them down with all
the information on why that's abetter way to do it. They kind
of have to get there themselves.People don't change until it's
kind of staying the same is alittle more damaging than the
(13:11):
change is.
Catherine McDonald (13:14):
Yeah. Yeah, it is a good point. And I see
it, and I suppose I would be thesame. It's very hard to work
with somebody who's on a totallydifferent mindset to you. Often
what I've seen when it comes tocuriosity, there are a few
people who talk about this, thatcuriosity occurs sort of on a
continuum, where on the farleft, you've got judgment on the
(13:35):
far right, you've got curiosity.
Vince Lanni (13:38):
And
Catherine McDonald (13:38):
I've heard people speak about the fact that
we're human and we all have alittle bit of judgment in us.
But we will I guess the best wayto develop ourselves is to
develop our mindset and ourskills to enable us to move
further up that continuum fromjudgment towards curiosity. And
sometimes when we go into anorganization, what I found and I
(13:59):
don't know if you found this,Vince, is that there's an awful
lot of blame going on. There's areal lack of curiosity. There's
just quick judgments going on,and that's leading to obviously
a lot of conflict and teamissues.
And oftentimes those are theorganizations that need
consultant most. They need anexternal person to come in to
help them see and understandwhat's happening and to help
(14:20):
them understand their ownmindset and maybe skill gaps and
work on them with them. But asyou say, they have to be open to
all of understanding that theyneed to develop. So I totally
get what you're saying there. Idon't know, have you ever been
in that situation where you goin to help an organisation and
you see this kind of practice isgoing on and you can step in and
(14:43):
help them with that?
Vince Lanni (14:44):
Well, one thing you touched on is the blame game
kind of thing. And I think thatthat's super important because
when we're trying to solveproblems together, that kind of
brings us all together in acommunity. So this is where that
curiosity really plays a valuein the culture of not playing
the blame game. We're all inthis together and we're finding
(15:06):
solutions together. We feel likemore of a team when there's that
kind of common goal.
But to answer your question, Itypically don't get that far. So
if the owner is interested inthey're going to make the
decision to hire me or If theowner is interested in the self
improvement stuff, and maybehe's got a couple of leaders on
the team that are stuck in theirways, they don't think they need
(15:28):
to improve, whatever. I haven'tgotten that yet, but I don't
think that that's outside of therealm of possibility by any
means. I can totally see thathappening. Typically, I'll get
that from the owner right offthe bat.
And it'll kind of end the movingforward and working together
(15:50):
thing before I even get to theteam because the owner is just
set in a ways and they don't seethe value. But they're like, I
make a ton of money. I'm good.I'm like, You are. Yeah, you
make millions of dollars withthis bar or restaurant, right?
You could make an extra halfmillion a year probably if you
did. Is that of interest to you?Some people don't really see the
value in a lot of this and somepeople do and they're open to
(16:12):
this kind of self improvementcuriosity type thing.
Patrick Adams (16:16):
So let's back up a little bit based on what you
just said, because I'm surethere are people that would be
interested to hear your approachwhen you go into a new
restaurant or bar. I'm sure it'sdifferent depending on the size
or the, again, whether it's abar or restaurant. But when I
think about the kind of workthat you do, I think about the
(16:37):
TV show, is it called BarRescue? Yeah. Is that kind of
similar?
I mean, that's probably elevatedfor TV, you know, but, you know,
I guess I'm asking you, what isyour approach? Like, what does
it look like when you have arestaurant owner that says,
Vince, we'd love to have youcome in and work with us? Where
(16:57):
do you start? What do you do?
Vince Lanni (16:59):
Well, first off, that show, I always hated that
comparison. And because the guyis such an asshole on the show.
Patrick Adams (17:06):
He is.
Vince Lanni (17:07):
He is. And I'm just like, oh, I'm not like that. I'm
a nice guy. Like, I'm here tohelp. And I'm also not going to
invest a ton of money into therenovations like they do on the
show because they got all themoney and the sponsors.
But then I kind of retrained mymind on that self improvement
and thought, well, at leastthat's something people know
(17:27):
about and can relate to kind ofwhat I do, so let's go from
there. So to answer yourquestion, I do that a bit, but
my first step is to find notonly the money that it costs to
hire me, but a lot more thanthat. So we're going to look
through their order guides,we're going do an inventory
audit, look through their vendorpricing, and find the best
(17:48):
pricing for them. A client Iworked with recently, they're on
track to save over 100,000 in,2025 based on this. Like, we
just went through, looked ateverything, took a couple months
to negotiate some pricing.
I have a network of resourcesand vendors here in Nashville
that I have connections with. Sokind of setting them up with
different options for POSsystems or linen services, stuff
(18:12):
like that and and the food isthe big one. You know, food
prices are always fluctuating.When you're trying to shop
around for prices, you don't getthe best prices. So, we have
some strategies that that makesure that we're finding you the
best prices available for yourrestaurant, and the savings are
incredible.
And then they think, wow, I'vejust been ordering this from
(18:32):
this company for so long. I'mlike, yeah, now what are you
going to do with that $100,000This is where step two comes in
now. Step two is what do we dowith it? Do you want to do
marketing spend? Do you need tohire another manager, focus on
leadership development, get somemore support in there on your
leadership team so you can domore work on the business and
(18:53):
not be so into the day to day asan owner?
Or maybe there's some incentiveprograms that you've wanted to
do for your leadership team thatjust haven't been in the budget.
Well, you don't even have to digit out of the current budget.
We're going to find you thatmoney. So that's the big step
one. And then steps two andthree are are, you know, just
kind of trying to find ways toimprove staff retention and
(19:20):
guest retention.
So, staff training, morale,leadership development, all
kinds of self improvementpractices, and we're gonna talk
more on curiosity and all thatstuff coming up on how it
applies. And then, yeah, someother, you know, guest retention
practices that I've done throughmy time to help other
restaurants.
Patrick Adams (19:39):
Okay. So that all makes a ton of sense. And I'm
sure I have to imagine thatmaybe it's not the case, but
restaurants and bars probablyhave a high turnover rate when
it comes to their employees, Iwould guess. So some of the work
that you're talking about thatyou do maybe would help increase
some of that retention and helpkeep people around longer, which
(20:02):
obviously is a huge expense forowners to have to retrain and
we'll go find and then retrainpeople. What about systems?
Like, do you work? Do you do alot of work on the back end
system side of things like theprocesses that they follow in
order to order the supplies thatthey need or to the process of
(20:25):
inputting orders into the systemor whatever it might be. You do
some work on that?
Vince Lanni (20:30):
Yeah. A little bit. We can do some people don't have
a great inventory trackingsystem. We can help there. Sales
forecasting and budgeting fororders weekly.
Okay. So you're ordering basedon what your expected sales are
instead of just bringing it upto par. You know? Okay. Only
order what you need.
Like, let's let's keep it lean.You know? Yeah. Yeah. So we we
(20:52):
have some tools, and we'll helpthem with that as well.
And then also just, yeah, as faras systems, systems in the non,
like, tech way or somethingmight be workflow of the servers
and the bartenders and the barbacks and making that a more
efficient process.
Patrick Adams (21:11):
Gotcha. Okay.
Vince Lanni (21:12):
Good. Really varies from different place.
Patrick Adams (21:14):
Right, I figured that. So thank you for that. I
wanted to take a couple of stepsback just because there's a lot
of people that are listeningright now who probably maybe
have never watched any processimprovement or continuous
improvement tools being appliedto restaurants or to bars. So
it's just kind of nice to knowyour high level approach.
Catherine McDonald (21:38):
Yeah. And seems to me that really the key
is to ask questions. It's reallyas simple as that. You know,
we're talking about going intoorganizations and understanding
what's happening. And the onlyway to understand is, well, two
things go to as we call it theGEMBA in Lean events.
That's the word that supposeLean practitioners would use, go
to GEMBA, see what's happening.But that's essentially what
(22:00):
you're talking about. Go in, seewhat's happening, observe the
work and ask questions. Itreally does come down to doing
that really, really well. Right?
Vince Lanni (22:09):
Yeah. Absolutely. And, I mean, like, some of the
best ideas come from the thefrontline people too. So keeping
them curious and letting themknow that, like, you're open to
their suggestions.
Patrick Adams (22:20):
Absolutely. I loved the other thing I said
earlier. I said I had two pointsand I don't want to miss that
second point because the otherthing that you said earlier was
you said that not only are youlooking for ways to help
generate curiosity within thecompanies that you're working
with, But you said you approachthem with curiosity and that you
(22:42):
don't have to have all theanswers. And I think, again,
that's probably the mostimportant thing that helped me
be more confident. You know,when I'm going into all these
different companies that aremaybe in different industries,
maybe different parts of theworld, they don't even speak
English potentially, but I canbe confident knowing I don't
have to know everything abouttheir process.
(23:04):
I don't have to know everythingabout what they do. I just have
to be curious. Catherine, toyour point, ask the right
questions because they're theexperts. They know their
process. They know the work thatthey're doing.
Now, yes, there could be someinefficient processes. There
could be some wastefulactivities that are happening,
(23:24):
but asking the right questionswill help bring some of that to
the surface. Would you agree,Vince?
Vince Lanni (23:31):
Yeah, absolutely. Definitely the key to confidence
really is not that you know itall, but that you can solve
you'll figure it out. You know?That's really confidence at the
end of the day is knowing thatbecause I'm not arrogant. I'm
not going to sit there and say,I know everything and that I can
solve any problem.
(23:51):
That's crazy. No one knowseverything. But I'm confident
that whatever the problem is,I'll figure it out. I've
probably seen something similaror I've seen enough that I know
that I'm building thatconfidence by this happened. I
didn't know how to handle it,but I solved it.
The next thing happens. Youdon't know how to handle it, but
you solve it. And this is justgrowth and self improvement. As
(24:12):
you continue to do that throughyour life and career, you
develop that confidence that nomatter what happens, I'll figure
it out.
Patrick Adams (24:20):
And that leads me into my next question,
specifically around problemsolving and continuous
improvement. So for youpersonally, do you have any
stories or maybe your approachto how or why curiosity is so
critical when being applied toproblem solving or to continuous
(24:42):
improvement? Any specificstories or just how use that
curiosity piece to really createsome good problem solving
solutions?
Vince Lanni (24:56):
Yeah, I like puzzles. And it's really like a
game or a puzzle when there'swhen there's something going on.
And I had an employee that Iworked with who every bar that I
would go into, I'm the problemsolver. And I don't know. It's
probably just because of this,you know, take on curiosity and
and confidence in problemsolving.
But I came into this place andhe was the guy. He was the
(25:18):
problem solver. Things wouldbreak. I don't know how to fix
this, but the POS systems areshut down at midnight and we got
100,000 people in there. We'recompeting against each other in
a fun way to try and solve theproblem first.
That made us a little moreefficient in doing it. The staff
(25:39):
would get a kick out of itbecause they'd be like, Oh,
who's going to win, VinceCurtis? Who's going to win this
time? Kind of thing. Then also,this is the other important
thing, too.
When you make it like a game orlike a puzzle and you don't
treat it so seriously, you'renot so frantic about it, the
staff feels that they're waymore confident, they're way more
(26:00):
comfortable, they know that it'sgoing to get taken care of,
they're not going to freak out,the guests are still going to
have a good experience becausethe team's not freaking out
because you're not freaking out.That's what I think really plays
a big role in it.
Catherine McDonald (26:14):
And what about Vince? So you go in,
you're a great problem solver.You're an external person coming
in to help this organization.They're delighted to have your
help. You have excellent problemsolving skills.
But how do you help them tobecome better problem solvers so
they don't become reliant onyou?
Vince Lanni (26:29):
That's the big thing, teaching them how to do
it. So ask them questions. Ifthey have a solution or a
potential solution, say, Okay,does this solution solve the
problem the way you want it to?And then make them answer that.
Does it?
Is this going to have the resultthat you're looking for? Or are
you just throwing stuff at thewall? And it's Okay if you are,
(26:50):
but let's dive in and figure itout. And if they really do think
that it's going to work, thenthey can try it. And if it
doesn't work or if it does workor maybe there's a hiccup along
the way, we're going to gothrough more of the why on why
that happened and how they thinkthat could be more efficient in
the future.
(27:11):
Yeah, really getting them tothink ahead on, Okay, does this
actually solve the problem? Oris this just something that I
feel like I need to do now?
Catherine McDonald (27:21):
Yeah, that's really good. Because obviously,
we know that critical thinkingskills are on a decline in a lot
of organizations. There are alot of reasons why that could
be. But we know that engagingfrontline staff and workers in
this kind of problem solving andinnovation and giving them
ownership of issues andinvolving them every step we
(27:43):
know that works. So it's greatto hear that that's your
approach.
And I suppose I had anotherquestion because having worked
in bars and restaurants, I knowhow busy they can be. And I
think this applies not just tobars and restaurants, but to
lots of other service sectororganizations where the actually
the frontline staff are so busy,they don't really have a lot of
time to stop and think they'reall go, go, go, do, do, do. But
(28:06):
we know that as consultants inthis kind of trade where we go
in to try and helporganizations, that they do need
to take a step back in order tothink and to see how to improve
and to take that ownership. Sohow do you do that, Vince? How
do you go into these really busyplaces and convince management,
first of all, to let you go inand spend the time with people?
(28:29):
And then I suppose, secondly,make the most of that time
because they have to get back towork?
Patrick Adams (28:35):
That's a good question.
Vince Lanni (28:36):
It is a good question. And the main thing
that I want to do is to definewho works for who. In my
opinion, and what I've had themost success in, is that the
leadership team, the managers,they work for the team. So if
they're too busy running around,why don't they have time to
think and come up with asolution? Why are they so busy?
(28:58):
You need to go in and help them.I think that's the first step is
to really define your role as aleader. And that's you work for
your team, they don't work foryou.
Catherine McDonald (29:09):
Real story.
Patrick Adams (29:09):
It's an important point. Yeah. Yeah, that's an
important point. You'd besurprised how many leaders don't
understand the power of justbeing the person that's in the
back, not in the forefront, butin the back that's helping to
remove those roadblocks and settheir team up for success. I
mean, those are the leaders thatfind the most success hands
(29:31):
down.
You know, they understand thevalue. Go ahead.
Vince Lanni (29:34):
Think of it this way. I mean, we're in the
service industry. We call it thebar and restaurant, like we're
in service of the guests. Thefrontline workers are in service
of the guests, but as a leader,who are you in service of?
You're in service of your team.
Patrick Adams (29:46):
Right. Right. So true. Now I want to go back to
the question though, I want todig a little bit deeper on this
because I think not just in thehospitality industry, but in
many of manufacturing andhealthcare, we find ourselves so
busy that sometimes we feel likewe don't have time for self
(30:07):
development or we don't havetime to challenge existing
processes or we don't have timeto improve this or that. How do
you get around that Vince?
What do you what do you do? Doyou do you you recommend that
they block time forimprovements? Do you pull them
off their work? Do you do itoutside of regular business
(30:28):
hours? I mean, what how do youdo it?
Vince Lanni (30:30):
Yeah, that that's a great question, Patrick. I I
think you have kids, you'llunderstand this. If you can't,
if you don't have time to have acatch with your kid, did you not
have time or did you not maketime? And when you think of it
like that, you're you're you'reyou're yet like and then that
would make you feel pretty bad.You know, if I, oh, I didn't
(30:51):
make time for that.
Like, I didn't prioritize this.So, take that to managing a bar
restaurant. Do you notprioritize the well-being of
your team? Do you not prioritizeincreasing sales and your
bonuses and all that stuff?Everyone's going be like, no, I
do.
I do. Well, then why aren't Soyes to time blocking. I love
(31:13):
time blocking.
Catherine McDonald (31:14):
And it doesn't have to be complex
either, right? I mean, thirtyminutes before a shift or at the
end of a shift can be added andtaken back by people. I think
what we have to ask for here isflexibility from people, from
management, but also fromeverybody,
Vince Lanni (31:30):
from
Catherine McDonald (31:30):
the entire staff team if we want to do
this. It's going to takeflexibility. Would you agree?
Vince Lanni (31:36):
Flexibility is it's a bonus in the industry that you
have flexibility. That's a greatpro of the industry. Use that
valuable tool. Use that as aresource because you don't have
to go in and do the same thingall day. You have those ups and
downs in business, right?
Like you get the lunch pop andyou die down a little bit before
(31:58):
dinner and you get busy atdinner. It depends on the
restaurant you're in. Buttypically, there's these ups and
downs and busy times in therestaurant where you might have
some time to sneak away or sometime to huddle up the team and
be like, cool, we got our asseskicked there. What do you think
we could have done? And I'vedone this as a new manager or a
consulting company.
I'm like, what could I have donein that scenario that would help
(32:21):
you get through that shifteasier? Finding that little
time, making time for that stuffis so important. So I use some
tools, I guess you could callthem templates, that are to keep
topics on top of mind of how amI going to help my team today
and how am I going to increasesales? And keeping those two
questions always at theforefront, ask myself before the
(32:43):
shift, write it down, check-inmidway through the shift, have I
done that yet? If not, let memake that a priority moving
forward through the rest of theshift, and then a recap at the
end.
That sounds like it's a lot ofextra stuff, but it's really
not. If you think about how longit takes you to answer two
little questions, a minute, thenyou review it halfway through
the shift, it takes anotherminute or two, and Then you do
(33:05):
it at the end of the shift.We're talking five minutes here
to make such a big impact. Soit's not that they don't have
time, it's that they're notmaking the time and they're not
using their time efficiently.
Patrick Adams (33:16):
Right. Yeah. For us in the lean world, we use a
tool called leader standardwork. And it's really a lot of
what you're talking about whereprioritizing is important
because busyness is going tocome. When you show up to work
in a restaurant, in a bar, orfor any listeners, work whatever
(33:37):
work that you're in, you showup, you don't have to have a
plan for the day if you don'twant to, and you're you'll be
busy.
And by the end of the day,you'll feel like you did a lot.
But then if you stop and thinkabout, okay, what did I actually
accomplish today? What are theone or two things that I got
done today? A lot of times, ifyou don't have a plan, if you
(33:59):
don't prioritize, you get to theend of the day and you're like,
I mean, I feel like I was busyall day, but what did I actually
get done? Versus I'm going to doone on ones with my frontline
team leaders today.
I'm going to get two of thosedone. I'm going to walk the, we
would say, Gemba, but I'm goingto walk the floor and I'm going
(34:20):
to look for opportunities forimprovement. I'm going to find
at least one opportunity forimprovement today. And I'm going
to dive into the financialsmaybe, and I'm going to look for
one opportunity to make animprovement today. So I'm going
to do those four things today.
I'm prioritizing those. Thoseare part of my standard work for
the day. So now at the end ofthe day, you're still going to
(34:41):
be busy all day. But at the endof the day, now you can look
back and go check, check, check,check. I was able to complete
those four things.
Vince Lanni (34:50):
Right. And it's a difference. Are you busy or are
you productive? Mean, there'ssuch a difference. I always
think that busy is a feeling.
It's how you feel. You feelbusy. But you're not necessarily
any amount of productive justbecause you feel busy. You have
a lot to do or you're doing alot. But like you said, are you
(35:13):
actually doing a lot or is itjust kind of running in circles?
Catherine McDonald (35:17):
I actually think that sometimes these
service sectors, they arewithout knowing it solely
without even trying a lot of thetime. Okay, sometimes they're
not and there's issues, but theyhave to be so lean.
Vince Lanni (35:29):
That's true.
Catherine McDonald (35:30):
They have no choice but to be lean because
they're customer facing. Thecustomer sees everything. So
they have to the voice of thecustomer comes first. They get
the voice of the customer soquickly and easily compared to
sectors that are not customerfacing. And so I've worked in
the hotel sector and I've workedin nonprofits.
And there's a similarity there,really. And I know you don't
(35:52):
technically use the word lean,Vince, but I suppose what have
you seen in terms of bars andrestaurants to maybe prove that
point? What are they doing thatis actually really efficient?
What can they teach othersectors, do you think?
Vince Lanni (36:08):
Yeah, there's a lot of those intangible metrics in a
bar and restaurant, right? Sowe're talking ticket time You
can't track Some things, youlook at the sales, that's like a
clear metric. You look at timeof day and all that stuff.
That's like on paper in thecomputer, you have that. But how
many times is your serverrunning back to the kitchen to
(36:31):
grab a side of ranch that theyforgot with the order?
How much time does that take?How much time are people waiting
to be seated or waiting for adrink at the bar? These are
things that you can't get byrunning a report on your
business. These are things thatyou need to watch, track in your
head, make notes if you to writethem down through the shift, go
ahead. But these are all thelittle things and so much more
(36:53):
that you have to be on top of.
And these are the things thatreally matter. To your point,
you get that information rightthen and there, you can make
changes and improvements. Itdoesn't even have to be at the
end of the shift. You can do iton the fly. You can jump in and
be in service to your team andhelp out to improve any of those
metrics that are failing.
(37:15):
And then you can take it to dorefresh topics or a little more
training or a little morefollow-up with some people to
improve those over the nextweek. But it's definitely a
quicker information gatheringprocess and being able to
improve it a lot faster.
Patrick Adams (37:33):
Love that. I didn't really think about that
until you said it, Kathryn, it'sso true. I mean, for many
organizations, customers, theynever meet the customer or most
people don't. The customerplaces an order and you're
fulfilling that order throughthis long value stream. But for
(37:54):
you guys, Vince, I mean, thecustomer's standing right there
and they're like, I need adrink.
How long does it take? You canhave
Vince Lanni (38:02):
facial expressions, the body language, all of it.
Patrick Adams (38:05):
Right. That's really interesting. We maybe we
should bring a group down and dodo our own, little gemba, waste
activity, that'd be pretty cool.Some guys that work with you.
Vince Lanni (38:18):
That'd be awesome.
Patrick Adams (38:20):
So we've talked about a lot of things in a short
amount of time, but if you couldsum up, you know, maybe some
practical strategies for anyonethat's listening for integrating
curiosity into their dailypractices or integrating their
curiosity into how they makedecisions or how they improve
(38:45):
processes. What would be acouple of things that you would
say, these are just a couple ofpractical strategies that you
should follow?
Vince Lanni (38:53):
I mean, think first, number one is lose the
ego. You don't know it all andbe open. Be curious. Number two
is I I I if I if I'm, like,bringing up the idea on
something, like, something Iwanna change or an, you know, an
idea for improvement, of course,I think it's a great idea. It's
my idea.
But I want the team practice,this is the practical part,
(39:15):
right? Tell the team to pokeholes in it for you, whether
that's your other leadershipteam or your front of house
team, whatever it is. Have thempoke holes in it because that's
going to give you some feed, youknow, the feedback that you need
to really make it a great planor a great improvement moving
forward and you don't have todouble back and kind of fix
things as you go because itdidn't work the way you thought
(39:38):
it was going to. Like, there'sso much value in in the team and
their opinions. Make them feellike their opinions matter and
that you they can always come toyou with cool ideas or or any
any type of improvement options.
Like, your door is always open.Kinda have that practice that
culture of we're always lookingto improve. I'm not going to
(39:58):
always have the best ideas.Y'all might have the best ideas
and if they are great, give themcredit. If they're not great,
you take the credit and you tryto help them make em better.
You know, people will come to meand say, whatever it is and I'm
like, Here's why I don't thinkit'll work. And then sometimes
(40:20):
it just won't work. Or sometimesthey'll come back to me a week
later and a bartender will comeback and be like, Okay, you said
it wouldn't work because ofthis, but what if we did this
that solves that problem? I'mlike, Okay, cool. Let's try it.
Right?
Catherine McDonald (40:34):
Yeah. So what you're saying is what
you're saying is organizationalimprovement really does start
with individual self improvementand developing those like
humility and the skills ofcuriosity. That's kind of what
I'm getting from you, Vince.
Vince Lanni (40:47):
Yeah, absolutely. And and from top to bottom of
the organization that it's okayto question what you've been
doing forever there, and it'sokay to question new ideas no
matter who they come from,whether they come from the owner
or it's okay to question them.
Patrick Adams (41:03):
Vince, one last question from me, and then I
don't know if Catherine has onemore. But just if you were to
think about all the differentbars, restaurants, owners that
you've worked with, you don'thave to say names here, but who
would be or what would theorganization be that maybe you
(41:26):
would say was the best customeror I guess the best improvement
activities that happened withthem would be like your
highlight, maybe just a littlestory about them. And then the
opposite side of that, yourbiggest challenge and what did
that look like?
Vince Lanni (41:44):
Yeah. Biggest challenge first is I can't do it
all. I'm just kind of givingthem I'm helping them. But at
the end of the day, they had toexecute. And sometimes I put a
lot of faith into that they canexecute what we've talked about
doing, and they don't always dothat.
(42:06):
And that's kind of the risk youtake as a consultant on are
they? They're going blame me nowbecause it didn't work, but they
didn't actually do it, right?Kind of thing. So I have worked
with a client like that before.And then a success story is a
place called Greenery Co.
That I work with, and they arereally open to it. I mean, they
(42:32):
knew what they needed. They knewtheir weaknesses, I guess, and
they were very clear and veryopen about that. They very much
wanted to improve, and they'reso willing to try new things.
And that's really theircuriosity and their willingness
to improve is why they've savedover $100 for this year.
(42:54):
And they're on track to increasesales by 10% to 15% for 2025.
Patrick Adams (43:01):
That's amazing. Yeah. The story, the initial,
the challenge too, as far asthat one goes, I mean, that's a
tough one. And I think even formany who are listening in, a
coach internally, I think theycan resonate, even if they're
not a consultant or runningtheir own business, just even as
(43:24):
an internal coach. A lot ofthese concepts that we're
talking about, they definitelymatter for sure.
So Catherine, last question foryou.
Catherine McDonald (43:35):
Yeah, I just I had something in my mind there
about curiosity. So I think it'sa skill we lose over time. We
start out really, reallycurious. Patrick, you said about
your new little grandchild andhow curious children are. And as
we grow up and get older, wedefinitely, definitely lose
those skills.
(43:56):
And I'm just wondering, Vince,because obviously you see the
value in curiosity. You rolemodel it with every organization
you go into, and it's somethingyou try to develop in your team.
How do you think, Vince, we can,I suppose, promote the power of
curiosity in people? How can weget the people we work with to
(44:18):
work on that skill and to bemore curious? What do you think?
Vince Lanni (44:23):
I think it's more of like the human vulnerability
of it's Okay to not know it all.And especially from an owner
standpoint or a leader that islooked to for answers and feels
like they should know it all andthey need to have this kind of
tough exterior like it doesn'tneed to be like that, you know?
I think leadership years ago wasalways about strength and a lot
(44:47):
of that still carries over andlike you said, as we get older,
like, that's definitely,something we'd pride ourselves
on. But leadership really isit's kind of changed with the
tech era to turn into brains alittle bit more. And then now I
feel like, as we're talkingabout self improvement and
curiosity, heart is the bigthing in leadership.
(45:09):
So I I I think being willing toopen yourself up to the new
experiences and to beingvulnerable and admitting that
you don't know it all, buthaving that same strength and
confidence and brainpower toknow that you can figure it out.
Catherine McDonald (45:24):
Yeah. Yeah. I guess what leaders role
modeling that every day, it itrubs off.
Vince Lanni (45:30):
Yeah. And if they're okay to ask questions,
then their team's gonna feelcomfortable to ask questions
too. That's what we want. Ifthey don't know something, we
wanna make sure that they havethis information so they can do
a better job. And also, theymight have a question that
prompts a really innovativechange that helps the company
too.
Patrick Adams (45:52):
Yeah. So true. Vince, the last thing I'm gonna
ask as we close here witheveryone listening in, the next
time that Catherine and I are inNashville, will you bring us to
your favorite pub?
Vince Lanni (46:06):
Absolutely. Oh, yeah. Yay.
Patrick Adams (46:09):
Alright. Good. I'm glad. I'm looking forward to
that. We definitely wanna getdown there and and see you.
And, yeah, we we, we're excitedto to have you on and appreciate
all your insight. I know ourlisteners definitely will take
value from this episode and justappreciate you coming on.
Vince Lanni (46:26):
Absolutely. Yeah. I hope there was some value there
for everyone listening and Iappreciate your time and it's
great to see you again.
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
The Joe Rogan Experience
The official podcast of comedian Joe Rogan.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Special Summer Offer: Exclusively on Apple Podcasts, try our Dateline Premium subscription completely free for one month! With Dateline Premium, you get every episode ad-free plus exclusive bonus content.