February 9, 2025 • 48 mins
Join Dani and Steph for part two of the motorcycle gang episode focusing on the legal journey of Paradis, Gibson, and Evans - bikers ensnared in a convoluted murder case. This episode covers key testimonies, shifting stories, and courtroom drama that spans decades. From questionable pathologist practices to Paradis's complicated love life and finding out what happened to Evans AKA Igor, we dissect the twists and turns of this true crime saga. Listen in for a detailed look at the chaos and legal battles that define this case, sprinkled with our trademark dark humor and sarcasm.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:30):
Welcome back to the LethalLibrary.
Today we are going over part twoof our motorcycle gang case.
We'll be discussing Paradistrial, Moline's testimony, we're
going to find out what reallyhappened to Igor, aka Evans, and
of course all of the appeals,appeals, appeals.
So Danny's going to start us offwith the trial for Paradis.
Dani (00:51):
An early December Paradis is on trial.
There's a lot of the sametestimony as Gibson's trial.
But we do have a defensewitness.
Remember Aria Beaver?
Yes.
She testified she was withParadis from 1 a.
m.
to 7 30 a.
m.
on June 21st.
She said she had met.
(01:12):
Now she knows the day.
She remembers.
Well, maybe, maybe she got thosedrugs cleared out of her system.
She said she had met Paradis atPeople's Park in Spokane the
afternoon before and that afterleaving three other people to
stay at Paradis's house thatmorning.
He came with her to her house,so.
Everyone's popping their pussyat people's parties.
Stephanie (01:34):
Let's go! This is a happening place.
Dani (01:43):
Fucking wild, dude.
Okay, she testified in theWashington trial, but was unsure
what day it was with Paradis.
Now her memory is clear.
Another witness for the defense,pathologist Charles P.
Larson, testified that the fluidin Kimberly's lungs was in the
back, indicating she died on herback.
(02:03):
The jury deliberated for fourhours before they found Paradis
guilty of first degree murder.
They said, yeah, anyway, you'refucking
Stephanie (02:13):
dead.
Dani (02:13):
Don't give a fuck.
That guy, uh, you know who'smissing from both these trials?
Moline, she was, I feel likeshe, I don't think she refused
to testify.
I just think that there was toomuch
Stephanie (02:30):
shit show
Dani (02:31):
happening.
They just were
Stephanie (02:32):
like, they left themselves at a disadvantage of
not being able to offer heranything there.
I feel like they could havepicked that up here and been
like, listen, how about we justin Idaho, we'll just say, put
you in witness protection ormake sure there's no federal
charges.
I wonder if she was offeredanything.
(02:53):
I,
Dani (02:53):
I don't know.
Stephanie (02:54):
Maybe they felt they had a strong enough case.
They were like, yeah, we don'teven need Moline.
This is too much of a
Dani (03:01):
clusterfuck.
I kind of feel like it was morethan that.
Like let's not make a mess here.
I mean, really?
Six hours?
It's been very messy.
Six hours total jurydeliberation.
We have two death penalties.
Stephanie (03:12):
Yeah, I did it.
So,
Dani (03:14):
but 1982, a few months later, Rosanna Moline decides to
tell her story.
During a hearing for Peridus.
Peridus has not, I'm gonna, Iknow it's already in my nose.
He has not even been Technicallyconvicted.
I mean he's been convicted ofthe murder, but he hasn't been
sentenced and they're alreadytrying to get him a new trial
(03:38):
Until she's coming to hissentencing to say something.
Yeah, Moline.
No, not the sentencing.
This is a hearing for a newtrial and he hasn't even been
sentenced.
It hurt my brain.
I'm like, wait, did I misssomething?
What's happening?
Moline told Judge Gary HammondThat she did not see Kimberly
die.
(03:58):
Gibson, quote, picked her up offthe ground by the throat and I
heard Kim choke.
She made a horrible noise.
Stephanie (04:06):
This is the death
Dani (04:07):
rattle.
Mmm, and hours later, she sawGibson attempting sexual
intercourse with emotionalistKim on the floor of the Spokane
home.
Stephanie (04:17):
Okay, and so Mauline is trying to help who?
Dani (04:23):
Paradis.
Okay, so she's
Stephanie (04:25):
putting,
Dani (04:27):
this is, this is, yeah, this is, there's a lot of Kim.
This is a hearing for Paradistrying to get a new trial before
he's even sentenced.
She also denied that she wastold.
So one of the stories that, thathad come about early that was
false, and that's why I didn'tput it in this, put it in this.
(04:47):
But there was storiescirculating that her and
Kimberly were putting her, putin a room and told to turn the
music up really loud while theywere beating Scott.
So she denied this.
She denied that she was told toturn up the stereo in order to
drown out the screams of Scott.
(05:08):
She was ordered to clean up theblood in the kitchen and that
Paradis, Gibson, Evans, andAmacher were present during
Scott's beating.
Still missing Igor.
She said she had returned toParadis's house where she had
been staying late June 20th.
She found Scott sitting alone inthe kitchen.
(05:28):
Scott told her to get out.
This isn't even Scott's house.
He's like, get out of here.
That's just drugs written allover it.
She then walked into theadjoined living room.
Kimberly was sitting on thecouch.
A few minutes later, she sawGibson in the kitchen arguing
with Scott.
Kim told her, quote, Scott waspretty upset there were some
(05:49):
guns that were missing.
He had to come talk to DonParadis about it.
While Moline and Kim weretalking, someone shut the door
between the living room and thekitchen, and then she heard a
loud noise, like something hadhit the floor or wall.
The stereo was playing, but shecould still hear over the music.
(06:10):
Gibson then came into the roomand told Moline and Kim to go
into a bedroom in another partof the house.
Listen,
Stephanie (06:27):
I've had a past of my own and I could see something
like this, I've been insituations kind of similar to
this where it's like, Oh,someone's getting beat up.
They're gonna get beat up andyou you're in survival mode.
You're just like okay What do Ineed to do to not get the shit
(06:48):
beat out of me and hopefullywalk out of here and I'll fix
them later yeah, if we'reoutnumbered and there's nothing
we can do about our stolen gunsthen take your licks and We'll
get out of here later I feellike that's how this started.
Dani (07:07):
It's weird to me.
Mind blowing.
Stephanie (07:09):
Yeah.
Dani (07:11):
Malene and Kimberly stayed in the bedroom for hours,
talking about things from theGrateful Dead to astrology.
Drugs.
That's
Stephanie (07:19):
drugs.
Dani (07:20):
Around 4 AM, Gibson called from the hallway.
Quote, Kim, come out and takeyour old man home now.
Kim led the way out of thebedroom, and as she reached a
doorway, Gibson grabbed her.
Stephanie (07:47):
This is all, being crack headedly planned
throughout the night, People arelike, keep her in here for a
minute.
Oh, go.
Okay, now we're gonna bring herout.
This is all completecrackheadness.
Dani (08:03):
Jesus.
In April, Paradis is alsosentenced to death.
Stephanie (08:09):
Idaho, they get it done.
Yeah, brother.
1984, Paradis is planning tomarry Betty Martinson on
September 22nd.
Who the fuck is Betty?
I know! But the good ol warden,Arvon Arave,
Dani (08:26):
Arave makes his, says,
Stephanie (08:29):
uh uh, nope, he puts his Arave is
Dani (08:31):
anti marriage.
He's
Stephanie (08:32):
like, you fucks.
Well, once you're convicted, Imean we went through this with
Creech, you have no rights.
No.
Uh, Betty was.
Be a spiritual
Dani (08:42):
partner.
Stephanie (08:43):
That will get you more.
Betty was Paradis spiritualadvisor before becoming his
fiancée.
These bitches be thinkin they'resneaky.
Why would you ruin it?
So visitation is now out.
Betty Martinson.
had known Paris since September83 when she met him through
(09:04):
another inmate.
I'm just Who is introducingpeople to They
Dani (09:10):
had like a newspaper ads or something.
It was basically the TikTokinmate system.
Pen pals.
Stephanie (09:23):
In,
Dani (09:24):
So in 1985, Gibson gives a telephone interview to a
reporter at the Spokesman Reviewconfessing he killed Kimberly.
Whoopsie.
Fuckin his attorneys was like,Alright.
He said that Paradis had nothingto do with the murder.
He stated, quote, I'm sorry Donis down here.
(09:48):
He didn't kill anyone.
Gibson is now saying afterKimberly saw the carnage of
Scott's beating, she quote blewit.
She came out of there and Igrabbed her around the throat
with this wire.
After I pulled her to the floor,I put my fingers on her throat
(10:08):
when she was drugged by Evansfrom the living room to the
kitchen.
Dawn showed up later and she wasdead by then for sure.
Stephanie (10:15):
They brutally fucked him up and her.
You're waiting there with awire.
You were never gonna let herleave.
This was planned.
Dani (10:26):
Dawn was not there at all.
I know that for a fact.
I grabbed her.
I kicked her.
She wasn't moving.
When Dawn came back, quote, hewas upset as hell.
Stephanie (10:37):
Okay, sure.
Like There's dead bodies in hishouse.
And this is an hours longundertaking.
Oh yeah.
She was in there with hours withUntil 4
Dani (10:47):
o'clock in the morning, I, what, I'm, they left the hotel
at a quarter to one, or theywere at the hotel a quarter to
one, so by the time they gotover there it was probably,
let's even just be generous andsay 1.
30, it took them 45 minutes,which I highly doubt.
So, several hours.
Stephanie (11:01):
Yeah, this was all going down in a drug fueled
fuckery.
Dani (11:08):
Almacher Chucker passes away in 1985.
From what?
I don't know! I couldn't findit.
Sorry.
Be gone.
So we're into 1986.
On July 21st, Lawrence Evans, a.
k.
a.
Igor, is located in BlueSprings, Missouri when he is
Stephanie (11:35):
Um, wow, I'm surprised they ever found him
because like how they were ableto find everyone else so easily.
Igor was out here justgallivanting.
Dani (11:46):
The FBI located him through a pair of speeding
citations he had received underhis alias Billy Ray Harkins.
The SWAT team rushed the home at730 in the morning.
Evans walked out of his garagecarrying garden tools when he
was captured.
Stephanie (12:05):
Who has garden tools in their hand at 7 30 a.
m.
What the fuck are we doing here?
Dani (12:10):
Who has garden tools when Evans was using crutches?
He was not able to run.
He had been in a motorcyclewreck that caused the amputation
of one of his legs below theknee.
God damn!
Stephanie (12:26):
You're not running from the cops now, are ya?
No,
Dani (12:29):
no, he wasn't running anywhere.
He's gonna go do a littlegardening.
What?
He finds extradition back toIdaho, but finally arrives in
November.
Stephanie (12:39):
Welcome.
Dani (12:41):
Washington has taken a back seat to this because, you
know.
Stephanie (12:44):
Clearly, they're like, Idaho somehow gets it
done.
And listen, I'm not saying it'sright, but Idaho.
Was basically like we will giveyou the death penalty for just
it's gonna happen like we'regonna we're gonna make it happen
Even if it's unconstitutionalAnd we'll pay for it for decades
(13:05):
So
Dani (13:05):
they're like sure Idaho I know has charged Evans with
first degree murder and onceagain the death penalty is on
the table 1987 the trial forEvans starts in August Evans
gave his account of the murdersLet's hear it.
The hat that was found underKimberly's body was examined.
(13:29):
Defense witness, criminologist,Carol Murin, testified most of
the hairs were dissimilar toEvans.
Evans says, that's not my hat.
Okay.
Evans even takes a stand in hisdefense.
Wow.
I just feel like people don't dothat as much now.
(13:49):
Like, Oh no.
They were defending to defend.
They were, they were going toget up there and say something.
Stephanie (13:55):
They had to.
Dani (13:56):
And that did not work out well for
Stephanie (13:58):
them.
I feel like people have learnedthat even if you're innocent,
it's, do not, not always a goodidea unless you can provide
something that isn't providedwith the evidence.
What it's all what you say andwhat you say
Dani (14:13):
and what you open yeah what you open yourself up to to
Yeah, he stated quote.
I didn't kill Kimberly Palmer.
I didn't intend her or anyone toget killed He also testified
that he did nothing to preventthe murders He admitted to
helping hide the bodies and thenwas on the run for six years He
(14:35):
also said quote what I'd done isnot do anything And I've had to
live with that.
On June 21st, 1980, Evans andParadis arrived at Paradis home
around 2.
30 in the morning.
They saw three men sitting inthe kitchen.
Scott, Gibson, and a mocker.
Evans knew there had alreadybeen a fight because Scott's
(14:59):
eyes and lips were beginning toswell.
Another fight started, andParadis told Evans to wait on
the porch to make sure no onecomes in.
You have to remember at thistime Evans was a, prospect for
this gypsy joker motorcyclegame.
He's trying to get in.
He's trying to get in.
So he's just doing what he'stold.
(15:19):
He's like, sure, I'll, I'll bethe lookout.
Yep.
Out front.
Sure.
An hour later, Evans was calledback inside the house and saw
Scott bloody beaten and mostlikely dead.
He did not see Kimberly, butshe, he knew she was inside.
They instructed Evans to leaveand get advice from other
motorcycle club leaders.
(15:42):
Okay.
When Evans returned to letParadis know that other leaders
did not want to get involved.
Stephanie (15:48):
They said, oh, you've got two dead bodies.
Why would you tell us that?
Shh.
Dani (15:53):
Don't know nothing.
He saw Gibson in the hallwaywith his pants down on top of
Kimberly's body.
Disgusting.
He said, quote, I don't knowexactly what he was doing.
I don't know if he was raping alive or a dead body.
Either way, you know, sir, it'ssomething.
Evanson went to the basement andsaw Paradis and Amaker throwing
(16:17):
lawn darts at Scott's hangingbody.
Stephanie (16:20):
Oh, so that's how we got there.
Yeah.
Y'all were out of fuckingcontrol.
Dani (16:28):
I just, I can't even process this evening.
Like, the, from start to finish,no.
Like, how did we get here?
Evans was instructed to helpcarry the two bodies out of the
house.
One was in a blue sleeping bag,and Gibson carried a red
sleeping bag into the van.
(16:49):
Evans said he did not know ifKimberly was dead, but believed
she was.
She was dead.
She was.
Paradis told him that he wasgoing to have to help get rid of
the bodies.
Gibson drove Scott's van withParadis and Evans to the Post
Falls area.
Gibson grabbed the red sleepingbag and told Evans to drag the
(17:10):
blue sleeping bag out of sight,which he did.
Stephanie (17:14):
Well, not well.
Dani (17:16):
No, I just don't.
Kimberly ends up outside of thesleeping bag.
And that's
Stephanie (17:25):
No, that's suspicious to me because I feel like
someone took her out to violateher again.
It's my thinking.
I don't, I'll never know.
Dani (17:36):
While he was moving that sleeping bag, he heard a crash
and saw that the van wasoverturned.
They did it on purpose, guys.
They tipped over the van onpurpose.
It didn't stall.
It didn't break down.
Stephanie (17:51):
They wanted it to look like a wreck, like, like
someone gets puncture woundsfrom lawn darts and dies out of
a
Dani (17:57):
Maybe they thought it was gonna roll way far down in a
ravine.
Stephanie (18:01):
They thought that they could, yeah.
Dani (18:02):
Superhuman strength like Hulk off the side of a mountain.
No, bro.
We'll
Stephanie (18:06):
never find the vehicle that we used to dispose
of the bodies because this wasthe ex girlfriends who clearly
didn't want the van.
They're like if we just tosseverything.
Yeah, let's go.
Dani (18:18):
The three men then walked to Post Falls with their baby
gun.
Evans denied he owned the bluehat.
The jury deliberated for almosta day and returned the verdict
of not guilty.
Stephanie (18:32):
Must have been very convincing.
Dani (18:33):
In a statement, the jury said that they did not believe
Evans was innocent, but theycould not find him guilty of
committing the crime in Idaho.
Stephanie (18:42):
Right.
Finally! That is a tough, whenis she dead?
And where is she dead?
Dani (18:48):
Finally! Evans is extradited to Washington to face
charges in Scott's murder.
So they're gonna try it again.
1988, Evans trial for the murderof Scott starts in February.
The jury deliberated for 14hours over three days before
they found Evans guilty ofsecond degree murder.
(19:11):
He is sentenced to 12 and a halfyears in prison.
Evans will end up spending 10years.
Stephanie (19:17):
That's still a very low sentence.
I mean, 10 years?
And he's had six years free?
Like, all right.
Dani (19:29):
All right.
Let's talk about some of theissues that are being brought up
on these appeals.
Stephanie (19:34):
I'm sure there's gonna be appeals.
Dani (19:36):
There's a ton of appeals.
Exponential appeals.
One issue is the testimony ofDr.
Brady.
He conducted the autopsies onScott and Kimberly.
He testified in Gibson andParadis's trial.
He said he believed Kimberly wasalive when she arrived in Idaho.
(19:58):
Dr.
Brady also said Kimberly hadwater in her lungs from the
creek where she was found.
He said the ligature mark onKimberly's neck was from her
necklace.
And was not fatal, and that itwasn't, by a piece of heavy
wire.
What was glossed over at trialwas a tear wound on Kimberly's,
(20:20):
near her crotch area.
It was inflicted after Kimberlydied because it did not bleed at
all.
Remember we were just talkingabout getting out of the
sleeping bag?
Stephanie (20:29):
Yeah, yeah.
Dani (20:32):
Pictures also showed Kimberly had blood on her left
nostril and ear, even though herhead had been submerged in the
water.
Despite this, Dr.
Brady testified in 1981 thatKimberly died in the creek after
being strangled and had beentossed alive into the creek
where she inhaled some creekwater.
Several years after the trial,Dr.
(20:53):
Brady was investigated.
He was placed on administrativeleave for selling body parts to
other laboratories.
Stephanie (21:00):
What in the literal hell?
Dani (21:03):
What?
You should see my face when I'mresearching this shit.
He collected money from thesebody parts to buy new lab
equipment for the Oregon office.
No criminal charges were broughtbecause there is no evidence
Brady profited personally.
He did end up suing for wrongfultermination.
Stephanie (21:24):
You're selling people's body parts.
I don't care if it's for labequipment for the greater You're
like, I am buying lab equipmentfor an underprivileged school,
whatever the fuck.
I'm gonna
Dani (21:34):
take your grandmother's, uh.
You
Stephanie (21:36):
cannot do that.
This is why, like, when you getyour license, they ask if you
want to donate your organs.
And dead bodies have rights.
People can't take your organs,even if someone is in desperate
need of it.
If you've said no.
They cannot take it.
If you want to do it, youcertainly can.
(21:58):
You cannot be selling people'sorgans.
Where, where are you findingbuyers, you fucking weirdo?
From other labs.
Other labs?
Or is it fucking weird people?
Who knows?
Who are you selling them to?
Dani (22:13):
Possibly.
Stephanie (22:15):
Some weirdo that wants, like, a fucking amputated
leg or something?
Oh, I can't, okay.
Sorry, that's, that's wild tome.
Dani (22:28):
One lab assistant said, When Brady learned a defense
appointed pathologist wouldreview his autopsy work, Brady
reopened the body and mutilatedseveral internal organs.
Stephanie (22:40):
Okay, so, so now you're like, Oh, I'm being
investigated, I better fuck thisup?
Like, what?
Yeah,
Dani (22:45):
no, he's like, uh, Fuck these people, I am right.
And so, I'm gonna just make itso they, they can't say
anything, yeah, mm hmm.
Stephanie (22:55):
Brady, you sound like a shitty person,
Dani (22:58):
dude.
In the Paratus trial, Dr.
Brady said fluid found inKimberly's lungs showed she
aspirated in the creek.
But in the later Evans trial, hesaid that that, it was just as
likely she did not aspirate inany creek water.
Make up your fucking mind, dude.
Brady Her lungs, while heavy,was still within normal range.
(23:20):
There was no work done to provethat she had any creak organisms
in her lungs, so no test forrun.
He also testified in the Evanstrial that it was possible
Kimberly had died before Scott.
So
Stephanie (23:34):
once again, Idaho overzealous and ready to, ready
to do it with.
Dani (23:40):
They just, he just What attorneys are not checking on
his previous testimony?
Stephanie (23:46):
Or bringing in, bringing in their own experts.
Dani (23:50):
We're going to get to that.
While testifying in the GibsonImperatives Trial, he said Scott
had died way before Kimberly.
And so he's just all over theplace.
This was brought about becauseof some color photos of the
autopsy.
These photos were not produceduntil after the original trial
and only came up in one of theappeals.
Stephanie (24:12):
They were just hanging out somewhere and were
never included.
Black and
Dani (24:15):
whites are fine.
Stephanie (24:16):
Cool, that's great.
This is the 80s, like, colorphotos are a thing.
Dani (24:22):
No, they, they did the whole trial with black and white
photos.
What
Stephanie (24:26):
the fuck are we even doing here?
Like there is so much fuckerygoing on that I don't even, I
don't even know what to writedown.
Like, fuckery, everything'sfucked.
Dani (24:38):
Everything's fucked.
That's what Steph's writing inher notebook.
I'm gonna write it.
And then also, and these appeal,we have para's attorney, bill
Brown, poor Bill.
He was a police officer for 20years and then went back to
college to get his law degree.
He was so new as.
(24:59):
Attorney that he hadn't evenargued a speeding ticket in
front of a judge
Stephanie (25:03):
and he went for a first degree murder
Dani (25:08):
Well, you know, they probably had two fucking
attorneys in that County sothey're
Stephanie (25:12):
like he's what we got
Dani (25:14):
So we are jumping up a bit we are in 1996 Paradis gets a
hearing in front of the IdahoCommission on Pardon and Paroles
This fuckin blows my mind, bythe way.
Fuck court.
We're just gonna go to Pardonsand Pearls.
Stephanie (25:32):
Is this like a special thing, like, clemency
type?
Yeah.
You want to put your name?
He still has
Dani (25:39):
appeals in though.
Stephanie (25:41):
Like, like, let's just skip all that.
Let's just, let's do everything.
I mean, sure.
Dani (25:47):
He is looking for them to to commute his death sentence to
life in prison.
Four medical pathologiststestify that Kimberly did not
die in Idaho.
Utah Chief Medical Examiner ToddGray stated, Quote, we found it
very disturbing that Mr.
(26:07):
Paradis was convicted on suchspeculative and frankly
incorrect evidence.
Okay.
Fuck you, Brady.
He caused a lot of these
Stephanie (26:16):
problems.
Well, and, listen, even if, I,I'm, I'm totally acknowledging
that she may or may not havedied in Idaho.
But, when these fourpathologists or experts, without
the body there, what do you haveto go off?
Dani (26:39):
So one of the the biggest things There's there's more to
come by the way But one of thebiggest things is the cut that
was on her labia that they foundit She had her jeans on but
there was no blood on her jeansfrom that cut Which means, it
(27:00):
happened, she was dead, she wasdead, when that happened.
So, that's a big chunk, butyou're gonna hear a little.
What a
Stephanie (27:10):
terrible, like, no matter who's guilty, innocent,
or whatever, like this wholenight of fucking terror, and
especially for her, and to,like, sickening.
Dani (27:23):
It really is.
we're gonna hear a little bitmore about some of that stuff
later on.
Gibson also testifies forParadis.
Gibson started off byimmediately declaring his
dislike for Paradis.
He's like, I don't like thisguy, but I'm going to tell you
the truth.
Maybe.
(27:44):
And then he said, I don't know.
I don't, I don't know what tobelieve from this guy.
But he, he said that Paradis didnot kill Kimberly.
Gibson said he might have killedher, but did not take clear
responsibility for it.
Quote, it was wrong whathappened for Mr.
Paradis to be executed forsomething he didn't do.
wasn't involved in would bewrong again.
(28:07):
I've made enough wrong decisionsin my life.
I don't expect forgiveness and Idon't forgive myself.
The State Commission on Pardonsand Paroles recommended that
Governor Phil Back commutepaired as a sentence.
It is a rare recommendationdecided on a 32 vote.
The governor has 30 days todecide.
(28:29):
Deputy Attorney General LynnThomas said, quote, I find it
inconceivable that the work ofeight courts spanning 15 years
could be set aside on the basisof six hours worth of testimony
not subject to crossexamination.
Stephanie (28:46):
Fair.
That is fair, because I mean,we've, there's been hundreds of
hours outside of this, and nowwe're going to take this.
Six hours to provide clemency oryeah, you
Dani (29:00):
commute a sentence So good point on May 25th Governor BAT
says there are too many doubtsto justify Paradis's execution
and commuted his sentence tolife in prison and of course all
of the All of the federalappeals regarding the death
sentence are dropped becauseit's no longer a death
Stephanie (29:19):
penalty case.
No death penalty.
Dani (29:21):
Sure, sure, sure.
So, uh,
Stephanie (29:26):
yeah, just like that.
Dani (29:28):
1998.
Guess who's getting married?
Gibson?
No, he's already married.
Paradis and Vanessa Sanford getmarried in the visitation room
of the Idaho State CorrectionalInstitution.
Aww.
How very romantic.
I'm sure they met.
She was probably a spiritualadvisor.
I'm not for sure.
Stephanie (29:49):
You spiritual women out here.
Love ya, but why are we Why arewe picking up men in the
prisons?
Stop, please.
Dani (30:00):
Also in 1998, Gibson has his conviction overturned by a
federal judge.
Stephanie (30:05):
Okay.
Dani (30:06):
The opinion of the court was ineffective counsel.
Gibson's attorney Mike Frablefailed to adequately refute the
state's medical expert Brady.
Idaho's ordered to eitherrelease Gibson or retry him.
In 1999, Paradis gets a hearingfor a new trial.
(30:29):
So not only was he commuted fromthe death penalty to life, he's
also getting he's getting
Stephanie (30:35):
to restart, to even Basically determine his guilt.
Mm hmm.
Okay
Dani (30:44):
in august of 99 the prosecution offers a deal for
gibson in exchange for an alfordplea for the murder of kimberly
Gibson will only have 41 moremonths to spend in prison
Stephanie (30:56):
You know what?
I think that people need to talkabout the alford plea a little
bit more just in general BecauseI think it's a, it's a genuine
plea, and with this and howmessy it is, it's basically
saying, I'm not admitting guilt,but with everything that's
against me, I wouldn't be ableto fight this.
(31:18):
There's no way for me to provemy innocence.
I can't defend it.
There's no way for me to createa reasonable doubt.
And, the Alford plea is, I'm nottrying to praise them, but I
think this is a good strategybecause it's like, in, instead
of him pleading guilty, ifthey're willing to just do this,
(31:41):
Sure.
Like I can see why this was thestrategy.
Dani (31:47):
I agree.
I agree.
Stephanie (31:52):
No, the Alford plea is like, there are situations
where you don't have anythingthat can go on your side and
you're like,
Dani (32:00):
I just,
Stephanie (32:01):
every time I hear the Alford plea, I just think of the
staircase.
The staircase trial.
Yeah, that's an interesting one.
I still don't know how I feel.
I know.
Well, I know how I feel about ittoo, but I can see, I'm
surprised it isn't used
Dani (32:15):
more.
I think also that the standardis, oh, they're just playing
that so they don't have to makeit so much.
I think it's deeper than that.
I do.
I think
Stephanie (32:30):
there's people who are innocent who have used the
alpha plea where they're like.
This is my last, you know, sure,put me in jail.
I didn't do it.
Fine, I'll
Dani (32:40):
do, I'll do 15 years even though I didn't do it.
Not the case in this, of course,you know, with this particular
trial.
Yeah, all for pleaseinteresting.
In 2000, a federal judge clearsthe way for a new trial or
release of Paradis.
Notes from Prosecutor Hawes werenever disclosed to the defense.
(33:04):
His notes showed doubt inBrady's testimony.
His notes said that Brady couldnot determine the time of death
and that Kimberly was notsexually assaulted as claimed,
and probably was dead when herbody was dumped in Idaho.
That's what the prosecutor hadin his notes, but then Brady
(33:25):
testified Completely different.
Ben
Stephanie (33:28):
has flip flops all over the place.
And Ben's selling body parts.
So I'm so your Actual likecharacter comes into play in
that if you're willing to sellpeople's body parts if you're
doing that type of shady shit.
Your credibility is gone.
Like, I'm sorry.
(33:49):
And he should have beendisbarred and gotten the fuck
out because, disgusting.
Dani (33:55):
On April 10th, 2001, after 21 years in prison, Paradis
pleads to a lesser charge and isfree after making a deal with
authorities.
He pleads guilty to being anaccessory to murder for helping
dump Kimberly's body.
The maximum sentence for thatcrime is five years.
Also later that year, inNovember, Paradis is seeking 20
(34:18):
million dollars from the stateof Idaho and Kootenai County.
Which, I, if I was wrongfullyconvicted and spent 21 years in
prison, this was his wholething.
He never had the chance to,build a career.
I mean, there's lots of thingsthat he missed out on, but 20
(34:42):
million's a lot of money.
Stephanie (34:43):
20 million is a lot of money, and here's my thing.
Is all of this could have beenavoided.
I feel like they tried to keepthat bad boy loyalty for way too
long.
Paradis, if you would have justflop, flipped.
If you truly didn't murder orrape a dead body or whatever.
(35:05):
if you were the one that was,you just happened to be there
and you're like, shit, I get it.
I get it.
If someone's murdered someoneelse in, in the same house as
you, and then you're in thisbiker gang mentality and they
say, we got to get rid of thisbody.
You can't be a tattletale rightthen.
(35:28):
You can't be like, guys, this iswrong.
We got to call the police.
You can't leave then.
I, I can understand the dynamicsof that.
But, to then tell Pete, tellyour story and plead out early.
Tell them all the informationthey need to know.
(35:48):
And you could plead out and getFive, 10 years?
Dani (35:53):
Uh, yes, but I don't, I don't think that was ever an
option for, for him, honestly.
Do you remember Rice from, thatlast ca, that, that last, case,
the, yeah, the tattle tail.
Yeah, that's exactly what hedid.
And he ended up spending moretime than the people have
fricking murdered people.
(36:13):
Right.
So honestly, this was a, i thiswas a witch hunt.
It is what it is.
By, by the prosecution.
They wanted, they wanted it all.
They were not, I mean, first ofall.
And they were
Stephanie (36:27):
stretching the truth.
Dani (36:28):
For the Spokane prosecutors to have that trial
all together, you would neversee that today.
Stephanie (36:36):
Ever, ever, ever, ever.
It's just created.
And so fast.
Y'all didn't even try to putyour case together.
Nope.
You guys fucked it up.
This is why all this hashappened decades later.
Dani (36:48):
Yep.
Decades later, in 2002, the veryend of 2002, December 31st,
Gibson, at age 51, is releasedafter 22 years in prison.
All done.
In 2006, in a settlement withKootenai County, they agreed to
pay Paradis 900, 000 forwrongful imprisonment.
Stephanie (37:11):
What was he asking for, 20 million?
Yeah.
Dani (37:15):
And it was like, he got like 50 grand right away, and
then it was like For so manyyears it was like 3, 500 a
month.
Stephanie (37:22):
I have a structured settlement and I need cash now.
Call JG Wentworth 877 CASH NOW.
Sponsor us.
JG.
JG.
We love, we love
Dani (37:38):
your shit, dude.
So, but the fuckery doesn'tstop.
God, I
Stephanie (37:45):
cannot
Dani (37:45):
believe there's more.
So, well these guys are both outof prison, right?
But I'm just telling you this istheir mentality, okay?
And I don't know, in 2011, Sixyear old Gibson is arrested in
California during a sweep of theVagos Motorcycle Club.
Drugs, weapons, and party armorwere seized during the raid.
(38:07):
He is charged with possessingthe marijuana and participating
in criminal activities.
And a criminal streaking.
I don't, I couldn't figure out,there was nothing in the papers
what happened to that, but he'slike,
Stephanie (38:19):
he should have just ran for office.
Truly.
Dani (38:23):
No.
He went back to his gang, oldchief's at
Stephanie (38:26):
it.
He's like, I'm the chief, let'sget her done
Dani (38:29):
back.
So anyway, I just had, I had toinclude that because it's.
It's like, dude, seriously,
Stephanie (38:35):
calm down.
You're 60
Dani (38:36):
years old.
After doing
Stephanie (38:37):
that many years in prison, you're 60 years old.
I would be retiring and learningto crochet.
Find a hobby, bro.
Dani (38:46):
My activities are remote
Stephanie (38:47):
control cars, stained glass,
Dani (38:51):
and coloring with gel pens.
So, we're gonna jet up to 2018.
Okay.
Cause you thought the fuckerywas done.
Stephanie (39:01):
It just keeps going.
Dani (39:04):
At age 69, Paradis is back in court.
In September 2017, Paradis and afriend, Richard Myers, got into
a heated argument in Paradishome.
Richard had been living with theParadises at the time.
During the argument, Richardkicked one of Paradises dogs and
(39:24):
screamed at Paradis and the dog.
Stephanie (39:27):
Don't be kicking someone's dog.
Do
Dani (39:29):
not be kicking somebody's dog.
Stephanie (39:31):
People will be Listen.
Dani (39:34):
Paradis told Richard he needed to sober up and leave.
Peridis then left to the gym andwhen he arrived back home two
hours later, Richard was stillthere, not taking the hint.
Yikes.
Richard basically said, I'm notleaving.
Stephanie (39:52):
Knowing that someone, no matter what actually
happened, knowing this story andthat regardless, everyone was
guilty of some fuckery thatnight, whether it's not saying
anything or actually killingsomeone or beating the shit out
of someone, Or raping a deadbody, knowing that someone had
(40:15):
been involved in that, I don'tcare how long ago it is, that
says to someone's character,maybe if you kicked their dog
and they said you better get thefuck out of there, I'd be like,
you know what, I should probablyleave.
I'm going to sleep in my cartonight or I'm going to find a
motel six.
Richard, what did you do?
You stayed there.
(40:36):
He said, I'm not leaving.
Dani (40:39):
I have tenants rights.
Paradis then shoved a gun in theback of drunk Richard's neck.
Richard was not injured though.
Paradis's attorney, Bill Mock,said it was a pistol that fires
BBs and pellets.
Stephanie (40:57):
I'm sorry.
I don't want to be shot in thehead with a BB.
I know a drunkard should notkick the fucking dog.
Don't
Dani (41:04):
be kicking the dog and don't be shooting BBs at people
like.
And if you're a drunkard stayingat somebody's house, I'm not
defending this guy, it soundslike him, but if you're a
drunkard at somebody's house andthey tell you to leave.
Just go.
Just go.
You gotta go.
Bro, go get a fucking job.
You kicked his dog.
Dude, do not kick my, I would.
I'd throw down.
I know you, and I would too.
(41:27):
A pre sentencing investigatorrecommended probation for
Paradis.
Idaho prosecutors arerecommended 15 years Wow.
That's quite the rage.
parent is, pleads guilty toaggravated assault and the use
of a firearm during a commissionof a crime.
(41:49):
And he is sentenced to 15 yearswith three years fixed.
Stephanie (41:53):
That's wild to me.
15 years and no one was.
He's actually injured.
It was a
Dani (42:00):
BB gun.
Not that they can't injure you,but Jesus, it was a BB gun.
And also, he's a 69 year old,he's an old man.
Well and, you know.
And they kicked his, I'm, my dadwould fucking throw down if
somebody kicked his, he gets hishurt, his feelings hurt if I
make fun of his dog.
He's like,
Stephanie (42:20):
I might bring out a gun, Danny.
You make fun of Rusty one moretime.
He's like, that's my boy.
I'm like, well, your boy's fat,dad.
He said, what?
Somebody get me my pistol.
Dani (42:33):
But currently, you know that three years fixed?
This is in 2018.
Currently, Paradis is 75 andstill in custody at the Idaho
State Correctional InstitutionMedical Annex.
Stephanie (42:45):
I'm sorry, but with viewing everything separately,
like I've said, There wasfuckery every, I think everyone
that was involved in this wholenight was guilty of stuff.
But for him to be exonerated andthen get 15 years when no one
was even injured?
(43:07):
Like, so a lot of people don'tunderstand like if you brandish
a firearm, that's a big Thing,if you brandish a firearm and
there is no, like, fear for yourlife, like a road rage incident,
if you like, pull a gun onsomeone when, after you're
already safe, like say you're inyour neighborhood and you pull a
(43:28):
gun, they can take all yourguns.
You can be on probation orparole for a long time.
It's a felony.
So, so yes, I would understandprobation slash parole, whatever
the fuck you want to call it.
Maybe a year of jail time less.
Dani (43:44):
And he's an old man.
Who was hurt?
Stephanie (43:47):
The dog! Where's the justice
Dani (43:50):
for Fido here?
I'm just saying if somebodykicked my fucking dog, it would
go down.
I just thought it was a littleoverkill.
Stephanie (43:58):
So this is the most recent updates we've got on this
one.
Dani (44:01):
Yeah.
Stephanie (44:03):
Anyway, what a wild ride.
Don't you guys think?
Thank you, Danny, for I just,let me just tell you guys the
amount of research that thistook Dani to even put together.
It hurt me.
You guys heard how much of ashit show it was, right?
It hurt me deep inside.
But she fucking soldieredthrough.
(44:23):
So thank you, Dani.
I hope you guys enjoyed.
Dani (44:27):
I hope that I told you a complete story and if, I mean,
if you have questions, pleasereach out.
Jenny's the pro.
I would love to address thembecause I probably know it in my
brain.
It just might not have made iton, on paper.
Well, and there's some thingsthat are just unknown.
Yeah.
The victims.
There was nothing I found finedeath notices and so and I'm you
(44:50):
know I'm we're at a certainlevel of paying for paywalls So
and I'm sure that there is moreresearch that I could have found
through court systems and allthat stuff But it's money
transcripts is Extremelyexpensive.
So, I'm depending on newspaper.
com.
Statesman, get us through! I didfind that there are several, 60
(45:14):
Minutes did a thing on Paradistrial.
60 Minutes 2, by the way.
Didn't even know that was athing.
unable to locate the, the video.
It's floating out theresomewhere.
The New Yorker did a hugearticle on it, which I decided
not to read because it's a 13,000 word article.
(45:35):
Big ol page.
And I found that very late in myresearch, and so I chose not to
read that, but that is availabletoo.
but there's, but then there'sjust, so you get stuff like that
and then there's nothing onthese victims.
If you guys
Stephanie (45:47):
read that stuff and find contesting info, we're
interested in it.
I will apologize like amotherfucker.
We're not reporting the news.
We're reporting on what wefound.
Like this is how we put ittogether.
Dani (46:00):
Motorcycle gangs and I'm telling you, those Lich wishes
that he would, he's like man, doyou know they're all in prison
together and Creech is like, Godbro, I wish I could be just like
you.
He's like,
Stephanie (46:13):
I was in 17 gangs all across the United States, and
they're like, no, we heard aboutyou, you fucking poser ass
bitch.
Dani (46:21):
I'm Mr.
Nationwide, and Gibson's like,really, no.
Stephanie (46:25):
You don't have any idea, bro.
None.
Anyway, another great episode.
Thank you, Dani.
I know how much work this onewas.
Follow us on Facebook,Instagram.
Our TikTok is up.
We hope you love it.
We hope
Dani (46:40):
TikTok stays.
we would love to get to thepoint where we could do a live.
So, so invite your friends
Stephanie (46:47):
to follow repost our stuff.
Yes.
We just need, how many, is it?
500 followers.
That's what I've heard.
We're 111 followers.
Thank you to each and every oneof y'all that have followed us.
We're, we're so stoked aboutthat.
So we're
Dani (47:01):
20% there.
Yes, we can do it.
We can do it.
Folks.
We would love to do a live.
That would be
Stephanie (47:06):
awesome.
For any questions, comments,concerns, you can email the
lethal library.com or justcomment on our post Risa.
We see you.
this episode, unfortunately foryou, was over the top with the
language.
Our apologies, Risa.
Apologies again.
(47:26):
We're trying.
I don't know if we'll ever meetyour standard, but we love you,
Risa.
Thank you.
Dani (47:34):
Alright, guys.
Thank you so much.
Love you.
Bye.
10 4, rubber ducky.
Fuck yeah.
outro
Welcome back to the LethalLibrary.
Today we are going over part twoof our motorcycle gang case.
We'll be discussing Paradistrial, Moline's testimony, we're
going to find out what reallyhappened to Igor, aka Evans, and
of course all of the appeals,appeals, appeals.
So Danny's going to start us offwith the trial for Paradis.
Dani (00:51):
An early December Paradis is on trial.
There's a lot of the sametestimony as Gibson's trial.
But we do have a defensewitness.
Remember Aria Beaver?
Yes.
She testified she was withParadis from 1 a.
m.
to 7 30 a.
m.
on June 21st.
She said she had met.
(01:12):
Now she knows the day.
She remembers.
Well, maybe, maybe she got thosedrugs cleared out of her system.
She said she had met Paradis atPeople's Park in Spokane the
afternoon before and that afterleaving three other people to
stay at Paradis's house thatmorning.
He came with her to her house,so.
Everyone's popping their pussyat people's parties.
Stephanie (01:34):
Let's go! This is a happening place.
Dani (01:43):
Fucking wild, dude.
Okay, she testified in theWashington trial, but was unsure
what day it was with Paradis.
Now her memory is clear.
Another witness for the defense,pathologist Charles P.
Larson, testified that the fluidin Kimberly's lungs was in the
back, indicating she died on herback.
(02:03):
The jury deliberated for fourhours before they found Paradis
guilty of first degree murder.
They said, yeah, anyway, you'refucking
Stephanie (02:13):
dead.
Dani (02:13):
Don't give a fuck.
That guy, uh, you know who'smissing from both these trials?
Moline, she was, I feel likeshe, I don't think she refused
to testify.
I just think that there was toomuch
Stephanie (02:30):
shit show
Dani (02:31):
happening.
They just were
Stephanie (02:32):
like, they left themselves at a disadvantage of
not being able to offer heranything there.
I feel like they could havepicked that up here and been
like, listen, how about we justin Idaho, we'll just say, put
you in witness protection ormake sure there's no federal
charges.
I wonder if she was offeredanything.
(02:53):
I,
Dani (02:53):
I don't know.
Stephanie (02:54):
Maybe they felt they had a strong enough case.
They were like, yeah, we don'teven need Moline.
This is too much of a
Dani (03:01):
clusterfuck.
I kind of feel like it was morethan that.
Like let's not make a mess here.
I mean, really?
Six hours?
It's been very messy.
Six hours total jurydeliberation.
We have two death penalties.
Stephanie (03:12):
Yeah, I did it.
So,
Dani (03:14):
but 1982, a few months later, Rosanna Moline decides to
tell her story.
During a hearing for Peridus.
Peridus has not, I'm gonna, Iknow it's already in my nose.
He has not even been Technicallyconvicted.
I mean he's been convicted ofthe murder, but he hasn't been
sentenced and they're alreadytrying to get him a new trial
(03:38):
Until she's coming to hissentencing to say something.
Yeah, Moline.
No, not the sentencing.
This is a hearing for a newtrial and he hasn't even been
sentenced.
It hurt my brain.
I'm like, wait, did I misssomething?
What's happening?
Moline told Judge Gary HammondThat she did not see Kimberly
die.
(03:58):
Gibson, quote, picked her up offthe ground by the throat and I
heard Kim choke.
She made a horrible noise.
Stephanie (04:06):
This is the death
Dani (04:07):
rattle.
Mmm, and hours later, she sawGibson attempting sexual
intercourse with emotionalistKim on the floor of the Spokane
home.
Stephanie (04:17):
Okay, and so Mauline is trying to help who?
Dani (04:23):
Paradis.
Okay, so she's
Stephanie (04:25):
putting,
Dani (04:27):
this is, this is, yeah, this is, there's a lot of Kim.
This is a hearing for Paradistrying to get a new trial before
he's even sentenced.
She also denied that she wastold.
So one of the stories that, thathad come about early that was
false, and that's why I didn'tput it in this, put it in this.
(04:47):
But there was storiescirculating that her and
Kimberly were putting her, putin a room and told to turn the
music up really loud while theywere beating Scott.
So she denied this.
She denied that she was told toturn up the stereo in order to
drown out the screams of Scott.
(05:08):
She was ordered to clean up theblood in the kitchen and that
Paradis, Gibson, Evans, andAmacher were present during
Scott's beating.
Still missing Igor.
She said she had returned toParadis's house where she had
been staying late June 20th.
She found Scott sitting alone inthe kitchen.
(05:28):
Scott told her to get out.
This isn't even Scott's house.
He's like, get out of here.
That's just drugs written allover it.
She then walked into theadjoined living room.
Kimberly was sitting on thecouch.
A few minutes later, she sawGibson in the kitchen arguing
with Scott.
Kim told her, quote, Scott waspretty upset there were some
(05:49):
guns that were missing.
He had to come talk to DonParadis about it.
While Moline and Kim weretalking, someone shut the door
between the living room and thekitchen, and then she heard a
loud noise, like something hadhit the floor or wall.
The stereo was playing, but shecould still hear over the music.
(06:10):
Gibson then came into the roomand told Moline and Kim to go
into a bedroom in another partof the house.
Listen,
Stephanie (06:27):
I've had a past of my own and I could see something
like this, I've been insituations kind of similar to
this where it's like, Oh,someone's getting beat up.
They're gonna get beat up andyou you're in survival mode.
You're just like okay What do Ineed to do to not get the shit
(06:48):
beat out of me and hopefullywalk out of here and I'll fix
them later yeah, if we'reoutnumbered and there's nothing
we can do about our stolen gunsthen take your licks and We'll
get out of here later I feellike that's how this started.
Dani (07:07):
It's weird to me.
Mind blowing.
Stephanie (07:09):
Yeah.
Dani (07:11):
Malene and Kimberly stayed in the bedroom for hours,
talking about things from theGrateful Dead to astrology.
Drugs.
That's
Stephanie (07:19):
drugs.
Dani (07:20):
Around 4 AM, Gibson called from the hallway.
Quote, Kim, come out and takeyour old man home now.
Kim led the way out of thebedroom, and as she reached a
doorway, Gibson grabbed her.
Stephanie (07:47):
This is all, being crack headedly planned
throughout the night, People arelike, keep her in here for a
minute.
Oh, go.
Okay, now we're gonna bring herout.
This is all completecrackheadness.
Dani (08:03):
Jesus.
In April, Paradis is alsosentenced to death.
Stephanie (08:09):
Idaho, they get it done.
Yeah, brother.
1984, Paradis is planning tomarry Betty Martinson on
September 22nd.
Who the fuck is Betty?
I know! But the good ol warden,Arvon Arave,
Dani (08:26):
Arave makes his, says,
Stephanie (08:29):
uh uh, nope, he puts his Arave is
Dani (08:31):
anti marriage.
He's
Stephanie (08:32):
like, you fucks.
Well, once you're convicted, Imean we went through this with
Creech, you have no rights.
No.
Uh, Betty was.
Be a spiritual
Dani (08:42):
partner.
Stephanie (08:43):
That will get you more.
Betty was Paradis spiritualadvisor before becoming his
fiancée.
These bitches be thinkin they'resneaky.
Why would you ruin it?
So visitation is now out.
Betty Martinson.
had known Paris since September83 when she met him through
(09:04):
another inmate.
I'm just Who is introducingpeople to They
Dani (09:10):
had like a newspaper ads or something.
It was basically the TikTokinmate system.
Pen pals.
Stephanie (09:23):
In,
Dani (09:24):
So in 1985, Gibson gives a telephone interview to a
reporter at the Spokesman Reviewconfessing he killed Kimberly.
Whoopsie.
Fuckin his attorneys was like,Alright.
He said that Paradis had nothingto do with the murder.
He stated, quote, I'm sorry Donis down here.
(09:48):
He didn't kill anyone.
Gibson is now saying afterKimberly saw the carnage of
Scott's beating, she quote blewit.
She came out of there and Igrabbed her around the throat
with this wire.
After I pulled her to the floor,I put my fingers on her throat
(10:08):
when she was drugged by Evansfrom the living room to the
kitchen.
Dawn showed up later and she wasdead by then for sure.
Stephanie (10:15):
They brutally fucked him up and her.
You're waiting there with awire.
You were never gonna let herleave.
This was planned.
Dani (10:26):
Dawn was not there at all.
I know that for a fact.
I grabbed her.
I kicked her.
She wasn't moving.
When Dawn came back, quote, hewas upset as hell.
Stephanie (10:37):
Okay, sure.
Like There's dead bodies in hishouse.
And this is an hours longundertaking.
Oh yeah.
She was in there with hours withUntil 4
Dani (10:47):
o'clock in the morning, I, what, I'm, they left the hotel
at a quarter to one, or theywere at the hotel a quarter to
one, so by the time they gotover there it was probably,
let's even just be generous andsay 1.
30, it took them 45 minutes,which I highly doubt.
So, several hours.
Stephanie (11:01):
Yeah, this was all going down in a drug fueled
fuckery.
Dani (11:08):
Almacher Chucker passes away in 1985.
From what?
I don't know! I couldn't findit.
Sorry.
Be gone.
So we're into 1986.
On July 21st, Lawrence Evans, a.
k.
a.
Igor, is located in BlueSprings, Missouri when he is
Stephanie (11:35):
Um, wow, I'm surprised they ever found him
because like how they were ableto find everyone else so easily.
Igor was out here justgallivanting.
Dani (11:46):
The FBI located him through a pair of speeding
citations he had received underhis alias Billy Ray Harkins.
The SWAT team rushed the home at730 in the morning.
Evans walked out of his garagecarrying garden tools when he
was captured.
Stephanie (12:05):
Who has garden tools in their hand at 7 30 a.
m.
What the fuck are we doing here?
Dani (12:10):
Who has garden tools when Evans was using crutches?
He was not able to run.
He had been in a motorcyclewreck that caused the amputation
of one of his legs below theknee.
God damn!
Stephanie (12:26):
You're not running from the cops now, are ya?
No,
Dani (12:29):
no, he wasn't running anywhere.
He's gonna go do a littlegardening.
What?
He finds extradition back toIdaho, but finally arrives in
November.
Stephanie (12:39):
Welcome.
Dani (12:41):
Washington has taken a back seat to this because, you
know.
Stephanie (12:44):
Clearly, they're like, Idaho somehow gets it
done.
And listen, I'm not saying it'sright, but Idaho.
Was basically like we will giveyou the death penalty for just
it's gonna happen like we'regonna we're gonna make it happen
Even if it's unconstitutionalAnd we'll pay for it for decades
(13:05):
So
Dani (13:05):
they're like sure Idaho I know has charged Evans with
first degree murder and onceagain the death penalty is on
the table 1987 the trial forEvans starts in August Evans
gave his account of the murdersLet's hear it.
The hat that was found underKimberly's body was examined.
(13:29):
Defense witness, criminologist,Carol Murin, testified most of
the hairs were dissimilar toEvans.
Evans says, that's not my hat.
Okay.
Evans even takes a stand in hisdefense.
Wow.
I just feel like people don't dothat as much now.
(13:49):
Like, Oh no.
They were defending to defend.
They were, they were going toget up there and say something.
Stephanie (13:55):
They had to.
Dani (13:56):
And that did not work out well for
Stephanie (13:58):
them.
I feel like people have learnedthat even if you're innocent,
it's, do not, not always a goodidea unless you can provide
something that isn't providedwith the evidence.
What it's all what you say andwhat you say
Dani (14:13):
and what you open yeah what you open yourself up to to
Yeah, he stated quote.
I didn't kill Kimberly Palmer.
I didn't intend her or anyone toget killed He also testified
that he did nothing to preventthe murders He admitted to
helping hide the bodies and thenwas on the run for six years He
(14:35):
also said quote what I'd done isnot do anything And I've had to
live with that.
On June 21st, 1980, Evans andParadis arrived at Paradis home
around 2.
30 in the morning.
They saw three men sitting inthe kitchen.
Scott, Gibson, and a mocker.
Evans knew there had alreadybeen a fight because Scott's
(14:59):
eyes and lips were beginning toswell.
Another fight started, andParadis told Evans to wait on
the porch to make sure no onecomes in.
You have to remember at thistime Evans was a, prospect for
this gypsy joker motorcyclegame.
He's trying to get in.
He's trying to get in.
So he's just doing what he'stold.
(15:19):
He's like, sure, I'll, I'll bethe lookout.
Yep.
Out front.
Sure.
An hour later, Evans was calledback inside the house and saw
Scott bloody beaten and mostlikely dead.
He did not see Kimberly, butshe, he knew she was inside.
They instructed Evans to leaveand get advice from other
motorcycle club leaders.
(15:42):
Okay.
When Evans returned to letParadis know that other leaders
did not want to get involved.
Stephanie (15:48):
They said, oh, you've got two dead bodies.
Why would you tell us that?
Shh.
Dani (15:53):
Don't know nothing.
He saw Gibson in the hallwaywith his pants down on top of
Kimberly's body.
Disgusting.
He said, quote, I don't knowexactly what he was doing.
I don't know if he was raping alive or a dead body.
Either way, you know, sir, it'ssomething.
Evanson went to the basement andsaw Paradis and Amaker throwing
(16:17):
lawn darts at Scott's hangingbody.
Stephanie (16:20):
Oh, so that's how we got there.
Yeah.
Y'all were out of fuckingcontrol.
Dani (16:28):
I just, I can't even process this evening.
Like, the, from start to finish,no.
Like, how did we get here?
Evans was instructed to helpcarry the two bodies out of the
house.
One was in a blue sleeping bag,and Gibson carried a red
sleeping bag into the van.
(16:49):
Evans said he did not know ifKimberly was dead, but believed
she was.
She was dead.
She was.
Paradis told him that he wasgoing to have to help get rid of
the bodies.
Gibson drove Scott's van withParadis and Evans to the Post
Falls area.
Gibson grabbed the red sleepingbag and told Evans to drag the
(17:10):
blue sleeping bag out of sight,which he did.
Stephanie (17:14):
Well, not well.
Dani (17:16):
No, I just don't.
Kimberly ends up outside of thesleeping bag.
And that's
Stephanie (17:25):
No, that's suspicious to me because I feel like
someone took her out to violateher again.
It's my thinking.
I don't, I'll never know.
Dani (17:36):
While he was moving that sleeping bag, he heard a crash
and saw that the van wasoverturned.
They did it on purpose, guys.
They tipped over the van onpurpose.
It didn't stall.
It didn't break down.
Stephanie (17:51):
They wanted it to look like a wreck, like, like
someone gets puncture woundsfrom lawn darts and dies out of
a
Dani (17:57):
Maybe they thought it was gonna roll way far down in a
ravine.
Stephanie (18:01):
They thought that they could, yeah.
Dani (18:02):
Superhuman strength like Hulk off the side of a mountain.
No, bro.
We'll
Stephanie (18:06):
never find the vehicle that we used to dispose
of the bodies because this wasthe ex girlfriends who clearly
didn't want the van.
They're like if we just tosseverything.
Yeah, let's go.
Dani (18:18):
The three men then walked to Post Falls with their baby
gun.
Evans denied he owned the bluehat.
The jury deliberated for almosta day and returned the verdict
of not guilty.
Stephanie (18:32):
Must have been very convincing.
Dani (18:33):
In a statement, the jury said that they did not believe
Evans was innocent, but theycould not find him guilty of
committing the crime in Idaho.
Stephanie (18:42):
Right.
Finally! That is a tough, whenis she dead?
And where is she dead?
Dani (18:48):
Finally! Evans is extradited to Washington to face
charges in Scott's murder.
So they're gonna try it again.
1988, Evans trial for the murderof Scott starts in February.
The jury deliberated for 14hours over three days before
they found Evans guilty ofsecond degree murder.
(19:11):
He is sentenced to 12 and a halfyears in prison.
Evans will end up spending 10years.
Stephanie (19:17):
That's still a very low sentence.
I mean, 10 years?
And he's had six years free?
Like, all right.
Dani (19:29):
All right.
Let's talk about some of theissues that are being brought up
on these appeals.
Stephanie (19:34):
I'm sure there's gonna be appeals.
Dani (19:36):
There's a ton of appeals.
Exponential appeals.
One issue is the testimony ofDr.
Brady.
He conducted the autopsies onScott and Kimberly.
He testified in Gibson andParadis's trial.
He said he believed Kimberly wasalive when she arrived in Idaho.
(19:58):
Dr.
Brady also said Kimberly hadwater in her lungs from the
creek where she was found.
He said the ligature mark onKimberly's neck was from her
necklace.
And was not fatal, and that itwasn't, by a piece of heavy
wire.
What was glossed over at trialwas a tear wound on Kimberly's,
(20:20):
near her crotch area.
It was inflicted after Kimberlydied because it did not bleed at
all.
Remember we were just talkingabout getting out of the
sleeping bag?
Stephanie (20:29):
Yeah, yeah.
Dani (20:32):
Pictures also showed Kimberly had blood on her left
nostril and ear, even though herhead had been submerged in the
water.
Despite this, Dr.
Brady testified in 1981 thatKimberly died in the creek after
being strangled and had beentossed alive into the creek
where she inhaled some creekwater.
Several years after the trial,Dr.
(20:53):
Brady was investigated.
He was placed on administrativeleave for selling body parts to
other laboratories.
Stephanie (21:00):
What in the literal hell?
Dani (21:03):
What?
You should see my face when I'mresearching this shit.
He collected money from thesebody parts to buy new lab
equipment for the Oregon office.
No criminal charges were broughtbecause there is no evidence
Brady profited personally.
He did end up suing for wrongfultermination.
Stephanie (21:24):
You're selling people's body parts.
I don't care if it's for labequipment for the greater You're
like, I am buying lab equipmentfor an underprivileged school,
whatever the fuck.
I'm gonna
Dani (21:34):
take your grandmother's, uh.
You
Stephanie (21:36):
cannot do that.
This is why, like, when you getyour license, they ask if you
want to donate your organs.
And dead bodies have rights.
People can't take your organs,even if someone is in desperate
need of it.
If you've said no.
They cannot take it.
If you want to do it, youcertainly can.
(21:58):
You cannot be selling people'sorgans.
Where, where are you findingbuyers, you fucking weirdo?
From other labs.
Other labs?
Or is it fucking weird people?
Who knows?
Who are you selling them to?
Dani (22:13):
Possibly.
Stephanie (22:15):
Some weirdo that wants, like, a fucking amputated
leg or something?
Oh, I can't, okay.
Sorry, that's, that's wild tome.
Dani (22:28):
One lab assistant said, When Brady learned a defense
appointed pathologist wouldreview his autopsy work, Brady
reopened the body and mutilatedseveral internal organs.
Stephanie (22:40):
Okay, so, so now you're like, Oh, I'm being
investigated, I better fuck thisup?
Like, what?
Yeah,
Dani (22:45):
no, he's like, uh, Fuck these people, I am right.
And so, I'm gonna just make itso they, they can't say
anything, yeah, mm hmm.
Stephanie (22:55):
Brady, you sound like a shitty person,
Dani (22:58):
dude.
In the Paratus trial, Dr.
Brady said fluid found inKimberly's lungs showed she
aspirated in the creek.
But in the later Evans trial, hesaid that that, it was just as
likely she did not aspirate inany creek water.
Make up your fucking mind, dude.
Brady Her lungs, while heavy,was still within normal range.
(23:20):
There was no work done to provethat she had any creak organisms
in her lungs, so no test forrun.
He also testified in the Evanstrial that it was possible
Kimberly had died before Scott.
So
Stephanie (23:34):
once again, Idaho overzealous and ready to, ready
to do it with.
Dani (23:40):
They just, he just What attorneys are not checking on
his previous testimony?
Stephanie (23:46):
Or bringing in, bringing in their own experts.
Dani (23:50):
We're going to get to that.
While testifying in the GibsonImperatives Trial, he said Scott
had died way before Kimberly.
And so he's just all over theplace.
This was brought about becauseof some color photos of the
autopsy.
These photos were not produceduntil after the original trial
and only came up in one of theappeals.
Stephanie (24:12):
They were just hanging out somewhere and were
never included.
Black and
Dani (24:15):
whites are fine.
Stephanie (24:16):
Cool, that's great.
This is the 80s, like, colorphotos are a thing.
Dani (24:22):
No, they, they did the whole trial with black and white
photos.
What
Stephanie (24:26):
the fuck are we even doing here?
Like there is so much fuckerygoing on that I don't even, I
don't even know what to writedown.
Like, fuckery, everything'sfucked.
Dani (24:38):
Everything's fucked.
That's what Steph's writing inher notebook.
I'm gonna write it.
And then also, and these appeal,we have para's attorney, bill
Brown, poor Bill.
He was a police officer for 20years and then went back to
college to get his law degree.
He was so new as.
(24:59):
Attorney that he hadn't evenargued a speeding ticket in
front of a judge
Stephanie (25:03):
and he went for a first degree murder
Dani (25:08):
Well, you know, they probably had two fucking
attorneys in that County sothey're
Stephanie (25:12):
like he's what we got
Dani (25:14):
So we are jumping up a bit we are in 1996 Paradis gets a
hearing in front of the IdahoCommission on Pardon and Paroles
This fuckin blows my mind, bythe way.
Fuck court.
We're just gonna go to Pardonsand Pearls.
Stephanie (25:32):
Is this like a special thing, like, clemency
type?
Yeah.
You want to put your name?
He still has
Dani (25:39):
appeals in though.
Stephanie (25:41):
Like, like, let's just skip all that.
Let's just, let's do everything.
I mean, sure.
Dani (25:47):
He is looking for them to to commute his death sentence to
life in prison.
Four medical pathologiststestify that Kimberly did not
die in Idaho.
Utah Chief Medical Examiner ToddGray stated, Quote, we found it
very disturbing that Mr.
(26:07):
Paradis was convicted on suchspeculative and frankly
incorrect evidence.
Okay.
Fuck you, Brady.
He caused a lot of these
Stephanie (26:16):
problems.
Well, and, listen, even if, I,I'm, I'm totally acknowledging
that she may or may not havedied in Idaho.
But, when these fourpathologists or experts, without
the body there, what do you haveto go off?
Dani (26:39):
So one of the the biggest things There's there's more to
come by the way But one of thebiggest things is the cut that
was on her labia that they foundit She had her jeans on but
there was no blood on her jeansfrom that cut Which means, it
(27:00):
happened, she was dead, she wasdead, when that happened.
So, that's a big chunk, butyou're gonna hear a little.
What a
Stephanie (27:10):
terrible, like, no matter who's guilty, innocent,
or whatever, like this wholenight of fucking terror, and
especially for her, and to,like, sickening.
Dani (27:23):
It really is.
we're gonna hear a little bitmore about some of that stuff
later on.
Gibson also testifies forParadis.
Gibson started off byimmediately declaring his
dislike for Paradis.
He's like, I don't like thisguy, but I'm going to tell you
the truth.
Maybe.
(27:44):
And then he said, I don't know.
I don't, I don't know what tobelieve from this guy.
But he, he said that Paradis didnot kill Kimberly.
Gibson said he might have killedher, but did not take clear
responsibility for it.
Quote, it was wrong whathappened for Mr.
Paradis to be executed forsomething he didn't do.
wasn't involved in would bewrong again.
(28:07):
I've made enough wrong decisionsin my life.
I don't expect forgiveness and Idon't forgive myself.
The State Commission on Pardonsand Paroles recommended that
Governor Phil Back commutepaired as a sentence.
It is a rare recommendationdecided on a 32 vote.
The governor has 30 days todecide.
(28:29):
Deputy Attorney General LynnThomas said, quote, I find it
inconceivable that the work ofeight courts spanning 15 years
could be set aside on the basisof six hours worth of testimony
not subject to crossexamination.
Stephanie (28:46):
Fair.
That is fair, because I mean,we've, there's been hundreds of
hours outside of this, and nowwe're going to take this.
Six hours to provide clemency oryeah, you
Dani (29:00):
commute a sentence So good point on May 25th Governor BAT
says there are too many doubtsto justify Paradis's execution
and commuted his sentence tolife in prison and of course all
of the All of the federalappeals regarding the death
sentence are dropped becauseit's no longer a death
Stephanie (29:19):
penalty case.
No death penalty.
Dani (29:21):
Sure, sure, sure.
So, uh,
Stephanie (29:26):
yeah, just like that.
Dani (29:28):
1998.
Guess who's getting married?
Gibson?
No, he's already married.
Paradis and Vanessa Sanford getmarried in the visitation room
of the Idaho State CorrectionalInstitution.
Aww.
How very romantic.
I'm sure they met.
She was probably a spiritualadvisor.
I'm not for sure.
Stephanie (29:49):
You spiritual women out here.
Love ya, but why are we Why arewe picking up men in the
prisons?
Stop, please.
Dani (30:00):
Also in 1998, Gibson has his conviction overturned by a
federal judge.
Stephanie (30:05):
Okay.
Dani (30:06):
The opinion of the court was ineffective counsel.
Gibson's attorney Mike Frablefailed to adequately refute the
state's medical expert Brady.
Idaho's ordered to eitherrelease Gibson or retry him.
In 1999, Paradis gets a hearingfor a new trial.
(30:29):
So not only was he commuted fromthe death penalty to life, he's
also getting he's getting
Stephanie (30:35):
to restart, to even Basically determine his guilt.
Mm hmm.
Okay
Dani (30:44):
in august of 99 the prosecution offers a deal for
gibson in exchange for an alfordplea for the murder of kimberly
Gibson will only have 41 moremonths to spend in prison
Stephanie (30:56):
You know what?
I think that people need to talkabout the alford plea a little
bit more just in general BecauseI think it's a, it's a genuine
plea, and with this and howmessy it is, it's basically
saying, I'm not admitting guilt,but with everything that's
against me, I wouldn't be ableto fight this.
(31:18):
There's no way for me to provemy innocence.
I can't defend it.
There's no way for me to createa reasonable doubt.
And, the Alford plea is, I'm nottrying to praise them, but I
think this is a good strategybecause it's like, in, instead
of him pleading guilty, ifthey're willing to just do this,
(31:41):
Sure.
Like I can see why this was thestrategy.
Dani (31:47):
I agree.
I agree.
Stephanie (31:52):
No, the Alford plea is like, there are situations
where you don't have anythingthat can go on your side and
you're like,
Dani (32:00):
I just,
Stephanie (32:01):
every time I hear the Alford plea, I just think of the
staircase.
The staircase trial.
Yeah, that's an interesting one.
I still don't know how I feel.
I know.
Well, I know how I feel about ittoo, but I can see, I'm
surprised it isn't used
Dani (32:15):
more.
I think also that the standardis, oh, they're just playing
that so they don't have to makeit so much.
I think it's deeper than that.
I do.
I think
Stephanie (32:30):
there's people who are innocent who have used the
alpha plea where they're like.
This is my last, you know, sure,put me in jail.
I didn't do it.
Fine, I'll
Dani (32:40):
do, I'll do 15 years even though I didn't do it.
Not the case in this, of course,you know, with this particular
trial.
Yeah, all for pleaseinteresting.
In 2000, a federal judge clearsthe way for a new trial or
release of Paradis.
Notes from Prosecutor Hawes werenever disclosed to the defense.
(33:04):
His notes showed doubt inBrady's testimony.
His notes said that Brady couldnot determine the time of death
and that Kimberly was notsexually assaulted as claimed,
and probably was dead when herbody was dumped in Idaho.
That's what the prosecutor hadin his notes, but then Brady
(33:25):
testified Completely different.
Ben
Stephanie (33:28):
has flip flops all over the place.
And Ben's selling body parts.
So I'm so your Actual likecharacter comes into play in
that if you're willing to sellpeople's body parts if you're
doing that type of shady shit.
Your credibility is gone.
Like, I'm sorry.
(33:49):
And he should have beendisbarred and gotten the fuck
out because, disgusting.
Dani (33:55):
On April 10th, 2001, after 21 years in prison, Paradis
pleads to a lesser charge and isfree after making a deal with
authorities.
He pleads guilty to being anaccessory to murder for helping
dump Kimberly's body.
The maximum sentence for thatcrime is five years.
Also later that year, inNovember, Paradis is seeking 20
(34:18):
million dollars from the stateof Idaho and Kootenai County.
Which, I, if I was wrongfullyconvicted and spent 21 years in
prison, this was his wholething.
He never had the chance to,build a career.
I mean, there's lots of thingsthat he missed out on, but 20
(34:42):
million's a lot of money.
Stephanie (34:43):
20 million is a lot of money, and here's my thing.
Is all of this could have beenavoided.
I feel like they tried to keepthat bad boy loyalty for way too
long.
Paradis, if you would have justflop, flipped.
If you truly didn't murder orrape a dead body or whatever.
(35:05):
if you were the one that was,you just happened to be there
and you're like, shit, I get it.
I get it.
If someone's murdered someoneelse in, in the same house as
you, and then you're in thisbiker gang mentality and they
say, we got to get rid of thisbody.
You can't be a tattletale rightthen.
(35:28):
You can't be like, guys, this iswrong.
We got to call the police.
You can't leave then.
I, I can understand the dynamicsof that.
But, to then tell Pete, tellyour story and plead out early.
Tell them all the informationthey need to know.
(35:48):
And you could plead out and getFive, 10 years?
Dani (35:53):
Uh, yes, but I don't, I don't think that was ever an
option for, for him, honestly.
Do you remember Rice from, thatlast ca, that, that last, case,
the, yeah, the tattle tail.
Yeah, that's exactly what hedid.
And he ended up spending moretime than the people have
fricking murdered people.
(36:13):
Right.
So honestly, this was a, i thiswas a witch hunt.
It is what it is.
By, by the prosecution.
They wanted, they wanted it all.
They were not, I mean, first ofall.
And they were
Stephanie (36:27):
stretching the truth.
Dani (36:28):
For the Spokane prosecutors to have that trial
all together, you would neversee that today.
Stephanie (36:36):
Ever, ever, ever, ever.
It's just created.
And so fast.
Y'all didn't even try to putyour case together.
Nope.
You guys fucked it up.
This is why all this hashappened decades later.
Dani (36:48):
Yep.
Decades later, in 2002, the veryend of 2002, December 31st,
Gibson, at age 51, is releasedafter 22 years in prison.
All done.
In 2006, in a settlement withKootenai County, they agreed to
pay Paradis 900, 000 forwrongful imprisonment.
Stephanie (37:11):
What was he asking for, 20 million?
Yeah.
Dani (37:15):
And it was like, he got like 50 grand right away, and
then it was like For so manyyears it was like 3, 500 a
month.
Stephanie (37:22):
I have a structured settlement and I need cash now.
Call JG Wentworth 877 CASH NOW.
Sponsor us.
JG.
JG.
We love, we love
Dani (37:38):
your shit, dude.
So, but the fuckery doesn'tstop.
God, I
Stephanie (37:45):
cannot
Dani (37:45):
believe there's more.
So, well these guys are both outof prison, right?
But I'm just telling you this istheir mentality, okay?
And I don't know, in 2011, Sixyear old Gibson is arrested in
California during a sweep of theVagos Motorcycle Club.
Drugs, weapons, and party armorwere seized during the raid.
(38:07):
He is charged with possessingthe marijuana and participating
in criminal activities.
And a criminal streaking.
I don't, I couldn't figure out,there was nothing in the papers
what happened to that, but he'slike,
Stephanie (38:19):
he should have just ran for office.
Truly.
Dani (38:23):
No.
He went back to his gang, oldchief's at
Stephanie (38:26):
it.
He's like, I'm the chief, let'sget her done
Dani (38:29):
back.
So anyway, I just had, I had toinclude that because it's.
It's like, dude, seriously,
Stephanie (38:35):
calm down.
You're 60
Dani (38:36):
years old.
After doing
Stephanie (38:37):
that many years in prison, you're 60 years old.
I would be retiring and learningto crochet.
Find a hobby, bro.
Dani (38:46):
My activities are remote
Stephanie (38:47):
control cars, stained glass,
Dani (38:51):
and coloring with gel pens.
So, we're gonna jet up to 2018.
Okay.
Cause you thought the fuckerywas done.
Stephanie (39:01):
It just keeps going.
Dani (39:04):
At age 69, Paradis is back in court.
In September 2017, Paradis and afriend, Richard Myers, got into
a heated argument in Paradishome.
Richard had been living with theParadises at the time.
During the argument, Richardkicked one of Paradises dogs and
(39:24):
screamed at Paradis and the dog.
Stephanie (39:27):
Don't be kicking someone's dog.
Do
Dani (39:29):
not be kicking somebody's dog.
Stephanie (39:31):
People will be Listen.
Dani (39:34):
Paradis told Richard he needed to sober up and leave.
Peridis then left to the gym andwhen he arrived back home two
hours later, Richard was stillthere, not taking the hint.
Yikes.
Richard basically said, I'm notleaving.
Stephanie (39:52):
Knowing that someone, no matter what actually
happened, knowing this story andthat regardless, everyone was
guilty of some fuckery thatnight, whether it's not saying
anything or actually killingsomeone or beating the shit out
of someone, Or raping a deadbody, knowing that someone had
(40:15):
been involved in that, I don'tcare how long ago it is, that
says to someone's character,maybe if you kicked their dog
and they said you better get thefuck out of there, I'd be like,
you know what, I should probablyleave.
I'm going to sleep in my cartonight or I'm going to find a
motel six.
Richard, what did you do?
You stayed there.
(40:36):
He said, I'm not leaving.
Dani (40:39):
I have tenants rights.
Paradis then shoved a gun in theback of drunk Richard's neck.
Richard was not injured though.
Paradis's attorney, Bill Mock,said it was a pistol that fires
BBs and pellets.
Stephanie (40:57):
I'm sorry.
I don't want to be shot in thehead with a BB.
I know a drunkard should notkick the fucking dog.
Don't
Dani (41:04):
be kicking the dog and don't be shooting BBs at people
like.
And if you're a drunkard stayingat somebody's house, I'm not
defending this guy, it soundslike him, but if you're a
drunkard at somebody's house andthey tell you to leave.
Just go.
Just go.
You gotta go.
Bro, go get a fucking job.
You kicked his dog.
Dude, do not kick my, I would.
I'd throw down.
I know you, and I would too.
(41:27):
A pre sentencing investigatorrecommended probation for
Paradis.
Idaho prosecutors arerecommended 15 years Wow.
That's quite the rage.
parent is, pleads guilty toaggravated assault and the use
of a firearm during a commissionof a crime.
(41:49):
And he is sentenced to 15 yearswith three years fixed.
Stephanie (41:53):
That's wild to me.
15 years and no one was.
He's actually injured.
It was a
Dani (42:00):
BB gun.
Not that they can't injure you,but Jesus, it was a BB gun.
And also, he's a 69 year old,he's an old man.
Well and, you know.
And they kicked his, I'm, my dadwould fucking throw down if
somebody kicked his, he gets hishurt, his feelings hurt if I
make fun of his dog.
He's like,
Stephanie (42:20):
I might bring out a gun, Danny.
You make fun of Rusty one moretime.
He's like, that's my boy.
I'm like, well, your boy's fat,dad.
He said, what?
Somebody get me my pistol.
Dani (42:33):
But currently, you know that three years fixed?
This is in 2018.
Currently, Paradis is 75 andstill in custody at the Idaho
State Correctional InstitutionMedical Annex.
Stephanie (42:45):
I'm sorry, but with viewing everything separately,
like I've said, There wasfuckery every, I think everyone
that was involved in this wholenight was guilty of stuff.
But for him to be exonerated andthen get 15 years when no one
was even injured?
(43:07):
Like, so a lot of people don'tunderstand like if you brandish
a firearm, that's a big Thing,if you brandish a firearm and
there is no, like, fear for yourlife, like a road rage incident,
if you like, pull a gun onsomeone when, after you're
already safe, like say you're inyour neighborhood and you pull a
(43:28):
gun, they can take all yourguns.
You can be on probation orparole for a long time.
It's a felony.
So, so yes, I would understandprobation slash parole, whatever
the fuck you want to call it.
Maybe a year of jail time less.
Dani (43:44):
And he's an old man.
Who was hurt?
Stephanie (43:47):
The dog! Where's the justice
Dani (43:50):
for Fido here?
I'm just saying if somebodykicked my fucking dog, it would
go down.
I just thought it was a littleoverkill.
Stephanie (43:58):
So this is the most recent updates we've got on this
one.
Dani (44:01):
Yeah.
Stephanie (44:03):
Anyway, what a wild ride.
Don't you guys think?
Thank you, Danny, for I just,let me just tell you guys the
amount of research that thistook Dani to even put together.
It hurt me.
You guys heard how much of ashit show it was, right?
It hurt me deep inside.
But she fucking soldieredthrough.
(44:23):
So thank you, Dani.
I hope you guys enjoyed.
Dani (44:27):
I hope that I told you a complete story and if, I mean,
if you have questions, pleasereach out.
Jenny's the pro.
I would love to address thembecause I probably know it in my
brain.
It just might not have made iton, on paper.
Well, and there's some thingsthat are just unknown.
Yeah.
The victims.
There was nothing I found finedeath notices and so and I'm you
(44:50):
know I'm we're at a certainlevel of paying for paywalls So
and I'm sure that there is moreresearch that I could have found
through court systems and allthat stuff But it's money
transcripts is Extremelyexpensive.
So, I'm depending on newspaper.
com.
Statesman, get us through! I didfind that there are several, 60
(45:14):
Minutes did a thing on Paradistrial.
60 Minutes 2, by the way.
Didn't even know that was athing.
unable to locate the, the video.
It's floating out theresomewhere.
The New Yorker did a hugearticle on it, which I decided
not to read because it's a 13,000 word article.
(45:35):
Big ol page.
And I found that very late in myresearch, and so I chose not to
read that, but that is availabletoo.
but there's, but then there'sjust, so you get stuff like that
and then there's nothing onthese victims.
If you guys
Stephanie (45:47):
read that stuff and find contesting info, we're
interested in it.
I will apologize like amotherfucker.
We're not reporting the news.
We're reporting on what wefound.
Like this is how we put ittogether.
Dani (46:00):
Motorcycle gangs and I'm telling you, those Lich wishes
that he would, he's like man, doyou know they're all in prison
together and Creech is like, Godbro, I wish I could be just like
you.
He's like,
Stephanie (46:13):
I was in 17 gangs all across the United States, and
they're like, no, we heard aboutyou, you fucking poser ass
bitch.
Dani (46:21):
I'm Mr.
Nationwide, and Gibson's like,really, no.
Stephanie (46:25):
You don't have any idea, bro.
None.
Anyway, another great episode.
Thank you, Dani.
I know how much work this onewas.
Follow us on Facebook,Instagram.
Our TikTok is up.
We hope you love it.
We hope
Dani (46:40):
TikTok stays.
we would love to get to thepoint where we could do a live.
So, so invite your friends
Stephanie (46:47):
to follow repost our stuff.
Yes.
We just need, how many, is it?
500 followers.
That's what I've heard.
We're 111 followers.
Thank you to each and every oneof y'all that have followed us.
We're, we're so stoked aboutthat.
So we're
Dani (47:01):
20% there.
Yes, we can do it.
We can do it.
Folks.
We would love to do a live.
That would be
Stephanie (47:06):
awesome.
For any questions, comments,concerns, you can email the
lethal library.com or justcomment on our post Risa.
We see you.
this episode, unfortunately foryou, was over the top with the
language.
Our apologies, Risa.
Apologies again.
(47:26):
We're trying.
I don't know if we'll ever meetyour standard, but we love you,
Risa.
Thank you.
Dani (47:34):
Alright, guys.
Thank you so much.
Love you.
Bye.
10 4, rubber ducky.
Fuck yeah.
outro
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