June 22, 2025 • 59 mins
In this episode of The Lethal Library, hosts Dani and Stephanie uncover the haunting 1988 murder of Kay Vanderford in Boise, Idaho. What starts as a seemingly normal day at a quaint gift shop spirals into chaos as Kay is fatally stabbed. The investigation features eerie sightings, a sketchy suspect, and bizarre inmate testimonies claiming confessions from the accused, Zane Jack Fields. Listeners are taken through a maze of legal drama and questionable evidence, leaving them to ponder whether justice was truly served or if Fields was merely a convenient fall guy. Tune in for a captivating blend of dark twists and true crime intrigue.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Stephanie (00:30):
Alright.
So everybody, welcome back tothe Lethal Library.
I'm Stephanie.
I'm Danny.
And today we're gonna tell youanother true crime tale out of
Idaho.
So Danny, what do you have forus today?
Dani (00:42):
Today we're diving into the chilling tale of Kay
Vanderford, whose seeminglynormal day at her Boise gift
shop turned into a horrifyingnightmare from mysterious
sightings of suspiciouscharacters and bulky jackets to
inmate and informants chattingit up like they're on the
episode of Reality tv.
(01:03):
Good.
This case has all the elementsof a true crime roller coaster
resources used.
Today are articles from theIdaho Statesmen
Stephanie (01:13):
exclusive, exclusive to the Idaho Statesmen.
Sponsor.
It could be you.
They're like, um, yeah, not withthat filthy male.
Dani (01:26):
on February 11th, 1988, 69-year-old Kay Vanderford and
her husband Herbert, headed downto their daughter's gift shop,
the wishing Well in Boise,Idaho.
Stephanie (01:40):
Very cutesy.
Dani (01:41):
Isn't that a very cute gift shop?
Wishing well gift.
I love that.
Kay and Herbert opened up theshop that morning and got their
day going just like any typicalday.
Herbert washed the front windowsaround 11 o'clock and left
shortly after.
At 1120, Kay called 9 1 1 andreported she had been stabbed A
(02:06):
customer entered the store andalso dialed 9 1 1.
Police arrived within fourminutes of the first call.
Stephanie (02:13):
That's a great response time.
Dani (02:14):
Great response time.
Kay was transported to St.
Al's where she died around 1230for her injuries during a
surgery.
Stephanie (02:23):
I just can't even imagine that, as a partner, to
see your partner regular day andwithin basically an hour they're
dead.
Yeah.
Dani (02:34):
Like, because it was a very normal, normal day for
them.
He's, of course.
and I just, let me just tell youwhere this is at in Boise.
So, it's on Fairview betweencoal and Alumba.
So it's by like there's asunrise right there.
Mm-hmm.
There's like a little strip mallwith four or five businesses in
it, and that's where that waslocated.
(02:56):
It's no longer there, but that'swhere that was.
Wow.
At, Kay had two grown children.
Karen, who owned the gift shop,and a son Tom.
Who lived in northern Idaho.
Kay.
Had just celebrated her 47thwedding anniversary three weeks
before she was murdered.
(03:17):
Family and friends said sheenjoyed keeping up on current
events, being with her familyand spending time at the cabin
and Cascade.
They had a, a dorms.
Yeah, they had a lakeside cabinup there that they would go and
with all the family.
Yeah.
Stephanie (03:31):
It sounds like they had a very cute, like 47 year
anniversary.
Almost made it to 50.
That's really incredible.
And
Dani (03:37):
she was still she was helping her daughter run th gift
shop, which I think is soawesome.
Like, it, definitely was herpurpose.
I mean, and she loved hergrandchildren, that that was
very, her grandchildren werevery, very important to her.
But she went down and she wasthe face of that store.
(03:59):
Mm-hmm.
Karen said her mother was thecornerstone of the store.
Oh.
Kate had been working at thegift shop for 15 years and she
absolutely loved it.
Stephanie (04:08):
It sounds like that would be a great job.
Dani (04:10):
'cause they, her and her husband had like, uh, a service
station, um, I think it was upby Lewiston, where they ran that
and stuff and then they retired.
Stephanie (04:21):
Yeah.
Dani (04:21):
And then she's like, I'll come help your daughter.
Those
Stephanie (04:24):
little fun hobbies.
Yeah.
Like job to get, get extraincome and, and she
Dani (04:28):
was doing,'cause she had, obviously life experience
running a business.
Mm-hmm.
So she was doing the books, andalso helping purchase the items
for the store.
Yeah.
What are we gonna put in thestore?
Yeah.
I
Stephanie (04:39):
think that's a great thing for older folks if they
want to, to find a really lowimpact job.
Yeah.
That still they're using theirbrain.
Mm-hmm.
They're still socializing.
They're absolutely still, youknow,
Dani (04:50):
and they're helping out their daughter.
Stephanie (04:52):
Yeah.
Family business that's just,just like picture perfect.
I think most people would want akind of retirement like that.
You know,
Dani (05:02):
I think it's healthy for, to still get out.
Mm-hmm.
police started theirinvestigation beginning with the
nearby businesses.
Stephanie (05:09):
Really,
Dani (05:11):
and well, this happened in the middle of the day.
Yes.
Literally in the middle of theday.
Day and
Stephanie (05:15):
in the morning too.
It was, this is like 1120 in
Dani (05:18):
the middle of the day.
What, what are we doing?
And I'm not sure what time thestore opened.
I kind of feel like it was maybelike 10 ish because they got
there, open everything up, andthen, you know, Herbert's out
there just like, let me, youknow, clean these windows.
You know, I've worked retailbefore.
A restaurant like the, the frontdoor's always felt that you're
hitting that every day.
(05:39):
Yeah.
Oh yeah.
you know, make it presentable.
And he is like, I'm gonna go runsome errands.
I'll be back.
Whatever he's doing, you know,normal day, normal day, an
employee from the State FarmInsurance office, located next
door, said she had heard ascream, but thought it was a
playful yell.
And employees from anotherneighboring business.
(05:59):
Manino
Stephanie (06:01):
Love man.
Love Mancino.
Dani (06:02):
Love mea Manino.
It's been a hot minute, but Ilove it.
Stephanie (06:05):
I know it's one that I always forget about.
Yeah.
Where you at?
Manino?
We need you in some ads orsomething.
Right.
Dani (06:11):
You know where they're at here though, right?
Stephanie (06:13):
Yeah.
They're just in the like, whatis that road?
Midland?
Yeah.
Yeah.
They're
Dani (06:18):
Midland like lone star, I think.
Get you some Mancino sponsor.
the employees from Mancino saidthey didn't see or hear anything
unusual.
They were
Stephanie (06:31):
just working about their own day.
Yeah.
And you're not expecting that?
No.
Dani (06:35):
and I've worked in those businesses like where you're
like sharing a wall, a stripmall.
Mm-hmm.
You can hear other things, butwhether, I mean, if I'm busy
talking on the phone orsomething and I hear a loud
noise, I can't, you wouldn't bedecipher.
Like, is is that a cry for helpor was somebody laughing because
(06:56):
I would assume somebody would belaughing or hollering not
getting stabbed?
Mm-hmm.
on February 13th, just a fewdays later, police release a
sketch of a suspect.
He is described as a 48-year-oldman, six four, and weighs about
220 pounds.
(07:18):
The top of his head is bald withbrown hair on the sides.
He was last seen a bluesweatshirt with a white or gray
shirt underneath and navy bluepants.
Stephanie (07:29):
Pretty good description.
Dani (07:31):
It's pretty
Stephanie (07:32):
descrip.
There's a lot of things inthere.
Dani (07:35):
Let me show you their sketch.
Stephanie (07:40):
Okay guys, I'm gonna describe this sketch in my first
impression.
It reminds me of what is theactor that does Fight Club?
Not Brad Pitt, otherwise Edward
Dani (07:52):
Norton.
Yeah,
Stephanie (07:53):
ed.
It looks to me like Edward doesthat not
Dani (07:56):
Yeah, Edward Norton with But Bald, but balding.
Stephanie (07:59):
Yeah.
Maybe look, look it up guys.
Or maybe I'll put it on theFacebook, but yeah, imagine
Edward Norton.
But bald is what it looks like.
Dani (08:08):
I, but on February 18th, the authorities say they're
seeking a Second Man, employeesand the owners of nearby
businesses in the Linda VistaPlaza.
Saw a man with a large knifesticking out of his coat pocket
not long after the stabbing.
Oh.
They described the man as 25 to30 years old, six feet tall,
(08:33):
about 220, 2 30 pounds.
He had bushy strawberry blondehair and was wearing an orange,
bulky coat with blue jeans.
He had entered several shops inthe plaza between 12 and 1230 on
the, on February 11th, the daythat Kay was stabbed.
(08:55):
And this isn't far, it's like ahalf mile.
Stephanie (08:59):
So it makes you think if someone's staking out places
going in.
Mm-hmm.
Dani (09:05):
Detective Sergeant Dave Smith said the clerks asked if
they could help him, but all hesaid was, I'm just waiting.
The clerk said they all feltuneasy about him being there and
that they had never seen him inthe area before.
Stephanie (09:21):
Right.
I'm just waiting.
Yeah.
Well, I guess if you're outsidethe store, maybe I wonder if it
was inside or outside, but like,say no, he,
Dani (09:31):
he went inside the stores.
Like they made himuncomfortable.
Like, to say that
Stephanie (09:34):
inside.
Like, what?
What do you mean waiting?
Yeah.
Like,
Dani (09:39):
but also could I show up at a, at a store?
We're gonna go look at somethingand be like, I guess I just
waiting for my friend.
We're gonna go look at some, Idon't know.
Okay.
I mean, it's a stretch, but hewas,
Stephanie (09:51):
he was just bad vibes.
Yeah.
That was it.
The vibe was off.
Dani (09:56):
the man was last seeing running East on Fairview.
Why are you running, why are yourunning in the middle of the day
in a large coat?
I mean, it's February.
He's not going for a jog.
Right.
Stephanie (10:08):
What's going on here
Dani (10:11):
in 1989?
Authorities say they are stillactively pursuing leads.
Ooh.
So
Stephanie (10:20):
that means they haven't gotten much probably a
year later if you're asking forany leads.
Dani (10:25):
Yeah.
Kay's daughter keeps her storeopen on the one year anniversary
of her mother's death.
Her daughter invites the publicto come down to the store and
share memories of Kay.
Stephanie (10:40):
That's heart.
It's good, but it'sheartbreaking.
Like,
Dani (10:44):
and I feel like, you know, she's had a, the family's had a
year mm-hmm.
To process this and to deal withit however you deal with it.
But I also think it's very howheartwarming, you know, when you
lose somebody close to you andpeople come and comfort you and
tell you how Awesome.
(11:05):
Right.
Somebody, if it's good, you feelclose.
And I also feel like she waslike, Hey.
Yo.
Hello.
There's still a murderer on theloose.
Stephanie (11:16):
Remember that one time when someone came into my
fucking store and killed my mom?
Yeah.
You remember that?
I think that's, we're stillhere, just patiently waiting.
So, um, yeah.
So I kind of feel like it's agood, it's a good tactic.
'cause we've heard many caseswhere someone even doing a
newspaper article, or an opinionpiece mm-hmm.
Or some type of memorial,especially for an unsolved case.
(11:40):
Sometimes 10 years down theline, someone's like, oh my
gosh,
Dani (11:43):
somebody told me about that.
Stephanie (11:45):
Yeah.
This guy got drunk in a bar
Dani (11:46):
and told me all about this and that.
So I, I do think it was good.
I probably, mentally and also tohelp kind of boost it and keep
it boost.
Yeah.
In the headlines.
On April 18th, 1989, policefinally charged someone with a
murder of Kay Goodness, ZaneJack Fields age 30 as charged
(12:10):
with first degree murder.
Fields is a current inmate atthe Idaho Correctional
Institution in Orofino.
Stephanie (12:18):
Welcome home.
Dani (12:21):
Lemme tell you a little bit about this guy.
Stephanie (12:23):
Okay.
Dani (12:24):
Fields's criminal history started in 1976 when he was
convicted of grand larceny.
He was paroled a year later, butquickly returned to prison on a
charge of possession of acontrolled substance.
He has also been convicted ofburglary, forgery, and delivery
of a controlled substance.
(12:45):
So Adila and Chema, he hasalready spent nearly 10 years in
prison for those convictions.
Stop doing these things.
Yeah.
So he's 30, so he's been in thesystem a
Stephanie (13:00):
a third of his life.
Yeah.
And then think of your adultlife.
You've got 12 adult years.
So he's had like two years ofhis adult life.
'cause I mean, if you're inprison, you're an adult most
likely.
Dani (13:13):
Yeah.
No, calm
Stephanie (13:15):
down.
Dani (13:17):
He was fucking around and found
Stephanie (13:19):
out.
And finding out rep heatedly,like you're again, the people
who are not good at crimes, justwanna keep doing the crime
stuff.
Stop or learn.
Let's see some innovation.
And I'm not talking about likefor murdering, but like, you
wanna do a little shoplifting orwhatever.
Let's be innovative about it.
(13:41):
No, let's not be dumb about it.
My God.
Dani (13:46):
Phil's most recent conviction came from an incident
on February 22nd, 1988.
So I'm gonna just do a littletimeline for you.
Yes.
Kay was murdered on February11th.
Mm, 1988.
Stephanie (14:02):
11 days later.
Yes.
He is arrested for, what was it?
Larceny.
Burglary.
Dani (14:06):
Oh, let me tell you.
Stephanie (14:07):
Oh, I'm ready.
Dani (14:10):
Fields entered the Shopco on Fairview.
In Boise around one 30 in theafternoon.
He was in the store for a whileand drew the attention of some
employees who thought he mightbe shoplifting.
Oh,
Stephanie (14:27):
see, you're bad at it.
Dani (14:28):
Were you wearing the big coat, bro?
Stephanie (14:30):
That fucking puffy coat.
Dani (14:33):
When Fields left the store, a security guard and the
store manager approached him andthey said, Hey, have you taken
anything from the store?
Phil's response was, he was sickof prison and he didn't wanna
spend any more time there.
And then he drew a gun andpointed it at the two men
(14:55):
escalation at times a thousand.
Okay.
He didn't shoot it.
he pointed at the two men.
He just turned and walked away.
Stephanie (15:04):
Brandishing not good, bro.
And you're a felon most likely,right?
Dani (15:10):
Yeah.
I mean, because they're allfelonies.
I'm thinking 10 years probablyfe Yeah.
Controlled substances.
And that
Stephanie (15:16):
automatic, I think it's an automatic, yeah.
Okay.
Dani (15:20):
And it probably was pot back in 88.
I'm just had to say that one.
Isn't
Stephanie (15:25):
that so ridiculous to think about?
Just dumb.
Dani (15:31):
He was arrested about 20 minutes later.
They found a cassette tape and aholster on fields at the time of
his arrest.
So for our, everybody knows whata tape cassette?
Yeah.
Oh, it's not a cd.
Stephanie (15:50):
It's before.
It's the step before CDs.
Dani (15:53):
It's between an eight track and a cd.
Stephanie (15:55):
Yes.
Dani (15:56):
I'm not an eight track
Stephanie (15:57):
girl.
Dani (15:58):
I'm not either.
I did not know
Stephanie (15:59):
those.
I've, I've never held one.
Dani (16:02):
Uh, were you, uh, tape girl?
Did you have tapes?
Tapes?
Oh yes.
Tapes.
Stephanie (16:09):
Lots of tapes.
Lots of
Dani (16:10):
tapes.
Stephanie (16:11):
And then my sister got that subscription to like
whatever music company sendsout, like subscriptions of CDs
and then I would just steal herCDs.
That's beautiful.
She was very cool.
She had all the cool stuff.
Dani (16:23):
I love that.
For you Fields was found guiltyof aggravated assault and petty
theft.
Do you wanna know what he stole?
Was it the cassette?
Yeah, but you wanna know whatband it was?
Yes.
Who CCR are?
Oh my God, I feel so old rightnow.
Stephanie (16:46):
I might, I might know this song.
What's this?
Their popular song?
Dani (16:51):
Credence Claire.
What?
Oh,
Stephanie (16:53):
I just don't, I don't recognize, I never call them
that.
So yes, I know tons of theirsongs.
Okay, now I feel embarrassed.
And I thought you said zr, so Iwas like, oh.
Led Zeppelin now like CCR.
I'm sorry.
I didn't understand the I lovethem.
Okay, we're good.
Dani (17:10):
Oh my gosh.
Now I feel so You thought Ididn't know them well?
No, I felt stupid using theirlittle abbreviation and I was
like, oh my God, I'm fuckingold.
Stephanie (17:21):
I should, I don't know why I don't use the abra.
I mean, sometimes I just saycredence.
CCR.
That's how the cool kids, thesuperfan say it.
Dani (17:29):
Okay.
I'm fucking cool now.
I know.
Now I feel better stuff.
Thank you.
Okay.
Uh, during his sentencinghearing for that crime, he told
Judge Schroeder, who we haveseen in, we know many and
others.
Schroeder good old Schrodersquote, prison's not where it's
(17:50):
at.
The streets are where it's at.
That's where my life is.
Prison's getting a little oldunquote.
Stephanie (17:59):
Very effective and persuasive argument, sir.
And judge, I went, did you wrapit on a beat?
'cause it sounds like he wantedto.
I kind of feel like that he wasseeing that a little bit.
Prison ain't where it's at.
I, I, I live on the streets.
Dani (18:13):
Prison's getting a little old from me.
Stephanie (18:19):
The judge is like, alright, this is the worst day
of my life.
Should's like, but I had to seethat.
Dani (18:24):
Uh, sorry you feel that way, but here's five years for
you.
Yeah.
Thanks for sharing yourfeelings.
Thank you, sir.
So he was sentenced to fiveyears for stealing the cassette
tape and
Stephanie (18:35):
pulling the gun.
Five years for the credence.
Man, you must have been a bigfan, willing to brandish and
point a firearm over a cassettetape.
Dani (18:45):
They never did find the gun, but he had a holster.
Yes.
And they don't think would lie
Stephanie (18:50):
about.
Being pulled
Dani (18:51):
and you know, back in the day they put like the cassettes
and like the big plastic things.
Mm-hmm.
Stephanie (18:56):
Mm-hmm.
So those are not the optimalitem to steal just like CDs
because they take forever toopen and you have to get it
open.
You can't just
Dani (19:07):
ditch
Stephanie (19:08):
it.
Mm-hmm.
Dani (19:09):
You can't like unwrap all the cellophane and be like
putting it in your Walkman andbe like, dude, I've had this.
Right.
No, no.
It doesn't work.
Doesn't it doesn't work
Stephanie (19:16):
that way.
Dani (19:19):
We're not criminals.
Well,
Stephanie (19:22):
I am.
I was when I was a teenager.
No.
I used to shop with littlethings like lip gloss and stuff
as like a preteen and a teenwith no supervision.
And then one time I went to theplace where we always shoplifted
from, um, with two boys thatthought that they were real hot
shit and they went straight forthe CDs.
(19:42):
And I was like, that's a badidea.
That's a very stupid idea.
And was like.
They thought, they said, no, weknow what we're doing.
And they were like walkingthrough the aisles, like putting
the cellophane in, like old rug,like not old rugs, but rolled up
rugs and stuff, sliding thecases under the aisles and
stuff.
And I'm like, oh my God, this isawful.
Guess who stops us on the wayout?
(20:03):
Loss prevention.
They weren't called lossprevention back then.
They, they had their littlebadge, you know, little security
guard.
Yes.
And so, um, that's what wecalled back in the day anyways.
Did you unfriend them?
We did not go on anothershopping trip again.
Okay.
I assure you of that.
And I was like, I didn't even, Iwas so nervous.
I didn't even take like a lipgloss or anything.
(20:23):
I was like, I ain't gettingcaught with you idiots.
Like, no.
Anyways, I ran bye.
I don't know.
They, they, I think got awaytoo.
They basically just gave him awarning, which they should have
just for the stupidity of the,the whole thing.
But yeah, no, we were not, um,that's not
Dani (20:39):
happening
Stephanie (20:39):
nowadays.
We were not shopping buddies.
Dani (20:42):
I actually think I, I should look that up.
I bet you shoplift is way, waylow for like stupid teenage
kids.
'cause there's cameraseverywhere.
Stephanie (20:51):
Oh, yeah.
Yeah.
And they, they're sosophisticated, right?
Like for the folks that thinkthat they're getting away with
it, for at Sephora or Target,even if you're putting a
different label on or scanningeverything as an orange, um,
that you're not getting awaywith it.
What they're doing is they'rebuilding a file on you and
waiting for you to get to thefelony level, and then they're
(21:13):
gonna be like, here's 16 hoursof tape of you.
So just for those out there thatthink, oh man.
And may, maybe you did it forlike, you know, you got a bag of
oranges and you only scan forone.
They are very serious about,they're counting about it and
they want anything that'saffecting their bottom
Dani (21:33):
TikTok.
Accountants are back there withtheir spreadsheets.
Yes.
Stephanie (21:35):
And those cameras just.
They people think, oh, I paidwith cash.
They're never gonna know who Iam.
The cameras can read your ID andyour the numbers on your card.
Mm-hmm.
They're very good.
Cameras
Dani (21:46):
don't do it.
They're following you to yourcar.
Speaking as a
Stephanie (21:49):
former teen criminal of lip gloss theft, it ain't as
easy as it was.
We're can't even do cocaineanymore.
Dani (21:57):
Can't even shoplift, can't even do cocaine in America.
That's, uh, all of, uh, Theo vYouo v telling JD Vans can't
even do cocaine in this countryanymore except this country,
man.
In June, police are asking thepublic if they have any
information on the knife thatwas used to kill Kay.
(22:19):
They said that it was throwninto the back of a pickup truck
after the attack.
Stephanie (22:25):
Oh, so someone gave up that info?
Dani (22:32):
No.
Stephanie (22:34):
No.
How did they know that?
Oh, I'm skipping ahead.
Dani (22:41):
I think they, yeah, they're just, listen, we're not
sure.
Yeah.
Okay.
Somebody was talking.
Um, I don't think it was Fields.
I like 95%.
It wasn't fields.
So let's get down to some nittygritty hearing.
Yeah.
Let's get into it.
(23:01):
figure out why they were askingfor that and where that
information came from.
In August, a fellow inmate offields testified that Fields had
confessed to the crime.
Harold Gilcrest said Philconfessed that quote.
(23:22):
He stabbed the lady in the neckabove the shoulder.
Gilcrest said quote, we arefriends.
Are you though?
That what?
He said, we are friends.
That's such a weird response,isn't it?
It is.
Stephanie (23:40):
Danny, I hit someone with my car, but we are friends.
Sure.
Conversational like that is solike
Dani (23:49):
it's not how words work.
Gilcrest said he asked fieldsabout the murder and at first
fields maintained his innocence,but then he asked Fields, quote
how much money was taken fromthe till, and he told me he got
48 to$50.
(24:12):
Wow.
I just opened that day.
You don't rob when?
No, that's just bad robbery.
Um, but also I want you to just,even in 1988, would$50 be a good
opening till?
No.
No, I don't think so.
Keep that in mind.
(24:33):
Yeah.
Okay.
A former inmate, Keith Edsonsaid he saw fields near the
store that day.
He knew fields from a stay atthe Idaho State Penitentiary.
He said he saw a man in anorange jacket into the store and
recognized him as fields.
Edson said he saw him leave thestore after about 10 minutes.
(24:55):
Hmm.
Fields entered a not guiltyplea.
He's facing the death penalty,so all this testimony is coming
up in his arraignment.
Yeah, trial, all that stuff inOctober.
Fields.
Asked for a change in venue andwas also asking for a new court
(25:20):
appointed attorney.
Judge Schroeder will considerthe change of venue along with a
handful of motions entered bythe defense.
No new attorney.
The judge said it was workedout.
Basically fields is like, Iasked my attorney to bring me
these papers, like gimme myformal charges and blah, blah,
blah, blah, blah.
Like he wanted some information.
(25:40):
Mm-hmm.
The attorney didn't provide thatto him, but in court he did.
He's like, here, here's yourdocuments.
So it was all, he settled asquash.
Yeah.
And late November Fields defenseteam requested to be removed
from the case.
Oh.
So why didn't we just, well,some stuff come about.
(26:01):
So, uh oh.
So Amil, my Shin and Gus Cahilland we've had my shin in here
before, and I might be saying itwrong.
It's M-Y-S-H-I-N.
Michin.
Michin.
It sounds like it would be.
Right.
Uh, and Gus Cahill were grantedthe requests to be removed from
the case because they hadrepresented several inmates that
are scheduled to testify in thecase.
(26:22):
Oh, big conflict of
Stephanie (26:24):
interest.
Yeah.
Dani (26:26):
This delays the trial, which was scheduled for December
4th.
So.
Because the new attorneys haveto have some time.
Yeah.
Yeah.
They gotta be able to prepare.
Uh, new attorneys are assignedto the case, Gar Hackney and
John Lin.
And from my reading, I heart mesome Hackney.
(26:46):
I think you're gonna be happywith, let's hear about it.
Hackney.
Yeah.
In 1990, the new set ofattorneys are asking to suppress
Gilcrest testimony from thetrial.
Gilcrest admitted thatdetectives asked him to listen
for information concerning themurder at the wishing well.
(27:08):
The defense team said wheninmates solicited the
information from fields, theywere acting as agents of the
Boise Police Department.
They argue that fields shouldhave been provided a Miranda
Rights warning prior to talkingto the informants.
Mm.
So this got me thinking like we,we hear about Miranda Rights all
(27:33):
the time and I was like, I don'teven know where that comes from
or what that means.
I mean, I know what it is.
Mm-hmm.
So it's Education Corner onDanny at the Lethal Library.
so this is from, history.com andit's says that the Miranda
(27:59):
rights originated from alandmark 1966 US Supreme Court
case, Miranda versus Arizona aMarch 2nd, 1963.
When an 18-year-old Phoenixwoman told police that she had
been abducted, driven to thedesert and raped detectives
questioning her.
The story gave her a polygraphtest, but the results were
(28:21):
inconclusive.
However, tracking the licenseplate number of the car that
resembled that of her attackersbrought police to Ernesto
Miranda, who had a prior recordas a peeping Tom.
Although the victim did notidentify Miranda in a lineup, he
was brought into police custodyand interrogated.
(28:43):
What happened next is disputed,but officers left the
interrogation with a confessionthat Miranda later recanted
unaware that he didn't have tosay anything at all.
The confession was extremelybrief and differed in certain
respects from the victim'saccount of the crime.
However, Miranda's appointeddefense attorney.
(29:05):
He didn't call any witnesses atthe ensuing trial, and Miranda
was convicted.
While Miranda was an Arizonastate person.
The American Civil LibertiesUnion took up his appeal,
claiming the confession wasfalse or coerced, and the
Supreme Court overturned hisconviction.
(29:26):
Miranda was retired andconvicted in October, 1966,
remaining in prison until 1972.
Ernesto Miranda was laterstabbed to death in the men's
room of a bar after a poker gamein January of 76.
Shit.
So I know that's a lot, but Ijust like, I was like, I'm gonna
go look that up.
(29:47):
Mm-hmm.
Because we hear that all thetime.
Miranda Rights.
Miranda Rights.
They weren't read.
They're Miranda rights, butit's, it's after that case
where.
He was coerced, but never giventhe advice that he had a right
to an attorney.
Stephanie (30:00):
And I figured that it was, you know, I think, I think
we all know that it's from acase, but especially with
Miranda, I was like, maybe it'sa girl.
Mm-hmm.
No idea.
Dani (30:08):
Yeah.
So anyways, little EducationCorner with Danny.
In May, 1990, the trial begins.
This is two years after Kay ismurdered.
(30:31):
Attorney Hackney tells the jurythat Zane Fields is a scapegoat
and a patsy for theinvestigators that failed to
solve the murder of Kay.
Yikes.
Hackney showed the compositepolice release to the public
stating that it looks nothinglike his client.
Prosecutor Joel Horton told thejury that fields confess to the
(30:54):
murder and he will presentfellow inmates that will testify
to that fact.
Defense attorney Hackney said,quote, the state has no forensic
or scientific evidence thatconnects fields to the murder
outside of the courthouse.
This is after the first day ofcourt.
A reporter asked Fields abouthis feelings on the trial, and
(31:17):
he said, quote, go eat shit anddie.
You bitch.
Oh,
Stephanie (31:24):
I quote, not quite as eloquent of a rap verse in that
one, but, oh, not the
Dani (31:29):
staying in the prison.
The streets are my
Stephanie (31:31):
life.
Streets are my life.
That's where it's at.
Chicken.
Chicken.
Honey, you've only been able tohave two years on the streets.
Regardless.
The prison is your life so
Dani (31:43):
far.
Prison is your life.
On the second day of the trial,a prosecution witness said she
saw another man, not thedefendant.
Enter the gift shop that day.
Ooh.
Betty Honecker told the jurorsshe was a customer in the
wishing well.
That day, she saw a man rapidlyenter the store.
(32:06):
Quote.
I kept an eye on him because Ifelt he was trying to avoid me,
unquote.
When asked to identify the man,Betty chose a police photo of a
former customer who disputed an$80 deposit with a shop's owner.
She picked the wrong dude, andHackney was like, whoa, what he
(32:32):
was, yeah.
Where's this guy?
He was taken.
He was totally surprised by thistestimony, but the prosecution
had other witnesses take thestand who said they saw fields
that day with a knife actingstrangely.
Nancy Miller and Vicki Tippetsboth pointed to fields in the
courtroom when asked to identifywho they saw that day.
(32:55):
Both women saw fields at theVista Plaza.
Shopping Center about a halfmile from the gift shop.
Both said they saw what appearedto be a wooden handle of a knife
in field's, right Pocket Tippetsaid quote, he stared at me.
He stared at the cash register.
(33:16):
Then he stared at me again, andhe looked back at the cash
register and the people in theshop.
So he was like, eyeballing.
So let's go back into her quote.
His eyes were very wild looking.
Mm.
He has very scary eyes to lookat.
They were evil.
If there was an objection onthat testimony, I would be
(33:39):
surprised, right?
Yeah.
Yeah.
What is evil?
What does evil eyes look like?
Then they played case nine oneone call in the courtroom.
Stephanie (33:51):
Oh, I bet that was terrible.
Dani (33:53):
She was crying for help.
Quote, she said quote, I've beenstabbed and I'm bleeding to
death.
Ugh.
Stephanie (34:04):
Yeah, and just like that so quickly, something like
this to happen, just like wewere talking about, it's just
crazy.
And that for
Dani (34:10):
her to real like, I don't know.
I just think like if I gotstabbed, I'd be like, I'm
bleeding.
But like she knew it was bad.
Mm-hmm.
That's It's heartbreakingpathologist, Frank fao, funny
name.
Yeah.
Frank FAO testified, Kay bled todeath from a stab wound that
(34:32):
severed a vein in her neck.
Stephanie (34:35):
It
Dani (34:35):
was
Stephanie (34:36):
the carotid or whatever.
Yeah, it was jugular.
Dani (34:42):
A key prosecution witness.
Keith Edson testified he walkedfrom his residence at the
Olympic Hotel to Po.
Joe's on the day of the murder.
Good old Po Joe's.
I love Po.
Joe's.
He saw someone he thought lookedfamiliar, walking to the wishing
well.
(35:03):
Edson waited for the man becausehe felt he knew him.
After waiting 15 minutes, hesaw, he said he saw Phil left
the leave the store and Edsondecided not to approach him.
I had this gut feeling.
He acted really nervous.
He was looking around likesomething wasn't right.
(35:27):
When asked why he didn't callauthorities after hearing about
the attack, Edson said he didn'tcall because he couldn't recall
the man's name.
I didn't think I had anyrelevant information.
He waited until 12 days later tocontact the authorities when he
saw the news reports that Fieldshad been arrested for attempting
(35:48):
to rob the Shopco.
Oh, weird.
If you saw the new, let me just,
Stephanie (35:58):
even if you don't know their name, their
description
Dani (36:01):
at the place where somebody was murdered.
Stephanie (36:03):
Yeah.
Dani (36:04):
And you said he looked suspicious regardless whether
you knew him or not.
Mm-hmm.
If you saw somebody enter thestore, waited for them, they
exited, and then later on theevening news, you saw somebody
was stabbed in that store, youwouldn't call the cops.
Yeah, you should call the cops.
Yeah.
Here comes Hackney.
(36:24):
He was like, uh, Mr.
Addison, shouldn't you rememberField's name?
You literally spoke every day toeach other for six months.
What?
In 1985 you had adjoining salesat the Idaho State Penitentiary.
Edson was serving a three yearsentence for stealing a car.
(36:48):
Hackney also called outinconsistencies between Edmond's
testimony, Edson said he sawfields wearing an orange, brown,
and green camouflage jacket thatday.
Remember what the otherwitnesses said?
Fields was wearing an orangecoat.
Mm-hmm.
Just a plain, not a camouflage.
(37:08):
Yeah.
That's not hard.
Anyway.
You don't know him.
You don't know him?
Stephanie (37:14):
Yeah.
Sounds fishy.
I'm not loving it.
Dani (37:19):
I'm not loving it either.
Stephanie (37:21):
Mm-hmm.
Dani (37:22):
Because he's like, Hey, for six months you guys talked
to each other.
Stephanie (37:29):
Yeah.
I think it would be pretty hardto forget someone's name, but
just not calling in.
Even if you in general don'tknow the name.
Right.
You don't have to know the name.
Right.
Dani (37:43):
You don't have to.
No.
Just tell him what you saw.
Right.
Regardless if you knew this guyfrom somebody familiar or not.
Oh no.
I was watching that store and Isaw mm-hmm.
Somebody leave and enter thatstore and he looked a little
off.
That's all.
Stephanie (37:59):
Yeah.
And you can say, they lookedfamiliar to me, but I can't
place from where.
Dani (38:04):
Mm-hmm.
Stephanie (38:05):
Like, and Hackney's like,
Dani (38:06):
oh, I think you can, sir.
Yeah.
I think, you know, a fingerprintexaminer testified that she
lifted 19 different fingerprintsfrom the counter of the gift
shop.
None of them match fields.
Bummer.
Another inmate, Joe Heintestified that fields shouted
(38:29):
through the jail's ventilationsystem that he had robbed and
stabbed.
Kay Hackney said that would behighly improbable due to the
kind of consequences that itwould bring to fields.
Fields would've had to haveshouted loud enough for high
stand to hear it about 40 feetaway.
(38:51):
We're not whispering in vents.
Stephanie (38:54):
I'm just, this
Dani (38:55):
seems a little
Stephanie (38:56):
outlandish.
Dani (38:57):
And then high stand said there was, yes, there was about
30 other inmates in the block atthe time, so he would had to
have shouted loud enough for itto come through the ventilation
system 40 feet away, but nobodyelse heard it.
Stephanie (39:15):
Yeah.
Dani (39:17):
Do you see.
Stephanie (39:19):
Little iffy.
Yeah.
Dani (39:22):
Inmate Jeffrey Atchison testified Fields admitted
stabbing kay in March of 1988while they shared a bunk bed in
the Ada County Jail.
He said Fields became agitatedwhen he watched a televised
description of the murders fromCrime Stoppers.
Fields.
Said they're trying to pin thatone on me, but I took care of
(39:44):
that.
Fields told him he disposed ofthe evidence so the police could
not link him to the crime.
I think he's talking about theknife.
Mm-hmm.
I think this is where they gotthe knife in the back of the
truck.
Okay.
Information.
Hackney asked Atchison why hewaited two years to tell
authorities about the confessionand question his motive in
(40:07):
testifying.
Okay.
Sison denied any compensationfor his testimony.
Hackney also attacked hiscredibility, calling him, quote,
a thief, forger and drug dealer.
A three time
Stephanie (40:21):
loser.
Three time loser.
Man, he's reading him in thiscourtroom.
Hackney said, Edison.
How do you say that intestimony, Mr.
Edison?
Is it true that you are in facta three time loser?
Because they always askquestions that way,
Dani (40:41):
right?
I'd be like, provide me.
Isn't it true that you are, I'dbe like, could you, uh, provide
me a definition of a loser?
Stephanie (40:48):
That's what I would be as someone.
So what if someone did thatthree times?
So is that in fact, you, sir?
Because I, as I, we can see, letthe record reflect, oh my God.
Dani (41:02):
Hackney also said that, Edson was expected to benefit.
By testifying against fields.
Edson had wrote a letter to theJudge Schroder asking for
special treatment.
Stephanie (41:13):
Oh.
And you know, little specialtreatment.
Yeah,
Dani (41:16):
he's getting it.
Can I get some some extra ramenand stuff?
We have one more inmate.
Stephanie (41:24):
These inmates are really just, I think they just
want to go do an activity forthe day.
They need more trip activities.
Field trip.
They're like, yes.
Have a little rise,
Dani (41:33):
some fresh air.
One more Inmate, Scott Bianchitestified.
Fields admitted to him.
He killed Kay.
Quote, fields told me that hekilled that lady and he didn't
mean to kill her, and he feltreal bad for her.
Hackney laid into him.
He accused Bianchi of flipflopping on a story, a letter
(41:56):
written to the prosecution inJanuary by Bianchi stated he
would quote, blow their case ifhe had to testify.
Oh my God.
Hackney said he is onlytestifying with the expectation
of receiving leniency from theparole board.
Bianchi said he was not offeredanything in exchange for his
(42:17):
testimony.
He only wanted to do the rightthing.
The right thing.
Mm-hmm.
So let's do a little count.
Are you ready?
Yeah.
How many three people testifiedFields was the man who entered
the store at the Linda VistaPlaza Those are like employees,
business owners.
(42:38):
Mm-hmm.
High Sand Bianchi said Fieldsconfessed to them and Edson said
he saw fields go into the shop.
Stephanie (42:46):
Okay.
Dani (42:48):
The defense called only two witnesses to the stand.
They only testified to thediscrepancy in Edison's
testimony.
That's a big word for me inopening statements.
An alibi witness was promisedfor fields.
So Hackney was like, Hey, wehave an alibi, but that didn't
(43:09):
happen.
Hackney said Field's roommatewas going to testify that he was
home that day watching the 12o'clock news on KTVB.
Good old KTVB love her.
KTVB sent over the footage ofthe newscast several months
before the trial, but sent thewrong date of the newscast.
(43:31):
Meaning nobody looked at it,they just thought they had the
right one.
Okay, because you know, there'sgonna be testimony, we've seen
this where like tell like, uh,the Scott Peterson case where
he's like, they're like, tellme, he's like, we're watching
like Morning America.
What was, and he is like RothStewart was making.
Lemon.
Mm-hmm.
Poppy seeds, something or Ican't remember.
(43:53):
I hope that's right.
Anyways.
And that was proven to be true,but like, that's what they're
trying to do here.
Yeah.
but when they went to goactually look at the newscast,
it was the wrong date.
So they're like, yo, send us theright dates, please.
Thank you.
KTVB.
I'm a little disappointed.
When the prosecution asked forthe, the correct footage from
(44:15):
KTVB, it was been destroyed.
Uh, KTVB.
What happened?
Well, a lot of these, I mean,they would reuse tape.
I mean, it was a lot a differenttechnology back then.
Stephanie (44:28):
Yes.
But there wouldn't be an a wayto look up what was on TV that
day, like on the internet.
So that could be.
At least a fair, I mean, youcould ask someone Sure.
Or but to remember a random,
Dani (44:41):
yeah.
Oh yeah.
I had chef, they went to herPeter on and Yeah.
Yeah.
And we covered this.
Like they went to the animalshelter
Stephanie (44:51):
or
Dani (44:51):
whatever.
This is literally over two yearslater, you're not gonna
remember.
That's like me asking you like,Hey, what did you do two years
ago on this day at work?
Stephanie (45:00):
No idea.
Dani (45:00):
Right?
Stephanie (45:01):
Absolutely no idea.
You're like,
Dani (45:03):
well, maybe I could dig through my emails and find
something.
Stephanie (45:05):
Oh, my email's deleted after that long.
So I'd be, shit, I maybe my onenote I could tell you something.
Right.
Dani (45:12):
So that's what I'm saying.
Like that was like, oh, we haveanyway, and he kind
Stephanie (45:18):
of dropped the ball there.
Dani (45:22):
fields does not testify in his defense.
The testimony only lasted fivedays before it was turned over
to the jury.
Very short trial.
Mm-hmm.
And it took 12 hours for thejury to come back with a guilty
verdict for first degree murderof Kay Vanderford.
In July, the defense is askingfor a new trial based on newly
(45:44):
discovered evidence thatchallenges the key prosecution
witnesses.
Ooh, what do we got?
Okay.
Oh God.
The defense team has their ownconvict find convicts with
convicts.
Salvador Martinez stated thatBianchi Gilcrest and High Stand
(46:06):
told him.
They fabricated theirtestimonies.
He said one of them studiedfield's, preliminary hearing
transcript to make sure theysounded credible.
Ooh, prosecutors bring injailers and other prison
officials that state thatMartinez was not behind bars,
but those other inmates on thosespecified dates.
(46:28):
Prosecutors said they have ataped interview with Martinez
stating he contacted the defenseteam before the trial.
And if that is true, Martinez'stestimony being be disqualified
because it's not new evidence.
Stephanie (46:43):
Oh, this is a really rough one.
Dani (46:46):
And then convict Gilcrest testified at this hearing quote,
I've never seen this gentlemanin my life.
I have no idea who he is whenreferring to Martinez and the
other inmates, Bianchi and Edsontestified they didn't lie on the
witness stand.
Okay.
Of
Stephanie (47:06):
course he would say that.
I mean, I don't know if they'relying or not, but you're not
going to go up there and belike, yeah, I did lie.
Unless you are caught dead torights, especially as a
prisoner,'cause that's gonnahurt your
Dani (47:20):
parole
Stephanie (47:21):
chances.
Dani (47:22):
It's just not a feel gooder for me.
Mm.
In November, judge Schroederdenies the new trial quote.
The testimony of Mr.
Martinez was not believable tothis court and would not be, be
believable to the, to a jury.
Law enforcement made seriousefforts to prevent the inmates
who testified from havingcontact with other inmates.
(47:45):
It is highly unlikely that Mr.
Martinez had the opportunity toengage in the conversations he
claims
Stephanie (47:51):
they should know whether or not they were in the
same space together at the sametimes.
Like that should be an easilyprov, provable thing.
So when they say, what was thatlast line like?
It is highly unlikely.
Yeah.
I don't wanna, highly unlikely.
I wanna No, here's our recordsof when everyone was doing time
and where they were, theywouldn't have interacted.
(48:14):
That's what I wanna see.
Dani (48:16):
It's 88 though.
Stephanie (48:17):
Yeah.
Dani (48:21):
Technological.
Technological, sorry.
Uh, sorry.
Let me have a sip.
On March 8th, 1991, despiteField's claims of innocence,
(48:41):
judge Schroeder sentenced him todeath for the murder of King.
Mm.
So, and I was, I can't rememberthe case.
It was, it was like, we're notgonna give him the death penalty
because it's not For sure, forsure.
Like the judge felt.
Right.
(49:01):
And I feel like, who was that?
Oh, I wish I, I should havelooked that up, but it was like,
not a For sure, for sure.
So we're not gonna do the deathpenalty.
Yeah.
There was
Stephanie (49:08):
some doubt or there was, you know, the evidence was
just lacking, whatever.
And I think they should do that.
I think.
If we're gonna go death penalty,it needs to be absolutely
certain.
Like
Dani (49:22):
there was no, this is what convicted him.
Was other.
Convicted,
Stephanie (49:31):
yeah.
Dani (49:33):
Felons
Stephanie (49:34):
saying that he said something,
Dani (49:36):
I don't like it.
Stephanie (49:37):
Yeah.
And eye witness listen,eyewitness can be good, but it
is one of the most
Dani (49:42):
highly unreliable,
Stephanie (49:44):
especially for like a circumstance where you're just
going about your day andsomething crazy happens.
It's not always the best.
I'm not saying that peopledon't, you know, haven't had
good testimony, but they've donestudies on it.
Yeah.
Like it truly can be unreliable.
So the different stories of whatthey look like, the sketch that
(50:07):
doesn't look like the guy.
I can't believe no one in thestore would be able to like,
participate and give a good ideaof further sketch in the
description.
Like if, what if they were inthe store and they saw
something?
'cause it sounded like that onelady, that
Dani (50:20):
lady did see somebody and she picked somebody else out of
the lineup.
Mm-hmm.
I just look, I, I feel very,very horrible for what happened
to Kay.
And I think somebody should beconvicted Yes.
For murdering her.
(50:41):
I just don't, I feel I, I would
Stephanie (50:44):
wanna see more evidence.
Yeah.
I would want something else.
And lemme just
Dani (50:47):
give you another little fun fact.
It's not a fun fact.
Another woman was murdered inOctober of 87.
Just, what is that, six months?
Stephanie (51:00):
Mm-hmm.
Before
Dani (51:02):
at her hallmark store in the very close to location.
and I am gonna do that story.
so there was lots of the publicwanted this to be solved.
Stephanie (51:17):
Yeah.
'cause you're killing littleladies in their cute little
stores.
Dani (51:21):
Exactly.
Two and six months the pressurewas on the police.
Yeah.
And in Boise.
Mm-hmm.
Because that's, it wasdefinitely much, much smaller.
So I just wish we had someforensic evidence, and I know 88
was, but
Stephanie (51:38):
just something else, or less, you know, contradicting
Dani (51:42):
testimony, like not shouting through the vents test.
I would never, as an attorney, Iwould, I would never even put, I
don't a prosecuting attorneyputting Oh, he yelled at me
through a 40 foot vent, that hekilled her and he felt really
bad.
Him like.
Very good questions anyways.
I just, eh, it doesn't feel likegood solid to me.
(52:06):
Right.
Um, but he was convicted, so, Ijust wanted more, and I'm not
saying it's not him by anymeans.
I mean,
Stephanie (52:15):
I don't, I don't know.
It's one that
Dani (52:17):
feels different.
And this is the one that feels,honestly,'cause I, and I, and I
told Steph this before westarted recording, I'm like, I
know.
I mean,
Stephanie (52:30):
I just, some of them are like this and it just, it
doesn't feel great.
And like you said, you just wantmore.
Like, give me something that'smore, that can help prove some
of this doubt or get rid of someof this doubt.
Dani (52:45):
Was he carrying a baby gun through town?
Yes.
That's my guy.
Yeah, right.
Stephanie (52:51):
Like that's what I want.
If they could have gotten thefingerprints or something, then
I would've been like, mm.
Yeah.
Dani (52:56):
Oh, were you did, you didn't buy
Stephanie (52:57):
anything.
Dani (52:58):
Did, were you driving the car?
Yeah.
And we found your license platesand we tracked you down because
you shot somebody at theconvenience store and Yeah,
that's what I want.
Oh, and you had that same gun onyou that killed the person.
I, there's nothing, there's nomurder weapon, no fingerprints.
Of course, DNA wasn't availablethen, but like there is, this
(53:23):
is,
Stephanie (53:23):
especially for a death penalty case.
It's a little wild.
That's what I'm
Dani (53:25):
saying too, like anyway, do without what you will, it
just doesn't feel assault aslike mm-hmm.
I'd like to have more.
Some of the other cases we'vedone in 1992, an execution data
set for fields for March 12th,and then here we go, appeals,
(53:46):
appeals, appeals.
Mm-hmm.
Appeals.
Mm-hmm.
And this is so many years later,still on death row, on March
27th, 2017, fields was foundunresponsive in his maximum
security cell at the Idaho StatePrison.
(54:07):
He was declared dead about anhour later.
Authorities said he died ofnatural causes at age 58.
Wow.
So he was still on death row andappealing his sentences.
And can I just tell you I'm verysurprised that he's still
appealing his sentences?
Yeah.
That, because he should what?
(54:29):
We, you would
Stephanie (54:29):
think they'd be exhausted.
Dani (54:30):
Uh, I think what I, what I was anticipating.
From our previous cases is thatit would've presented that a
judge cannot hand down the deathpenalty.
It has to be done by a jury, andtherefore they either had to
retry him or work out some dealwhere he got life and that was
(54:55):
not done.
Stephanie (54:58):
That is so interesting.
'cause it's, it's the, it wasthe usable tactic because Idaho
was just doing whatever the fuckit wanted it to do.
Dani (55:05):
He was, when Fields got convicted, he was like the 21st
or 22nd person, uh, on death rowin Idaho because, you know, they
were just rampant.
They were just Oh, they were
Stephanie (55:17):
handed it out.
Yeah.
Dani (55:18):
Left and right.
Washington's like, Hey, get thisguy for me.
Yeah, you Utah was like, getthis guy for me.
So, you know, it was just deathpenalty was just being handed
out willy-nilly.
And then we saw this shrink downto a very short list of people
because of the United StatesSupreme Court Dec Court decision
that.
States, it's that juries have tohand down the death sentence.
(55:39):
And so we saw a lot of thoseoverturned into life sentences
versus going back to trialbecause it was so long ago, et
cetera, et cetera.
We've talked about that.
But that did not happen forfields.
He was still on death row.
And the
Stephanie (55:54):
judge did give the death penalty, not the jury.
Right.
Was he like And he was waitingfor appeals and stuff.
Yeah, he was
Dani (56:03):
still on appeals.
Stephanie (56:05):
That's wild.
I know.
Things grind to it.
The, and I didn't go
Dani (56:10):
there.
First of all, I'm gonna tell youthat it was a sensational case
at the beginning.
Right.
Some, but then they
Stephanie (56:19):
become forgotten.
And then
Dani (56:20):
they become forgotten, and then they're not reported on.
Yeah.
So, I could have went and duginto the court system, but eh.
Stephanie (56:32):
I don't know.
I just, it is what it is.
I mean, sometimes it's, it endedthat way.
He died in jail and,
Dani (56:38):
and he was only 58.
That's pretty young.
so, and there you have itjustice served well, appeals
exhausted.
I mean, he was still appealing.
Mm-hmm.
But, and ultimately naturestepping into close a chapter.
Stephanie (56:56):
Yeah.
Dani (56:57):
On fields.
But the question is, was Fieldstruly the monster behind that
crime?
Right.
Or was he a conveniencescapegoat for a police
department under pressure,
Stephanie (57:09):
because we have seen that happen.
Or when they super focus onsomeone where they just have a
hunch, and even when evidence isleading them elsewhere, those
cases suck.
Dani (57:21):
But either way, field's bizarre behaviors, the
questionable testimonies andinmate drama ensured this case
was anything but ordinary.
I just, I did not like thatthere was, there was more
inmates.
Stephanie (57:39):
Yeah.
That's testimony.
That's the bulk of the case.
Dani (57:42):
Then there was, and there was just a couple of shopkeepers
that saw a man a half mile downthat I just don't think it would
fly today.
No, I just don't, I don't thinkit would fly today.
And so I kind of have thatskeptical, like,
Stephanie (57:58):
because it's always kind of a 50 50 with inmate
testimony.
'cause there's everything togain and nothing to lose.
Nothing to lose unless they canprove somehow that you're lying.
And that's, and especially for
Dani (58:10):
these guys that are spending, it's a three year
sentence.
Mm-hmm.
A four year sentence.
Really nothing for them to lose.
Now if you are a lifer and yougo snitch, big impact there.
There's you during your.
Incarceration.
You're gonna have people callyou a snitch.
Mm-hmm.
And you're gonna have to be inlock.
(58:31):
But these guys that are doinglike two or three years, like
I'm on my last like six months.
Sure.
Yeah.
And I
Stephanie (58:36):
might get out right now because of doing this.
Yeah.
So not right now,
Dani (58:39):
but
Stephanie (58:40):
yeah, I might.
Or maybe my,
Dani (58:42):
maybe my probation won't be so bad'cause I was a good
dude.
Stephanie (58:47):
Exactly.
I don't like it.
There's lots of incentive andvery little risk
Dani (58:52):
anyways, uh, stay safe and keep questioning
Stephanie (58:56):
everything for real.
Alright guys, been a goodepisode.
We are gonna have some fun stuffon TikTok and Facebook.
Maybe a little mini giveaway.
so keep your eyes peeled there.
Once again, appreciate you forlistening and emailing and
commenting and we have so muchfun.
So thank you again and we willsee you in two weeks.
(59:20):
Ten four rubber ducky.
Fuck yeah.
Alright.
So everybody, welcome back tothe Lethal Library.
I'm Stephanie.
I'm Danny.
And today we're gonna tell youanother true crime tale out of
Idaho.
So Danny, what do you have forus today?
Dani (00:42):
Today we're diving into the chilling tale of Kay
Vanderford, whose seeminglynormal day at her Boise gift
shop turned into a horrifyingnightmare from mysterious
sightings of suspiciouscharacters and bulky jackets to
inmate and informants chattingit up like they're on the
episode of Reality tv.
(01:03):
Good.
This case has all the elementsof a true crime roller coaster
resources used.
Today are articles from theIdaho Statesmen
Stephanie (01:13):
exclusive, exclusive to the Idaho Statesmen.
Sponsor.
It could be you.
They're like, um, yeah, not withthat filthy male.
Dani (01:26):
on February 11th, 1988, 69-year-old Kay Vanderford and
her husband Herbert, headed downto their daughter's gift shop,
the wishing Well in Boise,Idaho.
Stephanie (01:40):
Very cutesy.
Dani (01:41):
Isn't that a very cute gift shop?
Wishing well gift.
I love that.
Kay and Herbert opened up theshop that morning and got their
day going just like any typicalday.
Herbert washed the front windowsaround 11 o'clock and left
shortly after.
At 1120, Kay called 9 1 1 andreported she had been stabbed A
(02:06):
customer entered the store andalso dialed 9 1 1.
Police arrived within fourminutes of the first call.
Stephanie (02:13):
That's a great response time.
Dani (02:14):
Great response time.
Kay was transported to St.
Al's where she died around 1230for her injuries during a
surgery.
Stephanie (02:23):
I just can't even imagine that, as a partner, to
see your partner regular day andwithin basically an hour they're
dead.
Yeah.
Dani (02:34):
Like, because it was a very normal, normal day for
them.
He's, of course.
and I just, let me just tell youwhere this is at in Boise.
So, it's on Fairview betweencoal and Alumba.
So it's by like there's asunrise right there.
Mm-hmm.
There's like a little strip mallwith four or five businesses in
it, and that's where that waslocated.
(02:56):
It's no longer there, but that'swhere that was.
Wow.
At, Kay had two grown children.
Karen, who owned the gift shop,and a son Tom.
Who lived in northern Idaho.
Kay.
Had just celebrated her 47thwedding anniversary three weeks
before she was murdered.
(03:17):
Family and friends said sheenjoyed keeping up on current
events, being with her familyand spending time at the cabin
and Cascade.
They had a, a dorms.
Yeah, they had a lakeside cabinup there that they would go and
with all the family.
Yeah.
Stephanie (03:31):
It sounds like they had a very cute, like 47 year
anniversary.
Almost made it to 50.
That's really incredible.
And
Dani (03:37):
she was still she was helping her daughter run th gift
shop, which I think is soawesome.
Like, it, definitely was herpurpose.
I mean, and she loved hergrandchildren, that that was
very, her grandchildren werevery, very important to her.
But she went down and she wasthe face of that store.
(03:59):
Mm-hmm.
Karen said her mother was thecornerstone of the store.
Oh.
Kate had been working at thegift shop for 15 years and she
absolutely loved it.
Stephanie (04:08):
It sounds like that would be a great job.
Dani (04:10):
'cause they, her and her husband had like, uh, a service
station, um, I think it was upby Lewiston, where they ran that
and stuff and then they retired.
Stephanie (04:21):
Yeah.
Dani (04:21):
And then she's like, I'll come help your daughter.
Those
Stephanie (04:24):
little fun hobbies.
Yeah.
Like job to get, get extraincome and, and she
Dani (04:28):
was doing,'cause she had, obviously life experience
running a business.
Mm-hmm.
So she was doing the books, andalso helping purchase the items
for the store.
Yeah.
What are we gonna put in thestore?
Yeah.
I
Stephanie (04:39):
think that's a great thing for older folks if they
want to, to find a really lowimpact job.
Yeah.
That still they're using theirbrain.
Mm-hmm.
They're still socializing.
They're absolutely still, youknow,
Dani (04:50):
and they're helping out their daughter.
Stephanie (04:52):
Yeah.
Family business that's just,just like picture perfect.
I think most people would want akind of retirement like that.
You know,
Dani (05:02):
I think it's healthy for, to still get out.
Mm-hmm.
police started theirinvestigation beginning with the
nearby businesses.
Stephanie (05:09):
Really,
Dani (05:11):
and well, this happened in the middle of the day.
Yes.
Literally in the middle of theday.
Day and
Stephanie (05:15):
in the morning too.
It was, this is like 1120 in
Dani (05:18):
the middle of the day.
What, what are we doing?
And I'm not sure what time thestore opened.
I kind of feel like it was maybelike 10 ish because they got
there, open everything up, andthen, you know, Herbert's out
there just like, let me, youknow, clean these windows.
You know, I've worked retailbefore.
A restaurant like the, the frontdoor's always felt that you're
hitting that every day.
(05:39):
Yeah.
Oh yeah.
you know, make it presentable.
And he is like, I'm gonna go runsome errands.
I'll be back.
Whatever he's doing, you know,normal day, normal day, an
employee from the State FarmInsurance office, located next
door, said she had heard ascream, but thought it was a
playful yell.
And employees from anotherneighboring business.
(05:59):
Manino
Stephanie (06:01):
Love man.
Love Mancino.
Dani (06:02):
Love mea Manino.
It's been a hot minute, but Ilove it.
Stephanie (06:05):
I know it's one that I always forget about.
Yeah.
Where you at?
Manino?
We need you in some ads orsomething.
Right.
Dani (06:11):
You know where they're at here though, right?
Stephanie (06:13):
Yeah.
They're just in the like, whatis that road?
Midland?
Yeah.
Yeah.
They're
Dani (06:18):
Midland like lone star, I think.
Get you some Mancino sponsor.
the employees from Mancino saidthey didn't see or hear anything
unusual.
They were
Stephanie (06:31):
just working about their own day.
Yeah.
And you're not expecting that?
No.
Dani (06:35):
and I've worked in those businesses like where you're
like sharing a wall, a stripmall.
Mm-hmm.
You can hear other things, butwhether, I mean, if I'm busy
talking on the phone orsomething and I hear a loud
noise, I can't, you wouldn't bedecipher.
Like, is is that a cry for helpor was somebody laughing because
(06:56):
I would assume somebody would belaughing or hollering not
getting stabbed?
Mm-hmm.
on February 13th, just a fewdays later, police release a
sketch of a suspect.
He is described as a 48-year-oldman, six four, and weighs about
220 pounds.
(07:18):
The top of his head is bald withbrown hair on the sides.
He was last seen a bluesweatshirt with a white or gray
shirt underneath and navy bluepants.
Stephanie (07:29):
Pretty good description.
Dani (07:31):
It's pretty
Stephanie (07:32):
descrip.
There's a lot of things inthere.
Dani (07:35):
Let me show you their sketch.
Stephanie (07:40):
Okay guys, I'm gonna describe this sketch in my first
impression.
It reminds me of what is theactor that does Fight Club?
Not Brad Pitt, otherwise Edward
Dani (07:52):
Norton.
Yeah,
Stephanie (07:53):
ed.
It looks to me like Edward doesthat not
Dani (07:56):
Yeah, Edward Norton with But Bald, but balding.
Stephanie (07:59):
Yeah.
Maybe look, look it up guys.
Or maybe I'll put it on theFacebook, but yeah, imagine
Edward Norton.
But bald is what it looks like.
Dani (08:08):
I, but on February 18th, the authorities say they're
seeking a Second Man, employeesand the owners of nearby
businesses in the Linda VistaPlaza.
Saw a man with a large knifesticking out of his coat pocket
not long after the stabbing.
Oh.
They described the man as 25 to30 years old, six feet tall,
(08:33):
about 220, 2 30 pounds.
He had bushy strawberry blondehair and was wearing an orange,
bulky coat with blue jeans.
He had entered several shops inthe plaza between 12 and 1230 on
the, on February 11th, the daythat Kay was stabbed.
(08:55):
And this isn't far, it's like ahalf mile.
Stephanie (08:59):
So it makes you think if someone's staking out places
going in.
Mm-hmm.
Dani (09:05):
Detective Sergeant Dave Smith said the clerks asked if
they could help him, but all hesaid was, I'm just waiting.
The clerk said they all feltuneasy about him being there and
that they had never seen him inthe area before.
Stephanie (09:21):
Right.
I'm just waiting.
Yeah.
Well, I guess if you're outsidethe store, maybe I wonder if it
was inside or outside, but like,say no, he,
Dani (09:31):
he went inside the stores.
Like they made himuncomfortable.
Like, to say that
Stephanie (09:34):
inside.
Like, what?
What do you mean waiting?
Yeah.
Like,
Dani (09:39):
but also could I show up at a, at a store?
We're gonna go look at somethingand be like, I guess I just
waiting for my friend.
We're gonna go look at some, Idon't know.
Okay.
I mean, it's a stretch, but hewas,
Stephanie (09:51):
he was just bad vibes.
Yeah.
That was it.
The vibe was off.
Dani (09:56):
the man was last seeing running East on Fairview.
Why are you running, why are yourunning in the middle of the day
in a large coat?
I mean, it's February.
He's not going for a jog.
Right.
Stephanie (10:08):
What's going on here
Dani (10:11):
in 1989?
Authorities say they are stillactively pursuing leads.
Ooh.
So
Stephanie (10:20):
that means they haven't gotten much probably a
year later if you're asking forany leads.
Dani (10:25):
Yeah.
Kay's daughter keeps her storeopen on the one year anniversary
of her mother's death.
Her daughter invites the publicto come down to the store and
share memories of Kay.
Stephanie (10:40):
That's heart.
It's good, but it'sheartbreaking.
Like,
Dani (10:44):
and I feel like, you know, she's had a, the family's had a
year mm-hmm.
To process this and to deal withit however you deal with it.
But I also think it's very howheartwarming, you know, when you
lose somebody close to you andpeople come and comfort you and
tell you how Awesome.
(11:05):
Right.
Somebody, if it's good, you feelclose.
And I also feel like she waslike, Hey.
Yo.
Hello.
There's still a murderer on theloose.
Stephanie (11:16):
Remember that one time when someone came into my
fucking store and killed my mom?
Yeah.
You remember that?
I think that's, we're stillhere, just patiently waiting.
So, um, yeah.
So I kind of feel like it's agood, it's a good tactic.
'cause we've heard many caseswhere someone even doing a
newspaper article, or an opinionpiece mm-hmm.
Or some type of memorial,especially for an unsolved case.
(11:40):
Sometimes 10 years down theline, someone's like, oh my
gosh,
Dani (11:43):
somebody told me about that.
Stephanie (11:45):
Yeah.
This guy got drunk in a bar
Dani (11:46):
and told me all about this and that.
So I, I do think it was good.
I probably, mentally and also tohelp kind of boost it and keep
it boost.
Yeah.
In the headlines.
On April 18th, 1989, policefinally charged someone with a
murder of Kay Goodness, ZaneJack Fields age 30 as charged
(12:10):
with first degree murder.
Fields is a current inmate atthe Idaho Correctional
Institution in Orofino.
Stephanie (12:18):
Welcome home.
Dani (12:21):
Lemme tell you a little bit about this guy.
Stephanie (12:23):
Okay.
Dani (12:24):
Fields's criminal history started in 1976 when he was
convicted of grand larceny.
He was paroled a year later, butquickly returned to prison on a
charge of possession of acontrolled substance.
He has also been convicted ofburglary, forgery, and delivery
of a controlled substance.
(12:45):
So Adila and Chema, he hasalready spent nearly 10 years in
prison for those convictions.
Stop doing these things.
Yeah.
So he's 30, so he's been in thesystem a
Stephanie (13:00):
a third of his life.
Yeah.
And then think of your adultlife.
You've got 12 adult years.
So he's had like two years ofhis adult life.
'cause I mean, if you're inprison, you're an adult most
likely.
Dani (13:13):
Yeah.
No, calm
Stephanie (13:15):
down.
Dani (13:17):
He was fucking around and found
Stephanie (13:19):
out.
And finding out rep heatedly,like you're again, the people
who are not good at crimes, justwanna keep doing the crime
stuff.
Stop or learn.
Let's see some innovation.
And I'm not talking about likefor murdering, but like, you
wanna do a little shoplifting orwhatever.
Let's be innovative about it.
(13:41):
No, let's not be dumb about it.
My God.
Dani (13:46):
Phil's most recent conviction came from an incident
on February 22nd, 1988.
So I'm gonna just do a littletimeline for you.
Yes.
Kay was murdered on February11th.
Mm, 1988.
Stephanie (14:02):
11 days later.
Yes.
He is arrested for, what was it?
Larceny.
Burglary.
Dani (14:06):
Oh, let me tell you.
Stephanie (14:07):
Oh, I'm ready.
Dani (14:10):
Fields entered the Shopco on Fairview.
In Boise around one 30 in theafternoon.
He was in the store for a whileand drew the attention of some
employees who thought he mightbe shoplifting.
Oh,
Stephanie (14:27):
see, you're bad at it.
Dani (14:28):
Were you wearing the big coat, bro?
Stephanie (14:30):
That fucking puffy coat.
Dani (14:33):
When Fields left the store, a security guard and the
store manager approached him andthey said, Hey, have you taken
anything from the store?
Phil's response was, he was sickof prison and he didn't wanna
spend any more time there.
And then he drew a gun andpointed it at the two men
(14:55):
escalation at times a thousand.
Okay.
He didn't shoot it.
he pointed at the two men.
He just turned and walked away.
Stephanie (15:04):
Brandishing not good, bro.
And you're a felon most likely,right?
Dani (15:10):
Yeah.
I mean, because they're allfelonies.
I'm thinking 10 years probablyfe Yeah.
Controlled substances.
And that
Stephanie (15:16):
automatic, I think it's an automatic, yeah.
Okay.
Dani (15:20):
And it probably was pot back in 88.
I'm just had to say that one.
Isn't
Stephanie (15:25):
that so ridiculous to think about?
Just dumb.
Dani (15:31):
He was arrested about 20 minutes later.
They found a cassette tape and aholster on fields at the time of
his arrest.
So for our, everybody knows whata tape cassette?
Yeah.
Oh, it's not a cd.
Stephanie (15:50):
It's before.
It's the step before CDs.
Dani (15:53):
It's between an eight track and a cd.
Stephanie (15:55):
Yes.
Dani (15:56):
I'm not an eight track
Stephanie (15:57):
girl.
Dani (15:58):
I'm not either.
I did not know
Stephanie (15:59):
those.
I've, I've never held one.
Dani (16:02):
Uh, were you, uh, tape girl?
Did you have tapes?
Tapes?
Oh yes.
Tapes.
Stephanie (16:09):
Lots of tapes.
Lots of
Dani (16:10):
tapes.
Stephanie (16:11):
And then my sister got that subscription to like
whatever music company sendsout, like subscriptions of CDs
and then I would just steal herCDs.
That's beautiful.
She was very cool.
She had all the cool stuff.
Dani (16:23):
I love that.
For you Fields was found guiltyof aggravated assault and petty
theft.
Do you wanna know what he stole?
Was it the cassette?
Yeah, but you wanna know whatband it was?
Yes.
Who CCR are?
Oh my God, I feel so old rightnow.
Stephanie (16:46):
I might, I might know this song.
What's this?
Their popular song?
Dani (16:51):
Credence Claire.
What?
Oh,
Stephanie (16:53):
I just don't, I don't recognize, I never call them
that.
So yes, I know tons of theirsongs.
Okay, now I feel embarrassed.
And I thought you said zr, so Iwas like, oh.
Led Zeppelin now like CCR.
I'm sorry.
I didn't understand the I lovethem.
Okay, we're good.
Dani (17:10):
Oh my gosh.
Now I feel so You thought Ididn't know them well?
No, I felt stupid using theirlittle abbreviation and I was
like, oh my God, I'm fuckingold.
Stephanie (17:21):
I should, I don't know why I don't use the abra.
I mean, sometimes I just saycredence.
CCR.
That's how the cool kids, thesuperfan say it.
Dani (17:29):
Okay.
I'm fucking cool now.
I know.
Now I feel better stuff.
Thank you.
Okay.
Uh, during his sentencinghearing for that crime, he told
Judge Schroeder, who we haveseen in, we know many and
others.
Schroeder good old Schrodersquote, prison's not where it's
(17:50):
at.
The streets are where it's at.
That's where my life is.
Prison's getting a little oldunquote.
Stephanie (17:59):
Very effective and persuasive argument, sir.
And judge, I went, did you wrapit on a beat?
'cause it sounds like he wantedto.
I kind of feel like that he wasseeing that a little bit.
Prison ain't where it's at.
I, I, I live on the streets.
Dani (18:13):
Prison's getting a little old from me.
Stephanie (18:19):
The judge is like, alright, this is the worst day
of my life.
Should's like, but I had to seethat.
Dani (18:24):
Uh, sorry you feel that way, but here's five years for
you.
Yeah.
Thanks for sharing yourfeelings.
Thank you, sir.
So he was sentenced to fiveyears for stealing the cassette
tape and
Stephanie (18:35):
pulling the gun.
Five years for the credence.
Man, you must have been a bigfan, willing to brandish and
point a firearm over a cassettetape.
Dani (18:45):
They never did find the gun, but he had a holster.
Yes.
And they don't think would lie
Stephanie (18:50):
about.
Being pulled
Dani (18:51):
and you know, back in the day they put like the cassettes
and like the big plastic things.
Mm-hmm.
Stephanie (18:56):
Mm-hmm.
So those are not the optimalitem to steal just like CDs
because they take forever toopen and you have to get it
open.
You can't just
Dani (19:07):
ditch
Stephanie (19:08):
it.
Mm-hmm.
Dani (19:09):
You can't like unwrap all the cellophane and be like
putting it in your Walkman andbe like, dude, I've had this.
Right.
No, no.
It doesn't work.
Doesn't it doesn't work
Stephanie (19:16):
that way.
Dani (19:19):
We're not criminals.
Well,
Stephanie (19:22):
I am.
I was when I was a teenager.
No.
I used to shop with littlethings like lip gloss and stuff
as like a preteen and a teenwith no supervision.
And then one time I went to theplace where we always shoplifted
from, um, with two boys thatthought that they were real hot
shit and they went straight forthe CDs.
(19:42):
And I was like, that's a badidea.
That's a very stupid idea.
And was like.
They thought, they said, no, weknow what we're doing.
And they were like walkingthrough the aisles, like putting
the cellophane in, like old rug,like not old rugs, but rolled up
rugs and stuff, sliding thecases under the aisles and
stuff.
And I'm like, oh my God, this isawful.
Guess who stops us on the wayout?
(20:03):
Loss prevention.
They weren't called lossprevention back then.
They, they had their littlebadge, you know, little security
guard.
Yes.
And so, um, that's what wecalled back in the day anyways.
Did you unfriend them?
We did not go on anothershopping trip again.
Okay.
I assure you of that.
And I was like, I didn't even, Iwas so nervous.
I didn't even take like a lipgloss or anything.
(20:23):
I was like, I ain't gettingcaught with you idiots.
Like, no.
Anyways, I ran bye.
I don't know.
They, they, I think got awaytoo.
They basically just gave him awarning, which they should have
just for the stupidity of the,the whole thing.
But yeah, no, we were not, um,that's not
Dani (20:39):
happening
Stephanie (20:39):
nowadays.
We were not shopping buddies.
Dani (20:42):
I actually think I, I should look that up.
I bet you shoplift is way, waylow for like stupid teenage
kids.
'cause there's cameraseverywhere.
Stephanie (20:51):
Oh, yeah.
Yeah.
And they, they're sosophisticated, right?
Like for the folks that thinkthat they're getting away with
it, for at Sephora or Target,even if you're putting a
different label on or scanningeverything as an orange, um,
that you're not getting awaywith it.
What they're doing is they'rebuilding a file on you and
waiting for you to get to thefelony level, and then they're
(21:13):
gonna be like, here's 16 hoursof tape of you.
So just for those out there thatthink, oh man.
And may, maybe you did it forlike, you know, you got a bag of
oranges and you only scan forone.
They are very serious about,they're counting about it and
they want anything that'saffecting their bottom
Dani (21:33):
TikTok.
Accountants are back there withtheir spreadsheets.
Yes.
Stephanie (21:35):
And those cameras just.
They people think, oh, I paidwith cash.
They're never gonna know who Iam.
The cameras can read your ID andyour the numbers on your card.
Mm-hmm.
They're very good.
Cameras
Dani (21:46):
don't do it.
They're following you to yourcar.
Speaking as a
Stephanie (21:49):
former teen criminal of lip gloss theft, it ain't as
easy as it was.
We're can't even do cocaineanymore.
Dani (21:57):
Can't even shoplift, can't even do cocaine in America.
That's, uh, all of, uh, Theo vYouo v telling JD Vans can't
even do cocaine in this countryanymore except this country,
man.
In June, police are asking thepublic if they have any
information on the knife thatwas used to kill Kay.
(22:19):
They said that it was throwninto the back of a pickup truck
after the attack.
Stephanie (22:25):
Oh, so someone gave up that info?
Dani (22:32):
No.
Stephanie (22:34):
No.
How did they know that?
Oh, I'm skipping ahead.
Dani (22:41):
I think they, yeah, they're just, listen, we're not
sure.
Yeah.
Okay.
Somebody was talking.
Um, I don't think it was Fields.
I like 95%.
It wasn't fields.
So let's get down to some nittygritty hearing.
Yeah.
Let's get into it.
(23:01):
figure out why they were askingfor that and where that
information came from.
In August, a fellow inmate offields testified that Fields had
confessed to the crime.
Harold Gilcrest said Philconfessed that quote.
(23:22):
He stabbed the lady in the neckabove the shoulder.
Gilcrest said quote, we arefriends.
Are you though?
That what?
He said, we are friends.
That's such a weird response,isn't it?
It is.
Stephanie (23:40):
Danny, I hit someone with my car, but we are friends.
Sure.
Conversational like that is solike
Dani (23:49):
it's not how words work.
Gilcrest said he asked fieldsabout the murder and at first
fields maintained his innocence,but then he asked Fields, quote
how much money was taken fromthe till, and he told me he got
48 to$50.
(24:12):
Wow.
I just opened that day.
You don't rob when?
No, that's just bad robbery.
Um, but also I want you to just,even in 1988, would$50 be a good
opening till?
No.
No, I don't think so.
Keep that in mind.
(24:33):
Yeah.
Okay.
A former inmate, Keith Edsonsaid he saw fields near the
store that day.
He knew fields from a stay atthe Idaho State Penitentiary.
He said he saw a man in anorange jacket into the store and
recognized him as fields.
Edson said he saw him leave thestore after about 10 minutes.
(24:55):
Hmm.
Fields entered a not guiltyplea.
He's facing the death penalty,so all this testimony is coming
up in his arraignment.
Yeah, trial, all that stuff inOctober.
Fields.
Asked for a change in venue andwas also asking for a new court
(25:20):
appointed attorney.
Judge Schroeder will considerthe change of venue along with a
handful of motions entered bythe defense.
No new attorney.
The judge said it was workedout.
Basically fields is like, Iasked my attorney to bring me
these papers, like gimme myformal charges and blah, blah,
blah, blah, blah.
Like he wanted some information.
(25:40):
Mm-hmm.
The attorney didn't provide thatto him, but in court he did.
He's like, here, here's yourdocuments.
So it was all, he settled asquash.
Yeah.
And late November Fields defenseteam requested to be removed
from the case.
Oh.
So why didn't we just, well,some stuff come about.
(26:01):
So, uh oh.
So Amil, my Shin and Gus Cahilland we've had my shin in here
before, and I might be saying itwrong.
It's M-Y-S-H-I-N.
Michin.
Michin.
It sounds like it would be.
Right.
Uh, and Gus Cahill were grantedthe requests to be removed from
the case because they hadrepresented several inmates that
are scheduled to testify in thecase.
(26:22):
Oh, big conflict of
Stephanie (26:24):
interest.
Yeah.
Dani (26:26):
This delays the trial, which was scheduled for December
4th.
So.
Because the new attorneys haveto have some time.
Yeah.
Yeah.
They gotta be able to prepare.
Uh, new attorneys are assignedto the case, Gar Hackney and
John Lin.
And from my reading, I heart mesome Hackney.
(26:46):
I think you're gonna be happywith, let's hear about it.
Hackney.
Yeah.
In 1990, the new set ofattorneys are asking to suppress
Gilcrest testimony from thetrial.
Gilcrest admitted thatdetectives asked him to listen
for information concerning themurder at the wishing well.
(27:08):
The defense team said wheninmates solicited the
information from fields, theywere acting as agents of the
Boise Police Department.
They argue that fields shouldhave been provided a Miranda
Rights warning prior to talkingto the informants.
Mm.
So this got me thinking like we,we hear about Miranda Rights all
(27:33):
the time and I was like, I don'teven know where that comes from
or what that means.
I mean, I know what it is.
Mm-hmm.
So it's Education Corner onDanny at the Lethal Library.
so this is from, history.com andit's says that the Miranda
(27:59):
rights originated from alandmark 1966 US Supreme Court
case, Miranda versus Arizona aMarch 2nd, 1963.
When an 18-year-old Phoenixwoman told police that she had
been abducted, driven to thedesert and raped detectives
questioning her.
The story gave her a polygraphtest, but the results were
(28:21):
inconclusive.
However, tracking the licenseplate number of the car that
resembled that of her attackersbrought police to Ernesto
Miranda, who had a prior recordas a peeping Tom.
Although the victim did notidentify Miranda in a lineup, he
was brought into police custodyand interrogated.
(28:43):
What happened next is disputed,but officers left the
interrogation with a confessionthat Miranda later recanted
unaware that he didn't have tosay anything at all.
The confession was extremelybrief and differed in certain
respects from the victim'saccount of the crime.
However, Miranda's appointeddefense attorney.
(29:05):
He didn't call any witnesses atthe ensuing trial, and Miranda
was convicted.
While Miranda was an Arizonastate person.
The American Civil LibertiesUnion took up his appeal,
claiming the confession wasfalse or coerced, and the
Supreme Court overturned hisconviction.
(29:26):
Miranda was retired andconvicted in October, 1966,
remaining in prison until 1972.
Ernesto Miranda was laterstabbed to death in the men's
room of a bar after a poker gamein January of 76.
Shit.
So I know that's a lot, but Ijust like, I was like, I'm gonna
go look that up.
(29:47):
Mm-hmm.
Because we hear that all thetime.
Miranda Rights.
Miranda Rights.
They weren't read.
They're Miranda rights, butit's, it's after that case
where.
He was coerced, but never giventhe advice that he had a right
to an attorney.
Stephanie (30:00):
And I figured that it was, you know, I think, I think
we all know that it's from acase, but especially with
Miranda, I was like, maybe it'sa girl.
Mm-hmm.
No idea.
Dani (30:08):
Yeah.
So anyways, little EducationCorner with Danny.
In May, 1990, the trial begins.
This is two years after Kay ismurdered.
(30:31):
Attorney Hackney tells the jurythat Zane Fields is a scapegoat
and a patsy for theinvestigators that failed to
solve the murder of Kay.
Yikes.
Hackney showed the compositepolice release to the public
stating that it looks nothinglike his client.
Prosecutor Joel Horton told thejury that fields confess to the
(30:54):
murder and he will presentfellow inmates that will testify
to that fact.
Defense attorney Hackney said,quote, the state has no forensic
or scientific evidence thatconnects fields to the murder
outside of the courthouse.
This is after the first day ofcourt.
A reporter asked Fields abouthis feelings on the trial, and
(31:17):
he said, quote, go eat shit anddie.
You bitch.
Oh,
Stephanie (31:24):
I quote, not quite as eloquent of a rap verse in that
one, but, oh, not the
Dani (31:29):
staying in the prison.
The streets are my
Stephanie (31:31):
life.
Streets are my life.
That's where it's at.
Chicken.
Chicken.
Honey, you've only been able tohave two years on the streets.
Regardless.
The prison is your life so
Dani (31:43):
far.
Prison is your life.
On the second day of the trial,a prosecution witness said she
saw another man, not thedefendant.
Enter the gift shop that day.
Ooh.
Betty Honecker told the jurorsshe was a customer in the
wishing well.
That day, she saw a man rapidlyenter the store.
(32:06):
Quote.
I kept an eye on him because Ifelt he was trying to avoid me,
unquote.
When asked to identify the man,Betty chose a police photo of a
former customer who disputed an$80 deposit with a shop's owner.
She picked the wrong dude, andHackney was like, whoa, what he
(32:32):
was, yeah.
Where's this guy?
He was taken.
He was totally surprised by thistestimony, but the prosecution
had other witnesses take thestand who said they saw fields
that day with a knife actingstrangely.
Nancy Miller and Vicki Tippetsboth pointed to fields in the
courtroom when asked to identifywho they saw that day.
(32:55):
Both women saw fields at theVista Plaza.
Shopping Center about a halfmile from the gift shop.
Both said they saw what appearedto be a wooden handle of a knife
in field's, right Pocket Tippetsaid quote, he stared at me.
He stared at the cash register.
(33:16):
Then he stared at me again, andhe looked back at the cash
register and the people in theshop.
So he was like, eyeballing.
So let's go back into her quote.
His eyes were very wild looking.
Mm.
He has very scary eyes to lookat.
They were evil.
If there was an objection onthat testimony, I would be
(33:39):
surprised, right?
Yeah.
Yeah.
What is evil?
What does evil eyes look like?
Then they played case nine oneone call in the courtroom.
Stephanie (33:51):
Oh, I bet that was terrible.
Dani (33:53):
She was crying for help.
Quote, she said quote, I've beenstabbed and I'm bleeding to
death.
Ugh.
Stephanie (34:04):
Yeah, and just like that so quickly, something like
this to happen, just like wewere talking about, it's just
crazy.
And that for
Dani (34:10):
her to real like, I don't know.
I just think like if I gotstabbed, I'd be like, I'm
bleeding.
But like she knew it was bad.
Mm-hmm.
That's It's heartbreakingpathologist, Frank fao, funny
name.
Yeah.
Frank FAO testified, Kay bled todeath from a stab wound that
(34:32):
severed a vein in her neck.
Stephanie (34:35):
It
Dani (34:35):
was
Stephanie (34:36):
the carotid or whatever.
Yeah, it was jugular.
Dani (34:42):
A key prosecution witness.
Keith Edson testified he walkedfrom his residence at the
Olympic Hotel to Po.
Joe's on the day of the murder.
Good old Po Joe's.
I love Po.
Joe's.
He saw someone he thought lookedfamiliar, walking to the wishing
well.
(35:03):
Edson waited for the man becausehe felt he knew him.
After waiting 15 minutes, hesaw, he said he saw Phil left
the leave the store and Edsondecided not to approach him.
I had this gut feeling.
He acted really nervous.
He was looking around likesomething wasn't right.
(35:27):
When asked why he didn't callauthorities after hearing about
the attack, Edson said he didn'tcall because he couldn't recall
the man's name.
I didn't think I had anyrelevant information.
He waited until 12 days later tocontact the authorities when he
saw the news reports that Fieldshad been arrested for attempting
(35:48):
to rob the Shopco.
Oh, weird.
If you saw the new, let me just,
Stephanie (35:58):
even if you don't know their name, their
description
Dani (36:01):
at the place where somebody was murdered.
Stephanie (36:03):
Yeah.
Dani (36:04):
And you said he looked suspicious regardless whether
you knew him or not.
Mm-hmm.
If you saw somebody enter thestore, waited for them, they
exited, and then later on theevening news, you saw somebody
was stabbed in that store, youwouldn't call the cops.
Yeah, you should call the cops.
Yeah.
Here comes Hackney.
(36:24):
He was like, uh, Mr.
Addison, shouldn't you rememberField's name?
You literally spoke every day toeach other for six months.
What?
In 1985 you had adjoining salesat the Idaho State Penitentiary.
Edson was serving a three yearsentence for stealing a car.
(36:48):
Hackney also called outinconsistencies between Edmond's
testimony, Edson said he sawfields wearing an orange, brown,
and green camouflage jacket thatday.
Remember what the otherwitnesses said?
Fields was wearing an orangecoat.
Mm-hmm.
Just a plain, not a camouflage.
(37:08):
Yeah.
That's not hard.
Anyway.
You don't know him.
You don't know him?
Stephanie (37:14):
Yeah.
Sounds fishy.
I'm not loving it.
Dani (37:19):
I'm not loving it either.
Stephanie (37:21):
Mm-hmm.
Dani (37:22):
Because he's like, Hey, for six months you guys talked
to each other.
Stephanie (37:29):
Yeah.
I think it would be pretty hardto forget someone's name, but
just not calling in.
Even if you in general don'tknow the name.
Right.
You don't have to know the name.
Right.
Dani (37:43):
You don't have to.
No.
Just tell him what you saw.
Right.
Regardless if you knew this guyfrom somebody familiar or not.
Oh no.
I was watching that store and Isaw mm-hmm.
Somebody leave and enter thatstore and he looked a little
off.
That's all.
Stephanie (37:59):
Yeah.
And you can say, they lookedfamiliar to me, but I can't
place from where.
Dani (38:04):
Mm-hmm.
Stephanie (38:05):
Like, and Hackney's like,
Dani (38:06):
oh, I think you can, sir.
Yeah.
I think, you know, a fingerprintexaminer testified that she
lifted 19 different fingerprintsfrom the counter of the gift
shop.
None of them match fields.
Bummer.
Another inmate, Joe Heintestified that fields shouted
(38:29):
through the jail's ventilationsystem that he had robbed and
stabbed.
Kay Hackney said that would behighly improbable due to the
kind of consequences that itwould bring to fields.
Fields would've had to haveshouted loud enough for high
stand to hear it about 40 feetaway.
(38:51):
We're not whispering in vents.
Stephanie (38:54):
I'm just, this
Dani (38:55):
seems a little
Stephanie (38:56):
outlandish.
Dani (38:57):
And then high stand said there was, yes, there was about
30 other inmates in the block atthe time, so he would had to
have shouted loud enough for itto come through the ventilation
system 40 feet away, but nobodyelse heard it.
Stephanie (39:15):
Yeah.
Dani (39:17):
Do you see.
Stephanie (39:19):
Little iffy.
Yeah.
Dani (39:22):
Inmate Jeffrey Atchison testified Fields admitted
stabbing kay in March of 1988while they shared a bunk bed in
the Ada County Jail.
He said Fields became agitatedwhen he watched a televised
description of the murders fromCrime Stoppers.
Fields.
Said they're trying to pin thatone on me, but I took care of
(39:44):
that.
Fields told him he disposed ofthe evidence so the police could
not link him to the crime.
I think he's talking about theknife.
Mm-hmm.
I think this is where they gotthe knife in the back of the
truck.
Okay.
Information.
Hackney asked Atchison why hewaited two years to tell
authorities about the confessionand question his motive in
(40:07):
testifying.
Okay.
Sison denied any compensationfor his testimony.
Hackney also attacked hiscredibility, calling him, quote,
a thief, forger and drug dealer.
A three time
Stephanie (40:21):
loser.
Three time loser.
Man, he's reading him in thiscourtroom.
Hackney said, Edison.
How do you say that intestimony, Mr.
Edison?
Is it true that you are in facta three time loser?
Because they always askquestions that way,
Dani (40:41):
right?
I'd be like, provide me.
Isn't it true that you are, I'dbe like, could you, uh, provide
me a definition of a loser?
Stephanie (40:48):
That's what I would be as someone.
So what if someone did thatthree times?
So is that in fact, you, sir?
Because I, as I, we can see, letthe record reflect, oh my God.
Dani (41:02):
Hackney also said that, Edson was expected to benefit.
By testifying against fields.
Edson had wrote a letter to theJudge Schroder asking for
special treatment.
Stephanie (41:13):
Oh.
And you know, little specialtreatment.
Yeah,
Dani (41:16):
he's getting it.
Can I get some some extra ramenand stuff?
We have one more inmate.
Stephanie (41:24):
These inmates are really just, I think they just
want to go do an activity forthe day.
They need more trip activities.
Field trip.
They're like, yes.
Have a little rise,
Dani (41:33):
some fresh air.
One more Inmate, Scott Bianchitestified.
Fields admitted to him.
He killed Kay.
Quote, fields told me that hekilled that lady and he didn't
mean to kill her, and he feltreal bad for her.
Hackney laid into him.
He accused Bianchi of flipflopping on a story, a letter
(41:56):
written to the prosecution inJanuary by Bianchi stated he
would quote, blow their case ifhe had to testify.
Oh my God.
Hackney said he is onlytestifying with the expectation
of receiving leniency from theparole board.
Bianchi said he was not offeredanything in exchange for his
(42:17):
testimony.
He only wanted to do the rightthing.
The right thing.
Mm-hmm.
So let's do a little count.
Are you ready?
Yeah.
How many three people testifiedFields was the man who entered
the store at the Linda VistaPlaza Those are like employees,
business owners.
(42:38):
Mm-hmm.
High Sand Bianchi said Fieldsconfessed to them and Edson said
he saw fields go into the shop.
Stephanie (42:46):
Okay.
Dani (42:48):
The defense called only two witnesses to the stand.
They only testified to thediscrepancy in Edison's
testimony.
That's a big word for me inopening statements.
An alibi witness was promisedfor fields.
So Hackney was like, Hey, wehave an alibi, but that didn't
(43:09):
happen.
Hackney said Field's roommatewas going to testify that he was
home that day watching the 12o'clock news on KTVB.
Good old KTVB love her.
KTVB sent over the footage ofthe newscast several months
before the trial, but sent thewrong date of the newscast.
(43:31):
Meaning nobody looked at it,they just thought they had the
right one.
Okay, because you know, there'sgonna be testimony, we've seen
this where like tell like, uh,the Scott Peterson case where
he's like, they're like, tellme, he's like, we're watching
like Morning America.
What was, and he is like RothStewart was making.
Lemon.
Mm-hmm.
Poppy seeds, something or Ican't remember.
(43:53):
I hope that's right.
Anyways.
And that was proven to be true,but like, that's what they're
trying to do here.
Yeah.
but when they went to goactually look at the newscast,
it was the wrong date.
So they're like, yo, send us theright dates, please.
Thank you.
KTVB.
I'm a little disappointed.
When the prosecution asked forthe, the correct footage from
(44:15):
KTVB, it was been destroyed.
Uh, KTVB.
What happened?
Well, a lot of these, I mean,they would reuse tape.
I mean, it was a lot a differenttechnology back then.
Stephanie (44:28):
Yes.
But there wouldn't be an a wayto look up what was on TV that
day, like on the internet.
So that could be.
At least a fair, I mean, youcould ask someone Sure.
Or but to remember a random,
Dani (44:41):
yeah.
Oh yeah.
I had chef, they went to herPeter on and Yeah.
Yeah.
And we covered this.
Like they went to the animalshelter
Stephanie (44:51):
or
Dani (44:51):
whatever.
This is literally over two yearslater, you're not gonna
remember.
That's like me asking you like,Hey, what did you do two years
ago on this day at work?
Stephanie (45:00):
No idea.
Dani (45:00):
Right?
Stephanie (45:01):
Absolutely no idea.
You're like,
Dani (45:03):
well, maybe I could dig through my emails and find
something.
Stephanie (45:05):
Oh, my email's deleted after that long.
So I'd be, shit, I maybe my onenote I could tell you something.
Right.
Dani (45:12):
So that's what I'm saying.
Like that was like, oh, we haveanyway, and he kind
Stephanie (45:18):
of dropped the ball there.
Dani (45:22):
fields does not testify in his defense.
The testimony only lasted fivedays before it was turned over
to the jury.
Very short trial.
Mm-hmm.
And it took 12 hours for thejury to come back with a guilty
verdict for first degree murderof Kay Vanderford.
In July, the defense is askingfor a new trial based on newly
(45:44):
discovered evidence thatchallenges the key prosecution
witnesses.
Ooh, what do we got?
Okay.
Oh God.
The defense team has their ownconvict find convicts with
convicts.
Salvador Martinez stated thatBianchi Gilcrest and High Stand
(46:06):
told him.
They fabricated theirtestimonies.
He said one of them studiedfield's, preliminary hearing
transcript to make sure theysounded credible.
Ooh, prosecutors bring injailers and other prison
officials that state thatMartinez was not behind bars,
but those other inmates on thosespecified dates.
(46:28):
Prosecutors said they have ataped interview with Martinez
stating he contacted the defenseteam before the trial.
And if that is true, Martinez'stestimony being be disqualified
because it's not new evidence.
Stephanie (46:43):
Oh, this is a really rough one.
Dani (46:46):
And then convict Gilcrest testified at this hearing quote,
I've never seen this gentlemanin my life.
I have no idea who he is whenreferring to Martinez and the
other inmates, Bianchi and Edsontestified they didn't lie on the
witness stand.
Okay.
Of
Stephanie (47:06):
course he would say that.
I mean, I don't know if they'relying or not, but you're not
going to go up there and belike, yeah, I did lie.
Unless you are caught dead torights, especially as a
prisoner,'cause that's gonnahurt your
Dani (47:20):
parole
Stephanie (47:21):
chances.
Dani (47:22):
It's just not a feel gooder for me.
Mm.
In November, judge Schroederdenies the new trial quote.
The testimony of Mr.
Martinez was not believable tothis court and would not be, be
believable to the, to a jury.
Law enforcement made seriousefforts to prevent the inmates
who testified from havingcontact with other inmates.
(47:45):
It is highly unlikely that Mr.
Martinez had the opportunity toengage in the conversations he
claims
Stephanie (47:51):
they should know whether or not they were in the
same space together at the sametimes.
Like that should be an easilyprov, provable thing.
So when they say, what was thatlast line like?
It is highly unlikely.
Yeah.
I don't wanna, highly unlikely.
I wanna No, here's our recordsof when everyone was doing time
and where they were, theywouldn't have interacted.
(48:14):
That's what I wanna see.
Dani (48:16):
It's 88 though.
Stephanie (48:17):
Yeah.
Dani (48:21):
Technological.
Technological, sorry.
Uh, sorry.
Let me have a sip.
On March 8th, 1991, despiteField's claims of innocence,
(48:41):
judge Schroeder sentenced him todeath for the murder of King.
Mm.
So, and I was, I can't rememberthe case.
It was, it was like, we're notgonna give him the death penalty
because it's not For sure, forsure.
Like the judge felt.
Right.
(49:01):
And I feel like, who was that?
Oh, I wish I, I should havelooked that up, but it was like,
not a For sure, for sure.
So we're not gonna do the deathpenalty.
Yeah.
There was
Stephanie (49:08):
some doubt or there was, you know, the evidence was
just lacking, whatever.
And I think they should do that.
I think.
If we're gonna go death penalty,it needs to be absolutely
certain.
Like
Dani (49:22):
there was no, this is what convicted him.
Was other.
Convicted,
Stephanie (49:31):
yeah.
Dani (49:33):
Felons
Stephanie (49:34):
saying that he said something,
Dani (49:36):
I don't like it.
Stephanie (49:37):
Yeah.
And eye witness listen,eyewitness can be good, but it
is one of the most
Dani (49:42):
highly unreliable,
Stephanie (49:44):
especially for like a circumstance where you're just
going about your day andsomething crazy happens.
It's not always the best.
I'm not saying that peopledon't, you know, haven't had
good testimony, but they've donestudies on it.
Yeah.
Like it truly can be unreliable.
So the different stories of whatthey look like, the sketch that
(50:07):
doesn't look like the guy.
I can't believe no one in thestore would be able to like,
participate and give a good ideaof further sketch in the
description.
Like if, what if they were inthe store and they saw
something?
'cause it sounded like that onelady, that
Dani (50:20):
lady did see somebody and she picked somebody else out of
the lineup.
Mm-hmm.
I just look, I, I feel very,very horrible for what happened
to Kay.
And I think somebody should beconvicted Yes.
For murdering her.
(50:41):
I just don't, I feel I, I would
Stephanie (50:44):
wanna see more evidence.
Yeah.
I would want something else.
And lemme just
Dani (50:47):
give you another little fun fact.
It's not a fun fact.
Another woman was murdered inOctober of 87.
Just, what is that, six months?
Stephanie (51:00):
Mm-hmm.
Before
Dani (51:02):
at her hallmark store in the very close to location.
and I am gonna do that story.
so there was lots of the publicwanted this to be solved.
Stephanie (51:17):
Yeah.
'cause you're killing littleladies in their cute little
stores.
Dani (51:21):
Exactly.
Two and six months the pressurewas on the police.
Yeah.
And in Boise.
Mm-hmm.
Because that's, it wasdefinitely much, much smaller.
So I just wish we had someforensic evidence, and I know 88
was, but
Stephanie (51:38):
just something else, or less, you know, contradicting
Dani (51:42):
testimony, like not shouting through the vents test.
I would never, as an attorney, Iwould, I would never even put, I
don't a prosecuting attorneyputting Oh, he yelled at me
through a 40 foot vent, that hekilled her and he felt really
bad.
Him like.
Very good questions anyways.
I just, eh, it doesn't feel likegood solid to me.
(52:06):
Right.
Um, but he was convicted, so, Ijust wanted more, and I'm not
saying it's not him by anymeans.
I mean,
Stephanie (52:15):
I don't, I don't know.
It's one that
Dani (52:17):
feels different.
And this is the one that feels,honestly,'cause I, and I, and I
told Steph this before westarted recording, I'm like, I
know.
I mean,
Stephanie (52:30):
I just, some of them are like this and it just, it
doesn't feel great.
And like you said, you just wantmore.
Like, give me something that'smore, that can help prove some
of this doubt or get rid of someof this doubt.
Dani (52:45):
Was he carrying a baby gun through town?
Yes.
That's my guy.
Yeah, right.
Stephanie (52:51):
Like that's what I want.
If they could have gotten thefingerprints or something, then
I would've been like, mm.
Yeah.
Dani (52:56):
Oh, were you did, you didn't buy
Stephanie (52:57):
anything.
Dani (52:58):
Did, were you driving the car?
Yeah.
And we found your license platesand we tracked you down because
you shot somebody at theconvenience store and Yeah,
that's what I want.
Oh, and you had that same gun onyou that killed the person.
I, there's nothing, there's nomurder weapon, no fingerprints.
Of course, DNA wasn't availablethen, but like there is, this
(53:23):
is,
Stephanie (53:23):
especially for a death penalty case.
It's a little wild.
That's what I'm
Dani (53:25):
saying too, like anyway, do without what you will, it
just doesn't feel assault aslike mm-hmm.
I'd like to have more.
Some of the other cases we'vedone in 1992, an execution data
set for fields for March 12th,and then here we go, appeals,
(53:46):
appeals, appeals.
Mm-hmm.
Appeals.
Mm-hmm.
And this is so many years later,still on death row, on March
27th, 2017, fields was foundunresponsive in his maximum
security cell at the Idaho StatePrison.
(54:07):
He was declared dead about anhour later.
Authorities said he died ofnatural causes at age 58.
Wow.
So he was still on death row andappealing his sentences.
And can I just tell you I'm verysurprised that he's still
appealing his sentences?
Yeah.
That, because he should what?
(54:29):
We, you would
Stephanie (54:29):
think they'd be exhausted.
Dani (54:30):
Uh, I think what I, what I was anticipating.
From our previous cases is thatit would've presented that a
judge cannot hand down the deathpenalty.
It has to be done by a jury, andtherefore they either had to
retry him or work out some dealwhere he got life and that was
(54:55):
not done.
Stephanie (54:58):
That is so interesting.
'cause it's, it's the, it wasthe usable tactic because Idaho
was just doing whatever the fuckit wanted it to do.
Dani (55:05):
He was, when Fields got convicted, he was like the 21st
or 22nd person, uh, on death rowin Idaho because, you know, they
were just rampant.
They were just Oh, they were
Stephanie (55:17):
handed it out.
Yeah.
Dani (55:18):
Left and right.
Washington's like, Hey, get thisguy for me.
Yeah, you Utah was like, getthis guy for me.
So, you know, it was just deathpenalty was just being handed
out willy-nilly.
And then we saw this shrink downto a very short list of people
because of the United StatesSupreme Court Dec Court decision
that.
States, it's that juries have tohand down the death sentence.
(55:39):
And so we saw a lot of thoseoverturned into life sentences
versus going back to trialbecause it was so long ago, et
cetera, et cetera.
We've talked about that.
But that did not happen forfields.
He was still on death row.
And the
Stephanie (55:54):
judge did give the death penalty, not the jury.
Right.
Was he like And he was waitingfor appeals and stuff.
Yeah, he was
Dani (56:03):
still on appeals.
Stephanie (56:05):
That's wild.
I know.
Things grind to it.
The, and I didn't go
Dani (56:10):
there.
First of all, I'm gonna tell youthat it was a sensational case
at the beginning.
Right.
Some, but then they
Stephanie (56:19):
become forgotten.
And then
Dani (56:20):
they become forgotten, and then they're not reported on.
Yeah.
So, I could have went and duginto the court system, but eh.
Stephanie (56:32):
I don't know.
I just, it is what it is.
I mean, sometimes it's, it endedthat way.
He died in jail and,
Dani (56:38):
and he was only 58.
That's pretty young.
so, and there you have itjustice served well, appeals
exhausted.
I mean, he was still appealing.
Mm-hmm.
But, and ultimately naturestepping into close a chapter.
Stephanie (56:56):
Yeah.
Dani (56:57):
On fields.
But the question is, was Fieldstruly the monster behind that
crime?
Right.
Or was he a conveniencescapegoat for a police
department under pressure,
Stephanie (57:09):
because we have seen that happen.
Or when they super focus onsomeone where they just have a
hunch, and even when evidence isleading them elsewhere, those
cases suck.
Dani (57:21):
But either way, field's bizarre behaviors, the
questionable testimonies andinmate drama ensured this case
was anything but ordinary.
I just, I did not like thatthere was, there was more
inmates.
Stephanie (57:39):
Yeah.
That's testimony.
That's the bulk of the case.
Dani (57:42):
Then there was, and there was just a couple of shopkeepers
that saw a man a half mile downthat I just don't think it would
fly today.
No, I just don't, I don't thinkit would fly today.
And so I kind of have thatskeptical, like,
Stephanie (57:58):
because it's always kind of a 50 50 with inmate
testimony.
'cause there's everything togain and nothing to lose.
Nothing to lose unless they canprove somehow that you're lying.
And that's, and especially for
Dani (58:10):
these guys that are spending, it's a three year
sentence.
Mm-hmm.
A four year sentence.
Really nothing for them to lose.
Now if you are a lifer and yougo snitch, big impact there.
There's you during your.
Incarceration.
You're gonna have people callyou a snitch.
Mm-hmm.
And you're gonna have to be inlock.
(58:31):
But these guys that are doinglike two or three years, like
I'm on my last like six months.
Sure.
Yeah.
And I
Stephanie (58:36):
might get out right now because of doing this.
Yeah.
So not right now,
Dani (58:39):
but
Stephanie (58:40):
yeah, I might.
Or maybe my,
Dani (58:42):
maybe my probation won't be so bad'cause I was a good
dude.
Stephanie (58:47):
Exactly.
I don't like it.
There's lots of incentive andvery little risk
Dani (58:52):
anyways, uh, stay safe and keep questioning
Stephanie (58:56):
everything for real.
Alright guys, been a goodepisode.
We are gonna have some fun stuffon TikTok and Facebook.
Maybe a little mini giveaway.
so keep your eyes peeled there.
Once again, appreciate you forlistening and emailing and
commenting and we have so muchfun.
So thank you again and we willsee you in two weeks.
(59:20):
Ten four rubber ducky.
Fuck yeah.
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