Competition, Mental Health, Apprentices and Finding out What Success Means to You.

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
There's things that my apprentices have told me
about how they do something andwhy they do it and I'm like,
yeah, that'll work and that'sactually probably more efficient
.
But if I thought, no, no, I'mthe boss, then I'm actually.
It's to the detriment of mybusiness if I wasn't listening.

Speaker 3 (00:15):
I feel like there's a lot of builders out there that
use apprentices as a cheap labor.

Speaker 4 (00:18):
I would say you need at least four years as being a
qualified carpenter to actuallygo out on your own and do your
own thing.

Speaker 5 (00:25):
If you take a young trader, you're an apprentice,
especially an apprentice.
You've got a responsibility, aduty of care to them, to do your
utmost to educate them and givethem every opportunity.

Speaker 3 (00:41):
G'day guys, welcome back to another episode of Level
Up.
We have definitely got acracking episode coming your way
today, because we are sittingaround a table saw in the shed
with three other incrediblebuilders.
They all happen to be part ofmy Live Life Build Elevate
community.
But we're going to be talkingall things this afternoon, from

(01:02):
mental health, collaboration inthe building industry.
We're even going to touch onthe difference between the east
and the west side of Australiaby the sounds of it.
But yeah, massive shout out toCraig, the godfather's, back in.
We got Ryan from Loxbeck withus today and Anthony from Two
Tone Construction, so we'll kickit off with you.
Anthony, just tell us a quicklittle intro about yourself and
your business.

Speaker 1 (01:23):
Yep, anthony Hickey, I run a construction business in
the inner west of Melbourne and, yeah, the company name is Two
Tone Construction, which wasspawned from my dad being a
carpenter, who I love and adore,and followed under his
footsteps, and he was my firstemployee, and so there was two
tones there, and so it madesense we're the two tones.

(01:45):
So, um, that's us, and I'll getyou over to riser yeah, um, I'm
ryan from lockspec building.

Speaker 4 (01:53):
We're based in shell harbour in the south coast of
illawarra.
Um, lockspec comes from, uh, myambition to become a building
inspector in my first son.
So we combine the two.
We predominantly do full houserenovations and new builds.
And yeah, just here to chew thegab with the boys, I suppose.

Speaker 5 (02:17):
Craig Stewart from Stewart Homes and Renovations,
aka the Godfather Just thoughtI'd throw that in there.
That's it Primarily customdesign between renovations and
new builds um and everythingelse in between mate, that's
godfather.

Speaker 3 (02:32):
We I know we're gonna get some hats made or something
.
I think it's um.
You need your own instagram,the godfather you need to change
it up.
but uh, look, we're here to havethis conversation today and to
put this podcast out there.
Um, these guys are doingfantastic things in the building
industry.
We're here to have thisconversation today and to put
this podcast out there.
These guys are doing fantasticthings in the building industry.
We're all trying to buildbetter, we're all trying to
improve ourselves and ourbusinesses, and the only way

(02:54):
that this industry is going toimprove is by doing exactly what
we're doing here this afternoon, and that's having a chat and
collaborating.

Speaker 1 (03:05):
So I'm not sure on the first topic.
Who wants to kick it off?
I'll just talk for the sake oftalking For someone that was
just about to throw up beforewhen we recorded your podcast.

Speaker 3 (03:13):
You're so nervous, you're jumping in.

Speaker 1 (03:15):
Well, you know, as the leader of this group, I'm
lucky enough to be one of thecaptains of an A-team group.
We've got in our Elevateplatform and at some point
during the captaincy I wasrelegated because they brought
the Godfather in, so now we'reco-captains.

(03:36):
But yeah, we, I guess, havebuilt an incredible relationship
through our A-team and Icertainly call both you guys a
dear friend of mine.
Now, and I guess to run thisinto a question, how do you
think, as a building industry,we can become better when

(04:00):
there's a different belief outthere, that we are working
against each other and everyoneis, I guess, holding their cards
close to their heart or closeto their chest and they're
fighting against the otherbuilder to try and get the job,
when clearly, I know we live allin different states We've got
Queensland, new South Wales andVictoria here but I know for a

(04:24):
fact that I'm a better person bysharing my experiences and
learning from you guys and whatyou've experienced.
So did I ask a question there?

Speaker 4 (04:32):
Can you answer?
No, you're just not going tolet us talk.
I think that's a wrap.
Thank you, we're waiting for it.

Speaker 1 (04:38):
I don't really have a question, I just wanted to hear
my own voice there.

Speaker 5 (04:40):
I think it's collaboration.
I think the important thingyou're trying to say there,
anthony, is that the fact thatwe all live so far apart but
we're so connected emotionallyI'm not going to say physically,
um, yeah and also likebusiness-wise, and I think now
that comes back to the live lifebuild amelia and duane um being

(05:02):
so passionate what they do.
But I think the connection isso strong for us.
As you said, we're all in theA-team, but I think that we've
just found that common groundthat we support each other, and
I think there should be more ofit, whether it's A-team or not.
But I myself try to bepassionate about other builders.
I meet in my travels and tryand talk to those sort of guys
and put it out there.

Speaker 3 (05:28):
Because how's the industry going to get better if
we don't start talking,communicating and and helping
each other out?
It's pretty unbelievable likewe, with the big event we put on
a few weeks ago, like webrought matt rising around from
the states and like literallylike I've talked to him on zoom
and phone and stuff, but likeI'd never met him.
I was nervous as shit when Iwent to pick him up from his
hotel, but like he walked outbig hugs, like it's like we've
known each other forever and um,he talks about it on my podcast

(05:49):
, but he's like we all deal withthe same thing.
Like doesn't matter whether ifyou're a chinese carpenter,
american carpenter, australiancarpenter, like wherever you're
from in the world, we all dealwith the same thing on a daily
basis.
We still have to go home andprovide for our families.
We still have to produce likeproducts for our, for our
clients.

Speaker 1 (06:09):
So we're so similar and so the the best way to just
improve everything is for us totalk to each other and share
information yeah and thereshouldn't be any competition at
all and we're lucky enough to bearound each other through um
elevate and through live lifebuild, and so we get to see that
we are.
We're all enough to be aroundeach other through Elevate and
through Live Life Build, and sowe get to see that we're all
like-minded.
There's no egos, we're all justtrying to better ourselves and

(06:31):
our businesses.
But outside like taking this topeople who aren't part of a
building coaching group ormentoring group I think we need
to break that stigma of notwanting to let any trade secrets
out to other builders because,like you just said, we all share
these experiences.
We've all had highs and lows inour building businesses and it's

(06:55):
by being able to open up andcommunicate and let people in on
what's going on in your worldthat it makes it easier and, I
guess, connects you with thoseother builders.
So I feel like it's reallyimportant to have things which I
know we all do.
We try and have buildersbreakfast, which we have our
members that we know throughLive Life Build, but we also

(07:16):
keep trying to bring otherbuilders in so they can
understand and see what it lookslike when people are working
together to try and betterthemselves and their business,
and every time we've had newbuilders come into our building
breakfast mornings, they'realways in awe of the fact that
we are so open and we're alsoinquisitive as to how they

(07:38):
operate, because we don'tnecessarily have the right way
to do things.
We want to learn how they dothings so we can maybe tweak
what we do to become better, andthen therefore we're all
getting better.
Yeah, um, I think it's superimportant mate, just on that
builder's breakfast.

Speaker 3 (07:51):
I actually I don't know if I've ever mentioned on
the podcast before there's a.
We set up a facebook page fouryears ago when I started that
it's just called the builder'sbreakfast group, so you should
get on there and get everymember in your breakfast group
on there.
But the whole idea is to hookbuilders up in your area and get
on there and ask anyone thatwants to have a breakfast yeah,
beautiful, um, yeah, jump onthere and have a look.

Speaker 4 (08:09):
Definitely tell you on facebook, not instagram I
think, I think one of the bigthings I've taken out of the is
the growth that you can havewith, like, having people like
this around you.
So I can remember to the dayactually to the car park I was
sitting in when I got a phonecall from craig and I the reason
why I joined a group likeelevate was because I was at

(08:31):
probably one of my lower pointsand not knowing what I wanted to
do with my business and whatnot.
But the conversations there andthen was um, like I'm not alone
.
And to have that conversationwith someone that I heard him on
a couple of podcasts and he'sgot quite an aura about him, um,
I didn't know he was as big aswhat he was, uh, but he's a

(08:52):
giant.
But the conversations I've, Iremember listening to the
podcast months prior to that andjust thinking that this dude's
like he's pretty special.
And I got this phone call fromCraig Stewart and I was just
like holy crap, this bloke'stalking to me.
But like no, but instantly Ihad this.
I just had this feeling that hewas there to help me and you're

(09:13):
not alone, like it, just thewave just goes away and as soon
as you can open yourself up tohave that conversation and again
the vulnerability.
We talk a lot about that.
That really, really, reallyhelps everybody grow Like
Craig's probably to me, probablyone of the best craftsmen in
the country, and I've got to saythat because he's so big and

(09:34):
I'm scared.
No, but he is.
But I know he gets a lot out ofus as well, because I don't
think computers are around whenyou grow up.
But I'm able to help Craig.
I'm quite up but but like I'mable to help Craig with I'm
quite techie, so I'm able tohelp Craig and that sort of
thing.
So like we bounce off stuff allthe time and it's just.
I reckon it's so cool to havethat relationship, oh man.

Speaker 5 (09:57):
I agree totally and you know, they didn't do
computers when I went to school.
Everything I've done I'velearned myself.
I've never even been to acomputer course, I was only
marketing that's all right.
It's the truth, though you knowum, and I could not get myself
out of trouble.
But, yeah, the collaboration,but the connection of opening
each other up and makingyourself vulnerable and knowing
that you guys aren't going tojudge, no matter what I say or

(10:17):
what I do, but you're there tosupport and pick you up.
You know, in those low moments,yeah, um, and just that
reaching out, like you said,sitting in the car park, I just,
you know, did that when that ateam started, just because I
wanted to connect with otherpeople, and I suppose it comes
from me going back as a youngtradie.
So when I started at 22 yearsof age, looking for myself,
everything I wanted to do, therewas no one there to help you,

(10:39):
to give you support.
You know, if there's somethingdifferent on a project, there
was really no one apart fromgoing to the master builders and
talking to those people.
So I'm a lot more open now totry and help the younger
builders coming through, or eventhe older builders, like you
two, like sometimes, hey, comeon.
I'm not 40 just yet, but that'swhat it's about, though, isn't
it?
Like you said, we talk a bit oftech, we talk a bit of mental

(11:00):
health, we talk a bit ofconstruction methods, yeah, um,
and those sort of things.
So I think that part of it, theconnection, the vulnerability I
think what I'm trying to say isthat we get vulnerable, and
from that point, we can actuallygrow and become better yeah,
better within ourselves I thinkthere's still a lot of stigma
around um people seeing eachother as competition as well
especially like locally.

Speaker 4 (11:20):
Like to not share information or not to share a
better way to do things isreally naive, I reckon now.
I think that now I used tohonestly hand on heart, used to
think that the builder down theroad was public enemy number one
yeah, but um, and where do youthink that's come from?

Speaker 3 (11:34):
right?
Like a bit of it probably comesfrom clients.
Like because if you're involvedin those tendering scenarios,
clients are forcing thatcompetition, yeah, by going for
the cheapest quote.
But like what?
Where?
Why do you think that led youdown that path?

Speaker 4 (11:50):
um, I get, I guess just, yeah, trying to trying to
race to the bottom, get, get job, get jobs, um, build, build a
business, like now that I lookback on it now, the way we
operate now is like we take jobsthat we want and that we know
is going to be a good outcomefor everybody, like the client
and ourselves.
Before it would have been like,oh okay, who's the cheapest?

(12:13):
All right, I've got a job andhow much turnover am I going to
have?
I think that does come fromeveryone quoting against each
other and being the cheapestpossible price and quality
doesn't matter, unfortunately, Ithink it used to be like that,
but I think there's a reallyawesome transition and happening
now where everyone's quality isgetting heaps better too.

Speaker 1 (12:36):
I think there's also a big bit of ego involved as
well, crossed with impostersyndrome, which we all have said
at times that we get.
So you're going into anindustry, you're trying to win
jobs, you see this otherbuilder's sign somewhere and so
you think that they're, you know, doing well because the house
is looking good.
So your ego flares up, that youknow you want to be like them

(12:59):
or better than them.
But you've also got this thinginside that you feel like, oh,
maybe I'm not, as I'm not asgood, maybe I'm not capable of
doing that, so it makes you wantto shut down and not connect
and not have those conversations.
Um, but the reality is it's byhaving connections with other
builders and sharing challengesand, um, being able to learn and

(13:21):
grow from other people'sexperiences is what's going to
catapult you to be the bestbuilder you can be and and also
help them by you know themleaning on you as well.
So that's a pretty deep one tostart trying to shed the ego a
little bit in those scenarios,but if you can see the dangling
carrot that it's actually goingto benefit you like that's where
the connection is.
And these builders breakfastsare a great starting point.

(13:44):
Um, we all know, like we allknow, trades, because we're
using them every day oh sorry,they're working part of our team
every day.
Um, so we have the connectionsaround to be able to communicate
with other builders.
Um, it's about sort of, yeah,starting those conversations and
really just leaning into it andleaning into the
uncomfortableness of it, becauseit very quickly gets to a point

(14:07):
where we're shooting the shit.

Speaker 3 (14:09):
Yeah.
So it's pretty crazy.
The ego yeah, ego is definitelya big part of it.
I think because, again, if youdon't know what you don't know
in business and you think thatsuccess is the amount of
projects you have on, you takenotice, and these days, with
Instagram, like you, followinstagram you think, holy shit,
like that builder's killing it.

(14:29):
He's like, fuck, you go backthrough his post, he's got eight
jobs under construction.
He looks like he's got a bigteam and like, so you, a lot of
people see that as success, butno one actually knows behind the
scenes he's running a shit show, he's putting out fires every
day and he's losing money andnot making profit on probably
eight out of the ten jobs.
So, yeah, the ego is definitelya big thing.

(14:52):
It's very easy to get tied upin that.

Speaker 1 (14:55):
Yeah, I have to remind myself even now, like to
just keep the blinkers onbecause, you know, depending on
how you're traveling mentally,sometimes you can get sucked
into that little whirlpool ofwhat was me and why aren't we
doing jobs like this?
Or why don't we have theseshiny, beautiful photos or
whatever it is.
But the reality is everyone'srunning their own race, and your

(15:19):
vision of what success is iscompletely different to another
person, and so the wholeconnection and collaboration
with other builders is onlygoing to benefit you to get to
your success, um, and so youjust don't have to worry about
what everyone else is doing, andI think that's super important
to make note of as well so let'sjust go around.

Speaker 3 (15:41):
What's success to you .

Speaker 1 (15:44):
It's changed since starting.
Success for me now is reallybeing able to come home and be
present with my family.
That's my number one.
My wife has done a power ofwork to get me to where I am
today and taken the lion's sharewhen I have been too despondent
, I guess, thinking about workside of things, and I've got two

(16:06):
young kids.
So success for me is beingcomfortable financially, also
being able to still be workingtowards our goals as far as
investment properties.
So we're working towards them.
We don't need to be making itin one year, but the biggest one
is be comfortable financially,um, and be present at home, and

(16:28):
that's success for me.
If my relationships are good,more than anything else, um,
then everything else seems to gowell and it all starts with, I
guess, me as well.
If I'm good, everything elseseems to start going.

Speaker 4 (16:39):
My way, um, mine's very similar to anthony's.
Um, like personal life I've I'mat a funny part stage in my
life where I've I've realizedthat I probably haven't, uh,
prioritized family but more asmuch as what I probably should
have.
Um, and I'll probablyprioritize the business.
But I'm in a good stage in mylife professionally where I can

(17:01):
spend more time in prioritizingthe family.
So for me that would be, yeah,being more present at home.
You know little things likeputting the phone down when I
know I should be putting thephone down.
It's just such a bad habit thatyou always think that someone
needs your help or somethinglike that.
But the irony in that is, forme, success.
I would love to give back to alot of people too.

(17:23):
I love helping people and justtalking.
I'm not a counsellor oranything like that, but I just
love being able to help outother builders, other guys,
especially dads, young dads inbusinesses and stuff like that,
just to have that opportunity todo that without any guilt
attached to that spending timedoing that.

(17:43):
Do that without any guiltattached to that spending time
doing that and having, like,professionally, having a team
that wants to come to work fortheir role, not for the pay
packet.
That's success for me.

Speaker 3 (17:55):
That's awesome.

Speaker 1 (17:56):
That sounds way better than mine.
I'll second that.

Speaker 5 (18:00):
What about you, guy Fowler?
Look, I think it's probablysimilar to both what Anthony and
Ryan have said.
I was in that whirlpool ofevery job you attended.
You had to have a job, you hadto put food on the table for a
young family.
So, unfortunately, my kids areolder and they probably have
suffered there and I've beenmaking up for it in later years.
But working Saturday, workingSunday, leaving dark, come home

(18:23):
in dark, all that sort of stuff,because that was the mentality
we were in and it comes back tothat build it down the road.
He's your enemy.
You don't want to talk to himso you just go, go, go all the
time.
So being able to have thatsuccess now that I don't need to
take every single job, that Ican take the jobs that I think
fit my business model and fit myboys, my team, that work for us

(18:43):
, I think that's reallyimportant.
Obviously, you know, creatingsome wealth so that you're
financially sound, and that sortof thing.
And this year was the firsttime Lucia and I have had a
holiday in 30 years togetherwithout kids, so that's an
achievement.
Absolutely that's huge, it waspretty awesome mate, so she's
already booking another one.
It was really good.

(19:06):
So I think success is havingthe business that can do what
have the business so I can dowhat I need to do.
I think that's important um forme, and having a good team.
And I think the other realsuccessful thing for me is
having clients that appreciateand love what I do.
Yeah, yeah, that's you know thequality of the job and the way
you do it and why you do it, andhaving clients that actually

(19:28):
take that on board, that's alsoa success.

Speaker 1 (19:32):
It makes such a big difference.
I know we talk about peoplepleasers and whatever else, but
being acknowledged for the hardwork, we talk about blood, sweat
and tears and every project.
You have all three of themevery single time.
They're all in there and it'sbecause we care about what we do
and just the slightest amountof appreciation goes so far and

(19:53):
that that is a really good signof succeeding.
It's also a really good reasonwhy we do pre-construction,
because that's where we work out, where our clients, um, you
know if they align with us and,um, that's been a super benefit
to being a part of live life,build and understanding the pack
process and implementing it.

Speaker 4 (20:09):
Yeah, before we said glad.
Can I ask you what success isfor you?

Speaker 3 (20:13):
uh, I think what success looks like to everyone
should like.
It changes like as you continuelife's journey and improve on
things.
It definitely changes focus.
But my, I probably have threethings that mean success to me.

(20:33):
Number one is like and I thinkI'm quite lucky because I've
been able to do it acrossmultiple businesses now not just
one like having businesses thatare so well structured, have
incredible team members that I Idon't, if I don't feel like
showing up or I don't need toshow up, like it just keeps

(20:54):
operating, um, and I think a bigpart of success for that with
me.
I've only been thinking aboutthis last couple of days.
Actually, I used to get a lotof anxiety around, like I just
knew if I turned my computer on,one of the emails was going to
be shit.
I knew each day like I wasgoing to get one of the text

(21:14):
messages was going to be shit.
I knew one of the phone callswas going to be shit.
So the other part of that partof the success is that just I
don't have to worry aboutanything like everything, like
we don't get bad emails, wedon't get bad text messages, we
don't get bad phone calls, andthat's like we still get the
problems we had before, but it'sit's the way I've changed and

(21:37):
the mindset that I have arounddealing with that.
So definitely having multiplebusinesses that can run without
me is huge, um.
My next one is, um, like justbeing able to choose when I
spend time with my family.
Now, like don't works, I don'tneed work to be the number one
priority.
Like, if I choose to to have anafternoon off or a weekend off

(21:59):
or a week off or a month off,whatever I, I can do that with
my family.
Um, but the third one to me,mate, and to be honest, this is
probably it might sound a bitweird I think this is the
biggest one, even though I wantto spend a lot of time with my
family.
I success to me is I want toearn as much money as I possibly
can like so that I can helpmore people.

(22:20):
I am determined to givemillions back.
I want to be able to helpdisabled people.
I want to be able to donate todisabled schools because I just
I've never I've been touchedwhat I've been fortunate enough
to not have, like we've got.
I've got cousins and things.
I've got disabled kids.
But I see how much stress thatputs on families and as a

(22:40):
builder, I know how much I cando, and so for me to have enough
cash that I can just go to afamily and say, hey, we'll put
all the disabled ramps in, we'llmodify your bathrooms and just
do it, that is my dream mate.
I just think that would beincredible to be able to do that
.
The more people I can help, thebetter.

(23:00):
But I think, while we're onthis like sort of subject, I I
do think it's really important,like I don't.
I feel like not enough people,especially people in the
building industry, don't takeenough time to sit back and

(23:20):
actually work out what successis for them.
I think most people's successis purely based off what they
see every other builder andtrader do on Instagram, which I
think is actually really sad.

Speaker 5 (23:32):
Yeah, but do they actually take the time to plan
where they want to be in fiveyears or 10 years?
I mean and I'm guilty of thatlike early days it was just go
to work every day.
If you're going to work everyday, you thought you were doing
okay, but it's probably later inlife for me, and especially
since I've started getting youknow, since I've met you and
live life, build everything elsethey'll actually sit down now

(23:53):
and actually try and make a goal.
But how many in theconstruction industry are just
in that mundane every day ofgetting up and going to work?
Yeah, and there is no sort ofend target or a bit of a target
to reach to get to the nexttarget.
And I think that's probably abig thing that a lot of people
need to stop and have a thinkabout.
Sit down for five minutes intheir own space and work out
where they're going and whatthey're trying to do, instead of

(24:13):
just being the flashy ute andthe flashy caravan and the
flashy trailer.
Maybe look at some other.

Speaker 3 (24:18):
Too busy living like wanting it now, like right now.

Speaker 1 (24:30):
Yeah, living in the present and not looking towards
the future, sort of thing.
Yeah, and yeah, the goal sideof things that's so important,
which I never did early oneither.
I was just trying to keep thething afloat, but it's like
driving without your lights onat night you're just going and
you don't know where you'regoing.
When you have a goal and youknow you're working towards it,
it makes the harder days easierbecause you know you're still
slowly, but it makes the harderdays easier because you know
you're still slowly but surelyprogressing to where you want to
get to.
Um, and yeah, for me, yeah,having goals and um, being able

(24:53):
to implement small steps to beable to continue to get there
has certainly made it.
I think it's pretty um cliche,but you, we've thankfully and
luckily got to a point wherewe've reached some of our goals
and the goals are very fleetingin happiness.
You find that the journey whichis this is a cliche, but it's

(25:16):
actually striving to get there.
That's the enjoyable part andthat's the part that gets you up
.
When you get there, you realizethat the happiness isn't there,
it's's in you the whole time.
So if you keep putting it outthere, when we get to this point
, I'm going to be happy.
It's never going to happen, andso it's.

Speaker 3 (25:31):
For me, it's about just trying to enjoy the journey
and understand that I'm thecreator of my happiness, not the
things that I can achieve orthe things that I can buy with
whatever I make yeah, journey isdefinitely the most important
part yeah like and so manypeople just don't enjoy the
journey enough because they'reit's like how many times have
you wanted, like could beanything, could be a tool, could

(25:51):
be a new vehicle, like anythingbut and you get it and like
that was good.
Literally you wake up the nextday and you're like, yeah,
what's?

Speaker 4 (25:59):
next yeah yeah, well, I've, um, I've had a.
I set some really big goalsthis year actually and we ticked
them off pretty quickly.
And I'm pretty open abouttalking about mental health and
I speak to TX and I've justfinished my, I suppose, course
of TX and one of the things Iseeked most of my help, most of

(26:24):
my help through TX, wasreflection, and I think it's
important to have goals, butit's probably equally important
to reflect that those goals thatyou've done or half done.
It's still important to countthose things because, um, I mean
, I I know I don't do it as wellas what I probably should do
and I know that's a big thingI've got to work on.
But, um, yeah, just even inpreparation for the podcast, I

(26:48):
opened up my journal and readback six months ago.
I was like holy shit, that'scool, and I did it At the time.
I was like no way you're goingto be able to do that.
And now I was like that was apiece of piss.
That's the reflection.
Sort of a piece of piss.

Speaker 5 (27:02):
But yeah, I think reflection is a really, really
important thing to add to, Ithink also too, as men, as
blokes, but also in theconstruction industry.
I don't think we give ourselvesenough credit at times to
reflect back and reach thatpoint.
But I don't think, and I'mguilty of it too.
You never stop to smell theroses and I reckon every day my

(27:26):
wife will stop and look at thesun of an afternoon or the
morning, or.
I remember before we built thenew house, the old house on the
farm, and I'd renovated one roomand every night she'd go and
turn the light on and look atthe room before she went to bed.
And I'm like, seriously, justsit in the loft and go to bed.
I see it all the time.
But she stops to appreciatethose things and I think that's
something that I definitelydon't do enough of.

(27:47):
Like you're saying, I thinkit's reflection, appreciation
and the journey that's gettingto that point.
I think we should be taking abit of a pat on the back for
ourselves sometimes.

Speaker 1 (27:56):
Definitely I get caught up on at times, get
caught up on looking at theideal, how I wanted it to be,
and then judging myself based onthat, because it hasn't worked
out to be exactly that.
And there's a book,everything's audio books for me,
the Gap and the Gain, and Rizerand I constantly like I'll

(28:17):
remind him or vice versa, aswe're going through something.
And it's about theunderstanding that you know this
is where you started and thisis your ideal.
You're somewhere in between, inthe middle.
If you're constantly looking atthe ideal.
You're somewhere in between, inthe middle.
If you're constantly looking atthe ideal, you're looking at
what you're lacking and soyou're in the gap mentality,
whereas if you just look in therear view and you can see from

(28:39):
where you started to whereyou've come, you realize that
you may not have reached thatexact goal you wanted, but geez,
you've gone a long way.
And that's the momentum and theconfidence that it builds to
get you to keep going to whereyou're going.
And sometimes I'll slip intothe gap or the gain.
And it's incredible to have agroup like this or any family

(29:00):
members or friends that can sortof keep pepping you up when you
need it, or sometimes a littleclip across the ear to you know,
you know the answer here justget out of your bad mind frame
or mindset.
But I think it's reallyimportant to, with reflection,
to just really take appreciationof how far you have come from
where you've started.

Speaker 3 (29:20):
That's a good segue back to what we were talking
about with competition, becauseI think that's something that
every builder and every tradershould be doing.
They should be looking at wherethey are and where they've come
from and not worrying about howmany jobs they've got on and
the type of jobs and the valueof jobs and how much turnover
they have.

(29:40):
Reflect on where you startedand where you've come to now.
That's the most important.

Speaker 1 (29:47):
And there's so many incremental things that can
change.
That that's the most important.
And there's so many incrementalthings that can change.
And, let's say, even thefinances haven't changed from a
year to a year um, for profitreasons, but you've implemented,
like an inquiry form or awebsite, which has freed up your
time instead of taking phonecalls to potential tire kickers.
You've got all these differentthings that you've implemented,
which has made your businessmore systemized and made you

(30:10):
have more time to do things thatbring value.
That is going to catapult you.
You just have to keep doingthose things incrementally.
And I could just look at theaccount and go, well, it's
another year, I've worked my assoff, and for what?
But the reality is we've come ahuge, long way in 12 months and

(30:31):
it's by looking at those thingsis what gets me out of bed and
wants me to keep going.

Speaker 5 (30:34):
Um holy shit well, anthony's bought his a game
today.

Speaker 1 (30:35):
He's like yeah that's all I got.

Speaker 3 (30:40):
All right, I'm out godfather, junior, that's um
mate, that's another.
Like that, what you just saidthere is so important as well.
Because you look at, I do likeI'm pretty strong, like I do
believe that you're um, you'refun, like you're I call it your
report card.
Like your asset liabilitystatement at the end of
financial year, like it's theonly thing we've got to really

(31:01):
relate to when you leave school,like that's, that's how far
you've come.
But it doesn't.
Like you said, you can look atthe bank account and where it's
at and it might not.
Like you might have earned 200grand last year and this year
you've only you've earned 200grand again.
But the asset liability sheetwill show you that you've paid
money off houses, you've paidmoney off vehicles, you've like

(31:23):
you've gained a lot in there,but even though the, the amount
you've earned may be the same asthe year before, if you've
implemented stuff, like you justmentioned, your inquiry form
you might have put some systemsin place.
You understand your overheads.
You've got to think about thehours as well, because you might
have earned the same amount ofmoney, but maybe you've only

(31:44):
worked four days a week insteadof six days a week or been more,
more present at home with thekids.
Maybe you've been more present,that's right, maybe you've got
two days a week, you've pickedthe kids up from school.
There's a lot more in life thanthe dollar value.
Yeah, I guess that's what I'mtrying to say.
Your success has to be based onfar more than just what the
accountants told you you'veearned at the end of the year.

(32:05):
Because if you earn two hundredthousand dollars a year and
you've worked six, seven days aweek, you're going to work when
the sun's coming up, you'recoming home, the kids are in bed
and you're not getting timewith any family.
Or you're earning 200 grand ayear.
You're working the hours youwant to work, you're spending
time with friends and family,you're going on holidays.
That's a massive, massive gainyeah, yeah, there's.

Speaker 5 (32:27):
There's 100 grand's worth of spare time there that
you've got back.
So in the bank you've got 200,but technically you've made 300
for the year because you'reusing your own time the way you
want to do it.
Isn't that great?

Speaker 1 (32:40):
These are light bulbs even for me, as we're saying,
because it just reminds me howgood things are and being able
to hopefully hear this and otherpeople listening can make sense
of that that it's not all thedollar values.
How has this year looked versuslast year?
Have I been as stressed?
Have I got some more tools inthe mental toolbox to be able to

(33:01):
cater to stresses that comethrough business?
They're all incredible gainsthat, like I said, said, are
still going to just catapult youto where you know the money
will come, um, or the extra timewill come.
Whatever it is that you'reworking towards, as long as you
keep um, you know, positive andkeep looking at where you've
come from, I think you're in agood stead to keep, yeah,

(33:22):
thriving yeah, the world's sofocused on dollar values, but
that's and our industry is badfor it.

Speaker 3 (33:28):
Like you, um, it's all perception, isn't it really
like?
Again, like you see the guywith the, the big truck and the
flash tool trailer and mightlook like he's doing more work
with you, but maybe you're ontop of all your debt and maybe
he's in debt to the eyeballs.
Like I really think people justneed to focus on themselves.
You said before, anthony, yougot to run your own race, so

(33:49):
that's pretty important.
Gee, we're getting pretty deepdown some.

Speaker 1 (33:54):
Well, that's what we do.
This is what we're, the band ofbrothers, as our A-team that we
call ourselves, and we need toalso shout out we've got an
incredible team.
It's not just us three that aretalking every week, but, yeah,
it's by having theseconversations and letting people
in, letting each other in onwhat's going on.
Um, that has created a bit of abromance really I think that's

(34:19):
an understatement.

Speaker 5 (34:20):
Yeah, I think it is I think I think like we're the
instigators in the a team, butwe've definitely got people that
come on board, that have satback.
But just through ourpersistence we're now a lot more
active.
Persistence is a funny wordactually.
Yeah, it's a little bitannoyance maybe Annoyance, you
know what I mean.
Yeah, but definitely we've gotgood interaction in our A-team

(34:42):
and I think we all help eachother in some way, shape or form
.

Speaker 4 (34:50):
I think I'd like to ask the group like um, a lot of
guys that would be listening tothis podcast would be, you know,
could be in a, in a pretty lowspot, um, where obviously and I
hate to put a dampener on it,but we're obviously everyone at
this table's had a bad like abad experience in building and
stuff like that, what would youguys suggest the best thing you
could do if you're in a darkspot?

(35:10):
It's a bit of a loaded question.
I think we all know that weshould be talking to people.
What would be the first thingyou did?
If you're just starting out andyou've just promised a client
that you can do it for $100,000and you've blown your budget and
you're just completely justdismissing your ability to do
anything, what would you do?

Speaker 5 (35:32):
I think a couple of you.
Well, if you're in a bad spot,you want to be ringing tx?
Yeah, um, so you can help withthat.
But I think you've got to findsomeone that you can.
You can talk to some sort ofmentor that's going to help you
through.
Yeah, I don't know, it's likeyou said, it's a bit of a funny
question, but unless you're sortof in that position but I think

(35:52):
you've got to reach out You'vegot to put anything aside, no
matter how bad it looks, becauseyou've got to move forward.
You can't say where you are orgo backwards, which is going to
be a pretty bad state.
So I think you've just got toreach out.
Um, you know whether that'ssomeone like duane or one of us
guys, or even just someone aneighbor, a friend, you know,

(36:14):
another colleague, whatever butI think that's where you've got
to start, because there's a lotof bravery in in doing that, I
believe.

Speaker 4 (36:20):
Yeah, definitely like it takes balls to know that
you're in a bad spot and to beable to talk to people and to
reach out and ask for help.
Yeah, definitely, I just thinkthat talking to one another or
to anybody that you look up toor anyone that could have
potentially been in the sameposition.
There's so much value in that.
And you'll find pretty quicklyyou'll bring yourself out of

(36:43):
that spot.

Speaker 3 (36:44):
Yeah, definitely, like Craig said, reach out to
the guys at TX.
That would be first andforemost.
But I believe that's anotherreason why Live Life Build is so
successful because you, whenyou like, because we get a lot
of members that are in thatplace when they first sign up

(37:05):
and like we say all the time,like, if you want to get
somewhere, you've got to talk topeople that have been through
what you're going through andare like, if you want to get
somewhere, you've got to talk topeople that have been through
what you're going through andare achieving things that you
want to achieve.
But I think that somethingthat's overlooked and maybe not
spoken about enough is you'vegot to do whatever it takes.
Like you can't just like I wasvery guilty for it.
You can't just blame the client, the industry, your

(37:28):
apprenticeship, your boss.
Like you've got to do whateverit takes and, um, I feel like
there's a lot of young tradiesand builders out there that they
take on jobs.
They under quote them and theylearn very quickly that they're
they're in too deep.
They don't know what they'redoing.
They look we've talked aboutbefore on our individual

(37:49):
podcasts like they, um, they'vejust seen the gear rocking up
the site.
They don't.
They know what they're doingWe've talked about before on our
individual podcast.
They've just seen the gearrocking up the site.
They don't understand all thebehind the scenes.
They've realized they're in theshit.
So you've got to do whatever ittakes.
If you're going to do your ass,how are you getting to work?
You got a vehicle.
Sell the vehicle, buy a cheapervehicle.
You've got to be prepared tomake a loss so you can get out

(38:09):
of it and move on and not makethe same mistakes next time.
And I'm I do see a lot ofpeople that just I don't know if
it's a pride thing or whatever,but they just keep digging
themselves a deeper hole becausethey're they're not, they're
too afraid to put their hand upand say I fucked up, I didn't
know what.
I didn't know.
I I'm going to do my ass.
And they just dig them.

(38:32):
They lead to depression,anxiety and all sorts of things
go bankrupt.
Like there's no shame infucking shit off.
Sell your tool trailers.
Like put your tools in the backof the ute, get some cash in,
use that to cover the job.
Like there is things thateverybody can do to get
themselves out of the shit.
You've just got to suck it up.
Take some ownership.

Speaker 5 (38:50):
Take some ownership.
Just own it, yeah, and you'llcome out the other side better
once you've owned it, gotthrough it.
Yeah, you still might be in abad place financially and
hopefully mentally you'll bebetter off.
Yeah, but you know for the nexttime, yeah, and then reach out
and get some, but the quickeryou and you.

Speaker 3 (39:06):
And look, I shouldn't probably say because, touch
wood, I've never been divorced,I'm happily married, but I've
got.
I don't know what's going on.
But I in the last 12, 18 months,two years, like so many of our
close friends are separating,yeah, and they just turn into
these ugly messes where they'rebitching and fighting and
carrying on and I keep saying tomy mates like just just cut

(39:27):
your losses, like just get ridof it, sell your shit up and
start again.
Don't spend the next five yearsrooting around with things.
I think it's the same asbusiness.
Like Craig said, suck it up.
Most people will have shit theycan sell.
I'm sure a lot of these peoplethat are struggling and having
hard times they've still got atrail bike.
They go trail bike riding onhaving hard times.

(39:48):
They've still got a trail bike.
They go trail bike riding onthe weekend.
Or they still got a flash roadbike, they go.
Well, they've still got a gymmembership.
Or they're still buying theircoffee every morning, like yeah,
there is shit that everybodycan do, that can.
There's always a way.

Speaker 1 (40:02):
There's always a way I think that's super important.
We're talking about, you know,reaching out, and it's it is.
It's so important to findsomeone that you feel
comfortable to talk to and ifyou don't, then find someone
like tx, where they're trainedand skilled to be able to help
you out in those darker moments.
But it's about also, yeah,taking ownership and making a
game plan for me.

(40:22):
When we've had some troublingtimes early on, I'm a
catastrophizer and so you know,I think the world's ending.
I'm gonna have to, I'm gonnalose the house that we've got,
you know, the roof over our headwe've worked so hard for.
But once you get it out and youalso get it out and chat to
someone who's not emotionallycharged in that environment you
can set a plan and then worktowards getting there.

(40:42):
And once you've got a game plan, it just takes that bit of load
off your shoulders and you knowthat little bit of light starts
popping out again.
Um, but it all starts withcommunicating, first and
foremost, and then starting toput a plan in action.
Uh, plan in place to startactioning.

Speaker 5 (40:57):
I think maybe, like you said, you just need to talk
to someone who's going to tellyou things you don't want to
hear yeah, like no you'retalking to your, your best mate,
because he's going to say she'sall right, mate, you're okay.
You need to go talk to youraccountant or somebody that's
going to say to you, like yousaid, you need to sell some shit
.

Speaker 3 (41:10):
Well, not not only that mate.
So when I was in my dark days Italked, called one of my old
man's mates, like he like when Iwas early 30s.
He was I don't know, he wouldhave been in his, probably his
late 50s, 60s and he basicallyjust told me what I just said.
Yeah, he's like fuck, sell yourshit, dwayne.
Yeah what do you?
What do you complain about?
Like you're in the shit,fucking sell shit and get out of
it.

Speaker 4 (41:30):
Yeah and we're in an age that is there wouldn't be
more available to do.
Those like tx, like we're allmassive advocates for it, but
like 10, 20, probably not even10 years ago, there wasn't
platforms like that that existed.
To to, to be able to bevulnerable, to really just give
them a call for free, for astart.

(41:51):
That's amazing, so there's noexcuse not to do it.

Speaker 3 (41:55):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (41:56):
Yeah, like we said earlier, it takes balls to do it
, but just do it.

Speaker 5 (42:00):
You'll be better for it in the long run Look.

Speaker 3 (42:02):
Anthony, well, that was in our individual podcast.
You said, mate, you shouldn'tjust leave it to you in that
dark hole either.
Yeah, like an individualpodcast.
Like you said, mate, youshouldn't just leave it until
you're in that dark hole either.
Yeah, like, I had a meetingwith TX yesterday about some
stuff and that's what they weresaying like, just ring up, you
don't have to be in a hole likejust ring up, check in, talk
through stuff.
Like even if you only I want toget Shay to look up

(42:27):
catastrophizer you got a pictureof me.
I'm sure it's a word.

Speaker 5 (42:33):
I was really good at England at school see, I think
that comes back to what we weretalking about earlier about
collaborating with otherbuilders and stuff like that.
I think that if the more youcommunicate and realise that the
other builder down the road isnot your enemy, I think we're
all better off, yeah, mentally,financially, you know, because

(42:54):
there's more than enough workout there for all of us yeah, to
take on and do.
But I think that's reallyimportant, that we try to get
rid of that stigma of you knowit comes back to that, like you
said, that, the tendering aspectof it, whereas I don't want to
tell you what I'm quoting onthis job, because you're quoting
the same job and we could be$300 difference.
That could be the differencebetween me or you winning the
job.
So we're not talking, you know,even though I might see you

(43:14):
every second day at the hardwarestore.
So I think, now that this isstarting to open up and more
people are starting to realizethat you might be quoting the
job and I'm quoting the job, andif we have a chat about it,
well then go.
Well, hey, that job's notreally for me, maybe that job is
better for you, yeah, and I'llclose that door and open another
door instead of thinking youknow, this is my younger days
that every job I had to have, Ihad to go to work every day.

(43:36):
I had to have a job because Ineeded to support my family.
Yeah, where?
Now I'm like okay, well, I cansay yes and no to jobs.
Yeah, and that comes with timeand experience.
But we need to get the youngergeneration of builders and
tradies coming through,realizing that they've got that
opportunity now and not have togo through the heartache and
stuff that we've been throughand the stress and those sort of
things.

Speaker 3 (43:55):
But look at what the race to the bottom has fucked
every industry really.
You think?
about the race like cheaper food.
We've now just got shit, massproduced food with no nutrients
or goodness in it.
It's literally just fuckingchemicals.
Same with our pharmaceuticalRace to the bottom there we're
just popping pills that are fullof shit.
And they've done the same thingwith the housing industry the

(44:18):
race to the bottom.
You've got all thesevolume-built homes.
I shouldn't throw them allunder the bus because some of
them are good, but we've createdan industry where people are
living in homes that are lowerthan the building code yeah,
like they don't even meet code,a lot of them and which we're
now like I I am a little bitnervous about the next sort of

(44:40):
10 to 20 years in australia,because a lot of I do feel like
a lot of these and, look, I'mprobably guilty, I built her
homes 10 years ago that I, I,with what I know now, I
shouldn't have used certainproducts or done certain things.
So we're going to have thiswhole period of people living in
homes that those homes areaffecting their health.
Yeah, and that's all caused bythis race to the bottom, like I

(45:04):
believe.
Anyway, I'm not sure what yourguys' opinions is.

Speaker 1 (45:07):
And the whole tender process and race to the bottom.
You could be fresh out of yourtime and get your license.
You've got minimal overheadsand so your price versus someone
who has a team and has peoplein the office like it just
doesn't correlate.
Like you, my price would be ahundred thousand dollars more

(45:27):
expensive than someone elsebecause I've got a lot more
overheads.
Anyone listening, client wise,that's not the case but, like
the reality is it's?
Completely different it's not.
They could build the exact samehouse and use all the same
material, but in order to keeptheir business running and
hopefully they understand theiroverheads, they will be more
expensive than someone whodoesn't.

(45:48):
And the person who does knowtheir overheads and would charge
more will then also be around,hopefully in the next 10 years,
if anything did go wrong,whereas potentially the person
who doesn't know their figuresmight go belly up because they
do their ass on the first one.

Speaker 3 (46:04):
Well, that's what the tendering scenario has created.
It blows my mind that highlyeducated university degree
designers, architects, that pushthese tendering scenarios.

Speaker 2 (46:19):
I'm going to fall back on what I was going to say
there.

Speaker 3 (46:22):
Like you can't.
Like how can you expect twobuilders to have the same like
the same cost?
Like it's just, it's impossible.
In your example, anthony, it'sperfect.
Like just the overhead letalone.
So, number one, you've got theoverhead, so you're going to
have a guy that could be on thetools with an apprentice.

(46:43):
He's going to be far cheaperand far less overheads than
someone that's got multiplesupervisors, work vehicles,
phones, all those types ofthings.
So that's only one part of it.
And then you've got the waythat they actually build.
There's four of us here.
I guarantee you the, the waythat they actually build.
Like there's four of us here.
I go into the four of us allframed differently, so there's
going to be different costs inour materials.
Like there's going to bedifferent costs in the time,

(47:05):
like the speed.
Like all four of us would bedifferent in like to take longer
or shorter to hang a door, likeyeah I'm the quickest joking
craigs.
There's so many things that comeinto play, and I just think
it's absolute madness thatpeople think they can put out to
tender and get a good resultout of it and that's that

(47:26):
education.

Speaker 1 (47:27):
Isn't it making people understand that that's
not the case, and we've had alot of luck with um.
Some architects we work withthey're all for it, they're very
open um to the pre-constructionand understanding that it's a
win for everyone.
Um, uh, but it is stillbreaking that stigma, not even
stigma, just the habit of that'swell, that's how we do it and
you know that's how.

(47:47):
When I started my buildingcompany, I did what I had
learned and so I didn't know anybetter and thought that was how
you build and that's how yourun a business and incrementally
tried to change things.
But I was so far off it andit's not until I educated myself
and it also landed a few fairfew times on my face and had to

(48:08):
pay for it that I, you know, thepenny dropped, and here we are
today.

Speaker 5 (48:12):
But part of that too is I'm not not like a text on
all designers, but they might beable to draw nice pretty
pictures, but a lot of themdon't understand the actual
construction process, method andcost.
And I know myself I've beeninvolved with a few different
designers and stuff at differenttimes and then you bring your
first round of costings throughand the client's like what the

(48:33):
hell?
We said we've got an $800,000budget and you're 1.2.
And I'm like, yeah, becausethat's what you're trying to
build.
No, no, but he said we could dothis for 800.
I'm like, yeah, but youphysically can't.
I'm 50% dearer.
I'm not like 50 grand or 100grand.
And then you start explainingto the client and they're like
oh, but that's not what wediscussed, and rah, rah, rah,
but that's.
You know that education.
So comes back to your thingwith the pre-construct, getting

(48:56):
the builder involved.
But it's still happening thatthere's still plans being drawn
and being set out and clientshave given false expectations on
cost.

Speaker 4 (49:05):
Unfortunately, that'll probably always happen,
though, because it's alwaysgoing to be about the dollar.
But it's.

Speaker 3 (49:12):
For certain people it will be yeah it is, but the
education is.

Speaker 4 (49:16):
It's not just as our role as a builder to educate the
client.
I believe it's equally importantto educate the designer as well
yeah because they, they, I'dlove to, I wanted to be an
architect before, I wanted to bea builder but and they can do
some beautiful things on plansand stuff like that, but they
don't know what it costs as well.
But it's our job.

(49:37):
I see it as our job to educateeverybody, not just the client,
is to like the realistic of whatthings cost.
That that's going to benefiteverybody and the earlier the
better.

Speaker 1 (49:48):
The earlier the better, because if we've already
got concepts that the evenconcept designs that the clients
have fallen in love with, butyou know the size of it is not
going to work with their budget,then you're already pushing
shit uphill, yeah I think likethere's just so many parts of it
like we're.

Speaker 3 (50:03):
We're having a little bit of a situation with a
couple of jobs at the moment andI've really been sort of
digging deep to figure out why,um, it's happened so and a lot
of it's come back to like you'vegot reps out there that are
visiting all these designers andarchitects and trying to flog
all these new products andtrying to set expectations and

(50:28):
selling them this dream of whatit's going to look like when
it's finished.
But there's a lot of reps outthere that have never worked in
a trade, have never actuallyphysically installed or cut or
use a product.
That reps out there that havenever worked in a trade have
never actually physicallyinstalled or cut or used a
product that they're selling.
They've never even gone andvisited whatever it might be the
cabinet maker, the stonemason,the tiler to get feedback or

(50:49):
knowledge on their product, andso you have this very false
expectation.
So one of the scenarios isthere's a new timber paneling
feature product out there andthey've put heaps of it in this
house and it's come back at like$90,000 or something and for

(51:12):
not a huge amount, like tworooms and then a couple of
feature walls.
And they're like oh, the reptold us it was only 380 a sheet
and I'm like well, number one,did you have a thing about how
many sheets you need?
But did you even ask him aboutthe backing, like what it gets
installed to the substrate, likeall the labor that's involved
to do it?

(51:32):
Yeah, oh no, they told us itwas piece of piss.
You just put it on your normalstud framework, like so there's
there.
Like as builders, we're likewe're getting pulled from so
many directions, yeah, and likeit keeps coming back to
education.

Speaker 1 (51:48):
Yeah, you've really got to educate everybody and
yourself, like with you know,there's always some new cladding
, there's always something thatwe need to understand how it
needs to be put on so that wecan price accordingly.
Like we can't just assume youknow the assuming that word that
can cost you a fortune.
We need to make sure we see,like, the information required,

(52:10):
um, how to put it on, how weneed to do it, so we can work
out the labor component, andthat takes time.
So when we just get thrownsomething you know I'm a bit of
a we keep going back to peoplepleasing, but I want to give the
answers the clients want tohear, but that's not to their
benefit, because if I just saysomething to make that
conversation nice andcomfortable, then and there it's
going to bite me in the assweeks down the track when I

(52:32):
can't renege on the fact that Isaid I could do something that I
can't or it's going to costsomething which it's going to
cost much more.
So taking a little bit of pauseto be able to get a bit of
space to understand those thingsand learn what you need to do
in those environments to givethe right prices, it's pretty
important.

Speaker 3 (52:49):
There's a bonfire starting over there.
I've got nothing.

Speaker 1 (52:52):
I don't know, what to do with my hands.

Speaker 5 (52:56):
He's got nuggets going everywhere.
This is what happened.

Speaker 1 (52:59):
This is what we talk about collaboration.
So, yeah, hanging out withthese guys via whatsapp, mind
you, because they live ininterstate.
I'm around this all the timenow and any, anytime I have any
queries, I get these guys andthe rest of the a team and the
rest of live life build.
So, um, you can't help but havesome of it rub off on you.

Speaker 4 (53:18):
So I'm slowly getting a little bit more like we,
anthony and I talk probablyevery couple of days and to the
point where we actually share ava now.
Um, he's in melbourne, I'm inshell harbour or woollongong
sort of area how's that work?

Speaker 3 (53:31):
a lot of fun, yeah va um is in.

Speaker 1 (53:36):
Uh, do you remember what town exactly it is?
No, no, anyway, philippines,jira, and he's incredible.
He's amazing, and so hecurrently works for me Monday,
tuesday, wednesdays and withVerizon Thursday, fridays, and
we're going to tweak that a bitwhere we need to.
But, yeah, we run the same orvery similar system, so any

(53:57):
recipes that get put in sort ofcorrelate um, anything that's
slightly different.
He has access to both our umsoftwares, um, but so far it's
been pretty seamless, for, like,we've been pretty fortunate
because I've got um two othervas in our business uh, food
administration and social mediaas well now.

Speaker 4 (54:15):
So I've been able to take what I've learned with them
and sort of implement theestimating side, because I was
finding the weakness in mybusiness and probably the area
where I could probably I couldput myself in other areas of the
business to bring more value tothe business was I needed help
in estimating.
I didn't run the overheads, wasable to run the overheads,

(54:37):
couldn't afford to um use ain-house estimator in australia,
so just put two and twotogether, basically.
And then anthony was in thesame similar situation where he
was.
He's got a lot of of that sortof thing on the on the table and
so far it's been, yeah, it'srevolutionized the.

Speaker 1 (54:55):
It's only been what a month and a bit, but yeah, if I
wasn't married, I might marryJire, I think yeah.

Speaker 4 (55:03):
What he's put into the business has just been
amazing.
But what I'm equally as proudof is that we've developed a
relationship where we can sharethat and look bounce off each
other Like that's amazing.

Speaker 3 (55:16):
Vas are unbelievable, eh yeah, their skills and their
qualifications, and just Ithink Jare is a structural or
civil engineer.
Yeah, but I think I'm not surelike we've got five across our
businesses now and what reallyamazes me is their thirst to
impress, like if you give themsomething to do and they don't

(55:38):
know it, like they will go andstudy and learn it and come back
to you and go, hey, I think weneed to do this, this, this is
this.
Like yeah, where else?
Like you don't get that here inaustralia.

Speaker 1 (55:47):
yeah, you would love that on site, wouldn't you?
Again?
My team's amazing um, yeah, andlike again with working with
riser or alongside riser he'she's taught me, um, how to use a
loom recording.
So, um, I would never have donethat stuff, um, I would never
have known where to look, um,and to have someone in the group

(56:12):
and um, in live, life, buildand just in the industry to show
me how he does things and howmuch he's seen benefit.
So Loom 21 Listen is like avideo recording of your screen.
You can have your happy littleface there as well and show
people how you go about things.
So, whether you're in yoursoftware, your quoting software
or whatever, and what you wouldlike done or how you do things,

(56:32):
then you can record that andsend that to someone else so
that they can always go back toit and see how it's done.
So they can then mimic it.
That's been huge for us becauseI can now learn from what
ryan's done, implement what Iwant to, and then when I've
implemented something, I cansend it back to ryan or our va
and it's there forever.
So if we have anyone else thatcomes into the business that we

(56:54):
need to help get up to speed.
They've got a whole library.

Speaker 3 (56:59):
What if they're not in your business?
You might have to hook theGodfather up here with them.
Well, we've already discussedthis.
Don't worry, we've already beendiscussing.

Speaker 1 (57:07):
We're dabbling.

Speaker 4 (57:09):
But I like the idea because you can do it once and
it's done.
If you're set on your processand you do your recording around
that, or you might do yourrecording around that or, um,
you know, you might do yourcompany, company manager or like
an introduction of your company, and you want to, you've
onboarding a new, you know,apprentice or a new carpenter
and you can say this is, this isthe way we do things, this is

(57:29):
how we log our time sheets, thisis all that sort of stuff.
So it's saving time and they'rethe things that you learn
collaborating with other guys.

Speaker 3 (57:37):
So definitely yeah yeah, it's bloody awesome.
Um, I mentioned at thebeginning we're going to talk a
little bit east and west, sowhat's?
Uh, uh like?
There definitely seems to be abit of a gap between the eastern
side of australia and thewestern side of australia.
They reckon west is best.
I've never been there, but, um,like, uh there's a lot of

(58:00):
building work going on there.
We've got um western australianmembers in in livelock build and
I know they struggle with likeobviously we do live events and
things.
It's a long way for them tocome, yeah, but how like there
does seem to be a lot morecollaboration with builders on
the eastern side of austral overthere.
Is it just the gap, thedistance?

Speaker 1 (58:20):
I don't know.
I don't really have an answerthere, because we obviously do
run all up the east coast.
How have we stunned Anthonytoday?
I'm not sure, because I knowNathan and Kelly are over in the
west and I get along like ahouse on fire with those guys.
It's a distance thing.

Speaker 4 (58:43):
I don't think they've got any better builders or
we've got better builders hereor anything like that.
I honestly think it's just adistance thing.
I mean, we've got quite a fewmates in the middle in South
Australia.
I don't think there's any NTmembers, I'm not sure, but
there's some bloodyinspirational guys all over the
state and and they're all greatin their own way.

(59:06):
I honestly think it's adistance thing.

Speaker 1 (59:08):
so I guess it is because the connections that we
make the tiredest are the oneslike sorry, nathan cal, they've
come to live events and so I'vemet them face to face and we see
everyone on our facebook groupsand whatever else, but it's
that connection, seeing eachother, is the one that sort of
really um, uh, what is it?

(59:29):
Solidifies it, um, but I don'tknow, I don't know yeah I've
used all my big words, so maybewe do have to get over the West
and start connecting with theWesties.

Speaker 3 (59:42):
But even on Instagram I don't get a lot of Western
Australia builders.

Speaker 4 (59:47):
I get more American builders pop up on my socials
than I do.
Western Australian buildersMight be the algorithm there.

Speaker 3 (59:52):
Is it because?

Speaker 5 (59:53):
their style of building is different.
I reckon that's a lot to dowith it, because a lot of the
west is your carpenters arereally just roof framers, yeah,
you know, and maybe fit out andstuff like that, because there's
so much masonry being done overthere.
Is it that they just don't havethe content or they don't show
it as much or they don'tinteract as much because we're
building?
You know that variance of styleof building maybe.

Speaker 3 (01:00:14):
Yeah, I do think that's a lot to do with it, but,
um, it does.
From what I can see, it doeslook like there's a lot of
lightweight constructionstarting to come in over there.
So they're obviously doingdifferent things with their
tight end and stuff.
But yeah, I don't know for anywest aussies listening like
reach out, yeah, I've neverthought of that.

Speaker 1 (01:00:31):
like I see a lot of um, you know, tassie builders
all up the coast and SouthAustralia.
But yeah, what is it?
Forrester Coast is the onesthat I always see from WA and
they do incredible work.
But outside of them I don'tknow if I follow any other
builder over that side, and so Idon't really have it in my feed

(01:00:53):
, but there's got to beincredible.

Speaker 3 (01:00:55):
I'm going to put West Australia builder in my
Instagram and see what comes up.

Speaker 1 (01:00:57):
Yeah, there's got to be incredible.
I'm going to type WestAustralia Builder in my
Instagram and see what comes up.
Yeah, there's got to beincredible builders, because
that's my whole feed is justbuilding.
To be fair, I haven't reallybeen searching for a WA builder,
though, and notice if it's themor not, but when you see
Margaret River, you don't forgetit.

Speaker 3 (01:01:14):
What else do you want to get out today, guys?
Or what do you want to talkabout?

Speaker 4 (01:01:19):
You've been quiet.

Speaker 5 (01:01:20):
Craig, I don't need to talk because Anthony's taking
a look young people in theindustry.

Speaker 3 (01:01:24):
How do we encourage more of them to get in the
industry and how do we keep them?

Speaker 5 (01:01:29):
keeping them?
That's a good question.
I think it's keeping them.
I think we've got to make thempassionate, and that's a big one
.
Like who do they work for isthe start, isn't it?
I'm a little bit chuffed at themoment because before we went
away to New Zealand two daysbeforehand, a young tradie we

(01:01:50):
had left for his own probablymental reasons and had some
family issues.
And four and a half weeks laterhe came back and I thought that
was really good.
And then we've just put afourth year apprentice on and
he's just um started with us andhe told me after the first week
that he was talking to theother tradie and he gave us a
really good rap and that's whyhe come back.
And the fourth year apprenticesaid well, I know I'm in the

(01:02:13):
right place now.
So I think the, the mentorshipand the team and the culture and
all that sort of thing I thinkis really important for those
apprentices that want to come inand young tradies and stuff.
I think you've got to make them, give them enough
responsibility that they canhave a go and achieve something.
And I think that's reallyimportant too, that if they're
making little steps and littlegoals themselves, it encourages

(01:02:34):
them to want to do better.
You know you can't have anapprentice that's two years in
and he's still on the broom.
I think you've got to give themthat responsibility and make
some mistakes, but explain tothem why and how, give them the
big why and then make themhungry to want to keep growing
and developing because we arelosing a lot of people out of
the industry.

Speaker 1 (01:02:51):
I think that's super important.
I know I certainly put my handup and can attest to the fact
that I was a bit of a helicopterparent certainly to one of the
apprentices who now is qualified, and it was only when he
brought it to my attention thatit wasn't helping him.
I think he pulled out a GeorgeOrwell 1984 quote or something,

(01:03:11):
so it's meant to be looselyabout big brother.
He's like, okay, you smartass.
But then the very next day Icame to work and I let him be
the boss and he was third yearmaybe at the time, or late third
, early fourth, and I got him toexplain what he needs to do for
the day and how he's going todo it and what he wants me to do

(01:03:32):
, and he started to thrive and Ithen, you know, looked back and
that's how I thrived, because Iwas pushing brooms and, mind
you, it was probably thecleanest site you'd ever seen.
But it was only when I gotthrown in the deep end that I
also was engaged on site Iactually wanted.
I had to learn because I was theone that was responsible for it

(01:03:53):
, and so I think that's reallyimportant and I think the
vetting um early on, before wetake them on is to make sure
that the person who is gettinginvolved really wants to do it.
It's not just I need to do atrade.
So you know this person knowsthis person, so I'll do it.
You really want to.
You want to learn and be acarpenter?
Yeah, you don't want to just bedoing it because you need a

(01:04:15):
trade.
Yeah, I think that's importanttoo.

Speaker 5 (01:04:17):
You've got to have passion yeah, carpentry is not
an easy profession.
It's a very for me it's a veryrewarding profession, but
there's days when it's hot,there's days when it's cold,
it's wet.
You're digging holes, you know,if you're doing the whole
aspect of the project.
So there's got to be somepassion in there and if you're
just coming, like you said, fora, they're not going to last.

Speaker 4 (01:04:36):
Yeah, I think patience is something we could
instill in our apprentices inparticular, because when they
finish their time, everybodywants to earn like the top
dollar, and it's naive to thinkthat because I mean, we've all
spoken about it in the past Likejust because you signed off as
a carpenter, that doesn't makeyou a carpenter, and I think

(01:04:57):
we're all.

Speaker 3 (01:04:58):
Got to earn your stripes, mate, yeah.

Speaker 4 (01:05:00):
I would say you need at least four years as being a
qualified carpenter to actuallypotentially go out on your own
and do your own thing.
I think patience is probably athing we could probably try and
instill in, and it's not goingto happen all straight away.
It's probably hard to do thatfor young blokes, because young
dudes want everything all atonce.

(01:05:20):
But um, maybe training, likeeducating them at on site, and
stuff like that, it's not allgoing to happen straight away.
So I mean, it didn't happen forme straight out of my
apprenticeship, that's for sure.
But um, and there was heaps oflearning curves from that.
But I mean it's platforms likepodcasts and memberships and

(01:05:43):
stuff like that, talking aboutthose things and encouraging
them to listen to these podcastsas well.
There's heaps of value in that.

Speaker 3 (01:05:51):
Yeah, I think it's a hard one.
I don't know what the answer isyet, but yeah, I do think
that's got a lot to do with it,both that patience and, um, yeah
, I don't know I don't know likehard work it's just like they,
everyone.
Well, it's like everyone in it.
They want the paycheck but theydon't want to.
Yeah, necessarily do it, but um, I think if you the people

(01:06:15):
they're working.

Speaker 1 (01:06:15):
If you have created a culture where people you know
they know what they're doingeach day you're working through
it, and so the younger guys ormature age apprentices that come
into the business can see thateveryone is doing something and
it's done at a pace, but also ata quality, then that just
bleeds into how they'll then doit as well.

(01:06:37):
Quality, then, that just bleedsinto how they'll then do it as
well.
If, if it's a bit of a shitshow with your other trades and
they're trying to learn, butthey're seeing how that is,
that's their baseline of whatthey think they need to get to.
Yeah, so, um, yeah, it's aboutsort of making sure when you do
take someone on, you're also,you know, showing a good example
of what it needs to be and whatyou're expecting of them.
So, um, which, which you know.

(01:06:58):
That's a positive thing,because it means it keeps
everyone on their toes and makessure that you're always showing
up to the best of your ability.

Speaker 5 (01:07:04):
Yeah, I think you have a responsibility.
If you take a young trader,you're an apprentice, especially
an apprentice.
You've got a responsibility, aduty of care to them, to do your
utmost to educate them and givethem every opportunity, and
then it comes back to theindividual.
But you've still got to be ableto take that responsibility.
I think If you're not going toput the time into them, I don't
think you should be taking themon.

Speaker 3 (01:07:25):
Yeah, that's my view on it.
Yeah, yeah, they need to.
I do feel that there's a lot ofas builders.
There's a lot more Like we doneed to take some more
responsibility, and again thatcomes back to costing jobs
correctly, making sure you'vegot the time in there, so your
team and yourself can spendenough time with them.
Yeah, um, because, yeah, I thinkthat's a huge issue why we've

(01:07:46):
got a lot of unskilled tradeslike I.
I feel like there's a lot ofbuilders out there that use
apprentices as a cheap labor,like my, my, really my business
is that there's never any onemore apprentice to two tradies,
like I know.
You see builders that have fiveapprentices to one tradie, like
it's just it's how can theylearn from that?

Speaker 5 (01:08:06):
yeah, you know, they're purely.
They just used to be laborers.
That's what they're doing,aren't they?
Yeah, I remember we did a jobnearly 20 years ago and I had um
three apprentices at the timeand we had two tradies myself
and another mature tradie he wasolder than me and there was a
builder down the road and hecame up one afternoon and he

(01:08:26):
said to me what are you doingwith all these apprentices?
And I said, well, I'm teachingthem to be carpenters.
And he's like well, what do youmean?
And I said you know, we weredoing fix out at the time and
two of them were out the frontwith cape and sore and they're
doing scribing and stuff likethat.
And once they got good enoughto keep bringing showing me,
well, then they do inside thewardrobes.
Anyway, his attitude was hewould get apprentices from the
training companies, use them,put his frames up, put these

(01:08:47):
trusses up, maybe a couple otherthings, and then you get rid of
them.
And then he just finished theproject by himself.
So he was using them basicallyas a laborer.
But those guys weren't beingtaught anything.
No skill set, no reasoning.
You know, they just gethammered all day to go, go, go,
and they were just labourers.
And then they go to the nextbloke and the next bloke, and
that's what they did.

Speaker 3 (01:09:07):
Our industry has allowed that to happen, Mark,
because you have these trainingorganisations that literally
have apprentices for labour hire?

Speaker 4 (01:09:12):
Yes.

Speaker 3 (01:09:18):
Like it should never have been allowed by a
government.
Like if you do anapprenticeship, you should be
signed up to a builder for thatterm and obviously, if they
can't keep work or whatever, youcan swap to another builder.
But apprentices shouldn't besomething you can ring a
training company up and say, hey, I need someone for four weeks.

Speaker 1 (01:09:30):
Yeah, that's ridiculous because they don't
have the skill set, they'revulnerable I know it's super
dangerous not to mention they'renot going to at all get the
learning they need to and theydo their time, like we said, and
they've got nowhere near theskills they need to to be
classified as a qualifiedcarpenter.
I think taking responsibilityto the or giving power to the

(01:09:52):
apprentices or potentialapprentices I think it's really
important for them to use socialmedia for good, I guess.
But just look around at whatbuilders are in the area and see
if you do want to become a goodcarpenter and potentially a
builder down the track, what doyou want to build?
And see what's out there andsee how they operate and reach

(01:10:13):
out to them.
There's nothing better thansomeone that pesters you for a
job and you can see that they'rekeen.
A good personality and eagerness.
That's the formula.
Everything else you can teach,but it's just someone who's been
bred well, I guess, like just aperson who's got good values

(01:10:34):
and who's eager to learn.
It's perfect.
That's what you want.
Yeah, that's what any builderwants, I think.
I think I could probably speakfor yeah yeah, so what?

Speaker 3 (01:10:43):
uh?
I guess just go around onething, like for any young people
listening that are thinkingabout being an apprentice, or
like what's one tip that you cangive them to be successful come
to work with a good attitude.

Speaker 5 (01:10:56):
I tell all my guys I can teach them any school they
need to have, but I can't teachthem attitude.
That's the big one for me.
If they come, you know, in theright headspace, wanting to
learn, wanting to listen, have ago.
I'm all for input coming back,but just have the attitude and
then we'll teach the schoolsfrom there yeah yeah.

Speaker 4 (01:11:14):
It's a little, I would say, on top of that like
commitment.
So like if you, if you want todo a carpentry apprenticeship,
don't say, oh yeah, I'll give ita month, sort of thing.
You've really got to commitbecause it gets better and
better, like I've been doing itfor nearly 20 years and I'm
enjoying it more now than what Idid my first two years as a
carpenter.

(01:11:34):
So commit to it and don't justbe like, oh, this is hard, two
years as a cup.
So commit to it and don't justbe like, oh, this is hard, I'm
going to do something else.
But life's hard.
Just you're going to be able toyeah, to break through those we
only get back what you put inyeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:11:47):
I think, um, the best thing is to just have a growth
mindset.
Um, understand that the day youthink you know everything is
the day you stop learning.
And yeah, with an ever-changingbuilding industry, like there's
a million ways to do something.
So it then gives you theability to listen to everyone

(01:12:07):
who's talking to you on site asyou go through your
apprenticeship and you becomefourth and you've got people
underneath you.
There's things that myapprentices have told me about
how they do something and whythey do it, and I'm like, yeah,
that'll work and that's actuallyprobably more efficient.
But if I thought, no, no, I'mthe boss, then I'm actually.
It's to the detriment of mybusiness if I wasn't listening.

Speaker 3 (01:12:29):
What about respect?
I think they need to like.
A lot of them need to actuallyrespect that they've been given
a job Like take it seriously.

Speaker 4 (01:12:39):
I think we've spoken about it before around the
Christmas time, I think it's asomewhat expectation that they
get Christmas bonuses.
I think I've probably heard iton the podcast.
You guys, and you've definitelysaid it you used to give your
boss a box.
Not that I need a box of beeror anything like that, but you
used to be like I box.
Not that I need a box of beeror anything like that, but you

(01:12:59):
used to be like I've got a jobthank you like yeah, that I
think that is.
I don't think that's just likein the carpentry sort of thing,
that's that's, that's, that'sthe big picture, yeah yeah, but
um, yeah, I think that that'd bepretty important to appreciate
having a job that's huge, yeah,yeah, I think that appreciation
has gone a lot, you know.

Speaker 5 (01:13:18):
I mean, I remember myself as an apprentice, um, and
a young, young worker.
You were happy to go to work,you had a job yeah you're
grateful for that.
Yeah, whereas they seem to sortof chop and change so much
these days, it's just thatappreciation isn't there.
Yeah, you know, and they don't.
I don't think they fullyunderstand what's involved in
keeping them on a job every day.
Yeah, you know, that's theother thing too yeah, mate, I'll

(01:13:39):
give someone any.

Speaker 3 (01:13:42):
Any worker not doesn't have to be an apprentice
, but any worker that shows merespect, that they are grateful
to have their job.
I will help out as much as Ipossibly can yeah, like the
small things, like yeah, I'm nota big drinker, but like even
just a card at christmas time,like just anything to like.
We've got a couple of employeesthat do it, but yeah it's.

(01:14:02):
I think it's few and farbetween these days.
Yeah, every employer I've everworked for I've always given a
gift on their birthday and theirand christmas time.
Yeah, because, um it's, ittakes a lot to employ people, so
yeah, it's a mutual.

Speaker 1 (01:14:16):
It's a mutual, isn't it?
Because we obviously areappreciative and respectful of
our employees, our team, butwhen it does come back the other
way, it is a bit of a shock attimes.
I'm a little bit on the outerfrom you guys, because last year
two of my three tradesmenbought me a gift for Chrissy,
and I must admit it was thefirst time I'd ever got anything

(01:14:37):
.
But I was taken back back.
I thought it was incredible, um, and that just showed me that
we're on the right track withour team.
Um, we, we do have, uh, mutualrespect for each other and um,
yeah, I think it's.
It's really beneficial andhelpful towards reaching our

(01:14:58):
goals, not only as a company butindividually, because we've
gone through and worked out whateach of us are trying to
achieve.
And so how can I, as thebusiness owner, benefit?
Sorry, how can I, as a businessowner, help you get to there?
And then how can you help meget to my goals and our team
goals?
And that builds the respect aswell.
So keep bringing gifts, boys.

Speaker 5 (01:15:22):
Well, one of my guys about three years ago actually
gave me a birthday present, buthe gave it to me a little slowly
in the afternoon, so no oneelse knew about it, and I sort
of felt bad for him the factthat he had to give it to me
without everyone else knowingwhat was it.
It was a really old eggbeaterdrill, you know.
You know what was it?
Uh was a really old umeggbeater drill, you know, yeah,

(01:15:42):
yeah, yeah, because I collectold yeah have you shown me?

Speaker 3 (01:15:43):
yeah, your office.

Speaker 5 (01:15:44):
I've got, you know, a big glass cutter with them in
there, yeah, and he'd been outsomewhere, a secondhand shop,
and found it and put a littlebag and brought it to work and
had a card and stuff in there.

Speaker 1 (01:15:51):
That's that's thoughtful, like that's the
thing that gets me my wife umhar on.
We've had some reallythoughtful gifts from our
clients, like really wellthought out.
One of them, for example, waslike the local cafe to the job.
When we first started the job,they got us a voucher for the
coffee shop up the street whichin Melbourne yeah, we love our
coffees.
But I was taken back by that.

(01:16:13):
We hadn't even started yet andthey were appreciative of our
pre-construction and what we'ddone to that point.
And, yeah, my wife always says,like these are the thoughtful
gifts that you, you know youshould do these for the boys and
for maybe other people in thefamily and I can definitely work
on that.
But like thoughtful gifts, likethat of something that you

(01:16:34):
clearly you know have aneagerness to continue to, get.

Speaker 5 (01:16:38):
Well, a good little tip for your wife.
This week Lee's made cupcakes.
I took them to work for Smoko.
Yes, boys love them eh.

Speaker 1 (01:16:45):
Did you take full credit?
No, no, no, good man.
No, no, no, no Nor would I?

Speaker 5 (01:16:50):
No, no, I was bullshitting.
I took this bloody box ofcupcakes to work at smoker time
and they thought it was awesome.
It's the small things, isn't it?

Speaker 3 (01:17:01):
It's the small things that make the biggest
difference.
You've got to be consciouslythinking about that stuff all
the time.

Speaker 1 (01:17:09):
And it's hard because in business you can't shut me
up, can you?
There is so many things inbusiness and there's so many
things that can be stressful andtriggering, and so the
connection to the team sometimesgoes by the wayside.
But that's the thing thatanchors everything.
So when stuff does get rough,anchor rough, that's great.
Then you can start working onthose things because you know

(01:17:29):
that the team's looking afteryou.

Speaker 2 (01:17:31):
I'm killing it, I'm absolutely killing it.
Have you got any?

Speaker 4 (01:17:34):
pillows in here.
We'll just leave you.
Oh gosh.

Speaker 3 (01:17:38):
A catastrophizer is a real thing.

Speaker 1 (01:17:39):
Yes.

Speaker 4 (01:17:40):
People who catastrophize often feel they
have little control over theirlives and everything happens to
them.

Speaker 1 (01:17:45):
Yes, thank you.
Not a great thing to bethinking.
That's what we're working onCatastrophizer yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:17:53):
Well, look, guys, I appreciate your time, especially
you two flying up from wheredid you fly out of Sydney?

Speaker 4 (01:17:58):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:18:00):
Sydney and Melbourne.
Look, I think you've addedheaps of value today.
It's Godfather as well.
Next podcast, we're going tohave a Godfather hat on.
We need a Godfather day I thinkWell, the Godfather needs a
YouTube channel.
That's Liver King.

Speaker 5 (01:18:15):
Yes, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:18:26):
Might support the, a youtube channel like that.
Um, liver king, yeah, yeah,yeah, yeah.
But, um, oh, look, I think it'sfantastic.
I think just having these sortsof conversations gets a lot out
there and a lot of knowledge, alot of advice and all that sort
of thing.
So, um, look for anyone thatlistening.
If you like these types ofpodcasts where we have multiple
guests, let us know so we canget more of them.
But if you've got any questionsat all, make sure you reach out
.
If you're having trouble withyour mental health or you're in
a dark place, make sure youreach out to the guys at TX.

(01:18:47):
But one last thing to wrap itup guys, what have you got?

Speaker 5 (01:18:53):
I think for me it's the whole reason we're here is
networking, networking.
I think for me it's the wholereason we're here is networking,
networking, communication,collaboration and ultimately
it's come from Live Life Build.
But I think it's important thatyou just reach out at the
hardware store and things likethat.
There's a couple of builders inour local area that I've had
little chats with.
I've seen one of them turn upat your level up experience and
he come and saw me and he askedme about Paula and I said go buy

(01:19:15):
a book.
I seen him last week and hegoes.
I bought the book.
So I just think the networking,networking, collaboration, and
that's why we're here now and Ithink, it's so important and our
growth, our free growth and ourwhole team.
From that is this next level.

Speaker 4 (01:19:27):
Yeah, we're leveling up boys, that's it um, in light
of letting anthony have theclosing comment, um, yeah, just
doing the little things, don'tover-dramatise.
Just reaching out and having achat to someone, it's really not
that hard, just to put yourselfout there.
So I'll keep it short and sweetbecause Anthony's next.

Speaker 1 (01:19:50):
Yeah, I think I've said everything I need to say.
I just want to thank you forletting us come on.
This podcast and this platformis so incredibly important for
builders and tradies out thereand hopefully it does get the
message across that you knowit's okay to not be okay and
there's always a way out.
Sorry, there's always a way toget through things, should I say

(01:20:12):
, and it's about communicatingand letting people in.

Speaker 3 (01:20:16):
Awesome.
Yeah, guys, if you'reinterested in Healthy Homes we
do have quite a bit of stock ofPaula's Prescription for Healthy
Homes book.
Go to my website,duanepiercecom.
You can purchase them there.
While you're there, grab somemerch, but look, if you've got
questions to these guys, I'msure they're not going to mind
you reaching out.

(01:20:36):
Craig Stuart Holmes Renovationson Instagram.
Ryan Loxbeck on Instagram.
Anthony Two-Tone keep an eye onhis videos.
They're great.

Speaker 1 (01:20:47):
Like and subscribe.

Speaker 3 (01:20:49):
Like and subscribe.
Like and subscribe to all theguys.
Check them out.
They're doing great things.

Speaker 2 (01:20:58):
And look as always, like subscribe and we will see
you on the next one.

Speaker 1 (01:21:00):
are you ready to build smarter, live better and
enjoy life?

Speaker 2 (01:21:02):
then head over to live like buildcom forward,
slash, elevate to get startedeverything discussed during the
level Up podcast with me, dwaynePearce, is based solely on my

(01:21:22):
own personal experiences andthose experiences of my guests.
The information, opinions andrecommendations presented in
this podcast are for generalinformation only, and any
reliance on the informationprovided in this podcast is done
at your own risk.
We recommend that you obtainyour own professional advice in
respect to the topics discussedduring this podcast.

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