The Real Challenges of Running a Building Business (And How to Overcome Them!) | Duayne Pearce

🔗 Check out Haiku Building:
https://haikubuilding.com.au/
🔗 Highwood Timber Instagram:   / haiku.building   

Join us for an inspiring conversation with Todd Parris, a builder who transformed his business and life by embracing data, systems, and a passion for healthy homes. In this episode, Todd shares his journey from working with his dad to running his own award-winning building company, the challenges he faced, and the lessons he learned along the way. 

Discover how Todd overcame overwhelm, built a strong team, and shifted his focus to building healthier, more sustainable homes for his clients. Whether you’re a builder, business owner, or just love stories of growth and resilience, this episode is packed with practical advice and real-world insights. 

Send us a text

Support the show

Check out the Duayne Pearce website here...

https://duaynepearce.com/

Episode Transcript

SPEAKER_00 (01:28):
Hey guys, welcome back to another episode of Level
Up.
We are back in the shed thisafternoon for another cracking
episode.
Look, another one that I'mreally excited about, another
builder, another member of LiveLife Builds Elevate program, and
another builder that has come anincredible long way in the last
couple of years.
So I'm really pleased to havehim sitting in the hot seat to
uh have a chat about where hewas, where he was at, and where

(01:51):
he is now.
So big warm welcome to Todd fromHaiku Building.
How are you, buddy?
Thanks, Duane.

SPEAKER_01 (01:56):
Um been a bit of a mission to get here today.
It has, yeah.
I sort of I left Sydney in anabsolute rainy hellhole.
And um it's good to be up herein the sunshine.

SPEAKER_00 (02:05):
Yeah, the um it is absolutely blowing its ass off
here today.
So I think that might have ledto some of your delays, but
anyway.
Um mate, we got a lot to talkabout.
Like you you're kicking goals.
Um, you've come a long way inthe last couple of years.
How long have you been withElevate?
Uh so over two years now.
Um exactly, but yeah, over twoyears.

(02:26):
Yeah.
Yeah.
So take us back before we startgetting into business and those
sorts of things.
Like, give us a little bit ofyour background.
How'd you become a builder?
How'd you get into it?

SPEAKER_01 (02:35):
So I was uh an apprentice with my dad, worked
with him for I think it'sprobably about 12 years, maybe
11 years.
Um and yeah, started out withhim, we did renovations, we did
pretty widespread um range ofwork and loved it.
We were doing really good work,finished my trade with him and

(02:57):
then stayed with him working fora few more years after that.
Uh, we were sort of doing reallynice architectural work in
Sydney, and I was learning alot, so I was happy to stay and
keep learning, but uminevitably, yeah, just decided
to go out on my own and give ita crack.

SPEAKER_00 (03:16):
The um I know when you first reached out to come to
Elevate, you're a little bit umlittle bit iffy on it because
the main reason you were sort ofreaching out was because you you
knew there had to be a betterway to do things and you wanted
to hit the ground running a bitbecause you hadn't been gone
very long for your yourself,have you?

SPEAKER_01 (03:35):
Yeah, I think also I when I started, so I was working
with my dad, we were doing nicework, we were doing really good
jobs, and I didn't want to goout on my own and then sort of
go back to you know doingsmaller jobs and work my way
back up to the jobs we weredoing.
So I sort of wanted to use thetime while I was with him to

(03:59):
sort of hone my skills and learnwhat I could, and then when I
went out on my own, tackle thekind of jobs that we wanted to
from the outset, um, which wedid.
We we sort of got lucky, we gotgot a good job that came
through, which was exactly thekind of work that we like to do,
um, which is like renovatingterraces in Sydney and the older
houses.

(04:19):
Um and that was good.
We went from that to another abigger job, um, and then from
that to another similar jobafter that.
And it was really good in asense that we were doing the
work that we wanted to do.
Um although because they werebigger jobs, I was learning big
lessons, and I I I wasn'tgetting I guess I wasn't getting

(04:42):
the feedback quick enough.
Like if you were doing decks ordoing smaller projects, you're
getting that feedback prettyquick.
So, what do you mean byfeedback?
Well, like not making money.
Making money, making mistakes,or yeah.
Um, like we nothing wrong withthe bills, that we were doing
great jobs, but it was more justa bit like the business side of
things where I was struggling.

(05:02):
Um, and so for me, like,although we were doing really
good work and I loved the jobsthat we were doing, for me it
was a bit of a hard journeythose initial couple of years.
It was also through COVID aswell.
So we had um, I mean, somepeople did quite well through
COVID.
We struggled with materials andavailability, and so there was a

(05:23):
lot of lessons wrapped up inthat as well.

SPEAKER_00 (05:25):
So, did you do any of the business side of things
when you're working with yourdad?

SPEAKER_01 (05:30):
Uh no, no, no, not at all.
So it was just um myself, therewas another carpenter, um, and
yeah, we did renovation sort ofwork, so he was managing
everything on his own, and yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (05:44):
So, had you like did you have any idea of what was
involved in the business side ofthe side of it?
Uh no.

SPEAKER_01 (05:52):
Like I wasn't uh I wasn't completely naive to it.
Like I enjoyed when I wasworking with him, I was um using
that time to sort of learn tomanage jobs, but it was more
only from like a project pointof view, not like a business
point of view.
So um, yeah, I guess I kind ofjumped into it and um we worked

(06:13):
things out, like nothing reallywent wrong dramatically, but it
was just uh lots of lessonspicked up in those first few
years.

SPEAKER_00 (06:20):
So, how did you know how to price the job and make
money?

SPEAKER_01 (06:23):
And uh it's funny, like I I actually remember
taking my first job, I think, toto dad, and um I think I'd I'd
gone through and sort of workedit all out, and he was just in
his office, sort of eating anapple, and he looked over, he's
like, Yeah, I had to lookthrough that, looks alright.

(06:44):
I mean, oh yeah, cool.
Is that it?
He goes, Yeah, looks alright.
And so I was like, All right,cool, sweet, away we go.
And um that was it, you signed acontract.
And it's yeah, I I mean, I wasconfident with like my like
hours and materials and stufflike that.
Like, I'm pretty good withplanning and setting out
spreadsheets and doing all thatstuff, but um obviously like

(07:08):
there's so many things that areunforeseen, especially in those
you know, smaller terrace jobs,and so yeah, I mean, I a lot of
lot learned a lot of lessonsearly.

SPEAKER_00 (07:17):
So um so like in your early days when you're
starting out on your own, didyou were you in communication
with your old boy a bit, likeasking questions and stuff, or
was that sort of off the table?

SPEAKER_01 (07:27):
Um I wasn't off the table.
Like we spoke about stuff, butnot not really, yeah.
Not nah.
Not really.
Like not that I not that Iwouldn't reach out like I would
for sure, but I just we just Iguess just didn't.
Yeah, he was doing his thing, Iwas doing my thing.

SPEAKER_00 (07:44):
Yeah.
Both pedaling away.
Yeah.
So what made you get to a pointwhere you you thought, shit, I I
need a bit of a hand with whatI'm doing here?

SPEAKER_01 (07:53):
Uh I think it was so after so when COVID happened, we
had one job where like we wecouldn't get sheets, we were
driving around like all ofSydney trying to get sheets for
plaster, and there was justmultiple things through a couple
of jobs, um, because it was overtwo jobs for us that um that

(08:14):
really took a pinch for us.
And so it was at that pointwhere I was like, oh, it's
really not that easy.
I think when you start, it's allyou know, you're bright-eyed and
bushy-tailed, and you goteverything set up and you just
you're just pedaling away.
Um, but I think it's also easyjust to keep pedaling, you don't

(08:36):
have much time to sort of lookback and see what's going wrong.
But um I think actually for usthat COVID was actually a
blessing that it highlightedproblems that we probably
wouldn't have picked up on hadthat not occurred.
Yeah.
And so I was actually gratefulthat that happened because the
jobs going forward, I was ableto pick up on errors that maybe

(09:00):
wouldn't have showed up if COVIDhadn't have been there.
Yeah.
And so that allowed me to sortof look back and go, all right,
well, there's a lot of thingsthat we need to fix and get
right first.

SPEAKER_00 (09:09):
So is New Cerfile similar to Queensland, like to
get your builder's license, youyou've got to sit a bit of a
business, like three-daybusiness course, they talk you
through a building contract andthen give you a license.
So what what happens down there?

SPEAKER_01 (09:21):
So you do a certificate four, which is the I
mean the normal path is you're acarpenter and you go through the
certificate four.
Um I think that I think that'sum that course has actually been
condensed down quite a lot fromwhat it was.
Um so I actually finished thecert four wanting more

(09:46):
information.
And I was like, I remember goingthrough the course and being
like, this can't be it.
Like we've sort of glazed over afew subjects, but we haven't
gone into much depth.
Um so I I went out after thatand sought more help through a
like an online university anddid a diploma of construction
project management, which helpedit helped more so with uh like

(10:11):
managing bigger projects andplanning and all that sort of
stuff.
Um but really nothing on thebusiness front.
Yeah, like nothing, and that'sit's certainly a huge hole
that's missing because it'scrazy, isn't it?

SPEAKER_00 (10:23):
That builders and and even traders these days can
literally get a license and likewithin sometimes could be a
matter of weeks, you're signinga contract for hundreds of
millions of dollars, yeah, andyou're expected to know how to
manage and control and maintainand quality and like run teams.
Like it's just insane.

SPEAKER_01 (10:43):
Yeah, and I think the home warranty is was a huge
thing.
Early um home warranty in NewSouth Wales can be can be tricky
when you're starting out,especially if you're a company.
Uh and so learning a lot aboutthat, like there could be a
course individually on homewarranty and what they want,
because yeah, honestly, like umthat's a huge part of running a

(11:05):
business, certainly in New SouthWales, you need to manage that.

SPEAKER_00 (11:08):
So yeah, I think I know as much as people hate it,
it it's probably something thatneeds to be rolled out to other
areas of Australia.
Like you look at Tasmania wherethey don't have any of that.
Yeah, like it's it's only like Iknow it can be painful, but it's
only a good thing.
Yeah.
Like making businesses managetheir cash flow, understand
their numbers to make surethey're not gonna go bally up uh

(11:30):
during a build.
But um, so yeah, like what wasthe final straw, I guess, to to
go shit.
I'm gonna go and look forsomething and get some help with
this.

SPEAKER_01 (11:39):
Oh look, I think um I think it was just the
overwhelm.
I actually remember, I rememberthe phone call I first had with
you.
Uh I was at the front of thisjob, we just demolished it, and
I was just like, oh man.
Just this feeling of overwhelm.
We'd had two big jobs that gotfinished, and I was fine.
Like, I'm not, I'm veryconfident with like building and

(12:02):
building a house of no problem.
Like, I'm not there's nothingthat there's nothing I've come
across in a job where I'm like,oh I mean, I can't do this, it's
just the business side ofthings.
So I think it was that overwhelmof just not knowing what I
didn't know, and then I reachedout to a few different coaches
at that same time.
Um, and it was just I justdidn't really gel with anything

(12:24):
like they were saying, or andthen I sort of came came across
your stuff.
Um, I think it was throughAmelia actually, and then yeah,
came came across you, and thenjust yeah, I I just feel like
there was just I I was veryaligned with it with what you
were teaching, and it was justwe live and breathe it, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (12:42):
Yeah, it's uh I think it does make a very big
difference, but um I've I'veseen your work mate on socials,
and it like you do some prettycomplicated stuff.
Like, I we don't have anythinglike those little terrace hours
here in Brisbane.
Like we we have little workers'cottages and things in town
where there's small lots, andwe've recently finished once uh
one of them, and uh every timeyou do it, it's a learning curve

(13:05):
because you don't realise howmuch time is taken up moving
shit around manually becausethere's no room to do anything.
Yeah, yeah.
Um, but like it I can Iunderstand where you're at, and
I think all builders can.
Like when you're so confident inbuilding and you can pick up a
very detailed set of drawingsand you can take that from a set
of pages to a finished project,it can be very hard to like you

(13:32):
can be very hard on yourself tothink, shit, what's wrong with
me?
Like, why can't I make thiswork?
What's going on?
Why's my bank account got nomoney?
Like, why am I having all theseissues?
Like, I can do this shit.
Yeah, yeah.
But it's far more than justbeing able to like running a
business in the constructionindustry is far more than being
able to do your trade and buildthe building.

SPEAKER_01 (13:50):
Yeah, I I said to someone recently, I said, it it
sounds stupid and people wouldthink this is ridiculous to say,
but the problem with building,well not the problem with
building, but one of like thehardest thing with a building
business is not building housesand building homes, it's it's
just the it's the it's makingthe business work to be
profitable.
And that's it.
If you could go to work and justsomeone kept everything on

(14:11):
behind the scenes and you justworked away, it's it's fine, you
know.
You just make things work, youcome across issues, you resolve
them, but it's it's keeping allof it together at at once and
keeping everything moving.
It's yeah, it's tricky and itcan be overwhelming, and that's
that's why I sort of reachedout.
Um yeah, like I was I wasconfident with what we were
doing and what we were buildingand stuff, but yeah, I just

(14:33):
needed I needed more help behindthe scenes.

SPEAKER_00 (14:36):
Yeah, it's hard, like so many people, it's hard
to have conversations withpeople that aren't builders in
because they like unless you'vetried to run a building
business, you really can't getyour head around it.
Yeah um, and the only the bestway I can explain it is it it's
two businesses.
Like you have the constructionpart of it, which a lot of

(14:57):
people are really good at, andyou have the business part of
it.

SPEAKER_03 (15:00):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (15:00):
And without the business part of it, the
construction part falls overreally quickly.

SPEAKER_03 (15:04):
Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (15:05):
Um, you'll end up working your whole life, like
just busting your ass to try andstay above water.

SPEAKER_02 (15:12):
Yeah, exactly.
Exactly.

SPEAKER_00 (15:14):
Um so mate, how like what were the biggest changes, I
guess, once you started like didyou know what you needed to work
on, or is it like um yeah, Idid.

SPEAKER_01 (15:24):
Look, I I knew uh I knew overheads for me initially
were were an issue.
Um because we were we weretracking our projects and stuff
like that, with like in terms ofcosts, um, and we were executing
the jobs well.
For me, it was it was just yeah,um initially it was just that
profit and cash flow and and solearning overheads, like what is

(15:48):
an overhead, because it I meaninitially I just sort of jumped
into um I think it was M M Y O Boriginally and just sort of went
away running the business andputting things where I thought
they should be, and and thenthat was it, and we just kind of
kept pedaling.
But I I knew that I wasn't um Ijust wasn't doing everything
properly.

(16:08):
I needed help.
I didn't really know where toreach out in terms of like
bookkeeping and stuff like that.
Um, we had a bookkeeper at thetime, and yeah, so I just I knew
I had to make a change.
I I think initially it wasoverheads, um, and then also we
had an issue with home warranty,which um we had to resolve as
well.
So there was just there's a lotof moving parts for it.

SPEAKER_00 (16:29):
It can be hard.
Like if you're a if you're in asituation where you're you're
good with data and you're you'requoting the jobs accurately and
you're you're tracking all yourcosts as you're building the
project and they're lining up.
Like you can see on paper,you're you've you've allowed
enough for carpentry, framing,whatever it may be.
And but you're looking at yourbank account and you're like,
What why have I got no money?

(16:50):
Yeah, where we're like we'reinvoicing for this, we're
covering our costs, like what'sgoing on here?
Um, because overheads aresomething that I I don't know
why we're not taught aboutoverheads at school.
Like it should be a subject.
Yeah, because it doesn't matterwhat industry in every business
has overheads.
Yeah, um, the amount of peoplethat reach out to me, um,
overheads is one of the firstthings I ask people, like,

(17:11):
what's your overheads?
And the amount of people thatrespond with I don't have any.
Like, yeah, mate, every businesshas overheads.
Oh no, it's fine, I own my car,I've only got my phone.
Like, oh what about all yourinsurances?
What about fuel to get to andfrom work?
Like, what about this?
What about that?
And you're like, oh shit, isthat overheads?
Like it's um plus the fact thatlike every business owner needs

(17:34):
to get paid for the role theyplay.
Um, are those the sorts ofthings that you were missing
out?

SPEAKER_01 (17:40):
Yeah, and I think also like so.
We were doing so we were I wassort of brought up a lot of the
jobs we were doing with with dadpreviously were cost plus
contracts.
Um I wanted to just be wipedfrom that.
I don't like cost pluscontracts, I don't like what
they do to the relationship inthe building.
Um what what why is that?

SPEAKER_00 (18:01):
What have you saying?

SPEAKER_01 (18:02):
Oh, I just I think it becomes like with a cost plus
contract, I find it just becomeseverything becomes so focused on
the money and focused on umcounting everything out, you
know, whether it's trackinghours and doing which is which
is totally fine, but it bringsthe relationship away from like
we're providing a service, likea complete package service.

(18:25):
Um and but by going into a costplus contract, in my opinion,
the whole way through that job,everything's coming back to
price and this, and it justbecomes this to and fro.

SPEAKER_00 (18:35):
And yeah, the focus gets taken away from the
experience that the clientshould be.

SPEAKER_01 (18:40):
The experience, yeah, exactly.
And and and for me, that was oneof the driving forces of me
going out of my own was to havegood client experiences.
Like I've we wanted to buildgood houses for good people from
the outset, and um relationshipsfor us is is huge, and there's
no better feeling than walkingaway from a job and having a

(19:01):
good relationship with that withthat family, like um, you know,
better than making a profit, inmy opinion.
Like you can walk away and notmake any money if you've got a
good relationship and you builda good house, then that's a
that's successful.

SPEAKER_00 (19:16):
But they go hand in hand, like nine times out of
ten, if you build a greatrelationship with a client,
they're happy to pay you whatthe job like what you need to
make a profitable business.
Yeah, and so you you get two,you get both.
You get a good relationship andthe profit.

SPEAKER_02 (19:28):
Exactly.

SPEAKER_00 (19:29):
Yeah, um, and so what like it's one of those
things you don't know what youdon't know, do you?
Like, and look, every I thinkour class every day is a school
day, like every single day thereis stuff to learn in running a
business.
So, but you just took to it likea duck to water.
Like, I know you're very humble,and I I feel you're very hard on
yourself.

(20:48):
Um, like mate, you just bloodytook away a wardrobe full of
trophies from uh from Live LifeBill's bloody awards night.

SPEAKER_03 (20:55):
Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (20:56):
Like you're kicking goals.
So, like, how and you and youlike I said, you took to it like
a duck to water.
Like, what was the driver?
Like, were you seeing progressquite quickly, and that drove
you just to keep improving moreand more?

SPEAKER_01 (21:09):
Um, yeah, I think like I love work, I just love I
love building, I love work, Ilove the I love the office side
of things.
Like so, I I guess in somerespects I'm a bit of a
workaholic.
Um but I think for me when Ijoined up with Live Life Build,
having a path where I could sortof see things clearer, knowing

(21:32):
that I'm not gonna pedal amillion miles in the in the
wrong direction.
For me, that was just it gave meclarity that I could go, all
right, sweet.
Like I was aligned with thefixed price um teachings that
you guys go on about.
Um and I was like, yeah, this ismy jam, the pack process, like
collaboration, working with theclients, like this is exactly
where I want to be.

(21:53):
And so for me, I knew that itwas just I can just push as hard
as I can down this road becauseI know that's where I want to
be.

SPEAKER_00 (22:01):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (22:01):
Um, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (22:02):
So tell us a little bit about the PAC process
because there's still a lot ofpeople out there saying that
that's crazy.
You can't people won't pay toget a proposal.

SPEAKER_01 (22:09):
Yeah, so the PAC process for us has been has been
huge.
It's it's one of those thingswhere like now I look back when
we were starting to do it, uh,like we've improved it a lot
over the years, and um, like nowwe're at a really good spot with
it.
I think initially the first few,like I was it's a it's a
daunting thing to go out and andsort of do, especially like

(22:32):
being brought up aroundarchitects and builders and
stuff who were just you know,spinning tenders, and you just
that's that's the only wayforward.
And we were getting sent a lotof tenders, a lot of nice work
to do, and um I just didn't wantto be involved with it.

SPEAKER_00 (22:48):
So um for me I was straight into the pack process
because So how did you get thecourage to say no to those jobs
when you needed work?

SPEAKER_01 (22:57):
Um so we were initially when we were working
on uh jobs before we startedwith you guys and doing the pack
process, we weren't like weweren't charging for for quotes
and stuff, but we were workingwith them from the start and
spending a lot of time with ourclients to get it to a point
where we can sign a contractbecause it's a fixed price
contract, and that's the work weneed to do.

(23:20):
And so the progression kind ofmade sense for me, and the
process made sense.
Um, it was more the confidenceto go out and ask for it.
Um but now looking back, likethe time that we spend in that
process is is huge.
And like I know now, I even lookback on jobs where the first
pack process we did, I look backon that, and there was things

(23:42):
that we should have spent moretime on um before we signed the
contracts that would have madethat job flow better, just
little selections and stuff likethat.
And so now I'm sort of a lotmore firm with it, and that's
and that that comes into havinga better um workflow as well.
Like everything's connected, youcan't you can't be sort of

(24:04):
pushing back on jobs if youdon't have the workflow there.
It's all kind of connected in abig circle, I think.

SPEAKER_00 (24:09):
So it definitely is, and yeah, the universe is crazy
what it gives you back once youget once you connect all the
dots.
Um and look, you've definitelyhad a lot of uh success with the
PAC process and things, but onething I like, and correct me if
I'm wrong, but you're you'revery uh much wanting to build

(24:29):
healthy homes and and um you'releaning more towards passive
house, correct?

SPEAKER_03 (24:34):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (24:35):
Um and you've gone as far as starting to write into
your contracts the air changesper hour.

SPEAKER_01 (24:41):
Yeah, so we like like to be fair, like we've
we've never done a certifiedpassive house.
Um so initially, when we beforeI started Haiku, we um like I
went out and did the passivehouse course, and for me that
was huge, super enlightening,and it just made so much sense.
Um and then I sort of went downthe healthy home route and

(25:02):
learned about that, and I thinkall these things together, like
for me, there's no one way to togo about building a house, and I
don't want to pigeonhole myselfinto anything, but every client,
every family's different and gotdifferent, like everyone lives
differently in their houses.
Um and so it's learning aboutall the different ways that we

(25:22):
can build and kind of piecingtogether, like we've got
non-negotiables now with the waywe do our houses, which is like
your external wrap, like areally good quality, like Pro
Climber wrap, um, ventilatedcavity button, good insulation,
insulation inspections.
Um, who's doing the insulationinspections?
So we just do we just have achecklist that we go through.

(25:43):
It's um we just take photos ofeach wall, each ceiling, all
that sort of stuff.
Um and but just doing that, likethat's not that's not going
overboard, you're not spendingmuch more.
Like, and you obviouslyhigh-quality windows, like
double glaze windows.
Um, and I mean the way thingsare moving with the code, I
think that should be theminimum.
Like, and after what we'velearned um through all this

(26:06):
process, there's nothing I'velearned that you'd take out and
go, oh no, we'll just leave thatout for this job and we'll go
back to doing it the old way.

SPEAKER_00 (26:15):
Once you understand how a building performs and
definitely the wraps and thecavity batten and the windows,
like you yeah, you can't goback.
Like it's um you really got totreat every building like a
living, breathing thing.
Like um, but like that sort ofthing is giving your clients a
lot of confidence, like to seethat you're pushing so hard that

(26:36):
you've made that a standard.
Like if they build with highqueue, this is what you get.

SPEAKER_01 (26:39):
Yeah, yeah.
Yeah, well, like I think youhave to like if you're selling
um like the wrap and you'reselling all this, you need to
sort of be testing it at the endof the day.
Um, whether or not you're goingto passive power standards, or a
lot of the houses we do are oldterraces, so you're dealing with
a like a party wall, you mightbe dealing with a timber
subfloor.

(27:00):
Um and a lot of that comes intoit, it's really, really hard in
terms of air sealing.
Um, so some of the jobs, likewe've done slabs all the way
through, um, one we've got on atthe moment, which is like half
concrete, half subfloor.
It's it's tricky, and you spendso much time in doing it.
Uh it's yeah, it can be a lot.

(27:23):
And you go through, and evenstill now, like we track all our
our data and timesheets andmaterials and all that sort of
stuff.
And I know um there's so muchtime that goes into it on those
old jobs.

SPEAKER_00 (27:34):
So, how do you was that a client um requested
thing?
Or was that like the airchain,like writing air changes per
hour into a contract?
Is that something that you'reyou're wanting to do?

SPEAKER_01 (27:44):
Uh so that was a conversation with the client
about that.
Um, because and it was, I thinkit's fair enough because they
were asking about you know,they're gonna spend all this
money on the wrap, and how do weknow it's gonna be it's gonna
perform?
Um and so yeah, we just wrote itin for that one, and I think
it's the way it should be.

SPEAKER_00 (28:03):
Yeah, 100%.
And um I don't know.
I I think I feel like a lot ofbuilders out there don't even
understand that it's actuallyalready in the building code
that we are supposed to bebuilding.
Yeah.
Under is it?
I think it's under 10 airchanges or air.

SPEAKER_01 (28:15):
Yeah, but I I I actually would like, and I know
they're talking about like youknow, going back and testing and
um giving some sort ofcertification to jobs in the
future, but I think it'd be goodto have some sort of
certification that's like astamp.
So when you're selling thathouse, whether it's an old
beaten-up cottage or whetherit's a new build that you've
just completed, it comes withall that information, like a

(28:36):
washing machine, like four and ahalf stars.

SPEAKER_00 (28:38):
Mate, I'm 100% with you there.
Uh, it's something we'reintroducing into our building
business.
Um, like Paula Baker of Porkgave me the idea when she was in
here.
Like they she said, why whydon't our houses have like you
go to the supermarket and youbuy food?
Like every every label has tohave on the sugar, the
carbohydrates, like all thatstuff.
Like, why should our houses nothave a sticker on the inside of

(29:00):
the kitchen cupboard that saysthis is your R value, this is
the type of insulation that ithad, this is a building wrap
that it had, like, this is howmany air changes it had per
hour.
Yeah.
Um, to me, and I do believe itwill go that way, and I do
believe that any builders thatare going to that length, and
like it's something like I said,we we're going to create our own
little stickers for that.

(29:21):
I believe it's something thatwill add value when the house
comes time to get sold.
Yeah.
Um because yeah, to me, it'sjust a no-brainer.
Like, once you know how all thisstuff works, it it's um, and I
feel like COVID has really likeobviously COVID highlighted a
lot of things, especially likepeople living healthier.
Yeah, and I really feel that'snow starting to push through.

(29:42):
Everyone's been going to farmersmarkets and eating healthier,
and now they're starting tofigure out well shit, our houses
has a big part to play in ourlife.
We need to be doing things thatmake our like our sleeping
better, our environment better,yeah, like our air quality
better.

SPEAKER_01 (29:59):
Yeah, 100%.
Like we've we've uh I guesswe've been lucky from the start.
We've we've attracted goodclients that have been
like-minded in that sense.
Um, so the area that we do workin, like in inner west of
Sydney, there's um, I don'tknow, for whatever, for whatever
reason, we've had like a really,really good run of clients and

(30:21):
everyone's super aligned,they're on the same page.
So you're not you're not sort ofit's not that I'm selling
something, like like you'reputting yourself out there.
Yeah, you just I'm I'm teachingthem how we should be.

SPEAKER_00 (30:32):
You're too humble, mate.
You're attracting these clients.
Like yeah, yeah.
It's not it's not just magicallyhappen, like you're you're
putting it out there.

SPEAKER_01 (30:40):
Yeah, but I think it's it's up to us as builders
in that initial stage to beteaching them about this stuff
as well.
Um not necessarily likerailroading them into one type
of building, but just teachingthem what's what's important um
and why it's important and whatit does, because it's it's a
huge investment.
And like I I know for me, once Ilearnt this stuff, I was just

(31:01):
like, oh man, this is I can'tbelieve people are actually
building houses now who don'tknow this.
It's like it's just scary.
Like it's but uh yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (31:10):
You you you talk about this, these things on your
socials, but don't you as well?

SPEAKER_01 (31:13):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
And I mean that's something I'veonly just started getting
comfortable with, I guess,talking on socials and doing
this sort of stuff.

SPEAKER_00 (31:20):
So yeah.
But you I think in the past I'veseen some good stills.
Like you've you've done postswhere you're you're commenting
and and educating people onyeah, um, and I I think all that
stuff adds value.
Yeah, like that'll be addingvalue to your clients without
you even realizing it.
Like someone might be followingyou for two years, seeing all
your little tips and tricks, andyeah, when they decide to build,

(31:42):
they're reaching out becausethey they align with you.

SPEAKER_01 (31:44):
Yeah, I think it's good.
Like we've we've actually had aa job recently that came through
an energy assessor, which wascool, um, which is the first
time that's happened, and Ithink that's that's awesome.
I think energy assessors aregreat.
I think they should be involvedin pre-construction, and I think
it's uh it's awesome that peopleor clients are actually reaching
out to someone like that forthis.

(32:05):
It was just a small renovation,um, reaching out to an energy
assessor before they start arenovation.
So I think that's it's awesome.
But it shows that there's youknow, people are certainly
concerned with health and youknow, they want to live in
better homes.
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (32:19):
Um I'm gonna go.
Back to the data and the numbersand things, mate, because it you
um quite often in our Zoom callsfor Live Light Bill, like I can
see you're sitting back andyou're very quiet, and then
every now and then you'll you'lljump in with a question.
But yeah, I feel like you'rewell, you're definitely very
humble, but like you're reallyrefining how your business

(32:40):
operates based on the datayou're getting, aren't you?

SPEAKER_01 (32:43):
Yeah, we've gone pretty uh pretty ham on the on
the data side of things.
Like I think um as the businesshas grown and we've taken on
more jobs and more staff andstuff like that, we came into
new problems that we didn't havebefore.
Um, and so we kind of fixed ouroverheads, and then we had more

(33:04):
jobs that came through, and thenmore workers, and then we had
different problems.
So I think data's huge.
And so for us, we reached out toKatie from Profit First and got
their team.
Um, she has a team ofbookkeepers who do tradey
bookkeeping and um did acomplete overhaul of our books,

(33:26):
which was huge.
We I wasn't confident with ourlike zero file to say that when
I logged on there, that'sexactly a snapshot as today.
So I knew I wanted moreconfidence in that, and I wanted
to be able to look at thesenumbers and like I'm really uh
like I'm good with spreadsheetsand I'm good with numbers and
all that sort of stuff.

(33:47):
I love it.
And um for me it gave me morevisibility.
So yeah, we went pretty prettyturbo on it.
I've got a bunch of spreadsheetsthat we track each month.
So I've got, I don't know, maybe20 or 25 KPIs that we track each
month.
And what what sort of things arethey?
Uh so revenue, gross profit, netprofit, assets versus

(34:08):
liabilities, um, number ofemployees, revenue, revenue per
employee, all that sort ofstuff.
So then I can go through and seelike I can pinpoint when I was
most stressed and go back andsay, all right, cool.
Oh, we had like seven guys thenand this happened, and you can
see it.
And and so you're making betterdecisions off the right things.

(34:31):
Making educated decisions.
Educated decisions, I guessthat's what I'm trying to say.
But not knowing everything, youkind of you just you're just
guessing, like just saying, Oh,I'm just whinging about
overheads because oh, I don'thave enough money on overheads,
but it's probably not that.
Maybe it's employees, maybe it'sthe revenue, maybe it's
something else.

SPEAKER_00 (34:48):
So Yeah, you can't if if you don't track your data
and break it down and review it,you'd you're simply just making
assumptions all the time.

SPEAKER_03 (34:55):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (34:56):
There's no um like it's all guesswork.

SPEAKER_03 (34:59):
Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (35:00):
So how how do you think that's a well you've just
mentioned stress, like a lot ofpeople listening to this are
probably thinking, like, I justdon't have the time to to do all
that, or I'm no good atspreadsheets and those types of
things.
But have you found that justknuckling down, putting the time
into those things has actuallygiven you more time and reduced
all your stress?
For sure.

SPEAKER_01 (35:20):
It's so having having all our zero file and
everything up to date um and andproper, like the way it should
be, that was the first step, andthat was huge.
Um then tracking the numbers inyour project management system.
Um like for me, like I don't Idon't enter all of the data each

(35:43):
month.
Um, we've got a VA who who goesthrough and takes ticks a lot of
them off, and then I comethrough and fill in the blanks,
but um, it just becomes part ofthe routine.
And I actually find comfort in alot of that stuff, like the
overhead calculator that we usein Live Life Build, um, the
projected revenue, like theyform part of this spreadsheet
that I've got.

SPEAKER_00 (36:03):
And I like I love that you're using the assets
liability one as well.
Like that's well, that's huge.

SPEAKER_01 (36:07):
Like it's a it's it's more a business assets
liability.
So um, because to me, that's theone two port cards.
That's the one, like that is theone.
If you get that sitting rightand sitting consistent, then
you're you're doing good.
So and you can see when it'stracking down, you're like,
okay, cool, then you track itback up, and it just gives you
clarity.
Like, and I actually findcomfort in that when I'm

(36:30):
stressed about stuff, I can gothrough we actually project all
of this forward as well.
So um that same spreadsheet weuse, I have a running tab for
the next six months, and I canproject forward the progress
claims that we'll have in.
Um, so I can plan the next threemonths, and it gives me clarity.

(36:50):
I actually, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (36:52):
Does it help you um like with your family life as
well, like um with confidence?
Like I know I have a very muchhigher uh level of risk than
what my wife Camille has, andlike but having all those
documents um like yourself andbeing able to look at them and
clearly see, and again, forecastthree months, six months, twelve

(37:14):
months down the track, and itgives Camille a lot of
confidence in decisions we'remaking and all that type of
stuff.
Like it I don't know, likeeveryone's very different.
Like, I I like it because I makeeducated decisions based off it.
She likes it because it justgives her confidence knowing
that we're safe doing it.

SPEAKER_01 (37:31):
Yeah, yeah.
Yeah, I think for me, I it'sit's definitely I definitely use
it as a comfort thing.
Like if I'm if I'm feelingstressed, rather than kind of
just you know, hiding or doingwhatever people do when they're
stressed, like I'll just walkup, go and sit up in the office,
go through the projected revenuecalculator, go through my

(37:52):
overhead, see where things areat, and soon enough, like you
can get a gauge for it and see,okay, it's not that bad.
It's just a spot.
Because in like a buildingbusiness, like you can go from
month to month and you haveterrible months, and then you go
really good months.
It's not there's there's lots ofebbs and flows with it.
So um, it's easy to get caughtin the now and say, Oh, I'm just
this is the worst, it's the endof the world, and um but you've

(38:14):
got to zoom out a little bit.
I always say to my wife Laura,if in doubt, zoom out.
You gotta um that's a good oneand the name of this podcast.

SPEAKER_00 (38:22):
If in doubt, zoom out.
That's a good one.
Um, so let's talk about team fora bit, mate.
That's another one that a lot ofbusinesses struggle with.
Like you've had a lot of growth.
Like, how have you gone aboutbuilding your team?

SPEAKER_01 (38:35):
Yeah, so we um initially I struggled to find an
apprentice.
Uh, I think I went through likefive apprentices in the first
four months.
Um, like I was hiring onattitude, like I just wanted
someone who was keen and umwanted to turn up to work.
Anyway, I found someone, hestayed with us for a long time

(38:57):
and obviously became a tradesmanand did his time with us.
Um and then from then it kind ofjust it was all very organic.
I think it kind of just flowedon.
Um we had a few that didn't makeit through.
Um and now we've got uh weactually had quite a big team
last year.
We had up, I think up to like Imean, big for us was like six at

(39:21):
1.7 with an overlap, and thennow we've come down to four.
But recently we've been reallyunder the pump.
I've had a guy away on holidaysat the moment, and and so yeah,
team's been tricky.
Um but we've got a really good,really good team.
Um, I've got a young apprenticeat the moment who's just
awesome.
Really it's hard to find peoplewith that good attitude who are

(39:44):
keen, I think.

SPEAKER_00 (39:45):
But um Do you think having such clarity around the
type of work you want to do andthe and the the things you want
to uh deliver for your clienthas helped attract the team
members that you need?

SPEAKER_01 (39:57):
Uh possibly, yeah.
I think we've like we've alwayshad good we have always had good
workflow and consistent um typesof jobs, I guess.
Um so I think that has probablyhelped, yeah, for sure.
And we had a good initially itwas I mean it was a really good
um camaraderie.

(40:19):
I mean it was very fun on site,and I think so people came,
people came to work with us, andum, you know, things just gelled
and it just kind of happened,but I do think I kind of
flooched my way through that andwe ended up with a good team.

SPEAKER_00 (40:33):
Seriously, you're the most humble bloke I've ever
come across.
Like it's like getting bloodover a stain.
Yeah, like you've you've put ina lot of work, mate, in the last
couple of years.
Like I've seen the changes andthe growth that you've had.

SPEAKER_01 (40:48):
Like you are you are you on site a lot on your Yeah,
look, I I think last year, lastyear I was off-site more because
we were um I was sort ofimplementing a lot in the office
and doing a lot of back-end worklast year um in the office,
getting estimates ready and allthat sort of stuff.

(41:09):
And so um this year with theteam being reduced, um, I've
been on site a lot more.
And but I mean I love being onsite for me.
It's like I want to get thebusiness to a point where I can
be on site and not just comingin and kind of annoying my team.
But uh, like for me, I'd I Ienjoy being on the tools, I

(41:31):
enjoy that flow state of justframing or concreting or all the
big days that are reallystressful.

SPEAKER_00 (41:38):
I love that stuff.
I'm the same.
It's unreal talking to tradiesthat are passionate about their
job.
Like they all talk about gettingin that flow.
Yeah, like it's there'ssomething about having a good
day on the tools and everythingjust snaps.
Like it's very different tohaving a big day in the office.

SPEAKER_01 (41:53):
Yeah, like I enjoy, like I gotta be really
structured in the office for meto have a good day.
Otherwise, it's just it's notvery productive.
Like I need to structure it in away where I'm getting stuff
done.
I feel like I'm getting thingsdone.
Um, otherwise I can get a bitlost.
Whereas, yeah, on site it's justespecially when there's lots

(42:13):
happening, like those big days,lots of people, very stressful.
Like, I don't know, it's just Iguess my mind, I just like that.

SPEAKER_00 (42:21):
Um it's the um the problem solving, like just
having to figure things out onthe fly.

SPEAKER_01 (42:26):
I think problem solving for sure, yeah.
Um, but I think the busyness aswell, like that that quiet in
the office where it's just meand I'm accountable to only
myself.
It's like it can be hard to sortof push through and get a lot
done, but um, that's why I justgot to be careful with the way
you you structure it and dostuff in the middle of the day
to try to get out and get backinto it.

SPEAKER_00 (42:47):
So, how have you managed to get the time to step
away and and be able to work onthe business?

SPEAKER_01 (42:54):
That was tricky.
Um, it was tricky initially.
I actually struggled with thatwith the team.
So, especially that first likecarpenter I had doing his
apprenticeship with him andworking alongside him for so
long.
Then turning that into then medeveloping into a business owner

(43:16):
was really tricky to manage.
Um and I think for me, there'salways that like as a builder,
you've always got thatcamaraderie between your team
and that, and it's not that youwant to see it go, but at some
point you need to step back andget in the office because it's
just there's so much time thatgoes into the office that's like
I still can't believe how much Ihave to do.

(43:37):
Like, I got a VA who helps whois amazing, um, but still
there's so much that goes intoit.
Um I I kind of sold it to myteam in a way that like I need
to be in here to do this, to getthis stuff planned, so things
are arriving on time.
If I'm not in the office, if I'mhelping you on site with things

(43:59):
that's gonna push on site, thenwe're gonna fall behind anyway.

SPEAKER_00 (44:02):
So yeah, the office is a massive, it's far bigger
than what most people realise.
Um, so how how do they like doyou have regular communication
with them and let them know whatyou're working on, what's coming
up, and all that sort of stuff?

SPEAKER_01 (44:13):
Yeah, I try to be consistent with my office days,
but to be honest, the last sixmonths I haven't been.
I did have a good flow lastyear, but um I try to sort of
have certain days where I'm orplan it at least at the start of
the week where I am in theoffice, um, which was Tuesdays.
But um, yeah, so I I do try andlike we have a weekly kickoff at

(44:35):
the start of the week and justrun them through my week of
where we're gonna be at.
So yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (44:40):
Those weekly site meetings or regular site
meetings are really valuable,aren't they?
Like, so your team's notfluffing around, they actually
they've got some structure thereweek, you set intent for the
week, you um have a plan there.
So, like how does your team workwhen you're not there?
Like, do you is there a leadcarpenter, you've got a
supervisor?

SPEAKER_01 (44:56):
Yeah, so we've got like a lead, basically a lead
carpenter um on each job, andthen um it was an apprentice and
then another carpenter.
So um, yeah, so it's just wehave like obviously like the
chats and stuff, and I generallyat the moment I'll I'll go there
in the morning and set them upfor the day, and we'll go
through what needs to be, youknow, spoken about and

(45:17):
documented, and um, they're intouch with Shannon, who's in the
office as well.
And so if they need anything,it's it's straight to them.
And like I find I'm quicker,like if I'm in the office and
going through things, I I can bequicker to get stuff back to
them anyway.
So it's um yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (45:34):
Um can we talk about your VA for a minute?
Because I I really feel like VAis add enormous value to
construction businesses, and umit can be a little bit
overwhelming, I guess, to getyour head around how you can
like how you can work withsomeone that's not sitting in
your office.

SPEAKER_01 (45:51):
Yeah.
Yeah, I um I'd never really knewwhere to start with that,
especially like having someonein the office.
I was yeah, it was it was a bigone for me because I'd never I'd
never had like an in-housebookkeeper, I'd never had anyone
sort of in an admin role at all.
And so initially, initially Ididn't know what it was supposed

(46:14):
to be like.
So the first VA that we had wasa little bit unsuccessful.
But initially I didn't know whatto expect, so I kind of let it
go for a bit.
But um once I sort of refinedthe role and worked out what
that role was, that was that washuge, but it has been a game
changer.
It's meant that I can implementthe things that I should be

(46:35):
doing, because otherwise youjust don't have time.
Like it's um, it can be reallyhard.
So having someone who can um,you know, also finish the things
that you start, because I thinkme as me as a person, my
personality, like I'm very goodat coming in and starting things
and setting things up, andthat's something I've learned.

(46:56):
I think you learn a lot aboutyourself in business, and I'm
very good at getting to flowingwith things and setting things
up, and here's how we're gonnado it, and coming up with ideas
and stuff like that.
When it comes into the weeds ofjust doing day-to-day things,
I'm like, yeah, no, I just doit.
Yeah, so what sort of what sortof tasks have you got your VA
doing?

(47:16):
So Shannon, our VA, is um, she'sawesome.
She runs, wears a lot of hats,she does, you know, timesheets,
um project management.
So, like, as as in managing thesoftware that we use, um we were
using an older software whichlinked into spreadsheets.
So she was managing all thetimesheets, the job photos, um,

(47:39):
like file management, um,emails, calendar management,
scheduling, like Instagramposts, all that sort of stuff.
Um but to be honest, I think themain thing she does is she holds
me accountable.
Like having someone else therewho uh like I know what I need
to do, but I think in business,especially when I'm kind of on

(48:00):
my own in the business, like asa like sole director, there's
only yourself to hold youaccountable.
And so I think having having herhas been like it's been really
good, and me giving her freereign to pull me up on things
where you know we need to begetting more done or I need to
be more consistent with certainthings.
So it's been it's been reallymassive for us having a VA.

SPEAKER_00 (48:23):
So, mate, what's on the cards for Haiku?
Like, you've definitely um well,actually, before we go there,
let's let's talk about yourawards.
You um you needed a truck to getthem home.
Um, but actually, um moreimportant than your awards was
your little awards ceremony whenyou got home.

(48:43):
Oh yeah.
I thought that was absolutelybrilliant.
So tell us about that.

SPEAKER_01 (48:48):
Uh so I got home.
I'm trying to think of the umthe actual so yeah, I got home
and um so I got a lovely wife athome, Laura, and three beautiful
kids.
Uh six, four, and two at thattime.
And um yeah, I got home and theywere sort of stoked that I'd
gotten awards, and so Laura hadawarded them their own little

(49:11):
awards when I got home for thebest kid who was well behaved
while I was away.
And I think one of them was fordoing a poo on the toilet.
I think the other one was for Ican't remember.
There was there was three ofthem, but it was super cute to
come home to, and they were allwide awake at whatever it was,
10 o'clock when we got home.
So cool.
I thought that was really,really cool.

SPEAKER_00 (49:28):
But yeah, talk us through your awards.
Like you you like I said, youput in the effort and you got
rewarded for it.

SPEAKER_01 (49:35):
Yeah, so I mean, going through that process with
Live Life Bill was actually Ifound it.
I think you can get, and Icertainly can get bogged down in
the gap of where you are, likethe gap versus gain.
So like seeing where you are andwhere you could be or where you
want to be.

(49:55):
And so for me, going throughthat process of um filling out
those award entries and stufflike that for me was quite
cathartic in that um I wasgiving myself room to sort of
recognize the changes that I hadmade.
Um so that was huge, just goingthrough the process of applying,
and I probably got enough out ofit to stop there.

(50:17):
But then to get the awards waswas absolutely um was awesome.
Like I don't not that I don't dowell with it, but I just oh man,
I was I was pretty like uh takenaback from the whole thing, to
be honest.

SPEAKER_00 (50:29):
Yeah, yeah.
Oh mate, you definitely deservedit.
So what um for those that don'tknow, Live Life Bill does a um
this year was our second year,so we we do annual awards
nights.
Um this year was definitelyspecial.
Like we hired Movie World,bloody loaded everyone on a bus
and rocked up to Movie World, noone knew where we were going.
So that was the the venue thatCarrie organized was friggin'

(50:50):
insane.
Um but yeah, tell us about theactual awards.

SPEAKER_01 (50:54):
Like so I um I took out the Healthy Home Award,
which for me was um was huge.
That's somewhere where we'vedone a lot of work in our
business, and it's somethingthat my wife Laura is she she
did the course with me and she'sbringing her skill set into
haiku and working out where shecan come into the business.

(51:15):
So um that was really good.
Uh, we also took out thepartnerships award, which was um
you know, for buildingpartnerships with clients and
architects, which I guess when Ilook at it, we've we've done
pretty good in that sense.
Um and the systemization awardgot a highly commended for that

(51:36):
one as well, which which I wasvery rapt with.
Um but the standout member ofthe year for me was um yeah, I
mean, that was pretty special.
There's been so many builders inthis community that are so
inspirational to me.
Um but to be recognized in aroom with you know you guys and
all of those builders was huge.

SPEAKER_00 (51:58):
Yeah, well, you deserved it, mate.
Like one thing uh Amelia and Ihave wanted to do with Live Life
Build, like we we didn't want itto be just like the average
awards that the industry has,and based on dollar value of
homes and size of business andthose types of things.
And so the healthy home one issomething that's very important
for us.
Um, we believe that people inthe industry that are putting in

(52:21):
the effort to deliver theirclients healthier homes
definitely deserve to um berepresented.
Um, the partnership one issomething else, I think, that
needs to like that's obviouslywhy we've got an award for it.
Like, it needs to be somethingthat gets spoken about because
ultimately, for you to have asuccessful business, like you
you have to be good atcollaboration, you've got to be

(52:41):
building partnerships withclients, designers, architects,
engineers, like there's so manypeople involved.
Um, and yeah, systemization likeit takes a lot of work to
systemise a business.
So yeah, you put in the effort,mate, and you um like you're
obviously seeing the rewardsfrom systemising your business,
so mate, you deserve the awards.

SPEAKER_01 (53:02):
So yeah, no, I was I was super rapped.
I was to be honest, I couldn'tsleep that night.
I got back to the hotel room.
I just like didn't want to goout drinking or anything, so I
just went to bed, but I was justlike I was pretty rattled by the
whole thing.
I just it was awesome.
I really, yeah, really loved it.
And I mean that that room, movieworld, the whole scene was just

(53:22):
epic.
But that there's so manybuilders in that group who like
I certainly look up to everyonein that group, and I've learned
so much from everyone there, soit's just awesome.

SPEAKER_00 (53:33):
No, well it's well deserved, mates.
But um, yeah, so where to now?
What's what's your goals withhaiku?
You just like you you want toyou're working on the healthy
home stuff, just getting betterat the same time.

SPEAKER_01 (53:43):
Yeah, so we're I mean we're working on I'd like
to bring more of a more of aservice to our pack process with
the healthy home.
I think healthy homes is tricky,like it's a longer education
process, um, and there's it's soin-depth, like how far you want
to go down that um that road.
So we're I'm working with Lauraat the moment, we're trying to

(54:05):
bring together something wherewe can use that in the PAC
process to sort of educate ourclients more.
Um, but we're we've got to dothat really early because
there's there's a lot in that.
Um and so for us it's it'srefining that pack process and
working more on that.
We've done really good jobs forexactly the type of clients that

(54:26):
we want to work for, and I'mreally proud and happy that
we've got such a good clientbase.
Um for us now, it's moving intothe type of jobs we want to do
and focusing more on thathealthy home side of things.
So uh passive house as well,we'd love to, we'd love to get
one of those under our hat.

(54:47):
But um for us I think thehealthy home thing for us is is
huge.
So um we're also looking at Iwant to systemise more of the
on-site stuff at the moment.
So we did a lot of work on ouroffice side of things, um, and
so bringing that to our team andbringing that systemization on

(55:07):
site, um, that's what's next forthe for the next 12 months for
sure.

SPEAKER_00 (55:11):
How do you think you can systemise it on site?
Like a lot of people think it'simpossible.

SPEAKER_01 (55:17):
But we we both I think just I think just keeping
it simple, like I I can gopretty overboard with
everything.
Like, and once I jump intosomething, I'm like, yeah, we'll
do everything.
And but I gotta kind of rein itback, and I think making it
simple is is the key.
So we have like we have thesystems for our on-site team,

(55:39):
but we're actually bringing justchecklists in now.
So just having them more as achecklist and following those
systems and having the system asa visual.
Um, but just using smallerchecklists and having them front
of mind where they where theyneed to be done and when they
need to be done.

SPEAKER_00 (55:56):
Yeah.
Um and how do you go aboutgetting your team to follow
those systems?

SPEAKER_01 (56:01):
Oh, look, like we've um the main ones we've used,
basically like pre-plasterchecklists for insulation, all
that sort of stuff,waterproofing, um, framing,
obviously, before the uminsulation comes, but they're
the key ones that we've thatwe've focused on because they're
like probably the mostimportant.

(56:21):
Yeah.
Um and from there, we're justgonna keep it simple and just
gradually build it out because Idon't want it to be this
overwhelmed thing that kind ofjust gets forgotten about then.
So I think keep it simple fornow and slowly introduce it.

SPEAKER_00 (56:37):
It's gotta be simple, hasn't it?
Like I know that's my motto inmy business.
Like, if it's if it's notsimple, I won't use it and my
team won't use it.
Yeah, um, before we wrap it up,like for listeners out there
listening to this, it might bein a tough spot, business maybe
isn't going to plan, life mightbe a little bit hard.
Like, what what advice could yougive them?

SPEAKER_01 (56:58):
Uh I think I think for one to be be teachable, like
be willing to learn from yourmistakes, learn from other
people, um not just sort of goit on your own like a bull out
of gate and you know, think youknow everything, because there's
just there's so much that all ofus don't know.

(57:21):
Um and also not to shy away fromthe data and the hard work
because I think it's very easyto hide in the shrubs and hide
in the things that you think youshould be doing when you know
deep down where you should befocusing and fronting up to the
issues that you're having.
So yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (57:40):
Um couple more.
I keep thinking about like Ishould have made some more notes
for yours, but um what do youdo, mate, to get to chill out?
Like you've you've already saidyou love work, you you work a
hole at you get into it.

SPEAKER_01 (57:51):
But like what do you do to uh nature for me?
Um like I'm huge on just gettingin getting back into nature.
Like I used to when I was young,did a lot of hiking, um, a lot
of overnight hikes and stufflike that.
For me, it just grounds us andbrings us back going camping
with our kids.

(58:11):
Um we live sort of on the bush,so it's like next to the
national parks and stuff.
So even if it's just a walk withthe family on in through the
bush or a mountain bike ride,but we do a lot of camping and
stuff for us, and that's for me,that's that's where I de-stress.

SPEAKER_00 (58:31):
Yeah, it's important to get time for yourself, isn't
it?
Yeah.
And with with kids and partnerand stuff.
But do you take time out foryourself?
I do, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (58:39):
I think I do pretty good with that.
Um I think I do pretty good withthat.
Like I'm I don't I don't keepsuper busy, like when I'm not at
work, I'm with my family, andthat's it.
I don't I don't find the need tobe going to all these different
events and things to just justkeep it simple and that's where
I want to be, you know?
Yeah, it's a happy place.
Happy place.

(58:59):
Come home and cuddle a chickenand everything's all good.

SPEAKER_00 (59:05):
Um mate, last one before we wrap it up.
Um I want to ask you.
So I'm I'm assuming yourrelationship with your old boy
is really really good, but uhhow's he go with seeing how
you're doing things now in yourbusiness compared to what he's
doing in his business?

SPEAKER_01 (59:22):
Oh, I mean, I don't think we've really spoken about
it, but I think he's I like Iknow he's proud of you know what
I've done, but um uh yeah, he'sstill he's still doing his
thing, he's still building.
So um, yeah, I think it's goodto to see, not like um, I guess
I don't know to be to be short.

(59:42):
Are you in the same area?
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
We're in the same area, yeah.
So is it um have we got astandard father and son
relationship, you know?
We keep it all very shallow.

SPEAKER_00 (59:53):
So, what's gonna happen the day you get a set of
drones across your desk thatyour old man's pricing it as
well?

SPEAKER_01 (59:58):
Like, we don't do tenders, mate.

SPEAKER_00 (01:00:01):
Very good, very good.
No, mate, look, it's been apleasure having you on.
I um I really appreciate youtaking the time out to come up
here and and have a chat.
Um, is there anything you wantto get out before we wrap it up?
Uh you've done well, mate.
I've got a question.

SPEAKER_01 (01:00:16):
I've got a question.
Yeah.
Um, so with you with yourbusinesses and everything you've
got going on, how do you becauseI see the way you run
everything, right?
And the way you've got so muchgood time with your family as
well and your girls, like how doyou manage your time that well?

SPEAKER_00 (01:00:36):
Well, you mentioned uh a book before called The Gap
and the Gain.
Yeah.
Um he's got another really goodbook called Who Not How.
Yeah.
Have you read that?
I think I have, yeah, yeah.
Yeah.
I I've actually only listened tothat book uh recently, but I've
been doing that for 10 years.
Yeah.
Like I don't I used to get soworked up about trying to figure

(01:01:02):
out the how that I would losesleep.
Oh and I like I wouldn't achievewhat I wanted to achieve because
I just get so lost in how am Igonna do it.

SPEAKER_02 (01:01:12):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (01:01:12):
Um as soon as I changed it to who's gonna help
me, yeah, like instead of how amI gonna do it, mate.
My everything just started, andI and I'm I feel in the last two
years that I've just grown andgrown and grown that.
So the first question I askednow with every single idea I
have is like who's gonna helpme?
Um and so that's how I get mytime.

(01:01:33):
And one thing that I I reallyvalue my time, I think this is
an another really importantthing.
I I really believe that truefreedom, uh, and everyone's got
different views on freedom, um,but you can't have freedom
without wealth, because wealthis what's going to give you the
freedom, and like they go handin hand.

(01:01:54):
And I really think once you onceyou truly value your time and
you guard it like a temple, umeverything else just start like
the the wealth comes.
Um so yeah, my thing is I'malways finding who can help me
get reach my goals rather thanme trying to bust my ass doing
myself.
And I talk I've talked about alot, like across my businesses,

(01:02:15):
I don't like Live Life Builds,you're an incredible team.
Um, my building business is.
Got an amazing team.
Like between my supervisors andmy carpenters and team on site,
like most importantly, myamazing wife in the office.
Um, Sharon, our accountsmanager.
We got we've got multiple VAsnow.
Yeah.
Um, like Shay does recording ofthe podcast.

(01:02:37):
We've got a really good producernow.
Like, I yeah, I just I figureout who's gonna help me get to
where it is, and I don't put adollar value on it.
Like that's another thing thatreally used to hold me back and
and and take my time away frommy family.
Was I would get so like I wouldget a price for someone to help
me, yeah.
Like whatever, could like couldhave been whatever, lawyer,

(01:02:58):
accountant, could have beenwhatever.
And I'd go, fuck that.
You're not paying that muchmoney.
Yeah, and then I would be theidiot up till all hours of the
night or weekends trying to dothat work.
Yeah, and it back then I was sorather than being I was so
focused on the dollar valueinstead of the time, and like I

(01:03:20):
was wasting my time because thatthat took all my time away from
my family.
Yeah, um, yeah.
So I I pay more money now forpeople to help me than I ever
thought I would.
Like best accountants, bestlawyers, best solicitors, best
team members.
Um like yeah, and so you've gotto weigh up you've got to weigh

(01:03:44):
up the value.
Like what you paying a cost tohave that person help you, what
value is that adding to you?
And to me, the value is they'regonna get the job done probably
better than I would because theyknow what they're doing.
So I'm getting the value of themdoing it in a timely manner, but
I'm also getting the value of Iget to spend time with people

(01:04:07):
all enjoying what I want to do.
Yeah.
So yeah, who not how, mate.
Love it, love it.
Yeah, if I'd highly recommendthat book for anyone that hasn't
listened to it.
It's it's a game changer.
Yeah.
Awesome.
All good, thank you.
Well, mate, appreciate youcoming up.
Um, look, guys, as usual, makesure you like, subscribe,
comment.

(01:04:27):
Um, let us know what you want usto talk about on the podcast.
Let us know if you're out thereand you want to be a guest on
the podcast.
If you haven't been to theDuanePears.com website yet and
purchase the merchandise to geton board with the level up
movement, make sure you do.
And uh, we look forward toseeing you on the next podcast.
Help us continue making thisAustralia's number one podcast,
and uh we'll see you on the nextone.

(01:04:48):
All right, guys, I want tointroduce you to a really
exciting new product that Ibelieve is going to play a
massive role in Australiabuilding healthier homes.
As you all know, I am extremelypassionate about healthy homes,
and I'm doing a lot of researchand putting a lot of time and
effort into making sure myconstruction business is leading
the way when it comes tobuilding healthy homes here in

(01:05:10):
Australia.
We've teamed up with the guysfrom Highwood Timber.
Highwood Timber are pioneeringcondensation management with
their high flow ventilated LVLbaton system.
High flow battons give buildersa stronger, straighter, and
smarter way to create aventilated cavity behind
cladding and underneath roofswithout compromising on

(01:05:31):
structural performance.
While tackling condensation toimprove building health and ease
of insulation, highwood battonsare built to perform.
When it comes to dealing withcondensation and ventilation,
high flow batttons will help youcreate continuous ventilated
cavities behind all yourcladding and underneath your
roof sheeting.
They reduce condensation riskand support healthier, longer

(01:05:54):
lasting buildings.
Highwood timber battons are alsoin alignment with the proposed
NCC condensation managementrequirements as well as passive
house ventilation requirements.
Being an engineered LVL product,they are stronger, straighter,
and more dimensionally stablethan a solid material such as
pine.
This helps resist warping,twisting, and shrinkage,

(01:06:15):
ensuring more consistentinstalls less prone to splitting
than solid timber.
Howwood timber batons areprecisely manufactured, meaning
that your installation will befaster and easier than other
products on the market.
The part that I like the mostabout these battons are they are
H3 treated for long-termprotection against decay and
turmoiles.
They use a waterborne H3treatment which reduces

(01:06:38):
reactivity with membranes andadhesives when compared to LOSP.
These are the exact battens thatyou want to be using on your
homes and your builds if you areconsidering building healthier
homes or passive homes.
Check them out.