December 1, 2025 • 36 mins
Are you stuck in a “cost” mindset, always worrying about hourly rates and the cheapest price? In this episode, we dive deep into why focusing on value—not just cost—can transform your construction business and your life. Join us as we explore: The pitfalls of chasing hourly rates How a value-driven mindset leads to better clients, higher profits, and less burnout Real-world examples from the building industry The importance of educating clients about quality and long-term value How to break free from old-school thinking and unlock new opportunities Whether you’re a builder, tradie, or anyone in the construction industry, this episode will challenge the way you think about money, work, and success.
Check out the Duayne Pearce website here...
https://duaynepearce.com/
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Episode Transcript
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SPEAKER_00 (02:50):
G'day guys, welcome back to another episode of Level
Up.
We are back in the shed thisafternoon for another cracking
episode.
Uh, look, today's episode isabout a topic that I've seen
coming up a lot um on not onlyon my social media but also in
the Builders Breakfast groupthat I run.
And this is about uh the cost ofthings and probably uh to the
(03:14):
point hourly rates of whatpeople are charging.
And so there's a there's a lotof there's a lot going on when
you uh questioning uh I guessrates of what people are
charging.
So I wanted to unpack it, put itout there for the universe, and
yeah, let's see what you thinkand uh what your opinion is of
it.
I'd love to know.
So uh shoot me the questions,shoot me some comments, and uh
(03:37):
we'll come back to you.
But um I think this is a is areally interesting topic because
I'm hearing a lot of talk at themoment, or probably over the
last actually, probably sinceCOVID, over the last sort of
three or four years.
This has been a hot topic aboutthe like how high the LE rates
are um that people are charging,um, how high the cost of
(04:00):
materials are.
Um and I just think back to I II used to be in that mindset
that it like it can't they can'tcharge that, that's too high,
they're ripping me off, or theythey're not worth that, or I
can't afford that, and all thesetypes of things.
I spent 10 to 15 years runningmy business with that old school
(04:24):
2x mentality.
Um, and if you're in a 10x, yourlife and your business, you
really need to change the waythat you think about money and
about how you can add value topeople.
So um, I've spoken about itbefore on the podcast.
A massive shift in my mindsetaround money uh and value uh was
(04:46):
after I read or listened to theaudible book, The Creature from
Jekyll Island.
Uh, it was recommended by uhRobert Kayosaki.
Uh I always get his last namewrong, but that's how I say it.
Um incredible book, and I'vesince recommended the book to a
lot of people, and uh they'veranked they've literally
messaged or called me and say,Fuck mate, I've I've listened to
(05:08):
two hours, three hours, fourhours.
That book's shit.
So like everything, you caneither take it or leave it.
If you um if you be open-mindedand you listen to things and you
take it in and you you sort ofimplement what things what
people are saying, um you mayhave some changes.
(05:28):
If you if you don't, if youignore it, if you are too
stubborn that you think it's allrubbish, then you're not gonna
have change in your life withanything.
So um, but look, back to what Isee value in.
If someone like seeing value ineverything in life has really
(05:48):
changed the way that I dobusiness.
Um I'm got I've got a I've got asituation going on at the moment
in my life where I see a certainvalue and someone else sees a
completely different value.
Um, my value is based on like mytime and what I will get out of
(06:10):
it if I follow through with it.
Their value is all on trying toget the highest dollar value
with as little work as possible.
So I'm not I can't go into toomany details on that, but
anyway, it's um what I'm gettingat is everybody sees different
levels of value in everything,and it's funny because the more
(06:35):
I'm aware of this now and andmore open-minded and and how
I've changed my mindset aroundthis, I see how this really
holds people back.
Like money is a is a funnything, eh?
Like, we're just we're nottaught enough about it at
school.
Um, and because of that, it'sit's really interesting seeing
(06:56):
how different people value uhmoney.
I know this this podcast mightseem like it's going around in a
circle a little bit, but I thinkit's important to talk about all
this stuff because it's it'sreally, really interesting.
And so I I I've got so manyopinions on this and views on
this and all types of things,but like when I say people see
different values in things, likeI I've got a very high I'm not
(07:23):
even sure on the wording for it,but I guess to go backwards, I I
see so many people that seevalue in quick hits.
So they whinge and bitch all thetime that they've got no money,
they can't afford to pay theirbills, living's too expensive,
they're not getting paid enough,all these types of things, and
yet they'll buy a carton of abooze, they'll buy a packet of
(07:45):
smokes, or they'll vape.
They think vaping's okay becauseit's cheaper than smoking.
Like um, they'll go to the shopevery morning and buy bloody
icebreaks or Vs or any of thosehigh-energy drinks or coke, and
so they they see a lot of valuein that shit.
Like, I call that shit.
Like, I don't um to me that theysee what they see value in is
(08:12):
affecting the value of theirentire life.
So because they see value inthose shitty things, they're
spending their money on itinstead of keeping that money
and investing that money in inbetter things, I would rather
like go without and never drink,never buy a drink from a shop at
(08:32):
all.
Like we drink we get water outof the tap for free.
So um well, you pay water rates,obviously, but um that I'm just
using that as an example.
Like, I don't see value inbuying, well, number one, buying
drinks to start with, but numbertwo, I definitely don't see
value in buying shit and fillingmy body with shit.
So, and so because of that, Isee value in looking after
(08:57):
myself and being healthy so thatI can do more with my life.
Um, like a lot of that stuff,it's the same with with social
media and stuff.
Like a lot of people see valuein just flicking and flicking
and flicking and spending likebefore they know it, wasting
hours on shit.
Whereas I see value in my time.
(09:19):
Like, I don't want to waste timeon social media because I value
my time and I want to spend thattime with my with my kids, with
my wife, with my with my dog.
Like um again, it's just anotherit's another different opinion
on value.
Um but what I'm getting at withthis is like coming back to
hourly rates and things, uhthere's a lot of like everyone's
(09:42):
the cost of building is gettingexpensive.
That that's it's as simple asthat.
And reality is the cost ofconstruction has increased in
cost since the since Noah's Arkwas built.
Since Noah built the Ark,construction and and it can it
will continue to increase untilas long as there is any
construction work being done.
That is just reality.
(10:02):
Um, everything in life goes upin cost.
That you you you will never itwill never come backwards, you
will never slow it down, you'llnever change it.
That's just life.
As the world grows, as thepopulation grows, things have to
increase in price to stimulatethe economy and all those types
of things.
So um, but all I'm like I'mliterally sick and tired of just
(10:29):
hearing everybody whinging andbitching about it.
And so part of that conversationis people are talking about
hourly rates, and um, I've gotto pay my carpenters$50 an hour,
I've got to pay my carpenters$70an hour, I've got to pay my
plumber$120 an hour.
Like, and look, I I know there'sgonna be some of my mates and
builders I know listening tothis, and look, it's no offense
(10:52):
to you, but if you're in the themindset that I'm talking about
today, you've got to shiftbecause I used to be in the
mindset that whinged and bitchedand complained about everything,
and I've talked about it a loton the podcast.
Like I I live my life now, I Ipay for what I see value in.
(11:12):
So let's talk about employees,for example.
If if a carpenter comes to meand wants to pay, like I'll I'd
say I'd make it very clear to mycarpenters, like I will pay, and
and this isn't just carpenters,this is trades as well.
I will pay you whatever you wantif you're adding me three times
that in value.
(11:33):
Because that's how businessworks.
If if I've got to pay someone$100, I need to, they need to
add$300 worth of value to mybusiness for my business to be
sustainable.
Um, by the time you cover allyour overheads, running costs,
and just how business works,taxes and those types of things.
It's three, it's generally threeX.
That's a basic rule.
So if you want to get paid$100an hour, do you add$300 an hour
(12:00):
value to my business?
And look, in a lot of instances,that the answer is going to be
no.
But in some instances, therethat the answer will be yes.
Like there is people out therethat would 3x the value to my
business.
And if that's the case and theyadd that amount of value, and my
business can be sustainable,profitable, and operate long
(12:23):
term, then I'll pay them thatbecause that's how the world
works.
The reason that people whingeand bitch and complain about
what people are charging isbecause those people aren't
adding that value to them ortheir business.
It's as simple as that.
So the other side of this is youshouldn't be operating on hourly
(12:46):
rates in business.
Early rates is a 2x mindset.
If you have if you want to 10xyour life, your business, if you
need a 10x mindset.
You need to you need to pricethings up correctly.
Um I truly believe that peoplethat are operating on hourly
rates have a 2x mindset.
They they they see value intheir time instead of value in
(13:10):
what they put out and what theyadd.
Um and this is this is really,really important stuff.
Like, if you can get your headaround this, it will change your
life because it did mine.
I was I was that person.
Like, to give you a fewexamples, like I was a guy when
I finished my apprenticeship.
So to go back a bit, um, Ifinished my apprenticeship, I
(13:31):
went and worked for my old boydoing some painting for about 12
months, 18 months maybe.
Uh, and then I got offered arole to do some subcontracting
work for a large developer herein Brisbane.
And at the time, so I was on$25an hour.
I finished my time, had atrawler full of tools, planks,
(13:52):
trestles.
I I had a lot of gear, and I wason$25 an hour.
And people complain to me nowthat they they can't have all
the tools, they can't afford allthe tools, and they're on$50 and
60 bucks an hour.
Um, and I thought it wasfantastic.
Like, I I think before that I'dbeen on$21 an hour, and so in my
head, I I saw the value in mythe hours that I did, and so I
(14:18):
used to do the maths.
I was like, man, like$25 anhour.
If I do four hours, that's ahundred dollars.
Like every day, if I do eighthours, I'm gonna get two hundred
dollars.
And and then I was like, shit,like if I do 10 hours, if I do
two extra hours a day, that's anextra 50 bucks.
Like, so I was always doing themath, thinking about the
numbers, but it was all justbased on the hours that I could
(14:40):
work.
And look, reality is it doesn'tmatter, it does not matter what
your hourly rate is.
When whether it's$25 or$2,500 anhour, you are capping yourself.
You can never earn more than thehours you can work.
And this is how people burn outbecause everything is about the
hours they work instead of thevalue that they add.
(15:03):
And this is why I'm a massivebeliever now that all employees
should be on agreed salaries orwages, because a wage and a
salary is a lot easier to earnmore money because it can all be
but it's all based on the valuethat you add to a business.
Anyway, that's another story.
But when you are basingeverything on the hours that you
(15:26):
work, like I said, it's thereason a lot of people in the
industry burn out because theywant to earn more money.
The only way they can earn moremoney is by doing more hours,
and that's not sustainable.
You you can't operate like that.
And yes, look, you might be ableto earn a hundred bucks an hour,
and through that and the hoursyou do, you might be able to
earn a hundred, hundred andfifty grand a year, and that's
(15:48):
that's good money.
Like if you're sensible withyour money, you don't live
beyond your means, like that isfucking awesome money.
But if you want to 10x your lifeand your business and everything
around you, the only way you cando that is by adding more value
and charging for your value, notcharging for your time.
(16:09):
And again, the reason I wantedto talk about this today on the
podcast is I think this issomething that we're like, we're
not taught this shit at school.
I've been saying a lot on mypodcast lately, like we are not
sure taught what we need to betaught at school because if you
were taught this, everyone wouldget on board with this and
everyone would figure out howthey can add value to people.
(16:30):
So um, look, for all tradies,builders, anybody in the
construction industry that's outthere, if you're focused on what
you can charge per hour, you'restuck in a 2x mindset.
You need to you need to move onaway from that.
Um the other thing with hourlyrates is hourly rates, you open
(16:52):
yourself up for a lot ofconflict um and a lot of
questioning by people.
Because, especially builders,like I know so many builders
that um operate their businesseswith cost plus contracts.
Uh, I know a lot of tradies thatoperate their businesses by just
charging for the hours theycharge.
If if you are charging workthrough hours, you're really
(17:17):
leaving yourself completely openfor a lot of problems, a lot of
arguments, and a lot of conflictbecause it's very easy for
people to question the hoursyou've done, especially if
you're doing work on a on a sitewhere the client lives or um is
aware of when you start andfinish and those types of things
because they'll be tracking yourhours.
Like um, believe me, like youmight not think they are, but
(17:40):
people will be taking notice.
They'll be they'll glance overwhen they see you walk onto
site, they'll glance over whenthey see you leave, like in
they'll have it in their mind,oh, that was around 3.30 or
whatever.
Um, but it's just a horrible wayto do things, and it and it,
like I said, it opens yourselfup for a lot of um a lot of
conflict, but it reallyrestricts what you can earn.
(18:00):
So, like in in my buildingbusiness, we avoid hourly rate
at all cost.
Um yes, I am very big onunderstanding the true costs of
all my employees and myself, andin our contract documents, we do
have all the hourly rates listedout for uh admin time,
accounting time, projectmanagement time, supervision
(18:21):
time, my time, carpenter's time,apprentices time.
That's there in case the veryrare occasion that there is some
form of work that we have to doon early rate.
And um, we make it very clear toour clients that if something
comes up that we can't price forwhatever reason, there may be a
(18:45):
very small amount of that workthat will get done on early
rate.
Once we have the information weneed, we'll provide you a quote
to finish that work.
And um, as an example, where wewould use that, if we're doing
earthworks on a project and wecome across uh a buried grease
trap or asbestos buried in theground or unlike ground
(19:06):
conditions that weren'tpredicted, we will charge an
hourly rate to resolve or get tothe bottom of the problem, or
get enough, like I said, getenough information, or or get
another consultant out to side,or an engineer, or someone that
can give us more information sothat then we can put a price on
the rest of the rectificationwork.
(19:26):
Um as I said, we'll we avoidhourly rate at all costs because
it's it's too open-ended, uh, itopens you you up for, like I
said, conflict and argument.
And look, let's be honest,people you don't make money at
hourly rate.
Like it's as simple as that.
Like I know some people thatcharge big hourly rates, like
(19:47):
they're very professional,they're very good at their job,
and they have two, two and ahalf, three thousand dollar
hourly rates.
Because the task and the workthat they do quite often only
takes an hour or sometimes two.
And that sounds fantastic, butnine times out of ten, it they
could they might get one job aweek or one job a fortnight or
(21:07):
one job a month.
So even though it sounds reallygood, it's actually fucking shit
because when you add it up overa financial year, they've earned
fuck all money.
So um, but when you talk tothem, they come, they think it's
really powerful, they think it'sgreat, like they're they're on
$3,000 an hour.
And I pull them up all the time.
Like I find this.
Um there's a few trades outthere that I um I'll pick on for
(21:31):
this one.
Like, I uh over my time on thetools, um concreters used to be
the worst for this, like theywere always chasing a high early
rate or a higher day rate, andthey would like I I I had mates
that would would do work for me,and they would drop me at the
like as at the flick of a switchbecause someone else had offered
(21:54):
them more a higher day rate orearly rate or whatever.
Um, and in the end, I got theshits with it, and I just I
completely avoided them.
I'd I stopped using them, I evenstopped talking to them because
again, they put so much value,they saw so much value on the
hourly rate or the day rate theywere getting instead of seeing
value in what they earn over afinancial year.
(22:17):
So, and I found from that, andit still stands true to this
day, people that chase higherhourly rates, higher day rates,
or are always chasing an extradollar will always be less
better off because they spendmore time out of work than they
do actually earning money, yetthey can't see through it, and
(22:40):
so they think, oh fuck yeah, I'mgetting like a carpenter, yeah,
I'm getting 80 bucks an hour.
Like that's fucking awesome.
Like, I'm not working for youbecause you're only paying$60 an
hour.
They go and do the$80 an hour,but they only get the eight,
like over a 12-month period,they get four months work, and
they spend the other eightmonths doing a day here and
(23:01):
there or a bit here and there,and over a financial year they
only earn$60,000.
Whereas if they had gone on the$60 an hour, had full-time work
over a financial year withovertime and things, they
probably would earn$100,$120,000a year.
So I hope this is sinking in, Ihope this is getting across to
(23:21):
you, but it's it's reallyimportant to understand what you
see value in because if you seevalue in an hourly rate or a day
rate, you're definitely stuck inthat 2x mindset, and you're not
gonna have growth, you're notgonna excel in life until you
get out of that 2x mindset andyou get into a 10x mindset where
you see value in what youdeliver.
(23:44):
And this is what I want tofinish, I'll finish this podcast
up talking about this becausepeople want value.
And so the whole buildingindustry is focused on price and
being the cheapest.
Whether that's the cheapestbuilder, whether it's um the
cheapest contractor, whetherit's the cheapest supplier,
(24:06):
everything is focused on beingthe cheapest, which is leading
to very poor, or delivering verypoor products, very poor
building, finished buildings toclients.
Uh, it's resulting in very lowstandards, uh, very low quality
of work.
Uh it's even leading to, Ibelieve, a big reason why
(24:28):
there's a lot of depression andsuicide and and anxiety in our
industry.
Because when you're working likethat and you're racing to the
bottom, it is putting you underenormous pressure.
Because the only way that youcan make money is to cut corners
or to run around like a headlesschalk and try and get it done as
(24:50):
quickly as you fucking possiblycan, which is wearing you out.
And that is not a good way tooperate.
And look, there is always goingto be clients out there, people
out there, that are quite happyto accept a very poor quality,
low standard home because that'sall they can afford.
(25:13):
But I do believe if we all putmore time and energy into
educating our clients, if you'rea trade, educating the builders
you work for, um, if you're abuilder educating your clients,
uh, if suppliers educatingpeople that are buying your
products, if we spent more timeeducating and understanding the
(25:34):
importance of education andadding value to people, we will
lift the standard of buildingsgetting built in Australia, in
the world.
We will lift the quality ofproduct that is getting
delivered to our clients, butmost importantly, we will
(25:54):
deliver better quality orhealthier homes and healthier
buildings for people to live in,will increase the value in
people's life, um, will it willincrease the value in our homes.
Um, like there is so much thatwill come out of this.
And I guess to give you anexample, how I think, how my how
(26:18):
my brain thinks, and how Ioperate, if my Tyler, this is
this is pure example, this hasnever happened.
But if my Tyler was to go to hissupplier this afternoon and pick
up some materials for his work,and the guy at the tile shop
said, Hey mate, like we've gotthese fantastic new products in,
(26:39):
like um, we've got this newwaterproofing product, it is
great for the environment, it'sflexible, it's gonna solve this,
this, and this problem.
Um, it's like it's awesome.
Uh, but it does cost an extra$20a drum.
My toilet knows the type ofperson I am, so um he might
(27:03):
reach out to me and go, heyDuane, I was at my tile shop
yesterday, and I uh mysupplier's like told me about
this new product, he's given mea drum.
We're gonna we're I'm I'm reallykeen to try it out.
Would you be happy to use it onyour project?
Um, it does this, this, andthis, and it's gonna make things
more durable, it's gonna makethings last longer.
(27:23):
Um like I would go, I would say,oh mate, have you have you got
the material safety data sheeton it?
Can I have a look into it?
Um do possibly can I go and talkto the supplier?
Like, I'd run through it.
But for me, if it's gonnaincrease the durability of my
projects, if it's gonna increasethe quality of what I'm
delivering to my clients, then Iwill consider it and I'll look
(27:48):
into it.
And if it does everything that'sthat it says it's going to do, I
will say to my toile, oh mate,like that new product that you
suggested, let's let's go forit, let's start making that our
standard on all of our projects.
So then when I'm doing my PACprocess, paid as a consultant
with all my clients, and I'mtalking them through every part
of the project.
When it comes to tiling, I'mgonna have a conversation with
(28:10):
them and I'm gonna explain tothem, hey, look, um, look, we've
been using these otherwaterproofing products for
years, and um over time we wehave had these couple of issues
with this, and we had thissituation, and we had to fix
that, and we did this, and butum look, we've we've got this
new product, I've done all myhomework on it, I've looked into
it, I've spoken to the supplier,I've spoken to some people that
that use it, I've I've runthrough it with my Tyler.
(28:33):
Um look, it is a little bit moreexpensive, but I believe if we
use it, it's going to do this,this, and this.
Um, then I've I've added valueto my client.
And I say this all the time (28:43):
if if you've got clients that are
questioning what you'recharging, whether you're a
tradier or a builder, there's noquestions about it, you're
attracting the wrong clients.
So if you're a trade working fora builder and the builder's
constantly questioning yourpricing, you're either working
for the wrong builder or you'renot educating the builder enough
(29:08):
on how you do things and theproducts you use.
If you're a builder that isworking for clients that are or
constantly getting clients thatare questioning your pricing
because they're getting pricingfrom other builders and they
they think you're too expensive,you're what you're attracting
the wrong types of clients.
You're either attracting thewrong types of clients or, and
(29:30):
this is the more common one,you're not spending enough time
educating them on why you costwhat you cost.
Like you're so focused on thedollar value, instead of
educating your clients on what'sin your proposal and why it is
better.
Um, and so in that back to thatsituation with the Tyler, I do
(29:51):
that for every single aspect,every single material, every
single part of our builds.
Uh, we have very high standardsin my building business.
We have there is products thatwe will, if a client chooses or
says to us, hey, we we don'twant to pay for that or we don't
want to use it, we will walkaway from the job because we're
(30:11):
not willing to lower ourstandards on things that we know
will either cause the businessor myself problems, financial
problems, or some sort ofproblems in the future.
Um or even higher priority thanthat, that will lower the
durability and the lifespan ofthe buildings that we're
(30:35):
building.
Because for me, that is theultimate sustainability that
we're building buildings thatare going to last the test of
times because we're doing thingsthat are more durable.
So um, yeah, look, so that thatto me that's a really good
example of um of your mindsetwhen it comes to value and what
you see value in.
If um, if you're if back to thatexample, if you were the tile
(30:57):
that goes to the supplier thisafternoon and the tile shows you
this, the the supplier shows youthis new product, and straight
away you're like, fuck mate, I'mnot interested in that.
I I can't even get work withwhat I'm using at the moment,
and it's cheaper.
Like I if I if I buy moreexpensive product, I'm gonna get
even less work because I can'tcharge anymore.
That is a 2x old school mindsetmentality that is going to keep
(31:20):
you stuck, that is going to keepyou struggling, that is going to
stop you from earning the moneythat you should be earning.
Um people see value in alldifferent things, and like
seriously, as tradies, asbuilders, please.
I encourage you to spend moretime educating the people that
you're selling your services to.
(31:42):
Um just completely take the thecost, the dollar conversations
out of it, and just purely focuson educating your clients on
where you add value.
Um, whether you're a plumber ora plaster or a tile or a
bricklayer, a block layer, aconcreter, electrician, I don't
care what you are, abalustrading guy, a pool
(32:04):
building guy.
Uh if you're not adding value toyour clients, if you're not
educating, if you're noteducating your clients and
showing them how that how youare adding value to their
project, you're you're wastingyour time.
You're you're going toconstantly be working with
people that will question whatyou're charging, will question
(32:26):
your invoices, will try and comeup with excuses not to pay you
what you should be paid or whatyou've invoiced for.
And you're really just creatingyour own problems.
Um, I haven't said it for awhile on the podcast, but you
all know, like one of my bestsayings is Grant Cadone saying,
nothing happens to you,everything happens because of
you.
This is a perfect example ofthat.
(32:48):
So um guys, I'll wrap this oneup.
But look, if you've gotquestions, if you're um if you
don't quite get what I'm talkingabout, like there is so many
books out there that talk aboutthis sort of stuff.
Um uh like I said, the thecreature from Jekyll Island, um
the richest man in Babylon, likeall those stories, uh all those
books all come back to how yousee value and what you see value
(33:12):
in.
So spend some time, uh, listento Audible books, listen to some
podcasts.
But this is a really importantuh, I guess, subject or topic to
be more open minded about.
Um, stop living your life aroundmentalities and mindsets about
that you've grown up with orthat you've been told or that
you believe in, and uh get a bitmore open minded about it
(33:34):
because it's powerful stuff.
Like when you change your yourmindset on what you see value
in, it's it's really, reallypowerful.
Um And I've seen how quickly itcan change the growth in
people's personal wealth, thegrowth in their business, all
those types of things.
So as usual, guys, like, share,subscribe, all those things.
(33:55):
Please share this podcast withevery other person in the
construction industry so that wecan continue to create a new
building industry and make thisAustralia's number one
construction podcast.
Go to the DwaynePears.comwebsite, grab your merch, get
behind us, support us.
Love you guys.
Thanks so much for watching orlistening, and we'll see you on
(34:15):
the next one.
All right, guys, I want tointroduce you to a really
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As you all know, I am extremelypassionate about healthy homes,
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(34:37):
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(34:59):
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When it comes to dealing withcondensation and ventilation,
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(35:22):
lasting buildings.
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(35:43):
ensuring more consistentinstalls less prone to splitting
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The part that I like the mostabout these battens are they are
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(36:06):
reactivity with membranes andadhesives when compared to LOSP.
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Check them out, Howard TimberProducts.
G'day guys, welcome back to another episode of Level
Up.
We are back in the shed thisafternoon for another cracking
episode.
Uh, look, today's episode isabout a topic that I've seen
coming up a lot um on not onlyon my social media but also in
the Builders Breakfast groupthat I run.
And this is about uh the cost ofthings and probably uh to the
(03:14):
point hourly rates of whatpeople are charging.
And so there's a there's a lotof there's a lot going on when
you uh questioning uh I guessrates of what people are
charging.
So I wanted to unpack it, put itout there for the universe, and
yeah, let's see what you thinkand uh what your opinion is of
it.
I'd love to know.
So uh shoot me the questions,shoot me some comments, and uh
(03:37):
we'll come back to you.
But um I think this is a is areally interesting topic because
I'm hearing a lot of talk at themoment, or probably over the
last actually, probably sinceCOVID, over the last sort of
three or four years.
This has been a hot topic aboutthe like how high the LE rates
are um that people are charging,um, how high the cost of
(04:00):
materials are.
Um and I just think back to I II used to be in that mindset
that it like it can't they can'tcharge that, that's too high,
they're ripping me off, or theythey're not worth that, or I
can't afford that, and all thesetypes of things.
I spent 10 to 15 years runningmy business with that old school
(04:24):
2x mentality.
Um, and if you're in a 10x, yourlife and your business, you
really need to change the waythat you think about money and
about how you can add value topeople.
So um, I've spoken about itbefore on the podcast.
A massive shift in my mindsetaround money uh and value uh was
(04:46):
after I read or listened to theaudible book, The Creature from
Jekyll Island.
Uh, it was recommended by uhRobert Kayosaki.
Uh I always get his last namewrong, but that's how I say it.
Um incredible book, and I'vesince recommended the book to a
lot of people, and uh they'veranked they've literally
messaged or called me and say,Fuck mate, I've I've listened to
(05:08):
two hours, three hours, fourhours.
That book's shit.
So like everything, you caneither take it or leave it.
If you um if you be open-mindedand you listen to things and you
take it in and you you sort ofimplement what things what
people are saying, um you mayhave some changes.
(05:28):
If you if you don't, if youignore it, if you are too
stubborn that you think it's allrubbish, then you're not gonna
have change in your life withanything.
So um, but look, back to what Isee value in.
If someone like seeing value ineverything in life has really
(05:48):
changed the way that I dobusiness.
Um I'm got I've got a I've got asituation going on at the moment
in my life where I see a certainvalue and someone else sees a
completely different value.
Um, my value is based on like mytime and what I will get out of
(06:10):
it if I follow through with it.
Their value is all on trying toget the highest dollar value
with as little work as possible.
So I'm not I can't go into toomany details on that, but
anyway, it's um what I'm gettingat is everybody sees different
levels of value in everything,and it's funny because the more
(06:35):
I'm aware of this now and andmore open-minded and and how
I've changed my mindset aroundthis, I see how this really
holds people back.
Like money is a is a funnything, eh?
Like, we're just we're nottaught enough about it at
school.
Um, and because of that, it'sit's really interesting seeing
(06:56):
how different people value uhmoney.
I know this this podcast mightseem like it's going around in a
circle a little bit, but I thinkit's important to talk about all
this stuff because it's it'sreally, really interesting.
And so I I I've got so manyopinions on this and views on
this and all types of things,but like when I say people see
different values in things, likeI I've got a very high I'm not
(07:23):
even sure on the wording for it,but I guess to go backwards, I I
see so many people that seevalue in quick hits.
So they whinge and bitch all thetime that they've got no money,
they can't afford to pay theirbills, living's too expensive,
they're not getting paid enough,all these types of things, and
yet they'll buy a carton of abooze, they'll buy a packet of
(07:45):
smokes, or they'll vape.
They think vaping's okay becauseit's cheaper than smoking.
Like um, they'll go to the shopevery morning and buy bloody
icebreaks or Vs or any of thosehigh-energy drinks or coke, and
so they they see a lot of valuein that shit.
Like, I call that shit.
Like, I don't um to me that theysee what they see value in is
(08:12):
affecting the value of theirentire life.
So because they see value inthose shitty things, they're
spending their money on itinstead of keeping that money
and investing that money in inbetter things, I would rather
like go without and never drink,never buy a drink from a shop at
(08:32):
all.
Like we drink we get water outof the tap for free.
So um well, you pay water rates,obviously, but um that I'm just
using that as an example.
Like, I don't see value inbuying, well, number one, buying
drinks to start with, but numbertwo, I definitely don't see
value in buying shit and fillingmy body with shit.
So, and so because of that, Isee value in looking after
(08:57):
myself and being healthy so thatI can do more with my life.
Um, like a lot of that stuff,it's the same with with social
media and stuff.
Like a lot of people see valuein just flicking and flicking
and flicking and spending likebefore they know it, wasting
hours on shit.
Whereas I see value in my time.
(09:19):
Like, I don't want to waste timeon social media because I value
my time and I want to spend thattime with my with my kids, with
my wife, with my with my dog.
Like um again, it's just anotherit's another different opinion
on value.
Um but what I'm getting at withthis is like coming back to
hourly rates and things, uhthere's a lot of like everyone's
(09:42):
the cost of building is gettingexpensive.
That that's it's as simple asthat.
And reality is the cost ofconstruction has increased in
cost since the since Noah's Arkwas built.
Since Noah built the Ark,construction and and it can it
will continue to increase untilas long as there is any
construction work being done.
That is just reality.
(10:02):
Um, everything in life goes upin cost.
That you you you will never itwill never come backwards, you
will never slow it down, you'llnever change it.
That's just life.
As the world grows, as thepopulation grows, things have to
increase in price to stimulatethe economy and all those types
of things.
So um, but all I'm like I'mliterally sick and tired of just
(10:29):
hearing everybody whinging andbitching about it.
And so part of that conversationis people are talking about
hourly rates, and um, I've gotto pay my carpenters$50 an hour,
I've got to pay my carpenters$70an hour, I've got to pay my
plumber$120 an hour.
Like, and look, I I know there'sgonna be some of my mates and
builders I know listening tothis, and look, it's no offense
(10:52):
to you, but if you're in the themindset that I'm talking about
today, you've got to shiftbecause I used to be in the
mindset that whinged and bitchedand complained about everything,
and I've talked about it a loton the podcast.
Like I I live my life now, I Ipay for what I see value in.
(11:12):
So let's talk about employees,for example.
If if a carpenter comes to meand wants to pay, like I'll I'd
say I'd make it very clear to mycarpenters, like I will pay, and
and this isn't just carpenters,this is trades as well.
I will pay you whatever you wantif you're adding me three times
that in value.
(11:33):
Because that's how businessworks.
If if I've got to pay someone$100, I need to, they need to
add$300 worth of value to mybusiness for my business to be
sustainable.
Um, by the time you cover allyour overheads, running costs,
and just how business works,taxes and those types of things.
It's three, it's generally threeX.
That's a basic rule.
So if you want to get paid$100an hour, do you add$300 an hour
(12:00):
value to my business?
And look, in a lot of instances,that the answer is going to be
no.
But in some instances, therethat the answer will be yes.
Like there is people out therethat would 3x the value to my
business.
And if that's the case and theyadd that amount of value, and my
business can be sustainable,profitable, and operate long
(12:23):
term, then I'll pay them thatbecause that's how the world
works.
The reason that people whingeand bitch and complain about
what people are charging isbecause those people aren't
adding that value to them ortheir business.
It's as simple as that.
So the other side of this is youshouldn't be operating on hourly
(12:46):
rates in business.
Early rates is a 2x mindset.
If you have if you want to 10xyour life, your business, if you
need a 10x mindset.
You need to you need to pricethings up correctly.
Um I truly believe that peoplethat are operating on hourly
rates have a 2x mindset.
They they they see value intheir time instead of value in
(13:10):
what they put out and what theyadd.
Um and this is this is really,really important stuff.
Like, if you can get your headaround this, it will change your
life because it did mine.
I was I was that person.
Like, to give you a fewexamples, like I was a guy when
I finished my apprenticeship.
So to go back a bit, um, Ifinished my apprenticeship, I
(13:31):
went and worked for my old boydoing some painting for about 12
months, 18 months maybe.
Uh, and then I got offered arole to do some subcontracting
work for a large developer herein Brisbane.
And at the time, so I was on$25an hour.
I finished my time, had atrawler full of tools, planks,
(13:52):
trestles.
I I had a lot of gear, and I wason$25 an hour.
And people complain to me nowthat they they can't have all
the tools, they can't afford allthe tools, and they're on$50 and
60 bucks an hour.
Um, and I thought it wasfantastic.
Like, I I think before that I'dbeen on$21 an hour, and so in my
head, I I saw the value in mythe hours that I did, and so I
(14:18):
used to do the maths.
I was like, man, like$25 anhour.
If I do four hours, that's ahundred dollars.
Like every day, if I do eighthours, I'm gonna get two hundred
dollars.
And and then I was like, shit,like if I do 10 hours, if I do
two extra hours a day, that's anextra 50 bucks.
Like, so I was always doing themath, thinking about the
numbers, but it was all justbased on the hours that I could
(14:40):
work.
And look, reality is it doesn'tmatter, it does not matter what
your hourly rate is.
When whether it's$25 or$2,500 anhour, you are capping yourself.
You can never earn more than thehours you can work.
And this is how people burn outbecause everything is about the
hours they work instead of thevalue that they add.
(15:03):
And this is why I'm a massivebeliever now that all employees
should be on agreed salaries orwages, because a wage and a
salary is a lot easier to earnmore money because it can all be
but it's all based on the valuethat you add to a business.
Anyway, that's another story.
But when you are basingeverything on the hours that you
(15:26):
work, like I said, it's thereason a lot of people in the
industry burn out because theywant to earn more money.
The only way they can earn moremoney is by doing more hours,
and that's not sustainable.
You you can't operate like that.
And yes, look, you might be ableto earn a hundred bucks an hour,
and through that and the hoursyou do, you might be able to
earn a hundred, hundred andfifty grand a year, and that's
(15:48):
that's good money.
Like if you're sensible withyour money, you don't live
beyond your means, like that isfucking awesome money.
But if you want to 10x your lifeand your business and everything
around you, the only way you cando that is by adding more value
and charging for your value, notcharging for your time.
(16:09):
And again, the reason I wantedto talk about this today on the
podcast is I think this issomething that we're like, we're
not taught this shit at school.
I've been saying a lot on mypodcast lately, like we are not
sure taught what we need to betaught at school because if you
were taught this, everyone wouldget on board with this and
everyone would figure out howthey can add value to people.
(16:30):
So um, look, for all tradies,builders, anybody in the
construction industry that's outthere, if you're focused on what
you can charge per hour, you'restuck in a 2x mindset.
You need to you need to move onaway from that.
Um the other thing with hourlyrates is hourly rates, you open
(16:52):
yourself up for a lot ofconflict um and a lot of
questioning by people.
Because, especially builders,like I know so many builders
that um operate their businesseswith cost plus contracts.
Uh, I know a lot of tradies thatoperate their businesses by just
charging for the hours theycharge.
If if you are charging workthrough hours, you're really
(17:17):
leaving yourself completely openfor a lot of problems, a lot of
arguments, and a lot of conflictbecause it's very easy for
people to question the hoursyou've done, especially if
you're doing work on a on a sitewhere the client lives or um is
aware of when you start andfinish and those types of things
because they'll be tracking yourhours.
Like um, believe me, like youmight not think they are, but
(17:40):
people will be taking notice.
They'll be they'll glance overwhen they see you walk onto
site, they'll glance over whenthey see you leave, like in
they'll have it in their mind,oh, that was around 3.30 or
whatever.
Um, but it's just a horrible wayto do things, and it and it,
like I said, it opens yourselfup for a lot of um a lot of
conflict, but it reallyrestricts what you can earn.
(18:00):
So, like in in my buildingbusiness, we avoid hourly rate
at all cost.
Um yes, I am very big onunderstanding the true costs of
all my employees and myself, andin our contract documents, we do
have all the hourly rates listedout for uh admin time,
accounting time, projectmanagement time, supervision
(18:21):
time, my time, carpenter's time,apprentices time.
That's there in case the veryrare occasion that there is some
form of work that we have to doon early rate.
And um, we make it very clear toour clients that if something
comes up that we can't price forwhatever reason, there may be a
(18:45):
very small amount of that workthat will get done on early
rate.
Once we have the information weneed, we'll provide you a quote
to finish that work.
And um, as an example, where wewould use that, if we're doing
earthworks on a project and wecome across uh a buried grease
trap or asbestos buried in theground or unlike ground
(19:06):
conditions that weren'tpredicted, we will charge an
hourly rate to resolve or get tothe bottom of the problem, or
get enough, like I said, getenough information, or or get
another consultant out to side,or an engineer, or someone that
can give us more information sothat then we can put a price on
the rest of the rectificationwork.
(19:26):
Um as I said, we'll we avoidhourly rate at all costs because
it's it's too open-ended, uh, itopens you you up for, like I
said, conflict and argument.
And look, let's be honest,people you don't make money at
hourly rate.
Like it's as simple as that.
Like I know some people thatcharge big hourly rates, like
(19:47):
they're very professional,they're very good at their job,
and they have two, two and ahalf, three thousand dollar
hourly rates.
Because the task and the workthat they do quite often only
takes an hour or sometimes two.
And that sounds fantastic, butnine times out of ten, it they
could they might get one job aweek or one job a fortnight or
(21:07):
one job a month.
So even though it sounds reallygood, it's actually fucking shit
because when you add it up overa financial year, they've earned
fuck all money.
So um, but when you talk tothem, they come, they think it's
really powerful, they think it'sgreat, like they're they're on
$3,000 an hour.
And I pull them up all the time.
Like I find this.
Um there's a few trades outthere that I um I'll pick on for
(21:31):
this one.
Like, I uh over my time on thetools, um concreters used to be
the worst for this, like theywere always chasing a high early
rate or a higher day rate, andthey would like I I I had mates
that would would do work for me,and they would drop me at the
like as at the flick of a switchbecause someone else had offered
(21:54):
them more a higher day rate orearly rate or whatever.
Um, and in the end, I got theshits with it, and I just I
completely avoided them.
I'd I stopped using them, I evenstopped talking to them because
again, they put so much value,they saw so much value on the
hourly rate or the day rate theywere getting instead of seeing
value in what they earn over afinancial year.
(22:17):
So, and I found from that, andit still stands true to this
day, people that chase higherhourly rates, higher day rates,
or are always chasing an extradollar will always be less
better off because they spendmore time out of work than they
do actually earning money, yetthey can't see through it, and
(22:40):
so they think, oh fuck yeah, I'mgetting like a carpenter, yeah,
I'm getting 80 bucks an hour.
Like that's fucking awesome.
Like, I'm not working for youbecause you're only paying$60 an
hour.
They go and do the$80 an hour,but they only get the eight,
like over a 12-month period,they get four months work, and
they spend the other eightmonths doing a day here and
(23:01):
there or a bit here and there,and over a financial year they
only earn$60,000.
Whereas if they had gone on the$60 an hour, had full-time work
over a financial year withovertime and things, they
probably would earn$100,$120,000a year.
So I hope this is sinking in, Ihope this is getting across to
(23:21):
you, but it's it's reallyimportant to understand what you
see value in because if you seevalue in an hourly rate or a day
rate, you're definitely stuck inthat 2x mindset, and you're not
gonna have growth, you're notgonna excel in life until you
get out of that 2x mindset andyou get into a 10x mindset where
you see value in what youdeliver.
(23:44):
And this is what I want tofinish, I'll finish this podcast
up talking about this becausepeople want value.
And so the whole buildingindustry is focused on price and
being the cheapest.
Whether that's the cheapestbuilder, whether it's um the
cheapest contractor, whetherit's the cheapest supplier,
(24:06):
everything is focused on beingthe cheapest, which is leading
to very poor, or delivering verypoor products, very poor
building, finished buildings toclients.
Uh, it's resulting in very lowstandards, uh, very low quality
of work.
Uh it's even leading to, Ibelieve, a big reason why
(24:28):
there's a lot of depression andsuicide and and anxiety in our
industry.
Because when you're working likethat and you're racing to the
bottom, it is putting you underenormous pressure.
Because the only way that youcan make money is to cut corners
or to run around like a headlesschalk and try and get it done as
(24:50):
quickly as you fucking possiblycan, which is wearing you out.
And that is not a good way tooperate.
And look, there is always goingto be clients out there, people
out there, that are quite happyto accept a very poor quality,
low standard home because that'sall they can afford.
(25:13):
But I do believe if we all putmore time and energy into
educating our clients, if you'rea trade, educating the builders
you work for, um, if you're abuilder educating your clients,
uh, if suppliers educatingpeople that are buying your
products, if we spent more timeeducating and understanding the
(25:34):
importance of education andadding value to people, we will
lift the standard of buildingsgetting built in Australia, in
the world.
We will lift the quality ofproduct that is getting
delivered to our clients, butmost importantly, we will
(25:54):
deliver better quality orhealthier homes and healthier
buildings for people to live in,will increase the value in
people's life, um, will it willincrease the value in our homes.
Um, like there is so much thatwill come out of this.
And I guess to give you anexample, how I think, how my how
(26:18):
my brain thinks, and how Ioperate, if my Tyler, this is
this is pure example, this hasnever happened.
But if my Tyler was to go to hissupplier this afternoon and pick
up some materials for his work,and the guy at the tile shop
said, Hey mate, like we've gotthese fantastic new products in,
(26:39):
like um, we've got this newwaterproofing product, it is
great for the environment, it'sflexible, it's gonna solve this,
this, and this problem.
Um, it's like it's awesome.
Uh, but it does cost an extra$20a drum.
My toilet knows the type ofperson I am, so um he might
(27:03):
reach out to me and go, heyDuane, I was at my tile shop
yesterday, and I uh mysupplier's like told me about
this new product, he's given mea drum.
We're gonna we're I'm I'm reallykeen to try it out.
Would you be happy to use it onyour project?
Um, it does this, this, andthis, and it's gonna make things
more durable, it's gonna makethings last longer.
(27:23):
Um like I would go, I would say,oh mate, have you have you got
the material safety data sheeton it?
Can I have a look into it?
Um do possibly can I go and talkto the supplier?
Like, I'd run through it.
But for me, if it's gonnaincrease the durability of my
projects, if it's gonna increasethe quality of what I'm
delivering to my clients, then Iwill consider it and I'll look
(27:48):
into it.
And if it does everything that'sthat it says it's going to do, I
will say to my toile, oh mate,like that new product that you
suggested, let's let's go forit, let's start making that our
standard on all of our projects.
So then when I'm doing my PACprocess, paid as a consultant
with all my clients, and I'mtalking them through every part
of the project.
When it comes to tiling, I'mgonna have a conversation with
(28:10):
them and I'm gonna explain tothem, hey, look, um, look, we've
been using these otherwaterproofing products for
years, and um over time we wehave had these couple of issues
with this, and we had thissituation, and we had to fix
that, and we did this, and butum look, we've we've got this
new product, I've done all myhomework on it, I've looked into
it, I've spoken to the supplier,I've spoken to some people that
that use it, I've I've runthrough it with my Tyler.
(28:33):
Um look, it is a little bit moreexpensive, but I believe if we
use it, it's going to do this,this, and this.
Um, then I've I've added valueto my client.
And I say this all the time (28:43):
if if you've got clients that are
questioning what you'recharging, whether you're a
tradier or a builder, there's noquestions about it, you're
attracting the wrong clients.
So if you're a trade working fora builder and the builder's
constantly questioning yourpricing, you're either working
for the wrong builder or you'renot educating the builder enough
(29:08):
on how you do things and theproducts you use.
If you're a builder that isworking for clients that are or
constantly getting clients thatare questioning your pricing
because they're getting pricingfrom other builders and they
they think you're too expensive,you're what you're attracting
the wrong types of clients.
You're either attracting thewrong types of clients or, and
(29:30):
this is the more common one,you're not spending enough time
educating them on why you costwhat you cost.
Like you're so focused on thedollar value, instead of
educating your clients on what'sin your proposal and why it is
better.
Um, and so in that back to thatsituation with the Tyler, I do
(29:51):
that for every single aspect,every single material, every
single part of our builds.
Uh, we have very high standardsin my building business.
We have there is products thatwe will, if a client chooses or
says to us, hey, we we don'twant to pay for that or we don't
want to use it, we will walkaway from the job because we're
(30:11):
not willing to lower ourstandards on things that we know
will either cause the businessor myself problems, financial
problems, or some sort ofproblems in the future.
Um or even higher priority thanthat, that will lower the
durability and the lifespan ofthe buildings that we're
(30:35):
building.
Because for me, that is theultimate sustainability that
we're building buildings thatare going to last the test of
times because we're doing thingsthat are more durable.
So um, yeah, look, so that thatto me that's a really good
example of um of your mindsetwhen it comes to value and what
you see value in.
If um, if you're if back to thatexample, if you were the tile
(30:57):
that goes to the supplier thisafternoon and the tile shows you
this, the the supplier shows youthis new product, and straight
away you're like, fuck mate, I'mnot interested in that.
I I can't even get work withwhat I'm using at the moment,
and it's cheaper.
Like I if I if I buy moreexpensive product, I'm gonna get
even less work because I can'tcharge anymore.
That is a 2x old school mindsetmentality that is going to keep
(31:20):
you stuck, that is going to keepyou struggling, that is going to
stop you from earning the moneythat you should be earning.
Um people see value in alldifferent things, and like
seriously, as tradies, asbuilders, please.
I encourage you to spend moretime educating the people that
you're selling your services to.
(31:42):
Um just completely take the thecost, the dollar conversations
out of it, and just purely focuson educating your clients on
where you add value.
Um, whether you're a plumber ora plaster or a tile or a
bricklayer, a block layer, aconcreter, electrician, I don't
care what you are, abalustrading guy, a pool
(32:04):
building guy.
Uh if you're not adding value toyour clients, if you're not
educating, if you're noteducating your clients and
showing them how that how youare adding value to their
project, you're you're wastingyour time.
You're you're going toconstantly be working with
people that will question whatyou're charging, will question
(32:26):
your invoices, will try and comeup with excuses not to pay you
what you should be paid or whatyou've invoiced for.
And you're really just creatingyour own problems.
Um, I haven't said it for awhile on the podcast, but you
all know, like one of my bestsayings is Grant Cadone saying,
nothing happens to you,everything happens because of
you.
This is a perfect example ofthat.
(32:48):
So um guys, I'll wrap this oneup.
But look, if you've gotquestions, if you're um if you
don't quite get what I'm talkingabout, like there is so many
books out there that talk aboutthis sort of stuff.
Um uh like I said, the thecreature from Jekyll Island, um
the richest man in Babylon, likeall those stories, uh all those
books all come back to how yousee value and what you see value
(33:12):
in.
So spend some time, uh, listento Audible books, listen to some
podcasts.
But this is a really importantuh, I guess, subject or topic to
be more open minded about.
Um, stop living your life aroundmentalities and mindsets about
that you've grown up with orthat you've been told or that
you believe in, and uh get a bitmore open minded about it
(33:34):
because it's powerful stuff.
Like when you change your yourmindset on what you see value
in, it's it's really, reallypowerful.
Um And I've seen how quickly itcan change the growth in
people's personal wealth, thegrowth in their business, all
those types of things.
So as usual, guys, like, share,subscribe, all those things.
(33:55):
Please share this podcast withevery other person in the
construction industry so that wecan continue to create a new
building industry and make thisAustralia's number one
construction podcast.
Go to the DwaynePears.comwebsite, grab your merch, get
behind us, support us.
Love you guys.
Thanks so much for watching orlistening, and we'll see you on
(34:15):
the next one.
All right, guys, I want tointroduce you to a really
exciting new product that Ibelieve is going to play a
massive role in Australiabuilding healthier homes.
As you all know, I am extremelypassionate about healthy homes,
and I'm doing a lot of researchand putting a lot of time and
effort into making sure myconstruction business is leading
the way when it comes tobuilding healthy homes here in
(34:37):
Australia.
We've teamed up with the guysfrom Highwood Timber.
Highwood Timber are pioneeringcondensation management with
their high flow ventilated LVLbatten system.
High flow battons give buildersa stronger, straighter, and
smarter way to create aventilated cavity behind
cladding and underneath roofswithout compromising on
(34:59):
structural performance.
While tackling condensation toimprove building health and ease
of insulation, highwood battonsare built to perform.
When it comes to dealing withcondensation and ventilation,
high flow battons will help youcreate continuous ventilated
cavities behind all yourcladding and underneath your
roof sheeting.
They reduce condensation riskand support healthier, longer
(35:22):
lasting buildings.
Highwood timber battons are alsoin alignment with the proposed
NCC condensation managementrequirements as well as passive
house ventilation requirements.
Being an engineered LVL product,they are stronger, straighter,
and more dimensionally stablethan a solid material such as
pine.
This helps resist warping,twisting, and shrinkage,
(35:43):
ensuring more consistentinstalls less prone to splitting
than solid timber.
Highwood timber batten areprecisely manufactured, meaning
that your installation will befaster and easier than other
products on the market.
The part that I like the mostabout these battens are they are
H3 treated for long-termprotection against decay and
turmoiles.
They use a waterborne H3treatment which reduces
(36:06):
reactivity with membranes andadhesives when compared to LOSP.
These are the exact battens thatyou want to be using on your
homes and your builds if you areconsidering building healthier
homes or passive homes.
Check them out, Howard TimberProducts.
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