EXPERIENCE 209 | Scott Kissel - Executive Director of Sky Corral Ranch - Raised in Small Business, Educated in Ministry, Experienced with All of The Above - The LoCo Experience

Episode Transcript
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(00:00):
This week I was pleased to spendtime with Scott Kissel,

(00:02):
Executive Director of Sky CorralRanch, located near the top of
the full year drivable portionof Old Flowers Road in Bellevue,
Colorado.
Loco Think Tank has held itsannual Next Level Summit at Sky
Corral the past two years, andwe're pleased to return this
August for another amazing doseof mountain hospitality.
Scott has lived quite aninteresting journey, growing up
in a retail grocery family inSouth Fork, Colorado as a hard

(00:25):
working multi sport athlete,finding faith and then drawing
his family to it, and thenattending Colorado Christian
University in Denver.
After college, he soon foundhimself as a leader in sales and
operations at Gibbs Bagels andthen Yancey's Food Service.
And then finding his way back toministry as a senior executive
with Timberline Church.
Scott shares many amazingbusiness and faith stories in

(00:47):
this episode, and also gives usa behind the scenes on the
renovation operation and futureplans at Sky Corral Ranch.
So tune in and enjoy myconversation with Scott Kissel.
Let's have some fun.
Welcome to the Low CoveExperience Podcast.

(01:08):
On this show, you'll get to knowbusiness and community leaders
from all around NorthernColorado and beyond.
Our guests share their stories,business stories, life stories,
stories of triumph and oftragedy, and through it all,
you'll be inspired andentertained.
These conversations are real andraw, and no topics are off
limits.
So pop in a breath mint and getready to meet our latest guest.

(01:33):
Welcome back to the LocoExperience Podcast.
My guest today is Scott Kisseland Scott is the executive
director.
The Sky Corral Ranch and uh, Ithink I want one of those
jackets like that that rocks thesky corral colors.
We can make that happen for you.
Thanks for having me.
Yeah.
Thanks for being here.
Um, and so, I don't know, whatpercentage of people in Larimer

(01:53):
County do you think know aboutthe the Reimagined Sky Corral
Ranch?
Oh, man, it's gotta be low.
It's kind of the best keptsecret.
20% or something?
Yeah, I was gonna say 20% orless.
30%?
Yep.
So for the 80 percenters.
Uh, can you give a quick kind ofoverview, uh, a drone flyover of
the operation at Sky Corral?
Yeah.
You bet.
Yeah.
Thank you.

(02:14):
105 acres, private venue forabout 50 people.
They can either stay overnightand enjoy all things mountain,
or they can do corporateretreats and strategic planning.
It's just got a little bit ofeverything, rock climbing.
Fishing, hiking, canoe, kayak,stand up paddle board.
Bears, turkeys, deers.
Oh yeah, absolutely.
Moose.
Yeah, exactly.

(02:34):
Hawks and eagles.
It's just a, a great opportunityto pause in the mountains with
people that you enjoy and it'sjust you.
Just private.
I dig it.
And this is basically up the topof Old Flowers Road, kinda.
That's correct.
Stove Prairie area.
Over Risk Canyon.
Yep.
Up Stove Prairie.
Up Old Flowers Road.
Just past Stove PrairieElementary School.
Three miles.
Um.
Um.

(02:55):
Where does it make sense to kindof start with talking about Sky
Corral?
Do you want us to talk aboutLike some of the events and
teams you've had there in recentyears, it came back into service
when, and when did you join theteam?
Well, the best place probablyKurt to start is just the
leadership legacy.
Couldn't be sitting here todaywithout, you know, the 1950s,
the Grubbs family, or who turnedit into an old dude ranch, 1957

(03:20):
became operational.
Okay.
Then a long history of leaders,you know, from that point.
Uh, but the point where itreally came into a new found,
you know, business model was in2008 with Bill and Avis ward.
Okay.
A great couple and family fromfront range internet.
No, no different.
Nope.
Different.
He is a word.
Yeah.
Word.
Petroleum.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And so amazing family, Enid,Oklahoma, and they bought it in

(03:42):
2008 and really kind of put iton the map for, you know, family
camps and just exciting getawaysfor people.
And then they had it until 2015and then they donated it.
This is an amazing story ofgenerosity to the community
foundation.
A great foundation in town thattook it on as an asset and
poured a million dollars into itfor capital improvements.

(04:04):
Uh, fire re, uh, suppressionsystem kinda helped us dredge
out the lake, set up another$1million endowment with another
foundation.
And so that was Oh, like for,for maintenance kind of thing or
something?
Yeah, exactly.
Yeah.
Just after the Hyde Park fire of2012.
So this might.
Sound weird, but I've hadKristin on from the Community
Foundation and I know that theydo investing in funds and donor

(04:25):
directed things and stuff.
This isn't the kind ofinvestment that's really
supposed to make a bunch ofmoney.
It's really preserving an assetfor the community to use.
Is that the right way to look atthis?
That is correct.
Yeah.
And so, uh, If they ever makeany money on it, they'll be
happy?
No.
It is probably one of the Theyprobably could make They could.
Yeah.
Yeah.
But there was just a uniqueopportunity for them to take us
on as an asset.

(04:46):
And we would not be in businesstoday without the community
foundation in Northern Colorado.
That team has been amazing overthe years.
So like both the capital supportand just even probably just
awareness, like having a little,little, we'll call it a ranch
yet, right?
Like it's too small to be aworking ranch and keep cattle or
things like that to speak of.
So it has to be.

(05:07):
Touristy kind of oriented.
Yes.
But finding a voice in thatmarketplace is hard.
Very hard.
And uh, they were the experts init.
Yeah.
So put a board of directorstogether and helped with all the
capital, you know, campaignimprovements and phenomenal
partnership.
Okay.
And then in 20, uh, 18, uh, theyturned it back over to Sky
Corral Ranch, so it's now fullyin our hands as a 5 0 1 C3.

(05:28):
Oh, I see.
So it almost had a incubationperiod.
Correct.
re transplanted the operatingentity.
And then is that where you cameon?
I came on a little bit later,almost four years ago, may of
2021.
So during those COVID years, ifyou will, it just kind of was,
uh, just limping by great reasonto promote it to get a bunch of
people together in the mountainsand tight quarters.

(05:50):
So, yeah, no, it was afterthey're seeing kind of the end
of this.
Period.
They're like, okay, I guess it'stime to get serious about this.
Yes.
Yeah.
So Bill Ward and the other guyon the board, Andy Peterson got
together with me and said, Hey,let's talk about this
opportunity.
Probably too early to gettogether to talk about an
executive director, but we'dlike to do that.
And then the board agreed togive it a go.
And so here I am almost fouryears later.

(06:11):
What were you doing?
Like, what were you, we'll jumpin the time machine and get kind
of more of your story, but whatwere you doing, like, going into
that time?
Yeah, at that time I was theSenior Executive Pastor at
Timberline Church here in FortCollins, Colorado.
So, 14 years on staff at thatchurch.
It's been our home church since,uh, 30 years ago.
Uh, and just was looking for alittle bit of a change and

(06:31):
wasn't sure what that meant.
Seems like a pay cut.
Yeah.
Probably.
Well, the, uh, Sky Corral Boardhas been, uh, been very good,
very generous, very favorable,you know, for me.
So grateful for that and thepartnerships that we have.
Yeah, but it's still probably apretty big pick up from
Timberline.
I'm just saying, um, I know whatthose pastures are going to be,
I'm just kidding.
Um, so, so you were like seeingan opportunity and for sure, no

(06:53):
question about it, but it's abig, complicated organization
for sure.
That's a, what, I don't know, athousand person.
More than that.
Oh yeah.
Well, 10, 000 call at home, 4,500, yeah, 4, 500 on a weekend,
all the campuses, so for sure ahundred staff.
Right.
Exactly.
That's no play thing job there.
They want you to actually workhard here.

(07:13):
You just got to screw around alot, kind of play rancher a
little bit.
Yeah.
Glad hand people when they comeup for conferences and stuff
like that.
Yeah.
You're getting a little toopersonal.
Sorry.
I'm just seeing the benefit ofthis job change too.
Yeah, definitely a big changegoing from that big of an
organization to me being thesole, you know, employee of Sky
Corral Ranch.
And then we hire a bunch ofcontractors, which are

(07:34):
phenomenal.
And your team are awesome.
Um, like the.
The bang for buck on yourcatered food?
Nobody can touch it.
Like if anybody ever has aconference up there or something
and they order food to bebrought up from Fort Collins and
with apologies to all theamazing Fort Collins caterers,
they're foolish.
Don't do it.
Like, you'll regret it becauseyou're gonna pay twice as much

(07:56):
and it won't be It won't be halfas good, probably.
Ah, yeah.
Yeah, Karen and Penny definitelyspoil our group, so glad you had
a good experience with that,Karen.
Well, they're just so dedicatedto service, too.
You know, it's not just thequality of the food, but it's
also just both, like, it'sdiversity, it's attentiveness.
You know, when the lettuce isrunning low in the salad bar,
they're, like, right out therebefore you get a chance to walk

(08:16):
back and ask them.
Yep.
Pretty unique ladies blend ofhospitality and catering and
service.
It's phenomenal.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Um, and so what kind of groupsdo you?
Host mostly like it's kind of aset up and you want to describe
the grounds just a little bit interms of like Like for me, it
was like, okay, this doesn'treally work for like a couples

(08:38):
Kind of outing or whatever,cause there's a lot of like bunk
rooms and stuff like that.
Mostly a bunk style model, uh,overnight, but during the day we
can host, you know, corporateretreats, but we mostly have
large groups that don't mindmultiple people in a room
sharing bunks, keeps the costsdown and then they can just
enjoy, you know, their wholegroup and their whole facility,
fit a bunch of people into asmall place.
Absolutely.

(08:59):
So it's like a big men's groupthing.
Skateboarders group I rememberwas either coming in or leaving
last year.
Yes, Camp Good Buddy, phenomenalorganization, partner
organization.
They book three and a half weeksof skateboarding camps every
summer, pretty much the month ofJuly.
What kind of skateboardingfacilities do you have up there?
They actually built everything.
They have a half pipe.

(09:19):
Yeah.
They have a nice half pipe upthe road behind the lodge.
Oh, I didn't know that.
Yeah.
And then over at the barn, theyhave some mini ramps and then
the sport court, which isbetween our two main buildings,
they turn that into a full onskate park, ramps and rails, and
they set it up and then tear itdown when they're done.
Wow.
It is pretty unique.
But yes, skateboarding camps,men's retreats, women's
retreats, environmental groups,uh, we have a lot of student

(09:42):
organizations, mostly because ofanother foundation.
I have to give them a shout out,Enander Family Foundation.
If it's faith based and studentrelated, they get 50 percent off
of whatever rate Sky Corralcharges.
Oh, is that right?
Heavy student groups, Maythrough October.
Okay.
You know, mostly when school'sout.
Yeah, yeah.
It's pretty phenomenal.
That makes sense.
And did you do mixed?
Students to do boys and girls,boys rooms and girls rooms.

(10:05):
Correct.
Yeah.
And then you've got like bunkrooms for like four or six kind
of four, six or eight.
And then we have a coupleoutlying cabins that can, people
can stay there too with otherbunks and counselors can be kind
of thing when they're ready totake a break from the craziness.
Right, right.
Well, it sounds like a perfectlike youth camp of if it's small
size.
Yes.
Up to 50.
Could you.

(10:26):
Build more and host biggergroups.
That's the hope we're working ona strategic planning session
right now to kind of look at thenext three to five years.
And what do we want to do?
The dream would be to have ahundred bed bunk house on the
hill, and then turn the lodgeback into a marriage retreat,
corporate retreat, where it's aking or a queen bed, private,
similar to a hotel, becauseright now we don't have that.

(10:46):
And we know we want to go thatdirection.
Oh yeah.
That would actually probablywork pretty good.
Really good.
That we're returning to down alot of groups that would love
just to have some private, youknow, rooms for their group.
So getting ready to do a capitalcampaign, kind of, is that how
that works in your situation?
Just the very beginning stagesof it with some great people on
the board that are saying, let'stalk about it.
What do we want to raise themoney for?

(11:06):
And how long will it take?
Well, and part of the benefit ofyour former position with
Timberline is, you know, likewho the deep pockets are over
there.
We have a very generouscommunity, Kurt, for sure.
I'm very thankful for it.
And the nonprofit community herein Larimer County is off the
charts as well.
We're grateful for all of it.
Can we talk about, uh, maybesome highlights, um, you spend a

(11:28):
fair bit of time up there on theranch, especially when you've
got guests up there and stuff.
You're usually there to greetthem or send them off at least
and whatnot.
But what are some of thehighlights of the really?
You've got, like, I mentionedthat summer of 21 was pretty
slow still.
So you've got two seasonseffectively.
Really done now?
And are you closed in thewintertime?

(11:48):
Are you still rocking it upthere?
You can still, it's still, yougot the fires going and whatnot?
Yeah, we're open year round.
We just winterize a couple ofour buildings, but the lodge and
then the community room.
Open year round, we can host,you know, people all the time,
but, uh, yes, no, surprisinglymay through, you know, August of
2021, wasn't terribly slow.
It just, people had to managethe COVID requirements and the

(12:09):
masks and things, but, uh, itwas, you know, slower, they
were, yeah, they wanted, theywere like up in the mountains.
Let's, this is fine.
Our group is, we know our, we'renot sharing space with another
group.
So it tattletales right aroundhere.
Nothing like that.
Nope.
Yeah.
So 24 just saw, you know,tremendous growth as far as our
groups that booked and then cameback and then told other groups,

(12:31):
so now we have a log jam in thesummer and we're just trying to
figure out how to expand ourshoulder seasons right now.
Yeah.
You know, one thing we're goingto have to dip into and maybe
we'll even do it.
Sooner than later, but the likemanaging a giant church like
that with 4, 000 people andstuff I know how our church
managed during kovat nation, butwe're gonna have to talk a

(12:53):
little bit about that, too Sodon't forget definitely a
conversation to have for sure.
Okay.
Yeah Um, but the highlights, youwere just talking about the
highlights and, uh, with, I haveKaren Steadman.
She is a contractor that wecontract with.
She lives a mile from theproperty, phenomenal host.
So she does a lot of the day today stuff, hospitality, greeting
groups, orientation.
And then when I'm up there, myhighlight is really just

(13:14):
floating around, seeing people.
She kind of makes the thingwork.
Oh my gosh.
And you make sure there'scustomers.
Correct.
Yep.
They say I'm the house works.
Yeah, I'm the face of Sky Corraldown here in town.
Community networking,fundraising, all of that, and
then Karen has boots on theground to be able to make sure
everything is running smoothly.
Whatever else.
Correct.
Yeah, but my highlights are justseeing groups.
Fulfilling their mission andtheir purpose for their stay up

(13:36):
there.
Yeah.
And then how can we help them?
Okay.
Well, thanks for hosting LocoThink Tank.
We've had two years in a rownow, our next level summit up
there for our largest kind ofpremium memberships at Loco and
it's just so.
Perfect size and shape likehaving the separate meeting
rooms for some of the trainingand workshoppy things and then
go back to the lunchroom andgrab lunch and then go back over

(13:59):
there and, you know, Well, we'reglad and you guys, uh, turkeys,
it's nothing like it reallyisn't.
Yeah.
And you guys are great.
You provide us with so manygreat pictures and videos.
So hats off to you and your teambecause we lean on you a lot for
those.
Thank you.
Thank you.
And have you gotten any, uh, anyLike other business from our
members over the last couple ofyears yet or yes, a couple of

(14:21):
them.
I don't remember the day thingsfor sure that attended your,
your seminar and say, Hey, wewant to come back part of the
goal.
That's why you gave us thehookup that first time.
Yes, absolutely.
And we're looking forward tohaving you back again.
Well, we're looking for thehookup again.
We can talk about that.
So should we talk about thevision a little bit more for Sky
Corral?

(14:41):
Sounds good.
So if you do this, It's ahundred person bunk house.
I imagine again, kind of thefour, sixes, eights, kind of
different, smaller and largerrooms.
Um, maybe a couple of floors Iimagine, or multiple even, so
you can segregate the girls fromthe boys even easier and stuff
like that.
Put tape in the doors, whatnot.
Um, and then like, do you needother facilities, maybe a bigger

(15:03):
kitchen probably to serve allthat and whatnot.
Is that part of the vision?
It is.
Yeah.
The lower level of that bunkhouse would be more like a
conference center, uh, would beuh, what we would have on the
bottom where larger commercialkitchen, easier to serve,
meeting space as well on thatvery bottom level of that kinda
designed for that purpose.
Correct.
Instead of make it work.

(15:23):
Correct.
Yep.
Got it.
Got a lot more space.
And then the upstairs would justbe whatever, all the lodging,
six rooms or eight rooms.
That's correct.
Or something like that's, yeah.
Okay.
Cool.
Mm-hmm And probably.
I don't know how the countyfeels about it, but can you put
like, I guess you don't havethat many flat spots, but I was
thinking pads for like littlecabinets and stuff like that,
too.
Yeah, the board that has servedat Skycrawl for a lot of years

(15:44):
has always talked about eitherlike yurts or tent pads or
things like that.
So we have a lot of different,you know, spots.
Have you been up to AvalancheRanch before?
No.
They, uh, it's a hot springs upkind of not too far outside of
Carbondale.
Okay.
And among, they've got a numberof cabins and things, but they
also have covered wagons.
Oh man.
With little propane heaters inthe covered wagons.

(16:05):
So you sleep in them?
Yeah, yeah.
If the wagon is rocking, don'tcome and occupy it.
Uh, but yeah, they're just alittle wagon.
And they just, you just parkthem in a flat spot.
And, uh, they seem to do thetrick for them.
And it would be kind of on themefor your Yeah, we're looking for
all kinds of creative ways to beable to have more people up
there.
Saunas.

(16:26):
You could use some saunas upthere as well.
Uh, a built in sauna.
I've got a future guest comingon the podcast here I can
introduce you to.
Cause that would be a fun thingfor any kind of retreat, right?
Right.
Just have that opportunity anduh, you know, don't have to have
a gym membership or go to,Norway.
Right.
Right.
We have the cold plunge takencare of with our lake, you know,

(16:47):
but yeah, but the sauna put thesauna house down by the lake,
you could put a word burningsauna right down in there.
Double win.
I like it.
Okay.
Capital campaign people.
When you listen to this, makesure you don't forget the 12
person wood burning sauna downby the lake.
We do take donor designatedfunds.
Right.
Perfect.
Um, so anything else that wouldreally be required to serve

(17:09):
that.
You know, what would then be 150person size, probably community
in that range.
And then obviously need to workwith the County and make sure
we're going about it.
Right.
How about sewer system andstuff?
Is it all septic up there?
So that would be another thingthat would, yeah, absolutely.
Yeah.
Different septics for each ofour facilities.
And that would require its ownwith acres.
You got the a hundred acres.

(17:29):
So yeah, makes sense.
And typically it's really good.
As long as you, you know, keepit living within its means.
That's right.
Maintenance is key.
Yep.
Yep.
And, and overflow is bad.
Very bad.
Nobody wants that.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Um, what else should peoplereally know about the ranch?

(17:51):
Uh, Do you want to talk aboutlike how much it costs or
anything like that?
Or is that more of a negotiablebased on the size of your group
or?
Yeah, no, it's, it's flexiblefor sure.
And our peak season, May toOctober, you know, typically
ranges around 115 a person andthat covers everything on the
property except our rockclimbing wall.
And catering.
And so that's for staying theretoo.
Yeah, correct.
Okay.
It was pretty much usingeverything on the property.

(18:12):
So 115 per person per night is afantastic rate to enjoy all 105
acres and all the activitiesthat it comes with.
So that's primary, but yes, itdepends on the season, size of
group, how much they need.
If you're five people, we mightnot be able to give you the
whole place.
Correct.
Minimum typically is 20, but wedo, I just hate turning people
away.
I'm just being honest.
So, so we can negotiate that.

(18:33):
And if we're not booked and it'sonly three weeks out.
Correct.
I'm easier.
Yeah, absolutely.
Yeah, we want people to use it.
Have you got, have you had anyprevious experience with kind of
lodging type?
Businesses or whatever thatreally isn't applicable.
Maybe that's not on the lodgingside, you know, I grew up down
by Alamosa So between Alamosaand Pagosa Springs family
business mom and pop grocerystore sporting goods hardware

(18:55):
all of that the whole familyworked there So that's where
business, you know really began,you know for me and that's kind
of the roots of that Okay, sobut no not on the lodging sit
there.
I mean, let's do it.
Mom and dad told you more event,you know, it's an event space.
Ultimately not right.
Karen handles the lodging part.
So hospitality and lodging, youknow, my coworker would be the
one that does that.
So I'm more on the people side,the marketing side, all of that

(19:19):
food industry for sure did a sixyears at Gibbs bagels, uh, here
in Fort Collins and had a greatstretch with them.
And so learned a lot about thefood industry and so business
when I was a kid and then somefood industry later in life.
Well, let's, uh, you know, ifthere isn't a lot more to say
about the Sky Corral kind ofprojects ahead, I think we can
zoom back and jump in the timemachine to Little Scotty.

(19:40):
Yeah, no, sounds great.
Sweepin the floor at the grocerystore, hardware store,
everything else store inAlamosa.
Was it, it was probably the,the, At least one of a few
everything stores, if not theonly.
Yep, we had two in town, uh,Foothills Market was ours, and
uh, Rainbow Grocery was theother one.
But yeah, we wanted to move outof California and be in a small

(20:00):
town.
So my dad said, let's go toSouth Fork, Colorado, population
300.
Oh, South Fork.
Yes, that's different thanAlamosa.
Yeah.
Did you live in South Fork?
We did.
The store was in Alamosa?
No, store, I say Alamosa, Kurt,because nobody knows where South
Fork is.
Oh yeah, South Fork is nothing.
300 people, we live there andwork there.
It's a flat spot on the way downfrom Wolf Creek Pass, if I
remember correctly.

(20:21):
That's right, that was my skihaven as a kid.
Would ski 40 times a winter, forsure.
So were you born in Californiathen?
Yeah, Thousand Oaks.
Okay.
Yep.
Which is, that's LA area, orwhat is Thousand Oaks?
Orange County.
Orange County, okay.
Yep.
Orange County before OrangeCounty was Orange County, kind
of thing?
Yeah, for sure.
And, uh, so you're just a littleguy though, you arrive in the
mountains.
Did you have, what was thesituation?

(20:41):
Like, what were your parentsdoing?
What were they escaping from?
Yeah, so my mom and dad, my dadworked for Litton Industries,
was in on the executive teamthere.
Kind of a corporate guy, what'sLitton do?
I couldn't tell you stuff likedepressed the worker and, uh,
maximize profits for theirshareholders.

(21:03):
Yeah.
You know, and then my mom wasadministrative assistant and so
they just were excited to just,you know, start in a small town
and raise our family.
So I have an older sister and anolder brother.
Okay.
And we all worked in the storetogether.
Literally, Kurt, our house, Icould walk there in 60 seconds.
So house was right behind thestore.
And so it was just a really nicesetup for how far is South Fork
from from Alamosa?

(21:24):
One hour, give or take.
Okay.
Yeah.
South Fork kind of the Only townwith that kind of stuff?
Uh, so it goes Alamosa, MontaVista, Del Norte, and then South
Fork.
So South Fork would be the smalltown before you go to Pagosa
Springs or you go up to Creed,Colorado.
Man, it just seems hard to haveenough customers to make a store
work.

(21:45):
And that's why you soldeverything but the kitchen sink,
I guess.
That's correct.
Well, summers we went, our townwas 300 and we went to 3, 000 in
the summer.
All the tourists, you know, thepeople want to come to the
mountains and enjoy all thingsthere.
Uh, that was when we capitalizedon the tourism, similar to Estes
Park, yeah, you capitalize when,uh, when people are there and
then in the winter, you know,Wolf, Wolf, Wolf Creek just
being up the road, massive ski,you know, lots of people from

(22:08):
out of state would come andenjoy skiing.
So it was really a, a, aseasonal business, very much so
dead as a doornail a lot oftimes during the, you know, in
October, the doorbell ain'thardly ringing.
That's right.
And that's why family business,buying groceries and whatever.
That's why you could adjust as afamily.
You just figure it out.
Yeah, yeah.
Yeah.
Um, what was the motivatingevent, if I may, if your folks

(22:29):
talked about it?
Like, were they come from smalltowns and made it to Thousand
Oaks?
Or like, how the hell did theycome to South Park?
I know.
They just were really lookingfor a serious Pace of life
change.
And I find that interesting nowwith working at sky Corral,
because that's what it is up onthe mountain.
It's a serious change of pace.
Yeah.
Uh, so I'm kind of feeling likeit's a full circle moment for

(22:51):
me.
Like, Oh my gosh, am I parents?
Am I my parents taking a changeof pace?
But that's just what they did.
And they just found South Forkand said, that's, that's the
place for us.
Found a business that was forsale and they jumped on it.
What an interesting, like, uh, Idon't know, just to, to me, to
be imagining somebody from likea rapidly developing hop in

(23:12):
California back in those days,especially it wasn't a miserable
homeless bill, but to just like,how do you, how do you even
learn about it?
Like there wasn't an internet ornothing, you know, just, uh,
people that he knew had beenthrough that area and told him
about it.
Huh.
Yeah.
Fascinating.
Yeah.
The funny story that everybodytells in my family is my brother
graduated class of one.

(23:34):
So when people talk about smalltown, they're just like, what?
What do you mean he graduatedclass of one?
So that's a unique andinteresting trait of our family.
I'm a class of five.
Oh man.
So I've never met anybody thatgraduated with a smaller class
than me.
I don't think.
I was 33.
So I have not met anybody elseunder 10.
was a class of one?
He must have merged schools.
Uh, yeah, but I went to theconsolidated school.

(23:56):
These classes of one are justnot going to work out very good.
Right.
Oh my gosh.
Where were you?
Uh, North Dakota.
Okay.
Central North Dakota.
Kind of, uh, I don't know if youknow where Jamestown is.
It's halfway between Bismarckand Fargo.
I do.
And I'm from, uh, North Dakota.
12 miles north of there.
Okay.
A little village calledBuchanan.
Yeah.
Classified.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I, I'd like to say I comprisethe top 20th percentile of my

(24:18):
high school class just to seehow good people are at math.
Oh, that's great.
Yeah.
My brother's claim was it didn'tmatter what his GPA was.
He'd be valedictorian anyway.
Um, what a fascinating, so talkto me about like.
How many kids were around?
Were you kind of free rangeraised?
Um, and like, what was littleScott like when you were seven,

(24:41):
eight, 10 years old, whatever.
Yep.
Out on the bike, going to hangout with friends.
Just got to be home by dark.
Lots of basketball, lots ofbaseball.
Lighting fires with hairspray.
Oh my gosh.
Dumb stuff like that.
Oh, totally.
Lighting parts through a, youknow, a PVC pipe, seeing who
could launch them the farthest.
Lots of fishing and rafting and,you know, in the winter,
snowmobiling, ice fishing.

(25:02):
I mean, it was truly a mecca fora kid, you know, to grow up in
that area.
Yeah, I'm sure.
I'm sure.
I've only been through a couplefew times, honestly, but I know
it's gorgeous.
So, uh, I'm sure the springswere especially, like, I've
barely been there in the springbecause it's too late for
skiing, but it's But it has tobe remarkable just to see that
the transformation from so muchwhite to so much green.

(25:25):
Yes.
It's phenomenal every year andyou'd get excited because then
you can start being outside andenjoying all things being out.
You've been cooped up the wholetime.
That's correct.
Yeah, we always went to bed witha snow shovel inside of our door
because a lot of times we'd openthe door and you can't really
get out.
Right.
So we'd have to shovel frominside to get out.
So, you kind of evolved,developed, and how many kids,

(25:48):
like, talk to me about your,like, your school that you went
to.
Yep, so I went to one town overcalled Del Norte.
Wanted to start playing sports,and when you're in a small
school, like my brother was, notreally opportunities for sports.
So I went to the ConsolidatedSchool in Del Norte.
And that's like a town of 5, 000or something.
Man, I don't even know.
Now, yeah, probably.
But, uh, yeah, then it was justa little bit bigger than South

(26:08):
Fork, but that's where most ofthe kids in the area.
They still can only field ninekids for the basketball team,
but yeah.
Yeah, well, and my wife alwaysthinks this is a joke, but the
football team at halftime Partof the team would be in the band
as well.
So they're out there on thefield in their uniform playing
in the band.
And my wife's saying, that's notpossible.
I'm like, it is because theydon't have enough to do both.

(26:29):
They don't have a saxophone.
If the tight end doesn't getout, I actually, so I was.
In my 7th grade year, so we, we,we actually merged with Pingree,
so we were Pingree Buchanan HighSchool that I graduated from,
even though it was two townsthat made five kids.
But in my 7th, no, in my 6thgrade year, me and my, my

(26:51):
cousin, my, my dad's youngestbrother, my, my uncle cousin,
um, got called up from 6th gradeto play on the B squad for the
7th grade.
through 9th grade teambasically, the JV team.
And then in 7th grade, we bothgot called up to play in the
varsity because some kids gotcaught with minor in possession
and they just didn't have ateam.

(27:12):
So in 7th grade, I was like thefirst man off the bench on the
point guard position.
I was playing on the varsity, soI would play the B squad for the
first half, and then me and Jimwould go into the locker room to
get ready for the A squad gamethat was immediately following
that, and then we would get ourasses kicked.
We went like 5 and 46 orsomething over three years that

(27:36):
I played 7th, grade, and then Iwas, and the coach was terrible,
and the team was terrible, and Ijust got fed up and quit.
Yeah, we need to get togetherafter the podcast Oh, for sure.
Um, but it toughens you up.
Oh, for sure.
For future years.
Correct.
So I'm guessing you're both agood athlete and a good student

(27:56):
going through these years.
You know, you're a pretty bigguy, right?
Small town like that.
You can kind of make hay.
Yeah.
I was kind of a freak of natureas far as, you know, size goes,
you know, as an athlete forsure.
And then.
Were you like super big already?
Like seventh grade?
I was.
Like how big?
Oh, man.
I mean, when I was in highschool, I mean, I was 6'3 6'4
you know, a freshman, you know,in high school.

(28:17):
Right.
Yeah.
When I was 12, I grew so fast, Ipopped out of my hip joints.
Oh, dang.
And so, yeah, they had to boltthem closed, you know, to, to
take care of that.
Okay.
So, I joke, I'd be 7 if theydidn't bolt my hips closed.
Well, too bad for you, I guess.
So, yeah, loved athletics.
Loved athletics and, uh, I didmy best at school and had a good
time.
And what were your sports?
Basketball primarily.

(28:37):
Okay.
And then baseball and track.
Okay.
What was your position inbaseball?
Uh, pitcher and first base.
Nice.
Yeah.
When you're tall and lanky.
Yeah.
That's the two spots they wantto stick you.
Well, if you're scared of thegrounders.
Uh, and I was honestly, I was athird base shortstop and a
pitcher, actually my, my claimto fame.

(28:58):
And you're about my age.
I think maybe I'm 53.
I'm 50.
Okay.
So, uh, in little league in 12thor 13 year old kind of little
league.
So my mom founded our eighthgrade.
Or 8 year old, yeah, 8th gradelittle league team, or whatever
that was, in our town.
The Google speaker is talking tous, but my mom founded our, when

(29:20):
I was 8 years old, she founded alittle league baseball team,
cause she was a long time fastpitch.
Um, softball player.
Yeah.
And she, she rounded up a teamfrom this 50 person high school,
of the right age kids, justenough to make a team with,
like, two people in a bench.
Oh, man.
Um, but then, eventually Iplayed baseball and then I went
to town to play for one year,uh, before the farm demanded my

(29:43):
attention.
Um, but, Darren Erstad, uh, wasUm, the most famous kid from our
town at the time, and he wasfirst draft picked by the
angels.
Wow.
Uh, back in the day.
And he won several golden glovesand I struck him out twice in
one game.
There you go.
That's a big deal.
He hit 800 and like home runshalf the time.

(30:06):
How'd you strike him out?
What was the plan?
Um, you know.
Honestly, it was keep itoutside, keep it low and outside
because he, he couldn't quitereach those because he was, he
was built like you already, likean eighth grade and he just
couldn't quite reach it.
He knew he wanted to tap it outon me, but so I just made it,
had to make him want it, youknow, basically that was the

(30:29):
strategy.
That's awesome.
And, uh, and, uh, you know, pushthem inside once in a while to
be able to sort it.
Keep them guessing.
Yeah.
You can't just throw it outside.
But that was the, that was thestrikeout pitch.
Anyway, I digress.
You don't know who Jared Nerstadis?
I don't.
Oh, he's a super famous baseballplayer.
Okay.
He challenged Rod Carew'sbatting championship one year
back in like 2007 or so.

(30:52):
He was batting over 400 for partof the season.
Wow.
Yeah.
That's impressive.
And then he totally flaked out.
Darren, sorry.
Yeah.
It was a weak play.
I digress.
Darren, if you want to come onmy podcast sometime, you're like
the most famous person fromJamestown, North Dakota.
And so if anybody out there islistening and knows Darren and
wants to introduce, then you're,I'll put you up.

(31:15):
I'll put you up in Fort Collinsfor the night.
There you go.
Or up at Sky Corral Ranch.
We can do that too.
Up at Sky Corral Ranch.
Yeah.
Yeah.
We'll give you a So, so you'rethis stud football, not
football.
I know parents wouldn't let meplay.
They didn't want me to get hurt.
Oh, too violent.
Basketball.
You got to keep your health forbasketball.
Interesting.
Yeah.
Because you were better atbasketball or just.
Yes, for sure.

(31:36):
Okay.
Yeah.
That is one of my biggestregrets is to not have played
football.
Really?
For sure.
Interesting.
I'd go back and do it again.
You got a body for it, for sure.
That's what they tell me.
I hated playing guys like you inbasketball.
Like, I'm good if everybody'slike, Bye.
Bye.
Six foot and skinny, but you puta six, four heavy guy in there
and they just shut me down.
Yeah, sorry, just saying, justsaying so annoying.

(31:58):
I know.
Well, well, my first basketballgame memory, we lost 124 to 24
dude.
So to lose by a hundred points,you know, I should have just
hung up my tennis shoes rightthen and there.
In the.
County tournament against theWoodworth Pettibone Robinson
Wolfpack.
We lost a hundred and thirteento fifteen.
Oh, see, they fell just short ofbeating us by a hundred points.

(32:20):
Those guys were such assholes.
That's just not right.
It isn't, but it buildscharacter.
Absolutely.
So, did you, like, go off tocollege on a basketball
scholarship, I'm gonna say?
I did, yes.
I had the, uh, the privilege ofplaying at Colorado Christian
University for four years.
I wanted to stay in state.
You wanted to keep getting beatbadly for a few more years.

(32:43):
So is your dad a pastor orsomething or were you raising a
Christian family though?
Yeah.
So I was pretty much the firstis going to church.
It's a pretty unique story, butI don't have time for it today.
No, let's, let's, let's zoom inthere.
Okay.
No, I appreciate it.
Like you started hanging outwith your friends and stuff.
And one of the friends was like,Hey, let's check out this church
thing.
Even more unique than that.

(33:03):
So I told you that we have aninflux of tourists in the
summer.
Sure.
Uh, we had a lady named EdieBoatwright that would come in
and do her grocery shoppingevery single Sunday in the
summer.
And she's your wife now?
Nope.
Nope.
She was a 65 year old woman.
Okay.
Uh, you know, doing her groceryshopping.
And so once she got to know us,she said, asked my mom and dad,
hey, can I take your son tochurch?
So from when I was 5 until I was8, every Sunday in the summer.

(33:24):
I would go to church.
Really?
Yup.
So.
And why did she ask them that?
She just was a diehard churchperson from Plainview, Texas.
Yeah.
And she's like, this young manprobably needs to the Texans are
thick, right?
Like half of that extra 3, 000people was Texans.
Oh, for sure.
Right.
A hundred percent.
Okay.
Yeah.
Uh, and so that was my, myintroduction to church.
And you just started going toSunday school in what church?

(33:44):
If I may.
Yeah, it was called EmanuelChapel in South Fork.
So pretty much an independentkind of little church kind of
thing?
Pretty much everyone in townwould either go there or to the
Catholic church.
Right.
Those were the two that really.
You know, dominated thepopulation and, uh, and then
that's where I just became achurchgoer and, and, uh, started
a relationship with Jesus familyfollowed you.
They did.
We grew up Catholic, so, youknow, religion, you know,

(34:06):
structured churches in our worldfor a lot of years.
But then as far as making ashift, uh, Emmanuel chapel, my
mom, my dad, yeah, brother andsister and pretty unique.
Can you describe like how thatwent down?
Kind of like you said, five toeight, it was you.
And then like, it startedtrickling in or like talk to me.
Were you just, I mean, not tomake it about that, but this is

(34:28):
a really interesting story.
I appreciate you asking.
Yeah.
Cause it's all aboutrelationships.
So if it weren't for EdieBoatwright making a difference
in my life as a little five yearold, I wouldn't be where I am as
far as a person of faith.
Yeah, absolutely.
Yeah.
Um, so no, it just, I went tovacation Bible school when I was
eight, uh, which is a basicallyan everyday thing for, you know,
a church that would do thingsfor the students, and I never

(34:50):
remembered one thing they talkedabout, but I remember the
stories about Jesus that hewould tell me in the car going
and coming back and that's whatstuck.
And so that's really where itwas and then I would come home
and tell my mom and dad aboutyou got to hear this story that
Edie told me today and then itjust led to that.
It's all parables mostly.
Pretty much.
Stories.
That's what it's full of.
Yeah.

(35:11):
And then they were like, Let'sgive it a try.
Let's try it.
Absolutely.
Like they didn't, did they, hadthey, they just kind of
rejected?
Catholicism, I guess, becausethey weren't going to the
Catholic church in town, eventhough they came from that
background.
No, they were.
We were going to the Catholicchurch, uh, when we first moved
to town.
And so then they just made ashift.
They said, you know what, Scottreally loves this church.

(35:31):
Yeah, exactly.
And, uh, so let's go where Edieand Scott go.
Yeah.
And then we just never lookedback.
My mom became the Sunday schoolsuperintendent at the church.
Interesting.
Not very much long after.
So we really went all in as afamily.
I grew up in a town and it'sfunny how Similar, our
experiences are with you, likejust off the mountains of
Colorado and me in the midst ofthe prairies of North Dakota.

(35:54):
But we had a Catholic church anda Lutheran church.
And pretty much everybody wasCatholic or Lutheran.
My family was congregational.
We went to the church in townthat Grandma had gone to.
Turns out it wasn't really achurch.
Like, I didn't know the goodnews until I was 25.
So, they missed the mark in thatrespect.
But Like, nobody cared if youwere Catholic or Lutheran except

(36:18):
if you started dating a girl.
On the opposite team orsomething like that, like that
was my observation.
Like, I've always been anobserver of people.
I wasn't dating because I wasfive foot one and with a mullet,
you know, but, um, Got to see apicture sometime.
You can, I'll show you one.
But, uh, but that was kind ofthe rules.
Like it was all cool.

(36:38):
There was no religious strife ordisposition unless, you know,
the Catholic girl wanted to datethe Lutheran boy and vice versa.
And then things were weird.
It's true.
Was that that way for you too?
Yeah, and our church was, youknow, very strict on the
religious side of things.
So they were like Baptist plus?
Yeah, it was called nondenominational, but yeah, more
on the Baptist side I would say.

(36:59):
Fair enough.
Okay, well that's where the goodTexans come from, right?
Right.
So, so your family gets furtherand further involved, your
brothers, brother and sisterrather, right?
Yep, they did, yeah, olderbrother, older sister, you know,
at that time, yeah.
And then, uh, So that's whyultimately you went to CCU.
Correct.
Yeah, fair enough.

(37:19):
That's where my, uh, my nephewgoes right now.
He's gonna finish up, uh, he'sgot a, uh, he's been their
master flutist for a few years.
Uh, Isaiah Johnson.
Uh, he was a piano amazing kidat like 11 and then switched to
the flute and he's been theirfirst chair for, and he's gonna
probably cure cancer orsomething, I don't know.
Man, good for him.

(37:39):
Yeah.
Yeah.
And he's been really enjoyingthat community and was just
telling, My wife, he's going toSweden and some kind of a
exchange kind of thing with someof his friends.
Wow, good for him.
The university's changed a lotover the years.
We were actually the firstgraduating class because
Colorado Baptist University andColorado Christian College okay
merged and so we were freshmenthe first year of the merger so

(38:01):
we were technically the firstgraduating class of Colorado
Christian University.
So you're the center on thebasketball team or more of a
forward, power forward style,six, seven, six, 10 people from
Nigeria.
So I was definitely not thetallest.
All right.
Fair enough for sure.
That's where the Nigeria is,where they make the best
basketball players and some ofthe best Christians.
Yeah, they're good.

(38:23):
So, so your experience there waspretty amazing.
It was, um, did you find a girlthere too?
Or I did my current wife rightnow.
All right.
So we dated as freshmen all theway through and got married when
we graduated.
Awesome.
Have three kids now.
So twenty six, twenty four areour daughters and our son is
twenty.
We'll let you zoom in on thefamily in a moment.

(38:44):
Okay.

(39:28):
Um.
So, what's your, like, show me,talk to me about your career
trajectory, just a little bit.
Like, uh, you get out ofcollege, you're studying.
Well, when I was in college, Istarted out as business.
Uh, the plan was to go back andtake over the family business.
I went and worked at a sportscamp in Branson, Missouri,
called Camp Canicook.
Okay.
And at that camp, I decided, youknow what?

(39:48):
I want to work with students.
And so I went back, changed mymajor from business to youth
ministry.
Oh, wow.
Until the last three years ofcollege, I was focused on that.
And then that's where the churchintroduction as far as a staff
position began.
Is there a church associatedwith CCU?
There is not multiple churchesin the area.
Yeah.
And they all welcome CCUstudents.
Of course they do.

(40:10):
Right.
Yeah.
Oh, that's cool.
Yeah, so we went to Bear ValleyChurch when we were down there,
and that's when I worked withthe youth group and thought, you
know what, I think I want to gointo this for a career.
I've been to Bear ValleyBrewery.
I think that's right up the roadthere.
I think it is up the road.
So, you get into ministry rightout of the gate.
I did.
I worked for Fellowship ofChristian Athletes.
Uh, so it came up to FortCollins.
That's what moved us up here.

(40:30):
Okay.
They were opening an office forFCA, is what it was called.
And they said, hey, they knew methrough college because I was
involved, uh, as an athlete withFCA.
Yeah.
And so, yeah.
That's surprising that, so youwere the founder, really, of the
FCA locally?
Not the founder, but the firstworker here?
For, yeah, for NorthernColorado.
They said, hey, we want you tobe our first, uh, Northern
Colorado director.
That seems really surprisingthat they wouldn't have taken,

(40:52):
like, a CSU athlete.
I know, and the main reason theystarted it was there was 200
people going to the ColoradoState University FCA huddle.
Oh dang.
So there was a bunch going andthat's why they wanted to open
an office.
Interesting.
Well, it's kind of sweet thatthey already had a captive
audience for you.
They definitely did.
So, what was that job like?

(41:12):
Oh, it was a dream.
I mean, first of all, hats offto my wife.
She gave up her dream job atColorado Christian to follow us
up here to Fort Collins,Colorado and start that.
But, yeah, I just loved it.
Worked with all of theNortheastern Colorado junior
high, high school, and college.
Summer camps, sports, EstesPark.
I mean, it doesn't get anybetter than that.
So, a guy in his early 20s,newly married, it was a dream.

(41:36):
Didn't make a lot of money, butdon't need a lot of money.
Nope.
We were at twenty two thousanddollars a year We just joked
about this the other day as anewlywed.
That was a four call I was 22five when I started in banking
man.
Okay, so bankers make we havelike a parallel life We suffer
like you love God and I'm on thefringes kind of thing.
We could start a brewery churchI love God just as much.

(41:57):
I know not quite as much.
You don't know that her I don'tknow.
Who knows?
He loves me more though.
I, I, okay.
Otherwise, my life wouldn't beso blessed just by doing so many
dumb things.
so you're protected is whatyou're saying, right?
I got gardened angels, dude.
Yeah.
Don't mess with me more than Ihave.
Even though you're bigger.
uh, the bourbons start to hitjust a little bit.
Okay.

(42:17):
Alright.
Yeah.
How you doing?
I'll give you that.
You haven't even, I alreadyalmost drank all mine.
Well, I don't officially reallyknow how to, how to do that as
well as you do.
I know.
But that's what makes it funwhen we have podcast guests
here.
When you're big, you can have awhole bourbon while you're on
this podcast.
That's fine.
Um, where did we leave off onthat squirrel chase?
Oh, uh, uh, going into ministryas far as college, you know, my

(42:40):
career trajectory.
So FCA, six years.
So Aaron Santini pretty well.
I do.
Yeah.
He was a staff person, uh, afterme.
So Aaron Santini is a phenomenalguy and, and, uh, leading a
church here in town.
Doing a great job.
Oh, no, I didn't know that.
I've been going to for.
12 plus years.
Him and Daniel Smith have beenon.
You know Daniel too?
I've met Daniel.
Aaron introduced me to Daniel.

(43:01):
For sure.
Yeah.
Oh, and uh, Beck.
Do you know Beck?
Oh yeah.
FCA.
Been a long time.
He's with our staff now too.
Okay.
Wow.
Yeah.
We pulled away from anotherchurch.
We fixed it.
Good for you.
Sorry if you're the formerchurch.
But you did have some kind ofwhacked out views.
I'm sorry.
Oh man.
I'm just kidding.
Well, no.
So yeah.
This is the local experience,man.

(43:21):
You gotta be ready for some nonpolitically correct conversation
here.
Yeah.
Understood.
So you're, you're like leadingthese young guys to both be men
and to be athletes and to beChristians, basically, is that
kind of like a three leggedstool of FCA?
Really, my hot button ispotential.
And so putting FCA with focusedon character as athletes with my

(43:42):
hot button of let's push peopletowards their potential.
It was a win win all the wayaround just because students,
junior high, high school orcollege, they need that to be
kept in front of them.
Character and potential.
It's a powerful one two punch.
You gotta do hard things, youknow.
I'm telling you.
You gotta do it right.
Yep.
Absolutely.
I dig it.
Okay.
Yeah, so six years with, uh,Fellowship of Christian
Athletes.
Okay.
Uh, and then I went into thecrazy food industry.

(44:02):
Yeah.
I really did try to find otherministry jobs.
Basically, I was gonna gettransferred to Denver.
Okay.
And my wife and I were like, ah,we want to do the big city.
And is she working?
Is she having kids already ornot yet?
Not quite.
Not quite.
Yeah.
She worked for a long time.
at, uh, the Hilton, uh, here inFort Collins, she worked with
Alpine Manufacturing, the GirlScouts, uh, for the early years
of being, being up here, butdecided we don't things this and

(44:25):
that.
Nothing career really.
What was her degree?
Study?
She's uh, English, English,English.
Yeah.
Yeah.
But she really wanted to be astay at home mom and all of a
sudden done.
So yeah.
Start making enough money so Ican do that.
I know exactly.
Exactly.
So I tried to find otherministry jobs because we didn't
want to move to Denver.
We're like, we don't want to dothe city life.
So I decided to stay here.

(44:47):
Thought I'd just deliver bagelsat night and look for jobs
during the day.
And that turned into a six yearcareer at Gibbs Bagels and loved
every minute of it.
Right from there, yeah.
That's a highlight for us.
No, I mean, I, the company grewso much and how they, like just,
I don't know, kind of set adifferent standard for how a
local business can have kind ofa multi location operation and

(45:09):
influence and I don't know theyhad a lot of what was that
there's a gal that maybe cameafter you that ran it?
Well Rachel Yendra, her name wasRachel Bradley at the time.
I know Zach better than I knowRachel but I know she's super
well respected by a lot ofpeople.
Oh yeah.
As well.
Well Kurt, I have to tell you.

(45:30):
And people say she turned itaround after Scott left.
That's right.
Well she did and because I hiredher.
So it's pretty funny.
I hired her as a high schoolstudent.
Oh, is that right?
And now she's obviously one ofthe best hires I ever made as a
young manager at Gibbs bagel.
So we stay in touch to this day.
Like I was so jealous of Zach.
Because he had like a wife thatwould make enough money so he
could screw around and driveschool buses around and take

(45:53):
kids and do stuff and, and buildawesome bikes and cool things.
He's very talented.
I love his creativity.
Yeah.
Anyway, I'm a fan.
Well, good.
And now they're merged withSpoons.
So Spoons and Gibbs are owned bythe same owner.
And then Rachel.
And who's the owner now?
Mike Howland.
Oh, is that right?
So he's the one who bought Gibbsfrom Gibb.
So Tom, Tom sold Spoons.

(46:13):
That's correct.
Tom.
Tom.
I don't remember his last name.
Yeah, I don't remember either.
So Mike bought it and so nowGibbs and Spoons are under the
same ownership with Rachel atthe helm.
Running the whole thing.
Pretty much.
President.
I hope she's got a slice of theequity at least.
I am not sure.
Let's ask her.
She should.
Oh man, she works so hard.
Right, well she made it what itis in a So hard.
And Spoons is a hard businesstoo, but so good, like, I love

(46:34):
their model.
Yes.
Yep.
Yeah.
And that's why they bought in.
Okay, well that's interesting.
Yeah, it's a small world.
Maybe I'll have a futurepodcast.
Maybe Rachel and Zach should beon it.
Oh, they'd be great.
They would be great.
Zach has, uh A filter similar tomine, I suspect, when we start
talking with Bourbon.
Okay.
I'm just, I'm just guessing.
What would the filter be?

(46:55):
No filter.
Okay.
Basically.
So, so you kind of helped Gibbsin some ways kind of turn the
corner to being a for realawesome business, and then you
hired a high school that took itover when you went to I left
from Gibbs and went to Yancey'sFood Service.
I don't know if you know GregYancey.
Well, sure.
Well, Greg and Drew have beenon, and Drew is my next level 2

(47:16):
facilitator.
Phenomenal family.
Okay.
So again, looked for ministryjobs when I was leaving Gibbs.
Couldn't find any.
And so Yancey's was verygenerous to say, Hey, do you
want to come do some streetsales for us?
So I committed to that and thenafter that I landed at
Timberline Church interestingYeah, and how was what was that
job at Timberline like and hadyou been searching try to get
back into ministry proper or no?

(47:38):
I pretty much wrote it off.
I said, you know what?
I think food industry is gonnahave to be what you know The
career path is and then theexecutive pastor at the time
reached out to me.
His name was Rob Coles Oh, yeah,and he said hey like that guy.
Oh, man.
He's so likable Yeah, he's doinga phenomenal job at Genesis
project.
Yep.
Yep.
Yep Yep.
Um, I think I met him first withSandy Brown from Colorado

(48:02):
Christian School.
I might be interlacing twodifferent introductions.
Anyway, um, I know Rob has beensuper involved with the Matthews
House and hosting their officesand stuff and I met him there.
But I think the very first timeI met Rob was Sandy from CCU,
not CCU, what's the, what's thehigh school here with the
flexible kind of thing?

(48:22):
Oh, CEC, Colorado Early College.
Yes.
Yes.
Okay.
Sandy, who has introduced me toRob at the Peach Festival.
Oh, okay.
Forever ago.
Anyway.
Yeah.
Sometimes, do you do this?
Like, when you hear a name, doyou flash back to the first
moment that you met that person?
Absolutely.
Kind of?
I think that's the importance ofrelationships.
Yeah.
Where did I meet you?
Yeah.

(48:42):
That's, so for me, that was RobColes, even though I've met him
five other times at mostlyMatthew's house related things,
like I still flash to thatmoment at Hughes stadium when
Sammy introduced me.
Wow.
Anyway.
Yeah.
So he's the one that met with meand said, Hey, we have opening
at Timberline church.
What do you think about gettingback into ministry world?
Oh, cause you knew from FCA kindof world or something like that.

(49:02):
And I was attending the churchat the time.
So I knew him as one of thepastors.
So there you go.
Well, that's a good eye fortalent exhibited.
Right, Rob, I guess I would say.
Too kind.
Or, or maybe, maybe it was adisaster, I don't know, but you
rose up the ranks, so we'll see.
Yeah, well.
So what's it look like to be Socircuit me, by the way, because
this is like 2014, 15, somethinglike that.

(49:25):
So I started at Timberline 2006and then left in 2021, uh, as
far as staff goes.
Okay.
Yep.
Yep.
Yep.
And I kept my credentials when Ileft and went to work for Sky
Corral.
So it was 15 years at Timberlineas far as paid staff.
And then we started attendingthere in 94 as a family.
Yeah.
So it's been our, our homechurch for 30 years.
Yeah.
Yeah.

(49:46):
Um, what.
Like can we talk about theevolution of sure like it was I
remember so I I've lived herestarting in 99 Wasn't a
Christian yet met my wife becamea Christian eventually we went
to the meeting place Church Mmhmm back in 99 with Dwight
Bradshaw I know the name he andhis wife were customers at the

(50:09):
bank that I went to andeventually Persuaded me and
along with my beautiful wifebeing a Christian already but
then Like that was the circa andthen I moved away for a few
years later, but like Timberlinewas probably just Really good to
be a big thing probably aboutthat time, right?
That's correct late 90s Yeah, soearly 2000s really when they

(50:31):
moved locations off of LeMaywhere Ridgeview is currently the
school You know, they moved overto Timberline Road.
It was that was explosive And itjust blew up and I'm always
like, I'm against the trends.
So I never, I think I went onceand I was like, nah, I'm not
going to go to a big church likethis.
Understood.
It is fine.
Yeah.
So, but tell me about that.
Like being, you were there.

(50:52):
Yeah.
We were there as members of thechurch and then to move
locations and to see this, uh,just explosive, you know, growth
was very, especially being asmall town, you know, church
guy.
Yeah.
I'm like, okay, how am I goingto handle this?
And this is more people thanI've been around in a long time.
Uh, but it was amazing how theyhandled it.
They just stayed focused on thecommunity.
They stay focused on the people.
And they said, you know what,we're going to continue to love

(51:14):
people where they are.
Why do you think, like, was itthe charisma of the pastor at
the time?
Was it the systems thatdeveloped?
Like, was it multiple factors?
Like what really contributed tothat?
Yeah.
Definitely.
I appreciate you asking.
Definitely multiple factors, butPastor Derry Northrup has been,
you know, he's just gettingready to retire after 38, 39
years of senior leadership atthe church.

(51:35):
He's so excited aboutretirement.
He's definitely no Joe Biden.
Yeah.
Oh man.
Yeah.
So very charismatic.
Yeah.
Love the community.
He's very people oriented, youknow, so it was that, and then
the team that he had around himjust were committed to go.
Let's figure out how we can be amom and pop church, but in the
mega church model Yeah, andsomehow they found a unique

(51:57):
blend of how to do that andpeople just like you know what
I'm gonna keep coming back Yeah,yeah, so that's what it was and
then when I came on staff in2006 They were kind of after
that initial explosive growth,and then I'm more of a how do we
make things better?
So it worked out well my role isto come alongside of them and
say what can I do to help like?
How do you measure better?
As a pastor, like, is it becausewe make more money, you know, is

(52:19):
it because we get more members?
Is it because they enjoy itmore?
How do you know if they enjoy itmore?
Yeah.
You want a little inside, youknow, you know, everybody always
goes to nickels and noses assuccess of a church, the money
and the number of people thatyou have, but any pastor can do
the anecdotal anecdotal storyof.

(52:40):
Well, I met with so and so andthey turned their life around
and then all of a sudden yourwhole church is not 20 of those
or 100.
And so that could be happening,you know, all the time.
So you look at retention, youknow, how many people are coming
back?
Is there a new growth that'scoming into the church?
And then how is the back door?
How many people are leaving?
So that's really where you lookat, you know, the same as local,
same time.

(53:01):
It's really a business model.
People had the hardest time.
How do you get people torespond?
Like how they like it?
Well, it depends on who they'retalking to.
If they're talking to the seniorpastor, they're probably not
going to say, right.
If they're talking to theoperations guy like me, they're
going to tell you what they likeand what they don't like.
So you definitely had tonavigate that because you would
hear two sides of the coin.
I just had one of the mostinteresting, so this is

(53:24):
probably.
Behind the curtain a little bit,but we, we had a chapter that
was struggling and, and we madea change in the facilitator
position.
It had been decreasing inmembership.
Within LOCO?
Yeah, within LOCO.
And I, I offered to be theinterim facilitator whilst I
found the right nextfacilitator.
And like, I'm a goodfacilitator.

(53:46):
BSF, Bible Study Fellowshiptaught me how to facilitate.
Like way back in the day when Iwas first a Christian and stuff.
I'm good at it.
And I heard from them, like.
We don't really want you herebecause you're like the loco
think tank guy and it's hard forus to be authentic and
vulnerable while Loco think thatguy is here and I'm like dude.
My business is one fourth thesize of yours and I barely make

(54:10):
any money Like you don't reallyhave to be ashamed But like it's
almost like I'm the seniorpastor.
That's true of loco think tankand I can't really huh Yeah,
that's what I'd say.
Pastor Derry, he would say, ifI'm going to walk in a room,
everybody's head's going to turnto me.
Right.
So why would I walk in the roomwhen I can have you walk in the

(54:31):
room and navigate that meetingjust as well or better?
Because people are going torespond differently.
That's tremendous leadership.
Um, and insight, really, forprobably, for him, what was at
the time.
Learned a lot.
He didn't I don't really know ifthat was right, it just felt
right, you know, so, okay, well,that's, uh, so sorry to take
that squirrel chase, but I thinkit's so worth it, honestly,

(54:53):
like, and I'm not starting areligion, just for those that
are listening.
You're not going to apply forGary's job?
Neither did Pastor Gary, he'sjust continuing the religion,
you know, his religion is Jesusis awesome and mine is pure
advisory is useful.
Uh, in different ways.
Yeah, and he would say it's notreligion, it's a relationship.
If he were sitting here next tome, he's like I hate the word

(55:15):
religion, that's why we talkabout faith, family, politics
here.
Yeah, love it.
And so, so I guess your time,um, at, Timberline from 2006 to
2015 was kind of a support anddevelopment role kind of as the
church kind of took its nextphase in because it blew up fast
to be kind of the power churchin Fort Collins and then, and

(55:36):
then what?
Yeah, yeah, multiple years oflots of different roles.
So I started out in the carearea and men's.
Uh, so funerals, memorials, youknow, weddings, you know, all of
those things, uh, and thenshifted into a supervisory role
with other staff, uh, directors.
And then the last.
Uh, what would that be?
20, you know, 18 to 2021 wouldhave been the senior executive

(55:59):
role, which is more operational,you know, side kind of saying,
Hey, I hear your vision.
How do we get there?
And then how do we mobilize theteam to go do it?
Huh?
So it really was, I just reallyfelt like I needed to help make
things a little bit better.
So you like probably had likeone of the worst jobs during
COVID nation.
Not to flashback to that time,but it was challenging Not only

(56:21):
challenging on the operationalside, but we are such a
relational church at the timeYeah How do you navigate all
those relationships andeverybody's opinions on what you
should do what you shouldn't doand right online?
Services and meeting in person.
Well, I've got to jump to thepunchline by any means, but
you're like a country kid fromthe mountains, and you're like,

(56:43):
big football player y guy, andI'm just gonna guess that your
fear level over this bug wasn'tquite as extreme as what you
were supposed to expect, orwhatever.
No, we grew up not, nobody had asnow day, you didn't care about,
you know, that, you just wentabout your business, all of
those things, and Yeah, that waswhat I used to say, and it
pissed people off a little bit,but I was like, you know, where

(57:05):
I'm from, like, if there's avirus, or a Bug, you either get
the bug or you don't get thebug, and then you either die or
you don't die.
And you just keep moving on andyou do the things that need to
happen.
And people thought that was notvery funny at all.
No, no, I get it.
I get it.
Now, as a leader, I You couldn'tsay that kind of shit like I
did.
No, because as a leader, Iwanted to follow the rules.

(57:26):
And then, uh, with the county,we have a great relationship,
you know, with Larimer County.
I wanted to navigate that, youknow, well.
But I will never forget thevisual, Kurt, of our 1, 400 seat
auditorium being set aside inTwo seaters and four seaters and
six seaters and eight seatersand trying to guide families to
sit six feet apart.
I will never forget what ourauditorium looked like and how

(57:47):
that just changed what churchfelt.
Oh, I'm sure it was gross.
It was unbelievable.
Just like crickets.
2, 000 people watching from homebecause you're like, did you
disinvite people or was itenough fear that just didn't
fill up the stands anyway?
It was a combo.
We did encourage people to watchonline if they could just for
the safety of the people thatreally wanted to be in person.

(58:09):
So it was just a unique blendthat we had to try to figure
out.
A lot of technology, uh,development and implementation
at that time.
Absolutely.
A lot of hires to be able tonavigate it.
No offense, but you guys werekind of the fancy church with
the super cool band all the timeanyway.
And so, like, part of theexperience was being there with,
like, felt like God was rightthere with you, you know?

(58:30):
Right.
Right.
I mean, I'm sorry to, no, no, Iappreciate it.
It's funny cause my town, mytown would have fit.
It's an amazing production.
Like it was beautiful.
One of the times I've beenthere.
Yeah.
When you have a producer for aservice and, you know, making
sure everything flows well.
10, 000 members and 4, 000attendees, your budget is a lot
bigger than our little church,you know?

(58:50):
And so to go from that to likehere, here's, you know, no
community, barely.
Right, you got, what, 200 peopleattending with this proper
spacing or something instead of1, 300 or whatever, or 2, 000?
Yep.
Wow, you want to know what theunique thing was during that
whole thing is everybody wouldautomatically assume that we

(59:11):
suffered, you know financiallyYeah, the interesting thing was
is you know, there were someblips of course, but people's
generosity during that timebecause everybody got free money
Everybody got tons of free moneyfrom the government.
It was life was easy You didn'thave to spend gas money anymore,
right for a month right off yourbudget.
You just stay home and Yeah, wewere grateful for the generosity

(59:34):
for sure.
So, so I guess from a financialmanagement and stuff, it wasn't
that hard, but from anoperational standpoint, it's
like, uh, there's an old BillCosby line that I don't know the
secret to success, but thesecret to failure is to try to
please everybody.
Oh gosh.
Yeah.
Does that resonate with yourexperience there?
Boy, it is so true.
And Pastor Derry would alwayssay, Hey, we're going to try

(59:57):
something.
If it doesn't work, we'll goback to what wasn't working
before.
I love it.
I love it.
So, uh, then kind of like,because if I remember right, May
2021 was like, Oh, we're goingto be free.
And then.
Oh shit, all those vaccinesdidn't really work and we
clamped back down in Septemberof 21 or something like that.

(01:00:17):
Is that true?
I don't remember the specificdates.
I think it did.
But when I started at Sky Corralin May of 21, we were still
navigating some of that.
Yeah, yeah, and then it kind offreed up for that summer and
then locked back down again.
Right.
No, seriously, we had to say topeople, if you're not of the
same family, you might have tosleep in a mask.
And we looked at each other andwent, how, how can we enforce

(01:00:38):
that?
Right.
Well, I had, I had members leaveLoco Think Tank because we
didn't have a policy on how wewere going to require it.
And I was like, well, it seemslike I should have just said it,
I guess, like restaurant rulesanyway, I don't know.
Glad we're on the other side.
Um, I feel like it's a good timefor a break.
Okay.

(01:01:46):
All right.
Well, so we got Faith familypolitics is our mandatory
segments.
Okay.
Do you have a preference onwhere you would start?
Probably family.
Yeah, that's an easy one for me.
Talk to me about your family.
So, uh, this, this little galthat followed you up into this
crappy job in Fort Collins, waswhom again?
Uh, Christina Seiler was hermaiden name.

(01:02:06):
Yes.
And, uh, met our freshman yearat Colorado Christian.
Uh, just, uh, met our freshmanyear and it was like, man, she's
from Boulder.
Okay.
Uh, born in Iowa.
Uh, but she was a Boulder highschool girl.
So she was an outcast in hercommunity as well.
Yeah.
Christian.
Oh, everybody always talkedabout, wait, you're a Christian
and you're from Boulder.
So she had to answer thatquestion.
I don't know how many times, butyeah, freshman year we met and

(01:02:28):
just dated all the way through.
It was a great time to get toknow her and.
Uh, me being a small town boy,it was like, wow, you know,
somebody from a big city, right?
Somebody can see me.
Why would she say that she sawin you?
Other than the fact that youwere like on the basketball team
or whatever.
Yeah, and she could have caredless about that.
That was the interesting part.
I just, you know, being agentleman, you know, being kind,

(01:02:51):
you know, all of that.
Yeah.
So it had to be somethingbecause it wasn't my clothes.
Coming from a small town, man.
The fashion was flannel orflannel.
You know, it absolutely.
You're calling it right there.
Yeah.
We always talk about that, butyeah, so met our freshman year
and then dated all the waythrough.
And you, what you liked abouther was that she seemed to like
you.
No, well, no, I mean, she was abombshell.

(01:03:12):
I was just like very drawn toher, but it was really her
personality.
She was very, just.
Outgoing and just so interactiveand that's just somebody I
hadn't been around in a longtime.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And so that just, you know,jumped right out at me.
Well, and that kind ofpersonality doesn't really
blossom as much in small townenvironments.
No.
Like they're usually shusheddown.

(01:03:34):
Correct.
Uh, by the peer pressure of notbeing like a, a butterfly or
whatever, right?
Yeah.
Yeah.
So yeah, it was definitelydifferent than I'd ever
experienced before.
Yeah.
I didn't date a lot.
I'm in high school, so this wasgonna be my first, you know,
major, you know, datingexperience.
Yeah, exactly.
Uh, and so yeah, learned a lotthrough that, and we just kept
getting to know each other.
Okay.
And she made me laugh, and shewas so creative and adventurous,

(01:03:57):
and I just needed that.
We felt like we were a reallygood blend for each other.
I dig it.
How, like, did you get engagedsoon, or did you go all the way
through college?
All the way through college.
It was like, kind of not, itwasn't really culturally normal
to We know we talked about it.
We talked about getting engagedin college and we said why would
we do that?
We don't only get to do thisonce.
So let's finish college.

(01:04:17):
Plus her dad was still payingfor college.
Yeah, right, right It wasn'tcertain if he And great family.
So yeah, it's the funny We gotengaged the fall of our senior
year and then got married afterwe graduated college.
Okay, and um Like what was herfamily up to like being a
boulder and stuff like where didshe did she have siblings as

(01:04:39):
well?
And she did.
Yeah, she did So older brotherolder sister and then herself
the unique part of that story isall three of them were adopted
Mmm, my mother in law currentmother in law that I know had
cancer as an early teenager Soshe couldn't have kids.
Oh, so her her parents adopted.
Okay, all three of them.
So that's a pretty nice storydomestic adoptions Yep all

(01:05:01):
domestic Yep.
Yep.
Des Moines, Iowa.
Okay.
Interesting.
Yeah.
And that's where she came to CCUfrom was Iowa.
Nope.
So they kind of born and raised.
Yeah.
And then, but Boulder wasBoulder.
Yeah.
Boulder high school and all ofthat.
Yeah.
I came to Colorado Christian.
Gotcha.
Yeah.
Um, And you have children?
We do.
So, two daughters.

(01:05:22):
Uh, Reagan, who's 26.
Okay.
Uh, Whitney, who's 24.
They live in Loveland.
Okay.
Uh, they're roomies.
Alright.
Which is great.
It's fun having them close.
Yeah, yeah.
And our, uh, son is Tennyson.
He's 20.
Uh, junior at Grand CanyonUniversity in Phoenix.
So, you've got like a fresh, uh,fresh empty nest, kinda.
We are figuring that out.
Yeah, Kurt, it is definitelydifferent.
We're enjoying it.
Lots of flexibility.
Yeah, yeah.

(01:05:42):
We soak up the time wheneverybody's home, but then we
definitely enjoy the time wheneverybody's out.
And no grandkids or any, like,hints of that with girls or
roommates, so.
Right.
Yep.
Yep.
One of them's dating, the otherone is not at the current time.
Okay.
Yeah, so nothing on the horizonright now.
Would you like to do the, uh,One word description challenge

(01:06:03):
for your children.
Oh man, go for it.
You mean give one word to eachone of them?
For each one of them.
Yeah.
You've given them names andages, but if you want to come
back with a word for them, yeah,absolutely.
Reagan, our oldest positivewould be the one.
Was she named after RonaldReagan?
No, she was not.
You know, my wife being anEnglish major, uh, you know,
Reagan, all the stuff inliterature and things.
So that's where that, that namecame from.

(01:06:23):
I was thinking maybe it wasabout that time though, wasn't
it?
No, wait, no.
It's way after Reagan.
Holy crap.
We're so old.
We might want to edit that out.
40 years ago was when Reagan wasaround.
Yeah.
And then, uh, yeah, Whitneywould be caring.
Very, very much caring.
Yeah.
And then Tennyson would be aentrepreneur.

(01:06:45):
Tennyson is also, uh, Englishkind of a name, right?
It is.
Yeah.
That is spelled with a Y.
His is spelled with an I.
Um, but if you're okay with it,I mean, his name comes from a,
uh, university of Coloradofootball player named Tennyson
was a tight end at theuniversity of Colorado.
And, uh, we met him throughfellowship of Christian
athletes.
We're like, if we ever have aboy.

(01:07:05):
We really like that name.
And so two girls later, we hadour boy and we said, we like
that name.
Let's go with that.
That's good.
Yeah, exactly.
Um, that's gotta be aninteresting time right now
because like right now is where.
The rubber hits the road alittle bit in adulting, right,

(01:07:26):
for them.
And you can't put a firm hand onthere, but you can always be an
encourager.
And like, it's just, you know,the next ten years you're gonna
see how, how things play out.
Who they, who the girls chooseto be their husbands if they do.
Correct.
Um, and all that.
Yeah.
It's very unique.
So to say, Hey, I'm going to beavailable, but then watch them.
Adult is very, very unique.

(01:07:47):
Yeah.
Yeah.
And you can come stay up at theranch whenever you want.
Right.
Right.
Yeah.
The oldest is a fourth gradeteacher at Rice elementary.
So she's in the education worldright now.
And then, uh, Whitney is at GoodSamaritan in Loveland.
Oh, yeah.
Activities director and keepingpeople moving and all the
activities there.
What's her last name?
Whitney Kissel.
Yeah.
Okay.

(01:08:07):
Yeah.
I actually.
I went and spoke to a group ofguys down at the Good Samaritans
down in Windsor about likeentrepreneurship or something.
I'm guessing the previous personthat had the program director
job was Maybe.
That's Windsor.
She's in Loveland.
Oh, okay.
Gotcha.
Gotcha.
Two different locations.
So anyway, one of her peers, Iguess.
Yeah, somebody was like, Hey,would you like to come and talk
to like 25 old dudes about LocoThink Tank?

(01:08:30):
And I was like Sure, I guess.
You know, why not?
Yeah.
We can talk about the podcast,too.
And I bet they enjoyed that.
Oh, yeah, for sure.
Yeah.
One of them was supposed toactually refer me to his son,
who's a CEO of a local business,but I guess he slacked on it,
so.
Oh, man.
Sir, if you're listening, youdidn't follow up.
Like I asked you to, uh, but Iwould say the greatest joy of

(01:08:50):
watching them do adulting, youknow, Kurt has just been seeing
them make their decisions, youknow, on their own and to watch
them do that has been pretty funso far.
So good.
So far.
So good.
Very proud of them.
Um, we're, I'm going to sayScotch Irish.
You talking about our name?
Yeah.
Your family, man.
See, you're going to hit a spotwhere I don't know much about

(01:09:12):
it.
Well, Kissel sounds like more ofa British name.
But usually the British namesare because the British like
raped some Scotch Irish girl orwhatever.
Because that's how they got thebig ones.
Because the Brits didn't,weren't big.
It was the Scotches and theIrish that were like the big
people, plus the Danes and theSo, but Kissel seems like a
English name to me.

(01:09:34):
Yeah.
I don't know.
No, no, mom.
I know you're listening to thisprobably five times, so you can
tell me where that's from.
Okay.
We just weren't big into that.
So I'm not necessarily sure.
I know the Kissel car.
I get comments all the timeabout the, the brand Kissel car.
So I don't know what that is.
Yeah.
You'll have to, where's it from?
Don't even know, I shouldn'thave brought it up, get this out
of here.
We're not getting that out ofthere.

(01:09:55):
We're keeping this.
Um, I just, I'm just surprisedat the lack of curiosity, I
guess a little bit.
Yeah.
I don't know where that camefrom.
I just have never been like, youknow, what kind of name do we
have and where are we from?
I've just, I don't know.
And it's kind of, cause I'veactually had people look at me
like, Why are you asking methis?
You know, especially if it'slike an Asian name or something.
I'm like, well, because I wantto know if this is a Filipino

(01:10:17):
name?
Is it a Korean name?
Is it a Japanese name?
I don't know.
I'm curious.
Um, but as like an old whiteguy, people are like, well, why
do you want to know?
Uh, especially in Mega Days,right?
Um, so But anyway, that would bemy suspicion, uh, especially
with a Catholic background andjust being big.
Like the Brits weren't very big.

(01:10:38):
Like they're like little KingCharles sized people and stuff
like that.
The aristocracy didn't need tobe tough.
Interesting.
I don't know.
Yeah, well my dad was 6'3 and mymom, Kurt, was 5'4.
So there you go.
Really tall.
My wife is four 11 and I'm six.
But I was, that's part of mylisteners will be like annoyed,

(01:10:59):
but I was five foot one at theend of my sophomore year.
And then I grew six inches ayear by junior senior as high
school.
Like, got to college at like,six, two, one thirty.
With a mullet.
Yeah.
With your original parts?
Yeah, that's the difference,that's the difference between me
and you is like, you were like astud muffin and I was like a

(01:11:23):
dorkopotamus kinda.
Oh man.
Eh, you know.
Whatever, at least I'm betterlooking than you now.
Agree.
So, uh, I think we kind offished out the family tree.
You just don't really know thatmuch.
I really don't have grandkidsyet.
So you got dogs or chickens oranything that are really close
to you?
Yeah.

(01:11:43):
We are a big time dog familycurrently have a woodle, which,
you know, everybody gets tiredof hearing.
A Wheatland?
No, Wheaton and a poodle.
Wheaton Terrier and a poodle.
Yeah, that's probably prettysolid.
I've got a schnauzer mix.
Okay.
Uh, schnocker, schnauzer,cocker.
Okay.
Yeah.
Um, so that's probably 30, 40pounds.
Yeah.
38.
Okay.
Right in there somewhere.
Yep.

(01:12:03):
Yep.
We had a sheep dog, was ourfirst one, so just a big hairy,
you know, dog.
We loved that.
But then we got into the Wheatonmix.
Yeah, it's nice having nonshedding dogs.
Oh, 100%.
Yeah, Jill wants like a, aBernese Mountain Dog next.
I'm like Maybe a Bernadoodle,but definitely not a Bernese,
like, no way.

(01:12:24):
May as well go to the St.
Bernard route and have the jowlsand the drips right on top of
the hair.
I don't want none of that.
I don't want no slobber.
I don't want no hair, really.
So, um, faith or politics next?
Oh, yeah, faith, for sure.
So, talk to me about, what wasthe, the 65 year old lady that
started taking you to churchand, I guess part of my question

(01:12:45):
is, why did your parents, whywere they okay with it?
Like, that's a reallyinteresting scenario.
Everybody asked me that and itdidn't happen right away.
So definitely, uh, she startedcoming in to do the shopping.
She got to know us.
My mom was the cashier and I wasthe bagger, you know, putting
the groceries in the bag.
Just got to know sweet old Edie.
And, uh, she started justasking.
Yeah.
And they said no.

(01:13:06):
They originally said no forquite a few weeks.
And then I don't know if it wasthe next summer or if it was
just later that summer.
Yeah.
They said.
Come get him, bring him home, doyour shopping, and then you can
head out and we'll see you nextweek.
And that just worked out.
Huh.
So that's where, yeah, thatbegan.
And did you, like, you fell intoit pretty strong.

(01:13:26):
Sounds like you were like one ofthe big cheerleaders around and
whatever, like when the questionwas whatever you were the first
one to say, Jesus, I was more ofan Edie fan than I was a Jesus
fan.
I think, uh, just, I wanted tohang out with Edie.
Uh huh.
She was just one of those lovingladies that just had great
stories.
She modeled it for you, kind of.

(01:13:46):
Yeah, and then she'd invite meup to her cabin, and I would
tube down the river, and she'dmake me sandwiches, and it was
just like a kid's dream.
Just the two of you?
Like you would hang out withthis old lady?
Oh yeah, totally.
Nothing weird though.
No! Just kidding, sorry.
No, family cabin, it's all, Iknow, at this day and age, you
wouldn't know.
Right, you'd be like, thatlady's crazy.
Back then, in a small town, it'sjust, that's what you do.
What a lovely thing.
Everybody knows everybody.

(01:14:07):
She was probably so lonely.
For sure.
In some ways.
She didn't have like a family?
She did.
They would come up occasionallyin the summer.
Okay.
So they're from Texas.
And so it just depends on whenher time, she stayed all summer
time.
Yeah.
People would come and go.
So her family would come and go,but I was like thinking added,
you know, grandson, if you will.
Right.
Oh, what a beautiful likerelationship.

(01:14:28):
I think that's what.
It's so interesting, like, inthis world that's evolved since
then, like, everything is cool.
You can be whoever you wanna be,you can call yourself whatever
gender you want, you can be in arelationship with whoever you
want, but stuff like that isn'tcool.
It's weird.

(01:14:48):
You know, like, but it'sbeautiful.
Right.
Like, to hear about it here 20years later, or even to think
about it happening today.
You know, what a beautiful thingfor an elderly person to have,
probably a brighter than averagesix or eight year old kid.

(01:15:08):
To just hang out with and talkwith as they expand their
knowledge of the world and youknow She fed you and you fed her
with probably so much.
Yeah, so and I think part of itwas I mean as a family business
Most people that have familybusinesses No, it's a lot of
work.
So I think part of it for herwas Does he ever get outside of
the store at all?

(01:15:28):
Oh, wow.
You know, because if mom and dadare always in the store every
time it opens and closes, what'she doing during the day?
So I think part of it was, hey,can I help, you know, Scott's
parents out by just getting themoutside and letting them hang
out and be a kid.
How was your, like Family incomelevel, like, could you go out to
restaurants?
Could you ever travel or dothings?

(01:15:49):
We would do one vacation a year,typically.
Okay.
Uh, not a whole lot of out toeat.
I would say our family, uh,really focused on, you know, the
things to enjoy experiences.
Yeah, yeah.
Snowmobiles.
Fishing.
Fishing.
Getting a raft.
You know, making sure thatwhatever we did as a family, we
could do it on the weekend andwhenever the store was closed.
Yeah, yeah.

(01:16:11):
And whenever there was thatopportunity, then it was like,
took it, get it.
Yep.
You took it.
Interesting.
Yeah.
Um, well, and the interestingthing about a retail store like
that is like every dollar thatyou pull out of that business is
like a dollar less than you canhave an inventory.
Which is like a dollar less thanthe store can make down the road
kind of thing, right?
Like you're probably familiarwith that notion.

(01:16:31):
Different than a church.
You just fill the pews a littlemore and you get more money kind
of thing.
Yeah, my brother was thebutcher.
Sister was the bookkeeper, youknow, so you just kind of
enjoyed it.
Yeah, yeah, and I was the sneakylittle kid that would
accidentally cut the wrappers ofa Snickers when I'm opening the
box Oh, I guess I'm gonna haveto eat this.
I'm gonna have to eat this one.
Exactly.
That's the beauty of it Anytimes of doubt in your faith

(01:16:54):
journey or times of realchallenge?
For you, for sure.
I think, you know, one of thetimes was when I left the
fellowship of Christian athletesand then could not find another
ministry job, I thought, youknow, what, what's my purpose.
You know, if I can't go backinto full time ministry, you
know, what, where do I land inthis whole, you know, ordeal.
And then as I got into the foodindustry, you know, a couple of

(01:17:16):
years into there, I was reallystruggling.
Uh, my wife would look at me andsay, you know what?
You are in ministry.
You're around people that don'tknow anything about church every
single day, more than you everhave in all your other jobs.
So kind of like suck it up, uh,figure out how to interact with
people and not start, you know,don't keep complaining about not

(01:17:36):
being in full time ministry.
And it was at that moment whereI said, okay, I'm all in, it
gives bagels and I'm going to dothe job that I know I can do,
and I'm going to have a goodtime hanging out with these
people that don't know muchabout church at all.
And then did.
That advanced kind of the causeat Gibbs we didn't kind of flash
forward and past that chapterBut it seems like there was
probably a lot more there than Igave credit to yeah Gibb at the

(01:17:59):
time You know Gibb who owned it.
He would call me, you knowpastor on the call.
Okay.
Yeah, he's like, you know I justI'm kind of the traveling pastor
for Gibbs bagels.
And so I've officiated someweddings.
I was the amount of faith Uh,also, minimally, and then as we
got to know each other, hereally, uh, grew in his faith
and was just peppering me withquestions all the time.
His favorite was, Hey, Scott,you got time?

(01:18:20):
Let's go for a walk.
Let me go for a walk around thebagel store and typically a
spiritual question would pop up.
So some of my favorite memoriesthere, for sure, for sure.
Um, politics.
Oh boy.
You are well versed, it soundslike, in politics.
Uh, pretty much not versed atall.
Uh, I think it's partly from myupbringing.
Never talked about politics.

(01:18:41):
Uh, it was never a discussion asfar as, you know, voting or
anything like that or Like itwas kind of one of those kind of
church kind of things.
You just kind of live with theworld that evolves.
It's God's will.
And so don't you question it?
Yeah.
I just, I never remember oneinstance of my parents saying,
Hey, let's talk about leadershipin our country.
Oh, interesting.
Yeah.
So like, We're in a super weirdtime right now.

(01:19:06):
Like, for listeners, we'reFebruary 4th.
Like, Doge has been, like,dumping the USAID files on the
countertop, saying, here's allthe dumb shit we're paying for,
and there's a bunch of protests,and we're dis immigrating.
Quite a few thousands of people,some of which have criminal
records, some of which don't.

(01:19:27):
Like, are you familiar with anyof those kind of hot button
topics right now?
A little bit, yes.
Just enough?
Yeah, just enough.
And like We watch the 10 o'clocknews for 30 minutes and that's
literally my Interaction withit.
Okay.
Okay.
Except for a few notificationson my phone.
Well, don't watch this.
Don't watch the news.
Just kidding.
Well, I mean, to be frank, it'sbeen a more interesting season

(01:19:49):
in politics.
I've been kind of, I'm in thelibertarian guy that just like,
like I voted for Kanye lastelection and Gary Johnson the
time before that, but I did votefor Trump in 2024 and now he's
in and like.
Shit's going down like, I don'tknow if you, yeah, there's a lot
of, a lot of stuff happening,you know, massive anti

(01:20:09):
immigration stuff and likeAlma's, uh, from a local
Hispanic church.
And so she literally knows a fewdozen people that, I feel like
they are at risk of beingdeported, even though they
haven't broken any laws herenecessarily, but they haven't
gotten their shit together withthe immigration either.
And so I'm brushed up againstwith that.

(01:20:31):
And just, there's tons offederal funding to arts
organizations and nonprofits.
And like the city of FortCollins has had its staff for
their economic developmentdepartment grow from five to
twelve in the last few years,mostly due to federal funding of
Unknown utility.
And so there's like all thiscuts potentially coming because

(01:20:54):
Elon Musk and his AI poweredinvestigative machine is like
looking at how the government'sbeen spending our 20 years.
And it looks like it's terrible.
Anyway, so I brought you up tospeed.
Okay.
There you go.
There you go.
Thanks for the politicalupgrade.
So I guess like in your role,like, I guess let's go here.

(01:21:15):
Like is Skycrow Ranch a faithorganization?
It is, yes.
Yeah, we, our core values areoperate on Christian principles,
love your neighbor, and buildgenuine relationships.
Okay.
Okay.
So with the first one being theChristian principles.
Yep.
So, like from a Not exclusive.
I mean, people would say, well,faith friendly because anybody
can book Sky Corral.

(01:21:35):
Uh, doesn't have to be faithbased.
Could I have my lesbian weddingthere?
No, we don't do weddings.
Yeah, we have a wedding venueright down the road.
Yeah, they're like, yeah,they're a mile away.
So let me think about, uh,politics that I can I know,
you're wondering, where can yougo with this guy?
Yeah, a little bit.
Like, where can I go to get someinteresting stuff?
I guess, let's talk about, um,like, the climate of the world.

(01:21:58):
Mm.
Um, because, simplistically put,we had, like, a president that
was, Barely there the last fewyears, um, I'm not going to get
into January 6th, whether thatwas good or bad or whatever, you
know, that's, it's settledhistory at this point kind of
thing, um, but like aninteresting thing is that if it

(01:22:20):
wouldn't have been for the 2020election, Trump wouldn't have
nearly as much horsepower now,like, and now he's got kind of
a, he's got the popular vote,he's got the The House, the
Senate momentum, and it's reallychallenging kind of the, the
deep state of America as it is.
Is that good or is he dangerous?

(01:22:44):
Or both?
Hmm.
Yeah.
And see, I don't know how youwant to go about this.
Cause I, I don't know.
Cause the, the two things that Ialways believe in when, if
you're going to talk aboutpolitics with me is, uh, one is
I don't envy anybody in politicsregardless of party because they
have an incredibly miserablejob.
Uh, two, when it comes toscripture, you know, we're
encouraged to, you know, supportand pray for anybody in

(01:23:06):
authority.
So regardless of who I.
Vote for whoever wins, whoeverloses as a believer, I am still
called to pray for those inauthority.
I may not agree with them, uh,but I do have to pray for them
and support them.
It doesn't mean I have to agree.
So I will say that I can'tengage in that part of it
because, you know, we're calledto love people.

(01:23:29):
You know, but if you don't knowwhat they're doing, how do you
know how to pray for themproperly?
I know.
It says in Romans 8, 26, that,you know, the Holy Spirit is
covering our gaps, covers us inour weaknesses.
So when we pray, I may not knowhow to pray for politician a,
but I can say, will you be withthat person?
That's in authority.
Cause I have no idea what's ontheir plate.
I have no idea who's aroundthem.

(01:23:49):
I have no idea who's chiming intheir ear to go about this a
certain direction, but.
Well, you give them wisdom inwhatever decisions, you know,
they're making.
All right.
So I can, you know, go down thatroad on those two things for
sure.
That's fair.
So regardless of politicalparty, man, we, we got to love
people.
We got to love them well, and wehave to pray for whoever's in
authority.

(01:24:09):
So can we take it more to thepolitics of our times instead of
Pacific people?
Sure.
Like.
Um, well, let me ask you thisfirst is give me a definition of
politics since I'm not highlyversed in it.
I don't engage with it all thetime.
Tell me where you're comingfrom.
Well, so like one, uh, this isa, uh, uh, interesting caveat or

(01:24:32):
a angle to come from, but likein a, in a.
leadership Fort Collinsconversation I was in.
I put forward the theory to the,the, they had the, the, the head
of the school counselors forPoodle School District there.
And the, the girls transingthemselves and saying they're
boys kind of thing was at peakfervor at that point in time.

(01:24:53):
And I, and I shared with themthat I, I feel like the, the
thing I'm concerned about, andone of the factors of this could
be that climate change hasconvinced girls that creating a
baby is like a bad thing.
Like, this baby that you createis just gonna, like, make more
carbon and, like, make the worlda worse place, kind of, in a

(01:25:15):
way.
Where, being a woman has alwayskind of sucked because you gotta
go through your monthly cycle.
You gotta, you're weaker thanmen, you're subject to their
potential physical dominationand things like that.
And it's all worth it becauseyou can make babies.
But if babies aren't valued,then that sucks.

(01:25:38):
And so that's politics to me.
Gotcha.
That climate change narrativeabout, are babies valuable or
are they a scourge on the earth?
Right?
And, and, and how does thosedeeper cultural issues influence
actual trends in politics andgovernment and how we go about
things?
You know, like, I've met peoplethat are very legitimately

(01:26:01):
confused about their, theirgender.
And like with this Trumpadministration, they kind of got
rid of the, the T and the Q kindof thing.
Like, we're not doing thatanymore.
We're no he, her, she, him,stuff like that.
Like, that's harsh.
And for people that arelegitimately confused or

(01:26:21):
struggling, that's very harsh,right?
But it's also kind of true,right?
For the most part, most of usare a boy or we're a girl.
And we should decide and be thebest boy or girl.
We should be.
So to me, those are politicalissues, even though they're
actually science issues in away, but it's cultural,

(01:26:42):
political, right.
Because of where the decisionsare being made.
Right.
Yeah.
So I don't view it as political.
I view it really morerelational.
Yeah.
And scientific for sure.
Right.
Well, and cultural as well.
Like, how has that beennavigating that both as a.
Pastor and as a person raisingdaughters.
Yup.
Yeah, definitely interestingconversations in church

(01:27:04):
leadership, you know, thesedays, regardless of what church,
you know, people are attendingto have those discussions, uh,
you know, as far as childdedications, weddings, you know,
things like that, uh, we alwaysgo back to what the Bible says.
And, you know, biblically, ittalks about, you know, uh, you
know, marriage was between a manand a woman.
I mean, God only created, youknow, two, you know, genders.

(01:27:26):
Um, is there confusion in theworld?
Of course, you know, there isconfusion.
There's confusion, not justgender, uh, confusion about, you
know, everything else.
Purpose, uh, family, you know,relational career, all those
things.
So it's not all just, you know,gender.
I think where our world ispolitically, as far as what
you're talking about is there'sjust confusion overall.

(01:27:48):
And there's just a lot of noise,a lot of noise happening in our
world.
Um, and a lot of.
Selfish, um, what's the word,uh, entitled, uh, things in our
culture right now is a veryentitled culture for the most
part.
I mean, I'm not saying it's ahundred percent all the way, but
you know, we don't, I don't gothrough a day without running

(01:28:08):
into somebody that is, you know,entitled, right?
It's pretty much, you know, amore common occurrence, you
know, these days.
So I'm trying to work throughthat myself as an individual and
as a leader of a nonprofit andas a family entitlement, you
know, how do you shift that tosome other, like, Humility or
gratitude or those kinds ofthings because that's more

(01:28:30):
better, right?
Yeah, so to interact withsomebody that might come across
as entitled, you can't tell themyou're entitled, right?
It's not gonna go well, youknow, or to talk to my kids, you
know, they're adults now, but tosay hey Let's talk through, you
know, this whole egoEntitlement, you know,
everything is mine, you knowkind of a thing we need to talk
about that We don't want to bethat as a family So I think, um,

(01:28:53):
this is slightly off topic, butI think the first time you
really ate humble pie Ultimatelywas kind of after that FCA job.
You'd kind of been a star.
You got the the gorgeous wifeEarly on you came from this
small town and then all of asudden you're like, oh, I guess
I got to work at the freakinBagel shop.
Yep.
Was that good for you?
Oh, yeah at the time.

(01:29:14):
I would have not said I wouldhave said what is wrong with
places not hiring me Now.
Absolutely.
It was good for me.
I mean, Kurt, the moment I havein my mind vividly is getting my
fifth rejection letter from thesame organization when I've
applied for multiple jobs.
And I just threw it.
I wadded it up, threw it on thefloor, and said, what the hell,

(01:29:36):
Lord, what's wrong with them?
What is wrong?
And it was like instantly inthat moment, it was like
entitlement kind of broke alittle bit.
It was, I felt this.
Scott Kissel can't always getwhat Scott Kissel wants.
Mm-hmm Cause you're ultimatelynot in charge.
And I just went for a drive.
I being honest, I bawled my eyesout and went, you're right.

(01:29:57):
I thought I was the cat's meowand I guess I'm not, where
should I work and where do I getmy own and I'll go back to doing
bagels tomorrow.
I love it.
I love it.
Thanks for sharing that.
It's an important moment.
I think I've barely met anybodythat didn't have a moment like
that along the way that actuallyachieved great things.

(01:30:19):
And I do reflect back on itquite a bit.
And I hope you keep doing greatthings.
Are you ready for the ping pongball?
Oh man, yeah.
I told somebody earlier today,I'm a little nervous about this
when you say, I think you saidinteresting and awkward, or did
you say intimate?
No, we're not going to getintimate.
I can try to make you blush orcry, but I'm not going to get

(01:30:44):
into your bedroom.
All right, great.
Um, grab three balls.
Okay.
And we have, uh, some specialprizes.
Actually.
Scott brought, uh, some, uh,breezed through car wash cards
and he brought some ferris wheelride cards at shields and we'll

(01:31:09):
we'll do some social mediaposting so follow us on both the
loco experience on instagram andon linkedin if you want to get a
chance at some of these prizesum so 22 22 is the first one 22
Let's see if I can read this.
Oh, I like this one.
I actually made this one up.
Me and Ava worked on thisproject.
If you could live anywhere forthree months a year, where would

(01:31:33):
it be?
Oh, no brainer.
Switzerland.
It has been on my list to livein the Alps for And three months
would be perfect.
Because I would pick, you know,the height of the best skiing
time and have a ski in and skiout residence of some kind in
the Swiss Alps.
Just gotta get the SkycrawlRanch, uh Yeah.
Built up a little bit.
So you can afford thatlifestyle.
Just a little bit.

(01:31:53):
Yeah.
Or meet somebody that can.
Yeah.
You're not talking like afriend, right?
Like you're already married.
Cause right.
Okay.
Good.
Just making sure you're notfishing for some rich Swiss girl
that can bring you up there.
Not at all.
A really good friend.
I would actually try to talk mywife into that.
Be like, Hey, but it's justthree months.
I can just go up there.
I'll be fine.

(01:32:14):
No, I'm not gonna Just kidding20 20.
What's your go to excuse whenyou want to get out of plans?
Oh Man, that is a good like ifone of your Church members wants
to be with you.
You just really don't want to,man.

(01:32:35):
I was taught at such a young,early age group to literally say
the generic comment of, and see,I'm outing myself.
So now when I use this, somebodyis going to say, that's just
your excuse.
That's awesome.
I can't, I have a previousengagement.
Oh.
And that previous engagement orcommitment could be, I'm
watching a football game athome, I'm going to hang out with

(01:32:56):
my wife, I, you know, engagementis a broad term, but that is my
go to is, I'm sorry, I can'thave a previous engagement.
A previous commitment, I sayactually.
Correct.
Yeah, I do that one too.
Good one.
Okay.
Number six.
If you could only eat Oh, wejust had this last podcast.

(01:33:19):
Did you?
Do I need to take another one?
No, it's okay.
We'll start the balls betternext time.
It's a good question.
Okay.
If you could only eat one colorof food for the rest of your
life, what color food would youchoose?
My favorite color is red.
It also goes with marinara sauceand pizza.
Right.
Steak.
Anything red.
Steak.
Absolutely.
Tomatoes.

(01:33:39):
Ribeye.
You name it.
Cherries.
Strawberries.
raspberries.
Yep.
Yeah, I don't Ava.
I don't think anybody else isgoing to choose any other colors
of red.
Is that what it's been?
What was last week?
There's only two so far, butyeah, they both read, read,
read.
I can't think of any other, likewhat I'm going to choose.
Brown, I guess maybe brown food.

(01:34:00):
Good.
Yeah, I guess, but I don't know.
Green happened.
People got to say green forveggies.
I know, but If there was greenmeat, if there existed any kind
of good green meat, yes, butthere is no green meat.
So that means I can never eatmeat again.
So fuck it.
I'm choosing red, man.
No, but growing up in a grocerystore, I, we always got all the

(01:34:20):
expired stuff at our house.
All right.
So I definitely had some greenmeat, Kurt.
Right.
Just trim that shit off.
It's good.
Can't go to waste.
Take it home.
Dude, as a food trucker, cause Iwas doing that for a while.
Right.
And I would have like.
A gallon of extra, like, pulledpork.
Like, I had a one weekexpiration, but do you think I
could eat that more than onetime or two times?

(01:34:43):
You can only do so much with it.
Rarely.
Or cilantro lime coleslaw?
That stuff is amazing.
I could eat a ton of that stuff,but not four times a week.
Heard.
So, that was probably, that wasinteresting.
How much of your, how much ofyour diet do you think was near
expiration food when you weregrowing up?
Easily 80%.
Easily.
Love it.

(01:35:03):
No, the joke in our house is,what's expired in the fridge,
and then, or, Hey, Scott, willyou smell this?
Is it expired?
I'm like, well, the date doesn'tmatter.
Let me smell it.
Totally.
I'm in the same ballpark with,why would I throw it away?
If it's like we have an exchangestudent now, my wife and I, we
don't have kids.
Yeah.
We don't, uh, we haven't had anykids, but we have, Lenny's our
12th exchange student from work.

(01:35:24):
Uh, he's from Finland.
Okay.
Yeah.
Yeah.
It's been pretty.
Pretty fun, he's, and I'm readyfor him to leave in a few
months, it's cool, you know, Idon't want any real kids.
Well, if I had one, it would becool.
Like, Jill, if you hear this,like, if you get pregnant, we're
having it.
Even though you're 44, we'regonna try.
Uh, but anyway, I digress.
Um, but I'm like, Dude, when yousee things that are getting kind

(01:35:47):
of tired, like, eat that.
And, but nobody else does,except for me, because, like,
there's a Clif Bar right there.
And some strawberries, and someblueberries, and all the other
things that aren't in danger ofexpiring.
But I'm like, well, if I don'teat it The chickens are going to
get it, you know, and I'drather, we really are similar in

(01:36:08):
a lot of ways.
So, oh, which question iswinner?
Um, which of those questions didyou like?
We're not going to choose thecolor red.
No, no, definitely has got tobe, if I could go somewhere for
three months, that's got to bethe winning one.
Yeah, Switzerland.
For sure.
Okay, so if you're listening tothis podcast, that's going to be
the answer, but you're going tohave to go to Instagram or

(01:36:33):
LinkedIn or some place to findthe actual post where we share,
like, DM us, and if you're thefirst one you get the answer.
Um, and then the localexperience.
That's our final segment.
Okay, your craziest experienceof your lifetime that you're
willing to share with ourlisteners Man, well the very

(01:36:56):
first thing that comes to mymind is trying to get bagels
sold To the airline industry.
Oh, so being a small mom I don'tknow Gibbs ever did that that
was kind of during the boom ofwhen Gibbs really took off Okay,
the wholesale business just shotthrough the roof.
So I'm gonna give a little salessecret and as you follow other
Bagel trucks around to see wherethey deliver Okay.

(01:37:18):
And so as a salesperson forGibbs, I did that and I found
that they went down to theairlines.
And so we're like, well, wegotta get our bagels on the
airline.
Right.
Took a long time to finally getan appointment, would drop off
samples all the time.
Say, Hey, oh wow.
Drop'em off.
Drop'em off.
Couldn't get anybody to call meback.
All your experience with Yancywas probably, or was that pre,
it was pre Gibbs was pre Yancy.
Oh shit.

(01:37:39):
Yeah.
So totally was different.
Persistent.
And that probably got you thejob at Yancey's in a way.
No, it really was.
And Gibb said he would switchthe business to Yancey's if they
hired me.
So it was a no brainer.
I like it.
But anyway, we finally got ameeting.
Gibb went with me and they said,we don't need bagels, but we
could use some breadsticks.
Do you guys do breadsticks?
And before I got no out of mymouth, Gibb said, yes, we do

(01:38:00):
breadsticks.
And they get the bestbreadsticks.
Yeah.
How many flavors do you need?
And when can we bring samplesdown?
And they said, well, we need 4,000 a day and we're looking for
rosemary.
He goes, great.
We'll bring some samples downnext week.
Oh, we go out into the elevatorin the lobby.
The door closes.
He looks over me and he goes,how the hell are we going to do
this?
I'm like, dude, I don't know.
You sold her breadsticks.

(01:38:20):
And so we went back to the bagelshop and probably can't tell you
the rest of the story, but no,we basically cut a bagel in
half.
Stretched it out, same bageldough, same recipe, bought a
different oven, steamed them,and uh, took them down, and they
bought them.
So we did breadsticks, cookies,uh, marinara sauce for the
breadsticks, the last productthe airline took was the bagel.

(01:38:42):
What was the, like the bend tothe revenue line from that?
My gosh, I mean it was, it wasin the range of, you know, 20,
000 a month.
You know, influx instantly,which was 20 percent or
something, but a big chunk waytoo long ago, but no, no

(01:39:02):
employees, just dough anddelivery.
Yeah.
Trying to figure out how to getthose things down there.
Yeah, exactly.
Interesting.
So anyway, we joke about thatone all the time.
You still friends with Gibber?
Oh yeah.
Yeah.
We text, you know, probably atleast every other month or so.
And he's in Florida.
I dig it.
Um.
Love you Gibb.
Last things you want to sharewith the people that are

(01:39:23):
wondering what more to knowabout Scott?
Man, I would.
So if you're going to go to,like check out Scott, Sky Corral
Ranch up at the website.
Oh yeah.
It's, I don't know,skycorralranch.
org.
Yeah, skycorral.
org.
Okay, skycorral.
org.
Yep.
And we believe something happensin the pause.
Get up there.
Oh yeah.
Slow your pace down.
Did I tell you that?
Just something happens in thepause.
Did, did your gal that called meabout featuring us in the

(01:39:46):
newsletter talk to you about myconversation with her?
No, I just saw it in the, in theactual newsletter.
Oh dude, it was so much moreinteresting than that.
Really?
Because I totally didn't getback to her for like quite a
while.
Okay.
And it was getting close to thetime and I was like, oh shoot.
So she called me and I was I wasin St.
Lucia, I think, maybe, or I wason vacation, um, or maybe not,

(01:40:08):
maybe I came back, but anyway,that was part of why I missed
it.
But she asked me for like apowerful moment that was
significant during our nextlittle summit up there, and, uh,
I said, well, you know, probablythe coolest moment is when Max
Anderson was talking about, Likehe had a set of like four or
five different like ways toreally scale an acquired

(01:40:29):
business because he's kind ofbuilt a group of Kind of pre
middle market size companiesthat he's put together and he
was our speaker up there andduring the first I don't know,
maybe 15 minutes in, he waslike, If anyone wants to take a
quick break and look at the mamabear and two baby bears, walking
across the, the, the valley overthere, Um, now would be a good

(01:40:52):
time.
And so we literally paused.
And that's the language I used.
So like, the speaker paused thepresentation, and said,
everybody go over to the windowand look, and here's this mama
and two babies.
And then came back, and thenyour, your gal who called me was
like, Well, that's so crazybecause the power of the pause
is actually the theme of ournewsletter here.

(01:41:14):
I was like, well, I'm Kurt Baer,so you can quote me on that.
I know the power of pause.
Absolutely.
Yeah.
And if we could apply that inour lives outside of Sky Corral,
if we can just have some morepause moments as a society, as
individuals and leaders, we'll,we'll do a lot better.
I dig it.
It's a, it's an important thing.
And, uh, I'm glad you get thepauses and provide the pauses

(01:41:37):
that you need.
Well, thank you.
Cheers.
Thanks, Scott.
Thank you for having me.
Yeah, of course.
All right.
Bye for now.
Bye.

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EXPERIENCE 209 | Scott Kissel - Executive Director of Sky Corral Ranch - Raised in Small Business, Educated in Ministry, Experienced with All of The Above

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