August 4, 2025 • 59 mins
Artificial intelligence is transforming how filmmakers and choreographers make work. It also offers exciting possibilities to become more efficient and productive with admin tasks, or filling in funding application forms to finance creative projects.
Performers, dancers or actors, can also make AI work for them, to prepare castings or find more castings for example, to name but a few.
In this episode, Cindy Claes (host; action actress; filmmaker) and Jenny Ambukiyenyi Onya (AI business owner and artist) discuss how to unlock creativity and productivity with AI.
Get your seatbelt on and listen to the list of top tips for actors, dancers, writers and filmmakers. Tune in to unlock the potential AI could offer you to expand your creative business even more!
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Welcome to the Loud Whisper Takeover podcast.
Today we are going to talkabout artificial intelligence,
ai.
How can we use it as makers,filmmakers, theatre makers,
choreographers?
How can we use it as performers, as actors, as dancers?
What are the excitingpossibilities that exist?
(00:22):
What are the things that we arescared about?
Today I have a very specialguest.
She's an artist herself.
She's creating and makingtheater, she's writing, she's
choreographing and she also hasa business focused on AI.
So what better guest than JennyOnya?
Hey, jenny, what's up?
(00:44):
Hello Cindy, I am fine.
How are you doing?
Hello Cindy, I am fine.
What about you?
I'm super excited.
So, number one, you're based inBelgium, let's say that to
start with, but you workinternationally.
Your AI business is workinginternationally.
Can you explain to us in anutshell what your AI-focused
business is doing and what youspecialize?
Speaker 2 (01:04):
in?
Yes, sure, thank you for havingme today, today's session.
So, first of all, thank you forthat.
Basically, I've created twocompanies, one in Belgium and
another one in DRC, democraticRepublic of Congo, but both
companies are focusing onproviding services and product
to other organizations, andproduct and services that are
(01:26):
focusing on artificialintelligence.
This is our main expertise andwe provide different kinds of
services that can go fromconsulting services that can go
to capacity building, researchand development, and you also
have impactful products thatactually are serving the
undeserved population in Africa.
(01:48):
So, yes, we are actually usingartificial intelligence to
create impact in our societies,are?
Speaker 1 (01:56):
you basically consulting businesses on how to
use artificial intelligence tobecome more productive, become
more creative, find moresolutions, or are you also
creating AI tools to help theirneeds?
Do you do both, or is it one orthe?
Speaker 2 (02:15):
other.
Actually, we are doing both.
We are helping other companiesthat would like to actually
integrate artificialintelligence into their own
processes, products,organization.
We provide strategic advisingon how to do it the best way,
and also we also create AIalgorithms.
(02:36):
So we have our own products.
Speaker 1 (02:38):
Yes, Can you tell us in a nutshell what you do as an
artist?
Because you're also an artist.
You work in the creative world.
Yes, sure?
Speaker 2 (02:46):
So basically, I am a choreographer and I'm also a
playwright.
I use, I will say, dance as avehicle for communication
through theater.
So basically, I create playwhen I use dance as a focus
point to communicate and toactually share emotion, tell
(03:09):
story.
So basically, this is what I'mdoing as a creative person.
Speaker 1 (03:14):
For all the people that are new to this podcast, I
am obviously a filmmaker.
I'm an action actress, I'm ascreen actress, but I also have
a background in dance.
I was a choreographer.
I used a screen actress, but Ialso have a background in dance.
I was a choreographer.
I used to create a lot oftheater as well, so we will be
talking about a whole bunch ofcreative expressions.
I will probably, in today'sepisode, talk a bit more about
(03:36):
how we can use AI in the actingbusiness, the film business, and
Jenny will probably add more interms of how we can use AI in
general, as creatives, and alsoin the theater and dance
business.
So I know you've also beenwinning quite a few prizes or
awards in the AI field.
Your leadership skills werehighlighted.
(03:57):
Can you give us a couple ofthings that really were
important for you?
Yes, sure.
Speaker 2 (04:02):
So, yes, I'm actually working a lot in Africa.
This is very important.
This is also coming from myroots, my background, originally
, even though I'm based inBelgium, but I had the privilege
to actually to provide a pitchin the annual meetings of the
African Development Group, whichis a very huge corporation in
(04:25):
Africa that is providing financeto can be bank itself, but it
can be also entrepreneur, andthey have like a specific
program that is focusing onwomen women in business in
Africa and they wanted me toactually pitch our companies,
our initiative, on the Africancontinent.
I was invited to provide thispitch in front of a huge
(04:51):
audience of leaders on theAfrican continent, so this was
actually very interesting.
But we also have worked and wonsome prizes in Belgium, such as
the D4D prize, which was aprize provided at Tervuren in
Brussels, so it was also aboutimpactful AI ideas and projects
(05:14):
that can impact undeservedpopulations that are outside
Belgium, and we were alsoprivileged to be shortlisted,
just to name a few.
Speaker 1 (05:25):
Amazing.
So, first of all, we are goingto talk about all the exciting
opportunities about AI.
We can talk about all thedoubts and the fears, maybe at
the end of this podcast, butfirst of all, it's about giving
a lot of hope, a lot ofexcitement, a lot of joy, a lot
of practical tools.
So we will talk around how wecan develop initial ideas, how
(05:49):
we can use AI in the creativeprocess, how we can then use AI
in supporting our making,putting a team together, funding
, application forms, pitchingand then obviously also
marketing.
When it comes to being aperformer, we will also look at
how we can use AI to train ourskills and also how to prepare
for castings, how to prepare fora role when we have been casted
(06:11):
, and how, maybe, to createInstagram content or social
media content as well.
So let's start.
We have an initial idea.
We are an artist.
Boom.
I have an idea.
What can we do with AI in order, not for AI, maybe, to become
the creator instead of me, buthow can it support our initial
(06:32):
idea?
Speaker 2 (06:33):
Yes, sure, but I would like just to emphasize on
one point that you actually justsaid, but it's important to
have this in mind throughoutthis entire session, I think.
So we tend to see that AI islike replacing things that we
are doing, but we rather see it,as you have to see it, in my
(06:54):
opinion as a virtual assistant.
So imagine I'm a creative, Idon't have like an entire team
of 10, I don't have the budget,let's say so.
This is also where AI isactually helping a lot.
So, basically, you will haveseveral virtual assistants and I
(07:15):
insist on the word assistant inorder for you to take a
decision as the I would say, thecreative person that actually
is taking charge of this project.
So this is important.
So, if we go back to what we arediscussing now, it's ideation,
concept development.
We can see artificialintelligence helping you.
(07:36):
I would say, generate ID, opennew doors of IDs that you didn't
add.
It will also help you, assistyou in the writing of narrative
arcs.
It will also help you exploretone, also have brainstorming of
characters, having a mapping ofa structure, mapping like the
(07:57):
hero journey.
So all these tools that you canuse are really helping you as a
creative in charge of theproject to open your horizons
and to have more ideas togenerate.
So just basically to have adiscussion with a computer and
just asking him yeah, histhought about your basic idea.
Speaker 1 (08:19):
So question do you only use ChatGPT or are there
other tools that you use for theinitial concept development?
So you have a narrative arcthat you want to clarify, maybe
the tone of your story, the herojourney, the characters?
Do you use ChatGPT or othertools as well?
Speaker 2 (08:35):
Yes, actually, chatgpt is a very, I will say,
very interesting tool.
It englobes a lot of, I wouldsay, ai-powered components.
Interesting tool.
It englobes a lot of, I wouldsay, ai-powered components, but
there is a lot of, I would say,tools that are integrating AI,
such as, you can see, sudowritethat is helping you prompting,
(08:56):
generate ID, create narrativearcs.
You also have Characterai soyou can type it directly on
Google.
Characterai that is helping youprovide a genre, providing you
a tone to a specific character,brainstorming about the
character of the, of your, yourstory.
And you also have a squibblerio, which is actually helping you
(09:20):
to have a structure mapping,like create a hero journey that
you are going to use for yourstory.
So there is a lot of othertools that sometimes are also
integrating ChatGPT.
Speaker 1 (09:33):
So, you see, in order for you to do a specific action
, Then another thing I'd love todiscuss with you is I feel like
when I talk about ChatGPT orother tools with some friends,
some are saying, well, no, it'slike so general and stupid.
But I actually feel there is anart in giving the right prompt,
(09:57):
because if you give ChatGPT,like if you can't delegate
basically to your virtualassistant, your virtual
assistant can't do a good job.
And I feel us as creatives orany person using AI, you need to
be really good at giving theright prompt.
And number one would you agreewith me?
And number two, how do youorganize your prompts, either
(10:19):
with ChatGPT or these otherwebsites, so that it gives you
something with meat?
Speaker 2 (10:25):
Yes, sure, and this is.
I actually really agree and I'mcompletely in line on what you
are saying.
It's the same as like in reallife.
For instance, I go back to myexperience as a leader of a
company.
Then you have someone that isworking with you, for you, and
you have to provide her or himinstruction, like you have to be
very clear about what you wantso that the work can be done
(10:48):
effectively.
So that's the same actuallywith GPT.
So, if you want GPT to actuallyprovide you the right answer,
you really have to be like tostructure your mind in a way
that it can provide you also aclear answer.
And also you also have tounderstand that there is, like,
different model.
I would say, precisely, there isdifferent model of GPT.
(11:09):
There is a free one, which ishaving more confusion.
You will see that, okay,sometimes it's like having a bit
of delusional information thatis providing.
Then you also have paid version, where the model is more
accurate, more precise, moreefficient.
So if you want to have a betterresponse of GPT, you have
(11:33):
actually to pay, and promptingis something that is now a new
job, actually With the, I wouldsay, the popularization of
ChatGPT in 2022, I think, yeah,prompt engineer.
It's becoming like a newprofile job that people are
seeking.
So it's like an expertise thatyou actually develop on how to
(11:56):
really in an efficient wayinteract with the computer so
that the computer provides youthe best answer.
Speaker 1 (12:03):
I'll give you two examples of how I've been
prompting different AI tools.
First of all, I try to keep myprompts short.
So, for example, I'm not goingto say to ChatGPT or any other
platform oh, write me a scriptabout this Viking that goes and
(12:24):
fights with some pirates in theocean.
I would say, hey, write me aparagraph of the opening scene
of the idea I have of there is afemale Viking.
Does it even exist?
I don't even know.
But I'd say that I have afemale Viking in mind.
A female Viking.
She just looks at the land thatshe's about to leave and she's
(12:48):
about to board on the boat thatwill take her away for three
months to fight some pirates.
Write me a paragraph and then,once I have a paragraph that AI
writes for me, like I rewrite it, and it's a back and forth of
rewrites and then this paragraph, I will develop it.
But I always give short prompts,if that makes sense, to AI,
(13:13):
another thing that I've alsobeen doing.
So I've been experimenting withvideo making tools, AI video
making tools, and so what I'mdoing, instead of prompting the
video making tool, I'm going tochat GPT and I say, hey, I need
to write a good prompt for myvideo AI tool.
(13:37):
This is what I want the videoAI tool to do.
Can you help me write a goodprompt?
And I say it needs to do thisand this and this and this and
this, but it seems to put it ina way that is clearer than if I
was to delegate straight away tothe video platform, if that
makes sense.
So my first question is do youthink I can improve what I'm
(14:00):
doing currently?
And number two do you have anysort of magic recipe of what
good prompting is?
Speaker 2 (14:08):
I will say that, yeah , in my experience, when I'm
prompting with GPT andinteracting with GPT, I provide
first, I provide the context.
So I provide the context so thatwe can actually narrow the
search of information.
(14:28):
So let's say that I want myspecific story to happen in this
specific geographical location,then I will tell it.
Then it needs to be in thislocation and incorporate this
and this aspect of the locationthat I'm focusing on.
And then after that, afterproviding the context, then I
(14:53):
ask the instruction in the mostdetailed way.
But, as you mentioned, I'm notgoing to type a lot of
instruction at the same timebecause then you might have some
confusion happening.
Then, after that I received theresponse, then it's not the end
.
Then I continue, likeinteracting.
(15:13):
I will say, okay, good answer,but I would like this to be
changed in this sense, orprovide this tone, or it's more
like that.
Then I continue the interactionuntil I receive the response
that I want to have.
So, basically, for me, if I cantell, like a recipe there is,
like, I assume that there islike better recipe that I'm
(15:35):
giving.
But for me the first thing isto provide the context, then
provide the variable meaning,like what you want, I would say,
to change in the context or inwhich degree you want the
algorithm to actually work inthe space that you're providing,
like the context, and then Ifinish with the instruction in
clear one, very precise one.
(15:56):
If it's too large or too vaguethen you might be disappointed
about the answer.
So I will work like that, soit's more like it's work like an
entonnoir, meaning like it'scontext, and then a bit of
information and then a precisionon the action that I want the
model to do.
And I want to tell somethingI'm coming from an Afro-decent
(16:19):
background and I know thatsometimes the answer that I want
to get are not incorporatingthe African culture and this is
a big, big, I would say, problem.
And things that people areworking on in the AI scene is to
have, I would say, gpt kind ofmodel that is also incorporating
the African culture and historyand knowledge, so that the
(16:43):
response that is given is notlike, I would say, european
based only kind of answer.
So, um, yeah, you interact withai, but you also have to know
that how ai is working isworking and how you have to
interact with the tool and themodel so that you get the the
best of it.
Speaker 1 (17:11):
Well, that's super interesting that what you're
saying there, because maybe wecan keep that as a question for
the end.
But how chat GPT eventuallyunify this world culture into
one, and where is our diversityand our specificities as
different cultures going?
Why is chat gpt not includingenough african culture?
Is that because there is notenough data online that it can
analyze, or what is?
(17:32):
How comes that the that it'snot finding or responding in
that way?
Speaker 2 (17:37):
it's about uh, there is a lot of factor, but I think
the most, I will say, adiscussed one is the data that
are used in order to incorporateall this information and
providing it to the user itself.
There is a lot of knowledge onthe African scene, but not all
the knowledge are digitalized.
Speaker 1 (17:58):
Let's continue with the creative process.
So you've already told us abouta couple of tools that you're
using.
What else are you using AI forwithin your creative process?
Speaker 2 (18:11):
Yes, if we go back to scripting, screenplay
development, then for editing,or consistency in terms of tone,
there is like a tool that Iused before the integration of,
I would say before thepopularization of, gpt, but now,
as GPT integrated is Grammarly,so Grammarly, you are able to
(18:32):
actually provide like a dialoguethat you have written and say,
okay, I want this dialogue to bein this specific tone, like I
want it to be joyful, there is alot of sadness inside or things
like that.
Then it provides you back whatmight be or could be the
dialogue.
So I think this can help.
(18:52):
If you want to have aconsistency in terms of tone
throughout the dialogues or thestory that you want to create,
then, after having, like, yourideation is done, then you have
creating yeah, like your, yourthe first dialogues with the
specific tone.
Everything has been done.
Then you are able to now go tothe face of fundraising,
(19:17):
fundraising hold on.
Speaker 1 (19:18):
Can we just pause for a second and continue on the
creative process?
First, because I'd love to addsome things and maybe also have
a discussion around some things.
So for me in the creativeprocess, so once I've written a
script, for example, I also use,for example, chat GPT to get
feedback on my script and Ispecifically tell chat GPT do
(19:41):
not rewrite anything, I want tostill write my own script, I
want you to read my script and Iwant you to give me feedback.
And I must say, very often ittells me, oh, okay, here are all
the pros, all you know thestrength of your script.
But here is where things aren'tvery clear and I must say it
(20:01):
has helped me in making myscripts clearer or certain bits
of dialogue clearer.
However, I often find that thefeedback is always very positive
, like, chatgpt will never tellme off and will never tell me
that I'm doing bad, bad work.
I know it tells me okay, thiscan be improved and stuff.
(20:21):
Do you that?
Using chat gpt as a tool forfeedback, is it enough, or is
there a way to prompt it for itto be more honest, or is it just
always going to word it?
You know, in a very british way.
The british always word it in avery, very polite way.
You know how to give feedback.
What do you think about usingit for feedback?
Speaker 2 (20:42):
Yeah, I would say that I will not, I would say,
base all my feedback from GPT.
This is actually where, like, agood phase can happen with
directly person, I would say,where I want to have the
feedback on, specifically onabout what we were discussing
about bias that are existing andthe fact that GPT is very happy
(21:07):
, always joyful, positive, islike also a regulation that is
happening and that is veryimportant in AI.
It's about ethic.
So I will say that it's normal,that it's positive, but you can
prompt it a bit to say, okay,please give me a feedback in the
hat of, let's say, a specificgenre or type of people that you
(21:32):
want actually to get thefeedback from.
But you will get the feedback,but I would advise not to just
base everything that you arerequesting a report on or
feedback on only based on GPT.
Go to the real world, go to theright person and ask them
directly their opinion.
(21:52):
So, yeah, we have to see that.
Ok, gpt, as we said, is virtualassistant, but you really have
to also know in which phase youwant this tool to be involved
fully or partially or not at all.
And I will just advise at thisstage to go directly to the real
(22:12):
world and to go outside thevirtual one.
Speaker 1 (22:16):
I actually have never used it for feedback, neither
as a dancer, choreographer orfor self-tapes as an actress, so
I've never asked feedback on avideo.
Have you ever tried, based on avideo, to give you feedback and
not based on a written document?
Speaker 2 (22:31):
No, never, to be honest.
No, this is actually, as I said, this is where you have to go
in the real world.
At this stage, it's like itwill be.
Let's say that you have as athis is me, that's my opinion.
As a creative you also have, Iwould say, a responsibility on
what you are putting, I wouldsay, in the world.
Basically, I think that allthat we are creating as a
(22:55):
creative have an impact, canhave, I would say, a huge impact
on people.
Restricting your opinion onwhat a computer is saying and
has been programmed to respondto a certain way is not like
yeah, I will say it's not like agood strategy.
On my sense and because youknow that your art, your story,
(23:20):
what you are actually creating,will have an impact, go directly
to the people that you aretalking to and ask feedback.
Speaker 1 (23:29):
Question around intellectual property.
So I have the paying version ofChatGPT and you know, in the
settings we can say or we candeactivate this setting so that
whatever we're putting into thesystem, that the system doesn't
use it to inform the rest of itsdata.
So I've obviously deactivatedit, however.
(23:52):
So I give you an example.
So I'm writing a series at themoment and I had, I think I had
10 or 11 episodes, but I wantedto have one extra one, and I was
struggling to find just thesummary of this extra episode
for this TV series.
And so I gave ChatGPT all myideas, all the scripts and
(24:13):
whatever of the world of this TVseries, blah, blah, blah.
And I'm asking it to help mefind an idea for an extra
episode, right?
And I said okay, give me threedifferent ideas.
Don't write the script, justgive me a general context of
what this episode could be aboutMe doing that.
(24:34):
And so number one is am Iputting myself in danger that
you know the script, even thoughI have?
I've copyrighted the rest of myscript but I'm putting it into
ChatGPT.
Are there any dangers insharing with ChatGPT your ideas?
Number two if I'm coming upwith this extra episode that is
(24:56):
inspired by ChatGPT.
I'm not saying ChatGPT is doingall the work, but it's
inspiring me, right?
It's a brainstorm, buddy.
Is there anything withintellectual property we should
be aware of?
Speaker 2 (25:10):
That's a very good question and I think it's also
applying not only in thecreative scene, but in other
kinds, I will say, of sector.
So what we actually see moreand more happening, and I think
it's legal and also focusing onwhat we were discussing about
the importance of what you areputting out there.
It's like people are nowexplicitly saying that this
(25:35):
content, this creation, this arthas been co-created by
artificial intelligence.
And they are mentioning that onpurpose, because, first of all,
because they know that, yeah,it's important to tell that,
because if there is like anaudit or someone that is asking
like more information about howyou create this and this aspect,
(25:59):
you will be obliged to tellthat it has been co-created by
artificial intelligence.
Just to come back to what youwere asking about are you in
danger?
I will ask you back thequestion what is your fear,
exact fear, when you are askingthis question?
(26:20):
Do you fear that other peoplemight have the same idea or,
like your idea will be displayedor disclosed somewhere?
So what's?
Speaker 1 (26:32):
I think I'll be very specific.
Let's say that I've written ascript, right.
Let's say that I've written ascript, right.
Let's say that I've written ascript about a short film and
it's a horror movie, right,about a girl that just lost her
mom.
Okay, and something ishappening in the house.
I'm now writing this script, Iam submitting it to ChatGPT.
Chatgpt now is using it as apart of its database to,
(26:57):
generally speaking, analyze theworld.
Blah, blah, blah.
Now somebody else across theworld is saying hey, I'd love to
write a short film, but Ireally don't know what to write.
I know I want a daughter and amother in there.
Give me five ideas, and hereChatGPT gives the idea of my
script.
Is that possible?
(27:19):
Is that not possible?
Is that a danger?
Is that not a danger?
It's a possibility.
Speaker 2 (27:29):
There is a probability that it might be
advice to someone else that isclose to your background in
terms of the data that you areactually sharing with GPT.
So it might happen that likenot specifically your ID, but
like a close one, can beproposed to another person that
is actually following the samepattern configuration settings
(27:50):
as you.
So it's important and it's agood, I would say, strategy for
you.
If you have a paid model, justto have more precise interaction
with the model, this is good.
And if you have the possibilityto be very specifically saying
that do not use my data foranything else, then of course
he's obliged to do it, butnevertheless we know, and it
(28:13):
might happen, that some part ofthe data can be used.
So we never know.
So we have to be conscious ofwhat we are sharing and what we
are not sharing.
And maybe, as I said, you willstart with a gpt to have, like
your, the basic id, but thenoutside of gpt, then you refine
(28:33):
it and you make it really onyour own, on your tone.
You add, like your signaturemeaning, like the way that you
are providing your stories, likevery unique to you.
Then you will see that it willbe very different.
Then you go and you protectyour art as usual.
So start, as I said and I willalways repeat that in the
(28:54):
session start with GPT, butcontinue with your own
creativity so that you avoidthat kind of problem before
moving on, just maybe a coupleof extra things that we have
tried with ai and or creativeprocess.
Speaker 1 (29:14):
So what I can share is I know that I've tried to
generate images from AI, forexample, to find ideas for
costumes, for example, to findactually I found an AI tool that
is a story border.
So from the script it made me awhole storyboard with images,
(29:35):
which was amazing.
Storyboard with images, whichwas amazing.
So the storyboard is calledstoryboarderai images.
I've tried images for pitchesas well for storyboards, just to
give like a vision, likea moodboard of a theater play that I'm
writing or a film.
What else have I used AI forrecently?
(29:55):
Songs, and I'm not saying thatI'm going to use these songs for
a film per se, but sometimes itcan be for something more, like
an Instagram little sketch orsomething.
Yeah, is there anything elsethat you've used a tool for for
your creative process that youthink of that we haven't
mentioned yet?
Yes, everything around.
Speaker 2 (30:13):
voiceover you can find really now, because back in
the time it was very robotic,but now you can really find
really realistic VoiceOver.
So if you need that for yourpitch let's say that you have
your presentation and you wantit to be more dynamic, having a
voice, a type of tone of voicethen you can actually use AI to
(30:38):
do it.
So you provide your text andthen you provide it to the
voiceover automatic voiceover sothat you are able to do it.
Video I've used a lot Automaticcreation of images, like you
have something in mind, then youprovide your text and then, of
course, you come back to theprompting aspect.
Then you have a generation ofimages.
(31:01):
Then, of course, when we aretalking about creation, we want
also the outside world to beaware of what you are creating
the film, the theater, anythingelse like the book, everything,
anything related to creativityand art.
Then you are able to createcontent.
So if you know your target, youknow your target, you have a
(31:25):
way to prompt it.
We discussed about prompting.
Then you are able to actuallyask what can be the scheduling
time.
So when and on which platformshould I post any content and
(31:49):
what should be the contentadapted to the target audience
scene of creation, creativity,culture.
But be mindful on which stageand how far you go with the
creation process with AI.
Speaker 1 (32:04):
For me, there is a huge potential when it comes to
Instagram and or social mediacontent creation that I feel we
can tap into.
So, for example, if we have afilm coming out or a theater
show or a dance show, there isso much that we have to put out
there, like in terms of contentthat is not just about the film
(32:25):
or about the theater show.
Let's say that our theater showlike I know that you had a
theater show about the mines inCongo but then it's like, okay,
how can I talk about my show andcreate content that is not just
the show but also around thetopic or the theme?
Some other people create a hugeamount of content interviewing
people in the streets and stuff,but how can AI help us create
(32:47):
parallel content of our film, ofour show?
If I make a show about cats anddogs, can AI start to make a
couple of funny videos of catsand dogs to create traction to
my Instagram account aroundfunny videos of cats and dogs?
To create traction to myInstagram account around my film
around cats and dogs, whichthen, you know, brings in people
(33:07):
that loves cats and dogs andthen will be interested in the
film.
I feel even as an actress.
So at the moment, you knowthere's this thing.
As a dancer, it seems to be soeasy to create content because
you just like put your camera inthe middle of nature, in the
middle of a train station, youdo a little dance and like you
have content.
But as an actor, you cannotstart, you know, performing a
(33:29):
monologue in the middle of atrain station and put that on
Instagram, unless you're in aproduction.
Sometimes it's difficult foractors to create content, but
I'm really looking into contentcreation with AI now, so that
not only I can create,eventually, instagram content,
but how can I also make it avision board?
For example, I want to do moreaction movies, right?
(33:50):
So at the moment, what I'mtesting out is can AI turn me
into a Viking Costumes, makeupand everything?
Really, it's Cindy.
Ai puts makeup on Cindy, putscostume on Cindy and then I can
perform a monologue at home.
But I can already visualize memyself and I with the makeup and
the costume and everything.
(34:11):
I think AI, if we use itintelligently, we can use it to
our advantages, advantages wherewe often feel stuck as
creatives, especially contentcreation, because there's so
much that is being demanded fromsociety now in terms of content
creation.
Speaker 2 (34:27):
It's how we can actually use or create the
avatar of Cindy, the avatar ofJenny, and putting this avatar
into a specific scene with aspecific, I would say, costume
and things like that.
(34:48):
And this I think it's veryinteresting because it's also
helping you on the casting level.
Let's say that you haveportrayed you as like the role
or in the scene that you reallywant to achieve.
Then you are able to alsoshowcase that to the world, to,
I would say, people that will bein charge of casting it, and
(35:08):
they will say, okay, I didn'tsee this aspect and actually it
fits what I'm looking for, whatI'm thinking about, or what I
heard they are looking for.
So this I think it's alsoopening, like you said, a door,
and if you don't have like anidea on how to use it, you can
also ask GPT.
You can ask GPT and ask thetool on how yeah, this is where
(35:32):
I am, this is where I want to goAdvise me on the steps and the
tools that I need to use inorder to attract this and this
person or to, uh, expand mynetwork.
Speaker 1 (35:43):
And you can also have this kind of advice, because
now we are just focusing on andthat's good on, um, the creative
process, but sometimes you alsoneed advice let's continue with
that thought when you said, oh,oh, we can use ChatGPT to see
which casting directors we canconnect with, how to network,
how can I expand my network andstuff.
(36:04):
So I have never, to be honest,had quite good responses or
specific enough responses whenit comes to that.
However, and maybe it's myprompting or maybe it's the
system that is not enough up todate yet, and maybe it's my
prompting or maybe it's thesystem that is not enough up to
date yet.
However, where I've been verysuccessful is, for example,
writing, rewriting my CV forcertain things like, for example
(36:26):
, about six months ago, Iapplied for a job.
I wasn't really sure if Iwanted it or not, but I was like
I need to submit for it.
They were looking for anartistic director or a cultural
center and I was like, let metry it.
I really used it as my careercoach.
So I was like here is my CV asan actress, here is my CV as a
teacher, here's my CV as aproducer.
(36:46):
Can we put it all together?
How can I structure my letterof motivation?
And I really I used chat GPT toanalyze.
Sorry, I first asked chat GPTto analyze.
Sorry, I first asked ChatGPT toanalyze the job post, the job
specifications.
What did they want from anartistic director of this
particular cultural center?
So it helped me to analyze iteven further than what I would
(37:10):
have done it.
Then it helped me to structuremy motivation letter, because I
had written like nine pages ofjust me being a passionate and
it was and then it helped me torestructure it in a way that was
way more understandable by aperson that had never met me.
So, yeah, that's how I've beenusing it for career development
before.
Have you ever used it for thesesort of things as a yes?
Speaker 2 (37:34):
I think, to be honest , and that's the best I will say
, advice that you can receivefrom GPT is about the carrier
and like screening of your CV oradapting based on a certain job
description, because these aredata that are like outside the
world, that are available on thewebsite and there is no like
subjectivity, if I can say itlike that.
(37:55):
So this is the job descriptionthat is mostly common, let's say
, for this specific role thatyou are actually applying for,
and we already have data thatare factual data from this
specific organization that youwant to apply for.
So I think JudgeGPT is the best,I would say, for this kind of
(38:16):
interaction and content that youwant to get from advice.
So, yeah, I use it a lot forthis aspect like CV screening,
job description, and what I liketo do also is to, when I want
to rewrite my CV or rewrite mymotivation letter, it's like I'm
asking also GPT to revise it,to review it, in a way, like
(38:41):
with a specific hat on, let'ssay that I know that the person
that will receive will be thedirector of XYZ company and I
know that this person has thisand this background already.
Person has this and thisbackground already.
I've done my research and Iwant GPT to be like specifically
(39:02):
revise, like review my contentbased on this hat that he's
putting, and this I provide itas a context.
So, as I said, my prompting isalways like in Antenoir I put
the context and then I askspecifically the instruction,
and then you will see that theresponse is different when you
are asking GPT like just reviseit like that, or revise it or
(39:24):
review it in the perspective ofthis specific profile.
That's the best way to interactwith this model.
Speaker 1 (39:34):
So that can maybe lead us to funding application
forms, because sometimes wewrite with so much passion and
if I or you had to share thatwith another artist or a
filmmaker or they would totallyunderstand us.
But if we have to explain ouridea to an institution that
gives grants and money to makeit possible, sometimes we have
(39:56):
to word it differently.
That gives grants and money tomake it possible, sometimes we
have to word it differently.
So asking ChatGPT to review ourdocument with another hat on is
going to be crucial at thatpoint.
Have you ever used ChatGPT forfunding application forms and
can you give any maybe specificsof how it can work?
Speaker 2 (40:11):
Yes, I've done it.
I've done it basically.
So I always put the context,this is the context, this is the
fundraising campaign that Iwould like to apply for and also
provide a website.
So you know that GPT also iscapable of analyzing what is the
content of a specific website.
So I provide this first and Iask can you please review my
(40:35):
answers based on the need, therequirement of the fund, and
then GPT is capable of tellingokay, this is actually what you
are saying at this paragraph.
It's really good, and then youcan maybe improve this.
Also, some advice on how toimprove the text.
(40:56):
So, of course, I've used it alot and I think this is a game
changer improve the text.
So, of course, I've used it alot and I think this is a game
changer in the scene.
Before that it was taking a lotof time and, yes, it also helps
when you are.
Sometimes you also have tocreate pitch deck and in the
creative world then pitch deckwith words sometimes it might be
(41:18):
be like not boring, but peopleare not like feeling what you
are.
You want to project, what youwant to create, so they have to
be emotionally attracted to youridea.
Then you also have tools suchas beautifulai, where you are
able to actually create videowith a specific atmosphere tone.
(41:40):
Then you project, like you helppeople to project them into
your ID.
So you have your pitch deckthat is complemented and
generated with a beautifulai.
You have your fundraisingapplication that has been
improved and reviewed by GPT,knowing the context, and then
you also have sometimes you haveto create a budget.
(42:00):
Then you can use tools to havea budget.
You can use tools such as arcai, where you have a finance model
, financing, forecasting, Iwould say Excel spreadsheets
that is created.
So this is helping a lot interms of time and you always put
(42:21):
the context.
I think the like to provide thecontext first is key, because
then you want this model to beanswering really within the
context, because if you areoutside the context, of course
you can have the very goodapplication well written, but if
it's not matching the need ofthe fundraiser, then what's the
(42:42):
point?
You can also create AI videopitches where you can convert a
text and then the prompting isimportant.
We discuss that a lot withintools such as Synthesia.
So, basically, you providecontext, like the text, and you
want an AI video pitches that iscreated automatically, and this
(43:04):
is very amazing, you will see,like such as a butterfly effect.
You start with AI providing youID improvement, and then maybe
you are amazed about what youget out of your AI tools and you
open doors to other ideas, andthen it becomes, you know.
Speaker 1 (43:22):
I'll share a bit with you what my experiences have
been with budgets.
I actually feel that AI isgiving me very often very good
feedback or ideas for budgets,and that even includes when I
want to buy or sell or rent aspace in a specific city and you
might want to rent a spacebecause you need to move country
(43:44):
, but you might also want torent a space because you need to
film for a day in an apartmentin Brussels or something.
It is giving quite accuratebrackets for budgets and stuff.
I've also asked for fundingapplication forms for AI to find
me statistics.
For example, if I'm applying tomake a show or a film to
(44:05):
empower women, I might ask AIhey, this is the topic of my
film or my show, this is whatthe funding body is supporting.
Can you find me statistics thatshow how many women are
underrepresented in blah blahblah, in these layers of society
?
And I will support my fundingapplication form.
(44:27):
So I came up with really goodstatistics.
Another thing as well, like, forexample, sometimes I have to
present myself in video so thatcan be as an actress.
So recently I applied for itwas like an acting, a two-day
acting thing.
They were looking, looking formultilingual actors, we had to
present ourselves to apply forit and be selected, and I wasn't
(44:50):
really sure what I had to sayor how to say it, and so, with
AI, it told me for 30 seconds,you say this.
For 30 seconds you talk aboutthis about your life.
For 30 seconds, you talk aboutthis part of your CV.
For 45 seconds, you talk aboutyour dog.
And actually it made it, itgave it a good flow and I got
(45:11):
selected.
We're only six actors that wereselected.
I've also recently applied fora writing residency, but a part
of the application form was alsopresenting ourselves in video.
Same thing.
I wasn't.
Yes, I know what to say, buthow do I say it in three minutes
?
They say in maximum threeminutes.
(45:33):
Pitch yourself in three minutesin your idea, and AI gave me a
structure.
For 30 seconds, you talk aboutyour experience.
For 45 seconds, you talk abouta new idea, then 10 seconds you
give this line.
That is just the hook of youridea or whatever.
So that can really help as well.
Video pitches.
We're not going to dive toodeep into this episode, into it,
(45:55):
but a lot of filmmakers areusing AI now instead of asking
for I don't know how manyhundreds of thousands of dollars
or euros to make a film.
They make a concept video withAI tools and then they can start
promoting their idea andfinancing to make it happen,
(46:15):
which is always very exciting.
Speaker 2 (46:19):
Yes, yes, that's completely true.
I think and I think, as I said,when you don't have the budget,
but you are seeking for fundsto actually develop your idea,
then use AI.
Please, use it as much aspossible so that you can
actually grab these fundings andmake it real reality.
Speaker 1 (46:41):
Let's talk about being a performer.
So maybe I can give you acouple of examples of how I've
used AI as an actress and thenmaybe you can then say how you
would, or maybe encourage yourdancers to use it when you
create a new piece of dancetheater.
Does that sound good?
Yes, perfect.
So for me as a performer, as anactress I'm going to talk about
(47:05):
me as an actress I've beentrying to train ai to be my
improv buddy.
So there is something calledimprov and comedy improv and I
was like you know what, everymorning I want to do a bit of
improv, just to get the machinerolling.
It's been interesting, but Iliterally had to be AI's teacher
(47:26):
.
So I used Gemini for thisparticular one, not ChatGPT, and
I told Gemini you know, let yoube my improv buddy.
And here is a prompt let's go,let's start.
We start an improv scene, butevery improv scene went
spiraling down and went nowherebecause AI was not using these
(47:49):
technical skills or humanempathy.
So I had to teach AI really howto become a better partner, a
better actor I can interact with.
We're still working on it, butit's improving.
I'm not saying it's supersuccessful yet, but it's
improving.
I've also used AI to preparecastings.
So, as actors that work in film, we are often being sent a
(48:12):
script.
We have to prepare it at homeand we have to film ourselves at
home.
Sometimes we don't have muchcontext of that script, which is
very annoying.
So here you have a script.
You just know you are, I don'tknow, a drug dealer Cool.
And you know that you're in afuturistic world Cool but you
still don't know what is thetexture of this drug dealer.
(48:35):
So I've sometimes asked AI andthat is important, because you
all also talked about it oftenwhen do you want to keep
ownership as an artist?
That is important and I feelfor me as a performer, when I
discuss things with AI, Ispecifically tell AI do not tell
me how to act, do not tell mewhich choices to make.
(48:59):
I want you to help me analyzethe script so I can have ideas,
as a performer, of what happenedbefore the scene or after the
scene, or basically analyze it,but not tell me what to do,
because I think that's where Iwant to keep ownership,
(49:20):
definitely.
So, yeah, those are a couple ofexamples you working with
dancers.
Speaker 2 (49:47):
Definitely.
So, yeah, those are a couple ofexamples.
You working with dancers isthere any way that you have
encouraged or they are, they arelike moving on the scene should
be in that in that way, becausethis is coming from the, the
background of the, the, thespecific character.
So, basically, when I'm workingwith team of dancer, then I
provide dialogues and I providethe story.
I always provide also and thisis something that I have done
for years I have provided aone-pager for each character
(50:11):
where I actually provide thehistory background of this
person.
If I receive this specificone-pager of Jenny, I will
submit this one-pager toArtificial Intelligence Model
and analyze it and providing memore context.
How do you think this charactershould be, or what kind of
(50:36):
emotion should be like,portrayed so that the entire
scene make sense?
How do you see the interactionin terms of emotion and how do
you think and then put the hatas the target audience that will
come to see the show, how doyou think they will react?
And this is important, knowingand come back, come back into
(50:59):
the fact that I was saying thatas a creative person, you are in
charge of what you are puttingoutside the world and the
emotion that you want to createin the head of the audience.
Speaker 1 (51:13):
Let's talk about everything that is controversial
around AI.
So obviously this episode hasbeen about what are the exciting
possibilities?
How can AI support our creativecareers, make us even more
productive, support ourcreativity?
There are a lot of fears aswell that people face, such as
(51:36):
will performers eventually bereplaced?
Will writers disappear?
Are there any elements that youare scared of or that you could
see, or it's for you,everything positive?
Speaker 2 (51:50):
I am a creator of AI algorithms, so I know I will say
the extent of AI, but I alsoknow what AI can actually cause
to certain persons.
So this is why I'm saying thatwhen you are using these tools,
you have to be mindful on how touse it, what you are disclosing
(52:13):
as information.
I know it from fact.
I'm creating AI algorithms.
I am inside this sector but inthe same time, I see it like
it's such a revolution.
It's like a game changer, and Idon't see AI as replacing, I
would say, people's jobs.
(52:34):
I see AI as like maybe creatingjobs.
We discussed about promptengineering that was not
existing before.
So this is like really a jobPeople are searching for, prompt
engineering.
So it actually creates jobs,but for jobs that are already
existing.
I think it's really like asupporting tool.
(52:56):
Let's talk about the translators, like now and even before AI,
to be honest, you had to putyour text in the translators and
then you received thetranslation and this was this is
a question this was killingtranslator job.
No, it was helping the reviewto be more fast.
(53:18):
So let's say that you have atext you are writing in French,
but you want your text to be ina Swahili, let's say African
language, then you will use AIor another not AI tool and it
helps, because after that youwill say I have my text in
(53:39):
Swahili, but I want a translatorlike really someone that is
Swahili phone to review it,because AI can have some
mistakes and that's normal.
That's a computer.
What the translator will spendmore time.
Now it's not translating thetext, but reviewing a text that
you have translated and maybeadding more skills to his
(54:04):
services, which is not only liketranslating but, let's say,
providing a certain context,meaning like, okay, let's say
that in Swahili we say this in aspecific way, that actually
it's not well translated by AImodels.
Then I know it from factbecause I'm a Swahili fan, and
(54:25):
we also know that Swahili isdifferent from a country to
another.
So let's say that swahili fromkenya and swahili from this drc
it's a bit different in terms of, I would say, expression.
So all these things will beproviding by a human person.
That is like living in the realworld.
So for me, I don't see ai as akilling job, but as, but, as
like freeing up time to certainactivity that you tend to do.
(54:49):
Before that was maybe not the Iwould say, the activity that
was fulfilling your dream, butfreeing up time for you so that
you can focus on more importantand more, I would say, exciting
things in your own jobs.
And we see also.
We discussed about promptengineering as one example.
It also creates new jobs.
(55:10):
Yes, we had computer scienceand things like that in the past
, way before I was not born, andthings like that.
It was also scary for thepeople out there, but now it's
part of our world.
We use computer as like now,but it's the same with AI.
Some people are scared about AI.
(55:30):
Now I understand there arecertain things that we have to
be mindful of.
We discussed that.
But in a certain way, we haveto embrace AI and see how we can
still interact with thistechnology.
Speaker 1 (55:41):
That will involve with the years that are coming
with this technology that willinvolve with the years that are
coming.
To wrap up this interview, Iwould love you to give a little
bit of advice on the following.
I consider myself to be quitetech savvy and I learn quick and
I love learning.
However, in the world of AI,there are new tools coming.
(56:05):
It's so fast, it evolves insuch a fast way and I'm still
learning a tool that I'm stilltrying to explore and while it
can really help me with myproductivity, I also have to put
in ever-evolving AI landscapeso that we can still use it to
(56:31):
be productive, but we also learnenough and on time so that we
keep up with how it's evolving.
Speaker 2 (56:37):
That's a very good question.
I will advise to be like youcan actually find, I would say,
a newsletter or like we naming acertain company, but you can
find a newsletter where you canbe up to date to receive
information about the new toolsthat are existing in the
(56:57):
creative space, so that youactually don't have to search
for but the information iscoming to you, so that you keep.
I would say you are up to dateabout, but the information is
coming to you so that you keep.
I will say, uh, you are up todate about all the information
and I will say, if you want touse a tool to be honest and even
myself I'm not like, I'm likelearning also some things
(57:17):
youtube is a good place, a goodplace to find a lot of
information.
You you will find a lot oftutorials, a lot it's a huge
library that you can find onYouTube just to learn one, I
would say, specific tool.
And there is like I think everyday they have like a new video
(57:39):
it can be like five minutesvideo or 15 minutes video where
you will be actually learningthe basics for what you need to
do and for your specific task inthe creative space.
So I will advise two things.
First is to actually connect toa newsletter of a company that
you are following and providing,like AI tools for creative
(58:01):
persons, and also follow what isexisting on a tutorial on
YouTube regarding the tool thatyou actually select to help you
in your creative journey.
I think it's the best way andthe cost, I will say effective
way to be up to date and to benot like lost in all this
information.
So, because you don't want tolearn everything, you just need
(58:23):
to have, like in certaininformation on certain specific
things.
So select what you want toactually learn by connecting to
the right newsletter and alsothe same on youtube awesome.
Speaker 1 (58:37):
Thank you so much, jenny.
So where can people keep intouch with you, both as an
artist and with your ai company?
Speaker 2 (58:43):
I think the best way to be in touch of what I'm doing
is to search on my name inLinkedIn, because then you will
be able to write me a messageand then I will be more than
happy to respond to you.
So, if you type my long name,which is Jenny Ambukieni Onya
but I think if you type JennyOnya you find me on LinkedIn
Jenny Ambukieni Onya, but Ithink if you type Jenny Onya
(59:04):
you'll find me on LinkedIn Then,yeah, it's a direct way to
interact with me.
Thank you so much, Jenny.
Thank you Cindy, Thank you alot.
Welcome to the Loud Whisper Takeover podcast.
Today we are going to talkabout artificial intelligence,
ai.
How can we use it as makers,filmmakers, theatre makers,
choreographers?
How can we use it as performers, as actors, as dancers?
What are the excitingpossibilities that exist?
(00:22):
What are the things that we arescared about?
Today I have a very specialguest.
She's an artist herself.
She's creating and makingtheater, she's writing, she's
choreographing and she also hasa business focused on AI.
So what better guest than JennyOnya?
Hey, jenny, what's up?
(00:44):
Hello Cindy, I am fine.
How are you doing?
Hello Cindy, I am fine.
What about you?
I'm super excited.
So, number one, you're based inBelgium, let's say that to
start with, but you workinternationally.
Your AI business is workinginternationally.
Can you explain to us in anutshell what your AI-focused
business is doing and what youspecialize?
Speaker 2 (01:04):
in?
Yes, sure, thank you for havingme today, today's session.
So, first of all, thank you forthat.
Basically, I've created twocompanies, one in Belgium and
another one in DRC, democraticRepublic of Congo, but both
companies are focusing onproviding services and product
to other organizations, andproduct and services that are
(01:26):
focusing on artificialintelligence.
This is our main expertise andwe provide different kinds of
services that can go fromconsulting services that can go
to capacity building, researchand development, and you also
have impactful products thatactually are serving the
undeserved population in Africa.
(01:48):
So, yes, we are actually usingartificial intelligence to
create impact in our societies,are?
Speaker 1 (01:56):
you basically consulting businesses on how to
use artificial intelligence tobecome more productive, become
more creative, find moresolutions, or are you also
creating AI tools to help theirneeds?
Do you do both, or is it one orthe?
Speaker 2 (02:15):
other.
Actually, we are doing both.
We are helping other companiesthat would like to actually
integrate artificialintelligence into their own
processes, products,organization.
We provide strategic advisingon how to do it the best way,
and also we also create AIalgorithms.
(02:36):
So we have our own products.
Speaker 1 (02:38):
Yes, Can you tell us in a nutshell what you do as an
artist?
Because you're also an artist.
You work in the creative world.
Yes, sure?
Speaker 2 (02:46):
So basically, I am a choreographer and I'm also a
playwright.
I use, I will say, dance as avehicle for communication
through theater.
So basically, I create playwhen I use dance as a focus
point to communicate and toactually share emotion, tell
(03:09):
story.
So basically, this is what I'mdoing as a creative person.
Speaker 1 (03:14):
For all the people that are new to this podcast, I
am obviously a filmmaker.
I'm an action actress, I'm ascreen actress, but I also have
a background in dance.
I was a choreographer.
I used a screen actress, but Ialso have a background in dance.
I was a choreographer.
I used to create a lot oftheater as well, so we will be
talking about a whole bunch ofcreative expressions.
I will probably, in today'sepisode, talk a bit more about
(03:36):
how we can use AI in the actingbusiness, the film business, and
Jenny will probably add more interms of how we can use AI in
general, as creatives, and alsoin the theater and dance
business.
So I know you've also beenwinning quite a few prizes or
awards in the AI field.
Your leadership skills werehighlighted.
(03:57):
Can you give us a couple ofthings that really were
important for you?
Yes, sure.
Speaker 2 (04:02):
So, yes, I'm actually working a lot in Africa.
This is very important.
This is also coming from myroots, my background, originally
, even though I'm based inBelgium, but I had the privilege
to actually to provide a pitchin the annual meetings of the
African Development Group, whichis a very huge corporation in
(04:25):
Africa that is providing financeto can be bank itself, but it
can be also entrepreneur, andthey have like a specific
program that is focusing onwomen women in business in
Africa and they wanted me toactually pitch our companies,
our initiative, on the Africancontinent.
I was invited to provide thispitch in front of a huge
(04:51):
audience of leaders on theAfrican continent, so this was
actually very interesting.
But we also have worked and wonsome prizes in Belgium, such as
the D4D prize, which was aprize provided at Tervuren in
Brussels, so it was also aboutimpactful AI ideas and projects
(05:14):
that can impact undeservedpopulations that are outside
Belgium, and we were alsoprivileged to be shortlisted,
just to name a few.
Speaker 1 (05:25):
Amazing.
So, first of all, we are goingto talk about all the exciting
opportunities about AI.
We can talk about all thedoubts and the fears, maybe at
the end of this podcast, butfirst of all, it's about giving
a lot of hope, a lot ofexcitement, a lot of joy, a lot
of practical tools.
So we will talk around how wecan develop initial ideas, how
(05:49):
we can use AI in the creativeprocess, how we can then use AI
in supporting our making,putting a team together, funding
, application forms, pitchingand then obviously also
marketing.
When it comes to being aperformer, we will also look at
how we can use AI to train ourskills and also how to prepare
for castings, how to prepare fora role when we have been casted
(06:11):
, and how, maybe, to createInstagram content or social
media content as well.
So let's start.
We have an initial idea.
We are an artist.
Boom.
I have an idea.
What can we do with AI in order, not for AI, maybe, to become
the creator instead of me, buthow can it support our initial
(06:32):
idea?
Speaker 2 (06:33):
Yes, sure, but I would like just to emphasize on
one point that you actually justsaid, but it's important to
have this in mind throughoutthis entire session, I think.
So we tend to see that AI islike replacing things that we
are doing, but we rather see it,as you have to see it, in my
(06:54):
opinion as a virtual assistant.
So imagine I'm a creative, Idon't have like an entire team
of 10, I don't have the budget,let's say so.
This is also where AI isactually helping a lot.
So, basically, you will haveseveral virtual assistants and I
(07:15):
insist on the word assistant inorder for you to take a
decision as the I would say, thecreative person that actually
is taking charge of this project.
So this is important.
So, if we go back to what we arediscussing now, it's ideation,
concept development.
We can see artificialintelligence helping you.
(07:36):
I would say, generate ID, opennew doors of IDs that you didn't
add.
It will also help you, assistyou in the writing of narrative
arcs.
It will also help you exploretone, also have brainstorming of
characters, having a mapping ofa structure, mapping like the
(07:57):
hero journey.
So all these tools that you canuse are really helping you as a
creative in charge of theproject to open your horizons
and to have more ideas togenerate.
So just basically to have adiscussion with a computer and
just asking him yeah, histhought about your basic idea.
Speaker 1 (08:19):
So question do you only use ChatGPT or are there
other tools that you use for theinitial concept development?
So you have a narrative arcthat you want to clarify, maybe
the tone of your story, the herojourney, the characters?
Do you use ChatGPT or othertools as well?
Speaker 2 (08:35):
Yes, actually, chatgpt is a very, I will say,
very interesting tool.
It englobes a lot of, I wouldsay, ai-powered components.
Interesting tool.
It englobes a lot of, I wouldsay, ai-powered components, but
there is a lot of, I would say,tools that are integrating AI,
such as, you can see, sudowritethat is helping you prompting,
(08:56):
generate ID, create narrativearcs.
You also have Characterai soyou can type it directly on
Google.
Characterai that is helping youprovide a genre, providing you
a tone to a specific character,brainstorming about the
character of the, of your, yourstory.
And you also have a squibblerio, which is actually helping you
(09:20):
to have a structure mapping,like create a hero journey that
you are going to use for yourstory.
So there is a lot of othertools that sometimes are also
integrating ChatGPT.
Speaker 1 (09:33):
So, you see, in order for you to do a specific action
, Then another thing I'd love todiscuss with you is I feel like
when I talk about ChatGPT orother tools with some friends,
some are saying, well, no, it'slike so general and stupid.
But I actually feel there is anart in giving the right prompt,
(09:57):
because if you give ChatGPT,like if you can't delegate
basically to your virtualassistant, your virtual
assistant can't do a good job.
And I feel us as creatives orany person using AI, you need to
be really good at giving theright prompt.
And number one would you agreewith me?
And number two, how do youorganize your prompts, either
(10:19):
with ChatGPT or these otherwebsites, so that it gives you
something with meat?
Speaker 2 (10:25):
Yes, sure, and this is.
I actually really agree and I'mcompletely in line on what you
are saying.
It's the same as like in reallife.
For instance, I go back to myexperience as a leader of a
company.
Then you have someone that isworking with you, for you, and
you have to provide her or himinstruction, like you have to be
very clear about what you wantso that the work can be done
(10:48):
effectively.
So that's the same actuallywith GPT.
So, if you want GPT to actuallyprovide you the right answer,
you really have to be like tostructure your mind in a way
that it can provide you also aclear answer.
And also you also have tounderstand that there is, like,
different model.
I would say, precisely, there isdifferent model of GPT.
(11:09):
There is a free one, which ishaving more confusion.
You will see that, okay,sometimes it's like having a bit
of delusional information thatis providing.
Then you also have paid version, where the model is more
accurate, more precise, moreefficient.
So if you want to have a betterresponse of GPT, you have
(11:33):
actually to pay, and promptingis something that is now a new
job, actually With the, I wouldsay, the popularization of
ChatGPT in 2022, I think, yeah,prompt engineer.
It's becoming like a newprofile job that people are
seeking.
So it's like an expertise thatyou actually develop on how to
(11:56):
really in an efficient wayinteract with the computer so
that the computer provides youthe best answer.
Speaker 1 (12:03):
I'll give you two examples of how I've been
prompting different AI tools.
First of all, I try to keep myprompts short.
So, for example, I'm not goingto say to ChatGPT or any other
platform oh, write me a scriptabout this Viking that goes and
(12:24):
fights with some pirates in theocean.
I would say, hey, write me aparagraph of the opening scene
of the idea I have of there is afemale Viking.
Does it even exist?
I don't even know.
But I'd say that I have afemale Viking in mind.
A female Viking.
She just looks at the land thatshe's about to leave and she's
(12:48):
about to board on the boat thatwill take her away for three
months to fight some pirates.
Write me a paragraph and then,once I have a paragraph that AI
writes for me, like I rewrite it, and it's a back and forth of
rewrites and then this paragraph, I will develop it.
But I always give short prompts,if that makes sense, to AI,
(13:13):
another thing that I've alsobeen doing.
So I've been experimenting withvideo making tools, AI video
making tools, and so what I'mdoing, instead of prompting the
video making tool, I'm going tochat GPT and I say, hey, I need
to write a good prompt for myvideo AI tool.
(13:37):
This is what I want the videoAI tool to do.
Can you help me write a goodprompt?
And I say it needs to do thisand this and this and this and
this, but it seems to put it ina way that is clearer than if I
was to delegate straight away tothe video platform, if that
makes sense.
So my first question is do youthink I can improve what I'm
(14:00):
doing currently?
And number two do you have anysort of magic recipe of what
good prompting is?
Speaker 2 (14:08):
I will say that, yeah , in my experience, when I'm
prompting with GPT andinteracting with GPT, I provide
first, I provide the context.
So I provide the context so thatwe can actually narrow the
search of information.
(14:28):
So let's say that I want myspecific story to happen in this
specific geographical location,then I will tell it.
Then it needs to be in thislocation and incorporate this
and this aspect of the locationthat I'm focusing on.
And then after that, afterproviding the context, then I
(14:53):
ask the instruction in the mostdetailed way.
But, as you mentioned, I'm notgoing to type a lot of
instruction at the same timebecause then you might have some
confusion happening.
Then, after that I received theresponse, then it's not the end
.
Then I continue, likeinteracting.
(15:13):
I will say, okay, good answer,but I would like this to be
changed in this sense, orprovide this tone, or it's more
like that.
Then I continue the interactionuntil I receive the response
that I want to have.
So, basically, for me, if I cantell, like a recipe there is,
like, I assume that there islike better recipe that I'm
(15:35):
giving.
But for me the first thing isto provide the context, then
provide the variable meaning,like what you want, I would say,
to change in the context or inwhich degree you want the
algorithm to actually work inthe space that you're providing,
like the context, and then Ifinish with the instruction in
clear one, very precise one.
(15:56):
If it's too large or too vaguethen you might be disappointed
about the answer.
So I will work like that, soit's more like it's work like an
entonnoir, meaning like it'scontext, and then a bit of
information and then a precisionon the action that I want the
model to do.
And I want to tell somethingI'm coming from an Afro-decent
(16:19):
background and I know thatsometimes the answer that I want
to get are not incorporatingthe African culture and this is
a big, big, I would say, problem.
And things that people areworking on in the AI scene is to
have, I would say, gpt kind ofmodel that is also incorporating
the African culture and historyand knowledge, so that the
(16:43):
response that is given is notlike, I would say, european
based only kind of answer.
So, um, yeah, you interact withai, but you also have to know
that how ai is working isworking and how you have to
interact with the tool and themodel so that you get the the
best of it.
Speaker 1 (17:11):
Well, that's super interesting that what you're
saying there, because maybe wecan keep that as a question for
the end.
But how chat GPT eventuallyunify this world culture into
one, and where is our diversityand our specificities as
different cultures going?
Why is chat gpt not includingenough african culture?
Is that because there is notenough data online that it can
analyze, or what is?
(17:32):
How comes that the that it'snot finding or responding in
that way?
Speaker 2 (17:37):
it's about uh, there is a lot of factor, but I think
the most, I will say, adiscussed one is the data that
are used in order to incorporateall this information and
providing it to the user itself.
There is a lot of knowledge onthe African scene, but not all
the knowledge are digitalized.
Speaker 1 (17:58):
Let's continue with the creative process.
So you've already told us abouta couple of tools that you're
using.
What else are you using AI forwithin your creative process?
Speaker 2 (18:11):
Yes, if we go back to scripting, screenplay
development, then for editing,or consistency in terms of tone,
there is like a tool that Iused before the integration of,
I would say before thepopularization of, gpt, but now,
as GPT integrated is Grammarly,so Grammarly, you are able to
(18:32):
actually provide like a dialoguethat you have written and say,
okay, I want this dialogue to bein this specific tone, like I
want it to be joyful, there is alot of sadness inside or things
like that.
Then it provides you back whatmight be or could be the
dialogue.
So I think this can help.
(18:52):
If you want to have aconsistency in terms of tone
throughout the dialogues or thestory that you want to create,
then, after having, like, yourideation is done, then you have
creating yeah, like your, yourthe first dialogues with the
specific tone.
Everything has been done.
Then you are able to now go tothe face of fundraising,
(19:17):
fundraising hold on.
Speaker 1 (19:18):
Can we just pause for a second and continue on the
creative process?
First, because I'd love to addsome things and maybe also have
a discussion around some things.
So for me in the creativeprocess, so once I've written a
script, for example, I also use,for example, chat GPT to get
feedback on my script and Ispecifically tell chat GPT do
(19:41):
not rewrite anything, I want tostill write my own script, I
want you to read my script and Iwant you to give me feedback.
And I must say, very often ittells me, oh, okay, here are all
the pros, all you know thestrength of your script.
But here is where things aren'tvery clear and I must say it
(20:01):
has helped me in making myscripts clearer or certain bits
of dialogue clearer.
However, I often find that thefeedback is always very positive
, like, chatgpt will never tellme off and will never tell me
that I'm doing bad, bad work.
I know it tells me okay, thiscan be improved and stuff.
(20:21):
Do you that?
Using chat gpt as a tool forfeedback, is it enough, or is
there a way to prompt it for itto be more honest, or is it just
always going to word it?
You know, in a very british way.
The british always word it in avery, very polite way.
You know how to give feedback.
What do you think about usingit for feedback?
Speaker 2 (20:42):
Yeah, I would say that I will not, I would say,
base all my feedback from GPT.
This is actually where, like, agood phase can happen with
directly person, I would say,where I want to have the
feedback on, specifically onabout what we were discussing
about bias that are existing andthe fact that GPT is very happy
(21:07):
, always joyful, positive, islike also a regulation that is
happening and that is veryimportant in AI.
It's about ethic.
So I will say that it's normal,that it's positive, but you can
prompt it a bit to say, okay,please give me a feedback in the
hat of, let's say, a specificgenre or type of people that you
(21:32):
want actually to get thefeedback from.
But you will get the feedback,but I would advise not to just
base everything that you arerequesting a report on or
feedback on only based on GPT.
Go to the real world, go to theright person and ask them
directly their opinion.
(21:52):
So, yeah, we have to see that.
Ok, gpt, as we said, is virtualassistant, but you really have
to also know in which phase youwant this tool to be involved
fully or partially or not at all.
And I will just advise at thisstage to go directly to the real
(22:12):
world and to go outside thevirtual one.
Speaker 1 (22:16):
I actually have never used it for feedback, neither
as a dancer, choreographer orfor self-tapes as an actress, so
I've never asked feedback on avideo.
Have you ever tried, based on avideo, to give you feedback and
not based on a written document?
Speaker 2 (22:31):
No, never, to be honest.
No, this is actually, as I said, this is where you have to go
in the real world.
At this stage, it's like itwill be.
Let's say that you have as athis is me, that's my opinion.
As a creative you also have, Iwould say, a responsibility on
what you are putting, I wouldsay, in the world.
Basically, I think that allthat we are creating as a
(22:55):
creative have an impact, canhave, I would say, a huge impact
on people.
Restricting your opinion onwhat a computer is saying and
has been programmed to respondto a certain way is not like
yeah, I will say it's not like agood strategy.
On my sense and because youknow that your art, your story,
(23:20):
what you are actually creating,will have an impact, go directly
to the people that you aretalking to and ask feedback.
Speaker 1 (23:29):
Question around intellectual property.
So I have the paying version ofChatGPT and you know, in the
settings we can say or we candeactivate this setting so that
whatever we're putting into thesystem, that the system doesn't
use it to inform the rest of itsdata.
So I've obviously deactivatedit, however.
(23:52):
So I give you an example.
So I'm writing a series at themoment and I had, I think I had
10 or 11 episodes, but I wantedto have one extra one, and I was
struggling to find just thesummary of this extra episode
for this TV series.
And so I gave ChatGPT all myideas, all the scripts and
(24:13):
whatever of the world of this TVseries, blah, blah, blah.
And I'm asking it to help mefind an idea for an extra
episode, right?
And I said okay, give me threedifferent ideas.
Don't write the script, justgive me a general context of
what this episode could be aboutMe doing that.
(24:34):
And so number one is am Iputting myself in danger that
you know the script, even thoughI have?
I've copyrighted the rest of myscript but I'm putting it into
ChatGPT.
Are there any dangers insharing with ChatGPT your ideas?
Number two if I'm coming upwith this extra episode that is
(24:56):
inspired by ChatGPT.
I'm not saying ChatGPT is doingall the work, but it's
inspiring me, right?
It's a brainstorm, buddy.
Is there anything withintellectual property we should
be aware of?
Speaker 2 (25:10):
That's a very good question and I think it's also
applying not only in thecreative scene, but in other
kinds, I will say, of sector.
So what we actually see moreand more happening, and I think
it's legal and also focusing onwhat we were discussing about
the importance of what you areputting out there.
It's like people are nowexplicitly saying that this
(25:35):
content, this creation, this arthas been co-created by
artificial intelligence.
And they are mentioning that onpurpose, because, first of all,
because they know that, yeah,it's important to tell that,
because if there is like anaudit or someone that is asking
like more information about howyou create this and this aspect,
(25:59):
you will be obliged to tellthat it has been co-created by
artificial intelligence.
Just to come back to what youwere asking about are you in
danger?
I will ask you back thequestion what is your fear,
exact fear, when you are askingthis question?
(26:20):
Do you fear that other peoplemight have the same idea or,
like your idea will be displayedor disclosed somewhere?
So what's?
Speaker 1 (26:32):
I think I'll be very specific.
Let's say that I've written ascript, right.
Let's say that I've written ascript, right.
Let's say that I've written ascript about a short film and
it's a horror movie, right,about a girl that just lost her
mom.
Okay, and something ishappening in the house.
I'm now writing this script, Iam submitting it to ChatGPT.
Chatgpt now is using it as apart of its database to,
(26:57):
generally speaking, analyze theworld.
Blah, blah, blah.
Now somebody else across theworld is saying hey, I'd love to
write a short film, but Ireally don't know what to write.
I know I want a daughter and amother in there.
Give me five ideas, and hereChatGPT gives the idea of my
script.
Is that possible?
(27:19):
Is that not possible?
Is that a danger?
Is that not a danger?
It's a possibility.
Speaker 2 (27:29):
There is a probability that it might be
advice to someone else that isclose to your background in
terms of the data that you areactually sharing with GPT.
So it might happen that likenot specifically your ID, but
like a close one, can beproposed to another person that
is actually following the samepattern configuration settings
(27:50):
as you.
So it's important and it's agood, I would say, strategy for
you.
If you have a paid model, justto have more precise interaction
with the model, this is good.
And if you have the possibilityto be very specifically saying
that do not use my data foranything else, then of course
he's obliged to do it, butnevertheless we know, and it
(28:13):
might happen, that some part ofthe data can be used.
So we never know.
So we have to be conscious ofwhat we are sharing and what we
are not sharing.
And maybe, as I said, you willstart with a gpt to have, like
your, the basic id, but thenoutside of gpt, then you refine
(28:33):
it and you make it really onyour own, on your tone.
You add, like your signaturemeaning, like the way that you
are providing your stories, likevery unique to you.
Then you will see that it willbe very different.
Then you go and you protectyour art as usual.
So start, as I said and I willalways repeat that in the
(28:54):
session start with GPT, butcontinue with your own
creativity so that you avoidthat kind of problem before
moving on, just maybe a coupleof extra things that we have
tried with ai and or creativeprocess.
Speaker 1 (29:14):
So what I can share is I know that I've tried to
generate images from AI, forexample, to find ideas for
costumes, for example, to findactually I found an AI tool that
is a story border.
So from the script it made me awhole storyboard with images,
(29:35):
which was amazing.
Storyboard with images, whichwas amazing.
So the storyboard is calledstoryboarderai images.
I've tried images for pitchesas well for storyboards, just to
give like a vision, likea moodboard of a theater play that I'm
writing or a film.
What else have I used AI forrecently?
(29:55):
Songs, and I'm not saying thatI'm going to use these songs for
a film per se, but sometimes itcan be for something more, like
an Instagram little sketch orsomething.
Yeah, is there anything elsethat you've used a tool for for
your creative process that youthink of that we haven't
mentioned yet?
Yes, everything around.
Speaker 2 (30:13):
voiceover you can find really now, because back in
the time it was very robotic,but now you can really find
really realistic VoiceOver.
So if you need that for yourpitch let's say that you have
your presentation and you wantit to be more dynamic, having a
voice, a type of tone of voicethen you can actually use AI to
(30:38):
do it.
So you provide your text andthen you provide it to the
voiceover automatic voiceover sothat you are able to do it.
Video I've used a lot Automaticcreation of images, like you
have something in mind, then youprovide your text and then, of
course, you come back to theprompting aspect.
Then you have a generation ofimages.
(31:01):
Then, of course, when we aretalking about creation, we want
also the outside world to beaware of what you are creating
the film, the theater, anythingelse like the book, everything,
anything related to creativityand art.
Then you are able to createcontent.
So if you know your target, youknow your target, you have a
(31:25):
way to prompt it.
We discussed about prompting.
Then you are able to actuallyask what can be the scheduling
time.
So when and on which platformshould I post any content and
(31:49):
what should be the contentadapted to the target audience
scene of creation, creativity,culture.
But be mindful on which stageand how far you go with the
creation process with AI.
Speaker 1 (32:04):
For me, there is a huge potential when it comes to
Instagram and or social mediacontent creation that I feel we
can tap into.
So, for example, if we have afilm coming out or a theater
show or a dance show, there isso much that we have to put out
there, like in terms of contentthat is not just about the film
(32:25):
or about the theater show.
Let's say that our theater showlike I know that you had a
theater show about the mines inCongo but then it's like, okay,
how can I talk about my show andcreate content that is not just
the show but also around thetopic or the theme?
Some other people create a hugeamount of content interviewing
people in the streets and stuff,but how can AI help us create
(32:47):
parallel content of our film, ofour show?
If I make a show about cats anddogs, can AI start to make a
couple of funny videos of catsand dogs to create traction to
my Instagram account aroundfunny videos of cats and dogs?
To create traction to myInstagram account around my film
around cats and dogs, whichthen, you know, brings in people
(33:07):
that loves cats and dogs andthen will be interested in the
film.
I feel even as an actress.
So at the moment, you knowthere's this thing.
As a dancer, it seems to be soeasy to create content because
you just like put your camera inthe middle of nature, in the
middle of a train station, youdo a little dance and like you
have content.
But as an actor, you cannotstart, you know, performing a
(33:29):
monologue in the middle of atrain station and put that on
Instagram, unless you're in aproduction.
Sometimes it's difficult foractors to create content, but
I'm really looking into contentcreation with AI now, so that
not only I can create,eventually, instagram content,
but how can I also make it avision board?
For example, I want to do moreaction movies, right?
(33:50):
So at the moment, what I'mtesting out is can AI turn me
into a Viking Costumes, makeupand everything?
Really, it's Cindy.
Ai puts makeup on Cindy, putscostume on Cindy and then I can
perform a monologue at home.
But I can already visualize memyself and I with the makeup and
the costume and everything.
(34:11):
I think AI, if we use itintelligently, we can use it to
our advantages, advantages wherewe often feel stuck as
creatives, especially contentcreation, because there's so
much that is being demanded fromsociety now in terms of content
creation.
Speaker 2 (34:27):
It's how we can actually use or create the
avatar of Cindy, the avatar ofJenny, and putting this avatar
into a specific scene with aspecific, I would say, costume
and things like that.
(34:48):
And this I think it's veryinteresting because it's also
helping you on the casting level.
Let's say that you haveportrayed you as like the role
or in the scene that you reallywant to achieve.
Then you are able to alsoshowcase that to the world, to,
I would say, people that will bein charge of casting it, and
(35:08):
they will say, okay, I didn'tsee this aspect and actually it
fits what I'm looking for, whatI'm thinking about, or what I
heard they are looking for.
So this I think it's alsoopening, like you said, a door,
and if you don't have like anidea on how to use it, you can
also ask GPT.
You can ask GPT and ask thetool on how yeah, this is where
(35:32):
I am, this is where I want to goAdvise me on the steps and the
tools that I need to use inorder to attract this and this
person or to, uh, expand mynetwork.
Speaker 1 (35:43):
And you can also have this kind of advice, because
now we are just focusing on andthat's good on, um, the creative
process, but sometimes you alsoneed advice let's continue with
that thought when you said, oh,oh, we can use ChatGPT to see
which casting directors we canconnect with, how to network,
how can I expand my network andstuff.
(36:04):
So I have never, to be honest,had quite good responses or
specific enough responses whenit comes to that.
However, and maybe it's myprompting or maybe it's the
system that is not enough up todate yet, and maybe it's my
prompting or maybe it's thesystem that is not enough up to
date yet.
However, where I've been verysuccessful is, for example,
writing, rewriting my CV forcertain things like, for example
(36:26):
, about six months ago, Iapplied for a job.
I wasn't really sure if Iwanted it or not, but I was like
I need to submit for it.
They were looking for anartistic director or a cultural
center and I was like, let metry it.
I really used it as my careercoach.
So I was like here is my CV asan actress, here is my CV as a
teacher, here's my CV as aproducer.
(36:46):
Can we put it all together?
How can I structure my letterof motivation?
And I really I used chat GPT toanalyze.
Sorry, I first asked chat GPTto analyze.
Sorry, I first asked ChatGPT toanalyze the job post, the job
specifications.
What did they want from anartistic director of this
particular cultural center?
So it helped me to analyze iteven further than what I would
(37:10):
have done it.
Then it helped me to structuremy motivation letter, because I
had written like nine pages ofjust me being a passionate and
it was and then it helped me torestructure it in a way that was
way more understandable by aperson that had never met me.
So, yeah, that's how I've beenusing it for career development
before.
Have you ever used it for thesesort of things as a yes?
Speaker 2 (37:34):
I think, to be honest , and that's the best I will say
, advice that you can receivefrom GPT is about the carrier
and like screening of your CV oradapting based on a certain job
description, because these aredata that are like outside the
world, that are available on thewebsite and there is no like
subjectivity, if I can say itlike that.
(37:55):
So this is the job descriptionthat is mostly common, let's say
, for this specific role thatyou are actually applying for,
and we already have data thatare factual data from this
specific organization that youwant to apply for.
So I think JudgeGPT is the best,I would say, for this kind of
(38:16):
interaction and content that youwant to get from advice.
So, yeah, I use it a lot forthis aspect like CV screening,
job description, and what I liketo do also is to, when I want
to rewrite my CV or rewrite mymotivation letter, it's like I'm
asking also GPT to revise it,to review it, in a way, like
(38:41):
with a specific hat on, let'ssay that I know that the person
that will receive will be thedirector of XYZ company and I
know that this person has thisand this background already.
Person has this and thisbackground already.
I've done my research and Iwant GPT to be like specifically
(39:02):
revise, like review my contentbased on this hat that he's
putting, and this I provide itas a context.
So, as I said, my prompting isalways like in Antenoir I put
the context and then I askspecifically the instruction,
and then you will see that theresponse is different when you
are asking GPT like just reviseit like that, or revise it or
(39:24):
review it in the perspective ofthis specific profile.
That's the best way to interactwith this model.
Speaker 1 (39:34):
So that can maybe lead us to funding application
forms, because sometimes wewrite with so much passion and
if I or you had to share thatwith another artist or a
filmmaker or they would totallyunderstand us.
But if we have to explain ouridea to an institution that
gives grants and money to makeit possible, sometimes we have
(39:56):
to word it differently.
That gives grants and money tomake it possible, sometimes we
have to word it differently.
So asking ChatGPT to review ourdocument with another hat on is
going to be crucial at thatpoint.
Have you ever used ChatGPT forfunding application forms and
can you give any maybe specificsof how it can work?
Speaker 2 (40:11):
Yes, I've done it.
I've done it basically.
So I always put the context,this is the context, this is the
fundraising campaign that Iwould like to apply for and also
provide a website.
So you know that GPT also iscapable of analyzing what is the
content of a specific website.
So I provide this first and Iask can you please review my
(40:35):
answers based on the need, therequirement of the fund, and
then GPT is capable of tellingokay, this is actually what you
are saying at this paragraph.
It's really good, and then youcan maybe improve this.
Also, some advice on how toimprove the text.
(40:56):
So, of course, I've used it alot and I think this is a game
changer improve the text.
So, of course, I've used it alot and I think this is a game
changer in the scene.
Before that it was taking a lotof time and, yes, it also helps
when you are.
Sometimes you also have tocreate pitch deck and in the
creative world then pitch deckwith words sometimes it might be
(41:18):
be like not boring, but peopleare not like feeling what you
are.
You want to project, what youwant to create, so they have to
be emotionally attracted to youridea.
Then you also have tools suchas beautifulai, where you are
able to actually create videowith a specific atmosphere tone.
(41:40):
Then you project, like you helppeople to project them into
your ID.
So you have your pitch deckthat is complemented and
generated with a beautifulai.
You have your fundraisingapplication that has been
improved and reviewed by GPT,knowing the context, and then
you also have sometimes you haveto create a budget.
(42:00):
Then you can use tools to havea budget.
You can use tools such as arcai, where you have a finance model
, financing, forecasting, Iwould say Excel spreadsheets
that is created.
So this is helping a lot interms of time and you always put
(42:21):
the context.
I think the like to provide thecontext first is key, because
then you want this model to beanswering really within the
context, because if you areoutside the context, of course
you can have the very goodapplication well written, but if
it's not matching the need ofthe fundraiser, then what's the
(42:42):
point?
You can also create AI videopitches where you can convert a
text and then the prompting isimportant.
We discuss that a lot withintools such as Synthesia.
So, basically, you providecontext, like the text, and you
want an AI video pitches that iscreated automatically, and this
(43:04):
is very amazing, you will see,like such as a butterfly effect.
You start with AI providing youID improvement, and then maybe
you are amazed about what youget out of your AI tools and you
open doors to other ideas, andthen it becomes, you know.
Speaker 1 (43:22):
I'll share a bit with you what my experiences have
been with budgets.
I actually feel that AI isgiving me very often very good
feedback or ideas for budgets,and that even includes when I
want to buy or sell or rent aspace in a specific city and you
might want to rent a spacebecause you need to move country
(43:44):
, but you might also want torent a space because you need to
film for a day in an apartmentin Brussels or something.
It is giving quite accuratebrackets for budgets and stuff.
I've also asked for fundingapplication forms for AI to find
me statistics.
For example, if I'm applying tomake a show or a film to
(44:05):
empower women, I might ask AIhey, this is the topic of my
film or my show, this is whatthe funding body is supporting.
Can you find me statistics thatshow how many women are
underrepresented in blah blahblah, in these layers of society
?
And I will support my fundingapplication form.
(44:27):
So I came up with really goodstatistics.
Another thing as well, like, forexample, sometimes I have to
present myself in video so thatcan be as an actress.
So recently I applied for itwas like an acting, a two-day
acting thing.
They were looking, looking formultilingual actors, we had to
present ourselves to apply forit and be selected, and I wasn't
(44:50):
really sure what I had to sayor how to say it, and so, with
AI, it told me for 30 seconds,you say this.
For 30 seconds you talk aboutthis about your life.
For 30 seconds, you talk aboutthis part of your CV.
For 45 seconds, you talk aboutyour dog.
And actually it made it, itgave it a good flow and I got
(45:11):
selected.
We're only six actors that wereselected.
I've also recently applied fora writing residency, but a part
of the application form was alsopresenting ourselves in video.
Same thing.
I wasn't.
Yes, I know what to say, buthow do I say it in three minutes
?
They say in maximum threeminutes.
(45:33):
Pitch yourself in three minutesin your idea, and AI gave me a
structure.
For 30 seconds, you talk aboutyour experience.
For 45 seconds, you talk abouta new idea, then 10 seconds you
give this line.
That is just the hook of youridea or whatever.
So that can really help as well.
Video pitches.
We're not going to dive toodeep into this episode, into it,
(45:55):
but a lot of filmmakers areusing AI now instead of asking
for I don't know how manyhundreds of thousands of dollars
or euros to make a film.
They make a concept video withAI tools and then they can start
promoting their idea andfinancing to make it happen,
(46:15):
which is always very exciting.
Speaker 2 (46:19):
Yes, yes, that's completely true.
I think and I think, as I said,when you don't have the budget,
but you are seeking for fundsto actually develop your idea,
then use AI.
Please, use it as much aspossible so that you can
actually grab these fundings andmake it real reality.
Speaker 1 (46:41):
Let's talk about being a performer.
So maybe I can give you acouple of examples of how I've
used AI as an actress and thenmaybe you can then say how you
would, or maybe encourage yourdancers to use it when you
create a new piece of dancetheater.
Does that sound good?
Yes, perfect.
So for me as a performer, as anactress I'm going to talk about
(47:05):
me as an actress I've beentrying to train ai to be my
improv buddy.
So there is something calledimprov and comedy improv and I
was like you know what, everymorning I want to do a bit of
improv, just to get the machinerolling.
It's been interesting, but Iliterally had to be AI's teacher
(47:26):
.
So I used Gemini for thisparticular one, not ChatGPT, and
I told Gemini you know, let yoube my improv buddy.
And here is a prompt let's go,let's start.
We start an improv scene, butevery improv scene went
spiraling down and went nowherebecause AI was not using these
(47:49):
technical skills or humanempathy.
So I had to teach AI really howto become a better partner, a
better actor I can interact with.
We're still working on it, butit's improving.
I'm not saying it's supersuccessful yet, but it's
improving.
I've also used AI to preparecastings.
So, as actors that work in film, we are often being sent a
(48:12):
script.
We have to prepare it at homeand we have to film ourselves at
home.
Sometimes we don't have muchcontext of that script, which is
very annoying.
So here you have a script.
You just know you are, I don'tknow, a drug dealer Cool.
And you know that you're in afuturistic world Cool but you
still don't know what is thetexture of this drug dealer.
(48:35):
So I've sometimes asked AI andthat is important, because you
all also talked about it oftenwhen do you want to keep
ownership as an artist?
That is important and I feelfor me as a performer, when I
discuss things with AI, Ispecifically tell AI do not tell
me how to act, do not tell mewhich choices to make.
(48:59):
I want you to help me analyzethe script so I can have ideas,
as a performer, of what happenedbefore the scene or after the
scene, or basically analyze it,but not tell me what to do,
because I think that's where Iwant to keep ownership,
(49:20):
definitely.
So, yeah, those are a couple ofexamples you working with
dancers.
Speaker 2 (49:47):
Definitely.
So, yeah, those are a couple ofexamples.
You working with dancers isthere any way that you have
encouraged or they are, they arelike moving on the scene should
be in that in that way, becausethis is coming from the, the
background of the, the, thespecific character.
So, basically, when I'm workingwith team of dancer, then I
provide dialogues and I providethe story.
I always provide also and thisis something that I have done
for years I have provided aone-pager for each character
(50:11):
where I actually provide thehistory background of this
person.
If I receive this specificone-pager of Jenny, I will
submit this one-pager toArtificial Intelligence Model
and analyze it and providing memore context.
How do you think this charactershould be, or what kind of
(50:36):
emotion should be like,portrayed so that the entire
scene make sense?
How do you see the interactionin terms of emotion and how do
you think and then put the hatas the target audience that will
come to see the show, how doyou think they will react?
And this is important, knowingand come back, come back into
(50:59):
the fact that I was saying thatas a creative person, you are in
charge of what you are puttingoutside the world and the
emotion that you want to createin the head of the audience.
Speaker 1 (51:13):
Let's talk about everything that is controversial
around AI.
So obviously this episode hasbeen about what are the exciting
possibilities?
How can AI support our creativecareers, make us even more
productive, support ourcreativity?
There are a lot of fears aswell that people face, such as
(51:36):
will performers eventually bereplaced?
Will writers disappear?
Are there any elements that youare scared of or that you could
see, or it's for you,everything positive?
Speaker 2 (51:50):
I am a creator of AI algorithms, so I know I will say
the extent of AI, but I alsoknow what AI can actually cause
to certain persons.
So this is why I'm saying thatwhen you are using these tools,
you have to be mindful on how touse it, what you are disclosing
(52:13):
as information.
I know it from fact.
I'm creating AI algorithms.
I am inside this sector but inthe same time, I see it like
it's such a revolution.
It's like a game changer, and Idon't see AI as replacing, I
would say, people's jobs.
(52:34):
I see AI as like maybe creatingjobs.
We discussed about promptengineering that was not
existing before.
So this is like really a jobPeople are searching for, prompt
engineering.
So it actually creates jobs,but for jobs that are already
existing.
I think it's really like asupporting tool.
(52:56):
Let's talk about the translators, like now and even before AI,
to be honest, you had to putyour text in the translators and
then you received thetranslation and this was this is
a question this was killingtranslator job.
No, it was helping the reviewto be more fast.
(53:18):
So let's say that you have atext you are writing in French,
but you want your text to be ina Swahili, let's say African
language, then you will use AIor another not AI tool and it
helps, because after that youwill say I have my text in
(53:39):
Swahili, but I want a translatorlike really someone that is
Swahili phone to review it,because AI can have some
mistakes and that's normal.
That's a computer.
What the translator will spendmore time.
Now it's not translating thetext, but reviewing a text that
you have translated and maybeadding more skills to his
(54:04):
services, which is not only liketranslating but, let's say,
providing a certain context,meaning like, okay, let's say
that in Swahili we say this in aspecific way, that actually
it's not well translated by AImodels.
Then I know it from factbecause I'm a Swahili fan, and
(54:25):
we also know that Swahili isdifferent from a country to
another.
So let's say that swahili fromkenya and swahili from this drc
it's a bit different in terms of, I would say, expression.
So all these things will beproviding by a human person.
That is like living in the realworld.
So for me, I don't see ai as akilling job, but as, but, as
like freeing up time to certainactivity that you tend to do.
(54:49):
Before that was maybe not the Iwould say, the activity that
was fulfilling your dream, butfreeing up time for you so that
you can focus on more importantand more, I would say, exciting
things in your own jobs.
And we see also.
We discussed about promptengineering as one example.
It also creates new jobs.
(55:10):
Yes, we had computer scienceand things like that in the past
, way before I was not born, andthings like that.
It was also scary for thepeople out there, but now it's
part of our world.
We use computer as like now,but it's the same with AI.
Some people are scared about AI.
(55:30):
Now I understand there arecertain things that we have to
be mindful of.
We discussed that.
But in a certain way, we haveto embrace AI and see how we can
still interact with thistechnology.
Speaker 1 (55:41):
That will involve with the years that are coming
with this technology that willinvolve with the years that are
coming.
To wrap up this interview, Iwould love you to give a little
bit of advice on the following.
I consider myself to be quitetech savvy and I learn quick and
I love learning.
However, in the world of AI,there are new tools coming.
(56:05):
It's so fast, it evolves insuch a fast way and I'm still
learning a tool that I'm stilltrying to explore and while it
can really help me with myproductivity, I also have to put
in ever-evolving AI landscapeso that we can still use it to
(56:31):
be productive, but we also learnenough and on time so that we
keep up with how it's evolving.
Speaker 2 (56:37):
That's a very good question.
I will advise to be like youcan actually find, I would say,
a newsletter or like we naming acertain company, but you can
find a newsletter where you canbe up to date to receive
information about the new toolsthat are existing in the
(56:57):
creative space, so that youactually don't have to search
for but the information iscoming to you, so that you keep.
I would say you are up to dateabout, but the information is
coming to you so that you keep.
I will say, uh, you are up todate about all the information
and I will say, if you want touse a tool to be honest and even
myself I'm not like, I'm likelearning also some things
(57:17):
youtube is a good place, a goodplace to find a lot of
information.
You you will find a lot oftutorials, a lot it's a huge
library that you can find onYouTube just to learn one, I
would say, specific tool.
And there is like I think everyday they have like a new video
(57:39):
it can be like five minutesvideo or 15 minutes video where
you will be actually learningthe basics for what you need to
do and for your specific task inthe creative space.
So I will advise two things.
First is to actually connect toa newsletter of a company that
you are following and providing,like AI tools for creative
(58:01):
persons, and also follow what isexisting on a tutorial on
YouTube regarding the tool thatyou actually select to help you
in your creative journey.
I think it's the best way andthe cost, I will say effective
way to be up to date and to benot like lost in all this
information.
So, because you don't want tolearn everything, you just need
(58:23):
to have, like in certaininformation on certain specific
things.
So select what you want toactually learn by connecting to
the right newsletter and alsothe same on youtube awesome.
Speaker 1 (58:37):
Thank you so much, jenny.
So where can people keep intouch with you, both as an
artist and with your ai company?
Speaker 2 (58:43):
I think the best way to be in touch of what I'm doing
is to search on my name inLinkedIn, because then you will
be able to write me a messageand then I will be more than
happy to respond to you.
So, if you type my long name,which is Jenny Ambukieni Onya
but I think if you type JennyOnya you find me on LinkedIn
Jenny Ambukieni Onya, but Ithink if you type Jenny Onya
(59:04):
you'll find me on LinkedIn Then,yeah, it's a direct way to
interact with me.
Thank you so much, Jenny.
Thank you Cindy, Thank you alot.
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