November 22, 2023 • 29 mins
Have you ever sat down to create and the next thing you know you're folding laundry or watching Netflix? You're likely encountering RESISTANCE... an invisible force that every single person on earth experiences.
Join us, this week, as we explore the subtle force of resistance that often crops up in an artist/creative's journey. Overcoming creative resistance is essential for artists, as it unlocks the pathway to uninhibited expression, allowing your authentic voice and artistic vision to flourish.
Mama Judy and I will draw parallels between resistance and impostor syndrome (as talked about in episode #6), offering practical techniques to overcome these challenges and liberate your creative expression.
Tune in!
Click here to tune into episode #6 on Imposter Syndrome.
If you'd prefer to watch this podcast, you can find us over on our YouTube page (The Mama Judy & Jill Podcast).
We'd LOVE to hear from you! Click here to send us your thoughts and ideas for a future episode.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Oh good, you made it.
We are so glad you're here.
Welcome to the Mama Judy andJill podcast, an
intergenerational chat aboutlife, art and the creative
process.
I'm your host, jill, andjoining me is my wonderful
co-host and bonus mom, mama Judy.
Let's get started.
Welcome back, we are so gladyou're here today.
(00:23):
Today we are going to betalking about an invisible force
that every single human onearth experiences, called
resistance.
So before we dive into that,hello Mama Judy, hi Jill and,
yes, I've been feelingresistance, so this is perfect.
Okay, good to know, and so Ithink a great place to start
(00:46):
would be.
Can you tell us, mama Judy,what does resistance mean, where
you know?
Where did the word come from?
Tell us a little bit about howthat came about, okay well,
we'll narrow it down to more ofthe creative resistance.
Speaker 2 (00:59):
But I'm going to start at the human DNA.
Humans are somehow in ourevolution, they're hardwired.
That resistance is part of usbecause what the body is trying
to do in resisting change isprotect us from pain.
(01:20):
That's the big global humanpsychology of resistance.
On the creative level, that canbe narrowed down to the fact
that, for example, when I saidI've been feeling resistance, I
noticed that when I go to start,let's say, a new technique in a
(01:44):
total different medium, I feelan energy of resistance about
beginning and what I find myselfdoing.
And this is so easy to do.
I'll go dust, I'll go fold theclothes.
(02:05):
I mean, trust me, houseworknormally does not make the top
of my excitement list.
But, when it comes to I've beenthinking about this and when it
comes to the pain of startingsomething new, which is putting
your vulnerability out there,it's like I have a hard time
(02:27):
sometimes breaking through tostart, and so I go back to
what's known and what'scomfortable and that kind of
fits in with what humans do,what our hard wiring does.
Okay.
Speaker 1 (02:45):
I have two questions.
Yeah, okay, I have twoquestions on that.
So first, I love the fact thatyou said it's part of our DNA
because it was to protect usfrom change.
So what would that look like?
Like why is change a bad thing?
And even back when it firststarted.
I understand now, like I canunderstand, that maybe fear is
(03:06):
driving resistance or you knowsome of those type of things.
But what was the?
What is the problem with change?
Speaker 2 (03:15):
Well, change means you have to put yourself out
there into the unknown, andhuman beings do not like the
unknown.
We want the known, so we'recomfortable in the known.
So when change comes along, youhave to put yourself into an
environment that you don't knowany thing about.
(03:37):
And in creativity, what happenswith resistance?
To me it's almost like the bigforce that allows things like
self doubt, procrastination,criticism I'm not good enough,
(03:58):
all of those things topsychologically creep in that
sneaky, snake voice.
But it's that big umbrella, ifI can use that word of
resistance to change that.
Then these little voices fillin to keep us from doing
something that we might reallywant to do, but we just can't
(04:24):
quite get there.
Speaker 1 (04:26):
Yeah, and when you say that I am experiencing
resistance right now, I wouldnot have known it until you just
said it, because I'm where I'msitting today recording our
podcast.
Today I'm in my studio, so youcan't see it, but right down
here, the table that my computeris sitting on, but right down
here I'm going to show you.
So, if you're on YouTube, I'mtilting the computer.
(04:49):
It's just everything's pilingup.
It is a mess.
I know there's a little spot inthe middle, but that right
there is causing me to.
When I come in here, I feeloverwhelmed and I go back out.
Okay, so I'm feeling resistanceto create because I've allowed
this to pile up and it's likeI've procrastinated.
(05:11):
I've procrastinated on gettingthis in order because I'm
overwhelmed, and now I really amfeeling resistance to create
because I'm stuck and I feellike this all has to get done
before I can really create, andso I did not even think about it
until you just said it now.
Speaker 2 (05:27):
You know, jill, we talk about a lot of this in
different ways and we've touchedon things like this in other
terms, and I hadn't thoughtabout the word resistance either
.
Excuse me, but, just like you,as I begin to examine, why am I
(05:53):
feeling this way?
Why can't I do this?
Why is it easier for me to runoff and find any excuse not to
sit down at my paint table, myeasel and begin what I want to
begin, and I realize I amresisting it?
(06:15):
And the only thing I can thinkof and that's what made me start
examining this a little bitmore is there's got to be
psychologically, emotionally,something that that resistance
is trying to do.
And so when I did my research,that's what I found out
Resistance is to keep us awayfrom it.
(06:38):
It thinks it's doing us a favor.
It's to keep us frompsychological, physical and
emotional pain.
And you know, when you putyourself out there to try
something new, you feelvulnerable.
You feel like, oh, I'm not goodenough, or what if this fails?
(06:59):
What if I'm just a horriblepainter?
All of those things suddenlyshow up, and that's because
resistance has allowed them to.
Speaker 1 (07:11):
Right, and one of the things that you mentioned to
about the self doubt and thelittle inner credit is saying
you know, who do you think youare and all that.
That does remind me of whatwe've talked about way back in
episode six when we talked aboutthe imposter syndrome, because
the big part of it too.
But, like you said, resistancekind of has this umbrella thing.
(07:32):
But I was sort of wonderingbefore we talked about this
today I was thinking, well,resistance and imposter syndrome
are kind of similar and so Ipulled up something.
Can I just read in case someoneelse in the audience is
thinking like, isn't this justthe same thing as imposter
syndrome?
I want to read a little bitthat I pulled up.
Absolutely Okay.
So what you've just talkedabout, you've already described
(07:53):
what resistance is, so I'm justgoing to say imposter syndrome
on the other hand.
So separate from resistance isthe feeling that you're not
truly qualified for the workyou're doing or the success
you've achieved, despiteevidence of your competencies.
And I know we said that when wedid our so done imposter
syndrome, but I kind of forgotbecause I just got these lumped
(08:15):
in together the resistance andimposter syndrome.
It's the same thing.
They're coming at you andspeaking the little voices in
your head, but they're differentbecause many things, like you
said, if you're trying a newtechnique, you're having that
resistance because you don'talready have the competencies.
You can't say, well, what am Idoing?
I am a good painter, I knowthat already, it's already been
(08:36):
proven or I can show myself that.
Speaker 2 (08:39):
Absolutely, and if you think about it when you're
doing anything that requireschange, what does that feel like
in your body?
Speaker 1 (08:52):
It feels new, hard, uncomfortable.
Speaker 2 (08:57):
Okay, you've just hit upon it resistance.
The purpose of resistance inthe human being is to protect us
from the discomfort of change.
That's why it's so nice to stayin the status quo.
You stay there, you're not inpain, you know what's familiar
(09:24):
all of that.
So it's almost like you use theword force, this invisible
force.
So if I can paint an image,let's think of resistance in
front of an army and it's gotthis big battering ram that kind
of pushes back against any kindof change.
(09:49):
And behind that wall, thatbattering ram, are all these
little minions likeprocrastination, self-doubt,
imposter syndrome.
They're all behind resistance.
Speaker 1 (10:05):
Wow, what a great visual.
That helped me a lot.
Speaker 2 (10:10):
Good good.
If you look at the status quo,for example, what you have is a
long-standing pattern of habit,and I'll use myself.
I've mentioned before howcomfortable it is for me to go
in and do my little grungy artjournal pages.
(10:34):
I try out techniques.
I don't have to worry aboutwhether one page is successful.
I'm very, very comfortabledoing it.
So when I decided to startfollowing an artist that does
little tips on how to paint, Inoticed that it was like going
(10:59):
to the dentist.
It wasn't fun to sit down withthat paintbrush in hand and
follow the lessons.
I was not comfortable because,again, I'm in the unknown.
I don't know whether I'm goingto be successful.
If I show it to anybody, arethey going to tell me oh, you
(11:23):
better go back to something else?
So, we've used different terms,but what I was hoping when we
talk about resistance, is justto make people self-aware that
we're all dealing with it andit's a human thing and we can
(11:43):
overcome it.
But really to examinethemselves Am I experiencing
resistance?
Is that what's keeping me fromdoing what I want to do?
Because it's through two things, and I've read this in several
places.
In fact, I just read it thismorning on an Instagram page
(12:08):
where the artist said today I'mopen and curious.
Well, the way you overcomeresistance is awareness and
curiosity.
You have to be aware whenresistance is playing its part
in your art.
If you find yourself thinkingabout going to do something new,
(12:33):
but all of a sudden foldingsocks is more appealing, that
might be resistance.
If you find taking out thegarbage is more fun than sitting
down at your new project, yeah,you're dealing with some
resistance.
So the first step is to justunderstand it's there.
(12:56):
All of us go through it at sometime.
And the other thing that willhelp overcome it is curiosity,
Like when we were kids we'vereferred to this many times Stay
open like a child.
They don't worry about whetheror not it's good, they just do
(13:16):
it.
So if we can learn to always becurious and stay aware of when
resistance.
Don't beat yourself up, butjust, oh look, I normally don't
do this.
I wonder if this is my way ofnot going to an uncomfortable
(13:38):
place.
Speaker 1 (13:40):
Right.
And then also so youacknowledge that it's happening
and then pushing through and I'mthinking of that battering ram,
like pushing against theresistance.
You've got to push through inorder to keep going and then
have fun or see something thatyou really like, that you just
created, or something to get tothat next level.
(14:00):
So you got past the change andnow you're like OK, I've moved
on.
You're seeing a little bit ofpositive momentum.
Speaker 2 (14:07):
Absolutely.
And if you think about it, wetalked about just a moment ago
about what it feels like whenyou come up against resistance
it's uncomfortable, you're notexcited.
But when you're in a creativespace, when you're open and
flowing and gotten pastresistance, it's excitement.
(14:30):
You're excited to be there,you're excited to do this.
So those two things, those twoways of feeling, are very
inherent and go back and forthin the creative process.
Rick Rubin, who we'vereferenced before, talked about
(14:53):
a block, an artist block, beingthat not necessarily that you've
lost your creativity, becausecreativity is always out there.
You've just chosen to step back.
But, like you said, stevePressfield in his books talks
about resistance as causing theartist block.
(15:14):
So between those two authors,we have two different ways of
looking at something as simpleas the artist block, and that's
why another reason why when wetalk about similar things with
different words and come at itfrom a different way, it's all
good, it's all the same thing,it's all wrapped up in the
(15:37):
creative process, but wesometimes need to hear and
understand things differentlybefore it resonates with me,
just like the battering ram.
If that helped you understandwhat resistance is, now you know
(15:58):
it emotionally as well asperhaps intellectually.
Speaker 1 (16:02):
Yes, yes, exactly, and I think too.
Tell me, I don't know why thisword just popped in my head, but
I was thinking about you.
Okay, you meant change, butevolve.
Yes, evolve, that word justcame to mind and I thought
evolve is kind of a way thatsmashes down that resistance.
Also, right, as we evolve, ifwe allow ourselves to evolve,
(16:27):
which means to change, insteadof having that resistance to
change as we evolve.
I don't know why.
That's an interesting word thatliterally just popped into my
head.
Speaker 2 (16:36):
Well, it's perfect word right now, because as you
overcome resistance and whilewe're talking about that, let me
just say that resistance alsois the beginning of the process
of new creativity.
Now that soundscounterintuitive to what I've
(16:56):
just said, but if you thinkabout it, resistance, and you
take that step to overcome it,getting past resistance, means
you've changed even a little bit, your art has changed even a
little bit.
So, as you move beyondresistance, you're trusting more
(17:20):
, you're evolving more, yourwork is changing, but it starts
with resistance, with overcomingresistance.
So evolve is the perfect word,because that's what you're doing
by overcoming resistance.
Speaker 1 (17:38):
Right, I think I'm going to write that word on my
and put it around here on mydesk somewhere.
Speaker 2 (17:42):
Yes, so I put.
Speaker 1 (17:45):
Go ahead.
Speaker 2 (17:46):
No, go ahead.
I was going to say I'm going toput resistance in front of me
to help me remember.
When I begin to those samefeelings that, oh, I don't want,
maybe I'll go straight in thefront room up.
I want to identify what'sreally behind that.
(18:06):
Was I thinking of going inpainting and all of a sudden
that sounded more appealing it's.
You know, it takes 90 days tomake a new habit.
So, if we identify resistance,we are not going to overcome it
in one fell swoop.
It's going to take tiny littlesteps of evolution Right and 90
(18:31):
to 100 days to go beyond andestablish the habit that you've
started with overcomingresistance.
I don't ever want anybody tothink that, oh, if I identify it
, that's undone.
That's only the beginning.
Speaker 1 (18:50):
Right, yeah, and one thing I forgot to mention
earlier when I mentioned themess that my desk is.
The resistance is because Iwant to clean this desk, because
I want to try out some paintingwhich you know, I haven't
painted barely anything but Iwant to clear my space out just
to make some pages for journalsand do some painting.
But all this stuff needs to becleared away.
(19:12):
That was my resistance I forgotto mention earlier.
So someone listening it couldjust be that you keep not
cleaning your desk area orwhatever, because you're trying
to clear space for that nextcreative endeavor you're going
to be, because right noweverything is stitching related,
so I can sit down here andstitch, but what I really want
to do is clear my space so thatI can try something new.
And that is exactly what's beengoing on, and we've just named
(19:34):
it.
Speaker 2 (19:36):
And that's true.
It's just like me getting upand dusting and I mean literally
that's what I was doing andthere is.
All of us can deal with acertain amount of clutter.
I function and always have.
I was that person whose desklooked like a bomb went off, but
(19:59):
I knew where every piece ofpaper was.
Somebody who has to be neat andorderly approaches things
differently, but here's whereyou have to be careful.
Just like you mentioned, youhave to be careful that your
need for order and cleanlinessis not an excuse resistance for
(20:22):
going and doing what you want.
So even something as simple astidying up your workspace Great
Well, I even need to tidy upmine.
But how often do you do it?
Do you do it every time youthink of a new project?
Speaker 1 (20:40):
No.
Speaker 2 (20:41):
It's awareness again.
Speaker 1 (20:42):
Right, yes, ok, great , that makes sense.
So, before we wrap up, when youwere just experiencing it, so
you have self-examined this withthe painting, did you, is this
just a very new realization, ordid you already overcome that
resistance and did you paintsomething new?
Or are you about to?
Speaker 2 (21:03):
Probably all of the above.
Ok.
So we've touched on this typeof thing in different ways.
Like we said, and like I'vesaid in prior podcasts, I am
extremely thinking self and lifephilosophically and this idea
(21:23):
of resistance just kind of itwas like the aha moment where
you go, oh, maybe that, and thatthen triggered me to do more
research into it and to find outyeah, this is a normal human
thing and part of the process.
So, with that in mind, what I'mdoing now is I'm still Going to
(21:49):
take one step at a time in thepainting.
I'm gonna want learn and becomfortable there's that word
again, comfort With one aspectof the painting.
I'm gonna quit, in the back ofmy mind without realizing that,
thinking I have to be Van Goghin the first painting I paint.
(22:09):
I'm gonna quit setting myselfup for failure with these high
expectations, and that allhappens internally without being
aware of it.
So I'm working on that.
I am.
I have been painting more andDoing things much more outside
my comfort zone, but I'm gonnaI'm gonna be more aware of it
(22:35):
and I think that's gonna help metremendously be comfortable
with that Process and it.
It probably goes back, like wesaid one time before, where you
always have somebody from theexternal Say something and it
stays in your mind and mind, wasthe Art assistant that taught
(22:57):
the drawing class.
You know that voice is probablyLurking back there where my
resistance says ooh, that waspainful, don't want to go there
again.
So let's not even start in thatdirection.
Speaker 1 (23:13):
Right, and if?
If you didn't listen to thepodcast episode, what mama Judy
is referring to is an artassistant that told her that she
shouldn't.
She shouldn't be doing the artlike she should just wrap it up
and go do something else.
Speaker 2 (23:25):
Right, right, and I'll bet you, everybody out
there has someone at some timethat's made a comment that's
still in their psyche.
Speaker 1 (23:38):
Yeah, well, and I think one thing interesting for
those listening, One thing Icould say that would come from
this is to, like you said, beaware of the resistance and then
start taking small steps toMove forward and and create and
you've all been all that.
But also one thing that we bothsaid that's very different is,
as we all experience theseThings that are just natural to
(24:01):
be in a human, and beingcreative, call it what it is or
put a word out there.
You said you're gonna writeresistance, I'm gonna write it
off like.
So we just chose two differentwords and different approaches,
but it's still to acknowledgewhat's happening or what could
be, or something.
I think that's a helpful thingfor us to write down what's
(24:24):
happening, or write down anAspirational word or something
like that to help us, to remindus of things as they pop up.
Speaker 2 (24:31):
Absolutely, that's it .
That's part of that awareness.
Yeah, those words that we aregonna use, they're just gonna
remind us, they're gonna make usaware and it occurred to me too
, jill, that another way ofsomeone is Feeling this if this
resonates with someone, and theydo make journal pages or even
(24:53):
stitch, put those words thatcome up into your work.
Speaker 1 (24:58):
Hmm, yes, I've seen that a lot, val, who you know?
Val is words in there.
Megan, there's a lot of peoplethat I see that they stitch
words or just, like you know,have a cutout word or write the
word on into their work.
Speaker 2 (25:11):
Right really nice, and and it's okay To acknowledge
even the words that aren't ourbest friends Right evolve as our
best friend.
Resistance not so much, but westill need to give it its place.
It's due, it's there for apurpose mm-hmm but it takes its
(25:35):
job too seriously sometimes.
Speaker 1 (25:38):
Love thinking about that.
Well, and I hope that us evenbeing on this podcast and others
that are watching we sometimessay we'll be your accountability
partner.
But, mama Judy, I'm gonna askthat you be my accountability
partner so to push through thatresistance for me for the
painting, I just need to tidy upa few things.
I'm not gonna let that beanything that's stopping me, but
(25:59):
I just don't want to get painteverywhere on my threads.
So sometimes it helps to havean accountability, to be able to
push through resistance,because you kind of put it out
there into the world and thatdoes help me.
So I'm gonna use you for that,please.
Speaker 2 (26:13):
You bet, and you know , because painting again is a
Vulnerable area for me, I'm notready to go flashing them around
, but I will show you.
Okay, I know you're my account.
You're, even if we don't usethe word accountability partner.
Yes, I guess the bottom line isI Trust you enough in this new
(26:39):
part of my journey To show it toyou before I'm ready to show
other people and trust is a bigpart of our creative journey
that is, and thank you for beingvulnerable in that way and for
me, all I need.
Speaker 1 (26:53):
I don't.
This isn't really vulnerablebecause I'm probably not gonna
share much of it, but I justknow that you're gonna want me
to evolve.
So you're gonna text me and saydid you get that done?
Yet?
Like, I know that you care thatthis is important to me and so
we're kind of looking at it alittle bit different ways.
But, yes, great.
Speaker 2 (27:12):
Yeah, so I hope everybody out there that listen
to this Will find something thatresonates with them that then,
like you said, jill can take onesmall step to overcoming
resistance to whatever it is andMaybe even keep track of their
(27:36):
own Evolution, because they will, as they as any of us, get
beyond the resistance.
We'll see the changes in ourwork Well, and we take small
steps.
Speaker 1 (27:50):
Yes, and one episode that aired last week with Wanda
talked about how you can useInstagram as a Visual archive
type thing when you're ready.
But that is a place where, forsure, you can go back and say,
wow, look how I remember Ipushed through and that was my
first time I ever did decide toshare XYZ or whatever for all of
(28:12):
us.
But that's a neat visualrepresentation to or in a little
journal.
I sometimes just jot downthings that I'm working on in a
little journal and it's fun tolook back and go oh my gosh, I
was fretting about this on thiscreative journey and here I am
doing something totallydifferent, or that was so much
fun and I've evolved since then.
Very good, yes, okay.
(28:33):
Well, thank you everyone forjoining us today.
This was fun.
Mama Judy, thank you forbringing this idea to all of us,
because this was I learned alot today myself, and I hope all
of our listeners do as well,and I did too in my research.
Okay and we look forward toseeing whatever painting that
you put out there to the wideworld at some point down the
road, maybe, if not, text mepictures, all right, I will all
(28:58):
right, All right.
Speaker 2 (29:00):
Thank you all.
Love you Jill.
Speaker 1 (29:04):
Love you too, mama Judy.
Talk to you later.
Oh good, you made it.
We are so glad you're here.
Welcome to the Mama Judy andJill podcast, an
intergenerational chat aboutlife, art and the creative
process.
I'm your host, jill, andjoining me is my wonderful
co-host and bonus mom, mama Judy.
Let's get started.
Welcome back, we are so gladyou're here today.
(00:23):
Today we are going to betalking about an invisible force
that every single human onearth experiences, called
resistance.
So before we dive into that,hello Mama Judy, hi Jill and,
yes, I've been feelingresistance, so this is perfect.
Okay, good to know, and so Ithink a great place to start
(00:46):
would be.
Can you tell us, mama Judy,what does resistance mean, where
you know?
Where did the word come from?
Tell us a little bit about howthat came about, okay well,
we'll narrow it down to more ofthe creative resistance.
Speaker 2 (00:59):
But I'm going to start at the human DNA.
Humans are somehow in ourevolution, they're hardwired.
That resistance is part of usbecause what the body is trying
to do in resisting change isprotect us from pain.
(01:20):
That's the big global humanpsychology of resistance.
On the creative level, that canbe narrowed down to the fact
that, for example, when I saidI've been feeling resistance, I
noticed that when I go to start,let's say, a new technique in a
(01:44):
total different medium, I feelan energy of resistance about
beginning and what I find myselfdoing.
And this is so easy to do.
I'll go dust, I'll go fold theclothes.
(02:05):
I mean, trust me, houseworknormally does not make the top
of my excitement list.
But, when it comes to I've beenthinking about this and when it
comes to the pain of startingsomething new, which is putting
your vulnerability out there,it's like I have a hard time
(02:27):
sometimes breaking through tostart, and so I go back to
what's known and what'scomfortable and that kind of
fits in with what humans do,what our hard wiring does.
Okay.
Speaker 1 (02:45):
I have two questions.
Yeah, okay, I have twoquestions on that.
So first, I love the fact thatyou said it's part of our DNA
because it was to protect usfrom change.
So what would that look like?
Like why is change a bad thing?
And even back when it firststarted.
I understand now, like I canunderstand, that maybe fear is
(03:06):
driving resistance or you knowsome of those type of things.
But what was the?
What is the problem with change?
Speaker 2 (03:15):
Well, change means you have to put yourself out
there into the unknown, andhuman beings do not like the
unknown.
We want the known, so we'recomfortable in the known.
So when change comes along, youhave to put yourself into an
environment that you don't knowany thing about.
(03:37):
And in creativity, what happenswith resistance?
To me it's almost like the bigforce that allows things like
self doubt, procrastination,criticism I'm not good enough,
(03:58):
all of those things topsychologically creep in that
sneaky, snake voice.
But it's that big umbrella, ifI can use that word of
resistance to change that.
Then these little voices fillin to keep us from doing
something that we might reallywant to do, but we just can't
(04:24):
quite get there.
Speaker 1 (04:26):
Yeah, and when you say that I am experiencing
resistance right now, I wouldnot have known it until you just
said it, because I'm where I'msitting today recording our
podcast.
Today I'm in my studio, so youcan't see it, but right down
here, the table that my computeris sitting on, but right down
here I'm going to show you.
So, if you're on YouTube, I'mtilting the computer.
(04:49):
It's just everything's pilingup.
It is a mess.
I know there's a little spot inthe middle, but that right
there is causing me to.
When I come in here, I feeloverwhelmed and I go back out.
Okay, so I'm feeling resistanceto create because I've allowed
this to pile up and it's likeI've procrastinated.
(05:11):
I've procrastinated on gettingthis in order because I'm
overwhelmed, and now I really amfeeling resistance to create
because I'm stuck and I feellike this all has to get done
before I can really create, andso I did not even think about it
until you just said it now.
Speaker 2 (05:27):
You know, jill, we talk about a lot of this in
different ways and we've touchedon things like this in other
terms, and I hadn't thoughtabout the word resistance either
.
Excuse me, but, just like you,as I begin to examine, why am I
(05:53):
feeling this way?
Why can't I do this?
Why is it easier for me to runoff and find any excuse not to
sit down at my paint table, myeasel and begin what I want to
begin, and I realize I amresisting it?
(06:15):
And the only thing I can thinkof and that's what made me start
examining this a little bitmore is there's got to be
psychologically, emotionally,something that that resistance
is trying to do.
And so when I did my research,that's what I found out
Resistance is to keep us awayfrom it.
(06:38):
It thinks it's doing us a favor.
It's to keep us frompsychological, physical and
emotional pain.
And you know, when you putyourself out there to try
something new, you feelvulnerable.
You feel like, oh, I'm not goodenough, or what if this fails?
(06:59):
What if I'm just a horriblepainter?
All of those things suddenlyshow up, and that's because
resistance has allowed them to.
Speaker 1 (07:11):
Right, and one of the things that you mentioned to
about the self doubt and thelittle inner credit is saying
you know, who do you think youare and all that.
That does remind me of whatwe've talked about way back in
episode six when we talked aboutthe imposter syndrome, because
the big part of it too.
But, like you said, resistancekind of has this umbrella thing.
(07:32):
But I was sort of wonderingbefore we talked about this
today I was thinking, well,resistance and imposter syndrome
are kind of similar and so Ipulled up something.
Can I just read in case someoneelse in the audience is
thinking like, isn't this justthe same thing as imposter
syndrome?
I want to read a little bitthat I pulled up.
Absolutely Okay.
So what you've just talkedabout, you've already described
(07:53):
what resistance is, so I'm justgoing to say imposter syndrome
on the other hand.
So separate from resistance isthe feeling that you're not
truly qualified for the workyou're doing or the success
you've achieved, despiteevidence of your competencies.
And I know we said that when wedid our so done imposter
syndrome, but I kind of forgotbecause I just got these lumped
(08:15):
in together the resistance andimposter syndrome.
It's the same thing.
They're coming at you andspeaking the little voices in
your head, but they're differentbecause many things, like you
said, if you're trying a newtechnique, you're having that
resistance because you don'talready have the competencies.
You can't say, well, what am Idoing?
I am a good painter, I knowthat already, it's already been
(08:36):
proven or I can show myself that.
Speaker 2 (08:39):
Absolutely, and if you think about it when you're
doing anything that requireschange, what does that feel like
in your body?
Speaker 1 (08:52):
It feels new, hard, uncomfortable.
Speaker 2 (08:57):
Okay, you've just hit upon it resistance.
The purpose of resistance inthe human being is to protect us
from the discomfort of change.
That's why it's so nice to stayin the status quo.
You stay there, you're not inpain, you know what's familiar
(09:24):
all of that.
So it's almost like you use theword force, this invisible
force.
So if I can paint an image,let's think of resistance in
front of an army and it's gotthis big battering ram that kind
of pushes back against any kindof change.
(09:49):
And behind that wall, thatbattering ram, are all these
little minions likeprocrastination, self-doubt,
imposter syndrome.
They're all behind resistance.
Speaker 1 (10:05):
Wow, what a great visual.
That helped me a lot.
Speaker 2 (10:10):
Good good.
If you look at the status quo,for example, what you have is a
long-standing pattern of habit,and I'll use myself.
I've mentioned before howcomfortable it is for me to go
in and do my little grungy artjournal pages.
(10:34):
I try out techniques.
I don't have to worry aboutwhether one page is successful.
I'm very, very comfortabledoing it.
So when I decided to startfollowing an artist that does
little tips on how to paint, Inoticed that it was like going
(10:59):
to the dentist.
It wasn't fun to sit down withthat paintbrush in hand and
follow the lessons.
I was not comfortable because,again, I'm in the unknown.
I don't know whether I'm goingto be successful.
If I show it to anybody, arethey going to tell me oh, you
(11:23):
better go back to something else?
So, we've used different terms,but what I was hoping when we
talk about resistance, is justto make people self-aware that
we're all dealing with it andit's a human thing and we can
(11:43):
overcome it.
But really to examinethemselves Am I experiencing
resistance?
Is that what's keeping me fromdoing what I want to do?
Because it's through two things, and I've read this in several
places.
In fact, I just read it thismorning on an Instagram page
(12:08):
where the artist said today I'mopen and curious.
Well, the way you overcomeresistance is awareness and
curiosity.
You have to be aware whenresistance is playing its part
in your art.
If you find yourself thinkingabout going to do something new,
(12:33):
but all of a sudden foldingsocks is more appealing, that
might be resistance.
If you find taking out thegarbage is more fun than sitting
down at your new project, yeah,you're dealing with some
resistance.
So the first step is to justunderstand it's there.
(12:56):
All of us go through it at sometime.
And the other thing that willhelp overcome it is curiosity,
Like when we were kids we'vereferred to this many times Stay
open like a child.
They don't worry about whetheror not it's good, they just do
(13:16):
it.
So if we can learn to always becurious and stay aware of when
resistance.
Don't beat yourself up, butjust, oh look, I normally don't
do this.
I wonder if this is my way ofnot going to an uncomfortable
(13:38):
place.
Speaker 1 (13:40):
Right.
And then also so youacknowledge that it's happening
and then pushing through and I'mthinking of that battering ram,
like pushing against theresistance.
You've got to push through inorder to keep going and then
have fun or see something thatyou really like, that you just
created, or something to get tothat next level.
(14:00):
So you got past the change andnow you're like OK, I've moved
on.
You're seeing a little bit ofpositive momentum.
Speaker 2 (14:07):
Absolutely.
And if you think about it, wetalked about just a moment ago
about what it feels like whenyou come up against resistance
it's uncomfortable, you're notexcited.
But when you're in a creativespace, when you're open and
flowing and gotten pastresistance, it's excitement.
(14:30):
You're excited to be there,you're excited to do this.
So those two things, those twoways of feeling, are very
inherent and go back and forthin the creative process.
Rick Rubin, who we'vereferenced before, talked about
(14:53):
a block, an artist block, beingthat not necessarily that you've
lost your creativity, becausecreativity is always out there.
You've just chosen to step back.
But, like you said, stevePressfield in his books talks
about resistance as causing theartist block.
(15:14):
So between those two authors,we have two different ways of
looking at something as simpleas the artist block, and that's
why another reason why when wetalk about similar things with
different words and come at itfrom a different way, it's all
good, it's all the same thing,it's all wrapped up in the
(15:37):
creative process, but wesometimes need to hear and
understand things differentlybefore it resonates with me,
just like the battering ram.
If that helped you understandwhat resistance is, now you know
(15:58):
it emotionally as well asperhaps intellectually.
Speaker 1 (16:02):
Yes, yes, exactly, and I think too.
Tell me, I don't know why thisword just popped in my head, but
I was thinking about you.
Okay, you meant change, butevolve.
Yes, evolve, that word justcame to mind and I thought
evolve is kind of a way thatsmashes down that resistance.
Also, right, as we evolve, ifwe allow ourselves to evolve,
(16:27):
which means to change, insteadof having that resistance to
change as we evolve.
I don't know why.
That's an interesting word thatliterally just popped into my
head.
Speaker 2 (16:36):
Well, it's perfect word right now, because as you
overcome resistance and whilewe're talking about that, let me
just say that resistance alsois the beginning of the process
of new creativity.
Now that soundscounterintuitive to what I've
(16:56):
just said, but if you thinkabout it, resistance, and you
take that step to overcome it,getting past resistance, means
you've changed even a little bit, your art has changed even a
little bit.
So, as you move beyondresistance, you're trusting more
(17:20):
, you're evolving more, yourwork is changing, but it starts
with resistance, with overcomingresistance.
So evolve is the perfect word,because that's what you're doing
by overcoming resistance.
Speaker 1 (17:38):
Right, I think I'm going to write that word on my
and put it around here on mydesk somewhere.
Speaker 2 (17:42):
Yes, so I put.
Speaker 1 (17:45):
Go ahead.
Speaker 2 (17:46):
No, go ahead.
I was going to say I'm going toput resistance in front of me
to help me remember.
When I begin to those samefeelings that, oh, I don't want,
maybe I'll go straight in thefront room up.
I want to identify what'sreally behind that.
(18:06):
Was I thinking of going inpainting and all of a sudden
that sounded more appealing it's.
You know, it takes 90 days tomake a new habit.
So, if we identify resistance,we are not going to overcome it
in one fell swoop.
It's going to take tiny littlesteps of evolution Right and 90
(18:31):
to 100 days to go beyond andestablish the habit that you've
started with overcomingresistance.
I don't ever want anybody tothink that, oh, if I identify it
, that's undone.
That's only the beginning.
Speaker 1 (18:50):
Right, yeah, and one thing I forgot to mention
earlier when I mentioned themess that my desk is.
The resistance is because Iwant to clean this desk, because
I want to try out some paintingwhich you know, I haven't
painted barely anything but Iwant to clear my space out just
to make some pages for journalsand do some painting.
But all this stuff needs to becleared away.
(19:12):
That was my resistance I forgotto mention earlier.
So someone listening it couldjust be that you keep not
cleaning your desk area orwhatever, because you're trying
to clear space for that nextcreative endeavor you're going
to be, because right noweverything is stitching related,
so I can sit down here andstitch, but what I really want
to do is clear my space so thatI can try something new.
And that is exactly what's beengoing on, and we've just named
(19:34):
it.
Speaker 2 (19:36):
And that's true.
It's just like me getting upand dusting and I mean literally
that's what I was doing andthere is.
All of us can deal with acertain amount of clutter.
I function and always have.
I was that person whose desklooked like a bomb went off, but
(19:59):
I knew where every piece ofpaper was.
Somebody who has to be neat andorderly approaches things
differently, but here's whereyou have to be careful.
Just like you mentioned, youhave to be careful that your
need for order and cleanlinessis not an excuse resistance for
(20:22):
going and doing what you want.
So even something as simple astidying up your workspace Great
Well, I even need to tidy upmine.
But how often do you do it?
Do you do it every time youthink of a new project?
Speaker 1 (20:40):
No.
Speaker 2 (20:41):
It's awareness again.
Speaker 1 (20:42):
Right, yes, ok, great , that makes sense.
So, before we wrap up, when youwere just experiencing it, so
you have self-examined this withthe painting, did you, is this
just a very new realization, ordid you already overcome that
resistance and did you paintsomething new?
Or are you about to?
Speaker 2 (21:03):
Probably all of the above.
Ok.
So we've touched on this typeof thing in different ways.
Like we said, and like I'vesaid in prior podcasts, I am
extremely thinking self and lifephilosophically and this idea
(21:23):
of resistance just kind of itwas like the aha moment where
you go, oh, maybe that, and thatthen triggered me to do more
research into it and to find outyeah, this is a normal human
thing and part of the process.
So, with that in mind, what I'mdoing now is I'm still Going to
(21:49):
take one step at a time in thepainting.
I'm gonna want learn and becomfortable there's that word
again, comfort With one aspectof the painting.
I'm gonna quit, in the back ofmy mind without realizing that,
thinking I have to be Van Goghin the first painting I paint.
(22:09):
I'm gonna quit setting myselfup for failure with these high
expectations, and that allhappens internally without being
aware of it.
So I'm working on that.
I am.
I have been painting more andDoing things much more outside
my comfort zone, but I'm gonnaI'm gonna be more aware of it
(22:35):
and I think that's gonna help metremendously be comfortable
with that Process and it.
It probably goes back, like wesaid one time before, where you
always have somebody from theexternal Say something and it
stays in your mind and mind, wasthe Art assistant that taught
(22:57):
the drawing class.
You know that voice is probablyLurking back there where my
resistance says ooh, that waspainful, don't want to go there
again.
So let's not even start in thatdirection.
Speaker 1 (23:13):
Right, and if?
If you didn't listen to thepodcast episode, what mama Judy
is referring to is an artassistant that told her that she
shouldn't.
She shouldn't be doing the artlike she should just wrap it up
and go do something else.
Speaker 2 (23:25):
Right, right, and I'll bet you, everybody out
there has someone at some timethat's made a comment that's
still in their psyche.
Speaker 1 (23:38):
Yeah, well, and I think one thing interesting for
those listening, One thing Icould say that would come from
this is to, like you said, beaware of the resistance and then
start taking small steps toMove forward and and create and
you've all been all that.
But also one thing that we bothsaid that's very different is,
as we all experience theseThings that are just natural to
(24:01):
be in a human, and beingcreative, call it what it is or
put a word out there.
You said you're gonna writeresistance, I'm gonna write it
off like.
So we just chose two differentwords and different approaches,
but it's still to acknowledgewhat's happening or what could
be, or something.
I think that's a helpful thingfor us to write down what's
(24:24):
happening, or write down anAspirational word or something
like that to help us, to remindus of things as they pop up.
Speaker 2 (24:31):
Absolutely, that's it .
That's part of that awareness.
Yeah, those words that we aregonna use, they're just gonna
remind us, they're gonna make usaware and it occurred to me too
, jill, that another way ofsomeone is Feeling this if this
resonates with someone, and theydo make journal pages or even
(24:53):
stitch, put those words thatcome up into your work.
Speaker 1 (24:58):
Hmm, yes, I've seen that a lot, val, who you know?
Val is words in there.
Megan, there's a lot of peoplethat I see that they stitch
words or just, like you know,have a cutout word or write the
word on into their work.
Speaker 2 (25:11):
Right really nice, and and it's okay To acknowledge
even the words that aren't ourbest friends Right evolve as our
best friend.
Resistance not so much, but westill need to give it its place.
It's due, it's there for apurpose mm-hmm but it takes its
(25:35):
job too seriously sometimes.
Speaker 1 (25:38):
Love thinking about that.
Well, and I hope that us evenbeing on this podcast and others
that are watching we sometimessay we'll be your accountability
partner.
But, mama Judy, I'm gonna askthat you be my accountability
partner so to push through thatresistance for me for the
painting, I just need to tidy upa few things.
I'm not gonna let that beanything that's stopping me, but
(25:59):
I just don't want to get painteverywhere on my threads.
So sometimes it helps to havean accountability, to be able to
push through resistance,because you kind of put it out
there into the world and thatdoes help me.
So I'm gonna use you for that,please.
Speaker 2 (26:13):
You bet, and you know , because painting again is a
Vulnerable area for me, I'm notready to go flashing them around
, but I will show you.
Okay, I know you're my account.
You're, even if we don't usethe word accountability partner.
Yes, I guess the bottom line isI Trust you enough in this new
(26:39):
part of my journey To show it toyou before I'm ready to show
other people and trust is a bigpart of our creative journey
that is, and thank you for beingvulnerable in that way and for
me, all I need.
Speaker 1 (26:53):
I don't.
This isn't really vulnerablebecause I'm probably not gonna
share much of it, but I justknow that you're gonna want me
to evolve.
So you're gonna text me and saydid you get that done?
Yet?
Like, I know that you care thatthis is important to me and so
we're kind of looking at it alittle bit different ways.
But, yes, great.
Speaker 2 (27:12):
Yeah, so I hope everybody out there that listen
to this Will find something thatresonates with them that then,
like you said, jill can take onesmall step to overcoming
resistance to whatever it is andMaybe even keep track of their
(27:36):
own Evolution, because they will, as they as any of us, get
beyond the resistance.
We'll see the changes in ourwork Well, and we take small
steps.
Speaker 1 (27:50):
Yes, and one episode that aired last week with Wanda
talked about how you can useInstagram as a Visual archive
type thing when you're ready.
But that is a place where, forsure, you can go back and say,
wow, look how I remember Ipushed through and that was my
first time I ever did decide toshare XYZ or whatever for all of
(28:12):
us.
But that's a neat visualrepresentation to or in a little
journal.
I sometimes just jot downthings that I'm working on in a
little journal and it's fun tolook back and go oh my gosh, I
was fretting about this on thiscreative journey and here I am
doing something totallydifferent, or that was so much
fun and I've evolved since then.
Very good, yes, okay.
(28:33):
Well, thank you everyone forjoining us today.
This was fun.
Mama Judy, thank you forbringing this idea to all of us,
because this was I learned alot today myself, and I hope all
of our listeners do as well,and I did too in my research.
Okay and we look forward toseeing whatever painting that
you put out there to the wideworld at some point down the
road, maybe, if not, text mepictures, all right, I will all
(28:58):
right, All right.
Speaker 2 (29:00):
Thank you all.
Love you Jill.
Speaker 1 (29:04):
Love you too, mama Judy.
Talk to you later.
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