November 29, 2023 • 24 mins
Ever wonder why time flies when you're lost in art or how your artistic journey takes unexpected, yet gratifying turns?
This is the magical state of FLOW. Join us as we explore the the concept of flow state and its PROFOUND influence on your creativity.
While you can't force flow state, we'll share some practical techniques to create a conducive environment to induce flow state. Press play to tune in now!
Click here to watch the episode mentioned on creating rituals, routines, and an environment to confidently create more art.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Oh good, you made it.
We are so glad you're here.
Welcome to the Mama Judy andJill podcast, an
intergenerational chat aboutlife, art and the creative
process.
I'm your host, Jill, andjoining me is my wonderful
co-host and bonus mom, Mama Judy.
Let's get started Well, hieveryone.
Speaker 2 (00:20):
We are so glad you're back here with us today.
So last week, if you listenedto the podcast, mama Judy and I
talked about resistance.
So this week we thought we'dturn it around a little bit and
have some fun and talk about theflow state, being in the flow
and especially as creatives,wouldn't you say, mama Judy?
It's so fun and important as acreative to have those
(00:42):
opportunities where you're in aflow state, absolutely.
Speaker 3 (00:47):
I mean, as you were talking, I was thinking oh, I
like flow so much better thanresistance.
Speaker 2 (00:54):
It just feels good, and you said I like being in
flow rather than resistance.
A state of flow is not justavailable at our beck and call
either.
There are things that we can doto help allow that state to
come to us, so we can talk aboutthat.
But that is one thing.
It's not just free for thetaken, for everybody to have
(01:15):
whenever they want it.
Speaker 3 (01:18):
Darned, because if it was, we would have a whole
world with peace, because we'dall be in the state of flow.
Yes, but no, it isn't.
And there are techniques forhelping yourself get to that
state.
But, jill, do you have a gooddefinition of flow?
Speaker 2 (01:39):
Well, I, would say that flow is the state that you
get into, where you're inintense focus and concentration.
Time slips away when you'redoing something, whether it's
your writing or I guess youcould be reading, you could be
crafting, whatever you're doingartistically.
But it's that intense focus,that where you just get into the
(02:02):
flow of what you're doing andthings are easy and great ideas
are coming in.
Things that you can't evenimagine are taking place during
this flow state.
I know that's not a verytechnical term, but that's how I
see it.
Speaker 3 (02:16):
Well, we don't need a technical term because you're
exactly right, that's what it is, and athletics are.
In a lot of sports they call itbeing in the zone, and that's
worth.
Just like you said, time dropsaway.
You're the only thing on theplanet and you're so intensely
(02:39):
focused on what you're doing.
You know someone could comeinto the room or there could be
something going on around you.
You wouldn't even notice itbecause you're present in the
moment of whatever you're doing.
And it's almost like a state ofgrace, if I can use that word,
(03:01):
because in that state you'recloser to source, to soul, to
your innate ability to create,than at any other time.
And you said that flow is notalways available and we will
talk about ways that you canhelp yourself.
(03:22):
But when you, let's say, you'resitting down to do a project
and you have ideas on what youwant to do during that project,
well, flow can hijack you.
And I use that word, whichdoesn't seem like it should go
with flow, and what I mean bythat is, suddenly you're in a
(03:47):
state of flow and everythingthat you had planned is no
longer relevant.
You go off in a totallydifferent direction, but happily
.
You go there happily and youjust feel wonderful about it,
and when you get done, you stepback.
You could go.
Well, gosh, that isn't what Ihad planned at all.
(04:08):
So flow can at any time, evenwhen you have something planned
out.
Speaker 2 (04:15):
Yeah, and it's almost like a wave comes and you just
kind of you get picked up by thewave and you're pulled along,
and I love that the thought ofusing the word grace for this
period too.
Now, on the other hand though,mama Judy, another when I
reached flow state with work.
So when I'm writing and thatkind of thing, and I hope to get
into a flow state, I find thatI'm able to get into that flow
(04:40):
state, versus what you were justsaying on the other flip side,
where I have a plan so that I'mnot distracted with, like, what
do I do next?
I have a specific plan, this iswhat I want to accomplish, and
I allow myself, with my skillsand my know-how and whatever, to
dive in and know where I'mgoing and start, and then the
keyboard is flying because I'mtyping as I'm writing for work
(05:02):
or something, and timedisappears, and it's the same
thing, but it's verygoal-centered and planned out.
So there's kind of two sides.
We could look at it.
Speaker 3 (05:11):
You are correct and that's generally, I think, from
personal experience, whathappens with flow, but just want
to point out that flow doesn'tnecessarily give you what you
thought you were going to startwith, and so the whole point of
this, in summary, is that flowis an intense state of
(05:35):
creativity where you're sofocused you just are not.
You're almost like outsideyourself.
What else is doing it?
Because you're so close to thesource of creativity.
Now I don't know, does thatmake sense?
Was that clear?
Speaker 2 (05:57):
Yeah, that makes a lot of sense to me and I would
say you know we mentioned theword intuition somewhere in here
I find that when, as far ascreatively outside writing which
I love getting in flow withwriting but with my stitching I
am more likely to get in thatflow state when I am doing
intuitive stitching versus if Iwere to sit down and say, oh,
(06:19):
I'm going to do like a try tomake a landscape with some neat
daisy stitches and specificstitches.
You know that is just for me.
But I have found when I justlet the thread and the needle
just go and I have no plan atall, that is when an hour can
just pop up and it's like I'vebeen stitching for an hour with
no specific plan in place.
But it's letting my intuitionguide me too, and so that is a
(06:42):
very much of a flow state inletting that intuition take you
away.
Speaker 3 (06:46):
And I think that's what my jumbled words were
trying to explain is that whenyou're in that state of flow,
there's no brain involved.
In fact, that's one of thefirst things we can talk about
is how do you encourage thestate of flow?
First of all, you quit thinking, and that's hard for humans to
(07:10):
do, especially, I think, notjust in our life, but in
creativity because we have aplan of what we want to create
and we want to do this Well.
That gets our mind involved inthe process.
To have flow happen more oftenand more regularly, you have to
quit thinking and, like youpointed out, jill, you sit down
(07:33):
and you have your supplies.
And it's the same exact thingwith my mixed media.
In fact, I'll even say thatrecently for another friend,
I've been trying to do somethingspecific as far as art and I
found that I struggled a littlebit because I felt out of my
(07:57):
element, and my element is anintuitive place.
That's one reason I quit doingcommissions is because with a
commission, you have an endproduct.
I like to create with no endproduct in mind.
So you sit at your stitches, Isit with my mixed media and you
(08:18):
pick it up, you hum to yourself,you put the music on, you quit
thinking and you just let theintuition, the intuitive
creative process, use your handsas a means to create something.
You put the brain in it and itwants to take charge.
(08:39):
It's kind of a bully.
Speaker 2 (08:41):
Well, and it wants to take charge, or also it wants
to judge what you're doing andyou know, put some sort of
judgment out there, letting theflow just take you where it
needs wants to go.
Speaker 3 (08:53):
That's an excellent point, because when you're in
flow, there is no judgment,there is no criticism, there is
no, I'm not good enough.
There is only you in thecreative process, and I think
everybody out there that's everexperienced flow in any Form or
(09:15):
for any link will agree with usthat, boy, we'd all like to stay
in that Low state, because ifyou're creating and the ego and
the mind just hanging around onyour shoulder, it is going to
judge you, it is going to tellyou, no, this isn't good or oh,
(09:35):
that's not.
I saw so-and-so and hers wasbetter.
So flow is that state that is,as we've already said, the
closest to our source ofcreativity and that's why it's
so wonderful, yes.
Speaker 2 (09:53):
And another thing to sort of tag on to encourage that
flow state is so no judgment,no thinking and no editing.
And I know editing it soundslike, oh, a writer's word, but
it's true.
The minute I try to startediting my writing, or even
editing our art, like going back, oh, I did that wrong, let me
(10:13):
go back and fix it.
Instead, just let the processgo and you can always go back
and do your editing later,whatever that looks to you, but
in the moment the editing willstop that flow immediately.
Speaker 3 (10:26):
Absolutely.
You know the other thing, sincewe started talking about how do
you encourage flow, we know wehave to get the brain out of it.
So even if you start yourprocess with Just Clearing your
mind and maybe 30 seconds ofjust deep breathing or something
(10:47):
like that, to just kind ofprepare yourself for no thinking
or and I use the word hummingand you know, of course I'm in
my room doing this by myself soit doesn't bug anybody else but
a lot of times I will just kindof hum, and it's not even a song
, it's just like a mantra, it'sa movement that my Vocal chords
(11:11):
are doing that keeps the brainfrom entering the party.
I was not invited.
So when I do that, I start outand and that then Helps me get
to that first point, becauseonce you hit flow, wow, you're
there.
(11:31):
You don't have to do any moreof this, unless you do what I
did one time, which was I Wentup.
I'm in flow.
Know what happened when I didthat?
Okay, flow goes.
No, you're not.
You just ruined it.
Speaker 2 (11:50):
Well, and and when you just mentioned to, I was
looking up a podcast episode wedid its episode, number 12 how
to create rituals, routines andenvironment to consistently make
more art.
So if you, if anyone, wants togo check out, you ever listen.
That is another thing.
You mentioned the breathing oreven just introducing some of
those things to put yourself Ina good position, to be in a
(12:13):
state of flow, whether that'slighting a candle, you know,
having those little bit ofrituals to allow yourself as
well.
And I don't know who the famouswriter was, but they said in
order to get into that flowstate.
They said it's so much betterthan this, but basically they
said what I had to do is I justhad to show up at my desk every
day, you know, instead of likehow am I gonna achieve flow?
(12:34):
And trying to do all thesethings, instead you sit up.
You sit down, put your buttdown and start writing or start
creating or whatever, and showup so that flow can Meet you.
There, can find you, yes, canfind you.
Speaker 3 (12:48):
Find you if you don't show up first of all as and
find you if your brain istalking too much.
Flow is there, it's like.
It's like Rick Rubin'sdescription of the creative
process it's always out there.
Creativity never ceases toexist, no matter what we do, but
(13:12):
we have to Create anenvironment that allows it to
find us, to hook up with us.
Yes, so, in addition to putyour butt down, clear your mind,
the other thing that helps withthat is If you have some place
(13:34):
that you can do your workwithout distractions.
As I'm sitting there thinkingabout distractions, I'm going
okay, I'm outside, I can hearthe birds I don't know if
anybody else on the podcast canhear the birds in the distance
and all of a sudden, I'mlistening to the birds instead
(13:57):
of thinking about what I want tosay on the podcast.
Well, that's a distraction.
Speaker 1 (14:02):
Right.
Speaker 3 (14:03):
But then at the same time I thought wait a minute,
but being in nature is a greatplace to find flow.
So we have a conundrum Do Icome out to nature and get
distracted by the birds, or do Ilock myself in my little five
by five room and shut the door?
(14:26):
It just depends.
It really doesn't say that youhave to go to any one place.
You could be sitting at thekitchen table.
The whole point is to get towhere you don't let external
movement, external sound,distract you to the point that
(14:48):
now you begin to think Right, ifI can achieve a state of flow
out here with these birds in thebackground, I won't hear them
because I'm in flow.
When you're in flow, the worlddoes not exist.
If you hear the world like thewater my neighbor's water just
(15:10):
came on If I were to hear thatwhen I'm in flow, I'm no longer
in flow.
So it's a very delicate thing.
And yet you can make it stronger, you can achieve a point where,
if you set the rightenvironment and you, like your
(15:34):
writer said, like you said, ifyou show up time after time
after time, the more flow findsyou, the more often it will show
up because it knows you'regoing to be there, right.
Speaker 2 (15:49):
And another thing I want to add is you see people in
coffee shops working on theircomputers and writing, doing
things like that, and so that isanother place where it seems
like it would be so distracting.
But I have worked in a coffeeshop when I've been traveling,
or a co-working space, and I wasable to get into that flow
state too, although there werelots of distractions.
(16:10):
But you have to put your mindto it that I'm going to block
distractions.
I am here.
Same thing when I'm on anairplane there's all this stuff
going on, but sort of with thatwhite noise and with the
intention of getting into whatI'm doing, I've been able to get
in the flow state on anairplane too, doing writing
anyway.
Speaker 3 (16:29):
Okay, let me ask you one question Was that a state of
flow or was that just deepconcentration on what you're
doing?
Because there is a difference.
Speaker 2 (16:41):
Tell me the difference.
I don't know.
I would have thought I was inflow and I'm probably audience.
Speaker 3 (16:49):
I'm probably splitting fine hairs.
But deep concentration I can besomewhere and concentrating and
I might still hear thedistractions and the background
noises, but I'm concentratingenough that I can get beyond
(17:10):
them.
But when I'm in a state of flow, it's even beyond deep
concentration.
It is that next level.
It's like going down into acellar.
You go down deeper and deeperinto concentration until you
don't have to concentrateanymore.
You just do, you just flow.
(17:34):
So again, I know I'm splittinghairs, but there is a difference
between deep concentration andflow.
Anybody that's been in flowwill know what I'm talking about
.
You know what I'm talking about.
Yes, it's just, it's almosteuphoric to be in a state of
(17:55):
flow and it puts you in a placethat you're so connected that
nothing else exists.
I know I'm getting a littleexcited here.
I'm going.
God, I need you to go in andsit at my desk.
Maybe flow will show up.
For today.
Speaker 2 (18:13):
I do find sometimes, when I'm in the state of flow,
that I find myself smiling, justsmiling to myself, because I'm
so happy and I'm just excited,and it's more Giddy I have it
with writing.
Yeah, I'm giddy, yeah it'sreally fun.
Speaker 3 (18:28):
Yep, you know, what I love about flow is when I come
out of it and this has happenedseveral times I don't remember
creating.
I will get up when the flow,and sometimes it will just
naturally run its course forthat day, and when it is, I'll
(18:50):
stop and I'll get up and I'lllook at the pages and I'll go.
I don't remember doing them,which is really an interesting
thing.
Or if I get up and I leave theroom and I come back and I look
at them and go, well, I wonderwho created those, because it
(19:12):
wasn't me.
I mean, really, that is just so, so powerful to me.
Can you tell a rather fond offlow?
Speaker 2 (19:25):
Okay.
So to recap, as people arelistening here, what are some
things to think about if youwant to put yourself in a way
for flow to happen to you withyou.
So, brain off in a way yes, thethinking part of us.
Okay, what's the next one?
Well, first of all, we have toput our butt in the seat.
Yeah, show up Button, the seatbrain off.
Speaker 3 (19:49):
And, of course, limit distractions.
Yes, and then from that point,it's just do it.
Speaker 2 (19:57):
Do it, no judgment and no editing.
Speaker 3 (20:01):
And just probably after this podcast, the biggest
thing that I will have to do isremember I cannot force flow to
show up.
I cannot put my butt in theseat, clear my mind and think
okay, here comes flow, we'regoing to do great.
You put your butt in the seat,you limit the distractions, turn
(20:25):
off your brain, and then youjust pick up your supplies and
go.
No, this phrase we all hear gowith the flow, baby.
So you might just have a niceeasy session or you might find
yourself dropping into thateuphoric state of grace that
(20:49):
we're calling flow.
Speaker 2 (20:52):
And pay attention, if you do, when you come out of
flow.
Maybe there was something thatyou set it up like oh, I
realized that I did say a littleprayer beforehand or I took
some deep breaths or a littlecandle, like pay attention to
those things too, because thosecould be clues that are helping
flow show up as you show up aswell.
Speaker 3 (21:11):
Yeah, it just occurred to me.
Flow, of course, is spelledF-L-O-W and it means movement,
but I have this vision of mewalking into the doorway of my
little art area in the officeasking flow, f-l-o.
Okay, flow, here we go.
(21:31):
So we have to.
It's okay to personalize it,kind of make lighthearted of a
very wonderful process.
Yes, and to your advantage, andif you have not experienced
that feeling that we're talkingabout, we cannot guarantee you
(21:53):
this is not a 30-day money backguarantee thing that you can
show, get flow.
But if you follow those thingswe've talked about, I don't know
what the splashing for those ofyou watching on this wall
behind me is occasionally, forthose of you not watching, it
(22:15):
doesn't matter.
Anyway, it distracted me.
She got out of her state ofpodcast flow.
I got out of flow, but when you,we can't guarantee that any of
us are going to show up for flow.
But those habits that youtalked about, jill, in recapping
(22:36):
this will certainly not onlyhelp you get closer to a state
of flow, but if you think aboutit, no matter what the outcome
is, that's what's going to haveit help your creative process.
So again, I'll ask Jill torecap those few things.
Speaker 2 (22:59):
Okay, but in the seat , to show up, distraction free,
no thinking, do the work andthen, as you're doing that, no
judging, no editing, let thingshappen.
Maybe set yourself up for somesuccess beforehand by doing some
deep breathing, saying a prayer, lighting a candle, something
like that to set the tone andjust show up and do the work.
(23:21):
And also don't judge yourselfthat oh my gosh, how come I
can't have the flow, like wewere saying.
It's not anything to be forced,just keep enjoying, because
obviously we enjoy creating evenwhen we're not in the flow
state, aren't we lucky?
It's just that that's thatextra little bit of yumminess
that happens to people.
Speaker 3 (23:41):
Perfect description.
I couldn't have said it better.
Speaker 2 (23:46):
Okay, well, I'm definitely going to try to get
into the flow state this week,or be I'm going to be available
to the flow state this week as Isit my bet in my studio.
How about you?
I am?
Speaker 3 (23:54):
I'm going to walk in at the doorway and say to flow,
feel free to show up wheneveryou want.
I'll try to help you along.
Speaker 2 (24:03):
Yes, I think I'm going to start calling her flow
to a, why not?
Okay, well, thanks for joiningus today.
Everyone.
We really appreciate it.
We would love it if you wouldshare this podcast episode.
You can share a link or forwardit to someone, because you know
we want all of our friends andour family and acquaintances to
be in a state of flow also, somaybe they need to hear
(24:25):
something today.
So, thank you so much and itwas good chat with you.
Mama Judy, love you.
Love you too.
Talk to you later.
Bye.
Oh good, you made it.
We are so glad you're here.
Welcome to the Mama Judy andJill podcast, an
intergenerational chat aboutlife, art and the creative
process.
I'm your host, Jill, andjoining me is my wonderful
co-host and bonus mom, Mama Judy.
Let's get started Well, hieveryone.
Speaker 2 (00:20):
We are so glad you're back here with us today.
So last week, if you listenedto the podcast, mama Judy and I
talked about resistance.
So this week we thought we'dturn it around a little bit and
have some fun and talk about theflow state, being in the flow
and especially as creatives,wouldn't you say, mama Judy?
It's so fun and important as acreative to have those
(00:42):
opportunities where you're in aflow state, absolutely.
Speaker 3 (00:47):
I mean, as you were talking, I was thinking oh, I
like flow so much better thanresistance.
Speaker 2 (00:54):
It just feels good, and you said I like being in
flow rather than resistance.
A state of flow is not justavailable at our beck and call
either.
There are things that we can doto help allow that state to
come to us, so we can talk aboutthat.
But that is one thing.
It's not just free for thetaken, for everybody to have
(01:15):
whenever they want it.
Speaker 3 (01:18):
Darned, because if it was, we would have a whole
world with peace, because we'dall be in the state of flow.
Yes, but no, it isn't.
And there are techniques forhelping yourself get to that
state.
But, jill, do you have a gooddefinition of flow?
Speaker 2 (01:39):
Well, I, would say that flow is the state that you
get into, where you're inintense focus and concentration.
Time slips away when you'redoing something, whether it's
your writing or I guess youcould be reading, you could be
crafting, whatever you're doingartistically.
But it's that intense focus,that where you just get into the
(02:02):
flow of what you're doing andthings are easy and great ideas
are coming in.
Things that you can't evenimagine are taking place during
this flow state.
I know that's not a verytechnical term, but that's how I
see it.
Speaker 3 (02:16):
Well, we don't need a technical term because you're
exactly right, that's what it is, and athletics are.
In a lot of sports they call itbeing in the zone, and that's
worth.
Just like you said, time dropsaway.
You're the only thing on theplanet and you're so intensely
(02:39):
focused on what you're doing.
You know someone could comeinto the room or there could be
something going on around you.
You wouldn't even notice itbecause you're present in the
moment of whatever you're doing.
And it's almost like a state ofgrace, if I can use that word,
(03:01):
because in that state you'recloser to source, to soul, to
your innate ability to create,than at any other time.
And you said that flow is notalways available and we will
talk about ways that you canhelp yourself.
(03:22):
But when you, let's say, you'resitting down to do a project
and you have ideas on what youwant to do during that project,
well, flow can hijack you.
And I use that word, whichdoesn't seem like it should go
with flow, and what I mean bythat is, suddenly you're in a
(03:47):
state of flow and everythingthat you had planned is no
longer relevant.
You go off in a totallydifferent direction, but happily
.
You go there happily and youjust feel wonderful about it,
and when you get done, you stepback.
You could go.
Well, gosh, that isn't what Ihad planned at all.
(04:08):
So flow can at any time, evenwhen you have something planned
out.
Speaker 2 (04:15):
Yeah, and it's almost like a wave comes and you just
kind of you get picked up by thewave and you're pulled along,
and I love that the thought ofusing the word grace for this
period too.
Now, on the other hand though,mama Judy, another when I
reached flow state with work.
So when I'm writing and thatkind of thing, and I hope to get
into a flow state, I find thatI'm able to get into that flow
(04:40):
state, versus what you were justsaying on the other flip side,
where I have a plan so that I'mnot distracted with, like, what
do I do next?
I have a specific plan, this iswhat I want to accomplish, and
I allow myself, with my skillsand my know-how and whatever, to
dive in and know where I'mgoing and start, and then the
keyboard is flying because I'mtyping as I'm writing for work
(05:02):
or something, and timedisappears, and it's the same
thing, but it's verygoal-centered and planned out.
So there's kind of two sides.
We could look at it.
Speaker 3 (05:11):
You are correct and that's generally, I think, from
personal experience, whathappens with flow, but just want
to point out that flow doesn'tnecessarily give you what you
thought you were going to startwith, and so the whole point of
this, in summary, is that flowis an intense state of
(05:35):
creativity where you're sofocused you just are not.
You're almost like outsideyourself.
What else is doing it?
Because you're so close to thesource of creativity.
Now I don't know, does thatmake sense?
Was that clear?
Speaker 2 (05:57):
Yeah, that makes a lot of sense to me and I would
say you know we mentioned theword intuition somewhere in here
I find that when, as far ascreatively outside writing which
I love getting in flow withwriting but with my stitching I
am more likely to get in thatflow state when I am doing
intuitive stitching versus if Iwere to sit down and say, oh,
(06:19):
I'm going to do like a try tomake a landscape with some neat
daisy stitches and specificstitches.
You know that is just for me.
But I have found when I justlet the thread and the needle
just go and I have no plan atall, that is when an hour can
just pop up and it's like I'vebeen stitching for an hour with
no specific plan in place.
But it's letting my intuitionguide me too, and so that is a
(06:42):
very much of a flow state inletting that intuition take you
away.
Speaker 3 (06:46):
And I think that's what my jumbled words were
trying to explain is that whenyou're in that state of flow,
there's no brain involved.
In fact, that's one of thefirst things we can talk about
is how do you encourage thestate of flow?
First of all, you quit thinking, and that's hard for humans to
(07:10):
do, especially, I think, notjust in our life, but in
creativity because we have aplan of what we want to create
and we want to do this Well.
That gets our mind involved inthe process.
To have flow happen more oftenand more regularly, you have to
quit thinking and, like youpointed out, jill, you sit down
(07:33):
and you have your supplies.
And it's the same exact thingwith my mixed media.
In fact, I'll even say thatrecently for another friend,
I've been trying to do somethingspecific as far as art and I
found that I struggled a littlebit because I felt out of my
(07:57):
element, and my element is anintuitive place.
That's one reason I quit doingcommissions is because with a
commission, you have an endproduct.
I like to create with no endproduct in mind.
So you sit at your stitches, Isit with my mixed media and you
(08:18):
pick it up, you hum to yourself,you put the music on, you quit
thinking and you just let theintuition, the intuitive
creative process, use your handsas a means to create something.
You put the brain in it and itwants to take charge.
(08:39):
It's kind of a bully.
Speaker 2 (08:41):
Well, and it wants to take charge, or also it wants
to judge what you're doing andyou know, put some sort of
judgment out there, letting theflow just take you where it
needs wants to go.
Speaker 3 (08:53):
That's an excellent point, because when you're in
flow, there is no judgment,there is no criticism, there is
no, I'm not good enough.
There is only you in thecreative process, and I think
everybody out there that's everexperienced flow in any Form or
(09:15):
for any link will agree with usthat, boy, we'd all like to stay
in that Low state, because ifyou're creating and the ego and
the mind just hanging around onyour shoulder, it is going to
judge you, it is going to tellyou, no, this isn't good or oh,
(09:35):
that's not.
I saw so-and-so and hers wasbetter.
So flow is that state that is,as we've already said, the
closest to our source ofcreativity and that's why it's
so wonderful, yes.
Speaker 2 (09:53):
And another thing to sort of tag on to encourage that
flow state is so no judgment,no thinking and no editing.
And I know editing it soundslike, oh, a writer's word, but
it's true.
The minute I try to startediting my writing, or even
editing our art, like going back, oh, I did that wrong, let me
(10:13):
go back and fix it.
Instead, just let the processgo and you can always go back
and do your editing later,whatever that looks to you, but
in the moment the editing willstop that flow immediately.
Speaker 3 (10:26):
Absolutely.
You know the other thing, sincewe started talking about how do
you encourage flow, we know wehave to get the brain out of it.
So even if you start yourprocess with Just Clearing your
mind and maybe 30 seconds ofjust deep breathing or something
(10:47):
like that, to just kind ofprepare yourself for no thinking
or and I use the word hummingand you know, of course I'm in
my room doing this by myself soit doesn't bug anybody else but
a lot of times I will just kindof hum, and it's not even a song
, it's just like a mantra, it'sa movement that my Vocal chords
(11:11):
are doing that keeps the brainfrom entering the party.
I was not invited.
So when I do that, I start outand and that then Helps me get
to that first point, becauseonce you hit flow, wow, you're
there.
(11:31):
You don't have to do any moreof this, unless you do what I
did one time, which was I Wentup.
I'm in flow.
Know what happened when I didthat?
Okay, flow goes.
No, you're not.
You just ruined it.
Speaker 2 (11:50):
Well, and and when you just mentioned to, I was
looking up a podcast episode wedid its episode, number 12 how
to create rituals, routines andenvironment to consistently make
more art.
So if you, if anyone, wants togo check out, you ever listen.
That is another thing.
You mentioned the breathing oreven just introducing some of
those things to put yourself Ina good position, to be in a
(12:13):
state of flow, whether that'slighting a candle, you know,
having those little bit ofrituals to allow yourself as
well.
And I don't know who the famouswriter was, but they said in
order to get into that flowstate.
They said it's so much betterthan this, but basically they
said what I had to do is I justhad to show up at my desk every
day, you know, instead of likehow am I gonna achieve flow?
(12:34):
And trying to do all thesethings, instead you sit up.
You sit down, put your buttdown and start writing or start
creating or whatever, and showup so that flow can Meet you.
There, can find you, yes, canfind you.
Speaker 3 (12:48):
Find you if you don't show up first of all as and
find you if your brain istalking too much.
Flow is there, it's like.
It's like Rick Rubin'sdescription of the creative
process it's always out there.
Creativity never ceases toexist, no matter what we do, but
(13:12):
we have to Create anenvironment that allows it to
find us, to hook up with us.
Yes, so, in addition to putyour butt down, clear your mind,
the other thing that helps withthat is If you have some place
(13:34):
that you can do your workwithout distractions.
As I'm sitting there thinkingabout distractions, I'm going
okay, I'm outside, I can hearthe birds I don't know if
anybody else on the podcast canhear the birds in the distance
and all of a sudden, I'mlistening to the birds instead
(13:57):
of thinking about what I want tosay on the podcast.
Well, that's a distraction.
Speaker 1 (14:02):
Right.
Speaker 3 (14:03):
But then at the same time I thought wait a minute,
but being in nature is a greatplace to find flow.
So we have a conundrum Do Icome out to nature and get
distracted by the birds, or do Ilock myself in my little five
by five room and shut the door?
(14:26):
It just depends.
It really doesn't say that youhave to go to any one place.
You could be sitting at thekitchen table.
The whole point is to get towhere you don't let external
movement, external sound,distract you to the point that
(14:48):
now you begin to think Right, ifI can achieve a state of flow
out here with these birds in thebackground, I won't hear them
because I'm in flow.
When you're in flow, the worlddoes not exist.
If you hear the world like thewater my neighbor's water just
(15:10):
came on If I were to hear thatwhen I'm in flow, I'm no longer
in flow.
So it's a very delicate thing.
And yet you can make it stronger, you can achieve a point where,
if you set the rightenvironment and you, like your
(15:34):
writer said, like you said, ifyou show up time after time
after time, the more flow findsyou, the more often it will show
up because it knows you'regoing to be there, right.
Speaker 2 (15:49):
And another thing I want to add is you see people in
coffee shops working on theircomputers and writing, doing
things like that, and so that isanother place where it seems
like it would be so distracting.
But I have worked in a coffeeshop when I've been traveling,
or a co-working space, and I wasable to get into that flow
state too, although there werelots of distractions.
(16:10):
But you have to put your mindto it that I'm going to block
distractions.
I am here.
Same thing when I'm on anairplane there's all this stuff
going on, but sort of with thatwhite noise and with the
intention of getting into whatI'm doing, I've been able to get
in the flow state on anairplane too, doing writing
anyway.
Speaker 3 (16:29):
Okay, let me ask you one question Was that a state of
flow or was that just deepconcentration on what you're
doing?
Because there is a difference.
Speaker 2 (16:41):
Tell me the difference.
I don't know.
I would have thought I was inflow and I'm probably audience.
Speaker 3 (16:49):
I'm probably splitting fine hairs.
But deep concentration I can besomewhere and concentrating and
I might still hear thedistractions and the background
noises, but I'm concentratingenough that I can get beyond
(17:10):
them.
But when I'm in a state of flow, it's even beyond deep
concentration.
It is that next level.
It's like going down into acellar.
You go down deeper and deeperinto concentration until you
don't have to concentrateanymore.
You just do, you just flow.
(17:34):
So again, I know I'm splittinghairs, but there is a difference
between deep concentration andflow.
Anybody that's been in flowwill know what I'm talking about
.
You know what I'm talking about.
Yes, it's just, it's almosteuphoric to be in a state of
(17:55):
flow and it puts you in a placethat you're so connected that
nothing else exists.
I know I'm getting a littleexcited here.
I'm going.
God, I need you to go in andsit at my desk.
Maybe flow will show up.
For today.
Speaker 2 (18:13):
I do find sometimes, when I'm in the state of flow,
that I find myself smiling, justsmiling to myself, because I'm
so happy and I'm just excited,and it's more Giddy I have it
with writing.
Yeah, I'm giddy, yeah it'sreally fun.
Speaker 3 (18:28):
Yep, you know, what I love about flow is when I come
out of it and this has happenedseveral times I don't remember
creating.
I will get up when the flow,and sometimes it will just
naturally run its course forthat day, and when it is, I'll
(18:50):
stop and I'll get up and I'lllook at the pages and I'll go.
I don't remember doing them,which is really an interesting
thing.
Or if I get up and I leave theroom and I come back and I look
at them and go, well, I wonderwho created those, because it
(19:12):
wasn't me.
I mean, really, that is just so, so powerful to me.
Can you tell a rather fond offlow?
Speaker 2 (19:25):
Okay.
So to recap, as people arelistening here, what are some
things to think about if youwant to put yourself in a way
for flow to happen to you withyou.
So, brain off in a way yes, thethinking part of us.
Okay, what's the next one?
Well, first of all, we have toput our butt in the seat.
Yeah, show up Button, the seatbrain off.
Speaker 3 (19:49):
And, of course, limit distractions.
Yes, and then from that point,it's just do it.
Speaker 2 (19:57):
Do it, no judgment and no editing.
Speaker 3 (20:01):
And just probably after this podcast, the biggest
thing that I will have to do isremember I cannot force flow to
show up.
I cannot put my butt in theseat, clear my mind and think
okay, here comes flow, we'regoing to do great.
You put your butt in the seat,you limit the distractions, turn
(20:25):
off your brain, and then youjust pick up your supplies and
go.
No, this phrase we all hear gowith the flow, baby.
So you might just have a niceeasy session or you might find
yourself dropping into thateuphoric state of grace that
(20:49):
we're calling flow.
Speaker 2 (20:52):
And pay attention, if you do, when you come out of
flow.
Maybe there was something thatyou set it up like oh, I
realized that I did say a littleprayer beforehand or I took
some deep breaths or a littlecandle, like pay attention to
those things too, because thosecould be clues that are helping
flow show up as you show up aswell.
Speaker 3 (21:11):
Yeah, it just occurred to me.
Flow, of course, is spelledF-L-O-W and it means movement,
but I have this vision of mewalking into the doorway of my
little art area in the officeasking flow, f-l-o.
Okay, flow, here we go.
(21:31):
So we have to.
It's okay to personalize it,kind of make lighthearted of a
very wonderful process.
Yes, and to your advantage, andif you have not experienced
that feeling that we're talkingabout, we cannot guarantee you
(21:53):
this is not a 30-day money backguarantee thing that you can
show, get flow.
But if you follow those thingswe've talked about, I don't know
what the splashing for those ofyou watching on this wall
behind me is occasionally, forthose of you not watching, it
(22:15):
doesn't matter.
Anyway, it distracted me.
She got out of her state ofpodcast flow.
I got out of flow, but when you,we can't guarantee that any of
us are going to show up for flow.
But those habits that youtalked about, jill, in recapping
(22:36):
this will certainly not onlyhelp you get closer to a state
of flow, but if you think aboutit, no matter what the outcome
is, that's what's going to haveit help your creative process.
So again, I'll ask Jill torecap those few things.
Speaker 2 (22:59):
Okay, but in the seat , to show up, distraction free,
no thinking, do the work andthen, as you're doing that, no
judging, no editing, let thingshappen.
Maybe set yourself up for somesuccess beforehand by doing some
deep breathing, saying a prayer, lighting a candle, something
like that to set the tone andjust show up and do the work.
(23:21):
And also don't judge yourselfthat oh my gosh, how come I
can't have the flow, like wewere saying.
It's not anything to be forced,just keep enjoying, because
obviously we enjoy creating evenwhen we're not in the flow
state, aren't we lucky?
It's just that that's thatextra little bit of yumminess
that happens to people.
Speaker 3 (23:41):
Perfect description.
I couldn't have said it better.
Speaker 2 (23:46):
Okay, well, I'm definitely going to try to get
into the flow state this week,or be I'm going to be available
to the flow state this week as Isit my bet in my studio.
How about you?
I am?
Speaker 3 (23:54):
I'm going to walk in at the doorway and say to flow,
feel free to show up wheneveryou want.
I'll try to help you along.
Speaker 2 (24:03):
Yes, I think I'm going to start calling her flow
to a, why not?
Okay, well, thanks for joiningus today.
Everyone.
We really appreciate it.
We would love it if you wouldshare this podcast episode.
You can share a link or forwardit to someone, because you know
we want all of our friends andour family and acquaintances to
be in a state of flow also, somaybe they need to hear
(24:25):
something today.
So, thank you so much and itwas good chat with you.
Mama Judy, love you.
Love you too.
Talk to you later.
Bye.
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