October 29, 2024 • 51 mins
I recently had the pleasure of interviewing Chris Ladd, a seasoned private equity investor and board member. Chris shared insights from his extensive career in corporate development, M&A, and private equity. Here are some highlights:
How Chris Identifies High-Potential Companies
When considering investments, Chris looks for two key ingredients - a market need/gap, and a solution that can fill that gap in a way that's core to the customer. Solid management, competition, industry trends etc. matter too, but those two factors are paramount.
Strategic Guidance as a Board Member
In board roles, Chris focuses on bringing structure and strategic frameworks to early-stage companies. This includes testing key assumptions, making sure the right resources are in place, and that management processes align with the strategy. He notes it's a fluid process as strategies morph rapidly in early-stage companies.
Technology's Impact on Business Growth
Chris sees technology and innovation as crucial for driving growth and productivity gains needed in today's competitive landscape. He pointed to the huge amount of remaining manual processes and whitespace in supply chain, logistics and other sectors where there's room for efficiency gains.
The Future of Private Equity
Chris predicts private equity will continue growing as an asset class as more retail/individual investors get exposure. Platforms are emerging to provide individuals with easier access. He sees AI and technology improving processes like deal sourcing, research and analytics on the operations side.
Chris' Best Career Advice
One professor emphasized that business is a grind, so you need to physically and mentally prepare through exercise, proper sleep etc. This has stuck with Chris as great advice for building the endurance required to perform at a high level consistently.
Key Takeaways
- Focus on market gaps and solutions core to the customer
- Provide structure/strategy frameworks to early-stage companies
- Technology will drive productivity and efficiencies
- Private equity access is democratizing for individual investors
- Success requires tremendous effort and lifestyle habits like fitness
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Matt Waller (00:11):
Welcome to the Mant Waller podcast, sponsored by
New Road Capital Partners, wherewe look at success at the
intersection of technology,logistics, supply chain, retail
and CPG, which we also call theretail value chain.
I want to clarify that thispodcast is distinct from my
responsibilities as a professorin the Sam Walton College of
(00:32):
Business.
Nonetheless, it aligns with myaspiration to provide practical
insights to professionals inbusiness by showcasing companies
and people that can enhanceyour ability to manage, lead,
strategize and marketeffectively in the retail value
chain.
Before we dive into today'sexciting episode, I'd like to
take a moment to express mydeepest gratitude to our
(00:55):
founding sponsor, new RoadCapital Partners.
New Road Capital Partnersinvests in proven and innovative
technologies, products andservices that serve existing and
unmet needs in the marketplace.
New Road partners withgrowth-oriented companies in
supply chain, logistics andinnovative consumer companies as
experienced entrepreneurs andoperators.
(01:17):
The New Road team prides itselfon the high level of
collaboration it brings to eachof its investments.
New Road's team of investmentprofessionals and operating
partners have deep, relevantinvesting and operating
experience, includingsignificant experience leading
large divisions of enterprisecompanies and building
businesses from scale to conceptto realization.
(01:41):
To learn more, visitnewroadcpcom.
I also want to disclose that Iam an advisor to New Road.
I would like to take thismoment to recognize
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Their mission is simple Tostreamline the process of
(02:01):
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They're equipped withindustry-leading equipment and
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Now, without further ado, let'sget started with today's episode
.
Today, I'm interviewing ChrisLadd, and I am so excited about
(02:24):
this podcast.
He has experience in privateequity that goes way back.
In fact.
He got an internship when hewas an undergraduate with a firm
in private equity.
Actually, even when he was veryyoung, like in fifth or sixth
grade, he got involved in aninvestment club.
(02:47):
He's been interested in thisfor a long time.
This conversation is quiteinteresting.
I ask him how do you identifyhigh potential growth companies?
What factors do you look forwhen you're investing?
You'll hear his answer.
I think it's really importantto understand these, especially
(03:09):
if you're an early stage or amid-stage company.
To understand this, he's alsoon the board of many companies
boards of many companies andalso serves as an observer for
some companies.
But I was talking to him abouthow he provides strategic
guidance and support.
Again, it's a very interestingconversation.
(03:33):
We talk about technology andinnovation and how that's
affecting the competitivelandscape today.
I think you'll enjoy that.
We talk about many other thingsas well, including the future
of private equity and howemerging technologies are
affecting industry.
(03:53):
There's all kinds ofinteresting topics we cover.
I would say.
If you're interested ininvesting or private equity, or
the retail value chain broadly,I would encourage you to listen
to this.
Chris is a seasoned investorstrategist and board member with
extensive experience incorporate development, mergers
(04:15):
and acquisitions and privateequity across a diverse range of
industries.
Currently a partner at New RoadCapital Partners, chris has
been with the firm for over sixyears, helping to identify and
support high growth companies.
In his current role at New RoadCapital Partners, chris has
been actively involved invarious capacities with several
(04:36):
portfolio companies.
As a board observer, he hasprovided strategic guidance and
support to organizations such asInsight AI, wavebl, quinn, new
York Shipping Exchange alsocalled NICEX, engage 3, big Elk
Energy Systems, LLC, shiftboardand others.
(04:56):
Chris has also served as aboard member for TAXA Outdoors
and Blue in Green, furtherbroadening his experience in
guiding companies towardssuccess.
Prior to joining New RoadCapital Partners, chris spent
four years at Walmart, holdingsenior roles in corporate
development, corporate mergersand acquisitions, and corporate
(05:19):
strategy and finance.
His tenure at Walmart hasequipped him with a deep
understanding of the retailspace, which he has successfully
carried forward into hisinvestment and board roles.
Before his time at Walmart,chris worked as an associate at
TPG Global, ksl Capital PartnersInternational LLP, where he
(05:42):
honed his skills in privateequity deal sourcing and
portfolio management.
His experience at thesewell-established firms has
provided him with a solidfoundation and the world of
finance and investment.
Chris earned an MBA from TexasMcComb School of Business,
graduating with honors.
He also holds a bachelor'sdegree in Applied Economics and
(06:04):
Management from CornellUniversity, where he was an
active member of the CornellUniversity rugby team.
Chris Ernst Young prepared areport called the Economic
Contribution of the US PrivateEquity Sector in 2022.
They prepared this for theAmerican Investment Council and
there's a lot of reallyinteresting things in it from my
(06:27):
perspective, but one thatreally caught my attention is
that 6.5% of the US GDP issupported by the private equity
sector, 1.7 trillion of GDPgenerated by US private equity
(06:47):
sector, 12 million employed bythe US private equity sector and
1 trillion dollars earned inwages and benefits by US private
equity sector workers.
Did that surprise you?
Chris Ladd (07:06):
It didn't.
If you think about the numberof workers, it's interesting
it's about the same number asWalmart has domestically.
It's got an interesting stat.
But I think private equity hasbeen around for a long time
Really in earnest in its currentform kind of early 90s when
groups like KKR and TPG gotstarted and it doesn't surprise
(07:32):
me.
I think it's only going to grow.
If you look at where privateequity plays, it is kind of
taking the handoff from venturecapital and really continuing
that engine of growth which issmall business.
So most of that employment isin per the study that you shared
with me In companies under 500,FTEs or employees, and that's
(07:54):
truly kind of the growth of theUS and broadly the world economy
.
The ingenuity and startup scenecarried through to private
equity.
So it didn't quite surprise me.
I think it surprised by how lowit was.
It was actually a little bithigher as a percentage GDP.
So it's good to see thosefigures.
I think it's only going to growover time.
(08:16):
If you look at investmentallocation, for just generally
across the spectrum, from retailinvestors to institutional
investors, there's still a lotof room to grow.
So institutional investors,they have somewhere over
allocated, especially in marketslike this.
We've had a lot of allocationin 20 and 21, and a drop in the
(08:38):
public markets in 22 creates abit of an imbalance in their
allocation.
But even looking at that ortaking that into account,
there's a lot of institutionsthat are under allocated to
private equity, includingventure capital, growth equity
and private equity.
So I think that will continueto grow.
What's really interesting isthe other side of the spectrum,
which is your retail investorkind of your normal mom and pop
(09:02):
was a 401k and then, you know,kind of moving along the
spectrum a little bit more tothe high net worth individual
who has maybe three to fivemillion in net worth.
They're under allocated as well.
What's been an interesting trendWe've taken advantage of this a
bit is, since 2008 2009, theGreat Recession, A lot of the
(09:24):
money that was in larger banksor banks in general and their
wealth management divisionsmoved into these registered
investment advisors RIAs forshort and so RIAs have grown
quite dramatically since 20082009.
We fundraise from a lot ofthose groups.
A lot of those groups are nowdeploying into private equity
and venture capital and itenables that high net worth
(09:46):
individual who makes, or who isworth, you know, maybe five
million dollars to allocate anddiversified manner into private
equity.
And that's just starting.
You know, look at theallocation percentages for a lot
of the RIA clients and still insingle digits.
Depending upon your philosophyor what we have about private
equity exposure, that should bea bit higher.
You know at least 10, maybe 20%.
(10:08):
There's certainly groups likeTiger 21 that advocate for
something a lot higher.
You know, kind of 50 pluspercent into private investments
, including real estate, right,Not just companies but also
include real estate.
And so I think it wasinteresting to see I was a
little bit shocked it was so low, you know, but I think it will
only continue to grow, you know,as we look to those companies
(10:29):
and private equity to take that,take those companies that are
successful and continue to growit and integrate them into the
economy.
Matt Waller (10:35):
When you look at the you know return on private
equity investments, you wouldthink it would be a higher
percentage.
It is really surprising.
Chris Ladd (10:44):
Yeah, for sure.
Yeah, you look at some of themost successful private equity
firms over time, like I mean totake your pick a Blackstone or
KKR or TPG.
They've averaged kind of mid20s IRR since inception.
Matt Waller (10:58):
Right.
Chris Ladd (10:59):
It's absolutely yeah , it's shocking right, and so
that's why they've risen to thetop right, Because they've
consistently been able to deploycapital across multiple cycles,
across multiple industries.
You know, a lot of that ischalked up to operational
expertise and the ability todrive value in any situation.
(11:20):
Structure can only get used sofar right.
You can structure around a baddeal.
It's still a bad deal or a badcompany.
So the fundamentals have to bethere or you have to be able to
change the fundamentals, and Ithink a lot of the private
equity shops that have been moreeverlasting have been able to
do that.
Not that it's not just rely onstructure, but really focus on
(11:41):
driving operational excellenceand operational improvements.
Matt Waller (11:44):
Well, chris, I'd like to shift gears to you,
general Moment.
You've had a really amazingcareer already, but could you
share a little bit about yourjourney in the world of finance
and investments and what led youto become a partner at New Road
Capital Partners?
Chris Ladd (12:02):
Yeah, sure, I still feel like it's early days, but
my career, yeah.
So I grew up in the Northeastin a small farming town in
upstate New York, went to schoolat Cornell and studied
economics and finance and had acouple strokes of luck, got an
internship at a private equityfirm when I was an undergrad, as
(12:24):
a sophomore, and so I was ableto integrate and learn the
business at an early age andalways had an interest in
finance and invest in since Iwas in fourth grade, fourth,
fifth grade when I joined aninvestment club.
So it's been a while, but yeah,so I was laser focused, but
really kind of the kickstartthat I got was interned at a
(12:46):
private equity fund in collegeand that's in part why kind of a
shameless plug here why we havesuch a strong intern program at
New Road is because of thatopportunity that I had and I
want to try to replicate that.
Matt Waller (12:58):
I didn't know that.
Well, I knew.
I mean, I knew you hired a lotof interns, because you hire a
lot from the Walton College, andI noticed that.
And you seem to be able to getright us too.
Yeah, you do a good job of that.
Well, thank you for doing that.
Appreciate that, of course.
But then you eventually went towork at Walmart, which was kind
of out of that path.
Chris Ladd (13:19):
Yeah, so yeah, undergrad, that internship that
led to a full time privateequity offer out of undergrad
with a different firm that hadjust spun out, a KKR.
So they raised about a billiondollars and moved out to Denver.
I'd never been to Denver butgot the role and so moved out
there, spent about four yearswith them and then went to TPG
(13:43):
capital, which is a you know, Iguess, larger, more general
private equity firm is there fora couple of years.
Kind of along that journey metmy wife, who is from Northwest
Arkansas and so after we gotmarried and started a family,
she wanted to move back and becloser to her family.
So I made it to NorthwestArkansas and was finishing up my
(14:04):
MBA in Walmart recruits at UTAustin.
So one thing led to another andended up getting a job in
corporate strategy and RobertM&A.
That's how I made it toNorthwest Arkansas.
Matt Waller (14:19):
That is a great story.
Would you mind talking just alittle bit about what you did at
Walmart?
Yeah, sure.
Chris Ladd (14:27):
So started off in corporate strategy was mainly
focused on e-commerceinitiatives.
So at the time, this was in2013.
Amazon was still considered apotential threat, you know,
especially in grocery, and Ithink it was the fall of 2013,.
(14:50):
Amazon really spiked its onlinesales during the holiday season
from Thanksgiving to, you know,through Christmas right, and
that really spooked a lot of theexecutives at Walmart and that
got the gears moving a bitquicker on.
What should we do to respond,like, what should we employ or
(15:11):
what strategy should we createto respond to this?
So we did a large study withBain and corporate strategy.
We actually hired a partnerfrom Bain to come on board to
help assess the situation and,yeah, we put forth a strategy.
That's become the grocerybusiness for Walmart, which is
the pickup and delivery business.
The idea was we need to keepthe market share in grocery and
(15:36):
effectively train the customerto come to the store.
We've got this large asset thatwe wanna increase utilization,
in which we wanna increaseutilization, and so we started
on the path of started a newbusiness within Walmart, which
is never easy and so, but thatit's actually become, I think,
(15:56):
one of the fastest growingsegments within Walmart, still
fairly small compared to theoverall US business.
But I think the e-commercebusiness broadly just eclipsed
about 50, 60 billion in revenue,and a lot of that is grocery.
So so worked on e-commerceinitiatives, grocery first,
general merchandising second.
That strategy took a couple ofyears to percolate and then
(16:18):
eventually it led to the jetcomacquisition a couple of years
later.
So a couple of years in thecorporate strategy moved over to
corporate development andworked on the jet deal and then
a number of the tuck-ins, bothon the deal side and then the
integration side.
Matt Waller (16:32):
Well, now switching back to your private equity
role of the trend now, how doyou identify high potential
growth companies and what arekey factors you look for in
considering an investment?
Chris Ladd (16:43):
Yeah, sure.
So it's a little bit differentacross stages, right.
So I've had the benefit ofinvesting now early, early stage
, did a little bit of that atWalmart, but I've been mainly in
more established businesses,cash flowing businesses.
So one thing that we do at NewRoad, and a little bit of what
we did at Walmart, was identifymarket opportunities or market
(17:07):
gaps, right.
So what are the key problems inthe industries that we're
focused on?
And then how do we findsolutions to solve those market
gaps?
And so it's a process thattakes a lot of time.
Research, luckily, across mycareer we've had about access to
(17:30):
a number of experts, right, andwhether they be an operating
partner or a strategic advisoror just somebody else in the
network, it's a really firstunderstanding.
Is there a market need, isthere a market gap for a
solution to drive better sales,to drive a better cost structure
or more efficiency?
That's kind of number one,especially at early stage.
(17:51):
Place a emphasis on that.
And then it's about finding thesolution right that can
actually drive a change orprovide a solution and have it
be fundamental to their customer, right, and so we can go into
some of the investments thatwe've made.
(18:13):
But those two high levelingredients, I think are
paramount.
Right, you've got a bunch offactors like management team and
competition and industry trends, customer trends, that you of
course look at right, analyze,but if there's not a market need
or a market gap and there's nota solution that can actually be
(18:36):
core to the customer that hasthat problem, then everything
else doesn't really make sense.
Matt Waller (18:46):
You're a board member.
We're an observer on severalcompanies.
These are younger, high growthtechnology companies, primarily
in logistics and supply chain,but the retail value chain more
(19:07):
broadly.
What is your approach toproviding guidance and support
for these companies in yourroles as a board member or
advisor?
Chris Ladd (19:19):
Yeah, yeah, it ebbs and flows with the investment
cycle for that particularcompany, right.
So we'll come in close a deal.
There's a 100 day plan.
That's the culmination of, youknow, months long of diligence,
basically, right, Sometimesyears depends on the deal.
There's a 100 day plan thatcomes out of it and that's
(19:41):
mainly tactical, right.
So that's kind of the firstfocus area Strategically, that
kind of folds in.
You know, after that point intime, Most of the companies that
we invest in are all thecompanies that have a strategy
right For product development,sales strategy et cetera.
But it is trying to bring, Iguess, maybe more structure, a
(20:04):
better framework to how toapproach a strategy, to develop
a comprehensive strategy thattakes into account and tests,
you know, where a company wantsto play, how do they wanna win,
and making sure that they havethe right resources and then
management processes to actuallypull off that strategy.
And so a lot of early stagecompanies don't have a type of
(20:27):
structure necessarily, or thetype of framework, and so making
sure that they are maybe it'spart of, in part of
communication issues as much asit is anything else making sure
that they are taking intoaccount all of the inputs in a
framework that is digestible.
Also, make sure that it testskey assumptions right, Including
(20:49):
the core business.
You know, making sure that youhave the right resources or it's
the right strategy.
One thing I've learned in earlystage investing it's it changes
almost daily, so it's an up anddown, up and down battle, and
so you know you always wannamake sure that you're adjusting
to the market, you respond intocompetitive pressures,
(21:12):
management, team changes, etcetera.
Matt Waller (21:15):
What role do you think technology and innovation
will play in driving growth andsuccess in today's competitive
business landscape?
Chris Ladd (21:26):
Sure high, high level, 40,000 foot view.
The world needs moreproductivity right.
Matt Waller (21:33):
Right, yeah, it's the best way to deal with
inflation Productivity, so I'msure yeah yeah, definitely one
of the tools, for sure, yeah, Iagree.
Chris Ladd (21:42):
But if you look at you know, birth rates,
replacement ratios, it's moreacute in certain pockets, you
know, like parts of Europe andcertainly China, japan, right,
and so technology is, to yourpoint, the best solution to
combat that right, to combatinflation, but just to make sure
that those populations canactually continue to live with
(22:05):
the high quality of life thatthey're used to today, right, so
technology is definitely apiece of that and it's gonna
play a role in driving thatproductivity going forward,
given, unless the populationratios or the replacement rate
does change, which could, whichcould.
Kind of focusing in on maybe,the US and where we typically
(22:26):
invest, which is supply chaintech solutions, technology is
also key.
The number of manual processesin supply chain, just it takes
to good from A to B.
It's actually shocking to mewhen I joined six years ago and
just the amount of white spacethat's out there and still this
(22:49):
is true.
Matt Waller (22:50):
Still, it is true.
I remember during the dot comboom I was really involved with
technology in this space and I,if you would have asked me then,
what would it be like today?
I would have thought most ofthis would be solved.
Everything's automated, really,didn't?
I mean?
The progress has been very slow, it has.
Chris Ladd (23:12):
I think there's a function of just people being
creatures of habit, right, tosome extent.
You know, we see adoptionbarriers at companies when it
may replace a job or it justchanges how they run their day,
right, like you know, digitalbrokerage is an interesting
example of that.
(23:32):
Insights inside AI is, you know, seeing some of that pushback?
Nice X has seen it as well, andso it's.
You know it's interesting towatch.
I hope it's like, or the next,like 15 to 20 years.
Maybe we'll be where youthought we'd be.
It's slowly, slowly changing.
(23:55):
I mean, there's a number ofstudies that have come out that
show everyone wants to adopttechnology.
Everybody wants.
You know, companies want moreproductivity, more efficiency,
but yet the tech adoption lags,and yeah, I'll tell you
something interesting.
Matt Waller (24:12):
I read an article this morning that it was based
on an empirical study.
That was done, but basically26% of the Fortune 500 companies
are not really pursuingtechnology and understanding or
a strategy of how to usegenerative AI 26%.
(24:33):
I found that remarkable.
Chris Ladd (24:38):
It actually doesn't surprise me.
I think, again, there's ahesitancy to adopt something
that may disrupt your livelihood, and so you don't really know
where it's gonna stop, honestly,right, okay, so it's probably
gonna start in certain fieldslike legal or copyrighting.
That makes sense, right, andthen at certain levels, right,
(25:01):
like building a PowerPointprobably won't be the time
consuming and manual task thatit is.
Or building a model, right, atleast the base, right, like
around the edges, you're likelyto be modifying or tweaking.
You know, but where does itstop?
And I think people are a bithesitant.
There's also competing,competing priorities for capital
(25:22):
, and especially in a marketthat's a down market, which is
interesting to see is that, evenif the solution is core, it's
fundamental to drivingefficiency, getting capital,
getting time, attention,executives when they're putting
out a fire, trying to save theirbusiness or what have you.
This type of market.
It becomes secondary, and soit's a bit of a myopic approach.
(25:45):
Maybe it's just because we'reall, it's just the human nature
of things, you know, but seeingfive, 10 years out in the future
is often hard, andunderstanding the ROI of that
it's often hard.
Matt Waller (25:55):
That's probably why there's so much turnover of
who's in the fortune five Everytwo, three years.
Yeah, I know, yeah, it'samazing.
So can you share a successstory of a company you've worked
with that's experiencedsignificant growth
transformation in your, say,portfolio companies?
Chris Ladd (26:14):
Sure, yeah, nice Shacks is one of them.
It's a good story.
They we invested.
They had about a million inrevenue, so the earliest deal
that we've ever done at New Road.
But Chris Sultemeyer, who ledall of logistics and
transportation at Walmart,really understood the problem
(26:36):
that they were going out Right.
So, coming back to what I wassaying before, like there was a
huge market gap there, and thatmarket gap in the case of Nice
Shacks was probably 35 to 40billion dollars and lost
efficiency a year.
And that lost efficiency isfrom stems from the contracting
process between an ocean shipper, even like a Walmart, they have
(26:56):
issues.
If you talk to Gary Adams, oneof our operating partners,
despite being the largestshipper in the world, oftentimes
they don't get the rates or thecapacity they need, so because
they're still somewhat small inthe grand scheme of things often
so it's solving a contractingissue which is paper, electronic
(27:18):
document that the contract iswritten on has very little teeth
, and so terms can change,prices can change all the way up
to the point where thecontainer is loaded onto a ship,
and so what happens is you havea shipper always looking for a
better price or better set ofterms, a carrier doing the same
thing up until the moment ofdeparture and so you have
(27:39):
overbooking and that justcreates waste in the system,
again to the tune of about 35billion dollars.
And so the founder of Nyshex hewas an executive at MERSC.
He dealt with this problem.
He had multiple regions underhis purview when he was at MERSC
and this frustrated him quite abit and so he started Nyshex to
(28:00):
first solve that contractingissue.
If you think about closeadjacencies to a contract,
that's providing some form offinancial support or greasing
the wheel there.
So they're moving intofinancing solutions for mainly
shippers, given a lot ofconcentration on the carrier
side.
They've moved into providingbetter visibility, allocation,
(28:25):
some predictive solutions forcarriers as well, and they've
grown quite a bit.
It's not a success story yet interms of an exit, but we're
very happy with where Nyshex hasgone from like one million
revenue to targeting, hopefully,mid-20s this year.
So quite a bit of growth, quitea bit of growth over the last
(28:46):
two and a half, maybe threeyears now and so.
But one company that was an exitwas Taxa Outdoors.
It was kind of a new age campercompany trailer company.
It was founded by a former NASAdesign engineer who liked to
get out into the outdoors, likedto have a safe place to sleep,
(29:11):
to cook and not be attacked by abear, for example, because you
like to go off grid a little bitbut still be able to get off.
So I kind of like theaspirational camper who wants to
really push it and so.
But that deal ended up beingabout a good return for us.
But we grew revenue from aboutfive million to about 30 and
(29:34):
sold it to Elcaterton.
We dealt with a number ofissues a couple of CEO changes,
cfo changes, some manufacturingissues during COVID for sure
that was interesting A few otherproblems, but yeah, my role in
all of that was, yeah, veryfocused on making sure that the
company had the right financialcontrols, financial procedures
(29:57):
in place, strategy, productdesign, things like that.
Matt Waller (30:04):
Well, congratulations, very impressive
, yeah.
Based on your experience atWalmart and corporate
development and mergers andacquisitions, what are some
lessons you learned that youwere able to carry forward into
your current roles?
Chris Ladd (30:21):
Sure, so it was my first role in corporate
development.
What's interesting is Walmartis very thoughtful and
deliberate in making any newchange or any dramatic change,
and so what was interesting tosee is committee-like approach
(30:45):
to making those decisions.
It slowed things down a littlebit but I think it led to better
outcomes.
And so I think I talked aboutthe Jetcom acquisition and so
that took a couple of years towork through the system, kind of
gain the support across theorganization that it needed.
So I learned that when I was incorporate development, because
(31:09):
you act a bit like an airtraffic controller at most
corporate development divisionsof companies and so especially
at Walmart, right, becauseyou've got multiple strategy
groups.
Of course you have legal, youhave supply chain, operations,
merchandise chain all thesegroups need to coalesce around a
(31:30):
strategy, whether it be to buya company or open market or
launch a new retail format, forexample.
And so takeaway there is Ithink it pays to kind of slow
down a bit, make sure that legalis signed off or merchandising
(31:53):
is signed off on a particularstrategy, that they're ingrained
in the process and reallybought in.
And that's important for how Iinvest now.
It's even more important forcorporations because if you
integrate the right people earlyin the process for an
acquisition, for example thenyou can take those individuals
and put them on the integrationteam and make sure that they own
(32:15):
it.
They can.
You know, the merchandisinglead now has a new set of
products that he or she needs tosell across new channels,
multiple channels.
You know, certainly there'sincentives you need to tie in
there.
But yeah, I think that's a key.
Matt Waller (32:31):
Learning is how do you see the future of private
equity and what impact willemerging technologies have on
the industry?
Chris Ladd (32:42):
Sure, we started talking about this before, but I
think there's more room to runfor private equity, meaning that
private equity should continueto grow as an asset class across
venture growth and later stageinvesting, or private equity.
Technology is going to enablethat to some degree.
(33:03):
You're seeing it already withthe group of platforms like a
Yield Street, for example, whereif you're accredited, you can
go online and start withinvesting at 10 to 15 grand into
office, built into early stagestartup.
You still have to be accredited, but that is opening up.
I've talked about RIAs before.
(33:24):
Rias are playing thataggregation role.
They can aggregate 100 clientsto do $250,000 each right and
then commit $25 million to afund right, and so that strategy
is playing out through theseplatforms.
If you're a retail investor,you don't have many options
(33:45):
today other than perhaps to buyKKR or TBG that's publicly
traded.
I think hopefully, that'llchange over time.
The technology like a YieldStreet's coming in and helping
to really improve access anddemocratize that process Within
(34:06):
private equity.
Operationally, tech is going tochange how it's already
changing, how we source.
It's changing how othercompanies source.
Days of manually searching for acompany old calling, I think
those days are limited.
So, for example, we knowcompanies.
We're working on a processwhere we're building technology
(34:29):
to make sure that we don't missa deal and over time, hopefully,
that technology will be smarter, will help us be more efficient
.
I don't think we'll ever use itprogrammatically, but it'll at
least allow us to skip a couplesteps and become more efficient
over time.
And certainly you've got theanalytical play with AI.
(34:52):
And when does that come in?
We're using it a little bit.
I know some of our analysts andassociates are using it to
improve research, get access tobetter data, build some very
basic analyses like tables orwhat have you.
But I think that's only goingto grow over time, and so
integration of AI, I think, willchange the staffing model to
(35:15):
some extent internally atprivate equity firms.
Not exactly sure how that looks, but I know it'll change over
time.
Matt Waller (35:25):
What are some trends or sectors that you
believe will have a significantimpact on the investment
landscape in the next five to 10years?
Chris Ladd (35:35):
Certainly, globalization, the reduction of
it to more regionalization right, it's been a trend that's been
happening for the last 10, 15years or so seems to be
accelerating and beingreinforced by a number of
actions kind of US or China orwhomever, right.
(35:56):
Certainly, some companies aretaking actions to de-risk the
exposure that they may have toan overseas market for sourcing,
for example.
Right, we're seeing that moveof manufacturing.
I think it was a Q1, mexicoactually surpassed China on a
(36:17):
net import basis.
I saw that, yeah, which was alot sooner than I think people
expected, and so I don't know ifthat's seasonal or what have
you, but I'd be interested tosee what happens with Q2 data.
But, yeah, I think that's goingto change a lot for, especially,
companies that are dealing withphysical goods, like a retailer
(36:37):
or a grocer.
It's going to change how,potentially, we invest right, in
terms of technology offeringsor even just opportunities to
invest.
I think anytime you have achange, things will open up.
So we don't invest inasset-heavy businesses, but
(36:59):
there will be more solutionsoriented for that flow from
Mexico into the US versus a shipcoming into the US.
So I think that's definitely abig kind of a secular trend and,
yeah, I think that'll continueto grow.
Matt Waller (37:20):
It'll be interesting to see.
I mean, it's kind of caused allkinds of changes Even just in
Mexico.
It'll be interesting to seewhat that does.
I suppose the wealth there isgoing to increase a lot.
Yeah, I should buy land in.
Chris Ladd (37:34):
Laredo, or yeah, or even in Mexico, if you can.
Matt Waller (37:40):
What, in your opinion, what qualities make for
a successful investor, and howhave you developed these
qualities in your career?
Chris Ladd (37:51):
Sure, Okay, so I haven't developed this quality,
but surrounding yourself withoperational expertise, right?
I started talking about thisbefore.
I saw this firsthand threedifferent firms I've worked at
or company in the case ofWalmart.
But KSL was heavy operations,Half their team was in their
(38:12):
portfolio management side of thehouse and so kind of an equal
representation, and the twofounders of that firm had run
companies much like ClaytonJeremy at that.
At TPG, they had not quite anequal amount, but they had about
150 former executives orexecutives in their ops group
(38:34):
that they'd rotate aroundcompanies in their capital
portfolio.
Both of those firms have donevery well over time, proven by
their ability to invest inmultiple cycles and drive
operational value.
So, taking away from that, wedid something similar at Walmart
.
But if you don't have the rightskill set, in this case
(38:57):
operational expertise, you needto surround yourself with it as
an investor to make sure thatyou can invest in any cycle With
that operational expertise,making sure that you stay
focused on what you know and notstray outside of that.
(39:17):
Looking back at the GreatRecession, there were a lot of
generalist firms that popped upin private equity firms in 2005,
2006, 2007, and a lot of themgot wiped out in the Great
Recession.
Those firms that were focusedon what they knew brought the
operational expertise to bear,powered through the downturn.
(39:39):
I think we're seeing a bit of ashakeout like that early days,
but that happened in early stageinvesting.
The number of VC firms earlystage investment firms that have
come about over the last, say,five years or so, is quite
staggering, and so something'sgoing to break.
I think it's kind of a slowprocess, but I think you're
(40:03):
going to see less firms, morefocused firms, especially
earlier stage, and smaller funds.
There's no reason why youshould be running a $100 billion
fund and a generalist itdoesn't quite make that much
sense To the point yeah.
I don't know, I could be wrong,but something that you see Stay
true to your knitting.
What you know, don't strayoutside of it.
Matt Waller (40:29):
Well, I'm sure you've been around so many
talented people in your career,but what's the say best piece of
advice you've received, and howhas it affected how you invest
or manage?
Chris Ladd (40:46):
Yeah.
So the best advice was from aprofessor I had at UT and he
hammered this home.
He said business is a grind,like there's no way around it.
Like to do well in businessit's consistent effort and
depending on how motivated youare, it's all out effort every
day.
So he said what you need to doevery morning is wake up and get
(41:11):
some cardio in Like, lift someweights, get your heart right up
, develop that endurance thatwill allow you to work 12 hours
right.
Be mentally strong, physicallystrong.
You got to travel to Singapore,right, or you got to travel to
Europe and pitch.
It just takes a lot of time andeffort, and so the more you can
(41:33):
do for your body physically,often that translates into
better mental health as well.
So, making sure you're workingout, sleeping as much as you can
to prepare yourself for justthe continuous grind that is
business, right.
No one gets away just on talent, unfortunately.
Matt Waller (41:55):
I agree with that advice and research is showing
daily exercise affects so manythings, especially when you look
at hazard rates.
Do you exercise, do you not?
That is a bigger impact than doyou smoke or do you not.
(42:17):
I mean you shouldn't smoke,right, but the impact of
exercise is multiple times theimpact of quitting smoking on
the hazard rate and variable.
And it's interesting, and Iagree cardio is good,
(42:38):
weightlifting there's more andmore evidence too that
weightlifting affects cognitiveskills, which is.
I don't know if they know themechanism, but it seems to be
true.
Chris Ladd (42:50):
Yeah, yeah yeah, yeah, I mean, aside from just
the skeletal benefits, right,and you know, balance benefits.
You don't fall when you're 70and break your hip.
That's true, yeah, but skeletal, yeah, but there is a tie and I
don't.
Yeah, we probably listen to thesame podcasts on this.
We probably have.
Matt Waller (43:07):
I listened to Peter Atia and, of course, andrew
Huberman.
Have you ever listened toHuberman?
Chris Ladd (43:12):
Of course, yeah, yeah yeah, yeah, so yeah, for me
that's been a bit of a godsend.
You know, I really onlydiscovered it maybe over the
last, like I went to businessschool a while ago, but like the
last five, six years, likeactually taking that to heart,
and it's made a dramatic changein my own efficiency, my
(43:33):
performance, right, but not justat work, also outside of work
too, because you have the energyto do more.
Matt Waller (43:40):
Yes, I think Huberman may be having a bigger
impact on our country thananyone.
Yeah, you know, yeah, and youknow some of the things he talks
about too, include making sureyou get sleep, and I have a word
of ram just to make sure I'm agood guy.
Yeah, yeah, but you can see,you know, are you getting enough
REM, mm-hmm.
(44:01):
Are you getting enough deepsleep?
Are you getting enough totalsleep?
Right, right, you know yourheart rate variability and you
know and again, I think when Italk to people, I run into
people all the time at the gymwho have listened to Huberman
and they've you can tell who hasbecause they're getting in dry
(44:24):
heat saunas more frequently.
They're getting in the coldplunge.
When I see people in the coldplunge, I think there's probably
a 50% probability they'velistened to Huberman, but you
know.
And then the other thing herecommends is early in the day,
getting sunlight and ice, and itreally does seem to make a
(44:46):
difference.
Chris Ladd (44:47):
That's one thing I haven't adopted yet is the.
I think he said he wakes uparound like 6.30 every day, like
the first thing he does.
He doesn't go to the coffee potand drink coffee.
He goes and you know, startsthe cycle right, Getting out in
the sun for 15, 20 minutes,circuiting rhythm, and then he
gets coffee right.
You know and so it's yeah, Ihaven't done that yet my wife
(45:10):
has and she's yeah, it's workingfor her.
Sometimes I like heat.
Today, I don't know about heat,it's 100 degrees.
Matt Waller (45:18):
Well, you know, but this, this is really a good
point, even though it's at theend of the podcast and we've
talked about all kinds of things, but sometimes there's
mediating and moderatingvariables that affect everything
else a lot.
And, and I do think, strengthtraining, cardio, sleep.
(45:45):
Actually, you know he takes thesaunas, the dry heat saunas.
I believe that you know if you,if you do it 10 to 20 minutes a
day and the heat level is atleast at 175 Fahrenheit, if you
do it like three days a week, itreduces your probability of
(46:08):
dying of cardiovascular diseasein any year by like 45% and it
goes up from there.
It goes up really high if youdo it every day.
But the other thing, the coldplunge.
You know the Blake Street House, which I'm a member, at
Bentonville, they got a coldplunge.
It doesn't tend to be very coldlater than they have.
(46:29):
If you get there early in themorning it can be pretty cold
and if you get in there for afew minutes it increases your
focus the rest of it.
Have you tried?
Chris Ladd (46:41):
it yet I haven't.
No, it's one of the things Ihaven't done.
But you know hebermansupplement lists, you know very
strict adherence to that andmaking sure I'm getting, you
know, enough sleep and workingout.
It's kind of a mix between likea tea and heberman.
Terms of like, you know theydiffer a little bit but a tea is
(47:03):
actually hard, like when you'retraveling a lot and you know to
get four hours of zone two, youknow.
And then do all the balancetraining and the VO2 max and you
know.
But as long as you'reincorporating, I think, a lot of
that, you know not everythingall the time, but you know as
much as you can.
It's almost impossible ifyou're you know, I mean you
travel a lot, if you're goingabroad or whatever.
Matt Waller (47:24):
It's really hard to maintain that especially when
you're here, but as much as youcan, I think it's you know, when
I'm traveling now, I actuallymake sure I prefer not stay at a
hotel that doesn't have a goodgym.
If they don't have a good gymthen I look on a map to see if
there's a gym I can go to.
You know close by.
And it's funny, I would neverthought that that would be so
(47:46):
important.
But, as you mentioned, thatadvice your professor gave you
is tremendous and I give thatadvice to students as well.
Another thing and the otherthing is you know, some students
don't sleep enough.
I know we have an executive MBAprogram and the average number
(48:10):
of years of experience in thatprogram is like 13.
And a few years ago I spoke tothe incoming class of the MBA
students and I said you know,make sure you sleep because
they're working, they've got bigjobs some of them, and I
actually, just to for effect, Irode into the building on my
(48:32):
bike.
I'd ridden the bike to work andactually rode into the
classroom.
All the MBA students were thereand it was to make a point.
You know, hey, you need to.
It's great you're learning, butyou've got to do some other
things.
And right, it turns out therewas a physician in there,
because his name's Eric's band.
He just graduated about my ageand he was so thrilled he says I
(48:59):
couldn't believe you said that,but it's so true.
And I think as you get older,if you're not sleeping enough it
will impair your cognitiveskills.
Chris Ladd (49:09):
Yeah, I'm trying to recall a study I read.
But if you don't get enoughsleep, it has the highest
correlation to cancer, right?
And other diseases too, right?
So you know memory loss andthings like that.
But if you don't sleep and letyour body recover enough, then
it doesn't matter how much youwork out or what you eat it's, I
(49:31):
mean, certainly that helpsoffset, but eventually a lot of
lack of sleep catches up withit's funny.
Matt Waller (49:38):
When I was in graduate school, I thought I had
read that you can trainyourself to sleep less.
Now, this is a long time ago 35years ago and so I would.
I was trying to train myself tosleep five hours a night.
I did it all through graduateschool, but I don't think it was
good for me.
Chris Ladd (49:58):
Probably not, but I didn't know it.
Matt Waller (50:00):
You know, thankfully we've got so much
information out there.
If you want, you can reallyimprove.
Well, Chris, it's been a realpleasure.
I love it.
I'm busy with you.
Thank you so much for takingtime.
Thank you, If you're findingvalue in this podcast.
We greatly appreciate yoursupport by subscribing to our
YouTube channel.
(50:21):
Additionally, following us onApple and Spotify and leaving up
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We welcome any feedback orquestions related to the podcast
, as well as suggestions forfurther topics and guests.
Please also take a moment tocheck out our podcast sponsors,
(50:46):
as they play a critical role inkeeping this podcast running.
For more information onspecific topics, timestamps or
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matwallerpodcastcom.
Welcome to the Mant Waller podcast, sponsored by
New Road Capital Partners, wherewe look at success at the
intersection of technology,logistics, supply chain, retail
and CPG, which we also call theretail value chain.
I want to clarify that thispodcast is distinct from my
responsibilities as a professorin the Sam Walton College of
(00:32):
Business.
Nonetheless, it aligns with myaspiration to provide practical
insights to professionals inbusiness by showcasing companies
and people that can enhanceyour ability to manage, lead,
strategize and marketeffectively in the retail value
chain.
Before we dive into today'sexciting episode, I'd like to
take a moment to express mydeepest gratitude to our
(00:55):
founding sponsor, new RoadCapital Partners.
New Road Capital Partnersinvests in proven and innovative
technologies, products andservices that serve existing and
unmet needs in the marketplace.
New Road partners withgrowth-oriented companies in
supply chain, logistics andinnovative consumer companies as
experienced entrepreneurs andoperators.
(01:17):
The New Road team prides itselfon the high level of
collaboration it brings to eachof its investments.
New Road's team of investmentprofessionals and operating
partners have deep, relevantinvesting and operating
experience, includingsignificant experience leading
large divisions of enterprisecompanies and building
businesses from scale to conceptto realization.
(01:41):
To learn more, visitnewroadcpcom.
I also want to disclose that Iam an advisor to New Road.
I would like to take thismoment to recognize
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Their mission is simple Tostreamline the process of
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creating podcast videos.
They're equipped withindustry-leading equipment and
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I'm very pleased with theservices they provide me.
Now, without further ado, let'sget started with today's episode
.
Today, I'm interviewing ChrisLadd, and I am so excited about
(02:24):
this podcast.
He has experience in privateequity that goes way back.
In fact.
He got an internship when hewas an undergraduate with a firm
in private equity.
Actually, even when he was veryyoung, like in fifth or sixth
grade, he got involved in aninvestment club.
(02:47):
He's been interested in thisfor a long time.
This conversation is quiteinteresting.
I ask him how do you identifyhigh potential growth companies?
What factors do you look forwhen you're investing?
You'll hear his answer.
I think it's really importantto understand these, especially
(03:09):
if you're an early stage or amid-stage company.
To understand this, he's alsoon the board of many companies
boards of many companies andalso serves as an observer for
some companies.
But I was talking to him abouthow he provides strategic
guidance and support.
Again, it's a very interestingconversation.
(03:33):
We talk about technology andinnovation and how that's
affecting the competitivelandscape today.
I think you'll enjoy that.
We talk about many other thingsas well, including the future
of private equity and howemerging technologies are
affecting industry.
(03:53):
There's all kinds ofinteresting topics we cover.
I would say.
If you're interested ininvesting or private equity, or
the retail value chain broadly,I would encourage you to listen
to this.
Chris is a seasoned investorstrategist and board member with
extensive experience incorporate development, mergers
(04:15):
and acquisitions and privateequity across a diverse range of
industries.
Currently a partner at New RoadCapital Partners, chris has
been with the firm for over sixyears, helping to identify and
support high growth companies.
In his current role at New RoadCapital Partners, chris has
been actively involved invarious capacities with several
(04:36):
portfolio companies.
As a board observer, he hasprovided strategic guidance and
support to organizations such asInsight AI, wavebl, quinn, new
York Shipping Exchange alsocalled NICEX, engage 3, big Elk
Energy Systems, LLC, shiftboardand others.
(04:56):
Chris has also served as aboard member for TAXA Outdoors
and Blue in Green, furtherbroadening his experience in
guiding companies towardssuccess.
Prior to joining New RoadCapital Partners, chris spent
four years at Walmart, holdingsenior roles in corporate
development, corporate mergersand acquisitions, and corporate
(05:19):
strategy and finance.
His tenure at Walmart hasequipped him with a deep
understanding of the retailspace, which he has successfully
carried forward into hisinvestment and board roles.
Before his time at Walmart,chris worked as an associate at
TPG Global, ksl Capital PartnersInternational LLP, where he
(05:42):
honed his skills in privateequity deal sourcing and
portfolio management.
His experience at thesewell-established firms has
provided him with a solidfoundation and the world of
finance and investment.
Chris earned an MBA from TexasMcComb School of Business,
graduating with honors.
He also holds a bachelor'sdegree in Applied Economics and
(06:04):
Management from CornellUniversity, where he was an
active member of the CornellUniversity rugby team.
Chris Ernst Young prepared areport called the Economic
Contribution of the US PrivateEquity Sector in 2022.
They prepared this for theAmerican Investment Council and
there's a lot of reallyinteresting things in it from my
(06:27):
perspective, but one thatreally caught my attention is
that 6.5% of the US GDP issupported by the private equity
sector, 1.7 trillion of GDPgenerated by US private equity
(06:47):
sector, 12 million employed bythe US private equity sector and
1 trillion dollars earned inwages and benefits by US private
equity sector workers.
Did that surprise you?
Chris Ladd (07:06):
It didn't.
If you think about the numberof workers, it's interesting
it's about the same number asWalmart has domestically.
It's got an interesting stat.
But I think private equity hasbeen around for a long time
Really in earnest in its currentform kind of early 90s when
groups like KKR and TPG gotstarted and it doesn't surprise
(07:32):
me.
I think it's only going to grow.
If you look at where privateequity plays, it is kind of
taking the handoff from venturecapital and really continuing
that engine of growth which issmall business.
So most of that employment isin per the study that you shared
with me In companies under 500,FTEs or employees, and that's
(07:54):
truly kind of the growth of theUS and broadly the world economy
.
The ingenuity and startup scenecarried through to private
equity.
So it didn't quite surprise me.
I think it surprised by how lowit was.
It was actually a little bithigher as a percentage GDP.
So it's good to see thosefigures.
I think it's only going to growover time.
(08:16):
If you look at investmentallocation, for just generally
across the spectrum, from retailinvestors to institutional
investors, there's still a lotof room to grow.
So institutional investors,they have somewhere over
allocated, especially in marketslike this.
We've had a lot of allocationin 20 and 21, and a drop in the
(08:38):
public markets in 22 creates abit of an imbalance in their
allocation.
But even looking at that ortaking that into account,
there's a lot of institutionsthat are under allocated to
private equity, includingventure capital, growth equity
and private equity.
So I think that will continueto grow.
What's really interesting isthe other side of the spectrum,
which is your retail investorkind of your normal mom and pop
(09:02):
was a 401k and then, you know,kind of moving along the
spectrum a little bit more tothe high net worth individual
who has maybe three to fivemillion in net worth.
They're under allocated as well.
What's been an interesting trendWe've taken advantage of this a
bit is, since 2008 2009, theGreat Recession, A lot of the
(09:24):
money that was in larger banksor banks in general and their
wealth management divisionsmoved into these registered
investment advisors RIAs forshort and so RIAs have grown
quite dramatically since 20082009.
We fundraise from a lot ofthose groups.
A lot of those groups are nowdeploying into private equity
and venture capital and itenables that high net worth
(09:46):
individual who makes, or who isworth, you know, maybe five
million dollars to allocate anddiversified manner into private
equity.
And that's just starting.
You know, look at theallocation percentages for a lot
of the RIA clients and still insingle digits.
Depending upon your philosophyor what we have about private
equity exposure, that should bea bit higher.
You know at least 10, maybe 20%.
(10:08):
There's certainly groups likeTiger 21 that advocate for
something a lot higher.
You know, kind of 50 pluspercent into private investments
, including real estate, right,Not just companies but also
include real estate.
And so I think it wasinteresting to see I was a
little bit shocked it was so low, you know, but I think it will
only continue to grow, you know,as we look to those companies
(10:29):
and private equity to take that,take those companies that are
successful and continue to growit and integrate them into the
economy.
Matt Waller (10:35):
When you look at the you know return on private
equity investments, you wouldthink it would be a higher
percentage.
It is really surprising.
Chris Ladd (10:44):
Yeah, for sure.
Yeah, you look at some of themost successful private equity
firms over time, like I mean totake your pick a Blackstone or
KKR or TPG.
They've averaged kind of mid20s IRR since inception.
Matt Waller (10:58):
Right.
Chris Ladd (10:59):
It's absolutely yeah , it's shocking right, and so
that's why they've risen to thetop right, Because they've
consistently been able to deploycapital across multiple cycles,
across multiple industries.
You know, a lot of that ischalked up to operational
expertise and the ability todrive value in any situation.
(11:20):
Structure can only get used sofar right.
You can structure around a baddeal.
It's still a bad deal or a badcompany.
So the fundamentals have to bethere or you have to be able to
change the fundamentals, and Ithink a lot of the private
equity shops that have been moreeverlasting have been able to
do that.
Not that it's not just rely onstructure, but really focus on
(11:41):
driving operational excellenceand operational improvements.
Matt Waller (11:44):
Well, chris, I'd like to shift gears to you,
general Moment.
You've had a really amazingcareer already, but could you
share a little bit about yourjourney in the world of finance
and investments and what led youto become a partner at New Road
Capital Partners?
Chris Ladd (12:02):
Yeah, sure, I still feel like it's early days, but
my career, yeah.
So I grew up in the Northeastin a small farming town in
upstate New York, went to schoolat Cornell and studied
economics and finance and had acouple strokes of luck, got an
internship at a private equityfirm when I was an undergrad, as
(12:24):
a sophomore, and so I was ableto integrate and learn the
business at an early age andalways had an interest in
finance and invest in since Iwas in fourth grade, fourth,
fifth grade when I joined aninvestment club.
So it's been a while, but yeah,so I was laser focused, but
really kind of the kickstartthat I got was interned at a
(12:46):
private equity fund in collegeand that's in part why kind of a
shameless plug here why we havesuch a strong intern program at
New Road is because of thatopportunity that I had and I
want to try to replicate that.
Matt Waller (12:58):
I didn't know that.
Well, I knew.
I mean, I knew you hired a lotof interns, because you hire a
lot from the Walton College, andI noticed that.
And you seem to be able to getright us too.
Yeah, you do a good job of that.
Well, thank you for doing that.
Appreciate that, of course.
But then you eventually went towork at Walmart, which was kind
of out of that path.
Chris Ladd (13:19):
Yeah, so yeah, undergrad, that internship that
led to a full time privateequity offer out of undergrad
with a different firm that hadjust spun out, a KKR.
So they raised about a billiondollars and moved out to Denver.
I'd never been to Denver butgot the role and so moved out
there, spent about four yearswith them and then went to TPG
(13:43):
capital, which is a you know, Iguess, larger, more general
private equity firm is there fora couple of years.
Kind of along that journey metmy wife, who is from Northwest
Arkansas and so after we gotmarried and started a family,
she wanted to move back and becloser to her family.
So I made it to NorthwestArkansas and was finishing up my
(14:04):
MBA in Walmart recruits at UTAustin.
So one thing led to another andended up getting a job in
corporate strategy and RobertM&A.
That's how I made it toNorthwest Arkansas.
Matt Waller (14:19):
That is a great story.
Would you mind talking just alittle bit about what you did at
Walmart?
Yeah, sure.
Chris Ladd (14:27):
So started off in corporate strategy was mainly
focused on e-commerceinitiatives.
So at the time, this was in2013.
Amazon was still considered apotential threat, you know,
especially in grocery, and Ithink it was the fall of 2013,.
(14:50):
Amazon really spiked its onlinesales during the holiday season
from Thanksgiving to, you know,through Christmas right, and
that really spooked a lot of theexecutives at Walmart and that
got the gears moving a bitquicker on.
What should we do to respond,like, what should we employ or
(15:11):
what strategy should we createto respond to this?
So we did a large study withBain and corporate strategy.
We actually hired a partnerfrom Bain to come on board to
help assess the situation and,yeah, we put forth a strategy.
That's become the grocerybusiness for Walmart, which is
the pickup and delivery business.
The idea was we need to keepthe market share in grocery and
(15:36):
effectively train the customerto come to the store.
We've got this large asset thatwe wanna increase utilization,
in which we wanna increaseutilization, and so we started
on the path of started a newbusiness within Walmart, which
is never easy and so, but thatit's actually become, I think,
(15:56):
one of the fastest growingsegments within Walmart, still
fairly small compared to theoverall US business.
But I think the e-commercebusiness broadly just eclipsed
about 50, 60 billion in revenue,and a lot of that is grocery.
So so worked on e-commerceinitiatives, grocery first,
general merchandising second.
That strategy took a couple ofyears to percolate and then
(16:18):
eventually it led to the jetcomacquisition a couple of years
later.
So a couple of years in thecorporate strategy moved over to
corporate development andworked on the jet deal and then
a number of the tuck-ins, bothon the deal side and then the
integration side.
Matt Waller (16:32):
Well, now switching back to your private equity
role of the trend now, how doyou identify high potential
growth companies and what arekey factors you look for in
considering an investment?
Chris Ladd (16:43):
Yeah, sure.
So it's a little bit differentacross stages, right.
So I've had the benefit ofinvesting now early, early stage
, did a little bit of that atWalmart, but I've been mainly in
more established businesses,cash flowing businesses.
So one thing that we do at NewRoad, and a little bit of what
we did at Walmart, was identifymarket opportunities or market
(17:07):
gaps, right.
So what are the key problems inthe industries that we're
focused on?
And then how do we findsolutions to solve those market
gaps?
And so it's a process thattakes a lot of time.
Research, luckily, across mycareer we've had about access to
(17:30):
a number of experts, right, andwhether they be an operating
partner or a strategic advisoror just somebody else in the
network, it's a really firstunderstanding.
Is there a market need, isthere a market gap for a
solution to drive better sales,to drive a better cost structure
or more efficiency?
That's kind of number one,especially at early stage.
(17:51):
Place a emphasis on that.
And then it's about finding thesolution right that can
actually drive a change orprovide a solution and have it
be fundamental to their customer, right, and so we can go into
some of the investments thatwe've made.
(18:13):
But those two high levelingredients, I think are
paramount.
Right, you've got a bunch offactors like management team and
competition and industry trends, customer trends, that you of
course look at right, analyze,but if there's not a market need
or a market gap and there's nota solution that can actually be
(18:36):
core to the customer that hasthat problem, then everything
else doesn't really make sense.
Matt Waller (18:46):
You're a board member.
We're an observer on severalcompanies.
These are younger, high growthtechnology companies, primarily
in logistics and supply chain,but the retail value chain more
(19:07):
broadly.
What is your approach toproviding guidance and support
for these companies in yourroles as a board member or
advisor?
Chris Ladd (19:19):
Yeah, yeah, it ebbs and flows with the investment
cycle for that particularcompany, right.
So we'll come in close a deal.
There's a 100 day plan.
That's the culmination of, youknow, months long of diligence,
basically, right, Sometimesyears depends on the deal.
There's a 100 day plan thatcomes out of it and that's
(19:41):
mainly tactical, right.
So that's kind of the firstfocus area Strategically, that
kind of folds in.
You know, after that point intime, Most of the companies that
we invest in are all thecompanies that have a strategy
right For product development,sales strategy et cetera.
But it is trying to bring, Iguess, maybe more structure, a
(20:04):
better framework to how toapproach a strategy, to develop
a comprehensive strategy thattakes into account and tests,
you know, where a company wantsto play, how do they wanna win,
and making sure that they havethe right resources and then
management processes to actuallypull off that strategy.
And so a lot of early stagecompanies don't have a type of
(20:27):
structure necessarily, or thetype of framework, and so making
sure that they are maybe it'spart of, in part of
communication issues as much asit is anything else making sure
that they are taking intoaccount all of the inputs in a
framework that is digestible.
Also, make sure that it testskey assumptions right, Including
(20:49):
the core business.
You know, making sure that youhave the right resources or it's
the right strategy.
One thing I've learned in earlystage investing it's it changes
almost daily, so it's an up anddown, up and down battle, and
so you know you always wannamake sure that you're adjusting
to the market, you respond intocompetitive pressures,
(21:12):
management, team changes, etcetera.
Matt Waller (21:15):
What role do you think technology and innovation
will play in driving growth andsuccess in today's competitive
business landscape?
Chris Ladd (21:26):
Sure high, high level, 40,000 foot view.
The world needs moreproductivity right.
Matt Waller (21:33):
Right, yeah, it's the best way to deal with
inflation Productivity, so I'msure yeah yeah, definitely one
of the tools, for sure, yeah, Iagree.
Chris Ladd (21:42):
But if you look at you know, birth rates,
replacement ratios, it's moreacute in certain pockets, you
know, like parts of Europe andcertainly China, japan, right,
and so technology is, to yourpoint, the best solution to
combat that right, to combatinflation, but just to make sure
that those populations canactually continue to live with
(22:05):
the high quality of life thatthey're used to today, right, so
technology is definitely apiece of that and it's gonna
play a role in driving thatproductivity going forward,
given, unless the populationratios or the replacement rate
does change, which could, whichcould.
Kind of focusing in on maybe,the US and where we typically
(22:26):
invest, which is supply chaintech solutions, technology is
also key.
The number of manual processesin supply chain, just it takes
to good from A to B.
It's actually shocking to mewhen I joined six years ago and
just the amount of white spacethat's out there and still this
(22:49):
is true.
Matt Waller (22:50):
Still, it is true.
I remember during the dot comboom I was really involved with
technology in this space and I,if you would have asked me then,
what would it be like today?
I would have thought most ofthis would be solved.
Everything's automated, really,didn't?
I mean?
The progress has been very slow, it has.
Chris Ladd (23:12):
I think there's a function of just people being
creatures of habit, right, tosome extent.
You know, we see adoptionbarriers at companies when it
may replace a job or it justchanges how they run their day,
right, like you know, digitalbrokerage is an interesting
example of that.
(23:32):
Insights inside AI is, you know, seeing some of that pushback?
Nice X has seen it as well, andso it's.
You know it's interesting towatch.
I hope it's like, or the next,like 15 to 20 years.
Maybe we'll be where youthought we'd be.
It's slowly, slowly changing.
(23:55):
I mean, there's a number ofstudies that have come out that
show everyone wants to adopttechnology.
Everybody wants.
You know, companies want moreproductivity, more efficiency,
but yet the tech adoption lags,and yeah, I'll tell you
something interesting.
Matt Waller (24:12):
I read an article this morning that it was based
on an empirical study.
That was done, but basically26% of the Fortune 500 companies
are not really pursuingtechnology and understanding or
a strategy of how to usegenerative AI 26%.
(24:33):
I found that remarkable.
Chris Ladd (24:38):
It actually doesn't surprise me.
I think, again, there's ahesitancy to adopt something
that may disrupt your livelihood, and so you don't really know
where it's gonna stop, honestly,right, okay, so it's probably
gonna start in certain fieldslike legal or copyrighting.
That makes sense, right, andthen at certain levels, right,
(25:01):
like building a PowerPointprobably won't be the time
consuming and manual task thatit is.
Or building a model, right, atleast the base, right, like
around the edges, you're likelyto be modifying or tweaking.
You know, but where does itstop?
And I think people are a bithesitant.
There's also competing,competing priorities for capital
(25:22):
, and especially in a marketthat's a down market, which is
interesting to see is that, evenif the solution is core, it's
fundamental to drivingefficiency, getting capital,
getting time, attention,executives when they're putting
out a fire, trying to save theirbusiness or what have you.
This type of market.
It becomes secondary, and soit's a bit of a myopic approach.
(25:45):
Maybe it's just because we'reall, it's just the human nature
of things, you know, but seeingfive, 10 years out in the future
is often hard, andunderstanding the ROI of that
it's often hard.
Matt Waller (25:55):
That's probably why there's so much turnover of
who's in the fortune five Everytwo, three years.
Yeah, I know, yeah, it'samazing.
So can you share a successstory of a company you've worked
with that's experiencedsignificant growth
transformation in your, say,portfolio companies?
Chris Ladd (26:14):
Sure, yeah, nice Shacks is one of them.
It's a good story.
They we invested.
They had about a million inrevenue, so the earliest deal
that we've ever done at New Road.
But Chris Sultemeyer, who ledall of logistics and
transportation at Walmart,really understood the problem
(26:36):
that they were going out Right.
So, coming back to what I wassaying before, like there was a
huge market gap there, and thatmarket gap in the case of Nice
Shacks was probably 35 to 40billion dollars and lost
efficiency a year.
And that lost efficiency isfrom stems from the contracting
process between an ocean shipper, even like a Walmart, they have
(26:56):
issues.
If you talk to Gary Adams, oneof our operating partners,
despite being the largestshipper in the world, oftentimes
they don't get the rates or thecapacity they need, so because
they're still somewhat small inthe grand scheme of things often
so it's solving a contractingissue which is paper, electronic
(27:18):
document that the contract iswritten on has very little teeth
, and so terms can change,prices can change all the way up
to the point where thecontainer is loaded onto a ship,
and so what happens is you havea shipper always looking for a
better price or better set ofterms, a carrier doing the same
thing up until the moment ofdeparture and so you have
(27:39):
overbooking and that justcreates waste in the system,
again to the tune of about 35billion dollars.
And so the founder of Nyshex hewas an executive at MERSC.
He dealt with this problem.
He had multiple regions underhis purview when he was at MERSC
and this frustrated him quite abit and so he started Nyshex to
(28:00):
first solve that contractingissue.
If you think about closeadjacencies to a contract,
that's providing some form offinancial support or greasing
the wheel there.
So they're moving intofinancing solutions for mainly
shippers, given a lot ofconcentration on the carrier
side.
They've moved into providingbetter visibility, allocation,
(28:25):
some predictive solutions forcarriers as well, and they've
grown quite a bit.
It's not a success story yet interms of an exit, but we're
very happy with where Nyshex hasgone from like one million
revenue to targeting, hopefully,mid-20s this year.
So quite a bit of growth, quitea bit of growth over the last
(28:46):
two and a half, maybe threeyears now and so.
But one company that was an exitwas Taxa Outdoors.
It was kind of a new age campercompany trailer company.
It was founded by a former NASAdesign engineer who liked to
get out into the outdoors, likedto have a safe place to sleep,
(29:11):
to cook and not be attacked by abear, for example, because you
like to go off grid a little bitbut still be able to get off.
So I kind of like theaspirational camper who wants to
really push it and so.
But that deal ended up beingabout a good return for us.
But we grew revenue from aboutfive million to about 30 and
(29:34):
sold it to Elcaterton.
We dealt with a number ofissues a couple of CEO changes,
cfo changes, some manufacturingissues during COVID for sure
that was interesting A few otherproblems, but yeah, my role in
all of that was, yeah, veryfocused on making sure that the
company had the right financialcontrols, financial procedures
(29:57):
in place, strategy, productdesign, things like that.
Matt Waller (30:04):
Well, congratulations, very impressive
, yeah.
Based on your experience atWalmart and corporate
development and mergers andacquisitions, what are some
lessons you learned that youwere able to carry forward into
your current roles?
Chris Ladd (30:21):
Sure, so it was my first role in corporate
development.
What's interesting is Walmartis very thoughtful and
deliberate in making any newchange or any dramatic change,
and so what was interesting tosee is committee-like approach
(30:45):
to making those decisions.
It slowed things down a littlebit but I think it led to better
outcomes.
And so I think I talked aboutthe Jetcom acquisition and so
that took a couple of years towork through the system, kind of
gain the support across theorganization that it needed.
So I learned that when I was incorporate development, because
(31:09):
you act a bit like an airtraffic controller at most
corporate development divisionsof companies and so especially
at Walmart, right, becauseyou've got multiple strategy
groups.
Of course you have legal, youhave supply chain, operations,
merchandise chain all thesegroups need to coalesce around a
(31:30):
strategy, whether it be to buya company or open market or
launch a new retail format, forexample.
And so takeaway there is Ithink it pays to kind of slow
down a bit, make sure that legalis signed off or merchandising
(31:53):
is signed off on a particularstrategy, that they're ingrained
in the process and reallybought in.
And that's important for how Iinvest now.
It's even more important forcorporations because if you
integrate the right people earlyin the process for an
acquisition, for example thenyou can take those individuals
and put them on the integrationteam and make sure that they own
(32:15):
it.
They can.
You know, the merchandisinglead now has a new set of
products that he or she needs tosell across new channels,
multiple channels.
You know, certainly there'sincentives you need to tie in
there.
But yeah, I think that's a key.
Matt Waller (32:31):
Learning is how do you see the future of private
equity and what impact willemerging technologies have on
the industry?
Chris Ladd (32:42):
Sure, we started talking about this before, but I
think there's more room to runfor private equity, meaning that
private equity should continueto grow as an asset class across
venture growth and later stageinvesting, or private equity.
Technology is going to enablethat to some degree.
(33:03):
You're seeing it already withthe group of platforms like a
Yield Street, for example, whereif you're accredited, you can
go online and start withinvesting at 10 to 15 grand into
office, built into early stagestartup.
You still have to be accredited, but that is opening up.
I've talked about RIAs before.
(33:24):
Rias are playing thataggregation role.
They can aggregate 100 clientsto do $250,000 each right and
then commit $25 million to afund right, and so that strategy
is playing out through theseplatforms.
If you're a retail investor,you don't have many options
(33:45):
today other than perhaps to buyKKR or TBG that's publicly
traded.
I think hopefully, that'llchange over time.
The technology like a YieldStreet's coming in and helping
to really improve access anddemocratize that process Within
(34:06):
private equity.
Operationally, tech is going tochange how it's already
changing, how we source.
It's changing how othercompanies source.
Days of manually searching for acompany old calling, I think
those days are limited.
So, for example, we knowcompanies.
We're working on a processwhere we're building technology
(34:29):
to make sure that we don't missa deal and over time, hopefully,
that technology will be smarter, will help us be more efficient
.
I don't think we'll ever use itprogrammatically, but it'll at
least allow us to skip a couplesteps and become more efficient
over time.
And certainly you've got theanalytical play with AI.
(34:52):
And when does that come in?
We're using it a little bit.
I know some of our analysts andassociates are using it to
improve research, get access tobetter data, build some very
basic analyses like tables orwhat have you.
But I think that's only goingto grow over time, and so
integration of AI, I think, willchange the staffing model to
(35:15):
some extent internally atprivate equity firms.
Not exactly sure how that looks, but I know it'll change over
time.
Matt Waller (35:25):
What are some trends or sectors that you
believe will have a significantimpact on the investment
landscape in the next five to 10years?
Chris Ladd (35:35):
Certainly, globalization, the reduction of
it to more regionalization right, it's been a trend that's been
happening for the last 10, 15years or so seems to be
accelerating and beingreinforced by a number of
actions kind of US or China orwhomever, right.
(35:56):
Certainly, some companies aretaking actions to de-risk the
exposure that they may have toan overseas market for sourcing,
for example.
Right, we're seeing that moveof manufacturing.
I think it was a Q1, mexicoactually surpassed China on a
(36:17):
net import basis.
I saw that, yeah, which was alot sooner than I think people
expected, and so I don't know ifthat's seasonal or what have
you, but I'd be interested tosee what happens with Q2 data.
But, yeah, I think that's goingto change a lot for, especially,
companies that are dealing withphysical goods, like a retailer
(36:37):
or a grocer.
It's going to change how,potentially, we invest right, in
terms of technology offeringsor even just opportunities to
invest.
I think anytime you have achange, things will open up.
So we don't invest inasset-heavy businesses, but
(36:59):
there will be more solutionsoriented for that flow from
Mexico into the US versus a shipcoming into the US.
So I think that's definitely abig kind of a secular trend and,
yeah, I think that'll continueto grow.
Matt Waller (37:20):
It'll be interesting to see.
I mean, it's kind of caused allkinds of changes Even just in
Mexico.
It'll be interesting to seewhat that does.
I suppose the wealth there isgoing to increase a lot.
Yeah, I should buy land in.
Chris Ladd (37:34):
Laredo, or yeah, or even in Mexico, if you can.
Matt Waller (37:40):
What, in your opinion, what qualities make for
a successful investor, and howhave you developed these
qualities in your career?
Chris Ladd (37:51):
Sure, Okay, so I haven't developed this quality,
but surrounding yourself withoperational expertise, right?
I started talking about thisbefore.
I saw this firsthand threedifferent firms I've worked at
or company in the case ofWalmart.
But KSL was heavy operations,Half their team was in their
(38:12):
portfolio management side of thehouse and so kind of an equal
representation, and the twofounders of that firm had run
companies much like ClaytonJeremy at that.
At TPG, they had not quite anequal amount, but they had about
150 former executives orexecutives in their ops group
(38:34):
that they'd rotate aroundcompanies in their capital
portfolio.
Both of those firms have donevery well over time, proven by
their ability to invest inmultiple cycles and drive
operational value.
So, taking away from that, wedid something similar at Walmart
.
But if you don't have the rightskill set, in this case
(38:57):
operational expertise, you needto surround yourself with it as
an investor to make sure thatyou can invest in any cycle With
that operational expertise,making sure that you stay
focused on what you know and notstray outside of that.
(39:17):
Looking back at the GreatRecession, there were a lot of
generalist firms that popped upin private equity firms in 2005,
2006, 2007, and a lot of themgot wiped out in the Great
Recession.
Those firms that were focusedon what they knew brought the
operational expertise to bear,powered through the downturn.
(39:39):
I think we're seeing a bit of ashakeout like that early days,
but that happened in early stageinvesting.
The number of VC firms earlystage investment firms that have
come about over the last, say,five years or so, is quite
staggering, and so something'sgoing to break.
I think it's kind of a slowprocess, but I think you're
(40:03):
going to see less firms, morefocused firms, especially
earlier stage, and smaller funds.
There's no reason why youshould be running a $100 billion
fund and a generalist itdoesn't quite make that much
sense To the point yeah.
I don't know, I could be wrong,but something that you see Stay
true to your knitting.
What you know, don't strayoutside of it.
Matt Waller (40:29):
Well, I'm sure you've been around so many
talented people in your career,but what's the say best piece of
advice you've received, and howhas it affected how you invest
or manage?
Chris Ladd (40:46):
Yeah.
So the best advice was from aprofessor I had at UT and he
hammered this home.
He said business is a grind,like there's no way around it.
Like to do well in businessit's consistent effort and
depending on how motivated youare, it's all out effort every
day.
So he said what you need to doevery morning is wake up and get
(41:11):
some cardio in Like, lift someweights, get your heart right up
, develop that endurance thatwill allow you to work 12 hours
right.
Be mentally strong, physicallystrong.
You got to travel to Singapore,right, or you got to travel to
Europe and pitch.
It just takes a lot of time andeffort, and so the more you can
(41:33):
do for your body physically,often that translates into
better mental health as well.
So, making sure you're workingout, sleeping as much as you can
to prepare yourself for justthe continuous grind that is
business, right.
No one gets away just on talent, unfortunately.
Matt Waller (41:55):
I agree with that advice and research is showing
daily exercise affects so manythings, especially when you look
at hazard rates.
Do you exercise, do you not?
That is a bigger impact than doyou smoke or do you not.
(42:17):
I mean you shouldn't smoke,right, but the impact of
exercise is multiple times theimpact of quitting smoking on
the hazard rate and variable.
And it's interesting, and Iagree cardio is good,
(42:38):
weightlifting there's more andmore evidence too that
weightlifting affects cognitiveskills, which is.
I don't know if they know themechanism, but it seems to be
true.
Chris Ladd (42:50):
Yeah, yeah yeah, yeah, I mean, aside from just
the skeletal benefits, right,and you know, balance benefits.
You don't fall when you're 70and break your hip.
That's true, yeah, but skeletal, yeah, but there is a tie and I
don't.
Yeah, we probably listen to thesame podcasts on this.
We probably have.
Matt Waller (43:07):
I listened to Peter Atia and, of course, andrew
Huberman.
Have you ever listened toHuberman?
Chris Ladd (43:12):
Of course, yeah, yeah yeah, yeah, so yeah, for me
that's been a bit of a godsend.
You know, I really onlydiscovered it maybe over the
last, like I went to businessschool a while ago, but like the
last five, six years, likeactually taking that to heart,
and it's made a dramatic changein my own efficiency, my
(43:33):
performance, right, but not justat work, also outside of work
too, because you have the energyto do more.
Matt Waller (43:40):
Yes, I think Huberman may be having a bigger
impact on our country thananyone.
Yeah, you know, yeah, and youknow some of the things he talks
about too, include making sureyou get sleep, and I have a word
of ram just to make sure I'm agood guy.
Yeah, yeah, but you can see,you know, are you getting enough
REM, mm-hmm.
(44:01):
Are you getting enough deepsleep?
Are you getting enough totalsleep?
Right, right, you know yourheart rate variability and you
know and again, I think when Italk to people, I run into
people all the time at the gymwho have listened to Huberman
and they've you can tell who hasbecause they're getting in dry
(44:24):
heat saunas more frequently.
They're getting in the coldplunge.
When I see people in the coldplunge, I think there's probably
a 50% probability they'velistened to Huberman, but you
know.
And then the other thing herecommends is early in the day,
getting sunlight and ice, and itreally does seem to make a
(44:46):
difference.
Chris Ladd (44:47):
That's one thing I haven't adopted yet is the.
I think he said he wakes uparound like 6.30 every day, like
the first thing he does.
He doesn't go to the coffee potand drink coffee.
He goes and you know, startsthe cycle right, Getting out in
the sun for 15, 20 minutes,circuiting rhythm, and then he
gets coffee right.
You know and so it's yeah, Ihaven't done that yet my wife
(45:10):
has and she's yeah, it's workingfor her.
Sometimes I like heat.
Today, I don't know about heat,it's 100 degrees.
Matt Waller (45:18):
Well, you know, but this, this is really a good
point, even though it's at theend of the podcast and we've
talked about all kinds of things, but sometimes there's
mediating and moderatingvariables that affect everything
else a lot.
And, and I do think, strengthtraining, cardio, sleep.
(45:45):
Actually, you know he takes thesaunas, the dry heat saunas.
I believe that you know if you,if you do it 10 to 20 minutes a
day and the heat level is atleast at 175 Fahrenheit, if you
do it like three days a week, itreduces your probability of
(46:08):
dying of cardiovascular diseasein any year by like 45% and it
goes up from there.
It goes up really high if youdo it every day.
But the other thing, the coldplunge.
You know the Blake Street House, which I'm a member, at
Bentonville, they got a coldplunge.
It doesn't tend to be very coldlater than they have.
(46:29):
If you get there early in themorning it can be pretty cold
and if you get in there for afew minutes it increases your
focus the rest of it.
Have you tried?
Chris Ladd (46:41):
it yet I haven't.
No, it's one of the things Ihaven't done.
But you know hebermansupplement lists, you know very
strict adherence to that andmaking sure I'm getting, you
know, enough sleep and workingout.
It's kind of a mix between likea tea and heberman.
Terms of like, you know theydiffer a little bit but a tea is
(47:03):
actually hard, like when you'retraveling a lot and you know to
get four hours of zone two, youknow.
And then do all the balancetraining and the VO2 max and you
know.
But as long as you'reincorporating, I think, a lot of
that, you know not everythingall the time, but you know as
much as you can.
It's almost impossible ifyou're you know, I mean you
travel a lot, if you're goingabroad or whatever.
Matt Waller (47:24):
It's really hard to maintain that especially when
you're here, but as much as youcan, I think it's you know, when
I'm traveling now, I actuallymake sure I prefer not stay at a
hotel that doesn't have a goodgym.
If they don't have a good gymthen I look on a map to see if
there's a gym I can go to.
You know close by.
And it's funny, I would neverthought that that would be so
(47:46):
important.
But, as you mentioned, thatadvice your professor gave you
is tremendous and I give thatadvice to students as well.
Another thing and the otherthing is you know, some students
don't sleep enough.
I know we have an executive MBAprogram and the average number
(48:10):
of years of experience in thatprogram is like 13.
And a few years ago I spoke tothe incoming class of the MBA
students and I said you know,make sure you sleep because
they're working, they've got bigjobs some of them, and I
actually, just to for effect, Irode into the building on my
(48:32):
bike.
I'd ridden the bike to work andactually rode into the
classroom.
All the MBA students were thereand it was to make a point.
You know, hey, you need to.
It's great you're learning, butyou've got to do some other
things.
And right, it turns out therewas a physician in there,
because his name's Eric's band.
He just graduated about my ageand he was so thrilled he says I
(48:59):
couldn't believe you said that,but it's so true.
And I think as you get older,if you're not sleeping enough it
will impair your cognitiveskills.
Chris Ladd (49:09):
Yeah, I'm trying to recall a study I read.
But if you don't get enoughsleep, it has the highest
correlation to cancer, right?
And other diseases too, right?
So you know memory loss andthings like that.
But if you don't sleep and letyour body recover enough, then
it doesn't matter how much youwork out or what you eat it's, I
(49:31):
mean, certainly that helpsoffset, but eventually a lot of
lack of sleep catches up withit's funny.
Matt Waller (49:38):
When I was in graduate school, I thought I had
read that you can trainyourself to sleep less.
Now, this is a long time ago 35years ago and so I would.
I was trying to train myself tosleep five hours a night.
I did it all through graduateschool, but I don't think it was
good for me.
Chris Ladd (49:58):
Probably not, but I didn't know it.
Matt Waller (50:00):
You know, thankfully we've got so much
information out there.
If you want, you can reallyimprove.
Well, Chris, it's been a realpleasure.
I love it.
I'm busy with you.
Thank you so much for takingtime.
Thank you, If you're findingvalue in this podcast.
We greatly appreciate yoursupport by subscribing to our
YouTube channel.
(50:21):
Additionally, following us onApple and Spotify and leaving up
to a five-store review would beimmensely helpful.
We welcome any feedback orquestions related to the podcast
, as well as suggestions forfurther topics and guests.
Please also take a moment tocheck out our podcast sponsors,
(50:46):
as they play a critical role inkeeping this podcast running.
For more information onspecific topics, timestamps or
links to articles mentionedduring the podcast, head over to
matwallerpodcastcom.
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