June 9, 2025 • 27 mins
This episode originally aired in June 2024, and we hope you enjoy it again as a Second Listen this year! Be sure to check out HOPE's social media or research in your own community for local Juneteenth events you can plan to be a part of!
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Original Show Notes:
On this week's episode, members of HOPE's Racial Justice Team - Betty Joynes and Lori Chewkanes - return to the podcast to help us learn the history behind the upcoming Juneteenth holiday on June 19. They offer to us personal reflections and also encouraging ways we as individuals and a faith community can honor, celebrate, and grow in not only the marking of this holiday, but in our every day lives as well. See notes below for local Juneteenth events and helpful resources!
NOTES & RESOURCES:
- Learn more about Juneteenth: https://nmaahc.si.edu/juneteenth-digital-toolkit
- Looking for a great kids book? Try this one! https://a.co/d/49ZY519
- The Opal Lee Walk: https://opalswalkdallastx.raceroster.com/
- Get involved with HOPE's Racial Justice Team! Email us at podcast@meethope.org for more info.
Thanks for being a part of the HOPE community as we continue conversations about faith and hope! You can learn more at meethope.org or find us on socials @meethopechurch. Join in for worship on Sundays at meethope.online.church! Have a question? Contact us at podcast@meethope.org.
Enjoy what you heard? Be sure to rate us on Apple Podcasts and click the subscribe button so you don't miss new episodes every Monday!
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hello Hope Podcast listeners.
We live in a fast-paced worldwhere new material and ideas are
thrown at you 24-7.
Some of you told us this andsaid I want to listen to
everything, but it's hard tocatch up.
Well, we're here to help.
We desire to be a place that isgrateful for and respectful of
your precious time, and so toserve you best, we will every so
(00:20):
often be resharing pastepisodes that we call Second
Listen, where we encourage youto take a second to listen to an
old episode we think is stillrelevant today.
Even if you are an every weeklistener, we think having a
second listen to these episodeswill make an impact on your
weekend life, and if you haveheard this one but are behind on
new episodes, now is a greattime to catch up on any others
(00:43):
you have missed.
This week is an episode aboutcelebrating Juneteenth that
we've released around the sametime last year.
Be sure to check out Hope'ssocial media for information
about local community Juneteenthcelebrations you can be a part
of or research what's happeningin your own community so you can
participate.
Thank you, and here we go soyou can participate, Thank you.
Speaker 2 (01:26):
And here we go can lead to a growing influence in
our community and our world forthe sake of others.
Speaker 1 (01:31):
Welcome to Hope.
Hi everyone, welcome to theMeet Hope podcast.
My name is Ashley Black and I'mexcited to be here with you
today.
Joining me today on our podcastis Betty Joins and Lori
Chou-Kaines, who have previouslyjoined us on our podcast.
Hi, betty and Lori.
Hi, how are you doing today?
Good, good, I'm so glad you'rehere.
So, if our listeners don't knowyou, you were on episodes 66
(01:55):
and 67 with us, which werecalled Courageous Conversations
About Race, and the last timethat you were on the podcast,
you shared about a study thatthe lead team had done around
the sin of racism, and then thatwas kind of the outline for our
podcast.
But I realized that when we didthat podcast we didn't really
take the time to talk much aboutwhat that came out of or what
(02:20):
that has led to, and so part ofthat is that you both are part
of the racial justice team hereat Hope, right, and so I was
wondering if you would eachshare a little bit about it,
about what that is and why youare a part of it.
Speaker 3 (02:34):
So our team, our racial justice team, really
started as a sub team of Hope'slead team.
We were exploring the questionwhat can Hope Church do to end
the sin of racism?
And that is a good question anda big question.
So it's also I was happy toserve and continue to be happy
(02:55):
to serve with this particularsub-team because that's a
question that's been on my heartpersonally for a while.
I believe that God calls us inthe Bible over and over to seek
social justice, to take action,and I see this issue of racism
(03:15):
as maybe one of the most, maybethe most important issue in
America.
So it's been a joy to servewith Betty and with Jamie and
with Lauren two other members ofthe team and basically we're
now looking for opportunitiesthroughout the church to have
conversations about race andthen to come together and take
(03:40):
action and take action.
Speaker 4 (03:49):
I'm currently serving on lead team and I'm also as
part of the team.
I'm also on staff parish and,of course, on the racial justice
team.
We've done a lot of courageousconversations and we're
continuing to do so, and thenpart of my role would then be to
go back to lead team and sharewith them what we have been
doing, to get their input andtheir suggestions, and also to
(04:12):
encourage them to do some of thetraining along with us.
Speaker 1 (04:17):
I love that.
I love that.
So I love that this kind ofbegan with some members of lead
team and has since grown out ofthat and is becoming maybe part
of more of our larger communityhere at Hope and Betty, you're
kind of a liaison now betweenthe two.
I love that, and so somethingthat has come out of that is
that you both were a part of abook club here at Hope.
(04:39):
You are a part of a book club,it's not?
Speaker 3 (04:41):
over.
It's still going on, right.
Speaker 1 (04:46):
And that book club is called the Seek Justice Book
Club, correct?
Speaker 3 (04:48):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (04:49):
And so how has it been going?
Tell us about the book club.
What have you read?
What have you learned?
Share with us.
Speaker 3 (04:56):
The book club was the idea of one of our racial
justice team members, laurenGrace Bond, and it's actually.
She had that on her heart for awhile and when she realized we
had a racial justice team hereat Hope, she approached us and
said can I facilitate a bookclub?
And we said yes, and we'll alsoask you to join the team, just
(05:18):
full of so many good ideas.
So over four months in thespring we read four different
books on the topic of justice,and one is Generous Justice by
Pastor Timothy Keller.
That was really an introductionand a walk through the Bible.
And then Just Mercy by BryanStevenson, which was a look at
(05:41):
poverty and the criminal justicesystem, and how to Be an
Antiracist by Dr Ibram X Kendi,and that was an in-depth study
of slavery, the history ofslavery, and then racism in
America today.
And then the book we've justcompleted was the Sum of Us by
Heather McGee, which for me Isee as a book of hope for the
(06:03):
future.
Yeah, it was well attended.
We had incredible conversations.
Everyone came willing to speak,to listen.
They wanted to talk about raceand racism, and I think that's
true of Americans more broadly.
They want to know about it andthey want to know how to
(06:24):
eliminate it.
Speaker 4 (06:26):
And Lori and I both were participants.
So, even though we were on theteam, we were there to just
participate in the courageousconversations.
Speaker 1 (06:35):
And.
Speaker 4 (06:35):
I thought that it went really well and people were
open to share, to ask questionsand to talk about what they can
do next.
Speaker 1 (06:46):
Yeah, I'm so, I'm so glad that it's been going well.
I love that.
You just said that, betty, thatit you're not there to like
stand in front of others and andjust talk at them or even
facilitate that.
It's a.
It's a dialogue betweeneveryone in a conversation.
Anyone that is there is it'spart of the conversation, and I
love that there's this safespace that you've created to do
(07:06):
that for people that are wantingto do that.
I think sometimes I would saythat many people that I talk to
it's um, it's something we allwant to talk about and sometimes
finding the place to startdoing it, and so I love that
this exists, and so if anybodyis listening and is interested
in it and they can reach out tous and we can point them toward
you to come to book club, and sothose are some things that the
(07:31):
team has been doing, and oneother thing that we had talked
about that was what we're goingto do today on the podcast is
we're always trying to find waysto help our community grow,
grow and learn and be moreeducated around the topic of
racial justice and our history,and so today we're going to talk
about Juneteenth, which is aholiday that is coming up on
(07:53):
June 19th, and so I waswondering we're going to kind of
start with the backgroundhistory of the holiday.
I think, betty, you're going tostart us off with that.
Speaker 4 (08:02):
Yes, so Juneteenth is also known as Emancipation Day
or Freedom Day.
It's celebrated annually onJune 19th to commemorate the
emancipation of enslaved AfricanAmericans in the United States.
The Emancipation Proclamationissued by President Abraham
Lincoln on January 1st 1863,declared freedom for enslaved
(08:28):
people in Confederate states.
However, it took over two yearsfor the news to reach enslaved
African Americans in Galveston,Texas.
On June 19, 1865, Union GeneralGorton Granger arrived in
Galveston and announced the endof slavery, effectively
(08:49):
emancipating the remainingenslaved individuals in Texas.
This momentous event becameknown as Juneteenth, a
combination of June and 19th.
Speaker 1 (09:01):
Tell us more about how Juneteenth went from this
first finding out about freedomto when it first happened, to
how it became something that ismarked as a holiday every year.
Speaker 4 (09:16):
Opal Lee, known as the grandmother of Juneteenth,
dedicated her life to raisingawareness about the holiday and
its historical significance byembarking on a mission to make
Juneteenth a nationallyrecognized holiday, walking
symbolically from her home inFort Worth, texas, to Washington
(09:38):
DC in 2016, at age 89, todeliver a petition to the White
House.
Speaker 1 (09:45):
So I was so excited by this that you shared this
with me before we when we wereputting this podcast together,
betty, just because my mind wasblown by this woman that at 89,
did this walk and the firstthing that came to my mind was
like, well, how far is thatright?
So this morning, before werecorded, I looked up like how
far does it from Fort Worth,texas, to Washington DC?
(10:08):
I put it into Google Maps andGoogle Maps told me that it
would take me 19 hours and 53minutes to drive there, let
alone to walk.
There would take 511 hours or21 days, and that is a distance
of 1400 miles.
And I also learned that everyyear the african american museum
(10:28):
of dallas does a 2.5 mile walkto recognize the two and a half
years it took for the news offreedom to reach the enslaved
people of texas.
Um, and part of that like aplace where I read that was that
it's called the Opal Lee.
Walk in it and you get to youwalk with Opal Lee that she is
(10:48):
now 97 years old and she doesthis walk every year as a way of
continuing to advocate for thisholiday.
And I just was so moved bysomeone's persistence in
promoting freedom and good, evenat 97, it made me feel like,
okay, still got a lot to do.
I can still do that when I'm 97, you know so.
(11:11):
And she looks wonderful.
Yes, she looks great.
Yes, she does, and so she, asyou shared, has been advocating
for this for a long time.
But when did Juneteenth becomean official federal holiday?
Speaker 4 (11:27):
Okay.
Juneteenth had gainedincreasing recognition and
support at both the local andnational levels before it became
a national holiday.
In 2021,.
Juneteenth was officiallydeclared a federal holiday in
the United States.
Juneteenth is an occasion tohonor the past, address present
(11:49):
challenges and strive for a moreinclusive and equitable future.
It stands as a momentouscelebration of freedom and
resilience of the AfricanAmerican community.
Speaker 1 (12:02):
And with a holiday like this, I think it's so
important not to just know thehistory that you guys have both
just shared with us, but alsoit's an opportunity for us to
continue to educate ourselves.
Speaker 4 (12:12):
Yes, it offers an opportunity to educate and raise
awareness about the history ofslavery, the struggles endured
by African Americans and theongoing fight against systemic
racism.
Juneteenth empowers individualsto engage in conversations,
advocate for equality and worktowards creating a more just
(12:36):
society.
It has become an occasion tohonor our ancestors, recognize
their sacrifices and celebratethe achievements and
contributions of Black Americansto our nation.
Speaker 1 (12:49):
Betty, you had mentioned when we were talking
that you one of your passions iseducating others about
accomplishments of BlackAmericans, and so I was
wondering you had shared alittle bit with me about there's
some kids books that you likeor you want to say more about
that.
Speaker 4 (13:06):
Yes, there are some wonderful children's books, and
one of the ones that stood outto me is the one called ABCs of
Juneteenth, and the bookactually teaches children how to
learn their ABCs, but then theyapply those alphabets to
Juneteenth terms.
Speaker 1 (13:25):
I love that.
Speaker 4 (13:26):
And it's for children of all ages, and so if you have
young children, check out thatbook.
And then there are also booksthat generally elementary,
middle school, that talks aboutthe history, but in a child's
language, so that theyunderstand what the holiday
really means and what thebackground is for it.
Speaker 1 (13:49):
Yeah, I love things like that.
Just as a parent, I lovegetting to do things like that
with my son, because I learnalso while I'm reading these
things with him, like if I wereto read the ABC's book right,
like it's not just teaching mykid language, but it's teaching
me language.
And something that I love aboutthat is what I love for him is
(14:11):
that my hope is that thesethings become part of his
language now, at such a youngage where, for me, I feel like
I'm playing catch up sometimesof trying to learn now, at 35,
these things to be part of myeveryday conversations.
So I love that.
So we've talked a lot about thefacts of the holiday, the
history of the holiday, waysthat we honor it, what it means,
(14:34):
but I was also wondering ifeach of you would be willing to
share some personal reflectionsof either what it has meant to
you to learn about this holidayor what it means to celebrate it
Just anything on a personallevel.
Speaker 3 (14:50):
I think for me, learning about Juneteenth as we
prepared to talk about it was apersonal education.
I didn't learn about Juneteenthin school.
We didn't have Juneteenthcelebrations when I was growing
up, and this just highlightedfor me the fact that you know
history is most often told bythe people who are in charge of
(15:12):
telling it, the people who havethe power to tell it, and so for
most of American history that'sbeen white people.
But it makes me happy that youknow, fast forwarding.
Now I can learn about thesethings.
These things are so importantfor us to know.
This is American history.
They're not just black history,and I can now look at it and
(15:35):
see not just the deep sorrowexperienced as a result of
slavery but the joy and hopethat comes from these
celebrations.
Speaker 4 (15:45):
And for some of us, including myself, we were not
taught about Juneteenth.
We didn't hear about it, wedidn't celebrate it.
I'm from a very small communityin Alabama and community so
small that you can count thenumber of people and we never
heard anything about this.
(16:06):
And so then we moved to NewYork and then to New Jersey and
during all of that time I knewnothing about Juneteenth until
recently and, I would probablysay, when it became a national
holiday.
And so now, of course that we doknow and we've done our
homework and we continue toresearch it and find out where
the activities are.
(16:27):
We're going to participate inthe activities and we're also
going to start including it aspart of our own family
celebrations right in thebackyard with, you know, the
barbecue and family discussionsand all of those things, and
we're really excited to knowabout that.
So, even though I have a slightbit of sadness within me that I
(16:49):
didn't know until now, it'snever too late.
So I'm embracing it and we'resharing it with others and we're
hoping that those of you whoare like me, who did not know
that, you're happy to know itnow.
And now we're going to become apart of celebrating and
reminding ourselves of thestruggles of our ancestors and
(17:09):
all that they did to get uswhere we are today, and that we
still have much work to do.
Speaker 3 (17:15):
I had a conversation yesterday with a dear friend and
if not for looking at thisissue and preparing for the
podcast, I wouldn't have broughtit up.
But I asked Barbara, who grewup in Philadelphia and spent
most of her career in New York,do you know about it?
And she didn't.
She had no idea.
(17:35):
I said but didn't your dad comefrom the South?
I mean, didn't he come fromNorth Carolina?
And he did, but the same thing.
It wasn't something.
But now she's excited tocelebrate it.
So we'll just continue to spreadthe word yeah, no, I love.
Speaker 1 (17:49):
I love that you shared.
You know, there's obviouslylike a grief there of I didn't
know this, that I couldcelebrate this, and then how
that also propels someoneforward to to, to, to, to, to,
to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to,to, to, to, to.
Then let others know and sothat we everyone can be
celebrating, um, and that kindof that kind of touches on what
you both said about that.
There are, you know, maybe somemisconceptions around the
(18:11):
holiday, like you said, laurie,that you just assumed that your
friend knew about it andcelebrated it.
Right.
And so you know, as with somuch of black history,
unfortunately, we know that as asociety we have missed the mark
and, as we've already talkedabout, that often those in power
and with privilege are the onesthat tell our history and tell
our stories, whether or not itis the correct story, and so it
(18:32):
matters to recognize and correctthose misconceptions wherever
we can.
And so I know you both have afew myths and misconceptions to
share with us about how we maybeget this wrong.
Speaker 3 (18:43):
Well, I was reading an article in the New York Times
and a gentleman named SamCollins, an African-American who
has spent his entire life inGalveston, texas, and who is the
co-chair and president of thenonprofit group the Juneteenth
Legacy Project, and he sharedwhat he thought was a
misconception about Juneteenth,and I'll quote him Juneteenth
(19:05):
was recognized as a stateholiday in 1980 in Texas, but
our families have beencelebrating Juneteenth since
1866.
I think what is so often lostis the story of the ancestors
and elders that kept thishistory going by acknowledging
the day even when the largersociety wouldn't acknowledge it.
Juneteenth didn't becomeimportant because it became a
(19:27):
national holiday, and it didn'tbecome important in 2020 after
the unfortunate murder of GeorgeFloyd.
It has always been important tothe former enslaved and their
descendants, and that justreally resonated with me that we
can't forget the people wholived this story.
Speaker 4 (19:46):
Yes, and I would like to add that, though the holiday
is marked by various activitiessuch as parades, picnics,
musical performances, historicalreenactments, educational
events fostering a sense ofcommunity unity and pride,
(20:07):
events fostering a sense ofcommunity unity and pride, but
Juneteenth is also a reminder ofthe strength, the trauma and
the sacrifices that ourancestors endured.
So we want to honor the legacyof our ancestors, we want to
look at the cultural richnessand the resilience of the
African American community, butwe still have a long way to go
(20:31):
in achieving true freedom andequality and social justice.
So we, as Lori and I have saidin many of our talks and
presentations with others, thisis just the beginning and we
want to ask you what actionswill you take?
What will you do?
And it can be something verysmall, it doesn't have to be
(20:54):
something enormous, but just getstarted.
And so that's where we are.
Speaker 1 (20:59):
Yeah, no, I love.
I mean, I love that you saythat, betty, because I know and
we talked about, we'll share inour show notes that there are
lots of in our local communityin South Jersey.
There is a lot of differentevents going on and, lori, you
had mentioned to me that theCourier Post had a list, and so
we'll share all those in ourshow notes.
If people are looking for waysto go out and to celebrate, for
(21:27):
ways to go out and to celebrate,and also if that feels not
possible or feels maybeoverwhelming to have to go out
and do things that I know, betty, you had before we had recorded
, you had been kind of talkingwith me about even the small
things you can do, like cookinga meal while you're cooking a
meal, or do you want to say moreabout that?
Like, what are the small thingsyou can also do?
Speaker 4 (21:43):
Yes, so I'm saying that especially on Juneteenth,
but any other day actually.
Yeah, you can, you know, add toyour meal an African-American
food, have your childrenparticipate in preparing that
with you, and you can talk aboutwhat the food is or what that
meal includes, and so on.
(22:04):
So there are all kinds of smallways that you can begin to talk
about Juneteenth, celebrateJuneteenth with your children,
with your family, and so, also,while you're cooking or at any
other time, you can play music,and Ashley has a couple of, I
did so when we were talkingabout this podcast.
Speaker 1 (22:24):
You all, um, you brought a lot to it, and the
thing that I was able to bringwas I had said that there's a
really moving worship album, Ithink, by the band maverick city
, called jubilee, juneteenthedition.
That came out in 2021, and I umpersonally, have learned so
much from it.
I feel like I learn a lotthrough music and through
artists, and so I just wanted toinclude that as another tool to
(22:50):
grow and to learn and toimmerse yourself in this type of
celebration.
There's also another album thatcame to mind by a group called
the Porter's Gate, calledJustice Songs, and that one is
not only Juneteenth specific but, like you said, it's not just
something you can do on June19th, it is something you can do
any day of the year and at anytime, and so those were two that
(23:11):
came to mind, and I know, in asimilar way, we're talking about
different artists.
There's a poet named AmandaGorman that you have a quote by
her that you wanted to share.
Speaker 3 (23:23):
Yes, yes, you have a quote by her that you wanted to
share, yes, yes.
So Amanda Gorman, in reflectingon Juneteenth, in an interview
on NPR in 2022, said we arecelebrating African-American
liberty, but a liberty that hastypically come delayed, a
liberty that was not promised,but something that we
continually have to fight for,including today.
(23:44):
Enjoy some foods, eithercelebrate at home with family or
go out to an event, but thenremember that this is not
promised.
Speaker 1 (24:03):
We must continue to preserve the history and to take
next steps.
Yeah, I love that.
The words that you just used,laurie, so like, this is not
promised, but that there is.
Like, as you know, this is thepodcast is we talk about is a
conversation about hope andfaith, and for me, this is
really a conversation about hopeand faith, but hope that we can
keep having hope, that thatfreedom and justice and equality
(24:24):
for everyone is is possible.
And so, as we close out, isthere anything else that you
want to share?
Speaker 4 (24:31):
It's that we recognize that most people are
very busy with their schedules,their lives and so many things
going on, but these kinds ofthings can be just small steps,
and we believe in at leasttaking a small step.
So that's why we wererecommending that some of the
ideas that we had about you know, cooking, of food, but also
(24:54):
remember that you can read abook to your children, choose a
book about African Americans orhow really we're we're alike in
so many ways that maybe we don'teven consider, and so just
share those things with eachother while you're sitting
around the table or sitting onyour sofas.
If you're going to watch amovie, choose one that has
(25:19):
African-Americans in it.
It doesn't have to be totallyAfrican-American, but that
they're participating and justliving whatever.
So just normal everyday things,get started and just before you
know it, you know we're goingto all have wonderful
conversations, getting to knoweach other, and that's what
(25:40):
we've been talking about overtime with our justice team is
that having the conversationsare important, getting to know
the stories of other people, andso on.
Speaker 1 (25:54):
Thank you.
Thank you both for doing thistoday, for helping us to learn
and grow so that we can beindividuals and a community that
seeks to be more like Jesus,which is what it's all about,
right, and so we feel that thesethings line up with that, so
that's why we're talking aboutthem today.
So if anyone listening has anyquestions, feel free to reach
(26:14):
out to us.
You can email us at podcast, atmeethopeorg, and we can point
you to Lori or to Betty or tothe racial justice team, and so,
yeah, just thank you both forbeing on today and encouraging
us in our Juneteenthcelebrations.
Speaker 4 (26:30):
Thank you, Ashley, for having us.
This was wonderful, ashley, itwas great.
Thank you for the opportunity,all right.
Speaker 3 (26:35):
Can't wait to catch up with everyone and find out
what they did for Juneteenth.
Speaker 1 (26:38):
Yeah, yes, please let us know yes.
Speaker 2 (26:55):
Well, until next time , we are the Meet Hope Podcast
and we will see you then.
Find us more at meethopeorg orfind us on socials at
meethopechurch.
Hello Hope Podcast listeners.
We live in a fast-paced worldwhere new material and ideas are
thrown at you 24-7.
Some of you told us this andsaid I want to listen to
everything, but it's hard tocatch up.
Well, we're here to help.
We desire to be a place that isgrateful for and respectful of
your precious time, and so toserve you best, we will every so
(00:20):
often be resharing pastepisodes that we call Second
Listen, where we encourage youto take a second to listen to an
old episode we think is stillrelevant today.
Even if you are an every weeklistener, we think having a
second listen to these episodeswill make an impact on your
weekend life, and if you haveheard this one but are behind on
new episodes, now is a greattime to catch up on any others
(00:43):
you have missed.
This week is an episode aboutcelebrating Juneteenth that
we've released around the sametime last year.
Be sure to check out Hope'ssocial media for information
about local community Juneteenthcelebrations you can be a part
of or research what's happeningin your own community so you can
participate.
Thank you, and here we go soyou can participate, Thank you.
Speaker 2 (01:26):
And here we go can lead to a growing influence in
our community and our world forthe sake of others.
Speaker 1 (01:31):
Welcome to Hope.
Hi everyone, welcome to theMeet Hope podcast.
My name is Ashley Black and I'mexcited to be here with you
today.
Joining me today on our podcastis Betty Joins and Lori
Chou-Kaines, who have previouslyjoined us on our podcast.
Hi, betty and Lori.
Hi, how are you doing today?
Good, good, I'm so glad you'rehere.
So, if our listeners don't knowyou, you were on episodes 66
(01:55):
and 67 with us, which werecalled Courageous Conversations
About Race, and the last timethat you were on the podcast,
you shared about a study thatthe lead team had done around
the sin of racism, and then thatwas kind of the outline for our
podcast.
But I realized that when we didthat podcast we didn't really
take the time to talk much aboutwhat that came out of or what
(02:20):
that has led to, and so part ofthat is that you both are part
of the racial justice team hereat Hope, right, and so I was
wondering if you would eachshare a little bit about it,
about what that is and why youare a part of it.
Speaker 3 (02:34):
So our team, our racial justice team, really
started as a sub team of Hope'slead team.
We were exploring the questionwhat can Hope Church do to end
the sin of racism?
And that is a good question anda big question.
So it's also I was happy toserve and continue to be happy
(02:55):
to serve with this particularsub-team because that's a
question that's been on my heartpersonally for a while.
I believe that God calls us inthe Bible over and over to seek
social justice, to take action,and I see this issue of racism
(03:15):
as maybe one of the most, maybethe most important issue in
America.
So it's been a joy to servewith Betty and with Jamie and
with Lauren two other members ofthe team and basically we're
now looking for opportunitiesthroughout the church to have
conversations about race andthen to come together and take
(03:40):
action and take action.
Speaker 4 (03:49):
I'm currently serving on lead team and I'm also as
part of the team.
I'm also on staff parish and,of course, on the racial justice
team.
We've done a lot of courageousconversations and we're
continuing to do so, and thenpart of my role would then be to
go back to lead team and sharewith them what we have been
doing, to get their input andtheir suggestions, and also to
(04:12):
encourage them to do some of thetraining along with us.
Speaker 1 (04:17):
I love that.
I love that.
So I love that this kind ofbegan with some members of lead
team and has since grown out ofthat and is becoming maybe part
of more of our larger communityhere at Hope and Betty, you're
kind of a liaison now betweenthe two.
I love that, and so somethingthat has come out of that is
that you both were a part of abook club here at Hope.
(04:39):
You are a part of a book club,it's not?
Speaker 3 (04:41):
over.
It's still going on, right.
Speaker 1 (04:46):
And that book club is called the Seek Justice Book
Club, correct?
Speaker 3 (04:48):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (04:49):
And so how has it been going?
Tell us about the book club.
What have you read?
What have you learned?
Share with us.
Speaker 3 (04:56):
The book club was the idea of one of our racial
justice team members, laurenGrace Bond, and it's actually.
She had that on her heart for awhile and when she realized we
had a racial justice team hereat Hope, she approached us and
said can I facilitate a bookclub?
And we said yes, and we'll alsoask you to join the team, just
(05:18):
full of so many good ideas.
So over four months in thespring we read four different
books on the topic of justice,and one is Generous Justice by
Pastor Timothy Keller.
That was really an introductionand a walk through the Bible.
And then Just Mercy by BryanStevenson, which was a look at
(05:41):
poverty and the criminal justicesystem, and how to Be an
Antiracist by Dr Ibram X Kendi,and that was an in-depth study
of slavery, the history ofslavery, and then racism in
America today.
And then the book we've justcompleted was the Sum of Us by
Heather McGee, which for me Isee as a book of hope for the
(06:03):
future.
Yeah, it was well attended.
We had incredible conversations.
Everyone came willing to speak,to listen.
They wanted to talk about raceand racism, and I think that's
true of Americans more broadly.
They want to know about it andthey want to know how to
(06:24):
eliminate it.
Speaker 4 (06:26):
And Lori and I both were participants.
So, even though we were on theteam, we were there to just
participate in the courageousconversations.
Speaker 1 (06:35):
And.
Speaker 4 (06:35):
I thought that it went really well and people were
open to share, to ask questionsand to talk about what they can
do next.
Speaker 1 (06:46):
Yeah, I'm so, I'm so glad that it's been going well.
I love that.
You just said that, betty, thatit you're not there to like
stand in front of others and andjust talk at them or even
facilitate that.
It's a.
It's a dialogue betweeneveryone in a conversation.
Anyone that is there is it'spart of the conversation, and I
love that there's this safespace that you've created to do
(07:06):
that for people that are wantingto do that.
I think sometimes I would saythat many people that I talk to
it's um, it's something we allwant to talk about and sometimes
finding the place to startdoing it, and so I love that
this exists, and so if anybodyis listening and is interested
in it and they can reach out tous and we can point them toward
you to come to book club, and sothose are some things that the
(07:31):
team has been doing, and oneother thing that we had talked
about that was what we're goingto do today on the podcast is
we're always trying to find waysto help our community grow,
grow and learn and be moreeducated around the topic of
racial justice and our history,and so today we're going to talk
about Juneteenth, which is aholiday that is coming up on
(07:53):
June 19th, and so I waswondering we're going to kind of
start with the backgroundhistory of the holiday.
I think, betty, you're going tostart us off with that.
Speaker 4 (08:02):
Yes, so Juneteenth is also known as Emancipation Day
or Freedom Day.
It's celebrated annually onJune 19th to commemorate the
emancipation of enslaved AfricanAmericans in the United States.
The Emancipation Proclamationissued by President Abraham
Lincoln on January 1st 1863,declared freedom for enslaved
(08:28):
people in Confederate states.
However, it took over two yearsfor the news to reach enslaved
African Americans in Galveston,Texas.
On June 19, 1865, Union GeneralGorton Granger arrived in
Galveston and announced the endof slavery, effectively
(08:49):
emancipating the remainingenslaved individuals in Texas.
This momentous event becameknown as Juneteenth, a
combination of June and 19th.
Speaker 1 (09:01):
Tell us more about how Juneteenth went from this
first finding out about freedomto when it first happened, to
how it became something that ismarked as a holiday every year.
Speaker 4 (09:16):
Opal Lee, known as the grandmother of Juneteenth,
dedicated her life to raisingawareness about the holiday and
its historical significance byembarking on a mission to make
Juneteenth a nationallyrecognized holiday, walking
symbolically from her home inFort Worth, texas, to Washington
(09:38):
DC in 2016, at age 89, todeliver a petition to the White
House.
Speaker 1 (09:45):
So I was so excited by this that you shared this
with me before we when we wereputting this podcast together,
betty, just because my mind wasblown by this woman that at 89,
did this walk and the firstthing that came to my mind was
like, well, how far is thatright?
So this morning, before werecorded, I looked up like how
far does it from Fort Worth,texas, to Washington DC?
(10:08):
I put it into Google Maps andGoogle Maps told me that it
would take me 19 hours and 53minutes to drive there, let
alone to walk.
There would take 511 hours or21 days, and that is a distance
of 1400 miles.
And I also learned that everyyear the african american museum
(10:28):
of dallas does a 2.5 mile walkto recognize the two and a half
years it took for the news offreedom to reach the enslaved
people of texas.
Um, and part of that like aplace where I read that was that
it's called the Opal Lee.
Walk in it and you get to youwalk with Opal Lee that she is
(10:48):
now 97 years old and she doesthis walk every year as a way of
continuing to advocate for thisholiday.
And I just was so moved bysomeone's persistence in
promoting freedom and good, evenat 97, it made me feel like,
okay, still got a lot to do.
I can still do that when I'm 97, you know so.
(11:11):
And she looks wonderful.
Yes, she looks great.
Yes, she does, and so she, asyou shared, has been advocating
for this for a long time.
But when did Juneteenth becomean official federal holiday?
Speaker 4 (11:27):
Okay.
Juneteenth had gainedincreasing recognition and
support at both the local andnational levels before it became
a national holiday.
In 2021,.
Juneteenth was officiallydeclared a federal holiday in
the United States.
Juneteenth is an occasion tohonor the past, address present
(11:49):
challenges and strive for a moreinclusive and equitable future.
It stands as a momentouscelebration of freedom and
resilience of the AfricanAmerican community.
Speaker 1 (12:02):
And with a holiday like this, I think it's so
important not to just know thehistory that you guys have both
just shared with us, but alsoit's an opportunity for us to
continue to educate ourselves.
Speaker 4 (12:12):
Yes, it offers an opportunity to educate and raise
awareness about the history ofslavery, the struggles endured
by African Americans and theongoing fight against systemic
racism.
Juneteenth empowers individualsto engage in conversations,
advocate for equality and worktowards creating a more just
(12:36):
society.
It has become an occasion tohonor our ancestors, recognize
their sacrifices and celebratethe achievements and
contributions of Black Americansto our nation.
Speaker 1 (12:49):
Betty, you had mentioned when we were talking
that you one of your passions iseducating others about
accomplishments of BlackAmericans, and so I was
wondering you had shared alittle bit with me about there's
some kids books that you likeor you want to say more about
that.
Speaker 4 (13:06):
Yes, there are some wonderful children's books, and
one of the ones that stood outto me is the one called ABCs of
Juneteenth, and the bookactually teaches children how to
learn their ABCs, but then theyapply those alphabets to
Juneteenth terms.
Speaker 1 (13:25):
I love that.
Speaker 4 (13:26):
And it's for children of all ages, and so if you have
young children, check out thatbook.
And then there are also booksthat generally elementary,
middle school, that talks aboutthe history, but in a child's
language, so that theyunderstand what the holiday
really means and what thebackground is for it.
Speaker 1 (13:49):
Yeah, I love things like that.
Just as a parent, I lovegetting to do things like that
with my son, because I learnalso while I'm reading these
things with him, like if I wereto read the ABC's book right,
like it's not just teaching mykid language, but it's teaching
me language.
And something that I love aboutthat is what I love for him is
(14:11):
that my hope is that thesethings become part of his
language now, at such a youngage where, for me, I feel like
I'm playing catch up sometimesof trying to learn now, at 35,
these things to be part of myeveryday conversations.
So I love that.
So we've talked a lot about thefacts of the holiday, the
history of the holiday, waysthat we honor it, what it means,
(14:34):
but I was also wondering ifeach of you would be willing to
share some personal reflectionsof either what it has meant to
you to learn about this holidayor what it means to celebrate it
Just anything on a personallevel.
Speaker 3 (14:50):
I think for me, learning about Juneteenth as we
prepared to talk about it was apersonal education.
I didn't learn about Juneteenthin school.
We didn't have Juneteenthcelebrations when I was growing
up, and this just highlightedfor me the fact that you know
history is most often told bythe people who are in charge of
(15:12):
telling it, the people who havethe power to tell it, and so for
most of American history that'sbeen white people.
But it makes me happy that youknow, fast forwarding.
Now I can learn about thesethings.
These things are so importantfor us to know.
This is American history.
They're not just black history,and I can now look at it and
(15:35):
see not just the deep sorrowexperienced as a result of
slavery but the joy and hopethat comes from these
celebrations.
Speaker 4 (15:45):
And for some of us, including myself, we were not
taught about Juneteenth.
We didn't hear about it, wedidn't celebrate it.
I'm from a very small communityin Alabama and community so
small that you can count thenumber of people and we never
heard anything about this.
(16:06):
And so then we moved to NewYork and then to New Jersey and
during all of that time I knewnothing about Juneteenth until
recently and, I would probablysay, when it became a national
holiday.
And so now, of course that we doknow and we've done our
homework and we continue toresearch it and find out where
the activities are.
(16:27):
We're going to participate inthe activities and we're also
going to start including it aspart of our own family
celebrations right in thebackyard with, you know, the
barbecue and family discussionsand all of those things, and
we're really excited to knowabout that.
So, even though I have a slightbit of sadness within me that I
(16:49):
didn't know until now, it'snever too late.
So I'm embracing it and we'resharing it with others and we're
hoping that those of you whoare like me, who did not know
that, you're happy to know itnow.
And now we're going to become apart of celebrating and
reminding ourselves of thestruggles of our ancestors and
(17:09):
all that they did to get uswhere we are today, and that we
still have much work to do.
Speaker 3 (17:15):
I had a conversation yesterday with a dear friend and
if not for looking at thisissue and preparing for the
podcast, I wouldn't have broughtit up.
But I asked Barbara, who grewup in Philadelphia and spent
most of her career in New York,do you know about it?
And she didn't.
She had no idea.
(17:35):
I said but didn't your dad comefrom the South?
I mean, didn't he come fromNorth Carolina?
And he did, but the same thing.
It wasn't something.
But now she's excited tocelebrate it.
So we'll just continue to spreadthe word yeah, no, I love.
Speaker 1 (17:49):
I love that you shared.
You know, there's obviouslylike a grief there of I didn't
know this, that I couldcelebrate this, and then how
that also propels someoneforward to to, to, to, to, to,
to, to, to, to, to, to, to, to,to, to, to, to.
Then let others know and sothat we everyone can be
celebrating, um, and that kindof that kind of touches on what
you both said about that.
There are, you know, maybe somemisconceptions around the
(18:11):
holiday, like you said, laurie,that you just assumed that your
friend knew about it andcelebrated it.
Right.
And so you know, as with somuch of black history,
unfortunately, we know that as asociety we have missed the mark
and, as we've already talkedabout, that often those in power
and with privilege are the onesthat tell our history and tell
our stories, whether or not itis the correct story, and so it
(18:32):
matters to recognize and correctthose misconceptions wherever
we can.
And so I know you both have afew myths and misconceptions to
share with us about how we maybeget this wrong.
Speaker 3 (18:43):
Well, I was reading an article in the New York Times
and a gentleman named SamCollins, an African-American who
has spent his entire life inGalveston, texas, and who is the
co-chair and president of thenonprofit group the Juneteenth
Legacy Project, and he sharedwhat he thought was a
misconception about Juneteenth,and I'll quote him Juneteenth
(19:05):
was recognized as a stateholiday in 1980 in Texas, but
our families have beencelebrating Juneteenth since
1866.
I think what is so often lostis the story of the ancestors
and elders that kept thishistory going by acknowledging
the day even when the largersociety wouldn't acknowledge it.
Juneteenth didn't becomeimportant because it became a
(19:27):
national holiday, and it didn'tbecome important in 2020 after
the unfortunate murder of GeorgeFloyd.
It has always been important tothe former enslaved and their
descendants, and that justreally resonated with me that we
can't forget the people wholived this story.
Speaker 4 (19:46):
Yes, and I would like to add that, though the holiday
is marked by various activitiessuch as parades, picnics,
musical performances, historicalreenactments, educational
events fostering a sense ofcommunity unity and pride,
(20:07):
events fostering a sense ofcommunity unity and pride, but
Juneteenth is also a reminder ofthe strength, the trauma and
the sacrifices that ourancestors endured.
So we want to honor the legacyof our ancestors, we want to
look at the cultural richnessand the resilience of the
African American community, butwe still have a long way to go
(20:31):
in achieving true freedom andequality and social justice.
So we, as Lori and I have saidin many of our talks and
presentations with others, thisis just the beginning and we
want to ask you what actionswill you take?
What will you do?
And it can be something verysmall, it doesn't have to be
(20:54):
something enormous, but just getstarted.
And so that's where we are.
Speaker 1 (20:59):
Yeah, no, I love.
I mean, I love that you saythat, betty, because I know and
we talked about, we'll share inour show notes that there are
lots of in our local communityin South Jersey.
There is a lot of differentevents going on and, lori, you
had mentioned to me that theCourier Post had a list, and so
we'll share all those in ourshow notes.
If people are looking for waysto go out and to celebrate, for
(21:27):
ways to go out and to celebrate,and also if that feels not
possible or feels maybeoverwhelming to have to go out
and do things that I know, betty, you had before we had recorded
, you had been kind of talkingwith me about even the small
things you can do, like cookinga meal while you're cooking a
meal, or do you want to say moreabout that?
Like, what are the small thingsyou can also do?
Speaker 4 (21:43):
Yes, so I'm saying that especially on Juneteenth,
but any other day actually.
Yeah, you can, you know, add toyour meal an African-American
food, have your childrenparticipate in preparing that
with you, and you can talk aboutwhat the food is or what that
meal includes, and so on.
(22:04):
So there are all kinds of smallways that you can begin to talk
about Juneteenth, celebrateJuneteenth with your children,
with your family, and so, also,while you're cooking or at any
other time, you can play music,and Ashley has a couple of, I
did so when we were talkingabout this podcast.
Speaker 1 (22:24):
You all, um, you brought a lot to it, and the
thing that I was able to bringwas I had said that there's a
really moving worship album, Ithink, by the band maverick city
, called jubilee, juneteenthedition.
That came out in 2021, and I umpersonally, have learned so
much from it.
I feel like I learn a lotthrough music and through
artists, and so I just wanted toinclude that as another tool to
(22:50):
grow and to learn and toimmerse yourself in this type of
celebration.
There's also another album thatcame to mind by a group called
the Porter's Gate, calledJustice Songs, and that one is
not only Juneteenth specific but, like you said, it's not just
something you can do on June19th, it is something you can do
any day of the year and at anytime, and so those were two that
(23:11):
came to mind, and I know, in asimilar way, we're talking about
different artists.
There's a poet named AmandaGorman that you have a quote by
her that you wanted to share.
Speaker 3 (23:23):
Yes, yes, you have a quote by her that you wanted to
share, yes, yes.
So Amanda Gorman, in reflectingon Juneteenth, in an interview
on NPR in 2022, said we arecelebrating African-American
liberty, but a liberty that hastypically come delayed, a
liberty that was not promised,but something that we
continually have to fight for,including today.
(23:44):
Enjoy some foods, eithercelebrate at home with family or
go out to an event, but thenremember that this is not
promised.
Speaker 1 (24:03):
We must continue to preserve the history and to take
next steps.
Yeah, I love that.
The words that you just used,laurie, so like, this is not
promised, but that there is.
Like, as you know, this is thepodcast is we talk about is a
conversation about hope andfaith, and for me, this is
really a conversation about hopeand faith, but hope that we can
keep having hope, that thatfreedom and justice and equality
(24:24):
for everyone is is possible.
And so, as we close out, isthere anything else that you
want to share?
Speaker 4 (24:31):
It's that we recognize that most people are
very busy with their schedules,their lives and so many things
going on, but these kinds ofthings can be just small steps,
and we believe in at leasttaking a small step.
So that's why we wererecommending that some of the
ideas that we had about you know, cooking, of food, but also
(24:54):
remember that you can read abook to your children, choose a
book about African Americans orhow really we're we're alike in
so many ways that maybe we don'teven consider, and so just
share those things with eachother while you're sitting
around the table or sitting onyour sofas.
If you're going to watch amovie, choose one that has
(25:19):
African-Americans in it.
It doesn't have to be totallyAfrican-American, but that
they're participating and justliving whatever.
So just normal everyday things,get started and just before you
know it, you know we're goingto all have wonderful
conversations, getting to knoweach other, and that's what
(25:40):
we've been talking about overtime with our justice team is
that having the conversationsare important, getting to know
the stories of other people, andso on.
Speaker 1 (25:54):
Thank you.
Thank you both for doing thistoday, for helping us to learn
and grow so that we can beindividuals and a community that
seeks to be more like Jesus,which is what it's all about,
right, and so we feel that thesethings line up with that, so
that's why we're talking aboutthem today.
So if anyone listening has anyquestions, feel free to reach
(26:14):
out to us.
You can email us at podcast, atmeethopeorg, and we can point
you to Lori or to Betty or tothe racial justice team, and so,
yeah, just thank you both forbeing on today and encouraging
us in our Juneteenthcelebrations.
Speaker 4 (26:30):
Thank you, Ashley, for having us.
This was wonderful, ashley, itwas great.
Thank you for the opportunity,all right.
Speaker 3 (26:35):
Can't wait to catch up with everyone and find out
what they did for Juneteenth.
Speaker 1 (26:38):
Yeah, yes, please let us know yes.
Speaker 2 (26:55):
Well, until next time , we are the Meet Hope Podcast
and we will see you then.
Find us more at meethopeorg orfind us on socials at
meethopechurch.
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