Menopause isn't just your mother's journey anymore. Today's conversation with Lauren Tenenbaum, author of the upcoming book "Millennial Menopause: Preparing for Perimenopause, Menopause, and Life's Next Period," challenges everything you thought you knew about this life transition.
Did you know perimenopause symptoms can start in your 30s? Despite being well-read and passionate about women's health, Lauren found herself at 39 realizing she knew nothing about the next phase of her reproductive and mental health journey. This knowledge gap drove her to create what she describes as "the compassionate guide that every woman in her 30s and 40s needs" for navigating this significant life transition.
Our discussion tackles persistent myths that continue to impact women's health decisions, particularly around hormone therapy. Lauren brings her unique perspective as both a licensed social worker and former lawyer to address the intersectionality of ageism, gender, and healthcare access. We explore how millennial women are approaching menopause differently than previous generations – breaking taboos, demanding better care, and rewriting cultural narratives around aging.
The conversation offers practical takeaways for listeners at any stage: building your healthcare team before symptoms start, advocating effectively in medical settings and workplaces, finding community support, and embracing aging as "a privilege, not something gross." Lauren's mother's advice resonates throughout: "If you don't ask, you won't get."
Whether you're experiencing symptoms now, supporting someone who is, or simply planning ahead, this episode provides the knowledge and empowerment to approach menopause with confidence. Pre-order Lauren's book (available July 15th) and join the conversation that's finally getting the attention it deserves.
Lauren A. Tetenbaum, LCSW, JD, PMH-C is an advocate and therapist who supports millennial and young women through life transitions. She specializes in professional and personal identity shifts, including the perinatal period and perimenopause. Lauren is the go-to resource for women seeking counsel, empowerment, and connection.
Lauren’s website: https://thecounselaur.com/
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Email Us: info@midovia.com
MiDOViA is dedicated to changing the narrative about menopause by educating, raising awareness & supporting women in this stage of life, both at home and in the workplace. Visit midovia.com to learn more.
The information, including but not limited to, text, graphics, images & other material contained on this website are for informational purposes only. No material on this site is intended to be a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis or treatment.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to the MiDOViA Menopause Podcast, your
trusted source for informationabout menopause and midlife.
Join us each episode, as wehave great conversations with
great people.
Tune in and enjoy the show.
Speaker 2 (00:15):
Hi everyone and welcome.
Today we're getting real abouta topic that's finally getting
the attention it deservesmenopause.
But not just menopause, butmillennial menopause.
Yeah, you heard that right.
We have a special guest, LaurenTenenbaum, author of an
upcoming book called MillennialMenopause Preparing for
(00:37):
Perimenopause, menopause andLife's Next Period.
I like that.
Lauren is a licensed socialworker, a former lawyer, a mom
of two and an outspoken advocatefor women's wellness and
empowerment.
She brings empathy, humor anddeep insight into what this next
chapter looks like for thegeneration that's rewriting the
(01:00):
narrative on aging and health.
Thank goodness, welcome, lauren.
Speaker 3 (01:04):
Thank you so much for having me.
I'm so happy to be here.
Speaker 2 (01:07):
Yeah, we're finally happy to have you too.
So your book's not out yet.
How would you describeMillennial Menopause in one
sentence?
Speaker 3 (01:16):
It comes out July 15th and it is available for
pre-order already, and I woulddescribe it as the compassionate
guide to the next phase of lifethat every woman in her 30s and
40s needs.
Speaker 2 (01:31):
And what inspired you to write it.
Did something happen in yourpersonal life that sparked it?
Or your friends or family?
What inspired you to write thisbook?
There's a gap.
This doesn't this.
This book is filling a gap thathasn't been filled, so how'd
you get?
Speaker 3 (01:44):
that was really the motivation.
I realized that I was 39 lastyear and I knew nothing about
the next phase of life, ofhealth, of my reproductive
health, my mental health and I'mvery well read and very in tune
and very much, always anadvocate for women's health and
I didn't know anything aboutmenopause.
(02:07):
And I went to an event.
I met Anne Fullenweider, whoco-founded Alloy.
The way she spoke about thegaps in care and the way that
the other women in the room wereso passionate about educating
others, I said well, okay, atleast it's not just me who
doesn't know, but I think it isup to me to spread the word.
(02:28):
And so I started writing andresearching and it led to the
book.
Speaker 2 (02:33):
I know Anne's pretty inspirational she is, you know.
Speaker 1 (02:36):
We're excited about this book, though Before we hit
record, we mentioned thatoftentimes in the work that we
do, we hear from millennialsthat say I'm not worried about
that yet, I'm not there yet,right, because they haven't
reached perimenopause ormenopause, and it's
(02:57):
misunderstood to your point,lauren.
So I'm wondering what doesmenopause look like for
millennials and how would yousay that it's different from the
experience of previousgenerations?
Speaker 3 (03:10):
Well, I think primarily, we are talking about
it more and much like fertilityissues, maternal mental health,
mental health in general.
I will say that I think mygeneration of millennials are
used to talking about previouslyprivate things.
Menopause is not yet at theforefront of our conversations,
I think in part because we areso ignorant and under taught,
(03:34):
but also because people tend tofear aging, especially women
aging, and that's just acultural shift that needs to
happen, that you know.
The work that you do is lendingitself to that.
So thank you for earliercalling me an outspoken advocate
.
I am proud to wear that hat andbe loud.
I think that we have to be loudtogether.
I know that not everyone hasthe privilege of being loud and
(03:57):
I view my privilege as anopportunity to use my voice to
speak up.
Yeah, millennials, yeah, goahead, go ahead.
Speaker 2 (04:08):
Kim go.
Oh okay, you sort of you writethat this generation still
thinks this is a little bit oftaboo.
What did you find in yourresearch for the book?
Speaker 3 (04:21):
I found a very wide range of reactions.
I interviewed over four dozenexperts in this space, many of
them are millennials themselves,and I also surveyed over 120
lay women, and the reactionsranged from ew I don't want to
talk about it, you know, gross,I'm afraid but also very basic
(04:45):
questions.
Please tell us what we need toknow.
Where do I go?
How do I find more information?
Why aren't we talking about it?
And I think those knee-jerkreactions with that negative
implication is again due to thecultural impact that we have,
the culture in which we live,that aging is something to be
(05:05):
feared or is quote unquote grossAging is not gross, it's a
privilege.
I understand it comes with somenegative consequences, like to
our health, but that's all themore reason why we have to get
prepared and really feel thatwe're in a position of power and
optimize our health, that we'rein a position of power and
optimize our health.
Speaker 1 (05:24):
Yeah, yeah, I think to your point, lauren.
Menopause just has thisintersectionality of so many
things right Gender ageism thatpeople don't want to talk about
it.
I was just reading last nightin a book that the anti-aging
industry for cosmetics, makeup,wellness so supplements are
(05:46):
folded in that as well is over a$500 billion industry.
So we still want to look young,stay young, fit into that box,
which may have.
I think it plays a big piece inwhy we don't have these
conversations right, andparticularly Kim and I are
focused on the workplace, so Ithink that you know obviously
(06:09):
funnels into the workplace aswell.
We don't want to be seen as oldand not capable.
But there are a lot ofmisconceptions out there as well
about perimenopause, menopause.
I mean, the laundry list thatwe have is very, very long.
But I'd love to hear from youand maybe some of the things
that you challenged or wanted tochallenge in your book.
Speaker 3 (06:32):
Sure.
So there are quite a few, andgo get the book and you can read
it.
I would say the firstmisconception or first lesson
that I learned is thatperimenopause symptoms can start
in one's 30s.
So when we say things like ew,that's gross, I don't want to
think about it, I'm so far awayfrom it.
(06:52):
I'm not trying to scare peopleand say create the sense of
urgency that you must, but I dowant to raise awareness that
actually you might already be init right, and I do believe that
knowledge is power, not tomention the many women, many of
whom you might know, who gothrough earlier premature
menopause and they're feelingprobably especially lonely and
(07:14):
that they don't know who to talkto or where to turn for further
information.
So it's important to normalizethis experience and to normalize
that it can start in one's 30s.
I also think it's reallyimportant to teach people that
support is available and thatcan be in the form of hormone
therapy, which still today, in2025, has a lot of
(07:38):
misconceptions around it, andmany women I interviewed said
doesn't it cause breast cancer?
I was taught to.
The only thing I ever heardabout menopause was to stay away
from hormone treatment.
Doctors I spoke with, weretaught to avoid it, et cetera.
So that is obviously a major,major myth that has been
(07:58):
debunked, but we still need touse our voices to spread that
message.
So I'm really proud to be ableto do that through this book.
Speaker 1 (08:12):
Yeah, Isn't it amazing that a study that is
over 20 years old is stillaffecting us and our society and
the way that we look at hormonetherapy, and I find it
interesting too.
Sometimes I'll challenge it andsay where did you hear that?
And people don't even knowwhere they heard it Right, so it
doesn't even link directly backto that study.
Speaker 3 (08:25):
It's they don't even know what the study is.
That's just the word on thestreet.
Speaker 1 (08:30):
Yeah, exactly Word on the street, yeah, yeah.
And I also find it interestingand I'm so glad that you brought
this up about early menopause.
I'm one of those, you know.
I went through early menopauseand my doctor said oh, that's
normal, go home right, deal withit.
And it's not.
It's not, and it was very, verychallenging to your point and I
(08:53):
think it's an importantconversation to have, because
not only is it lonely andisolating and you don't know
where to go for help, as youmentioned, but I think a lot of
women are waiting later to havechildren and if you know this,
going into that family planning,that you could start menopause
early and look at the geneticsand your family history, it's
(09:15):
important to note that right,going into that family planning
stage of your life, don't waittoo long.
Perhaps don't wait too long,right.
Speaker 2 (09:27):
Don't do it too early .
Don't do it too early eitherFor our daughters, who are
listening.
Speaker 3 (09:31):
Hold on Whatever you choose.
Know that it's not in your head.
If you are feeling unlikeyourself, and whether it's due
to postpartum issues or toperimenopause or to both
simultaneously, you deserve andcan access help, and that's, you
know, my mission.
My day job is as a therapist,and I've been primarily focusing
(09:54):
on women in their 20s and 30swho are emerging adults and or
family planning and or newmothers, and I see a lot of
perinatal mood and anxietydisorders and, as I've shifted
my focus a bit into theperimenopause space, the amount
of times I've seen actually youare postpartum, but you're also
(10:15):
in perimenopause, and I've heardthat from providers as well,
and so it's definitely somethingwe need to shine a light on.
Speaker 1 (10:23):
Quick pause here because this matters.
Medovia is proud to be thefirst and only organization in
the US offering amenopause-friendly membership
and accreditation for workplaces.
We're not a trend.
We are not check-the-boxbenefit.
We're a movement for lastingchange.
(10:44):
We're helping organizations ofall sizes shift culture, support
their people and retainexperienced talent.
Whether you're looking just toget started or ready to lead the
way, we've built a roadmaprooted in best practices from
hundreds of employers across theglobe.
If you want to learn more, headto menopausefriendlyuscom and
(11:06):
find out how to become aworkplace that doesn't just talk
the talk but walks it, becausemenopause is a workplace issue
and the best organizations knowit.
Speaker 2 (11:18):
Yeah, I think it's really interesting because you
bring a different lens on this,both from a clinical experience
and a legal background.
How does your work as a socialworker and lawyer shape your
book and your perspective onthis?
Speaker 3 (11:36):
Sure.
So, as you mentioned, I am alot of things, but certainly not
a healthcare provider.
I'm not a doctor, I'm not anurse practitioner, so I don't
have that science background.
But what I do have is themental health background, the
advocacy background and thestorytelling background, and
that's why I wanted to writethis book with all of those
(11:57):
perspectives.
For me, menopause, it wasn'tsomething that I was personally
experiencing that led me towrite this, but once I became
aware of it, I felt compelled totell these stories, to find out
more information, because it'sa continuation of all of my work
thus far on women'sreproductive health care, their
(12:21):
autonomy, their access to mentalhealth care and to community
building.
And when it comes to my legalbackground, I used to practice
primarily immigration law, whichis not quite applicable here,
but just in terms of socialjustice and speaking up for
what's right and changingworkplace policies, which
obviously I know is near anddear to your heart.
(12:43):
That all came into play, and soit's not just the perspective
of a mental health clinician butalso an advocate, and I pride
myself on being one.
Speaker 1 (12:54):
Yeah, can I switch gears a little bit here, lauren?
Because I love educating andbringing awareness to our
audience, but I also love forthem to have takeaways and
tangible strategies that theycan implement when they walk
away from our podcast.
So, if we can switch gears alittle bit here and talk about
some of the most helpful copingtools or strategies that you
(13:18):
cover in your book, especiallyfor someone that might be
feeling overwhelmed orunprepared for this stage of
life, or unprepared for thisstage of life?
Speaker 3 (13:30):
Yeah, absolutely.
The goal of the book is to helpsomeone the reader and or their
partner or loved ones, feelprepared.
Now can we prepare for everypossible outcome?
No, we all know that menopauseaffects every person differently
.
But to have knowledge andresources literally at one's
fingertips and to make theseresources accessible is my goal.
So whether you're 20 and readingit, or 50 and reading it, or 70
(13:53):
and reading it, I want it to beenjoyable, fun.
It's a lighthearted book.
It's silly at times.
It's meant to really connectwith the reader and some coping
mechanisms that I think, beyondreading it and feeling prepared
in that way, are encouragingwomen to talk about it.
Talk about it with your mom, ifyou can.
What was her experience like?
(14:14):
What would she do differentlyif she could Talk about it?
With the other women in yourlife, whether they're family,
friends, coworkers Certainlyadvocate for better workplace
policies.
If it's not affecting you yetor you went through menopause
years ago, I almost think allthe more reason for you to get
involved in the workplacemovement now, because it might
(14:37):
feel less urgent for you, lessoverwhelming, and I do think
it's up to us, as a collectivemovement, to help each other and
to advocate for betterworkplaces for all women, for
all people who need additionalsupport In general.
Sleep is always a good copingmechanism, but, of course, that
can be difficult when you'reexperiencing any of the symptoms
(14:59):
, and so, to that end, findingthe right providers and building
your support team is huge, andthat should include a
well-educated menopause providerwho can potentially provide
hormone therapy or othermedications, and a therapist,
because we know that women goingthrough the menopause
transition experience a widerange of mood symptoms that are
(15:23):
often attributed to other lifestressors, which may compound
those symptoms, but often arebecause of the hormonal
fluctuations, so it's reallyimportant to find the right
support.
Speaker 2 (15:41):
And again, support is available.
Yeah, I always talk aboutfinding your tribe and when
people say in perimenopause, I'mlike this doesn't affect me,
I'm like it's going to.
So get your, get your teamtogether.
Find your doctor or find a newdoctor If your doctor is not
working for you.
Find your therapist, find yourphysical therapist.
Like, get your team togetherbefore right before.
Speaker 1 (15:58):
Yeah, so that you're prepared.
And, kim, you talk aboutcommunity, building that
community and just being aroundother people and talking about
menopause.
It's been shown to decreasesymptoms, so it's important for
us in so many ways.
I mean, you impact a lot therein your answer, lauren.
Sleep, community, right support, find your healthcare
(16:22):
specialist that can help you.
One thing that you mentioned,though, that I love, is to
advocate for workplace policy.
I know what my answer would befor this, but I'm just curious
from someone that maybe isn'tmarinating in this every single
day how would someone do that wesay advocate for workplace
(16:45):
policy?
What's one thing that someonecould do in the workplace to do
that I'm putting on the spothere I got a Madhavia training
in the workplace.
Speaker 3 (16:58):
It's hugely important and the research shows that
employees are eager foreducation and, quite frankly,
education is a fairly easy thingfor companies to provide, as
long as they invest in it.
But this is not out of reachfor most employers.
So please, please, please, atthe very least to all companies
(17:20):
out there, set up an educationalwebinar, meeting, whatever it
is, and start the conversation.
And there are other workplacepolicies that are hugely
beneficial.
I know I don't have to tell you, but whether it's in the form
of tangible support likefinances to pay for those
menopause specialists or accessto the thermostat, or whether it
(17:45):
is a cultural shift of simplytalking about things, maybe
workplace flexibility to attendappointments or just treat
people like adults, there's awide range of things that
employers can and should bedoing.
Speaker 2 (18:00):
Thank you, april.
Yeah, april, always just ask,ask for it.
Speaker 3 (18:05):
Yeah, you have to ask but speak up right.
Yeah, that's the number onereason why companies don't
provide it, that's right.
Speaker 1 (18:13):
They don't feel like there is a need because no one's
talking about it, and I alwayssay ask, because guess what that
does?
It ignites that investigationon the organization's part.
They have to look and see.
If you say, you know, do wehave a menopause policy, do we
have support for menopause, dowe have accommodations?
(18:33):
They're obliged to andobligated to look into it for
you, and that starts theconversation, and that starts
the movement, and that startsaction.
So I love that.
How might individuals advocatefor themselves in the healthcare
system, though?
So we've talked about workplaceand advocacy being incredibly
(18:56):
important with your healthcareprovider and finding that
specialist that knows whatthey're talking about and can
help you.
How do you do that?
What does it look like forwomen in midlife?
Speaker 3 (19:08):
I would almost go back, and before you even have
to advocate for someone whoknows what they're talking about
, you have to navigate beingdismissed by someone who doesn't
.
And unfortunately, I see ittime and again for women in
their 30s, especially becausethey bring up symptoms and
they're told well, you're justpostpartum, or it's too early,
(19:30):
or don't worry about that.
Yet I've heard that myself andI think that's really dismissive
, really condescending, andwomen are asking for information
that they deserve, if notactual treatment options, which
they also deserve.
So Having a healthcare providerwho's dismissive is a major red
flag.
There are so many resources outthere that can help educate
(19:56):
other providers yourself, and sotake advantage of those,
whether it's through communityresources like the ones you
provide, social media, althoughyou know, take the well-vetted
resources from their forumsonline, and then the Menopause
Society provides a directory.
There are also a lot ofwonderful healthcare providers
(20:18):
who refer to others, who knowwhat they're talking about, et
cetera.
It's really nice, I think, tohave a sort of buddy in this and
again, they don't need to behaving the same symptoms as you
you and they probably aren't butjust you know, on that group
chat text team say, hey, doesanyone have a good doctor that
they like, that they really feelheard by.
(20:40):
And I have doctors who say tome oh, I'm not sure about that
but I'll look into it, andthat's okay because we are all
learning.
But what I don't want anyone tohave is the provider who says,
forget about it, we'll's okaybecause we are all learning.
But what I don't want anyone tohave is the provider who says,
forget about it, We'll talkabout it later.
Speaker 2 (20:56):
Yeah, we talked about divorcing your doctor.
Who does that for you.
You know, I'm curious when youwere researching this book, what
differences did you see withmillennials in this timeframe
versus the generations that camebefore them?
Is it a different conversation?
Is it a harder conversation?
Is it more open, Like what,what was, what was the sort of
(21:19):
finding that you had?
And looking at the generationswho are dealing with menopause
at all different levels?
Speaker 3 (21:28):
All the women I spoke to who had already been through
menopause said I'm so happyyou're doing this, because I
felt so alone and in the darkwhen I went through it and of
course, that exacerbated theirsymptoms, right, physical,
mental, everything.
And I do think that millennialsare more comfortable with these
(21:49):
open dialogues, which isawesome.
I think, again, social mediahas its pros and cons, but the
ability to access informationand such a wide range of
information is really cool,right, we can use it to our
advantage, we can connect withothers, and so social media
should be used that way.
And I think that millennialsare more aware of I don't want
(22:14):
to say more aware, but they areaware of, kind of the inherent
misogyny in the healthcaresystem and not really ready or
willing to take it.
And I'm giving caveats becauseit's not that I think the
generation prior was willing totake it, but I think that they
almost were forced to, andhopefully that is changing and
(22:35):
you know my generation canreally make a difference and not
stand for that.
Speaker 2 (22:40):
And by take it you mean get misinformation, get
gaslighted, get wronginformation, you know, get
dismissed.
Speaker 3 (22:48):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (22:49):
No, that's good, that's good.
Speaker 1 (22:51):
Is there anything else that during your research,
just out of curiosity, that wassurprising to you?
Speaker 3 (22:57):
The level of ignorance, and I say that with
the kindest of hearts and Idon't mean to be critical, but,
as I mentioned earlier, I'm notreally a science person.
That's not my strength, and sowhen I first met Anne and I
first was thinking about it, Ithought maybe it's just me,
maybe I missed that day inbiology back in high school and
(23:18):
for some reason my mom didn'ttalk about it with me and, ok, I
felt a little dumb.
And then I realized veryquickly that it was absolutely
not just me, and in fact themost brilliant physicians who
truly care about women's healthwere also taught nothing, or
next to nothing, about menopause, and it just again boiled down
(23:41):
to this lack of value, I think,of women's health and women's
rights, and that lit a fireunder me to change it.
Speaker 1 (23:48):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (23:48):
You've not written a book before right Lauren.
I've contributed chapters toanthologies and I've written for
magazines and blogs, but thisis my first.
Speaker 2 (23:57):
I mean, you were like I hear this calling, I can't
avoid it, I have to go after itand take care of it and solve it
, and I admire that very much.
So good work on.
Oh yeah, somebody should dothis.
Speaker 1 (24:10):
And you're like oh, I guess that somebody's me.
I'll do it.
Yeah, yeah, so I love that, andit is available for pre-order.
Where can our audiencepre-order the book on?
On any platform.
Speaker 3 (24:26):
Yes, Amazon, Barnes and Noble, and on my website I
provide links to all the sources.
There's everywhere books aresold and where can and where can
they find you Thecounselorcom.
So counselor, but L-A-U-R forLauren, because both therapists
and lawyers provide counsel.
Speaker 2 (24:43):
So I love that.
Well, what else exciting iscoming up for you?
Speaker 3 (24:48):
Well, I am continuing to speak and write about issues
that are meaningful to me aboutwomen's reproductive health,
about working parenthood, genderequity, maternal mental health
and I have some fun family stuffgoing on.
But, yes, I will be doing a lotof book events in the New York
and California areas in July andwe'll see where else it takes
(25:12):
me, but it's really been apleasure to connect with like
minded women who are passionateabout this topic.
Speaker 2 (25:17):
You know Seattle's just up the coast from
California, so you know come on,we'd love to have you.
Well, we ask our podcast gueststhe same question what's the
best piece of advice you've everreceived or given?
Speaker 3 (25:33):
So this is echoing April's earlier sentiment, which
is advice from my mother, whoalways taught me that if you
don't ask, you won't get, andask with a smile, and I really
feel that that made me who I amtoday, because I'm not afraid am
today because I'm not afraid toask, I'm not afraid to confront
(25:54):
which gets a bad, you know,reputation or connotations.
But if you ask kindly and ifyou ask for the right reasons,
you're going to make change andI think that I really take that
to heart.
Speaker 2 (26:07):
I love that.
I love that you learned thatfrom your mom.
Oh, thanks for joining us today.
Speaker 1 (26:13):
Great conversation and an important conversation, I
think you know, as we noted atthe very beginning of this
podcast, we hear a lot frommillennials that I don't need to
worry about this yet, and wejust talked about the importance
of building your tribe andhaving information and educating
yourself, advocating foryourself both in and outside of
(26:34):
the workplace.
So thank you for shedding lighton this topic, for writing the
book and for taking the time tobe with us today, Lauren.
We really appreciate it.
Speaker 3 (26:44):
Thank you so much and I hope I see you in person soon
.
Speaker 1 (26:48):
Absolutely and for all of our listeners, until we
meet again.
Go find joy in the journey.
Bye, lauren, thank you, bye.
Thank you.
Thank you for listening to theMedovia Menopause Podcast.
If you enjoyed today's show,please give it a thumbs up.
Subscribe for future episodes,leave a review and share this
episode with a friend.
(27:09):
Medovia is out to change thenarrative.
Learn more at medoviacom.
That's M-I-D-O-V-I-A dot com.
Welcome to the MiDOViA Menopause Podcast, your
trusted source for informationabout menopause and midlife.
Join us each episode, as wehave great conversations with
great people.
Tune in and enjoy the show.
Speaker 2 (00:15):
Hi everyone and welcome.
Today we're getting real abouta topic that's finally getting
the attention it deservesmenopause.
But not just menopause, butmillennial menopause.
Yeah, you heard that right.
We have a special guest, LaurenTenenbaum, author of an
upcoming book called MillennialMenopause Preparing for
(00:37):
Perimenopause, menopause andLife's Next Period.
I like that.
Lauren is a licensed socialworker, a former lawyer, a mom
of two and an outspoken advocatefor women's wellness and
empowerment.
She brings empathy, humor anddeep insight into what this next
chapter looks like for thegeneration that's rewriting the
(01:00):
narrative on aging and health.
Thank goodness, welcome, lauren.
Speaker 3 (01:04):
Thank you so much for having me.
I'm so happy to be here.
Speaker 2 (01:07):
Yeah, we're finally happy to have you too.
So your book's not out yet.
How would you describeMillennial Menopause in one
sentence?
Speaker 3 (01:16):
It comes out July 15th and it is available for
pre-order already, and I woulddescribe it as the compassionate
guide to the next phase of lifethat every woman in her 30s and
40s needs.
Speaker 2 (01:31):
And what inspired you to write it.
Did something happen in yourpersonal life that sparked it?
Or your friends or family?
What inspired you to write thisbook?
There's a gap.
This doesn't this.
This book is filling a gap thathasn't been filled, so how'd
you get?
Speaker 3 (01:44):
that was really the motivation.
I realized that I was 39 lastyear and I knew nothing about
the next phase of life, ofhealth, of my reproductive
health, my mental health and I'mvery well read and very in tune
and very much, always anadvocate for women's health and
I didn't know anything aboutmenopause.
(02:07):
And I went to an event.
I met Anne Fullenweider, whoco-founded Alloy.
The way she spoke about thegaps in care and the way that
the other women in the room wereso passionate about educating
others, I said well, okay, atleast it's not just me who
doesn't know, but I think it isup to me to spread the word.
(02:28):
And so I started writing andresearching and it led to the
book.
Speaker 2 (02:33):
I know Anne's pretty inspirational she is, you know.
Speaker 1 (02:36):
We're excited about this book, though Before we hit
record, we mentioned thatoftentimes in the work that we
do, we hear from millennialsthat say I'm not worried about
that yet, I'm not there yet,right, because they haven't
reached perimenopause ormenopause, and it's
(02:57):
misunderstood to your point,lauren.
So I'm wondering what doesmenopause look like for
millennials and how would yousay that it's different from the
experience of previousgenerations?
Speaker 3 (03:10):
Well, I think primarily, we are talking about
it more and much like fertilityissues, maternal mental health,
mental health in general.
I will say that I think mygeneration of millennials are
used to talking about previouslyprivate things.
Menopause is not yet at theforefront of our conversations,
I think in part because we areso ignorant and under taught,
(03:34):
but also because people tend tofear aging, especially women
aging, and that's just acultural shift that needs to
happen, that you know.
The work that you do is lendingitself to that.
So thank you for earliercalling me an outspoken advocate
.
I am proud to wear that hat andbe loud.
I think that we have to be loudtogether.
I know that not everyone hasthe privilege of being loud and
(03:57):
I view my privilege as anopportunity to use my voice to
speak up.
Yeah, millennials, yeah, goahead, go ahead.
Speaker 2 (04:08):
Kim go.
Oh okay, you sort of you writethat this generation still
thinks this is a little bit oftaboo.
What did you find in yourresearch for the book?
Speaker 3 (04:21):
I found a very wide range of reactions.
I interviewed over four dozenexperts in this space, many of
them are millennials themselves,and I also surveyed over 120
lay women, and the reactionsranged from ew I don't want to
talk about it, you know, gross,I'm afraid but also very basic
(04:45):
questions.
Please tell us what we need toknow.
Where do I go?
How do I find more information?
Why aren't we talking about it?
And I think those knee-jerkreactions with that negative
implication is again due to thecultural impact that we have,
the culture in which we live,that aging is something to be
(05:05):
feared or is quote unquote grossAging is not gross, it's a
privilege.
I understand it comes with somenegative consequences, like to
our health, but that's all themore reason why we have to get
prepared and really feel thatwe're in a position of power and
optimize our health, that we'rein a position of power and
optimize our health.
Speaker 1 (05:24):
Yeah, yeah, I think to your point, lauren.
Menopause just has thisintersectionality of so many
things right Gender ageism thatpeople don't want to talk about
it.
I was just reading last nightin a book that the anti-aging
industry for cosmetics, makeup,wellness so supplements are
(05:46):
folded in that as well is over a$500 billion industry.
So we still want to look young,stay young, fit into that box,
which may have.
I think it plays a big piece inwhy we don't have these
conversations right, andparticularly Kim and I are
focused on the workplace, so Ithink that you know obviously
(06:09):
funnels into the workplace aswell.
We don't want to be seen as oldand not capable.
But there are a lot ofmisconceptions out there as well
about perimenopause, menopause.
I mean, the laundry list thatwe have is very, very long.
But I'd love to hear from youand maybe some of the things
that you challenged or wanted tochallenge in your book.
Speaker 3 (06:32):
Sure.
So there are quite a few, andgo get the book and you can read
it.
I would say the firstmisconception or first lesson
that I learned is thatperimenopause symptoms can start
in one's 30s.
So when we say things like ew,that's gross, I don't want to
think about it, I'm so far awayfrom it.
(06:52):
I'm not trying to scare peopleand say create the sense of
urgency that you must, but I dowant to raise awareness that
actually you might already be init right, and I do believe that
knowledge is power, not tomention the many women, many of
whom you might know, who gothrough earlier premature
menopause and they're feelingprobably especially lonely and
(07:14):
that they don't know who to talkto or where to turn for further
information.
So it's important to normalizethis experience and to normalize
that it can start in one's 30s.
I also think it's reallyimportant to teach people that
support is available and thatcan be in the form of hormone
therapy, which still today, in2025, has a lot of
(07:38):
misconceptions around it, andmany women I interviewed said
doesn't it cause breast cancer?
I was taught to.
The only thing I ever heardabout menopause was to stay away
from hormone treatment.
Doctors I spoke with, weretaught to avoid it, et cetera.
So that is obviously a major,major myth that has been
(07:58):
debunked, but we still need touse our voices to spread that
message.
So I'm really proud to be ableto do that through this book.
Speaker 1 (08:12):
Yeah, Isn't it amazing that a study that is
over 20 years old is stillaffecting us and our society and
the way that we look at hormonetherapy, and I find it
interesting too.
Sometimes I'll challenge it andsay where did you hear that?
And people don't even knowwhere they heard it Right, so it
doesn't even link directly backto that study.
Speaker 3 (08:25):
It's they don't even know what the study is.
That's just the word on thestreet.
Speaker 1 (08:30):
Yeah, exactly Word on the street, yeah, yeah.
And I also find it interestingand I'm so glad that you brought
this up about early menopause.
I'm one of those, you know.
I went through early menopauseand my doctor said oh, that's
normal, go home right, deal withit.
And it's not.
It's not, and it was very, verychallenging to your point and I
(08:53):
think it's an importantconversation to have, because
not only is it lonely andisolating and you don't know
where to go for help, as youmentioned, but I think a lot of
women are waiting later to havechildren and if you know this,
going into that family planning,that you could start menopause
early and look at the geneticsand your family history, it's
(09:15):
important to note that right,going into that family planning
stage of your life, don't waittoo long.
Perhaps don't wait too long,right.
Speaker 2 (09:27):
Don't do it too early .
Don't do it too early eitherFor our daughters, who are
listening.
Speaker 3 (09:31):
Hold on Whatever you choose.
Know that it's not in your head.
If you are feeling unlikeyourself, and whether it's due
to postpartum issues or toperimenopause or to both
simultaneously, you deserve andcan access help, and that's, you
know, my mission.
My day job is as a therapist,and I've been primarily focusing
(09:54):
on women in their 20s and 30swho are emerging adults and or
family planning and or newmothers, and I see a lot of
perinatal mood and anxietydisorders and, as I've shifted
my focus a bit into theperimenopause space, the amount
of times I've seen actually youare postpartum, but you're also
(10:15):
in perimenopause, and I've heardthat from providers as well,
and so it's definitely somethingwe need to shine a light on.
Speaker 1 (10:23):
Quick pause here because this matters.
Medovia is proud to be thefirst and only organization in
the US offering amenopause-friendly membership
and accreditation for workplaces.
We're not a trend.
We are not check-the-boxbenefit.
We're a movement for lastingchange.
(10:44):
We're helping organizations ofall sizes shift culture, support
their people and retainexperienced talent.
Whether you're looking just toget started or ready to lead the
way, we've built a roadmaprooted in best practices from
hundreds of employers across theglobe.
If you want to learn more, headto menopausefriendlyuscom and
(11:06):
find out how to become aworkplace that doesn't just talk
the talk but walks it, becausemenopause is a workplace issue
and the best organizations knowit.
Speaker 2 (11:18):
Yeah, I think it's really interesting because you
bring a different lens on this,both from a clinical experience
and a legal background.
How does your work as a socialworker and lawyer shape your
book and your perspective onthis?
Speaker 3 (11:36):
Sure.
So, as you mentioned, I am alot of things, but certainly not
a healthcare provider.
I'm not a doctor, I'm not anurse practitioner, so I don't
have that science background.
But what I do have is themental health background, the
advocacy background and thestorytelling background, and
that's why I wanted to writethis book with all of those
(11:57):
perspectives.
For me, menopause, it wasn'tsomething that I was personally
experiencing that led me towrite this, but once I became
aware of it, I felt compelled totell these stories, to find out
more information, because it'sa continuation of all of my work
thus far on women'sreproductive health care, their
(12:21):
autonomy, their access to mentalhealth care and to community
building.
And when it comes to my legalbackground, I used to practice
primarily immigration law, whichis not quite applicable here,
but just in terms of socialjustice and speaking up for
what's right and changingworkplace policies, which
obviously I know is near anddear to your heart.
(12:43):
That all came into play, and soit's not just the perspective
of a mental health clinician butalso an advocate, and I pride
myself on being one.
Speaker 1 (12:54):
Yeah, can I switch gears a little bit here, lauren?
Because I love educating andbringing awareness to our
audience, but I also love forthem to have takeaways and
tangible strategies that theycan implement when they walk
away from our podcast.
So, if we can switch gears alittle bit here and talk about
some of the most helpful copingtools or strategies that you
(13:18):
cover in your book, especiallyfor someone that might be
feeling overwhelmed orunprepared for this stage of
life, or unprepared for thisstage of life?
Speaker 3 (13:30):
Yeah, absolutely.
The goal of the book is to helpsomeone the reader and or their
partner or loved ones, feelprepared.
Now can we prepare for everypossible outcome?
No, we all know that menopauseaffects every person differently
.
But to have knowledge andresources literally at one's
fingertips and to make theseresources accessible is my goal.
So whether you're 20 and readingit, or 50 and reading it, or 70
(13:53):
and reading it, I want it to beenjoyable, fun.
It's a lighthearted book.
It's silly at times.
It's meant to really connectwith the reader and some coping
mechanisms that I think, beyondreading it and feeling prepared
in that way, are encouragingwomen to talk about it.
Talk about it with your mom, ifyou can.
What was her experience like?
(14:14):
What would she do differentlyif she could Talk about it?
With the other women in yourlife, whether they're family,
friends, coworkers Certainlyadvocate for better workplace
policies.
If it's not affecting you yetor you went through menopause
years ago, I almost think allthe more reason for you to get
involved in the workplacemovement now, because it might
(14:37):
feel less urgent for you, lessoverwhelming, and I do think
it's up to us, as a collectivemovement, to help each other and
to advocate for betterworkplaces for all women, for
all people who need additionalsupport In general.
Sleep is always a good copingmechanism, but, of course, that
can be difficult when you'reexperiencing any of the symptoms
(14:59):
, and so, to that end, findingthe right providers and building
your support team is huge, andthat should include a
well-educated menopause providerwho can potentially provide
hormone therapy or othermedications, and a therapist,
because we know that women goingthrough the menopause
transition experience a widerange of mood symptoms that are
(15:23):
often attributed to other lifestressors, which may compound
those symptoms, but often arebecause of the hormonal
fluctuations, so it's reallyimportant to find the right
support.
Speaker 2 (15:41):
And again, support is available.
Yeah, I always talk aboutfinding your tribe and when
people say in perimenopause, I'mlike this doesn't affect me,
I'm like it's going to.
So get your, get your teamtogether.
Find your doctor or find a newdoctor If your doctor is not
working for you.
Find your therapist, find yourphysical therapist.
Like, get your team togetherbefore right before.
Speaker 1 (15:58):
Yeah, so that you're prepared.
And, kim, you talk aboutcommunity, building that
community and just being aroundother people and talking about
menopause.
It's been shown to decreasesymptoms, so it's important for
us in so many ways.
I mean, you impact a lot therein your answer, lauren.
Sleep, community, right support, find your healthcare
(16:22):
specialist that can help you.
One thing that you mentioned,though, that I love, is to
advocate for workplace policy.
I know what my answer would befor this, but I'm just curious
from someone that maybe isn'tmarinating in this every single
day how would someone do that wesay advocate for workplace
(16:45):
policy?
What's one thing that someonecould do in the workplace to do
that I'm putting on the spothere I got a Madhavia training
in the workplace.
Speaker 3 (16:58):
It's hugely important and the research shows that
employees are eager foreducation and, quite frankly,
education is a fairly easy thingfor companies to provide, as
long as they invest in it.
But this is not out of reachfor most employers.
So please, please, please, atthe very least to all companies
(17:20):
out there, set up an educationalwebinar, meeting, whatever it
is, and start the conversation.
And there are other workplacepolicies that are hugely
beneficial.
I know I don't have to tell you, but whether it's in the form
of tangible support likefinances to pay for those
menopause specialists or accessto the thermostat, or whether it
(17:45):
is a cultural shift of simplytalking about things, maybe
workplace flexibility to attendappointments or just treat
people like adults, there's awide range of things that
employers can and should bedoing.
Speaker 2 (18:00):
Thank you, april.
Yeah, april, always just ask,ask for it.
Speaker 3 (18:05):
Yeah, you have to ask but speak up right.
Yeah, that's the number onereason why companies don't
provide it, that's right.
Speaker 1 (18:13):
They don't feel like there is a need because no one's
talking about it, and I alwayssay ask, because guess what that
does?
It ignites that investigationon the organization's part.
They have to look and see.
If you say, you know, do wehave a menopause policy, do we
have support for menopause, dowe have accommodations?
(18:33):
They're obliged to andobligated to look into it for
you, and that starts theconversation, and that starts
the movement, and that startsaction.
So I love that.
How might individuals advocatefor themselves in the healthcare
system, though?
So we've talked about workplaceand advocacy being incredibly
(18:56):
important with your healthcareprovider and finding that
specialist that knows whatthey're talking about and can
help you.
How do you do that?
What does it look like forwomen in midlife?
Speaker 3 (19:08):
I would almost go back, and before you even have
to advocate for someone whoknows what they're talking about
, you have to navigate beingdismissed by someone who doesn't
.
And unfortunately, I see ittime and again for women in
their 30s, especially becausethey bring up symptoms and
they're told well, you're justpostpartum, or it's too early,
(19:30):
or don't worry about that.
Yet I've heard that myself andI think that's really dismissive
, really condescending, andwomen are asking for information
that they deserve, if notactual treatment options, which
they also deserve.
So Having a healthcare providerwho's dismissive is a major red
flag.
There are so many resources outthere that can help educate
(19:56):
other providers yourself, and sotake advantage of those,
whether it's through communityresources like the ones you
provide, social media, althoughyou know, take the well-vetted
resources from their forumsonline, and then the Menopause
Society provides a directory.
There are also a lot ofwonderful healthcare providers
(20:18):
who refer to others, who knowwhat they're talking about, et
cetera.
It's really nice, I think, tohave a sort of buddy in this and
again, they don't need to behaving the same symptoms as you
you and they probably aren't butjust you know, on that group
chat text team say, hey, doesanyone have a good doctor that
they like, that they really feelheard by.
(20:40):
And I have doctors who say tome oh, I'm not sure about that
but I'll look into it, andthat's okay because we are all
learning.
But what I don't want anyone tohave is the provider who says,
forget about it, we'll's okaybecause we are all learning.
But what I don't want anyone tohave is the provider who says,
forget about it, We'll talkabout it later.
Speaker 2 (20:56):
Yeah, we talked about divorcing your doctor.
Who does that for you.
You know, I'm curious when youwere researching this book, what
differences did you see withmillennials in this timeframe
versus the generations that camebefore them?
Is it a different conversation?
Is it a harder conversation?
Is it more open, Like what,what was, what was the sort of
(21:19):
finding that you had?
And looking at the generationswho are dealing with menopause
at all different levels?
Speaker 3 (21:28):
All the women I spoke to who had already been through
menopause said I'm so happyyou're doing this, because I
felt so alone and in the darkwhen I went through it and of
course, that exacerbated theirsymptoms, right, physical,
mental, everything.
And I do think that millennialsare more comfortable with these
(21:49):
open dialogues, which isawesome.
I think, again, social mediahas its pros and cons, but the
ability to access informationand such a wide range of
information is really cool,right, we can use it to our
advantage, we can connect withothers, and so social media
should be used that way.
And I think that millennialsare more aware of I don't want
(22:14):
to say more aware, but they areaware of, kind of the inherent
misogyny in the healthcaresystem and not really ready or
willing to take it.
And I'm giving caveats becauseit's not that I think the
generation prior was willing totake it, but I think that they
almost were forced to, andhopefully that is changing and
(22:35):
you know my generation canreally make a difference and not
stand for that.
Speaker 2 (22:40):
And by take it you mean get misinformation, get
gaslighted, get wronginformation, you know, get
dismissed.
Speaker 3 (22:48):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (22:49):
No, that's good, that's good.
Speaker 1 (22:51):
Is there anything else that during your research,
just out of curiosity, that wassurprising to you?
Speaker 3 (22:57):
The level of ignorance, and I say that with
the kindest of hearts and Idon't mean to be critical, but,
as I mentioned earlier, I'm notreally a science person.
That's not my strength, and sowhen I first met Anne and I
first was thinking about it, Ithought maybe it's just me,
maybe I missed that day inbiology back in high school and
(23:18):
for some reason my mom didn'ttalk about it with me and, ok, I
felt a little dumb.
And then I realized veryquickly that it was absolutely
not just me, and in fact themost brilliant physicians who
truly care about women's healthwere also taught nothing, or
next to nothing, about menopause, and it just again boiled down
(23:41):
to this lack of value, I think,of women's health and women's
rights, and that lit a fireunder me to change it.
Speaker 1 (23:48):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (23:48):
You've not written a book before right Lauren.
I've contributed chapters toanthologies and I've written for
magazines and blogs, but thisis my first.
Speaker 2 (23:57):
I mean, you were like I hear this calling, I can't
avoid it, I have to go after itand take care of it and solve it
, and I admire that very much.
So good work on.
Oh yeah, somebody should dothis.
Speaker 1 (24:10):
And you're like oh, I guess that somebody's me.
I'll do it.
Yeah, yeah, so I love that, andit is available for pre-order.
Where can our audiencepre-order the book on?
On any platform.
Speaker 3 (24:26):
Yes, Amazon, Barnes and Noble, and on my website I
provide links to all the sources.
There's everywhere books aresold and where can and where can
they find you Thecounselorcom.
So counselor, but L-A-U-R forLauren, because both therapists
and lawyers provide counsel.
Speaker 2 (24:43):
So I love that.
Well, what else exciting iscoming up for you?
Speaker 3 (24:48):
Well, I am continuing to speak and write about issues
that are meaningful to me aboutwomen's reproductive health,
about working parenthood, genderequity, maternal mental health
and I have some fun family stuffgoing on.
But, yes, I will be doing a lotof book events in the New York
and California areas in July andwe'll see where else it takes
(25:12):
me, but it's really been apleasure to connect with like
minded women who are passionateabout this topic.
Speaker 2 (25:17):
You know Seattle's just up the coast from
California, so you know come on,we'd love to have you.
Well, we ask our podcast gueststhe same question what's the
best piece of advice you've everreceived or given?
Speaker 3 (25:33):
So this is echoing April's earlier sentiment, which
is advice from my mother, whoalways taught me that if you
don't ask, you won't get, andask with a smile, and I really
feel that that made me who I amtoday, because I'm not afraid am
today because I'm not afraid toask, I'm not afraid to confront
(25:54):
which gets a bad, you know,reputation or connotations.
But if you ask kindly and ifyou ask for the right reasons,
you're going to make change andI think that I really take that
to heart.
Speaker 2 (26:07):
I love that.
I love that you learned thatfrom your mom.
Oh, thanks for joining us today.
Speaker 1 (26:13):
Great conversation and an important conversation, I
think you know, as we noted atthe very beginning of this
podcast, we hear a lot frommillennials that I don't need to
worry about this yet, and wejust talked about the importance
of building your tribe andhaving information and educating
yourself, advocating foryourself both in and outside of
(26:34):
the workplace.
So thank you for shedding lighton this topic, for writing the
book and for taking the time tobe with us today, Lauren.
We really appreciate it.
Speaker 3 (26:44):
Thank you so much and I hope I see you in person soon
.
Speaker 1 (26:48):
Absolutely and for all of our listeners, until we
meet again.
Go find joy in the journey.
Bye, lauren, thank you, bye.
Thank you.
Thank you for listening to theMedovia Menopause Podcast.
If you enjoyed today's show,please give it a thumbs up.
Subscribe for future episodes,leave a review and share this
episode with a friend.
(27:09):
Medovia is out to change thenarrative.
Learn more at medoviacom.
That's M-I-D-O-V-I-A dot com.
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