June 4, 2024 • 22 mins
Can employee ownership change the game in addressing income inequality? Discover how this transformative approach can lead to better wages, improved working conditions, and enhanced company performance as we explore the growing challenge of limited wealth-building pathways in America. Drawing insights from a compelling Forbes article and economic forecasts, we delve into the cautionary views of experts like Albert Edwards, who warn against market complacency, prompting a search for alternative investment opportunities outside Wall Street. And don't miss the inspiring story of Dakin Kramer, a fifth-grader whose heartfelt initiative raised over $7,000 to clear his classmates' lunch debts, underscoring the power of community support.
As we shift our focus to the severe housing crisis, particularly in California, we confront the daunting need for over two million additional homes just to match the national per capita average. The staggering housing costs have far-reaching consequences, forcing young adults to live with family and complicating hiring for local businesses. Join our conversation with Sibley Simon from New Way Homes, as he introduces innovative solutions for providing affordable housing while offering returns on investment. We also tackle the intertwined challenges of social safety nets and historical racial discrimination in housing, advocating for equitable solutions that bolster community growth. This episode promises a comprehensive exploration of how community-driven efforts and local investments can foster sustainable change and economic resilience.
www.newwayhomes.org
This program is brought to you by:
Arc Integrated
Be sure to visit BizRadio.US to discover hundreds more engaging conversations, local events and more.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Joel (00:00):
What if investing in each other could change the world?
I'm Joel Skeen with bizradiousand this is the Mindful
Marketplace.
Welcome, welcome to anotheredition of the Mindful
Marketplace here on Biz Radio US.
I'm your host, joel Skeen, ifthis is your first time with us.
On this program, we talk to theentrepreneurs, advisors,
(00:23):
industry leaders, investors andeconomic experts who are
questioning the assumption thatthere's just one bottom line.
It's where we learn how toconnect our money and businesses
to our values, our communityand ourselves.
Today I'll be talking withSibley Simon from New Way Homes
about how they are solving thehousing crisis with community
investment.
But first the balance sheet theassets, liabilities, debts and
(00:47):
investments.
Okay, first, in the assetscolumn, I want to talk about an
article in Forbes about howthere's a growing problem of
limited pathways for Americansto build wealth and assets.
Income and wealth inequality inthe US are at unprecedented
levels, with the top 1%controlling more wealth than the
entire middle class andlow-income Americans owning just
(01:07):
3% of the country's wealth.
But many see new alternativemodels for ownership as a
pathway to wealth creation.
Social innovators are leadingefforts to promote employee
ownership.
Ownership, as opposed to justhigher wages, enables the
accrual of equity and wealthover time, providing more
control and choice, for example,research has shown in the
(01:31):
article.
It talks about howemployee-owned businesses lead
to better wages, workingconditions and company
performance overall.
Expanding ownership could be aforce for adjusting the economy
to allow more people to partakein economic growth, potentially
overcoming some of the wealthgap issues that we talked about.
However, it talks about howachieving this goal will require
(01:53):
a significant capital tofacilitate employee buyouts,
provide low-interest loans andcompete with private equity
firms.
The public sector can play arole through policies and
incentives that support theownership economy, but there are
innovators who are guiding theevolution of this economy,
emphasizing social enterprisesand community development.
(02:13):
So if you're interested in thisanything we talk about in this
show I think you're going to geta lot out of this article.
Expanding ownership and wealthbuilding opportunities has
broader political support thanefforts to expand social welfare
.
It aligns them more with theAmerican values of equality and
opportunity.
So in the liabilities column, Ido want to hit on the Wall
(02:35):
Street boom and bust cycle.
So you know there are a lot ofeconomic forecasters that have
shifted from predicting arecession to predicting more
optimism.
But this article in Money Watchtalks about how, despite the
positive outlook, some experts,such as Albert Edwards, are
cautioning against complacency.
They argue that while certaineconomic indicators, such as
(02:56):
non-farm payrolls and GDP, havebeen strong, other less
prominent readings, like theChicago Fed National Activity
Index and Consumer ConfidenceSurveys, paints a more
concerning picture.
The discrepancy suggests thatthe economy may not be as robust
as the official data indicates.
Additionally, there areconcerns about the level of
complacency in the market,reminiscent of the period before
(03:17):
2007, when the global financialcrisis happened.
Even bullish market strategistsare becoming uneasy about the
exuberance in stock markets, asevidenced by a high level of
bullish sentiments amongindividual investors.
The article also mentions therecent performance of the main
US stock indexes, which aretraded mostly lower after
(03:40):
hitting record highs.
Given the uncertainty andcaution expressed by some
experts regarding the economyand stock market, many people
are looking for alternative waysto invest their money outside
of Wall Street.
This search for alternativeinvestment opportunities may
stem from concerns around thepotential risks associated with
traditional stock marketinvestments, especially in light
(04:01):
of the warnings aboutcomplacency and the historical
parallels drawn to the periodbefore the 2007 and 2008 global
crisis.
Investors may be exploringother options like real estate,
commodities, bonds or local andimpact investment vehicles that
are less correlated withtraditional Wall Street boom and
bust and that are not solelyreliant on the performance of
(04:23):
the stock market.
That may be a strategy for alot of people is that
individuals are considering tomitigate potential risks and
capitalize on opportunities inother sectors of the economy,
like their own local economy.
All right, in the debts column Ihave somewhat of a heartwarming
and also kind of heartbreakingstory of a Dak and Kramer, a
fifth grade student from BlueSprings Missouri.
(04:44):
Heartbreaking story of a DakinKramer, a fifth grade student
from Blue Springs, missouri.
He's captured the nation'sattention because he set out to
raise a few hundred dollars tohelp pay off his classmates
lunch debt, but his effortsactually far exceeded his
initial goal.
This is a, you know, incredibleyoung kid.
Though his determined, throughhis determination and compassion
, he managed to raise animpressive $7,370, completely
(05:05):
clearing any negative lunchbalances for his fellow students
and even having a surplus leftover.
This kind selfless actresonated with people across the
country.
Donations poured in fromvarious states with amounts
ranging from $50 to up to even$1,000.
The fundraising efforts notonly alleviated his school lunch
(05:28):
, the school's lunch debt, butalso garnered heartfelt messages
from his schoolmates familiesexpressing admiration for his
exemplary character and hisability to inspire both children
and adults to do good forothers.
However, the heartwarming storydoes shed a light on the
prevalent issue in America,which is school lunch debt.
(05:49):
Many families struggle toafford school lunches for their
children, leading toaccumulating debt that can place
a significant burden on boththe students and the school.
Dracken's actions highlight theimpact of the financial strain
and the importance of thecommunity support in addressing
it.
His success in alleviating thelunch debt underscores the need
for a sustainable solution thatensures that no child goes
(06:10):
hungry or faces financialhardship due to school meal
expenses.
Dracn's remarkable initiativenot only exemplifies the power
of compassion and generosity,but it also serves as a reminder
of the ongoing challenges facedby many families providing
basic necessities for theirchildren.
As Dakin, you know,contemplates his future effort
(06:31):
in the transition to middleschool, his story serves as an
inspiration for communities tocome together and support
initiatives aimed at alleviatingschool lunch debt and ensuring
that every child has access tonutritious meals without the
burden of financial strain.
And as a reminder, in order tohelp combat the debt crisis, my
insurance agency, skeenFinancial, is providing all
(06:53):
listeners of the MindfulMarketplace with a free,
customized report on how you canbest eliminate debt, based on
your unique situation.
This report has helpedindividuals, families and small
businesses eliminate their debt,including mortgages, in nine
years or less without spendingany additional money.
(07:13):
So you can get your freecustomized report on how to get
debt-free by going toSkeenFinancialcom and, lastly,
in the investments column.
So I wanted to talk a little bitabout an op-ed in Nonprofit
Quarterly.
The op-ed highlights uniquemotivations and challenges faced
by Black-owned businesses,emphasizing the importance of
(07:34):
freedom, financial stability andthe role of collective action
in their entrepreneurial journey.
It discusses the contrastbetween the venture capital
approach and the foundation ofsuccess for Black black owned
businesses, emphasizing thehistorical significance of
collective action within theblack community.
It also delves into the contextof the quote black tax and how
(07:54):
black owned businesses rely oncommunity support in the face of
unfair practices and policies.
The piece provides a lot ofhistorical and contemporary
examples of how collectiveaction has been crucial for
addressing injustice anddiscrimination, ultimately
underscoring the vital role ofcommunity support overcoming
strategic discrimination.
So it also talks a lot abouthow investment the tides are
(08:26):
changing and how there is morecollective involvement,
collective action, on theinvestment side of things.
So really interesting, reallyinteresting article.
Check out that and that'll doit here for the balance sheet
the assets, liabilities, debtsand investments.
All right, I am excited to getto talk with sibley simon of new
way home.
Sibley, welcome.
Thanks for getting to be on theshow here today.
Sibley (08:41):
Thank you so much.
Joel (08:41):
I'm excited to be here, yeah, yeah, really glad to have
you.
I you know.
I think I want to start byasking a little bit.
I know New Way Homes is reallydoing a lot of work to solve
some of the housing crisisissues that we've talked about
on this show and you know thatwe've talked about.
You know that are just beingtalked about kind of all over
the place.
Sibley (09:19):
But first, I guess you know I'd like for people to get
to know you just a little bitand I come from farming families
that were always doing newthings.
But then I started a couple ofsoftware companies.
So I was in tech as a founderand learned a ton through that
but really wanted to move mywork to something that mattered
(09:42):
more to me fundamentally and itwas more, a little more based in
my own community.
So I felt a little burned outafter 14 years of working really
hard on software startup stuff.
It took some time off, had akid got volunteering.
A lot One thing led to anotherand I started.
I joined the board of the localorganization that focuses on
(10:03):
addressing homelessness helpingfamilies and individuals exit
homelessness and was reallyinspired by leaders there that
we needed to change a lot in oursystem to make better use of
resources to help folks who havebeen long-term homeless get all
the way out.
Once someone's been homelessfor a while, they tend to stay
that way a very long time andthen die on the streets, and so
(10:27):
those folks were being verypoorly served by the hodgepodge
of a patchwork of social safetynet things we have, you know, in
the US and that there are costeffective solutions, and so we
were learning from elsewhere gotinto that.
We were taking a very businessapproach of how do we be cost
effective and just get morepeople out of homelessness every
month, track it, find thebottlenecks, improve it, you
(10:48):
know, change how uh resourcesare spent, etc.
It was all great and againlearned from what was working in
other parts of the country, hadgoals and we really hit a
ceiling in our county.
Uh, 12 people a month or so iswhat we could collectively get
out of long-term homelessness.
And the ceiling was reallyabout the bottleneck we couldn't
(11:08):
move the needle on was housing,and and so that was a that was
one I was like just how do weget some housing, you know?
And then, even when we could payfor it, we could get vouchers,
you know, to help someone asthey improve their life, get
back on their feet.
We could pay for the housing,but we'd be competing against
100 people that show up for oneapartment, you know, including
(11:30):
school teachers, everybody elsein our community, and then I see
the social services workers whoare providing the services to
help change someone's life.
Who's in that position?
And we would have thesediscussions on the board.
Are we employing people intohomelessness, folks who are
providing these services, youknow, who themselves are not
getting paid enough to live inreally expensive communities in
(11:53):
coastal California, you know,and when I learned about a
social services worker who wasliving in a van, I mean it was
just like you know.
This is a complete disaster forour community.
And realizing that climatechange goals, you know, health
care, all this stuff comes backto housing, so I was just like
(12:13):
that's got to be the thing thatI want to try to work on.
What can we do?
Joel (12:19):
Well, you're definitely right about about that point
there about service workers, youknow, people who are doing the
social work and doing the casemanagement.
That's where I started.
My career was in casemanagement of chronically
homeless folks, people who hadbeen homeless for at least a
year, and I just remember beingin a similar situation where,
you know, I wasn't even making30 grand a year and I had to,
(12:42):
like you know, live in Ann Arbor, Michigan, the pretty nice like
town, and also the other thingthat you mentioned about the
competition among for thehousing themselves.
We would.
That was my direct experience.
I had a caseload of about 20clients who were all vying for
three or four, maybe fivehousing vouchers, and so it was
(13:04):
really different.
We had to we were in anunfortunate position of scarcity
to try to figure out okay, howdo we pick?
Which person is, you know quoteunquote worthy of this home,
when in my mind, they you knowthey were much better at getting
jobs and, you know, working ontheir mental health and working
on their substance abuse issuesonce they got that housing.
But you're right, there didseem to be that same kind of
(13:26):
wall there.
It's been 10 years or no,probably 15 years since I've
done that, though, I'm curiouswhat you've seen when it comes
to the problems of housing.
I live in a town where there'sa lot of workforce housing
issues.
There's also a hugehomelessness problem, I guess.
What do you see as being someof the biggest problems around
(13:49):
housing from your perspective?
Sibley (13:51):
Yeah, thank you, and what I was describing for me was
10 years ago and now I've spenta decade fully diving into this
challenge and I just open anyconversation with saying that I
see there being three separatehousing crises in our country
and large parts of our country,and one is supply.
(14:14):
There are just not enough homesand there's even a little bit
of mythology around like, oh, ifthere weren't so many vacation
homes or Airbnbs and you canhave one little place where
that's kind of true, but ingeneral that's not the issue.
There just are not nearlyenough homes, and so California
is the biggest area, that's theworst off.
(14:35):
But there are many other placesin the country where that's
true.
But a stat that illustrates isan example.
You take the entire state ofCalifornia.
We would need over two millionmore homes to have the same
amount of housing per capitathat the rest of the United
States has.
So that's why housing is evenmore expensive in California,
because we're auctioning it.
We don't have enough.
(14:56):
It's a scarce resource.
There's literally not enoughfor the people who live here
Everybody, you know peopledouble, tripled up.
The majority of adults underthe age of 34 are living with
their parents or family members,you know, et cetera.
So we've already done all thatkind of mitigation measures and
we're auctioning it off and itkeeps getting more expensive.
So you know, scarce good pricegoes up and plenty of other
(15:16):
places in the U?
S where that's happening.
So that's the supply, like weactually just need more homes.
And second is that social safetynet which we were both
referring to, that everywhere inthe United States there are at
least some folks who can'tafford any safe housing to live
in and so that's a again asocial safety net.
(15:37):
And it's very hard to get intoa better economic position.
You may need other things aswell, but you have to have a
safe place to sleep and live inorder to deal with other issues
or get employment and keep it,et cetera.
So that's a social safety netproblem.
We have that at a very lowincome, extremely low income end
(16:00):
.
And the third is racial equityand housing is one of the areas
in which there's been the mosthistorical discrimination in our
country.
That's what we call segregationright, but there are still many
effects from that, from theliteral redlining that happened,
and many of those are still inplace today.
There are many, many places inthe United States where the
(16:23):
property tax is higher per, say,$100,000 of home value in
places that were redlined thanplaces that were not, because of
formulas that are still inplace that don't say that, oh,
this is a minority neighborhoodor neighborhood of color, but it
still is, and the formula makesit more expensive on property
tech.
That's just one, many examples.
(16:44):
And so often then, as sometimesyou get solutions to the supply
problem, which is a bunch ofhousing getting built in
somewhere that isdisproportionately displacing a
community of color that's thegentrification challenge, and
that's not always the case, butit can be the case and then you
(17:04):
say, oh, you're solving one ofthese problems.
You might be making one of themworse.
You really got to look at allof it together.
Joel (17:11):
Yeah, how do you feel like the business communities kind
of come into that equation?
Do you see an opportunity forsort of the business, local
business communities in generalto you know, kind of invest in
their own communities but alsoin effect investing in
themselves in the long run?
Obviously, if there's astronger community around them,
(17:33):
there's more people to you knowsupport their business.
Yeah, I'm curious yourperspective on that.
Sibley (17:40):
Tremendously.
So it literally was at a boardmeeting yesterday of the Santa
Cruz County Business Council andthere's no question that,
broadly speaking, you know,local businesses here see
housing as their number oneissue because it's very hard for
them to hire and retain staffbecause of the housing costs.
Hard for them to hire andretain staff because of the
housing costs, hard for them topay enough for that, and then
(18:02):
customers affected by that aswell, this amount of disposable
income people have, et cetera,et cetera.
So there's a business groupthat has come together and
unequivocally support solutionsto the housing crisis.
Some businesses have theability to make a financial
investment, some don't, andwe'll talk later about how we've
(18:23):
engaged with that.
But there's no question thebusiness groups and communities
and individual businesses comingtogether because a lot of the
supply problem comes back topolitical issues and the reason
it's worse in places you knowthe reasons a number of places
in our country are not nearly asgood at creating housing as
(18:45):
they are creating jobs isbecause they put land use
policies in place that empowerpeople who live in local
neighborhoods, who just don'tfear change, don't want things
to change, don't want a buildingto be built down the street,
worried about parking, traffic,views, whatever, and they're
empowered to just stop it fromhappening.
And businesses can help standup and say no, but we need this.
(19:09):
Let's do it thoughtfully, let'splan for it and then actually
do it to provide that balance.
Actually do it to provide thatbalance.
Joel (19:16):
Yeah, and it seems like what your guys' approach, which
is what I'm really excited toget into in part two of our
conversation here.
For those of you listening outthere, this is going to be a
two-part conversation withSibley and in the second half
we're going to get more intoexactly how New Way Homes is
actually allowing.
Earlier, when I mentionedpeople looking for alternatives
(19:39):
to Wall Street investing andlooking for ways to invest their
money in their localcommunities, how there's
actually ways where you can earna return on your money but also
be investing into affordablehousing for your local community
.
Sibley, is there anything thatyou can kind of tease us with
that as far as just in the nextkind of minute or so about what
(20:02):
that's meant?
Sibley (20:04):
Yeah, absolutely.
That's the cornerstone of whatwe're doing, because the whole
reason I got into this isbecause I did some spreadsheets
and realized, well, we can builda housing that's more mixed
income, that's affordable to farmore folks and return some
money to investors.
It just doesn't provide thesuper high returns that a
national equity fund, who seeseach project as a very risky,
(20:27):
that they want to seek, and sowe don't have to rely on public
funds that are grants foraffordable housing.
That's great, but there's notenough of it to solve the
problem.
So that's out there.
We don't want to compete forthat.
It all gets used.
There's another model andthat's what we're.
That's what we set off tocreate and are having real
success with is doing exactlythat.
Joel (20:48):
Yeah, I'm excited to dig into that.
So make sure to tune in nextweek here on biz radio us on
Tuesdays when we air.
You can also make sure tosubscribe.
That's one of the best ways youcan help.
The efforts that we have hereon the show is to subscribe.
Leave us a review on Spotify,on iTunes, on Stitcher,
iheartmedia, anywhere you getyour podcasts, youtube we're now
(21:11):
up on YouTube as well.
So subscribe, leave us a likeand a comment, engage with us
and tell us what you think.
And in the meantime, make sureto check out newwayhomesorg if
you want to learn more aboutwhat they're doing.
And until next time, rememberwe are each other.
What if investing in each other could change the world?
I'm Joel Skeen with bizradiousand this is the Mindful
Marketplace.
Welcome, welcome to anotheredition of the Mindful
Marketplace here on Biz Radio US.
I'm your host, joel Skeen, ifthis is your first time with us.
On this program, we talk to theentrepreneurs, advisors,
(00:23):
industry leaders, investors andeconomic experts who are
questioning the assumption thatthere's just one bottom line.
It's where we learn how toconnect our money and businesses
to our values, our communityand ourselves.
Today I'll be talking withSibley Simon from New Way Homes
about how they are solving thehousing crisis with community
investment.
But first the balance sheet theassets, liabilities, debts and
(00:47):
investments.
Okay, first, in the assetscolumn, I want to talk about an
article in Forbes about howthere's a growing problem of
limited pathways for Americansto build wealth and assets.
Income and wealth inequality inthe US are at unprecedented
levels, with the top 1%controlling more wealth than the
entire middle class andlow-income Americans owning just
(01:07):
3% of the country's wealth.
But many see new alternativemodels for ownership as a
pathway to wealth creation.
Social innovators are leadingefforts to promote employee
ownership.
Ownership, as opposed to justhigher wages, enables the
accrual of equity and wealthover time, providing more
control and choice, for example,research has shown in the
(01:31):
article.
It talks about howemployee-owned businesses lead
to better wages, workingconditions and company
performance overall.
Expanding ownership could be aforce for adjusting the economy
to allow more people to partakein economic growth, potentially
overcoming some of the wealthgap issues that we talked about.
However, it talks about howachieving this goal will require
(01:53):
a significant capital tofacilitate employee buyouts,
provide low-interest loans andcompete with private equity
firms.
The public sector can play arole through policies and
incentives that support theownership economy, but there are
innovators who are guiding theevolution of this economy,
emphasizing social enterprisesand community development.
(02:13):
So if you're interested in thisanything we talk about in this
show I think you're going to geta lot out of this article.
Expanding ownership and wealthbuilding opportunities has
broader political support thanefforts to expand social welfare
.
It aligns them more with theAmerican values of equality and
opportunity.
So in the liabilities column, Ido want to hit on the Wall
(02:35):
Street boom and bust cycle.
So you know there are a lot ofeconomic forecasters that have
shifted from predicting arecession to predicting more
optimism.
But this article in Money Watchtalks about how, despite the
positive outlook, some experts,such as Albert Edwards, are
cautioning against complacency.
They argue that while certaineconomic indicators, such as
(02:56):
non-farm payrolls and GDP, havebeen strong, other less
prominent readings, like theChicago Fed National Activity
Index and Consumer ConfidenceSurveys, paints a more
concerning picture.
The discrepancy suggests thatthe economy may not be as robust
as the official data indicates.
Additionally, there areconcerns about the level of
complacency in the market,reminiscent of the period before
(03:17):
2007, when the global financialcrisis happened.
Even bullish market strategistsare becoming uneasy about the
exuberance in stock markets, asevidenced by a high level of
bullish sentiments amongindividual investors.
The article also mentions therecent performance of the main
US stock indexes, which aretraded mostly lower after
(03:40):
hitting record highs.
Given the uncertainty andcaution expressed by some
experts regarding the economyand stock market, many people
are looking for alternative waysto invest their money outside
of Wall Street.
This search for alternativeinvestment opportunities may
stem from concerns around thepotential risks associated with
traditional stock marketinvestments, especially in light
(04:01):
of the warnings aboutcomplacency and the historical
parallels drawn to the periodbefore the 2007 and 2008 global
crisis.
Investors may be exploringother options like real estate,
commodities, bonds or local andimpact investment vehicles that
are less correlated withtraditional Wall Street boom and
bust and that are not solelyreliant on the performance of
(04:23):
the stock market.
That may be a strategy for alot of people is that
individuals are considering tomitigate potential risks and
capitalize on opportunities inother sectors of the economy,
like their own local economy.
All right, in the debts column Ihave somewhat of a heartwarming
and also kind of heartbreakingstory of a Dak and Kramer, a
fifth grade student from BlueSprings Missouri.
(04:44):
Heartbreaking story of a DakinKramer, a fifth grade student
from Blue Springs, missouri.
He's captured the nation'sattention because he set out to
raise a few hundred dollars tohelp pay off his classmates
lunch debt, but his effortsactually far exceeded his
initial goal.
This is a, you know, incredibleyoung kid.
Though his determined, throughhis determination and compassion
, he managed to raise animpressive $7,370, completely
(05:05):
clearing any negative lunchbalances for his fellow students
and even having a surplus leftover.
This kind selfless actresonated with people across the
country.
Donations poured in fromvarious states with amounts
ranging from $50 to up to even$1,000.
The fundraising efforts notonly alleviated his school lunch
(05:28):
, the school's lunch debt, butalso garnered heartfelt messages
from his schoolmates familiesexpressing admiration for his
exemplary character and hisability to inspire both children
and adults to do good forothers.
However, the heartwarming storydoes shed a light on the
prevalent issue in America,which is school lunch debt.
(05:49):
Many families struggle toafford school lunches for their
children, leading toaccumulating debt that can place
a significant burden on boththe students and the school.
Dracken's actions highlight theimpact of the financial strain
and the importance of thecommunity support in addressing
it.
His success in alleviating thelunch debt underscores the need
for a sustainable solution thatensures that no child goes
(06:10):
hungry or faces financialhardship due to school meal
expenses.
Dracn's remarkable initiativenot only exemplifies the power
of compassion and generosity,but it also serves as a reminder
of the ongoing challenges facedby many families providing
basic necessities for theirchildren.
As Dakin, you know,contemplates his future effort
(06:31):
in the transition to middleschool, his story serves as an
inspiration for communities tocome together and support
initiatives aimed at alleviatingschool lunch debt and ensuring
that every child has access tonutritious meals without the
burden of financial strain.
And as a reminder, in order tohelp combat the debt crisis, my
insurance agency, skeenFinancial, is providing all
(06:53):
listeners of the MindfulMarketplace with a free,
customized report on how you canbest eliminate debt, based on
your unique situation.
This report has helpedindividuals, families and small
businesses eliminate their debt,including mortgages, in nine
years or less without spendingany additional money.
(07:13):
So you can get your freecustomized report on how to get
debt-free by going toSkeenFinancialcom and, lastly,
in the investments column.
So I wanted to talk a little bitabout an op-ed in Nonprofit
Quarterly.
The op-ed highlights uniquemotivations and challenges faced
by Black-owned businesses,emphasizing the importance of
(07:34):
freedom, financial stability andthe role of collective action
in their entrepreneurial journey.
It discusses the contrastbetween the venture capital
approach and the foundation ofsuccess for Black black owned
businesses, emphasizing thehistorical significance of
collective action within theblack community.
It also delves into the contextof the quote black tax and how
(07:54):
black owned businesses rely oncommunity support in the face of
unfair practices and policies.
The piece provides a lot ofhistorical and contemporary
examples of how collectiveaction has been crucial for
addressing injustice anddiscrimination, ultimately
underscoring the vital role ofcommunity support overcoming
strategic discrimination.
So it also talks a lot abouthow investment the tides are
(08:26):
changing and how there is morecollective involvement,
collective action, on theinvestment side of things.
So really interesting, reallyinteresting article.
Check out that and that'll doit here for the balance sheet
the assets, liabilities, debtsand investments.
All right, I am excited to getto talk with sibley simon of new
way home.
Sibley, welcome.
Thanks for getting to be on theshow here today.
Sibley (08:41):
Thank you so much.
Joel (08:41):
I'm excited to be here, yeah, yeah, really glad to have
you.
I you know.
I think I want to start byasking a little bit.
I know New Way Homes is reallydoing a lot of work to solve
some of the housing crisisissues that we've talked about
on this show and you know thatwe've talked about.
You know that are just beingtalked about kind of all over
the place.
Sibley (09:19):
But first, I guess you know I'd like for people to get
to know you just a little bitand I come from farming families
that were always doing newthings.
But then I started a couple ofsoftware companies.
So I was in tech as a founderand learned a ton through that
but really wanted to move mywork to something that mattered
(09:42):
more to me fundamentally and itwas more, a little more based in
my own community.
So I felt a little burned outafter 14 years of working really
hard on software startup stuff.
It took some time off, had akid got volunteering.
A lot One thing led to anotherand I started.
I joined the board of the localorganization that focuses on
(10:03):
addressing homelessness helpingfamilies and individuals exit
homelessness and was reallyinspired by leaders there that
we needed to change a lot in oursystem to make better use of
resources to help folks who havebeen long-term homeless get all
the way out.
Once someone's been homelessfor a while, they tend to stay
that way a very long time andthen die on the streets, and so
(10:27):
those folks were being verypoorly served by the hodgepodge
of a patchwork of social safetynet things we have, you know, in
the US and that there are costeffective solutions, and so we
were learning from elsewhere gotinto that.
We were taking a very businessapproach of how do we be cost
effective and just get morepeople out of homelessness every
month, track it, find thebottlenecks, improve it, you
(10:48):
know, change how uh resourcesare spent, etc.
It was all great and againlearned from what was working in
other parts of the country, hadgoals and we really hit a
ceiling in our county.
Uh, 12 people a month or so iswhat we could collectively get
out of long-term homelessness.
And the ceiling was reallyabout the bottleneck we couldn't
(11:08):
move the needle on was housing,and and so that was a that was
one I was like just how do weget some housing, you know?
And then, even when we could payfor it, we could get vouchers,
you know, to help someone asthey improve their life, get
back on their feet.
We could pay for the housing,but we'd be competing against
100 people that show up for oneapartment, you know, including
(11:30):
school teachers, everybody elsein our community, and then I see
the social services workers whoare providing the services to
help change someone's life.
Who's in that position?
And we would have thesediscussions on the board.
Are we employing people intohomelessness, folks who are
providing these services, youknow, who themselves are not
getting paid enough to live inreally expensive communities in
(11:53):
coastal California, you know,and when I learned about a
social services worker who wasliving in a van, I mean it was
just like you know.
This is a complete disaster forour community.
And realizing that climatechange goals, you know, health
care, all this stuff comes backto housing, so I was just like
(12:13):
that's got to be the thing thatI want to try to work on.
What can we do?
Joel (12:19):
Well, you're definitely right about about that point
there about service workers, youknow, people who are doing the
social work and doing the casemanagement.
That's where I started.
My career was in casemanagement of chronically
homeless folks, people who hadbeen homeless for at least a
year, and I just remember beingin a similar situation where,
you know, I wasn't even making30 grand a year and I had to,
(12:42):
like you know, live in Ann Arbor, Michigan, the pretty nice like
town, and also the other thingthat you mentioned about the
competition among for thehousing themselves.
We would.
That was my direct experience.
I had a caseload of about 20clients who were all vying for
three or four, maybe fivehousing vouchers, and so it was
(13:04):
really different.
We had to we were in anunfortunate position of scarcity
to try to figure out okay, howdo we pick?
Which person is, you know quoteunquote worthy of this home,
when in my mind, they you knowthey were much better at getting
jobs and, you know, working ontheir mental health and working
on their substance abuse issuesonce they got that housing.
But you're right, there didseem to be that same kind of
(13:26):
wall there.
It's been 10 years or no,probably 15 years since I've
done that, though, I'm curiouswhat you've seen when it comes
to the problems of housing.
I live in a town where there'sa lot of workforce housing
issues.
There's also a hugehomelessness problem, I guess.
What do you see as being someof the biggest problems around
(13:49):
housing from your perspective?
Sibley (13:51):
Yeah, thank you, and what I was describing for me was
10 years ago and now I've spenta decade fully diving into this
challenge and I just open anyconversation with saying that I
see there being three separatehousing crises in our country
and large parts of our country,and one is supply.
(14:14):
There are just not enough homesand there's even a little bit
of mythology around like, oh, ifthere weren't so many vacation
homes or Airbnbs and you canhave one little place where
that's kind of true, but ingeneral that's not the issue.
There just are not nearlyenough homes, and so California
is the biggest area, that's theworst off.
(14:35):
But there are many other placesin the country where that's
true.
But a stat that illustrates isan example.
You take the entire state ofCalifornia.
We would need over two millionmore homes to have the same
amount of housing per capitathat the rest of the United
States has.
So that's why housing is evenmore expensive in California,
because we're auctioning it.
We don't have enough.
(14:56):
It's a scarce resource.
There's literally not enoughfor the people who live here
Everybody, you know peopledouble, tripled up.
The majority of adults underthe age of 34 are living with
their parents or family members,you know, et cetera.
So we've already done all thatkind of mitigation measures and
we're auctioning it off and itkeeps getting more expensive.
So you know, scarce good pricegoes up and plenty of other
(15:16):
places in the U?
S where that's happening.
So that's the supply, like weactually just need more homes.
And second is that social safetynet which we were both
referring to, that everywhere inthe United States there are at
least some folks who can'tafford any safe housing to live
in and so that's a again asocial safety net.
(15:37):
And it's very hard to get intoa better economic position.
You may need other things aswell, but you have to have a
safe place to sleep and live inorder to deal with other issues
or get employment and keep it,et cetera.
So that's a social safety netproblem.
We have that at a very lowincome, extremely low income end
(16:00):
.
And the third is racial equityand housing is one of the areas
in which there's been the mosthistorical discrimination in our
country.
That's what we call segregationright, but there are still many
effects from that, from theliteral redlining that happened,
and many of those are still inplace today.
There are many, many places inthe United States where the
(16:23):
property tax is higher per, say,$100,000 of home value in
places that were redlined thanplaces that were not, because of
formulas that are still inplace that don't say that, oh,
this is a minority neighborhoodor neighborhood of color, but it
still is, and the formula makesit more expensive on property
tech.
That's just one, many examples.
(16:44):
And so often then, as sometimesyou get solutions to the supply
problem, which is a bunch ofhousing getting built in
somewhere that isdisproportionately displacing a
community of color that's thegentrification challenge, and
that's not always the case, butit can be the case and then you
(17:04):
say, oh, you're solving one ofthese problems.
You might be making one of themworse.
You really got to look at allof it together.
Joel (17:11):
Yeah, how do you feel like the business communities kind
of come into that equation?
Do you see an opportunity forsort of the business, local
business communities in generalto you know, kind of invest in
their own communities but alsoin effect investing in
themselves in the long run?
Obviously, if there's astronger community around them,
(17:33):
there's more people to you knowsupport their business.
Yeah, I'm curious yourperspective on that.
Sibley (17:40):
Tremendously.
So it literally was at a boardmeeting yesterday of the Santa
Cruz County Business Council andthere's no question that,
broadly speaking, you know,local businesses here see
housing as their number oneissue because it's very hard for
them to hire and retain staffbecause of the housing costs.
Hard for them to hire andretain staff because of the
housing costs, hard for them topay enough for that, and then
(18:02):
customers affected by that aswell, this amount of disposable
income people have, et cetera,et cetera.
So there's a business groupthat has come together and
unequivocally support solutionsto the housing crisis.
Some businesses have theability to make a financial
investment, some don't, andwe'll talk later about how we've
(18:23):
engaged with that.
But there's no question thebusiness groups and communities
and individual businesses comingtogether because a lot of the
supply problem comes back topolitical issues and the reason
it's worse in places you knowthe reasons a number of places
in our country are not nearly asgood at creating housing as
(18:45):
they are creating jobs isbecause they put land use
policies in place that empowerpeople who live in local
neighborhoods, who just don'tfear change, don't want things
to change, don't want a buildingto be built down the street,
worried about parking, traffic,views, whatever, and they're
empowered to just stop it fromhappening.
And businesses can help standup and say no, but we need this.
(19:09):
Let's do it thoughtfully, let'splan for it and then actually
do it to provide that balance.
Actually do it to provide thatbalance.
Joel (19:16):
Yeah, and it seems like what your guys' approach, which
is what I'm really excited toget into in part two of our
conversation here.
For those of you listening outthere, this is going to be a
two-part conversation withSibley and in the second half
we're going to get more intoexactly how New Way Homes is
actually allowing.
Earlier, when I mentionedpeople looking for alternatives
(19:39):
to Wall Street investing andlooking for ways to invest their
money in their localcommunities, how there's
actually ways where you can earna return on your money but also
be investing into affordablehousing for your local community
.
Sibley, is there anything thatyou can kind of tease us with
that as far as just in the nextkind of minute or so about what
(20:02):
that's meant?
Sibley (20:04):
Yeah, absolutely.
That's the cornerstone of whatwe're doing, because the whole
reason I got into this isbecause I did some spreadsheets
and realized, well, we can builda housing that's more mixed
income, that's affordable to farmore folks and return some
money to investors.
It just doesn't provide thesuper high returns that a
national equity fund, who seeseach project as a very risky,
(20:27):
that they want to seek, and sowe don't have to rely on public
funds that are grants foraffordable housing.
That's great, but there's notenough of it to solve the
problem.
So that's out there.
We don't want to compete forthat.
It all gets used.
There's another model andthat's what we're.
That's what we set off tocreate and are having real
success with is doing exactlythat.
Joel (20:48):
Yeah, I'm excited to dig into that.
So make sure to tune in nextweek here on biz radio us on
Tuesdays when we air.
You can also make sure tosubscribe.
That's one of the best ways youcan help.
The efforts that we have hereon the show is to subscribe.
Leave us a review on Spotify,on iTunes, on Stitcher,
iheartmedia, anywhere you getyour podcasts, youtube we're now
(21:11):
up on YouTube as well.
So subscribe, leave us a likeand a comment, engage with us
and tell us what you think.
And in the meantime, make sureto check out newwayhomesorg if
you want to learn more aboutwhat they're doing.
And until next time, rememberwe are each other.
Popular Podcasts
United States of Kennedy
United States of Kennedy is a podcast about our cultural fascination with the Kennedy dynasty. Every week, hosts Lyra Smith and George Civeris go into one aspect of the Kennedy story.
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com