September 4, 2025 • 33 mins
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EPISODE DESCRIPTION
In this episode, Dean and Jason are joined by Chris Pughe & Danny Duong, both Mortgage Brokers with Mortgage Architects, and newly minted Broker Relationship Managers, or BRMs, with A Better Way Group.
Having a combined 55 years of industry experience between them, Chris & Danny bring invlauable experience to the new BRM role, which focuses on guiding professionals through the complex transition of joining the brokerage. Through personalized onboarding, hands-on training, and emotional support, they're creating a welcoming community that sets-up new brokers at A Better Way for long-term success.
Chris & Danny are here to discuss:
→ The creation of the BRM position and why they are the perfect fits to pilot this role at ABW.
→ The importance of a seamless onboarding process and easing the banker to broker transition for new brokers.
→ Being the conduit of community for new team members and creating an inclusive culture through mentorship.
→ How they balance the BRM role with their personal books of business.
→ Tips for aspiring mentors and future opportunities in the BRM role.
→ Why brokers keep coming back to ABW after testing other brokerages.
Chris Pughe's Website: www.thatmortgagebrokerchris.com
Chris Pughe's Instagram: @thatmortgagebrokerchris
Chris Pughe's LinkedIn: @ChrisPughe
Chris Pughe's Facebook: @ChrisPughe
Danny Duong's Website: www.dannyduongmortgage.ca
Danny Duong's Instagram: @dannyduong_mortgagebroker
Danny Duong's LinkedIn: @DannyDuong
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📝 The Mortgage Broker Podcast Blog: @ABWMedia
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CONNECT WITH THE HOSTS
📋 Dean Lawton's LinkedIn: @DeanLawton
📋 Deryk Williamson's LinkedIn: @DerykWilliamson
📋 Jason Marshall's LinkedIn: @JasonMarshall
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CONNECT WITH A BETTER WAY MORTGAGES
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📬 A Better Way Mortgages Tuesday Mortgage Memo: @ABWTuesdayMortgageMemo
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Welcome to the Mortgage BrokerPodcast.
tailor -made for Canadian mortgageindustry professionals.
Proudly presented by A Better WayMortgage Group, this podcast is
your trusted source for insiderinsights, market updates, and
strategies to elevate your careerin the ever -evolving world of
mortgage brokering.
Whether you're a seasoned broker
with A Better Way Mortgage Groupor an industry enthusiast looking
(00:21):
to stay ahead, our episodes aredesigned to empower you with the
knowledge and tools you need toexcel in the Canadian mortgage
space.
All right, we're back for another
episode of the Mortgage BrokerPodcast.
And today we're going off script alittle bit here.
We're going to jump into the newbroker relationship manager role
with Chris Pugh and Danny Duong.
This is all about mentorship and
(00:42):
growth.
And we're going to start with why
we created this role and what itis.
Essentially going to explore thecreation and the ongoing success
of our BRM role.
You know, we'll cover the why.
Behind it, the rollout process andits impact on our team.
We've seen an immediate resulthere.
We started this role in May 1st ofthis year.
We're recording sometime in themiddle of August here.
(01:02):
And, you know, we're reallyexcited.
We were extremely excited to rollthis out.
And we're going to touch on, youknow, our hiring process and how
we came to the conclusion thatDanny and Chris were the perfect
fit for us and a better way withinthis role.
We'll do a brief introduction toDanny and Chris.
If you're a regular listener, youwould already know who they are
because we just dedicated twoepisodes on our Behind the Broker
(01:23):
series with Danny and Chris each.
Jason's here joining me as well.
A big integral part of this roleis Jason, who really maintained
our entire onboarding process at ABetter Way and was very much hands
-on from a training perspective onjust what he does and the parts of
this role that make it such asuccess.
So with that, we'll kick it off.
You know, one, welcome back and
(01:44):
thank you so much for being hereand willing to share your time
once again and jumping right intothis.
Thanks for having us.
Thank you so much for having us.
It's awesome to see you guys.
Yeah, absolutely.
So, you know, I kind of just wantto start off like not going too
deep with the introduction.
For those of you that don't know
Danny and Chris, I highlyrecommend listening to their
Behind the Broker series episode.
You know, they shared a bunch of
(02:04):
resources of who they are andwhat, you know, makes them tick
and their success in the industry.
the brm role we shared our vision
with you guys initially and youwere two of the first people to
reach out and say hey i want to dothis and it was really important
to us that existing brokers thatare practicing today were the ones
that were going to take this roleon and we were very mindful that
(02:26):
you know somebody jumping into arole to support other agents we
didn't want to take away from yourbusiness.
And so this is very much a quartertime role, so to speak.
We're looking for 10 to 20 hoursat the most a week, but really 10
hours is the sweet spot.
And with that, we found that was
super important because you'reactive in the business and you're
still staying active.
And with this being such a
changing industry, really everyday there's something new that was
(02:48):
important to us.
So before I really go deep into
why we created it, what drew youto the ability to just jump in?
and help other brokers.
Why was I really interested in
being a broker relationshipmanager?
was I really interested in being abroker relationship manager?
I was super intrigued when I sawthe posting come out.
A whole bunch of reasons.
One is that I have a lot of
(03:08):
experience and I haven't been ableto figure out a way to share some
of that.
And I by no means know a lot of
the answers, but I do have someunderwriting skills.
And sometimes I know why decisionsare made.
And I always feel like I should behelping people understand the why
sometimes in our business.
So that felt like a really good
opportunity.
I absolutely love people.
I'm so proud to work for thisbrokerage.
And I know that we are one bigteam and we're seen by all of the
(03:31):
lenders as one big team.
And we sometimes will be judged by
our weakest links.
And so I wanted to be able to...
help my teammates get up to speedand build a really, really good
rapport or reputation for ourbrokerage by just lending a hand
and helping out and supportingwhere I can.
Yeah, I mean, that's one of thekey reasons why when we saw you
(03:53):
apply for the posting, we weresuper excited because, you know,
you're within the brokerage, youunderstand the ins and outs of a
better way, how it operates.
And, you know, you're already a
sounding board for so many of ourbrokers to just go to from a
comfort basis.
and say, hey, I don't know what to
(04:14):
do here.
What would you suggest?
Like, let me just call Chris.
And, you know, hence you applying
for that role.
I think that just brings, you
know, a further sense of comfortto some of the brokers that may
not always want to reach out tous, but they know that they have a
go -to person like yourself that'sin the weeds and really
understands the ins and outs andhow things are working.
So we were super excited when wesaw your resume pop through.
(04:35):
How about you, Danny?As for me, I have to be honest, I
didn't even know about the postingto begin with, but sort of what
drove me to apply or express myinterest and it was a few years.
In the making, I think, even whenI was with TD Bank as a broker, I
always felt like there was alittle bit something more that I
wanted to do outside of justbrokering.
I enjoyed interacting with myclients, but I felt like there was
something missing.
And I've talked to Jason over the
(04:55):
years.
I think you recall we've had
coffee meetings and I often said,there's got to be something that I
could do besides brokering, maybe,you know, in some sort of training
position or sales team managementrole or something like that when I
was with TD.
And I always sought that out.
the years and when i mentionedthis to jason i guess you know
earlier this year you brought thatto my attention like oh wait a
minute we're thinking about doingsomething like this and so why
(05:17):
don't you look at the jobdescription and so yeah definitely
when i read it and i felt rightaway like yeah actually this
actually ticks a lot of the boxesmaybe this is the missing thing
that i've been kind of looking todo over the years that's cool to
hear and like i'll just go back tosome of the why and a big cool to
hear and like i'll just go back tosome of the why and a big piece of
(05:38):
A Better Way is we don't bring onnew to industry agents.
And, you know, we certainly havesome teams within A Better Way
that, you know, help and mentorand nurture brand new, new to
industry type brokers.
But our onboarding department is a
huge focus for us.
And it's truly a department.
There's a team of people that areassisting our brokers from the
onboarding process, right from,you know, the first conversation
that they maybe have with Jasonabout why A Better Way, why, you
know.
join a better way or leave the
bank and again a big piece of thepeople that are coming over to to
our brokerage are bankers rightthat are very experienced in
(06:00):
mortgage transactions but Youknow, like you mentioned, Danny,
on our last episode, like youdidn't even know you had to get a
laptop, like they're taking yourlaptop away, like little things
like that.
So, you know, this role isn't
teaching somebody how to be abroker.
It's helping them transition andget set up on their two feet and
be able to actually move forwardwith the simple necessities like a
laptop and all the other thingsthat come with this role.
(06:22):
So that was a big piece is likereally going over and above our
onboarding experience and makingpeople feel not just welcome to
the.
team by being able to work hands
-on with one of our top agents inyourself but then getting the tips
tools and the support that theyneed to feel comfortable that
they're actually you know gettingstarted in the right direction.
And so part of that is being apart of our welcome call.
(06:43):
So every broker that we onboard,after they've been onboarded, or
right when they've been onboarded,Jason would spend a good hour with
those people just going through,hey, here's our backend agent
internet.
Here's all the tools, tips that we
have.
Here's the resources, the lender
training calls, everything that wedo, the events, there's just so
much that we do, and it can beoverwhelming.
So, you know, taking the time toshow them that was a big piece.
(07:06):
Being able to transition thatwelcome call onto your plate was a
big time saver for Jason, ofcourse.
But also, again, I think it's aslightly better experience not to
put Jason down here, but to beable to get that support from
somebody that's going to be one oftheir peers and working alongside
them.
And then a lot of agents,
especially a banker, they decideto leave the bank and they're
walked right out of the door.
(07:27):
and they don't really have any
ability to serve their clientsuntil their license is activated
with BCFSA, FISRA, whereverthey're located.
And that process can take a day.
That process can take 10 days or
more, depending on where theregulator is at in there.
capacity.
So part of just being able to
support them in their transactionsand get introduced to their
clients so their clients aren't,you know, just left in the dust
(07:49):
waiting.
Hold up, Hold up, hold up.
Can you let that offer just stop?So just move for 10 more days,
please.
Yeah.
Works nowhere.
Just things like that.
please.
Yeah.
Works nowhere.
Just things like that.
It's like when we took over thebrokerage, we just couldn't
believe how much of that was goingon.
And so just again, now you'reanother resource for them to
assist them with those types oftransactions and ultimately make
(08:11):
sure their clients are served.
So that's another big piece of it.
And we just noticed like there'smultiple gaps in the onboarding
process.
And that was a big one.
Also, just you guys are so greatat building relationships, you
know, obviously with your clients,but more so with the brokers
within our brokerage.
So you're a connector to other,
you know, key people that willhelp them and support them.
And so, you know, maybe we canjust touch on and riff on that a
(08:32):
little bit and how you see.
I mean, Danny, you've been doing
the role quite extensively for thelast couple of months.
Chris, you're just getting intoit.
You know, Danny, maybe you canjust touch on like.
like some of the wins that you'vehad already.
Right.
We do the onboarding call, of
course.
I had the opportunity, thankfully,
to shadow Jason in seeing howthat's done.
And so I've been able to do, youknow, quite a few of them over the
last couple of months.
(08:53):
We prepared going into these Zoom
calls, onboarding calls.
We have to know if it's a new
broker to the industry, are theytransitioning from the bank or
from another brokerage?And depending on their situation,
we kind of almost custom -tailoredthat call so that they're
comfortable with that transition,first of all.
It's not overwhelming, and theexperience is generally, you know.
great, a good call, and they feelsupported.
For me, I notice, yeah, everybroker comes in, there's so much
to learn.
(09:13):
And so we have to take the time,
step back a little bit andunderstand that it's a difficult
time for them, just kind of helpthem navigate through the steps of
becoming fully functional.
There's two sides of it, I feel
like.
One is we want to make sure it's a
seamless process for them andtheir existing clients.
So for example, if it's a bankerthat's transitioning over to the
broker channel, they have clientsthat are still coming to them.
(09:34):
they're waiting for licensing,things like that.
We want to make sure that that's aseamless process for them too and
how we can facilitate that.
On top of just themselves being
set up to do the application ortake that transaction from access
to systems, to talking to BDMs,who to go to, which lender does
what.
So I think there's two different
sides to that is making sure thatthey're still in a good position
(09:57):
with their clients.
The transition is seamless and
then them also feeling...
supported learning the process
with the broker channel.
Yeah, I would say that there is so
much for people to consume interms of learning where to go and
what resources are out there, butthey're also actively dealing with
their clients and doing all of thethings that we do day to day.
So it's my hope that in our role,if they've forgotten something
that we've tried to teach them inthe onboarding call, they'll feel
(10:21):
really comfortable reaching outbecause sometimes when you're
brokering, you just get stuck onone thing and you just need that
needle to move, then you can coastfor the rest of the transaction.
So it's my hope.
If your needle needs to be moved
just on one thing, we're going tobe the people that are going to be
able to help you just sort of geton with your day and your
(10:42):
transaction.
You can't learn everything in the
one onboarding call either.
Yeah, I mean, I've been involved
in the recruitment process ofbrokers and bank specialists for a
number of years now.
And, you know, I know we have a
lot of bank specialists fromacross the country that listen to
this podcast.
And, you know, the recruiters from
the networks and the otherbrokerages.
They're excellent and they'revery, very good.
(11:02):
And we can hit on the high levelsof the whys.
Why should you leave the bankworld and come to the broker
world?And it's all the things that we
know.
Well, depending on your regulator,
you have the ability toincorporate.
You have more lenders.
You have a residual.
So all that is great.
more Also, not to interrupt, but I
did.
I just saw a stat where 56 % of
mortgage business.
is coming through the broker
(11:23):
channel.
And for me, I feel like that's the
first time that percentage hasbeen higher.
So that's telling me that more andmore and more consumers are going
to brokerages and broker channelsand acquiring their mortgages and
getting their skills throughbrokers.
We really have a responsibility tobe the best of the best that we
can possibly be if that manyconsumers are trusting us with
that.
But I've not seen the pendulum
swing like that.
(11:43):
Sorry for the interruption.
Yeah, I mean, the market share inthe broker space is definitely
growing.
And, you know, to what I was
saying, we're we can hit the highpoints.
But at the end of the day, whenthe bank specialist decides that
they want to make that move, whatthe hell do I do?
Like once I make the move, likewhat system do I use?
Who's going to walk me throughVelocity, which is the origination
(12:04):
platform we use?Who's going to help introduce me
to the lenders?Who's going to help show me how to
do payroll compliance?Like all of the things that you
need to do to get an applicationfrom front to back, they have no
idea.
So all of these high points are
great, but how am I going totransition my business to being
able to be on day one, fullyfunctional to when I have a client
(12:27):
from a trusted referral sourcethat calls me, I'm not scrambling,
not knowing what to do.
I have my BRM in place that's
going to take me through not onlythe system that I use to submit to
banks, but what's that process?How do I get signed up with
lenders?What lenders do I use when I fund
that mortgage?How do I do payroll and compliance
to get paid?So there's a missing gap that I
feel the recruitment world hasmissed from a full -on process
that goes well beyond therecruitment call that layers into
(12:48):
the actual onboarding.
It's really an integral piece to
where we want to be able to setpeople up for success when they do
make that decision.
And, you know, kind of funneling
down to that is if you're a brokerat another network, as an example,
and you want to come into a betterway.
It doesn't matter how well theonboarding process goes.
There's always going to be a bitof a lag in the business.
How do we make sure we mitigateany risk of potential client
(13:08):
impact or referral source impactand help those brokers that are
transitioning from another networkperhaps into a better way to where
there's zero business disruption?And that starts right from the
recruitment process, right intoonboarding, right into regulator
setup and lender setup.
And that's really the primary
function of this role is to makesure that we're ensuring our
brokers that are coming over.
or a bank specialist.
Success from day one.
Couldn't have said that better.
Hey everyone, Dean here.
(13:28):
Quick time out from the episode to
share with you the ABW Tuesdaymortgage memo, your weekly market
highlights sent directly to yourinbox every Tuesday.
This is certainly one you're notgoing to want to miss.
So make sure to sign up now.
You can do so with a link in the
show notes, or you can head tojoinabw
ca and sign up there.
This is a high level summary of
(13:49):
market developments, regulatoryupdates, and housing.
trends every Tuesday.
So hope you enjoy it and back to
the show.
Yeah, I wouldn't mind just
touching on that, like thepractical side and your experience
from both of you from coming froma bank to a broker and, you know,
maybe some of the bumps in thatroad and the frustrations and, you
know, a lot of bankers I talk tothat are brokers now.
they all say like there's a timewhere they're like, I should just
(14:12):
go back.
One time?
Yeah, no, definitely more than onetime.
So, you know, maybe just talk onthat a little bit, you know, your
lens on that.
I agree.
And the agents that I've workedwith over the last couple of
months, there have been, yeah, anumber of them said, well, first
of all, I'm glad that Jason, Dean,Derek have put me in touch with
you and Chris because, yeah, for acouple of weeks there, I almost
(14:34):
thought maybe I'm going to goback.
to the bank.
And of course, first thing is
like, no, no, wait a minute, just,you know, let's settle things
down.
Let's break things down, what you
need to do.
I think that's the biggest thing
is that anxiety and thatoverwhelming feeling when they
come over is that, what do I do,right?
From even just taking anapplication, how do I send out an
(14:55):
application?Going from a bank system, which in
most cases are quite archaic fromwhat I remember, the whole DOS
screen that's green to, you know,something that's much more
advanced velocity.
So just holding their hand from
day one, just saying, I got you.
Don't worry.
Whatever things you need helpwith, just give me a call or we'll
start with this bite -sizedtraining session first.
And it reassures them.
And then that feeling of maybe I
should go back to the bankdissipates pretty quickly.
(15:16):
It is an uncomfortable feelingcoming from a banker.
I came from, I was a credit unionto a mortgage broker.
You're a big fish in a little pondand you know your systems and you
know your lenders and you know allthe underwriters and you can be
really effective.
And then you get your broker's
license and then you come out intothe broker world and you've lost
all of your connections and you nolonger just need to know one
lender's policies.
You need to know 20 lenders
(15:37):
policies.
It's quite overwhelming.
So it takes a lot of grit to stickwith it, but you need to stick
with it because you willdefinitely get there.
So it is very nice to be able tobe that stopgap to help people
transition with whatever issuesthey're facing.
And some of them might just beemotional.
Very few of them are volumedriven.
It's more the emotional side andjust having someone to.
Well, yeah, I mean, you know, notpicking on the bank side, of
(15:57):
course, but you can build yourbusiness underneath one roof and
bank specialists, they know who togo to when they have an issue and
they go directly to the regionalsales manager.
Now, when you're on the brokerside, in general, you're on your
own, you have no one to go with.
So that is the key reason why we
started this role is toessentially for the bank people,
if we're talking in that segment,to replace the regional sales
(16:19):
manager now with a dedicatedbroker relations manager that is
going to take.
you through the steps that you
need to go.
So you're not on your own island,
you have the support system, andyou know exactly what you need to
do to move forward with atransition.
And we know who's who in the zoo,we know who's who in the zoo, and
we can help you with that as well.
Because there's a lot of new
people to meet, a lot of reallyfantastic people to meet.
(16:41):
And that's where I wanted to go.
Glad you said that.
Like, there's so many great peoplewithin this brokerage, and you're
the conduit for these peoplecoming in.
It's like, who should they know?Who should they speak to?
Even just like an event, like wedo so many events here, it could
be a little overwhelming.
And, you know, It's like going to
a new school for the first time,right?
It's like you're the firstclassmate.
(17:03):
You don't know anyone.
Maybe you're afraid to even attend
because you're just going to bestanding there alone.
Now you're like a resource forthem to feel comfortable.
You're a friend, right?All of a sudden.
So, you know, maybe you can touchon that.
You know how you see that.
progressing.
I know, Danny, you've alreadybumped into a few people that
right away, they feel comfortable.
They're going up to you first.
Actually, I've been thinking aboutthat analogy that you mentioned,
(17:24):
to you first.
Actually, I've been thinking about
that analogy that you mentioned,going to a new school.
It is like that, right?You join the brokerage and there's
so many new faces.
just like going to a new high
school, for example.
So knowing somebody that you could
immediately talk to or just beintroduced to other agents already
there, you know, familiar face, Ithink that really helps.
And so, yeah, the school analogy,having a buddy show up for a first
day of school is great.
Yeah, some people might not even
(17:44):
know that they're welcome andthey're wanted there and they
don't understand how approachableeverybody is.
And it's just trying things forthe first time.
And yeah.
Being your date, if you will, so
you're comfortable and you know afew other people's names, just
getting you there.
We talked about bankers and what I
found is like the bankers thatcome over, one of their first
pieces of feedback at an event islike, this reminds me of like when
I was at the bank, like, you know,we had all these peers and all
(18:06):
these colleagues that we got to,you know, hang out with in these,
you know, various functions.
And, you know, for a lot of other
brokers that join us, like theydidn't even have those types of
functions to go to.
So it's like they truly were on an
island.
So they rarely knew anyone at
their previous brokerage becausethey just didn't.
get out and about.
There wasn't that culture and that
peace.
So again, like just being a family
right from the get -go, I think isa big piece and just, you know,
(18:28):
instilling the culture and who weare and who everyone is.
Who's the who in the zoo, I guessis the phrase or whatever.
But yeah, I guess like goingforward, where do you see, you
know, abilities to maybe shine inthis role that we haven't even
maybe thought of yet or talkedabout as a group?
I think so far, like I said, I'velearned along the way, everyone
learns differently.
And so continued educational
pieces are always very valuable tothe brokers.
(18:48):
Sometimes when they'retransitioning over, they have a
lot of free time.
And so just learning, getting
ready to, you know, pounce on adeal when they're set up ready to
do the deals, I think is huge.
I think you guys do such a great
job with ABW providing all theopportunities to learn lender
calls every single week.
I don't know how you guys do that.
On top of that, all the events,just to make sure everyone feels
included, part of the brokerage.
(19:09):
I think continue to do those.
I see it and I've talked to someof the brokers.
Yeah, it's amazing.
I didn't know these guys, they
have time to do all this, but it'sawesome.
I feel too, maybe like we can bereal connectors and that way we
are working with everyone whererubber is hitting the road and we
understand a little bit more abouthow you run the business and the
brokerage business.
I know how much you want to hear
our voices.
Ours meaning... all of the
brokers, not just the BRMs.
There's a real opportunity for us
(19:30):
to be connectors and maybe seeopportunities and bring ideas to
the table that you guys might nothave been able to see because
you're not doing the doing.
You're doing the stuff that keeps
us doing.
Does that make sense?
But connecting more.
You know, know, everybody wants to
be a part of something.
And I think you guys continue to
drive a culture of a collaborativeapproach, inclusive approach that
you mentioned, Danny.
(19:51):
And I think that when somebody
joins us, whether it's a banker oran existing brokerage, having you
guys is that culture piece thatlayer in.
You're on the ground.
You're the foot soldiers.
And they feel the culture that wehave where we're, you know,
hopefully from our level, we'redoing a good job.
job and we're continuing to wantto grow and expand the company and
provide more value.
(20:11):
And we don't know from our lens
sometimes of the value that youguys need unless you're on the
streets doing the dirty work,helping us figure out what we can
do to make that culture evenbetter.
And I think to me, that's how wecontinue to grow.
This role is making sure that wecontinue to enhance on the culture
that we have here and justcontinue to grow and make everyone
feel that they're a part ofsomething that's growing and
(20:33):
great.
One piece of this role that we
were very sensitive towards wasjust balancing, you know, the
responsibilities of this role andthe fact that you guys are very
high achieving mortgage brokersand have a very successful
business to run outside of this.
And again, that was back to, you
know, keeping this at 10 hours orless, at least for the start of
this and making sure we reallystick to that.
How have you found balancing it?Because you guys had great answers
(20:55):
to this.
You provided us a lot of comfort
to even roll this out.
Again, we were very concerned
that.
this was going to take away from,
you know, your success.
And how do you feel about that?
And how are you, you know,balancing that?
I've been adapting quite nicely, Ifeel.
I think when you're excited aboutdoing something, it doesn't feel
like a chore.
(21:15):
Like, okay, I got to do this.
And how am I going to do this?For me, it's just fitting it into
my day now.
It's almost like you go to the
gym.
I don't have time.
If you fit it into your dailyschedule, you get it done.
And that's how I approached it.
An agent calls, I'll... book it
(21:37):
into my calendar or, you know,next few days, whenever they're
available and just go with it.
If I don't do that call, I feel
like I'm probably doing somethingthat may not be productive for my
own business as well sometimes.
So why not spend that time and
help a fellow broker?But I find in general, it's been
easy to adapt.
Like I said, I enjoy it.
So it doesn't feel like, oh, youknow, I don't want to do it or
(22:00):
it's tough.
I just fit it in and do it.
It's just like going to the gym,get it done.
it done.
You know, on both the podcasts
that we did individually with youboth, you mentioned that, you
know, you care about your clients,you care about the process.
And, you know, Danny, I'vedefinitely seen it with you having
been in the role that you reallycare about the success of the
people that are coming in andwanting to make sure that they're
(22:21):
successful.
And Chris, I know that's exactly
how you're going to operate withit.
So, and I think overall people arerespectful of each other's time
and understand that, you know,we're all busy with all this stuff
going on.
And, you know, you guys are doing
a great job with that.
And I don't foresee any change to
that moving forward.
One question for each of you to
answer.
Best way to frame this is one tip
for an aspiring mentor or somebodythat's a leader in this space.
(22:43):
I think my one tip would be to bea good listener.
think my one tip would be to be agood listener.
And then just throw your name inthe hat.
Take a seat at the table.
Speak up because it's really
welcome feedback and yourperspective is probably really,
really needed.
So don't be shy.
I would say the same, actually bea good listener.
I find that on any of the callsthat I've done, I just sit back
(23:05):
and listen to them, you know, whattheir pain points are and then
figure out, give them some advice.
I think above that is also you
learn something.
As I've been doing it, I've
learned that, oh, you know, so-and -so asked that question.
Actually, I don't know.
And we're going to find out.
And then I've incorporated it intomy own processes and refined them.
Like I helped them, but they alsohelped me.
So I think that's maybe onetakeaway is if you want to.
(23:27):
become a mentor or a role that'sin sort of in line with that is
you also get a lot out of it.
You're helping, but in turn,
you're going to learn a lot tooand help yourself.
So one of the last questions Iwanted to go into is I've already
seen some immediate success fromagents that have come on board,
one of the last questions I wantedto go into is I've already seen
some immediate success from agentsthat have come on board, bankers
especially, but even justexperienced brokers.
We had a couple of brokers leave abetter way this year.
(23:48):
and come right back.
And common feedback from everyone
is like, I'm telling everyone theyneed to join a better way because
of these experiences, whether itwas something that happened in the
onboarding or one of theconversations that they had in a
welcome call or what have you, orthe follow through afterwards of
feeling comfortable at an event,all the things that we've talked
about.
Have you seen any success there
from the feedback you've received?And Chris, did any of that stick
out to you as like, hey, thiscould be a great way to find other
(24:11):
people that... are like -mindedand, you know, we're always
looking to grow, but we're notlooking to just grow.
We want the right people that arethe right fit for our culture and
our team and everything else thatgoes on here.
So I just wouldn't mind gettingyour opinion on that.
The point that you mentioned,we've seen some agents leave and
come back and I've heard as wellis that beyond the culture that
you've built here, you know, thetechnicalities of the business to
(24:31):
compliance, for example, is ahuge, you know, change this past
year.
I've talked to some other brokers
that feel like brokerages are...
taking it very lightly.
And that's going to affect everybroker eventually down the road if
you're not taking the right stepsto ensure you're compliant.
And so ABW, you guys have done anamazing job with that.
I feel that's part of the reasonwhy when they're talking out in
the street is, well, I didn't knowthat in turn is that, yeah, you
(24:54):
should join ABW because not onlyare we educating the brokers on
these technical side of thebusiness and things that they must
do and above and beyond buildingthe culture that we're making sure
that they're doing everythingcorrect.
and, you know, properly.
Yeah, I completely understand why
they would leave and then comeback because I do know that this
is one of the best.
brokerages, if not the best
brokerage in Canada.
I've worked at other brokerages
and I talk to you guys becauseyou're so approachable and I know
that your sole purpose in thislife is to figure out how to help
us be more successful and serveour clients and have full access.
(25:17):
The efforts that you make mightnot be so obvious when you're just
experiencing that every singleday, but if you've worked in an
environment where you don'texperience that every single day,
then when you do get here, you areso, so grateful for all the work.
that our broker owners put intomaking this place a really stellar
place for us to deliver all theservices and serve as great
intermediaries for our clientswith the lenders.
(25:37):
There's no other place to be.
Well, I mean, thank you very much
for that.
One piece of feedback that I've
had is I had brought over a fairlyhighly producing mortgage
specialist from RBC who I'dbrought through the onboarding
process, answering questions for afew weeks after.
And this was kind of right as wewere transitioning Danny into the
role.
So I'd introduce this gentleman to
Danny.
And the guy called me.
About two or three days after, andhe said, thank God you introduced
(25:57):
me to Danny.
I'm able to call him now because
he just made me feel socomfortable about where I was at.
It reinforced the decision that Ihad made to join.
You know, I think he's probablyfour or five months in and he's
rolling very steadily.
He's at all the events, he's doing
all the learnings.
And that's where I really see the
benefit.
And again, I think that is the
(26:19):
major piece of having you twoleading this as ground level,
understanding what's going on andjust in the day -to -day weeds of
that.
I see the success continuing to
grow is just having people justfeeling like they're really a part
of the culture and how this wholething operates.
And some of it's tiny littletactical things like I've
submitted my first deal to thelender.
some of it's tiny little tacticalthings like I've submitted my
first deal to the lender.
(26:40):
Now what?
Like, do they get back to metomorrow?
Is it going to be next week whenyou're used to a system and then
all of a sudden you, and if theunderwriter hasn't gotten back to
you in a day or two, is thatnormal?
Is that not normal?You will sit there and sweat it
and not have the answers.
But now you could run it past
Danny and I and we could figureout whether that's normal or not,
(27:02):
or it's volumes or there'ssomething wrong.
Little tiny things like that, justturnarounds that can be so
unnerving when you have subjectremovals and clients to take care
of.
I just want to share a funny story
about this role specifically.
Our goal is to help the agents get
up and running and, you know,thrive.
So after working with one of theagents for probably like a month
and a half, we're talking almostevery other day, texting at night
(27:23):
sometimes.
And then eventually he was
comfortable and the calls got...
fewer and fewer in between.
And didn't hear from him foralmost a week.
And then he calls me and I waslike, hey, what's up?
Like, what do you need today?He's like, oh, nothing.
I just feel kind of weird.
Like, it's like we've broken up.
So I thought I'd just call to sayhi.
I'm like, okay, well, what are youup to?
(27:45):
And we're just chatting for alittle bit.
And yeah, it was pretty funny.
A way for me to measure our
success, our impact in this roleis like, we want to work with
them, get them up and running.
And if we hear... less and less
from them, it means we're doing agreat job.
They're up and ready to doeverything on their own.
They can find information on theirown and we're doing our job.
So in some ways, you know, webuilt a friendship now, but yeah,
(28:07):
now they're out on their own.
See you at the next event.
You know, that's a great metric tomeasure the success.
And it's probably a great point tokind of wrap this up.
Like that's certainly one thingI've noticed is From our position,
we're getting less and less calls.
To be honest, a lot of these
folks, zero.
Like they're not reaching out to
us for any support because you'veliterally handled it and they know
(28:27):
exactly what they're doing andthey feel comfortable in that.
So that's a huge win for us.
And, you know, again, back to the,
you know, the heavy event schedulewe have, these folks are coming to
the very first one since gettingonboarded.
And it's like.
It's crazy.
Like some of these guys, I knowwho the one you were just talking
about, like, it's like he's beenhere forever.
It's like I've known him forever.
like I've known him forever.
Right.
So it's cool to see just how
quickly people are gettingintegrated into this family.
And we want you to feel the love.
(28:49):
want you to feel the love.
Exactly.
Yeah.
It's just been a huge success forus out the gates.
And one of the most humblingpieces of this whole journey was
really just the hiring process andputting the, I guess, the job
posting out there to our team isjust so many of our brokers wanted
to do this.
And it just goes to show you how
willing our team is to helpeveryone.
All the interested brokers, Imean, we've been able to
(29:12):
communicate with everyone that,you know, obviously wasn't
successful in getting this role tobegin with.
But this is certainly going to bea growing segment of our team.
As we grow, we're going tocontinue to grow this BRM team and
this leadership team in general.
So there's always going to be
opportunities going forward here.
And so for those of you that are
listening, there definitely willbe another opportunity.
(29:32):
And for those of you that arelistening that maybe didn't put
your hat into the pile here, youknow, certainly reach out if this
is something of interest to you,because, yeah, it's just been so
great for us to see.
And we're really fortunate to have
you guys supporting us.
Thank you.
The feeling I'm sure is mutual.
We're really grateful for the
opportunity.
And thanks for your time again.
Let's put these mics down and havea group hug.
Yeah, exactly.
Yeah.
(29:52):
Well, thanks for listening.
I mean, again, that was like a
little bit off the script fromwhat we, you know, we usually do
on this show, but we just thoughtthis has been such a great
success.
We wanted to share it.
Also, even just with the industryfor, you know, broker owners that
are listening that think thatadding something like this to your
team could help, like I highlyrecommend it.
It's just a no brainer in oureyes.
So that's a wrap and thanks forlistening.
(30:13):
Thank you for tuning in.
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Once again, thank you for
listening and see you on the nextone.
and an
Welcome to the Mortgage BrokerPodcast.
tailor -made for Canadian mortgageindustry professionals.
Proudly presented by A Better WayMortgage Group, this podcast is
your trusted source for insiderinsights, market updates, and
strategies to elevate your careerin the ever -evolving world of
mortgage brokering.
Whether you're a seasoned broker
with A Better Way Mortgage Groupor an industry enthusiast looking
(00:21):
to stay ahead, our episodes aredesigned to empower you with the
knowledge and tools you need toexcel in the Canadian mortgage
space.
All right, we're back for another
episode of the Mortgage BrokerPodcast.
And today we're going off script alittle bit here.
We're going to jump into the newbroker relationship manager role
with Chris Pugh and Danny Duong.
This is all about mentorship and
(00:42):
growth.
And we're going to start with why
we created this role and what itis.
Essentially going to explore thecreation and the ongoing success
of our BRM role.
You know, we'll cover the why.
Behind it, the rollout process andits impact on our team.
We've seen an immediate resulthere.
We started this role in May 1st ofthis year.
We're recording sometime in themiddle of August here.
(01:02):
And, you know, we're reallyexcited.
We were extremely excited to rollthis out.
And we're going to touch on, youknow, our hiring process and how
we came to the conclusion thatDanny and Chris were the perfect
fit for us and a better way withinthis role.
We'll do a brief introduction toDanny and Chris.
If you're a regular listener, youwould already know who they are
because we just dedicated twoepisodes on our Behind the Broker
(01:23):
series with Danny and Chris each.
Jason's here joining me as well.
A big integral part of this roleis Jason, who really maintained
our entire onboarding process at ABetter Way and was very much hands
-on from a training perspective onjust what he does and the parts of
this role that make it such asuccess.
So with that, we'll kick it off.
You know, one, welcome back and
(01:44):
thank you so much for being hereand willing to share your time
once again and jumping right intothis.
Thanks for having us.
Thank you so much for having us.
It's awesome to see you guys.
Yeah, absolutely.
So, you know, I kind of just wantto start off like not going too
deep with the introduction.
For those of you that don't know
Danny and Chris, I highlyrecommend listening to their
Behind the Broker series episode.
You know, they shared a bunch of
(02:04):
resources of who they are andwhat, you know, makes them tick
and their success in the industry.
the brm role we shared our vision
with you guys initially and youwere two of the first people to
reach out and say hey i want to dothis and it was really important
to us that existing brokers thatare practicing today were the ones
that were going to take this roleon and we were very mindful that
(02:26):
you know somebody jumping into arole to support other agents we
didn't want to take away from yourbusiness.
And so this is very much a quartertime role, so to speak.
We're looking for 10 to 20 hoursat the most a week, but really 10
hours is the sweet spot.
And with that, we found that was
super important because you'reactive in the business and you're
still staying active.
And with this being such a
changing industry, really everyday there's something new that was
(02:48):
important to us.
So before I really go deep into
why we created it, what drew youto the ability to just jump in?
and help other brokers.
Why was I really interested in
being a broker relationshipmanager?
was I really interested in being abroker relationship manager?
I was super intrigued when I sawthe posting come out.
A whole bunch of reasons.
One is that I have a lot of
(03:08):
experience and I haven't been ableto figure out a way to share some
of that.
And I by no means know a lot of
the answers, but I do have someunderwriting skills.
And sometimes I know why decisionsare made.
And I always feel like I should behelping people understand the why
sometimes in our business.
So that felt like a really good
opportunity.
I absolutely love people.
I'm so proud to work for thisbrokerage.
And I know that we are one bigteam and we're seen by all of the
(03:31):
lenders as one big team.
And we sometimes will be judged by
our weakest links.
And so I wanted to be able to...
help my teammates get up to speedand build a really, really good
rapport or reputation for ourbrokerage by just lending a hand
and helping out and supportingwhere I can.
Yeah, I mean, that's one of thekey reasons why when we saw you
(03:53):
apply for the posting, we weresuper excited because, you know,
you're within the brokerage, youunderstand the ins and outs of a
better way, how it operates.
And, you know, you're already a
sounding board for so many of ourbrokers to just go to from a
comfort basis.
and say, hey, I don't know what to
(04:14):
do here.
What would you suggest?
Like, let me just call Chris.
And, you know, hence you applying
for that role.
I think that just brings, you
know, a further sense of comfortto some of the brokers that may
not always want to reach out tous, but they know that they have a
go -to person like yourself that'sin the weeds and really
understands the ins and outs andhow things are working.
So we were super excited when wesaw your resume pop through.
(04:35):
How about you, Danny?As for me, I have to be honest, I
didn't even know about the postingto begin with, but sort of what
drove me to apply or express myinterest and it was a few years.
In the making, I think, even whenI was with TD Bank as a broker, I
always felt like there was alittle bit something more that I
wanted to do outside of justbrokering.
I enjoyed interacting with myclients, but I felt like there was
something missing.
And I've talked to Jason over the
(04:55):
years.
I think you recall we've had
coffee meetings and I often said,there's got to be something that I
could do besides brokering, maybe,you know, in some sort of training
position or sales team managementrole or something like that when I
was with TD.
And I always sought that out.
the years and when i mentionedthis to jason i guess you know
earlier this year you brought thatto my attention like oh wait a
minute we're thinking about doingsomething like this and so why
(05:17):
don't you look at the jobdescription and so yeah definitely
when i read it and i felt rightaway like yeah actually this
actually ticks a lot of the boxesmaybe this is the missing thing
that i've been kind of looking todo over the years that's cool to
hear and like i'll just go back tosome of the why and a big cool to
hear and like i'll just go back tosome of the why and a big piece of
(05:38):
A Better Way is we don't bring onnew to industry agents.
And, you know, we certainly havesome teams within A Better Way
that, you know, help and mentorand nurture brand new, new to
industry type brokers.
But our onboarding department is a
huge focus for us.
And it's truly a department.
There's a team of people that areassisting our brokers from the
onboarding process, right from,you know, the first conversation
that they maybe have with Jasonabout why A Better Way, why, you
know.
join a better way or leave the
bank and again a big piece of thepeople that are coming over to to
our brokerage are bankers rightthat are very experienced in
(06:00):
mortgage transactions but Youknow, like you mentioned, Danny,
on our last episode, like youdidn't even know you had to get a
laptop, like they're taking yourlaptop away, like little things
like that.
So, you know, this role isn't
teaching somebody how to be abroker.
It's helping them transition andget set up on their two feet and
be able to actually move forwardwith the simple necessities like a
laptop and all the other thingsthat come with this role.
(06:22):
So that was a big piece is likereally going over and above our
onboarding experience and makingpeople feel not just welcome to
the.
team by being able to work hands
-on with one of our top agents inyourself but then getting the tips
tools and the support that theyneed to feel comfortable that
they're actually you know gettingstarted in the right direction.
And so part of that is being apart of our welcome call.
(06:43):
So every broker that we onboard,after they've been onboarded, or
right when they've been onboarded,Jason would spend a good hour with
those people just going through,hey, here's our backend agent
internet.
Here's all the tools, tips that we
have.
Here's the resources, the lender
training calls, everything that wedo, the events, there's just so
much that we do, and it can beoverwhelming.
So, you know, taking the time toshow them that was a big piece.
(07:06):
Being able to transition thatwelcome call onto your plate was a
big time saver for Jason, ofcourse.
But also, again, I think it's aslightly better experience not to
put Jason down here, but to beable to get that support from
somebody that's going to be one oftheir peers and working alongside
them.
And then a lot of agents,
especially a banker, they decideto leave the bank and they're
walked right out of the door.
(07:27):
and they don't really have any
ability to serve their clientsuntil their license is activated
with BCFSA, FISRA, whereverthey're located.
And that process can take a day.
That process can take 10 days or
more, depending on where theregulator is at in there.
capacity.
So part of just being able to
support them in their transactionsand get introduced to their
clients so their clients aren't,you know, just left in the dust
(07:49):
waiting.
Hold up, Hold up, hold up.
Can you let that offer just stop?So just move for 10 more days,
please.
Yeah.
Works nowhere.
Just things like that.
please.
Yeah.
Works nowhere.
Just things like that.
It's like when we took over thebrokerage, we just couldn't
believe how much of that was goingon.
And so just again, now you'reanother resource for them to
assist them with those types oftransactions and ultimately make
(08:11):
sure their clients are served.
So that's another big piece of it.
And we just noticed like there'smultiple gaps in the onboarding
process.
And that was a big one.
Also, just you guys are so greatat building relationships, you
know, obviously with your clients,but more so with the brokers
within our brokerage.
So you're a connector to other,
you know, key people that willhelp them and support them.
And so, you know, maybe we canjust touch on and riff on that a
(08:32):
little bit and how you see.
I mean, Danny, you've been doing
the role quite extensively for thelast couple of months.
Chris, you're just getting intoit.
You know, Danny, maybe you canjust touch on like.
like some of the wins that you'vehad already.
Right.
We do the onboarding call, of
course.
I had the opportunity, thankfully,
to shadow Jason in seeing howthat's done.
And so I've been able to do, youknow, quite a few of them over the
last couple of months.
(08:53):
We prepared going into these Zoom
calls, onboarding calls.
We have to know if it's a new
broker to the industry, are theytransitioning from the bank or
from another brokerage?And depending on their situation,
we kind of almost custom -tailoredthat call so that they're
comfortable with that transition,first of all.
It's not overwhelming, and theexperience is generally, you know.
great, a good call, and they feelsupported.
For me, I notice, yeah, everybroker comes in, there's so much
to learn.
(09:13):
And so we have to take the time,
step back a little bit andunderstand that it's a difficult
time for them, just kind of helpthem navigate through the steps of
becoming fully functional.
There's two sides of it, I feel
like.
One is we want to make sure it's a
seamless process for them andtheir existing clients.
So for example, if it's a bankerthat's transitioning over to the
broker channel, they have clientsthat are still coming to them.
(09:34):
they're waiting for licensing,things like that.
We want to make sure that that's aseamless process for them too and
how we can facilitate that.
On top of just themselves being
set up to do the application ortake that transaction from access
to systems, to talking to BDMs,who to go to, which lender does
what.
So I think there's two different
sides to that is making sure thatthey're still in a good position
(09:57):
with their clients.
The transition is seamless and
then them also feeling...
supported learning the process
with the broker channel.
Yeah, I would say that there is so
much for people to consume interms of learning where to go and
what resources are out there, butthey're also actively dealing with
their clients and doing all of thethings that we do day to day.
So it's my hope that in our role,if they've forgotten something
that we've tried to teach them inthe onboarding call, they'll feel
(10:21):
really comfortable reaching outbecause sometimes when you're
brokering, you just get stuck onone thing and you just need that
needle to move, then you can coastfor the rest of the transaction.
So it's my hope.
If your needle needs to be moved
just on one thing, we're going tobe the people that are going to be
able to help you just sort of geton with your day and your
(10:42):
transaction.
You can't learn everything in the
one onboarding call either.
Yeah, I mean, I've been involved
in the recruitment process ofbrokers and bank specialists for a
number of years now.
And, you know, I know we have a
lot of bank specialists fromacross the country that listen to
this podcast.
And, you know, the recruiters from
the networks and the otherbrokerages.
They're excellent and they'revery, very good.
(11:02):
And we can hit on the high levelsof the whys.
Why should you leave the bankworld and come to the broker
world?And it's all the things that we
know.
Well, depending on your regulator,
you have the ability toincorporate.
You have more lenders.
You have a residual.
So all that is great.
more Also, not to interrupt, but I
did.
I just saw a stat where 56 % of
mortgage business.
is coming through the broker
(11:23):
channel.
And for me, I feel like that's the
first time that percentage hasbeen higher.
So that's telling me that more andmore and more consumers are going
to brokerages and broker channelsand acquiring their mortgages and
getting their skills throughbrokers.
We really have a responsibility tobe the best of the best that we
can possibly be if that manyconsumers are trusting us with
that.
But I've not seen the pendulum
swing like that.
(11:43):
Sorry for the interruption.
Yeah, I mean, the market share inthe broker space is definitely
growing.
And, you know, to what I was
saying, we're we can hit the highpoints.
But at the end of the day, whenthe bank specialist decides that
they want to make that move, whatthe hell do I do?
Like once I make the move, likewhat system do I use?
Who's going to walk me throughVelocity, which is the origination
(12:04):
platform we use?Who's going to help introduce me
to the lenders?Who's going to help show me how to
do payroll compliance?Like all of the things that you
need to do to get an applicationfrom front to back, they have no
idea.
So all of these high points are
great, but how am I going totransition my business to being
able to be on day one, fullyfunctional to when I have a client
(12:27):
from a trusted referral sourcethat calls me, I'm not scrambling,
not knowing what to do.
I have my BRM in place that's
going to take me through not onlythe system that I use to submit to
banks, but what's that process?How do I get signed up with
lenders?What lenders do I use when I fund
that mortgage?How do I do payroll and compliance
to get paid?So there's a missing gap that I
feel the recruitment world hasmissed from a full -on process
that goes well beyond therecruitment call that layers into
(12:48):
the actual onboarding.
It's really an integral piece to
where we want to be able to setpeople up for success when they do
make that decision.
And, you know, kind of funneling
down to that is if you're a brokerat another network, as an example,
and you want to come into a betterway.
It doesn't matter how well theonboarding process goes.
There's always going to be a bitof a lag in the business.
How do we make sure we mitigateany risk of potential client
(13:08):
impact or referral source impactand help those brokers that are
transitioning from another networkperhaps into a better way to where
there's zero business disruption?And that starts right from the
recruitment process, right intoonboarding, right into regulator
setup and lender setup.
And that's really the primary
function of this role is to makesure that we're ensuring our
brokers that are coming over.
or a bank specialist.
Success from day one.
Couldn't have said that better.
Hey everyone, Dean here.
(13:28):
Quick time out from the episode to
share with you the ABW Tuesdaymortgage memo, your weekly market
highlights sent directly to yourinbox every Tuesday.
This is certainly one you're notgoing to want to miss.
So make sure to sign up now.
You can do so with a link in the
show notes, or you can head tojoinabw
ca and sign up there.
This is a high level summary of
(13:49):
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So hope you enjoy it and back to
the show.
Yeah, I wouldn't mind just
touching on that, like thepractical side and your experience
from both of you from coming froma bank to a broker and, you know,
maybe some of the bumps in thatroad and the frustrations and, you
know, a lot of bankers I talk tothat are brokers now.
they all say like there's a timewhere they're like, I should just
(14:12):
go back.
One time?
Yeah, no, definitely more than onetime.
So, you know, maybe just talk onthat a little bit, you know, your
lens on that.
I agree.
And the agents that I've workedwith over the last couple of
months, there have been, yeah, anumber of them said, well, first
of all, I'm glad that Jason, Dean,Derek have put me in touch with
you and Chris because, yeah, for acouple of weeks there, I almost
(14:34):
thought maybe I'm going to goback.
to the bank.
And of course, first thing is
like, no, no, wait a minute, just,you know, let's settle things
down.
Let's break things down, what you
need to do.
I think that's the biggest thing
is that anxiety and thatoverwhelming feeling when they
come over is that, what do I do,right?
From even just taking anapplication, how do I send out an
(14:55):
application?Going from a bank system, which in
most cases are quite archaic fromwhat I remember, the whole DOS
screen that's green to, you know,something that's much more
advanced velocity.
So just holding their hand from
day one, just saying, I got you.
Don't worry.
Whatever things you need helpwith, just give me a call or we'll
start with this bite -sizedtraining session first.
And it reassures them.
And then that feeling of maybe I
should go back to the bankdissipates pretty quickly.
(15:16):
It is an uncomfortable feelingcoming from a banker.
I came from, I was a credit unionto a mortgage broker.
You're a big fish in a little pondand you know your systems and you
know your lenders and you know allthe underwriters and you can be
really effective.
And then you get your broker's
license and then you come out intothe broker world and you've lost
all of your connections and you nolonger just need to know one
lender's policies.
You need to know 20 lenders
(15:37):
policies.
It's quite overwhelming.
So it takes a lot of grit to stickwith it, but you need to stick
with it because you willdefinitely get there.
So it is very nice to be able tobe that stopgap to help people
transition with whatever issuesthey're facing.
And some of them might just beemotional.
Very few of them are volumedriven.
It's more the emotional side andjust having someone to.
Well, yeah, I mean, you know, notpicking on the bank side, of
(15:57):
course, but you can build yourbusiness underneath one roof and
bank specialists, they know who togo to when they have an issue and
they go directly to the regionalsales manager.
Now, when you're on the brokerside, in general, you're on your
own, you have no one to go with.
So that is the key reason why we
started this role is toessentially for the bank people,
if we're talking in that segment,to replace the regional sales
(16:19):
manager now with a dedicatedbroker relations manager that is
going to take.
you through the steps that you
need to go.
So you're not on your own island,
you have the support system, andyou know exactly what you need to
do to move forward with atransition.
And we know who's who in the zoo,we know who's who in the zoo, and
we can help you with that as well.
Because there's a lot of new
people to meet, a lot of reallyfantastic people to meet.
(16:41):
And that's where I wanted to go.
Glad you said that.
Like, there's so many great peoplewithin this brokerage, and you're
the conduit for these peoplecoming in.
It's like, who should they know?Who should they speak to?
Even just like an event, like wedo so many events here, it could
be a little overwhelming.
And, you know, It's like going to
a new school for the first time,right?
It's like you're the firstclassmate.
(17:03):
You don't know anyone.
Maybe you're afraid to even attend
because you're just going to bestanding there alone.
Now you're like a resource forthem to feel comfortable.
You're a friend, right?All of a sudden.
So, you know, maybe you can touchon that.
You know how you see that.
progressing.
I know, Danny, you've alreadybumped into a few people that
right away, they feel comfortable.
They're going up to you first.
Actually, I've been thinking aboutthat analogy that you mentioned,
(17:24):
to you first.
Actually, I've been thinking about
that analogy that you mentioned,going to a new school.
It is like that, right?You join the brokerage and there's
so many new faces.
just like going to a new high
school, for example.
So knowing somebody that you could
immediately talk to or just beintroduced to other agents already
there, you know, familiar face, Ithink that really helps.
And so, yeah, the school analogy,having a buddy show up for a first
day of school is great.
Yeah, some people might not even
(17:44):
know that they're welcome andthey're wanted there and they
don't understand how approachableeverybody is.
And it's just trying things forthe first time.
And yeah.
Being your date, if you will, so
you're comfortable and you know afew other people's names, just
getting you there.
We talked about bankers and what I
found is like the bankers thatcome over, one of their first
pieces of feedback at an event islike, this reminds me of like when
I was at the bank, like, you know,we had all these peers and all
(18:06):
these colleagues that we got to,you know, hang out with in these,
you know, various functions.
And, you know, for a lot of other
brokers that join us, like theydidn't even have those types of
functions to go to.
So it's like they truly were on an
island.
So they rarely knew anyone at
their previous brokerage becausethey just didn't.
get out and about.
There wasn't that culture and that
peace.
So again, like just being a family
right from the get -go, I think isa big piece and just, you know,
(18:28):
instilling the culture and who weare and who everyone is.
Who's the who in the zoo, I guessis the phrase or whatever.
But yeah, I guess like goingforward, where do you see, you
know, abilities to maybe shine inthis role that we haven't even
maybe thought of yet or talkedabout as a group?
I think so far, like I said, I'velearned along the way, everyone
learns differently.
And so continued educational
pieces are always very valuable tothe brokers.
(18:48):
Sometimes when they'retransitioning over, they have a
lot of free time.
And so just learning, getting
ready to, you know, pounce on adeal when they're set up ready to
do the deals, I think is huge.
I think you guys do such a great
job with ABW providing all theopportunities to learn lender
calls every single week.
I don't know how you guys do that.
On top of that, all the events,just to make sure everyone feels
included, part of the brokerage.
(19:09):
I think continue to do those.
I see it and I've talked to someof the brokers.
Yeah, it's amazing.
I didn't know these guys, they
have time to do all this, but it'sawesome.
I feel too, maybe like we can bereal connectors and that way we
are working with everyone whererubber is hitting the road and we
understand a little bit more abouthow you run the business and the
brokerage business.
I know how much you want to hear
our voices.
Ours meaning... all of the
brokers, not just the BRMs.
There's a real opportunity for us
(19:30):
to be connectors and maybe seeopportunities and bring ideas to
the table that you guys might nothave been able to see because
you're not doing the doing.
You're doing the stuff that keeps
us doing.
Does that make sense?
But connecting more.
You know, know, everybody wants to
be a part of something.
And I think you guys continue to
drive a culture of a collaborativeapproach, inclusive approach that
you mentioned, Danny.
(19:51):
And I think that when somebody
joins us, whether it's a banker oran existing brokerage, having you
guys is that culture piece thatlayer in.
You're on the ground.
You're the foot soldiers.
And they feel the culture that wehave where we're, you know,
hopefully from our level, we'redoing a good job.
job and we're continuing to wantto grow and expand the company and
provide more value.
(20:11):
And we don't know from our lens
sometimes of the value that youguys need unless you're on the
streets doing the dirty work,helping us figure out what we can
do to make that culture evenbetter.
And I think to me, that's how wecontinue to grow.
This role is making sure that wecontinue to enhance on the culture
that we have here and justcontinue to grow and make everyone
feel that they're a part ofsomething that's growing and
(20:33):
great.
One piece of this role that we
were very sensitive towards wasjust balancing, you know, the
responsibilities of this role andthe fact that you guys are very
high achieving mortgage brokersand have a very successful
business to run outside of this.
And again, that was back to, you
know, keeping this at 10 hours orless, at least for the start of
this and making sure we reallystick to that.
How have you found balancing it?Because you guys had great answers
(20:55):
to this.
You provided us a lot of comfort
to even roll this out.
Again, we were very concerned
that.
this was going to take away from,
you know, your success.
And how do you feel about that?
And how are you, you know,balancing that?
I've been adapting quite nicely, Ifeel.
I think when you're excited aboutdoing something, it doesn't feel
like a chore.
(21:15):
Like, okay, I got to do this.
And how am I going to do this?For me, it's just fitting it into
my day now.
It's almost like you go to the
gym.
I don't have time.
If you fit it into your dailyschedule, you get it done.
And that's how I approached it.
An agent calls, I'll... book it
(21:37):
into my calendar or, you know,next few days, whenever they're
available and just go with it.
If I don't do that call, I feel
like I'm probably doing somethingthat may not be productive for my
own business as well sometimes.
So why not spend that time and
help a fellow broker?But I find in general, it's been
easy to adapt.
Like I said, I enjoy it.
So it doesn't feel like, oh, youknow, I don't want to do it or
(22:00):
it's tough.
I just fit it in and do it.
It's just like going to the gym,get it done.
it done.
You know, on both the podcasts
that we did individually with youboth, you mentioned that, you
know, you care about your clients,you care about the process.
And, you know, Danny, I'vedefinitely seen it with you having
been in the role that you reallycare about the success of the
people that are coming in andwanting to make sure that they're
(22:21):
successful.
And Chris, I know that's exactly
how you're going to operate withit.
So, and I think overall people arerespectful of each other's time
and understand that, you know,we're all busy with all this stuff
going on.
And, you know, you guys are doing
a great job with that.
And I don't foresee any change to
that moving forward.
One question for each of you to
answer.
Best way to frame this is one tip
for an aspiring mentor or somebodythat's a leader in this space.
(22:43):
I think my one tip would be to bea good listener.
think my one tip would be to be agood listener.
And then just throw your name inthe hat.
Take a seat at the table.
Speak up because it's really
welcome feedback and yourperspective is probably really,
really needed.
So don't be shy.
I would say the same, actually bea good listener.
I find that on any of the callsthat I've done, I just sit back
(23:05):
and listen to them, you know, whattheir pain points are and then
figure out, give them some advice.
I think above that is also you
learn something.
As I've been doing it, I've
learned that, oh, you know, so-and -so asked that question.
Actually, I don't know.
And we're going to find out.
And then I've incorporated it intomy own processes and refined them.
Like I helped them, but they alsohelped me.
So I think that's maybe onetakeaway is if you want to.
(23:27):
become a mentor or a role that'sin sort of in line with that is
you also get a lot out of it.
You're helping, but in turn,
you're going to learn a lot tooand help yourself.
So one of the last questions Iwanted to go into is I've already
seen some immediate success fromagents that have come on board,
one of the last questions I wantedto go into is I've already seen
some immediate success from agentsthat have come on board, bankers
especially, but even justexperienced brokers.
We had a couple of brokers leave abetter way this year.
(23:48):
and come right back.
And common feedback from everyone
is like, I'm telling everyone theyneed to join a better way because
of these experiences, whether itwas something that happened in the
onboarding or one of theconversations that they had in a
welcome call or what have you, orthe follow through afterwards of
feeling comfortable at an event,all the things that we've talked
about.
Have you seen any success there
from the feedback you've received?And Chris, did any of that stick
out to you as like, hey, thiscould be a great way to find other
(24:11):
people that... are like -mindedand, you know, we're always
looking to grow, but we're notlooking to just grow.
We want the right people that arethe right fit for our culture and
our team and everything else thatgoes on here.
So I just wouldn't mind gettingyour opinion on that.
The point that you mentioned,we've seen some agents leave and
come back and I've heard as wellis that beyond the culture that
you've built here, you know, thetechnicalities of the business to
(24:31):
compliance, for example, is ahuge, you know, change this past
year.
I've talked to some other brokers
that feel like brokerages are...
taking it very lightly.
And that's going to affect everybroker eventually down the road if
you're not taking the right stepsto ensure you're compliant.
And so ABW, you guys have done anamazing job with that.
I feel that's part of the reasonwhy when they're talking out in
the street is, well, I didn't knowthat in turn is that, yeah, you
(24:54):
should join ABW because not onlyare we educating the brokers on
these technical side of thebusiness and things that they must
do and above and beyond buildingthe culture that we're making sure
that they're doing everythingcorrect.
and, you know, properly.
Yeah, I completely understand why
they would leave and then comeback because I do know that this
is one of the best.
brokerages, if not the best
brokerage in Canada.
I've worked at other brokerages
and I talk to you guys becauseyou're so approachable and I know
that your sole purpose in thislife is to figure out how to help
us be more successful and serveour clients and have full access.
(25:17):
The efforts that you make mightnot be so obvious when you're just
experiencing that every singleday, but if you've worked in an
environment where you don'texperience that every single day,
then when you do get here, you areso, so grateful for all the work.
that our broker owners put intomaking this place a really stellar
place for us to deliver all theservices and serve as great
intermediaries for our clientswith the lenders.
(25:37):
There's no other place to be.
Well, I mean, thank you very much
for that.
One piece of feedback that I've
had is I had brought over a fairlyhighly producing mortgage
specialist from RBC who I'dbrought through the onboarding
process, answering questions for afew weeks after.
And this was kind of right as wewere transitioning Danny into the
role.
So I'd introduce this gentleman to
Danny.
And the guy called me.
About two or three days after, andhe said, thank God you introduced
(25:57):
me to Danny.
I'm able to call him now because
he just made me feel socomfortable about where I was at.
It reinforced the decision that Ihad made to join.
You know, I think he's probablyfour or five months in and he's
rolling very steadily.
He's at all the events, he's doing
all the learnings.
And that's where I really see the
benefit.
And again, I think that is the
(26:19):
major piece of having you twoleading this as ground level,
understanding what's going on andjust in the day -to -day weeds of
that.
I see the success continuing to
grow is just having people justfeeling like they're really a part
of the culture and how this wholething operates.
And some of it's tiny littletactical things like I've
submitted my first deal to thelender.
some of it's tiny little tacticalthings like I've submitted my
first deal to the lender.
(26:40):
Now what?
Like, do they get back to metomorrow?
Is it going to be next week whenyou're used to a system and then
all of a sudden you, and if theunderwriter hasn't gotten back to
you in a day or two, is thatnormal?
Is that not normal?You will sit there and sweat it
and not have the answers.
But now you could run it past
Danny and I and we could figureout whether that's normal or not,
(27:02):
or it's volumes or there'ssomething wrong.
Little tiny things like that, justturnarounds that can be so
unnerving when you have subjectremovals and clients to take care
of.
I just want to share a funny story
about this role specifically.
Our goal is to help the agents get
up and running and, you know,thrive.
So after working with one of theagents for probably like a month
and a half, we're talking almostevery other day, texting at night
(27:23):
sometimes.
And then eventually he was
comfortable and the calls got...
fewer and fewer in between.
And didn't hear from him foralmost a week.
And then he calls me and I waslike, hey, what's up?
Like, what do you need today?He's like, oh, nothing.
I just feel kind of weird.
Like, it's like we've broken up.
So I thought I'd just call to sayhi.
I'm like, okay, well, what are youup to?
(27:45):
And we're just chatting for alittle bit.
And yeah, it was pretty funny.
A way for me to measure our
success, our impact in this roleis like, we want to work with
them, get them up and running.
And if we hear... less and less
from them, it means we're doing agreat job.
They're up and ready to doeverything on their own.
They can find information on theirown and we're doing our job.
So in some ways, you know, webuilt a friendship now, but yeah,
(28:07):
now they're out on their own.
See you at the next event.
You know, that's a great metric tomeasure the success.
And it's probably a great point tokind of wrap this up.
Like that's certainly one thingI've noticed is From our position,
we're getting less and less calls.
To be honest, a lot of these
folks, zero.
Like they're not reaching out to
us for any support because you'veliterally handled it and they know
(28:27):
exactly what they're doing andthey feel comfortable in that.
So that's a huge win for us.
And, you know, again, back to the,
you know, the heavy event schedulewe have, these folks are coming to
the very first one since gettingonboarded.
And it's like.
It's crazy.
Like some of these guys, I knowwho the one you were just talking
about, like, it's like he's beenhere forever.
It's like I've known him forever.
like I've known him forever.
Right.
So it's cool to see just how
quickly people are gettingintegrated into this family.
And we want you to feel the love.
(28:49):
want you to feel the love.
Exactly.
Yeah.
It's just been a huge success forus out the gates.
And one of the most humblingpieces of this whole journey was
really just the hiring process andputting the, I guess, the job
posting out there to our team isjust so many of our brokers wanted
to do this.
And it just goes to show you how
willing our team is to helpeveryone.
All the interested brokers, Imean, we've been able to
(29:12):
communicate with everyone that,you know, obviously wasn't
successful in getting this role tobegin with.
But this is certainly going to bea growing segment of our team.
As we grow, we're going tocontinue to grow this BRM team and
this leadership team in general.
So there's always going to be
opportunities going forward here.
And so for those of you that are
listening, there definitely willbe another opportunity.
(29:32):
And for those of you that arelistening that maybe didn't put
your hat into the pile here, youknow, certainly reach out if this
is something of interest to you,because, yeah, it's just been so
great for us to see.
And we're really fortunate to have
you guys supporting us.
Thank you.
The feeling I'm sure is mutual.
We're really grateful for the
opportunity.
And thanks for your time again.
Let's put these mics down and havea group hug.
Yeah, exactly.
Yeah.
(29:52):
Well, thanks for listening.
I mean, again, that was like a
little bit off the script fromwhat we, you know, we usually do
on this show, but we just thoughtthis has been such a great
success.
We wanted to share it.
Also, even just with the industryfor, you know, broker owners that
are listening that think thatadding something like this to your
team could help, like I highlyrecommend it.
It's just a no brainer in oureyes.
So that's a wrap and thanks forlistening.
(30:13):
Thank you for tuning in.
If you found value in this show,
please subscribe to our channel onyour preferred platform.
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Your support is incrediblyappreciated.
We also welcome your reviews andfeedback, which are crucial in
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Lastly, a vital announcement aboutBackpack Buddies, our chosen
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this remarkable organization
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addresses a hidden hunger issuemany are unaware of in british
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