August 21, 2025 • 26 mins
What happens when your 10-year-old asks for a magazine and you realize there is not a single one you feel good about handing her? That is the moment Mary Flenner faced, and it led to Tween Magazine.
Mary is a mom of three girls, a longtime marketing and content writer, and the founding editor of a lifestyle magazine designed just for tweens. Instead of pushing girls to grow up too fast, Tween celebrates silliness, creativity, individuality, and the joy of being a kid.
In this conversation, we talk with Mary about:
- The origin story of Tween Magazine and why she chose print in 2024
- How media aimed at tweens and teens has missed the mark, and what she is doing differently
- Balancing sustainability with aligned advertising partners
- The most popular features so far, from “Real Girls Who Rock” to the pen pal program
- How her daughters have become her co‑creative directors
- What she hopes every girl feels when they open Tween: seen, celebrated, and free to be goofy
Mary also shares her vision for the next five years of Tween Magazine and why giving girls permission to be kids is a powerful countercultural stance.
🎧 Tune in to hear how one mom’s creative leap is giving a generation of girls a magazine they can call their own.
Visit tweenmag.com or @tweenmagazineforgirls to learn more.
TMIT Teammates #4: Celebrating Girlhood with Tween Magazine Founder Mary Flenner
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Hi everyone, our guest today is Mary Flenner, the founding
editor of Tween Magazine, a lifestyle magazine for young
girls that's all about empowering age appropriate
content. As a mom of three girls and a
seasoned marketing and content writer for nearly 20 years, Mary
saw a gap in what the media offers to tweens and decided to
create something different. Tween Magazine challenges
(00:23):
today's cultural norms where girls are often pressured to
grow up too quickly and instead embraces childhood.
Tween encourages girls to be authentic, goofy, and
adventurous and celebrates theseprecious preteen years.
And you know we all love a good,authentic, and developmentally
appropriate celebration here at Team IT.
Mary lives in Cleveland, OH withher husband and three daughters,
(00:46):
and we are thrilled to have her on the show.
Welcome, Mary. Hi, thank you so much for having
me. Yeah.
Thanks for being here. Very excited to talk with you
guys today. Yes, thank you.
SO I guess let's start at the beginning.
Tell us the tween origin story and what inspired you to create
a print magazine in 2024. Yeah, so one day my 10 year old
(01:09):
daughter had seen me reading a magazine and simply asked if
there was one that she could read.
And so I jumped online, looked around a little bit and was
shocked to find that even in today's world that I, there
really wasn't an appropriate option for her.
So, you know, we had done some of the more wholesome children's
magazines like Highlights and you know, Ranger Rick and those
(01:31):
are great. But as they, as my girls were
getting older, they're kind of outgrowing those.
But there wasn't really anythingfor that in between audience,
you know, it jumps up really quickly to those more teenage
magazines. And so I saw that gap and with
my background in marketing, I, Ithink the wheels kind of started
(01:51):
turning. And, you know, thinking back to
my childhood, I knew girls lovedmagazines.
I loved magazines and realizing that there's so many girls that
don't read them anymore, it almost, you know, kind of made
me sad. And I knew there's this
opportunity and this whole world.
They don't know about how cool they can be.
But I, I really got excited by the idea of kind of putting my
(02:13):
own spin on it and kind of like revamping them for today's
world. So, you know, making them a lot
more, a lot different than the ones I grew up reading, that
we're all about looking hot and learning to kiss boys and flirt
and, you know, which celebrity looked better in a dress and
things like that. So.
So yeah, I really wanted to kindof bring back the magazine for
(02:34):
today's World and the magazine that I would feel good giving to
my own daughters. Yeah.
So what topics did you want to address right out of the gate?
Yeah. So I really wanted to kind of
push back against the, you know,what's happening culture now
with girls on TikTok and, you know, they're going those
(02:55):
Sephora tweens and makeup routines and skin care that they
don't need. And I think girls are just
growing up way too fast. And so I kind of wanted to just
pull back and celebrate the everyday girl, make it about
embracing childhood, being silly, being a kid and just
almost kind of like pumping the brakes like this is all
happening too fast. You guys don't need to be doing
(03:17):
this, You know, learning these sexy choreographed dances on
Snapchat and TikTok and Instagram and all those
pressures. And it was all just happening so
fast. So I feel like it was, you know,
I really want it to be a way to get back to that more
traditional childhood like like I had in the 90s.
Mary, what did the magazines that you read when you were a
(03:38):
tween, when you were 11, what did they get wrong about you?
Oh boy, so I love them but they were not appropriate for me as
well I would say So I read Bop, Teen Beat and those were all
like the hot guy posters like Jonathan Taylor Thomas, Devin
(03:58):
Sawa, Andrew Keegan and. They great trifecta there.
Yeah, I would say what they got wrong about me and other girls
is, I mean, it's for them, you know, a money maker.
They know they're playing into that girls, our boy crazy at
this age and are idolizing and, you know, wanting to marry these
(04:19):
cute boys. And that's like all you're
thinking about. So that it was really just
playing into that, that that's all we're interested in.
And so I think that they they'vejust that they put too much
focus on our, you know, thinkingthat I'm thinking about develop,
you know, flirting with my crushat age 12.
(04:40):
And I think they're just puttingso much pressure on those
romantic relationships at such ayoung age where I probably
wouldn't have been thinking about it so much.
But when you're reading articlessaying, you know, Are you ready
for your first kiss? Then maybe you're going, Oh, you
know, I'm ready for my you know,it's, it's kind of in your head
now that, oh, girls my age are thinking about having their
(05:00):
first kiss. Am I ready?
Where maybe if it was about how to build a better lemonade stand
or like a door to door, but you know, some kind of neighborhood
business I could have started, maybe that's what I would have
spent more time thinking about. So I think they were just so
singular on, OK, you're thinkingabout boys, how to impress them,
how to look good and how to looklike these celebrities.
(05:22):
And my goodness, you know, the pressures with body image and
wanting to be as thin as the girls, of course, in the
magazine that I think every girlcould relate to growing up
breeding. I think it's something that they
all got wrong. And now they're realizing, you
know, 20 years later. It's been a slow, slow change
(05:43):
and shift over the years, but it's still something I think
they're struggling with finding that right, you know, balance.
The editorial was totally drivenby the commercial, right?
Where the boys are actors in movies and the skin care is
products that are advertised, right?
And so you now have an opportunity to do this
(06:04):
differently. But how do you do it
differently? Because I would imagine you want
to make money, right? So like what?
How does an indie print magazinestay sustainable without
lowering its standards? Yeah, it's a good question.
Is something I thought about a lot when we were starting.
It is that, you know, we includeadvertising right now it's more
limited, but I we are really deliberate and thoughtful about
(06:27):
every brand that we're partnering with.
So we only want to promote brands that we truly believe in.
And I think that that is really important and that's something
that our readers value because they know that they can trust
everything that's in tween is something that I really feel
good about giving my daughter. So we, you know, I've already
thought about, you know, what ifthis brand approached me or
(06:49):
something that kind of didn't align with our values.
So, so it has naturally worked out that the brands that, you
know, they really believe in ourmission and it just, you know,
it's naturally worked out that they, they see the value in what
we're doing and they believe in it and want to be behind it.
Are there any dream advertisers or partnerships that you think
of when you think of tween? Yeah, OK.
(07:12):
So if you used to buy magazines when you're a kid, I remember
like the the the print ads with brands like Steve Madden, like
Madden girls shoes, Pacific sunwear.
So I would love to have like some really cool brands like
that. We've been talking to gab
watches. Gab wireless has a lot of
(07:34):
products that we believe and we've had them for years.
So we already are talking with them.
But I would love to have those cool, like classic, you know,
when I think of the editorial photo shoots and things like
that that I grew up looking at. So.
So yeah, maybe one day. Sure, you're on your way.
Yeah. Yeah.
You know, it's interesting because I try to run this
(07:57):
household in a way where no advertisement gets in right,
where our kids don't know about any brands where.
And we fail. And we fail, of course, and it
comes. To Fabric talks about Batman and
Superman and we're like where did this come from?
But OK. It comes through the craziest
places, but I diapers because itcomes through diapers because it
comes through the library. I I try and I do it for myself
(08:21):
too and for for our family to just basically to only subscribe
to things where we're we have anad free version, right.
So I'm wondering, is that something that anyone has asked
for? Has anyone said, Hey Mary, you
know I love the the content for my kids but I don't want them
seeing any brands. Can you make something that just
is an ad insert for parents or an ad free option where you pay
(08:42):
more? Does that come up at all?
Have you thought about that? It hasn't come up at all, I
think because the brands that we're choosing are ones that
most of our readers would be OK with, you know, if that makes
sense. But if it did ever, you know,
some, I'm sure it's something wecould look at.
Of course would raise the price a lot, but, but as a reader, I
(09:05):
always, I really liked the ads. Maybe, you know, I remember
hanging them up on my wall and they never bothered me.
I really, I thought they were cool and interesting.
And so I think I am trying to take the best parts of the
magazine experience that I had as a kid.
So I, I think that advertising will always be a part of it, but
it is just selecting the right partners and making sure that
(09:27):
any of the messaging is, you know, in that tween, you know,
aligns with the tween brand. I like that that's a common
theme for us. It's like we can tend to be very
black and white with the best ofintentions.
But I do think that having aligned advertisements is
probably more realistic than having no advertisements.
(09:48):
Yeah. What has been your favorite
feature so far? Oh, that's a good question.
I got really excited. I mean, I get really excited
about all of them, but we recently did an interview with
playwright Lauren Gunderson. And if you aren't familiar with
who she is, look her up. She's one of the most produced
(10:08):
playwrights in America and like one of the most produced living
playwrights, which is a really big deal.
And so I was like, very nervous to talk to her because she's
very cool and brilliant. And so I did an interview with
her and she gave so much great advice.
And as a writer, it really resonated with me, you know, so
(10:30):
she talked to girls about, you know, what she does as a
playwright, how she gets ideas, things like that.
And then following that, we havea feature on how girls can write
their own play and put on put onan outdoor play.
So cool. She was really cool to talk to
and just give so many great tips.
(10:50):
And you know, she's, she's been promoting us and so she's just
been like such a great person toconnect with.
What do you think has been your daughter's favorite feature so
far? I think they felt pretty cool
about the We had the singer-songwriter from The
Voice, Britney Cartelli, and then we had learned to write
your own song again. Kind of like pairing them up
(11:11):
with, you know, having an experttell about, you know, teach
about a topic and then how girlscan do it.
So they really liked that one aswell.
They they get excited about justlike the did you know, facts,
They'll help the, you know, everyday they'll be like, oh,
this is one for tween. You know, here's a here's a fun
fact. So they like just, you know,
(11:33):
those little things like that are the crosswords and the
there's a would you rather that they love coming up with.
So, so they get excited about just like those little fun, you
know, little tidbits that I think the kids have a lot of fun
with. That's so cool.
Yeah. You've talked before about how
your daughters are your Co creative directors, right?
How has Tween adapted your family culture as you have
(11:58):
started? This Yeah.
So they they really are. They've been involved from the
beginning. And I love that they have got to
see every step of the way from me saying, you know, I have an
idea we're going to do this to creating a website.
And now I really do run everything past them because
they're my first focus group at home.
(12:18):
So I think it's helped build their confidence because they
see, you know, that I really do go it.
I really value their opinion. I listen to what they say, you
know, if they don't like the cover background or they think
something feels weird and fake or that's lame because I'm the
mom and I, you know, so I think it really has given them that
confidence like, oh, wow. Like, I know, you know, I have a
(12:42):
good opinion. And I even if though I'm a kid,
you know, I still, you know, mom's listening and I know what
I'm talking about. So, yeah, you know, we've gotten
busier creating the magazine. So I think finding that balance
has, you know, been tough. But it's something that we're
all really excited about. So they know, you know, I try to
(13:03):
really be deliberate with my time and set up, you know, OK,
I'm going to play with the kids now and then later jump on the
computer and get some things done.
But I think just, we've had to really be mindful about setting
aside that time for them becauseit's gotten busier and, you
know, there's more calls and just more to do So, but it's
(13:25):
nice because they are understanding, you know, like I
had to run out to a printer and drop off magazines.
And I said, well, I could wait, but the subscribers are waiting
for this magazine. And my oldest goes, no, you need
to get it to them. You need to go right now.
So they, I took them to their friend's house and they were
like, no, you need, we'll drive out their mom do it.
So they're like my business advisors and totally, yeah.
(13:47):
So tell us, if you Fast forward five years, like what do you
envision for Tween Magazine? How will you know that it's
making the kind of impact you envisioned when you first
started? Yeah.
I think in five years that we would be in some big retailers.
I think that we're going to be in Target.
I think we'll be in little toy shops all over and we'll, you
(14:08):
know, girls that have it are going to be telling all their
friends. It's going to be a lot more
popular. It's maybe not such a small
indie magazine. We have more trusted
relationships with some big brands.
We have so many amazing female designers that want to work with
us. And what will a young girl feel
when she picks it up? Like what?
What do you really want them to come away with?
(14:31):
Yeah, I want them to feel seen, I guess.
And just that like that, you know, Oh my gosh, this is like
everything I'm into. This is so cool.
We just had a mom who sent us her daughter's reaction getting
tween for the first time. She said, Oh, I, she said, I
truly left my video on accident and hearing her daughter like
(14:53):
made my whole week or month because she, it was that type of
reaction. Like, Oh my gosh, this and this,
like these are all the things I'm into.
And just kind of knowing, you know, having that feeling of
it's OK to be how I am. It's OK to be goofy.
It's OK to, you know, still playwith dolls or, you know, to be a
(15:17):
kid and not feel those pressuresof having to pretend to be or,
you know, acts carry yourself like a teenager.
So I think that's just that struggle of that age, you know,
is you kind of have one leg in each world, right?
You're you still are a girl and you want to well, maybe you want
to play or you sometimes want toplay with Barbies or But then
(15:40):
you're starting to feel like youwant to do more independently
and want to start dabbling in these things that the older
girls are doing and do less withyour parents and they're
starting to feel embarrassing. So I think it's, you know,
giving messages to both girls that feel, you know, in both of
those worlds and just letting them know that they're, you
(16:00):
know, if you're feeling hormonaland crazy, you're not crazy.
You know, all these things are normal.
Kind of normalizing that experience of all that it means
to be a preteen girl. I love that.
I especially love the goofy aspect, the permission to be
goofy. I feel like I was on the later
to mature side growing up and definitely wanted to be goofy
(16:25):
longer than some of my friends and actually grew apart from
some of my friends during those tween years because I still
wanted to be goofy. And I think that that's kind of
part of the adolescent transition, right?
And just enabling and and givingchildren permission to play in
that space and that silly space I think is really important.
(16:46):
So I applaud you for including that part.
Thanks. Yeah, I think a big part of our
mission is giving kids, giving girls permission to just be kids
longer. I think that's just such a, you
know, they're growing up so fastand it's like just pump the
brakes. Like you said, celebrating
childhood. Just be a kid.
You don't need to be a little mini influencer and worry about
(17:09):
your, you know, online social brand.
Just like take all of that away.Don't worry about those things
and just be you. I think like embracing
individuality is a big part of the magazine too.
So we're very, very much about, you know, being weird and being
you. So yeah, cool.
That's. Very cool in the family space,
(17:30):
particularly on social media. I'm sure you have spent a lot of
time there recently given what you're doing and I'm just
curious, are there anything thatyou have picked up on to reach
families more authentically thatyou're seeing either is working
or you know that you want to do?Yeah, we're kind of figuring it
out every day. I know.
(17:52):
I think people like to see our girls.
Like they like to know that it'sa, you know, my girls are
involved and it's kind of a family business ish.
But I have never put my kids on social media before this.
I like, I don't include their names or anything.
And I'm like, so that was kind of a big deal for me to be like,
OK, I never post pictures of them, but now I'm kind of
(18:14):
including them in tween stuff. And so my thought with that is
like a lot of times they're in aphoto shoot with many kids.
I'm not really saying who's my kids.
I don't use their names. I try to still like, you know,
keep it, keep their privacy. But yeah, we're so I want to let
people in and like see the face behind the magazine.
(18:34):
But I also, you know, I don't need to be a star.
I don't like, want us to be, youknow, So I, I guess I, yeah,
well, I struggle with that a little bit.
Like, that's a tug. That's a tug of war, right?
Because in a way, you kind of are the brand.
Yeah, exactly. Tween.
Tween is not a be. Forever, right?
Right. I mean, 'cause you do have two
tweens now, right? But presumably, yes.
(18:57):
And you'll have another one. But presumably this will be a
business for a long time, right?And you don't want to be no
longer relevant when your kids age out of that also.
So yeah, that's great. I guess before we let you go, I
had one question about one of your features.
I guess it's a recurring series called Real Girls Who Rock,
(19:19):
right? Can you, can you tell us about
that? And could you also tell us what
your feature would look like if you were one of the real girls
who rock? Oh boy, that's a good one.
So Real Girls who Rock is a spotlight on real everyday girls
who are doing something amazing,whether it's, you know, our
(19:40):
first one had a Taekwondo champ who has her black belt.
They could start a club, maybe they're a skilled musicians,
things like that. So if you're listening, we are
they're always taking nominations so you can send them
in to us. But I think it's really
important again, with, you know,how we're trying to go against
(20:01):
all those traditional, the traditional media that I grew up
reading and not spotlight what celebrities are wearing and, you
know, them getting their mail and how they're just like us,
but trying to inspire girls with.
You know, girls that are like them and kind of showing them,
you know, look, she did this amazing thing.
You could too. And so, yeah, we featured
(20:23):
Taekwondo champ, we featured in an environmental activist.
And in our issue 3, we have a gymnast who also has alopecia.
And issue 4 coming out in the winter is, is going to be
featuring an entrepreneur who started her own line of dolls.
(20:44):
So we have, we have so many, those have really been taken
off. We've had a lot of cool people
reaching out. So we have some like some
wrestlers who are going to feature some girls who play
hockey. So we really want to show girls,
you know, who are going against stereotypes, you know, things,
you know, putting themselves outthere, starting businesses,
(21:06):
showing kindness through volunteering and things like
that. So I did forget that when you
ask what my daughter's favorite is, a lot of the girls really
like the real girls who rock andI, they always, I think that was
their favorite in the first one.So there's so many different
features in it. It's almost they're really,
they're really jam packed. But they are.
They're great. That's what everyone really
(21:27):
likes those a lot so. Very cool.
And then so if if you had a realgirls Who Rock profile on you,
what are the strengths and quirks that got you here boy?
So is it me when I'm a, when I'myoung, when I'm like 10 or me
now OK or now or? Now, Yeah, well, what are what
are the things that actually it's a it's AI think you nailed
(21:49):
it, which is what are the thingsthat happened or that that you
that inspired you during those formative years that allowed you
to take this jump and do something bold like you're doing
now? Yeah.
I think it would be my headline would be something like girl who
like embraced her weirdness and like learned that it's OK to be
weird. I was always, I was called weird
(22:10):
a lot and like crazy. And I'd be like, why are you
saying crazy? And they'd say, well, you're
funny. And I'm like, well, then just
say that. Don't call me.
So I learned over the years to kind of embrace like who I am
and that I sometimes have big kind of crazy ideas, but this
was one of them. And people love it and my girls
(22:31):
love it. And I'm reaching moms out there
who are looking for something similar.
So I think it was, you know, embracing who you are, embracing
your talents as, you know, cheesy as it could sound, I have
always loved writing. And so I really, you know,
focused on that and what I love to do.
And to me, it was a dream job tobe like, OK, I would love to run
(22:53):
a magazine. Like, could I do that?
Like, that would be amazing. I would love to have that job.
So, you know, I just, I kind of gave it to myself.
Like, OK, I'm gonna gonna give myself the title.
I'm gonna see if I can do this. Even if, you know, just give it.
Yeah, give yourself the chance. So.
Way to reclaim crazy. That's great, yeah.
Yeah, I was crazy, the best friend.
(23:14):
But yeah, it was definitely veryquirky and creative and probably
kind of loud as a kid. Speaking of differentiated
features, you started a pen pal program early on at Tween as
well. Can you talk a little bit about
that and what you intend for it and how it should grow?
Yeah, the pen pal program is something I'm so excited about.
(23:34):
I've it's like I've tried to start pen pal programs like for
years through like the PTA. I'm always like, what about a
pen pal program? I love the idea of a pen.
I love the idea of connecting people and I just think there's
that there's so many great things about it.
I love getting girls back to writing letters, connecting with
(23:57):
a friend that you can be open with and share about your lives
and also learn about where they live and what might be
different. And so it is.
We get a lot of great feedback about our pen pal program for
moms and and the girls involved.So so yeah, right now we have
girls all over the country, a lot of girls in Canada.
(24:17):
So we're trying to make as many international matches as we can.
So again, with getting scrappy, I'm trying to like e-mail
schools and Italy and Spain and trying to make those
partnerships so that we have more, you know, kind of
interesting matches and you're not just being matched with
someone, you know, who lives around the block.
So, so yeah, the really excited about how that's taking off and.
(24:41):
That was the thing our daughter was most.
Excited about? Yeah.
Extremely excited to be a part of the pen pal program.
Yeah, there's nothing like getting something in the mail.
You know, you don't really get mail anymore.
And especially kids. So exactly the magazine's
exciting, but getting a letter in the mail from your friend
and, you know, we encourage them.
We we send out kind of like an informational letter when they
(25:02):
first join. And we say we encourage
handwritten letters. You know, you can draw pictures.
You can ask, ask questions, get to know each other.
So we kind of give them a littlebit of like, here's what it is,
since again, it's kind of one ofthose things that's almost going
extinct and here's how you do it.
And then we kind of leave it in the girl's hands after that.
Very cool, very cool. Greg, do you have any other?
(25:25):
No, this has been terrific. Thank you so much, Mary.
We are thrilled to have you heretoday.
We're thrilled to have you quarterly in our household with
our girls reading, following along.
And because they're starting young, you'll have them in your
audience for more than the tweenyears.
Yeah, that's. Great.
Which is exciting. Yeah, anything.
(25:45):
Any last thoughts you'd like to share with our audience or where
they can find you? And Tween Magazine.
Yeah, so you can subscribe to tween@tweenmag.com.
We do four issues a year. Makes a great gift.
Holidays are coming up, so we'llhave our holiday issue out in
time for, you know, before December.
(26:06):
And yeah, you can find information about joining the
Pen Pal program inside. And follow us on Instagram at
Tween Magazine for Girls. Awesome.
Thanks so much, Mary. Thanks for having me.
All right. Thanks everybody for listening.
This has been another episode ofThe Most Important Thing.
Hey, guys, if you're still here,you're definitely our kind of
person. Thanks for spending this time
(26:27):
with us on The Most Important Thing.
If this episode resonated with you, we'd love for you to follow
us wherever you get your podcasts and share it with
someone else. Building family culture on
purpose.
Hi everyone, our guest today is Mary Flenner, the founding
editor of Tween Magazine, a lifestyle magazine for young
girls that's all about empowering age appropriate
content. As a mom of three girls and a
seasoned marketing and content writer for nearly 20 years, Mary
saw a gap in what the media offers to tweens and decided to
create something different. Tween Magazine challenges
(00:23):
today's cultural norms where girls are often pressured to
grow up too quickly and instead embraces childhood.
Tween encourages girls to be authentic, goofy, and
adventurous and celebrates theseprecious preteen years.
And you know we all love a good,authentic, and developmentally
appropriate celebration here at Team IT.
Mary lives in Cleveland, OH withher husband and three daughters,
(00:46):
and we are thrilled to have her on the show.
Welcome, Mary. Hi, thank you so much for having
me. Yeah.
Thanks for being here. Very excited to talk with you
guys today. Yes, thank you.
SO I guess let's start at the beginning.
Tell us the tween origin story and what inspired you to create
a print magazine in 2024. Yeah, so one day my 10 year old
(01:09):
daughter had seen me reading a magazine and simply asked if
there was one that she could read.
And so I jumped online, looked around a little bit and was
shocked to find that even in today's world that I, there
really wasn't an appropriate option for her.
So, you know, we had done some of the more wholesome children's
magazines like Highlights and you know, Ranger Rick and those
(01:31):
are great. But as they, as my girls were
getting older, they're kind of outgrowing those.
But there wasn't really anythingfor that in between audience,
you know, it jumps up really quickly to those more teenage
magazines. And so I saw that gap and with
my background in marketing, I, Ithink the wheels kind of started
(01:51):
turning. And, you know, thinking back to
my childhood, I knew girls lovedmagazines.
I loved magazines and realizing that there's so many girls that
don't read them anymore, it almost, you know, kind of made
me sad. And I knew there's this
opportunity and this whole world.
They don't know about how cool they can be.
But I, I really got excited by the idea of kind of putting my
(02:13):
own spin on it and kind of like revamping them for today's
world. So, you know, making them a lot
more, a lot different than the ones I grew up reading, that
we're all about looking hot and learning to kiss boys and flirt
and, you know, which celebrity looked better in a dress and
things like that. So.
So yeah, I really wanted to kindof bring back the magazine for
(02:34):
today's World and the magazine that I would feel good giving to
my own daughters. Yeah.
So what topics did you want to address right out of the gate?
Yeah. So I really wanted to kind of
push back against the, you know,what's happening culture now
with girls on TikTok and, you know, they're going those
(02:55):
Sephora tweens and makeup routines and skin care that they
don't need. And I think girls are just
growing up way too fast. And so I kind of wanted to just
pull back and celebrate the everyday girl, make it about
embracing childhood, being silly, being a kid and just
almost kind of like pumping the brakes like this is all
happening too fast. You guys don't need to be doing
(03:17):
this, You know, learning these sexy choreographed dances on
Snapchat and TikTok and Instagram and all those
pressures. And it was all just happening so
fast. So I feel like it was, you know,
I really want it to be a way to get back to that more
traditional childhood like like I had in the 90s.
Mary, what did the magazines that you read when you were a
(03:38):
tween, when you were 11, what did they get wrong about you?
Oh boy, so I love them but they were not appropriate for me as
well I would say So I read Bop, Teen Beat and those were all
like the hot guy posters like Jonathan Taylor Thomas, Devin
(03:58):
Sawa, Andrew Keegan and. They great trifecta there.
Yeah, I would say what they got wrong about me and other girls
is, I mean, it's for them, you know, a money maker.
They know they're playing into that girls, our boy crazy at
this age and are idolizing and, you know, wanting to marry these
(04:19):
cute boys. And that's like all you're
thinking about. So that it was really just
playing into that, that that's all we're interested in.
And so I think that they they'vejust that they put too much
focus on our, you know, thinkingthat I'm thinking about develop,
you know, flirting with my crushat age 12.
(04:40):
And I think they're just puttingso much pressure on those
romantic relationships at such ayoung age where I probably
wouldn't have been thinking about it so much.
But when you're reading articlessaying, you know, Are you ready
for your first kiss? Then maybe you're going, Oh, you
know, I'm ready for my you know,it's, it's kind of in your head
now that, oh, girls my age are thinking about having their
(05:00):
first kiss. Am I ready?
Where maybe if it was about how to build a better lemonade stand
or like a door to door, but you know, some kind of neighborhood
business I could have started, maybe that's what I would have
spent more time thinking about. So I think they were just so
singular on, OK, you're thinkingabout boys, how to impress them,
how to look good and how to looklike these celebrities.
(05:22):
And my goodness, you know, the pressures with body image and
wanting to be as thin as the girls, of course, in the
magazine that I think every girlcould relate to growing up
breeding. I think it's something that they
all got wrong. And now they're realizing, you
know, 20 years later. It's been a slow, slow change
(05:43):
and shift over the years, but it's still something I think
they're struggling with finding that right, you know, balance.
The editorial was totally drivenby the commercial, right?
Where the boys are actors in movies and the skin care is
products that are advertised, right?
And so you now have an opportunity to do this
(06:04):
differently. But how do you do it
differently? Because I would imagine you want
to make money, right? So like what?
How does an indie print magazinestay sustainable without
lowering its standards? Yeah, it's a good question.
Is something I thought about a lot when we were starting.
It is that, you know, we includeadvertising right now it's more
limited, but I we are really deliberate and thoughtful about
(06:27):
every brand that we're partnering with.
So we only want to promote brands that we truly believe in.
And I think that that is really important and that's something
that our readers value because they know that they can trust
everything that's in tween is something that I really feel
good about giving my daughter. So we, you know, I've already
thought about, you know, what ifthis brand approached me or
(06:49):
something that kind of didn't align with our values.
So, so it has naturally worked out that the brands that, you
know, they really believe in ourmission and it just, you know,
it's naturally worked out that they, they see the value in what
we're doing and they believe in it and want to be behind it.
Are there any dream advertisers or partnerships that you think
of when you think of tween? Yeah, OK.
(07:12):
So if you used to buy magazines when you're a kid, I remember
like the the the print ads with brands like Steve Madden, like
Madden girls shoes, Pacific sunwear.
So I would love to have like some really cool brands like
that. We've been talking to gab
watches. Gab wireless has a lot of
(07:34):
products that we believe and we've had them for years.
So we already are talking with them.
But I would love to have those cool, like classic, you know,
when I think of the editorial photo shoots and things like
that that I grew up looking at. So.
So yeah, maybe one day. Sure, you're on your way.
Yeah. Yeah.
You know, it's interesting because I try to run this
(07:57):
household in a way where no advertisement gets in right,
where our kids don't know about any brands where.
And we fail. And we fail, of course, and it
comes. To Fabric talks about Batman and
Superman and we're like where did this come from?
But OK. It comes through the craziest
places, but I diapers because itcomes through diapers because it
comes through the library. I I try and I do it for myself
(08:21):
too and for for our family to just basically to only subscribe
to things where we're we have anad free version, right.
So I'm wondering, is that something that anyone has asked
for? Has anyone said, Hey Mary, you
know I love the the content for my kids but I don't want them
seeing any brands. Can you make something that just
is an ad insert for parents or an ad free option where you pay
(08:42):
more? Does that come up at all?
Have you thought about that? It hasn't come up at all, I
think because the brands that we're choosing are ones that
most of our readers would be OK with, you know, if that makes
sense. But if it did ever, you know,
some, I'm sure it's something wecould look at.
Of course would raise the price a lot, but, but as a reader, I
(09:05):
always, I really liked the ads. Maybe, you know, I remember
hanging them up on my wall and they never bothered me.
I really, I thought they were cool and interesting.
And so I think I am trying to take the best parts of the
magazine experience that I had as a kid.
So I, I think that advertising will always be a part of it, but
it is just selecting the right partners and making sure that
(09:27):
any of the messaging is, you know, in that tween, you know,
aligns with the tween brand. I like that that's a common
theme for us. It's like we can tend to be very
black and white with the best ofintentions.
But I do think that having aligned advertisements is
probably more realistic than having no advertisements.
(09:48):
Yeah. What has been your favorite
feature so far? Oh, that's a good question.
I got really excited. I mean, I get really excited
about all of them, but we recently did an interview with
playwright Lauren Gunderson. And if you aren't familiar with
who she is, look her up. She's one of the most produced
(10:08):
playwrights in America and like one of the most produced living
playwrights, which is a really big deal.
And so I was like, very nervous to talk to her because she's
very cool and brilliant. And so I did an interview with
her and she gave so much great advice.
And as a writer, it really resonated with me, you know, so
(10:30):
she talked to girls about, you know, what she does as a
playwright, how she gets ideas, things like that.
And then following that, we havea feature on how girls can write
their own play and put on put onan outdoor play.
So cool. She was really cool to talk to
and just give so many great tips.
(10:50):
And you know, she's, she's been promoting us and so she's just
been like such a great person toconnect with.
What do you think has been your daughter's favorite feature so
far? I think they felt pretty cool
about the We had the singer-songwriter from The
Voice, Britney Cartelli, and then we had learned to write
your own song again. Kind of like pairing them up
(11:11):
with, you know, having an experttell about, you know, teach
about a topic and then how girlscan do it.
So they really liked that one aswell.
They they get excited about justlike the did you know, facts,
They'll help the, you know, everyday they'll be like, oh,
this is one for tween. You know, here's a here's a fun
fact. So they like just, you know,
(11:33):
those little things like that are the crosswords and the
there's a would you rather that they love coming up with.
So, so they get excited about just like those little fun, you
know, little tidbits that I think the kids have a lot of fun
with. That's so cool.
Yeah. You've talked before about how
your daughters are your Co creative directors, right?
How has Tween adapted your family culture as you have
(11:58):
started? This Yeah.
So they they really are. They've been involved from the
beginning. And I love that they have got to
see every step of the way from me saying, you know, I have an
idea we're going to do this to creating a website.
And now I really do run everything past them because
they're my first focus group at home.
(12:18):
So I think it's helped build their confidence because they
see, you know, that I really do go it.
I really value their opinion. I listen to what they say, you
know, if they don't like the cover background or they think
something feels weird and fake or that's lame because I'm the
mom and I, you know, so I think it really has given them that
confidence like, oh, wow. Like, I know, you know, I have a
(12:42):
good opinion. And I even if though I'm a kid,
you know, I still, you know, mom's listening and I know what
I'm talking about. So, yeah, you know, we've gotten
busier creating the magazine. So I think finding that balance
has, you know, been tough. But it's something that we're
all really excited about. So they know, you know, I try to
(13:03):
really be deliberate with my time and set up, you know, OK,
I'm going to play with the kids now and then later jump on the
computer and get some things done.
But I think just, we've had to really be mindful about setting
aside that time for them becauseit's gotten busier and, you
know, there's more calls and just more to do So, but it's
(13:25):
nice because they are understanding, you know, like I
had to run out to a printer and drop off magazines.
And I said, well, I could wait, but the subscribers are waiting
for this magazine. And my oldest goes, no, you need
to get it to them. You need to go right now.
So they, I took them to their friend's house and they were
like, no, you need, we'll drive out their mom do it.
So they're like my business advisors and totally, yeah.
(13:47):
So tell us, if you Fast forward five years, like what do you
envision for Tween Magazine? How will you know that it's
making the kind of impact you envisioned when you first
started? Yeah.
I think in five years that we would be in some big retailers.
I think that we're going to be in Target.
I think we'll be in little toy shops all over and we'll, you
(14:08):
know, girls that have it are going to be telling all their
friends. It's going to be a lot more
popular. It's maybe not such a small
indie magazine. We have more trusted
relationships with some big brands.
We have so many amazing female designers that want to work with
us. And what will a young girl feel
when she picks it up? Like what?
What do you really want them to come away with?
(14:31):
Yeah, I want them to feel seen, I guess.
And just that like that, you know, Oh my gosh, this is like
everything I'm into. This is so cool.
We just had a mom who sent us her daughter's reaction getting
tween for the first time. She said, Oh, I, she said, I
truly left my video on accident and hearing her daughter like
(14:53):
made my whole week or month because she, it was that type of
reaction. Like, Oh my gosh, this and this,
like these are all the things I'm into.
And just kind of knowing, you know, having that feeling of
it's OK to be how I am. It's OK to be goofy.
It's OK to, you know, still playwith dolls or, you know, to be a
(15:17):
kid and not feel those pressuresof having to pretend to be or,
you know, acts carry yourself like a teenager.
So I think that's just that struggle of that age, you know,
is you kind of have one leg in each world, right?
You're you still are a girl and you want to well, maybe you want
to play or you sometimes want toplay with Barbies or But then
(15:40):
you're starting to feel like youwant to do more independently
and want to start dabbling in these things that the older
girls are doing and do less withyour parents and they're
starting to feel embarrassing. So I think it's, you know,
giving messages to both girls that feel, you know, in both of
those worlds and just letting them know that they're, you
(16:00):
know, if you're feeling hormonaland crazy, you're not crazy.
You know, all these things are normal.
Kind of normalizing that experience of all that it means
to be a preteen girl. I love that.
I especially love the goofy aspect, the permission to be
goofy. I feel like I was on the later
to mature side growing up and definitely wanted to be goofy
(16:25):
longer than some of my friends and actually grew apart from
some of my friends during those tween years because I still
wanted to be goofy. And I think that that's kind of
part of the adolescent transition, right?
And just enabling and and givingchildren permission to play in
that space and that silly space I think is really important.
(16:46):
So I applaud you for including that part.
Thanks. Yeah, I think a big part of our
mission is giving kids, giving girls permission to just be kids
longer. I think that's just such a, you
know, they're growing up so fastand it's like just pump the
brakes. Like you said, celebrating
childhood. Just be a kid.
You don't need to be a little mini influencer and worry about
(17:09):
your, you know, online social brand.
Just like take all of that away.Don't worry about those things
and just be you. I think like embracing
individuality is a big part of the magazine too.
So we're very, very much about, you know, being weird and being
you. So yeah, cool.
That's. Very cool in the family space,
(17:30):
particularly on social media. I'm sure you have spent a lot of
time there recently given what you're doing and I'm just
curious, are there anything thatyou have picked up on to reach
families more authentically thatyou're seeing either is working
or you know that you want to do?Yeah, we're kind of figuring it
out every day. I know.
(17:52):
I think people like to see our girls.
Like they like to know that it'sa, you know, my girls are
involved and it's kind of a family business ish.
But I have never put my kids on social media before this.
I like, I don't include their names or anything.
And I'm like, so that was kind of a big deal for me to be like,
OK, I never post pictures of them, but now I'm kind of
(18:14):
including them in tween stuff. And so my thought with that is
like a lot of times they're in aphoto shoot with many kids.
I'm not really saying who's my kids.
I don't use their names. I try to still like, you know,
keep it, keep their privacy. But yeah, we're so I want to let
people in and like see the face behind the magazine.
(18:34):
But I also, you know, I don't need to be a star.
I don't like, want us to be, youknow, So I, I guess I, yeah,
well, I struggle with that a little bit.
Like, that's a tug. That's a tug of war, right?
Because in a way, you kind of are the brand.
Yeah, exactly. Tween.
Tween is not a be. Forever, right?
Right. I mean, 'cause you do have two
tweens now, right? But presumably, yes.
(18:57):
And you'll have another one. But presumably this will be a
business for a long time, right?And you don't want to be no
longer relevant when your kids age out of that also.
So yeah, that's great. I guess before we let you go, I
had one question about one of your features.
I guess it's a recurring series called Real Girls Who Rock,
(19:19):
right? Can you, can you tell us about
that? And could you also tell us what
your feature would look like if you were one of the real girls
who rock? Oh boy, that's a good one.
So Real Girls who Rock is a spotlight on real everyday girls
who are doing something amazing,whether it's, you know, our
(19:40):
first one had a Taekwondo champ who has her black belt.
They could start a club, maybe they're a skilled musicians,
things like that. So if you're listening, we are
they're always taking nominations so you can send them
in to us. But I think it's really
important again, with, you know,how we're trying to go against
(20:01):
all those traditional, the traditional media that I grew up
reading and not spotlight what celebrities are wearing and, you
know, them getting their mail and how they're just like us,
but trying to inspire girls with.
You know, girls that are like them and kind of showing them,
you know, look, she did this amazing thing.
You could too. And so, yeah, we featured
(20:23):
Taekwondo champ, we featured in an environmental activist.
And in our issue 3, we have a gymnast who also has alopecia.
And issue 4 coming out in the winter is, is going to be
featuring an entrepreneur who started her own line of dolls.
(20:44):
So we have, we have so many, those have really been taken
off. We've had a lot of cool people
reaching out. So we have some like some
wrestlers who are going to feature some girls who play
hockey. So we really want to show girls,
you know, who are going against stereotypes, you know, things,
you know, putting themselves outthere, starting businesses,
(21:06):
showing kindness through volunteering and things like
that. So I did forget that when you
ask what my daughter's favorite is, a lot of the girls really
like the real girls who rock andI, they always, I think that was
their favorite in the first one.So there's so many different
features in it. It's almost they're really,
they're really jam packed. But they are.
They're great. That's what everyone really
(21:27):
likes those a lot so. Very cool.
And then so if if you had a realgirls Who Rock profile on you,
what are the strengths and quirks that got you here boy?
So is it me when I'm a, when I'myoung, when I'm like 10 or me
now OK or now or? Now, Yeah, well, what are what
are the things that actually it's a it's AI think you nailed
(21:49):
it, which is what are the thingsthat happened or that that you
that inspired you during those formative years that allowed you
to take this jump and do something bold like you're doing
now? Yeah.
I think it would be my headline would be something like girl who
like embraced her weirdness and like learned that it's OK to be
weird. I was always, I was called weird
(22:10):
a lot and like crazy. And I'd be like, why are you
saying crazy? And they'd say, well, you're
funny. And I'm like, well, then just
say that. Don't call me.
So I learned over the years to kind of embrace like who I am
and that I sometimes have big kind of crazy ideas, but this
was one of them. And people love it and my girls
(22:31):
love it. And I'm reaching moms out there
who are looking for something similar.
So I think it was, you know, embracing who you are, embracing
your talents as, you know, cheesy as it could sound, I have
always loved writing. And so I really, you know,
focused on that and what I love to do.
And to me, it was a dream job tobe like, OK, I would love to run
(22:53):
a magazine. Like, could I do that?
Like, that would be amazing. I would love to have that job.
So, you know, I just, I kind of gave it to myself.
Like, OK, I'm gonna gonna give myself the title.
I'm gonna see if I can do this. Even if, you know, just give it.
Yeah, give yourself the chance. So.
Way to reclaim crazy. That's great, yeah.
Yeah, I was crazy, the best friend.
(23:14):
But yeah, it was definitely veryquirky and creative and probably
kind of loud as a kid. Speaking of differentiated
features, you started a pen pal program early on at Tween as
well. Can you talk a little bit about
that and what you intend for it and how it should grow?
Yeah, the pen pal program is something I'm so excited about.
(23:34):
I've it's like I've tried to start pen pal programs like for
years through like the PTA. I'm always like, what about a
pen pal program? I love the idea of a pen.
I love the idea of connecting people and I just think there's
that there's so many great things about it.
I love getting girls back to writing letters, connecting with
(23:57):
a friend that you can be open with and share about your lives
and also learn about where they live and what might be
different. And so it is.
We get a lot of great feedback about our pen pal program for
moms and and the girls involved.So so yeah, right now we have
girls all over the country, a lot of girls in Canada.
(24:17):
So we're trying to make as many international matches as we can.
So again, with getting scrappy, I'm trying to like e-mail
schools and Italy and Spain and trying to make those
partnerships so that we have more, you know, kind of
interesting matches and you're not just being matched with
someone, you know, who lives around the block.
So, so yeah, the really excited about how that's taking off and.
(24:41):
That was the thing our daughter was most.
Excited about? Yeah.
Extremely excited to be a part of the pen pal program.
Yeah, there's nothing like getting something in the mail.
You know, you don't really get mail anymore.
And especially kids. So exactly the magazine's
exciting, but getting a letter in the mail from your friend
and, you know, we encourage them.
We we send out kind of like an informational letter when they
(25:02):
first join. And we say we encourage
handwritten letters. You know, you can draw pictures.
You can ask, ask questions, get to know each other.
So we kind of give them a littlebit of like, here's what it is,
since again, it's kind of one ofthose things that's almost going
extinct and here's how you do it.
And then we kind of leave it in the girl's hands after that.
Very cool, very cool. Greg, do you have any other?
(25:25):
No, this has been terrific. Thank you so much, Mary.
We are thrilled to have you heretoday.
We're thrilled to have you quarterly in our household with
our girls reading, following along.
And because they're starting young, you'll have them in your
audience for more than the tweenyears.
Yeah, that's. Great.
Which is exciting. Yeah, anything.
(25:45):
Any last thoughts you'd like to share with our audience or where
they can find you? And Tween Magazine.
Yeah, so you can subscribe to tween@tweenmag.com.
We do four issues a year. Makes a great gift.
Holidays are coming up, so we'llhave our holiday issue out in
time for, you know, before December.
(26:06):
And yeah, you can find information about joining the
Pen Pal program inside. And follow us on Instagram at
Tween Magazine for Girls. Awesome.
Thanks so much, Mary. Thanks for having me.
All right. Thanks everybody for listening.
This has been another episode ofThe Most Important Thing.
Hey, guys, if you're still here,you're definitely our kind of
person. Thanks for spending this time
(26:27):
with us on The Most Important Thing.
If this episode resonated with you, we'd love for you to follow
us wherever you get your podcasts and share it with
someone else. Building family culture on
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