The Murder of Haley McHone Part 3

Send us a text

The 1999 murder of 13 year old Haley McHone in Lexington Kentucky by rail-riding serial killer Tommy Lynn Sells.  Part 3 summarizes the prosecution strategy regarding Tommy Lynn Sells, discussed by Ray “The D.A.” Larson.

Show notes can be found HERE.

Transcript (please forgive minor errors):

David:

Warning, the podcast you're about to listen to may contain graphic descriptions of violent acts and injury. Listener discretion is advised.

Wendy:

Welcome to the Murder Police Podcast.

Wendy:

Well, we're back again. David, won't you tell me where we left off on episode two?

David:

When we finished that one we had just learned who the killer was and got amazing details from Detective Schoonover when he interviewed that serial killer, it was fantastic. And on this next episode what we're going to finish off with for this one is the legal process, a really good discussion about how this was handled through the court case, and inevitably what happened to Tommy Lynn Sells.

Det. Chris Schoonover:

With Tommy Lynn Sells, and people like him, you can't put your brain in their thought pattern because they don't don't think the same as every normal human being.

David:

Absolutely, absolutely.

Ray:

So did you arrest him?

Det. Chris Schoonover:

He was already arrested, so this is where you come in. I come back with the recorded, I would say admission, and with a swab of his DNA, and I present the case to your office.

Ray:

And you had assurance that he wasn't going to get out?

Det. Chris Schoonover:

Yes, he was in Texas, and he was charged with murder of a teenage girl and an attempted murder of a brave 10 year old, and we'll get to that later, hopefully you'll ask me about her. So I come back to you, I present the case to you, and much like another case that you handled you said, "Well let's see what Texas does, because I like their legal process. We'll talk to the family, see what's best for the family in this situation, and you'll get back with me, it's on you now." That's your exact words.

David:

It always is that way.

Wendy:

Well speaking of the girl, I have to, not ruin, but as I've told you, I've been so interested in this case ever since I learned about it, I just couldn't fathom a lot of the things that I had read in one of the books on him, and researching some of the stuff online, the videos of him and his interviews with various people. I found a video on that girl as a young adult, the 10 year old, and she described when he came in that room, you're right, she was hoping that he wouldn't see her, and he turned back to give one last look and that's when he caught her glance, and she said he just told her, "Get your hands up, move your hands," and she put them up by her head like he told her to do, and he just slit her throat and left.

Wendy:

And the interviewer asked her, "What was his demeanor?" And she said, "It was very flat." He had just no look in his eyes and he did it, he didn't seem angry, and she said, "I watched him kill my friend at the bottom of the bunk bed, and he had no expression, just none, and he slit her throat and walked off."

David:

Was he like that when you interview him, kind of flat, did he look nervous like oh, I'm caught?

Det. Chris Schoonover:

No. In my very honest opinion he enjoyed the attention. He knew he was going somewhere, as far as fame. Does that make sense?

David:

Absolutely.

Wendy:

Well, and you neede

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
If you have been looking for a realistic true
crime experience, you just foundit.
Get ready for true crime withreal detectives on the Murder
Police Podcast.

Speaker 2 (00:10):
Okay, well, he was charged in Lexington.

Speaker 3 (00:15):
Yes, he was by your office, okay.

Speaker 2 (00:18):
But he was never brought back to answer those
charges.

Speaker 3 (00:22):
He wasn't to answer those charges.
He wasn't and because you spokewith the family and us and felt
it'd be better off he'd be leftin Texas.

Speaker 2 (00:31):
Well, texas is tough on the death penalty.
They were a state where theyseek the death penalty and the
death penalty is given by a jury.
Texas carries it out.

Speaker 4 (00:51):
Warning the podcast you're about to listen to may
contain graphic descriptions ofviolent assaults, murder and
adult language.
Listener discretion is advised.
Welcome to the Murder PolicePodcast the Murder of Haley
McCone, part 3 of 3, with yourhosts Wendy and David Lyons.

Speaker 3 (01:33):
You can't put your brain in their thought pattern,
because they don't think thesame as every normal human being
.

Speaker 1 (01:40):
Absolutely, absolutely.

Speaker 2 (01:43):
So did you arrest him .

Speaker 3 (01:46):
He was already arrested.
So this is where you come in.
I come back with the recordedwhat I would say admission and
with a swab of his DNA, and Ipresent the case to your office.

Speaker 2 (01:59):
And you had assurance that he wasn't going to get out
.

Speaker 3 (02:02):
Yes, he was in Texas and he was charged with murder
of a teenage girl and attemptedmurder of a brave 10-year-old
and we'll get to that later.
Hopefully you'll ask me abouther.
So I come back to you.
I present the case to you and,much like another case that you
handled, you said, well, let'ssee what Texas does, because I
like their legal process.
We'll talk to the family, seewhat's best for the family in

(02:26):
this situation and you'll getback with me.
It's on you now.
That's your exact words.

Speaker 1 (02:32):
It always is that way .

Speaker 4 (02:34):
Well, speaking of the girl I have to kind of not ruin
.
But you know, as I told you,I've been so interested in this
case ever since I learned aboutit I just couldn't fathom a lot
of the things that I had read inone of the books on him and,
researching some of the stuffonline the videos of him and his
interviews with various people,I found a video on that girl as

(02:59):
a young adult, the 10-year-old,and she described when he came
in that room, you're right, shewas hoping that he wouldn't see
her and he turned back to giveone last look.
And that's when he caught herglance and she said he just told
her get your hands up, moveyour hands, and she put them up

(03:20):
by her head, like he told her todo, and he just slit her throat
and left.
And she just put him up by herhead, like he told her to do,
and he just slit her throat andleft.
And she just.
The interviewer asked her whatwas his demeanor and she said it
was very flat.
He had just no look in his eyeswhen he did it, he didn't seem
angry and she said I watched himkill my friend at the bottom of
the bunk bed and he had noexpression, just none, and he

(03:42):
slit her throat and walked off.

Speaker 1 (03:44):
Was he like that?
When you interviewed him kindof flat, did he look nervous
like oh, I'm caught.

Speaker 3 (03:49):
No, In my very honest opinion, he enjoyed the
attention.
He knew he was going somewhere.
As far as fame Does that makesense, absolutely.

Speaker 4 (04:00):
Well, and you needed him at that moment.
Right, you needed to hear whathe had to say.
And you know, in reading abouthim and he did have a horrendous
childhood and I'm by no meansusing that as an enabler factor
for him to do what he did but Ioften thought, the more I read,

(04:20):
he's reaching out for thatattention and so I feel like
that.
Maybe he thought you needed himat that moment and he's in
control.
It seems like everything wasabout control with him.
Put your hands up, the girl putthem up, he cut her throat.
So, or the guy who didn'tfollow the rule.
It seems like everything I'veread about Tommy Lynn.

(04:40):
He wanted control in everysituation and if you don't
follow his control or his rules,you pay the price.

Speaker 3 (04:49):
That's very accurate.
Personality-wise, and TommyLynn sells rules.
That's very accurate.

Speaker 2 (04:55):
Well, let's talk about.
He was charged with murder inTexas.
Was he charged with additionalmurders in Texas?

Speaker 3 (05:05):
I'm glad you asked that question because the next
day after I talked to the ranger, I got a call from my
supervisor that said no, youcan't stay out there, I need you
back as soon as possible.
So the ranger gets all thecredit for following up on Tommy
Lynn Settle's later confession.
He had a rapport with Tommy, Ithink that nobody else had, and

(05:27):
Tommy ended up leading him toother bodies.
Now the other bodies one or twocame up during the legal
process of him going to trialwith Katie Harris's death, and
then he was sentenced to deathand then all of a sudden, as
normal, uh, these criminals.
Hey, I have another body I wantto show you.

(05:50):
And so he would take the rangerto another location and sure
enough, there'd be a body thereand that would postpone his
execution and he knew what hewas doing.
Um, some of the social mediathings and excerpts you'll see
Tommy in.
He says things that are cliche.
I think that he's learned overthe years that people that are

(06:10):
like him would say, knowing hispersonality, one-on-one with him
, I know it's just him to gainfame, okay.

Speaker 2 (06:20):
Well, he was charged in Lexington.

Speaker 3 (06:24):
Yes, he was by your office, okay.

Speaker 2 (06:27):
But he was never brought back to answer those
charges.

Speaker 3 (06:31):
He wasn't, and because you spoke with the
family and us and felt it'd bebetter off he'd be left in Texas
.

Speaker 2 (06:40):
Well, texas is tough on the death penalty.
They were a state where theyseek the death penalty and the
death penalty is given by a jury.
Texas carries it out, andtypically in a much shorter

(07:01):
fashion it was very short, yeah.
And so, as a result, we make adecision, I made a decision, so
he's charged here and you wantto charge him because you want
some sort of resolution of thecase that's the Haley-McCone
case.
But let's leave the penalty toTexas, where we're more

(07:28):
comfortable that they're goingto deal with it the way it
should.
And if you bring a guy back tobe arraigned, like Tommy Lynn
sells, what you end up doing isyou have to transport him,
chance he can escape and andwhen he gets here he starts
filing some kind of motions notto go back to Texas.

(07:52):
So the legal, the best movelegally, is to leave him there.
And it turned out to be a gooddecision because they scorched
him Smoke him if you got him.

Speaker 3 (08:05):
Right and, if I recall, the other issue that we
discussed at your office wasthere was a family in Indiana
that they had discovered that hehad murdered and you said well,
we have to be in line, so let'swait and see.
When these homicides occur,homicide occurred and then we'll
get in line and see if we needto bring him here.
In the meantime, we'll leavehim in Texas and you'll make

(08:27):
contact with the other states tosee what the best situation is.

Speaker 2 (08:32):
Well, you don't want to bring a serial murderer, you
don't want to transport thembecause there's too many
possibilities of bad thingshappening.
So, and Texas did their job, Dowe have any idea?

Speaker 1 (08:48):
Talk about time because it's quick.
You're right, seven years, yeah.

Speaker 2 (08:52):
And in most places it's well.
In Kentucky, hell, there arepeople on death row now, and the
leading cause of death onKentucky's death row is old age.
Exactly, exactly.

Speaker 4 (09:05):
Well, I think, in talking about the family in Ida,
illinois that you werereferencing, that was horrific,
I think I don't.
I often wonder how many otherthings are out there that Tommy
Lynn did that just nobody everknew, or maybe he had forgotten
about in his alcohol inducedstates.

Speaker 3 (09:25):
I do know that, having access to some legal
information, I do know that hestill his DNA is still being
tested on older cold case crimesOut in California is one
location where they've wanted totest his DNA for certain crimes
out there and in othersituations as well.

Speaker 1 (09:43):
Let me ask this and Ray, this goes to you too, and
maybe we don't know did we everget an impression in Texas that
he was trying to delay thatBecause some of these guys will
play that game of well, if youdon't cook me, I'll take you to
three more?
Are you aware of anything?

Speaker 2 (09:59):
Oh, if you'll take the death penalty off the table,
I'll tell you?

Speaker 1 (10:03):
Oh, that happens, I didn't know if he had tried that
, but I know that's a commonthing.
Well, guess what?
I didn't know if he had triedthat, but I know that's a common
thing.

Speaker 2 (10:09):
Well, guess what, when you got a good, solid death
penalty case, go with it anddon't sit around and start doing
all of the bargaining with guys, because you said it, they lie.

Speaker 4 (10:26):
So you wrap this up, you figure out that he's your
guy and you come back and do youjust kind of keep following it
when you come back, or what'sthe next step in that process?

Speaker 3 (10:36):
I do.
What a lot of people don'tunderstand is the arrest is
really the beginning of the hardwork.
You've put the pieces together,so now what you have to do is
make it presentable so a jurywill understand it, and you have
to present it to theCommonwealth Attorney's Office.
Then Mr Larson will assignhimself or another assistant

(10:57):
Commonwealth attorney and theywill walk you through what they
need in court.
What's confusing is what youneed for an arrest to charge
Tommy Lynn Sells with murder istotally different than what you
would need for a conviction inthe courtroom in Fayette County.
So you want to have severalmeetings with Ray's office and

(11:18):
they're going to go through yourcase file, which is documented
You're always documenting and ifthey find something that needs
to be done, they're going toassign you a to-do list so they
can get a conviction in thecourtroom.
Which means I may have to goback to the family member and
say Tommy Lynn Sells tells me hewas here this afternoon in the

(11:38):
park on Elizabeth Street.
Where were you?
Why didn't you see yourdaughter on the bike and were
you home when she got home fromschool?
Can you say she was over at thepark.
So you have another series ofinterviews you're going to have
to go through, as well as theto-do list that Mr Larson's
office is providing you and anyserving subpoenas.

(12:00):
If the sheriffs can't do thatfor witnesses in a trial.
You have to go through all thatand prepare and prepare and
prepare for trial.

Speaker 4 (12:07):
So did you have to go back to Texas again when all of
this arrest work began.

Speaker 3 (12:11):
I did not Based on Mr Larson's decision on waiting to
see where we land in thelineages of crimes that Tommy
Lynn Sells had committed.
We were waiting and lo andbehold, we found out that they
were going to seek the deathpenalty trial for the death of
Katie Harris and the attemptedmurder of Crystal Searles.

Speaker 2 (12:32):
So did you follow the execution of Tommy Lynn Sales?

Speaker 3 (12:37):
I definitely did, and I also David kept in contact
with me the whole time.
We talked about the caseseveral times together and found
out that he was going to beexecuted in 2014.
We didn't know the date and weheard that it was going to be
April 3rd.
So we kind of watched the newsto see if that was actually true

(13:00):
.
And lo and behold, on April 3rd2014, tom Allen Sells was
executed in the state of Texas.

Speaker 1 (13:06):
What method did they use on him?

Speaker 3 (13:08):
Lethal injection.

Speaker 2 (13:12):
Texas.
What method did they use on him?
Lethal injection.
You know all of thenever-ending appeals over the
lethal injection.
Has to do with the number, withthe injection that supposedly
puts them to sleep before theyinject what will cause their
death.
And they say that firstinjection is painful.
And I used to get those callson the radio.

(13:36):
Somebody called me up and says,isn't that painful?
I mean, isn't that awful?
And I said, hey, buckaroo, youever had a colonoscopy?
And they'll say, well, yeah.
And I said do you remember themputting you to sleep?
He says no, nothing bothered me.
I said why don't we vote to usewhatever they do for a
colonoscopy?

(13:57):
And so we all agreed with that.
But that would have beenappealed.
That would be appealed as well.

Speaker 3 (14:05):
That could be your next bumper sticker as well, for
Ray the DA.

Speaker 1 (14:09):
Well, that's what's holding us up in Kentucky, if I
remember correctly, is the fightover the drugs, and you know
they use arguments like well, Iheard him snore and that's cruel
and unusual.
It indicates they're notpassing away quickly enough.

Speaker 2 (14:21):
Well, I can, just I'll start cussing here shortly.
Tell me about.

Speaker 4 (14:26):
Well, I have to reference something before we
move on with your next.
Tell me about.
You know, and I hear.
I agree.
I hear the people say it'scruel and unusual.
And me personally, this is justmy opinion.
That burns me up, because Ithink cutting a 13-year-old
little girl's neck is very crueland unusual, and I think

(14:52):
strangling a little girl that'salso 13 is cruel and unusual.
And all of his other murders,well, they were cruel and
unusual too.
So I know that people insociety want to say, well, this
is cruel and unusual.
Why are we doing this?
That hurts them.
That first injection hurts them, but why are we forgetting
about the victims?

Speaker 2 (15:09):
Now here's what you're doing You're starting to
get into the victim's rightsbusiness and how they really
don't care whether it hurts themor not, and I personally don't
care whether it hurts them ornot.
Pretty soon they're going to beout of here, and so I don't
care.
What I want to know is when wedidn't have a trial in Lexington

(15:37):
, kentucky, for the murder ofHaley McComb, what does a
detective spend so much time onthis case?
What do you think?
What are you thinking?

Speaker 3 (15:47):
Well, since I don't like to testify in court.
What are you thinking?
Well, since I don't like totestify in court, I'm thinking
that's great.
No, in all seriousness, whenyou evaluate, you have to take
each homicide case individually.
It can't be a blanket decisionfor all of them, and what I mean
by that is if the community isbetter served with the execution

(16:07):
of Tommy Lynn's cells, thenlet's do that.
If we think we can get more ofa sentence here than in Idaho or
Washington State, let's bringthem here and take care of that,
and I feel safe, speaking forall the detectives, that I think
that, as a result, that's whatthey would rather do.

Speaker 2 (16:26):
Well, one of the.
I've known lots and lots ofprosecutors around the country
and I think that therelationship between the
homicide unit not the policedepartment in general in
Lexington and the prosecutors isprobably the best that I've
ever run into, and I was thevice president of the National

(16:50):
District Attorneys Associationand I heard such complaints from
those men and women aboutworking with their police
department.
That was just foreign to me.
It just didn't—I mean hell,we're all on the same team.
We're trying to accomplish thesame thing.
Now you said there's adifference between making an

(17:12):
arrest and getting a conviction,and what you've got to think
about, and that most peopledon't, is you'll get 12 people
come in and make a jury.
How many months did this case?

Speaker 3 (17:28):
take you Estimate 10 months by the time we got the
DNA back and after the interviewof Tommy Lynn Sells.

Speaker 2 (17:37):
If we would have tried this case, it would have
taken at least a week to try it,and just think about having to
compress all of that informationthat took you 10 months to do
and get a group of people thattypically know nothing about it
Give them that kind ofinformation and then convince

(17:59):
them that this guy did it andthat he needs to suffer the
consequences of his behavior.
And that's hard to do sometimes, and you all are outstanding at
telling the story of the crime,and you did so.

(18:19):
At any rate.
I got all the faith in theworld in you guys.
Thank you.

Speaker 4 (18:22):
Well, thank you, Chris again for coming.
You have shared so much aboutthis that I've just been dying
to know, so I appreciate yousharing your experience with
Tommy Lynn Sills.

Speaker 3 (18:32):
I've enjoyed being here.
Thanks for letting me tell thestory of Haley McCone.

Speaker 4 (18:36):
Well, we appreciate that.
That's just bad.
I hated hearing this story andmy heart breaks for her family.
Ray, as always, thank you forsharing.
You're such a wealth ofknowledge.

Speaker 2 (18:51):
Adios.

Speaker 4 (18:52):
Husband.
Thank you.

Speaker 1 (18:54):
No, it was fantastic, and let me add too that her
memorial is still intact andbeautifully cared for in Floral
Park.
The Neighborhood Associationactually put a granite monument
years ago back there and theyhave it landscaped beautifully.
I was up there maybe a monthago and maybe we'll put that in
the show notes on this to givepeople an idea of what that
looks like.
So her memory goes on.

(19:15):
It was her favorite park andthose neighbors are still
letting her memory live on.

Speaker 4 (19:19):
Well, rest in peace, Haley.

Speaker 1 (19:23):
The Murder Police Podcast is hosted by Wendy and
David Lyons and was created tohonor the lives of crime victims
, so their names are neverforgotten.
It is produced, recorded andedited by David Lyons.
The Murder Police Podcast canbe found on your favorite Apple
or Android podcast platform, aswell as at
MurderPolicePodcastcom, whereyou will find show notes,

(19:45):
transcripts, information aboutour presenters and a link to the
official Murder Police Podcastmerch store where you can
purchase a huge variety ofMurder Police Podcast swag.
We are also on Facebook,instagram and YouTube, which is
closed caption for those thatare hearing impaired.
Just search for the MurderPolice Podcast and you will find

(20:05):
us.
Hearing impaired Just searchfor the Murder Police Podcast
and you will find us.
If you have enjoyed thispodcast, please subscribe for
more and give us five stars anda written review on Apple
Podcasts or wherever youdownload your podcasts.
Make sure you set your playerto automatically download new
episodes so you get the new onesas soon as they drop, and
please tell your friends.

Speaker 4 (20:22):
Lock it down, Judy.