S1 E5: Batman, Board Games, and Brandon Sanderson with Taylor Jackson

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 Join James and his guest, Taylor Jackson, as they dive into the worlds of superheroes, modern board games, and fantasy literature on this episode of The Nerd Nexus. Taylor, a school psychologist and lifelong fan of the Dark Knight, shares his insights on Batman’s enduring appeal, cheesy nostalgia from classic adaptations, and the art of storytelling in Brandon Sanderson's Cosmere. They also discuss the evolution of board games, highlighting gems like Kinfire Chronicles and Deep Rock Galactic. To cap it off, the duo tackles a fun and nerdy challenge involving AI and hypothetical battles. A must-listen for fans of comic books, board games, and epic storytelling! 

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Episode Transcript

James (00:08):
welcome back to the nerd nexus.
Today we have a very specialguest, a good friend of mine,
taylor jackson.
Uh, taylor, he is a schoolpsychologist and a lifelong fan
of superheroes, science fictionand fantasy.
He is a devoted fan and admirerof the Dark Knight, which I
hope to talk to you a lot abouttoday, taylor, bring it on.

(00:30):
And you're also a fellow Sanderfan, big fan of Brandon
Sanderson and his Cosmere, sothat'll be a lot of fun to dive
into a little bit as well.
I know you had mentioned alsothat your love for all things
nerdy began with Saturdaymorning cartoons like Batman,
the animated series and theJustice League, as well as

(00:52):
playing plenty of Batman videogames.
You get to join us today on theNerd Nexus to jump in and talk
about these fandoms and, in yourown words, you say you love
stories that defy the odds on acharacter-driven adventure, and
I couldn't agree more.
That's always really fun.
So I'd like to talk to you, man, and nerd out.

Taylor (01:14):
Yeah, thanks for having me Fun.

James (01:15):
Thanks for joining my podcast here in my basement
Having a good time.

Taylor (01:20):
Anytime, it's an excellent nerd Nexus basement, I
might say.

James (01:24):
Yeah yeah, the Nexus feels more like a cave or like a
hobbit hole right now, but itbut you're talking to the batman
fan like we literally dwell incaves.
We do I just need a waterfallentrance into my basement.

Taylor (01:38):
We'll work on that we're set.

James (01:39):
But, um, yeah, anyway, uh , thanks for being here.
Um, so, before we jump too farin, I was going to have you
participate really quick.
In our very first email that wegot to the Nerd Nexus podcast
at gmailcom, someone messaged us, so this actually just happened
to be an old buddy of mine fromway back in high school who

(02:01):
caught the podcast and hebrought up some fun stuff and
had some questions for us.
So in my episode, uh, that I metwith my, my wife, and we talked
uh we did talk a little bitabout how bad the adaptation of
the aragon series was in themovie yeah, uh, we didn't go
into too much detail about it,but, but we talked about how it

(02:23):
was pretty rough, um, and it gotMike Farnsworth uh, this friend
of mine thinking about thecartoon Lord of the Rings movie.
Um, and he's not talking aboutthe new, like Peter Jackson
anime one he's talking about,like the 1970s.

Taylor (02:38):
Lord of the Rings cartoon.

James (02:39):
Uh, did you ever watch that?

Taylor (02:41):
Probably when I was like 10 or younger.
I saw clips of it, but not inlike conscious memory to say
anything smart about it.

James (02:52):
Yeah, I think I saw it my freshman year of high school.
It was like one of those thingswhere it was the end of the
year and so the teachers werekind of like playing movies
whatever, whatever and.
I remember it was a math classand it was a old, old Lord of
the Rings cartoon and I think itwas the battle of the five
armies or whatever.
Oh yeah, and I just remember.
Just one clip is all I remember, but it's like the dwarves

(03:13):
talking.
They're like now there's fourarmies.
Now there's five armies.

Taylor (03:18):
Just like oh wow, there we go.

James (03:21):
But yeah, my thoughts on it.
That was one of the questions.
What were your thoughts on it?
I think when you look back atany of the old stuff it feels a
little cheesy.
Yeah, for sure, and I'm sureyears from now, people are going
to look back at our stuff andbe like that was a little cheesy
.

Taylor (03:39):
Right.

James (03:40):
But is there anything that you recall from earlier
times or older adaptations thatyou find a lot of cheese in, or
something that you liked whenyou were younger?
But you look back now andyou're like that's not as good
as I remember.

Taylor (03:54):
That's kind of cheesy.
Oh, that's a tough question.
I don't remember a lotspecifically of it, but I do
remember seeing a video onlinerecently of someone who like
resurrected the song from theend of return of the King and it
was like the most beautifulsong ever and they like duetted
it and put it to an orchestraand everything.

(04:14):
It's called like.
The road goes ever on and likeit's beautiful.
So I think there's like eveneven in the some of the cheesy
stuff, there's like still somenostalgia, but also some like
redeemable gems.
You know, like you wouldn'twant to throw it all away, and I
think I think like this is aperfect example, too, of like
even the cheese sometimes keepsit alive for a longer time so

(04:35):
that we can like, so that thefranchise as a whole can can
stick around for us and seebetter days in the future.

James (04:42):
Yeah, I don't know, sometimes it's fun to just go
days in the future.
Yeah, I don't know.
Sometimes it's fun to just goback to the cheesy stuff.
Anyways.

Taylor (04:48):
Oh, for sure.

James (04:48):
But you go back you're like oh, I remember this being
so much cooler, but I still loveit, but it is a little cheesier
than I remember.

Taylor (04:54):
Yeah, the ones that come to my mind like I think I know
going into them they're going tobe cheesy.
I don't remember the last, butI go back to some like VHS's
from the 90s or something andlike I remember one like called
page master from when I wasgrowing up and and like I knew
it was going to be cheesy but itwas like because I went in with
that expectation and not likethis is the greatest movie
you've ever seen, like I thinkit was still pleasantly

(05:18):
entertained well, I know we'regoing to dive into superheroes
specifically, so I'm thinkinglike did you ever watch, like
the old lou frigno, theincredible hulk?

James (05:27):
I didn't watch a lot of hulk but I'm like familiar with
it, yeah and and instead of cgi,it was just this big dude who
painted himself green, and hewas just buff, right I fist
bumped him at comic-con one time.

Taylor (05:38):
It was nice and you survived.
My hand recovered after a fewdays.

James (05:41):
Well, that's kind of cool , um, but I was thinking of that
one and then I actually neverwatched it.
But I have seen little clipsthat just make me laugh of like
an old captain america oneactually oh, yeah, and it'll
show me pulls out his shieldlike there's a robber running
away, and then it has a clip ofhim throwing it, and then it
cuts to like the, the littlefrisbee looking thing that looks
like it's hanging from a string, and then it like softly hits

(06:03):
the guy in the back of the headand he jumps forward like I
don't know, it was pretty cheesybut it made me laugh.
But uh, yeah, um, I don't know,I think there's, there's a lot
of old stuff that's uh fun todive back into.
But then when you do, you'relike I remember this being
cooler.

Taylor (06:19):
The other one I was thinking of was captain planet
oh, that was never big in theCaptain Planet, but I do still
hold it in some high esteem.

James (06:28):
Yeah, I just remember it was always really funny when
Captain Planet was getting readyto come and they all start
calling him out and they hold uptheir little power rings.
They're like Earth, fire, wind,and then you get this one
person, heart Right.

Taylor (06:40):
We ran out of elements, yeah, Element of love.
But it's funny, though, tothink about, like how certain
cheesy things like are admiredlooking back and other ones are
like cringeworthy looking back,because, like when you were
mentioning superheroes, like Ithought you were going to
mention, like Batman 66, youknow, with Adam West and
everything, oh yeah yeah, butthat one's like, beloved Like,

(07:06):
even though it's so cheesy it'slike you know, almost want to
hide behind your hands whileyou're watching a little bit,
sometimes like it's like no onecan say a bad thing about batman
66 and now that I said thatsomeone will.

James (07:11):
But yeah, it's been, uh, such a long time too, but that
that's the one right where theywould like kick, and it would
pause and go kapow or whatever,yeah, yeah oh man, that, yeah,
that's.
That's funny.
That was a good.
I can't believe I didn't eventhink of that one.
Then that's hilarious.

Taylor (07:25):
And it's one of those that like makes you question.
You're like do they know it'sthis cheat?
Are they trying to be funny oris it just that bad that it's
funny?

James (07:36):
I feel like that happens a lot, with not just cheesy
though where you remembersomething being a certain way.
Years later you're superexcited to share it, and then
you pull it back up and maybeyou've outgrown it or something
and then you're like almostcringing that you're showing it
to someone.

Taylor (07:48):
Right.

James (07:49):
I specifically remember.
Actually this is a funny one,but did you ever see the movie
the Other Guys?
That's Mark Wahlberg and WillFerrell.

Taylor (07:57):
Yeah, yeah.

James (07:59):
I just remember it being really, really funny.
And then it came on TV once andmy dad was looking through the
channels.
I was like, oh, the other guyswe should watch that.
So like it was around lunchtime, they kept it on.
We started watching it and Iforgot about some of the
inappropriate parts in it.
Sitting there with my parentswatching it and they'd crack a
joke, that was maybe a littlelittle on the vulgar side, spicy

(08:19):
side and I was like I can'tbelieve that I even recommended
this.
I don't remember any of that.
I remember the funny scenesthat weren't offensive and sure
enough, there were things inthere.

Taylor (08:28):
That's totally funny because I feel like, at least in
my experience, that's what myparents would always do.
It's like, oh, we loved thisone growing up.
It's from the 80s.
Watch it and we get like fiveminutes in and there's like tons
of nudity and swearing andwe're like 12 years old and
they're like oh, this is notwhat I remember.

James (08:45):
Mom, dad, what do you want us to watch?

Taylor (08:47):
but I I haven't exposed my parents to anything.
I think to agree just yet, soI'll get there, though I'll get
on your level all right.

James (08:54):
Well, um, we're gonna talk plenty more about, uh,
superheroes.
I think that'll be a fun one todive into a little bit.
But I wanted to discuss onething that I actually didn't
even mention in our intro to you.
But you are an avid board gamer.

Taylor (09:08):
I am.

James (09:09):
You love board games and my wife and I do as well.
I know we have had many couplesnight where we play some board
games.
But when we say board games Ifeel like the average person
thinks board games.
They think Monopoly, sorry,trouble, I don't know One of
those just very simple gameswhich I think there's still

(09:30):
merit to.
They're fun.
That's why people play them.
But when I think of people thatare way into board games, I
don't think of those games.
They're usually obscure games.
I feel like every time we sitdown to play a game, you're like
we got a new game and there'slike a 95% chance.
I've never heard of it.
Even though I play a lot ofweird games.
It's like when we're excited toshow each other, it's cause we
found a little weird secret game, um and so, uh, what do modern

(09:56):
board games mean beyond theclassics like monopoly and,
sorry, like, how would youdefine like a modern board game?

Taylor (10:07):
like how would you define like?

James (10:07):
a modern board game, that's, that's a.
That's a deep question.
Yeah, because I mean what I'mtrying to, I guess, explain is
to the casual board gamer.
They don't know what I'mtalking about.

Taylor (10:13):
But I'm trying to say what does it mean, like when?

James (10:15):
I'm saying there's a unique game.
What is that?
Even, what is makes it unique?

Taylor (10:18):
I, I've kind of in my mind, as I've pondered this,
like I think the I, I divide itinto like three tiers, like I
think there's your like tier one, like very simple, like the
sorry, the monopoly, thecatchphrase, you know Scrabble
and I don't want thisconversation to be like dissing
on those because we wouldn't behere without those right.

(10:39):
Like they set up what games areand I think they're still great
for lots of audiences.
Like you're not going to play.
You know Deep Rock Galacticwith your grandma, but you're
going to play.
Scrabble with your grandma right.
And then there's like I wouldcall it, the middle tier, which
is like Ticket to Ride orVillainous or you know.
It's like a little more complex.

(10:59):
Not everyone's played it orheard of it before.
Catan might even fall into thatcategory right.
Those are becoming, I think,more mainstream.
Those that are maybe I don'twant to put an age on it, but
coming up with, grew up withboard games and now finding new
ones.
And then I think there's themore niche.
You've never heard of this, orit cost over $100.

James (11:21):
Oh yeah, deep Rock, galactic Right.

Taylor (11:23):
Or it takes like two plus hours to play one session
or something like that, you know, yeah, so I think, mechanically
, you know, that's kind of whatI think of with modern games is
there's still a lot of, I think,new, simple games.
You know there's card gamesthat take 10, 15 minutes, but
they're new and interesting,right, but I think there's just
so much variety.
But they're new and interesting, right, but I think there's

(11:45):
just so much variety.
It's almost like this genre hasjust caught up to things like
movies and video games, whereit's just like there's so much
variety, you know, and there'speople who get deep into it and
there's people who are just hereto have a good 10-minute
experience.

James (11:56):
Yeah well, and I guess I'm going to jump back to a
little bit about what this wholeshow is about about nerdy being
the new cool.
I feel shows about about nerdybeing the new cool.
I feel like that has helpedpropel this forward too.
I mean, I feel like when I wasa kid, being way into board
games and trying to be likelet's try this new thing, would
be kind of oh, that guy's weirdyeah, why doesn't he play
monopoly?
Come on, man, or why isn't heout playing sports or something?

(12:18):
right and uh.
Nowadays, though, so manypeople have these hobbies and
it's celebrated, and I thinkthat is really helping in all
aspects.
I mean, we talk about comicbooks.
They're now like mainstreammovies about comic books.
Everybody knows about comicbook characters, at least now.
Now, it's not a matter of youhave people that know comics and
people who don't.
Now it's people who know thetrue comics, people who know the

(12:41):
movies and then people whomaybe don't watch any of it.
Like it, there's, there's moreaudience being reached, but, um,
I was gonna ask you what youwould say.
Uh is one of your favoriteboard games, and I feel like
that is a hard question becauseyou have a lot, what would?
You say is your favorite boardgame to play nowadays?

Taylor (12:58):
nowadays is easy to answer because I have.
I have my favorite board gameof all time, at least until
another one comes around.
But there's an indie board gamemy wife and I are playing
called the Kinfire Chronicles,and it falls into that category
of it cost about $120.

James (13:14):
Is that the one Did we play that once?
We did do it around that onewas fun yeah.

Taylor (13:18):
But for me it's perfect and I think it's a great example
of just what what board gamesoffer.
it's like an art form now rightlike there's depth, and even in
that middle tier you have adepth of strategy that just
isn't possible in like sorry,yeah, um, but I think now also
with some of these higher endboard games, you have a depth of
art and a depth of story.
One of the things I love aboutkinfire is it kind of holds your

(13:38):
hand and it's like having dndwithout a dm.
Like you get there areconsequences to every choice
that you make.
Your character progresses asyou go along, right, but but
someone doesn't have to likebuild the game on the backend.
The game does the game Right.
So so, anyways, so I love it.
It's very simple to get into.
It's set in like a fantasyworld that like is very flushed

(14:00):
out and beautiful and unique.
So that's one of our favoriteones right now.
Has like 21 scenarios you canplay through.
Each one takes like an hour,that's awesome.

James (14:09):
It's really cool, well, and I mean, you mentioned this a
few times, just for anyone whodoesn't know what we're talking
about.
So we talked about Deep RockGalactic.

Taylor (14:18):
That's true.

James (14:19):
And that is based on a video game.
They did a kickstarter thecompany that developed the game
and they built a board game andit did cost a couple hundred
dollars.
But it has a bunch of littleminifigs, uh little figurines,
in there that you could paint ifyou wanted to, and they're
really cool looking and I'd saythe coolest minifigs I've seen
in a game thus far.

Taylor (14:40):
They're pretty dope.

James (14:41):
They're pretty cool, but uh, I the ones.
From what did you say?
Chronicles of Kinfire.

Taylor (14:47):
Kinfire Chronicles.
Yeah, Kinfire Chronicles.

James (14:49):
The ones in there aren't exactly like the little plastic
figures.
They're like really shiny, coollooking.

Taylor (14:57):
Yeah, they're standees, but they're acrylic.
Yeah, they look really goodthey're kind of see-through, but
they're very colorful and artsy.
I love them.

James (15:04):
Well, so I guess the next question we both just talked
about games that cost a couplehundred dollars.
So if there was someone orsomething that's not as

(15:27):
intimidating but still new, Imean I, I guess I have a couple
thoughts in my head.
I don't know, I don't know forsure if they're even considered
that, like I'm, I'm thinking of,uh, remember, secret hitler oh
yeah show me that one, that onewasn't too crazy.
And there's no yeah video youcould play with it.
That like walks you throughout aplay um and that one was kind

(15:50):
of fun, but uh I mean, are thereany that come to mind for you
where you're like, okay, if I'mgonna take someone and
indoctrinate them?

Taylor (15:56):
in the way of these cool board.
Take them and just to maybethat middle tier even like I
think.
I think some of the ones thatcome to mind mind might be a
little niche, but they're theones on my mind right now are.
There's one called theadventures of Robin Hood and
it's really cool.
It's a cooperative game.
That's a big thing.
Me and my wife, like we, wedidn't love how we felt after.

(16:16):
Like strategic games, like his,one person was always mad at
the other person, right he'slike can't believe you did that
right, and so, anyways, westarted to just drift away from
those and just play solelycooperative games starting to
think.

James (16:27):
That's why you invite me and my wife over, so that you
can get mad at me instead nocomment, um, but anyways,
adventures of robin hood isreally fun.

Taylor (16:36):
The cool thing about that one is it comes with a like
a novel.
It's like a leather bound likebook, but each move that you
make or spot on the board has apage number attached to it and
it's like if you're in chapterseven and you landed here, like
make your decision and come here.
But it's very simple andstraightforward, but it has like
10 chapters and a story that,like your consequences matter
and stuff, but it's very easy toget into.

(16:57):
Um.
And then the other one aneighbor of ours introduced us
just called bullet oh yeah andbullets a really fun one, just
because it's a differentexperience.
It's almost like a live Tetris,almost you know, but with a few
interesting mechanics, so thatone's another fun one.
There's Bullet Hearts andBullet Star are kind of the base
games.

James (17:16):
I was just that reminded me of one that you showed me
that is very stress-inducing.

Taylor (17:21):
I have anxiety every time I play kites oh, kites,
that's a good one.
That's a great like entry level, though anybody can play kites
you can explain it in 30 secondsor less and those are.

James (17:30):
Those are good too to get a fun game that's new, no one's
heard of, and you don't have tosay, okay, here's this 45 page
manual we have to read to learnhow to play instead it's like
here I can explain it to youreally quick and we can play a
couple rounds and go yeah, kites.
Uh, if you think it's badenough having one timer and
you're stressing out over it,there's what?
Seven timers?
going at the same time and ohman, yeah, that was a stressful

(17:52):
one for sure.
Um well, great.
Uh, maybe I'll put some linksto some of these games, yeah, so
that people that want to take alook at them can take a look at
them.
And, uh, if the makers of thesegames here, hey, pass to
advertise your games.

Taylor (18:10):
There you go Just kidding.

James (18:12):
These won't be affiliate links because I don't have
affiliate links for them.

Taylor (18:15):
I don't know, so we'll just put it, we did not plan
these games ahead of time, wedid not plan this ahead of time
Disclaimer, um, okay.

James (18:22):
Well, a second thing that I wanted to talk into and uh,
talk about and show you a littlebit uh as well, cause I've got
this box behind me.
It's mysterious.
I wanted to share with you.
But uh, reading and and books,um, I do think that's kind of a
common theme in the nerd nexus,because everybody reads at least
a little bit.
And, uh, when I think of thenerdy side, we tend to dive into

(18:45):
fantasy and sci-fi.
But, um, I think it's fun totalk about the books we read and
the worlds and the characterbuilding, and it doesn't have to
be fantasy or sci-fi to havecharacters and a world so um,
but uh, I know, the one thing wehave in common, uh for sure,
though, is brandon sanderson.
Yeah, and I feel like, eventhough we've both read brandon

(19:07):
sanderson, I feel like we alsokind of took different routes in
there.
We've kind of read somedifferent things.
Yeah, um, but uh, what's yourexperience with brandon
sanderson?
How did you get into thecosmere?

Taylor (19:18):
I think it's actually you, was it really partially?
I like I think there were lotsof people two, three to four
years ago that were like talkingabout him a lot and reading him
a lot and I just hadn't gotinto it yet.
And so I think I finally Idon't know if I started with
Mistborn or the Way of Kings Ikind of like did both
simultaneously as it went on.

(19:38):
But I think I just heard abouthim from like even our friend
Tyler.
We're always talking about himand my wife's brothers were
always reading him.
So I think it was just kind oflike well, I'll give this a shot
, because you guys keep askingme if I've read this book and I
haven't read this book.
So I kind of have like my in mybrain.
I'm like, hey, if somebody'sasked me more than three times,
I better put it on my prioritylist, right?

(20:00):
So it was kind of one of thosethings and so glad I did.
So I've kind of purged.
I tried to like stay in thecause mirror as much as I could
and catch up to things like lostmetal came out like a year or
two into like my stuff.
Well, I've got to catch up onthis more.
And now, like you know, windand truth just came out.
So I was.

James (20:17):
I've been caught up in that one for a little bit, but
the funny thing is I have notread the lost metal or wind and
truth.
That's funny.
It's like the two people whointroduced me.
I'm like have you read this yet?

Taylor (20:26):
and they're're like no, I'm like oh, you guys got me
started.

James (20:30):
Well, one of the things that I was going to ask you a
little bit about is and I'm nottrying to embarrass you if it
heads that direction- but Idon't think it will, but I mean,
what would to dive into readingthese different books is one of

(20:51):
my things that I just can't getover is when someone recommends
a book, you hear it severaltimes, you start seeing it on
social media, everyone's talkingabout how great a book is, and
then you try to read it and youjust can't.

Taylor (21:04):
Right.

James (21:05):
This is not working for me.
I can't get into it, or thewriting's too complicated or
this world building's too much.
So I was going to ask, kind ofwhere you think your reading
level is and how you overcomeany of those hurdles.
If you come across those, maybeyou don't.

Taylor (21:21):
Well, this is kind of a weird thing because when I think
about that, I feel like I havethe opposite problem almost
where, like I've been spoiled bya few good authors and so now
when I go into like someprobably okay, but not like
excellent authors, I'm like, ah,you know, like I don't know.
Yeah, so like the an easyexample, and sorry to any fans

(21:44):
out there, there's nothing wrongwith the stories.
Just like before I was intosanderson I was doing a lot of
like orson scott card and thingslike doing like the enders
quartet and the bean series andstuff and and he's a fantastic
writer and he's so likecognitive and cerebral in his
writing.
You just know exactly what'sgoing on in somebody's head.
And then I think I went fromlike a lot of orson scott cards,
like the hunger games and whichis which is at.

(22:06):
You know, I've targeted at ayounger audience, right, but
it's just kind of a weirdexample for me of like it's so
basic and I think we've talked alittle bit about like I love
Star Wars, a big Star Wars fanand I like the ideas in a lot of
their books, but just like theway that they're written, it's
just like I have a hard timegetting into it and I think it's

(22:28):
just because I've been spoiledwith like once you go to some
big authors that are sobeautiful in their prose, like
Sanderson or Orson Scott Card oryou know some of these other
ones, I'm like it's hard to goback to a simpler not simpler as
in complicated, but like Idon't know, not as I don't know
high level writing form levelwriting form.

James (22:51):
I don't know I'm not finding the right words, but
yeah, well, and I don't know if,uh, maybe maybe it just makes
us book snobs, I wonder.

Taylor (22:55):
Yeah, I think I'm a little bit of a book.
Stop now like there.

James (22:57):
There's a book series that, uh, I have heard lots of
good things about and I finallyread it, and I did read the
entire trilogy.
I think I've mentioned this toyou before, but the, the poppy
wars oh yeah um, so it's aseries of three books, uh, it's
uh, basically I think it's likejapanese themed, kind of like a
feudal japan kind of vibe to itand uh, the the book started off

(23:21):
pretty good for me and then Ijust the more I got to know the
main character, the more I justdisliked the main character and
I still thought the story wasreally good and I I that's what
kept me going Like the bookwasn't unentertaining, it wasn't
like I, I didn't like it but Ijust could not.
It was like reading through themind of someone.
That just annoyed me.

(23:41):
So, uh it.
I just felt like the theprotagonist was very flip-floppy
.
It was one of those people thatwould be like I need to win at
all costs, even if it, you know,cost the lives of my friends.
And then, two seconds later,after she makes a decision that
hurts her friends, she's like ohno, my friends are hurt.
How could they ever be hurt?
What will I do?
And I'm like just two secondsago you were just talking about

(24:02):
you're gonna walk over the topright.

Taylor (24:04):
How did this happen?

James (24:05):
oh wait, it was me I just felt that was the vibe I got
from the protagonist of thatseries.
I felt like it was one secondshe was caring about her friends
and that was the most importantthing she could ever do is
protect them.
And then the next second it'sall that mattered was winning.
And then it was like she wasshocked that her friends were
hurt and I didn't feel like itlined up very well, and maybe

(24:25):
I'm the only reader that feltthat, because everyone else says
they love it.

Taylor (24:28):
Yeah, I did think of one other example of uh, one I just
had a hard time getting intoand it wasn't on like the lower,
you know levels, you know sortof thing and it's maybe a hot,
hot, divisive opinion.
But uh, wheel of time, I'mcurrently reading through and I
think I'm gonna finish thefourth book and so I'm not like
that far into it, but it kind offeels like homework for me.
It's like I want to get throughit because, like, people say

(24:50):
good things, um, but like hardtime really buying into the
characters and it's well doneworld building, but there's
something about the way he worldbuilds and stuff that I just
like it's harder for me to likecare about and so I'm still
gonna give it a go.
And actually this last book,shadow rising, that I just
finished, there were some plotlines and I'm like, oh, I

(25:13):
actually care about what'shappening right now, and so I
got a little more invested.
So I'm still going to give it ago.
But that one, you know it's notbad, but like 3.5 or 4 stars
versus like some of the 5-starbooks or whatever you know.

James (25:26):
Yeah, yeah, I was going to ask.
When it comes to BrandonSanderson, have you read a lot
of his non-Cosmere work?

Taylor (25:32):
I've started to dabble, like I've done Arithmetist, I've
done Legion, I thought Legionwas a very unique take.
Yeah, it was a lot of fun, andthat was one he kept
recommending to me.
I have started Skyward.
I don't know if I've done otherones yet, but those are some of
the ones that I've done so farhave you read snapshot?

(25:54):
No, but I hear they're adaptingit for tv right, are they?

James (25:57):
I think so that'll be interesting, that and skyward
it's a novella, like it's ashort short story, but, um, that
one kind of blew my mind andthe funny thing is, uh,
sometimes I feel like I'm a snoband I I'm not giving enough
attention to other things.
And then sometimes I feel likeI'm a snob and I'm not giving
enough attention to other things, and then sometimes I feel like
I'm illiterate and like I'mlike this was a masterpiece.
I go tell someone else likereally, so like Snapshot I'm not

(26:18):
saying it, you know, expect itto be like super simple minded,
but I just remember thinkingthere was some cool twist in
that.
Yeah, it kind of blew my mind.
I thought it was a really coolidea.
And then when I went, the oneperson I talked to about it was
like, really, I Saw it coming amile away, like to me it was
just it's pretty expected, and Iwas like, oh, but yeah,
snapshot is really cool.
It's the idea of like they havethis technology where you can

(26:41):
literally like Go into a timeperiod, like they'll put you
into the time period that acrime happened and you'll
witness the crime.
So they, they have likedetectives that go into a crime
scene, watch it happen and comeback to testify against the
criminal.
So like, okay, we know that themurder happened between this
time and this time and we thinkit was this person, and so these
detectives go into the timeperiod and just kind of like

(27:03):
make sure they see it happen andthen they can come back and
testify as witnesses, andtestify as witnesses.
And so the story is about thesetwo people that are trying to
track down this killer and seewhat happened.

Taylor (27:16):
Yeah.

James (27:17):
And I just thought it was really cool.

Taylor (27:20):
That's awesome yeah.

James (27:21):
It was a unique story, for sure.
But before we jump on because Iknow we want to talk a lot of
superheroes, because I thinkthat'll be fun but I wanted to
show you what's in my box yeah,the box.
So almost a year ago, I feellike there was a Kickstarter
campaign that Brandon Sandersondid for his next Leatherbound.

Taylor (27:40):
Oh.

James (27:40):
And I got it just yesterday, beautiful, and I want
to show you.

Taylor (27:44):
I say beautiful, but I haven't seen it yet.

James (27:45):
Actually yesterday, it might have been two days ago,
but I got three books, so I'mgoing to show you really quick.
Goodness right, this is wordsof radiance, volume one and
volume two.
oh man, so when they, when theyput it in the, the leather bound
, uh, the book's too big to justhave one, so it's being two
volume, but they're likegorgeous books and have some

(28:08):
pretty artwork in there and uh,I feel the same way when I'm
trying to open it, like sonervous to like I don't want to
ruin it, but how do I do thiscarefully?

Taylor (28:16):
Right, it's beautiful, the ancient old Sabbath.
That's been spoken.

James (28:22):
Yes, it's got like the gold foiled edges.
Oh my goodness, it's got allsorts of artwork.

Taylor (28:26):
Even got like painted oh my goodness, yeah, artwork.
Even got like painted thoughtoh my goodness, yeah.
These illustrations are oh todie for those are beautiful.

James (28:34):
So I'm like do I just like keep them on my shelf to
look pretty or do I just startreading from them?

Taylor (28:38):
and because I don't think right, I'm not like buying
them to sell them, right no,they're definitely like a
collector's thing and I didn'trealize they were so beautiful
on the inside.
That makes me want them all themore right sorry, sorry uh to
your wife it's all good but bigcost.

James (28:55):
But those are beautiful have you heard of sanderson
curiosities kind of a new thinghe's doing no I haven't.
So that was the second part ofthis box I was going to show you
he has these uh books that hereleases that are like, I mean,
some people might.
You'll have to tell me yourthoughts on Brandon Sanderson.
Some people might say that thisis his way of doing, like a

(29:16):
money grab, and maybe that'spartially true.
I mean, this is his income,this is his business his job?
Yeah, but he is.
I do find Brandon Sandersonvery passionate about what he
does, and he started going backto some of his old works that
were never published, thatweren't good enough to be
published, yeah, and he'sstarting to put them into these
Sanderson curiosities.

(29:36):
Okay, and so it's basically.
I have one on the shelf thatwas from an earlier Kickstarter.

Taylor (29:41):
That's the way of King's prime.

James (29:43):
Yes, so it's like back before it's it's the same story
but it's not the same story.
So it's like his early idea ofwhat the Stormlight Archives
would be.
Some of the character names aredifferent.

Taylor (29:54):
Some of the plot is slightly different.
Some characters don't evenexist.
Yeah Right.

James (29:56):
And so it's kind of interesting to read what the
world was going to be.
But then you have DragonsteelPrime, his first book, right,
which I guess was like his firstbook, and he mentions because I
I was reading a little bit ofjust what, what is this?

Taylor (30:13):
because I wasn't even entirely sure I just knew I
wanted it, so I got it withoutquite knowing right um, but he
talks about um that a lot ofthis book is.

James (30:22):
You'll see the ideas of other books, like things in this
book made it to other books soit's like he had a lot of good
stuff in here that just didn'tmesh and then he took those
ideas and put them in otherstories Like the shattered
planes apparently came from this.
Oh, it's just a Shalon from theway of Kings.
Apparently, that character wasoriginally like.
She originated from this book.

Taylor (30:41):
That's cool.

James (30:42):
Um and uh.
Anyway, he just talks about howthere's a lot of elements that
would become Cosmere canon inother books.
That kind of originated withthis idea, and so I don't even
know what the story is fullyabout, but I'm excited to read
it.

Taylor (30:58):
Yeah.

James (31:00):
It's not as fancy as the.

Taylor (31:01):
Oh, for sure yeah.

James (31:03):
But I know this is not a video podcast, so I'm going to
put pictures of this for peopleto see what I'm talking about.

Taylor (31:16):
But I wanted to share that with you because I think
it's fun.
No, that's really cool, and Ithink you know you mentioned the
money grab thing.
Uh, think, to anyone listening,you can read the ebook or
listen to the audiobook for freeon his website on dragon steel.
So, like, I think, with this mway of king's prime, like there,
you're paying for the you knowthe nice bookshelf edition,
right.
But but like, if you're justcurious, sanderson curiosities,

(31:38):
right, like you can just kind ofgo and tinker around and see
what it is too right.
So so I do think you know it'san easy way to make some money.
But I also just think, likehe's got people that are so
invested into his worlds.

James (31:49):
We just want to be in his world at all times, right yeah,
that's the thing it's like ifif you think he's a money
grabber, it's because peoplewant to spend money on it like
if no one spent money on it,there would be no, um, there
would be no fancy leather bounds, I guess.
Last question before we jumpinto our comic book stuff,
because I got excited for thesuperheroes, but um, I was gonna

(32:09):
ask what your who.

Taylor (32:10):
Your favorite character in the cosmere is oh boy, that's
a deep question and I don'tknow if I've ever thought about
it before.
Yeah, we will go with a simpleanswer.
I don't know if it's like myall-time favorite anything, but
I do love lift lift okay lift isalways a good time and I think
for some people the characterdoesn't work and she's annoying.

(32:33):
But you just get theseone-liners that are so great and
I love the idea of literallythe world is falling apart and
she's cracking jokes.
She's just sliding aroundcomplaining about pancakes and
everybody's like.
The desolation is here.

James (32:51):
Humanity is doomed.
She's like pancake, rightexactly so.

Taylor (32:54):
So I think she's always a lot of fun, and anytime she
comes up I'm like, oh, here sheis right.
Like, so I say, that's one.

James (33:00):
I also love I got.
I got a kick out of when sheshe made a shard fork yes, I
think yeah, she sure did so,wait, you could do anything oh
yeah, sorry, I don't know ifthat's a major spoiler.
It's like four years.
It's like people have theseshard blades or shard spears or
whatever, and she's like can Imake a shard fork?
I guess.
All right, sorry, I interruptedyou no, no, you're good.

Taylor (33:23):
Yeah, the other one, I don't know if he counts because
he's like everywhere, but I dolove Hoyt.
You know, or wit, every time wesee, see Hoyt and it's, you
know, kind of the fun.
Where's Waldo?
In some of the books and andthe other ones he's more of a
prominent character, but justthe idea of like he's the best,
like bard type, you know, you'veever created for those of the D
and D fame.

James (33:42):
Yeah, yeah, I actually like a lot of the characters in
the wax and Wayne series.
Oh yeah of the characters inthe wax and wayne series.
Oh yeah, they.
They surprised me a little bittoo, because I mean the series
is great, but if you're into thecosmere, the big thing is the
stormlight archives.
Everyone talks about theoriginal miss born trilogy a lot
, but I really like um wayne andit's been a minute since I read

(34:03):
it.
Uh, not starris, the other girlmarasi, mercy, mercy.
It did start with an m so yeah,it'd been a minute since I'd
read that and, uh, you didremind me, though wax is
actually one of my more seriousfavorite characters.

Taylor (34:17):
For me he's like a cosmere batman, um, that like he
obviously has superpowers inthis, but like just the vibe of
like the, the cityscape and likeflying through the city, and
he's kind of like dark andbrooding a little bit, not to
crack jokes or whatever, buthe's a detective Right.
So for me I've always likewe'll get into Batman, but I've

(34:41):
like always seen myself inBatman a little bit and so for
having like a Mistborn Batman,like it felt really, really cool
to me and just I and just I hada hard time getting into vin.
I don't have any problems withvin from era one, but then like
but wax, I like immediatelyglued into and felt myself as
wax, like I couldn't quite withvin so yeah so he's probably my
more serious top, top choice oh,and I I you know.

James (35:04):
I specifically mentioned wayne and merisi is that how you
say it?
Yeah, I didn't listen to theaudio.
I actually read those ones but.
But I like wax and Steris aswell so I just thought Steris is
interesting.
At the beginning I was like man.
I hate her right.
She's obnoxious and then youlearn to really like her.
But speaking of Batman, batman.

Taylor (35:29):
Batman.
Let's dive into Batman.
Nuff said.

James (35:31):
Nuff said and that is our podcast, so one of the things
that I thought would be reallyinteresting to get your take on.
So I guess first you used tohave a Batman-specific podcast.
I did Tell me a little bit aboutthat.
What exactly did you talk abouton your podcast?
What inspired you to do thepodcast?

(35:51):
I know it was a little whileago, but just give me the
lowdown on your podcast and yourexperience with Batman and
podcasting at my university atthe IT help desk People would
call in, they forgot theirpasswords or whatever and we'd
help them out.

Taylor (36:13):
And one of my buddies said Batman v Superman was about
to come out and he's likeyou're a Batman fan.
And I'm like I'm a Batman fan.
He's like are you so excited?

James (36:22):
I'm like, I'm so excited.

Taylor (36:24):
And then he was just like I'm thinking of starting a
podcast, do you want to co-hostwith me?
And I'm like sure, man.
And so it's.
That's it just kind of likecame out naturally like that.
We just started nerding outabout batman and so, uh, yeah,
we did have a podcast.
It was called beyond the batcave, the.
I think it was called thebatman centric dc comics or dc
universe podcast, something likethat.

(36:45):
So so it was a lot of fun.
I think we did somewhere around50 or so episodes.
So it was a good.
It was a lot of fun.
I think we did somewhere around50 or so episodes.
So it was a good run for acouple of years and so it was a
lot of fun.
We kind of would review somemovies or watch some old
episodes of things or talk aboutthe news and who they cast for
Batman, and so it was a lot offun.
Yeah, I'll cherish that time.

James (37:06):
This brings me back a little bit, yeah yeah, well, I
am a little bit, yeah, yeah, um,well, I, I am a Batman fan too.
Um, I would say for me, I'mrelatively I mean, it would be
the last couple of years a newBatman fan.
Yeah, um, and so, uh, I mean,there's so many ways to get into
superheroes now.

(37:26):
So you could be approachingthem from hey superheroes now,
so you could be approaching themfrom hey, I saw the Marvel
movies.
Hey, I saw the DC movies.

Taylor (37:36):
Hey, I picked up a comic book hey, I was at Comic-Con
and some guy was dressed as abat.

James (37:38):
I don't know you could find your way into that, like
the Big Bang Theory.
I don't know if you ever watchedthat TV series but these four
really nerdy guys, they'realways talking about comic books
and it was entertaining, um andso for, uh, for me, I, I had an
uncle, um, darren Smith shoutout to Darren if you're
listening but uh, way into comicbooks.

(38:00):
And my brother, uh, he was wayinto comic books and then I was
kind of just happy to be alongfor the ride.
I enjoyed them, but I was notnearly as deep into it as they
were.
I enjoyed them, but I was notnearly as deep into it as they
were.
And they both were big Marvelfans and so I was a Marvel fan.
Yeah, and my favoritesuperheroes on the Marvel side
are Captain America and Iceman.

(38:20):
Those are my two favorites, butI always just thought Marvel's
the way it goes.
And whenever people would asklike Marvel or DC, I'm like oh,
Marvel's so much better.
I just always, I was basicallyrooting for Marvel without
knowing what DC had to offer.
Right, and then I startedwatching some of the DC animated

(38:41):
cartoons yeah, and they've gotgood stuff.
The animated like stuff that DCputs out is way, way better than
anything Marvel, I think, hasput out right.
They don't mess around.
As far as the animated stuffgoes, if you look at the live
action, I think dc's got youknow some good stuff, but they

(39:01):
couldn't quite form the universeand I feel like they kept
trying to and they in my opinionit's like they took too long to
get it together, that actorswere exiting as they were trying
to bring them together, likechristian bale, like if they
could have brought that batmaninto the universe with superman,
like.
But christian bale was done andthey brought in a new batman
and then, uh, I don't know, Ijust feel like it was kind of

(39:23):
falling apart as they weretrying to put it together.
That that's my opinion, and sosome of these movies are really
great standalone, but then whenyou're trying to look at it as a
universe, I Worked great.

Taylor (39:32):
Yeah, I never quite took off, like, and then I think
sometimes they some people saythey actually went too fast, you
know trying to make an Avengersin there like third film or
whatever right, so so yeah, likethat we didn't quite get the
universe and I think with thenew Superman movie coming out
they're trying to reboot that.
I don't know if they're tryingto make an Avengers, but just
like a new, new universe alittle bit.
So I think it'll be interestingto see what comes about.

(39:55):
But I definitely agree withyour overall sentiment.
I think DC movies have some,some classics right, like you
know, look at Christopher E,superman, the Dark Knight
trilogy like like, not just forsuperhero fans, but like
universally beloved films, youknow, like.
So I think those are good,whereas before the MCU right,
like like we didn't we didn'thave any Marvel beloved.

(40:18):
I guess we had the TobeyMaguire, spider-mans right, like
that was kind of it.

James (40:21):
You look at some of the the Marvel movies before they
got the MCU together and therewere some, some that weren't as
great.
Right, daredevil, I don't know.
Yeah, electra.

Taylor (40:31):
Yeah, all those things those were.
Even the Hulks were a littlequestionable.
It took three times to get theright Hulk.
Yeah, yeah.

James (40:37):
But yeah.
So I guess the question is thenfor you DC or Marvel?

Taylor (40:43):
Oh, that's hard.
Which one do I like or whichone I think is better?

James (40:49):
I don't know.
I didn't really put any contextthere, I was just going to say
which are you pro DC over Marvelor pro Marvel over DC?
I mean, I'm pro-DC over Marvel,or?

Taylor (40:56):
pro-Marvel over DC.
I mean, I'm pro-superheroes,right, like I like all of them.
I think I kind of had I don'tknow if I had the opposite
experience of you, but like Ialways had Batman, you know, and
then so therefore I always hadSuperman, I always had the
Justice League, and so like thatwas where my bias was growing
up.
And then, like the Dark Knighttrilogy came out when I was like

(41:16):
in junior high and high schooland so like I cemented it as
like the greatest thing to everexist, right, and so I think
obviously I have to pickBatman's my man.
So I'm going with DC.
I do think they have.
It's just a very different vibe,like if you think about like
the macro of those two universesLike DC, about like the macro

(41:38):
of those two universes, likelike dc is about like I don't
know, their forerunners are likegods among men.
You know, like besides batman alittle bit, you got wonder
woman and superman and the flash, like really these they kind of
bring back some of these likegreek and roman god myths, right
, and and try to um, and thoseare their forerunners, and so
it's kind of just interesting tosee like how that interacts
with the world.
But anyways, I'm rambling.

(41:59):
He caught me rambling.

James (42:01):
No, no, that's perfect.
I was going to ask you.
You know, let's dive into someof the maybe popular or
unpopular opinions about Batman.
So one thing I often hear isthat Batman is basically
superhero due to plot, armor,plot armor.

Taylor (42:18):
I hear that all the time .
I'm less familiar with the term.

James (42:21):
But basically, like the only reason Batman can like the
saying is does Batman have preptime, like they say?
If Batman has prep time he canbeat anybody, and you were just
saying it's like God's man amongmen, except for Batman, like.
So, batman, he could take upthe whole justice league if he
had prep time Right.
And you know, there's part ofme I love Batman, and the more

(42:42):
I've read the comics and doveinto some of the series, the
more I kind of understand thereason behind that and I'm like
yeah.
Batman is really skilled and areally unique character as you
learn why he's so good at all ofthat.
But at the same time it's like,okay, truly, you've got someone
with super speed that couldprobably just snap his neck and
end him right.

(43:03):
Is batman legitimately justbeing protected by plot armor or
, uh, do you think that he canreally defend himself against
superheroes and supernaturalbeings like what?
What is what's your take on onbatman?
Is he as invincible as I thinka lot of people make him seen or
the comics make him seem?

Taylor (43:23):
I would that last question?
I would say no, right, andthat's part of what makes him, I
think, more relatable and morehuman is like he gets the most
broken out of any superhero,right, like you know, bane
literally breaks his back right,and he has to have another
person step in for batman, right, like for months, yeah, and so
like he goes through thesethings, and so I'd say about the

(43:45):
plot armor on a, on a dcuniverse scale, I think there's
a lot of like luck and you haveto be creative about your
writing.
About batman has to be at theright place at the right time,
to not get like gamma rate or,you know, dark sided at the
first moments, right.
So I do think there's a littlebit of protection when he's
fighting like cosmic beings,right, that are a little out of

(44:07):
his scope.
But then I think if you'regetting ground level Gotham
stories, like he's gettingsurprised all the time Like a
newer, newer series or villainentry, that I think is great.
It's like the court of owls yeahand that's one where like, just
like this kind of new villainentity kind of comes out of
nowhere, right, and he getstrapped in this like labyrinth

(44:29):
that they create for him andlike there was no prep time for
that, right, yeah, so I think ona gotham level, like they love
to just like throw surprises athim, but I I would see, you know
, if he's in some of those likejustice league stories and stuff
, like either he has to shelterhimself and I think they do poke
fun at it too like even likethe justice league films live,
some of the more recent oneslike there's certain parts he

(44:50):
just like can't participate inor he's just dodging, you know
for little parts of it.
So there's a little bit there,but I think so yeah, not
invincible, but he's got skillswell, it's just funny to me,
because to all the haters outthere it's like okay.

James (45:03):
Well, if we read a batman comic that doesn't have the
plot armor, it's like batmansteps out and dies the end it's
like well, that's notentertaining.
So I mean, obviously there'sgot to be a little bit to keep
the character for his series.
But one of my favorites, ohgosh, and I can't remember.
You might know what it is, butthere's one where someone gets

(45:27):
Batman's files on the JusticeLeague.
He has like contingency plans.
If any of them get brainwashedor go evil.

Taylor (45:33):
I think they call it Doom.
There's an animated one calledDoom.

James (45:35):
Yeah, I think so, and so he's got plans to take out
everybody, and you knoweveryone's like we can't trust
you, batman, but at the sametime it's like he's the only
person that has not got superanything.

Taylor (45:46):
of course he's gotta be prepared for it and he never
used it, right like he had it onfile, but he hasn't taken it
down yet it's one of my favoriteseries, favorite series.

James (45:55):
In one of the cartoons is there's a moment where Batman's
in the Batcave and he's goingthrough all these video feeds
and he's seeing all the heroesthat are like being taken out.
They're not like dead, butthey're being disabled or taken
down.
And all of a sudden he's likeAlfred, call everyone to the
Batcave, we're under attack.
He's like we're under attack.
Who's attacking us?

Taylor (46:13):
I am Me.
We're under attack.
Who's attacking us?
I am Me.

James (46:15):
It's like me and you're like whoa, what's going on?
And it turns out that, oh,spoiler.
No, you have to watch thatRight, but it's an intense one,
and I don't know, I've alwaysloved that about Batman and then
I always thought, you know,batman, you see, is like this
soul, like he's the solovigilante.

Taylor (46:37):
But then, like this soul , like he's, the solo vigilante,
but then, as you dive more intothe comics, he there's the bat
family right and there's a lotof them.
Yeah, it's like five robin, sixrobin, you know, depending on
how you count them.

James (46:43):
And I had no idea, and the five or six robins have
turned into other heroes yeah,you've got like the red robin
and you've got red hoodnightwing nightwing, um, and so
I don't know it's.
It's become more and moreentertaining to dive into the,
the bat world, because I justalways thought it was batman and

(47:04):
this little boy in tights thatrun around and, uh, you start to
get to know these charactersand and it's pretty, it's pretty
cool yeah, like if you justpick up one that's like a
current ongoing series, you'd besurprised like who's, who's
this?

Taylor (47:16):
and why are they helping batman, right, like he's, he's,
he's got sidekicks did youwatch any of the cw like green
arrow verse yeah, the arrowverse.
Yeah, yeah, I'd watched firstfour seasons of arrow and the
first probably three, fourseasons of flash.
I'd uh, I watched the firstseason of supergirl, maybe
season and a half, so I watcheda handful.

James (47:38):
I didn't watch all of them, but yeah, flash was an
interesting one because, uh, Idid think it was good.
But it's like, how many timescan the hero just be someone
faster, right?
Because it was like the firsttime.
It's like, oh no, he's so fast,what will I do?
And then he beats him.
And then the next, oh, he'seven faster, what do I do?
Right that just seemed toalways be the thing I can't beat
him um.
But uh, I was thinkingspecifically about arrow,

(47:59):
because he's another justiceleague member that doesn't have
any superpowers that's true um,and so what is your take on the
green arrow and how does herelate?

Taylor (48:10):
uh, paired up against batman, I guess I I haven't read
a lot of green era, like,obviously I've watched the show
and things.
Like I'd say there's maybe areason he's not always in, you
know, the the front startinglineup along with Batman, right,
like I think I think he holdshis own, like I'm not saying
he's a weak Superhero oranything, but he kind of reminds

(48:32):
me of a little bit of Hawkeyeand the Avengers.
Right, it's like I'm here tosupport I'll, I'll make a few
good shots at the right moment,sort of thing, but like if you
get the big scale ones.
But really you know thatself-made hero is kind of a
little bit of a trope nowadays,right that I think Batman and
Iron man kind of started thatoff of.
Like I don't have a radioactivespider to bite me, but I can.

(48:54):
I can hold my own because ofeither my training or my
skillset or other things, right.
So so I think he's definitely aworthy entry of that category.
Right, I wouldn't.
I wouldn't expect him to lastalong in a fight with Batman,
but I mean he did take on racialghoul a couple of times as well
.

James (49:10):
So do you ever see a there's a comic book series DC.
Did you ever see there's acomic book series DC versus?

Taylor (49:16):
vampires I think you've told me about it, but I haven't
read it.

James (49:18):
Yes, that one's interesting because you do get a
little Batman arrow fight.

Taylor (49:21):
Oh, that's fun.

James (49:22):
But basically the justice league has been infiltrated by
vampires and Batman and greenarrow I think the other one's a
vampire for a short stint.
And they're actually the what'scool about is they're the only
two that aren't infected.
That's funny.
So like the story is kind ofkicks off with the two of them
trying to figure out what are wegoing to do, Cause you've got
Superman, Wonder Woman, GreenLantern coming at them and

(49:43):
trying to kill them.
So it's it's pretty cool, but Iknow we don't have too much
more time here, but I wanted todo a little activity with you.

Taylor (49:54):
Sure, if you're down for it Always.

James (49:56):
So I tested this with my wife and it worked.
I think it's fun, so we'regoing to.
Ai is a big thing now.
So we're going to use AI.
I think it would be fun to comeup with some sort of
hypothetical situation here.
I'm going to type it into thechat GBT and say, hey, this is
the scenario and then we bothhave to create our own team and

(50:18):
see who comes out moresuccessful according to chat.
So we can do it one of two ways.
There's an objective that justeach of our teams has to do
individually and we'll see whohas a better chance of
succeeding.
Or we can do something wherewe're against each other and
we're forming teams that aregoing to have to go against each
other.
Um, I don't know what, what,what do you think?
Do you have any ideas?
I didn't think through too muchof what our, our story could be

(50:40):
, cause I wanted to leave thatopen.

Taylor (50:41):
So we can, I mean you were telling me about the one
you did with Claire and I thinkthat was super interesting
because, like you told me, yourteam, like your team totally
should have won and he sent mesome of the more like the
explanations I Like.
Okay, I guess Right, and so Ithink if you're just doing like
a, a three V three, like brawlor whatever, like it's a little
surface level, but I don't knowif I have like a great ideas,
your first one was really good.

James (51:02):
Yeah, so.
So the one that I did withClaire was uh, you had to take
the one ring to Mount doom andyou got three and we didn't even
say comic book characters, wejust said three fictional
characters to make up your team.
And I had picked CaptainAmerica, the flash and Albus
Dumbledore.
And my thought process wasCaptain America could have the

(51:22):
willpower to withstand the ringand the flash could obviously
get around armies and probablyhelp get them to Mount doom
really quick.
And then Albus Dumbledore is.
Albus Dumbledore is just verywise and a wizard and could
probably not only help with thearmies of Sauron but, uh, help
them, you know, navigate thechallenges that they come up
against.
And Claire came up with areally interesting team.

(51:44):
Hers was Tony Stark, jackSparrow and Galadriel from Lord
of the Rings.
And when we punched it all in,what we do is we type the
reasons we picked them too.

Taylor (51:53):
So that could influence it.

James (51:54):
Cause if you mentioned a really good point, and I'm not
mentioning good points on mypeople.
Even if I might've been theobvious choice, it could still
pick you.
Um, but uh, yeah, I typed upwhat she said and why, and then
I put my guys in why.
And then I said who has abetter chance of winning?
And it said Claire.
And then I actually asked atthe end I said if I had picked
Gandalf instead of AlbusDumbledore, would that have made

(52:16):
the difference?
And it said yes, oh,interesting.
It said Gandalf had enoughknowledge of Middle-earth and
Sauron and everything that itwould have made the difference,
but Albus Dumbledore did not,and so it was just kind of a
funny thing.
So I wanted to try somethinglike that with you.

Taylor (52:31):
You could flip it on its head a little bit, because
we're talking about, like,batman's prep time of like, what
if we have to take down Batman?
And like what are?
You know what team is he mostlikely unable to prepare for?

James (52:44):
Here's what we do.
How about chat?
Gpt gives us a scenario, thenGreat, I'll just tell him what
we're trying to do and have itpropose the scenario, and then
we'll type our answers in andwe'll go from there.

Taylor (52:53):
Yeah.

James (52:54):
So so the is in and we'll go from there, yeah, so?
So the scenario that we're goingto do is going to be generated
by chat gpt, and what I've typedin here says we're doing a
what-if scenario right now meversus taylor.
We want to come up with a teamof three comic book villains
each to try and take out batman.
Can you give us the scenariothat we have to prep for to take
him out, and then we will letyou know our teams and why we

(53:15):
pick them, and then you can tellus who is more likely to
succeed.
So if I put that in, it's goingto generate a scenario for us
which, okay, taking down thedark knight, batman is hosting a
secret gala at the wayne manorunder the guise of bruce wayne.
The event is a charityfundraiser for gotham's

(53:36):
underprivileged youth, but inreality, batman is gathering
Gotham's elite to uncover whichamong them has been aiding the
League of Shadows.
He has set up a series ofcovert traps, surveillance
measures and countermeasures toensure no villains get the upper
hand.
Your objective is to send ateam of three comic book
villains to infiltrate WayneManor neutralize Batman and

(54:36):
retrieve.

Taylor (54:36):
Oh boy, even if we're in the Batcave, he's going to send
PD down there.

James (54:39):
I guess According to what chat GPT said.

Taylor (54:42):
Okay, it's a possibility .
It's not off the table.

James (54:46):
Yeah, I don't know if you already have some thoughts, but
I'm going to start ponderingwhat my team will look like and
then we'll plug it in.
So the best way to make thiswork right is you're gonna give
me the three villains and thenkind of your reasoning why yeah,
and then I'll do the same.
And then you know it, chat gptdoesn't limit just to what we

(55:06):
say.
So if you like miss somethingobvious, it's not gonna be like,
oh, all of a sudden this persondoesn't know that, but you can
try and justify which it'll takeinto consideration okay, which
is so yeah?
you know, like when I did theone ring, I'd pick captain
america because I thought he wasa, like a pure character that
could resist the temptations ofthe ring.
So I specified that because Iwanted it to know why I'd pick
captain america.

(55:27):
Yeah, and so it took that intoconsideration and uh, yeah
anyway.

Taylor (55:32):
So I'm gonna think of my team okay, give you a second to
think of your team.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, you're good.
Are we limiting?

James (55:40):
ourselves to DC villains or any villain I think any comic
book villain.

Taylor (55:42):
Comic book villain.

James (55:42):
Okay, so you can branch out of Marvel and DC if you know
.

Taylor (55:45):
That's true.
That's true, or you know.
Third parties.

James (55:48):
Yeah, okay, so jumping back in.
Then here's James' team toinfiltrate Wayne Manor.
So I have Captain Cold.
Oh, okay, he has experience asa thief.
I think he can break in andavoid a lot of the traps that
Batman has set.
He has smarts when it comes toan operation like this, and then
I also think that if he has todefend himself, he's got his

(56:11):
cold ray gun stuff that's true,like it always caused a bad day
for Batman.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, for sure.
Um, and then I put dr doom oh,getting high level.
I was thinking about it and Iwas like, okay, I guess it
depends on how you view dr doom,because I think there's some
parts of him as a villain wherehe's a little on the beginner

(56:33):
level right Ground level versusGod level.
Yeah, and he eventually becomespretty much a God.
But I was picturing him andmaybe I should specify that.
But I was not picturing him atthe God level.

Taylor (56:45):
I was picturing him at the.
We're just like in FantasticFour realm right now Fantastic.

James (56:49):
Four realm.
How should I I should probablyspecify that, though, because I
don't want to how?

Taylor (56:54):
would you word that you?
It's okay.

James (56:55):
If you overpower, it's you know we just talked about
not going god level but um,because then my third one is
kind of god level too.
I feel like a little bit, but Iput loki, okay, yeah, yeah,
yeah I figured loki uh and he'snot kind of god level, he's
literally a god but uh, Ipictured loki could use his
illusions to cover their escapeand oh, I like that get away

(57:16):
like that.
So that was kind of my picture,but Taylor's team.
I don't know why don't youintroduce your team, oh, sure,
yeah.

Taylor (57:22):
So first one, I picked Scarecrow.
So one of Batman's weaknessesis I mean, it's his strength,
and his weakness is his fragileemotional state, and so I think
if there's a way for Scarecrowto get some fear toxin into
Wayne Manor, batman could becrippled or broken for long
enough for this heist to takeplace.

James (57:39):
The psychologist in you, man, maybe you should have just
put yourself on the team, maybe.

Taylor (57:44):
And, as I said, batman's quite vulnerable emotionally.
Finding a way to immobilize ordistract him psychologically
could provide the perfect coverfor our operation.
Second one I chose Brainiac.
He gets a little high levelsometimes, but I was trying to
think of, you know, who couldmatch Wayne's tech prowess,
right, and Brainiac is a livingtech entity, kind of early AI if

(58:08):
you will.
And so I felt like if we'regoing to break into the Wayne
vaults and things, brainiacwould get us in there in a snap.
Like if we're going to breakinto the Wayne vaults and things
, brainiac would get us in therein a snap.
And then I was trying to flushit out with, like if it came to
a physical confrontation withBatman and Robin, who who do I
want to cover the physical part?
And and I thought Ra's al Ghul,like in some, in some
departments he trained Batman,he trains, you know, damian

(58:31):
Wayne, right?
So depending on which Robin wegot, he knows their every move,
sort of thing.
So how do you prepare againstthe guy who prepared you?
So I thought that would be agood physical encounter cover.

James (58:45):
Okay, well, let's see.
So when I did this last time,it gave me a lot of details too,
so we'll see what it says here.
Okay, so it says, let's breakit down step by step based on
the challenges outlined in thescenario.
James's team Captain ColdStrengths.
He's a skilled thief withgadgets to bypass traps and
secure entry Weaknesses.

(59:05):
His expertise is more groundedand may struggle with advanced
bat cave level tech.

Taylor (59:10):
I was thinking the same thing, chap GBT.

James (59:12):
Dr Doom strengths genius intellect and mastery of
technology.
Doom could handle hacking theBatcave and biometric security
with ease.
His combat skills and armorgive him an edge if Batman
confronts him.
Weaknesses Doom's arrogancecould lead to underestimating
Batman's psychological tactics.
Loki Strengths His illusionsmake him invaluable for
deception and misdirection.

(59:33):
Buying critical time to securethe drive or escape.
Weaknesses Loki's chaoticnature might disrupt teamwork,
especially with someone likeDoom.
See, I didn't even think aboutthat.
That's why I think it's kind ofcool.

Taylor (59:44):
It brings this stuff up.

James (59:46):
So overall strengths of the team this team excels in
infiltration and technicalprowess.
Loki's illusions provide a wildcard that could throw Batman
off balance.
Weaknesses illusions provide awild card that could throw
batman off balance.
Weaknesses the team may lackcohesion due to the strong egos
of doom and loki.
Additionally, their escape plandepends heavily on loki's
trickery.
Taylor's team.
Scarecrow strengths directlytargets batman's psych.

(01:00:08):
Fear gas could incapacitatebatman or at least create a
moment of vulnerability.
Weaknesses fear gas requiresproximity or a strategic
delivery method which could becountered if batman anticipates
the attack.
Brainiac strengths advanced aiintelligence and ability to
overpower even the bat cavestech.
He would likely dominate anytechnological or data related

(01:00:29):
challenges.
Weaknesses brainiacs methodsmay be overkill, attracting
unnecessary attention, such asfrom Gotham PD or allies like
Superman.
Ra's al Ghul Strengths.
Extensive experience fightingBatman, his combat skills,
strategic mind and League ofShadows connections give him a
unique edge.
Weaknesses Batman is familiarwith Ra's tactics, which might

(01:00:53):
make him less effective incatching Batman off guard.
Strengths this team is balancedwith Brainiac's tech dominance,
scarecrow's psychological edgeand Ra's combat experience,
providing a multifacetedapproach.
Weaknesses their operation mayrely too heavily on Batman being
emotionally compromised whichcould fail if Batman remains
focused.

(01:01:14):
Verdict Winner Taylor's team.

Taylor (01:01:16):
Oh man, you're 0 for 2.

James (01:01:18):
Yeah, I know.
While James' team has a greatmix of technical skills and
deception, taylor's team edgesout because of its more diverse
approach Psychological warfare,tech, domination and combat
prowess.
Brainiac is the trump cardcapable of neutralizing the
Batcave's advanced securitysystems almost effortlessly.
If Scarecrow's fear gassucceeds, batman could be
incapacitated, leaving Roz freeto secure the drive or handle

(01:01:42):
Robin if necessary.
James's team would excel ininfiltration and escape, but
Taylor's team is better preparedto overcome Batman's ability to
adapt and counterattack.
There you go so there we go,that was fun, that was fun and
you have bested me.
So if we go, that was fun, thatwas fun and you, you have
bested me.
So if we ever have to breakinto the Wayne Manor, I'm just
going to follow your lead.

Taylor (01:01:59):
Just borrow my team, just borrow your team, I'll have
you review my strategy.
Right, yeah, it'd be fun if DCever did like a Marvel.
What if like?
That'd be a really fun episode,though, to watch like an
infiltration.

James (01:02:10):
Um well, great, uh.
That is probably going to endthis segment of the nerd nexus.
Uh, taylor, thanks for thanksfor being here, thanks for
coming and chatting with me andfor goofing off and talking
things nerdy uh with me, so uh.
To conclude, though, I wasgoing to ask um, where can

(01:02:36):
people find you?
I mean, we talked about fable,so it sounds like your podcast
doesn't exist anymore.

Taylor (01:02:41):
No, I mean you can find it on Facebook if you're curious
what we talked about, but Idon't think like even the
server's up anymore because,we're not going to pay for
something we're not doinganymore.

James (01:02:48):
Fair enough.

Taylor (01:02:49):
Um, you know you can find me on Twitter.
You know twitter, tiktok,instagram, but I don't, I don't
like post things, I kind of justscroll other people's things.
So the one place we're talkingabout that I actually am like
posting and replying and, andyou know, engaging with other
people is more fable and I'm newto it.
We'll see if it lasts, but fairenough, um, but really into.
You know we've talked aboutsanderson, so that's kind of

(01:03:12):
where I've been nerding out withsome of fellow nerds recently.

James (01:03:15):
Okay, well, I'll put a link to your table and if anyone
is interested in followingTaylor and his reading
adventures, follow my table andchat with me about books.
But thanks, taylor, Iappreciate you coming and I
guess until next time everybodystay great, thank you.