June 23, 2025 • 48 mins
What does it take to lead a healthcare nonprofit when funding is cut, policy shifts overnight, and lives are at stake?
In this episode of The NEXT BIG THING with Keith D. Terry, veteran healthcare Chief Executive Sharon Smith-Terry shares how she navigated high-stakes leadership roles—from Baxter Healthcare to the Orthopaedic Research Society—with a rare mix of strategic precision and mission-first clarity.
We unpack:
- Myths about nonprofit leadership vs. for-profit models
- The real impact of federal funding cuts on health equity
- How to lead through a crisis without losing your purpose
- Why fundraising is a core leadership skill, not a side hustle
- How servant leadership and DEI principles still matter in 2025
Whether you’re in healthcare, leading a nonprofit, or building a values-based business, Sharon’s story will challenge you to lead with courage, clarity, and compassion.
#HealthcareLeadership #NonprofitLeadership #StrategicLeadership #HealthEquity #ServantLeadership #KeithDTerry #TheNextBigThing #WomenInLeadership #AIInHealthcare #DEI #PodcastForChangeMakers #BuzzsproutPodcast #Sharonsmithterry
Send us your thought on this episode.
Keith D. Terry and JJaed Productions, LLC produced this episode. www.jjaedproductions.com
Please Follow us on our YouTube channel at www.youtube.com/@keithdterry
For podcast guest recommendations, contact kterry@terryperformancegroup.com
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to the podcast.
The Next Big Thing.
I'm your host, keith D Terry, aconsultant, a coach and a
serial entrepreneur.
The mission here is to teach,inspire and to motivate.
Today's episode is particularlyimportant because we're diving
into the world of non-profithealthcare organizations and
leadership, a space wheremission is everything, the
(00:23):
stakes are high and, of course,the resources are often limited.
But first let's talk aboutcontext, because I believe that
context is really important.
Right now, nonprofit healthcareorganizations across the
country are undergoing pressure.
Federal funding cuts, stricterrequirements for public programs
like Medicaid and SNAP areincreasing and the increasing
(00:48):
political shifts are placing aheavier burden on these
organizations that already servethe most vulnerable in the
community.
And yet our leaders from thisside of the pond rise.
They're doing remarkable things.
But, like I always do with allmy podcasts, I like to give a
historical context of nonprofitand health care in America.
(01:10):
From the 1960s through the1800s, cheap missions, charity
missions like churches andreligious organizations, served
as the backbone of health carein this country.
A lot of people forget that,that it was led by the clergy
(01:31):
and moral leaders who had acalling to serve those in the
community.
Now we shift from the 1890s tothe 1920s, reformers like Jane
Addams personalized orprofessionalized rather, public
health works.
They needed to galvanize civicsupport, to secure funding from
wealthy philanthropists to servethe urban poor.
Then we shift from the 1930s tothe 50s.
Government funding expanded andnonprofits grew through
(01:55):
structured partnerships,navigating government grants,
infrastructure programs.
Skills like publicadministration became essential.
And guess what else?
Fundraising requirements likegrant writing had to align
mission to what the federalpriorities were, programs like
the Hill-Burton Act.
Now we move on to the 60s and90s, I mean, and 80s.
(02:16):
Medicare and Medicaid enteredthe scene.
Nonprofits became engines forcivil rights, health equity and
systematic change Advocates forunderserved populations.
Leaders needed policy knowledge,public speaking skills to
influence change and this is whyI say leaders rise in the
(02:37):
nonprofit healthcareorganization.
They had to have anotherspecialized skill, and that was
fundraising, but it became moreformalized.
Have another specialized skill,and that was fundraising, but
it became more formalized.
They had to require them tobuild foundation partnerships
and engage in political advocacyfunding.
Now we shift from that period,from the 90s to 2000.
We're coming a little closer totoday.
Business acumen entered thenonprofit healthcare arena where
(03:00):
they had to balance mission andmargins became essential.
Nonprofit leaders adoptedstrategic planning, financial
management to compete in amarket-driven environment.
Fundraising became even morespecialized.
It was institutionalized, whereyou had major donor campaigns,
grant acquisition, board-drivencapital campaigns became the
(03:21):
norm.
But let's be clear.
Fundraising isn't just aboutsecuring dollars.
It's a high-level leadershipskill.
The best nonprofit leadersaren't just good at asking.
They're masters at aligningmission with money, building
trust and inspiring people toinvest in their vision and quite
a specialized skill.
(03:41):
The last era, from 2010 to now,during the COVID-19 mental
health crisis, nude racialinjustice movements, have shaped
what we are doing right now.
Today's leaders must beresilient crisis managers,
inclusive change makers, fluentin tech and data.
As you can see, the skill setof a nonprofit organization
(04:03):
leader is quite vast.
Fundraising became anomnichannel.
You know what I mean byomnichannel.
They had to master digitalplatform, corporate partnerships
, social media appeals and DEIline funding strategies, and I
would say DEI is still not a badterm.
A good term because it's notjust about race, it's about the
inclusion of so many differentgroups of people.
(04:25):
So how do you lead through allof this purpose?
Well, today's guest and this iswhere I get it becomes fun and I
shut up.
We get to listen to my.
It's my guest today.
My guest today is Sharon SmithTerry.
Let me introduce you to SharonSmith Terry.
Sharon is the former chiefexecutive officer of the
Orthopedic Research Society anda trusted advisor to national
(04:48):
health initiatives.
She brings over 30 years ofleadership experience across
healthcare, nonprofit, nonprofitstrategy, global operations,
marketing and public healthadvocacy.
Her career includes major rolesat Baxter International, the
American Hospital Association,the Neurocritical Care Society,
where she's led during theheight of the pandemic.
(05:12):
She's a Jackson State grad, anaward-winning MBA from Roosevelt
University and the author oftwo poetry books that speak to
the heart and soul of purpose.
Sharon, welcome to the show.
Welcome to the Next Big Thing.
How are you?
Speaker 2 (05:27):
Thank you, keith, I'm fine.
What a fantastic introductionon healthcare.
Thank you for that intro.
It helps set the stage for me,so I appreciate that.
Speaker 1 (05:36):
Okay, Well, thank you .
That's what we try to do here.
On the Next Big Thing Okay.
So with that, Sharon, let'sbegin you.
So with that, Sharon, let'sbegin you.
Know a lot of people don't knowyour journey.
Let's start there.
Who is Sharon Smith, Terry, andwhat shaped you as a leader
today?
Speaker 2 (05:51):
Well, first I was born Sharon C Smith To Allison
Minnie Smith.
I am the youngest of fivechildren.
So in growing up in a home withthe youngest of five children,
you learn from them and I thinkthat started to set my journey,
(06:11):
for who I am.
You know, sports was myfoundation, college was my
salvation and healthcare is myinspiration.
So, to sum it up, that's reallywho I am, but it's important to
know that you know it's allabout being authentic throughout
your journey Understand what itis you want to be, what you
want to become and how you wantto make an impact on society.
And so, just coming out of Zioninto college, that was my first
(06:32):
step in learning who the worldis and my place in it.
Speaker 1 (06:36):
Okay, and so was there some big event that led
you to the nonprofit side.
Because of what I know of you,you've always been
mission-driven, or is that nottrue?
Speaker 2 (06:45):
I've always been mission driven, even from the
point where I had the quickesthands in the county playing
basketball.
I was captain of my basketballteam as a senior.
We didn't win.
Speaker 1 (06:54):
Did you say the quickest hands?
Speaker 2 (06:56):
Quickest hands in the county that's what they named
me I'd steal a ball and crossover and go down the court and
lay it up on you.
That's a transferable skill tomy work, because it's all about
understanding what the goal is,understanding how to achieve it
and then achieving it.
But to my journey to healthcare.
Let me answer that for you.
So after graduating fromcollege, you know my goal was to
(07:19):
work in a juvenile field andyou know Father Flanagan said a
long time ago, there's no suchthing as a bad boy, and I wanted
to prove him right bycounseling them.
Couldn't find a job, so endedup at Baxter Healthcare.
Where was my introduction tothe healthcare field?
On a for-profit side, I learnedall there is to know about renal
disease and that nasty kidneythat's such a nasty disease
(07:42):
Patients, having patients gothrough that and looking for a
kidney transplant.
Until then, doing thoseexchanges, either in center or
in their homes, was really mywhole passion for healthcare.
Because in talking to patientsand understanding what their
journey was, either in home orin center, to make sure that
(08:02):
they can clean out all thosetoxins, through exchanges that
interrupted their lives eitherthree times a week or three
times a day, depending on thetype of dialysis they did.
So that was my passion.
To say gee, I want to makethese patients better.
At what all costs?
What can I do to help?
And so, after a few more jobs Ihad growing in my profession, I
(08:23):
ended up at the AmericanHospital Association.
That was my introduction tohealth care association in 2007.
Speaker 1 (08:33):
OK, and I would say, you know, the American Hospital
Association is pretty big, it'sthe premier non-for-profit.
And so as we talk about, youknow, a purpose driven
leadership, was there some somespecial moment that or a mission
critical moment that thatpulled you into a purpose driven
leadership that you now possess?
Speaker 2 (08:56):
Yes, you know it was all about.
It was all about the patients.
I will admit I was told incollege that was an idealist,
and I guess I still am, becauseI think there could be a cure
for every disease if they hadthe research funding to explore
it and find cures.
I don't like to see people sick, and when they're sick
unnecessarily, that reallybothers me, and so my passion is
around what can be done to makepeople well, and in making
(09:20):
people well, give everyone who'ssick an equal opportunity to
participate in clinical trialsto receive the medications that
they need, no matter what theirbackground, and so there's a
healthcare equity piece to thistoo.
That's really a driving forcefor me, as I saw when I talked
to some of the patients and atBaxter and who gets dialysis
(09:41):
care and who doesn't, as onequick example, keith, is, if a
nephrologist has a patient.
Speaker 1 (09:47):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (09:48):
And the patient know that they have kidney failure
and they need to go on dialysis.
The nephrologist has a choice Ican put them on home dialysis or
I can put them on dialysiswhere they go into a center.
There are some technologies now.
I understand that in-centerdialysis you can also do at home
now, but the data has shownpreviously that for
(10:09):
African-American patients,hispanic patients, folks from
lower income communities, werealways given in-center
treatments where they had toleave their home, find
transportation and go into acenter, sit in that center three
to four hours and have theirexchanges, versus the care of
home dialysis where you're athome, where it's a different
(10:32):
treatment, where you haveexchanges.
You can do exchanges threetimes a day, depending on your
body weight and size andcondition of your kidney, really
, or you can sleep whiledialysis is going on and be
hooked up to a machine.
Those are lifestyle issues,those are quality of care issues
that need to be addressed Okay,and that's why I'm so
(10:52):
passionate about health care andnot only making all patients
well, but making sure that theirlifestyle is best quality as
possible, as they're makingthemselves well.
Speaker 1 (11:03):
Okay, I appreciate that and I want to stay a little
bit on you before we startgetting into non-for-profits and
navigating, and let's stay onyour journey.
You've worked for healthcarefor-profit organizations and
healthcare non-for-profitorganizations.
Thinking of those two bigbuckets and your own personal
journey, you know, did one sideinfluence you more than the
(11:27):
other?
Did you learn somethingdifferent on one side or the
other?
Because what I'm getting at iswhat influenced your leadership
style.
Speaker 2 (11:34):
What influenced my leadership style was the
organization itself and whomakes up the organization people
.
They are a company's greatestasset, whether it's for profit
or non-for-profit.
So I've worked in anorganization where people were
not as valued as they could havebeen and I said to myself if I
get that wall office, if I getthat decision-making role, I'm
(11:55):
going to do some thingsdifferently, and that is making
people your number one priority,making them feel good about
coming to work, giving themtools and resources they need to
do their job.
You know and that's either onthe for-profit or not-for-profit
side but what I have found isthe difference If you have a
talented team, if you have aculture that allows people to
come to work and be themselves.
(12:15):
Yes, the major difference is infor-profit organizations you've
got to get five and six andseven level pools.
You've got to go to the manager, the director, the VP, and then
the VPs have to discuss it.
Then it goes back to thedirector.
They have to discuss it.
See what's in the budget.
By the time it comes back, it'slike could be six months later
and you're like what was thatidea I forgot?
(12:36):
Let me go back to my notes.
Versus, on the nonprofit side.
It goes up through your manager, maybe the executive director,
ceo.
They take a look at it, makesure it aligns with the mission,
make sure it's what the memberswant, and you're executing in
about two to three months.
So it's a matter of seeing anidea, a business need that
satisfies that beneficiarywhether it's a member, whether
(12:57):
it's a patient, whether it's acustomer how quickly you can get
that out to market to meet theneed.
Speaker 1 (13:02):
Okay, Okay, so now let's peel back the onion a
little bit more onnon-for-profits.
What are some of the biggestmisconceptions people have about
leading non-profitorganizations, particularly
healthcare non-profits?
Speaker 2 (13:14):
I like this question because I've been in non-profits
for a while now and this comesup a lot.
Number one is that non-profitsaren't a business.
The non-for-profits are whatNon-profits are, not a business.
Okay, they are a business.
They have annual budgets thatthey need to adhere to and one
of the key drivers of success ismeeting your bottom line.
Now you may call it somethingdifferent.
(13:36):
On the for-profit side, youcall it profit.
On a non-profit side, you callit a net gain, because that net
gain needs to be reinvested backinto your members in the way of
education and those kinds ofthings.
That's the only difference, butit is a business.
The second thing is, from acompensation standpoint, that
nonprofit professionals are notpaid competitively.
(13:56):
That's not true, because mostnonprofits do a market study at
the end of each year to see whatthe salary ranges are for a
particular field, whetherfor-profit or non-for-profit.
It just relates to zip code.
That's the only difference.
Then the third is that theworkforce isn't as talented and
they have lighter workloads.
(14:16):
I can assure you, if you workedfor a non-profit, you will be
like I wonder if it's less busyon a for-profit side, because
I'm working 60 hours a week andit's not because you have to,
it's because you want to,because many people who work for
nonprofits this is another one,and this one isn't a proven one
, because you're going to ask me, sharon, where's the data on
that?
I don't have the data on thisone, but I can tell you that
(14:39):
people in the nonprofit side aretruly passionate about their
job.
I believe that it is that enduser, that beneficiary that's
going to benefit from what youoffer that improves their life
in some way.
And then a final one that Iwould focus on as far as what
are some of the misconceptions,is nonprofits don't have the
same need for investments asother businesses.
(15:00):
So, yeah, we do need the samelevel of investment in
infrastructure, in technology,in people, in innovation,
because all these things areneeded to meet our mission and
vision.
You know so.
Please, I just implore you guysto rethink about nonprofits,
because it is a business.
We do need the infrastructurebecause the investment in
(15:22):
nonprofits serve that end user,serve that patient, and every
one of us has been a patient orwill be a patient at least once
in our lifetime.
Speaker 1 (15:30):
Well, let me ask you this Don't you think that?
You know, I do believe it's amisconception.
I just think the misconceptionis diminishing.
Now, that's just my perspective.
Now you could, I could be wrong.
Feel free to push back andshape it, because you're the
guest, you're the expert.
I do believe that.
I do believe people areincredibly passionate to work
for non-for-profits because it'smission focused.
(15:51):
This organization is theAmerican Hospital Association,
serves the issues of thehospital, the heart association,
lung cancer you just left theOrthopedic Research Society.
That said, I think I want topeel back the onion a little bit
on boards because, havingserved on non-for-profit boards,
some at a high level what Imean by high level?
(16:14):
Some very big, like PlannedParenthood to you know, the
Evanston Community Foundationboard, they are non-paid boards.
Is there a difference?
Do you have a perspective onnon-for-profit boards?
Speaker 2 (16:29):
I do.
My perspective is going in as aCEO or executive director and
let me just say for nonprofits,when you talk about the
difference, a CEO and executivedirector are pretty much the
same.
You serve yes, they are At thetop of that society.
You represent the society froman operational standpoint.
It's just a matter of whetheryour organization wants to call
(16:51):
you a CEO or wants to call youan executive director.
The nomenclature for mostnonprofits is executive director
.
But they serve the function asa CEO and their job is to
ultimately run that organization.
When things are great, pat thatCEO on the back.
When things are not so great,well then, you have to answer to
the board, stakeholders,members and everyone else.
(17:12):
But I would say, from a boardstandpoint, you got to have a
functional board and afunctional board doesn't mean
that your board meets quarterly,weekly, monthly, whatever.
It means understanding whatyour strategic responsibilities
are from that board standpoint,your fiduciary responsibility,
not getting into the weeds ofwhat that CEO or executive
(17:34):
director does, but from astrategic level, how are we
going to plan these things out?
Are we going to focus on DEI asan example?
Are we going to offercertification programs for the
value of our members?
Are we going to do some ofthese other things?
Are we going to partner withother organizations?
Those are the strategic thingsthat board thinks about and
(17:56):
needs to stay focused on.
So, as a leader of theorganization, on the operations
side, that CEO or executivedirector needs to make sure that
their boards aremission-focused,
strategic-driven andgoal-oriented at the strategic
level.
If you do that, then you have asuccessful functioning.
Speaker 1 (18:16):
Okay.
Well, this next question Ireally want to ask can you take
us into a moment when you faced,you were at a leadership
crossroads, when your valueswere tested, but you had to make
a hard call anyway?
Speaker 2 (18:29):
Yes, you know, and let me use the value of
accountability.
Speaker 1 (18:34):
As a leader.
Speaker 2 (18:34):
You are accountable to the organization, you are
accountable to your staff, youare accountable to the
memberships, you are accountableto everything within that
organization.
So let me just answer thequestion by telling you just a
quick story.
Okay, I had a friend who wasqualified for an open position.
I needed trusted people on myleadership team, so I hired her.
Speaker 1 (18:57):
You hired your friend .
Speaker 2 (18:58):
I hired my friend, okay, and after a while I found
out the friend wasunderperforming Because she was
a friend.
I gave her more leg room toimprove.
She did not.
So at some point.
But at the point where I gaveher more leg room to improve, I
was compromising the companyvalue of accountability.
I'm accountable to have themost talented people on my team
(19:21):
to deliver on our goals andobjectives.
So that lingered on for aboutsix months.
And trying to make her better,and you are as a leader.
If folks are struggling, yougot to try to help them along
the way.
But at some point you recognizethat you got to move that
person off to off the bus oronto a different seat on the
same bus.
I knew I needed to move thisperson off the bus, so I
(19:42):
captivized the values for aminute until I realized I
couldn't do it anymore.
So at the end of the day, theperson was separated from the
organization.
Here's a lesson learned.
Number one and it's what myboss told me when I first
started is Sharon, when you havea problem with an employee,
that's okay.
It's what you do with it thatmatters.
And what becomes your problemor stays that employee's problem
(20:04):
.
It started to become my problemand it started becoming the
organization's problem.
My lesson learned was I'drather have a good friend than
say that last part again so.
I'd rather have a good friendthan an employee.
Ok, because there's so muchtalent that you don't have to
put your friend in a role andsacrifice the friendship if it
(20:24):
doesn't work that you don't haveto put your friend in a role
and sacrifice the friendship ifit doesn't work.
Speaker 1 (20:31):
Gotcha, Gotcha.
Some people would say neverhire friends.
But I don't believe that'snecessarily true.
Everybody has to stayaccountable.
But thank you for that story.
Was it a tough learn for you?
A tough?
Speaker 2 (20:37):
learn.
I'm just going to say it wasmore emotional than tough.
Speaker 1 (20:42):
Okay, okay.
Speaker 2 (20:44):
You know I've had to let people go before.
The emotional part was that Ihad a personal connection to her
and I know leaders hirecolleagues, people that they
know all the time and let's notsit.
I just want your listeners toknow that this isn't this
emotional female leader who'sinto her feelings.
This is not what this is is.
(21:09):
This is about recognizing theneed for the organization and
making sure the person whowasn't was not performing well
enough would be okay, because noone wants to take food off a
people's table, but when you'rein this role, your first
objective, your first allegianceis to the organization, and
that's what I realized in that.
Speaker 1 (21:23):
Okay, so let's you know, let's anything else you
want to say about that story orabout employees, Because I want
to navigate into today'slandscape.
Speaker 2 (21:31):
No, go ahead.
Speaker 1 (21:32):
Well, you know, you see what's happening publicly.
You know, with the recentshifts in public policy funding.
You know new challenges, shiftsall across the board funding,
funding, funding policy changes,policy changes.
Is it political, Is it not?
But here is the issue.
People are still homeless,People still get cancer, People
still have diabetes, Peoplestill can't pay their bills.
(21:53):
There's so many things thatpeople are faced with.
I don't see cancer rates goingdown, diabetes rates going down,
obesity rates going down.
And so, with the recent shiftsin public policy funding and new
challenges, you know, nonprofitleaders.
How are nonprofit leaders, thesector, dealing with all of this
(22:15):
?
Speaker 2 (22:16):
Yeah, it's tough, it's a challenge and this was
the last thing I faced beforeleaving ORS.
And I recall at our annualmeeting in February, the
decision that came down toreduce indirects down to 15%.
It became pretty solemn at thatmeeting because the indirects
(22:37):
is where is the?
Speaker 1 (22:38):
fund Indirects, explain what that means to the.
Speaker 2 (22:40):
Indirects is your administrative expenses related
to a grant that you receive,that you use that to pay for
researchers, for the work thatthey do in the labs, gotcha.
So you know, and so let me backup and say this and I'll get
back to what that means is.
Let me just give you just acouple of data points.
Keith, you know, as reported bythe Associated Press back in
(23:03):
March, $11 billion of directfederal support was cut and that
eliminated over 20,000 jobs $11billion $11 billion, okay.
Also, according to NBC News,approximately $1.8 billion was
cut from the National Institutesof Health you mentioned before.
Keith, you talked about heartdisease, lung disease, kidney
(23:26):
disease, all these kinds ofthings.
You know that's healthcarefunding, you know.
And at that same time, betweenApril 28th and April 8th, 700
grants were cut across 24 NIHinstitutes.
Okay, so that's huge.
Go back to ORS.
Many of our members within ORSare PhDs.
(23:47):
They work in academicinstitutions.
They do research inmusculoskeletal health and, for
those who don't know whatmusculoskeletal health, that
deals with movement, our joints,our knees, our legs, our arms,
anything that has to do withmovement in the body, and
arthritis.
And arthritis is one of thosemajor things that you get.
If you have any kind ofligament issue, you're probably
(24:09):
going to end up with arthritis.
That's where a lot of theresearch was coming from for ORS
members.
A lot of that funding got cut,so those academic institutions
had to adjust.
If we're not going to get themoney from the federal
government, where are we goingto get it from?
They have to readjust andfigure out new budgets, reshift
some things around to see ifthey can keep these researchers
on board.
(24:30):
If they couldn't, unfortunatelythey had to let them go.
So much of the research wasstifled and in some cases it was
unplugged.
The research had to cease.
So what does that mean?
People lose their jobs.
Academic institutions have tofind other ways to find funding
to support it, and so you have alot of PhDs who don't have jobs
, and then you know so okay, soyeah, what does all that mean?
(24:54):
People lose their jobs.
What does that mean to thepatient?
Speaker 1 (24:57):
Yeah, because I was going to ask being balanced.
Here is some of.
I agree with you 1.8 billion isa lot, 700 grants is a lot, but
do you think there's any fat inthere at all?
Do you think all of those, isthat money well spent?
Speaker 2 (25:13):
before you get to your next point, I can't say
because I don't have the data tosupport it.
Who am I to say that somebody'sresearch is fat, when they have
taken the time to identify ahypothesis based upon a certain
issue and they started toconduct the research?
Because, ultimately, it's aboutsaving costs, improving quality
of care, improving whatsurgeons do in the operating
(25:37):
room based upon research, theclinical research that they've
gained.
So if you take this researchaway, then how do you know what
the side effects are oftransplant surgery?
We know someone who just had ahip surgery.
I know someone who had kneesurgery.
I had meniscus surgery.
What's the data on what type ofcare to give?
(25:57):
Can I use a scope to go in ordo I need to cut it open if I'm
doing a meniscus treatment?
What about Achilles?
We have athletes now.
I mean, we're heavy intobasketball season.
What if Angel Reese and what if?
What if Angel Reese and CaitlinClark, both God forbid, God
(26:19):
forbid, shredded their Achilles.
They're around the same age,same athletic fitness.
Who could heal the quickest?
Is there a difference inhealing by race?
So what if you had two maleathletes from the Pistons or
from OKC who tore their Achilles?
Is there a time difference inhealing in men or women?
That's the kind of researchthat's being done.
(26:40):
I see or let's take it a stepfurther.
If I'm a person who just sitsaround on my couch and never
exercises, but I have diabetes,what is that going to do to me?
I'm not getting any exercise,I'm becoming sedentary.
That could lead to all othertypes of diseases heart disease,
kidney disease and those kindsof things.
So that's where that researchbut I'm sorry, keith, you got me
(27:02):
on a roll here for- a second.
So that's all about the researchfunding, and it's even been a
challenge even before the budgetcuts Research based upon life
threatening illnesses versusresearch based upon lifestyle
illnesses.
Speaker 1 (27:19):
Aren't both important .
Speaker 2 (27:21):
Well, a lot of the research has gone towards life
threatening illnesses like heartdisease, cancer and those kinds
of things, but lifestyle issues, which sometimes people see as
is you can live if you've got abroken leg, you can live if
you've got arthritis and thosekinds of things, but they lead
(27:41):
to other life-threateningillnesses if they don't get
those taken care of in theproper way.
Which research helps to findthe best technique, the best
medicines, the best cures?
Speaker 1 (27:53):
That's helpful.
I never thought that's helpfulbecause I didn't know.
Research was gated that way interms of lifestyle versus life
crisis moments.
And you're right, one of thehardest things for people to
change is lifestyle, you know,so I appreciate the perspective,
you know.
Speaker 2 (28:13):
If I could just make this one point though Okay,
research isn't separated bylifestyle or life threatening.
It's the person who's givingthe research funding.
The priority goes to those whatthey perceive to be just
automatic life threateningsituations.
We got to take care of thisheart of this person and die
immediately.
We got to take care of thisbrain of this person going to
(28:33):
die immediately, but so I'mgoing to if I only have $10,000
to give.
Are you going to give tosomeone who has a heart
condition?
Are you going to give tosomeone who has a knee condition
?
Speaker 1 (28:43):
Out of curiosity, because while Trump and his
minions are making it seem likeDEI is a bad word, you know,
what we do know in this countryis that health equity.
There are gaps in health carefor different groups of people
in this country today, and oneof the things that I believe and
(29:05):
I could be biased is that someof the research can serve as a
measure to close those gaps.
The notion thatAfrican-Americans have a higher
degree of pain just drives meinsane, because pain is pain, no
matter what your melanincontent is.
So to hear that $1.8 billionhas been cut, 700 grants have
been cut, anything related toDEI is gone.
(29:27):
Any perspective before we keepgoing on that?
Any data points you have thatyou want to enlighten on that?
Or am I just wrong?
Speaker 2 (29:36):
I don't think it's a matter of wrong or right and no,
I can just get into data basedupon what I read, but today I
don't have any more data pointsto give you.
I will say this, though, that Iknow that because I sit on a
health care council which Iwon't name now.
What I do know is that, whilethe government has said we can't
focus on DEI, healthdisparities is still a priority.
(29:59):
It's massive in certain cases,yes, and the government
recognizes the healthdisparities is a huge issue that
needs to be addressed, andthere are plenty of researchers
who do research on health equity, so those are still getting
funded, and so I encouragepeople that if you're doing
research on health equity,continue to do it.
When you submit your grants,though, don't put black or white
(30:20):
in there, because it won't befunded.
You have to find clever ways towrite your grant on health
equity and stay away from thosetaboo words that will probably
kick your grant back to you withan unsatisfactory result.
Speaker 1 (30:36):
Okay, so let's peel back the onion a little bit more
on health, innovation and faith.
You know, I don't know if faithis a part of what you do on a
daily basis.
You've worked what I would sayat the intersection of science,
advocacy and community health.
How do you ensure that equityis more than just a statement,
but of something that's practice?
Speaker 2 (30:55):
Well, leaders need to be authentic about their desire
for equity within theirorganization.
When I say authentic, theyreally, really, truly need to
know what they are saying whenthey put equity in their mission
statement and if they want tosupport that with diversity and
inclusion, own it, stand by it.
Speaker 1 (31:13):
I would argue that people are running.
Sorry, go ahead, let me notinterrupt you, keep going.
Speaker 2 (31:17):
In spite of what the opposition says, I will say this
Since the new presidentialadministration has been in play,
many for-profit organizationshave dismissed their diversity
equity inclusion programs.
I further read that manyFortune 100 company CEOs got
together and talked about it andin 2024, they noted that was
(31:38):
the first time they feltcomfortable in talking about
their discomfort with thediversity equity inclusion
strategies and felt that theyhad to go along.
Because of the George Floydissue back in 2021, where
everybody then was saying, oh myGod, we have a crisis here,
Like they're just realizing,there's a crisis right when it
comes to race relations in thiscountry.
(31:59):
They've been here for a longtime.
George Floyd just brought it toa new level and because of
passion, people put missions inplace, and I would say you
should never build a missionupon passion, because passion
fades, Okay, the reality of whatyour company is trying to do.
Go back to your missionstatement and let your mission
statement drive what it is youwant to do for diversity, equity
(32:22):
and inclusion, and if there'ssomething in your mission
statement that aligns with DEI,then you should keep it in, no
matter what the opposition is.
Speaker 1 (32:30):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (32:30):
But more than anything else, be authentic and
own it.
Don't put it in.
Speaker 1 (32:58):
If you really don't believe it and you know finally,
I would say I would.
Speaker 2 (33:01):
I would, Because you know what?
There's not an all for anything.
There is a go-along mentalitythat they think that that's what
their stakeholders and theircustomers want, so they're going
to put it in, but it's notreally what they believe.
Those companies who reallybelieve it have sustained it.
I give Harvard University allthe kudos in the world, because
(33:21):
they are standing by a missionthat they believe in and the
world the world should applaudthem for all the heat that they
are taking and I just hope thatthey come out on the favorable
side of this so that otherorganizations can follow and not
go along because they thinkthat that is the path they
should take for the moment andnot for the path that they think
(33:43):
is right for, just for the goodof the organization and the
stakeholders and the customersthey serve.
Speaker 1 (33:49):
Are there organizations, in your opinion,
that are doing it right besidesHarvard?
You want to name them.
Speaker 2 (33:54):
There are.
Well, I would say-.
Speaker 1 (33:56):
In the nonprofit era.
Speaker 2 (33:57):
I would say up until I left the organization, I would
say ORS did.
The board made a decision tocontinue on.
I don't know how they're doingtoday.
I've been gone for just abouttwo months, maybe less.
I would say that theNeurocritical Care Society,
where I came from.
They still have their diversitystatement up, I would say
(34:18):
organizations like for-profits,like Costco.
They are holding to their task.
But to go back to nonprofits,many of them, though, and
they're in a tight spot now.
Speaker 1 (34:30):
They're in a tight spot Because, let's face it, you
know it's not like you got aproduct that you can sell and
it's open in the marketplace.
You know nonprofits have tofundraise and the federal
government has a big, big budgetunless you're, unless you have
a tap in with Bill Gates or someother philanthropic
organization.
And so you know I say this formy listeners you know nonprofits
(34:53):
are mission driven and you knowright now they are under
pressure because the ground isshifting and you know they have
to do something that for profitorganizations don't have to do,
and that's to raise moneybecause they don't sell their.
I mean, are there not forprofits to sell a product?
Speaker 2 (35:13):
Yeah, you sell, you sell education.
Speaker 1 (35:15):
I see what you're saying.
I see what you're saying.
Yeah no-transcript.
Speaker 2 (35:33):
And then other programs and services face.
If you are a 501c3 and youdon't adhere to the DEI
guidelines and compliances,there is a threat to take your
501c3 status and that willaffect your fundraising.
Because, most donors donate to501c3s because of the tax break
they get, so take that away.
Speaker 1 (35:53):
That's the pressure.
Speaker 2 (35:57):
And then I go back to .
They could truly be passionateabout DEI, but it's the DEI
passion and it's the bottom lineand ultimately, if you want
your organization to stay open,you have to do what you can to
make sure that that happens.
And that may mean going back onsome of your core values of
your organization in order forthat to happen.
(36:19):
And hopefully, if you do that,it's on a short term and you can
go back to it under newleadership.
Speaker 1 (36:31):
Yeah, and I, you know we're, you know we're, we're.
This is January, this is June,we're six months into a shift
now, coming from from the WhiteHouse.
And so I you know this is myown personal perspective I think
it's early in the game, butit's going to have a profound
effect.
It's unfortunate that.
You know, diversity, equity andinclusion is made to be a bad
word.
You know, you got a handicap.
That's diversity.
You have a religious background.
(36:53):
That's, that's a diversity.
You can't see, you're blind.
That's diversity.
To include those people, equitymeaning that they're included
in this.
I mean, it's just a sad day,but let's shift, let's shift,
let's shift and talk about it.
You know nonprofits andinnovation.
You know, do nonprofits usecreativity and entrepreneurial
thinking to help keep themselvesgoing?
(37:14):
Do you have a perspective onthat?
Speaker 2 (37:17):
So what are your thoughts on that.
You have to be innovative, ofcourse, of course, of course.
Innovation is one of the coreprinciples of organizations to
stay solvent.
You got to really know what'sgoing on in your industry to
understand where innovationhappens.
You got to have people on theteam to understand where
innovation happens.
(37:37):
Innovation is a key tosustainability in challenging
times where you have to adjust,and I would say one of those
ways to be innovative is to useAI.
Speaker 1 (37:47):
And guess what?
Speaker 2 (37:47):
folks.
There's more to AI than chat.
Gpt.
There's so many.
I know you do, keith.
There's so many, though, waysto use so many AI options that
you could use to make your lifeeasier at your organization,
where you're working smarter andnot harder and still maintain
your intellectual property, so Iwould encourage you to look
(38:09):
into that and get an AI experton your team.
If you're talking in any wayinnovation, talking product
development, program developmentyou got to have that AI piece
to help it work for you,particularly if you are a
smaller organization and don'thave the resources of a big
organization.
Let technology work for you,and that's where AI comes into
(38:30):
effect.
Speaker 1 (38:31):
Okay, okay.
And you know, I guess here'swhere I would say my own
personal bias.
You know, can a board impactcreativity and entrepreneurial
endeavors at a non-for-profit?
Speaker 2 (38:43):
Oh, absolutely your board has.
Speaker 1 (38:45):
I mean, the reason I say that is that those
non-for-profits that aremasterful at getting the right
board members because noteverybody deserves to be on a
non-for-profit board becausethey can make or break the
strategic direction of anorganization and I say this
provocatively, so I open it upto you to push back, to shape my
(39:06):
thoughts, because I'm talkingabout from the board down to the
coordinator, around creativityand innovation, because you just
said something interesting.
I think a lot of nonprofits.
Their only mechanism of raisingmoney is fundraising.
You just mentioned somethinginteresting Education.
Let me sell education.
(39:27):
I was under the impression thatnonprofits didn't have a
product to sell on themarketplace.
You just corrected me thatthey're selling education and I
would assume that maybe they'reselling memberships too, and
that's why I start talking about, about innovation here.
You know what are your thoughtson the staff board, the
(39:48):
employees, the CEO, theexecutive director, and
creativity and productinnovation in terms of
sustaining themselves, goingforward under this new paradigm
of Trumpianism.
Speaker 2 (40:01):
Okay, well, let's talk about it in the way of
dollars and cents.
Let's say you have a pie, right, and in that pie you have the
revenue streams of a nonprofitorganization.
Mostly, if you look at many ofthe organizations that pie, half
of that pie is an annualmeeting or conference and every
year most societies have anannual meeting where they're
(40:21):
bringing in their members.
They have education in person.
It's education and networkingand an exhibition hall.
Those are the three primarythings and research that goes on
at an annual meeting.
But let's say we remember thepandemic of a few years ago,
right, people couldn't meet inperson.
So if half of your revenuecomes in from an annual meeting
and you couldn't meet and havethat meeting, what do you think
(40:43):
happens to your bottom line?
I see, okay, now let's takethat pie and let's only make
that a quarter of the pie yourannual meeting, a quarter
membership dues, a quartereducation and a quarter programs
and services and other.
So you've got only 25% of therevenue gone in challenging
times.
But 75% of your revenue israised from these other revenue
(41:04):
streams that include fundraising.
But it isn't just onlyfundraising, it's all these
other areas that helps theorganization to stay solvent In
this time where budget cuts, Iwould ask them to go to the
membership and say what is doyou want from this organization?
What other value can you getfrom this organization that we
(41:26):
are currently providing, that weneed to enhance, or that we
don't have at all, that we needto add?
That's how you make yourorganization stay solvent and
grow, and most organizationshave what we call reserves,
which is money in an investmentaccount that they can pull into
the organization to use to helpthe organization to grow.
So if you don't have any moneyin your checking account, you
(41:49):
can pull from your reserves toreinvest back into the
membership.
For some of these revenuestreams that I'm talking about.
Separate from that, though, youdo need the fundraising arm.
That would do some fundraising,not just say, hey, give me some
dollars, maybe do some golfoutings, some galas, silent
auctions All those things bringin a lot of money, but you got
to have the expertise, and youmight even want to consider some
(42:11):
endowments or a foundation,because they also help.
Speaker 1 (42:14):
You know, spoken like a true CEO.
You know you put in perspective, kind of at a high level kind
of the levers that every CEOdoes.
You know, because they'relooking at product sales, you
need a sales team, right.
You know you got to do X, y andZ, so I appreciate that
perspective on innovation andthe different buckets that
(42:35):
non-for-profits have to use tostay profitable.
You know, I know we saynon-profits, but you know what's
interesting is non-for-profitshave to use to say profitable.
You know, I know we saynon-profits, but you know what's
interesting is non-for-profitsshould make a profit.
They should be able to.
You know, you know it's hard tobreak even every year.
Yeah, you have a budget, but Ithink every organization wants
to make more than they saythey're going to via their
budget.
That's just, keith Terry.
(42:56):
So let's shift a little bitbecause I appreciate you have a
few more minutes, sure, okay.
So let's shift here and talkabout leadership, the future,
and let's just look into thefuture.
What leadership traits do youbelieve are non-negotiable for
the next generation of employees, and particularly women and
(43:17):
particularly people of color,stepping into this sector that
you have been working in foryears?
Speaker 2 (43:24):
So let me just say this with respect to women and
people of color I carry both.
Yes, you do.
I'm wrapped in melanin.
That can't be changed.
It gets darker in thesummertime, gets lighter in the
wintertime, but it's still mydeep melanin.
That doesn't change my genderand my sex doesn't change.
I am a female, I identify as afemale and then, unfortunately,
(43:45):
as time goes on, throw in thatthird one.
That's age.
Those are the three visiblediverse things that people see
about you when you walk in aroom.
They guessed all three.
The data shows that.
But to your question, none ofthat matters.
It is about the person, it isabout the caliber of the person.
It's how well that person isprepared, how well that person
(44:06):
is trained and how muchexperience that person has.
And I would say the person hasto be transformative.
They have to be nimble and makesome adjustments within their
organization related to theneeds of the members, of
stakeholders and what's provided, some insights from their staff
, and be careful not to backinto the status quo.
We have always done it that way, you know what, but it may not
(44:29):
be useful to you.
Then, secondly, be a servant'sleader.
Be willing to change, bewilling to bring in your staff
and listen to some of theirideas and help them help you
with decision making.
You don't have to carry theload yourself.
Have some of the staff help youwith that.
Listen to your partners,collaborate with your partners
(44:51):
on things that they can bring tothe table that your
organization don't, and then youcan have that co-branded
product that really works reallywell.
My husband loves the Snicker Barice cream cones.
That is a co-branded productbetween the Snicker Bar company
and ice cream.
Pull that together and you gotyou a nice little dessert, right
.
That's cold and refreshing,right.
So that's what I'm talkingabout here.
(45:13):
It sounds very simple, but youknow what.
At the end of the day, it isbecause we know how to do this.
Also, don't forget yourstakeholders, like your
investors, those who give youfunding, those who sponsor your
events, those advertisers andyour board of directors are all
(45:34):
key to doing this and be willingto listen and comprehend,
research, act and accomplish.
If you do all of those, youwill be successful.
And I'll say finally, beinclusive, not tolerant.
Let me repeat that Be inclusive,not tolerant.
Not tolerant.
Okay, be equitable, notsatisficing Meaning you're just
doing it to get by, just to makesure you fly under the radar
screen, but you don't mean it.
And then, finally, be authentic, not yielding.
(45:56):
And when I say that, don't justsay what somebody wants you to
hear, or don't just say whatsomebody wants you to do,
especially if it's counter toyour mission.
Speaker 1 (46:05):
Be authentic and do what you need to do for the
benefit of your organization andthe people who work, okay, okay
, well, you know, if you couldhere's my last question If you
could leave one message to mylisteners about what it truly
means to lead with purpose in adivided world today, what would
you say to them Be?
Speaker 2 (46:24):
true to yourself, Know what you have to bring to
the table.
You need to show up, show outand showcase you, and then I
will end with this For me, asfar as my brand is concerned,
it's about what people say aboutyou, what people think.
I'll say it again what peoplethink about you when you enter
the room and what people sayabout you, what people think.
I'll say it again what peoplethink about you when you enter
the room and what they say aboutyou when you exit.
(46:44):
And if both of those arefavorable, then your brand is
intact.
Speaker 1 (46:49):
Ooh, we could have another show on that one here,
because you know at the end ofthe day.
Well, let me just stop there.
Let me give you the last word.
Yes, and I just want to thankyou, Sharon, for being on the
show.
Any closing remarks you want tomake before I take us to the
close?
This is your time.
Speaker 2 (47:06):
Sure, keith, I just want to say thank you for the
opportunity to talk about thistopic that is passionate to my
heart and I just want to say outthere for my healthcare
colleagues be strong, stand onyour mission as long as you can.
I know that there are a lot ofdistractors coming at you, but
as long as you're doing theright thing for yourself, your
organization and for the peoplewho work for it, I think you can
(47:26):
sleep well at night.
So cheers to sleeping at night.
Speaker 1 (47:29):
Okay, you didn't plug your book.
You have two books, right?
Can you just quickly tell methe?
Speaker 2 (47:35):
names of your books.
Sure, it's poetry.
I started off writing poetry asa kid, as a youngest child.
You know you can't always saywhat you want to say to your
siblings because they'll beatyou up because you're the
youngest.
So I wrote things down on paperand I put it into a rhythmic
form and that's how poetry wasformed for me.
So I have two books one calledPleasure Poetry that was my
(47:56):
first, and the second is Poetry.
That was my first, and thesecond is Poetry and Prose, and
you can get access to them.
Both of them are on Amazon oryou can go to my website, which
is wwwcoffeesmithcom.
That's C-A-U-F-E-Y-Smithcom.
Speaker 1 (48:13):
Thank you Well, sharon.
Thank you for being a part ofthe next big thing.
Your journey and blueprint forservant leadership, strategic
excellence and staying true toyour mission, no matter what
your obstacles, was profoundlyheard today, and I want to thank
you.
Thanks for listening to theNext Big Thing.
I'm your host, keith D Terry.
If you've enjoyed this episodeand you'd like to support this
(48:34):
podcast, please share it withothers, post about it on social
media or leave a rating and areview.
Please share it with others,post about it on social media or
leave a rating and a review Tocatch all the latest from me.
You can follow me on my YouTubechannel at Keith D Terry.
If you want to recommend aguest, please email me at info
at terryperformancegroupcom.
This has been produced by yourhost and Jade Productions.
Welcome to the podcast.
The Next Big Thing.
I'm your host, keith D Terry, aconsultant, a coach and a
serial entrepreneur.
The mission here is to teach,inspire and to motivate.
Today's episode is particularlyimportant because we're diving
into the world of non-profithealthcare organizations and
leadership, a space wheremission is everything, the
(00:23):
stakes are high and, of course,the resources are often limited.
But first let's talk aboutcontext, because I believe that
context is really important.
Right now, nonprofit healthcareorganizations across the
country are undergoing pressure.
Federal funding cuts, stricterrequirements for public programs
like Medicaid and SNAP areincreasing and the increasing
(00:48):
political shifts are placing aheavier burden on these
organizations that already servethe most vulnerable in the
community.
And yet our leaders from thisside of the pond rise.
They're doing remarkable things.
But, like I always do with allmy podcasts, I like to give a
historical context of nonprofitand health care in America.
(01:10):
From the 1960s through the1800s, cheap missions, charity
missions like churches andreligious organizations, served
as the backbone of health carein this country.
A lot of people forget that,that it was led by the clergy
(01:31):
and moral leaders who had acalling to serve those in the
community.
Now we shift from the 1890s tothe 1920s, reformers like Jane
Addams personalized orprofessionalized rather, public
health works.
They needed to galvanize civicsupport, to secure funding from
wealthy philanthropists to servethe urban poor.
Then we shift from the 1930s tothe 50s.
Government funding expanded andnonprofits grew through
(01:55):
structured partnerships,navigating government grants,
infrastructure programs.
Skills like publicadministration became essential.
And guess what else?
Fundraising requirements likegrant writing had to align
mission to what the federalpriorities were, programs like
the Hill-Burton Act.
Now we move on to the 60s and90s, I mean, and 80s.
(02:16):
Medicare and Medicaid enteredthe scene.
Nonprofits became engines forcivil rights, health equity and
systematic change Advocates forunderserved populations.
Leaders needed policy knowledge,public speaking skills to
influence change and this is whyI say leaders rise in the
(02:37):
nonprofit healthcareorganization.
They had to have anotherspecialized skill, and that was
fundraising, but it became moreformalized.
Have another specialized skill,and that was fundraising, but
it became more formalized.
They had to require them tobuild foundation partnerships
and engage in political advocacyfunding.
Now we shift from that period,from the 90s to 2000.
We're coming a little closer totoday.
Business acumen entered thenonprofit healthcare arena where
(03:00):
they had to balance mission andmargins became essential.
Nonprofit leaders adoptedstrategic planning, financial
management to compete in amarket-driven environment.
Fundraising became even morespecialized.
It was institutionalized, whereyou had major donor campaigns,
grant acquisition, board-drivencapital campaigns became the
(03:21):
norm.
But let's be clear.
Fundraising isn't just aboutsecuring dollars.
It's a high-level leadershipskill.
The best nonprofit leadersaren't just good at asking.
They're masters at aligningmission with money, building
trust and inspiring people toinvest in their vision and quite
a specialized skill.
(03:41):
The last era, from 2010 to now,during the COVID-19 mental
health crisis, nude racialinjustice movements, have shaped
what we are doing right now.
Today's leaders must beresilient crisis managers,
inclusive change makers, fluentin tech and data.
As you can see, the skill setof a nonprofit organization
(04:03):
leader is quite vast.
Fundraising became anomnichannel.
You know what I mean byomnichannel.
They had to master digitalplatform, corporate partnerships
, social media appeals and DEIline funding strategies, and I
would say DEI is still not a badterm.
A good term because it's notjust about race, it's about the
inclusion of so many differentgroups of people.
(04:25):
So how do you lead through allof this purpose?
Well, today's guest and this iswhere I get it becomes fun and I
shut up.
We get to listen to my.
It's my guest today.
My guest today is Sharon SmithTerry.
Let me introduce you to SharonSmith Terry.
Sharon is the former chiefexecutive officer of the
Orthopedic Research Society anda trusted advisor to national
(04:48):
health initiatives.
She brings over 30 years ofleadership experience across
healthcare, nonprofit, nonprofitstrategy, global operations,
marketing and public healthadvocacy.
Her career includes major rolesat Baxter International, the
American Hospital Association,the Neurocritical Care Society,
where she's led during theheight of the pandemic.
(05:12):
She's a Jackson State grad, anaward-winning MBA from Roosevelt
University and the author oftwo poetry books that speak to
the heart and soul of purpose.
Sharon, welcome to the show.
Welcome to the Next Big Thing.
How are you?
Speaker 2 (05:27):
Thank you, keith, I'm fine.
What a fantastic introductionon healthcare.
Thank you for that intro.
It helps set the stage for me,so I appreciate that.
Speaker 1 (05:36):
Okay, Well, thank you .
That's what we try to do here.
On the Next Big Thing Okay.
So with that, Sharon, let'sbegin you.
So with that, Sharon, let'sbegin you.
Know a lot of people don't knowyour journey.
Let's start there.
Who is Sharon Smith, Terry, andwhat shaped you as a leader
today?
Speaker 2 (05:51):
Well, first I was born Sharon C Smith To Allison
Minnie Smith.
I am the youngest of fivechildren.
So in growing up in a home withthe youngest of five children,
you learn from them and I thinkthat started to set my journey,
(06:11):
for who I am.
You know, sports was myfoundation, college was my
salvation and healthcare is myinspiration.
So, to sum it up, that's reallywho I am, but it's important to
know that you know it's allabout being authentic throughout
your journey Understand what itis you want to be, what you
want to become and how you wantto make an impact on society.
And so, just coming out of Zioninto college, that was my first
(06:32):
step in learning who the worldis and my place in it.
Speaker 1 (06:36):
Okay, and so was there some big event that led
you to the nonprofit side.
Because of what I know of you,you've always been
mission-driven, or is that nottrue?
Speaker 2 (06:45):
I've always been mission driven, even from the
point where I had the quickesthands in the county playing
basketball.
I was captain of my basketballteam as a senior.
We didn't win.
Speaker 1 (06:54):
Did you say the quickest hands?
Speaker 2 (06:56):
Quickest hands in the county that's what they named
me I'd steal a ball and crossover and go down the court and
lay it up on you.
That's a transferable skill tomy work, because it's all about
understanding what the goal is,understanding how to achieve it
and then achieving it.
But to my journey to healthcare.
Let me answer that for you.
So after graduating fromcollege, you know my goal was to
(07:19):
work in a juvenile field andyou know Father Flanagan said a
long time ago, there's no suchthing as a bad boy, and I wanted
to prove him right bycounseling them.
Couldn't find a job, so endedup at Baxter Healthcare.
Where was my introduction tothe healthcare field?
On a for-profit side, I learnedall there is to know about renal
disease and that nasty kidneythat's such a nasty disease
(07:42):
Patients, having patients gothrough that and looking for a
kidney transplant.
Until then, doing thoseexchanges, either in center or
in their homes, was really mywhole passion for healthcare.
Because in talking to patientsand understanding what their
journey was, either in home orin center, to make sure that
(08:02):
they can clean out all thosetoxins, through exchanges that
interrupted their lives eitherthree times a week or three
times a day, depending on thetype of dialysis they did.
So that was my passion.
To say gee, I want to makethese patients better.
At what all costs?
What can I do to help?
And so, after a few more jobs Ihad growing in my profession, I
(08:23):
ended up at the AmericanHospital Association.
That was my introduction tohealth care association in 2007.
Speaker 1 (08:33):
OK, and I would say, you know, the American Hospital
Association is pretty big, it'sthe premier non-for-profit.
And so as we talk about, youknow, a purpose driven
leadership, was there some somespecial moment that or a mission
critical moment that thatpulled you into a purpose driven
leadership that you now possess?
Speaker 2 (08:56):
Yes, you know it was all about.
It was all about the patients.
I will admit I was told incollege that was an idealist,
and I guess I still am, becauseI think there could be a cure
for every disease if they hadthe research funding to explore
it and find cures.
I don't like to see people sick, and when they're sick
unnecessarily, that reallybothers me, and so my passion is
around what can be done to makepeople well, and in making
(09:20):
people well, give everyone who'ssick an equal opportunity to
participate in clinical trialsto receive the medications that
they need, no matter what theirbackground, and so there's a
healthcare equity piece to thistoo.
That's really a driving forcefor me, as I saw when I talked
to some of the patients and atBaxter and who gets dialysis
(09:41):
care and who doesn't, as onequick example, keith, is, if a
nephrologist has a patient.
Speaker 1 (09:47):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (09:48):
And the patient know that they have kidney failure
and they need to go on dialysis.
The nephrologist has a choice Ican put them on home dialysis or
I can put them on dialysiswhere they go into a center.
There are some technologies now.
I understand that in-centerdialysis you can also do at home
now, but the data has shownpreviously that for
(10:09):
African-American patients,hispanic patients, folks from
lower income communities, werealways given in-center
treatments where they had toleave their home, find
transportation and go into acenter, sit in that center three
to four hours and have theirexchanges, versus the care of
home dialysis where you're athome, where it's a different
(10:32):
treatment, where you haveexchanges.
You can do exchanges threetimes a day, depending on your
body weight and size andcondition of your kidney, really
, or you can sleep whiledialysis is going on and be
hooked up to a machine.
Those are lifestyle issues,those are quality of care issues
that need to be addressed Okay,and that's why I'm so
(10:52):
passionate about health care andnot only making all patients
well, but making sure that theirlifestyle is best quality as
possible, as they're makingthemselves well.
Speaker 1 (11:03):
Okay, I appreciate that and I want to stay a little
bit on you before we startgetting into non-for-profits and
navigating, and let's stay onyour journey.
You've worked for healthcarefor-profit organizations and
healthcare non-for-profitorganizations.
Thinking of those two bigbuckets and your own personal
journey, you know, did one sideinfluence you more than the
(11:27):
other?
Did you learn somethingdifferent on one side or the
other?
Because what I'm getting at iswhat influenced your leadership
style.
Speaker 2 (11:34):
What influenced my leadership style was the
organization itself and whomakes up the organization people
.
They are a company's greatestasset, whether it's for profit
or non-for-profit.
So I've worked in anorganization where people were
not as valued as they could havebeen and I said to myself if I
get that wall office, if I getthat decision-making role, I'm
(11:55):
going to do some thingsdifferently, and that is making
people your number one priority,making them feel good about
coming to work, giving themtools and resources they need to
do their job.
You know and that's either onthe for-profit or not-for-profit
side but what I have found isthe difference If you have a
talented team, if you have aculture that allows people to
come to work and be themselves.
(12:15):
Yes, the major difference is infor-profit organizations you've
got to get five and six andseven level pools.
You've got to go to the manager, the director, the VP, and then
the VPs have to discuss it.
Then it goes back to thedirector.
They have to discuss it.
See what's in the budget.
By the time it comes back, it'slike could be six months later
and you're like what was thatidea I forgot?
(12:36):
Let me go back to my notes.
Versus, on the nonprofit side.
It goes up through your manager, maybe the executive director,
ceo.
They take a look at it, makesure it aligns with the mission,
make sure it's what the memberswant, and you're executing in
about two to three months.
So it's a matter of seeing anidea, a business need that
satisfies that beneficiarywhether it's a member, whether
(12:57):
it's a patient, whether it's acustomer how quickly you can get
that out to market to meet theneed.
Speaker 1 (13:02):
Okay, Okay, so now let's peel back the onion a
little bit more onnon-for-profits.
What are some of the biggestmisconceptions people have about
leading non-profitorganizations, particularly
healthcare non-profits?
Speaker 2 (13:14):
I like this question because I've been in non-profits
for a while now and this comesup a lot.
Number one is that non-profitsaren't a business.
The non-for-profits are whatNon-profits are, not a business.
Okay, they are a business.
They have annual budgets thatthey need to adhere to and one
of the key drivers of success ismeeting your bottom line.
Now you may call it somethingdifferent.
(13:36):
On the for-profit side, youcall it profit.
On a non-profit side, you callit a net gain, because that net
gain needs to be reinvested backinto your members in the way of
education and those kinds ofthings.
That's the only difference, butit is a business.
The second thing is, from acompensation standpoint, that
nonprofit professionals are notpaid competitively.
(13:56):
That's not true, because mostnonprofits do a market study at
the end of each year to see whatthe salary ranges are for a
particular field, whetherfor-profit or non-for-profit.
It just relates to zip code.
That's the only difference.
Then the third is that theworkforce isn't as talented and
they have lighter workloads.
(14:16):
I can assure you, if you workedfor a non-profit, you will be
like I wonder if it's less busyon a for-profit side, because
I'm working 60 hours a week andit's not because you have to,
it's because you want to,because many people who work for
nonprofits this is another one,and this one isn't a proven one
, because you're going to ask me, sharon, where's the data on
that?
I don't have the data on thisone, but I can tell you that
(14:39):
people in the nonprofit side aretruly passionate about their
job.
I believe that it is that enduser, that beneficiary that's
going to benefit from what youoffer that improves their life
in some way.
And then a final one that Iwould focus on as far as what
are some of the misconceptions,is nonprofits don't have the
same need for investments asother businesses.
(15:00):
So, yeah, we do need the samelevel of investment in
infrastructure, in technology,in people, in innovation,
because all these things areneeded to meet our mission and
vision.
You know so.
Please, I just implore you guysto rethink about nonprofits,
because it is a business.
We do need the infrastructurebecause the investment in
(15:22):
nonprofits serve that end user,serve that patient, and every
one of us has been a patient orwill be a patient at least once
in our lifetime.
Speaker 1 (15:30):
Well, let me ask you this Don't you think that?
You know, I do believe it's amisconception.
I just think the misconceptionis diminishing.
Now, that's just my perspective.
Now you could, I could be wrong.
Feel free to push back andshape it, because you're the
guest, you're the expert.
I do believe that.
I do believe people areincredibly passionate to work
for non-for-profits because it'smission focused.
(15:51):
This organization is theAmerican Hospital Association,
serves the issues of thehospital, the heart association,
lung cancer you just left theOrthopedic Research Society.
That said, I think I want topeel back the onion a little bit
on boards because, havingserved on non-for-profit boards,
some at a high level what Imean by high level?
(16:14):
Some very big, like PlannedParenthood to you know, the
Evanston Community Foundationboard, they are non-paid boards.
Is there a difference?
Do you have a perspective onnon-for-profit boards?
Speaker 2 (16:29):
I do.
My perspective is going in as aCEO or executive director and
let me just say for nonprofits,when you talk about the
difference, a CEO and executivedirector are pretty much the
same.
You serve yes, they are At thetop of that society.
You represent the society froman operational standpoint.
It's just a matter of whetheryour organization wants to call
(16:51):
you a CEO or wants to call youan executive director.
The nomenclature for mostnonprofits is executive director
.
But they serve the function asa CEO and their job is to
ultimately run that organization.
When things are great, pat thatCEO on the back.
When things are not so great,well then, you have to answer to
the board, stakeholders,members and everyone else.
(17:12):
But I would say, from a boardstandpoint, you got to have a
functional board and afunctional board doesn't mean
that your board meets quarterly,weekly, monthly, whatever.
It means understanding whatyour strategic responsibilities
are from that board standpoint,your fiduciary responsibility,
not getting into the weeds ofwhat that CEO or executive
(17:34):
director does, but from astrategic level, how are we
going to plan these things out?
Are we going to focus on DEI asan example?
Are we going to offercertification programs for the
value of our members?
Are we going to do some ofthese other things?
Are we going to partner withother organizations?
Those are the strategic thingsthat board thinks about and
(17:56):
needs to stay focused on.
So, as a leader of theorganization, on the operations
side, that CEO or executivedirector needs to make sure that
their boards aremission-focused,
strategic-driven andgoal-oriented at the strategic
level.
If you do that, then you have asuccessful functioning.
Speaker 1 (18:16):
Okay.
Well, this next question Ireally want to ask can you take
us into a moment when you faced,you were at a leadership
crossroads, when your valueswere tested, but you had to make
a hard call anyway?
Speaker 2 (18:29):
Yes, you know, and let me use the value of
accountability.
Speaker 1 (18:34):
As a leader.
Speaker 2 (18:34):
You are accountable to the organization, you are
accountable to your staff, youare accountable to the
memberships, you are accountableto everything within that
organization.
So let me just answer thequestion by telling you just a
quick story.
Okay, I had a friend who wasqualified for an open position.
I needed trusted people on myleadership team, so I hired her.
Speaker 1 (18:57):
You hired your friend .
Speaker 2 (18:58):
I hired my friend, okay, and after a while I found
out the friend wasunderperforming Because she was
a friend.
I gave her more leg room toimprove.
She did not.
So at some point.
But at the point where I gaveher more leg room to improve, I
was compromising the companyvalue of accountability.
I'm accountable to have themost talented people on my team
(19:21):
to deliver on our goals andobjectives.
So that lingered on for aboutsix months.
And trying to make her better,and you are as a leader.
If folks are struggling, yougot to try to help them along
the way.
But at some point you recognizethat you got to move that
person off to off the bus oronto a different seat on the
same bus.
I knew I needed to move thisperson off the bus, so I
(19:42):
captivized the values for aminute until I realized I
couldn't do it anymore.
So at the end of the day, theperson was separated from the
organization.
Here's a lesson learned.
Number one and it's what myboss told me when I first
started is Sharon, when you havea problem with an employee,
that's okay.
It's what you do with it thatmatters.
And what becomes your problemor stays that employee's problem
(20:04):
.
It started to become my problemand it started becoming the
organization's problem.
My lesson learned was I'drather have a good friend than
say that last part again so.
I'd rather have a good friendthan an employee.
Ok, because there's so muchtalent that you don't have to
put your friend in a role andsacrifice the friendship if it
(20:24):
doesn't work that you don't haveto put your friend in a role
and sacrifice the friendship ifit doesn't work.
Speaker 1 (20:31):
Gotcha, Gotcha.
Some people would say neverhire friends.
But I don't believe that'snecessarily true.
Everybody has to stayaccountable.
But thank you for that story.
Was it a tough learn for you?
A tough?
Speaker 2 (20:37):
learn.
I'm just going to say it wasmore emotional than tough.
Speaker 1 (20:42):
Okay, okay.
Speaker 2 (20:44):
You know I've had to let people go before.
The emotional part was that Ihad a personal connection to her
and I know leaders hirecolleagues, people that they
know all the time and let's notsit.
I just want your listeners toknow that this isn't this
emotional female leader who'sinto her feelings.
This is not what this is is.
(21:09):
This is about recognizing theneed for the organization and
making sure the person whowasn't was not performing well
enough would be okay, because noone wants to take food off a
people's table, but when you'rein this role, your first
objective, your first allegianceis to the organization, and
that's what I realized in that.
Speaker 1 (21:23):
Okay, so let's you know, let's anything else you
want to say about that story orabout employees, Because I want
to navigate into today'slandscape.
Speaker 2 (21:31):
No, go ahead.
Speaker 1 (21:32):
Well, you know, you see what's happening publicly.
You know, with the recentshifts in public policy funding.
You know new challenges, shiftsall across the board funding,
funding, funding policy changes,policy changes.
Is it political, Is it not?
But here is the issue.
People are still homeless,People still get cancer, People
still have diabetes, Peoplestill can't pay their bills.
(21:53):
There's so many things thatpeople are faced with.
I don't see cancer rates goingdown, diabetes rates going down,
obesity rates going down.
And so, with the recent shiftsin public policy funding and new
challenges, you know, nonprofitleaders.
How are nonprofit leaders, thesector, dealing with all of this
(22:15):
?
Speaker 2 (22:16):
Yeah, it's tough, it's a challenge and this was
the last thing I faced beforeleaving ORS.
And I recall at our annualmeeting in February, the
decision that came down toreduce indirects down to 15%.
It became pretty solemn at thatmeeting because the indirects
(22:37):
is where is the?
Speaker 1 (22:38):
fund Indirects, explain what that means to the.
Speaker 2 (22:40):
Indirects is your administrative expenses related
to a grant that you receive,that you use that to pay for
researchers, for the work thatthey do in the labs, gotcha.
So you know, and so let me backup and say this and I'll get
back to what that means is.
Let me just give you just acouple of data points.
Keith, you know, as reported bythe Associated Press back in
(23:03):
March, $11 billion of directfederal support was cut and that
eliminated over 20,000 jobs $11billion $11 billion, okay.
Also, according to NBC News,approximately $1.8 billion was
cut from the National Institutesof Health you mentioned before.
Keith, you talked about heartdisease, lung disease, kidney
(23:26):
disease, all these kinds ofthings.
You know that's healthcarefunding, you know.
And at that same time, betweenApril 28th and April 8th, 700
grants were cut across 24 NIHinstitutes.
Okay, so that's huge.
Go back to ORS.
Many of our members within ORSare PhDs.
(23:47):
They work in academicinstitutions.
They do research inmusculoskeletal health and, for
those who don't know whatmusculoskeletal health, that
deals with movement, our joints,our knees, our legs, our arms,
anything that has to do withmovement in the body, and
arthritis.
And arthritis is one of thosemajor things that you get.
If you have any kind ofligament issue, you're probably
(24:09):
going to end up with arthritis.
That's where a lot of theresearch was coming from for ORS
members.
A lot of that funding got cut,so those academic institutions
had to adjust.
If we're not going to get themoney from the federal
government, where are we goingto get it from?
They have to readjust andfigure out new budgets, reshift
some things around to see ifthey can keep these researchers
on board.
(24:30):
If they couldn't, unfortunatelythey had to let them go.
So much of the research wasstifled and in some cases it was
unplugged.
The research had to cease.
So what does that mean?
People lose their jobs.
Academic institutions have tofind other ways to find funding
to support it, and so you have alot of PhDs who don't have jobs
, and then you know so okay, soyeah, what does all that mean?
(24:54):
People lose their jobs.
What does that mean to thepatient?
Speaker 1 (24:57):
Yeah, because I was going to ask being balanced.
Here is some of.
I agree with you 1.8 billion isa lot, 700 grants is a lot, but
do you think there's any fat inthere at all?
Do you think all of those, isthat money well spent?
Speaker 2 (25:13):
before you get to your next point, I can't say
because I don't have the data tosupport it.
Who am I to say that somebody'sresearch is fat, when they have
taken the time to identify ahypothesis based upon a certain
issue and they started toconduct the research?
Because, ultimately, it's aboutsaving costs, improving quality
of care, improving whatsurgeons do in the operating
(25:37):
room based upon research, theclinical research that they've
gained.
So if you take this researchaway, then how do you know what
the side effects are oftransplant surgery?
We know someone who just had ahip surgery.
I know someone who had kneesurgery.
I had meniscus surgery.
What's the data on what type ofcare to give?
(25:57):
Can I use a scope to go in ordo I need to cut it open if I'm
doing a meniscus treatment?
What about Achilles?
We have athletes now.
I mean, we're heavy intobasketball season.
What if Angel Reese and what if?
What if Angel Reese and CaitlinClark, both God forbid, God
(26:19):
forbid, shredded their Achilles.
They're around the same age,same athletic fitness.
Who could heal the quickest?
Is there a difference inhealing by race?
So what if you had two maleathletes from the Pistons or
from OKC who tore their Achilles?
Is there a time difference inhealing in men or women?
That's the kind of researchthat's being done.
(26:40):
I see or let's take it a stepfurther.
If I'm a person who just sitsaround on my couch and never
exercises, but I have diabetes,what is that going to do to me?
I'm not getting any exercise,I'm becoming sedentary.
That could lead to all othertypes of diseases heart disease,
kidney disease and those kindsof things.
So that's where that researchbut I'm sorry, keith, you got me
(27:02):
on a roll here for- a second.
So that's all about the researchfunding, and it's even been a
challenge even before the budgetcuts Research based upon life
threatening illnesses versusresearch based upon lifestyle
illnesses.
Speaker 1 (27:19):
Aren't both important .
Speaker 2 (27:21):
Well, a lot of the research has gone towards life
threatening illnesses like heartdisease, cancer and those kinds
of things, but lifestyle issues, which sometimes people see as
is you can live if you've got abroken leg, you can live if
you've got arthritis and thosekinds of things, but they lead
(27:41):
to other life-threateningillnesses if they don't get
those taken care of in theproper way.
Which research helps to findthe best technique, the best
medicines, the best cures?
Speaker 1 (27:53):
That's helpful.
I never thought that's helpfulbecause I didn't know.
Research was gated that way interms of lifestyle versus life
crisis moments.
And you're right, one of thehardest things for people to
change is lifestyle, you know,so I appreciate the perspective,
you know.
Speaker 2 (28:13):
If I could just make this one point though Okay,
research isn't separated bylifestyle or life threatening.
It's the person who's givingthe research funding.
The priority goes to those whatthey perceive to be just
automatic life threateningsituations.
We got to take care of thisheart of this person and die
immediately.
We got to take care of thisbrain of this person going to
(28:33):
die immediately, but so I'mgoing to if I only have $10,000
to give.
Are you going to give tosomeone who has a heart
condition?
Are you going to give tosomeone who has a knee condition
?
Speaker 1 (28:43):
Out of curiosity, because while Trump and his
minions are making it seem likeDEI is a bad word, you know,
what we do know in this countryis that health equity.
There are gaps in health carefor different groups of people
in this country today, and oneof the things that I believe and
(29:05):
I could be biased is that someof the research can serve as a
measure to close those gaps.
The notion thatAfrican-Americans have a higher
degree of pain just drives meinsane, because pain is pain, no
matter what your melanincontent is.
So to hear that $1.8 billionhas been cut, 700 grants have
been cut, anything related toDEI is gone.
(29:27):
Any perspective before we keepgoing on that?
Any data points you have thatyou want to enlighten on that?
Or am I just wrong?
Speaker 2 (29:36):
I don't think it's a matter of wrong or right and no,
I can just get into data basedupon what I read, but today I
don't have any more data pointsto give you.
I will say this, though, that Iknow that because I sit on a
health care council which Iwon't name now.
What I do know is that, whilethe government has said we can't
focus on DEI, healthdisparities is still a priority.
(29:59):
It's massive in certain cases,yes, and the government
recognizes the healthdisparities is a huge issue that
needs to be addressed, andthere are plenty of researchers
who do research on health equity, so those are still getting
funded, and so I encouragepeople that if you're doing
research on health equity,continue to do it.
When you submit your grants,though, don't put black or white
(30:20):
in there, because it won't befunded.
You have to find clever ways towrite your grant on health
equity and stay away from thosetaboo words that will probably
kick your grant back to you withan unsatisfactory result.
Speaker 1 (30:36):
Okay, so let's peel back the onion a little bit more
on health, innovation and faith.
You know, I don't know if faithis a part of what you do on a
daily basis.
You've worked what I would sayat the intersection of science,
advocacy and community health.
How do you ensure that equityis more than just a statement,
but of something that's practice?
Speaker 2 (30:55):
Well, leaders need to be authentic about their desire
for equity within theirorganization.
When I say authentic, theyreally, really, truly need to
know what they are saying whenthey put equity in their mission
statement and if they want tosupport that with diversity and
inclusion, own it, stand by it.
Speaker 1 (31:13):
I would argue that people are running.
Sorry, go ahead, let me notinterrupt you, keep going.
Speaker 2 (31:17):
In spite of what the opposition says, I will say this
Since the new presidentialadministration has been in play,
many for-profit organizationshave dismissed their diversity
equity inclusion programs.
I further read that manyFortune 100 company CEOs got
together and talked about it andin 2024, they noted that was
(31:38):
the first time they feltcomfortable in talking about
their discomfort with thediversity equity inclusion
strategies and felt that theyhad to go along.
Because of the George Floydissue back in 2021, where
everybody then was saying, oh myGod, we have a crisis here,
Like they're just realizing,there's a crisis right when it
comes to race relations in thiscountry.
(31:59):
They've been here for a longtime.
George Floyd just brought it toa new level and because of
passion, people put missions inplace, and I would say you
should never build a missionupon passion, because passion
fades, Okay, the reality of whatyour company is trying to do.
Go back to your missionstatement and let your mission
statement drive what it is youwant to do for diversity, equity
(32:22):
and inclusion, and if there'ssomething in your mission
statement that aligns with DEI,then you should keep it in, no
matter what the opposition is.
Speaker 1 (32:30):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (32:30):
But more than anything else, be authentic and
own it.
Don't put it in.
Speaker 1 (32:58):
If you really don't believe it and you know finally,
I would say I would.
Speaker 2 (33:01):
I would, Because you know what?
There's not an all for anything.
There is a go-along mentalitythat they think that that's what
their stakeholders and theircustomers want, so they're going
to put it in, but it's notreally what they believe.
Those companies who reallybelieve it have sustained it.
I give Harvard University allthe kudos in the world, because
(33:21):
they are standing by a missionthat they believe in and the
world the world should applaudthem for all the heat that they
are taking and I just hope thatthey come out on the favorable
side of this so that otherorganizations can follow and not
go along because they thinkthat that is the path they
should take for the moment andnot for the path that they think
(33:43):
is right for, just for the goodof the organization and the
stakeholders and the customersthey serve.
Speaker 1 (33:49):
Are there organizations, in your opinion,
that are doing it right besidesHarvard?
You want to name them.
Speaker 2 (33:54):
There are.
Well, I would say-.
Speaker 1 (33:56):
In the nonprofit era.
Speaker 2 (33:57):
I would say up until I left the organization, I would
say ORS did.
The board made a decision tocontinue on.
I don't know how they're doingtoday.
I've been gone for just abouttwo months, maybe less.
I would say that theNeurocritical Care Society,
where I came from.
They still have their diversitystatement up, I would say
(34:18):
organizations like for-profits,like Costco.
They are holding to their task.
But to go back to nonprofits,many of them, though, and
they're in a tight spot now.
Speaker 1 (34:30):
They're in a tight spot Because, let's face it, you
know it's not like you got aproduct that you can sell and
it's open in the marketplace.
You know nonprofits have tofundraise and the federal
government has a big, big budgetunless you're, unless you have
a tap in with Bill Gates or someother philanthropic
organization.
And so you know I say this formy listeners you know nonprofits
(34:53):
are mission driven and you knowright now they are under
pressure because the ground isshifting and you know they have
to do something that for profitorganizations don't have to do,
and that's to raise moneybecause they don't sell their.
I mean, are there not forprofits to sell a product?
Speaker 2 (35:13):
Yeah, you sell, you sell education.
Speaker 1 (35:15):
I see what you're saying.
I see what you're saying.
Yeah no-transcript.
Speaker 2 (35:33):
And then other programs and services face.
If you are a 501c3 and youdon't adhere to the DEI
guidelines and compliances,there is a threat to take your
501c3 status and that willaffect your fundraising.
Because, most donors donate to501c3s because of the tax break
they get, so take that away.
Speaker 1 (35:53):
That's the pressure.
Speaker 2 (35:57):
And then I go back to .
They could truly be passionateabout DEI, but it's the DEI
passion and it's the bottom lineand ultimately, if you want
your organization to stay open,you have to do what you can to
make sure that that happens.
And that may mean going back onsome of your core values of
your organization in order forthat to happen.
(36:19):
And hopefully, if you do that,it's on a short term and you can
go back to it under newleadership.
Speaker 1 (36:31):
Yeah, and I, you know we're, you know we're, we're.
This is January, this is June,we're six months into a shift
now, coming from from the WhiteHouse.
And so I you know this is myown personal perspective I think
it's early in the game, butit's going to have a profound
effect.
It's unfortunate that.
You know, diversity, equity andinclusion is made to be a bad
word.
You know, you got a handicap.
That's diversity.
You have a religious background.
(36:53):
That's, that's a diversity.
You can't see, you're blind.
That's diversity.
To include those people, equitymeaning that they're included
in this.
I mean, it's just a sad day,but let's shift, let's shift,
let's shift and talk about it.
You know nonprofits andinnovation.
You know, do nonprofits usecreativity and entrepreneurial
thinking to help keep themselvesgoing?
(37:14):
Do you have a perspective onthat?
Speaker 2 (37:17):
So what are your thoughts on that.
You have to be innovative, ofcourse, of course, of course.
Innovation is one of the coreprinciples of organizations to
stay solvent.
You got to really know what'sgoing on in your industry to
understand where innovationhappens.
You got to have people on theteam to understand where
innovation happens.
(37:37):
Innovation is a key tosustainability in challenging
times where you have to adjust,and I would say one of those
ways to be innovative is to useAI.
Speaker 1 (37:47):
And guess what?
Speaker 2 (37:47):
folks.
There's more to AI than chat.
Gpt.
There's so many.
I know you do, keith.
There's so many, though, waysto use so many AI options that
you could use to make your lifeeasier at your organization,
where you're working smarter andnot harder and still maintain
your intellectual property, so Iwould encourage you to look
(38:09):
into that and get an AI experton your team.
If you're talking in any wayinnovation, talking product
development, program developmentyou got to have that AI piece
to help it work for you,particularly if you are a
smaller organization and don'thave the resources of a big
organization.
Let technology work for you,and that's where AI comes into
(38:30):
effect.
Speaker 1 (38:31):
Okay, okay.
And you know, I guess here'swhere I would say my own
personal bias.
You know, can a board impactcreativity and entrepreneurial
endeavors at a non-for-profit?
Speaker 2 (38:43):
Oh, absolutely your board has.
Speaker 1 (38:45):
I mean, the reason I say that is that those
non-for-profits that aremasterful at getting the right
board members because noteverybody deserves to be on a
non-for-profit board becausethey can make or break the
strategic direction of anorganization and I say this
provocatively, so I open it upto you to push back, to shape my
(39:06):
thoughts, because I'm talkingabout from the board down to the
coordinator, around creativityand innovation, because you just
said something interesting.
I think a lot of nonprofits.
Their only mechanism of raisingmoney is fundraising.
You just mentioned somethinginteresting Education.
Let me sell education.
(39:27):
I was under the impression thatnonprofits didn't have a
product to sell on themarketplace.
You just corrected me thatthey're selling education and I
would assume that maybe they'reselling memberships too, and
that's why I start talking about, about innovation here.
You know what are your thoughtson the staff board, the
(39:48):
employees, the CEO, theexecutive director, and
creativity and productinnovation in terms of
sustaining themselves, goingforward under this new paradigm
of Trumpianism.
Speaker 2 (40:01):
Okay, well, let's talk about it in the way of
dollars and cents.
Let's say you have a pie, right, and in that pie you have the
revenue streams of a nonprofitorganization.
Mostly, if you look at many ofthe organizations that pie, half
of that pie is an annualmeeting or conference and every
year most societies have anannual meeting where they're
(40:21):
bringing in their members.
They have education in person.
It's education and networkingand an exhibition hall.
Those are the three primarythings and research that goes on
at an annual meeting.
But let's say we remember thepandemic of a few years ago,
right, people couldn't meet inperson.
So if half of your revenuecomes in from an annual meeting
and you couldn't meet and havethat meeting, what do you think
(40:43):
happens to your bottom line?
I see, okay, now let's takethat pie and let's only make
that a quarter of the pie yourannual meeting, a quarter
membership dues, a quartereducation and a quarter programs
and services and other.
So you've got only 25% of therevenue gone in challenging
times.
But 75% of your revenue israised from these other revenue
(41:04):
streams that include fundraising.
But it isn't just onlyfundraising, it's all these
other areas that helps theorganization to stay solvent In
this time where budget cuts, Iwould ask them to go to the
membership and say what is doyou want from this organization?
What other value can you getfrom this organization that we
(41:26):
are currently providing, that weneed to enhance, or that we
don't have at all, that we needto add?
That's how you make yourorganization stay solvent and
grow, and most organizationshave what we call reserves,
which is money in an investmentaccount that they can pull into
the organization to use to helpthe organization to grow.
So if you don't have any moneyin your checking account, you
(41:49):
can pull from your reserves toreinvest back into the
membership.
For some of these revenuestreams that I'm talking about.
Separate from that, though, youdo need the fundraising arm.
That would do some fundraising,not just say, hey, give me some
dollars, maybe do some golfoutings, some galas, silent
auctions All those things bringin a lot of money, but you got
to have the expertise, and youmight even want to consider some
(42:11):
endowments or a foundation,because they also help.
Speaker 1 (42:14):
You know, spoken like a true CEO.
You know you put in perspective, kind of at a high level kind
of the levers that every CEOdoes.
You know, because they'relooking at product sales, you
need a sales team, right.
You know you got to do X, y andZ, so I appreciate that
perspective on innovation andthe different buckets that
(42:35):
non-for-profits have to use tostay profitable.
You know, I know we saynon-profits, but you know what's
interesting is non-for-profitshave to use to say profitable.
You know, I know we saynon-profits, but you know what's
interesting is non-for-profitsshould make a profit.
They should be able to.
You know, you know it's hard tobreak even every year.
Yeah, you have a budget, but Ithink every organization wants
to make more than they saythey're going to via their
budget.
That's just, keith Terry.
(42:56):
So let's shift a little bitbecause I appreciate you have a
few more minutes, sure, okay.
So let's shift here and talkabout leadership, the future,
and let's just look into thefuture.
What leadership traits do youbelieve are non-negotiable for
the next generation of employees, and particularly women and
(43:17):
particularly people of color,stepping into this sector that
you have been working in foryears?
Speaker 2 (43:24):
So let me just say this with respect to women and
people of color I carry both.
Yes, you do.
I'm wrapped in melanin.
That can't be changed.
It gets darker in thesummertime, gets lighter in the
wintertime, but it's still mydeep melanin.
That doesn't change my genderand my sex doesn't change.
I am a female, I identify as afemale and then, unfortunately,
(43:45):
as time goes on, throw in thatthird one.
That's age.
Those are the three visiblediverse things that people see
about you when you walk in aroom.
They guessed all three.
The data shows that.
But to your question, none ofthat matters.
It is about the person, it isabout the caliber of the person.
It's how well that person isprepared, how well that person
(44:06):
is trained and how muchexperience that person has.
And I would say the person hasto be transformative.
They have to be nimble and makesome adjustments within their
organization related to theneeds of the members, of
stakeholders and what's provided, some insights from their staff
, and be careful not to backinto the status quo.
We have always done it that way, you know what, but it may not
(44:29):
be useful to you.
Then, secondly, be a servant'sleader.
Be willing to change, bewilling to bring in your staff
and listen to some of theirideas and help them help you
with decision making.
You don't have to carry theload yourself.
Have some of the staff help youwith that.
Listen to your partners,collaborate with your partners
(44:51):
on things that they can bring tothe table that your
organization don't, and then youcan have that co-branded
product that really works reallywell.
My husband loves the Snicker Barice cream cones.
That is a co-branded productbetween the Snicker Bar company
and ice cream.
Pull that together and you gotyou a nice little dessert, right
.
That's cold and refreshing,right.
So that's what I'm talkingabout here.
(45:13):
It sounds very simple, but youknow what.
At the end of the day, it isbecause we know how to do this.
Also, don't forget yourstakeholders, like your
investors, those who give youfunding, those who sponsor your
events, those advertisers andyour board of directors are all
(45:34):
key to doing this and be willingto listen and comprehend,
research, act and accomplish.
If you do all of those, youwill be successful.
And I'll say finally, beinclusive, not tolerant.
Let me repeat that Be inclusive,not tolerant.
Not tolerant.
Okay, be equitable, notsatisficing Meaning you're just
doing it to get by, just to makesure you fly under the radar
screen, but you don't mean it.
And then, finally, be authentic, not yielding.
(45:56):
And when I say that, don't justsay what somebody wants you to
hear, or don't just say whatsomebody wants you to do,
especially if it's counter toyour mission.
Speaker 1 (46:05):
Be authentic and do what you need to do for the
benefit of your organization andthe people who work, okay, okay
, well, you know, if you couldhere's my last question If you
could leave one message to mylisteners about what it truly
means to lead with purpose in adivided world today, what would
you say to them Be?
Speaker 2 (46:24):
true to yourself, Know what you have to bring to
the table.
You need to show up, show outand showcase you, and then I
will end with this For me, asfar as my brand is concerned,
it's about what people say aboutyou, what people think.
I'll say it again what peoplethink about you when you enter
the room and what people sayabout you, what people think.
I'll say it again what peoplethink about you when you enter
the room and what they say aboutyou when you exit.
(46:44):
And if both of those arefavorable, then your brand is
intact.
Speaker 1 (46:49):
Ooh, we could have another show on that one here,
because you know at the end ofthe day.
Well, let me just stop there.
Let me give you the last word.
Yes, and I just want to thankyou, Sharon, for being on the
show.
Any closing remarks you want tomake before I take us to the
close?
This is your time.
Speaker 2 (47:06):
Sure, keith, I just want to say thank you for the
opportunity to talk about thistopic that is passionate to my
heart and I just want to say outthere for my healthcare
colleagues be strong, stand onyour mission as long as you can.
I know that there are a lot ofdistractors coming at you, but
as long as you're doing theright thing for yourself, your
organization and for the peoplewho work for it, I think you can
(47:26):
sleep well at night.
So cheers to sleeping at night.
Speaker 1 (47:29):
Okay, you didn't plug your book.
You have two books, right?
Can you just quickly tell methe?
Speaker 2 (47:35):
names of your books.
Sure, it's poetry.
I started off writing poetry asa kid, as a youngest child.
You know you can't always saywhat you want to say to your
siblings because they'll beatyou up because you're the
youngest.
So I wrote things down on paperand I put it into a rhythmic
form and that's how poetry wasformed for me.
So I have two books one calledPleasure Poetry that was my
(47:56):
first, and the second is Poetry.
That was my first, and thesecond is Poetry and Prose, and
you can get access to them.
Both of them are on Amazon oryou can go to my website, which
is wwwcoffeesmithcom.
That's C-A-U-F-E-Y-Smithcom.
Speaker 1 (48:13):
Thank you Well, sharon.
Thank you for being a part ofthe next big thing.
Your journey and blueprint forservant leadership, strategic
excellence and staying true toyour mission, no matter what
your obstacles, was profoundlyheard today, and I want to thank
you.
Thanks for listening to theNext Big Thing.
I'm your host, keith D Terry.
If you've enjoyed this episodeand you'd like to support this
(48:34):
podcast, please share it withothers, post about it on social
media or leave a rating and areview.
Please share it with others,post about it on social media or
leave a rating and a review Tocatch all the latest from me.
You can follow me on my YouTubechannel at Keith D Terry.
If you want to recommend aguest, please email me at info
at terryperformancegroupcom.
This has been produced by yourhost and Jade Productions.
Popular Podcasts
Bookmarked by Reese's Book Club
Welcome to Bookmarked by Reese’s Book Club — the podcast where great stories, bold women, and irresistible conversations collide! Hosted by award-winning journalist Danielle Robay, each week new episodes balance thoughtful literary insight with the fervor of buzzy book trends, pop culture and more. Bookmarked brings together celebrities, tastemakers, influencers and authors from Reese's Book Club and beyond to share stories that transcend the page. Pull up a chair. You’re not just listening — you’re part of the conversation.
On Purpose with Jay Shetty
I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com