#18 - Champion Forward: How World Series MVP Ben Zobrist is Helping Young Athletes Thrive On and Off the Field - The Nonprofit Renaissance

Episode Transcript
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Heredes (00:10):
Ladies and gentlemen, we're back with another
nonprofit, renaissance, helpingyou guys go further, grow faster
in your nonprofits and yourorganizations, whether it's
ministry, business,mission-minded organizations
that we've partnered with.
So, for those of you listening,thanks for the comments, thanks
for all the replies and thequotes that we're getting.
It means a lot that someone'slistening.
Some of you guys are three inthe morning listening to our

(00:33):
whispers and it makes us feelgood because it's like, okay,
somebody's out there.
But we're glad to be of helpand I'm excited to continue.
And today, nonetheless, we gotsome special guests and really,
really looking to have some funtoday and learn some things,
some connections that we'regoing to jump into really soon.
But, colin, tell us what wehave today here.

Collin (00:54):
I'm not sure if it runs out.
We've got two guests, twoguests joining us.
Our first guest was a probaseball player.
He's a three-time World Seriesparticipant, he's a two-time
World Series champion, he's aone-time World Series MVP and he
is now the founder of thenonprofit Champion Forward.

(01:18):
We've got retired baseballplayer Ben Zobris with us.
Ben, how you doing, man?

Ben Zobrist (01:23):
Doing well.
Doing well, guys.
Thank you.
It's a snowy day in Tennesseetoday, so we've all been
hunkering down the last coupleof days, but that's been well.

Collin (01:33):
Yeah, it's 70 here, so we are not hunkering down, we're
looking for opportunities toget outside.
I'm super excited to have thisconversation with you, but we
also guess what.
We've got another MVP in thebuilding today.
Another MVP, what in the world?
Yes, another MVP.
Our second guest is he is themost vice president out of

(01:53):
anybody in the org ChampionForward.
He is the MVP.
There's no one in the org thatis more vice president than my
man, and so you know, if youknow anything about successful
organizations, right behind theleader, the innovator, the
vision caster, there's someonewho is doing a lot of work to
help push the org forward, getthings done, and so that is John

(02:15):
Harrison, vice president ofChampion Forward.
Welcome, john, how you doing,man?

John Harrison (02:20):
I'm great.
Thanks, Colin.
Thanks H, Thanks for having us.

Heredes (02:23):
John, are you the guy who loves it?
You?

called him the MVP.
He loves it right now.

Yeah, because, yeah, trying to be humble, but
yeah, I was part of theagreement, though.

Heredes (02:34):
On the email he said hey, make sure you call me the
MVP.

It's on the content.

It's all making sense now.
This is this.
All that this is the end.

Hey, I'm working on asking for what I need,
that's good, hey good.

How do you feel about this, John?
You feel great.
Now you feel good Ready.

I feel affirmed.
I feel affirmed, that's whatwe're going for.
So we'll build off that.
But, yeah, I'm in the snow here.
I spent 10 years in Minnesotaand so the snow kind of became
second nature for me, and so wedon't get much of it here in
Tennessee.
And they were predicting snow,predicting snow, and sometimes
that happens and it's just alittle dusting, but this time
the weather folks, they earntheir money.

(03:14):
We've gotten I think we gotseven inches over the last 24
hours and so, yeah, they have areally intentional strategy here
, especially where we live,where it's called weight, and so
you just wait until the snowmelts.
So the snow in our drivewaysand in our streets is just there
, and it looks like it'll behere at least for the next week
or two.

Collin (03:35):
Does the city or state just kind of shut down when it
snows?
I spent a year and a half inSeattle and it rarely snows
there, so when it did snow a fewtimes, everything was just like
the world's over, until thisthought it's basically the same
thing.

Oh yeah, similar.
Everything completely shutsdown.

I mean, my kids are like so happy because
there's no school today andmaybe there will not be there,
probably won't be school, maybeeven the rest of the week, like
no joke, like there was asnowstorm two years ago and they
were out for seven consecutiveschool days, five full days and
then to the following week.
It's unbelievable.

Collin (04:10):
Wow, that's what we get Hurricanes right.

Heredes (04:14):
Hurricanes seasons for us is that it's like our snow
days, Like yeah, it's coming, sowe'll prepare and but but yeah,
we, we get, go ahead Fallon.

Collin (04:22):
Well, I was going to get us in, I was going to get us
started.
I want to.
I want to hear about championFord, want to hear about more
about you guys.
So why don't we?
Can we get to get a little bitof a history and background?
Who is champion Ford?
How did you guys, how did Benand John meet up and kind of
start this?
Give us a little backgroundthere.

Yeah, yeah.
Well, I usually bat lead off.

So I'll go first, yeah.

Yeah, you're always bad at second or below.
They never trusted you in thefirst spot.
I moved to Franklin, tennesseethree years ago, literally just
felt led by the spirit to movehere.
That's a whole nother podcastseries in itself but met my wife
, whitney, and I moved fromMinneapolis.
I'm from Kansas City originally, and so that's where I first

(05:05):
heard of the name Ben Zobrist asa Kansas City Royals fan in the
2015 World Series.
He was signed at the tradedeadline in July and then came
along.
It was just an integral part ofthat team.
I'd been to game seven of 2014when we lost, and so that was
heartbreaking.
So then to have Ben come and bea part of the team, that was
awesome.
And then, through actually amen's group and a Bible study,

(05:25):
I'd gotten connected with Benand at a men's night one night
I'd been here like a week or two.
I went up to him and I was liketotal fan girl like Ben, yeah,
like World Series dude, you didit.
It was awesome, and we ended uptalking for like 30 minutes and
then we ended up havingbreakfast, probably a week or
two later, and we had breakfastfor about three hours and just

(05:47):
got to know each other at adeeper level, got to share some
stories and some journeys, somehard things we'd been through.
There was a lot of themes thatwere similar in our stories and
so, before taking it too far, welaunched Champion Forward about
a year and a half after that,after we kind of journeyed
together as friends.
But taking it back, myexperience, I was an athlete

(06:08):
myself.
Between Ben and I we have threeWorld Series appearances, two
World Series titles and oneWorld Series MVP.
So, I played baseball up untileighth grade, but I played golf
in high school and college andso golf.

Collin (06:22):
Let me just say, you had me panicking there for a second
because I was like did this guyplay baseball?
I did till eighth grade.

Well, I mean like Major.

Collin (06:30):
League and I was like, oh my God, I'm the worst host in
the world.

Oh that was good.
No, no, no, no.
So then so I've had differentroles professionally.
Just kind of background havebeen sales operations, marketing
.
I kind of like doing it all andthen also just finish my
master's in organizationalleadership.
So I love studyingorganizations, how to build
teams, build cultures andinnovate and consult and coach,
and so those are all kind of thethings that I really enjoy

(06:54):
doing.
And then I connected with Benand we launched Champion Forward
.
He kind of had a vision and Isaid he said hey, could you help
me carry out this vision?
And so the rest is history.
We can talk a lot more aboutthat, but that's a little
background about me.

Well, thanks, I love it.
I appreciate you sharing all ofthat I actually I forgot
something.

Tell me jump in what.
No, totally kidding.
Go ahead, ben.

I think the idea for Champion Forward was really
born out of both of our painthrough the performance pressure
process Through mine andbaseball John's in golf early on
in his life as he played incollege but then couldn't play
beyond that, even though he haddreams of playing professionally

(07:46):
.
One of the things we connectedon as friends, as he remarked
about, was that we both had thispart of our journey and, yeah,
while I went on and played for anumber of years in the major
leagues, one of the things thatwe talked about was anxiety,
depression, some of the copingmechanisms that we had had while

(08:10):
we were trying to live out ourdream.
And we you know he had heardthat this is something that I
want to figure out how to helpyoung families, young athletes,
young coaches.
I want to figure out how to dothat, but I didn't really know
how to do it.
I was still kind of thinkingthrough my post-playing career

(08:31):
and trying to find out what'sthe thing that I need to do and,
as I did, a lot of identitywork and figuring out.
Here's what I'm reallypassionate about and started
talking to John about this.
John at the time wastransitioning into different
jobs, like he was leaving onejob that he had in the business
ministry job and then he went toanother business where they
were doing.
You know, he's an incrediblebusiness guy Like.

(08:53):
He knows a lot about differentparts of business, great
entrepreneur himself has donesome podcasting before this time
.
And I'm looking at all hisgifts as a friend and looking at
what we need to do, or what Ineed to do to get this thing
going and I'm like, dude, canyou help me do this?
And, as I, you know, talk tohim about that.

(09:15):
And he starts like, well, let'sjust talk.
And we didn't want to dive intoo quick.
And so we worked for what westarted, for what?
Three months.
We decided let's talk aboutthis for a couple months, you
know, and for consulting kind ofthing.
And then after those few monthswe were like, you know what?
This is going really good,let's see what we can build
together.
And so we really for the nextyear after that, really built

(09:37):
what's known as champion forwardnow and launched in September.
So that's how we got to wherewe are and on the regular we're
obviously podcasting together,but we have an incredible
support team that John hashelped put together here and got
a great advisory board ofpeople that are in sports,
people that are coaching, evenpractitioners, some therapists

(10:00):
and people that are that arekind of advising us on the side
of the performance pressure.
Because what we're noticing,like we want to help young
athletes, parents and coachesthis is our mission statement is
help them thrive on and off thefield.
And if we can, if we can dothat, we're not just doing that
for the athletes, because weknow that the athlete needs that
support system.
They need the caretakers thatare around them to be doing

(10:23):
their work and they need thecoaches to be doing their work
to provide that environment forthem to thrive.
We know that that's a mentalskills.
There's mental skills behindthat, there's emotional skills
behind that.
Everybody's dealing with thechallenging sports experience
out there and so we're like,what do we do to address this
challenge?
Because now we got money addedin at the amateur level I mean

(10:43):
NIL and the travel sportscircuit has gotten really crazy
over the last 20 years sincewe've done it and you know those
of us that have been through itfrom the youth all the way
through the professional ranks.
I feel called to do that, Ifeel called to speak to that.
So we're trying to inspire andchallenge these people that are

(11:04):
in that world, but we're alsotrying to educate them on some
of the things that we know aboutnow.
So, john, how was that?
Did I?
Did I sum it up a little bitmore?

You don't need my affirmation.

Heredes (11:19):
Let me jump in a little bit because there's a lot I can
relate.
I've seen some of your talks,ben.
Listen to your podcast, some ofyour interviews.
I'm a Patrick's kid myself,grow up in a large home.
You're a one of five kids,right?
I've got five boys myself, yeah, right, so it's a full-time gig
and I love Champion 4.
I mean, you guys, I love numberone.

(11:39):
It's the ABCs right OfEmotional Health, right With
awareness, balance, connection,and I love you know also I'm
going to kind of vomit here anddump on this, because the topics
I want to hit on Love theinterview you talking to your
dad and the importance of family, the importance of kind of that
upbringing and a father figurein a home.
Could you speak to a little bitof that and how it all comes

(11:59):
together?
One, if you're talking to me,I'm a dad of five young boys.
I've got five young boys.
I never figured out the girlsituation, but so five boys have
a dad who's been a mentor and afather figure for me.
It meant a lot.
How does it all play?
Because I think you know, evenhearing you talk one of the you
know, by the way, for ourlisteners, whether you're doing

(12:20):
your fundraising event, yourchurch, your nonprofit, your org
, bring Ben out to come, comespeak and come talk to you.
We're going to link all theinformation below.
Yeah, but just talk to us alittle bit about how it all
comes together, because you cameout of a big platform and I
think even one of your talks Iheard you say how it's
uncomfortable.
Right, you come and Colin justintroduce you with this list of

(12:40):
like, accolades, boom and thisand that, and how it's that
platform and that performancevibe of like you have to kind of
turn off.
And you've been working throughit, you're getting better,
you're mastering, you're tryingto teach it.
Tell us a little bit about thathow to not perform and how does
it play into kids and to theemotional health of kids who are
performing?

(13:00):
And again, we can go intoemotional coaching and skill
coaching and all beyond.
But I know I gave you a bunch,but I know that's the heart
behind Champion Four and gettingthat message out and helping
kids, coaches, parents, familiesand beyond.

So we just speak to that Well yeah, all of us, we
all learn early on from ourparental figures, our caretakers
, of what works, what doesn'twork, what are the lanes we need
to stay in right and I think asparents we do our best to guide
and encourage and try not tocriticize much.

(13:33):
But generally, as kids, whenyou're hearing affirmation and
praise around achievement, it'snatural to believe that my value
lies in how much I achieve.
That achievement doesn't justbegin or end at the athletic
field.
I mean that's in the classroom,that's at home, that can be in

(13:53):
church.
You mentioned faith.
That can be a faith journey too, and that's part of my journey.
Is even seeing paternal figuresor seeing a God figure as
needing me to perform in orderto get his approval is not the
Christian message at all.
Right and so that's never whatmy parents would have said,

(14:14):
that's never what they promoted,but sometimes that's the
message you hear as a kidgrowing up, when you're trying
to perform and achieve and tryto be good enough for the people
in your life, right and so.
On the athletic field, we knowthat that's a real challenge, a
big challenge, because you'relooking up at statistics and
every day it's a win, loss.
That's the problem with zerosome games.
So if our kids are playing zerosome games all the time,

(14:38):
whether it's on a computer orwhether it's on an athletic
field, and they see either oneor I lost, well, they're going
to walk away, believing that thevalue of who they are as a
player is relies.
It lies in whether we won orlost, whether I got the hit or I
didn't, whether I scored thepoint or I didn't, and

(14:58):
oftentimes failure is achallenging thing to deal with
for kids.
Right, they need the guides,they need the parental figures,
the caretakers, to do a coupledifferent things.
We both need paternal andmaternal caretakers in our lives
, whether they are our mother orfather or not.
That's what we need.
We need both of those, and soit does take more than just

(15:19):
those caretakers.
You need those figures in theirlife, but they need also other
adults and other kids that arealong the same journey.
So we need a combination offeeling and, john, we've just
learned some of this recentlybut feeling like.
Kids need to feel like theymatter, regardless of whether
they're winning or losing.
Kids need to feel a sense ofmaternal affection and sometimes

(15:45):
, as a father if you're a singledad, that's hard to provide is
like how do I give the level ofaffection to my children that
they need?
Well, they need male and femalefigures in their lives to give
them those types of things right.
So we can only do so much as aparent, but what we're learning
is as a parent or as a coach,there are a lot of things that

(16:07):
we do that don't help, and thenthere are certain things that we
can do that help a lot more.
So I think, as far as beingthat caretaker figure, whether
it's a parent, whether you're afather or whether you're a
mother, or whether you're justan uncle or a grandparent or a
neighbor, whoever it is that'sproviding that level of parental

(16:30):
advisement.
I think there are things that wedon't know emotionally, that we
need to know, and there arethings that John and I we're
learning on a daily, likelistening to the people that are
researching these things on aregular basis, so we can dig
into that a little bit.
But that's essentially whatwe've been studying for the last

(16:52):
year and what we're trying tolay out for our people group,
our people group.
I see my people group as thesports people.
Like if you're involved insports, like I know what it's
like to be a competitor.
I know what it's like to beclutch in those big moments, and
you want the mental skills andthe emotional balance and
everything that goes into beingable to be clutch and focus in
that moment.
At the same time are youtransitioning well to being a

(17:16):
human being after you've beenthe hero, and so that's what's
good, that's what the caretakersand the coaches have to teach
these young people how to do.
And if we don't know how to dothat, then we're just.
We're just kind of leaving themto their own devices.
They're gonna, they're gonnathink I'm a hero when I'm doing
amazing, and then when I'm notdoing amazing, what value do I
have?

Collin (17:35):
Wow, john, talk to us a little bit about that on on your
end, as I you know, someonemight say like well, yeah, I
understand the pressure of,maybe, professional sports and
kind of what that might do, butas someone who, who, who
probably it sounds likeexperience that same pressure
before that, I mean, I mean,what's, what's the value of this
type of thing that you guys aretrying to do for, even for

(17:57):
young kids who are just startingout in sports?

Talk a little bit about that, yeah, I think let's
normalize the human experience.
And when I get the chance to tospeak with Ben, I say hey, you
know, let's think about thatmoment that we all think about
Ben.
For 108 years, no World Series,champ championships, 10
thinning steps in the batter'sbox, 50,000 people watching in

(18:20):
the stands, countless millionsaround the globe watching.
Okay, what's he feeling in thatmoment?
Right, he's.
He's feeling maybe fear, he'sfeeling maybe a little bit
anxious, he's feeling angry,like excited, he's.
He's feeling all those things.
Right.
What I believe to in my core,what I believe is that somebody

(18:43):
actually is feeling the samethings as Ben in a little league
game, definitely.
And I believe that we havecreated these different
platforms and these differentlevels and these different
experiences when, in fact, thehuman experience is, we all
share the same feelings.
It might just have bigger orsmaller impact on different

(19:03):
people.
And so Ben felt the pressure toperform and throughout his 14
year MLB career that manifesteditself in different ways.
I felt the pressure to performthroughout my middle school,
throughout high school.
And when I say the pressure toperform, I'm not just talking
about to perform on my golf teamor on my sports team, but to

(19:23):
perform for my family to performin school right, and so there's
all these expectations.
Where I have to be, I have tobe great, I have to be great.
And when you're constantlytrying to live in this
performance based acceptanceenvironment, it wears you down
to the point where you startseeking out coping mechanisms.

(19:44):
And I believe that we have aculture that lives in two things
You're either in addiction oryou're in recovery, and I mean
that respectfully, but I meanthat we have so many addictions
and you obviously have theaddictions we talk about heavily
, whether it's substances,pornography, etc.
Like we talk about thoseaddictions, but I believe
there's addictions to socialmedia.

(20:05):
I believe there's addictions tofood, I believe there's
addictions to retail shoppingand all these things are
creating different dopamine hitsfor us, and when the brain is
in pain and we don't know how toconnect with what we're feeling
, we seek out these dopaminesources.
And so I think what's sovaluable about Champion Forward
is yeah, we're leading with, hey, we want to teach you to
perform under pressure, but inreality, we want to teach you to

(20:27):
regulate in a healthy way,because when you can regulate in
a healthy way, you're learningto respond to the way that life
throws different things at youinstead of react and when you
can respond.
I'm going to quote our mutualfriend, dr Rob Murray, that Ben
and I work with a lot and valuea lot.
He talks a lot about.
You know, we want you to bemore calm, we want you to have

(20:48):
more clarity, we want you to bemore connected, we want you to
be more compassionate, we wantyou to be more create,
courageous, but we also want youto be creative and we also want
you to be curious, and so thework that we teach people to do
is hopefully leading them downthis path where they can live
with all of those things, whereyou're living a life where
you're thriving.
We're not relieving thepressure to perform because it's

(21:09):
just going to ramp up.
Right H was making me so dangnervous and twitching in my
freaking slippers I'm wearingright now about five boys my
wife seven months pregnant, nochild yet, first baby and I'm
reading a baby book last night,like how am I going to do this?
And he's sitting here going,hey, I got five of them.
And like I'm doing and right,the pressure to be a dad, to be

(21:30):
a spouse, to be a friend, to bea leader of an organization,
whatever it is, we all just itall ramps up, and so what we're
trying to do is to equip notjust the young athletes and
competitors, but the people thatare responsible for their
caretaking them, and the coaches, how to how to handle what life
is throwing at them so they canbe the most effective in the

(21:50):
different roles that they have.

Heredes (21:52):
Yeah, yeah, I love that , John.
Let me go ahead, Ben.

Well, if I could just add, I just I love the fact
that this is what we've builtis not just for the athletes,
you know, like obviously theathletes are paramount because
they're the kids and they need.
You know, the kids need to bethe most supported, obviously,
but adults need support as well,and so if we, if we are giving
this and offering this to theyoung competitors the young,

(22:16):
they're the ones out there onthe field what, what's really
going on is probably thegreatest emotions that have no
outlet at all are the parentalemotions on the sidelines, Right
, and so this is just as muchfor the parents as it is for the
kids and everybody.
We all know those stories aboutparents that are out of control
and that they're screwing theirkid up by being out of control

(22:38):
at the field.
Like that's, that's what we'readdressing.
I love that, that.
That's part of this.

Collin (22:43):
We saw that.
We saw that video of you on thesideline age.
I said it to him beforehand,that's.

Heredes (22:47):
I told the publicist to take that down, sorry.

Collin (22:49):
We need to talk about it .

Heredes (22:50):
So no, I okay.
So, ben, tell me about that,because it's that whole like
I've been guilty and I've beenbetter, right, but I've.
I've got kids in soccer andfootball, I've got.
I've got the performers in inarts.
I've got a pianist and a violinplayer in my family, I got.
And they're performing in thesame way, right, cause that, and
it's like, well, you'll get anice cream if you score, okay.
So how crazy is that?

(23:10):
That was not me, that wasCollins.
But we live in that world ofrewarding a performance like
that or that, where it can be sotraumatizing and damaging to a
kid's soul.
Really, right, if we're notcareful.
Yet every dad has that.
I wanna see my kid win, I dowant, do I wanna see my kid beat
up the bully or be the bully?

(23:31):
Tell me about that In yourexperience, what you've seen in
pro, but also for kids, causeit's real for me now.
And I'll say this last thingcause Collins, a pastor's kid,
I'm a pastor's kid.
Ben John, are you a pastor'skid?
No, cause this will okay, thiswould have been a pastor's kid
podcast.

Collin (23:44):
I'm technically not a pastor's kid but church kid
through and through.

Heredes (23:48):
Okay, okay, there we go .
So there's been well.
There's a performance elementeven to that.
A lot of our leaders are evenchurches.
There's thousands of pastorslistening to this.
You have to perform if you'rethe pastor's kid, which is the
worst Now my dad has beenministry for 30 plus years.
He's led so well in saying youknow you be you and you're gonna
bring all your crap with it andGod's grace is the same for you
as it is for.
But there's this performanceelement and how he's handled my

(24:11):
mom, his wife of like do youdon't have to be this Now?
It's a challenge.
It is a challenge cause.
We're flesh and bones.
And tell me about that, ben.
How do you?
What are some tips to evenhandling all that?
How did you do as a pastor'skid?
Were you like the golden?
Are you the golden child?
Pastor's kid.

Well, golden child, I don't know about that, but
like as far as all I mean, wehad five in our family and you
know, I want to be careful hereto say that we're not trying to
lower standards, right, becausethe standards of excellence and
standards to try to behave in acertain way or be a good example
to those around you, be theleader of around you, is really

(24:53):
important.
I want my kids to be leaders.
At the same time, I want thatleadership to be to come from
within.
If that's coming from externalsources, if I'm the one putting
pressure on them externally todo it, guess what happens as
soon as that external pressuregoes away.
That's it, it's gone.

(25:15):
It's gone Like the big problem.
Whether you're in professionalsports or whether you're trying
to parent your kids, isextrinsic.
Motivation only lasts so long.
It only lasts so long.
As soon as you get the thing,there's always a lull.
As soon as you get the reward,there's always a lull.
And then you got to figure outwell, what's the next carrot?

(25:38):
Well, I lived that way for along time without realizing I
was living that way Because youget drafted.
Or you're playing college balland it's like, well, what if I
could get drafted, right?
So you go get that carrot.
I got drafted.
Now I can say I was aprofessional.
Well then, you're aprofessional and you're going.
Well, what's next?
Well, if I could just make itto the next level single-a,
double-a, triple-a.

(25:59):
There's always a carrot Majorleagues.
You're a Major League baseballplayer.
Now, ben, wow, that's amazing.
Now you're getting paid a lotof money.
There's so much that comesalong with that.
People are carrying your bagseverywhere.
Well, what's next?
Well, let's get the MajorLeague deal, the long-term deal,
set your family up for life.
That's what it's all about.

(26:20):
That's what people at thatlevel will tell you.
It's all about making the moneyfor your family so that they
can be set up for the rest oftheir lives.
And then you go get that andthen what you realize?
What next?
That's not enough.
Well, what if I could be anAll-Star?
What if I could make it to aWorld Series?
I made it to a World Seriesearly on in my career.
We lost, but I made it becamean All-Star.

(26:42):
Is that Tampa?

Collin (26:43):
Go raise, baby go raise.

That's right.
You know, become an All-Star.
I'm like, wow, what else isthere?
Free agency?
Get to free agency, get thatbig deal.
Now we've got to win the WorldSeries.
Well, I won the World Serieswith Kansas City.
It was amazing, so amazing.
Well, what do you do next?
Well, the Cubs haven't won in108 years.
Sign up with the Cubs, you knowyou get that opportunity.

(27:06):
So I went and did that.
We did it in the first year.
The Carrots just kept comingand I kept going, you know,
being a part of the teams thatwere achieving them right.
And then, on top of that, Inever expected to be a World
Series MVP.
And then I was a World SeriesMVP.
So, once all that extrinsicmotivation is done, what are you
left with If you haven'tlearned how to know who you are

(27:32):
when you take the uniform off,and you haven't learned who you
are when you're not achievinganything and you're not
intrinsically motivated at thatlevel?
You'll have just what I hadYou'll feel anxious, you'll feel
depressed, you will not feel atpeace.
And I had Jesus in my life, butI still hadn't learned that.
I wasn't tapping into thatunconditional love.

(27:54):
I wasn't tapping into thatintrinsic side of like, wow, I
know who I am when all of theachievement goes away, because
there was always a carrot there.
And that's what I wanna warnparents that are trying to help
their kids achieve great thingsHelp them achieve great things,
but while you're doing that, ifyou're not focused more on their

(28:16):
intrinsic motivation and helpthem learning who they are when
they're not achieving anything,then you're missing the boat.
That's what we've got to bedoing as parents.

Collin (28:26):
What an incredible message.
I mean, if there are more kids,I think that we're able to
frame it as the greatest thing Ican do is be the most joyful
and authentic version of myself.
It doesn't matter what isbeyond that man.
If you can hit that, anythingafter that is extra.
But like that's the point,that's so good.
You guys are doing suchincredible work.
I wanna hear, I wanna talk alittle bit about the faith as

(28:49):
well as the faith side of things.
But let's talk about the impactand let's talk about the
success stories.
What have you guys seen so faras you guys have been doing this
and you're going out?
First of all, give it maybe alittle bit of a glimpse of, like
, what does it look like for achampion forward to do what you
guys do?
I know there's speaking events,there's things like that.

(29:10):
Like, what does that look likeand what have you guys seen come
out of that?
What are some success stories?

Well, we've had two awesome in-person workshops
Kind of last year we were inChicago and then we were also
here in Franklin, and at theseworkshops we were just kind of
sharing some of our strategies.
So a lot of that year that Benand I spent together is trying
to come up with the content andthe framework and the pillars

(29:38):
through the work that each of ushave done.
And so we talked aboutawareness, which is gonna be a
mouthful here, but it's having aconscious knowledge of your
thoughts, feelings, patterns,surroundings, abilities and
challenges.
We talk about balance, which ishaving a healthy division of
time, energy and attentiongiving to the different
responsibilities that you have.
And then we talk aboutconnection, which is having
meaningful interaction thatincludes authentic communication

(30:00):
and feedback.
And then we also talk aboutthis idea of emotional
versatility, which is theability to identify your
feelings, clarify and understandwhat they're telling you and
engage with that informationeffectively.
And so we talk about theseconcepts and the product or the
result of intentionally pursuingthese are three things.
We talk about motivation, whichwe all wanna be motivated.

(30:20):
We all wanna have energy andenthusiasm.
We talk about vitality, whichis what separates something from
being dead versus being alive,and having that energy.
You wanna have that if youwanna be in life.
We all wanna have vitality andwe all wanna have presence.
We wanna be present for thepeople that matter most to us,
and so we've been sharing someof these concepts at these
different workshops.
We've been also talking abouthow you can do that and then

(30:42):
also taking people throughexperiences where they'll
actually feel what that is like.
That's some of the successesthat we've had, and then, in
addition, just recently, we'vehad multiple speaking
engagements.
We're starting to do a lot ofwebinar speaking engagements.
So we're partnering with highschools, colleges, different
travel sports organizations tobring webinars to kind of their

(31:03):
constituents and provide themresources, strategies, tactics.
We just did some in-personevents at some high schools and
partnered with a youth baseballorganization and did an event
for almost 400 people, which wasawesome to have them there.
And where we're evolving to ishow do we actually take what
we're doing and train and equipother people that are inside of
those organizations to becarrying out what we do?

(31:27):
Because we all know thatlong-term sustainable change
happens over time.
It happens kind of hand-to-hand.
You need somebody on the frontlines, and so Ben and I are
really just trying to be outeducating and inspiring and then
hopefully the next year we'llbe spent equipping, while we're
educating and inspiring,equipping those people inside of

(31:47):
organizations, inside of sportsteams, to be kind of the
ambassador, if you will,carrying forward what we're
doing From a success storystandpoint.
I think I always like to thinkof this of we're just planting
seeds and, coming from aministry background myself, I'm
trying really hard to be focusedon the seed planning and not

(32:08):
trying to take a look at theharvest.
And so right now, ben says atBeth's, he says we're teaching a
soft skill and so we don't wantto judge our successes by
having some instant, crazy,transformational story.
I really personally want tojudge our success by are we
planting seeds, are we beingfaithful to what we're called to
, and are we trying to helpcultivate and water those seeds

(32:29):
the best that we can and overtime, hopefully that will
produce impact that we never getto see, lest we would become
arrogant.
So we're just trying to befaithful in the process.
But, man, it's been so likelife giving to be in front of
organizations, speaking withpeople and seeing the lights
turn on and, you know, click,and then having some people come
up to us and say, wow, this wasreally impactful.

(32:50):
Makes all the hard work worthit.

Heredes (32:52):
Yeah, john, let me follow up on this For our
leaders.
You know, some of the listenersare just getting started or
about to start.
They're entering, maybe anonprofit or, you know, charity.
That are a foundation of sorts.
You guys are leveraging yourexperience, success, the lessons
, your entrepreneurial side, theyou know, the influence that
God's given you and then you'veachieved.

(33:12):
Give us some tips or tricks.
What are some of the lessons,some of the things you've
learned in kind of gettingstarted, getting going kind of
an initial year, initial stages?
What would you tell?

someone.
Yeah, I got connected, I thinkactually through Ben, through a
guy named Matt George and he isvery focused in the nonprofit
sector.
He's been extremely successfuljust leading nonprofits and in
his book he talks about thisquestion that I've applied to
our situation.
That I would encourage anynonprofit kind of visioneer or
leader to ask is what happens ifour nonprofit doesn't exist?

(33:45):
What happens if our nonprofitor our organization doesn't
exist?
Like what's the impact?

Heredes (33:52):
If it stops operating tomorrow, right With the world.

Notice With the world, even Well to the point
almost of like, like askingyourself it helps you get really
clear H on what problem are yousolving?
And I think that when we reallydistilled that down that helped
kind of propel us forward iswhen we found out, okay, what
happens if champion forwarddoesn't exist, and that's a.
You might need an hour or twoto fight through and keep asking

(34:18):
, but that would be kind of onepiece of advice.
Lesson learned Number two Iwould say this is just me
speaking to myself right nowdon't be afraid of adjustments.
One thing that made Ben greatin his career is the ability to
make adjustments, whether it wasto pitchers or in positions in
the field.
And I think for me, sometimes Iwant things so black and white,
but kind of be be, beadjustable, be flexible, be like

(34:41):
bamboo, you know Ben, but don'tbreak.
And then also, I think, a hugepiece of advice that I've
learned we got this from a guywho's been such a great guide to
us, a guy named Bart Garvin,incredibly successful
businessman, but a man of Godand faithful to our mission.
It's been awesome to have him apart of the team.
He says stay close to yourcustomer.
And you know, we live in aworld where we have access to so

(35:05):
many platforms Like we can,like the four of us right now
could build If we spent the nexteight hours.
We could build stuff that usedto take people years to build.
But be really careful in justbuilding, to build Like I'm
trying really hard to stay closeto my customer to say what do
you need?
What do you need and Ben does areally good job of that how can
we support you?

(35:25):
Because so often we're justthinking that we know what
someone needs or wants and thenwe go spend all of our time and
energy building that when inreality that isn't the support
that they're actually needing.

Yeah, that's so good, that's good stuff.
Yeah, to that end, from afounder's perspective, I would
just say, for people that are,that are the initial driver of
the nonprofit or the visionary,I think one of the things that I
am realizing now, looking back,but didn't really fully realize
at the time because it justworked out the right people, not

(36:00):
just knowing your constituencyof who you're trying to serve
and what the problem is, but whoare the people that you're
partnering with and doing thatand what are their giftings
Right?
So one of the things early onJohn and I talked about is like,
at the end of the day, if webuild nothing, I want to serve
you as a friend.
I want to figure out what.
What, john, are you reallygifted at?

(36:21):
And let's put you try to getyou in that lane.
And, ben, what are you reallygifted at?
And we knew early on like Johnis really gifted at taking a
vision and like making it go.
Ben is not great at making itgo.
Ben is great at throwing thevision and and and adjusting it
to what the needs are.

(36:42):
You know, and and we worked onthat together.
But then there came a time whereJohn's like when we add people
to the equation here in inpartnering.
We need to find people withthese giftings because we don't
have those.
You know he working genius issomething he worked.
He worked with like that thatbook and like we really needed

(37:04):
that, because that the thirdperson that we added into
champion forward after we hadworked for months and months and
months we needed a third person.
John's like this is what I knowwe need.
Based on doing this, we've gotto find a person like this and
it was like amazing how Goddropped Hannah Tanner into our
life.
Like Hannah has the perfectgifting of what we needed at the

(37:25):
time.
So she was the third hire tochampion forward.
We've gone on from there butlike knowing what pieces you
need in place to actually makethe vision come to fruition.
I didn't know that at the timebut John, when I brought John in
, john took my ideas, made itstart going and then he's going.
We need these people Right, andthat was such a huge part of,

(37:48):
you know, helping things startto move.

Yeah, one thing I want to add to that real quick,
because I don't want to missthis point, is using the.
The working genius wasincredibly valuable.
It's still very valuable.
You know, ben is a wonder andinvention guy, if you're
familiar at all, so he can comeup with an idea and then dream
about how something could bedifferent and then come up with
an idea.

Heredes (38:08):
He looks like a tenacity guy.
That's at the very bottom.

Zero tenacity, and so I'm a discernment and
enablement and so I love comingalongside but also figuring out
like Ben, let's distill that.
Is that actually going to work?
I don't know.
And then, you know, hannah camein and she was tenacity and
enablement Right.
So then we've had another teammember, omar, come on and I
can't remember.
He's galvanizing and so he'sgreat at getting people together

(38:33):
and so, as you kind of continueto grow, understand that, just
as it talks about, we all haveour unique skill sets as
followers and we fit into thebody of Christ.
You know, in the same way youcan fit into an organization,
but but getting an awareness ofwhat those are.
But the second thing I reallywant to talk about, like
logistically or tactically fornonprofits as they're launching,
is don't be afraid to leveragecontractor talent.

(38:57):
Like I think we live in a worldwhere you have access to so many
different people that you don'thave to hire a full time
employee, and I think we're.
So you need people before youneed them, which is the tough
part.
Like I was looking back inApril and I was like I know
we're going to need more people,but everyone that we've brought
on our team we've leveragedcontractor talent before that,

(39:17):
and so we've been doing thatright now in multiple different
segments and outsource to theexperts, in whatever field, and
I think there's just a.
That's a new way I'm seeing islike a new way of looking at the
business world and how youoperate an organization is
before.
You'd be like, well, we need tohire someone.
That means we need to pay$48,000 to $60,000 and we need

(39:38):
to give them insurance and weneed to bring it yes, maybe down
the line, but like you could beworking with four or five
different contractors on anhourly basis or a deliverable
basis, getting great things donewithout needing necessarily the
capital upfront that you wouldneed to bring someone on full
time.

Heredes (39:53):
No, that's right.
But even post, post 2020, we'veseen that.
You know we serve 100 plusorganizations and the fractional
piece whether it's fractional,cmo, fractional has been a huge,
you know, key to the success ofthe organizations who sometimes
can't, you know, are not in aposition, or don't necessarily
even need never, to bring onsomebody full time and then and
people get to use their gifts.

(40:13):
You know specific, so we'veseen that too.
Love the working genius.
We'll use it adverse at ouragencies, all the clients that
we recommended.
So big shout out to figuringout your widget.
And the cool thing about theworking genius, right, is that
the hierarchies, that you needthem all.
There's a genius in all of it,right from wonder to tenacity,
because I'm with you man, I'mtenacity man.
If I don't have, we have ourhand in our organization.

(40:34):
She runs our operation and her,she is tenacity to the tee and
without her, you know, we hadamazing.
Nd is floating all over theworld, but never I think we're
both Iggy's.

Collin (40:43):
I think we're both Iggy's, you and I.
So you know pretty much, prettymuch, we annoy the crap out of
Hannah.

Heredes (40:49):
Let me let's talk about you, talk about that ability,
that ability pivoting.
But I'm amazed.
I grew up in Brazil, so not ahuge baseball guy.
The Japanese community broughtbaseball to Brazil and then it
boom and it's growing.
Everybody's a fan of theYankees, not the Cubs down there
.
It's a thing Anyway.
But so I did my.
I was surprised.
You've played every position,ben, except catcher.
Is that right professionally?

(41:11):
Yeah, in major league, that it,and that's not normal, right,
that's not normal at all, isthat?

fair to say or no.
There's been a few guys inhistory that have done it in one
game.
A couple of guys have done itin one game, but you know, I, I,
I really didn't do any like thepitcher thing didn't happen to
the last inning in my career, soI pitched the last inning of
your last game, of your lastgame.
Correct, well, last gamebasically.
I pitched in college so I knewhow to pitch, but it had been 16

(41:41):
years since that had takenplace.

Heredes (41:44):
So that was, and you struck out a Hall of Famer.
Basically right.

I can't pronounce his name now.

Collin (41:49):
I mean, I'm not not trying to just go for it, just
do it, I'm getting speed.

That's the reality of that.
But but yes, I struck out YadirMolina, and he will be a Hall
of Famer within a couple years.
Here he's.
He's one of the best actorsthat we've had in our generation
.

Heredes (42:07):
Sweet so yeah, I love that.

The rest versatility was was what made me
a valuable player Like.
Without that I would have beenjust an average major league
player and I think what allowedme that.
I had people Joe Madden, AndrewFriedman like the front office
in Tampa Bay that saw likethere's a different way to do
this.
Utility players don't need tobe stuck, as you at utility if

(42:31):
they can hit and they can switchit like they could be like in
there every day at differentplaces.
So they they, they decidedthey're like let's see if we can
create this super utilityposition that allows for that
kind of versatility all over thefield and what that does allows
a lot of flexibility with theother personnel that you have on
the, on the team and on thebench.
So I became a valuablecommodity to a lot of different

(42:54):
teams during my career.
Now there's a lot of guys doingthat and versatility has become
something that a lot of playerstry to do early on in their
career, which I think is isbenefiting a lot of teams and a
lot of players At the same time.
It takes a special mindset to beable to do that.
You got to kind of put yourpride away sometimes.
So I guess what you need to dois make sure that when you're

(43:15):
doing that, your own game isgoing to get really good things
going and you're going to bewilling to do that in your own
games when you'd rather beplaying one position, you have
to be willing to beuncomfortable to do that.
But that how that correlates towhat we're doing now.
I mean we're trying to build alevel of we talk about emotional
versatility with championforward, because you can't just

(43:37):
be emotionally intelligent inone aspect of your life, crush
it at your job and push the ballforward and then come home and
listen to your toddler's cry oryour young kids cry and not try
to push the ball forward.
There You've got to just sitand listen.
We want to help people becomemore balanced in their lives and
become more emotionallyversatile in all these different

(43:59):
areas.
That really fits with the brandof the type of player I was.
I want to not only do thatmyself in my life and I'm always
working on that every day but Iwant to be able to help other
people do that and have a betterexperience than I had playing.
They may not make it to a WorldSeries and be World Series MVP

(44:20):
or whatever, but that doesn'tmean your experience playing
can't be better than it wasyesterday, that's great, that's
incredible.

Heredes (44:30):
Colin, I have a quick follow-up.
Go for it, take it away.
If I understand Ben correctly,you didn't sit out in middle
school or elementary school thatyou're going to be MLB.
I think you played collegeright.
You were like, if I do college,I'm good.
It was a tryout, it was anopportunity.
It was kind of maybe unorthodox, the way of the dream, the
kids' dream of becoming thatWorld Series champ.

(44:51):
Talk to me, if I'm coaching mykids, if you're talking to me as
a dad now and I'm looking at mykids because their days, I'm
like I'm all in, I'm going toput one of these guys.
I see it, I see the spark.
I'm going to go all in withthis one.
What would you recommend as adad when it comes to setting
them up for success and talkingabout identity, talking about
versatility and everything youjust shared?

If they love the game that they're playing sports
.
We're talking about sports.
I would say, keep it in properperspective.
That's the sense of balance.
That's part of what we teach isbalance as a family, balance as
an athlete, because that'sgoing to help them not burn out
as well too.
With all the opportunities nowthat kids are afforded to play

(45:35):
all year round, it's like, hey,you know what.
Let's, as a family, balancethis out a little bit more than
maybe the travel circuit wouldallow us to.
That's going to take somechallenging decisions by parents
.
But I think also, when you'retalking about awareness for
these kids and connection bothof those I think the biggest
thing I would tell parents to dois help your kid understand

(45:58):
what they love and don't loveabout their sport, because the
more they can start tounderstand here's what I really
like about it, here's what Idon't really like about it the
more they can think about thatthey're actually doing identity
work, because there's a reasonwhy they love this aspect of it
and don't like that aspect of it, and that's the kind of stuff
that will translate to otherthings they do in their life and

(46:21):
you'll start to help them feelknown for who they are, and not
just what they're doing on thefield.
That's the most important thingand that's also the connection
piece as a parent or as a coachthat you have to work on.
It's like I want them to know.
I know you, I know what youlike and don't like.
Even if things go well or gobad, it doesn't matter.
Like you know, I want to helpyou feel known and that you know

(46:46):
.
No matter whether you win orlose, you're mattering out there
to me.

Let me jump in on that.
I got to add some context tothat real quick.
I have a follow up because theonly 7% of athletes will play
collegially.
7%, that's a small number.
Seven out of the 100 kids thatyou see running around are going
to play in college.
It's an even smaller numberthat are going to play
professionally.

(47:10):
There's a myth that exists thatsports specialization will
somehow provide you a pathwaythat is going to be profitable
for the rest of your life.
That is false.
There's no data to support that.
In fact, range by David Epsteinis a great book that you can
check out where he's actuallyproven that generalists and not

(47:32):
specialization is a betterstrategy if you want long term,
sustainable success inprofessional sports or any high
level performance process.
We talked with other MLBathletes who have told me hey,
when you get to the MLB, it'senough of a grind.
When you're in college, it'senough of a grind.
Take away the grind whenthey're in middle school and

(47:52):
high school, because if they'regoing to make it and they have
it in them they're going to workhard.
Of course, give themopportunities.
Ben's a great example.
Yeah, he's an outlier, but I'mstarting to hear there's more
and more stories of guys playingmultiple sports in high school,
not until college, wherethey're specializing.
They just tried to be the bestthey could be that day, and it
just kept taking them on and on.

Heredes (48:12):
I love that, ben.
The follow up was this Again,you're speaking to me in my
season right now.
Right, I've got from three to12, I got them and they're in it
.
They're doing the sports,they're doing the stuff, pushing
them.
Sometimes there's theprojecting parents who project
everything I didn't do.
Now you're going to do it forit.
Right, there's the projecting,but pushing them.
How much should somebody pushIf I know it's healthier, good

(48:34):
for the social skills or for thephysical, for the?
Let's say they hate it.
I'm dragging them out there.
What's that balance?
What's that balance of like?
No, I'm going to drag it outthere.
You're going to hate it.
You may thank me later or no,or let them find their you know
their specialty somewhere else.
What would you?
What would you recommend?
I know it's maybe subjectiveand personal, but what.

What I recommend for them to figure out what they
like and don't like is trying alot of different things early
on.
But you, when you commit tothat season, you're going to
play the whole season out, evenif you hated it after the first
practice.
You're committed, you'd saidthat this is what you wanted to
do, stick with it all the waythrough and we're going to get
the full experience, even if youhate every second of it after

(49:16):
the first practice.
That's.
That's.
What I think is hard is is kids,especially early on.
They don't know if they like itor not.
They think they want to try it.
And so then they they say, yeah, I want to play.
And then you sign them up andthey're like I hate this, you
know I don't want to do it.
It's like, well, you know whatthey learn.
They learn to think a littleharder before they say this is

(49:36):
what I'm going to do, you know,and and so that's good for them
to start to have to have toconsider there's some
consequences.
If I commit to something,whatever it is, there are
consequences and I need to beresponsible then to follow
through with what I said Iwanted to do.

Heredes (49:53):
Love it man, so you call it Colin.
You're going to finish thepickleball season.
Okay, you heard.
You heard it from Ben, I don'tknow.
Listen, I'm going to finish it.

Collin (49:59):
Okay, I made jokes about it, but I think pickle elbows
are real thing and I think I gotit because my arm has been
hurting, Like I'm just, I wenttoo hard, without any warm up or
anything, but I did win thatlast game against you age, so
I'm pretty happy about that.
But no, that's great.
And you know, as a, I spentseven years in youth ministry
and one thing that I know forsure is that students, teenagers

(50:22):
, kids, have no idea, Like yousaid, they have no idea what
they want.
They have.
No, they might think they do,but like part of that is helping
them learn how to go throughthe process of like actually
figuring that out and tryingdifferent things.
That's such a good point andthat's such a.
I mean, that's one of the most,I think, valuable things, like
you're saying, you can do foryour, for your kids.
I think the other thing would beinstilling strong faith, which

(50:45):
it seems like all of our parentsdid.
That.
Where does faith come into thiswith you?
Obviously there's a strongfoundation and it's it's very,
it's very foundational andbackground for you guys.
But does, does your, does thatfaith come out publicly?
Does that?
Obviously it informs behind thescenes, but what does that look
like for you guys?
You know from like innerworkings and then when you guys

(51:07):
are out, places like.
You know how does that comeinto play?

Yeah Well, I mean, faith is even even mental health
practitioners now arerecognizing faith as a very
important part of mental healthright.
So so to say you can keep faithout of the equation is really.
I mean, everybody needs to havesome level of faith.
Now the question, of course,for everybody, the individual

(51:33):
side of it, is what is yourfaith in, or who is your faith
in?
And that's that's up to everyindividual to decide that for
themselves.
But, but there's no questionthat, like I can't, I can't get
away from the fact that that'swho I am.
That's part of what I believe.
It's going to be involved inevery, every decision that I

(51:53):
make, and and sometimes it'sgoing to be uncomfortable
because I'll believe differentthings than other people are
going to believe.
But at the end of the day, youhave to be able to be
comfortable in your own skinenough to own what you believe
and why you believe it.
And kids are in process on aregular basis, but in so so, our
parents oftentimes, as adults,were in process trying to figure

(52:15):
out what do I really believeabout this or that?
And and I think it's healthy tosay, hey, I don't know, but I
think this is, this is what Ithink, I believe and and you you
know we need to model that forour kids instead of pretending
like we always have everythingfigured out.
We need to model that.

(52:36):
I don't know for sure, but thisis what I believe and this is
why I believe it.
And then you also need to givethem the freedom to decide what
they believe and why theybelieve what they believe Right.
And that's so hard becauseco-dependence, as parents and
kids would say well, I got tomake sure that you don't make
the wrong decision here.

(52:56):
Well, sometimes their processof growth is going to involve
making bad decisions before theymake better ones, and we have
to have the fortitude of our ownfaith to trust that.
Hey, I want to guide you andhelp you, but at the same time,
you need to make your owndecision when it comes to this,
this or that you know.
And I'm not talking abouthealthy, protective things that

(53:21):
parents need to be doing.
I'm talking about as they getolder, into the high school and
college years.
It's like that needs to bewhere we need to give them more
freedom to make some of thosetougher decisions.

I'll add some context to that.
I mean, I'm a Christian, ben isa Christian, and our
organization itself is anorganization that teaches
competitors, caretakers andcoaches to thrive in the midst
of performance pressure.
That's what we do.
We serve a whole host ofdemographic of people.
We serve people from differentbackgrounds, different

(53:55):
experiences, different cultures,and that's our organizational
goal.
It might be different than ourpersonal missions or our
personal agendas Not even agenda, that's a horrible word but I
would say our personal missionmight be different than the
organizational mission.
We can't help but try to serve,because that's one thing we're

(54:16):
called to and, like Ben said,it's going to come out in who we
are and what we do.
But in terms of an educationalnonprofit versus a religious
nonprofit, champion Forward isan educational nonprofit.
We strive to help as manypeople as we can.
We also see our organization asa place where someone can come

(54:39):
and maybe churn up some thingsin their life that they've maybe
been afraid to churn up.
They maybe want to connect more.
Maybe a parent wants to say hey, I feel super disconnected.
I just want to figure out howto connect better to my young
athlete.
I feel like I'm just a shuttledriver now.
How can I connect to them, or ayoung competitor can come to
the organization and say hey,I'm trying to figure out, I just

(55:01):
don't feel like I'm enough if Idon't produce on the field or
at school, and so we're wantingto provide an environment where
people can start having thosecrucial conversations that can
create deeper connection andpotentially prevent burnout,
reduce isolation and maybe helpwith some of the struggles that
all of us are facing, whetheryou're a competitor or a

(55:22):
caretaker or a coach.

Collin (55:24):
Yeah, I think that's where it happens most
authentically too, when it's notsomething you're forcing, but
it's just something that it'sopen and it's there and you see
it in someone and it just makesyou like what's different about
you.
That's great.
So, as we're wrapping up here,I want to you know.
There's nonprofit leaders whomight be finding a lot of

(55:46):
success.
There's not profit leaders whomight be in a tough place.
What are some of the challengesthat you guys have run into
that you've encountered in thisprocess?
What's some of that?
Maybe, if there's any failstories that might be
entertaining, but whatchallenges have you guys come up
across and how have you workedthrough those?

Ben, I don't have any.
I haven't had a single one.
No challenges, john Zero,that's why you're the VP.

Collin (56:13):
Write the book.
Write the book.
Talk about having the rightpeople.
Man, yeah, how to succeedwithout challenge?

Yeah, knowing him, that's a lie.
No, I think mine has been.
You know, anytime you startsomething new, and especially
when you're building something,it takes a lot of effort and a
lot of time.
And I've got other things goingon in my life too.
This is not the only thing, andso John knows it's hard to find

(56:42):
time.
It's hard for me to like.
I've got to make sure that heand I get to the schedule early
on and then we book our timesand then we try to stick to them
, because there's a lot of otherthings that can take that time
away.
You know, anytime you'rebuilding something new, you're
usually not just, you know,getting rid of everything else
in your life so that you can dothis thing.

(57:03):
You usually have a whole bunchof other things already going
and you're trying to fit thisnew thing in, right?
So that's kind of what we'veboth been doing.
We did that at the start andnow he's full time doing stuff
and I'm still you know, when Ican part time.
We're working hours each week.
I don't know what.
We get 10, 15 hours a weekwhere we really are hard.

(57:25):
I'm hard at it, but he's hardat it, you know, most of the
week, right?
So it's like it's like he andHannah and some of the other
people on the team.
They're working more than I amon it, but also I'm you know
it's a big part of like metrying to fit that in to the
other things that I'm alreadydoing.
So that's been my biggestchallenge at the outset here,
john.
What about you?

Yeah, I would say there's multiple.
And now if I'm speaking to kindof early stage nonprofit
leaders is going to be a littlebit different than speaking to
nonprofit leaders that have beenaround for a while.
I would say the early stage isis simplify things, like just
keep it simple and get an ideaof what you're going to provide,

(58:10):
how you're going to do it, andjust go hammer that for six
months.
Go have conversations I talkabout three C's a lot and find
people that can do one of threethings.
When you're meeting withsomebody, a lot of times people
say, hey, how can I help you?
Know, what can I do to help you?
And I think giving peopleguidance is really helpful.
And so I say, hey, we'relooking for three things.

(58:31):
We're looking for people thatcan connect us.
So there's somebody.
After I've shared with you whatI've shared about who we are
and what we're doing, is thereanybody that comes to mind that
you think I should be connectedwith?
Maybe somebody who has a storyabout a young competitor that is
heartbreaking or wants to knowmore about what we're doing, or
a coach, or somebody that weshould connect with an

(58:52):
organization?
The second C I say is thereanybody that you think I need to
be collaborating with.
Who could I collaborate with?
Is there an organization or amission of another team or
somebody that you're like manwho comes to mind that just says
you know what you guys need tomeet because I think you're
doing something similar and Ithink you all could collaborate,
or who could contribute to whatwe're doing?

(59:12):
So nonprofits not only have theability to generate revenue,
but they also have the abilityto receive donations, and so
there are people who literallyfeel so passionate that their
personal mission is to supportorganizations that they believe
in and that's how theyparticipate, they contribute.
And so if you have the abilityto say, hey, I'm looking to
connect with the right people,collaborate with organizations

(59:34):
and get contributions fromorganizations or from people,
that's really helpful.
So early on, I think going andhaving those types of
conversations with your networkcan just kind of continue to
build.
I've seen a lot of thoseconversations catalyze into some
really profitable things.
The challenge that I have facedis a loneliness.
I shared this with Ben.

(59:55):
It can be very lonely to be anonprofit leader very lonely.
Just the people.
I've been in the business world, I've been in the nonprofit
world.
Most people have a perception ofnonprofit leaders of, wow,
they're serving, they're intheir sweet spot, they must just
be so fulfilled and it's like,actually it's extremely

(01:00:17):
difficult.
It's very, very difficult andat times it can be very, very
lonely because there's onlycertain people that understand
the weight of serving theconstituents that you do.
I'll just give you an exampleI'm getting an email almost
every other day of organizationsthat have stories of pain, of

(01:00:39):
people that have had kids who'vekilled themselves and are now
starting a foundation because ofthe pressure they were under,
and so people don't realize whatI'm getting every day and
seeing every day and exposingmyself to.
And yet then I'm having to gocarry out 50 to 75 things on my
to-do list and manage the teamthat we have and talk with
donors and plan events, and sothere's so many levers and

(01:01:02):
responsibilities that you'repulling and I love it.
I'm not complaining.
I'm just saying that times itcan be lonely, and so the
challenge with that is and wetalk about this organization is
who do I need to connect with?
And we look at really threephases Do I need to connect with
myself?
I might just be lonely formyself.
Where's John in this?
Am I starting to wear this as aburden and an identity.
Do I need to connect with God?

(01:01:22):
Do I need to spend some timeand figure out OK, lord, am I
just performing here?
Where are you?
What role are you playing?
Do I need to connect withothers?
Who in my life do I need to bespending time with and being
able to be lifted up or justhave a place where I can share?
But I would say, if you're anonprofit leader out there,
connect with other nonprofitleaders, because if you can find

(01:01:43):
peers who are doing similarthings to you and you can
connect and just share, there'sso much power in that and it can
provide just the space and there-energize moments that you
need to continue to sustain.

Collin (01:01:57):
That's amazing.

Heredes (01:01:58):
That's powerful.

Collin (01:02:00):
This has been an incredible conversation, guys.
Thank you so much.
As we wrap up here, any lastnugget to wisdom, whether it's
to nonprofit leaders, to coaches, to athletes, parents of
athletes, any last words.

Ben Zobrist (01:02:16):
My last words would just be to just keep doing your
own work.
The adults have to do.
We have to do our own work.
If we don't do our work on adaily basis, how can we expect
kids to do it?

Collin (01:02:32):
Yeah, that's great.
Yeah, I would say that'sinternal work.

Ben Zobrist (01:02:36):
That's internal work.
A lot of us we're doingexternal, a lot of external work
.
Out there I'm saying do yourown internal work.
That's the work that nobodysees, but it's the most
important in my opinion.

John Harrison (01:02:52):
Connect to your story.
I would say the value that I'veseen is just connecting to your
story with curiosity and notjudgment.
Connect to where you come from,connect to why you believe what
you believe, why you operatethe way that you do, and that
self-awareness can bring just anext level of emotional
attachability and connectivitythat will just completely

(01:03:15):
transform the human experiencefor you and your different
relationships.
So the power of connecting toyour own story with curiosity, I
think is a very important thing.
I love it.
Colin, I feel inspired.

Heredes (01:03:28):
I need to go do some work, man.
I need to go take my kids outof everything.
I'm not, I'm not.
This was helpful, guys.
Definitely.
I feel like a personaltherapeutic session for me, so I
appreciate the health I'mgetting out of this.
I will say Colin before you wrapno, we're going to list
everything For those who listeneven to the Cs, whether it's
collaborating, whether it'scontributing, whether it's just

(01:03:49):
making sure that you'reconnecting.
Make sure you connect with Benand with John and reach out.
This is part of why we do this,is creating this community, and
we're better together,especially when the values align
.
So don't hesitate Today, reachout, send an email.
We'll make sure everything islisted and all the platforms in
supporting and inquiring moreinformation or even

(01:04:10):
collaborating with what they'redoing.

Collin (01:04:12):
Yeah, and what I wanted to call out is you've heard the
heart behind Champion Ford andthis organization and what
they're trying to do.
It's not, they're not making itjust to play for themselves.
They've got their skin in thegame and they've really thought
it through.
And so, man, reach out, reachout to them, get them connected,
bring them out.
I think it'll be game changerfor your kids.

(01:04:34):
So, guys, john Ben, thank youso much for joining us today.
Thank you to those of you whoare listening, jumping in.
We will be right back here nexttime on the nonprofit
Renaissance.
Have a good one.

Outro (01:04:45):
Thanks again for listening to the nonprofit
Renaissance.
We hope it ignites aRenaissance in you and helps you
go further and grow faster.
Be sure to share, rate andsubscribe, and if you'd like to
recommend or be a guest on ourshow, send us an email at
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#18 - Champion Forward: How World Series MVP Ben Zobrist is Helping Young Athletes Thrive On and Off the Field

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}#18 - Champion Forward: How World Series MVP Ben Zobrist is Helping Young Athletes Thrive On and Off the Field