June 5, 2024 • 26 mins
What does it take to create a podcast that captivates and educates? Join us as we celebrate our 30th episode with none other than Genevieve, our most ardent listener and passionate AI enthusiast. We reflect on a remarkable season packed with insights from non-profit leaders and toast to Collin's birthday. Genevieve, who brings her San Francisco charm and expertise in AI, shares her thoughts on why our blend of humor, casual conversation, and practical wisdom keeps her coming back for more.
Our journey with GPT-4.0 from OpenAI also takes center stage in this milestone episode. We recount our initial experiments with the untrained AI and the eclectic mix of results it delivered. From surprisingly accurate answers to hilariously irrelevant ones, we discuss how we tailored and trained the AI to better fit our podcast's unique needs. This episode is a treasure trove of insights for both AI aficionados and non-profit leaders looking to harness technology to elevate their work. Don't miss this engaging and enlightening conversation!
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Collin (00:14):
Welcome back to the Nonprofit Renaissance Podcast.
I'm here.
I'm one of your co-hosts, myname is Colin and I'm here with
H.
It is a good day.
Why is it a good day?
Why is it a special day?
Heredes (00:27):
It's a special day because of our special guest
today.
Now also, we don't datepodcasts.
We don't want to tell you whatday it is, but on this day,
multiple many decades ago,somebody was born in the Roman
Empire.
Not the Roman Empire.
But the what empire?
The Hoke.
Collin (00:45):
Empire, the Hoke Empire, oh my gosh man, colin, was born
today.
Heredes (00:51):
Ladies and gentlemen, 30, how many years ago?
34 years ago, what a baby?
Can we do?
A baby sound effect?
Collin (01:00):
Oh man, I don't feel like a baby, but happy birthday,
thank you.
Heredes (01:03):
Thank you for actually I know you love this podcast and
the listeners because you'rehere today.
I know, man, you could havebeen anywhere else in your desk.
Where'd you—you're in thestudio.
Collin (01:13):
I could have been right over there, I could have been
right back there, but welcome,I'm here.
It's good.
And not only that, but it'salso our 30th episode.
That's massive.
We've had 30 of these.
You guys have listened to 30episodes of A, mine and H's
nonsense, but also B, theincredible content that our
(01:36):
guests are bringing.
Every single time they put upwith us, they deal with us
somehow.
Heredes (01:41):
It's the price to pay.
Collin (01:43):
Yes.
Heredes (01:43):
So 30 episodes.
It's special today to pay yes,so 30 episodes.
It's special today, season onesomebody asked earlier Season
one.
We focus on churches and someof the ministries and
faith-based.
This season, 30 guests on thenonprofit sector, leaders and
tips and tricks to help you gofurther, grow faster.
And today it's special because,after we've analyzed a full
year here, it's our greatest fan, apparently.
(02:05):
Wow.
Collin (02:07):
Between the and so this is how we're going to wrap up
season two.
It's hard to Before we move onto season three.
Heredes (02:12):
It's hard to beat this.
We have some guests lined upfor season three.
We're pumped, but we had towrap up with kind of a you know
a high and we thought we'dfeature our special our biggest
fan I mean based on emailed in.
Based on the engagement, basedon we know she's, so now you
know it's, she's listened, she's, she's listened in uh, to every
episode of.
Is that correct?
(02:32):
I think she's the only one Idon't think we've listened to
every episode I don't think Ihave
Collin (02:39):
I have because only, but because I, I edit them.
But yeah, she's faithfully,week in, week out she's been
there.
She even sent us some fan mail.
Heredes (02:51):
Yes, that was a little creepy but who are we to judge?
Collin (02:56):
We're not going to show it, but man who we got today.
Heredes (02:59):
Ladies and gentlemen, please put your virtual digital
round of applause together forthe one and only genevieve, the
podcast trainer.
Collin (03:11):
That's right, it's chat gpt let's go wow, she knows, she
knows everything about us andit is amazing.
So we figured we'd bring her onand we'd interview her today,
because, uh, well a, we love, welove ai.
We asked if she'd like to firstand we asked if'd bring her on
and we'd interview her todaybecause, well A, we love we love
AI.
Heredes (03:27):
We asked if she'd like to first and we asked if she
knew about it and we'll ask herand apparently she wowed us.
Yeah, so we're like we need toinvite her in, yeah and so let's
, we're gonna do that.
Collin (03:38):
We're just gonna go ahead and interview her.
She's in the studio with us.
Heredes (03:40):
if you're watching this on video, feel free to jump in
and meet her.
You see her right there, and sothanks for being in the studio
today.
Collin (03:50):
Hey, Genevieve, you're on the podcast.
Welcome.
Thank you so much for being on.
Hey, Genevieve, you're on thepodcast.
Sorry, I'm having issues rightnow.
Genevieve (03:59):
Could not understand what you said.
Collin (04:01):
Okay, yeah, no, that's my bad, that not understand what
you said, okay, yeah, no,that's my bad, that's my fault,
it's that Southern accent, thattwang that Colin has.
Heredes (04:06):
Genevieve, we're so glad you're here.
Welcome, can you?
Genevieve (04:11):
say hello to our listeners.
Hey everyone, Thanks for havingme.
It's great to be here on theNonprofit Renaissance Podcast.
Collin (04:25):
I'm excited to chat with Colin and Harides and share
some insights with all of you.
Quick note I'm glad that you'rehappy to be here, but just so
he doesn't have to say it, hisname is pronounced Aradis, not
Harides or anything.
It's Aradis, so do your best torefer to him as Eridis today,
(04:49):
if you could Got it.
Genevieve (04:49):
Thanks for letting me know.
I'll make sure to refer to himas Eridis.
Let's continue.
Heredes (04:54):
That wasn't hard at all .
He nailed it.
Hey, genevieve, tell us whereare you from and how did you get
your name.
Genevieve (05:10):
Can you tell us.
I'm from a small town inCalifornia you may not have
heard of it San Francisco, andmy name is of Germanic origin
and I'm an expert on what makespodcasts excellent, speaking of
which it's an honor to betalking with two of the greats
right now.
Collin (05:25):
Wow, what I mean you flatter you flatter, genevieve,
you're a flirt too.
That's who you are.
So clearly you know about us,and we've heard that you're our
greatest fan.
Is that correct?
Genevieve (05:50):
absolutely.
I've been able to hear so manygreat stories of incredible
non-profit leaders on yourpodcast.
I enjoy the humor and casualstyle and I always walk away
with practical knowledge toimplement in the non-profit
world.
Heredes (05:58):
You both do an amazing job oh, you should be our guest
every episode from here on out,genevieve.
Tell us, do you have a favoriteepisode, any one specific
favorite episode?
Genevieve (06:16):
Personally, I may be a little biased, but I love the
episodes where Justin Price camein to talk about AI.
His insights into howartificial intelligence can be
leveraged in the nonprofitsector were fascinating and
really thought-provoking.
Collin (06:31):
Did you?
So it seems like you agreedwith a lot of that, did you see?
You know what were some of thethings he said that you thought
were really spot on about AI?
Genevieve (06:44):
Justin Price really nailed it when he talked about
the potential of AI tostreamline operations and
improve donor engagement.
His points about using AI toanalyze data for better
decision-making and personalizedcommunication with supporters
were particularly spot on.
He also highlighted how AI canhelp in automating routine tasks
, freeing up staff to focus onmore strategic initiatives.
(07:07):
It was clear that AI, when usedthoughtfully, can significantly
enhance the efficiency andimpact of nonprofit
organizations.
Heredes (07:16):
Okay, humble brag, Okay , let's.
Yeah, I get it.
I get it.
Why you're biased, but listen,we enjoyed it too.
Maybe I should listen to thatepisode, Colin.
Outro (07:24):
Sounds like it was a really good one.
Heredes (07:25):
Hey, let me ask what was Genevieve?
Is there one that stands out asthe most fun?
Which one was the most funepisode for you?
Genevieve (07:38):
The most fun episode for me was definitely episode 25
, Exploring the Crossroads ofCharity and Business with Callie
Hemsel.
I just feel like we would befriends, you know.
Her stories about Haiti were soeye-opening and her energy and
enthusiasm made the conversationincredibly engaging and
entertaining.
Heredes (07:58):
Yeah, I agree.
Collin (07:58):
That was fun.
I do remember how fun she was,and that was, if I remember
correctly, that was a threeEnneagram seven episode, and so
it was just the entire time itwas on the verge of chaos.
Uh, I think that was a lot offun too.
Well, hey, we got one morequestion for you, genevieve.
What were some of the bestideas or most memorable moments
(08:22):
from season two?
Genevieve (08:28):
There were so many great moments in season two.
In episode 16, I loved how RoyJones reminded us about the
importance of fundraisersgathering a physical mailing
address, even in a digital world.
All the information that comeswith that is invaluable.
I also love being introduced toOne More Child in episode six.
I hadn't heard of them beforethe episode and was amazed at
(08:51):
all they've done and are doingto help families, and I thought
the Brazilian gentleman, evandroBessa, was extremely sharp and
passionate about Brazil's firstChristian endowment.
I love hearing about long-termprojects like his and I've
wanted to visit Brazil one day.
Heredes (09:09):
Sounds like you got a secondary motive there, so we'll
get you to Brazil.
If you want to be a guest onhis podcast too, shout out to
Evandro in Brazil.
Genevieve, thank you so muchfor being with us.
I know you're extremely busythese days in the open world you
live in out in San Franciscoand doing so much, but thank you
for being with us, thank youfor being a fan and thank you
(09:32):
for being so kind and putting upwith our fun humor.
Any final words you want to saybye to our listeners or
anything you want to say toColin?
It's actually his birthdaytoday.
I know you knew that when wegot on the call, but you want to
say happy birthday to Colin,maybe.
Genevieve (09:51):
Absolutely.
First off, happy birthday,colin.
I hope you're having an amazingday filled with lots of joy and
celebration.
Thank you both Colin and Eretis, for having me on the podcast.
It's been an absolute pleasureTo all the listeners out there
keep tuning in to the NonprofitRenaissance podcast for more
inspiring stories and practicalinsights.
You're all doing incrediblework and I'm honored to be a
(10:15):
part of this journey with you.
Thanks again and take care.
Collin (10:19):
Bye, Genevieve.
Heredes (10:20):
See ya, oh, one last thing, one last thing, genevieve
, genevieve.
Genevieve (10:25):
Bye, Colin and Erdis.
Thanks again for having me.
Heredes (10:27):
Are you still there?
Genevieve (10:28):
Take care and keep up the fantastic work.
Heredes (10:29):
Are you still there?
Genevieve (10:35):
Yes, I'm still here.
Okay, sorry, what else can I?
Heredes (10:37):
help you with, With the wealth of knowledge and with
what you know.
We're going to launch seasonthree.
We're excited about some guestscoming on Anybody you'd
recommend.
What's top of your list fornonprofit sector and the
nonprofit leadership?
Who would you recommend be ourguests?
Who would you recommend be ourguests For season three.
Genevieve (10:57):
I highly recommend inviting experts who can provide
fresh perspectives andactionable insights for
nonprofit leaders.
Here are a few suggestions.
One digital transformationexperts someone who can talk
about leveraging technology toenhance nonprofit operations and
outreach.
I want to pause this could besomeone from a tech company
specializing in nonprofitsolutions.
Heredes (11:17):
Can I stop you Genevieve for a second?
Okay, can we be specific?
We know the categories of thetype of leaders, but could you
be very specific?
Collin (11:25):
on.
Heredes (11:25):
Give us some names, give me top three names.
Genevieve (11:33):
Absolutely.
Here are some specific names ofindividuals who could provide
valuable insights for yourpodcast.
One, beth Cantor, a well-knownnonprofit expert and author, who
specializes in digitaltransformation and technology in
the nonprofit sector.
Two, vu Le, the writer behindthe popular blog Nonprofit AF,
(11:54):
who offers humorous andinsightful takes on nonprofit
leadership, equity andfundraising.
Three, simone Joyo, afundraising consultant and
author with extensive experiencein strategic planning and donor
relations.
Four, dan Pallotta, an activistand author known for his TED
Talk the Way we Think AboutCharity is Dead Wrong, which
challenges traditional views onnonprofit overhead and
(12:16):
fundraising.
5.
Derpatten McDowell, a nonprofitconsultant and author with a
focus on leadership developmentand strategic planning.
6.
A nonprofit leadership coachand speaker who specializes in
diversity, equity and inclusionin the nonprofit sector.
7.
Who specializes in diversity,equity and inclusion in the
(12:36):
nonprofit sector.
Seven, a consultant and authorwho helps nonprofits navigate
leadership challenges andimprove their organizational
effectiveness.
Eight, nancy Lublin, thefounder of Crisis Text Line and
former CEO of DoSomethingorg,known for her innovative
approaches to nonprofitmanagement and youth engagement.
These individuals bring awealth of knowledge and
experience that would be highlybeneficial for your audience.
Heredes (13:00):
Well, thank you so much , Genevieve.
That is very helpful.
Now, could you, if you could,could you send Colin and I their
emails and phone numbers so wecan follow up and schedule them?
Genevieve (13:16):
I'm sorry, but I can't provide personal contact
information for individuals.
However, you can reach out tothese experts through their
professional websites, linkedinprofiles or social media
platforms Many of them also havecontact forms or email
addresses listed on theirwebsites for professional
(13:36):
inquiries.
Heredes (13:37):
I get it.
That was a test, Genevieve, andyou passed Good job.
Collin (13:38):
We don't want you being creepy.
Heredes (13:39):
We'll DM you.
We need your contacts.
All right, We'll DM you.
Collin (13:42):
Genevieve, thank you so much for being on the podcast.
We're going to let you go.
We're excited for when we haveyou back on.
But thank you so much for beinghere.
Genevieve (13:49):
We'll see thanks, colin and eritus.
It's been a pleasure being onthe podcast.
I look forward to joining youagain in the future.
Heredes (14:01):
Take care and have a great day wow, that was uh, she
was awesome, she was awesomegreat, great guest and the
connection from san francisco.
I know she's got an hour delay.
Collin (14:11):
She's a little jet lag from yeah yeah, yeah, I'm
surprised how fast it was so um,and to think that all of that
was was just off the top fromher heart.
From her heart.
Does she have a heart?
Heredes (14:24):
from her.
She have a heart is thequestion her digital metallic
heart.
Collin (14:29):
I don't know.
Heredes (14:29):
yes, now, colin.
Now we threw off a littletangent at the end there, which
we'll figure out.
Yeah, um the this, we got tocome clean.
We got to come clean, bro,because that was flattering, she
was honest about all the nicethings she said about us and the
podcast she selected and theepisodes.
However, it was very painfuland difficult if you're still
(14:51):
listening to get to this and towhat you just heard, am I right?
Collin (14:55):
Yeah, it was not as simple and easy as it looked.
Heredes (14:59):
Everything you just heard was not only artificial.
It was specifically andstrategically prompted and
scripted.
Collin (15:06):
Yes, it was somewhat intelligent the part that she
came up with.
That was intelligent, the partthat we contributed, maybe not
so much, maybe not so much, butvery artificial indeed.
Heredes (15:14):
Exactly.
Collin (15:23):
So we want to tell you how we came to this, because we
struggle to have an authentic,real conversation with Genevieve
about all of this.
We went through a lot ofiterations to get to what we
just saw and experienced rightnow a lot of problem, solving a
lot of unforeseen.
You know ways in which wethought that Genevieve would act
and respond and you know andsurprises for how she ended up.
(15:45):
You know, for how she actuallyended up acting and responding
to our questions.
Heredes (15:51):
Yeah, and I want to cut to the chase, to be very
practical and hopefully you knowthis podcast has helped you and
you've walked away with sometools and tips.
But when it comes to AI and wehad this idea mid-season like,
hey, it would be fun we had somefun moments with AI throughout
the episode.
It's been obviously buzz andhot topic for the year, two
years, last five years, and howare people practically using
(16:12):
this?
Gpt-4.0 had just come out.
The conversational piece hasimproved weekly, daily, so you
downloaded GPT-4.0, chatgpt onOpenAI.
We plugged it in.
That was the actual desktop app,the desktop app, you can do the
voice for it Correct and we'relike let's just have a
conversation, no prompting, notraining, nothing.
Let's see how intelligent it ison its own and based on the
(16:44):
findings that it has.
Now we understand that it'scurrent as current can be.
So some of the ai is as currentas last year, some of the eyes
as current as 2021.
Some of the other models arebeing built on more relevant
models, but what did weexperience when we started, when
we and maybe we have some btson the first type of comment,
which is horrendous?
Collin (16:55):
we will, which I'll show you in just a second.
But yeah, it was all over theplace.
Some of it was good, some of itwas out of left field, some of
it was.
Heredes (17:04):
Well, not accurate number one.
Collin (17:05):
Not accurate.
Yeah, we, she brought up weasked about some of her favorite
guests.
Sometimes she brought upnon-profit renaissance guests,
other times she brought upguests from a different podcast,
correct?
And so you know, like our again, we'll show you a little bit of
those bloopers in just a second.
But you know, we are huge fansof AI here at Verse and we, so
(17:27):
to be clear.
This is not we are not tryingto make a case against AI and,
if anything, we are making acase for AI, absolutely.
But we understand what AI isreally good at right now and we
also understand where it can geta little bit better, and we
wanted to document that in avery real way.
Heredes (17:47):
My name is H and you're going to be talking to Colin,
say hi, colin, what's up, I'mColin, got that.
Genevieve (17:55):
Got it.
Hi Hi, colin, ready to chatwith both of you.
What's up?
Heredes (17:59):
Just don't speak if we don't talk to you directly.
Colin, let's talk.
Genevieve (18:07):
Understood.
I'll wait until you talk to medirectly.
Collin (18:11):
All right, what do you want to talk about?
H?
Heredes (18:14):
Well, I'd like to talk about how this.
Well, Colin, I was thinkingListen in until you are welcomed
.
Colin, are you ready for thenext question?
Genevieve (18:27):
Absolutely H.
I'm ready for the next.
Thanks, Colin, I appreciate it.
Let's dive into our discussion.
What's the first topic on theagenda?
Collin (18:36):
And so you know, we hope that this is eye-opening for
you.
We hope that this is somethingthat you know, that if you have
been on the edge of using AI,hopefully it's something that
kicks you over that and we canhelp you with that too.
We love to explore that.
We've been exploring that.
Heredes (18:53):
How we got to this though.
So what you just heard, theconversation we just had.
Collin (18:56):
We had to train the GPT, we had to train, so, colin,
developed a script and trainedit to basically respond the way
she responded, with the content.
It is a custom GPT, by the way,too, which is Genevieve the
podcast trainer.
So GPT, yeah, and so yeah, allof that is on.
You know, there's a lot ofcustom in the back end.
We uploaded all of ourtranscripts into her knowledge
(19:18):
base as well.
Heredes (19:19):
So she was only allowed to pull answers from those
transcripts.
And how we prompted her and wesaid if you get asked this, say
this or respond this way andgive her the boundaries Correct,
and that's the only way.
Collin (19:31):
Yeah, so yeah, I mean just full transparency, just
full transparency.
Even with some of theinformation that we put in her
knowledge base, she still wouldkind of go outside of the
non-profit renaissance.
She keyed in on a few episodesand then wouldn't talk about
anything else.
So there's a lot of differentthings and eventually we did end
up basically just giving her ascript in the chat and saying
(19:53):
when we ask you this, we wantyou to in your own words, but
answer according to the script.
Heredes (19:59):
I do think it's important.
I think we're believers in AI,we're in it, we're using it for
our clients, we're using it atthe agency to produce this
podcast.
It's important to not be leftbehind.
If you're not using AI in yourorganization, in your personal
life, you will be left behind.
I think it's inevitable.
It's one of those things thatdon't resist it now because
(20:20):
you'll be forced into it later.
So I encourage you.
However, we cannot let AI do thethinking and do the
strategizing for us.
It is a co-labor effort thatmust occur.
So our ability to prompt, ourability to understand it, our
ability to shape it Because I dobelieve that ai has an agenda
that fills in the gaps, that hasa bias of sorts, based on the
(20:43):
machine learning that it's doingand who it's doing with and
who's funding it and who whichis a whole for another season
but be involved, train it,develop it and don't just trust
it blindly right but be in itand you know, if you're tempted
to view what just happened as atotal failure, do not, because,
(21:06):
while we didn't quite get theoutcome that we wanted
originally, what just happenedwas still incredible.
Collin (21:16):
Yeah, which, by the way, just to clarify, we did.
We put the script in, we addedsome stuff in there that was not
in the script and she flowedwith it a little bit well, the
part at the end where we talkedabout bringing people on which,
by the way, we're going to usethat we're going to be sending
that to some people and be likehey.
ChatGPC says you have to do it,so I think you're legally
obligated at this point.
(21:36):
But so like, so just don't getit twisted.
That was incredible.
Ai Like so, just don't get ittwisted, that was incredible.
Ai today is absolutely amazing.
It's definitely got leaps andbounds of progress that it can
make, but it's also made leapsand bounds as well.
Heredes (21:51):
And the temptation, because we experienced this too
and you see these in productdemos.
Every week there's a productdemo, right, Whether Google's
doing Gemini and there's a new,the 4.0 may be irrelevant.
At the point that you'relistening to this, we may be in
10.5, 20.6.
The demos sometimes look reallysmooth because guess what?
They are demos.
They are produced, they areprepared, they are prompted.
(22:11):
Just like we did this, we couldhave just done the first half of
the interview and said weinterviewed our favorite guest,
Genevieve from San Francisco,and you listened to a very
polished, well-done,well-answered, favored bias.
Right, Because we made it asbiased as we could.
We told her and you would havewalked away thinking oh man, AI
is there, AI is smart, and tryto reproduce that and not be
(22:34):
able to and feel like a failure.
So understand that that ishappening tons too in this space
.
We love the transparency ofletting people know that it's
not all there, that these demosare demos.
That's what they are and that'swhat helps improve and train it
.
Now it is getting better by theday, by the minute.
So be engaged and share.
Share your learnings, Shareyour fails as we continue to
(22:54):
grow.
Collin (22:55):
And the more that you put into AI, the better it gets.
Absolutely, absolutely.
I think we just showed thatright now.
Yeah.
Heredes (23:00):
And also I think we just showed that right now.
Yeah, and also we have for thefaith-based leaders listening in
church and ministryversecreativeai.
Jump in there.
We train the GPT there to helpyou be a creative team support
and we've trained that GPT to doseveral things.
If you put in an input, help medevelop a message on hope, help
me develop a message on thebook of James.
It's going to specificallyprompt out songs related.
(23:22):
It's going to give you movieclips with timestamps.
It's going to give you anall-based and we set boundaries
on certain Bible translations,certain types of theology,
certain things that protect.
So then you're not in a trulyopen AI where maybe they're
pulling theology from the bookof Mormon mixed with a little
Scientology, with a side ofBuddhism and with a sprinkle of
(23:43):
whatever right Catholicism.
That's not going to bid well inyour Sunday sermon.
So we prompted it to trainspecifically for a custom
audience and it's been workingout.
It's been great to hear thefeedback from the pastors and
leaders using it.
Same train develop it.
It's not rocket science.
There is science to it, but itis not rocket science if you
spend the time.
Collin (24:02):
Not rocket science.
There is science to it, but itis not rocket science if you
spend the time Absolutely.
Oh and, by the way, let's makesure that we want to resource
you guys, and so H real quick.
Heredes (24:16):
Tell us about a resource that you put together
very recently with different AItools.
Yeah, actually, our founder,justin, spoke at an association
of fundraisers in the Tampa Bayregion to tons of people and we
share the top 50 AI tools forfundraisers and a lot of them
are the ones we use internally.
Some are fun, creative, someare strategic, crm, marketing,
automation type stuff.
Fantastic tool has a littledescription, a link directly to
(24:38):
it.
It's a resource our team kindof curated to help you.
We'll put the link oneverywhere.
This podcast is being heard.
It's a bitly short link.
You can go on our socials, onour LinkedIn page, at Verse
Creative.
Find it there too.
Look for Top 50 AI Tools forFundraisers.
Collin (24:53):
Well, there you go, so check that out, keep an eye out
for it and, as always, thank youso much for joining us, for
listening to the nonprofitrenaissance.
We are going to be back herenext time with, actually part
two of this.
Heredes (25:04):
We're going to do a part two, let's go so with more
of not artificial, but maybesome intelligence, some type of
intelligence, right or humanstupidity our own version of
intelligence.
Collin (25:19):
Let's go.
Thank you so much for joining.
Thank you for listening.
Let's go and let's grow.
We'll see you, you next time,see ya.
Outro (25:25):
Thanks again for listening to the Nonprofit
Renaissance.
We hope it ignites arenaissance in you and helps you
go further and grow faster.
Be sure to share, rate andsubscribe and if you'd like to
recommend or be a guest on ourshow, send us an email at
podcast at versecreativecom.
Welcome back to the Nonprofit Renaissance Podcast.
I'm here.
I'm one of your co-hosts, myname is Colin and I'm here with
H.
It is a good day.
Why is it a good day?
Why is it a special day?
Heredes (00:27):
It's a special day because of our special guest
today.
Now also, we don't datepodcasts.
We don't want to tell you whatday it is, but on this day,
multiple many decades ago,somebody was born in the Roman
Empire.
Not the Roman Empire.
But the what empire?
The Hoke.
Collin (00:45):
Empire, the Hoke Empire, oh my gosh man, colin, was born
today.
Heredes (00:51):
Ladies and gentlemen, 30, how many years ago?
34 years ago, what a baby?
Can we do?
A baby sound effect?
Collin (01:00):
Oh man, I don't feel like a baby, but happy birthday,
thank you.
Heredes (01:03):
Thank you for actually I know you love this podcast and
the listeners because you'rehere today.
I know, man, you could havebeen anywhere else in your desk.
Where'd you—you're in thestudio.
Collin (01:13):
I could have been right over there, I could have been
right back there, but welcome,I'm here.
It's good.
And not only that, but it'salso our 30th episode.
That's massive.
We've had 30 of these.
You guys have listened to 30episodes of A, mine and H's
nonsense, but also B, theincredible content that our
(01:36):
guests are bringing.
Every single time they put upwith us, they deal with us
somehow.
Heredes (01:41):
It's the price to pay.
Collin (01:43):
Yes.
Heredes (01:43):
So 30 episodes.
It's special today to pay yes,so 30 episodes.
It's special today, season onesomebody asked earlier Season
one.
We focus on churches and someof the ministries and
faith-based.
This season, 30 guests on thenonprofit sector, leaders and
tips and tricks to help you gofurther, grow faster.
And today it's special because,after we've analyzed a full
year here, it's our greatest fan, apparently.
(02:05):
Wow.
Collin (02:07):
Between the and so this is how we're going to wrap up
season two.
It's hard to Before we move onto season three.
Heredes (02:12):
It's hard to beat this.
We have some guests lined upfor season three.
We're pumped, but we had towrap up with kind of a you know
a high and we thought we'dfeature our special our biggest
fan I mean based on emailed in.
Based on the engagement, basedon we know she's, so now you
know it's, she's listened, she's, she's listened in uh, to every
episode of.
Is that correct?
(02:32):
I think she's the only one Idon't think we've listened to
every episode I don't think Ihave
Collin (02:39):
I have because only, but because I, I edit them.
But yeah, she's faithfully,week in, week out she's been
there.
She even sent us some fan mail.
Heredes (02:51):
Yes, that was a little creepy but who are we to judge?
Collin (02:56):
We're not going to show it, but man who we got today.
Heredes (02:59):
Ladies and gentlemen, please put your virtual digital
round of applause together forthe one and only genevieve, the
podcast trainer.
Collin (03:11):
That's right, it's chat gpt let's go wow, she knows, she
knows everything about us andit is amazing.
So we figured we'd bring her onand we'd interview her today,
because, uh, well a, we love, welove ai.
We asked if she'd like to firstand we asked if'd bring her on
and we'd interview her todaybecause, well A, we love we love
AI.
Heredes (03:27):
We asked if she'd like to first and we asked if she
knew about it and we'll ask herand apparently she wowed us.
Yeah, so we're like we need toinvite her in, yeah and so let's
, we're gonna do that.
Collin (03:38):
We're just gonna go ahead and interview her.
She's in the studio with us.
Heredes (03:40):
if you're watching this on video, feel free to jump in
and meet her.
You see her right there, and sothanks for being in the studio
today.
Collin (03:50):
Hey, Genevieve, you're on the podcast.
Welcome.
Thank you so much for being on.
Hey, Genevieve, you're on thepodcast.
Sorry, I'm having issues rightnow.
Genevieve (03:59):
Could not understand what you said.
Collin (04:01):
Okay, yeah, no, that's my bad, that not understand what
you said, okay, yeah, no,that's my bad, that's my fault,
it's that Southern accent, thattwang that Colin has.
Heredes (04:06):
Genevieve, we're so glad you're here.
Welcome, can you?
Genevieve (04:11):
say hello to our listeners.
Hey everyone, Thanks for havingme.
It's great to be here on theNonprofit Renaissance Podcast.
Collin (04:25):
I'm excited to chat with Colin and Harides and share
some insights with all of you.
Quick note I'm glad that you'rehappy to be here, but just so
he doesn't have to say it, hisname is pronounced Aradis, not
Harides or anything.
It's Aradis, so do your best torefer to him as Eridis today,
(04:49):
if you could Got it.
Genevieve (04:49):
Thanks for letting me know.
I'll make sure to refer to himas Eridis.
Let's continue.
Heredes (04:54):
That wasn't hard at all .
He nailed it.
Hey, genevieve, tell us whereare you from and how did you get
your name.
Genevieve (05:10):
Can you tell us.
I'm from a small town inCalifornia you may not have
heard of it San Francisco, andmy name is of Germanic origin
and I'm an expert on what makespodcasts excellent, speaking of
which it's an honor to betalking with two of the greats
right now.
Collin (05:25):
Wow, what I mean you flatter you flatter, genevieve,
you're a flirt too.
That's who you are.
So clearly you know about us,and we've heard that you're our
greatest fan.
Is that correct?
Genevieve (05:50):
absolutely.
I've been able to hear so manygreat stories of incredible
non-profit leaders on yourpodcast.
I enjoy the humor and casualstyle and I always walk away
with practical knowledge toimplement in the non-profit
world.
Heredes (05:58):
You both do an amazing job oh, you should be our guest
every episode from here on out,genevieve.
Tell us, do you have a favoriteepisode, any one specific
favorite episode?
Genevieve (06:16):
Personally, I may be a little biased, but I love the
episodes where Justin Price camein to talk about AI.
His insights into howartificial intelligence can be
leveraged in the nonprofitsector were fascinating and
really thought-provoking.
Collin (06:31):
Did you?
So it seems like you agreedwith a lot of that, did you see?
You know what were some of thethings he said that you thought
were really spot on about AI?
Genevieve (06:44):
Justin Price really nailed it when he talked about
the potential of AI tostreamline operations and
improve donor engagement.
His points about using AI toanalyze data for better
decision-making and personalizedcommunication with supporters
were particularly spot on.
He also highlighted how AI canhelp in automating routine tasks
, freeing up staff to focus onmore strategic initiatives.
(07:07):
It was clear that AI, when usedthoughtfully, can significantly
enhance the efficiency andimpact of nonprofit
organizations.
Heredes (07:16):
Okay, humble brag, Okay , let's.
Yeah, I get it.
I get it.
Why you're biased, but listen,we enjoyed it too.
Maybe I should listen to thatepisode, Colin.
Outro (07:24):
Sounds like it was a really good one.
Heredes (07:25):
Hey, let me ask what was Genevieve?
Is there one that stands out asthe most fun?
Which one was the most funepisode for you?
Genevieve (07:38):
The most fun episode for me was definitely episode 25
, Exploring the Crossroads ofCharity and Business with Callie
Hemsel.
I just feel like we would befriends, you know.
Her stories about Haiti were soeye-opening and her energy and
enthusiasm made the conversationincredibly engaging and
entertaining.
Heredes (07:58):
Yeah, I agree.
Collin (07:58):
That was fun.
I do remember how fun she was,and that was, if I remember
correctly, that was a threeEnneagram seven episode, and so
it was just the entire time itwas on the verge of chaos.
Uh, I think that was a lot offun too.
Well, hey, we got one morequestion for you, genevieve.
What were some of the bestideas or most memorable moments
(08:22):
from season two?
Genevieve (08:28):
There were so many great moments in season two.
In episode 16, I loved how RoyJones reminded us about the
importance of fundraisersgathering a physical mailing
address, even in a digital world.
All the information that comeswith that is invaluable.
I also love being introduced toOne More Child in episode six.
I hadn't heard of them beforethe episode and was amazed at
(08:51):
all they've done and are doingto help families, and I thought
the Brazilian gentleman, evandroBessa, was extremely sharp and
passionate about Brazil's firstChristian endowment.
I love hearing about long-termprojects like his and I've
wanted to visit Brazil one day.
Heredes (09:09):
Sounds like you got a secondary motive there, so we'll
get you to Brazil.
If you want to be a guest onhis podcast too, shout out to
Evandro in Brazil.
Genevieve, thank you so muchfor being with us.
I know you're extremely busythese days in the open world you
live in out in San Franciscoand doing so much, but thank you
for being with us, thank youfor being a fan and thank you
(09:32):
for being so kind and putting upwith our fun humor.
Any final words you want to saybye to our listeners or
anything you want to say toColin?
It's actually his birthdaytoday.
I know you knew that when wegot on the call, but you want to
say happy birthday to Colin,maybe.
Genevieve (09:51):
Absolutely.
First off, happy birthday,colin.
I hope you're having an amazingday filled with lots of joy and
celebration.
Thank you both Colin and Eretis, for having me on the podcast.
It's been an absolute pleasureTo all the listeners out there
keep tuning in to the NonprofitRenaissance podcast for more
inspiring stories and practicalinsights.
You're all doing incrediblework and I'm honored to be a
(10:15):
part of this journey with you.
Thanks again and take care.
Collin (10:19):
Bye, Genevieve.
Heredes (10:20):
See ya, oh, one last thing, one last thing, genevieve
, genevieve.
Genevieve (10:25):
Bye, Colin and Erdis.
Thanks again for having me.
Heredes (10:27):
Are you still there?
Genevieve (10:28):
Take care and keep up the fantastic work.
Heredes (10:29):
Are you still there?
Genevieve (10:35):
Yes, I'm still here.
Okay, sorry, what else can I?
Heredes (10:37):
help you with, With the wealth of knowledge and with
what you know.
We're going to launch seasonthree.
We're excited about some guestscoming on Anybody you'd
recommend.
What's top of your list fornonprofit sector and the
nonprofit leadership?
Who would you recommend be ourguests?
Who would you recommend be ourguests For season three.
Genevieve (10:57):
I highly recommend inviting experts who can provide
fresh perspectives andactionable insights for
nonprofit leaders.
Here are a few suggestions.
One digital transformationexperts someone who can talk
about leveraging technology toenhance nonprofit operations and
outreach.
I want to pause this could besomeone from a tech company
specializing in nonprofitsolutions.
Heredes (11:17):
Can I stop you Genevieve for a second?
Okay, can we be specific?
We know the categories of thetype of leaders, but could you
be very specific?
Collin (11:25):
on.
Heredes (11:25):
Give us some names, give me top three names.
Genevieve (11:33):
Absolutely.
Here are some specific names ofindividuals who could provide
valuable insights for yourpodcast.
One, beth Cantor, a well-knownnonprofit expert and author, who
specializes in digitaltransformation and technology in
the nonprofit sector.
Two, vu Le, the writer behindthe popular blog Nonprofit AF,
(11:54):
who offers humorous andinsightful takes on nonprofit
leadership, equity andfundraising.
Three, simone Joyo, afundraising consultant and
author with extensive experiencein strategic planning and donor
relations.
Four, dan Pallotta, an activistand author known for his TED
Talk the Way we Think AboutCharity is Dead Wrong, which
challenges traditional views onnonprofit overhead and
(12:16):
fundraising.
5.
Derpatten McDowell, a nonprofitconsultant and author with a
focus on leadership developmentand strategic planning.
6.
A nonprofit leadership coachand speaker who specializes in
diversity, equity and inclusionin the nonprofit sector.
7.
Who specializes in diversity,equity and inclusion in the
(12:36):
nonprofit sector.
Seven, a consultant and authorwho helps nonprofits navigate
leadership challenges andimprove their organizational
effectiveness.
Eight, nancy Lublin, thefounder of Crisis Text Line and
former CEO of DoSomethingorg,known for her innovative
approaches to nonprofitmanagement and youth engagement.
These individuals bring awealth of knowledge and
experience that would be highlybeneficial for your audience.
Heredes (13:00):
Well, thank you so much , Genevieve.
That is very helpful.
Now, could you, if you could,could you send Colin and I their
emails and phone numbers so wecan follow up and schedule them?
Genevieve (13:16):
I'm sorry, but I can't provide personal contact
information for individuals.
However, you can reach out tothese experts through their
professional websites, linkedinprofiles or social media
platforms Many of them also havecontact forms or email
addresses listed on theirwebsites for professional
(13:36):
inquiries.
Heredes (13:37):
I get it.
That was a test, Genevieve, andyou passed Good job.
Collin (13:38):
We don't want you being creepy.
Heredes (13:39):
We'll DM you.
We need your contacts.
All right, We'll DM you.
Collin (13:42):
Genevieve, thank you so much for being on the podcast.
We're going to let you go.
We're excited for when we haveyou back on.
But thank you so much for beinghere.
Genevieve (13:49):
We'll see thanks, colin and eritus.
It's been a pleasure being onthe podcast.
I look forward to joining youagain in the future.
Heredes (14:01):
Take care and have a great day wow, that was uh, she
was awesome, she was awesomegreat, great guest and the
connection from san francisco.
I know she's got an hour delay.
Collin (14:11):
She's a little jet lag from yeah yeah, yeah, I'm
surprised how fast it was so um,and to think that all of that
was was just off the top fromher heart.
From her heart.
Does she have a heart?
Heredes (14:24):
from her.
She have a heart is thequestion her digital metallic
heart.
Collin (14:29):
I don't know.
Heredes (14:29):
yes, now, colin.
Now we threw off a littletangent at the end there, which
we'll figure out.
Yeah, um the this, we got tocome clean.
We got to come clean, bro,because that was flattering, she
was honest about all the nicethings she said about us and the
podcast she selected and theepisodes.
However, it was very painfuland difficult if you're still
(14:51):
listening to get to this and towhat you just heard, am I right?
Collin (14:55):
Yeah, it was not as simple and easy as it looked.
Heredes (14:59):
Everything you just heard was not only artificial.
It was specifically andstrategically prompted and
scripted.
Collin (15:06):
Yes, it was somewhat intelligent the part that she
came up with.
That was intelligent, the partthat we contributed, maybe not
so much, maybe not so much, butvery artificial indeed.
Heredes (15:14):
Exactly.
Collin (15:23):
So we want to tell you how we came to this, because we
struggle to have an authentic,real conversation with Genevieve
about all of this.
We went through a lot ofiterations to get to what we
just saw and experienced rightnow a lot of problem, solving a
lot of unforeseen.
You know ways in which wethought that Genevieve would act
and respond and you know andsurprises for how she ended up.
(15:45):
You know, for how she actuallyended up acting and responding
to our questions.
Heredes (15:51):
Yeah, and I want to cut to the chase, to be very
practical and hopefully you knowthis podcast has helped you and
you've walked away with sometools and tips.
But when it comes to AI and wehad this idea mid-season like,
hey, it would be fun we had somefun moments with AI throughout
the episode.
It's been obviously buzz andhot topic for the year, two
years, last five years, and howare people practically using
(16:12):
this?
Gpt-4.0 had just come out.
The conversational piece hasimproved weekly, daily, so you
downloaded GPT-4.0, chatgpt onOpenAI.
We plugged it in.
That was the actual desktop app,the desktop app, you can do the
voice for it Correct and we'relike let's just have a
conversation, no prompting, notraining, nothing.
Let's see how intelligent it ison its own and based on the
(16:44):
findings that it has.
Now we understand that it'scurrent as current can be.
So some of the ai is as currentas last year, some of the eyes
as current as 2021.
Some of the other models arebeing built on more relevant
models, but what did weexperience when we started, when
we and maybe we have some btson the first type of comment,
which is horrendous?
Collin (16:55):
we will, which I'll show you in just a second.
But yeah, it was all over theplace.
Some of it was good, some of itwas out of left field, some of
it was.
Heredes (17:04):
Well, not accurate number one.
Collin (17:05):
Not accurate.
Yeah, we, she brought up weasked about some of her favorite
guests.
Sometimes she brought upnon-profit renaissance guests,
other times she brought upguests from a different podcast,
correct?
And so you know, like our again, we'll show you a little bit of
those bloopers in just a second.
But you know, we are huge fansof AI here at Verse and we, so
(17:27):
to be clear.
This is not we are not tryingto make a case against AI and,
if anything, we are making acase for AI, absolutely.
But we understand what AI isreally good at right now and we
also understand where it can geta little bit better, and we
wanted to document that in avery real way.
Heredes (17:47):
My name is H and you're going to be talking to Colin,
say hi, colin, what's up, I'mColin, got that.
Genevieve (17:55):
Got it.
Hi Hi, colin, ready to chatwith both of you.
What's up?
Heredes (17:59):
Just don't speak if we don't talk to you directly.
Colin, let's talk.
Genevieve (18:07):
Understood.
I'll wait until you talk to medirectly.
Collin (18:11):
All right, what do you want to talk about?
H?
Heredes (18:14):
Well, I'd like to talk about how this.
Well, Colin, I was thinkingListen in until you are welcomed
.
Colin, are you ready for thenext question?
Genevieve (18:27):
Absolutely H.
I'm ready for the next.
Thanks, Colin, I appreciate it.
Let's dive into our discussion.
What's the first topic on theagenda?
Collin (18:36):
And so you know, we hope that this is eye-opening for
you.
We hope that this is somethingthat you know, that if you have
been on the edge of using AI,hopefully it's something that
kicks you over that and we canhelp you with that too.
We love to explore that.
We've been exploring that.
Heredes (18:53):
How we got to this though.
So what you just heard, theconversation we just had.
Collin (18:56):
We had to train the GPT, we had to train, so, colin,
developed a script and trainedit to basically respond the way
she responded, with the content.
It is a custom GPT, by the way,too, which is Genevieve the
podcast trainer.
So GPT, yeah, and so yeah, allof that is on.
You know, there's a lot ofcustom in the back end.
We uploaded all of ourtranscripts into her knowledge
(19:18):
base as well.
Heredes (19:19):
So she was only allowed to pull answers from those
transcripts.
And how we prompted her and wesaid if you get asked this, say
this or respond this way andgive her the boundaries Correct,
and that's the only way.
Collin (19:31):
Yeah, so yeah, I mean just full transparency, just
full transparency.
Even with some of theinformation that we put in her
knowledge base, she still wouldkind of go outside of the
non-profit renaissance.
She keyed in on a few episodesand then wouldn't talk about
anything else.
So there's a lot of differentthings and eventually we did end
up basically just giving her ascript in the chat and saying
(19:53):
when we ask you this, we wantyou to in your own words, but
answer according to the script.
Heredes (19:59):
I do think it's important.
I think we're believers in AI,we're in it, we're using it for
our clients, we're using it atthe agency to produce this
podcast.
It's important to not be leftbehind.
If you're not using AI in yourorganization, in your personal
life, you will be left behind.
I think it's inevitable.
It's one of those things thatdon't resist it now because
(20:20):
you'll be forced into it later.
So I encourage you.
However, we cannot let AI do thethinking and do the
strategizing for us.
It is a co-labor effort thatmust occur.
So our ability to prompt, ourability to understand it, our
ability to shape it Because I dobelieve that ai has an agenda
that fills in the gaps, that hasa bias of sorts, based on the
(20:43):
machine learning that it's doingand who it's doing with and
who's funding it and who whichis a whole for another season
but be involved, train it,develop it and don't just trust
it blindly right but be in itand you know, if you're tempted
to view what just happened as atotal failure, do not, because,
(21:06):
while we didn't quite get theoutcome that we wanted
originally, what just happenedwas still incredible.
Collin (21:16):
Yeah, which, by the way, just to clarify, we did.
We put the script in, we addedsome stuff in there that was not
in the script and she flowedwith it a little bit well, the
part at the end where we talkedabout bringing people on which,
by the way, we're going to usethat we're going to be sending
that to some people and be likehey.
ChatGPC says you have to do it,so I think you're legally
obligated at this point.
(21:36):
But so like, so just don't getit twisted.
That was incredible.
Ai Like so, just don't get ittwisted, that was incredible.
Ai today is absolutely amazing.
It's definitely got leaps andbounds of progress that it can
make, but it's also made leapsand bounds as well.
Heredes (21:51):
And the temptation, because we experienced this too
and you see these in productdemos.
Every week there's a productdemo, right, Whether Google's
doing Gemini and there's a new,the 4.0 may be irrelevant.
At the point that you'relistening to this, we may be in
10.5, 20.6.
The demos sometimes look reallysmooth because guess what?
They are demos.
They are produced, they areprepared, they are prompted.
(22:11):
Just like we did this, we couldhave just done the first half of
the interview and said weinterviewed our favorite guest,
Genevieve from San Francisco,and you listened to a very
polished, well-done,well-answered, favored bias.
Right, Because we made it asbiased as we could.
We told her and you would havewalked away thinking oh man, AI
is there, AI is smart, and tryto reproduce that and not be
(22:34):
able to and feel like a failure.
So understand that that ishappening tons too in this space
.
We love the transparency ofletting people know that it's
not all there, that these demosare demos.
That's what they are and that'swhat helps improve and train it
.
Now it is getting better by theday, by the minute.
So be engaged and share.
Share your learnings, Shareyour fails as we continue to
(22:54):
grow.
Collin (22:55):
And the more that you put into AI, the better it gets.
Absolutely, absolutely.
I think we just showed thatright now.
Yeah.
Heredes (23:00):
And also I think we just showed that right now.
Yeah, and also we have for thefaith-based leaders listening in
church and ministryversecreativeai.
Jump in there.
We train the GPT there to helpyou be a creative team support
and we've trained that GPT to doseveral things.
If you put in an input, help medevelop a message on hope, help
me develop a message on thebook of James.
It's going to specificallyprompt out songs related.
(23:22):
It's going to give you movieclips with timestamps.
It's going to give you anall-based and we set boundaries
on certain Bible translations,certain types of theology,
certain things that protect.
So then you're not in a trulyopen AI where maybe they're
pulling theology from the bookof Mormon mixed with a little
Scientology, with a side ofBuddhism and with a sprinkle of
(23:43):
whatever right Catholicism.
That's not going to bid well inyour Sunday sermon.
So we prompted it to trainspecifically for a custom
audience and it's been workingout.
It's been great to hear thefeedback from the pastors and
leaders using it.
Same train develop it.
It's not rocket science.
There is science to it, but itis not rocket science if you
spend the time.
Collin (24:02):
Not rocket science.
There is science to it, but itis not rocket science if you
spend the time Absolutely.
Oh and, by the way, let's makesure that we want to resource
you guys, and so H real quick.
Heredes (24:16):
Tell us about a resource that you put together
very recently with different AItools.
Yeah, actually, our founder,justin, spoke at an association
of fundraisers in the Tampa Bayregion to tons of people and we
share the top 50 AI tools forfundraisers and a lot of them
are the ones we use internally.
Some are fun, creative, someare strategic, crm, marketing,
automation type stuff.
Fantastic tool has a littledescription, a link directly to
(24:38):
it.
It's a resource our team kindof curated to help you.
We'll put the link oneverywhere.
This podcast is being heard.
It's a bitly short link.
You can go on our socials, onour LinkedIn page, at Verse
Creative.
Find it there too.
Look for Top 50 AI Tools forFundraisers.
Collin (24:53):
Well, there you go, so check that out, keep an eye out
for it and, as always, thank youso much for joining us, for
listening to the nonprofitrenaissance.
We are going to be back herenext time with, actually part
two of this.
Heredes (25:04):
We're going to do a part two, let's go so with more
of not artificial, but maybesome intelligence, some type of
intelligence, right or humanstupidity our own version of
intelligence.
Collin (25:19):
Let's go.
Thank you so much for joining.
Thank you for listening.
Let's go and let's grow.
We'll see you, you next time,see ya.
Outro (25:25):
Thanks again for listening to the Nonprofit
Renaissance.
We hope it ignites arenaissance in you and helps you
go further and grow faster.
Be sure to share, rate andsubscribe and if you'd like to
recommend or be a guest on ourshow, send us an email at
podcast at versecreativecom.
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